Havn't simmed current azerite but droptimizer should be up to date
#assassination
rigid mango
vestal wren
!azerite is updated iirc, but might change now with raidbots supporting 8.3
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Azerite overview: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o
vestal wren
tl;dr is that raid azerite does not look super convincing
warm ruin
Aite. Cheers :)
candid jasper
vision is simming as a major slot for me now
arctic walrus
gonna go ahead and doubt that one
candid jasper
Perhaps I've made a mistake
Which is strange, as I've got master assassin, so it no longer times up with vanish
warm ruin
!essence
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
drifting cloud
you have worldvein at 0
candid jasper
Sorry, not sure I understand what you mean by at 0
candid jasper
Ah, I didn't realise worldvein was simming higher now
candid jasper
With world vein, vision still seems to be simming high
@arctic walrus unfortunately I've had terrible luck with 8.2 and mythic items
We finished this tier at 7/8M and I run a fair few m+ but yeah, hopefully I can get something better next tier 😄
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/oU95N2Fni3RUxwDFqTTBgz
With worldvein, I'm simming slightly higher
Not a massive difference though
fleet whale
BoTE and CLF seem really close now
next solar
just got a piece with infinite stars woo
dapper bough
gg
autumn girder
Is it correct that I use Rupture to 4 Targets and Garrote to 3? Or can i dot more
arctic socket
60k deeps Nice
dapper bough
Did you really get 2 pieces with infinite stars
hidden bay
next solar
no
frozen karma
we've got similar gear overall but you're simming like 10k over me lol is that new corruption that fucking strong?
frozen karma
yeah obviously, but in a few weeks
next solar
imagine comparing assass to havoc D:
pure moth
Holy s*** those sims
harsh sphinx
i got one infinite stars. was about a 10k gain for assa
tropic ocean
yes
cobalt pelican
if the affix is still being fucky with combat by the time it's live
tropic ocean
they will drop in the new raid
cobalt pelican
sounds annoying
tropic ocean
and in m+ dungeons too
cobalt pelican
but it'll be more than fine by nature of being a rogue spec
trail scarab
is sub going to have a place too you think? or is it still a no go
cobalt pelican
probably not
trail scarab
honestly havent seen anyone play that spec in bfa
trail scarab
other than zul boss in first raid lol
cobalt pelican
sub runs into the same problem over and over again n m+ where any time gained from being sub is lost in the amount of aoe smash lost
in raid idk, maybe
sims are kinda ok for sub and i don't think it'll take much to make it a functionally usable spec
trail scarab
yea, and with outlaw being the way it is i guess there isnt much point
in playing it
but once i get a dagger im going to test assa at least, looks pretty fun
assa ST is very strong right? or am i just imagining that
frozen karma
not sure about very strong but strong yeah
cobalt flame
idk , other classes have much higher sims with corrupted items , except ww , ww still does nothing 
cobalt pelican
depends if you mean in raid or m+
m+ single target is kinda ass
raid single target is great
cobalt flame
is it though? Ofc didnt have any way to test it ingame but 10+k lower dps in sims from 90% of other classes seems kinda big
cobalt pelican
the sims are all abusing infinite stars
so
any class that can abuse it the best will show significantly more powerful until it gets fixed
cobalt flame
is it not working properly or what , else i see no reason NOT to use it if for some classes it is 17k dps upgrade
cobalt pelican
it's unknown, it literally didn't work at all on ptr as a corruption for the end of the ptr
if it's working properly ingame now and the sim is an accurate reflection there's no way it survives a balance pass
smoky bluff
guys, need some confirmation, is mastery weigthin more?
cobalt flame
Yeah I am little pessimistic in that aspect. As long as it is op at least for someone blizz likes to let other classes cry for a few months
wouldnt be surprised if they nerf it one week before prepatch
cobalt pelican
i don't really care that some classes benefit from it more than others
but we're talking like, scales of magnitude better than other corruptions
it essentially breaks the entire system
frozen karma
there's no way something that gives you like 10-20k dps doesn't get nerfed in the next few days
cobalt flame
Yeah i wouldnt care either in normal situation but if some class will be broken with it some of us in the raid group will be forced to reoll or bench because of it
prisma cypress
i highly doubt anything will be truly broken after the pre-mythic balance pass
cobalt flame
hope so
cobalt pelican
i'd be surprised if infinite stars even survives till heroic week at this rate
though it's a bit of a strange situation since the buff only happened at the very tail end of ptr
which makes it a bit ???????????
cobalt flame
yeah seems weird
cobalt pelican
just wait and see though, if you care enough to reroll for raid performance then you'll need to gear several chars
rogues (predominately assassination) will likely show in most raid comps though so
cobalt flame
i wouldnt mind gearing other chars , essences are what is stopping me from doing alts 😄
tropic ocean
sin rogue naturally doesnt have as much haste as some other classes
so yeah on stuff like dh or fury
it will be bigger
maybe theyll buff other essences as well who knows
scarlet swift
How did practice get a 38 sec ashvane kill am I missing something
harsh sphinx
very organized loyal cheese
outer lotus
It also scales with AP so classes like survival hunter that have close 100% uptime on a mainstat buff from an azerite trait like it a lot too
jagged yoke
do u guys find cheat death or leaching better for open world and general use?
hasty vale
Do we know our azerite traits yet?
arctic walrus
probably slithering loa, and then from carapace and nzoth
strange python
Hey guys do you think Assa would be good in the new raid? I struggle a bit between 2 classes rogue & dk. I play rogue mostly cuz its fotm in M+ and im doing alot M+. Do you think is DK ok next patch (raid & M+). What would u recommand. I play my DK since ICC progress and Dk i started rogue at 8.2.5.
green tide
Assassination will perform very well
wary ice
Getting back into the game
Are the guides on Wowhead updated? or should i be using ravenholdt?
near coyote
is blood mallet correct?
arctic walrus
@wary ice wowhead and icy veins are good
@near coyote it's still very volatile in the state of the patch so take things with care
but it gives you a rough outline of what to look for atm
sand otter
jeez trying my best in our raid but i cannot beat a demonhunter
strange python
Post logs If you want Help
finite yarrow
any word on being able to mog to fangs of father?
olive topaz
finite yarrow
right, was just wondering if anyone else tried to because its not letting me
rough creek
doesn't work for me either
strange python
Right click it and select the other
smoky bluff
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
rough creek
ayy, that worked. cheers
strange python
np np
strange python
how do you get echoing void?
arctic walrus
random roll on your corruption
strange python
so i guess i wont get it this patch then
drifting cloud
ok bro
green tide
I mean that's one way of looking at it
strange python
We have curses and blessings in life, my RNG is a curse.
toxic kiln
so im looking at blood mallet, seems as if MoLD is running up top, but CLF is simming higher i wanna trust the sim, but id like to just be practicing using the proper essence. any thoughts?
cobalt pelican
use whatever sims best
cobalt pelican
essences aren't difficult enough that you should need more than 3 minutes practie with one
you might fluff the opener a couple times if yuo change but you'll get over it
sudden trench
Where is everyone getting azi with infinite stars already
civic forge
lucky gear pieces from assault caches
strange python
I'll be listening to Ameno for 8 hours straight starting now.
The key to good RNG
tiny granite
!essence
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
static fable
Hey, guys! Wondering if new mechgnomes are good as the rogue race. Any suggestions?
dense cedar
They get free primary stat so they can't be too bad
fervent beacon
and healthstone
dense cedar
excited to be the person in my raid group without infinite stars
safe canyon
They're not furry degenerates so they're better than vulpera by default
dense cedar
I prefer this over benthic tho tbh
static fable
Well, I am looking for the highest dps outcome, doing myth raids and etc
iron heath
fleet whale
i got the boring void ritual as my first corrupted piece... still a dps upgrade but meh
harsh sphinx
The bracers? Everyone gets that for piece #1
fleet whale
second piece wasn't much better, 420 pants with verse proc if you take damage
strange python
eh at least you can farm corruptions next week (i hope)
fleet whale
I'm not too worried about it atm, good pieces will come with time
dark crag
Or luck
hazy iron
whats infinite stars? A Corruption effect?
toxic timber
woa, thats awesome. How its proccing? While Multidotting?
next solar
thats pure ST
toxic timber
Thats huge 😮
so, its random that u got that Infinite Star procc?
on that item ur wearing?
real bay
seems balanced
drifting cosmos
sacred hatch
with one Shrouded Suffocation when do I use guardian during my opening?
jagged yoke
is blood of the enemy rank 1 better than azerite beam rank 3?
viscid onyx
No
rigid meteor
I don't think so
viscid onyx
Bote r3
jagged yoke
how are the new essences looking for assassination?
rigid mango
Aight.
loud mason
rigid mango
Dunno yet.
Like I said in the pins, when we know for certain I'll be posting and pinning about it
(:)
slow mountain
did clf really drop me 1.8k dps with the nerf
rigid mango
slow mountain
yet it still sims the highest feels bad
mighty elm
Guess I’m already 470 ilv
rigid mango
Blaster
mighty elm
rigid mango
mighty elm
Haven’t seen a single fight yet, but is this a SS tier for assa?
royal lantern
i somewhat doubt it cus you dont take a sin rogue for aoe, you take them for st
rigid mango
I can see SS being decent some places but
Honestly if u play sin ur just gonna mongo boss hump
as per usual
mighty elm
no fight where it lines up like it did on grong 
?
rigid mango
Eh, you have drest where you hav ea 30s burst window every 2 min
Which is like SS' prime
mighty elm
cobalt pelican
don't think there's anything where it's quite that well lined up
frail current
Is assa still best for upcoming Raid ?
faint harness
Its anyones guess really
rigid mango
Outlaw's in an awkward spot imo
I see sin being atleast good everywhere, and unless you can have a huge comp and swap out everything at a whim you're fine
faint harness
There are some aoe fights where it might shine, but I'm not too invested in tactics yet
green tide
Also comes down to if your raid even needs more cleave too
rigid mango
Yeah well that's what I meant by big comp.
If you can get a good comp with the right amount of cleave, sin'll shine as per usual
Outlaw is the strongest in that weird middle ground where you aren't fully optimised but you still want the mix
strange python
leeching posion or cheat death for visions?
rustic light
hi all not sure if i'm missing something, but the new azerite armors i dont see any echoing blades traits does that hurt aoe dmg a lot for m+?
toxic timber
yes, so u have to go for shrouded suffication traits
rigid mango
Yes. Bis'll all be from m+.
faint harness
were there any echoing blades on EP azerite?
ruby ruin
i thougth titanforging was removed with this patch ? O.o
shrewd night
afaik not removed, just capped
rustic light
wonder if our m+ dmg will still be decent without echoing blade tho 😮
rigid mango
you do realise m+ azerite is still a thing, right?
ruby ruin
well, so far i have only recieved titanforged gear and no corrupted gear
rigid mango
Seems like more of a wow gen issue
rustic light
what do you mean by that zine?
shrewd night
Thats because.. uuuh, corrupted gear is limited this week?
rigid mango
That you can get azerite from m+?
shrewd night
rigid mango
In your weekly chest, you get residuum and buy pieces from m+?
rustic light
oh there will be new armors with eb from that vendor?
rigid mango
There's 2, but still
2 new ones, but still we're gonna get the items from there
just like 8.2
rustic light
oh ok gotcha they just update the ilvl then?
rustic light
ah ok ty
rigid mango
They made the raid azerite raid relevant
rustic light
i see i see :3
calm tangle
This week is still season 3 in regards to m+ rewards afaik. So no corrupted stuff to be obtained there until HC raid opens and s4 starts
heavy haven
Ye and next reset u want to farm which lvl? 5s right?
faint harness
i mean what do you mean by raid relevant
echoing blades could have some relevance on some bosses
if you go full aoe pad
warm parcel
Yea cause that has historically been relevant 0 times
faint harness
I think its unfair towards all the padders
shrewd night
Boi cant wait to have that discussion with my RL
bruh i know its prog and shit, but pls give me padlogs first week kthx
rigid mango
It's annoying but the same this tier
I'm just hoping the meta changes more than anything.
faint harness
I had false hope in a bleed spec doing something
rigid mango
Huh.
faint harness
What kind of meta did you mean
storm lodge
some of the corruption is aoe friendly right
rigid mango
When you can full CP fok into env it's quite potent
faint harness
theres 1 really good corruption affix for aoe
rigid mango
But this season the pulls aren't big enough
storm lodge
echoing void?
storm lodge
or that devastation thingy?
rigid mango
OVer the weekend
faint harness
the nerf
rigid mango
It splits the damage onto everything
storm lodge
oh...nerfed to split damage?
faint harness
Bleuh
storm lodge
yeah..i saw that a couple of days ago
faint harness
true
I dont think hero damage sims take the nerfs to echoing void into account yet
rigid mango
idk ev's still probably really good
I havn't looked deep enough into shit since there's still colossaly broken shit
mighty elm
Is azure thingy boots bis?
rigid mango
hm?
mighty elm
Guess I’m getting carried while at work
rigid mango
Gonna get nerfed for sure
mighty elm
faint harness
will it tho
thats what everyone said about benthic armor too
what if blizzard is finally realizing that if everything is broken, nothing is
rigid mango
Yeah but it doing 25k worth of dps
faint harness
every class/spec can use infinite stars
rigid mango
Everything isn't
that's the thing
It's 1 trait
have fun rng'ing it
100% getting nerfed
or you'll bring affixes> meta classes
faint harness
I wish they would balance around making these trait stuff broken
instead of mediocre and boring
should be poggers to get something good
and not, oh nice a 0.5% dps upgrade
quartz rune
What? They also said benthic with sockets were a fuckup
I mean the Corruptions are pretty big
faint harness
sockets yes, talking about the effects
faint harness
almost everyone was sure they would nerf the dmg from the effects
mighty elm
rigid mango
mmhm
minor thicket
hey guys so I got many of my factions 19,999/10,000 for paragon chest. can someone explain why I dont hand them all in at once?
minor thicket
thanks - whens that post for the essences?
rigid mango
shrewd night
Its a topic for wow-general. Continuing the discussion here is just full on 4head
rigid mango
buoyant kraken
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/ujE2XvcRC82SHNioN7bhTr i guess infinite stars is decent lol
obsidian bison
buoyant kraken
Guess it will be nerfed before wednesday
no way this goes live
or atleast goes into raidweek
shrewd night
World vein 
strange python
its bis for me now
faint harness
at least its not lucid major 🤢
shy axle
So most people switched away from the raidessence because of the nerf? Whats best for you now? I am simming best with bote so ar
far
shut garnet
it’s the first day of the patch
there havent even been 24hrs of ppl playing yet, no one has a clue what’ll be most optimal
rigid mango
idk yet broski we'll see how shit pans out with more corruption and gear 😉
shy axle
not about whats optimal, just what you are using atm
shut garnet
anything, no one is running anything “competitive” until raid releases
just run w.e and get visions done
arctic socket
Visions shouldn’t be that difficult for you.. the first few are cake walks. If you need healing run flame. But just run the norm set up Essences (Raid setup worked fine for me)
stable nest
how many visions are we supposed to to this week?
keep getting the "reconstructing the curse of stone" after every one
untold mortar
6
rigid meteor
is it better to go with the ST traits for doing the new content?
arctic socket
I ran 1Eb with rest ST traits and was pretty easy/fast
stable nest
and we're supposed to just run and kill thrall everytime?
arctic socket
More or less yeah
stable nest
alright
brave vector
If you're afraid of failing you can just go straight for thrall to guarantee you get cloak 4, but you should be able to clear AT LEAST 1 corrupted area once you get your orb if you want to be efficient
stable nest
what more do you get from clearing 1more area?
rigid mango
Broskis defo wow gen and it's been talked about about a thousand times so far
just use ctrl f
open wolf
warm parcel
Ask again in 2 weeks
shut garnet
we’ll know when we can play the raid^^^^
viscid onyx
Where do u guys get the corrupted items from? Vision of ogrimmar ?
gusty mirage
I got mine from the assault caches that you get for completing them
hollow stone
Botd esssence seems like it could be fun. Sin with a useable execute? Hollllla
gusty mirage
I played around with it on PTR, if you can maximize its usage (use it when a mob is over 80%, and execute it) it's a significant amount of damage. It could be a huge ST buff for sin in M+
hollow stone
Did you do any shenanigans on ptr w the raid essence? Im not sold on it. It sounds like it’d be janky in general
gusty mirage
unfortunately no 😦 I just messed around with stuff I'd use in m+ because I don't do mythic prog
hollow stone
It could be neat for m+ if you n the homies plan out all your essences. Could have x for trash and y for st
I just dont really know if its worth it. The minor sounds ok too
All feelycraft for me atm
Havent done shiiii
Thoughts on 3rd minor at 75? Was currently thinking cof but botd may push it out. I guess theyre basically the same as minors so itd just be what sims higher
hazy geyser
botd? do you mean blood of the enemy?
hazy geyser
ah
gusty mirage
at the risk of this becoming too #wow-general I think we'll be forced to use more of the new essences for corruption resistence @hollow stone
hollow stone
Yea. True. And then make up the dps w corrupted items
hazy geyser
but the thing with conflict is that the extra vers will be really nice for essence and azerite and just dps in general
hollow stone
Although, with current state, why even use corrupted gear that isnt infinite stars 😬
hazy geyser
but that crazy damage below 20% might make it really good in raids not sure about m+
hollow stone
Yea. I have a feeling it will get some niche usage as a major for us
hazy geyser
maybe even in a crazy world it could be good as major a fuckload of damage on above 80 and below 20 is nice
gusty mirage
if you can chain execute on trash and go into the boss fight with the buff consistently in m+ it has a chance to be really good. The minor is a nice passive buff to ST as well, honestly just use the downtime this week in m+ to mess around with it a bit 🙂
hollow stone
Yea for sure, i like the play week for testing shit out
Been outa the m+ game for a while as sin. Folks still using ttk or just all in on ss eb?
gusty mirage
ideally you'd want 3x EB and 3x SS
but fitting in 1 TTK for either trait is fine
esp for tyran weeks
unborn rampart
i believe you can only benefit from the corruption resist from 1 corruption resist essence at a time -- so there won't be a situation where you stack all the new essences to get +30 corr resist -- you can only get +10 from essences
static acorn
I haven’t been able to get around to doing the 8.3 stuff and getting the cape/wrists/etc. but my guild is suggesting making everyone use the 440 wrists. Do they sim well for us when compared to, say, socketed 440s with similar secondary stats?
hollow stone
The wrists i got (idk if everyone gets the same) were ~+600 sim dps over socketed benthic bracers. So they probably arent better, or at least not much better, than 440 socketed w “bis” secondaries
Idk if they all roll the same corruption tho, that may change the math
hollow junco
i have [uncorrupted] 440 socketed crit/vers bracers. They are about 189 dps worse in a sim vs 440 corrupted bracers with no socket.
hollow stone
Based on his evidence n mine, seems unlikely that they would be “required”
cold patio
my corrupted bracers simming ~189dps less than my uncorrupted 445 socket
got Void Ritual on them
hollow junco
your uncorrupted bracers are probably better itemized than mine, which are crit/vers
cold patio
crit/mst
hollow junco
also, secondary weights vary. in general void ritual corruption seems to be a A Good Thing that isn't too far ahead of or behind the value of a socket. simyoself always applies.
static acorn
Followup: Does stuff like raidbots have an option like it has for worldvein and loyal to the end all that to toggle how many people have the corrupted thing on?
If it is the same piece my guildies were sending, it scales w/ more people using it
gusty mirage
I don't think raidbots has the corruption stuff implemented yet
buoyant kraken
Has anyone simmed vulpera?
static acorn
I knew it said initial support was live and just might have bugs, wasn’t sure if they had corruption support at all
gusty mirage
I'll check for you right now @static acorn 🙂
so SimCraft has a lot of the corruption stuff in beta right now (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vSGcEJgomgZLu6H8W6PLor6XfUP5C-Orz--UGOrT4ejj2pKRKJsE7jAakifsogZHHzn9rnKXBaICdEs/pubhtml# has their to do list) , but there aren't any options for adjusting anything on raidbots right now
static acorn
Thanks! Been way too busy to get around to doing any simming or 8.3 stuff, but if my guild is gonna try pushing to force people to run the bracers, i’d rather know if it’s worth it.
Seems that if sims currently can’t exactly say how good it’ll be, might be worth trying out everyone using it to see if it’s worthwhile but don’t make it a hard-set rule yet.
Thanks so much tho!
meager yacht
Hello, returning Sin rogue for 8.3 with a lot of catching up to do. Can anyone push me in the right direction for essences for raiding only? Thanks a lot.
gusty mirage
@meager yacht no one really knows for sure what'll actually be the best raiding essences just yet it's mostly just sims on HeroDamage and sims that are in beta. We'll know more by the time mythic nyalotha is out
meager yacht
@gusty mirage yeah I figured.... gonna be hard for me to catch up then with essences without really knowing what to aim for, and from the looks of it, some are a huge grind, aka BotE
spring topaz
I got some boots that were 35 corrupted with 1275haste procc 30%+ uptime. 1600 dps upgrade from 440 with socket
languid ore
No sims up yet right
cobalt pelican
sims are up and you can sim your own character on raidbots
noble temple
so what bis raid essences atm ? i just got back to wow after 2 months break
rigid mango
People with good luck?
wide badge
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
wide badge
did ur WAs got fucked too?
unkempt solstice
at low level, is master poisoner better then elaborate planning?
rigid mango
At low level that choice is irrelevant
serene surge
Which trait & talent setup for this week m+?
rigid mango
@hoary patrol
hoary patrol
Kay
alpine rain
!weakaura
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
alpine rain
Lost all my weakauras thanks blizz 😦
rigid mango
Welcome to a new patch.
strange python
so my raidlead wants us to fill out a bis spreadsheet and im kinda lost what to choose from the new raid how can i find out what bis is for assa?
drifting cloud
bis lists dont exist
ashen solar
Try using the droptimizer to see what is best for you
strange python
ok thanks
edgy pawn
do you think its worth using deeper strategem at zaqzul if youre going delirium?
no real way to sim that 😦
versed mica
it might be, but it depends how long you're in deli
unkempt solstice
does he want ham, or baloneey?
strange python
are there any sims out yet for vulpera?
true fulcrum
!Essence
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
woven pine
anybody tried 2 bonus chesting after the first cloak upgrade?
rotund pier
I don’t think it’s worth messing around until rank 5 from what I read, but idk, didn’t try
obtuse sleet
I've only gone for one bonus chest.
woven pine
right path or left? i've got 3 orbs so i should be alright I'm just trying to be efficient without risking it
untold mortar
i did 2 times 2 bonus chest easily
first left the easy one then right the easy one
obtuse sleet
I went right path to Garona and did not think it was that bad.
woven pine
cheers 🙂
spice nymph
We talking about soloing them right
rotund pier
What do you get from the bonus?
obtuse sleet
More mementos and sparks of unwavering strength.
brave vector
Should move this to #wow-general
green tide
Sorry zine 😭
rigid mango
worldly condor
what are the best 4 essences to be running for first week of the new raid?
drifting cloud
we dont know
plain thistle
has anyone tested vulpera bag of tricks? want to know if the dps racial is any good before I race change 😛
gusty mirage
I'll copy and paste my message from earlier today 😛
civic palm
They will all be balanced, as normal.
gusty mirage
"no one really knows for sure what'll actually be the best raiding essences just yet it's mostly just sims on HeroDamage and sims that are in beta. We'll know more by the time mythic nyalotha is out"
plain thistle
🙂
civic palm
👋
strange python
nah i havent noticed anything wrong with it ive been running it with a group of my buddies and i get over 6k agility when i popp it
right now it seems busted as fuck imo
thats with just 3 people running it cant wait to see how it gets with a whole party
My biggest question is how much will the overwhelming power rework affect us picking traits. Is the haste proc so valuable that the fact that it procs less often going to change whether or not we trip stack it?
wide hedge
someone already simmed vulpera? is the race any good dps wise?
near coyote
What major essence is everyone running condense still?
I know protocol for certain bosses but still
shut garnet
outer hatch
Vulpera simmed ~450dps less for me than my current belf. That is assuming they are functioning and I didn't do something stupid.
wooden cave
On bloodmallet it is really looking like some kind of stack haste build is gonna be the new meta.
rigid mango
wooden cave
Galecallers + Worldvein seems really strong. Probably because of that 6x stats and + 80% duration buff. (both 1m cds)
shy dust
Or more than likely Gale is strong because it makes infinite stars procs more
Which is what blood mallet is using
wooden cave
True, stars sim DPS went like 6k up.
ashen solar
bruh
even though the sims are reliable, you cant rely on stat weights
they differ too much
crimson salmon
Is the stat difference good enough to pay for a race change from worgen to belf?
Since there is a 30% discount right now
vast forum
anything is worth racechanging away from worgen
any reason you can think of is good enough
crimson salmon
Lol ok then
wooden cave
Emiri, while that may be, was merely stating that checking it the next couple of weeks might be a good idea
rigid mango
I'd rather be checking sims instead of bloodmallet 😉
dusky tinsel
guildy was saying WV is still bugged? anyone confirm this?
silent raven
it prob is , they never fixed it properly
faint harness
@senkei dont think vulpera is implemented yet
near coyote
What major essence have you guys been using the most this patch so far
faint harness
Races impact on dps is minimal either way, play whatever suits you
Just running aoe essences for visions
Soo.. beam
near coyote
Protocol has been nutty sometimes but ya I might go back to beam
frosty burrow
People are saying that breath of the dying is bugged rn where r1 has the effects of r3 is that true?
near coyote
Didn't seem like it for mine
frosty burrow
I think major, I’m not sure how reliable the info is which is why I asked
stable isle
Might on zuljin had 3 rogues run major in their reclear last night. uptime looks pretty decent
atleast on azshara
didnt check other fights
oh my bad you're talking about breath of the dying now, thought conversation was still about worldvein
faint harness
We played wv during our first nights on Azshara way back. But found that its extremely inconsistent
Had like 10 players with wv and still dropped down to 1 stack at times
Shifty essence
candid ermine
!essence
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
mild obsidian
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/vQRCe9jPyUC6TcZCXToe1H
Crucible still my highest simming major
release me from this pain
rigid mango
Play the game, that'll probs help.
steel summit
Infinite stars hotfixed?
azure coral
why galecallers sims so high?
civic palm
It always has. SIMs atm are all speculative.
prisma roost
Not mine, CLF still sims a lot higher than everything else
fair relic
what's better for m+, crit > mastery or crit > vers? just curious because i have seen a rogue or 2 stacking vers
minor thicket
You playing Sin for m+?
You want crit and mastery
Low haste
Just SIM your dude
But haste around 12-15%
At most
placid kraken
Just coming back to the game since BOD raid. Where is Sin sitting in the M+ and Raids?
strange python
Noone really knows yet, balancing isn't done and it'll depend a lot on corruption tuning
but from the looks of things we'll be good in both
crimson salmon
best race for alliance rogue-human?
fleet whale
depends on what you want to do. Nelves are great in M+
strange python
Yeah nightelf is by far the best if you want to run m+, not only because shadowmeld can be used for skips and to dodge certain mechanics, but you can re-stealth mid-combat(not on bosses) to get more SS garrotes out
fleet whale
And honestly they are fine for raiding too
crimson salmon
thanks!
red tinsel
Is Sin still one of the slowest specs in the game? APM-wise
strange python
yep
toxic timber
hey guys, i have one question. Maybe someone ist playing this:
I got a 445 Galecallers Boon and a 445 Razer Coral. How is this playing togehter? First Galecallers, than stacking coral up after 20 sec soft CD?
I also got an 435 Incpod and a 455 Harlans loaded dice.
Thanks 4 help
arctic walrus
sim it. but I'd probably drop the gale for dice
shrewd perch
Anyone knows what azerite traits we play. Bloodmallet confuses me. Still 3 double dose ?
drifting cloud
azerite has 3 traits, we will play the ones whose 3 sum sims the highest
real star
what major essence are we going for guys? Still clf after the nerfs?
strange python
guys any way for dont overcap CP in toxic blade? https://imgur.com/nN3fSrP
buoyant coyote
Hm
quasi pewter
doesnt matter
green tide
That's what I was thinking. Missing 2 out of 4 cp is pretty good. Even if it's not perfect, I'd rather miss 1 cp because I tbd then envenomed instead of envenom into tb to get the cp
strange python
oh... ok 🙂
Another question, when the vendetta is about to come back around 10 seconds of cd, I start holding the toxic blade cd, is that right?
quasi pewter
dont hold tb
heavy haven
What? Not even for vendetta??
quasi pewter
other way around
heavy haven
So hold vendetta for tb > hold tb for vendetta if its about idk some secs only
shrewd night
The point being, holding vendetta wont likely cost you another use of vendetta because of its long cd. But holding TB will cost you a TB or two in the long run.
quasi pewter
you only have to hold a few seoncds since tb cd is so short
cobalt pelican
5 seconds of tb cd is like 20% of its entire cd
heavy haven
Mh seems reasonable
heavy haven
Actually true
quasi pewter
by the time vendetta is rdy tb cd is 15 sec
so you hold 4 seconds
use vendetta
after 11 sec use tb
and u get full tb in vendetta
strange python
thx for help guys!! 🙂
marble hemlock
You'd rather use tb at the start of vendetta though to get the extra 60 energy in your tb :p
That's why delaying vendetta is usually the correct play
storm lodge
for sin does it matter if the force multiplier enchant is on the mainhand wep or offhand?
rigid mango
Nope
storm lodge
ah kk..reason i asked is my mh dagger will be my off hand wep for outlawe
quasi pewter
39 is default because at 40 it becomes alot more annoying
use as much as ur comfortable with
winter gale
Ok
One more...Will this cloak be viable for Dungeons and PvP too?
If so I can sell other cloaks, thats why 😄
quasi pewter
it gives you corruption resistance and ur gonna be using that gear in dungeons too
also its very high ilvl so
unless you have no corrupted gear and have a very high ilvl socket cloak, ur gonna be using that cloak everywhere
winter gale
Ty m8
strange python
anyone know if some of the mobs in visions are abberations? thinking about rocking purification protocol minor
shrewd night
Arent all of them?
strange python
they are? dont know didnt pay attention:(
steady owl
Is it true what people have said that none of the raid drops are good for assa in m+? I want to play outlaw in m+ but assa in the raid and gearing for that is more important and I’m not sure what to set my loot spec to. Will I get all the gear I need for assa in the raid and can I then set the loot spec for outlaw in m+ without loosing out on important assa gear?
Actually I can see myself that not a single piece of the gear from the raid has an eb trait
cobalt pelican
you can basically gear outlaw in m+ alone, and i doubt assassination will use any of the m+ drops in the trinket slots in raid
you might want to initially do m+ in assassination loot spec till you at least have baseline 465 daggers though
steady owl
I think I’ll do that I got two 445 folly anyway. I actually much prefer the assa play style, I’m just tired of being reliant on the tank letting me restealth to do damage and being asked to do things I can’t do as assa in pugs
bronze kelp
if you got a chainpulling tank, just take less SS traits
rigid meteor
for the visions and open world content is worth taking leech poison and/or master Poisoner
mighty elm
can we make macro for the vision exrta button?
royal lantern
ye, take leeching if you want too pull big
buoyant kraken
Has anyone gotten the Echoing Void corruption and tried it? How does it do, i got the infinite stars, but as we all know that will be nerfed soon.
royal lantern
our dh had rank1 echoing for orgo
was ~32% of his dmg
did a good chunck more then the outlaw
lone junco
@mighty elm you can pull the visions extra button off and set it to a key. I just do that to get it out of the way.
shrewd night
Macro
frozen karma
!help
royal lantern
what do you need...?
bronze kelp
so can EP items corrupt now ?
bronze kelp
okay
shut garnet
bronze kelp
so you only can get corrupted items from visions so far ?
shut garnet
corruption is exclusive to nyalotha + whatever other random drops during this patch
so pvp, m+, quests that offer items, literally whatever
no because horrific visions dont give you any items
distant mist
Horrific visions can give you loot
bronze kelp
those gave a cache when completing
shut garnet
this is a spec channel :p
bronze kelp
yes sorry
crude topaz
Hi All,
Newish Rogue main here...
BoTE is sims best for me atm. Should i always line this up with Vendetta, or in M+/Visons etc just use on CD?
jagged elk
M+ AoE Openers
With Crimson Tempest talented
G1 G2 G3 CT FoK R1 BotE 5xFoK
Without Crimson Tempest
G1 G2 G3 R1 FoK Env BotE 5xFoK
@marble hemlock
for boss fights of course line it up with vendetta
marble hemlock
jagged elk
sry, wanted to mention your quote 😄
crude topaz
Awesome, saving this... Thank you!
brisk frost
Have you guys found out good way to deal with a Thing From Beyond? Blind macro didnt seem to work for me, got any good ideas?
ashen solar
errr
rigid meteor
What is the meaning of BotE?
ashen solar
Would using your blind on it be a sound strategy anyways outside of raiding
Blood of the enemy
!abbreviations
prisma monolithBOT
Rogue abbreviations: http://www.ravenholdt.net/rogue-abbreviations/
ashen solar
^if you need help with abbreviations
rigid meteor
thank you
ashen solar
Np
brisk frost
mainly wondering ways to deal with it on raids
rigid meteor
so with CT we don't use envenom?
ashen solar
We do use envenom, just depends on the number of targets
It's just that in the opener we dont
rigid mango
CT works like a bleed
rigid meteor
but I think it doesn't regen energy
rigid meteor
so after opener I put R to all target and spam FoK
ashen solar
Pandemic is 2 seconds if you're wondering
rigid meteor
thank you @ashen solar just trying to improve my aoe damage
ashen solar
Uh idr the exact number of targets where you just spam fok. I'm not too much of a pver when it comes to rogue lmao
rigid meteor
With the EB trait I do it if there are 2+ targets, without them on 3+
rigid mango
You use fok as builder at 2+~
rigid meteor
and keep R up, but do you do it in all targets in pulls over 5 mobs?
ashen solar
4 bleeds up at a time
Either empowered garrotes + rupture or ruptures
4 bleeds is where energy gain breaks even with usage
floral shoal
Bloodmallet has Shrouded Suffocation very worthless, is tthat right and what changed to make it so?
ashen solar
Are you using it on ST
modest tendon
Best dagger in new raid?
ashen solar
Rather, are you looking at the sims for ST
rigid meteor
but Garrote does give energy back? 
ashen solar
yes
rigid meteor
so 4 bleeds up and then envenom or CT if remains 2 secs or less
marble hemlock
CT pandemic is 3.6 at 5 CP
strange python
if you use plater I can link a script that makes rupture/CT glow when in pandemic range to remind you of refreshing @rigid meteor
heavy haven
Can u add the script to a imported profile? Since im using fraggy plater dont want to rip it
rigid meteor
that's awsome, thank man
polar zephyr
anybody have an explaination for why i get taken out of stealth randomly during my horrific visions?
heavy haven
Thanks dude
white wyvern
Mobs were seeing me through stealth. Likely just that way so Rogues can't skip all the trash.
rough creek
yeah, I was randomly dropping stealth too. likely a bug or they forgot to mark stealth seeing mobs
spark sky
I've been getting unstealthed in the very beginning area but haven't noticed that happening in the other areas
tropic ocean
same here
think its related to not being able to shroud skip stuff or w/e
was our estimation
pretty shitty for sin tho
surreal solar
The beginning area acts just like chromie for me, can’t stay stealthed for the first 5seconds or so, but I usually mount and rush to where I’m going anyways
gusty mirage
Once you get a higher cloak start clearing some trash because they add to the memento total 🙂
at rank 5 cloak I was able to comfortably clear a lot of that trash and do 2 extra areas
shut garnet
it’s just that they have higher stealth detection radius im pretty sure
arctic walrus
Clear 2 areas at rank 2 
tropic ocean
@shut garnet idk i get suddenly unstealthed w/o being infight with anything
its weird
shut garnet
idk try seeing whether any mobs rush at you before you come out of stealth
tropic ocean
I thought it was related to that aoe blood stuff u have but its not unless u actually hit mobs with it
shut garnet
if its actually just spontaneous “im outta stealth” then yeah might be bugged ON TOP of mobs having higher detection radius
sharp dust
how much % haste need for raiding?
gusty mirage
whatever the sim says
sharp dust
ye i try every si but actually my gear is 16% haste 36% mastery 28% crit :X
strange python
those stats sound reasonable, so what's the problem?
sharp dust
slow envenom spamming
strange python
??
strange python
we're not fury warriors
shut garnet
if you could show some logs we can see where you're going wrong maybe?
strange python
low apm doesn't mean low dps
arctic walrus
If you think you’re playing bad you can link logs here
arctic walrus
Saying “slow spamming” for the lowest apm spec gets you nowhere
topaz vine
this might be kinda silly.. but i've lost 1500 dps since the patch.. i dont really understand why.. i've tried using the exact same gear.. also the bentic for the old raid.. have condensed been nerfed that much? does it explain it? also I changed to fox from blood elf.. not that that so make that big of a change.. xD or is it just that the azerite gear traits things have changed a lot..
cobalt pelican
i lost like 3k off my sim
topaz vine
well xD
hmm.. but nothing else sims higher for me.. at the moment
cobalt pelican
and vulpera is ~300 behind belf
arctic walrus
@rigid mango know if mechagnome is implemented correctly in sims?
rigid mango
No clue
topaz vine
it sim 600 lower for me tho..
cobalt pelican
mechagnome should be in, it's just a passive bleed right?
topaz vine
what if i dont have any allies.. i raid alone ;P
shut garnet
you one man raid?
cobalt pelican
it got 'initial implementation', vulpera needs to be added to class apls to be used
shut garnet
xd
cobalt pelican
but if it's just the passive nanoslicer bleed or w/e it should work fine
tropic ocean
like even with only little amount of people using it
uptime is insane
by the time more ppl use it in raid its pretty much 100% 4 stacks
cobalt pelican
what were your stacks like
topaz vine
yes its very hard... i dont get past trash xD
no i see.. makes more sense to me now..
cobalt pelican
like can you link it if it's your raid
cobalt pelican
ah yeah
shut garnet
but if you "solo raid" as in, you pug a lot
topaz vine
no no im kidding.. i'll put more allies in.. not sure how many in my guild who actually use it tho
tropic ocean
well you can make them aware of using it
its very strong on most dps
at least for now, maybe stuff will change when u get other essences rank 3 or they get tuned
idk
topaz vine
yeah ty ^^ It should make my sim a little better.. just don't like going down in dps 😆
cobalt pelican
only 182 dps difference between op and unstable flames on muh helmet now
very sad
shut garnet
so op still outsims?
strange python
just wait until next week and we'll start flying @topaz vine
cobalt pelican
unstable flames at least in my case yes
i don't really have tons of gear to sim
does anyone know how void ritual is treated in simc by default
outer lotus
What bleed? Mechagnome racial is stacking main stat
cobalt pelican
is it not nanoslicer
or whatever
i honestly don't know what it does i don't play alliance anymore and never read it
outer lotus
No thats a dungeon ability
outer lotus
It stacks up main stat while in combat
cobalt pelican
it was the broken racial on ptr at least i rmmbr that, if it changed idk
outer lotus
And you can summon mirror images, dont know if they do damage though
neat remnant
No, the images don't do a bleed. They are actually terrible. They do about 5k damage lol. I changed to mechagnome. The combat analysis is pretty good though, so is failsafe
torn bear
Just use your M+ build do mass pulls win
fallen geode
Prob been asked a ton but I don’t. Have bote what should I use for essences in m+
arctic walrus
3eb 3 sob 
buoyant olive
what about talents , hidden blades or CT
buoyant olive
thanks
severe sedge
any essence changes with the new rank 1s? (for raiding)
minor thicket
@rigid mango will post a message on essences and what we should be using for main etc once it’s settled and more clear
According to him anyway
rigid mango
severe sedge
sims said that my normal combo is best
rigid mango
When I know, everyone'll know
severe sedge
but who knows
frozen karma
!essence
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
arctic walrus
Oh no no
severe sedge
worldvein looking good on loggs from 8.3
rigid mango
It do.
Comes down to encounter, comes down to scaling
A lot that we don't know yet
Hence why my post isn't pinned and ready for everyone to glare at, and there's no shining winner.
We'll see what will be used for prog.
hollow stone
👋 @rigid mango congo rats on being in the big leagues now (sry this isnt sin specific) ❤️
rigid mango
night vale
Is it not something to do with their attacks doing shadow dmg? Not at computer so can’t check?
outer hatch
What is Folly in relation to sin? Only thing that pops to mind is the axe.
tacit pebble
it is the axe, the idea being you dont use any of your dagger abilities in islands aoe
so weapon type doesn't matter
I think using axes only blocks mut and envenom
outer hatch
Gotcha, thanks! Thought I was missing something.
ebon roost
Thoughts on Breath of the Dying?
unborn rampart
@fallen geode https://mplus.subcreation.net/assassination-rogue.html for talents/essences etc. for M+
(based on data from the top 828 Assassination Rogue M+ logs from the past 4 weeks, ranging in difficulty from +16 to +24.)
fallen geode
Thank you
twin vortex
@unborn rampart thanks
unborn rampart
yw -- let me know if you have ideas / suggestions for things you'd like to see there :)
twin vortex
its seems that its to go essence from wlogs
mental obsidian
i guess use it with every vendetta and then TB
gonna check logs
everyone using it as minor on logs
twin vortex
checking 8.3?
mental obsidian
no
sacred hatch
Goblin vs vulpera?
rigid mango
Irrelevant?
sacred hatch
looks
strange python
I know world vein is simming very well, but it is so situational. What alternative should we be using for fights we have to spread out or high movement?
strange python
Thank you. Sometimes I just don't trust my simulations/work. But you are right.
inner sonnet
I used evasion fine with 15 mobs on me earlier in a vision - you must have got an unlucky bug or something 🤨
What major essence are people choosing for visions? I’m basically running my M+ build with beam, beam feels a lot better without a tank
rigid mango
blood
Just playing standard m+ build pulling everything onto bosses and mowing everything down with bote eb and ct
dense axle
I'm doing Purification Protocol, cause theyre all aberrations
high chance to just delete them
rigid mango
It's bad af :^)
Aight as a minor
but we run no heal and I'd rather have vers from strife
strange python
Guys, above how many targets is worth using Crimson instead of env as a finisher?
strange python
for spam, like 6 + target its not viable?
I see in morning stream they spamm in WM with big pull
dense axle
also purification does a 3sec stun on aberrations, which is nice
rigid mango
He uses it as a bleed I hope
to apply to everything
not to spam as damage
Why CC when you can kill 😉
royal shadow
someone know how to use/import?, or what need to make this wa work https://wago.io/b5lQFqr5V
sterile ocean
is raidbots buggy atm?
rigid mango
Why would it be?
arctic walrus
It makes sense if you think about it. Iris buffed your haste which made clf minor proc more often
lusty narwhal
Its not bugged it’ll be changing for quite a while yet
sterile ocean
oooh opk
subtle tundra
anyone know a content creator that did visions on assa? i wanna see how other people do it
sterile ocean
so its not set and stone what it wants us to use
dense axle
just stack 3 vend traits and hit a dummy with it as major. Thats about it
lusty narwhal
I mean use whatever it tells you to atm but you only have 11 dps difference between them and that’s not even worth worrying about
So choose
sterile ocean
oh yeah im not worried i was confused XD
lusty narwhal
Yeah clf still sims highest for me but its different for a number of people
sterile ocean
ah ok
rigid mango
VoP sucks ass 😉
sterile ocean
now its telling me iris again 😂 i simmed it i was curious
lone mirage
Hi guys , im running again my rogue in raid, can u give me an idea of crit % you run with ?
rigid mango
Whatever sims best
river zinc
corruption seems to be another RNG thing lol
lone mirage
Yes but lots of my crits come from gem crits and its blasting for m+
rigid mango
Really? I think you're the first.
lone mirage
So i dont want to change them :(
lone mirage
Yes i was not rly asking for an issue but just wanted to see other rogue stuff
lethal heart
btw idk if was mentioned
but racing flags dont work anymore
cant shadowstep on them anymore
lethal heart
@rigid mango says invalid target when i try my usual stuff
so im guessing good times are over 🙂
rigid mango
Fucking dumb shit that innit
lethal heart
unlucky
severe sedge
are there more assa or outlaw fights in nya?
look like there are some crazy outlaw fights, but also alot of singletarget stuff
rigid mango
fleet whale
Depends on raid comp, even in cleave fights, it might be better to go assassin if your raid already has enough cleave
severe sedge
alot of cleave looks spread out
lethal heart
since it guarantees certain traits now
teal scaffold
What are the go to essences for 8.3? For assassination
fleet whale
seems to vary
teal scaffold
Any majors to focus on ranking up?
lusty narwhal
Lucid
fleet whale
BoTE, worldvein, CLF
and eventually breath of the dying... mainly for the minor though
sinful palm
bote as major?
lofty onyx
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
fleet whale
it's not that much worse than CLF in ST, and it's great in M+
covert belfry
do you wait for energy before using toxic blade?
civic palm
So long you can get 2+ Envenoms inside the Toxic Blade window you're all good.
(lucky crits might allow more)
lofty onyx
any of the wa working stil? Devlins seems to have dropped the combo points since wa update
civic palm
Was using mine last night seemed totally fine.
cobalt pelican
don't think any weakauras actually like