as sin
#assassination
novel star
spice spire
Legs 😦
novel star
not sure where youre even seeing that
toxic tusk
Is pawn garbage too?
balmy condor
very
toxic tusk
Just take my whole life from me
raven egret
pawn IS misleading
balmy condor
pawn is marginally useful if you sim your stat weights, and then change the weights based on that sim
toxic tusk
... was i the pawn?
balmy condor
but if you're simming your stat weights
balmy condor
then you could just sim your top gear
raven egret
yeah
toxic tusk
I have no idea what weights are if they’re not on a bar.
novel star
what whispyr said
balmy condor
and if you sim your top gear
then why the fuck
would you take a less accurate
and janky representation
of the same thing
spice spire
Convenience 
toxic tusk
Am I allowed to post grainy cell phone pictures in here? Now that I have already anyway?
balmy condor
Convenience <:kermit_pepe:731911360904036473>
I mean, it's more convenient to not use pawn
spice spire
I haven’t used pawn since I FIRST came back and needed some guidance.
And then I found the light
toxic tusk
spice spire
Exsanguinate/CT.
toxic tusk
I’ll see the light, I promise. Just let me sit in the dark for a bit.
balmy condor
oh man
those are somehow even worse
do you just not have discord on your computer
toxic tusk
I’m on discord on my computer
balmy condor
instant screenshot
balmy condor
print screen button bad, windows shift s very good
toxic tusk
I’m literally on discord and used my phone anyway without thinking.
toxic tusk
spice spire
It’s probably legs this week ngl
fleet whale
I got a helm
dusky umbra
one question guys, now that everyone got a bit more versa gear what do you think of ass vs sub for rbg?
dusky umbra
my bad 🙂
balmy condor
np, happens a lot
balmy condor
boomer move
toxic tusk
Okay! So, stats question. I do want to know which is better but also why.
balmy condor
yes, because yes
I actually have no clue what the question is
but it probably boils down to "it's better because it's better and does things that are good"
toxic tusk
Glove comparison
toxic tusk
My current has higher agility, but gives me crit and mastery.
the lower ilvl ones have less agility but give haste and vers.
knotty sparrow
keep the 213 dont get a downgrade from the vault
balmy condor
the 213's are better
toxic tusk
So 6 agility is a better trade off than getting rid of mastery for vers?
balmy condor
yes
toxic tusk
and picking up 30 haste?
balmy condor
you're also losing 7 "stat" in the process
knotty sparrow
its not just 6 agi its more of the worse secondaries too
balmy condor
you gain lose 62 vers/mast
but you lose 37 crit and get 30 haste for it
so not only are you getting less agi
you're actually getting less "stat"
toxic tusk
Wait what, I'm losing crit and mastery for haste and vers
toxic tusk
Not disagreeing, I just don't understand.
balmy condor
glove 1 is 30 haste 62 vers, thats 92 stat, the other gloves are 62 mast, 37 crit, that's 99 stat
you're losing 7 stat
knotty sparrow
its like if you put on a 226 necklace with 200 mastery, its better than the 184 necklace with 100 vers
more of the worse stat
toxic tusk
I understand the idea of what you're saying but what does it mean in a sense? It's better to just have more stat, if possible, even if it's not the best stat?
balmy condor
more agi and more stat is usually better than less agi and less stat
even when the less is technically more optimized
toxic tusk
Aaah, gotcha.
balmy condor
the difference between the stats are not large enough to make up for the loss
toxic tusk
I think where I got hung up was thinking that less of a better stat is better than more of a worse stat
balmy condor
therefore having more stat less optimized is better
gleaming eagle
Always about that ilvl
balmy condor
np
royal lantern
its pretty easy too understand tbh
for items with mainstat its 99,9999% higher ilvl wins simply because mainstat increases EVERYTHING you do
open swift
do you guys think assassination will get any more buffs
royal lantern
secondarys only increase a specific part(except vers, but vers scales way weaker then mainstat)
🔮 i can see the future
it says:
its cloudy tomorrow
weird, nothing about sin buffs
toxic tusk
Here's a close one. So with weapons, are stats counted the same?
royal lantern
for weapons its also pretty much always ilvl>everything else
balmy condor
yeah
royal lantern
for mainhad it IS always ilvl
toxic tusk
weapons are hard as frig to find so far. There's a blue reward that I think is better, if not just barely, than my offhand dagger.
open swift
Does anyone know if the NF class ability is affected by mastery ?
balmy condor
Does anyone know if the NF class ability is affected by mastery ?
it is not
open swift
ah
royal lantern
nobody cares about weapon stats cus ilvl on weapons means weapon dmg, and weapon dmg is the most important thing in the entire game
open swift
i wish it did that would be fun
royal lantern
ofc if you can chose bettwen 2 weapons with the same ilvl and 1 has the better secondarys, you take that one
balmy condor
mainhand with agi and mainhand weapon dps is just always ilvl
offhand weapon can be treated basically like a boot or chest slot, the stats matter, but usually still matter less than ilvl
royal lantern
tbf whisp, offhand weapon dps got somewhat more important in SL
still not THAT much
but in bfa it was litearlly a cosmetic slot lel
balmy condor
yeah
somewhat more important
still not important though
it's like
a little better
open swift
is the difference between NF and kyrian that big? or is it just prefrence
balmy condor
about 1.2% iirc
open swift
eh not bad
royal lantern
covenants for rogue dont matter
gleaming eagle
Well placed steel conduit work with sepsis
royal lantern
like, play what you want, or if you go really high m+ with a group, play the covenant your group needs for dungeon buffs lel
open swift
ok ok ty
open swift
i see
balmy condor
sepsis damage kinda shit regardless of what you do
royal lantern
ye
rogue won the "covenant abilitys with the lowest impact" lottery out of all classes lel
open swift
then theres druid
spice spire
RIP in peace bone spike 😦
royal lantern
i mean, you can also see it in another way
open swift
RIP in peace bone spike 😦
what happend to bone spike
open swift
i love soulshape
gleaming eagle
ya no condemn
royal lantern
like
spice spire
what happend to bone spike
It was nerfed to oblivion. At one point it was THE top damaging ability on rogue (vastly overtuned)
royal lantern
i dunno how they want too get NF balanced for fire as an example lol
the ability could do 0 dmg and would still be insane cus its a MAJOR OFFENSIVE CD REDUCTION
royal lantern
wisp, i just wanna say, when people allready complain about hunter/mage/druid dominance
i cant wait until they see the 100%crit openers a hunter will do with wild spirits in aoe when we have all soulbinds unlocked
🙂
or same with mage/druid 🙂
stoic needle
sepsis damage kinda shit regardless of what you do
It does more than flag 
The most fucked up thing about flag is that with dreamweaver you basically get 90% of a fully stacked flag for 0 effort
Just press the button and stand in the flowers
And sepsis actually does damage
stoic needle
What I mean is
royal lantern
and like, its the only dps soulbind dreamweaver has
stoic needle
You get something that's nearly equal in power to the entire covenant ability as the soulbind passive
royal lantern
thats like saying " venthyr gets haste for 0 effort, atleast i have too use sepsis and stand in the circle too get haste" cus of the haste soulbind venthyr has
stoic needle
Yeah but that soulbind is shit because it's random lol
royal lantern
cant meassure stuff without looking at the overall package
stoic needle
Dreamweaver also lets you use 2 potency
If they don't want to change the way flag functions it should do way more damage on each lash or give more haste for each stack
royal lantern
i mean, unless they change the numbers on burrs
i can see dreamweaver beeing the "best" st option in future patches anyway
stoic needle
Yeah I can see that
Am I wrong in thinking there's like a 0% chance they get rid of flag and give venthyr a new cov ability?
royal lantern
i doubt that they gonna replace an entire ability at this point
stoic needle
Like did they ever get rid of any azerite traits completely
royal lantern
maybe change how flag works
aka you get the buff at the end by itself instead of having too use it 2x
or just buff the numbers
but change the entire ability? nah, no way
fleet whale
change flag to a new ability named "sinsbane"
gleaming eagle
Ya flag is bad lol
I find flag to be the worst
I do like sepsis a lot in pvp though
stoic needle
I just wish that ambush was worth using with sepsis
balmy condor
I mean, it is worth
just have to be the last ability you press in the fight
if you're going for a finisher after that ambush, it's a loss
so easy solution
just hold sepsis to time the ambush with the end of the fight
ez pz ambush worth
knotty sparrow
envenom should just hit a little harder IMO
ST always ends up as maintaining dots, SnD, etc - and spamming envenom with excess points
so like, just give it a nudge a little bit
right now my 215 assn. set sims at 4.7k and my 217 outlaw set sims at 5.5k
patchwerk
fleet whale
envenom can hit decently hard... but only with like everything up
i've gotten 10K+ envenom crits before at 205 ilvl. Sure it's no evis but it can chunk
problem is envenom outside of all of that
knotty sparrow
yeah i dont mind the ramp-up in dps but we're ramping up to a (still) large difference in ST dps
fleet whale
i actually like the idea behind the septic shock trait, it just need to be better
knotty sparrow
i think there is a problem in overlaying envenoms, i don't think that dot stacks. so we're effectively dumping CP into this big finisher but a good chunk of the dps is lost because we're refreshing the dot before it does anything meaningful
knotty sparrow
i mean the debuff
fleet whale
what debuff... do you mean the self buff envenom gives you
knotty sparrow
you're getting a 7 sec buff and refreshing it before the full 7 seconds
balmy condor
I feel like I'm missing something
plain thistle
not sure about now, but that envenom buff was never worth playing around
balmy condor
do I have to read the convo
knotty sparrow
its balanced around it
fleet whale
he's talking about the self buff envenom gives you
knotty sparrow
30% for 7 seconds
fleet whale
the one that increases poison application chance and not really
balmy condor
oh
fleet whale
it's not a big deal to clip that buff
balmy condor
the thing that doesn't matter
knotty sparrow
anyway its 17% away from my outlaw set at a 2ilvl difference
with bis legendaries in both
i think the problem is not fixed
fleet whale
your gap is kind of weird, since simc has sin and outlaw sims
being like 550 dps a part
knotty sparrow
the 235 celerity gets replaced with 200 shoulders
i dunno man i ran simc latest nightly
balmy condor
well yeah
I'm agreeing with your result
I'm just saying that gear matters on that difference
since its much closer for me
knotty sparrow
right yeah
stoic needle
I think they should rework the envenom effect to actually matter
Make it into a dot of its own
Or a damage increase or something
viral meadow
I would think mut damage increase would be what we want and what we need
stoic needle
From envenom or just in general?
fleet whale
in wod we had a perk
viral meadow
just in general. base mut %dmg
fleet whale
that made the envenom buff increase mut damage
stoic needle
I wish maim mangle wasn't trash
viral meadow
overlapping envenom dot would feel bad. even if it could pandemic
stoic needle
Stacking though
The more envenoms you do the harder the dot hits
Give it a limit to how many times it can stack/refresh or whatever
I also like system shock as a concept
fleet whale
i was sad when system shock was first revealed
like it's a really cool thing that fits sin perfectly...
and it's a pvp talent
lol
viral meadow
make the slow aspect a pvp talent
torpid spoke
why the fuck does fan of knives only award 1 combo
where SS awards 1 per target
????
viral meadow
why the fuck does fan of knives only award 1 combo
awards more on crits but yes still feelsbadman.jpg
fleet whale
the cp issue is really only a thing because of FoK dealing little damage and crit levels being low
when sub was bad in bfa, sub players complained about Seal fate generating extra cps from FoK
stoic needle
make the slow aspect a pvp talent
this this this
elfin valley
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
stoic needle
So when did they make boss/mob armor not really matter anymore? It seems to me like the heavy nature damage profile of sin should be an advantage because it goes through armor but it doesn't seem to put it ahead of any other specs that do purely physical damage
Seems like different damage types are only really for flavor now
fleet whale
i mean it still matters a little bit
it's just that blizz balances specs around those profiles
outer lodge
for 2nd potency conduit on Niya - best to run wps + lethal poison?
fleet whale
yes
toxic ravine
Whats our best spec for pve
fleet whale
Outlaw as a whole
toxic ravine
Outlaw feels hard
stoic needle
for 2nd potency conduit on Niya - best to run wps + lethal poison?
I guess what I mean is like... There's no bosses with higher armor and less resistances and vice versa. Or are there?
fleet whale
it's not too bad
toxic ravine
Knowing what buffs to roll, keeping debuffs going n buffs going using skills on cd
fleet whale
@stoic needle argus the unmaker was the last boss with specific school weaknesses
you don't really re roll much as outlaw anymore
fleet whale
i mean I don't want blizz to go back to certain npcs being immune to certain schools of damage
like most of the MC bosses being immune to fire
toxic ravine
Im thinking of switching to assassination as i had an easier time n my dps is sucking nuts as outlaw, what do you guys think
stoic needle
And yet fire is still the best spec in MC
Only 2 bosses are immune
Ignite is that strong
I get you about total immunity but I like the flavor of some level of resistances
fleet whale
you can't be fire for rag
stoic needle
Yeah but you still just cast frostbolts anyway because you don't lose all your other spells by being fire spec
fleet whale
also i'm looking at classic naxx logs for rogue...
why are none of them using instant poison?
it doesn't take a debuff slot
stoic needle
The sharpening stones are better
There's +100ap to undead sharpening stones
That share the slot of poisons
fleet whale
just looking at the world buffs slot in WCL, it just puts me off of classic but not in the way you think
stoic needle
Dude fuck world buffs
fleet whale
most players didn't bother with that shit in actual vanilla
stoic needle
They are literally cancer
They are half of the reason why I quit classic
I just couldn't take that shit anymore
fleet whale
min/max culture kills classic
stoic needle
It really does
fleet whale
current gamer mindset kills the magic of vanilla
stoic needle
Yeah
Vanilla is a dramatically worse game when you try to play it like a modern game
stoic needle
The problem with classic is just the level of farming required for everything
I have hundreds of maraudon princess kills on my hunter
I would spend upwards of 300g a week in AQ when I would flask every week
That's like ... 100k equivalent per raid for ONE PERSON in retail
Maybe more
fleet whale
lmao flasks were optional for most guilds in actual vanilla
stoic needle
Yeah but in a guild like mine if I didn't flask every week my healers would just let me die and I'd lose all of my buffs
It was horrible
fleet whale
i wonder how classic tbc will go, since it is drastically different in a lot of ways compared to vanilla
stoic needle
I mean this seriously: warcraftlogs ruined classic
fleet whale
private servers did too ironically
stoic needle
Classic tbc won't be any different from vanilla if they don't make changes
I don't think I'm gonna bother
fleet whale
tbh classic wotlk might be the only one worth playing for me
since it is fairly "modern" compared to tbc and vanilla
stoic needle
I never got to play in WOTLK so I am a little interested in that
fleet whale
it was fun but dks were mega busted
stoic needle
Sounds like now 
fleet whale
they were more busted
stoic needle
Yeah I know, I remember hearing horror stories about the ghoul battle rez and shit
sonic wind
I remember DKs in 3.0.3
stoic needle
In general I just feel like classic was fun to try as someone who didn't get the chance to experience vanilla, but playing it for an extended period in the modern day was absolute dogshit
sonic wind
Holy... They were like 5 today fire mages
stoic needle
I only stuck around because of my guild
fleet whale
there damage for pve actually wasn't that insane for dks by ICC
both combat and assassin were top dogs by then
stoic needle
Combat 
sonic wind
Sub rogues were way more better than now, when backstab hits for 100 damage
fleet whale
well, as far as raiding went
sub was like the worst raiding spec in ICC lol
it was still a dedicated pvp spec back then
sonic wind
Oh, I played mostly PvP though
fleet whale
yeah in pvp sub was obviously great
wet heron
what is our dmg profile, is our highest dmg mostly melee like the average melee class, or is it rupture/enven?
fleet whale
and in M+ garrote and DP usually are in front of melee
sonic wind
They kinda same
fleet whale
but it depends
stoic needle
For me it's deadly poison, then melee, then rupture and garotte and envenom
stoic needle
that's from a quick sim
usually looks pretty similar in practice
but rupture and garotte are usually above mutilate
stoic needle
yes
stoic needle
this is what i get for aoe
strange python
I’ll just be mad when I have to redraft to legs lmao
I guess I could always just run pvp leg master assassin
strange python
It’s what 1.2% dps
stoic needle
you're heroic only right?
strange python
No mythic
strange python
Lol
stoic needle
i feel like if you're not gonna do mythic to get mythic pants you're better off crafting them in pants slot
balmy condor
Well vault exists
stoic needle
this is what i get for aoe(last one was still on patchwerk lol)
strange python
True I guess
stoic needle
so, deadly poison on top for both ST and AOE
strange python
Poisons opopop
sonic wind
Interesting, somehow CT is on top, while in my case it has very low dmg even in M+
stoic needle
what are outlaws simming in dslice nowadays? i get 5.4k
probably not casting it enough
stoic needle
one of the things i like about sin is that it's possible for me to get close to the simmed dps lol
strange python
Simmed
strange python
Mastery oml
stoic needle
doesn't sub too?
gleaming eagle
Versatility seems to effect it too
stoic needle
their mastery increases finisher damage
yh thats why vers is better than mastery
its like mastery but affects auto attacks too
I don't like vers as a stat tbh it's boring
I'd like to be able to specialize into making certain things do more damage by prioritizing stats
Go heavy mastery for fights with lots of mechanics for big dot damage
Heavy crit for aoe
Etc
gleaming eagle
Sin Mastery boost more rupture dmg than sub mastery does to rupture I'm sure
Too lazy to calculate lol
stoic needle
I'm pretty sure they're both just a flat %
strange python
Think they’ll make it so you can change the stats on a leg for a price sometime?
stoic needle
Probably not
stoic needle
I don't think the stats of one single piece of gear matters that much in the grand scheme of things when you can tailor the rest of your gear around it
To get to your goal
strange python
I’d agree except that a legendary is the best way to fill a gap
stoic needle
Sure, I just mean to say that having suboptimal stats on your legendary isn't the end of the world
My zoldyck is haste/vers
With as much m+ as I do I wish I'd gone haste/crit but I just stack crit in other places
And vers is still solid even if it's boring :P
gleaming eagle
Vers is a must for pvp
balmy condor
I'm pretty sure they're both just a flat %
Sub mastery is kind of a weird one
Sin mastery is just poison bleed by X%
gleaming eagle
At least 15%
balmy condor
Sub mastery if you dig into it is actually a 2 part x% to finisher damage
Where part one is instant finishers
And part two is periodic finishers
The periodic ones actually getting less gain than the instant ones
stoic needle
that makes sense
it would be incredibly wack if sub rupture did more damage than sin rupture lol
gleaming eagle
thought so as well
There's no way sub rupture does more than sin
these devs did went to school
balmy condor
these devs did went to school
Someone didn’t
gleaming eagle
Hard job
stoic needle
the problem is that they don't play what they create
i refuse to believe that these devs play the things they make and then think they are okay
well, they do with some
the good ones
stoic needle
but like there is no fucking way a dev made flag and played with it and was like "yup, this is fine"
gleaming eagle
I'm tired of poe
cedar steeple
poe skill tree 
stoic needle
yeah i guess if you spent 60+ hours a week designing a game you might not want to play it afterwards
balmy condor
poe skill tree <a:A_monkaSStare:660940134136676352>
Actually not bad once you get used to it tbh
gleaming eagle
Black desert online is good
stoic needle
once you realize that half the talents in the tree are just flat stat boosts it becomes a bit easier to understand
gleaming eagle
If sin get more buffs
In the future
Honestly it can be a good class
Looks like it will get that buff too
stoic needle
If they give us a talent rework this expansion it would be incredibly poggers
stoic needle
We need actual talents to replace alacrity and the other stuff in that row
And something done about the last row
please god make exsang st vein rippers
gleaming eagle
lol
strange python
How would I add zoldych legendary to raid bots gear sims?
balmy condor
Well top gear adds it
As if you wouldn’t have it
Gear compare doesn’t support it I don’t think
strange python
Gotya
balmy condor
You’d either have to make the string yourself, or go through the top gear add a legendary thingy
plain thistle
you can sim legendary with gear compare as well, just search for the leather item name and you can select the legendary power as well
balmy condor
Oh cool
plain thistle
got a 220 dagger, finally I can at least play assa/sub 
still 400 dps behind outlaw in 1t 5min sim
350 actually, 5657 vs 6009
fallow otter
Well....
plain thistle
yeah, simming with 225 too, 235 next week
legendary*
just need renown 30 are we are good to go
stoic needle
plain thistle
inerva ring would be nice too
stoic needle
Double potency seems to be a pretty big upgrade for us
plain thistle
its better than it is for outlaw, but outlaw has cto 🤷♂️
and we dont have anything even close to that
fallow otter
and we dont have anything even close to that
No one does lol
fallow otter
Cto very huge though
open swift
what's better wowhead or icey veins guides
slow marsh
Is there any precedence to sin rogues having hte highest score avg in m+ 15s over the last week or is it a fluke?
fleet whale
Might have to do with there being barely any sin rogues
And are you looking at WCL or Raider IO
balmy condor
yeah those stats are probably omegascuffed
slow marsh
I wish I could see how many different players there are within the number of parses
slow marsh
I just can't do outlaw since they changed it. Like I've tried so many times but there's just something wrong with me
Like my brain just wont accept the fact they killed combat
fleet whale
Then play sin or sub if you like them more
slow marsh
Well i'm playing sub right now but i'm hard stuck 201 ilvl at the moment cuz i can't get into 15s. rightfully so
Just been watching sin to see if its scaling out at all and would be worth learning or if i should just reroll hunter or something
xD
knotty sparrow
i have yet to do a 15 and im at 217 ilvl
just keep pushin it man youll do it
(but i also hit 1800 and got 220 pvp gear :p)
knotty sparrow
3s im not neurotic enough to 1800 in 2s lol
in 3s its easier to rely on good teammates
slow marsh
True. Been trying to cheese 2's but ret pallies are cancer
knotty sparrow
one thing i noticed with ret pallies is when they see shadow dance they blow all their cooldowns usually. at that point i just vanish and wait for all the BS to drop off
open again with 2nd charge of shadow dance and they crumble
they get a hardon and bubble+wings+everything else
mortal tartan
ret is scary as fuck
slow marsh
I can usually force bubble on open the issue i have is getting the reset with enough burst to actually kill
but i think its more my partner than me tbh
knotty sparrow
just open with 1 shadow dance so they see the purple rogue and get scared, then when you open again shadow dance + shadow blades
save the SB for 2nd opener
slow marsh
I generally do so that's good
I should probably save sob too though i usually pop on open
SoD
mortal tartan
i watched a ret wait for his team to die 1v2 and then he just walked out and 1 shot both of them
knotty sparrow
word of glory is some BS
gleaming eagle
You can't beat ret on 2s
If you beat ret on 2 then the ret misplay
Ret is like king of 2s right now
fringe dust
!bis
prisma monolithBOT
Whispyrs Bis list: http://tiny.cc/76r5tz
fringe saffron
can we use finishers at 4 combo points?
balmy condor
yes, you finish on 4 with vigor/mfd, and finish on 5 with deeper
fallow otter
So what you get whisp
balmy condor
wdym
vivid shuttle
so if youre using zoldyck you go with master assassin? I've been on subterfuge so long because of MA wrists that's gonna throw me off 
balmy condor
zoldyck does not impact the choice of talents
if anything, it makes you go subterfuge more than MA
open swift
does the kyrian ER give fatty envenoms ?
balmy condor
it gives exactly 1 cp fattier envenoms
open swift
damn
fallow otter
I have to start using double on use I think
Feelsbadman
Sins dread
My opener already got lots going on haha
balmy condor
not gonna lie
I'm doing pretty good
and then sun king happens
and idk what the fuck I'm supposed to do there
maybe CT
or MFD
or both
spice spire
I do CT and pray. But I shit parse there so my advice is moot.
stoic needle
what the fuck even is sun king
i have no idea what to do on that fight
i just try to CC infusers and dot everything i can
and still feel like i'm pretty useless
tender sable
I will go to hc this reset, any advice? 206 ilvl before vault, MA ring 210 and I should be able to craft any 190 legendary. I have a chain and a cube trinkets which simming the highest for me for ST
spice spire
As for the legendary? if you’re going assassination, run Zoldyck’s
tender sable
That’s what I were thinking to craft thanks
zinc kelp
I hate doing sun king... 9/10 im just running around clicking the lanterns and cc and then burning the Shade when it comes up
robust pine
Wow, abomination necrolord companions now go to stealth with you, cool
viral meadow
I keep ruptures and as many garrottes on the gargs and big casters. FoK at 4+ adds for envenom dumps. Internal bleeding on the runners whatever they’re called. Vendetta on open, and save for both kael phases. Ez 99
It’s a pain In the ass, especially compared to outlaw which is just blade flurry and pretend it’s single target
stoic needle
Internal bleeding 
viral meadow
It’s pretty dirty and helps with CC if your group needs it
mortal tartan
im the 13th rated sin rogue on my realm and i've only done like 5 mythics with 380 score lmao
rugged dragon
Ded realm?
stoic needle
I'm #2 
only a couple more 10+ and I'll be #1
mortal tartan
i guess theres just a lot less people playing sin then i thought there would be
like a shit ton less lmao
robust pine
I reached top103 in the world, but then I suddenly wasn't able to complete like 5 m+ in time in the row and got sick of this week. I have to reach top100 next week, it's only thing I live now for
robust pine
can you alone fight against 127 people? I doubt it, unless you are Jackie Chan
rugged dragon
Jackie chan = WW monk
mighty zenith
Poison bomb or crimson tempest for mythic plus?
balmy condor
CT
mighty zenith
Ok thank you
cedar steeple
what is that
raven egret
the one that consumes ur dots on vanish
mortal tartan
looking at the mythic+ rankings makes me sad
raven egret
best feeling anima trait to use
cedar steeple
what if i dont one shot it then it deaggros
mortal tartan
all i see is bal druid fire mage and outlaw rogue
balmy condor
there's a seli screenshot floating around where it does like 18mil damage instantly
but also, just use an ability right after vanishing?
it's not hard
balmy condor
yeh
cedar steeple
i did blind and vanish once before as sub rogue then the boss deaggroed on me
im not sure how it happened
balmy condor
then you didn't attack fast enough
lament dove
make a macro for it...
no matter how fast I press an ability (I mean I had the problem with sub and shadowdance constantly) it still resets mobs half of the time with 30 ms so I have no idea how others don't reset them...
woeful wigeon
question for sun king what talent shud i use and conduit cause only fight i keep getting green logs for the fight but purple for the boss parse
lament dove
also how do you make vein ripper do so much dmg? I mean one set of my dots eats away like 10% of the boss's hp, so how will that kill it...?
cedar steeple
crit
woeful wigeon
balmy condor
what's this supposed to show me
woeful wigeon
question the trinket benifits from consuits also or not nott poisen one ?
as its a poisen buff
balmy condor
the what now with who
woeful wigeon
the trinket with the poisen buff you aplly on weapens dus it also benifit from our conduits
woeful wigeon
jjjust did wold boss that trinked did 35k dmg
balmy condor
ok
woeful wigeon
that why i ask
tender sable
that's... something... best necrolord option still worse than NF with necrolord conduit
balmy condor
what kind of cursed ass sim
balmy condor
its something
toxic ravine
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
vivid hearth
is vigor better than mfd for m+ this week with fortified ?
heady island
I always run vigor. Is that generally considered as a mistake?
iirc the guides suggest it, and I like it, so haven't simmed it.
vivid hearth
well i generally use mfd for some easy abuse on packs when stuff die, but might not be so usefull this week with fortified mobs
tender sable
Vigor is less mistake prone. Can't put mfd on longest living add if you don't have mfd
stoic needle
MFD seems very powerful even if you don't use it optimally. Just using it on CD is pretty good
tender sable
I assume it was about mfd...
rigid tartan
!fuu
prisma monolithBOT
Fuus Shadowlands evaluation Spreadsheet: http://tiny.cc/uxr1tz
stoic needle
Its 6am I haven't had coffee yet I meant mfd
You know how you're thinking of one thing but reading something else while you type and your fingers put what you're reading not what you were thinking of
cedar pilot
So turns out my assa Sims almost same dps as my outlaw gear... A dream come true
topaz saffron
Another week, another weapon less vault 🥲
viral meadow
you reckon its worth gar+rupt one of the other bosses on council for the energy regen?
plain thistle
last time I simmed for something similar to that its was 4-5% more main target dps to dot a second target, and a dps loss to the main target to dot all three
viral meadow
yeah 3 targets youd overcap energy probs
plain thistle
you probably waste too much combo points and gcd dotting all three, losing envenons and gcds on the main target
plain thistle
someone that sims more can confirm this (kojiyama, fuu or Whispyr), but when I did it was something like that
vestal wren
assassination is ~4-5% behind outlaw/sub on patchwork
plain thistle
he is asking about doting a "immune" target (council fight)
if its a dps increase for the main target
vestal wren
but having gear thats better suited for assassinaiton could def. make it sim higher
e.g. having not a good weapon for outlaw but a insane one for assassination would shift it towards assassination, having diffrent stat distributions, ....
sonic wind
Got Quantum Device 226 from vault, is it good?
plain thistle
sonic wind
Well, this thing seems pretty strange, so Idk whether it sims correctly, maybe someone knows better
vestal wren
if it sims better, its great tbh
it means you can play assassination without the concern that you lose dps for doing so
sonic wind
I see, I just read that this thing can restore mana or health for someone instead of giving the damage buff
viral meadow
look the item up on wowhead. someone in the comments has the uses
"if your hp or close ally's hp is < 30%, then it heals. Inscrutable Quantum Device
if a healer near you is <20% mana, then it gives him mana. Inscrutable Quantum Device
if crowd controlled then it removes it. Inscrutable Quantum Device
if something related to being "in danger" then it spawns a device that grabs aggro. Inscrutable Quantum Device
if trinket can execute your target with x damage, it will. Inscrutable Quantum Device
if none of those things are true then it buffs a secondary stat (330366/330367/330368/330380)
"
stoic needle
Well, this thing seems pretty strange, so Idk whether it sims correctly, maybe s...
There is a weakaura that you can use to predict the effect to make sure you get the stat buff every time
It's a very good trinket
sonic wind
That's a nice information, thanks
drifting parrot
Which Legendary are you people using for a week like this?
toxic tusk
If I have the soul ash, is it worth picking up multiple legendaries at lower ilvl for like, strategic battles? Or should I just focus on maxing one and move on to another?
Same question as Kurinto, actually.
rugged dragon
Zoldyck best overall, but I think pure single target dashing scoundrel is better
Zoldyck gets better as soon as there is 2 or more targets
drifting parrot
MA lego not worth it in keys ? Zoldyck was on my mind since I already have the other one
sweet wedge
Are you guys using any bleed aura for tracking bleeds?
rugged dragon
Havent tried it. Wouldnt be able to tell you
sweet wedge
weakaura *
grave cove
Yeah, anyone got some good WAs for Assa? There used to be a WA that would track the optimal time to recast garrote/rupture to maximise pandemic, but I can't find it anymore
fading wigeon
!Wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
stoic needle
I made a simple set of weakauras that does that https://wago.io/Lp33X6aon
Personally I recommend a combination of weakauras and plater nameplates with pandemic dot tracking
Having every single dot in the WA can clutter your screen, so I usually have it limited to my selected target, and use nameplates to track the rest
It says sub but it's for all specs heh
I use this plater profile to add pandemic glow to my dots https://wago.io/7kqu4VY2T
jagged elk
any possibility to use ambush and mutilate on the same keybind while being talented into blindside?
or are you just using different bindings for them?
stoic needle
The only ways are with a shift modifier macro (what I recommend) or an add-on like gnome sequencer(not recommended)
sweet wedge
Thank you @stoic needle
jagged elk
The only ways are with a shift modifier macro (what I recommend) or an add-on li...
wth is that? 😄
stoic needle
/cast [mod:shift] ambush; mutilate
Casts ambush when you hold down shift, mutilate when you don't
jagged elk
ah i see
well so its kinda useless for me, unless im using 1 for mutilate and sh-1 for fok
but thank you anyways!
jagged elk
yeh ill try out whats the best for me 🙂
heavy vessel
manic quartz
if i have MAlego/subterfuge do i follow the talent master assassin opener or subterfuge opener :o?
mystic surge
well in aoe situations u wanna focus on using fan for the crits
in singletarget idk really
dont use MA in raids :p
manic quartz
Dont have anything else than MA to use right now for assa :/
wanted to just do shriek as assa for fun
manic quartz
well i should use garrote atleast since im using subter, unless i change it to nightstalker
manic quartz
but is it more dmg than +80% to garrote 🤔
mystic surge
hmm
🤷♂️
ambush is 150% increased dmg with nightstalker and MA
my ambush deals 2k rn
manic quartz
5k~ with NS
mystic surge
ok yeah subterfuge is more dmg then
wait so 5k with ns
and that crits for 10k
garrote deals 3.5k
approx
idk
so with subterfuge
garrote deals 6300
so NS is more dmg
mystic surge
ok so then garrote is more dmg
there u go
MA is a shit legendary for raids so yea
manic quartz
yeah i know, havent focused on assa legs yet
but its better than nothing
i mean finality works for rupture but idk
mystic surge
yeah finality would prob be more dmg not gonna lie
depends on fight length i guess
what stats u got on ur ma?
manic quartz
crit/vers
manic quartz
vers/mastery :/
mystic surge
just go ma and experiment on target dummy
manic quartz
doing that atm, our last shriek was 3:20
stoic needle
If you do a quick sim with each talent setup it'll show you an opener
sonic wind
Tried assa in recent m+, hunter did double of my overall damage 😦
sonic wind
Ofc
sonic wind
Yeah
spice spire
Tried assa in recent m+, hunter did double of my overall damage 😦
What level mythic was it? That also has a lot to do with the damage you can output, as ours is bleeds and cleave, it ticks over time.
sonic wind
It was 14 Mists
spice spire
Oh, unfortunate.
sonic wind
It did 1kk damage with explosive shot or something, this is just a talent in theirs tree, holy
Also want such talents)
spice spire
I did a 10 yesterday with a boomy and UHDK. I did about 1k less than boomy, 300 less than UHDK, and about 1.8k over tank. It was on the lower side, but I didn’t talent CT, idiotically
sonic wind
What were the numbers?
lament dove
I did 4,4K last week in HoA 10 but there was no hunter
spice spire
We did a ToP 8 before then, so I specced out of CT (not enough trash warrants it there IMO. And I didn’t fix in between 
stoic needle
Maybe I play with bad players but I'm usually only 200-500 under the boomkins and mages and hunters
In 10s
Pugs be pugs I guess lol
stoic needle
It does get bigger if they're really good, but I think it's just a symptom of those classes being very overpopulated
Zoldyck for pve, pvp isn't quite decided yet. MA, maybe doomblade
mystic surge
how is doomblade in pve
stoic needle
It's viable
It's still too early to make serious judgements because most good players don't have assasa leggos and gear
jovial spear
I see. I cant craft mine until next week, so thought I should hear if anyone tried it out 🙂
torn hinge
its still 400-500 dps behind sub, but alot better than before
stoic needle
That's sim dps though, many people have been showing similar results with sin vs sub especially on heavy mechanic and movement fights
jovial spear
I would guess that Sin would outperform both Outlaw and Sub on heavy movement fights. But obviously on fights like the Sun King Outlaw would be the best.
mystic surge
so dashing scoundrel is kinda like akaari for sub?
where zoldryck is like a finality?
where dashing is only good for ST and zoldyck is generally good
stoic needle
It doesn't outperform outlaw pretty much ever unfortunately. Outlaw is just built different
It's tuned way better
stoic needle
where dashing is only good for ST and zoldyck is generally good
Yes. Sin's niche right now is execute damage so you're not getting that either if you use dashing
strange python
Well raid team@just imploded lol
I love trying to find a raiding guild at this point in the xpac/patch
spice spire
Mine almost did that. We lost 2 big DPS and two healers. So we replaced the two healers with two of our better dps :/
As a result we’re still on 6/10 Heroic instead of further progg’d but it’s coming together
topaz saffron
Stick it out with guilds who don't mind what class or spec you play, they are the true heroes ❤️
spice spire
Whispyr is a chad confirmed
stoic needle
i can't wait to pump this week with my new MH
i was already tied with the spriests for top dps in my raid, i'm definitely gonna be ahead of them now
balmy condor
Destroyer ?
Yeh
spice spire
Fuck that weekly great vault
Mood, holy fuck dude
I got a 210 week one. Since then, it’s been the god damn Sahara in my weekly. I was blessed with a slight upgrade at helmet this week 🙂
iron orchid
I got nice stuff on most of those weekly chests, but yeah, no weapon still
Today, everything it proposed was already equipped on my character, or a downgrade
except one item, which was a copy of an item i had equipped, but with an extra socket
stoic needle
listen i earned this 220 with blood sweat and tears
iron orchid
Nice upgrade
spice spire
Last week I got a cloak as the best, and it was +1 Dps total :^)
iron orchid
listen i earned this 220 with blood sweat and tears
Damn
stoic needle
i had literally 3 weeks in a row of legs as my 220 and 213 options
3 WEEKS
i use zoldycks
the fuck am i gonna do with 220 and 213 legs
iron orchid
Managed to fill out that chest with full 15+ choices
still my best option was an item from heroic raid with a socket
x)
spice spire
My 220 was the bottled anima trinket which was slightly worse.
OOF.
stoic needle
still no fucking phial
not once
not im m0, not in heroic, not in the vault, not as a drop
the other rogue in my guild has gotten it 3 times
if they dont give us M+ badges in 9.1 i will actually riot
spice spire
Yeah still no phial for me either. Week one, our other rogue got a 216 from his vault, that felt bad.
iron orchid
226 for me last week
stoic needle
i would just like a 2nd trinket that is anything but skulkers
iron orchid
226 for me last week
best drop from the chest, without a doubt
stoic needle
i have a 213 anima battery and a 213 skulkjers
spice spire
I think the best drop would be a weapon Deï
stoic needle
i quite enjoy the anima battery, especially since i'm not venthyr anymore
spice spire
But that’s damn close.
stoic needle
it's a lot of haste
gives me like 11% sheet haste on a 1.5m cooldown
syncs up nicely with sepsis
iron orchid
I think the best drop would be a weapon Deï <:kekw:610125925413289985>
Actually, droptimizer simmed phial as a 3.1% upgrade, where a 226 weapon would have been a 2.7%
spice spire
O. Actual best. Fuck, I got outplayed
stoic needle
i wish the infinitely divisible ooze was stronger, I love the ooze gang
especially as sin
frozen jasper
i wish the infinitely divisible ooze was stronger, I love the ooze gang
same man
vivid hearth
man weekly vault was sad
stoic needle
same man
always sad when the most boring trinkets are the bis ones, eh?
i'd love to get one of those inscrutable quantum devices...
spice spire
stoic needle
consider me baited
polar apex
I wish the poison coating trinket was bis, would be big spec identity
loud niche
it's not a poison tho, it's just nature DoT, and they're calling it a toxin, which you dip your blades into..... fucking blizz
loud niche
can anyone tell me what i did wrong?
or is it just gear?
actually getting frustrated im stuck not pulling 99's and 100s, but if it's just gear i can get over myself
whispyr stop playing PoE and halp meeee
stoic needle
You missed a vanish
You have 3 vendetta but only 2 vanish
Also max out your zoldyck
royal lantern
i mean
rigid wyvern
The rupture/garrote uptime vs cast seems off to me
loud niche
it's possible for me to
i just have to DO IT
yeah i let 1 rup and 1 garrote hit 0.0
trying to fit 3 envens into a windo
and i didnt even realize i missed a whole damned vanish
toxic tusk
....
If you aren’t better than 99/100 percent of players and it makes you angry/upset, you might need to take a break dude.
stoic needle
How are you parsing 97s but don't know how to read your own logs lol
toxic tusk
Are you just starting on this expansion? Have you been parsing 99s the whole time?
loud niche
and who cares if i want to be top notch? like why is that an issue for you?
I'm returning, yes
loud niche
it's fine man just seemed rude idk
toxic tusk
It was, it’s not up to me to tell people what to care about.
I’m actually sorry, I shouldn’t have said it.
loud niche
ily bb, it's not that big a deal. i'm just intoxicated atm, so i said something about it. ask anyone i troll tf outta this discord pretty often
balmy condor
whispyr stop playing PoE and halp meeee
Actually was watching the inauguration
loud niche
oh, hope you enjoyed yourself
rigid wyvern
I mean parsing 97 here might just be due to your missed vanish + vendetta not lining up with your guilds lust
its probably not any major gameplay mistakes
spice spire
It also seemed slightly unlucky. Blindside procc’d at 28, then 1:15. Sepsis 15 seconds into the fight seems a bit sketch but outside the vanish, seems fine? But make yeah make whispyr do it
balmy condor
you also had a fairly unpleasant kill time
its not awful, but about 30 seconds faster would've been good
or a little bit later actually
you're right on the edge of another dreadfire
loud niche
yea, in a random group, i think later my guild's run will be better
balmy condor
I also wouldn't run MA on inerva personally
loud niche
subter better?
loud niche
so use garrote twice on pull like my lord Peen? Kappa
hm, yeah def wouldve been an improvement
the shiv on sepsis
balmy condor
but uh
stoic needle
If you shiv during the first sepsis and then shiv on CD every time after that it lines up perfectly
balmy condor
just seems like a little unlucky on the PB/ambush rng
balmy condor
~~If you shiv during the first sepsis and then shiv on CD every time after that ...
not true
and of course 2 more sockets would help
little more ilvl
all the usual stuff
loud niche
better to shiv on cd, or should i be continuing to wait to try and squeeze 3 envens in each?
balmy condor
on cd