assassination

[burnt star]

and u will see pi will pull ahead

[compact pumice]

Well, if all classes pop stuff on pull with BL or within 20 seconds of pull it wouldn't be too hard to set a rule when to get PI I don't think

[burnt star]

parsing is about that 1 time where u both get lucky and get pi

[sullen pagoda]

yeah but more parses means lower rank needed to get a 99%

[burnt star]

u can get pi and get unlucky.. u will be close to someone with higher uptime/luckier crit etc

[sullen pagoda]

like getting top 50 log is barely orange for assa on some bosses

[burnt star]

on mythic yep

[hollow escarp]

I got gray parse on rank 34

beginning of patch

[sullen pagoda]

im only talking mythic ye, hc is basically playing blind and u get a 99

[hollow escarp]

or last patch I htink

[gusty mirage]

Yeah but we still love you

[low girder]

depends on how well said APL is maintained

[burnt star]

not really lol

we still lack parse on heroic

top 100 is not even 99

[sullen pagoda]

with 10k parses you need to only get top 100

[hollow escarp]

I can't get more than 95 on Sire

hc

[sullen pagoda]

most good players dont bother with hc parses, you either boost hc for some gold or dont go hc at all

[burnt star]

that is true though

[storm hedge]

I lack the gear to get high parses. Got a 97 ilvl parse on huntsman mythic but it was just 88 parse overall

[burnt star]

problem with wow.. is u cant really "parse mythic"

[sullen pagoda]

i havent done 1 hc raid on rogue in 8.1

[hollow escarp]

unless you clear the raid in first 1-2 months

[burnt star]

1. lack of data, 2) lack of reclearing potential 3) u can get coked by your raid not wanting u to parse. but just want to speed reclear as much as possible

good thing with ff14 about parsing in high content.. u can reclear the raid as much as u want

and u can play with other.. they simply get no reward if u join them

[sullen pagoda]

ofcourse all of those are affecting your log but 99 is still perfectly possible without PI

[hollow escarp]

smart people don't look that way about mythic parses though

it's not like you are a bad player if you parsed low on a fight where you had to hold CDs for the sake of easy kill

[sullen pagoda]

well yeah

[burnt star]

ur a bad player cose u parsed 75

but wait

there'S only 100 parse..

so u are top 25..

[sullen pagoda]

yep thats early prog / not popular class

but most bosses now have decent amount of kills

[burnt star]

look at this druid. they have 30k parse.. he did top 500. and is 90.. he must be good

[hollow escarp]

most people are aware of that though

I've been told that I get good parses because nobody plays sin

[burnt star]

rofl

159 assa parse on slg

[hollow escarp]

there are 2 people on my realm who killed SLG as sin

one of them had single target talents lol

[sullen pagoda]

for mage you also have to consider the factor of most good mage players are playing the best spec aka fire so competition actually is lower for parsing good somewhat @hollow escarp

[hollow escarp]

yep

[sullen pagoda]

yea i killed SLG as sin with full ST talents also

kek

[hollow escarp]

as reclear I think it's w/e

[burnt star]

i played ct 😉 and zoldyc

[sullen pagoda]

i barely got my gm to bring my rogue in

being good at unholy dk is a pain when u want to play ur rogue

[hollow escarp]

watched Zerocool killing SLG, got 7k dps and a lot of mechanics

ohh

top is CT

2nd is full ST

[sullen pagoda]

i did only 6.2k with full ST

but i just cba padding just want to kill it and be over

[hollow escarp]

that's good though

[sullen pagoda]

or id be doing those cheeky bleeds on commandos in transition if you know what i mean

[hollow escarp]

don't know yet

[burnt star]

our outlaw rogue barely beat me

[sullen pagoda]

cuz we do the "afk until 5 commandos" and then blast them all down

and then u see some peoples dps just rising

[hollow escarp]

look at this lol https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/c7jMDdHp8r31x6kJ#fight=16&type=damage-done

[sullen pagoda]

[hollow escarp]

sin rogue over MM hunters

[burnt star]

11 min kill

wtf..

[hollow escarp]

first kill

[lethal heart]

11 minutes

😅

[burnt star]

our first kill was 9 min

no aoe padding

[hollow escarp]

[burnt star]

bring 2nd goliath into intermission

[lethal heart]

my 1st kill ever

was 11 minutes

in january

[sullen pagoda]

@lethal heart hunter sinner

😠

[burnt star]

o ya.. we just killed tuesday

we only raid 2days/week

[hollow escarp]

hey, for alliance it's still january @lethal heart

[lethal heart]

my hunter parse in january was grey

now its orange

[sullen pagoda]

was it 0% like one mage

[lethal heart]

[hollow escarp]

there are quite a few 11 min kill

on first SLG page

[sullen pagoda]

wtf do u do for 11 min is that some add padding

[mighty elm]

Crying in 12 minutes kill time

[hollow escarp]

I watched their kill, they were holding dps

well, that's a good kill time for dot classes

because dots don't kill the mobs

[burnt star]

ya exacly

[hollow escarp]

so the worse your guild is, the better parse you can get as sin rogue there

[burnt star]

everyone holding

but ur applying dot

cose.. anyways u cant really aoe burst if u have no dot on

[hollow escarp]

well, even if we want, we can't

[burnt star]

"u cant really aoe burst" period

our only aoe burst is zoldyc sub 30%

hahaha

or ns + ma + vanish + ct

[hollow escarp]

but you also need dps in last phase

[lethal heart]

assa is just bad for this fight and you shdouldnt play it if your guild actually struggles with shields damage

[burnt star]

au contraire..

zoldyc

is perfect for that fight

better then outlaw

for that mechanic

[hollow escarp]

don't know the mechanics yet

[burnt star]

its less aoe overall

[hollow escarp]

is shield at low hp? just like the trash mobs?

[burnt star]

but its better sub 30% mechanic damage

[lethal heart]

at 20%

sub 20%

[hollow escarp]

and you also get winds?

[lethal heart]

you dont get winds from commandos

[burnt star]

i did way more shield damage then the outlaw

[lethal heart]

only from skirmishers

[sullen pagoda]

nah winds is from other mobs

[hollow escarp]

ok

[sullen pagoda]

zoldycks does give 30% bleed/poison dmg in shield but compare that to MA KS pretty sure assa doesnt stand a chance @burnt star

[sullen pagoda]

ofcourse if you doing the "gather all up then aoe"

[burnt star]

thats zoldyc shield damage vs ma/ks

[hollow escarp]

it's a bit anecdotal

[sullen pagoda]

if you are doing slow one by one assa can be better

[lethal heart]

100k shield damage is laughable

i was doing like 200-250k as MA KS outlaw

[sullen pagoda]

how you deal with commandos @burnt star

[burnt star]

i mean... that depend of your guild

[lethal heart]

and players

[burnt star]

we hold cd

[drifting cloud]

his guild is like rank30

[hollow escarp]

my play is to play first phase as outlaw and when we consistently go to last phase, to play sin

[sullen pagoda]

trust me

dont play around p3

that phase is just a joke

[lethal heart]

p3 is free unless you have special people taht will kill you with blades in wrong spot

or wont soak

which is just so troll

[sullen pagoda]

yep dmg is last of problems p3

[hollow escarp]

so not free

[lethal heart]

because you have wa that covers like 97% of your screen

and tells you what mark to soak

[drifting cloud]

but tbh with latest shield nerfs

nobody should be struggling

ye sure sometimes they get to around 1s maybe even lower but hey thats what the nerf was for

[lethal heart]

i think biggest nerf to the fight is 80% healing reduction instead of 100%

[hollow escarp]

probably gonna swap to necrolord by then

[burnt star]

but ya.. your overall shield damage depend on how people burst on shield

[hollow escarp]

well, Ion's guild is still stuck at SLG so we might see another nerf soon

[burnt star]

but by saying its lower then outlaw.. its not always right

[hollow escarp]

and some encounter designer fired

[quasi ledge]

Hardest part is getting people not to DPS Commandos if you're holding/stacking up for AoE

[lethal heart]

yes but outlaw damage is all done in your ma/ks window

as assa you kinda pray shield is up for the max duration because you dont have any burst

unlike specs that do good on shield damage

like mm hunter

and idk wahts good nowadays for that even

[hollow escarp]

so you play sin for fun and outlaw for prog

[lethal heart]

right now in my guild mages/hunters/ele shaman are top

on shield

but yea pretty much ^

[sullen pagoda]

@hollow escarp yeah outlaw is definitely the play on prog

[lethal heart]

just play w/e you like my point is assa shouldnt be above outlaw on shield damage pretty much under any circumstance

[quasi ledge]

If you have those classes, just play Assass. You still need Goliath and boss damage

[hollow escarp]

we have 3 mages, 3 hunters

[quasi ledge]

If that's what you prefer, obviously

[lethal heart]

if your guild doesnt struggle with shield damage you can play anything

doesnt matter

[sullen pagoda]

@hollow escarp yea shield wont be your problem

unless they pepega

[hollow escarp]

erruptions will

[peak smelt]

its one fight that outlaw is clearly better on in almost every way

[lethal heart]

ye it is

[peak smelt]

hook is really good on that fight too

[lethal heart]

shadowstep vs hook is kinda same

the big advantage is that hook gets reduced cooldown because of relentless blade

or whatever that passive is called

and sprint aswell

[peak smelt]

hook you can instantly drop eruptions, you can hook to drop orb if you already used gate

[lethal heart]

so that is a big conveniance

you shouldnt ever pick up 2 orbs really

yo ushouldnt have to

[hollow escarp]

door of shadows as well

if I don't swap to necro

[lethal heart]

but yea i see

for me biggest thing about outlaw is just big uptime on sprint/cdr on hook

kinda op

dont have to think about it since its always up

[hollow escarp]

I noticed that on HC Sire, hook is always up for knockbacks

while shadowstep

[drifting cloud]

youre always welcome to go sub

[lethal heart]

😓

[prisma perch]

does doom work better this week than zold?

[hollow escarp]

even if it's tyranical, in M+ you still go aoe build

so doomblade might be better than on fortified weeks, but overall zoldyck/ma still better

[prisma perch]

zold still 2-2-3-2-1-2-3

alright?

[hollow escarp]

can play vigor as well

and Iron wire is still valuable in M+

[gloomy fern]

joins a log run for hc, 25 ppl all 225+ and like minimum 6/10M and cant get past huntsman 4 dks in group nobody can grip shades and tanks dont know how to move boss on them

[stoic needle]

Only in top/sd/pf

[compact pumice]

Just wondering why in particular those dungeons?

[stoic needle]

Zoldyck is useless on the last boss of sanguine depths

And all 3 dungeons have small pulls that are like 3 targets

And one of which needs to be prioed down

Tho tbf dashing is gonna be way better in those situations honestly

Because it makes your poisons crit on the extra targets

[frail fossil]

yeah i'd rather go dashing than doomblade

in those dungeons

[hollow escarp]

or MA

[frail fossil]

u could also play MA

[stoic needle]

I'm gonna craft a 190 after I max my celerity and try it out

[frail fossil]

🤝

[stoic needle]

NS MA is so much fun man wtf

[hollow escarp]

I was tempted to craft dashing and play poison bomb, master poisoner, but the sims don't look that great

[stoic needle]

I need to play it more in high keys but I might be a full MA convert

[hollow escarp]

the most frustrating thing about playing MA on sin is that it's so much better on outlaw

[stoic needle]

Is it tho

[hollow escarp]

cdr

[stoic needle]

?

Oh you mean more vanishes?

[hollow escarp]

yes

[stoic needle]

That's fair

NS CT might be more dps than MA KS

Like as a specific combo

[gusty mirage]

well yeah

😛

[hollow escarp]

my favorite sub trait is the one that gives CDR on Shadow Blades

it's not the best though

[ruby birch]

stiletto staccato?

[hollow escarp]

yes

[stoic needle]

Imagine if shadow blades was an actually good cd

[hollow escarp]

I like cdr mechanics a lot

[ruby birch]

yeah its nice on fights like sludge

otherwise it is dogshit :(

[stoic needle]

Cdr is kinda lazy when they just give it to everything

[ruby birch]

for some reason, i feel like the higher CD a damage cooldown, the shittier it is

[hollow escarp]

army?

[stoic needle]

I feel the opposite actually

[ruby birch]

ok with some exceptions i guess

[stoic needle]

Combust is the only outlier

[ruby birch]

vendetta is 2 min too but is pretty strong

dark soul im p sure is also 2 min

[hollow escarp]

combust is 2 min cd though with 10 sec duration

but that's a talent

[ruby birch]

combust is 12 sec duration

[hollow escarp]

12 sec now

[ruby birch]

is there even a competitor with dark soul

[stoic needle]

Shadowblades is just unbelievably shit

[hollow escarp]

probably not

[ruby birch]

meta is underwhelming

very underwhelming

[stoic needle]

Long cd and bad effect

Is it? I thought meta was big

[ruby birch]

demonic makes meta feel like it is useless

[hollow escarp]

^

[stoic needle]

What does that do?

[ruby birch]

DH's use meta as an eyebeam reset p much

what? demonic?

[stoic needle]

Yeah

[ruby birch]

puts you into meta for casting eye beam

[stoic needle]

Yeah see that's exactly what I mean

[hollow escarp]

isn't momentum simming better than demonic?

[ruby birch]

momentum always sims better

[hollow escarp]

ohh

[ruby birch]

but it's hard to use

[hollow escarp]

it's just not practical

yeah

[ruby birch]

so people just play demonic

[stoic needle]

When you have high uptime on your cd they make it low impact

That's why ar is underwhelming

[ruby birch]

i mean

mages that take kindling

sadge

[stoic needle]

But mages are just an outlier as a class

The rules don't apply to them

It's dumb af

[ruby birch]

does spriest even have cds other than void form

im p sure most of their cds are like sub 1 min

[pastel shale]

PI

[stoic needle]

I just wish vendetta did something in aoe

[hollow escarp]

I don't think that will ever change

[weak horizon]

Any of y'all ballers know if there's a way to sim a covenant change on raidbots?

[hollow escarp]

and I'm fine with it

[stiff cave]

Hi. Im using Quantum device trinket and i was wondering do i always hold trinket and flagellation to use with Vendetta or use all 3 off CD since the CDS are 1min30 , 2min and 3min ?

[ruby birch]

top gear

[stoic needle]

I'm not because I want an aoe cd

[hollow escarp]

play outlaw

[stoic needle]

They don't have one either

[hollow escarp]

vendetta by definition should be a single target cd

[weak horizon]

on topgear i see the option for unlocking all souldbinds. will changing to a different covenant's soulbind automatically also sim with that covenant's ability?

[ruby birch]

play sub

[hollow escarp]

^

[pastel shale]

Outlaw's existence is an AoE CD

[hollow escarp]

shadow blades works on aoe

[ruby birch]

i believe so

[stoic needle]

Outlaw fundamentally basically doesn't have cds

Where's my Poisons of Order

Convoke the poison bomb

[pastel shale]

Sin should have 0 downsides or weaknesses tbh, give them shuriken storm too

new assassination only leggo, jack of all trades

[hollow escarp]

Seli is gonna play a HoA key with NS build

[ruby birch]

randomly casts 5 envenoms and 6 CTs

[gusty mirage]

his reasoning behind using deeper instead of mfd makes a lot of sense tbh

[hollow escarp]

yeah

never thought about it

also on ST you still have vanish

[stoic needle]

Why is he using deeper instead of MfD?

[hollow escarp]

because he is starting pulls with full cp bar

[gusty mirage]

his point was you don't need to MFD CT because if you'd be carrying over combo points from the previous pull

[hollow escarp]

so 6 cp snapshoted are stronger

with NS

[stoic needle]

Yeah I guess if your tank is pulling properly

[hollow escarp]

probably for pugs MFD is safer

[gusty mirage]

yeah mfd makes it a guarantee if you pug with shitters like me

[polar cape]

Prob not worh in pugs or with troll tank

[gusty mirage]

lmao

still waiting for my tank to come out of his slumber so I can actually run assa keys (:

[stoic needle]

I hope I get more mastery gear in vault

[gusty mirage]

I hope you get everything you ever want osh

[stoic needle]

I need a 203 bell

I regret turning down that bis crit mastery chest 2x

I'm never gonna see it again

[gusty mirage]

did you pick something you still use?

each time?

[stoic needle]

Yeah

[gusty mirage]

then fuck it man

lol

[stoic needle]

But the memes...

[gusty mirage]

there's plenty of time for memes

you have 8 more vaults before 9.1

[stoic needle]

[gusty mirage]

NS/CT/MA Leggo is an impressive amount of damage tbh

[stoic needle]

Yeah I really wanna run it in a 17 or 18 and see how much damage I can do

15-20k dps on a pull seems like the best of all the rogue specs

[hollow escarp]

I've seen 20k burst in MA/KS

on Echelon I waited for Vanish CT when mobs spawned

for ultimate padding

[stoic needle]

Yeah but I mean

15k for the whole pull

Not just burst

Yeah that's the only thing I don't like about the ns ma build you kinda have to hold vanish sometimes

[hollow escarp]

we already did that with subt

or at least we should do that

[gusty mirage]

I hope those empowered conduits we heard about gives maim, mangle an extra CP from garrote

[prisma perch]

Is this accurate for m+?

[gusty mirage]

er

garrote

[teal bloom]

Is this ns build just for MA legendary?

[prisma perch]

zoldyck

[hollow escarp]

NW

[prisma perch]

without items

[stoic needle]

What dungeon

[hollow escarp]

it's necrotic wake

[stoic needle]

And what key level

[prisma perch]

I did not have the orb

[gusty mirage]

that the goliath buff

[prisma perch]

i didnt pick up any item tbh

[gusty mirage]

btw not the orb

[stoic needle]

What key level?

[prisma perch]

15

+2

[hollow escarp]

that's how I realised it's Necrotic

[stoic needle]

Idk you should be able to do more than that overall but it's on the right track

[prisma perch]

but wanna know if my dmg is right distributed

ya im ilv 214

[stoic needle]

Garotte and ct should be #1&2

Work on your ct uptime

[polar cape]

Well if pack instant die CT being lower a bit is normal

[stoic needle]

Rupture could be higher too

[prisma perch]

our demo did hard burst

[gusty mirage]

need the mobs to live long enough for your bleeds to do their thing

[gloomy fern]

not using mind numb raging weeks

[hollow escarp]

we are assa

[prisma perch]

i used mind numb

i used shiv only for soothing

[gusty mirage]

shiv's a major dps cd for assa

[hollow escarp]

tbf, on aoe, might as well keep shiv for soothing

[stoic needle]

Yeah it's not huge in aoe

[prisma perch]

yes but we didnt have any soothe so I had to

[stoic needle]

I hold it too this week

[gusty mirage]

pump the prio target

[polar cape]

Naah just put crippling and tell your tank to kite <.<

[gusty mirage]

[prisma perch]

xD

[hollow escarp]

most tanks prefer crippling though

mages love kiting with flame patch

[stoic needle]

I need to make a cast sequence to swap between crippling and mn

And bind it

[hollow escarp]

I have all poisons on 1 keybind

F2

[gusty mirage]

I just use opie

for my poisons

[hollow escarp]

same

[gusty mirage]

1 bind for all ze poisons

[hollow escarp]

it's annoying on outlaw/sub

as it shows poison 2 times

[gusty mirage]

hm

I only have that issue w/ assassination ironically

where it shows deadly twice

[hollow escarp]

ohh yeah

with assa

[gusty mirage]

and idk why it does that

[hollow escarp]

the other 2 just have deatly poison

[gusty mirage]

yeah they have wound/mind/cripp/instant

[hollow escarp]

it's fine though

[gusty mirage]

it started doing that in SL pre-patch

and it tilts me

[hollow escarp]

I just cast one of the 2 deadly poisons

[gusty mirage]

just double up deadly 4head

[prisma perch]

is stichflehs signet not our bis m+ ring???

[hollow escarp]

is that the crit heavy one?

[prisma perch]

It has mainstat haste then vers

[gusty mirage]

that's the haste/vers one

[stoic needle]

Nah

[hollow escarp]

that sims 2nd for me in dslice

[gusty mirage]

you want crit/master or crit/vers for m+

[hollow escarp]

223 version

[gusty mirage]

or even crit/haste

[prisma perch]

i play mainly raid

[stoic needle]

Crit mastery and crit haste

I mean I guess crit vers would work too

But for a m+ specific ring crit mastery is definitely bis

[gusty mirage]

in m+ haste loses a lot of value because generally stuff doesn't live as long

[stoic needle]

I think it's good to have some so you don't completely suck on bosses

But it's less of a priority for sure

[gusty mirage]

I miss the bfa days of running 7% base haste in keys

[prisma perch]

My current stats are 21crit 16 haste 33 mastery 12vers

[gusty mirage]

literally only haste I got was from the heart of azeroth

[stoic needle]

That's pretty good stats for m+

I have 31% crit 18% haste 23% mastery 8% vers

I want to drop some haste for vers and mastery

[prisma perch]

wow high crit

[stoic needle]

Yeah I got really lucky with good crit items in vault

[prisma perch]

Hoping to get my 2nd myth vault

[stoic needle]

I've never had a mythic vault

Probably won't get one for the whole tier

[hollow escarp]

already extending?

[stoic needle]

Cuz my guild is extendo

[prisma perch]

oh

[hollow escarp]

it sucks

[prisma perch]

same

I main havoc and assa for shadowlands currently

[gusty mirage]

oh so you've had a sad first few months of the expac

like a REALLY sad first few months

lol

[stoic needle]

If I can get ce I'll be happy

[gusty mirage]

I'm so sick of these covenant campaigns for alts, I'd literally pay blizzard $20 to just skip this shit on alts

[stoic needle]

5/10 CE

[gusty mirage]

still counts 🙂

[hollow escarp]

yep

[ruby birch]

havoc and sub

[hollow escarp]

10/10 is a climb, some people fall on the way and you need replacements

[gusty mirage]

there was like a couple of weeks where sub had false hope

[heavy trail]

For keys is it a massive difference to choose to put sinful over lightless ? just wondering I will share the weapon for pvp too 🙂

[ruby birch]

people thought sub was good at the beginning

idk how

[gusty mirage]

I think its cuz assa was just horribly undertuned

[subtle tundra]

cause it was better than the other specs

[gusty mirage]

and you either love or hate outlaw

[ruby birch]

outlaw was still better than it

[prisma perch]

sub was also in bfa strong at first

[ruby birch]

sub wasnt strong in bfa ever

it was strong on zul

one fight

[hollow escarp]

^

[gusty mirage]

remember that ONE boss that made blizzard break the spec for the entire expac?

instead of.... fixing the boss fight?

[prisma perch]

when it started it had high burst

[ruby birch]

sub wasnt even that strong in antorus

[heavy trail]

Sub seems a bit less involved then assassin too not as much fun to play in m+ anyway

[polar cape]

Still paying my zull tax every yrs

[ruby birch]

[gusty mirage]

"We designed this boss without realizing rogues were a thing, so we're just going to break sub. Enjoy the expac with 2 specs rogues"

[polar cape]

Worst part of it is antorus speed skill used that on couple fight

[ruby birch]

i wonder when sub will be good again

[gusty mirage]

when blizzard figure out where they want the spec to go

lol

[stoic needle]

My guild only formed halfway through the tier and they're already 7/10 so I'll see how the first bit of 9.1 goes before I decide if I want to move on or not

[ruby birch]

thats really good

[gusty mirage]

how many nights do you guys raid ? @stoic needle

[stoic needle]

Yeah My thoughts exactly

2

[gusty mirage]

yeah that's really good

[hollow escarp]

2 is great

[gusty mirage]

we'd be 7/10 possible 8/10 if we didn't have roster issues recently, and we got our roster solid by the end of January. So we had a bit of a head start and we were above the average pace

[stoic needle]

I'm about to go back to college I don't really have time for more than 2

[prisma perch]

and u r 5/10?

[gusty mirage]

someone suggested raiding 4 nights a week at the start of 9.1 I told him the moment we start raiding more than twice a week is the moment they find another rogue

We ain't getting world first or hall of fame, there's no reason to raid 4 nights a week

[stoic needle]

I'm 2/10

I was in a guild with my old classic guildmates that died when I was 5/10h

I pugged aotc and 2/10m and got into this 7/10m guild

[prisma perch]

dam my first guild also split up

and now they stopped raiding?

[stoic needle]

The classic guild also exploded last week

So I'm finally free of the classic curse

I don't think I want to do tbc tbh

I've grown to enjoy how streamlined retail is

[hollow escarp]

I think I also need jesus

[stoic needle]

My classic warrior has like 90 and my hunter has like 70

[hollow escarp]

100 days in Legion, 100 in BFA, now 45 in SL

[stoic needle]

But like 30% of that was afking in AV queues

[wild lion]

sub was broken in beta but got nerfed like hell

[hollow escarp]

it was bugged

[stoic needle]

Bring back 60% akaaris

[soft shale]

looking away with like 1300 days

.<

[stoic needle]

I feel like if I play tbc I'll do nothing but play wow for another year+ and I'd like to actually play some other games sometimes

And make music again

[potent rune]

isnt that the dream?

[gusty mirage]

tbh the nostalgia of classic wearing out early kinda makes me not want to even bother with tbc classic

[stoic needle]

I enjoyed classic a lot but the systems design was utter dogshit to play long term

Tbc will be better, but I'm afraid it won't be enough

[gusty mirage]

I had the dream of playing tbc arena again

[stoic needle]

Yeah I think I'm just kinda done with wow pvp

Tbc arena is unbalanced af

[gusty mirage]

but then I remember some matchups were literally 1 hour games

[stoic needle]

So is retail lol

[gusty mirage]

no dampening

[stoic needle]

I want warglaives on my warrior

[gusty mirage]

I got the glaives on my rogue and suffered through 6 hours of BT timewalking last night to get the mog for my DH

and I'm now dead on the inside.

[stoic needle]

Pog

I wish you could mog the glaives on rogues

[hollow escarp]

it's 200k gold on EU

[gusty mirage]

tbh I was tempted to just buy it

because the pugs I had were el terribly

[hollow escarp]

I wanted to boost black temple but I deleted my azerite armor

[gusty mirage]

yeah I didn't have any azerite gear but I still had my mechagon trinket

[hollow escarp]

and it's kinda needed

[gusty mirage]

free 5k damage on a 2 min cd

[hollow escarp]

I used Amanthul's

[gusty mirage]

also used the glaives for extra padding

[stoic needle]

I'm tempted to do some wqs for some azerite armor

[limber lion]

Better of doing dungeons tbh, you unlock the last row only on epic azerite armor

And not sure if you can get epic ones from wq's

Probably from the boss ones

[stoic needle]

Hmm that makes sense

Maybe farm some transmog at the same time

[gusty mirage]

you can from the emissaries still I think

[limber lion]

Yeh that's true!

[hollow escarp]

nazjatar vendor

[ruby birch]

did someone say, azerite gear

[frail fossil]

drest trinket in pvp

[hollow escarp]

Timewalking set with no azerite armor yet

[ruby birch]

BFA things

[hollow escarp]

need more 3 socket gear

[ruby birch]

this char is untouched from bfa

[hollow escarp]

sometimes I wish I kept my characters like that

and start fresh on a new expac

[ruby birch]

i level up chars to cap before new xpac

then play on them in the new xpac

and leave my old capped characters for way later

[frail fossil]

does essences work in timewalking ?

[hollow escarp]

yes

[ruby birch]

yes

essences work everywhere except shadowlands

[hollow escarp]

so rogues can heal the boss in ICC now

[ruby birch]

ye

[stoic needle]

Do the fangs of the father still work?

[ruby birch]

🥲

[hollow escarp]

no, but they have sockets

[stoic needle]

[hollow escarp]

amanthul has 4 stats

and looks cool

[neat jacinth]

Hey guys, one simple question. How can i see the DPS for a dungeon in warcraftlogs? The numbers on WCL always seem to be very low, because it counts the whole dungeon as one fight

[stoic needle]

I farmed those things and don't even use the transmog

[stoic needle]

Technically it counts the out of combat time and details only counts in combat time

Just add like ~1k to the overall

[hollow escarp]

you can set details to show out of combat dps

[neat jacinth]

Yeah, i k. But someone said you can filter by something like "effective" dps

[hollow escarp]

and considering the format of keystones, it's the correct way to look at M+ dps

[stoic needle]

Yeah but big number > small number

[neat jacinth]

where is the option ? 😄

[hollow escarp]

forgot exactly where, because I can't remember details options

[balmy condor]

as far as I know, logs don't have an option for it

[neat jacinth]

Ty guys anyway 🙂

One more question considering Assa: I really enjoy it playing it in M+. But i dont really know which one i like the most: Subtefurge / Vigor or Nightstalker / MfD. Playing with MA leggo atm. Sims always say, with MA Nightstalker MfD or even Subte/MfG is the best. But which one would you guys advice playing? Maybe even considering the ease of play, because my rogue is just my toon atm. Not playing him too much

[balmy condor]

subterfuge for sure

with zoldyck usually

[hollow escarp]

ma/ct is more fun for me but subterfuge is better for the group

[obtuse ruin]

Which is more damage fk groups

[balmy condor]

subterfuge usually

[neat jacinth]

Because of the silence, right?

[hollow escarp]

and more sustained damage

rather than burst

[balmy condor]

NS is only better if you have consistently large packs

[hollow escarp]

falls down a bit on bosses as well

[stoic needle]

Does it actually? I haven't noticed a boss dps difference between the two builds

[neat jacinth]

Allright. So you open with 3 Gar then, followed by FoK into CT and then going for as many ruptures and Gar as humanly possible while keeping up CT?

[stoic needle]

Yup

[balmy condor]

kinda

[neat jacinth]

And go for vanisch if the empowered Gar fall off? 🙂

[balmy condor]

if you have a shit ton of ruptures/garrotes out, or the mob is prio/low health, you would envenom

[neat jacinth]

ah, okay, also to keep up your SnD?

When do you drop SnD? 5+ targets?

[compact pumice]

Yeah envenom over SND if SND is falling off

[neat jacinth]

And is SnD like top prio on 3+ ? i mean if its not up from the previous pack f.w.

*f.e.

[compact pumice]

I think it is yeah. Well prob after the 3 Garrotes etc

But this doesn't matter too much, just make sure you keep it up and try to save CPs for it or make sure it lasts until next pack

[neat jacinth]

ty guys! 🙂

One last tiny question: Is Zoldycks for m+ mandatory or is MA just fine?

[hollow escarp]

both are fine

[sinful gate]

hey guys, why do ppl run internal bleeding for CN raid, is it bcs of adds or it works on bosses aswell (the bleed effect), kind new to assa that is why im askin

[hollow escarp]

MA is also good if you play subt build

is the kidney shot bleed a gain over any other finisher?

don't really think so

[sinful gate]

for the assa energy regen, cause it triggers venomous wounds on stunnable targets, but you can't actually stun a boss so that is why i am asking why ppl run on

only for adds or on bossfight aswell?

[alpine garden]

Does embrace of Kimbul count for Doomblade 🤔

[balmy condor]

it's a utility row

the damage doesn't matter

and you're not even going to cast kidney on purpose for the damage if you take it

[balmy condor]

no

[alpine garden]

Shame

[sinful gate]

so it doesn't matter what talent you chose ye?

[wild bobcat]

u almost always go internal bleeding just because its the most useful for raids

[balmy condor]

correct

[wild bobcat]

but ig it doesnt matter too much

[hollow escarp]

if we wanna min max, pretty sure prey on the week is more damage for the raid

thinking about dogs on huntsman now

but it's useless to even consider it

as they instantly die

[wild bobcat]

yeah thats fair

only been playing rogue for like 2 weeks never even taken prey on the weak ngl

[hollow escarp]

I'm defaulted on Iron Wire for m+

[wild bobcat]

mhm its really good with subterfuge

[uneven plume]

Outlaw discord is so toxic

Lmfaoo I’m staying here from now on

[hollow escarp]

is it though?

it was like that when sub was popular

lots of people

talking stuff

good and bad

[uneven plume]

Yah people are going nuts between raid and m+ outlaw rotation

[balmy condor]

that's the same thing tho pretty much

[hollow escarp]

for outlaw, I think so

unless you play ghostly strike

[compact pumice]

You add or change some things, Ghostly, KS for BR sometimes,

but overall it's too similar to call different

[shrewd night]

[heavy skiff]

we are starting progress on council tomorrow, any recommendations before we start?

[balmy condor]

don't die, play optimally

[keen dirge]

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I've read the guides and I don't see where this might be written. Shiv on CD, but are we trying to fit 2-3 Envenoms in that window as well, or no?

[hollow escarp]

if you like outlaw/sub, consider playing those over sin I didn't had a great time there

[royal lantern]

pray that your hunters and shamans find the interupt key in under 150pulls

[balmy condor]

you try to envenom during it, but it doesn't matter how many you fit

[heavy skiff]

wait sub > sin on council?

then im a happy boy

[hollow escarp]

not sure

but it's probably more fun to play than sin there, imo

[keen dirge]

okay, looking at logs I was seeing some rogues getting 2-3 so I assumed we were aiming for that, but it appears it's more of a "get as many as you can in" rather than a strict number

[balmy condor]

correct

[hollow escarp]

@heavy skiff but fun is not that relevant

[heavy skiff]

i dont want to mantain 5 bleed for the entire fight

[royal lantern]

sub can funnel i gues, but i wont make a big difference

[balmy condor]

the main thing is to just use shiv on cooldown

the envenoms are just icing

[heavy skiff]

just hurts to think about it

[solid hemlock]

i always pool for my shivs since i dont lose dmg as long as i dont cap energy and got me stuff rolling

[hollow escarp]

you don't have to though, you can go full single target and just swap attendant and stoneguard when they spawn and keep bleeds up on secondary boss for energy regen

if you wanna pad on waiters, feel free to pick CT

[balmy condor]

you should always pool on envenom as long as you're not in shiv/vend/flag

[keen dirge]

that was going to be my last dumb question before I leave you guys alone. In flag window I get 21-22 stacks, is this decent or am I misplaying?

187.25 item level - just hit 60 last night

[balmy condor]

thats okay

yeah thats fine

[keen dirge]

what would be like a "good flag" once I reach higher gear levels

[balmy condor]

26-28 is pretty solid

[keen dirge]

alrighty tyvm 🙂

[balmy condor]

np

[heavy skiff]

ok ty

gonna see how we do tomorrow

[hollow escarp]

you can try around, I tried outlaw a few pulls but then we tried single target boss rotation so I swapped to sin

in the end we killed it in normal rotation, with niklaus last

[frigid kestrel]

Been on Council for 4 days so far and got last boss to sub %5 3 times. Things I can tell you from prog so far.

1. Keep bleeds up on other bosses for energy regen.
2. If your on interrupts, making a macro will be super helpful.
3. Making a target macro for attendants is super helpful (third phase gets super hectic and for some people finding the attendants is hard)

Fight is scripted, but can get super hectic with some bad overlaps. If recital is coming up and a attendant is out, let range take care of attendant and group up for recital.

[heavy skiff]

ty going to make those macros

[gloomy fern]

only keep bleeds up on 1 other boss or ur just wasting

[frigid kestrel]

If you have boomies in your group you should ignore the first attendant, cause that one should be convoked

[frigid kestrel]

Ye this

[heavy skiff]

from what i read here argument was between 4 or 5 bleeds total

guess im gonna do 4 cause im lasy

[gloomy fern]

the potential gain u get from maximizing by adding another on a third target will 100% just make u miss more dmg on ur main target and ruin ur rotations etc

is not worth

[frigid kestrel]

Well technically it’s gonna be 5 if you keep bleeds up on two targets

Main target - Garrote, Doom, Rupture
Secondary Target - Garrote, Rupture

[shell ivy]

any recommended necro opener for raid?

full ST

[heavy skiff]

wait does doom give energy back?

[balmy condor]

same as every other covenanr

get sbs up early

[balmy condor]

no

[shell ivy]

i'm just lost af without flag

[balmy condor]

get maint up, including sbs, then cooldowns

that's the opener

[desert rain]

Mut snd mut garrot sbs rupt vend shiv and go on I guess

[balmy condor]

yeh that's fine

[shell ivy]

aight got it

thanks

[frozen rose]

Just started working on my rogue. Im necrolord but im reading that venthyr is better. Is it worth switching over to venthyr or is the difference negligible. (i primarily do M+)

[frigid kestrel]

No, but you will passively keep it up on your main target. It’s the reason I said technically.

[balmy condor]

I would not swap to venthyr for m+

[oak cypress]

so if im venthyr is it just alays better to go deeper stratagem or should i go vigor till my haste is higher

[limpid dew]

How much does Dashing Scoundrel change the feel of the spec? Doomblade just seems so passive, and considering the difference between the two is so minor from a dps perspective, I'm curious about a lego that might spices things up

[gloomy fern]

because dashing aint passive

[compact pumice]

They are equally passive in that sense?

[gloomy fern]

do food buff count towards iqd buff btw

as in if crit food makes it higher than haste do i get crit 100% during bl?

[shy dust]

Cabría does

Vantus^

So I believe that food buff would

[gloomy fern]

naruhodo

[stoic needle]

There aren't any legendaries that really spice things up for sin except for maybe duskwalkers

All of the best legendaries for all of our specs are boring unfortunately

[balmy condor]

most likely vigor in keys, deeper in raids

[oak cypress]

ok thanks Whispyr

[uneven plume]

Vigor on mythic sludge tho

[charred wraith]

Not necessarily

[stoic needle]

I think it's better imo

You can fit more finishers into the pillar with vigor

[limber lion]

I did some very janky custom sludge sims (again, very janky) and EP/Vig was always on top.

[stoic needle]

@marble hemlock my group doesn't have a very meta comp. Ele shaman + boomkin + myself. Do you think that ns/ma could have some value there because ele shamans don't burst as hard as fire mages or do you think I'm better off sticking with the normal build

Or just playing outlaw lmao

[marble hemlock]

lets see

you doing 100k dmg in your aoe opener

vs boomy or mage

doing 400k

[charred wraith]

sbs vs flag should be taken into account

[marble hemlock]

no matter what you do

you dont have aoe burst

you can pretend that you do, but you dont

[stoic needle]

Well the idea is that since we only have a boomkin and not a mage someone has to pick up the slack

[marble hemlock]

you cant pick up

the aoe burst capabilities of classes that are actually designed to have aoe burst

[limber lion]

I just play with Subt/Zoldyck on every dungeon nowadays. The solid, consistent damage is so much nicer, especially when the Mages/Boomies are waiting for cooldowns.

[marble hemlock]

the same way that playing MA+Killingspree didnt replace a hunter on commando dmg on SLG

its not what the spec is designed to do

trying to do front-loaded burst, is the exact opposite of what assa is designed to do

[limber lion]

It also helps on dungeons where tanks chain pull or spawn pride without allowing for restealths.

[marble hemlock]

and thats why itll never be good at it

ct does like

~4k dmg per target

with NS

and MA

youll maybe make that 7k

thats nothing

other classes have single abilities hit for 3times that

and youd have to sacrifice 2-3 talents and a legendary

just so it looks as if you ahve burst

and then you do 12k on a pack instead of 11.5k

while the monk or mage are doing 30

and as i said earlier, i dont even see NS+CT doing more dmg in your opener than triple garrote (let alone the benefit from having 3 iron wired enemies in each pack)

maybe its marginally better in your first 15seconds of the pull

but then you lose out on the last 30% entirely /shrug

[limber lion]

I think the comparison should also be made with keystone level in mind. Because honestly in under 20 keys you can probably play any setup and still do well.

[static pasture]

!bis

[marble hemlock]

i can see ma/mfd be decent for venthyr. maybe.

[stoic needle]

Yeah I get what you're saying

[limber lion]

Yeah, I played the NS/MFD with MA as Venthyr and it slaps on stuff like bosses and prides

[stoic needle]

Guess I was just excited to have a different build to play lol

[limber lion]

If that's what you're looking for, then go ahead

[marble hemlock]

cause the much higher cp gen allows you to get a decent amoutn of haste, so even though haste is kinda useless on aoe, itll still help you sustain better after a low-energy sustaining opener

i mean

[limber lion]

If you're looking for overall, Zoldyck probably still takes the crown

[marble hemlock]

you can play it

[stoic needle]

And yeah I'm venthyr right now but I'm planning to swap to necro soon for slg and keys in general

[marble hemlock]

its okay to play

its same as playing one of the "worse" legendaries on outlaw

youre not gonna be 10% better or worse playing a different build like that

[stoic needle]

Yeah but if I'm pushing I'd rather be doing the best I can

[marble hemlock]

then stop focusing on dps

dps isnt timing keys

not wiping is

[limber lion]

If you enjoy playing Outlaw, then you should just play that if your goal is to push keys.

[marble hemlock]

i would say ive played ~3000 m+ in my lifetime so far. i can count the keys that went flawlessly and that we simply overtimed by like 5seconds due to low dps on one hand

[stoic needle]

I like the flexibility of being able to play both specs for different situations and different keys

[marble hemlock]

assa is probably slightly better damage in like

mists, hoa

maybe DoS

[limber lion]

I think the damage profile of Outlaw and Assa is pretty similar and sometimes Assa pumps even harder (correct me if I'm wrong, Seli) but the loss of utility is a huge deal.

[limber lion]

Yeh, I thought so.

[subtle tundra]

i also think the dmg profile of outlaw is better for m+

[marble hemlock]

not having acrobatic strikes is a big loss

[stoic needle]

Sin just seems very attractive for tyrannical weeks

[marble hemlock]

outlaw has better ST unless the assa is venthyr

cuz you dont get 2 vendettas on tyrannical bosses

maybe with bad groups, idk

but in the 6 or 7 keys i played today

i didnt get 2 vendettas on any boss

[limber lion]

Vendetta on pride and boss on execute

[marble hemlock]

yeah thats pmuch it

but like

could just not vendetta pride

and vendetta pull with pride buff

which is the same thing really

[subtle tundra]

in the keys i've played as assa i felt like if i wasnt using vendetta on pride i was inting

[marble hemlock]

outlaw has more solid st cause they consistently get 2 or even 3 sets of CDS on bosses

assa doesnt

[stoic needle]

Yeah I pretty much always vendetta pride

[marble hemlock]

and the sacrifice of having to choose between st or aoe gearing optimization hurts a lot

[subtle tundra]

groups always see rogue and think that he would kill pride

and then im just doing mediocre dmg on it

[marble hemlock]

i mean you do like 5-6k maybe

[static pasture]

where can i find a bis list for assa guys ? ( thx a lot )

[marble hemlock]

without vendetta

6-7k with

not amazing, honestly

[balmy condor]

nowhere

[marble hemlock]

outlaw can pull the same numbers with some decent procs

[subtle tundra]

yea but still if noone else pops it hurts badly

[marble hemlock]

assa hasnt been the big st pumper in m+ in a loooong time

last time that was actually true, was in legion

[subtle tundra]

also as outlaw you can feint/vial on cd with less dps loss

assa energy is scarce so it hurts more

[stoic needle]

In the past few weeks that I have been playing outlaw I haven't really come close to my sin pride/boss dps but maybe that's because I'm bad at outlaw

[marble hemlock]

no

its because youre venthyr

and well yeah, maybe youre just bad at outlaw

[subtle tundra]

i'd swap back to venthyr but nowadays everyone expects me to be necrolord

[marble hemlock]

but the difference in covneants in m+ is very noticeable for assa

[subtle tundra]

even though its only good in top

[marble hemlock]

as you run low haste to optimize aoe

so playing venthyr makes up for a lot

[limber lion]

I do just fine as Assa myself, but I only do up to 20 keys

Can't really compare 20 keys and 25's.

[subtle tundra]

you can do 24-25 its just that outlaw is better, even if its slightly better

[stoic needle]

Yeah I'm really interested in trying necro sin and outlaw in keys

[marble hemlock]

dps wise assa is probably slightly ahead of outlaw in most dungeons

but assa was never better in tyrannical keys than in fortified

[stoic needle]

Right now my group is getting into 18s. I'd eventually like to get to 20s and up

[limber lion]

That's a screenshot right there.

[marble hemlock]

its an urban myth

[limber lion]

For the non-believers and doubters

[marble hemlock]

that was present in bfa and never got busted

cuz assa was actually great on st in legion

and hten people kept repeating that same myth over and over again and it never went away

[subtle tundra]

man i joined some groups recently as assa, for assa score as i already had those keys done and people were so dissapointed for some reason when they realised i was assa

[marble hemlock]

even though assa st was kinda meh in all of bfa

and still is in regular SL keys

[subtle tundra]

when they dont even know what the spec does

[marble hemlock]

and especially the tyrannical vs fortified discussion is just so blatantly obvious yet people still think assa does better on tyrannical keys

where trashfights are shorter

[subtle tundra]

5 globals in as assa, just starting to fok and mobs are already 70%

[marble hemlock]

when the entire design of the spec should make it very obvious that long sustained aoe trash fights, i.e. fortified, are what it really does well

[limber lion]

Yeh agree

[marble hemlock]

when mobs are in execute for more than 5seconds

anyway

me tired

[limber lion]

Go to sleep

[shy dust]

Yet people still believe it

Even people who regularly visit here

[junior pulsar]

Hey guys. Just started playing rogue again. Played it mid bfa ish the last time around. Im at the covenant choice part and im in doubt if I should take venthyr or necro. Do ppl like to play with serrated bone spikes in sin? cant decide if I like it or not 😄

Will be playing outlaw aswell, thats why im leaning towards necro

[stoic needle]

It's pretty great because it's a better builder than mutilate and fok in a lot of situations

[balmy condor]

necro is better in keys/ venthyr in raid, I think necro is more fun

venthyr is kinda just a button

[stoic needle]

It's HUGE DAM WOO but it kinda gets old after a while

[junior pulsar]

Will not raid at all. Only m+

[stoic needle]

Necro is engaging

[balmy condor]

then go necro

[junior pulsar]

How do u use it in ur rotation?

[subtle kiln]

necro is a lot more enjoyable for me. have three of the covenants at 40. lol

[balmy condor]

yeah I have 3 at 40 as well

[neat pulsar]

from 2 to 5 CP with just 15 energy, I would hardly get rid of SBS now ^^

[stoic needle]

Fuck kyrian

Lmao

[junior pulsar]

Stealth, i garrote 3-4 targets, then rupture and fan of knives, crimson tempest if talented. When do i start smashing the bone spikes?

[balmy condor]

after that

[subtle kiln]

your opener doesn’t change

[junior pulsar]

Ah nice

What about ST?

[subtle kiln]

with em i pop it during shiv

[balmy condor]

1 early for the dot, otherwise as a cheap builder

shiv is usually good

[neat pulsar]

yes during shiv, i still didn't try assa as a necro, but I remember having troubles to get to 3 envenoms during shiv, with SBS it wouldn't be a problem

and I am even wondering if i should get the shiv soulbind then

[balmy condor]

I mean

the amount of envenoms during shiv

isn't really something to give a shit about

[subtle kiln]

i worry more about the LBE uptime during shiv

[subtle tundra]

(sbs is bugged on sire allowing you to get 4 envenoms in toxic blade if you have 3 stacks up)

[balmy condor]

I sorta put it on par with roll the bones

[junior pulsar]

Very nooby question. When I last played sin I didnt use the shiv spell. Reading its tool tip I cant see where it slots in and to what purpose.

[balmy condor]

it's just on cooldown

like toxic blade

[junior pulsar]

Shiv is like toxic blade?

[shy dust]

Yes

For assa specifically

[junior pulsar]

Cool. I remember that one. I liked that talent

[balmy condor]

regarding this, roll the bones you kinda just get stuck with whatever, you have some agency with re-rolling (or pooling into a shiv window/prepping bleeds), but otherwise you just aim for uptime and get what you get

[balmy condor]

it's actually identical aside from the shiv utility

[junior pulsar]

Ah. Im too low lvl to get the nature dmg enhanced

Can see I get it in lvl 58

Im 53 atm

[balmy condor]

yeh

when we talk about anything, it's max level

[junior pulsar]

Thanks for the quick responses. I like this discord already

[balmy condor]

cause leveling is just so irrelevant

[junior pulsar]

True

The only thing about rogue i dislike is that theres way too many nice legendaries. Dont know which one to craft first 😄 I can see im gonna have 4-5 leggos perhabs. My main who is fury warr has one, that was crafted a few weeks into the expansion

[balmy condor]

well

if by "too many nice" you mean "too many unimpressive legendaries"

you'd be correct

[junior pulsar]

I can see that

[balmy condor]

we suffer from great balance

by way of nothing being great

[subtle kiln]

just wait and see what shows up on the ptr, may give some clarity on what to craft

[balmy condor]

I think in m+ there's like 5 legendaries within 3-4%

maybe 6

[subtle kiln]

you can still m+ with doomblade and pull over 5k in a 14 so it’s w/e

5k is usually what triggers keys at that level. lol

[junior pulsar]

Ye doomblade seams nice. I wanted this rogue to have a deadly ST dude. My ele shaman and fury wrecks on packs. But want a ST killer

[balmy condor]

doomblade probably is a good choice

dashing is quite good as well

[junior pulsar]

Hows the bleed leggo?

[balmy condor]

has a little bit more aoe

which

[junior pulsar]

zoldycjk

[balmy condor]

we have like 3 bleed legos :P

zoldyck is our aoe bis

[junior pulsar]

So making doomblade for tyranical and zoldyck for fortified could be the play?

[balmy condor]

usually you just play zoldyck for both

but you definitely can play doomblade for tyrannical

[limber lion]

Anything works

[balmy condor]

ye

[junior pulsar]

So your prefered is Zoldyck?

[balmy condor]

for m+ ye

for sure

nope

I guarantee you that whatever information you're looking can be simmed for yourself

[green forge]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[desert jungle]

Hey guys just got back into playing my rogue after a long break. The discussion above was great thank you. I want to raid and run m+ (aim is to get to 20) do you recommend vynther or necro? Thank you ahead of time

[balmy condor]

if you're pushing m+ I would suggest necro

[desert jungle]

I see it’s about 200 behind vynther in raid , shouldn’t be too much of an issue

[balmy condor]

yeah

lot of the raid isn't single target either

[desert jungle]

Also necro gives better flexibility for outlaw in m+ correct?

[balmy condor]

correct

[desert jungle]

Yea especially the important bosses towards the end

Great thanks for that

[balmy condor]

no problemo

[shell ivy]

any recommended conduits for necro aswell?

[balmy condor]

sudden fractures

[shell ivy]

is it mostly bis for both st and aoe? i gotta do the world boss

[shy dust]

Have you been like 36 renown

Or whatever

The final world quest increase

On any covenant yet?

If so callings can drop 200 ilvl conduits

[balmy condor]

yeah the 200 from callings is fine

[stoic needle]

I'd definitely go for dashing over doomblade for keys

For single target

Because dashing actually has some aoe value by making your poisons crit, doomblade has basically none and is bad at target swapping

The small single target boost doomblade gets over dashing isn't enough to make it better than dashing for that use case imo especially when you consider the ramp time you need

[royal lantern]

@balmy condor yo whisp

what stats would you craft for zoldy legs

haste/vers or haste/crit, it litearlly sims the same for me lmao

[soft shale]

do you prefer taking less damage or sometimes crit and not feel your life is miserable with 3 2 cp muts in a row

[balmy condor]

haste/crit personally

[royal lantern]

you are the real bigbrain

lets combine both and take vers/crit

https://tenor.com/view/twoset-twosetviolin-eddy-chen-brett-yang-gif-19323066

[soft shale]

i mean haste is 100%