assassination

[shy dust]

It’s true though makes balancing it tough

[balmy condor]

Subterfuge is very slightly behind in single target

[shy dust]

Blizzard even tried to address it and failed

[balmy condor]

But 3 targets literally means 3x the value from the talent

So

That’s pretty lit

[frail fossil]

they should've simply not give DS to any spec except sub

[cerulean burrow]

Got it then I start off with the three. Carrots then crimson tempest after right ? And got it all I’ll switch to master assa for single target

[frail fossil]

and tune it much higher

[shy dust]

Even then it’s a bit hard to tune legos

[balmy condor]

For aoe yeah

[shy dust]

When one spec vanishes 2-3 times more

[cerulean burrow]

Lol I said carrots @balmy condor

[frail fossil]

for sure, but like it was forseeable, that the spec with the lowest vanish cd, would benefit the most from DS, so i dont rly know why they chose to give it to other specs and specially outlaw

sub have less unique legendaries than any other spec i think

since DS is generic

[compact pumice]

Lot of people using MA on Huntsman though 😮 (I mean there's a few Subt too on Top parses but still, most MA)

[frail fossil]

make DS sub only so outlaw dont have to talk abt it

[frail fossil]

cuz parses doesn't not only rely on ur build

like hutsman parsing is more

how much mut u can fit on the adds

[compact pumice]

True I guess

[frail fossil]

than which talent u took

[warm parcel]

Assas talents are honestly so close to each other, top parses consist of mix of anything

[frail fossil]

that determine ur parse

[warm parcel]

Theres also way more variables in top parses

[frail fossil]

if a parse is top 3 but has like 4 pi, but doesn't run subt, like obv it's not there cuz they took a different talent build

[warm parcel]

I mean even our boi cever has run "suboptimal" talents

On bosses youd not expect and parse

[frail fossil]

unforgivable i will directly complain to him

[compact pumice]

there's loads of people without any buffs too though.

[warm parcel]

Assa isnt a popular simp spec on logs

[compact pumice]

maybe only 50% have buffs in top 20

[frail fossil]

yeah just, parses are more reliant on outside factors, than which tier 3 talent u took

[frail fossil]

more popular than sub and outlaw tho

[warm parcel]

Okay fair

Rogue isnt a popular simp target

Mages and locks rocking like 15 buffs

[frail fossil]

yeah, at least at the beginning of the tier rogue parse are gonna be chill cuz aint no serious person giving PI to a rogue

on prog

[warm parcel]

Completely understandable

[balmy condor]

B A S E D

[cerulean burrow]

What is pl?

[warm parcel]

I was honestly curious about this myself too

So when I looked at logs, they really were varied

[balmy condor]

A dumb ability that shouldn’t exist

[warm parcel]

Leges too

Not just 99% doomblade

[balmy condor]

It’s a priest spell

[compact pumice]

Sure but if a choice would be stronger it should show up proportionally. Like it's only 21% with Subt in top 100 though, rest being MA.

[balmy condor]

Give a bloodlust effect to a target

[cerulean burrow]

Oh like a buff ?

Oh shit

[warm parcel]

Maybe. Sometimes community perception plays a big part

And a 100 is still a very very small sample if we talking real statistics

[balmy condor]

It doesn’t work like that when talents are really close

[frail fossil]

GS is better for outlaw in like 8/1O fight in CN yet on every fight it has like 8% pick rate

people just run what popular rogues run

same for the other classes

[warm parcel]

Or what they feel comfy in

[frail fossil]

yeah that too

too used to play with QD and stuff, just saying top logs doesn't give a fair representation of what is best

[compact pumice]

I just think very few people actually practice with GS

Takes some time to get used to

[frail fossil]

cuz sometime people literally dont know something is better

[compact pumice]

But yeah I get what you mean

[frail fossil]

like MFD was insane for outlaw for a while even before SL, but no one on earth except guy ever took it

[warm parcel]

Its honestly a little hard to read into stats of say top 100 logs.
Where as a game like league can have 100k games on one hero you can look at

It is going to be so much more statistically valid in leagues case

[frail fossil]

parse is rarely about like specific build within 1% of each other like there are so many outside factors as to why u parse well sometime

[balmy condor]

Mfd has been a better talent for dungeons for sin since like prepatch bfa

And people just can’t be fucked

[compact pumice]

Found you could check stats in WCL like this:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/26/#dataset=95&boss=2418&class=Rogue&spec=Assassination&combatantinfo=Talents&tier=2

[warm parcel]

I could also argue dusk has a place on sludge

[compact pumice]

Seems Sub wins

[warm parcel]

Yet noone really played it yet

[balmy condor]

Stop it

[frail fossil]

i think rae tried

doesn't make ur vend 1min

[warm parcel]

It doesnt but it doesnt need to

[shy dust]

i never tried

[warm parcel]

66s is enough

[shy dust]

but you should have it up

[warm parcel]

You just gotta prepull ven

[shy dust]

for every after 1st break

[balmy condor]

Yeh

[shy dust]

or things like that

[balmy condor]

With dusk you hold for 1st pillar

And then it lines up

[frail fossil]

isn't vanish like half of vendetta anyway

[shy dust]

no

[compact pumice]

3 secs vs 20 secs

[shy dust]

you think 3 seconds of 50% crit

[balmy condor]

I’m a dusk nonbeliever though

[shy dust]

is half the value of a 20 second 30% damage buff

youre cooked mate

[frail fossil]

didn't meant it literally, just vanish is still an important part of what makes vendetta good

[compact pumice]

Just CD stacking makes Vendetta even better. But it's good without

[frail fossil]

anyway u could try duskwalker if u have spare soul ash

i dont cuz i have to recreaft doomblade

[warm parcel]

Ye mines only 190

And now that Im looking, we didnt even have log for last clear

[frail fossil]

[warm parcel]

This is what our clear looked like 3 weeks ago

Mine is the dusk with dashed line

Mustve fucked up something on 2nd pillar

Or just get 0 crits

[lost shadow]

This might be a dumb question, but do you still vanish during burst if you're running subterfuge instead of MA? And if so, what do you do during?

[next shale]

in AOE do you prio CT over everything even in shiv window?

[frail fossil]

if it's about to fall off yes

[west cove]

any expectations of rog getting raid buff/cd in 9.1 ?

[frail fossil]

probably not but who knows

[frail fossil]

basically, if it's about to fall off, it should be your next finisher

[next shale]

thanks 🙂 sry changing build mid-raid im an outlaw main, where does it fit in the opener/

for like sire where you open ST

should i just wait till adds are out to press it

[frail fossil]

no you keep it up in ST too if talented

i mean, i would personally do normal thing, which is put garrote and rupture first, use vendetta

and use CT

in ST

[next shale]

it just feels like a waste to press it like 2nd finisher and then again in <10 seconds when adds spawn

[frail fossil]

then u do the classic, shiv into vanish etc etc

[frail fossil]

by the time rupture and garrote are up adds will probably be spawning

anyway

so it doesn't rly change much

but just in general, if you play CT you keep it up in ST too

[next shale]

yaya 🙂 thanks, jsut checkign for the weird ST>AOE>ST shit that happens, idk if its worth holding CT on main taget for a small amount of time to avoid spending CP on it twice

[frail fossil]

this is what CEV did on his sire kill

but tbf, people give a bit too much importance to the opener

it's a very small part of a 10min fight

[balmy condor]

Opener andy’s

[warm parcel]

I mean even there he does one (I think) elaborate decision

He moves his vanish a global later

He always otherwise vanishes for mut cp

[balmy condor]

Yeh

[warm parcel]

Here he delays it one global so he can fok once in MA

[frail fossil]

very smart

[warm parcel]

Sure yall can meme about openers and stuff, but parses are about small things like this

[balmy condor]

I simmed mut env mut vs env mut env in Ma windows

And like

It was margin of error

[warm parcel]

Sure

[frail fossil]

yeah it's about the FOK here hto

[warm parcel]

But my point moreso is, people ask for rigid rules when wow is all about just understanding why to do what

[balmy condor]

Doesn’t matter is the point

[warm parcel]

Im also the person that would never run CT on sire

[balmy condor]

That 1 global isn’t gonna make any difference

At all

[warm parcel]

Just cause I only care of p3

Yea well

[frail fossil]

i mean i didn't notice the FoK thing in the vanish window

weak too smart

[warm parcel]

I mean thats only my assumption

But Idno why else hed delay it

[frail fossil]

but i mean it's def those kind of little things that separate assa players

[balmy condor]

[frail fossil]

cuz specs are not very complex

to be honest

[balmy condor]

You guys trying to find meaning

When cev probably just hit vanish too late

[frail fossil]

[warm parcel]

I sincerely doubt

[balmy condor]

Fucking hilarious

[frail fossil]

@limber lion hello mr ceverion, in your sire kill, you delay your vanish window by one GCD, so you get one FoK cast with MA unto the echo spawns, was it a deliberate action or just u hitting vanish randomly

[balmy condor]

If you take the argument of “oh he held vanish 1 gcd cause giga brain”

Giga brain how

Cause the fok does more damage?

Shouldve held until the fok and gotten 2 in then

[frail fossil]

[warm parcel]

Whatever boomer

[frail fossil]

literally no one said that man

[balmy condor]

I just don’t get

[warm parcel]

Maybe hes just washed up and forgot to vanish

[balmy condor]

Why we’re talking about the vanish

[frail fossil]

i mean idk weak pointed it out

and you're like

nooooo it doesn't matter

[balmy condor]

It doesn’t

[frail fossil]

when it's just smth weak pointed out without rly trying to say it was some giga 5head move

just, his vanish was a bit late, so his fok benefitted from the MA buff

[warm parcel]

As I said

It was my assumption

[balmy condor]

[warm parcel]

Maybe I give him too much credit

[balmy condor]

Parses are about small things

Like vanishing 1 sec later

For margin of error difference

[warm parcel]

Id rather not go into this

When youre already agitated

[frail fossil]

[balmy condor]

I’m not agitated

I’m giga confused

And memeing on you guys because of it

I’m willing to have a civil discussion

About why that vanish does or doesn’t matter

But earlier when I pointed out the logic

I got “whatever boomer”

So

[warm parcel]

Yes that was me saying Id rather not have this convo when you come in guns blazing

So Ill just cc and dip out

[balmy condor]

I’m just asking

What the reasoning is

[warm parcel]

I kinda gave my argument

[balmy condor]

That’s all I want weak

[warm parcel]

Same as with sludge

And you simply shot both down with an emoji

Idno how it would go on

Not much to talk further

[balmy condor]

Where did I shoot it down

Here?

Where you gave a reasoning and I responded

[odd hazel]

i dont see where whisp shot it down

seems you just expected him to 100% agree with you with out questioning

[warm parcel]

No

But "I just dont get it" or "not its not" isnt an argument that brings the convo forward

[balmy condor]

The only thing I shot down was when we started memeing about it like some 5head play

[warm parcel]

To me it just stops it

[odd hazel]

did he only say that?

[balmy condor]

I think the vanish should’ve been held even longer

In my opinion the vanish would be better used on fok Ct fok for the add damage

[odd hazel]

idk, seems like a fine convo to me.

[balmy condor]

The global on mutilate isn’t worth it

If you have adds that soon

[warm parcel]

Alright

Now were getting somewhere

[dapper solar]

probably whispyr not sure who cel is but im sure it was inconsequential to their overall damage

[balmy condor]

[warm parcel]

Those are both arguments to keeping the convo going

[balmy condor]

That’s literally what I was saying 10 minutes ago

[warm parcel]

And also broadly on the one global doesnt matter

Yes

and no

But you can never simulate this

[balmy condor]

Sure

I can get behind that

[odd hazel]

stares at conversation im not seeing any thing you're arguing weak.

[warm parcel]

And making this miniscule changes over an 11 min encounter, you can never sim it

[balmy condor]

Single target wise though finish build finish and build finish build

Run to the same outcome

This is on 1 min sims

[warm parcel]

I know and Im on board with it

[balmy condor]

Okay

Cool

So there’s common ground

[odd hazel]

this is a very confusing convo

[balmy condor]

Tell me about it

[warm parcel]

I just noted that 1. Hes used to doing mut env mut when he normally plays
2. So I assumed why he did something different here

That was the whole starting point

I just dont think a player like him would forget vanish

[balmy condor]

Yeah and then I pointed out that if he wanted to do that, he would’ve held later

[warm parcel]

Cause thats a yikes

[balmy condor]

For the fok

[warm parcel]

Ye well maybe he didnt think then

[balmy condor]

And because the vanish is so close to the mut

I’m assuming he just fat fingered

Or brain lagged

And missed the gcd

[warm parcel]

Then Im just disappointed

[balmy condor]

A feeling I commonly share

Well

I’m glad we got somewhere

Sorry that it seemed like I was agitated or not willing to talk about it

[warm parcel]

I just have severe ptsd from emoji usage

Cause theres been way too many times the otherside just throws in one

And leaves it there cause they couldnt be bothered with

So ye I hate that

And re: the small things you do

Say on sire diff can come from you prioing the blade over sire himself cause the blade often leaves your range

Its again something you could never realistically sim, but when you do that 5 times over someone that doesnt

It starts adding up

[balmy condor]

Fair point, I’ll think about it

[warm parcel]

But theres also been cases that go directly against this

[gloomy knoll]

oy

stop giving away

my secret vanish techniques

on sire whispyr

wtf bro

[balmy condor]

Yeah 5 dps 20 times is 100

[warm parcel]

Mainly legion and one famous parser kept doing something different to everyone else

Yet parsed

[balmy condor]

Sorry mate

Your pad is safe with me

[gloomy knoll]

[warm parcel]

Im also the one who tests every stupid claim cause sometimes stupid people find out something that works. Thank you for coming to my ted talk

[balmy condor]

That happens and I hate it

Stupid people stumbling into some optimizations

Makes me so angry

[lost shadow]

Sorry to ask again, but you all seem very smart, and I am confused. When running subterfuge, how do you use vanish?

like on a bossfight in a dungeon

[silent tinsel]

Pressing for for combo points only to realize it doesn't work like shuriken storm

[balmy condor]

You vanish during garrotes first pandemic to extend the empowered garrote

[frail fossil]

u do not pandemic the empowered garrote correct ?

[silent fossil]

with another empowered garrote you do

[loud light]

later in the fight you let the empowered one expire

[lost shadow]

Ahh, makes sense thanks

[balmy condor]

Yah you can

It’s technically optimal to

Like 18 second empowered garrote, 5.4 pandemic, so you vanish 13 seconds in, and extend it with another 18 second empowered garrote

Saves you the 5 seconds on vanish

Versus letting it time out and then vanishing

Which doesn’t sound like much but you’re vanishing like 15-20 times a dungeon

So it could be an extra cast

Ya know

[frail fossil]

this only happen regularly in dungeons tho

in raid that would only apply to your first, and second garrote in the fight

[wary pawn]

so my guild just killed sludgefist, we progressing slg tomorrow, is assa way worse than outlaw in this fight? rly enjoy it more than outlaw

[balmy condor]

Yep

[frail fossil]

dps is honestly so irrelevant on slg as u as u dont die u might aswell play any spec u want

[lost shadow]

I was asking about dungeons though, in raids you just play MA generally yeah?

[frail fossil]

and u can still pump slg as assa if u know what u're doing

[lost shadow]

or i guess not in cleave fights

[wary pawn]

gotta learn when to use CT i guess lul

[cerulean burrow]

For multi target cleave opener is it. Triple garrote then slice and dice ? Or tripple@garrote then crimson tempest ?

[frail fossil]

when it's about to fall off

[wary pawn]

ty<3

[frail fossil]

u just keep a close to 100% uptime on it

like with rupture

and garrote

[cerulean burrow]

How many envelops typically can you get off in a multi target situation before you have to disperse the dots again ?

Like 2 or 3 ?

Envenoms*

[balmy condor]

Depends on the target count

On 5 targets for example you would never envenom except to refresh snd, or when they’re gonna die soon

[bleak sky]

can any of you link me a SLG prog kill?

[cerulean burrow]

Wow that makes sense

Thank you !

So typically anything less than 5 I guess. Like I could get one or two off ?

And I guess i would weave in garrot in between if I need one combo point for 5 energy so I don’t over cap ?

And then shiv before envenom right ?

[balmy condor]

You would toss out garrotes on cooldown

And shiv on cooldown as well

[cerulean burrow]

Got it

[balmy condor]

And just weave in envenoms as you can

Like 3 targets for example right

[cerulean burrow]

Yeah

[balmy condor]

You can garrote all 3 (kinda hard, but in theory doable)

You maintain CT, rupture all 3

[cerulean burrow]

Well at the beginning with subterfuge

[balmy condor]

And from there if you have nothing else to do, you envenom

[cerulean burrow]

Do you mean after that ?

[balmy condor]

After that yeah

18 second dot, 6 second cooldown

Can get 3 out at a time

Usually it’s like 2 and a half

[cerulean burrow]

So like on three targets ill@barely be using envenom then

[balmy condor]

Cause you aren’t gcd perfect on refreshes and stuff

Yeah

[cerulean burrow]

But on two targets I’ll be using them. Frequently during that 6 second window

I guess right ?

[balmy condor]

Our priority damage rotation is 5 dots and then slam 1 target

[cerulean burrow]

Got it

The two poisons plus crimson. Garrot and rupture

[balmy condor]

Nah nah like the highest single target damage in theory

Is rup gar on 2 targets, gar on a third

And then using that to focus 1 target with the energy

Crimson doesn’t give energy

So it doesn’t count in that math

Something like stone legion or council

The strat is usually to dot 2 targets, the boss you’re hitting, and 1 additional

So 2 garrotes, 2 ruptures

And then single target the boss

[cerulean burrow]

Oh venomous sounds doesent benefit from crimson

I see what you mean now

Venomous wounds

[balmy condor]

Other way around technically, but yeah

[cerulean burrow]

Yeah hahaha

You know what I mean

[balmy condor]

Yep yep

One of the more common suggestions is to actually flip how VW works

Making poisoned ticks on bleeded targets give energy

rather than bleed ticks on poisoned targets

[cerulean burrow]

Got it so two garrote at all times

Third rupture on focus target

And slam envenoms into focus target with the energy from. Vw

[balmy condor]

Yeh something like that

The logic is always “if it survives long enough, hit it with a dot”

[cerulean burrow]

Is it worth it to throw out a fan of knives to get poisons out. Sometimes or will they typically get poisoned from your abilities and auto attacks ?

[balmy condor]

We fok for poisons on 3

And fok to generate on 4

On 2 you just tab over

[cerulean burrow]

Ohh okay

I need more haste

😂

[balmy condor]

Need is a strong term

But probably xD

[cerulean burrow]

Ohhhh and one more thing when do I slice and dice during the opener ?

[balmy condor]

The moment you get 3cp

[cerulean burrow]

After the garrotes ?

[thorny pond]

2nd hcd

[balmy condor]

But ideally in keys and stuff you just cast slice once

And then maintain it with envenoms forever

So you never re-cast

[cerulean burrow]

3cp?

[balmy condor]

Yeah that’s the cutoff atm

[thorny pond]

Hit it one time and never let it fall is the ultimate hacky sack

[balmy condor]

So a mut crit for 3 is good, if it’s at 2, mut again

If you garrote with subterfuge

And you garrote 3 times

You’re good to go

[cerulean burrow]

I have to learn all your abbreviated terms xD haha

[balmy condor]

If it’s single target and you garrote once, follow it with a mut

And then you’re at 3

I didn’t even notice I abbreviated something

What did I say?

[cerulean burrow]

But

Mut

[balmy condor]

Mutilate

[cerulean burrow]

lol I was like mut ?

[balmy condor]

:P

[cerulean burrow]

Then I realized yeah

[balmy condor]

There used to be a thing idk if it’s updated

[cerulean burrow]

So slice and dice with three combo points is what you are saying then ?

[balmy condor]

Uhhh

!abbreviations

Or uh

!abbr

Fuck

Idk what it was

[cerulean burrow]

Hahahaha

[balmy condor]

Yes

[cerulean burrow]

The command for abbreviations is abbreviated

Haha ok got it

[balmy condor]

!abb

[prisma monolith]

Rogue abbreviations: http://www.ravenholdt.net/rogue-abbreviations/

[balmy condor]

AH

Probably out of date

Bfa stuff

But should have the basics

[cerulean burrow]

Okie dokie

Wow I just practiced on two target dummies after applying what you went over with me and my consistent damage was like tripple what it was before

Assa is so much more fun then outlaw

[novel lily]

shhhhh, dont tell anyone

[cerulean burrow]

XD

[balmy condor]

I’m glad you’re seeing gains

[subtle kiln]

!bis

[cerulean burrow]

Yes

I’m wondering if that trinket from necrotic wake that does nature damage would be good mixed with phial from plague fall

[gusty mirage]

Flayedwing? It kinda sucks

[cerulean burrow]

Yeah that one

[balmy condor]

Trinkets aren’t affected by our mechanics like shiv and vendetta

[cerulean burrow]

For sure

Got it

[balmy condor]

Also there’s a great big FAQ in the pins no clue who put it there or anything but he must be a really swell guy

[north pewter]

no one reads the pins xD

or this chat would be half dead

[deft escarp]

hello im new and i have some questions, is sin/ necro ok for pvp?

[cerulean burrow]

Hmm I’m gonna have to figure out where to find those

[balmy condor]

#pvp

[strange python]

!bis

[balmy condor]

On mobile swipe to your left, and it’s at the top, on desktop there’s a pushpin icon in the bar at the top right

[cerulean burrow]

Oh thanks !

Sorry not really pro with discord platform yet 😅

[balmy condor]

[cerulean burrow]

Omg

There’s lots of great info in there

Thanks. 🙂

[balmy condor]

No problem

[spice spire]

imagine freeing whispyr from his chains lmao

[stoic needle]

!mastery

[spice spire]

stop this nonsense at once

[stoic needle]

!scaling

wtf useless bot

[cerulean burrow]

!bis

[balmy condor]

I put as much basic info into pins and stuff as I can which then lets me have better conversations

Instead of just “sim” “yes” “no”

[cerulean burrow]

Lol

[balmy condor]

That’s the idea at least

[cerulean burrow]

Makes sense 🙂

[spice spire]

I was going to say, didn't quite come to fruition

[balmy condor]

Wow toxic

You’re just mad you don’t have your own swamp

[hallow coyote]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[spice spire]

I’m just RPing as my spec man. Cmon.

But also I have plenty of swamps, I’m a fan of Jon Avon myself

[limber swallow]

those are some good lands.. you have good taste.

[spice spire]

signed copies only for jund

Anyway that’s OT, back to toxicity

[limber swallow]

I don't know how you can even meme toxicity anymore... toxic blade was removed from the game.

[spice spire]

If I could read I’d be very upset rn

[limber swallow]

c'mon... 1 dad joke a day? right?

[spice spire]

Boo

[balmy condor]

[dawn ivy]

is there a good gemstone WA

[balmy condor]

Many I’m sure

Wago has hundreds I assume

[lavish pulsar]

thanks for the advice on p2/p3 cd usage yesterday , we downed sire

i didn't top p3 dps because i had to drop two stupid orbs

[scarlet spade]

I know 9.1 is still a ways away but im getting to the point where my doomblade/zoldycks are about to be upgraded completely...would you guys say it is safe to start crafting other bis leggos for sub/outlaw or would it be wise to stash my ash until 9.1

[gusty mirage]

Craft leggos for other specs if you think you’ll play them/try them out. Better to have more options, ya know? Plus the new layers will give us even more soul ash + the new currency to upgrade r4s to higher levels

[odd hazel]

yeah, a safe bet right now is make some sub leggos

and outlaw tbh

but like oxi said, if you plan to play them

you could also save the soul ash for alts

[stoic needle]

I would wait until we know more about how domination sockets will work

[feral merlin]

Does Flayedwing Toxin work with Master Poisoner and mastery or Improved Poisons?

[gusty mirage]

No it’s nature damage not a poison

[feral merlin]

poisons are nature damage too

[gusty mirage]

Yep, but they’re classified differently than nature damage dots

[feral merlin]

yeah that sucks

[gusty mirage]

For whatever reason

[shell delta]

which covenant is looking best for 9.1 assassination? im leveling my old main rogue, 56 atm so i could still change easily

[gusty mirage]

Venthyr for pure ST, necro for anything 2+ targets

[scarlet spade]

Yeah I wanted to mess around with some sub so i was thinking of making finality but you made a good point about the domination sockets so I think i will hold off till we have some more info.

@shell delta I just switched from NF to necro and am it loving especially for m+

[gusty mirage]

Eh, we have 4-6 weeks of soul ash still? It’s not that big of a deal if you want to craft a couple rank 2s in case more info comes out

[stoic needle]

If domination sockets aren't addable to legendaries you'll want finality cloak

[shell delta]

m+ will be my main focus, maybe doing some pvp too but ill choose for m+

[stoic needle]

If they are you want chest

[stoic needle]

Necro

[shell delta]

aight thx guys

[scarlet spade]

Yeah i would say necro man I noticed a difference in the switch.

[shell delta]

heard some rumor assassination is going to be the best spec in 9.1, any true to that? i mostly played rogue during wotlk so I was assa/mutilate back then too so like it alrdy

[gusty mirage]

Also @stoic needle the shard of domination sockets seem to be on raid dropped items from everything I've read

nothing indicates that they'll go on legendaries

[versed mica]

the amount of people who !bis in this channel makes me audibly laugh when I see it

[stoic needle]

yes but that could change in the next ptr build

so until they make an official writeup about them i'd say it's better to wait to craft your legendary

[feral merlin]

!bis

[gusty mirage]

Not really, there's at minimum 6 weeks left of 9.0. That's a lot of soul ash.

[stoic needle]

it's still a waste if you craft it in the worse slot and then have to recraft it

[charred wraith]

actually thats just 1 legendary

[gusty mirage]

Sure. If you're going straight to a rank 4 of a legendary for an off spec

[feral merlin]

well you could make like 5 legos with that ash at low rank

[scarlet spade]

Have they mentioned when the next ptr build will be?

[gusty mirage]

they usually come out thursday or friday afaik

[scarlet spade]

Oh thats fine I can hold off another week technically tomorrow I will be done upgrading doomblade so i can hold off a bit

[odd hazel]

imagine thinking the slot of a leggo makes a huge difference

[stoic needle]

well it kinda does

[odd hazel]

i guess it depends on the leggo

and the slot

[stoic needle]

chest finality vs back finality is quite a bit of stats

or maybe you're a dingus who crafted shoulder doomblade

[odd hazel]

are you just mad you dont have 226 gloves?

[stoic needle]

tomorrow

[odd hazel]

i guess thats true, i have my finality on chest soooo

low key hoping sub is good so i can dabble in it

[gusty mirage]

the difference between head/chest/legs and back/wrists is like 240dps. It's nothing that'll turn a low blue parse into a purple parse

[stoic needle]

that's a shit ton of dps lmao

[gusty mirage]

Did I say it wasn't?

[odd hazel]

i'll be joining osh in the gloves department of doom once i actually get a decent pair of shoulders.

[stoic needle]

a 226 to 233 weapon is less dps than that

but true that it won't make up for you playing properly

[gusty mirage]

Plus, given how stubborn blizzard is about reforging secondaries on leggos/scrapping them I don't think they'll put in a socket system that'll make you have to recraft something

if that makes sense

[odd hazel]

osh, you're gonna get 226 gloves and im gonna get 226 shoulders

[stoic needle]

[gusty mirage]

they seem to have a huge boner for "meaningful choices" not burning you

[stoic needle]

Ehh

[odd hazel]

i mean

[stoic needle]

I wouldn't put it past them at all

[odd hazel]

i could see them making a lucky system of getting a random socket when you make it

[stoic needle]

It'll probably be a socket item you buy for a shit ton of stygia

[odd hazel]

most likely. im surprised theres no research system

but

will it be 10k+ stygia

no more no less

[gusty mirage]

well hold on to those horses @odd hazel

because there IS a research system in torghast next tier

lol

[odd hazel]

i mean

torghast seems 100% better to me next patch so hopefully its worth

you can farm the ash next patch yeah?

[stoic needle]

Yeah it's unlimited

[hazy crater]

what

[gusty mirage]

apparently sockets & conduits are rewards in torghast next tier too

[odd hazel]

time to get my big girl pants on and get the leggos done with

i mean

its better the ndoing this stupid rep and paying like 7500 for one socket

i wish i did this rep earlier

[stoic needle]

I've farmed like 6 sockets from the maw so far

You can do like one a week if you do it every day and use war mode

[prisma roost]

Is ring the best slot to make MA?

[stoic needle]

Yes

[prisma roost]

kk thx

[stoic needle]

Haste vers for pvp

Or pve

[shell delta]

woah, alrdy doing 1.6k dps to 56 sec single target boss nice

57lvl

[scarlet spade]

haste vers for pve?

thought it was haste crit?

unless it was m+ then you wanted crit/mastery right?

[strange python]

What's the consensus for doomblade slot? Shoulder or hands?

[scarlet spade]

I thought it was hands because of the SLG shoulders

[lean coral]

^

[plain onyx]

big slime on the first boss in PF, do I sap or blind ?

[lean coral]

Can't sap it

[plain onyx]

then blind

[lean coral]

Yer

[stoic needle]

You don't put crit on a legendary that gives you 100% crit

[odd hazel]

Hands if you can get the shoulders but realistically it doesnt matter

[scarlet spade]

ohhh my bad I thought we were talking about stats in general I must have missed that my bad.

[odd hazel]

235 shoulders here with 226 hands.

[scarlet spade]

Yeah i see now my bad

[odd hazel]

but yeah, if you can grab the SLG shoulders go hands

haste + crit

assuming like, haste/mastery for zold

[scarlet spade]

yeah for sure

[stoic needle]

Crit haste for zold

[dawn ivy]

do talents change when swapping from doomblade to dashing?

[balmy condor]

Nop

[pulsar warren]

What is the pandemic timer for crimson tempest? Does anyone know this? :)

rupture it's 7.2, garrote it's 5.4

[plain onyx]

Do you realize how hard it is to come from a DH to a rogue ? I mean, DH = 3-5 buttons and that's it. Rogue= you literally have to keep an eye or everything is make your rotation/dps perfect

[forest vigil]

Idk if sin is that bad, mistakes tend to happen if u just dont press the buttons and then panic trying to do it all

[balmy condor]

Pandemic refers to a hidden game mechanic applied to many dots and buffs (referred to as auras). Slice and Dice, rupture, garrote, and envenom all pandemic. When you reapply an aura while it is still active, a portion of the duration transfers to the new application. The maximum that can be transferred is 30% of the new aura being applied. Garrote being 18 seconds means 18*0.3=5.4 seconds. Refreshing anytime between 0 seconds and 5.4 seconds is no gain or loss in dps. Rupture, slice, and envenom duration varies by combo point, so the pandemic duration also varies

[pulsar warren]

Ah, thank you very much! :) I'm just trying to modify your plater pandemic glow script because it's not glowing at the right time if I use rupture not probably... e.g. I rupture with 1cp (which I shouldn't do) it's not glowing at 7.4s which I don't like :) Thanks btw for sharing it! :)

[balmy condor]

well that makes sense

If you rupture with 1 cp

And it hits 7.4 it should glow

The duration is based on the new dot

So if you apply a 1 cp rupture, and then get 5cp, and the current rupture is 7.4 seconds

Those 7.4 seconds will transfer

[pulsar warren]

Yeah! Your script calculates different (hopefully I get this point across): it sees a rupture with 1cp with an uptime of 8s. it will not glow at 7.4s but instead at 8s * 0.3 = 2.4s

it doesn't know that the max uptime of rupture can be 24s

[balmy condor]

Oh

Hm

It shouldn’t be doing that

But maybe that’s just jank I had to idk

Send me a dm I can look at it tomorrow

[velvet nacelle]

i mean this with nothing but the utmost respect, but fuck you and all your crazy dps

i'm topping my raid and getting like 20% parses

people below me are getting like 60-80s

i mean it's more that i shouldn't be topping any meters with 20% parses, but still

y'all giving me a hell of an insecurity complex

[balmy condor]

[dawn ivy]

just assume its a gear diff all the way until you are BiS, maxed conduits, 6 gems in your gear, and then just assume its because youre not getting enough PIs

[balmy condor]

And then you realize maybe you’re just garbage

[dawn ivy]

naaaaaaahhhhh

[balmy condor]

And then git gud

And then come back with full oranges across the board

Triumphant

[pallid bough]

like Ion said, its frankly a skill issue

[vestal wren]

as a player there is always something to improve

if you make a lot of mistakes, its the best position as you have a lot you can work on.
when you get to know the spec better it becomes more subtle and requires more effort to find those mistakes

[final star]

Just hit boss better

Sometimes u get every mechanic

[lavish pulsar]

huh, does the necrolord cov ability keep damage remoria (and thus sire) in p3?

[balmy condor]

It doesn’t keep damaging her I believe but the dot exists in some half state and gives you cp

It’s really janky

[lavish pulsar]

lmao, that rules

[limber lion]

Yep, no extra dps. Not worth applying massive bleeds on Remornia before P3 either.

[mint anvil]

Does crippling affect bosses?

[balmy condor]

No but numbing affects attack speed

[west cove]

on 2 targets should i doomblade both targets?

[dawn ivy]

no need

[limber lion]

No

[dawn ivy]

doomblade effect applies the remaining dmg of the current doomblade on top of the new doomblade application

so you never lose dmg spamming mutilates into one target versus maintaining it on 2

[west cove]

oh alright

[pseudo nimbus]

Which CDs do you precast before Sludge hits the pillar? Vendetta, Blood Fury (orc), Flagellation? And the first GCD after pillar hit is Shiv?

[limber lion]

All of this is correct.

You also want to make sure your bleeds won't drop during the vulnerability window

[pseudo nimbus]

I also went for the Shiv conduit to increase my damage to the pillar even more. Do you think it's better for progress instead of the Flag one?

[steel geyser]

You vendetta during the charge? I feel like there could be some energy waste here

[dawn ivy]

youre bound to be wasteful when youre pooling for that pillar hit

[pseudo nimbus]

I would say the extra gcd for shiv/mutilate/evis might be more beneficial than the energy

[limber lion]

Vendetta isn't on gcd

It might be better to use Vendetta early, just so you have your poisons and bleeds benefiting from it for the first second that you spend running towards the pillar.

You shouldn't get energy starved if you use Vigor and pool properly before the hit.

[limber lion]

I think Lashing Scars is probably still a bit better. For Necrolord you'd definitely want WPS instead of SF.

[pseudo nimbus]

thank you, so basically I know the theory +- quite good but I have fat fingers and always missclick something in the heat of the moment before the pillar hit

[limber lion]

Yep! Just needs some practice. You'll get it down, no worries!

[teal bloom]

I just swapped to necrolords and did lfr with sbs. Sbs seems to require some time to get used to

[limber lion]

It comes pretty quick honestly!

It can be a bit overwhelming in AoE but you get a touch for it pretty quick and then it's the absolute best.

I prefer SBS much more than Flag personally.

[teal bloom]

Yeah it's hard for me to know exactly how many combo points I'll get etc. 😄 In aoe and when bosses like inerva spawn adds you just bonespike every single mob possible even when you don't have gemstone active, right?

[untold nest]

Yes

They prob wont survive till gemstone proc

[limber lion]

Yep. The gemstone rule pretty much only applies if everything around you already has SBS on them.

[wary pawn]

progressing slg tomorrow for the first time, should i craft zoldyck or doomblade will do just fine?

[hollow dirge]

Just use every single one after the first on 0 cp in aoe situations

[limber lion]

They're both completely fine. Most people use Zoldyck.

Doomblade is useless against commando AoE or Skirmishers

But it's good if you focus your damage more on the boss/goliath.

It's gonna be less overall damage, but more prio damage.

[wary pawn]

ty<3

[north basin]

Sbs its just dot u apply and forget?

Thinking switching for fun

[limber lion]

Well almost. You apply it to everything around you and then you use it during gemstone windows.

You want to prioritize targets that die quickly so you get resets.

[tribal mauve]

what is the gemstone rule ? you only spam sbs during it ?

[limber lion]

Yes. You only use SBS during Gemstone windows, if every mob around your already have SBS on them.

You don't use it willy-nilly.

[alpine latch]

Although, if you're not using at all... willy nilly is probably a DPS increase.

I used to only use it once per fight

[limber lion]

Yeh, but no reason not to use them during Gemstone windows.

But yeh, don't let them cap and you're good.

[alpine latch]

Oh, 100%.

I have a bunch of stupid WAs I made for myself

When gemstone is up and I have 2 or more charges it flashes "dump time". One of my Outlaw ones says "CAST BTW" because I fat fingered BTE and it made me laugh

[limber lion]

:p yep, you evidently do some dumb stuff by playing the game so much. Happens to the best of us.

It's a learning experience for us all

[final star]

If it works for you

It works

[alpine latch]

I mean, it's getting me 95%+ item level parses and about 45% overall. Not bad for being under 210

[limber lion]

Keep it up

[alpine latch]

I have a few 100% item level parses. Not many 207s were killing 3 bosses in Mythic, lol

I got to 6500 on Huntsman and on my warlock I only did 6k. (I was REALLY bad on my Warlock, never again...)

[limber lion]

Yeah, you shouldn't really look into ilvl parses too much. They're not the best.

[alpine latch]

They aren't, but it's also good to know how I'm doing compared to equally geared people.

There's still plenty for my to get better with

I hit 211 after raid. At 211, I don't expect to be parsing

[limber lion]

Right, but it's not really a fair comparison. There's a lot of people being boosted and there's just simply very few people at that ilvl. Also I've seen people who are 210 ilvl with 233 weapons. I wouldn't call that a fair comparison to someone who has 213 weapons.

It's easy to inflate ilvl parses by just taking a piece or two off as well, which some people (albeit rarely) do.

Just joining a raid as a 210 ilvl in a raid full of mains at 225+ characters will inflate the parses, as the bosses will be cleared quicker and thus the dps will generally be higher.

[odd hazel]

i mean

considering that parses without equal item level show no consideration for anything equal to what someone of your ilvl can do. i'd rather do ilvl

i dont look into it much though, mainly use logs for how well im doing/etc

also

a lot of parses are terrible to get due to fight times/being gave 4 Pis

[tight ginkgo]

Isn't that another point in favor of overall parse, though? More data points make the noise less loud.

[ruby birch]

you can still parse high without pis or insanely short fight times

[odd hazel]

i guess, but comparing a 200 ilvl to 222 isnt great at the same time

[ruby birch]

you just wont be parsing 99 that easily

95+ is attainable on every fight without PI and with average fight times

[alpine latch]

Parses in general are bullshit. We all know that.

[odd hazel]

^

[ruby birch]

i dont think they're entirely bullshit

[alpine latch]

Entirely? No

65% bullshit? Yes

[odd hazel]

tbh, i just like logs to look at what i can do better

[ruby birch]

someone parsing 99s and 100s is definitely better than someone parsing below 80s

[alpine latch]

There's so much that goes into a parse that has literally nothing to do with you.

[ruby birch]

what is that so much

[limber lion]

Not really.

I have all 99's across the board

Did I just get lucky?

[ruby birch]

Cev is a perfect example of what is against what you're saying

[limber lion]

I'm 225 ilvl as well

[ruby birch]

He gets no PIs

[limber lion]

I have 226/220 weapons

[spice spire]

Nah, built different

[ruby birch]

he's bill dipperly

[limber lion]

Competing against people who have 229 ilvl

[alpine latch]

Oh, I'm sorry... I forgot kill speed has no impact on parse /s

[ruby birch]

Kill speed's impact isn't that significant

[limber lion]

Everything matters.

[alpine latch]

Literally everything matters.

[spice spire]

It definitely is

[alpine latch]

There's 19 other people that impact your parse

It's not JUST you

[spice spire]

3:59 kills are a feelsbad

[ruby birch]

it is significant at the very higher end

but like unless you're going for 99s and 100s, you cant sit here and say parses dont matter

[limber lion]

But it's not like you can't get 95's because "everyone has 229 ilvl and gets PI's"

[red bloom]

if you arent rank 1 are you even playing the game?

[ruby birch]

huh

[odd hazel]

yes but

lets take heroic

my fastest shriek kill?

is almost 4 minutes

[ruby birch]

okay

[odd hazel]

yours is 1:24

[ruby birch]

if you were to say heroic parses dont matter

i'd agree with you

[odd hazel]

your fastest sire?

4:30

mine? almost 8 minutes

[ruby birch]

that's literally impossible

[odd hazel]

Sire Denathrius
99 6,936.7 41 4:30 98 118.55 1

[proper tapir]

What's the point of waiting on gemstone phases for SBS dump?

[ruby birch]

okay not on mythic though

[spice spire]

Unethical parses in rogue chat

[stoic needle]

It's more damage

And more CP

[odd hazel]

yes, but im not mythic raiding so im doing whats equivalent to me

[ruby birch]

why do you care about parses so much then

heroic raids are pug content

[odd hazel]

its just the level of content im at. so its the only thing i have to compare to ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[ruby birch]

ofc people who tryhard to parse

are going to parse much higher than you, someone who isnt tryharding to parse

parse will give you a general idea

the people at the top of the ladder aren't going to make you parse 30s

there's a reason there's a MASSIVE gap between 75 parses and 95 parses

but between 75 and the lower bounds, there isn't really that gap

[odd hazel]

well yeah. but i fucking wish my kill times were 4:30 for sire

lmao

[ruby birch]

which again, you dont need to be parsing super high for anything in your life

[ruby birch]

why though

the fight isnt designed to be killed that fast

[odd hazel]

the memes honestly.

at this point

[red bloom]

cev, what was the timer on your first few kills on sire?

[odd hazel]

his average seems to be about 6minutes to 7:30 on heroic.

[frail fossil]

i have a 6 min sire kill

u can go faster than that tho

[odd hazel]

but

the difference between a 9minute kill and a 4:30 shows here

[red bloom]

my fastest is like 5.30 on hc

[frail fossil]

does it ? cuz a 4min sire kill if possible means u wont get to touch the adds more than a few seconds

so that's bad for ur parse

[red bloom]

but then ive got other pugs pushing that 7 minute mark just the skill level of the group youre with

[spice spire]

Yeah there’s a reason 4.5 and 6.5 kill are close but the 6.5 is ahead

But also based on numbers I’d assume these were carry runs

[frail fossil]

some fight parse rely on your raid grp not being very good

like inerva adds dying slowly

will result in better parse

since i'm in better guilds i literally cannot parse inerva higher than 95

cuz the adds literally disappear

same for council, if your group doesn't dps the waiter u have more time to pad them

hence better parse

[spice spire]

[red bloom]

im sure anyone can look through some 80-90 logs and see good players just from what they're doing on the kills

[frail fossil]

kill time is also not everything

[spice spire]

Padding is unethical tho

[frail fossil]

like for assassination a 3:50 min kill time

is worse

than a 4:20 one

[gusty mirage]

stares in receiving PIs 👀

[frail fossil]

even tho the 3:50 one is faster

[final star]

Or actually getting the adds helps to parse as assassination 😂 go from a 99 to 95 just skipping adds

[tight ginkgo]

pretty sure 420 is the best time.

[frail fossil]

how are the adds reducing ur parse ?

[gusty mirage]

is it unethical if you're the best boss damage in the raid?

[spice spire]

Based

[final star]

The opposite

They increase it

[frail fossil]

oh yeah sorry

misread

[final star]

[frail fossil]

but also as assa, if u dont have any add spawn

u'll be the first on the meter

[ruby birch]

the trick is to never press cloak when your group is immuning adds

[gusty mirage]

Look at this shit and tell me the assa rogues shouldn't get PI

[frail fossil]

assa rogue should not get pi

[ruby birch]

what fight is that

[frail fossil]

idk how that proves anything

[ruby birch]

council?

[spice spire]

No one should get PI

[gusty mirage]

boss damage on all kills that night

[ruby birch]

ohhh

[gusty mirage]

there was a different level of play in raid that night

[final star]

Just because you're doing the highest damage doesn't mean you get the most gain

[ruby birch]

true for classes that dont benefit from haste much

[gusty mirage]

there were 2 non-potatoes and 18 potatoes

[frail fossil]

i mean u playing with bad players isn't an argument for pi on an assa rogue

on a even matched raid group

[spice spire]

Whispyr and who else?

[inland oasis]

PI should be on warlock

[frail fossil]

u would not PI an assa rogue

on prog i mean

[gusty mirage]

the spriest

[frail fossil]

on farm no one cares

[ruby birch]

PI a sub rogue

ShT stonks

[final star]

A dk just has to press army for it to be more valuable 😂😂

[frail fossil]

might aswell PI a blood dk

[iron orchid]

Let's just PI the BDK

[gusty mirage]

I have to retain my title of Trashmaster

tbh I think PI should be changed to a personal buff for priests

[ruby birch]

it used to be

[spice spire]

It’s not that bad lol. We do like haste

[odd hazel]

I just

[gusty mirage]

so this PIing for parses and shit stops

[ruby birch]

but they keep changing it

[odd hazel]

Want 1 Pi in my life

[red bloom]

as an ex spriest main, i refuse to give my PI

[frail fossil]

but like i dont see how u doing more dmg than a spriest is an argument of pi being better on assa

[gusty mirage]

just come and raid with us and hope you win the PI lotto on every pull

makes your rotation great when you don't know if you're getting it

and you're pooling for a shiv and then you suddenly energy cap because you got an unannounced PI

[odd hazel]

I just wanna stab stab faster

[gusty mirage]

it's GREAT

[final star]

That's just bad priests

Rather than bad design

[odd hazel]

But if I was a spriest I would keep it tbh

[tight ginkgo]

the real flex is to demand pi and macro all your abilities to /cancelaura

[frail fossil]

as spriest u should not give it

[final star]

Spriest keeps PI

[inland oasis]

Affli is the dps spec that benefits the most from pi, certainly no sin rogue kek

[spice spire]

The ultimate chad move

[red bloom]

I have a cool weak aura for when I get PI as well, plz PI me

[frail fossil]

pi enjoyer

pathetic

[spice spire]

They have a healing priest as well iirc

[spice spire]

Toxic. And this is why you’re bullied flower

[final star]

Gonna start council prog this week pog

[ruby birch]

i hate council as sin

with a passion

[frail fossil]

i'm toxic to whoever start preaching about PI

[frail fossil]

dont play council as sin

[ruby birch]

unironically would rather play sub on council every time

[final star]

Just hit boss

[iron orchid]

I feel that

[frail fossil]

literally the worse of the 3 specs

on council

fight me

[gusty mirage]

its okay he doesn't understand sarcasm, that develops after you turn 14 I think

[frail fossil]

say something cringe, haha bro it's sarcasm

[gusty mirage]

haha bro read above that comment

[frail fossil]

i cant read

[final star]

Hoping like 30 pulls

For a kill on council

[ruby birch]

[gusty mirage]

context my boy

[spice spire]

This is actually an ongoing meme with him flower he randomly got PI one day and wondered why

Then he woke up realizing that he was unethical and had to put a stop to it. Like the true king he is

[ruby birch]

what are average pulls for a council kill on prog

[gusty mirage]

I mean I'm not going to say no to it tbh but it's super questionable that we're not PIing our DKs on pull w/ lust or our affi locks

I did message the priest and be like bruh if we're lusting pull and you're not PIing our DK you're legit trolling

[frail fossil]

i had like 115 before the nerf

[ruby birch]

i didnt really do council prog, i killed it on a reclear

[final star]

this is our current progs

[gusty mirage]

lust + PI on army is a degenerate amount of damage

[final star]

65-111 is average

[gusty mirage]

tf you doing

[ruby birch]

how far have you gotten on council with 5 pulls

[ruby birch]

that's not bad at all

maybe you can get it in under 30

worst fight in the whole raid though imo

[final star]

[ruby birch]

either that or SLG with 1 commando spawning

[final star]

SLG stinks

[ruby birch]

pool for aoe

1 commando

[final star]

average for xymox is 34-67 wipes

we had 13

[odd hazel]

Hoping to get into mythic next raid, doubt I’ll get far enough for the gear to matter this raid

[final star]

[odd hazel]

[ruby birch]

tbf xymox is

VERY rng

like even on reclears it can be worse than prog

portal > ghost > portal > ghost > dot

smile

[final star]

yeah dps-wise it's rng af

[iron orchid]

Xy mox is the adaptability check boss

You need to be sure you have 8 people with at leat half a brain

[final star]

we have a solid team of capable players

[iron orchid]

Which is not common

[final star]

so that helps prog a bit

[ruby birch]

i used to do seeds as night fae so i found xymox a lot more chill

because i knew if someone died

i could be backup

but now i literally cant do that

[gusty mirage]

half our not-brain dead players took a break and now raid is just sad

[final star]

we only had one of our mages alter time once with a seed

all of our raiders just came back to the game, hence only 3 weeks of raiding

[ruby birch]

its a good time to prog i think, a lot of the annoying shit mechanics were nerfed or retuned

[iron orchid]

Half our not brain dead player were just toxic, so they don't raid anymore, and we have no roster to end this patch

[final star]

tbf a lot of our raiders are ex-wf/top 10 raiders

[iron orchid]

Stuck with like 60 to 80 pulls on p3 sludge for like 1 month now

[ruby birch]

you mean p3 as in

going from p3 to p4

or p2 to p3

[dawn ivy]

either way thats rough

[iron orchid]

We had only one to two raid nights in the past month

[ruby birch]

is your raid team swapping positions on p4

[final star]

[ruby birch]

melee gets massively shafted after p3

entire room is rubble

[gusty mirage]

It kinda sucks to go from downing bosses faster than the average amount of pulls to an absolute shit show

[iron orchid]

Yes that's it

[final star]

we cutting out hc now cos people are geared enough

so hopefully prog goes faster now

[ruby birch]

you have time to down denathrius

get it

[final star]

for sure

may be tight but even a week a boss

it's done

[ruby birch]

if you guys are all vocal and coordinated enough, sludge wont be the pos wall that it is on prog

[iron orchid]

Same mood here, we recruited new players around 9.0.5, and down like 4 bosses in 1 week, then we got stuck on council for a while, and now we just cannot raid anymore

[final star]

the guild I was in before I swapped was hard stuck SLG prog

raid loggers only

and it died yesterday

[pure moth]

Officers in my guild stopped logging in over a month ago. A few people left, now I think im the only one who still logs in these days.

[final star]

dodged a bullet there

[gusty mirage]

we also have that issue, about 70% of the raid legit just raid logs and maybe does 1 key a week

[final star]

zero effort = zero guild

fax

[ruby birch]

ive been trying to get a 226 mists chest piece for so long

all i get are stupid fucking daggers

my collection of 226 mists daggers

[final star]