It’s biggg
#assassination
tropic ocean
You can use inkpod if orgozoa too, it will differ your playstyle a little bit but can have really good results
wanton mortar
Hey fellow rogues! What are your go to essences on PVP? I started the pvp grinding and would like some help. For 2v2 mostly.
wanton mortar
Wops, right!
strange python
!font
dark crag
!coral
prisma monolithBOT
The way to use coral in M+ is using it on your priority target,
and then whenever that target dies, reapply it to your next target.
Whenever your target dies it gives you the crit it would give from using it,
so consuming the stacks for crit mid pack is generally suboptimal.
arctic walrus
Font blurb is in #tc-updates
versed bobcat
Boys, any of the new essences interesting? And, do I need to farm CLF yet? Wanna play assa again next tier. Thanks for your tips or ideas
arctic walrus
New Essence might be good, might not 
You can’t really farm clf but you should just get it anyway. Do the raid on heroic/mythic and you should be fine
rigid mango
iirc they give corruption ressistance, so odds are they're gonna be wanted either way.
rigid mango
Yeah, I'm expecting them to be potent atleast
versed bobcat
How often do I need 2 do the raid for CLF? Actually maining disc and don't need it yet hehe.
rigid mango
Iirc tisu was saying exec was insane
strange python
!essences
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
rigid mango
How far in the raid are you going
arctic walrus
Do you do mythic
versed bobcat
With my rogue nowhere kinda since we don't raid hc anymore and on M we only doin azhara xd
So I need to to da random heroics
arctic walrus
So you can probably pug mythic radiance then do court/azshara on heroic is the “fastest” way for you
arctic walrus
Uhh idk 
rigid mango
Idk I'm guessing too, too long ago
versed bobcat
Phew. I mean, the other essences are easier to get in 8.3 idk why they don't do that w/ CLF
rigid mango
Meh, because it's easy as is
arctic walrus
Yeah looks like 3 weeks
12 for radiance, 14 for other 2
63 total required
26 per week
versed bobcat
Yea just.. The timegate.. Blizzard please. Haha. There's no way you can start playing with a patch and play competitive. That's not how it's supposed to be
rigid mango
I mean you've got what
another month and a half atleast
until the patch actually arrives
versed bobcat
Allrite. I'll start farming I guess. I know I will be sad when not needing it in January haha
Can't see TEP anymore
Cba
Is there a list of the new essences somewhere like the !essence thing?
arctic walrus
Try looking around wowhead
tame plover
so i am 8/8 heroic now and want to start really sincerely pushing mythic, right
but my dps is actual dogshit
even my sims are only like barely 40k, and thats patchwerk
so real movement fights like sivara i perform really poorly, anyone have any clue as to what i may be able to do to boost my sim?
arctic walrus
You could actually provide the sim for starters
tame plover
whats the best way to do that? pasting my simc data would kinda spam the chat
tame plover
oh yeah i forgot to switch my neck traits back
rigid mango
iris major
tame plover
lemme rerun it properly
grave delta
Yo CE peeps how bad was font to try to fenagle on azhara 1-10?
tame plover
also is font bis? i thought coral+ink was better
arctic walrus
It’s not hard
grave delta
👍
tame plover
in that case my guild is running heroic tonight so i may be able to yoink a font at 430 to replace my awful inkpod
arctic walrus
Yeah that’s like 1-2k
tame plover
my lucid im working on, but minor power doesnt sim higher until rank 3 unfortunately from the data i saw pasted in the pins here
what second minor should i use? im getting rank 3 life force tonight
tame plover
!essence
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
royal lantern
at specific m+ lvl's outlaw more or less only gets better cus of utility/deffensive vanish usage
rigid mango
Assa is generally really good everywhere
royal lantern
meanwhile sin/sub need too use is for dmg, or they drop pretty hard
but ye, like zine said, sin is good
rigid mango
Outlaw is just the step above in pretty much every scenario, atleast as the first rogue slot
turbid osprey
yo im starting QC prog tonight, worth trying to multidot while learning the fight or just ham one target down?
rigid mango
Move between with step
turbid osprey
only on step cd? ok
royal lantern
ye
rigid mango
Can use sprint when tanks are swapping and they're next to one another
turbid osprey
and the opener? run up to pashmar, open, step to siliv and pop cds?
turbid osprey
ah we're nuking siliv to 35%
royal lantern
but,yeha, start with the other guy, get both bleeds up>step too your main focus and do normal stuff
royal lantern
and then dot up the other boss when step is off cd again etc.....
rigid mango
I mean if you're blasting siliv you should just sit on him
no reason to multidot there
royal lantern
like i said, idk his raid tactic 🤷
turbid osprey
suppose playing for execute for other people more than my own parse
rigid mango
Yah, sit on silivaz' dick
turbid osprey
for now at least 😉
oh can you cloak off the movement decree btw?
or is it only iceblock/bubble?
royal lantern
you cant
royal lantern
its a fight where you can actually use cloak for yourself
tame plover
this might be a dumb question
scratch that, it is one, but im relatively new so /shrug
how do i use master assassin?
can garrote or rupture crit? do i prioritize that to extend bleed durations with vanish/MA with Pandemic?
i dont really understand how crit works in this game
scarlet sequoia
if u crit or not
marble hemlock
Whether you crit or not.
scarlet sequoia
main hand and off hand mutilate can crit
tame plover
oh i seeeeee
so thats why people build crit sometimes
why do some of the top pve rogues gem and enchant haste then? when their crit is only 20ish%?
rigid mango
What sims best
scarlet sequoia
hes in assa gear
rigid mango
yeah nvm
scarlet sequoia
i wouldnt look at that guy tho
rigid mango
saw talents
scarlet sequoia
its not the best idea to look at people in the very top guilds
rigid mango
Still, that's some bad gear
scarlet sequoia
majority of them stop caring after race is over
so they wont have fully optimized gear
tame plover
gotcha
true nexus
also the things they do to maximize very early in the tier sometimes isnt what you do later in the tier
true nexus
yes
afaik
vendetta on shield isnt helpful unless your strategy calls for it
but maybe someone else can chime in
winter widget
so we don't pop vendetta, vanish and guardian of azeroth on pull?
rigid mango
None of it
tranquil marsh
hello guys
we doing azhara progress
whats bis stats for azhara
i have %30 crit
%24 haste
%39 mastery
%3 versa
true nexus
you just toxic blade
rigid mango
Whatever sims best buddy.
true nexus
maybe prepot for the memes
rigid mango
I mean ofc, you always prepot and you tb
tame plover
another random question
is it worth using 5 combo point finishers even when the mutilate to get it to 5 combo points is only for 1 final combo point
arctic walrus
No
tame plover
or 6 for deeper stratagem
tame plover
okay
rigid mango
4 normal, 5 with deeper
scarlet sequoia
not popping every cd on ashvane on pull 
rigid mango
Just cap-1
tame plover
that makes sense
thank you guys for all your help, i didnt start this game until the end of legion and boosted the rogue when i bought legion so i never really learned a lot of basic shit, this is my first raid tier where ive actually raided
i didnt know what a sim or a parse were until maybe a month ago
scarlet sequoia
np
tame plover
so it helps a lot to have random dumb questions answered lmao
tranquil marsh
how to i use simbot settings on azhara
tranquil marsh
okay
tranquil marsh
ohh ty
dull turret
Is Loyal to the end good for sin?
I have either 2 Scent of Blood or 2 Loyal to the End for my rogue 😅... Have to play sin now that 2nd dagger has dropped for me.
edgy pawn
raid yes, m+ no
not sure about the 2nd stack tho
probably still better than scent
but you should always answer those questions with a sim
modest tendon
loyal is potentially good in m+, only with the zaqul helm maybe
tropic ocean
Loyal can be very decent if whole group uses it
Not only for the rogue but for everyone
shadow copper
Guys do we run Prey of the weak on Ashara? Do the 10 % dmg buff work only for rogue who stun it or for whole raid?
worn basin
You can still KS the hulk after binding goes off. It's not super necessary with the nerf to their HP but it helps.
lost grotto
!essence
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
grave elk
Im running subterfuge, would you guys run razorcoral inkpod or razor and font? my inkpod is 445 so i kinda figured to keep it
grave elk
is it? ive only ran coral with inkpod. so i am only familiar with popping coral at 30% boss hp lol
arctic walrus
There’s a bit of a learning curve with the 2 but yeah it’s way better
Sin can’t really stack inkpod like fury or dh, which is why it’s so incredible for em
I think it’s affected by haste isn’t it?
grave elk
oh fuck me. so basically vend then pop coral to just start utilizing it got it
strange python
Which battle pot becomes best next patch?
cobalt pelican
doubt there'll be that much change
it's possible that the gap between unbridled and the other two becomes smaller but it's big enough that nothing will probably overtake it
mild obsidian
Is there some kind of breakpoint or trinket that makes Master Assassin better? It's simming at a 2k dps loss right now
edgy pawn
keep to sub then
mild obsidian
kk
Trinks and weps still suck but hopefully I can get some Double Dose/NP azerite pieces next reset
cobalt pelican
you basically can't play master assassin with any shrouded traits
brave vector
Second NP is beating out third SS?
mild obsidian
But master assassin is statistically better correct?
brave vector
On your shoulders
edgy pawn
for raiding yes
mild obsidian
Oh shit I do have SS on shoulders lemme sim it but it's 100% gonna win
Yeah, 1k dps increase with third SS on shoulders
what trips me up is R3 Crucible just stomping R2 Blood, Iris and Lucid
edgy pawn
blood is only good at r3
r3 beats r2 usually
most essences get a massive upgrade at r3
tawny plank
whats the meta for sin mythic+ azerite traits (or talents)?
edgy pawn
3ss 1eb
and then you take what you need/want out of eb/ttk/bbi
maybe even one np in certain situation
s
rancid spade
why 3ttk on raid seems bad?
arctic walrus
There’s just better things out there? That add up to more damage
tepid tundra
Hey guys have looked at raider I/O and some of the highest rated assassination rogues seem to be talented into hidden blades. Anyone have any idea what that’s about / how you use that talent properly l?
cobalt pelican
you don't really play around it you just play normally
only thing to note is spending your stacks at high stacks on single target
in aoe just press fok normally
tepid tundra
I’m surprised that in high keys that it outdps’s poison bomb? Trash survives long enough that I would have thunk PB procs would outweigh 1x400% fok... and that’s if we managed to get 40 secs between pulls
velvet willow
is there a number of stacks that is most beneficial to use Coral at?
meager nebula
Check the pins for coral usage
velvet willow
It looks like it says just to use it anytime I use Vendetta
cunning needle
so i take it you can just macro it to your vendetta?
velvet willow
Thats what I currently have
meager nebula
Use it with vendetta ye
velvet willow
I was trying to stack it at times, get to like 30 stacks or something dumb and then use it
guess I won't do that anymore lol
cunning needle
and i think i read somewhere that in m+ you just apply it to the target off cooldown and when the target dies it gives you the crit buff automatically?
so you just keep reapplying when your target goes down
arctic walrus
Dicky's pin 
meager nebula
I'll look at redoing it when I get home
arctic walrus
Ye we just don't stack it as high as other specs, so the hit isn't as insane/guaranteed crit doesn't outweigh small windows of crit for vendettas
strange python
!azerite
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Azerite overview: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o
stuck junco
Is there an ideal number of SS + EB traits that I should be going for in m+ or just whatever I can get my hands on?
stuck junco
Thanks so much 🙂
compact carbon
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
hushed maple
Hey ma quities
I have the Behemoth chest and am wondering, if Loyal beats SS when Loyal isnt stacked to max?
distant lava
hushed maple
how can I setup loyal in raidbots?
winter widget
Hello, was wondering if this potion choice is up to date
"For potions you have to choose depending on the situation. Potion of Unbridled Fury is the pick for 1-3 targets. For more targets you want to use a Potion of Empowered Proximity."
It's from ravenholdt guide
distant lava
yes
winter widget
And I guess the one for outlaw is up to date too? This -> "For potions you should use Potion of Unbridled Fury for single target, Superior Battle potion of Agility for 2-3 targets, and Potion of Empowered Proximity for larger target counts"
cobalt pelican
yeah, it's accurate
i don't think all that many people bother carrying all 3 though
and just end up with unbridled/prox
hushed maple
Is there a way to setup details!, so I can practice on Dummies with using Vanish?
So maybe a "start new fight 2sec after exiting fight 1"
Oh and since I do have TTK now, I am wondering if I will only use 5CP Envenoms
rigid mango
Always 4+
hushed maple
damn man....2minute fight and 32.6k DPS :C
I feel like I did way more with 3xDD and 3x NP
Top Gear that bloody boostard says ttk and Loyal are 1k DPS more
royal lantern
we talk about a frking 2min fight lol
loyal gains value over longer fights cus it makes all your dots stronger
and ttk cus you do more envenom cast
vast forum
loyal on a dummy is a big HMMMMM by me tbh
rigid mango
tropic ocean
@royal lantern loyal doesn't gain value based on fight time, it always has the same value
dd gains/loses value with fight time depending on rng (as in balancing out procs), np also loses/gains value depending on fight time, as its tied to a 2min cd so it will will be stronger in a fight that ends shortly after vendetta runs out compared to a fight that ends shortly before you can use vendetta again
🤷
prisma valve
what kind of feelycrafting shit have I walked into
kind eagle
So I downloaded an addon called AzeritePowerWeights and it's telling me that my azerite power choices are not ideal. Can someone a bit more experienced than me look at my sim and see if the addon is correct?
I mostly do M+ and a few raids here and there.
arctic walrus
You can’t sim dungeon slice for assassination correctly. However the traits your running now are the best you’re gonna get with your gear
So yes don’t rely on adding with weights, like pawn or the azerite one. Just sim top gear for single target and for m+ you can bring your Inquiries here, or basically pick ss/eb/ttk etc
kind eagle
i'm assuming ss/eb/ttk equal shrouded suff/echoingblades/twist the knife?
arctic walrus
Correct
Stuff to avoid is double dose, nothing personal, scent of blood, and almost all generic traits
kind eagle
ok so i should change my dd i have selected to ttk.
arctic walrus
It’s just luck, but the pieces dslice picked for you are the best. So yeah if you’re running dd on that helm switch it to the ttk
kind eagle
ok thanks i'll resim as patchwork
arctic walrus
If you patchwork it’s going to be completely different. That’s what is bad about sin azerite
kind eagle
oh really thats interesting....so in general just stick to ss/eb/ttk for what content i play basically.
arctic walrus
You said you mostly do M+ so you play with ss and eb and such
These traits are complete garbage in raids, compared to np and dd. However you can give it a shot, your gear choices are very limited so you don’t have much wiggle room
kind eagle
thats understandable so the azerite traits change based of the content being played i.e raid vs m+
I really appreciate your time and patients. thanks
scarlet sequoia
np
strange python
other than poisons what spells would u guys like to be given back?
arctic walrus
My artifact weapon
round harbor
versed bobcat
Shiv
strange python
Hello guys i need some help maybe u can help me how can I hide my old logs from my old character name on WCL? I remeber there was a option in the Social tab to disable the auto rename/Tranfer Option.
raven burrow
Hey guys
what azerite traits do you prefer for m+ dungeons? I know that SS and EB are really good, right now I got 3x of each but I think about putting some TTK and 1x nothing personal into the mix, is it worth it for trash heavy weeks/dungeons?
strange python
@tropic ocean i wanna that my rogue is set to "auto rename/Tranfer -> disabled
my parses should be shown.
tropic ocean
for trash heavy dungeons/weeks you don't want traits that increase your st dps, but your aoe
@strange python so you want to remove the logs that were created prior to your character rename/transfer?
strange python
yes
strange python
there is a option under Interface-social
i dont know if I have to check it or unchecked it
tropic ocean
in wow?
strange python
tropic ocean
if its disabled wcl will not automatically merge your characters afaik
so when people type in wcl duthar
they will see the logs created under duthar and if they type in orbyboo they'll see logs created under orbyboi
im not sure though, wcl discord might be able to answer it exactly
strange python
yeah thank anyways @tropic ocean i open a ticket to wcl 😄 but i found a topic about that: https://forums.combatlogforums.com/t/activate-auto-rename-transfer/5432
So i need to check the option i guess ?
tropic ocean
so your question was answered 2018? already XD
its not sin related, but yes that option inside of wow makes wcl unable to track ur character or smth
strange python
when its checked? or when its unchecked?
tropic ocean
it needs to be unchecked for wcl to track ur character
fleet thorn
does cyclotronic get buffed by vendetta?
rigid mango
No
fleet thorn
oh i cant read. thanks!
brazen beacon
Do I trust my sim telling me not to run a NP, or do I play follow the leader and stick with a NP Helmet?
scarlet sequoia
considering its about 40 dps difference
its rng a lot
so prolly just go with np
hollow cloak
@scarlet sequoia u guys did change realm?
i was trying looking your logs like yesterday
scarlet sequoia
ye on draenor now
marble hemlock
no more cyaeveryday memes 😦
scarlet sequoia
exactly
🤡
wide hedge
drifting cloud
I mean his only sockets are weapons
honest vessel
huh?
drifting cloud
everyones best rings are either mecha or socketed ones, first cloak above 430 you get a socket on you will use for a while aswell
rest is benthic/crafted
honest vessel
they're still sockets tho...
drifting cloud
yeah and when everyone that sims above 53k has like 8 sockets and he has 10 or whatever
dark crag
I have 3 on nonbenthic gear
honest vessel
i dont understand whats going on
leaden burrow
Okay, so i have a question about rotation. I play very spammy with my attacks, and i find myself energy starved as fuck sometimes. What do you guys do to prevent that ? Just pool or am i doing somthing wrong ?
brave vector
“Just pool”
arctic walrus
You pool and don't hit your buttons every chance you can
honest vessel
if you have cp for an envenom, and you're outside of TB, you might as well just wait
you arent losing out on damage
brave vector
If your bleeds are up and you hit envenom you don’t technically need to hit anything for a few seconds
leaden burrow
Ahh, fair enough, that makes sense. Gotta train that i guess. I always spam my keys :/
honest vessel
its usually better to get to full cp and then hold, since you want to fit your muts into ur env/ep window after you envenom
lots of your damage is double dose
which is way more likely to trigger and does more damage if you mut right after your envenoms
but if you aren't mutilating, those buffs arent really relevant
leaden burrow
Super, thanks !
strange python
@wide hedge can u post your stats weights please? just want to see
shadow talon
is it better to have only one echoing blade and the rest single target azerite powers for tyrannical m+ ?
i usually have 3 echoing blade for m+ run and i want to improve it for tyrannical
ocean torrent
you have 1 Twist and 1 Shrouded atleast?
shadow talon
let me check
ocean torrent
anyone have any insight on best time to use Blood of the Enemy in the Vendetta/Vanish burst windows?
shadow talon
Tsumugiya: i have 3 echoing blade, 2 shrouded and 1 double dose, no Twist
shadow talon
what if i don't have any armor with Twist ?
arctic walrus
Dd sucks in m+ you don't want one
ocean torrent
not much you can do then but make the best with what you have
but yea, Echo, SS, Twist for Tyr
shadow talon
Tsm / vel thanks for your advice
ocean torrent
@arctic walrus yea i've been trying to decide if the Blood was better to use just before or after TB
prisma carbon
just got to azshara. people are running bote major just for adds?
arctic walrus
It just lines up better with the fight
prisma carbon
i see
arctic walrus
Low 30% crit btw
echo hornet
How would you go for the next week for m+? More st oriented? Less echoing blades?
arctic walrus
You don't change your build for anything
weak garnet
Hi folks, quick question about essence. I see pretty much everyone using BotE in keys, but Iris sims way higher for me. Currently have Iris and BotE at rank 2 (just came back to the game). Should I just go with the sim or is Iris weighted too heavily in sims?
arctic walrus
blood sucks until rank 3. When you get it you should use it in keys, in the meantime just use iris
Your boss damage won't be low provided you play correctly
weak garnet
Okie thanks much!
near coyote
[Undulating Tides] any good
edgy pawn
no
hidden bay
who needs benthic https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/4ryefvkf728pSVtrgNTv5a 
vast forum
no1 looks at ilvl logs anyway 
cobalt pelican
ehh, there's conflicting opinions on it
i'd say it's pretty okay for direct piece to piece comparisons (excluding trinkets)
but i think most people just tend to avoid it
cobalt pelican
crit > mastery > vers >> haste
true nexus
okay
cobalt pelican
kinda depends what you're playing
if you're playing high eb
crit probably
if you're playing 3ss
mastery maybe? though that's tentative
but crit/mastery can't really bad bad either way so
prisma valve
Is there a noticable potential dps increase with holding coral/vendetta and stuff for a swirling sands proc?
desert kelp
!azerite
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Azerite overview: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o
prisma valve
assuming you don't miss a cast
modest tendon
It likely will depend on the situation
In m+ it’s probably not worth it if you think you will use vendetta on the first trash pack after for example
Although on fortified weeks bosses die so quickly anyway
prisma valve
mainly thinking raids
Just wondering if the gain is notable
or if it is so small it isn't worth bothering
if the difference is like 50dps then who cares
but if it is like... 150...
although really doubt that
modest tendon
Maybe in raids if you have like a 30 second burn phase period where you will need to use you cds at some point maybe you could hold on a few more seconds hoping for some good rng
But I’d say for the most part meh
cobalt pelican
no proc is specifically worth playing around probably
like
the cost of waiting specifically for swirling sands might be that you pass a weapon enchant/op/unstable/something else
in a theoretical world yes you wait until you have the most procs maybe but it's just not realistic
prisma valve
SS is pretty big tho, and benefits from crit
sudden schooner
u also can go like 2 minuted without a single proc if your really unlucky
prisma valve
what is SS rpm tho
sudden schooner
dno rppm on swirling Vs bbi tho
but ive gone 2 minutes without a single bbi proc
then again i had 3 in a row during BL. rng ❤
fathom wyvern
What is better for ashara, bote or clf? I know cl Sims better but is dmg at points more important like on zaqul?
rigid mango
Bote
fathom wyvern
Mind explaining why? 😛
fathom wyvern
So its better than overall dmg Done on that fight? Got it
marble hemlock
@prisma valve Holding CDs for procs is not worth it since the set-up required to use our CDs efficiently would mean that half the proc is gone by the time you get to TB/Vanish during vendetta
brave vector
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/proudmoore/daggerverse have a full set of DD gear, and a wonky m+ set. My dd set sims higher but I went into ep with my m+ set and parses a bit higher on all the fights
I’m assuming it’s just cause the kills were faster so I got more value out of emp garrotes?
rigid mango
Your m+ set only had one EB that's dead, the rest are good. 3 ss is competitive on short kills like the one you did on sivara, and that kill timer isn't far from optimal for 3 SS either so that'd be why
That+ some good rng = decent log
shy axle
shall i save all coral stacks for inkpod procc or just use coral normaly and use coral again if you hit 30% in a few seconds with the amount of stacks you have gathered since the last use
rigid mango
Use coral w vend as per usual
gusty mirage
zine is indeed a qtpie for all the help ❤️
rigid mango
arctic walrus
Nah
stuck knoll
Giving his life for assa chat
arctic walrus
That statement assumes he had one to begin with 
gusty mirage
stuck junco
Is it better to use Blood of the Enemy or Focusing Iris as my major essence in m+? I don't have Blood of the Enemy so kinda wondering if I should grind it out.
arctic walrus
Blood is far better than iris for sin
And you will want blood for certain fights in raids as well
So it is worth it
wide delta
does cloak or evasion work on tentacles zaqul? xD
stuck junco
Thanks so much 🙂 I appreciate it
arctic walrus
Probably not
stuck knoll
No it doesn’t
You just gotta dodge
But you can just shadow step to a tank tbh
They should be safe anyway
arctic walrus
And if it’s ever dicey you can just dance between them it’s not hard
stuck knoll
Yeah
feral shuttle
Hi all - very specific question about QA phase 4 - if I am clicking the console with cloak do I need to activate cloak and then click during it's duration, or can I click then remove the debuff using cloak? Thanks.
arctic walrus
After
junior hawk
What weapon enchant do you have on weapons? 2x FM, 1x FM and 1x DN or something else? 🙂
feral shuttle
ty @arctic walrus
junior hawk
right, because it doesn't stack I assume
arctic walrus
It wouldn’t be x2 of the stat just more often. But that has diminishing returns so you run 2 different ones
winter widget
Hmm why on Ashvane sins don't use every burst except Azeroth Guardian from pull?
They will be up when first shield is broken, cause they have 2 mins cd
Right?
worn basin
Not unless your raids dps is terrible, I think on my last kill shield was broken at about 1 min or slightly less
winter widget
I mean not immediately after shield breaks
But nonetheless when there's no shield
they will be up
cobalt pelican
n o
you break the first shield in like 40 sec
and no shield is a 1min phase
or something
arctic walrus
2 minutes into the fight there won’t be a shield up
winter widget
okay, that is clear now 🙂
arctic walrus
And if your dps is bad the best you can manage is like a few seconds of it. But you need a few seconds for font setup, so you delay the window even more
Nonetheless, shield dog literally has no real value on killing the boss so you cd when she’s actually taking damage
However if you’re lusting at the start then just pop everything
Cuz you’ll get 2 phases anyway
nocturne gate
is conflict 2 worth at azshara m ? instead iris 3 ?
fathom wyvern
do you need to remove cripplin poison on azshara for hulk?
woven cedar
hey! what setup ae you guys running this week in m+?
arctic walrus
It never changes from wanting 3 ss and at least 1 eb
woven cedar
even tyrranical weeks?
arctic walrus
ye
woven cedar
iris major?
arctic walrus
always blood
woven cedar
oh
arctic walrus
if you don't have it theny eah iris
woven cedar
what about master poisoner vs elaborate planning
arctic walrus
never take mp
woven cedar
i see.. and considering it's tyrranical should i stick to poison bomb, or hidden blades?
pearl pagoda
so have any ptr heroes done research on the new essences? the majors sound bland af and only one minor sounds useable in raid form my untrained eyes
arctic walrus
the execute essence will probably be a good major
don't know for sure
You only have a choice between pb and ct, you shouldn't take hb
pb is just the safer pick and it rounds out you damage nicely
ct is more aoe oriented
arctic walrus
it's less damage than either
polar cape
HB is to asert domination on the first 2sec of the dongeon
woven cedar
so you say, 3x ss, at least 1 eb, blood/iris major, EP/Sub/PB?
arctic walrus
correct
woven cedar
what should i aim for the other 2 traits
arctic walrus
2 more eb, bbi, ttk
pearl pagoda
depending on what you want ttk/eb/bbi
woven cedar
bbi?
pearl pagoda
blightborne infusion
quasi pewter
gorak tuls
pearl pagoda
1400 crit proc
woven cedar
isnt swirling sands doing the same?
pearl pagoda
not quite as good
woven cedar
rip i dont have any helm with SS
quasi pewter
with gorak tuls you can go ss bbi overwhelming
arctic walrus
it's hard to get the 3/3 set up because it's all from the azerite vendor
woven cedar
is scent for blood trash?
woven cedar
should i not be spending my combo points applying ruptures in aoe?
drifting cloud
you should, agility just scales poorly in aoe, and the trait isnt insane baseline anyways
brave vector
You only need to keep 4 bleeds up roughly in aoe
Then you can usually switch to envenom on a prio target
woven cedar
ok one more question, when i open do i just apply garrote to as many targets as possible before sub runs out, or do i spend the combo points so i dont overcap?
brave vector
3 garrotes
First 3 globals out of stealth should be garrote, you can’t do any more than that
woven cedar
and then an envenom on a random target and then pop iris?
brave vector
GGG > Rupture
pearl pagoda
probably set up a rupture
you need to set up enough bleeds to be able to spam out evis and fok
for the first half of the pull that is
once the pull comes down to a few targets you just tune the bleeds you have out to how much energy you need
woven cedar
i see
prisma carbon
i see almost every top parse on azshara run conflict minor over iris. is there some kind of purpose to this or does it just sim better for those people?
brave vector
Lots of target switching
Strife doesn’t require you to stay on target to keep your stacks up
prisma carbon
ah
pearl pagoda
plus strife gives that vers dmg reduc
worn basin
the vers is helpful as well
woven cedar
in m+ you run memory+strife minors, right?
brave vector
What’s weird about BotE?
rigid mango
Huh?
pearl pagoda
and the strife is constant as long as your key is smooth
arctic walrus
rigid mango
Blood feels insanely impactful wdym
drifting cloud
you know you get the minor when bote is your major right
pearl pagoda
yes
but when youre only using it as a minor when youre using something else as major
rigid mango
Soooo
pearl pagoda
lmfao
subtle tundra
on queen, do i hold blood of the enemy for first adds or just use it with vendetta? (its first progress night on her)
pearl pagoda
like wtf lmao
drifting cloud
but since you almost never unequip it from the major slot whats the point of your asnwer
pearl pagoda
because some people use beam as major
woven cedar
he was answering me. i dont have BoTa so i use beam
pearl pagoda
ding ding ding
woven cedar
new char hi
pearl pagoda
context yaaaaayyyy
woven cedar
❤️
drifting cloud
yeah so why would he use bote in minor if he doesnt have it
because if he had it, he would just use it in major
ding ding ding
pearl pagoda
buddy
rigid mango
Just give it up, no gain convo from here.
woven cedar
i wish the fucking essences were account wide
rigid mango
So does everyone 😄
pearl pagoda
sorry for giving too much of an opinion lul
woven cedar
i farmed BotE on my druid already
rigid mango
30k aint that bad anymore.
woven cedar
i thought the achiev would let me buy rank 3 on the rogue straight away
do i seriously need to farm ANOTHER 30k
brave vector
Nows the time to farm it
pearl pagoda
yep haha
arctic walrus
It’s bg week it’s not horrible
woven cedar
WHAT
drifting cloud
if you just dinged you should have better things to do than farm bote
having bote3 at 400 ilvl wont make you any stronger
pearl pagoda
playing a rogue you can be scummy and just que for 40 man bgs and stealth near fights, remember everyone doing that in the first weeks
rigid mango
But alas, we're heading into #wow-general territory.
woven cedar
ok what about lucid dreams? it's really good for assa.. same story? if i already have the rank 3 achiev on a diff char.. i need to do it again anyway?
drifting cloud
yes because no essence is account wide
rigid mango
Bingo.
drifting cloud
long ass is relative, you get it in barely over 2 weeks for 10mins a day of effort
woven cedar
thanks.. guess i will.... i'll go cry in a corner stealthed while ppl farm honor for me
subtle tundra
on queen, do i hold blood of the enemy for first adds or just use it with vendetta? (its first progress night on her)
prisma carbon
are you talking about the hulk?
subtle tundra
adds
rigid mango
For prog it wont matter if u have the damage
prisma carbon
or the tiny adds? bc you have enough time to use it on pull and it'll be up for the small adds
arctic walrus
Just use it with your cds if you’re on prog
subtle tundra
the first adds after queen comes down, i can either use it with vendetta or hold it for the adds that go to the middle. i guess ill just use it with vendetta since adds will probably die easy
or i can use it on adds so i look better on dps 
worn basin
Depends on if your group is struggling to push her, or kill ads really. If you need to use it on ads, you can also use it on 2nd hulk.
red plaza
@subtle tundra you should be able to use it on pull, on 2nd hulk, and then I save it for when the devoted adds get gripped together....so delaying it after the vendetta/vanish. Itll be up again when you need it to burn venom tongue
hasty fiber
you have it up again when adds come out
scenic saffron
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/W37NY9RqmcgyGQdH#fight=12&type=damage-done
any idea why none of our inkpods dealt damage in this fight ?
hasty fiber
games broken
arctic walrus
it just sometimes happens
drifting cloud
🍝
winter aurora
boys does some1 know which essence's should i run for boostin freehold levelin with assa rogue? beam lucid CoF?
arctic walrus
you're solo boosting on a sin rogue?
winter aurora
y
alpine carbon
does double dose scale with mastery
royal lantern
its a poison dmg proc, so yes
alpine carbon
ok
Im trolling my guild by playing only outlaw
but my only good haste rings have mastery on them
royal lantern
how can you troll your guild with that lol
alpine carbon
considering we are trying to kill azshara
royal lantern
we have plenty people here that only play outlaw/assassination and still do top100 raiding
alpine carbon
@sudden brook will let you know about my outlaw 🙂
drifting cloud
if by plenty of outlaws you mean like 1
arctic walrus
Any "only play" subs? 
mighty scroll
guys whats the addon name that shows the skill I use
arctic walrus
TO use or HAVE used
red plaza
TrufiGCD or details has a ability tracker plugin
heady ridge
is there any way to deal with stand alone in mythic court when most the raid is melee
arctic walrus
you split to pashmar
compact rock
Couldn’t find it on past log... for lady ash Mythic, is it better to go with coral and font? Or coral and ink pod?
rigid mango
Depends on what strat you're doing.
compact rock
Senpai rogues please help me : ( 2 phases
compact rock
: D ty
ember rover
It might also depend on the fight length, but in general font + coral is better than coral + ink
arctic walrus
fight length = strat
ember rover
What I meant by that is that the more a fight is close to 2:20ish or 4:20ish or 6:20ish the more valuable font is in comparison to inkpod.
rigid mango
On.... Ashvane?
ember rover
On any fight in general, including ashvane.
rigid mango
A fight where kill timer is strictly bound to phasing, essentially.
Where even if the killtimer is 5:20 you're still using font and coral at predetermined spots, that entirely ignore killtimer, and only how many phases.
ember rover
I'm not saying that inkpod is better than font, that would be dumb of me.
What I'm saying is, the difference between font and inkpod depends on the length of the fight.
rigid mango
I'm saying kill timer isn't the relevant factor, I'm saying phasing is.
arctic walrus
which on ashvane, is dependent on strategy
it's predetermined whether you 2 or 3 phase it
ember rover
Oh, ye definitely.
It depends when it reaches 30% into the fight.
But who doens't 2 phase it at this point?
rigid mango
Exactly, that's why I asked, that's why I answered like I did and that's why your answer wasn't relevant to the question.
ember rover
My answer was that FOnt + coral is better almost universally, but the further the fight moves away from x:20 kill timer, the difference between inkpod and font diminishes.
rigid mango
Which was irrelevant since the question was specific to ashvane.
sweet inlet
What 3 essences should i use for M+ only
arctic walrus
blood lucid/strife
sweet inlet
so no essence of the focusing iris?
arctic walrus
blood is way better, but only if you have rank 3
if you lack rank 3 blood, you sub with iris
versed mica
i hate strife, it falls off so easily
formal willow
what azerite traits do you go for for orgozoa mythic?
shrouded
+echoing obviously, but what else? scent of blood sims pretty well but is it a paper tiger?
formal willow
ok
distant lava
amen brother
modest tendon
Or go outlaw 😛
formal willow
i started progress as outlaw but i hate roll the bones
jaunty arrow
@formal willow depend on raid group, if your group have enought cleave u can go pure singl target
arctic walrus
Not ep, envenom
rigid mango
Because with the haste, with lucid, and everything combined
There's barely any pooling needed
ornate gazelle
What do you mean @arctic walrus
rigid mango
You play pretty much optimally by not pooling, and pooling gives a super minor gain.
He means pool around envenom buff, not EP
ornate gazelle
Yeah that's how it's felt with all these procs and stuff
rigid mango
Since env buff is more impactful with DD traits than EP is
short pivot
hey guys hows it going, a quick question if i can go up to 38%crit 6 haste and 40 mast do i go for it for m+? or should i up mastery a bit? asking in general and for this week specificaly
modest tendon
You need to sim yourself
short pivot
huh?
modest tendon
Crit is slightly better for most situations
short pivot
how do u sim for m+ then enlighten me
modest tendon
So likely more of that will be better
Pick specific scenarios
Like big pull at start of FH- patchwerk 10, 40 seconds
Alternatively Fuus dungeon slice is the best overall
short pivot
for this week the big pull patchwerk doesnt work well i think
rigid mango
Your stats seem fine.
modest tendon
Min maxing crit mastery is best though
short pivot
cool Zine ty
modest tendon
I think I have like 38% crit 45% mastery
short pivot
yeah my question is should i drop 8% mast for extra 4% of crit
modest tendon
Sim yourself
short pivot
ok
rigid mango
Simming will show haste to be better though? 
short pivot
yeah sp at patchwerk 3 mins boss
rigid mango
You said sim 3 min patchwerk
modest tendon
Said 10 mob patchwerk before that?
modest tendon
How would you sim for m+ then?
rigid mango
I don't.
modest tendon
Do you not think the best possible way would be to take into account the types of pulls you would do
And decide what pieces average the best between them
rigid mango
I don't think it A: matters enough when it's about getting more of the best stat or best stat
B: Can assume which stat is better for which situation
modest tendon
You will likely find some pieces are consistently good across though
rigid mango
The ones with good stats, yah.
modest tendon
Sometimes items with bad stats are good though?
rigid mango
modest tendon
I have 455 versa mastery hands, sims tell me to use those in most situations
short pivot
i was referring more to the "ring play" here
items are pretty constant with TF and good stats
rigid mango
But how are they bad
short pivot
ver+mast is ok for high TF
better than crit+maste with lower ilvl and no socket id say
modest tendon
How do you know though?
modest tendon
I thought feelcraft was bad though?
short pivot
idk id take advice from stranger rather than digging deep into raidbots
then again i also tend to take candy from strangers so
modest tendon
It’s not always clear though
arctic walrus
Digging into raidbots lol
rigid mango
You don't need to sim stuff to understand why it's good
And I don't trust the APL because it's jank af.
So I go off of common understandings of how the spec functions
And asking other, better, players than me, getting their info and feels on things
What they're using, why, etc.
If the APL was trustworthy and sin had a properly functional dslice type deal, I'd be super down.
But I suck at mucking about with the APL and I don't expect anyone to pump the hours to making one.
rigid mango
And if you're simming diff target counts and then trying to cross reff the diff values it gives you in statweights/top gear
You're coming into a lot more minmaxing brain work than simply rolling with decent stuff, bec in the end it wont matter that much 😄
40% mast is fine
short pivot
ok nice ty
rigid mango
It's more bound to your triats/if you run CT
short pivot
nah i have all BiS long ago im just playing around with rings
but i always wonder if the glass+coral+deadly and 38% crit would be a bit of overkill
and i should pump more into mast
and no CT
rigid mango
You can try to sim it if you want at diff target counts
short pivot
3ss 2ttk 1 eb for this week
rigid mango
Mastery's dope with those traits tho
short pivot
hmmm
rigid mango
You've got 5 traits that scale really well off of mastery
Although I'd still probably go for 2 eb outside of kr/tos
short pivot
even with bolster?
rigid mango
Oh, not dropping an ss nah.
short pivot
i i could then i would :p
rigid mango
Would have to be a ttk ye.
short pivot
yeah sadly unlucky with gear
slate terrace
Just did a bit of catching up and reading some messages from earlier. I’m new here, btw, hello! Long time rogue player.
Just wanted to clarify that pooling is in fact not entirely necessary? Any time I’ve checked WowAnalyzer on a fight I’m being told I need to pool more, but pooling seems to just drop my DPS so much, even when gearing for a burst phase it doesn’t seem to make up for it. Any clarification?
rigid mango
Yes and no
Pooling is good, but the current iteration of assa has so many freebies from haste procs like OP, free haste from stuff like iris minor and ofc lucid.
Just ends up with pooling being nearly irrelevant because of how little downtime the spec actually has nowadays
but yes, tiny minmaxing to pool around ep and env.
slate terrace
That’s kind of what my thought process was. I haven’t really seen myself be starved for energy too often, but when I am it’s super brief. Especially with high haste, etc.
Also finally replaced my helm with one with BIS traits and holy hell is the damage increase insane. I was stuck in the mindset of ilvl upgrades being the only thing I needed, but just replacing the same ilvl helm with one that had DD, NP, OP, in that order was a crazy change.
Simmed an additional 1k DPS off it.
rigid mango
Yep, it's quite insane.
slate terrace
Hoping to replace my shoulders with better traits this week, and also clearing H EP a final time to craft 440 legs/boots through LW should help quite a bit as well.
cobalt pelican
pooling is still an objectively good habit to get into, even if it's as minor as moving 2-3 mutilates that were outside envenom to inside envenom and a couple from outside ep to inside ep
gusty mirage
May the RNG gods be with you when crafting @slate terrace ❤️
cobalt pelican
it is a lot less significant than in bod for example though for sure
rigid mango
^
slate terrace
Haha, thanks Oxi. Really hoping for it to pan out.
rigid mango
There's no reason not to do it.
slate terrace
Right, right.
Finishing R3 CDL next week I believe, as well. So I can stop using BOTE and be full BIS Essences.
gusty mirage
BOTE is still the better option on some fights 🙂
slate terrace
Oh for sure, but I just want this stupid grind out of the way, lol.
gusty mirage
fair lol
pearl ingot
@slate terrace hi
slate terrace
Hey there!
hollow stone
Always remember, if you arent overcapping energy or cps, youre not wasting potential dps (after months of inactivity in here my catchphrase still holds 
)
rigid mango
Apple special
outer wraith
Was wondering if 3x shrouded suffocation is better in m+, or if I should go 2x SF and 1x Echoing blades
arctic walrus
What’s sf
gusty mirage
you'll want at least 1 EB for M+
cobalt pelican
shrouded fluffocation
arctic walrus
And idk why you’re limiting yourself to 3 traits
It’s not Uldir we got 6 traits now :^)
gusty mirage
hardmode
outer wraith
I am limited by the traits on my gear 🙂
hidden bay
🤔
rigid mango
it's like the gloves
I also think it
is mega simpad aint it
Idk if it's actually that good realistically
arctic walrus
Indeed
distant lava
way better to flex luck than skill 
polar cape
The belt break stealth
I use azara glove even if they are a bit of simpad i refuse to heal people -.-
arctic walrus
how are gloves sim pad
rigid mango
They're not that good realistically
I checked through logs w shiennar the other day
They consistantly underperform
wise sun
can someone clarify to me when i should or shouldnt be pooling energy?
arctic walrus
when you lack energy
rigid mango
3rd time today
Jesus
Pooling isn't necessary, but it's a very minmax gain to keep a slightly higher uptime on EP and env, more importantly so env in raid scenarios.
But in the current iteration of assa, energy is a common commodity and pooling isn't as prevalent as it was in BoD because of scaling and essences.
arctic walrus
when'd you come across the pooling isn't necessary btw
"as necessary"
or just iq
wise sun
it just confuses me because it seems like with EP and ENV theres always a window that I should be using mutilate rather than pooling
wise sun
can you give an example? im so used to outlaw like always spamming something that its hard to get out of that mindset lol
rigid mango
When you have no energy?
Like, to put it like this
There's no loss from taking your hands off the keyboard if your bleeds are rolling and you're not overcapping
You can pool at generally any stage as long as it doesn't fuck up windows
So, easy example:
You just envenomed and you're low energy 0 cp, you try to squeeze two mutilates into preferably both EP and env window, but most likely only env if you don't get procs
Being at 4+ CP and having 0 energy, you now pool
Then you finish and then try to build + finish as fast as possible
Then go back to building > pooling
Rinse repeat
wise sun
Ah ok thats a good example and makes sense
rigid mango
Pooling is prevalent when setting up for good TB windows too
To rely less on RNG to get 3 envenoms in the window
wise sun
so like if i just refreshed rupture and had 0 energy I would mutilate a couple times in EP window then pool?
rigid mango
Yessir
wise sun
gotcha. thanks
rigid mango
but if first mut after is a crit for 4cp, and you can finish inside of EP still
It's better to env there
wise sun
ya makes sense
dark crag
someone stole my deliriums patch, they killed all 3 adds, zaqul has shield, gg
so scuffed and still purple log wtf
silver cedar
Hey guys, I'm back. Got my ashvane trinket (woo), wondering about how to properly use it though.
I have my aura and everything to track uptime/stacks, it's mainly the theory behind it. Should I just let stacks accumulate and then convert them in a vendetta window? Or should I let it get to like, 8, and just rotate off of that?
quasi pewter
silver cedar
gotcha, vendetta it is, ty!
quasi pewter
strange python
So for pooling, I try to pool enough that I can get a Toxic blade (if applicable), mutilatex2, and an envenom in. Then after that until the envenom goes off any additional mutilates that I can.
oh apparently i wasn't scrolled all the way down whoops i missed a whole lot of text
silver cedar
How much of a gain is pooling these days?
rigid mango
My god