Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
#assassination
prisma monolithBOT
vestal wren
you can ignore venthyr tbh
its possible that the high value is a side effect of the implementation/update
balmy condor
I mean
that's clearly bugged af somewhere in the chain
is it the ability
or is it the soulbind
sick scarab
night fae !! 🙂
onyx crane
but you are also here!
frosty kettle
hows the spec balance now with prepatch? always played assa but a friend told me sub might be better now
balmy condor
no idea
#pvp would know better
idk if there even is a prepatch pvp meta
sounds janky at best
warm olive
at what DPS amount in sims would you draw the dps line compared to lets say 100k pre-patch dps?
warm olive
ok, thanks, i was hovering around 43xx and it "felt" kind of low, but that gives me a little more confidence ^^
balmy condor
having mythic cara/nzoth azerite is kinda big
as is high ilvl and sockets
cara/nzoth is still 10ilvl higher
which means a lot more now
marble magnet
God, I'm still building combo points before I RtB. How to stop this habit?
marble magnet
oh, Im lost
balmy condor
welcome to the superior spec
viral silo
carmine dawn
@balmy condor how many garrotes do i do before i rupture
balmy condor
umbral rapids
@balmy condor
balmy condor
@balmy condor
umbral rapids
hi boi
balmy condor
hello
umbral rapids
how you doing ? 
balmy condor
tired :(
balmy condor
6am 
prepatch is good
sin is still really fast
I like snd
cause I'm a weirdo
shiv will come and be okay
umbral rapids
oh really ? that's great !
balmy condor
only complaint I have is that CT is still silly strong and pb blows
umbral rapids
okok
umbral rapids
what makes it "not really" in reality
shadow tulip
umbral rapids
Just wanna learn it to be more flexible depending on nerfs/buffs
lavish quarry
pinned message mentions the best azerite trait options but, does not give a priority. are there any?
for single target
lavish quarry
hmm, so BI and NP last choices?
lavish quarry
and, as for the trinkets, is mythic ashvane bis again 😄
balmy condor
Tbh with you I kinda hard disagree with the pins because that’s not what sims, nor logs are showing
I guess it’s a decent enough baseline for new characters
But crucible major and breath major are both getting outshined by bote and CLF
1 ss on the chest is simming higher for basically everyone
So I maintain sim yourself
carmine osprey
Does doomblade bleed ignite/roll?
lavish quarry
yy, I agree, I just wanted to ask to get started on somewhere
balmy condor
Ashvane isn’t really bis unless you have a super high titanforge with a socket
@carmine osprey Wdym by that
carmine osprey
When you mutilate again, is the remaining bleed damage added to the new 8 second dot?
balmy condor
does that make it bis ausrr
balmy condor
tropic ocean
or unless theres some hidden old content trinket that is super op
lavish quarry
never liked ashvane trinket, too confusing for me 😄
balmy condor
@carmine osprey the damage is the same, it just refreshes I’m pretty sure
balmy condor
Oh btw @tropic ocean
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/kdxnA1zAETUsX9h5vKGoeF
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/d16HdQFUPc3oNEn9o6oJgE
I even tossed in a 110 ilvl coral into that second sim just for fun. Not only does it not replace socketed vita, it isn’t an upgrade over a socketed plumage. I actually haven’t seen coral go BiS on any geared sin rogue. Can you link a sim where it does? I’m really curious
pastel hatch
I noticed that SnD takes me out of stealth when playing sin but this doesnt happen on the other specs. Is this a known bug?
balmy condor
Yeah it’s specifically with sin and subterfuge iirc
pastel hatch
Ahh thats big yikes. Since sin is the most stealth dependant. But good to know its known. I thought I remembered this happening on beta too, guess I remembered correctly.
balmy condor
Yeah
Just gotta cast your between pull snd’s sooner and restealths
Not too bad tbh
But it will get fixed hopefully
pastel hatch
Ye I just didnt know and clicked SnD and then we pulled the boss on FH so my opener just flopped.
balmy condor
Yup
strange python
So crucible is a good major atm?
balmy condor
Not really
strange python
I'm gettin my sim on today so need some options to play with
Max I'm getting is 4600
balmy condor
I assume breath/crucible major are listed just as baselines
strange python
yeah blood still sims highest for me
strange python
yeahhh
The stat prio is weird too. Everything says vers is best but seems like i need to gem/enchant everything to crit
balmy condor
Blood and CLF are the two single target contenders
You gem/chant vers usually
Maybe 2-3 gems as crit from what I’ve seen
balmy condor
Swap out all the OP for other stuff
strange python
I need more sockets but I don't ever want to run another vision again D:
balmy condor
Same lmao
wary ice
Did u check 2nd double dose on the helm?
wary ice
Not totally unexpected was just thinking outloud mostly
balmy condor
Some people sim higher with 2x ss
It’s either 1x ss or 2x ss that sims highest
@strange python
Little bit more
But not much
strange python
Where'd you find that 28 dps at
wary ice
2nd agi gem
strange python
ahhh
balmy condor
Yup
strange python
So used to not even simming those lol
balmy condor
Full crit and double agi
wary ice
double mainstat is like ~5% increase to mainstat its actually insane
strange python
Nice I'll try that out then. Thanks 🙂
Should I even be using Shiv atm?
I've been kinda just slapping a new add with it but not sure if even worth
Also, still use CT on ST? Or just when there are multiple targets? Seems like a lot of finishers
wary ice
Should I even be using Shiv atm?
until level 58 shiv is a 1cp gen slow
so not in pve
I'd only use ct on st if for some reason i wont be able to hit the target for a while immediately after using it: Ie the soul shards on yzma are coming out. (with the caveat that SnD/Rupture dont need a refresh obviously)
or if u still have a lot of haste
urban bramble
In single target rotation if I have envenom on CD and snd, garrote and rupture are all applied my combo point dump would be to just reapply the dot w the lowest time left correct?
Or is it not as important to dump combo points as say rage?
sour wraith
Envenom doesn't have a cd
urban bramble
omg
lol trying to learn the rotation kept hitting shiv
thinking it was envenom
ty lol
explains why the dot wasnt showing up on the nameplate either
wary ice
envenom doesnt have a dot either - it gives you a buff that increases your poison application rate.
urban bramble
Yikes
balmy condor
Maximizing envenom/ep uptime is basically the only thing you can do
wary ice
In that vein, Envenom will Pandemic, but EP wont, so be aware of that
balmy condor
Does it not
wary ice
Elaborate plannin? It does not
wary ice
that or my wa for it has been broken for a couple of years now
balmy condor
Yeah I just never thought about it
tropic ocean
@balmy condor obviously coral cant compete against max ilvl socketed plumage
but from iterations it will beat vita
in your own linked sim
(and so will harlans)
and if the gear gets replaced by better items
(guy is running haste/mastery and lots of haste pieces) if u switch them to crit/vers
difference will get bigger
balmy condor
It’s still a whole % down
How much gear do you think people will find
In prepatch
After farming mythic ny’alotha for months
tropic ocean
?
what u linked plumage + vita sims 4794
you don't necessarily need to find better gear you should have it already
I replaced most of my items by now
with old stuff that was useless before
balmy condor
You literally just linked me a sim
To try and show me that coral is bis
Where coral is 1% down from the top setup
balmy condor
Sure
tropic ocean
and you compare it vs max ilvl socketed plumage
balmy condor
But it’s also not coral
tropic ocean
now which is more accessible
475 plumage or 445 coral
?
in ur own sim coral is superior to vita
and thats what I said earlier
yes obv if u can get 475 plumage u'll use it
IF
balmy condor
My bad, I thought you meant BiS as in best in slot
tropic ocean
if u had max ilvl titanforge lurkers
you'd use it last tier as well but
who has it
😄
light bronze
Hi gibt es auch die möglichkeit in deutsch fragen zu stellen?
tropic ocean
maybe bad wording y
tropic ocean
@light bronze klar schreib an
balmy condor
@light bronze only in dm’s
wary ice
im not even using it cause i have 3 iq's
tropic ocean
and probably max ilvl arcano crystal
will be very strong as well currently
if u happen to have ne
one*
or eye of command
also if u dont happen to have
high plumage
🙂
coral+font is -6dps vs 475 plumage + vita
verbal mantle
🙂
balmy condor
Nice bis 
balmy condor
You realize
That it’s font
Not coral
Right
That’s with no sockets, and “achievable” or whatever you want to call it
“More accessible”
Yes but only 50%
It’s the rank 2 that’s changed
So instead of 20% extra for sin, it’s 10% energy regen
No 50% bonus
Is the baseline for all classes
And sin used to get an addition 20%
Which got changed
Dps nerf
Gameplay buff
Ye
And then might make ep viable sooner and enable dusk walker shenanigans and all sorts of fun stuff
dawn anvil
Hello! I know it's pretty early to ask, but, do you guys know if Assassination will be a viable spec in Sl?
balmy condor
With current tuning numbers, no
Will that change? Yes
At the end of tuning, sin will probably be good enough
lament spoke
Just how much far behind is it? I only raid heroic so it doesn't really matter much to me as I'll prob play sin anyway, just interesting to know % wise
dawn anvil
Thank you! I'm playing my first rogue ever, and I felt confortable with Sin, tried outlaw and sub, but i cound't figure it out properly
balmy condor
Right now it’s around 15-20% under sub
That’s not counting the changes to legendaries from the last build
lament spoke
Wow, quite a way then. Fingers crossed for the tuning
balmy condor
Just needs an aura buff tbh
They could fiddle with garrote/rupture numbers as well imo
sand pewter
at least sub is pretty fun too, I just dont want combat to be the viable spec
orchid ibex
whats the rotation now? garote>mutilate>rupture>mutilate>snd?
and then just upkeeping all 3
balmy condor
Opener with 1 ss is gar snd gar rup
balmy condor
Shrouded suffocation
frigid kestrel
Always thought when you open with MA it was Amb > Amb> Mut > SnD
balmy condor
The garrote azerite trait
balmy condor
MA openers are jank imo
frigid kestrel
We talking about two different things?
balmy condor
Idk probably
frigid kestrel
O shit
I forgot ambush was a thing
I auto reverted to what I thought it was before SS was a thing
Wasn’t it Mut Rup Mut?
grizzled jay
if you're lucky the snd doesn't land on your Animacharge, then you can Shiv next rotation to 7CP Env in Shiv window
frigid kestrel
SnD doesn’t consume animacharge so it wouldn’t matter, ye?
balmy condor
It used to be mut rup mut
frigid kestrel
Unless im misunderstanding you
balmy condor
Snd doesn’t consume, yes
grizzled jay
it consumes it rn as a bug pretty sure
but you don't get added benefits
who knows if a) they remove it consuming or b) they let it consume and you get benefits
up in the air
frigid kestrel
New bug I’m assuming?
grizzled jay
nah been that way since Alpha phase 1
balmy condor
It doesn’t consume I’m pretty sure
balmy condor
9/30 was a wednesday
frigid kestrel
Ye as of 10/2 when I tested it worked properly
grizzled jay
ya
balmy condor
10/2 was the Friday after
grizzled jay
wednesday is patch day
balmy condor
So must’ve been fixed either that day
Or you were trolling and it got fixed before that
grizzled jay
that was the ER buffs so I went and tested all the old bugs
frigid kestrel
Na I don’t troll I just make mistakes
grizzled jay
they fixed the Rupture bug that build but the SnD one was still around
grizzled jay
do i look like the kind of person that would trol
frigid kestrel
Uhhh yup
grizzled jay
if you answer wrong ur gay
balmy condor
grizzled jay
oh okay yeah MA is busted with Ambush ER
that's half of someone's health
thank god too im tired of Subt
this is a new anime power. for rogue this seems op
red plaza
Anime power 
balmy condor
grizzled jay
thats just whispyr
@balmy condor is it a new bug that if you are at max combo points, using ER does not generate an Animacharge?
grizzled jay
yo i got the godroll
marble hemlock
@grizzled jay best one is pokeballing one of the dark valkyr mobs, gives haste for each kill for 10sec or smth, you can go absolutely mental with that one 😛
and have like 200% haste
closer to 300% probably
marble hemlock
nah, i made a clip of it a while back
combined with the "your finishers deal increased damage after shadowstepping" and a proper 6CP CT
everything just melts 😛
astral plover
Is there a macro out there that makes Mutilate and Ambush on the same button for "blindside" proc?
balmy condor
Not without an addon
lavish quarry
is it even possible with an addon? :shocked:
balmy condor
Yeah, fuu made it happen
And I feel like half of the reason why he did it was to make me mad
astral plover
What is it calleD?
balmy condor
I’ll go find it
astral plover
ty ❤️
somber cairn
! Guide
balmy condor
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
frosty aspen
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
somber cairn
Thank you 👍
wary ice
Anyone elses WA's just decide to stop working at times?
I'm assuming its cause mine are old but i cant tell whats causing them to stop
grizzled jay
spell IDs might have changed
wary ice
blegh
frigid kestrel
Gnome sequencer still a thing?
Dude that shit use to be broken af. Like you can fit a rotation into a single button and play.
distant cypress
lol what
frigid kestrel
Just looking at Fuu’s answer for Blindside/Mut one button fix. Gnome Sequencer is one of the reasons why Blizz put certain limitations on macros if my memory serves me right. It was legit game breaking. I used it to Druid tank in Cata because reasons.
copper pine
Hey i wanna try Assa in m+ now in this prepatch. Which stats should i play ?
honest rain
marble hemlock
Hey i wanna try Assa in m+ now in this prepatch. Which stats should i play ?
@copper pine crit/vers
frigid kestrel
Ye
drifting light
Just looking at Fuu’s answer for Blindside/Mut one button fix. Gnome Sequencer is one of the reasons why Blizz put certain limitations on macros if my memory serves me right. It was legit game breaking. I used it to Druid tank in Cata because reasons.
@frigid kestrel I went back to check fuu’s video
I wonder if we can do something similar to ElvUI’s shadow dance stealth instance
But instead of replacing ur whole bar on shadow dance, it would just replace one button when ambush proc is up so you use the same button as mut
wary ice
Does elvui have its own stealth instance? i thought it just swapped to your stealth bar while in dance
drifting light
Not sure if it has its own stealth instance or just swaps to stealth bar on dance
But the idea is that it would change to this bar or instance on the proc, so if u have mut on 1 and ambush on 1 on stealth bar, it would change to the stealth bar/instance so u can use 1
copper pine
Silly question but which essence is PP ? 😄
stone pilot
Purification protocol
copper pine
ok ty ^^
frigid kestrel
@drifting light I mean, that might possibly be an answer. But our rotation is brain dead in my eyes anyways. Pressing another button when a literal alert comes up that tells you to press said button isn’t that bad...... especially when the spec currently plays slow and something more is needed anyway.
However, I will admit figuring out how to do that would be pretty cool though
amber quail
What is change to BLOODFANG to top The legendary chart? 😳
quaint sequoia
How does sin look compaired to the other specs after the latest build?
fleet whale
still lower than sub
quaint sequoia
how much tho? 🤔
balmy condor
~15-20%
quaint sequoia
Still that much huh, well that sucks
quaint sequoia
aint that with op Bloodfang
amber quail
Platini in beta sin stll little but slow(as class design) them sub that is quite faster
I picked max for both
In 2nd place is 2955/2627 still about 10-15%
But 1st place is with BLOOFANG for both
think that is fairly looking at that to “compare”(like apple with pineapple in my opinion😆)
The funny is the way to
dire spoke
strange python
you start in stealth?
normal olive
You know that Slice and Dice button?
normal olive
after doing hc once and wondering why i was 4th in dps
with 3.6k
i noticed that we have SnD
xD
strange python
my heart cant take this
low girder
lol
crimson palm
Where's the kidney mfd
crimson palm
:pepeclown-1:
normal olive
I'll do that tomorrow
only mfd SnD
and i'll bet my ass that i will do more dmg then some random in that Pug
strange python
is anyone actually gonna use slice and dice?
balmy condor
slice and dice is our strongest finisher
strange python
but why? it doesn't do any damage
normal olive
strange python
it just increases attack speed a bit
balmy condor
right
strange python
does it really?
balmy condor
yes
strange python
wow
bleak spoke
and for my next trick i'm going to remove toxic blade and hide it in the next patch
vague rock
ok this trink works with envenom apparently 
pretty bad in aoe tho, only has a tiny chance to proc off fok
low girder
fleet whale
people say that SL Sin rogue is gonna be slow...
but look at this cast per minute from classic:
V
normal olive
I'ma show you real apm tomorrow
fleet whale
normal olive
normal olive
xD
royal lantern
civic hatch
is force multiplier good atm?
opaque tree
Was curious about weapon enchants myself, which 2 are simming the highest?
grizzled jay
@vague rock There's another trinket that just does straight on-proc nature damage
chilly marsh
"Single Target Essences: Breath of the Dying or Crucible Major, Lucid Dreams, CnS and Breath of the Dying or Crucible Minor (depending on what you picked for Major)" but logs show other thing
its mostly blood or guardian
oak trout
is there a comprehensive guide what talents to pick? I'm kinda lost
drifting cosmos
in the pin
oak trout
oh
hazy iron
gilded fossil
oh then it turns into a toxic blade at 58
srry took the summer off getting back into it
balmy condor
Yuuuuuupp
normal olive
fleet whale
Lol, My Kingslayers have a higher ilvl than heroic BoD weapons
crazy what this squish has done
ionic vault
does anyone have a weak aura to track empowered garrote? I know it's pretty obviously that you cast it within 3 secs of coming out of stealth but for AoE packs I have became lazy and I spam tab target to apply garrote and I used to have an aura that would show green text on empowered garrote so I knew not to overwrite it
gray fjord
Just found that one on wago, it gives a little glowing cooldown tracker box when you're targeting something with a garrote that's empowered
Honesly I might reverse engineer it to use in my progress bar version I made. xD
gray fjord
Yeah I just found that one so idk if that'll be sufficient for their needs or not. xD I had been meaning to add an empowered garrote and nightstalker rupture tracker to my own WAs.
Why pastebin though, @balmy condor? Genuinely curious, I guess Wago doesn't mean much if people don't put screenshots of their WAs anyhow which happens a lot.
astral plover
How do u guys deal with the Ambush blindside proc?
gray fjord
I have only dabbled with the blindside talent, but in pre patch I'm not sure quite how potent it is if you're running double dose. When I have used it, it just works as a filler more than anything, as you don't want to miss pandemic refreshes just because of using a proc since the procs can only trigger from mutilates anyhow. I'm more of a hobbyist for assassination, so there might be more capable folks who can chime in. ^^;
jagged axle
should've just re-added dispatch baseline
gray fjord
I didn't really play much assassination when dispatch was a go-to option, but the way the talent was worded made it seem like it really just took the place of mutilate in execute range but had procs sprinkled in with it.
jagged axle
iirc it was baseline in like wod-ish
gray fjord
Ah, yeah back then I was pure combat until HFC xD
jagged axle
combat 😢
gray fjord
I know. 💔
That's why I get so devastated when they nerf my bandit's guile leggo into the dirt.
jagged axle
i spent like the entirety of WoD in BGs and Ashran just fucking around
gray fjord
Killing Spree being actually strong in PvP and burst of speed were my favorite things for so long about combat
jagged axle
iirc in like 6.1 S&D was a fucking passive and was always active
which would've been dope to have now considering that it's just another maintenance
gray fjord
I'm glad to see they at least were smart enough to give back the energy regen part as rank 2, which I'd been hoping they'd either do that or add a passive to help with it for assassination.
I know it's always been the low APM spec for rogue, but man is it really slow some times.
jagged axle
when the fuck did they do that
gray fjord
This last beta build, they made Rank 2 Slice and Dice give 10% energy regen specifically for assassination
gray fjord
It's a start, but from my testing it still just is kinda slow ish, I'm hoping for a little more.
topaz saffron
I still feel I want Dashing Scoundrel aswell as the extra regen
gray fjord
I think it's really lame to tie fluidity of a spec behind a legendary is the thing, Subversion.
But I do agree that dashing scoundrel should give more than 1 energy pre crit of poison. It was 2 before.
civic tide
Hi, can someone please take a quick peek if I am doing something wrong with my gear or if it's just low ilvl problem, that the dmg is kinda mediocore?
gray fjord
I know and agree that it's not meant to be a spamfest like it was with the giga-haste corruption build, @balmy condor , there are just times where slow and methodical feel sluggish. I guess that might be my outlaw bias shining through, I dunno. I guess I shouldn't compared early game SL sin to what it will be 2 years down the road.
balmy condor
outlul main 
gray fjord
💔 That's not nice. >> lol
balmy condor
gray fjord
I think assassination definitely has a very obvious mechanic and feel to it compared to outlaw. Pooling energy is a non-issue as outlaw in like 99% of situations, so I do appreciate the planning that can go into it.
jagged axle
I can't get into the rotation
for sub i mean
i've been playing sin since I found out that you had to press buttons individually rather than just slamming ur fingers into the keyboard hoping to do dmg
topaz saffron
I will literally never understand sub rotation 👌
gray fjord
Subtlety is in a kinda weird spot from what I can tell. It does great damage on the beta, but I've heard two sides to the argument of shadow dance being as high of uptime and defining of the spec versus a stronger, burst CD(ie less dances) but still doing good damage outside of dance windows. I'm used to spammy rotations so current sub suits me fine, but I know there are people that don't care for it.
I guess saying assassination isn't 'fluid' is inaccurate, as it is quite predictable what you should be doing. The APM just drives me nuts some times. xD
winter gale
Is assa now closer to sub?
Or sub is still way better at this current state of the game?
gray fjord
For beta damage? Closer, yes, but it's still been very neglected in my opinion.
winter gale
Assa is my spec, I want it to go on.
gray fjord
Closer isn't by much, though. The new slice and dice rank 2 should help and they're re-buffing their legendaries, but subtlety is sitting pretty, especially in terms of scaling with conduits. I'll be curious to keep an eye on that progress, though.
winter gale
Yes. We are still some 40ish days from expansion atleast?
So I guess alot can change
gray fjord
I'd say so. They literally are just replacing covenant abilities in the latest build so things are certainly very up in the air. I wouldn't take Pre-Launch data too much to heart as I anticipate some tuning once launch occurs. Fundamental changes I'd HOPE occur before launch, but we'll see.
balmy condor
the snd rank 2 is actually worse than the 20% attack speed me thinks
jagged axle
thought they never released a new release date
hope venthyr isn't shit
I'm going venthyr for sure even if it is shit though
gray fjord
@balmy condor it's definitely possible, since auto attacks are a large portion of damage across all 3 specs and deadly poison procs are too with sin. For single target, of course. It'd be really sad if that were the case, though.
balmy condor
from what I've simmed, baseline sin was higher before the change than after
by about 100-150
gray fjord
Ow, much more than I would've anticipated.
balmy condor
I think its fine though
sin just needs an aura buff, and maybe rupture/garrote needs some love
and then it'll be fine
gray fjord
I'm not an assassination main by any means, but I feel there should be some benefit to AoE in the future. I haven't seen the sims on poisoned Katar yet, but I feel assassination will be relegated into a very strict role if it doesn't have a viable AoE build.
sand heath
Similar to now, if you need to AOE you have 2 other specs tho, I would be comfortable if Assa is mainly focused single and other 2 is a AOE spec and a Hybrid of a both
balmy condor
lethal poison + poison katar is actually pretty good
if we can get enough stats for it
aoe problem really isn't that awful, its just locked behind conduit ranks
gray fjord
I definitely understand where you're coming from, Ninjass- There should be something a spec if prominent at, and I'm not expecting each spec to perform the same in each scenario.
I guess that's the thing, Whispyr- Without the higher conduit ranks I haven't seen what it can do in terms of actual potential for multi-target outside of just multi-dotting. I'd been tied up with pre-patch stuff so I haven't gotten my hands on any of the higher ranked conduits yet.
vestal wren
PK isn't that big of a dps gain in dungeon slice
balmy condor
wow really
vestal wren
however
gray fjord
I love the howevers
balmy condor
seems like it would be more than that
vestal wren
this is with CT, its possible that this gets amped a bit by picking HB
balmy condor
is that also factoring in lethal 7 for example
balmy condor
big feelycraft, but Imo the combination of the two playing off each other creates the strength
I haven't simmed it
so could be that pk is still shit
but idk, it seems pretty good
I would like a buff to pk though, maybe in the form of fan damage
vestal wren
its interessting that assassination has a conduit that is only relevant in aoe
kind of like subtlety has a pure st traits with pv
not sure how well that will work with the conduit change restrictions but will also come down to what traits are good
gray fjord
I'm more intrigued by the 'generic' legendary that buffs shiv by 350% but assassination has a conduit that buffs the damage 100% as well, honestly. xD Tiny Toxic Blade just sounds like it was meant for assassination from the beginning. Even the prior version sounded only moderately viable as assassination.
austere grove
when would i run vigor over DS?
balmy condor
always
austere grove
simple answer. thankyou
balmy condor
np
visual belfry
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
tender folio
So Shiv is useless until we get rank 2 of it ?
frigid kestrel
ye
surreal solar
the dispell doesnt even work, but it highlights it >.<
sterile talon
Dispel works
tender folio
Ye I saw that lol
vestal wren
its not shiv rank 2 but the poison that we don't have on level 50
surreal solar
???? I've used it on mobs with enrages and its not cleared it at all?? perhaps bug they fixed over past couple days?
vestal wren
did you apply the poison?
surreal solar
deadly/crippling? the only ones we have? or the "empowered non-lethals" anything that could be slowed, yeah
vestal wren
you need:
surreal solar
so, the dispel doesnt work, until SL
vestal wren
that's what i mean if i say "you don't have the poison on level 50"
it should work on beta if you want to test it
burnt temple
With the different aoe changes and spec changes is there any change to relative strength for m+ for sin/outlaw in SL?
vestal wren
outlaw looks good in m+
sin is atm slightly undertuned, so har to say how it ranks before balancing
burnt temple
Gotcha. I've always just preferred sin and hoped things might even out lol
vestal wren
beta is still in change
so i would not value the current balance to much
e.g. they just did a 2nd round of legendary balancing and its expected to see conduits being balanced soon
burnt temple
Yea makes sense. Probably need to try them both out. I have never enjoyed outlaw but with the RTB change maybe it's less annoying now lol
vestal wren
subtlety seems like a good pick in sl too
vestal wren
its diffrent than mid/late legion version but its not bad.
i would def. give it a try
burnt temple
I will do that. I remember some version in legion having some really odd rotational stuff that was big brain
Lol
vestal wren
it wasn't to bad once you got the basics down, but def. had a learning curve
quaint sequoia
is bloodfang still op on beta or did they hotfix it?
vestal wren
i assume they haven't but i can't verify
past moat
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
past moat
no RH sl guide for assa?
vestal wren
not yet
we got someone to do assa and outlaw for sl, but i don't think they want to constantly update those like i do atm with subtlety
errant cloak
,
copper pine
how u use in m+ your lvl 50 talent ? Just for the dot or "spam" it ?
lament aurora
assuming you're referring to Crimson Tempest (CT), you should maintain it on every mob, no need to spam it, just make sure its ticking
empty ravine
so like
if we have SS azerite traits do we want to open with 3/4 garr or just 1-2 garr then ambush?
and then proceed to regular roto
grizzled jay
it differs per scenario, what scenario are you asking this in regards to
empty ravine
just a typical tank and spank ST
grizzled jay
have you been using 3-4 garrotes before lol
empty ravine
yes
grizzled jay
oh no
grizzled jay
yeah but we've never used 3-4 garrotes lol
empty ravine
sure we have
grizzled jay
you only use 2 to get the max-duration refresh
the 3rd and 4th don't do anything in ST
empty ravine
if you have SS thats 3 combo points
so 2 garr then rup
then gar
well i should say
garr ven gar rup gar
grizzled jay
yeah that's never been the opener
grizzled jay
you are refreshing empowered garrote with a non-empowered garrote in that
which is a big dps loss
empty ravine
with SS and sub
shy dust
That was not the opener for exsang assassination
empty ravine
its empowered
shy dust
That’s how you scuffed your dps
shy dust
No
shy dust
^
empty ravine
i can get to 4
shy dust
You’d be replacing an empowered garrote
empty ravine
if im lucky
grizzled jay
???
shy dust
Even if you somehow got to 4
grizzled jay
Luck doesn't change how globals last
empty ravine
but more or less 3 reliably
shy dust
Your garrote is outside of the window
grizzled jay
It's always been Gar-Rup-Gar-vendetta-mut-rup-exsang-mut-ct
shy dust
And it’s set at 3 globals
grizzled jay
anyways, subt is ded in prepatch, all hail MA master race
shy dust
You physically cannot
empty ravine
ok thats also what i was gonna ask
shy dust
Get an empowered garrote into your opener as the 5th global
grizzled jay
Because we have Ambush now, it pushes MA over
empty ravine
if MA was the goto now
ya i know
and ambush does more flat dmg than mut at least in tooltip
but mut does have change to give more cp
err
not garrote
i mean mut
grizzled jay
Envenom isn't very powerful as it goes up in CP, so CP generation isn't like a big damage increase compared to Evis or Dispactch
empty ravine
so if we doing MA talent we open with ambush but still get a garrote in op?
grizzled jay
Ambush SnD Mut Rup Garrote then normal rotation I think, but you can just check logs and see what they do in the opener
lament aurora
honestly sim your talents and see whats comes on top for your gear
subt is still bis for m+ with SS, as well as for any aoe fight with SS
grizzled jay
in aoe yeah
grizzled jay
in SL the rotation is Ambush ER Rup Garr Mut SnD then normal rotation (while always triggering the Animacharge on ER with Shiv so you get a 7CP Env in the Shiv window)
empty ravine
ya for aoe i figured subt would win out especially for longer aoe fights
for short aoe id bet on MA being better
lament aurora
I mean it depends completely on your azerite traits, MA way worse than subt for me in every situation, but for you MA might be better
empty ravine
also we go vigor now not DS?
grizzled jay
its always been Vigor in ST afaik
dark crag
Not with the haste corruptions
rose violet
do you have haste corruptions?
empty ravine
sometimes DS would be good choice, even MfD for others
grizzled jay
@rose violet no one does
empty ravine
but i was haste corr
grizzled jay
i never gave up on DD Crit
dark crag
Don't listen to that shiny dwarf, believe in nzoth and corruptions work again. Servant of Nzoth title required
grizzled jay
is that title gone now?
dark crag
Good question
lean fossil
@grizzled jay what is er in your rotation?
empty ravine
i mean if you had hit the haste cap then i bet you could win over SS by pooling crit and doing DD
lament aurora
echoing reprimand
lean fossil
thank you
empty ravine
wounder if subt spec gonna be like it was in beg of BfA and be suprising good for aoe fights :p
subtle karma
should snd break stealth ? i'm pretty sure it's a bug
empty ravine
snd SHOUDLNT break stealth but that was back then
grizzled jay
it doesn't as far as i know
empty ravine
although i think in vanilla it did
grizzled jay
yea it doesn't
subtle karma
it does atm :/
empty ravine
so perhaps MfD is werf
grizzled jay
i just did it
empty ravine
if you MfD snd
grizzled jay
mfd is only good in aoe for like outlaw
grizzled jay
well i am spec'd Outlul atm
subtle karma
try in assa
empty ravine
im talking about in sin
subtle karma
i heard in subtlety doesn't break as well
empty ravine
snd like i said didnt and shouldnt break stealth
snd im pretty sure did break stealth back in vanilla
but i could be wrong there
grizzled jay
Oh looks like it's a Subt interaction
It doesn't with either other 2 talents
More reason MA is better
empty ravine
Snd works much like RtB since its a self buff, and RtB didnt break stealth
so if SnD broke stealth thatd be dumb
storm forum
SnD breaks stealth with subt i just tried it to confirm :<
subtle karma
rip
empty ravine
SnD lasts so long now too, so im almost positive yould want to have SnD in your rota
grizzled jay
it doesn't break with Sub's Subt lol
@empty ravine No one argued against using SnD?
empty ravine
thought someone was saying for sin it mihgt not be werf
empty ravine
was just stating that id be suprised if it was a dps loss
grizzled jay
mfd only good for Outlaw aoe
empty ravine
especially since it can last like a min
empty ravine
nasgashi~~~~
storm forum
im pretty sure snd is excellent, we don't get value for energy regen like other specs, but its definitely more damage than like the envenom or whatever you would be replacing it with.
grizzled jay
we will in SL
empty ravine
thats fair, mfd -> snd opener was something i just considered but hadnt tested out
grizzled jay
Problem with Sin is that both Envenom and CT are bad to spam, so MfD resets don't do much for them
Compared that to Outlaw and Sub who have true spammable AoE
storm forum
if we did theoretically take mdf, wouldn't we wanna open with rupture anyways?
like mfd -> rupture -> garrote -> mut/ambush -> snd?
empty ravine
theoretically youd want to mfd snd then wait a few sec
grizzled jay
i don't think an mfd rotation has been theorized cause its been historically bad
storm forum
oh like mfd->snd before pull?
empty ravine
then open and time it so get ambush opener
storm forum
ok that makes sense
empty ravine
but like i said i havent done any testing
storm forum
only fight i tried mfd on this tier was ilgy and it was not good
empty ravine
so it could very well be dps loss to get mfd either way
storm forum
mfd isnt good for AoE, it's for funneling envenoms
storm forum
yeah thats fair, excellent in pvp
empty ravine
but even in pvp DS was nice to suprsie healers with big env dmg
but usually the mfd ks was better in most situations
also
for now we is BotD major or do we want blood?
and i was debating whether CoF major was better pvp wise than BotD since potentially better spike as well as the heal util
CoF does 832 dmg + 75% of that dmg as dot (6sec)
which does 100% more dmg on each use up to 300% since it resets at 3
storm forum
one of the issue i have with BotE right now is that we dont have a mini CD to pair it with inside vendetta, cause we dont have TB or exang so it feels kinda weird to not have that
storm forum
but i also hate fireball/breath cause its boring
empty ravine
but 3min cd :c
stupid orc and their better racials
MAKE TROLLS GREAT AGAIN blizz
:c
fuck zanda trolls im talking og trolls
storm forum
i think troll/orc were better when exange was meta when like all our damage was in the vendetta window
cause now that we prefer DD, we're less bursty
empty ravine
ya it was, flat 10% attack speed for 12 such a small window
and lined up exactly with ven cd
ya with DD you are looking at optimising every mut being your big dmg
instead of over time dmg
but doesnt really matter in the end anyway since azerite gear going away in SL right?
Also
we dont do EotFI (essence or w/e) minor anymore?
think im hearing MoLD CnS and blood/BotD minorrs
actually if i also look at BotD and CoF passive i think BotD is superior dmg
although thought id share my 1337 macro
#showtooltip Vanish
/cast [combat] Vanish
/cast [nocombat] !Stealth
has never fucked with me once in pvp nor pve and will save you from all those times you accidentally vanish
and its simple 😄
dont know why i feel proud of myself but i do teehee
sweet pecan
i use something similar but also with sprint and mounting up
empty ravine
arent you a bawler
sweet pecan
some people find my setup pretty odd though
empty ravine
if you came up with it yourself the problem becomes when you give it to others to try to use it but dont know how to do coding and stuff
you dont want to see my macros for my opener button tho
sweet pecan
usually they just have their macros and skills on different places on the toolbar, and my icons show the numbers on the keyboard you have to press to activate the skills, and use the way weakauras paint the icons priority as a skill order system
vestal wren
opener macros 🤢
sweet pecan
i call it the priority stack
empty ravine
cause i combine garr, sap, pick pocket and now ambush all in one button
sweet pecan
mine is just mouseover and shadowstep
empty ravine
oh you use your LED keyboard to color code which buttons to press in your rota?
sweet pecan
empty ravine
see people posting their raidbots dps anyway
empty ravine
ah ok, well good for you doing that all by yourself
balmy condor
why the letters so big
balmy condor
empty ravine
looks kinda sloppy tbh, but when i do it myself its usually similar to that
sweet pecan
aM is alt mouse wheel
balmy condor
you don't have any muscle memory?
empty ravine
which is why i usually end up just copying some pro wa
sweet pecan
every time i add a skill i integrate it into the weakaura setup, its like a fun minigame to keep the combat stack priority optimal at every level
empty ravine
when there is a wa out there superior to mine already
balmy condor
making your own wa's is so soothing though
empty ravine
ya sadly im trying to find a job right now and due to that i tell myself that i shouldnt be a fuckwad and waste time trying to optimize my game dps
i have issues with procrastinating so ya
always just becomes another reason to not do what i should
sweet pecan
procrastinate more efficiently with optimized dps
empty ravine
but if i did that then id know deep down that im not trying as hard as i prob should
since if i was really trying to get a job i wouldnt be sitting around making stuff to make my gaming exp faster 😛
if that makes senese
sweet pecan
its the weekend though, no one is reading CVs right now anyway
empty ravine
cause in the past id end up being like "hurray look wat i did, this will surely cut the time to do stuff in game"
but in reality i shoulda not been gaming at all prob :p
i actually had someone call me earlier today for some reason
and since i do IT stuff that is sometimes normal since i sometimes work when ppl arent working
but even so, dont know why theyd call me on a saturday
wasnt garrote suppsoe to only be usable with daggers before 9.0.1?
cause now im noticing
only mut requires daggers
balmy condor
garrote has been usable without daggers before
empty ravine
but ambush and garrote dont
balmy condor
yep, only mut
empty ravine
would be cewl if there was a way to take adv of non daggers
balmy condor
there kinda was during hivemind
empty ravine
and use ambush and garrote and like poisoned nife
balmy condor
you would run double slappers 3x eb
and just fok single target
and do big aoe
it wasn't really meta ever
sweet pecan
i think thats silly, the only thing preventing me from playing with outlaw is that the weapons are not compatible with the other specs
cant just go back and forth
balmy condor
but there was some big logs from the cheese
empty ravine
neet
sweet pecan
i dont really see a reason why an assassin couldnt use a sword or something
empty ravine
perhaps with garr not needing dag it might actually become the goto way to maxmize dps
but prob not
balmy condor
wdym
empty ravine
well i thought garr required daggers back in 8.3
but if garr doesnt need daggers now
balmy condor
gar hasn't needed daggers all of bfa
empty ravine
you could maybe exploit the fact that you get bigger numbers with non daggers
do subt garr SS build
and just do big open dps
halcyon grail
balmy condor
definitely not worth losing mutilate
empty ravine
enough to allow fok and pk to keep you ahead
like i said prob not
just thought it was funny and neet and cewl
back in the day thats how you got ahead in vanilla
😛
kinda like how ppl realized you could swap weaps in combat
empty ravine
i know :c
sadly non-daggers dont do THAT much more dps
so it isnt something i was really srs bout
sweet pecan
so i just got a weapon questing
empty ravine
its that way to maintain the peace in the game
sweet pecan
im lvl 27, my mutilate does 90ish dmg
balmy condor
ye
empty ravine
between rogues and everyone else
sweet pecan
and the use on this weapon is do 3951 dmg over 5s
empty ravine
bet that divers folly still legit
balmy condor
it is
frigid kestrel
Jesus y’all been busy today
empty ravine
uhh just tried swaping weaps in combat
frigid kestrel
314 messages ...... that’s to much for me to catch up on
empty ravine
was able to swap my fist weap with dagger
balmy condor
its mostly just et and cytos
empty ravine
in combat
frigid kestrel
Gotcha
empty ravine
is this normal :l
balmy condor
the channel is pretty quiet usually
empty ravine
no i mean
frigid kestrel
^
frigid kestrel
Last that was a thing was in WOTLK
balmy condor
dunno
empty ravine
like even swaping with weap in bag
frigid kestrel
I think
empty ravine
try it right now
balmy condor
no
empty ravine
tell me if its just me
frigid kestrel
Didn’t know that
empty ravine
i mean you could take adv of divers folly hella
frigid kestrel
I remember having a weapon swapping macro way way back
balmy condor
could you though
empty ravine
divers follys a sword right?
balmy condor
fist
empty ravine
all i want to do is break the game and become e famous :c
cant say i know who the guy that came up with that mythic jaina cheeze was tho
balmy condor
I'm pretty sure it was method
empty ravine
ah ya prob :p
empty ravine
well they aint doin too hot from what i remember hearing
frigid kestrel
This is veering into a general convo, but they are starting up again.
How’s the new SnD feel, I haven’t logged on to test it out yet
balmy condor
sweeping sexual assault under the rug is indeed "aint doin too hot"
empty ravine
ya ill quit talking gen stuff here
balmy condor
frigid kestrel
Still having them white hits murdering them charts?
empty ravine
you could say one of em was caught with their pants down 👀
balmy condor
but its for sure our strongest finisher
frigid kestrel
Imma log and test sometime today