assassination

[low girder]

that's only if you won't lose a use

[pliant apex]

it needs to be times with vendetta

[low girder]

which isn't every fight

no

[limber lion]

I'm a Venthyr myself as well because I want big deeps

But it's A FACT that Night Fae is the best all around spec. It has tools for EVERY content in the game.

And the BEST covenant ability in the game.

[loud niche]

same, venth because i think it will out perform nf in pretty much every scenario

[pliant apex]

flag doesnt need to be used second time now right? from tuesdfay onward?

[loud niche]

except maybe pvp

[lament mica]

correct

[limber lion]

No, but you need to stay on the target for 24s to get full value out of it.

[strange python]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[lament mica]

flag is no longer a fuckign discusting ability to use

[limber lion]

If you do a mechanic, you lose out on value.

By a ton.

[loud niche]

you don't have to stay on THAT target tho? as long as youre on A target

[pulsar sluice]

tbh venth sin might be bis for pvp too, much feelcraft but most of pvp is feelcraft

[pliant apex]

coz you use it once now right?

[limber swallow]

you don't have to stay on the target. The target has to stay alive.

[pulsar sluice]

you don't need resets

[lament mica]

yes

u only use it once

1 GCD

[limber swallow]

1 GCD, no energy.

[pliant apex]

niccce

[limber lion]

You literally have to stay on the target and keep using abilities to do damage with it. If you do something else but hit the target, you're losing out on Flag value.

Like it's not even an argument. It's just a fact.

[pulsar sluice]

yes but what about NF?

[silent dune]

Sepsis is best with MA lego though

[limber swallow]

no, you don't. Consuming combo points increases the stacks. It doesn't have to be on that target.

[pulsar sluice]

do you not time sepsis with vendetta

[limber lion]

You do. Just like you do with Flag

[lament mica]

u get haste stacks but u don't benefit from the dmg

is wat he's saying

[pulsar sluice]

you suffer from downtime aswell

[limber lion]

What does that have to do with anything?

[faint harness]

the benefit of venthyr ability lasts over 24 seconds when you include haste, if you have to move off the boss during that time you're obviously losing benefit

[limber lion]

Do you not know what downtime is?

[pulsar sluice]

so your argument is just NF has more mobility is all, and venthyr has more damage

[faint harness]

sepsis is a dot that doesnt require anything from you and lasts for half the duration of venthyr

[loud niche]

cev, you don't have to stay on the target you used the flag on, assuming it's not changing?

[lament mica]

i mean bottom line is, as with vendetta, u don't randomly use it when it comes up. u use ur brain and don't use it befoer a mechanic goes out. takes more thinking than some other options tho, for sure

[limber lion]

Syncing Vendetta with your covenant ability is in no way related to downtime whatsoever

[loud niche]

you just need to be able to do dps to spend cp

[limber lion]

Yes, you need to be able to spend cp.

[pliant apex]

im actually confused now, should i NOT change covs now? stay NF?

[pulsar sluice]

can you not do that with flag as well?

[lament mica]

thats what im saying lol

[limber swallow]

right, you can use CP, so if you flag say sire, and then go kill one of the adds, you still get the benefit.

[lament mica]

thats my exact point

u should do that with flag

[limber lion]

If you use Flag on Artificer and you get ghosts, unlucky. You just completely missed out on your covenant ability.

[pulsar sluice]

so I really don't get this argument

[limber lion]

You use Sepsis on Artificer and it still does 15k damage

[lament mica]

im on the argument of flag being good lol

[pastel seal]

Want insane ST for all specs, especially Assa? Go Venthyr. Want insane AoE, especially Outlaw? Go Necro. Wanna be decent at all? NF is fine. Wanna be shit? Go Kyrian

[limber lion]

You miss the point. Downtime =/= Syncing Vendetta

[limber swallow]

ok, so your point is, you have to be able to spend points, and that is 100% true.. so if you use it and get screwed by mechanics, sure.

[stoic needle]

no you can't

[pulsar sluice]

but why would you use sepsis without shiv or vendetta

[loud niche]

okay, sure. if you end up having to do mechanics, it's worse off

[pulsar sluice]

im gonna hamemr a nail ot my head brb

[limber lion]

Shall I quote myself again here?

[lament mica]

mechanics aren't random, u know when mechanics are coming

don't use flag benfore a mechanic goes out

shit happens, but do ur best to make sure it doesn't

[limber lion]

Best ST: Venthyr
Best AoE: Necro
Best all around: NF
bad: Kyrian

[loud niche]

but simply not being on main target isn't that bad. and again, i'll disagree and say that all rounder goes to venth now ❤️

[pastel seal]

hey cool we wrote the same thing 😄

[faint harness]

I mean atm you already know how CN plays out and you can plan around it. I'm mostly talking about prog situations

[limber lion]

It's just not true but okay

[loud niche]

you've YET to prove that point

[pliant apex]

dam you guys fighting now lol , it doesnt help

[limber lion]

I've already done several times, and Push is backing me up.

Best all around =/= best damage in all content

[faint harness]

you're deflecting this to not being on "main target" if you cant be at any target at all after activating flag you just lost a fuckton of dps where neither kyrian, nf or necro would

[normal crater]

I’m Kyrian and staying shit, fuck it

[loud niche]

mechanics = nf > venth, and when you need to blink. that's not really proving it

[steel bane]

just try it out on tuesday it's not like you are locked forever with your covenant

don't like change it back

[limber lion]

If you take NF, you will do good on ALL content. If you take Venthyr, you'll be good on content where you don't have downtime.

[faint harness]

if you cant see how flag is more punishing than the other 3 abilities you're just in denial

[loud niche]

didnt say that

did i?

[limber lion]

Night Fae is the literal definition of a perfect all around covenant.

[lament mica]

flag does have the benefit of upfront burst if thats something that matters in a certain situation

[pliant apex]

ok ill saty NF then

[lament mica]

it has huge sustain clearly but also upfront

[loud niche]

i said that it's better for all around. as in, it's better for most situations than going NF for sepsis

[limber lion]

1. Good ST soulbind.
2. Good AOE soulbind.
3. Very good covenant ability which does not lose value because of downtime
4. The BEST signature covenant ability in the game.

[faint harness]

both thrill seeker and flag haste passive puts uptime as a bigger requirement than the other covenants, simple stuff

[pulsar sluice]

Honestly I liked the set and forget of sepsis, but not having a spell to press in psuedo shadow dance was assballscheeks so no ty to sepsis

[pliant apex]

yea think i should stay NF now

[limber lion]

Venthyr is not an all arounder by any means

[pliant apex]

too much work to give up stuff

[limber lion]

Door of Shadows is awful. Thrill seeker is awful.

Using flag with downtime is awful.

There's nothing awful about NF.

[pastel seal]

I switched to Venthyr today and nearly started crying when I found how just how shit door of shadows was. It's mind boggeling how blizz isn't buffing it

[limber lion]

You don't get punished by going NF.

[simple wadi]

Sepsis isn’t awful but not impactful

[loud niche]

other than losing in any dps race vs venth when both have almost 100% uptime 😉

[simple wadi]

For pve*

[limber lion]

Exactly. That's where Venthyr shines.

On ST fights where they have high uptime.

But NOT as an all around class by any means.

[pulsar sluice]

but wy would you take a rogue if not for damage

[lament mica]

idk wat fight has a mechanic where u would flag then get pulled off without knowing its coming

[steel bane]

truly think you are overestimating uptime here. It's really easy to "dodge" bad shit when you pop your cds

[pulsar sluice]

Yeah like we have fucking cloak

[loud niche]

yeah, so wanna go thru the raid bosses? i mean, pvp you could debate that nf is better cuz you get ticking dps, but venth you get flag so i mean...

[limber lion]

24s is a very, very long time.

[pastel seal]

Artificer for example? With portals/ghosts. Inerva? with links, etc etc etc

[pulsar sluice]

who cares about hungering balls or artificer ghost

[limber lion]

I assume you don't do any mythic raiding then.

[lament mica]

i asked for a specific boss lol

[steel bane]

Inerva would be bad yeah

[lament mica]

xymox u know exactly wahts coming

lady u have insane uptime what

[pulsar sluice]

umm you know when geometry is coming for inverva

[loud niche]

I'll assume you don't do any mythic raiding then.

kik'

[pulsar sluice]

if you don't then idk what to say

[burnt star]

i seriously dont know what mythic fight i dont have 100% uptime.. tbh beside shriekwing and sunking...

[pastel seal]

So you know exactly when you're getting ghosts and when you're getting portals? Holy fucking shit you can predict the future? 😮

[pulsar sluice]

i never had a situation where i was in vendetta and i got pulled away to do geo

[burnt star]

u can cloak 1 ghost

[lament mica]

u know what the mechanic goes out lol

[burnt star]

when u use cds..

[lament mica]

just assume it gonna go on u

and don't use cds before the mechanic goes out...

[steel bane]

thing with Inerva is that you usually want to burst when adds spawn and it's syncs with beams

[loud niche]

if you pop cds on xymox right before ghosts, and dont have cloak. you're dumb

[pastel seal]

Mate in mythic ghosts or portals go out every 2,412 seconds

[faint harness]

i mean holding your cds for an extended time is also a dps loss

you understand that too right

[pulsar sluice]

nah I usually burst to push the hp limits so adds don't spawn

no reason to hold onto shit

[burnt star]

u dont need to hold cds..

[lament mica]

depends on the timing of the fight lol

[loud niche]

extended time is less than 30sec?

[faint harness]

still a dps loss

[limber lion]

Like it's not even an argument.

[steel bane]

yiou can't skip every add @pulsar sluice

[loud niche]

its not?

[lament mica]

its not a dps loss if ur not gonna get to use the ability again...

[loud niche]

we have cloak my guy. downtime can usually be avoided when it needs to be

[faint harness]

plenty of fights got RNG downtime, shriek, huntsman, inerva, council, slg and sire

[limber lion]

Right, let's use cloak on a mythic boss because I want to DPS

[loud niche]

dont pop right before geometry

[lament mica]

shriek has rng downtime what lol

[limber lion]

Let's not save cloak for something actually important in the fight

[faint harness]

yes?

[lament mica]

WHAT

im lost

[faint harness]

do you not run out with echolocation

[lament mica]

no

[loud niche]

right. are you using cloak for traps? if so, where are the dks? where are the hunters?

[faint harness]

ok

[limber lion]

push help, I don't know what else to say

[loud niche]

echo is literally under 3 seconds of downtime

[limber lion]

I'm torn

[limber lion]

3s of dps loss

[pulsar sluice]

any soak is important tho

[loud niche]

yep

[faint harness]

if those 3 seconds happen during the 12 sec activation time

[pulsar sluice]

if you soak artificer ghost, good

if you soak hungering ball, good

[lament mica]

u know when echolocation goe out and its even less than 3 seconds

i literally soulshape with 2 seconds then step back

[faint harness]

but do you plan around echolocation

[loud niche]

3 seconds, how much dps does nf do in that 3 seconds vs venth averaging out so much higher?

[limber lion]

LMAO LMAO

We're talking about using VENTHYR

And you say that you soulshape awayt

[lament mica]

door of shadows

[faint harness]

its a cast

[limber lion]

1.5s cast

[faint harness]

you dont do anything during a cast

[pulsar sluice]

you have to move away anyway

cast it when its about to go to 1s

like theres ways to use the spell

[lament mica]

i mean we aren't just talking about venthyr anywayt we're talking about downtime on CN bosses

[faint harness]

like i dont understand how its so hard to grasp that there is rng downtime in this game and if that happens to you during cds you will be more punished as venthyr compared to otehr covenants

even impale on sire denny

[lament mica]

cuz its not 100% rng

u know when its coming

[faint harness]

you dont fucking plan around it

[lament mica]

thats why

[pulsar sluice]

i just cant believe we are talking about downtime on one of the specs with the least downtime in the game

[faint harness]

i dont believe ur looking at shriek boss timers and hold cds for echolocation going out

i simply dont

[loud niche]

shriek clears sepsis

when he goes into p2

[limber lion]

help

[loud niche]

so it's null

[faint harness]

it never overlaps

[limber lion]

someone

[lament mica]

i dont really cuz on shriek it means like nothing, but u have the ability to.. its compeltely within ur power

[faint harness]

if you press sepsis on cd its done before it happens

[stoic needle]

We having fun in here children?

[limber lion]

Shriek phases at 2mins, Sepsis is a 1.5m cd

Even if you sync it with Vendetta, you won't be using it before the intermission ends

Because Vendetta won't be up when he phases.

[faint harness]

i mean shriek is a good example, yea its a boss that doesnt matter but if you care about parsing, venthyr is just worse on it

[loud niche]

lol

we'll see on that

[faint harness]

cus your flag + vendetta combo gets delayed to after immunity phase

[lament mica]

that doesn't make sense

[pastel seal]

If you care about big pp dps for shriek, you go Sub there like a chad 😎

[lament mica]

cuz parasing is about getting lucky

[limber lion]

LMAO

[lament mica]

ur always gonna parse better with the better option

assumung u get lucky

[limber lion]

Oh no

Oh no

[loud niche]

and still pushes more dps in the fights timeframe i bet.

[lament mica]

it really is

[limber lion]

Oh no

[faint harness]

"get lucky"

[limber lion]

Someone please help me

[low girder]

it is not

lol

[lament mica]

yes

[limber lion]

Someone

[pulsar sluice]

you aren't going to parse if you get mechanics dawg

[lament mica]

do u think high pasrses don't have a high # of crits then the lower parses....

[pulsar sluice]

thats just how it goes

[lament mica]

im so confused right now

[dim shoal]

Does someone have a rough estimate of how much dps you loose when you dont have uptime during flag

[lament mica]

and u need to not get mechanics

yea lmao

[loud niche]

a lot sandblast

[lament mica]

obviously u also need to play well, that goes without saying

[faint harness]

we're not talking about straight rank 1s

[lament mica]

play well + luck = parse

[limber lion]

"I only parsed a 73 because I got unlucky"

[burnt star]

@lament mica is right there though.. parsing means u didnt get mechanic.. specialy on artificier

[limber lion]

KEKW

[lament mica]

well u said venrhyr won't parse well on shreik... i promise it'll be the #1 parse

and prob top 100

[faint harness]

alright

[loud niche]

actually, 73 to 90+ on huntsman can simply be unlucky

if you get picked for the stupid shots

[loud niche]

d o w n t i m e

[burnt star]

parsing just mean u have the best scenario possible + doing your job to do the damage.. and those high parse are gonna be those scenario..

• also get pi fed of course 😉

[gloomy fern]

u always get 90-95% even with mechanics if u play good and u dont have dogshit kill timers and actually got gear

[pulsar sluice]

imagine talking about downtime in sin channel

[faint harness]

its funny how you think downtime is a meme in this situation, but in another you'll say that sin is better than sub because it suffers less from downtime

[limber lion]

Yeah because you lose 20% of your parse because of one shot.

[faint harness]

hilarious

[loud niche]

it's not ONE shot

[dim shoal]

Outlaw will still have #1 because someone has 4 5 buffs. Its about consistency imo

[thorny rampart]

so

[pliant apex]

as a simple /casual player, im confused as f rigt now

[thorny rampart]

yall crafting doombleedlord?

[faint harness]

well venthyr punishes downtime more than other covenants, it's not rocket science

[pliant apex]

sepsis is easier on bosses true, flag makes you mess up with mechanics

[loud niche]

and have you seen how drastic the parsing is? a hundred dps can drop you at least 5+ people, and if your parse is dropped 5+ rankings as sin, you're only in competition with what? 70 other people?

[pulsar sluice]

sure it does if you use flag on its own without vendetta

[limber lion]

Damn, I only got a 97 parse on Huntsman. If I didn't get that one Sinseeker, it surely would have been rank 1

Imagine using Flag and getting Sinseeker

Oh boy, you'd be parsing grey at that point

[loud niche]

97 to 100, could easily have been 1 person who beat ya out by that point

[pulsar sluice]

imagine using any big cds without raid timers

[dim shoal]

Flag CD?

[stoic needle]

Just wait until you get thrill seeker during an intermission

[limber swallow]

1.5M

[dim shoal]

Yiiikkkeees

[faint harness]

as if you fucking plan around raid timers lmao

[pliant apex]

when getting new lego, what happens to old one, i gota unequip that armor piece?

[limber lion]

Imagine planning out Thrill Seeker for mechanics

[lament mica]

random procs are a whole other beast

no accounting for that

[loud niche]

imagine not planning out sepsis/flag for mechanics

[pulsar sluice]

lets not change the argument o trhill seeker we all know thats rng

[lament mica]

well its not even random

[pulsar sluice]

flag is soemthing you can control

[lament mica]

but timed i guess

[pulsar sluice]

we are talking about variables we can control

[dim shoal]

Are we holding flag for Vendetta?

[limber lion]

You do realize that Thrill Seeker is NOT something you can plan around?

[faint harness]

you're talking like its normal for a dps in here to track timers for vendetta usage

[limber lion]

And it's one of the main reasons why Venthyr sims so highly for Assa.

[faint harness]

when people cant even hit 3 abilities in a sequence

[loud niche]

imagine trying to debase someone's argument by using a logical fallacy... red herrings are tasty huh?

[balmy sable]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[limber lion]

You literally gain stacks every 2 seconds.

[celest sundial]

does anyone know if the "Prove your worth" quest gets progress by doing m+?

[limber lion]

There's NOTHING you can do to affect that

[lament mica]

ya thrillseeker is sim bait thats for facts

[limber lion]

So much talk about "planning for downtime" when a huge part of Venthyr's power is something that you CANNOT plan for.

[loud niche]

but i didnt say you could for THAT part of it

[ripe gulch]

why does everyone use zoldycks

[loud niche]

YOU brought that up when i mentioned not planning out sepsis or flag for mechanics

[faint harness]

sepsis is very different from flag

[limber lion]

No, you just said that Venthyr is the best all around covenant. Which it isn't.

[loud niche]

i did, and i'll stand by it, and we will certainly see

[burnt star]

not sure why this discussion si getting so flammed.. its not like covenant were 60% of our damage now

[lament mica]

I'd say from wat I know venthyr would be the best overall for CN idk about all content

[limber lion]

I still think you don't understand what "best all around" means.

It's not "what does the most damage in all content"

[loud niche]

best in m+ pvp and pve scenarios. your job is dps, which one brings you the most dps?

[limber lion]

All around =/= dps

[burnt star]

"if your not first, your last" - ricky bobbie

[loud niche]

assuming you at least try to controll your variables

[faint harness]

i see all these actual good players opt for necrolord over venthyr because its better for prog. But i guess they should just track boss mechanics better

[dim shoal]

Why is no one talking about kyrian 7cp envenoms?

[limber lion]

It's competitive in ST, it's competitive in AOE, it's the best in PvP, has the best signature covenant ability

Like, there's no argument.

[limber lion]

Yeah, maybe they should just plan for downtime a bit better

[faint harness]

git gud or something

[limber lion]

Venthyr is after all the best covenant in the game

For all content

[lament mica]

flag is debatably the best in pvp with the burst idk we'll see

[loud niche]

^

[astral plover]

Outlaw=Necro

Sin=ventyr

Sub=Nightfae

[burnt star]

its not like we were stuck on venthyr if it does turn out to be a sim bait

[loud niche]

kraffer, didn't you listen? that's wrong think

[dim shoal]

Rogue = bench

[burnt star]

logs are gonna talk for themself over a few week

and people will then adjust accordingly

[loud niche]

right think is that nf is BiS everywhere

kekw

[limber lion]

No one said that NF is bis everywhere

Should I quote myself for the 4th time now?

[stoic needle]

nf is just more consistent, period

[loud niche]

nobody said that venth was bis everywhere

[limber lion]

Best ST: Venthyr
Best AoE: Necrolord
Best all around: NF

[loud niche]

but you sure do parade around acting like i said that

[faint harness]

you literally said it 30 mins ago

[stoic needle]

venthyr can't be best all around covenant when both of its major soulbinds are rng/uncontrollable and the covenant ability isn't fire and forget

[loud niche]

reply to it

[limber lion]

Yeah, you literally said that earlier.

[loud niche]

i said best all around

[faint harness]

how is that different?

[limber lion]

Except, that it's not

[faint harness]

just different words

wtf

[loud niche]

oh so cev also said it about nf then you'd say?

[limber lion]

This man

[echo cargo]

Venth new BiS because you can be a teleporting vampire daddy

Sorry about your luck

[limber lion]

Yeah, because it's true. Night Fae IS the best all around covenant.

[loud niche]

or are you going to say that me saying it is somehow different from him saying it?

because feels

[dim shoal]

[fiery mauve]

To be fair

Venthyr loses on cleave

As per sims

[loud niche]

wtf is that

[icy haven]

perfect timing

[reef axle]

https://tenor.com/view/stubborn-mule-funny-gif-4867229

[loud niche]

it looks into my soul with it's singular eye... creeping me tf out

[balmy condor]

I’m gone for like an hour and I come back to 4 DM’s and a flaming spec channel

[pliant apex]

whisp they saying nf best all round and venth is hard with mechanics 😦

[astral plover]

Whips just dont ever go afk ever again

[balmy condor]

Venthyr suffers from downtime more than the others, yeah

[nocturne hawk]

From the shadows

[dim shoal]

Whispyr be like

[loud niche]

ofc it does, you have to spend cps for flag

that only makes sense.

[limber lion]

Also lose out on Thrill Seeker, which you cannot plan around.

[loud niche]

agreed, but at least youll still stomp on nf dps in more scenarios than not /shrug

[strange python]

is it better for sharpening stone or oils?

[balmy condor]

!oil

[prisma monolith]

Using consumables will increase your damage, however the difference between oil/stone/potion combinations are very minor (within 0.5% of each other). You can sim the difference for yourself by pasting this pastebin underneath your /simc input, in the "advanced sim" section of raidbots: https://pastebin.com/Lbxc7afJ

[faint harness]

didnt you just say "just plan better"

Mr. Flip over here

green name comes in

[loud niche]

yeah, forced downtime is forced downtime.

[faint harness]

changes opinion in a flash

[loud niche]

nope

[dim shoal]

[limber lion]

"Stomp" is a strong term when all covenants are within 3% off each other.

[loud niche]

if you can control a variable, and you dont, you're still dumb

like

[faint harness]

[loud niche]

nothing changed

[fiery mauve]

Wait why would sepsis stomp in more scenarios

Because it’s a dot?

[balmy condor]

I’m honestly lost about who’s arguing what right now

[faint harness]

its funny how ppl talk so big, like they do x/y when in reality they dps and just mindlessly hitting buttons

[loud niche]

you should be planning your big epeen dps cd's around mechanics. idc who you are, if you're not doing that you're playing poorly.

[fiery mauve]

With that argument, isn’t flag more pog than sepsis

[gloomy fern]

Push being schooled by muricans

[lament mica]

yes

[loud niche]

lol yeah, i just mindlessly press my face on my keys and pray for a good parse PogU

[cunning surge]

I just got here, I just want to ask, even tho it's peepeepoopoo bad, would Maim, Mangle increase the Bleed damage from Doombladed Mutilate?

[balmy condor]

Yes

[loud niche]

flag is more pog.

[cunning surge]

Thank you!!

[faint harness]

there's more than 1 gamer in here

[loud niche]

i agree.

cev out ranks me in parsemonkeying

by a lot iirc

doesn't mean i cant disagree with him fam ❤️

[lament mica]

both of u post ur WCL and ill determine who is right by whoever has tjhhe bigger allstar number

[loud niche]

kekw him i bet but ok

[lament mica]

[faint harness]

i only play sub, unironically

[limber lion]

Anyways, I'm still playing Venthyr. I just don't think it's as well rounded as NF, that's all.

[analog glade]

I wan't exsangue spec or dfa spec in SUB !! 😦

[loud niche]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/illidan/riverfang
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/eu/kazzak/ceverion

[limber lion]

Damn, we're both trash

Unlucky

What now?

[loud niche]

lol sucks to be worse than peen

[lament mica]

HE PLAY SUB

[loud niche]

guess we need to start following peen's rules. open with garrote x2

[lament mica]

everyone play sub

make me sick

[limber lion]

I've legit not cleared any of the mythic bosses in a month. Feb 10 was the last time I saw something else than Sludge/SLG.

[loud niche]

my guild fell apart :c

[dim shoal]

Ceverion wcl looks pog

[limber lion]

You look pog

[lament mica]

ya both have pretty pog wcl

i dont see enuf assassination tho

[dim shoal]

But there arent many playing assa Right?

[loud niche]

i don't. don't lie to me fam

[dim shoal]

Atleast 902

[faint harness]

1.5k ish

[wet ruin]

@balmy condor do we have any PI sims with the new venthyr? Would it make a big difference now

[lament mica]

i mean ur mythic logs coule be better but ur heroic is pog

[loud niche]

i had to stop dps EVERY vials on inerva cuz my RL said so, and grab the vial, because i'm just a rogue and they're all mages and hunters and shit

[lament mica]

i dont really look at xymox either cuz ppl could easily be mechanics-doers

[faint harness]

very few people run seeds as rogue

[balmy condor]

Didn’t change much

[lament mica]

well its still possible. my xymox parses are green cuz im a seed runner

feels bad

[wet ruin]

still shit then?

[balmy condor]

Sin has always been a decent target for PI, and a very good target with zoldyck in execute

And that’s true now as well

[gleaming reef]

Is there a way to check top sims for each spec on raidbots?

[faint harness]

what would it be otherwise?

none of our seed runners parse green

[lament mica]

[gleaming reef]

like which class is simming the highest in ST ? (all classes)

[faint harness]

shadowpriest

[lament mica]

highest ST classes are arcane mage, feral, spriest, ele

[dim shoal]

Shadow probably

[stable arch]

unholy dk?

[balmy condor]

No, and that’s kinda bait as well because some classes have much worse implementation than others

[gleaming reef]

i see

[lament mica]

udk is alright

[faint harness]

shadow priest has the biggest ST potential by quite a distance

[dim shoal]

@limber lion you Said youll still Go with venth?

Why

Whats your main point for it

[limber lion]

Because I'm a dps whore. I want big numbers.

[lament mica]

anyway, idk i guess ur seed runners are pog. i dont have anything close to green on any other fight

[dim shoal]

Same lul

[limber lion]

It's not as well rounded as Night Fae and losing Soulshape is a huge hit, but I'll accept it

[faint harness]

depending on which seed you got it should be less than 10s of downtime

[limber lion]

Sire is actually such an annoying boss without Soulshape.

Having just 1 shadowstep and getting knocked back all the time during P3 is so frustrating

[lament mica]

i run 4 seeds, and xymox is also a mechanic heavy boss in that u can get portal / ghost. just not a fight i look at very much for parses

[dim shoal]

I mean... i take one for the Team and bring venth buffs to m+

[lament mica]

its def more than 10 seconds of downtime

[faint harness]

2 shadowsteps

[dim shoal]

And vanish shadowstrike

[faint harness]

gonna miss soulshape

[dim shoal]

And cloak knockback for uptime xD

[limber lion]

I miss two shadowsteps and sprinting on water :''(

[burnt star]

blade rush > all

[silent tinsel]

Oh wtf you dont get to move your anima reservoir +

[gusty mirage]

no you don't, which is why people tell you to buy anima stuff before switching and refunding it to the vendor 😛

[faint harness]

didnt they fix that

[burnt star]

they didnt

[gusty mirage]

apparently its still a thing

[faint harness]

alright

thats nice

[burnt star]

i used it yesterday

bought 15k worth of anima

sold back for full refund

[dim shoal]

Oh fk me

[oblique flare]

[faint harness]

15k anima

[gusty mirage]

I'm still debating between going back to my vamp boys or becoming a necro boy

not like my net will let me log in anyway 😦

so I have plenty of time to think it over

[dim shoal]

Go kyrian for light mode

[burnt star]

was stacking my anima.

[dim shoal]

Log in at night and die

[gusty mirage]

I already switched venthyr -> kyrian

and I'm now blind

[burnt star]

after getting rank 3 portal... i didnt feel like wasting it on other shit

[gusty mirage]

ty blizzard

[lament mica]

tf

[burnt star]

and didnt like the mog from nfae..

[lament mica]

if ur not putting full anima into the garden

ur a PSYCHO

3 days for a lost sole? yes please

[pliant apex]

y

[lament mica]

so u can grow a fat garden wdym

10s of gold

[dark crag]

Is it true that sepsis isn't enhanced by assas mastery?

[astral tiger]

haste/vers hands for my doomblades, ye?

[silent tinsel]

Its a magic debuff not poison or bleed right

[tribal marlin]

Crit / Haste unless you want to do some PvP

[faint harness]

yes

[astral tiger]

alrighty ty

[tribal marlin]

Believe me I made multiple report in game (on PTR) about it, tested it all over the 9.0.5 ptr to see if they fixed it. And they did not.
It's intended.

[civic trellis]

Is there any info of how much sins is above of outlaw in ST?

[lament mica]

so many dumb bugs in this game w/ mastery randomly not affecting shit

[tribal marlin]

Sin looks like is kind ahead of the curve rn

Basically above every other spec in the game by large margin

[silent tinsel]

its like a 5% lead isnt it?

which is massive

[civic trellis]

Really? Wow

Even boomies/lokcs?

[faint harness]

guess you didnt hear about frost mage or shadow priest

[civic trellis]

😄

[silent tinsel]

Its melee, you cant throw it next to ranged

[civic trellis]

My heart, stop that.

[dim shoal]

Crit haste on doomblade hands?

[tribal marlin]

I don't know the PTR sims for other class, but looking at T26 official sims rn, only Shadows are above yeah

[lament mica]

BiS feral sim still higher i think

[faint harness]

how much dps does your sims gain from being strictly 5 minutes

[tribal marlin]

what do you mean ?

[faint harness]

cus the t26 sims are not done that way

well 0 time variance

[tribal marlin]

I'm not using 0 time variance

[faint harness]

[tribal marlin]

with the profile I use it's ~7320 and ~7340 without time variance

[lament mica]

didn't ele get buffed this patch, how are they looking ST?

[faint harness]

that looks like 0 time variance to me Miki

[lament mica]

they pump

[tribal marlin]

oh yeah I removed time variance in my recent research because I wanted to have the APL never delay Flag for APL tests purpose

[faint harness]

this is how the t26 sims look

clearly not the same

[tribal marlin]

but I mean it doesn't matter

[faint harness]

i think it does

[silent tinsel]

Back to setting hearth to ori like a pleb

[tribal marlin]

it's ~20dps difference

it doesn't matter

[dark crag]

Why isn't the time scale set to 30sec steps?

[tribal marlin]

you don't loose 150dps just because your iteration are using various time lenght

[faint harness]

well it might use cds at a different time no?

[fluid moth]

Are there sims up for PTR? Where is Assassination with the 9.0.5 changes?

[tribal marlin]

We implemented the sync for Flag in a way such that it always use it optimally

[pliant apex]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[balmy condor]

No 👏 variance 👏 no 👏 problem limit this echo that I’m just here to jam in chat

[balmy condor]

All in the pins

[tribal marlin]

what's the problem ?

[faint harness]

i mean i am no scientist

[tribal marlin]

is it a vendetta ?

[faint harness]

but saying that this doesnt matter

that the bot knows it can delay 3rd vendetta 30 sec

to do it the last 20 seconds

and getting another flag out

because it uses every 1.5 instead of syncin

20 dps you say

not sure

[tribal marlin]

yes the bot know he can sync or not

[faint harness]

yea so when you cancel at 5 abruptly it can play 100% optimally around a strict 5 min timer

doesnt sound like 20 dps, but maybe im wrong

[tribal marlin]

I think you don't understand how it works

The APL is playing 100% optimally regarding the current iteration time lenght

either you use variance or not

if you use variance, it and the iteration is 4:20 it will delay Flag, if the iteration is 5:00 it will delay Vendetta

if you remove Variance, it just simm 5:00 over and over

[gloomy fern]

I saw some Miki triple pi shenans

How much did u pay

[tribal marlin]

1000g

[gloomy fern]

Cheap

[tribal marlin]

yeah xD

[faint harness]

its just weird that ur sim is 100 dps above the pinned one

but fair enough

[tribal marlin]

Yeah

[shy dust]

Miki are you joining the venthyr covenant

[tribal marlin]

let's talk about it

[shy dust]

or necro

[tribal marlin]

So there is a difference, where does it come from ?

I don't know

and you know why I dont know ?

because pined sim are not public reports 🙂

[faint harness]

hard to know

[fluid moth]

thank you

[upbeat umbra]

But my followers 😦

[tribal marlin]

I could investigate if whispyr mind share his reports, can be anything from a different profile, a mistake (either me or him) who knows and we won't know because he won't share his reports

It's not relevant enough for me to fight this

But it's not coming from variance or shenanigans :

[slender urchin]

Do you always sync flag and vend in 905?

[celest sundial]

so, since i have already been venthyr (started as that because of m+ team) when I try to switch now I got a "Prove your worth" quest which I finished but now I have to come back next reset or something? anyone know how long it will take?

[pastel seal]

It's 2 weekly quests

[celest sundial]

2 identical prove your worth quests?

[tribal marlin]

I think I know where it comes from actually

He might be using ilvl 200 conduits

Lashing scars is big conduit, and is like 5% more damage per rank. That could explain why the difference is higher for Lashing Scars than for other combination

[dark crag]

226 lashing busted confirmed

[wide ridge]

currently renown 28, did 3 +14 and 1 +14 and not a single renown dropped 🤡

[civic trellis]

@tribal marlin do you have a profile with sins talents & soulbinds where I can just past my sub gear and check how it sims as sin?

[dark crag]

Nerf incoming

[pastel seal]

I believe so, yes

[civic trellis]

Also scars drops from which boss in CN?

[fluid moth]

if venthyr and NF are that close in sims wondering if its still worth to go NF if i plan on PVPing since soulshape is so good for restealths

[pastel seal]

Did you completely finish the story line?

[wide ridge]

sire

[wide ridge]

yes

[civic trellis]

That sucks.

[pastel seal]

Then just unlucky, you should be able to catch up to current renown with storyline done

[wide ridge]

i cleared both lfr and heroic CN, finished story

and am at 28

cringe system

[faint harness]

pretty sure he said its with 226

[tribal marlin]

Well then idk and unless he mind sharing some raidbot reports, idc 🙂

[faint harness]

yea i mean its not a big deal

[tribal marlin]

exactly

[hollow escarp]

[torpid spoke]

how do you copy different rotations

into simc

[livid moth]

So according to the pin it looks like doomblade is the new go-to legendary, correct?

[lament mica]

facts

[mortal scaffold]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[silent tinsel]

coming in with these stats

[civic trellis]

you need more mastery kappa

[chilly merlin]

should i be crafting zoldyck on legs or feet?

[spice spire]

Legs

[uncut pilot]

So I can't find anything in the pins but is assassination the new raid spec for 9.0.5?

[dense hamlet]

you choose that

[fiery mauve]

It’s a good ST spec

[dense hamlet]

it has better st so

[fiery mauve]

And everyone knows ST is all that matters

😎

[lament mica]

facts

[rocky escarp]

are raidbot sims already for 9.0.5?

[dense hamlet]

[tribal marlin]

No raidbot will shift to 9.0.5 when 9.0.5 will be live (as it always do with balance patches)

[fiery mauve]

Actually the pins have a literal FAQ now pog

[tribal marlin]

if you want to sim for 9.0.5 you need to specify PTR sims in advanced tabs @rocky escarp

[rocky escarp]

ty!

[wet ruin]

@tribal marlin aren't those 100 dps difference just the armor thing for doomblade in the sims, or are you talking about something else

[tribal marlin]

I don't think so

[wet ruin]

you posted that in tc-research right

[tribal marlin]

the sims I linked in TC research is using custom apl and differents simulation options. You would want to look at this report insteed : https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/nvMNxVhyMgVmF14PZ41EWB/simc

I mean I don't know dude it can be anything like a missing enchant, a different gear profile, or whatever it's really not relevant.

[civic trellis]

As sins for st and necrolord, the souldbind/conduit to go is heirmir + gemstones + WPS right?

[tribal marlin]

yeah looks like the best combination

[lament mica]

does mastery affect envenom? Im so confused

[tribal marlin]

yes it does

[lament mica]

its a poison cuz it does nature damage?

[timber gale]

do yall like CT on council of blood

or PB still

[tribal marlin]

it's poison because it's increased by mastery which increase poisons xD

[lament mica]

lol fair enough

no rhyme or reason to blizz logic

massively misleading tooltips as always

[tribal marlin]

yeah basically

[pliant sorrel]

tfw sin has been outsimming sub for me all along

wtf

[fiery mauve]

Subt is the poo

[pliant sorrel]

true

[gleaming reef]

sub huge burst and good pvp but in pve just avoid it

[gaunt patrol]

I always have went mut rogue for pve and sub pvp

[pliant sorrel]

i mean ive done fine as sub, just surprising that sin already out sims my sub set

didnt even think of trying it

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/bs1aWrScwFCdH1g3owT8R2

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/roUrSsayYG4MqaNcTTN6nd

[lament mica]

i mean its just numbers

doesn't relate to how you'd actually perform

[hoary wasp]

totally making a human venth sin rogue

[pliant sorrel]

id rather do fights as sin then sub

[lament mica]

then there's not much of a choice is there lol

[low girder]

i mean it's not like it's hard to equal sub performance as sin lol

[split grail]

Sorry if it's been asked before, but with the upcoming changes to bone spike, will my legendary be changing?

[gaunt patrol]

Probably pins

[pliant sorrel]

cool haste doesnt matter too too much

cause thats around 10%?

havent crafted gloves yet

[fiery mauve]

Pins have a lot of info

[unkempt ginkgo]

probably dumb question but, is the flag window 12 or 24 seconds

[loud niche]

24

[unkempt ginkgo]

so i have 12 seconds to spend combo points, and then another 12 seconds of bonus haste?

[lament mica]

yes

[loud niche]

huh?

[unkempt ginkgo]

i see thanks

[dawn ivy]

on tuesday yes

[gleaming reef]

its chaging

[unkempt ginkgo]

i mean for 9.0.5

[fiery mauve]

12 seconds of lashing, 24 seconds of haste afaik isn’t it

You just build up the haste over 12 seconds

[low girder]

and then you keep it for another 12, yeah

[fiery mauve]

Ya

24 seconds of haste

[unkempt ginkgo]

ah

[lament mica]

and the condi gives u good haste the second u use it

i think its 5%

[loud niche]

12 second duration 9.0.5, and it gives the haste insta. that's the change

[low girder]

that's the ptr tooltip

[loud niche]

^

[low girder]

meaning it's 12s to build, but the haste is 24s

[fiery mauve]

Yeah

Persisting 12 seconds after their torment fades

Is it really torment though

That’s someone’s kink

[lament mica]

0 energy instead of 20 too

its just so much better

[loud niche]

the torment is actually yours, when you realize that this doesn't change anything... Your main dmg source is still melee whites.

[unkempt ginkgo]

ok reading comprehension is weak for me. So with the conduit its 5% haste initially + 1% each lash over 24 seconds?

[fiery mauve]

No

You lash for 12 seconds

[loud niche]

that's a weird way to say it. let me rephrase it pls. it's 5% haste insta, +1% haste per lash for the next 12 seconds, and then that haste is stagnate for 12 MORE seconds... maybe that's more understandable?

[fiery mauve]

In those 12 seconds, you are building haste based on each lash

[loud niche]

^

[fiery mauve]

1 CP = 1 lash

1 lash = 1% haste

So if you spend 6 cp you lash 6 times for 6% haste gained

[unkempt ginkgo]

oh ok i see

[fiery mauve]

AFTER those 12 seconds, you have an increased haste amount for the amount of CP spent

[unkempt ginkgo]

thats kinda giga

also the conduit giving additional lashes, thats why its 5% right

1+4 lashes

[lament mica]

idk if ass will use MFD or if vigor still better, but assuming u flag with 5 cp, finisher, mfd, ur looking at at least 15 cp for it

[dawn ivy]

if you grow 12 lashes over the 12 seconds, you will then have 12 stacks for another 12 seconds

[shadow pivot]

The burst potential of assa spec sounds crazy w/ 9.0.5 flag

[faint harness]

yea completely off the rails

[dawn ivy]

relatively speaking, not really. its certainly increasing our burst a bit

[low girder]

sim runs deeper afaik

[gleaming reef]

whats the cap on haste gain / lashes used

[regal chasm]

It's just the burst potential of venthyr ain't it

[balmy condor]

30 stacks

[gleaming reef]

ah so it didn't change but with less time its kinda hard to even hit it i assume?

well MFD might make it easy

[lament mica]

i'd say its harder to hit yea, but the conduit helps

[faint harness]

you wont be hitting 30

[low girder]

like i said, highest simming combo runs deeper not mfd

[balmy condor]

It’s possible to hit 30 with some decent haste, crit rng, and mfd

[low girder]

at least on ST

[balmy condor]

But with deeper probably not

[manic harness]

What spec are you planning on going for single target raid encounters?

[torpid spoke]

when to use CD for sludgefist?

1st and 3rd pillar?

2nd and 4th?

[balmy condor]

We play sin everywhere

[lament mica]

sin def best ST rogue spec

[balmy condor]

If you play 4 pillars, you go pull 2/4 lust on 4, if you play 3, you go 1/3 lust on 3

[dim shoal]

On pull aswell if you play 4?

Or its not lining up?

[lament mica]

ye

on sludge 2 min CDs is best pull, 2, 4 w/ lust

assuming ur 4 pillaring just like whispyr said

[balmy condor]

That’s what I said :P

[lament mica]

3 min CDs are 1 and 4

[balmy condor]

Yep

[dim shoal]

Oh lol i overlooked it mb

[civic trellis]

@tribal marlin whats the dps difference in your sims between venthyr and necro assa?

on mines are 150 ish but 223 ilvl

[stoic needle]

Sin one trick ponies unite

[bold tusk]

How's venthyr aoe? How far behind?

[lament mica]

[bold tusk]

Do many of you guys play ass in keys?

[balmy condor]

Depends on “many”

But I personally do, and there’s a couple of regulars that do as well

On the grand scale of things, if you’re timing 16’s with sin, you’re in the top 100ish

[lapis ice]

ur not top 100

ur top 100 of the non min maxers

thats way diff

[dim shoal]

Do you recommend simming the stats you should put on doomblade hands?

Or just go haste versa?

[lament mica]

top 100 sin players lol

[modest peak]

its top 100 spec

[lament mica]

thats all he means

[balmy condor]

Haste + Vers/crit is fine, just take whatever you’d like

[balmy condor]

You’re right, I should’ve specified top 100 of sin rogues, not counting the people that aren’t sin rogues

[drifting valley]

So now for pure st is assa better than sub / out?

[balmy condor]

Yes

[faint harness]

its not even close

sin is pumpin st

[drifting valley]

Nice, wanna play assa tbh ty

[nocturne hawk]

Push got me wishing reset was tomorrow lol

[lament mica]

i wonder, does sin have the best execute in the game now or is it still war/udh?

udk

[faint harness]

gonna log in on tuesday/wednesday and do 600 more dps on avg

[faint harness]

well you dont play zoldyck if you want that dps gain

[lament mica]

right, but there's still the snd envenom interaction change

and flag

[faint harness]

ye

it adds up

[fiery mauve]

I doubt it

Dk execute is best isn’t it

[balmy condor]

It’s definitely close

[dawn ivy]

warrior execute is just going to continue dominating

[faint harness]

they buffed the execute legendary for warrior

[lament mica]

i think war is better than udk execute after all the udk nerfs n arms buffs

[faint harness]

not sure if they run it tho

[lament mica]

but even pre-patch all 3 were pretty close i think

[faint harness]

shadow priest >

[lament mica]

their execute is only like 10% tho

[faint harness]

well they also sim like 7500 with execute

if sin had to equip zoldyck, what would it be

[hoary wasp]

I used to main uhdk til all the nerfs

[lament mica]

no doubt spriest will do way more over the course of the fight, but specifically having a strong execute is a nice niche

like sire p3

really strong overall st + execute niche is pretty decent

for a spot

[faint harness]

this was our sire p3 dmg

[lament mica]

[nocturne hawk]

Imagine being in a raid grp w/o a spriest

[lament mica]

i cannot imagine that

[hoary wasp]

lol

[nocturne hawk]

Well... plus side is sin dam go +++

lol

[faint harness]

idk i think spriest is broken, should get nerfed

will only get worse

[lament mica]

they are tanky as fuck and ranged

so yeah, they get every adv in the world in addition to just busted dam

idkk how much they havew to hard cast

[faint harness]

its still a bit

[lament mica]

thats always annoying for some bosses, but its not like it can't be overcome by player skill and saving instants for mechanics / movement

[faint harness]

yea its not a huge factor

melees being forced off boss is worse

[regal chasm]

Went to sleep saying I'll go venthyr, but woke up thinking of necro.

[strange python]

lol ive been back and forth on it too

[dim shoal]

Wanted to go sleep but couldn’t

[dawn ivy]

theres enough time to jump to either one, farm renown and have a feel for it, and then swap to the other and do the same thing

find what feels better

im probably going to cry and swap to necro in a week or so to push necro renown

[fiery mauve]

Necro is chad

Abom friends

Fly mount

[lament mica]

its all so close. just go wit aesthetic and the ability u wanna use more

[dawn ivy]

fleshcraft is certainly an appealing feature of necrolords i wont lie

[lament mica]

yeah

[dawn ivy]

once i see the raid fights next tier i think Door of Shadows versus Fleshcraft might sway my decision

[lament mica]

they also get that super tanky soulbind thing

slime something

[dawn ivy]

if there are n'zoth/azhara beams on any late fight Door of Shadows will be invaluable but a fight like sludgefist would make fleshcraft so useful

[silent tinsel]

Are we gonna see a generic simcraft chart for the patch?

for all specs

[balmy condor]

When it comes out, the webpage will update

They run those sims daily

So once the base simulationcraft build is updated to 9.0.5

That will begin simming 9.0.5

[boreal vale]

Do you guys think assa will be the goto rogue spec for raid now?

[balmy condor]

Yes

Outlaw will be fine though

Especially on like slg etc

Where it aoe and burstier

[solar bramble]

Ya but outlaw is annoying to play. . And pvp sub daggers . . Gg

[boreal vale]

Do we already have sim comparision?

[fiery mauve]

You can look at the spec channels

They all got sims

[balmy condor]

There’s sims in all the channels

[nocturne hawk]

You can vanish reverb eruption right?

[boreal vale]

Yea but are the sims of the different channels comparable ? Same length, buffs ilvl? So assa sins 7.2 over outlaw 6.7?

[balmy condor]

I ran sin and sub, those are comparable, outlaw doesn’t have a bis profile lying around, so it’s a little lower when compared head to head

[pliant sorrel]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[stoic needle]

mastery stonks rising

[fiery mauve]

All I see are leech stonks

[pulsar sluice]

what cov are you going @balmy condor

I feel like necro is sleeper man

no sim bait

[fiery mauve]

Necro is pog though

[lament mica]

the pve cape has good mastery i think

[stoic needle]

Doesn't seem sleeper to me

[fiery mauve]

Abom friends

[stoic needle]

Seems pretty obviously good

[lament mica]

i mean pvp

why did i say pve

[stoic needle]

Lol

I wish there was haste/mastery pve gear

Crit/mastery isn't bad tho

[pulsar sluice]

yeah but its only simmin well in aoe

is what i mean

[stoic needle]

In what way do you think it's sleeper then

Idk to me it just seems like an obviously very solid covenant

[balmy condor]

Venthyr

[pulsar sluice]

the fact that it doesn't have stuff like thrill seeker

[balmy condor]

Oh no no no

Oshosi malding atm

[stoic needle]

?

i'm not malding i agree with him lmao

i'm going with venthyr for the mog knowing full well its a clown fiesta

[balmy condor]

But isn’t he saying thrill seeker pog

[sleek otter]

XDDDD

He hates Thrill seeker

[stoic needle]

all my homies hate thrill seeker

[balmy condor]

Guess I’m not a homie then

Unlucky

[sleek otter]

RiP Whispyr 😦

[stoic needle]

[balmy condor]

Thrill seeker messed up once on council, and once on second intermission shriek when I did my lfr renown runs

Out of 10 bosses

[stoic needle]

literally unplayable

smh my head

[balmy condor]

And my raid doesn’t get second intermission on shriek

And depending on timing I don’t think it would hit council intermission either

[stoic needle]

the last time i did it my raid was pepega

so maybe its fine with a good guild

[spice spire]

It probably is better with better numbers. I ended up quad fucked when I ran TS

So I was like yeah I’m done

[balmy condor]

To be fair, I only looked at the buff during downtime

I actually don’t notice when it pops

Don’t really think it matters that much tbh

I’m not mad

[tacit forum]

For those who swapped covenant. How long did it take to get back to lvl 30 ?

[wise gull]

Am I right in my assumption that opener isn't super important? Seeing lots of variance in top logs

[fickle hamlet]

I'm almost there, it's been about 3 days or so

[lament mica]

an opener is never 'super important' cuz its like 5 seconds in a 6 minute fight

[regal chasm]

Just got this feeling whichever cov I join will get nerfed 2 weeks later lol

[tacit forum]

Not that long then. Kinda with no time to grind it. Wondering if it’s worth.

[brittle pawn]

people always put way too much stock into it when it's next to irrelevant over the course of a fight

that said, its not hard learning like a less than 10 button order

[balmy condor]

Bout 4-5 days

[lament mica]

also helps to switch on like a sat so u can do the quests then do them again on a reset

[viral meadow]

I did it on thursday and I'm 28 atm

[regal chasm]

Well it's dependent how many hours u play in a day too haha

[buoyant mauve]

was it 48hours irl inbetween the two quests to get back into your old cov?

if so then I'll have to wait till 2:47am to get the 2nd part

[tacit forum]

Nice! Thank you guys.

[dense narwhal]

Renown lvl 19 for venthyr

Working my way up

[faint harness]

wdym

[balmy condor]

2 weeks

It’s gated by a reset

[buoyant mauve]

you lyin, tell me you lying ;-;

[balmy condor]

No

[kindred imp]

Hey guys, got a question around garrote. In the guide it says to let the empowered one from stealth drop before reapplying. Any reason to why? Is it to get all possible ticks of the empowered one before overriding with normal one?

[brittle pawn]

yes

[kindred imp]

Ya figured. Ta.

[balmy condor]

You can reapply an empowered garrote with an empowered garrote, or a normal garrote with an empowered garrote, but you never want to refresh an empowered garrote with a normal garrote

[scarlet sapphire]

Yo the fucking venthyr quests campaign is so trash

So spaced out

And revendreth is so poorly navigatable

[balmy condor]

You get used to it imo

Also flying in 9.1 apparently

[stoic needle]

3 timed 15s tonight

Going for #4

Ksm and curve in the same week maybe...!?

[dawn ivy]

certainly doable

[icy crater]

I looked for a group for 2h today and didn't get any keys

sadge

[random glen]

hey guys, assa is going to be better than sub on the next patch? (I just started playing ww and its going to be nerfed af so im thinking about re-rerolling haha)

[faint harness]

yep

[regal chasm]

Sub is still burstier I think

[faint harness]

nah

at least not if assa plays venthyr

[random glen]

for pve outlaw is going to be better tho, right?

[faint harness]

wdym by pve, for m+ yea

[random glen]

or assa is the king again?

[faint harness]

for raid no

[hearty solstice]

So if I'm 226 ilvl as sub rogue, y'all still think I'd do more damage as assassination after the patch drops? I know subs best stats for raid are pretty much not what assassination wants.

[icy crater]

secondaries aren't that important

[hearty solstice]

Well sub wants verse and crit, no? Assassination wants haste and mastery to my knowledge

[dawn ivy]

haste crit*

[hearty solstice]

Crit in M+

Interesting, my sims had crit rather low compared to haste and mastery. Are we not relying on dots to do most of the damage still?

[viral meadow]

CP gen maybe?

[hearty solstice]

Crit in M+ makes sense for more combo points on your FoK, but in raid I'm not certain

[regal chasm]

Well if sub isn't burstier it's practically a dead spec

[shy dust]

You will for the most pst

[regal chasm]

For pve anyway

World quest spec lol

[hearty solstice]

I suppose my sims might say differently on Tuesday, I'm just unsure on making the swap to venthyr currently since haste is ehhhh on sub

[faint harness]

haste is not bad on sub

venthyr is like 2% ahead of the others for sub too

[hearty solstice]

Bad? No. But it's not as desired.

[balmy condor]

Mastery gains slightly value in aoe, haste stays about the same, and crit gains a little

For sin

[faint harness]

doesnt matter tho, venthyr still good for sub

[hearty solstice]

Just not trying to brick myself in Mythic council progression, that's all :^)

[silent dune]

Are stat prio diff for m+ for Sin?

[tribal marlin]

Venthyr is pretty good for council tho (for sub)

you can funnel a lot of lashes

[balmy condor]

Slightly more emphasis on crit/mastery, but generally no

[timber gale]

I got my first purple ilvl parse on huntsman tonight

I am very happy abt it! Assassination is very fun

And I didn’t even have CT (idk when I should have it or not in Nathria)

[nocturne hawk]

No CT on huntsman

and grats!

[timber gale]

Thank u!! I even replaced one of my 194 daggers - there’s a lot of fights I’m super lost on in the raid as sin

But huntsman with zoldyck feels amazing

[balmy condor]

You would actually do CT on huntsman I think

I wasn’t a believer but the more I look at logs the more I think It is the play

[nocturne hawk]

Guess it depends where your grp positions the shades?

It even worth for 2 target?

[balmy condor]

Yes it is

[nocturne hawk]

I see Ceverion runs it

[slow marsh]

Ceverion our lord and savior

@limber lion

[nocturne hawk]

I just usually see this