why is zold better for aoe? isnt it just pushing dmg during execute?
#assassination
grim meteor
wary ice
why is zold better for aoe? isnt it just pushing dmg during execute?
more targets == more time in execute
cursive garnet
but in higher keys mobs take more time to die
grim meteor
okay makes sense
nimble spoke
because aoe has adds that reach 30 percent and your dots hit harder. So even if it's more adds, that means more time for them to tick
yea, and higher health at higher levels
stoic needle
And it's free execute on everything, you have to envenom or mut something for Doomblade to have value
wary ice
it being entirely passive is kinda big too tbh yeah
nimble spoke
I think I'll be crafting Zold today and try it in raid
dull cloak
bring back gear swapping in m+
tight ginkgo
Other than gouge only complaint about sin in m+ is mobility. One shadowstep and no CDR on sprint via restless blades feels sad. 
nimble spoke
we're only 10/10 H but might try mythic shriek again
grim meteor
yeah i am thinking about the same question
stoic needle
My doomblade at 210 outsimmed my zoldyck at 235 for st so you don't have to have a maxed doomblade to benefit from it
cursive garnet
so zold it is
nimble spoke
yea, I'm thinking so, too, Boom
cursive garnet
okay thanks guys
nimble spoke
I was going to do DB for raid/M+/PvP, but since it seems strong enough just for the ability, I'll do Zold and see how I like it. Think I can only craft a 190 today, anyway
oh, I might be able to get zold 190 and DB 210, actually. I have like 580 ash right now
might be close
stoic needle
Legendary ilvl is overrated
I remember people reeing at me for crafting MA first week because it would make me one week behind on ilvl for finality
gentle gyro
Effect > ilvl
stoic needle
nimble spoke
haha XD
stoic needle
All of those people are mad they even crafted finality now
wary ice
I'm not 😦
but i ree'd making MA strictly because the idea of another 2 years of playing around vanish as a dps cooldown was giving me stress sweats 😦
nimble spoke
I have a 210 finality and celerity. I kind of regret making them since i want to focus on Sin, but it's all good
ornate dawn
Just use DB for everything and be a fckin baller with them fatty envenoms
strange python
Hold up, is sin back on top? I've been afk on notes/logs for like 2-3 weeks
burnt star
M.a is kinda nice to have too
thorny rose
Hold up, is sin back on top? I've been afk on notes/logs for like 2-3 weeks
For ST
strange python
But sin > sub by a decent margin right now?
thorny rose
yeah sub is in shambles
dawn haven
Is it better to put Sinful revelation on your mainhand or offhand? Icy Veins guide says offhand but that seems odd.
shy dust
yeah sub is in shambles
dawn haven
Just for pure ST btw.
shy dust
Is it better to put Sinful revelation on your mainhand or offhand? Icy Veins gui...
Irrelevant
strange python
Lowkey, I've been waiting for sin to pick it up, been sub since beginning of xpac
Happy to see it doing well, will have to give it a shot now
wind dune
I just got ion'd Spent all of last week running 30 plaguefalls to get a 220 phial just for it to show up on the weekly 
shy dust
Lowkey, I've been waiting for sin to pick it up, been sub since beginning of xpa...
You’ve been waiting for .5 of a tier
strange python
Well I'm glad .5 has come then
stoic needle
I just got ion'd Spent all of last week running 30 plaguefalls to get a 220 phia...
is it 226 at least?
i saw 3 phials last week
wind dune
yea it is
burnt star
Still a good upgrade
stoic needle
yea 30+ dps aint bad
burnt star
I would totaly get it no question asked
Also i just realised. Why did blizz put so much pant with mastery in game..
Like the raid has mastery only pants. And m+ also has a bunch of them.
wise gull
already had a 226 but that haste thoooo
frigid kestrel
looks like its a Stygia Week for me
stoic needle
its good to have a small amount of mastery if you're stacking crit/haste in other slots
those pants usually give you a good amount so you don't need much elsewhere
wise gull
I'm such an idiot for not doing my venari rep
burnt star
I only do the weekly ven quest
wise gull
sockets are a bigger upgrade than any item in the game for me now
dull cloak
0 mastery gang
frigid kestrel
Let me Sim this Memory real fast before i take this Stygia
Im like %99 Sure its trash
burnt star
Memory 226 is good to have
wise gull
memory of past sins is not trash
burnt star
In raid
stoic needle
memory is good everywhere
wise gull
if its 226
burnt star
Skulker is a bit higher in keys
burnt star
Bah not really lollll
stoic needle
i've been skipping the maw grind but i need to do more i want to socket my MA
frigid kestrel
I have 220 Dread, Phial, Sulkers, Hateful, and IQD
I dont think Memory beats them out
but ill at least check
shy dust
Memory is not that good of a trinket
burnt star
A 226 will outsime them yes
shy dust
Most other trinkets beat it out
stoic needle
why not
frigid kestrel
a 226 Memory will outsim?
shy dust
Because it does less damage than other trinkets
burnt star
I use phial 220+ memory 226
burnt star
While having 226 skulker. 220 dreadfire. 213 chain
226 chain is the only upgrade i can get till 233 dreadfire
shy dust
Chain is shit
tropic echo
oh thank god mort is up this week
burnt star
U use trinket on pillar anyways
shy dust
In comparison to phial
burnt star
U use chain + phial..
compact pumice
I use 220 Phial over 220 dreadfire, but I use it with 226 skulkers
wise gull
why didn't i grind sockets/rep sooner?
shy dust
No you use whatever combination sims the best
onyx wind
frigid kestrel
Pfftttt Like imma run 220 IQD and 226 Memory, forcing me to drop my 220 Phial for 10 whole dps... Silly sims, go home
fathom lynx
I had a question a few days ago regarding if Mutilate applies Deadly Poison twice from Stealth - and in my combat log it only registers once, but I tried it with Wound Poison and I always get two stacks if I open from Stealth, so I would think Deadly Poison also hits twice from that.
This would only really matter when opening in single target when you use Subterfuge, because Garrote doesn't apply Deadly Poison at all while Mutilate does it twice. In my mind you would open with Mutilate>Garrote instead of Garrote>Mutilate, on fights like SLG or in m+ when there's a single target fight.
Does this matter at all? Or does it go into the thrash-bin of "Openers do not matter"?
here's a pic for anyone who cares
shy dust
Pfftttt Like imma run 220 IQD and 226 Memory, forcing me to drop my 220 Phial fo...
Iqd is a slammer trinket
Don’t insult it
stoic needle
226 hateful chain is exactly the same as 233 dreadfire with 22% haste
frigid kestrel
Iqd is a slammer trinket
??? IM insulting Memory... but also IQD is a sim trap
stoic needle
so its not really shit at all
fathom lynx
here's a pic for anyone who cares
(actually on this one it registered twice - my b)
brittle pawn
did something change with flayedwing toxin? or is it better for sin than other specs. it's simming within margin of error of both skulker/past sins
shy dust
so its not really shit at all
226 hateful is like 10 dps worse than 220 phial
Also @frigid kestrel
stoic needle
if yo have high haste
stoic needle
it sims the same as dreadfire
i watched whispyr sim it on stream
at 22% it was the same as dreadfire
compact pumice
??? IM insulting Memory... but also IQD is a sim trap
Why is it a sim trap? Does it not consider that sometimes it gives healers mana?
shy dust
It’s a sim trap if you can’t use your brain
There are fights where he’s
The 2nd proc will give you mana
But other fights you can consistently get stats every usage
frigid kestrel
Why is it a sim trap? Does it not consider that sometimes it gives healers mana?
It considers that you will get that stat gain %100
stoic needle
you can change that setting in raidbots tho
compact pumice
Maybe with the weakaura that predicts effect
frigid kestrel
We are straight on Prog, so seomtimes when it gets messy.... it legit gonna not give me stats
compact pumice
I’m glad I didn’t pick my IQD 226 from vault
frigid kestrel
you can change that setting in raidbots tho
O shit, you can?
compact pumice
The 226 hateful seems sexy though
stoic needle
shy dust
I’m glad I didn’t pick my IQD 226 from vault
???
its literally a sicko mode trinket
what the heck
frigid kestrel
Id like to unoffensivly and consensually kiss you
compact pumice
I’d rather not have to micromanage if that slot would be useless or not, and only for a minor upgrade compared to something like a phial, and only for sin(since it sims pretty bad for outlaw which I still play a lot)
stoic needle
hot take: it's not useless to help out your raid with the othe rprocs
also how is it bad for outlaw
how are stats bad for outlaw
compact pumice
I don’t know but it sims bad.
It’s like 8th or something
Loads of better trinkets
frigid kestrel
its literally a sicko mode trinket
Im not saying it isnt, ive been using my 220 for a while now.... but it bombs at times, or you have to hold it and hope your raid stabilizes. Like out M Inerva kill was slopy af, everyone was low.... how am i getting a stat proc?
limber lion
I wouldn't even blink an eye if I saw an IQD in the vault
stoic needle
thats your gear
with the t26 bis set it sims within margin of error of 223 dreadfire
compact pumice
I was simming bis gear
frigid kestrel
My entire point was this, my sims is telling me to drop 220 Phial/IDQ combo for 226 Memory/220 IDQ combo
and im like... na im good doggie
solar hare
hateful chain is shit
I did the same thing, farmed 20+ plaguefall 15s then got hateful and it was all for nothing
compact pumice
with the t26 bis set it sims within margin of error of 223 dreadfire
That’s one look. It’s a lot different for assassin
Cba setting up my own sim
lean rover
hey guys, is there a typical scenario is aoe M+ when you spam CT instead of one CT then envenoms for the next 12sec ?
stoic needle
when you've pulled 8+ mobs and need to get up CT on all of them
safe canopy
sometimes i get lost in the sauce trying rupture everything. are you supposed to just ct and then envenom one guy?
stoic needle
it's rare, only like the ghost pull in TOP or ardenweald in DOS
you're supposed to rupture things
envenom is rarely used in aoe
safe canopy
yeah sometimes i feel like i rarely env
lean rover
when you've pulled 8+ mobs and need to get up CT on all of them
other than that the initial damage of CT is still to be consider too low to matter right ?
safe canopy
oh cool that makes sense then
stoic needle
it's not nothing but it's still less damage than getting ruptures up
in that situation i would definitely refresh ct early over using an envenom but that's just me
safe canopy
are there dgs or situations where bomb is equivalent or better than ct
limber lion
are there dgs or situations where bomb is equivalent or better than ct
"...or situations"
Yeah, ST fights in the raid. 🙂
safe canopy
oh yeah i was just asking for dungeons haha. never for raid
limber lion
Yeh, always run CT my boy
stoic needle
apparently dashing duelist with PB is pretty decent for M+ because it makes PB crit more
limber lion
Find a good keybind for it an get comfortable
stoic needle
but nobody has tested it yet
limber lion
apparently dashing duelist with PB is pretty decent for M+ because it makes PB c...
You mean dauntless duelist?
stoic needle
apparently dashing + pb sims really well in dslice
i'd try it for the memes but i dont have soul ash to spend on memes atm lmao
limber lion
Hmm, I'll have to sim that and test it out
safe canopy
i just wish assas had a little more edge when it came to aoe in m+
SS last exp was nice but not enough
triple SS*
slim kernel
More on trinkets: my choices are 226 flayedwing (vault option), 213 IQD, 213 phial, 213 hateful. Bloodmallet points to IQD+Phial for ST and add cleave. That may be the answer but figured I'd ask if I'm missing something before I pass on a 226 trinket. None of the other vault options are particularly amazing.
fleet anchor
apparently dashing + pb sims really well in dslice
Have found quite a few optimizations for Dashing in DS over the last few weeks so I'm not too surprised about this. Dashing is not that bad for AoE anymore, just have to prioritize Envenoms a little more than normal.
limber lion
Will have to sim it myself and see how it fares against the other picks. Kinda cool seeing different legendaries come up and not have to run the same legendary for all content, and actually have more variance to choose from. :p
unkempt ginkgo
Does the leggo change between fortified and tyrannical weeks?
limber lion
For the profile that I'm using it's around 90 dps less in DSlice and almost 200 dps less with PB instead of CT.
But it's not that giga, pretty cool.
fleet anchor
PB+Dashing is about 0.5% ahead of Doomblade+CT in DS for me. Close enough that it's basically whatever.
limber lion
Ah right, actually
strange python
That’s pretty nifty
limber lion
Are these changes in the Raidbots default apl yet?
fleet anchor
Yeah
I mean I don't have Dashing right now and no immediate reason to craft it, but it's nice to have the option
limber lion
That's odd, using Whispyr's profile, Zoldyck still sims the highest with MA second.
Dashing with PB sounds like a blast tbh. Not that I would craft it myself either, but still :p
fleet anchor
Yeah my best setup is MA leggo+Subterfuge+CT
Which is about 1.5% ahead of that Dashing setup
limber lion
Mmh. How's Zoldyck doing?
fleet anchor
But all in all I'd say those are all close enough that it won't make any notable difference in a real key
fleet anchor
Zoldyck was side-gradey with the ST ones, could be ilevel replacement related though
limber lion
With different tanks/healers/dps and different routes/pulls.
I did a Mists +18 and did 7.4k in overall. Then I did one a few days later and did 6.7k overall. Tank pulling big is the #1 thing to increase your dps, if you're into that :p
fleet anchor
Not really sure I'm gonna stop running Outlaw for keys though 😛
limber lion
Yeh, Outlaw still pumps.
brittle pawn
so are the other people in your group
fallen current
hotlaw
sick scarab
That's odd, using Whispyr's profile, Zoldyck still sims the highest with MA seco...
i will craft dashing and give it a try asap
limber lion
i will craft dashing and give it a try asap
Sick, let us know how it goes 
sick scarab
Sick, let us know how it goes <:ApuSmile:699668592832282637>
talents are EP, Subterge and PB ?
stoic needle
Tyrannical week so back to sin I guess 
silent tinsel
The difference between haste and crit gem/enchants is less than a fraction of a percent lol
like 4 dps in total between all crit or haste
primal zinc
hello my friends @stoic needle and @limber lion
stoic needle
Sup
primal zinc
drinking blood
stoic needle
like 4 dps in total between all crit or haste
This is what we call margin of error
primal zinc
you?
silent tinsel
I prefer butter over magarine
stoic needle
Feeling good that I got an outlaw wep in the vault and never have to do plaguefall again 
steep gust
If i have Doomblade crafted - is it even worth crafting Dashing?
primal zinc
Feeling good that I got an outlaw wep in the vault and never have to do plaguefa...
you mean the pox?
stoic needle
I didn't get a pox, I got the 2nd bedt one, the gorebound predator's gavel
More than good enough for me to stop farming a pox and just wait for one from the vault
Pretty sure it's better than a 220 pox
stoic needle
If i have Doomblade crafted - is it even worth crafting Dashing?
Probably not
primal zinc
there a 4 core leggos .....dashing/zoldyck/MA/doomblade
steep gust
there a 4 core leggos .....dashing/zoldyck/MA/doomblade
in what scenario is Dashing good?
primal zinc
i have all 235 except MA
stoic needle
Dashing and doomblade are pretty much interchangeable
primal zinc
i would use it in case your haste i WAY low cos you need that extra energy ticks
stoic needle
Most of the benefit from dashing is in the fact that it makes envenom and pb crit 15% more
The energy is a nice bonus tho
primal zinc
before the patch i was using DS on mythic hungering....i had 300 energy raw gain none wasted
thats like 6 free muts leading to finishers
@steep gust
primal zinc
YES!!!! (i feel bad tho) the last 1900 stygia i spent for potency was lashing scars to 226 😦
weak jay
isn't that a good thing?
stoic needle
Ouch
fallen current
you totally do
spice spire
its okay guys I got a 226 maim mangle from raid
Wombo combo with Doomblade 
full flicker
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
gray tundra
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/2nkdb8K5MSGEWnHGiSFt12
NF?
heady rain
Hello everyone! I was wondering is there is a specific threshold of crit/haste needed to use Deeper Stratagem over Vigor? If so whats a good rule of thumb to follow when deciding which talent to use?
gray tundra
Hello everyone! I was wondering is there is a specific threshold of crit/haste n...
Vigor for m+, DS for raid
lean rover
hey whats the best legendary for single target boss ?
fallen current
hey whats the best legendary for single target boss ?
raven granite
What conduits should I get for doomblade sin on m+?
heady rain
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/3wKv6ZY5qxAyiT5LUbdfBb
Hmm interesting what is your crit/haste #'s out of curiosity
knotty sparrow
unbuffed
im also venth though i think someone was saying you need less haste if youre venth
silent tinsel
Ive been using leeching on sludge because I feel like if someone dies and procs cheat then its already a wipe
knotty sparrow
i love leeching
silent tinsel
also counters the persistent damage
knotty sparrow
in general
dull cloak
whats the hps on your leeching
heady rain
unbuffed
Yeah I'm Venth too these are my current stats. Do you think I should try and drop some haste?
knotty sparrow
im not sure i would just sim yourself with different rings and enchants and stuff
check what works for you
i have tons of vers from pvp gear so i wouldnt go off mine
but you have tons of mastery and as sin mastery tends to be dogshit a little bit
just sim it up
heady rain
i have tons of vers from pvp gear so i wouldnt go off mine
Fair enough, I have a bunch from various pieces https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/kYZuUG6g84RYe6kDD4WLmZ
shy dust
Yeah I'm Venth too these are my current stats. Do you think I should try and dro...
Don’t sim
Aim*
For any specific stats
Just run top gear and find your best setup
There is no x of a certain stat to aim for
Ilvl is generally king to
knotty sparrow
yeah i can drop like 30 haste for 7 agi and its an upgrade easily
celest sail
is there any reason to use ambush outside of a blindside or sepsis proc?
knotty sparrow
no
heady rain
For any specific stats
Okay thanks for the advice! I really appreciate the help
celest sail
so safe to put muti in that spot on my stealth bars
limber lion
is there any reason to use ambush outside of a blindside or sepsis proc?
Not really.
limber lion
Yeah, you still need a bind for both.
stoic needle
Hello everyone! I was wondering is there is a specific threshold of crit/haste n...
Sim it, usually it's roughly 15 % as venthyr and 25% as non venthyr
stoic needle
Ive been using leeching on sludge because I feel like if someone dies and procs ...
Nah man people will do dumb shit and break your chain before a wipe all the time, cheat can save you a brez and help you get a kill
limber lion
Yeah and leeching is honestly pretty bad.
knotty sparrow
ive been killed by a skullkers on sludge a couple times, ashamed to admit
stoic needle
Yeah I'm Venth too these are my current stats. Do you think I should try and dro...
If you want to drop anything it'd be mastery
fleet anchor
Cheat doesn't always save you from a chain break though since you get HP capped on it and it leaves you with extremely low HP. You have to be relatively high health to allow cheat to save from a break in Mythic
limber lion
If you want to drop anything it'd be mastery
Oshosi telling people to drop mastery? 
limber lion
cloak after cheat should work
You get stunned for like 6s after the chain breaks.
So you can't exactly do anything
It's all on the healers at that point to keep you alive
fallow glacier
Is haste/vers fine to craft onto MA if I'm also looking to PvP and do m+ with it?
stoic needle
Oshosi telling people to drop mastery? <:wutfacew:747234372327047180>
You never recommend memes to the newbies 
knotty sparrow
literally all my leggos are haste/vers
stoic needle
Is haste/vers fine to craft onto MA if I'm also looking to PvP and do m+ with it...
Those are the bis stats for MA
fallow glacier
Huh, Wowhead says Haste/crit
stoic needle
You don't put crit on ma because it gives you 100% crit
limber lion
Haste/Vers is a safe bet for many legendaries
limber lion
Huh, Wowhead says Haste/crit
Crit loses a lot of value because MA gives you 100% crit my boy
knotty sparrow
i would haste/crit a new doomblade
stoic needle
Same
limber lion
Haste/Crit is generally the best stats for most legendaries
stoic needle
But it doesn't particularly matter and I won't be recrafting
stoic needle
My Ma is vers/mastery kekw
limber lion
Even if you crafted mastery/vers legendary, you'd be fine
You just alter your other gear around it
And enchants/gems
stoic needle
It's only 10 dps lower for outlaw and 40 dps lower for sin
I don't use ma enough in sin to care
fallow glacier
Does wrist/ring matter?
stoic needle
Ring is generally more dps
fallow glacier
Aight, cheers guys
surreal halo
Haste&Crit on doomblade according to pins - is that still right?
limber lion
Haste&Crit on doomblade according to pins - is that still right?
Yes, sir.
surreal halo
ty sir!
limber lion
dark token
final ferry
Yo guys, I was wondering on TOP, do you use full multi talents?
or do you change some talents for a mono target vision?
stoic needle
Still use full multi target talents. You could experiment with pb but its probably still worse than ct
Doomblade is pretty nice for it tho
mental laurel
So I have IQD and Skulker's Wing. Any advice on how to use two on-use trinkets? I was thinking IQD at pull (with Vendetta), Skulker's at 0:30, then Skulker's 2:00 (lined up with Vendetta), IQD at 3:00 and wait out Skulker's to line up with next Vendetta (4:00) if the fight will end soon, otherwise pop it at 3:30 and get another at 5:00. Does that seem like a good setup?
mental laurel
Oh interesting. I didn'tt realize that
jovial horizon
what do yall think, 203 helm -> socketed 220 sadist's sinister helm, or 200 dagger -> 223 stitchflesh's scalpel? the helm sims ~20 dps higher but it feels weird to leave a weapon in the vault
jovial horizon
did u read my full message
fossil slate
Yes and I'm pointing out the solution of what item to pick sim it and pick what's best
drifting merlin
@jovial horizon make sure u simmed with enchant tho
fossil slate
If you've already simmed it it's pretty redundant to then ask people what they think when you have the sim results
stoic needle
what do yall think, 203 helm -> socketed 220 sadist's sinister helm, or 200 dagg...
Go with the weapon, you can farm a helm and upgrade it to 220
jovial horizon
thanks for your help tellas
stoic needle
In general there is no reason to take a 220 or less item from the vault because you can just farm the exact same item and upgrade it
Use the vault for 223+ items
late badge
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
fossil slate
Go with the weapon, you can farm a helm and upgrade it to 220
He could farm a weapon and upgrade it as well
frigid jasper
how do people feel going necro sin instead of venthyr?
north basin
they feel regret
sweet rampart
so when running master assassin, there is no snapshotting or anything right? Just keep rupture and garrote flowing, vanish with vendetta and use as many muts/envenoms after vanish?
limber lion
so when running master assassin, there is no snapshotting or anything right? Jus...
Yes, bleed damage updates dynamically.
Playing around Shiv is probably the most important thing for Assa.
sweet rampart
so weird to me after playing sin last xpac, not opening with a garrote from stealth haha
Line up Shiv as close as i can to vendetta right? but don't hold very long
limber lion
Line up Shiv as close as i can to vendetta right? but don't hold very long
I'm talking about Shiv usage outside of your opener.
On opener you just do the same thing every time
Muti-Snd-Muti-Gar-Flag-Rup-Vend-Shiv-Vanish-Muti-Muti-Env
sweet rampart
outside of opener = don't use shiv if i have to refresh a dot within the window?
limber lion
outside of opener = don't use shiv if i have to refresh a dot within the window?
Almost
You refresh the bleeds preemptively before Shiv comes off cooldown.
You don't want to ever delay Shiv.
You want to slam it on CD as much as possible
And to do that, you need to pool properly before it and remember to refresh bleeds so you don't have to do that during the Shiv window.
sweet rampart
right
astral bluff
can someone tell me why we open with mut instead of backstab?
limber lion
If Shiv is not on cooldown, you press it.
limber lion
can someone tell me why we open with mut instead of backstab?
We don't use backstab as Assassination, that's a Subtlety spell my boy
jovial horizon
cause we dont have backstab
astral bluff
yes, sorry
limber lion
!mut
prisma monolithBOT
Ambush is currently only used from blindside/sepsis proc, not from stealth.
The reasoning is a little complicated, but the most important of them is the difference in combo points on crit (up to 4 vs 3).
Some other factors to consider are increased poison applications, blindside, and doomblade. This is true for all talent combinations and legendaries.
devout oxide
open with mutilate instead of ambush because of master assassin. mutilate will give more CP
astral bluff
thank you, it is exactly what i needed
limber lion
No problem mate
forest wing
You refresh the bleeds preemptively before Shiv comes off cooldown.
Do we refresh it even before it hits pandemic? E.g. garrote at 10 secs and shiv coming up in 2 secs
limber lion
Do we refresh it even before it hits pandemic? E.g. garrote at 10 secs and shiv ...
With garrote it doesn't matter as much because it's a generator
But yes, you would refresh Rupture early if that were to happen
forest wing
Cool, tks
stoic needle
He could farm a weapon and upgrade it as well
You can't upgrade a weapon to 223
fossil slate
Yet he could get a 226 and the 223 weapon was less of an upgrade so it's a bit of odd advice
limber lion
Yet he could get a 226 and the 223 weapon was less of an upgrade so it's a bit o...
Just get a 226 weapon 
fossil slate
Well obviously that would be dungeons bud
stoic needle
Yet he could get a 226 and the 223 weapon was less of an upgrade so it's a bit o...
It's not odd advice. It makes no sense to get an item that you could farm from the vault over one you can't farm
limber lion
Well obviously that would be dungeons bud
wat
You cannot get 226 weapons from dungeons
fossil slate
for a DPS loss it would be
stoic needle
You've obviously never been stick with 213 weapons for weeks because none show up in the vault
limber lion
You cannot grind for a weapon from dungeons
fossil slate
Only from the vault
and what option would give a 226 weapon from the vault? DUNGEONS
limber lion
and what option would give a 226 weapon from the vault? DUNGEONS
Yeh, because you can choose to get a weapon from the vault
Just like all of us chose to get 226 Phial from the Vault as well
And 226 IQD
fossil slate
and yet people still do have it
limber lion
Yeah, but you can't grind for it
fossil slate
Well you can grind the chance bud
limber lion
The only content you can grind to get a 226 weapon from, is PvP
limber lion
Well you can grind the chance bud
Yeah, exactly
fossil slate
and telling someone to pick a 3 ilvl upgrade as a dps loss is just pepega
forest wing
Or a phial, FeelsBadMan
stoic needle
Framing it as a dps loss is just weird
You can get sockets and upgrade into the literally exact same item
But you cannot upgrade into a 223 wep
And weapons are the biggest dps increases for sin
fossil slate
yet the 220 was a dps increase over the weapon
fossil slate
so why why valor and time farming it
limber lion
He's farming
sweet rampart
@limber lion how long would you hold shiv for vendetta/vanish? timing windows for dummy on me right now, while keeping shiv on cooldown, i have to hold it for about 8-10 seconds before vendetta comes up again
fossil slate
When it's a better option to just take the 220 item from the vault
jovial horizon
the helm is actually indestructible as well, so i can't farm it, i think tellas is right
stoic needle
When it's a better option to just take the 220 item from the vault
Stop
limber lion
<@!165215952479322112> how long would you hold shiv for vendetta/vanish? timing ...
You don't hold Shiv like I said earlier.
stoic needle
You can hold it up to 12 seconds for vendetta tho
sour thunder
Would it be reasonable if I expect to do DPS as much as Ele shaman with Assass in M+?
limber lion
<@!165215952479322112> how long would you hold shiv for vendetta/vanish? timing ...
Your Vendetta lasts for 20s and Shiv lasts for 9s. As long as you cast it within 12s of casting Vendetta, you're good.
You don't have to use them both at the same time.
icy haven
depends alot on the ele these days i think
sour thunder
Generally speaking in performance wise
coz I dont care much about raiding and Im inbetween ele and assass
Dunno if it would be wise to play assass for M+
icy haven
i mean its not too bad, just ol blasts
limber lion
It does pretty decent damage and will work fine up to +20 keys.
But yeah, it's not Outlaw-level.
limber lion
I can help you with those guru
jovial horizon
turns out if i upgrade a helm i have in my bags to 220 and socket it, it's a bigger dps increase than the one in my vault. taking dagger, thanks all for clearing that up so succinctly
spare crown
ty.. xD
sacred thicket
figured i'd try ass so i changed my loot spec to ass for the vault and got a 226 dagger lol
limber lion
Which covenant/talents are you playing?
I can give you an opener for ST if you'd like.
nimble spoke
I was necro and am now venthyr. I love it, but I mostly play sin for everything
stoic needle
turns out if i upgrade a helm i have in my bags to 220 and socket it, it's a big...
Keep in mind for the future that the vault is the only non-raid/pvp source of 223+ gear so prioritize getting that stuff out of it at as much as you can. Access to gear like that is time gated so you want to get the most value from it as you can
limber lion
and raid
Right, the opener for PvP and raid is really different. You can go to #pvp if you want to learn the openers for that.
I can help you with the raid one if you'd like
spare crown
yes please
limber lion
yes please
Right, are you playing with EP/Vigor or BS/DS talents? I'm assuming with Vigor because you're Necro?
In that case, the opener is pretty similar is it is for Venthyr:
Muti - Snd - Muti - Garrote - Rupture - Vendetta - Muti - Shiv - Vanish - Env - Muti - Env - SBS
spare crown
i am following pin talents
prisma monolithBOT
limber lion
RH and Wowhead guides are updated with new rotations
I think Icyveins is a bit outdated.
spare crown
oh okay.. thanks bunch!
strange python
Any rough estimates on how much dps I'm losing by not using vanish? Master assassin.
Trying to match my sim dps on a dummy and details goes all fucky when you vanish.
limber lion
Any rough estimates on how much dps I'm losing by not using vanish? Master assas...
It's really hard to say, but it's not that much
strange python
I'm off my sim by about 200 dps
limber lion
That seems about right.
strange python
The biggest gap seems to be my flag and trinkets are doing a fraction of what my sim thinks
sleek sparrow
3 worthless necrotic wake items from vault 
strange python
Over 5 mins sim think flag should have done 70k, mine does 35k. Flayedwing poison sim suggests 30k, dummy it did 10k
sacred thicket
I wish I wasn't so mongo that I can't hit my sim numbers on a dummy.
strange python
Huh?
strange python
I mean if you're hitting the same number of autos as your sim and your passive proccing trinket just does half the damage...must be mongo
safe totem
tyty
sacred thicket
i got some mists loot despite not doing it this week, iirc. good stuff
cyan echo
i have 220 weapons but im scared ill never get another 226 vial
phial
**
do i just take the +6 phial?
limber lion
Weapon is probably bigger, sim them
limber lion
There we go
stoic needle
That Phial though
stoic needle
To also be fair
spice spire
Imagine getting daggers
hardy dagger
so is the m+ opener the same old tripple garrote into ct?
burnt star
Ive never seen phial either
mint kindle
Is there a good way to sim some form of the Sludgefist fight?
stoic needle
A better comparison would be to sim a 220 weapon to 226 weapon, and 220 Phial to 226 Phial
And see which is the larger upgrade
stoic needle
Is there a good way to sim some form of the Sludgefist fight?
No because you'd need to create a custom APL
cyan echo
yea i went with the phial
no way i was passing it up it would be another year til i see it
sacred thicket
I'd complain about never seeing a phial... but the vault keeps throwing weapons at me.
burnt star
I hope we wont be using it in 1 year tbh
spice spire
Pick your poison
I get neither 😦
Only reason I have 213 daggers is because another rogue pulled them two weeks in a row and didn’t Need lmao
cyan echo
A better comparison would be to sim a 220 weapon to 226 weapon, and 220 Phial to...
i did that exact scenario it was +23 for the weapon
surreal halo
Is necro supposed to be this close!?
stoic needle
Yeah
subtle tundra
it is with vigor aswell so its a bit closer
stoic needle
If you had more haste gear the gap would be slightly larger too
limber lion
Yeah, sim yourself with Deeper Stratagem my boy
surreal halo
Nice one yeah, ill give it a go! Only 15% haste rn... Making the switch from outlaw for the raiding fun
plush oasis
So I got five daggers from PF and saw 5 other people in my groups get phial before I finally got the damn thing. Should have guilted guildies to help me get it.
limber lion
You don't need much haste. I have 17% and it's just fine.
stoic needle
i did that exact scenario it was +23 for the weapon
How likely do you think it is for you do pvp for a weapon or get a mythic token? If it's not likely at all then go for the weapon
limber lion
Crit is already my highest simming stat
limber lion
How likely do you think it is for you do pvp for a weapon or get a mythic token?...
He already took the Phial
cyan echo
^^
stoic needle
Lol
I don't blame you because there's no replacement for a Phial
But there's lots of ways to get weapons besides vault
cyan echo
yep
plush oasis
Now I have to decide if I want to pair phial with chain or with iqd. Iqd naturally sims better, but I know that's probably not realistic.
sacred thicket
There's really not a lot of buttons to press here is there
tidal gorge
I hate all of you that get good items in your vault. 
shy dust
Now I have to decide if I want to pair phial with chain or with iqd. Iqd natural...
Don’t sleep on Iqd
Sin is a very streamlined and simple spec hazard
Does not have a lot of buttons
plush oasis
Dude. My healers are always oom. Iqd is so frustrating.
sacred thicket
ok, just getting anxiety that I have so many empty buttons
also fck managing iqd
the real qustion is should I bind my vendetta to a shift mod just for muscle memory of "big cd is shift mod" that I've already established.
knotty sparrow
I love that sin has fewer buttons
knotty sparrow
Meanwhile sub PvP requires like 18 macros
shy dust
You look at a wa it tells you
sacred thicket
i mean if u need a special aura to make it the best....
¯_(ツ)_/¯
and it's an icky 3 min cd
unborn eagle
did they fix the daggers to swords transmog cheat
shy dust
I too would not use a really strong trinket because it requires me to shift my eyes to a wa for a total of 5 seconds
surreal halo
😵 Went with DS aswell and haste gems and necro came out on top!
dawn ivy
quick swap
surreal halo
I am so confused! How!?
plush oasis
My problem with iqd is that I keep finding myself prepped with all my cds ready to go, then iqd is just stuck on mana.
knotty sparrow
Did you sim venth with the Flag conduit?
plush oasis
For probably entil execute is available.
Plus with the 3min, fight duration is a big deal.
limber lion
😵 Went with DS aswell and haste gems and necro came out on top!
I don't even see Venthyr there, are you sure you simmed it? Link the sim.
limber lion
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/dsA5rLr36Jg98TpEEdj9Do
You don't have Thrill Seeker equipped on the Venthyr sim
You're also simming a 143 ilvl conduit
balmy condor
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/dsA5rLr36Jg98TpEEdj9Do
You didn’t have thrill seeker selected, also a 145 lashing doesn’t do you any favors, can get a 200 from a calling super easy
strange python
cosmic tinsel
Sup guys. With recent Assa changes I've seen some new pvp videos, and a lot of them are suggesting Master Assassin legendary as it works well with Vanish as offensive CD and shadowmeld. But I'm playing chad Horde, not Alliance so my guess is Master Assassin isnt THAT good without shadowmeld for pvp?
limber lion
limber lion
Sup guys. With recent Assa changes I've seen some new pvp videos, and a lot of t...
It is still really good, but a lot of people are gravitating toward Doomblade in PvP. You can ask the folks in #pvp for more info, they know better.
lucid harness
Hey yall! any reason why Doomblade is recommended on shoulders? Does it really matter if shoulders/hands?
surreal halo
Ahhhh that makes sense! Thanks @limber lion and @balmy condor! I thought that made my covenant switch choice very easy, but back to the drawing board I guess haha
limber lion
Hey yall! any reason why Doomblade is recommended on shoulders? Does it really m...
It's not recommended on shoulders. It's recommended on hands if you have a chance to get mythic SLG shoulders. If not, doesn't matter.
lucid harness
Sweet thanks my dude
limber lion
No worries mate
sacred thicket
is it worth it to sim stat weights and build my lego off that or just go the top two
limber lion
is it worth it to sim stat weights and build my lego off that or just go the top...
If you want to minmax it, you can sim it by using Top Gear.
limber lion
Just use all of the combinations and see which one comes out top.
limber lion
Which two trinkets would you run for M Sludgefist:
Dreadfire and Phial
sacred thicket
oh huh top gear will let me know that info?
halcyon zealot
phisl nd dfv
limber lion
Yes.
slender urchin
Thanks bois
halcyon zealot
memory of sins is super good too if u have it
slender urchin
We should get him tonight with the nerfs
strange python
Anyone here use dashing instead of doomblade?
sleek sparrow
@sacred thicket you can sim legendary crafts with different stats in top gear
dense bramble
can i see damage chart like details after running a topgear sim?
sleek sparrow
No only quick iirc
limber lion
can i see damage chart like details after running a topgear sim?
You can see the Simulationcraft breakdown in HTML-form if you sim it with few iterations
But you can just do a top-gear sim, then copy the build to Quick Sim and there you can see everything
dense bramble
gonna try. Ty Cev!
limber lion
gonna try. Ty Cev!
frigid kestrel
Whats broken with Bloodfang? Do the bleeds just not hit hard enough, or not proc enough?
limber lion
Whats broken with Bloodfang? Do the bleeds just not hit hard enough, or not proc...
AFAIK, the legendary is just very undertuned. The numbers are just all too low.
gusty mirage
wtb more soul ash per wing already
limber lion
It needs the Doomblade treatment to be good.
frigid kestrel
Gotcha, seemed like it would have been a solid M+ lego reading it
Got bored, now im reading over the lego abilities for the first time since beta
limber lion
Quite a few cool legendaries out there, which are not usable because they are undertuned.
gusty mirage
kinda sucks, because it'd be fun to experiment with the dif ones and see what weird builds people could make viable
frigid kestrel
TTB is what shiv should be. without a lego
gusty mirage
you're not wrong
limber lion
Shiv is already kinda loaded tbh
frigid kestrel
Shiv is already kinda loaded tbh
thats fair
frigid kestrel
Be neat to see a DP build, Like if we had enough energy to just keep Vendetta up
stoic needle
Does bloodfang work with exsang 
limber lion
2 awful abilities combined to make one giga-ability
dense axle
did necro sims change recently? cause now Sudden Fractures is simming above any other conduits for me
limber lion
limber lion
did necro sims change recently? cause now Sudden Fractures is simming above any ...
Yes, they have updated Sudden Fractures apl
dense axle
crazy
limber lion
It is generally the better conduit for Necros now
Not for everyone and not for every situation
dense axle
5 min patchwork is my baseline
and if there's multi targets itll just get better
well now I can use Heirmir for all of my specs. Poggers
sacred thicket
I somehow after all this time do not have lashing scars... ope
gusty mirage
I found a correlation between needing loot from a boss and getting conduits. If you don't need loot, you won't get the conduit. If you DO need loot you'll get the conduit. So go into heroic sire and pretend you really need loot
limber lion
I somehow after all this time do not have lashing scars... ope
You should have it in one day, no problem
Literally do all callings, kill wb and kill sire on all difficulties
No way you don't get a lashing after that
sacred thicket
hrm haven't killed sire in a minute
limber lion
How many callings have you done?
You also have to be Venthyr, in case you weren't aware.
sacred thicket
oh eh, I went reading up on it, I'm not venthyr so that explains that. not gonna swap either I don't think so B tier it is.
limber lion
Welp.
sacred thicket
I thought it was odd that with everything I do I hadn't gotten it lol
dense axle
lol
sacred thicket
cool well thanks to this discord I'm ready for my first day as Sin
gusty mirage
Welcome to the club 🙂
in case anyone's wondering, Whispyr's blessing of my GV didn't work
I got hot garbo
sacred thicket
the only reason I'm trying Sin is because I was like "f it i'll try for a dagger" and I was blessed.
gusty mirage
only reason you're trying sin is cause we're the alpha rogues now
sacred thicket
eh, I like outlaw
limber lion
in case anyone's wondering, Whispyr's blessing of my GV didn't work
Mine did last week :^)
Assa best spec
gusty mirage
There's always next week 
sacred thicket
I remember my Sin glory days back in... uh cata?
gusty mirage
I had sin glory days in bfa man
raven locust
Cata was Sub
sleek sparrow
@gusty mirage but wait I do need H sire loot and still haven't gotten the conduit 
sacred thicket
MoP? I was Sin at some point back then.
limber lion
I just played Combat in Cata
sacred thicket
Cata sub was fun
surreal halo
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/vgYR67w1bJe4m6GjvJXPad
Oooof that is a big difference! What a champ.
gusty mirage
tbh I still need a 220 dreadfire, so I just get anima power
raven locust
Assass was very good in MoP
gusty mirage
I think if you need loot AND the conduit, you get anima power
sleek sparrow
Sadge
tropic echo
haste crit on dblade right?
sacred thicket
I never touched combat until this xpac, but hadn't played since MoP so
limber lion
haste crit on dblade right?
Yes
sleek sparrow
Cata combat with legendary daggers was lit
raven locust
Yea it was pretty fun
gusty mirage
I missed cata and mop, and I'm actually so sad about it
sacred thicket
loved those daggers... with the xmog would still let u get wings
raven locust
Though Cata during prepatch Assassination was insanely OP with the daggers
balmy condor
Oooof that is a big difference! What a champ.
raven locust
Was a lot of fun for those few weeks
gusty mirage
<a:MenheraLove2:679097361464557578>
Nice name 
strange python
What % haste are you guys around?
gusty mirage
I think I'm at like 17%, I'd have to log in and check though
limber lion
17.4%
shy dust
Somewhere between 0 and 20%
strange python
Gotcha thx
stoic needle
19.39%
gusty mirage
17.5%
sacred thicket
16 😦
stoic needle
getting kinda impatient with these boes i might just equip these boots
instead of waiting for them to sell
sacred thicket
mythic ones?
sacred thicket
I'd slap those bad bois on
gusty mirage
I would if they're an ilvl upgrade and you don't need the gold
sacred thicket
can i interest you in day trading?
stoic needle
maybe 
stoic needle
i still haven't quite found a guild that i'm hyped to be in yet
raven locust
oof
gusty mirage
my IO from s3 and s4 bfa got me into my current guild lol
stoic needle
i wish they could combine EU and NA
so lame that half the cool people are across the pond
limber lion
Yep, too bad the servers can't handle it
And it would suck for the other continent ping-wise
NA players sitting at 30 ping and EU at 280
Pog
strange python
hey i just switched from sub and im not doing as much as i feel i should
stoic needle
strange python
can som1 lend a hand?
stoic needle
post some logs
sour citrus
Get dem choices...213 boots with crit/vers VS 216 overcharged anima batt, whilst I have 213 mem of past sins and 207 quantum device... Grrrrr
gentle gyro
Ah riiiiiight, vault tomorrow
limber lion
dunno if i have any fro mthis week let me check
SSK logs don't really help, can't really analyze them
There's so much downtime and random stuff happening
gentle gyro
Time to get a 2nd phial as my only choice
strange python
ik but only fight as assa besides 2 hours a day on the stick
slate harbor
should my first leggo be doomblade on gloves with haste crit? Guides are kind of saying various things
spice spire
There's so much downtime and random stuff happening
Not running CT is pretty troll though right?
limber lion
SSK is a really troll fight, legit cannot help you with that.
You can run a ST build to maximize Shade damage, you can run a burst build with MA legendary and EP/NS/MFD to maximize shield damage or a full aoe build
spice spire
I mean you’re not wrong. You’re either padding hard or feeling bad
limber lion
Literally cannot help you with that. Would need to see some other logs.
If your comparison on "not doing well" is from 1 single pull on SSK, it's not a good comparison
strange python
ill upload today ones later then
spice spire
But yeah, literally ANY other fight
strange python
no no i have full night of attemps
limber lion
You played Sub most of the prog
strange python
like 20 trys half assa hals subt
yeah been sub whole exp so far
switched a week ago and just to train mostly. but feel i dont quite get it
limber lion
But yeh, upload any other fight and we'll take a look. Preferably Shriek/Huntsman/Arti/Hungering/Lady or Sludge
But generally, anything else but SSK xd
strange python
i think we going hungering today
gaunt geyser
is really covenant doing that much in case of dps?
sacred thicket
what boss is ssk? blanking
strange python
kaelthas
sacred thicket
ah.
limber lion
is really covenant doing that much in case of dps?
Quite a bit yes, Venthyr is significantly better than Kyrian in ST.
But in the end it doesn't reaaaaaally matter
Necro and Venthyr are quite close, NF is not too far away of those and is very versatile for most content.
Kyrian is pretty lackluster for Assa though and doesn't really fit into anything.
gaunt geyser
Quite a bit yes, Venthyr is significantly better than Kyrian in ST.
Necro is my choose, i guess
strange python
yup but im not switching again xD
limber lion
But it's not like you will do 1k less damage by going a "sub-optimal covenant"
Necro does the most sustained AoE damage, Venthyr the highest ST damage
So you'll be gucci if you go Necro
gentle gyro
Basically, do w/e you want
velvet bridge
Do we get energy for deadly poison procs?
gentle gyro
Except kyrian
strange python
D:
limber lion
Do we get energy for deadly poison procs?
No, only from Garrote/Rupture ticks.
You are required to have a poison on the target for that to work though.
spice spire
What the fuck is that
balmy condor
Cache sucks
spice spire
Ye I’m ready for disappointment
gray fjord
balmy condor
What the fuck is that
Cursed pikachu
spice spire
That’s cursed In every single metric, chief
gray fjord
Yeah pretty much the stuff of nightmares, the more I look at it.
balmy condor
That’s cursed In every single metric, chief
gray fjord
Naw that's tame
limber lion
Looks pretty cute
gray fjord
uwu
limber lion
Reminds me of my ex
gray fjord
balmy condor
I have so many emotes
gray fjord
I need that little kissie bear one you have, Whispyr.
balmy condor
I actually had to leave a server to join yours zera
gray fjord
❤️
stoic needle
Cache sucks
Let's see it
balmy condor
Cause there’s a server cap
strange python
vestal wren
the server cap is 100
balmy condor
Yeah
gray fjord
So Whispyr is a Discord Hoe is what we're saying here.
limber lion
Never knew someone that was addicted to Discord emotes
balmy condor
why can’t I hold all these emotes
limber lion
There's always a fetish for everything
balmy condor
There's always a fetish for everything
I also do log reviews
strange python
icy crater
finally got some nice stats goin https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/6g1J734wjWmLtLM3ZDeTds
prob swap enchants to crit
inland heath
mastery increases the dmg of phial of putrefaction?
stoic needle
any other sinful, celestial, and lightless force dagger gamers? 
stoic needle
mastery increases the dmg of phial of putrefaction?
no
balmy condor
mastery increases the dmg of phial of putrefaction?
Trinkets have no interaction with any of our abilities
inland heath
why is it soo wanted then
limber lion
any other sinful, celestial, and lightless force dagger gamers? <:smugpepe:64215...
Definitely not
shy dust
why is it soo wanted then
the trinket
stoic needle
i can't decide between sinful or lightless for my hammer
shy dust
just does A LOT of damage
limber lion
Everyone wants the trinket
balmy condor
Boys I have the hottest of news straight from the presses
limber lion
Not just us
Literally warriors and demon hunters want it
And they are ooga booga smash characters
balmy condor
Barring any crazy borrowed power
balmy condor
We’re dropping blindside for ep early next tier
stoic needle
plain thistle
rip
balmy condor
I just got it to sim higher on a 240 profile
limber lion
Still with DS?
balmy condor
Yep
limber lion
oh no.
stoic needle
but think about how big the envenoms will be
balmy condor
Doomblade envenom stacking seems to kinda be a thing
stoic needle
stoic needle
10%(ep)+5%(deeper)+15%(doomblade)
balmy condor
That’s probably doubtful
limber lion
main hand
gleaming eagle
left hand ?
limber lion
:^)
stoic needle
both actually
stoic needle
left
stoic needle
mut damage and therefore doomblade dot damage scales from both weapons
gleaming eagle
ah ok
balmy condor
Soon even CT will pull through
The CP you spend on CT to buff enven is better used to actually just do another envenom
limber lion
The CP you spend on CT to buff enven is better used to actually just do another ...
Yeaah makes sense. Good. 
limber lion
Yeh for sure
So, when we get 2 legendaries next patch, PB will pull even more ahead when we start running Doom + Dashing
stoic needle
doomblade+zoldyck tho
limber lion
doomblade+zoldyck tho <:pepehmm:674322381841498118>
I'm actually wet thinking about MA + Doomblade on Sludge
gleaming eagle
buff zoldyk to 50%
balmy condor
Inb4 some crazy ass borrowed power that gives you 900000 agility per bleed on the target and CT single target skyrockets past poison bomb again because poison bomb is a shit talent
limber lion
Too bad it'll be old tier at that point :'''(
stoic needle
sludge will be the go to fight for cheesing the biggest envenom ever for the rest of the tier tho
limber lion
Inb4 some crazy ass borrowed power that gives you 900000 agility per bleed on th...
PB is actually such a boring talent
stoic needle
so i will be enjoying it
urban shadow
gimmie that legion pb
limber lion
Hell nah fuck that
stoic needle
shiv makes your next envenom guaranteed to proc a PB. there fixed problem solved write me a check blizzard
balmy condor
Rng parse nonsense
limber lion
Delete pb
The top parses had 20-40% of their damage done by PB
Very healthy design
Even more on AoE bosses like Eonar
hollow escarp
oh dude
limber lion
proccing PB on those ads
Ye gotta agree though that proccing PB on Mythic Eonar Felhounds was pretty dank
But still, awful design nonetheless lol
hollow escarp
proccing PB during MA window
it was fun
trash but fun
a scuffed version of Convoke parsing today for boomies
stoic needle
but imagine how satisfying PB+CT together would be
i've had it in torghast it's litty
balmy condor
@stoic needle
limber lion
<@!502859708504342538>
Lmao
balmy condor
tempted to take the trinket just for ilvl or something
limber lion
Don't you already have 2 226 mastery rings anyways?
gray fjord
tempted to take the trinket just for ilvl or something
Ngl I did that a few weeks ago just to bump up my queue level. xD
stoic needle
<@!502859708504342538>
the trinket for queue ilvl is valid
also apparently it's a good trinket when you take into account the overall raid dps bonus
just hard to sim for that
limber lion
Trinkets that benefit your whole team? 
balmy condor
oh btw before you ask, I have that cloak
limber lion
Skip
stoic needle
limber lion
Upgrade
gray fjord
But that is like
balmy condor
Upgrade <:poggers:652288776021999626>
neither are equipped 
limber lion
Take the trinket my boy
gray fjord
^
limber lion
Never play it
gray fjord
^
limber lion
But take it
stoic needle
that's such a dogshit ring
limber lion
vers literally increases your envenom damage tho
haste doesn't
and neither does crit
stoic needle
yeah but mastery is more efficient at it
stoic needle
because i dont want melee to be in my top damage sources 
envenoms, deadly poison, garotte, rupture
melee
gray fjord
Ez
stoic needle
in that order
limber lion
It won't be with 0 haste my boy
limber lion
But Haste = more melee damage
limber lion
You don't want melee to be your top damage, but you build toward it
torpid spoke
is quantum device that good?
limber lion
Yeh
torpid spoke
maybe for parsing...
stoic needle
haste is unavoidable
dull cloak
is there such thing as too much haste :)
torpid spoke
i feel like it sucks everrywhere else
stoic needle
it's amazing in m+
limber lion
And haste only increases your attack speed, energy regen and bleed tick speed
stoic needle
and on prog
limber lion
And attack speed = very big melee
stoic needle
giving your healers mana isnt a bad thing
sudden river
haste sucks in m+ :/
stoic needle
wrong
limber lion
haste sucks in m+ :/
No it doesn't my boy