Using either nightstalker, or more commonly shrouded with subterfuge
#assassination
devout thicket
gotcha, thanks
placid mulch
@arctic walrus cheers vel. I’ll go get VoP and be not lazy. Rank 1 vs 2 vs 3 barely noticeable then?
distant lava
I wouldnt go with barely tbh
rigid mango
1 vs 3 really
distant lava
Iirc rank 2 is insignificant on the minor
rigid mango
the vers on r3 is good, r2 dosn't really matter
placid mulch
So blood main, VoP / LD is really the go for zaq
rigid mango
yeh
distant lava
But rank 3 is like 100 vers
placid mulch
Then Azerite you just go best single target still no special changes
rigid mango
Yep, same old same old
nothing changes there
you want leeching poison tho
instead of CD
placid mulch
Yep on that and just have to not f up hentai
rigid mango
placid mulch
Way more fun than qc already
rigid mango
Don't worry, you won't soon
placid mulch
Qc was just cooked cause we had a few nights of 6 melee comps
And it was not enjoyable
placid mulch
😦
distant lava
Ye its not very fun
placid mulch
Is queenie at least a bit of fun?
rigid mango
Yup.
placid mulch
That was fun
rigid mango
Orgo is the worst fight in this entire tier
strange python
Hi everyone. I am new here and just wondering if someone can point me in a direction to what items I should have equipped and what talents I should have. I am not a hardcore player just a somewhat tryhard casual who likes to have good gear
rigid mango
Yah, link shit and someone (me) will help
strange python
What should I link? Sorry for stupid questions, still finding my feet.
ember rover
I hate zaqul as assa rogue.
I got 1 destro and 1 ele shammy that are literally nuking me when I go in delirium with them.
rigid mango
Do you know how to sim @strange python
ember rover
I take on average 25k DPS of FRIENDLY FIRE and they say it's my fault for not surviving 🙂
ember rover
That 25k DPS of friendly fire is with cloak counted 😄
rigid mango
Sounds like poor cloak usage
steady owl
What do you think about phial? Is it better than harlans dice?
rigid mango
Nope
rigid mango
why is your lock destro
ember rover
Cloak that 🙂
rigid mango
ember rover
I`m taking more damage than our tanks when I go downstairs.
strange python
@rigid mango no
rigid mango
Well, download the addon called "simulationcraft", after that go into the game, type /simc
Copy paste the big wall of text and put it into https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/topgear
There, you can mix and match your pieces and it will evaluate properly what is the best for you
sullen robin
With coral/font do you guys use Coral at a specific amount of stacks, or just when CDS are back up every time to give the crit boost
rigid mango
#tc-updates read the paragraph in there about it (:
sullen robin
the simc usage of font and coral paragraph or higher up ?
rigid mango
The paragraph about it.
sullen robin
cool ty
pure forum
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
young portal
Is it best to stick with Font+Coral if dealing with deliriums on Zaqul? Or do you guys recommend coral+something else?
hot flume
Font is great, just be sure to cast it early enough. On which delirium do you go actually ?
wide hedge
Font ist great for zaqul, you have it up exactly where you need it
young portal
All apart from the first
young portal
First meaning the very first in p2
wide hedge
Used it the First time the boss takes more damage
And you get it for the first important rogue add
unreal burrow
One is the fear realm where everybody goes. The delirium realm is the orange one with the haste buff where only the people who need to burst the boss go
wide hedge
Well i was not the chosen one going into Delirium First time, only the Last 2 Times to burst the adds 😅
And then i Always died at 3rd thanks to the decision sending our DH down with me
I Bet it feels nice having 3 assas in a raid
dark crag
I am the delirium man. I go in the first and leave after 2nd group kills me. Then i go down for both adds again
wide hedge
We sent lock, firemage and dh at first.
No place for me as assa since i'll never survive their aoe
dark crag
My raid can improve a lot with delirium, some people use their cds+pot in opener when we do a dmg stop
So stupid
hoary patrol
Is font good trinket for assa rogues in m+?
ember rover
It's tricky to use.
vernal fern
I don't think so, because you need to restealth after using it and ppl wont wait 5 seconds on every pull for you
rigid mango
Optimally you'd use it when shit's dying anyways
hoary patrol
So bis trinkets are spyglass and?
rigid mango
And lose 1 sec of the trink when you phase between combats
Coral's really good on tyr weeks
Unsure about inkpop, font is potentially nuts if you can sync pulls with it
Plumage always works, but again, pulls to optimise usage
steady owl
What about Harlan’s loaded dice and phial of arcane tempest? How are those compared to plumage and coral, font, dead eye? I have them all now and I’m really unsure of what to use, but I’m gonna test them later. Provided the ilvl/socket is equal
In m+
steady owl
Ok I won’t use it. But that’s interesting seeing the dps differences with ilvl
winter moss
its guideline no actual graph
that's a fixed sim with fixed gear an talents on a fixed timer
making it a very unique setting that will almost never occour but is as close as it can get
steady owl
Isn’t galecallers Boon quite useless I most situations? Since you have to stand at the same spot for 10 sec to get the haste buff
nocturne gate
is it worth do deal with delirium without bote ?
rigid mango
Depends a bit on comp
But not really?
You can use clf, but it also blasts your allies downthere
And it means one echo will have no essence on it
nocturne gate
arent there better classes like spriests for that ?
rigid mango
Spriests aren't that good for echo damage
Demo locks are though
You need something with yuge burst damage, preferably some sustain and minimal cleave (if you're running melee)
If you have no melee, firemages are good
Demolocks are the kings though
nocturne gate
we have 3 rogues 1 ww 2xdhs and a warri as melees
2 locks 1 fire 1 frost 1x spriests and a hunter
rigid mango
I meant melee in the deli realm
nocturne gate
:D
simple gulch
You can't hit people outside the deli realm if you'r ein it right?
rigid mango
That is correct
simple gulch
Why is demo lock that good
dark crag
Huge cds
rigid mango
Because they scale insanely from haste
royal lantern
big burst, scales really good with haste
simple gulch
oh just remembered
Insane haste + tyrant
that's probably tons of additoinal damage
rigid mango
They're nuts
simple gulch
Which is weird because they're not close to top dps on zaqul
rigid mango
Have you done the fight?
simple gulch
Zaqul?
rigid mango
Yes.
simple gulch
Only on heroic
royal lantern
hc and mythic tend too be different
rigid mango
Then it's diff
rigid mango
It's about 2 adds in last phase
simple gulch
they're not close to top dps
simple gulch
in mythic
rigid mango
To what
I say
(:
There's 2 adds that need to die insta
Demos are good at that exact burst
With those added stats
simple gulch
Right
rigid mango
They're not the best for overall damage
simple gulch
So the 2 adds that summon other adds?
simple gulch
so these are not in heroic?
stuck knoll
It’s a mythic only mechanic
simple gulch
We're on Orgozoa right now, kind of a casual guild
simple gulch
okay
rigid mango
One of the reasons you see a lot of sin rogues on that fight
Even though outlaw does far more damage, log wise
nocturne gate
but if u dont do echoes outlaw should be better in the other phases arent they ?
tropic ocean
Better for overall dmg yes
But basically every sin build is viable and it solely comes down to what your raid needs
nocturne gate
i ask bc i dont have bote and our raidlead want us 3 rogues doin echoes
simple gulch
what's the HP of one echo
lethal heart
naa its like 6,2 or sth
errant crater
How many targets do you fan of knives with hidden blades and multiple echoing blades
cloud sandal
2+
rigid mango
You don't use hiddenblades
cloud sandal
but yeah use poison bomb
rigid mango
You fok as a builder at 2t
errant crater
in m+?
steady owl
Is that regardless of how many eb you have?
cloud sandal
u have any DD?
steady owl
No
prime stirrup
if no eb 3/4+ mobs for fok. with eb 2 targets. DD wo/ EB 5+. DD w/ EB i dont know 3?
rigid mango
If you want more consistant cp gain and more targeted damage, say 2nd boss fh, you mut at 0-2 , fok at 3, finish at 4+
If you have dd and eb
You ignore dd
steady owl
3ss 1eb and 2 tkk is what I use right now
rigid mango
Then do as I said
steady owl
Always 😄
errant crater
2nd highest score assa rogue is using hidden blades in every dungeon
even on tyrannical
with x2 echoing blades
prime stirrup
trash is the majority of dungeons. even on tyran weeks. so it makes sense
rigid mango
Just because he does it doesn't mean it's correct
Even in s2 pulls, HB was behind PB on overall
And that's trash included, obv loss to boss damage too
errant crater
less rng tho
prime stirrup
Oh i didnt see him mention HB. fuck HB thats terrible
rigid mango
HB and CT both suckass
prime stirrup
ct isnt that awful
prime stirrup
HB is only even remotely good because of echoing. ct was fine s1 when exsang was meta and it was another bleed to empower
rigid mango
Yeah
But thanks to eb, CT sucks
HB was never good enough, one coulf argue huge pulls in season 2 with 3 eb, but even then I'd argue it's not better
It's really lame that the two other options are worse, but that's just how it is
rigid mango
It was, and is
Even with 3 eb which was the case, it mathematically did less damage than PB did
And that was with bigger pulls than we have now
tropic ocean
prove the maths then 😉
arctic walrus
Okay, and what about the rest of the dungeon
rigid mango
tropic ocean
we only have a little amount of pubic logged high keys
but there hb is competitive, even this season
rigid mango
What, in the amount it's played?
distant lava
I mean youre already playing sin why not go full meme
tropic ocean
in fact the chinese and koreans (the ones who don't blindly follow 1 or 2 rogues)
are pumping with hb
with ct even with exsang
rigid mango
And they keep BS solo on ST
What's your point
Chinese and koreans have been doing whack shit for ages
tropic ocean
my point is that u say its worse overall
when it isn't
its ur opinion, fine
reality is different though
rigid mango
No, it was mathematically true
tropic ocean
just like ct isn't bad, it was worse to use when u used 3 eb
but its not worse than pb generally
rigid mango
Yikes.
tropic ocean
and theres plenty logs that prove it
arctic walrus
Let's see it
tropic ocean
and sim does so as well, even with no reaping 20mob pulls
in fact from public logged runs guy with hb did basically same overall dps on tyran freehold that top log did in fortified teeming with pb
errant crater
You cant mathematically prove something is better in dungeons you cant sim for dungeons, only proof you have is logs and unfortunately there are very few
tropic ocean
and besides that not using pb wont make you "suck" on st
as the dmg is very little of your overall on st anyway
distant lava
Its proven that overall is a very important metric in tyrannical dungeons
Cause you really need to kill those adds
tropic ocean
giving the metric a lower value for affix xy doesn't make a statement that x is better than y on overall true anyway
but yeah arguing here is often very poorly
even in tyran kings rest (highest logged run) the spend 16min to fight bosses
out of 48min * so they spend the rest fighting trash, even in a lower trash high boss dungeon
distant lava
And
tropic ocean
so yes bosses take the least amount of time you spend in a dungeon so improving your overall is not a bad thing
errant crater
it sucks?
distant lava
In a high tyr KR
tropic ocean
its a good talent to pick for a high tyrant kr yeah
I just used kr as a example to show how little of the time bosses influence the dungeon in comparison to overall time spent in it
distant lava
But that doesnt matter
tropic ocean
maybe daddy can give some insight as hes playing regularly with the assa rogue on high keys using hidden blades
and he can tell us 1st hand if it sucks
arctic walrus
While we're at it let's ask the sub rogue why his spec is viable too
distant lava
I dont need to play sin to realise
Going an aoe talent
When the difficulty of the week is to survive the bosses
Is stupid
tropic ocean
idk how you come up with this week when the conversation was about hb in general, and even about s2
vs s3
🤷
and what ones opinion is doesn't prove or disprove if something is viable or not viable
and for the sub thing, viable is a term that defines if something can successfully do task x and since we have sub rogues that cleared ep ce, one could argue that sub is viable for that content, its worse in comparison to the other 2 specs but that doesn't make it "non viable"
upper canyon
my spec is viable, thanks for asking vel, I can push my buttons in a mediocre mythic guild
plain moon
Isn’t the answer here just. Spec into aoe because it makes the dungeon go faster. If your group is wiping on bosses you then look into speccing into more ST
tropic ocean
generally you should play what doesn't make you wipe in first place
but im pretty confident on dungeons like freehold/motherlode/waycrest/siege etc. hb or pb won't make the difference to wiping to a boss or not, if it even would make a difference at all in any dungeon
anyway
plain moon
Well yeah, one person changing one dps talent isn’t huge.
Saying just play what makes you not wipe does nothing
shut garnet
would it be a dumb idea to play lucid major instead of clf if youre struggling with dps on zaqul during echoes
is that more dps for that burst period or time or
rigid mango
You should be playing neither
ANd lucid major is super fucking bad downstairs wdym
more energy reg when you already have that haste
shut garnet
well, you've got a ton of haste but idk
guess i thought itd be a bit more 
what do ppl play
blood?
shut garnet
the one essence i dont have yet 
tropic ocean
then use clf
zinc zealot
@distant lava specing hb over pb makes u loose 100 dps on a 1 target fight in m+. if you are wiping to a boss, that is not the reason you wiped. On top of that you will do slightly more AOE which will make the key go faster.
shut garnet
arguably killing the boss faster also makes the key go faster
zinc zealot
100 dps is negligible on ST. if you fight bosses on avg 30% of the key that is 30 dps to one talent
when you can take another talent that does basically the same ST dps and does more AOE dmg
rigid mango
But you can argue the same for HB
shut garnet
how does the maths check out there though
shut garnet
if pb has like a 20% chance to proc abilities that you WANT to use
whereas most bosses you just wouldnt use FoK
might be good to test with high crit though
on fortified
zinc zealot
it doesnt matter becuase you still use fok at 20 stacks of hb on ST
shut garnet
the only issue is
zinc zealot
there are many applications you can use it on bursting weeks aswell
shut garnet
to fully maximise that you should go high crit, 3 eb and hb
why not just play outlaw instead 
zinc zealot
what other stat would you run for m+? other than crit?
rigid mango
Mastery
shut garnet
lol
zinc zealot
idk im running 2.2k crit 400 mastery
zinc zealot
2ttk 2eb 1ss
shut garnet
yeah, i doubt youd be running 2.2k crit with 3ss
rigid mango
That's 5 traits
zinc zealot
last trait doesnt matter
shut garnet
zinc zealot
cos its shit
rigid mango
It might do
shut garnet
blood (oops) crit haste rogue with 3eb2ttk1ss and hidden blades new m+ meta?
rigid mango
I don't think HB is strictly bad
Just a bit worse, and not the thing you'd need most of the time
zinc zealot
what do you think about killing big trash packs for bursting? such as first two packs in Shrine?
sour wasp
crit haste m+ yikes
rigid mango
What about ithem?
rigid mango
So you can all enjoy 12 stacks of burst and die?
zinc zealot
healer can easily heal a 16 stack like that
zinc zealot
because it is free %
zinc zealot
its better than using shrouded and letting the adds die uneven
shut garnet
have any rogues done this yet or no
shut garnet
XD
rigid mango
You can just
zinc zealot
ye top 10 sin rogues
shut garnet
hmm
rigid mango
not pull them
zinc zealot
50/50 use hb
rigid mango
It's not hard
zinc zealot
other use pb
rigid mango
Yeah, a lot of them use HB
but that doesn't mean it's anymore correct
Until someone proves through imperical math, that HB is objectivly better
PB is the go to
People did it last season and PB was the better option
and afaik, nothing great has changed and if anything, HB should be worse
zinc zealot
and im confused why you think its not worth pulling the first pack on shrine on a bursting week
shut garnet
well, i guess blood changed
but it works very well with high mastery 3ss build also
and obviously wouldnt imagine it being bad with pb dropping after using it lol
rigid mango
I'm confused how you cannot understand the baseline logic of
zinc zealot
i mean i cant remember the exact %
rigid mango
what I'm trying to say
zinc zealot
but a pack that takes 5 seconds
zinc zealot
that is one example
rigid mango
I just cannot agree with that reasoning
zinc zealot
it sims higher on the API
rigid mango
Great to hear.-
shut garnet
the api is kinda scuffed for assa
vestal wren
what api do we talk about?
tropic ocean
if you don't trust dungeon slice (which you shouldn't) take ur dps for 5-6 targets (cuz thats what you're fighting most of the time then take your dps for st
~3-4min per boss
tada
vestal wren
you can use my dungeon slice version thats pinned in #wow-general
zinc zealot
i sim for 3 min fights ST and 5/10 target fights for 40 seconds
to see what is best for what situation
with 5/10 no hero
tropic ocean
@vestal wren u can only run it in advanced sim right? so seperate sims to compare talents?
tropic ocean
yy
upper canyon
If I'm being sent into the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th deliriums and running VoP r1 minor. Do I hold my vendetta to align with vanish on the 2nd and 3rd deliriums, or just mash that on cooldown and if they line up with vanish/delirium then sick, if not w/e
I'm running 2 nothing personal, and CLF since i dont have bote if that makes a difference
tropic ocean
U should align vanish with vendetta yes
difference to bote is that ull have it for both adds ? Afaik and clf not
upper canyon
If I hold vendetta for vanish is the only benefit to taking VoP just having vendetta for both adds at the end?
tropic ocean
thats the reason u play vop yeah
upper canyon
kk
upper canyon
alright thanks, I'm working on BotE but its so painful, I've only been playing BFA for about a month now and didn't really know I'd need it until a week or so ago ;_;
should at least have conflict and strife r3 next week (8 days, not tomorrow) so that will be an improvement over flame minor
tropic ocean
well you don't need it
but its really good for zaqul and azshara
you can kill them with clf as well 🙂
onyx halo
I'm pretty sure I can sim for more, but don't have raidbots premium to run big sims. Can you please check this out and see what options are the best for me for Ashvane? https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/nHFy4k5PaZDByPYJtKH1EH
tropic ocean
if you want to sim all your stuff, buy premium or sim them one by one
robust gull
for the benthic pieces, are the wrists, hands, waist and boots all about the same boost in dps? or are 1 or 2 of them slightly stronger?
real solar
boots are v important
robust gull
ok cool i just got those XD
just wondering if grinding the other 3 are necessary
like my gloves are 440 with a socket already
harsh anchor
Okie doke -
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/JMZBD8317c6jym2f#fight=8&type=damage-done&source=14
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/p8zSee6j2eitT4QTQvexRr
Any input on what could be improved to get closer to simmed DPS? My timings are a little wonky and I do need to work on timers for CDs and such, I know that. Trying to get beefed this coming week for expert M prog
distant lava
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
bitter rock
What do you guys like running for traits in m+? I've been told to run echoing blades but I feel like shrouded suffocation has worked better for me
robust gull
am i getting super lucky or is the chance for benthic gear to have sockets really high
tropic ocean
@robust gull u can sim it in gear compare for my char if I remove benthic
and repalce wtih 445-455 items I lose about 4k dps
robust gull
thats nuts
bitter rock
ttks bbi?
rigid mango
blightborne infusion
robust gull
benthic waist with physical damage and wrist with frost damage, are they about equal for dps gained?
sand whale
wrist > belt
robust gull
thanks
lucid carbon
pog?
jovial plume
can someone explain how to open with guardian of azeroth?
and master assasin?
without shroud
scarlet sequoia
yeah
jovial plume
what i currently do is. mut rup mut garrote toxic blade vendetta guardian of azeroth vanish envenom
scarlet sequoia
u wanna use essence > vendetta > tb > vanish > envenom
mut rup mut garrote is correct
jovial plume
but shouldn't i use the EP buff for the first vanish envenom?
scarlet sequoia
no you should do what i just said
arctic walrus
4-5
vestal wren
def. not that one, the image compression is making it terrible
tropic ocean
sry i've no clue how to quote it directly in disc 😦
woven summit
what do you guys find better for your sims as a third minor essence in mythic +? vop or blood?
rigid mango
sims suck
I would use neither
Blood is giga for major, you always pick lucid
3rd minor is strife really
tropic ocean
u use lucid minor
blood major is good because the active gives u crit dmg and crit chance so u can blast both aoe and st
and the minor is super good as well as u get stacking crit buff and haste buff which is also very good for st and aoe
overall conflict is super good minor as well as the full stacked vers buff is basically up 100%
on tyran i use iris minor for the haste as I dont have 3 op (which helps with bosses) overall lucid is better than iris though
woven summit
i see thanks for the elaboration
however, if you are not really a pvp guy what alternative you have instead of strife?
because blood i can grind it down with casual bgs it might be fun i'm halfway there anyway
dark crag
Rank2 strife is 1k rating
tropic ocean
iris major is good for overall
woven summit
i said lucid previously
tropic ocean
but bote is just stronger in general
before I had bote I was using iris major lucid minor conflict minor
but I can just advice u to get bote, its by far the best
woven summit
yeah i don't have much left for bote rank 3 i'll grind it down thanks
i thought iris was still bis for major but guess something changed
dark crag
At 1.5k rating you get 4 things per week, you need 15 for r3
woven summit
iris was very op guess they nerfed t
woven summit
i see
woven summit
i'll just use bote main, iris minor and lucid minor then
tropic ocean
go with iris until r3 bote though
woven summit
yeah for sure
tropic ocean
as the real power from bote is from r3 with the crit dmg buff
it makes u hit close to 300k envenoms on last boss freehold 😄
dark crag
Iris minor is not really worth it, if you switch targets a lot. For boss fights it's alright
woven summit
damn that's very sweet
oh yeah good point luhmi
so what would you get as an alternative to conflict minor?
dark crag
Think so
rigid mango
I mean
The crit isn't there
You get full stacks and it turns into haste from 2-3 foks
You can essentially think of it as 9.5% flat haste
dark crag
I should get r3 strife
woven summit
that's probably a lot of arena
dark crag
My sin m+ azerite reached 450
muted maple
not to bad as a rogue, tbh.
dark crag
Up to 1.4k you can't lose rating
So if you tryhard just down your mmr
But pvp community is so small, it doesn't matter
Ask the 2099 hunter
tropic ocean
if you're half decent at the game even 1.6k is free as sin rogue
tropic ocean
like i have no clue what to do, didnt even have DR tracker and went to 1.6k or smth
these people they dont know their class or anything they trinket on sap and stuff
vast forum
people who run adaptation vs rogues 
dark crag
The best people
tropic ocean
it kinda sux that 2 bis essences are from pvp
but meh u can reach it pretty easily
without much invest
dark crag
The hardest part of strife is getting a mate
woven summit
what about st essences? you still use the azerite guardian one as major?
vast forum
depends on boss
tropic ocean
either clf/lucid/iris-conflict
vast forum
for pure st sustain it's CLF + lucid + iris
woven summit
at least no strife needed there
tropic ocean
im not 100% sure but iris stacks don't drop as long as u dont stop attacking the main target
like in orgozoa
pure forum
Is there an exact number i should refresh my rupture at in duration? Or is it dependant on haste and azerite
tropic ocean
Pandemic relates to reapplying buffs/debuffs. When a debuff is refreshed, its remaining time (up to a cap of 30% max duration) will be added to the new buff. Primarily used to give leeway to reapply bleeds, however can also be used to make bleeds last longer.
7.2 seconds for rupture, 5.4 for garrote
pure forum
that is not long x.x The issue im running into is that i hit within that range, and have low energy/cp. So i either reapply it late, or i skip an envenom, and am left sitting auto attacking waiting for rupture to hit 7.2
and im not sure which is the worse option because both sound bad
tropic ocean
you don't need to refresh it exactly at 7.2 seconds (cuz you wont be able to every time)
but you can safely refresh it inside pandemic when it has 7.2 seconds or less left
(to not waste duration) 🙂
if you refresh anywhere from 1 second left to 7.2 seconds left you should never run into an issue where you won't be able to refresh it properly
and refreshing dots properly is > everything else
the raidbots api even refreshes dots during toxic blade buff, and its pumping so
pure forum
So if a situation arises where i have 10~ seconds left on rupture, and am capped on cp, rather then envenom i should hold the points? Assuming im energy drained and wont have time to build another 5 cp before it drops?
tropic ocean
no
you envenom
and you can refresh rupture with 4 cp as well
you always refresh rupture with 4 cp unless you have 5 cp from critting with mutilate
like you don't build 5 cp to refresh rupture if you have 4 cp you use them
pure forum
so i wont ever go more than 7-10 seconds without having the energy to build at least 4 cp?
tropic ocean
not sure if I understand you correctly but if you follow the to go sin priority you will never run into such an issue
except when you need to move due to mechanics of the encounter, then you might have situations where you refresh with 3 cp or outside of pandemic, so the bleed doesn't drop while u cant attack
sour wasp
@pure forum i know what you are saying, if you have 10 seconds left on rupture it is fine to wait the 3 seconds provided you don't overcap energy and don't delay tb
you're basically pooling for tb at that point
pure forum
Alright, thank you
sour wasp
you're not in a race to spend those cp's since you will pool a bit anyways @pure forum
acoustic cipher
Hey everyone! :D
I was wondering if there was a way to easily tab between prio targets in a big pull since i fuck it up sometimes when i wanna apply 3 garrotes quickly and i garotte a useless mob
sand whale
get use to clicking!
acoustic cipher
it's rly hard in a 10+ mobs pull and u wanna garrote 3 of them
like siege for example
sand whale
yep some nameplate settings can help you with that or if you wanna bother with targetting macros but
clicking's pretty nice and easy
acoustic cipher
i mean i try clicking too but sometimes the nameplates are so close it targets the other mob
what nameeplates settings can help with that?
sand whale
you can try this addon called plater it mighth be a bit convoluted in terms of what settings does what but it can do things like space the nameplates out, highlight them according to m+ etc etc
things like clickable area, all that sort of thing will help ya with that
acoustic cipher
i was thinking more like
addon or smth that can put marked targets as a boss frame to the right side of my screen where i can cick on each one of those marked targets
if u get me
sand whale
focus target
acoustic cipher
gonna be only 1 tho
sand whale
yep I mean it'll help if you just want a static frame to click lol
acoustic cipher
ye but i meant
lets say u pull 3 lashers + 5 living rots in underrot
i wanna premark those 3 lashers so i can garrote all 3
scarlet sequoia
could just press tab
acoustic cipher
and they appear as boss frame
yeah but tab can sometimes fuck you over tho and target the wrong thing
scarlet sequoia
sure
sand whale
don't think there's anything like that out there which is why I'm suggesting plater to you because it does make things easier to see and click on
acoustic cipher
and u wanna garrote the big ones
drifting cloud
but theres still some "skill" to it
acoustic cipher
or waycrest with all the maggots
hm
im gonna try plater then and see how it goes
wish i could just have an option that negates stupid trash that i dont need to focus on lol
sand whale
wago has some profiles you can look into for m+
dusky moon
what traits do you guys use on high M+ tyrannical weeks?
tough dome
is scent of blood any good?
drifting cloud
its not the worst, but you dont wanna use it if you can
tropic ocean
@acoustic cipher your best bet is to have individual colored nameplates for specific mobs
there are many preset profiles for plater
or you can just do them yourself, takes time for once and then you're good forever
most higher rio streamers also have these premade weak auras that automatically marks stuff n shit
or even elvui settings like drjay
raw oasis
!weakauras
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
rancid bobcat
does toxic blade boost inkpod
drifting cloud
no
robust hedge
hi what essences are people raiding with is iris better than cof in minor slot
latent drum
good morning everyone can someone explain why assassin rogues use Strife as minor in mythic azshara fight
robust hedge
sim does say its better but the haste from iris might make it better i seen a vid and they said iris but it was a while ago
acoustic cipher
@tropic ocean tyty
granite rampart
@latent drum theres a lot of target swapping until phase4 which makes iris minor lose a lot of value.
robust hedge
how can u see what other people have been using in raids
granite rampart
warcraftlogs
if you go to spec rankings and find rogue > assassination, you can see talents, azerite, essences, and trinkets used by the top parsers
latent drum
@granite rampart ty for the reply
ember rover
It's about the fact that haste decreases in value considering 2 factors
Azshara is a really great fight for BotE, and also there's 2+ targets for more than 50% of the fight
vast forum
downtime + multitarget = haste bad
ember rover
Haste decreases in value with multi target
vast forum
also targetswapping = lucid bad
ember rover
Also, versa becomes more valuable the more benthic pieces you have.
vast forum
questionable tbh
ember rover
It did in my sims.
I used to have 440 socketed vanilla gloves.
I got the benthic gloves to 425 and versa went up a chunk
granite rampart
that could also be due to a lack of vers on your gear. its not uncommon for vers to be valuable if you dont have much of it on your gear. with or without benthic
rigid mango
Benthic and clf highly values vers
nocturne gate
bote r4 ..psychopath
winter moss
ember rover
mac sim yourself with blood, then with CLF 🙂
ember rover
I mean, check your stat weights with CLF and then with BotE
And you`ll see that when you run CLF your haste is more valued than when running BotE.
winter moss
wanna know why
you are comparing haste procs to no haste procs and afaik hast loses value over a certain point.
ember rover
I dont know what you're attempting to prove. My statement was that with CLF, your haste value increases and you started posting random tooltips.
winter moss
buddy. you are going in the wrong direction here
ember rover
I mean, am I?
winter moss
ya its hasted
ember rover
I`m at work so I can't run a sim, but you can easily check that instead of arguing.
winter moss
but you are ignoring all the other facts
ember rover
I`m not ignoring anything, I said CLF favors haste and you started linking random tooltips.
winter moss
buddy
clf favors haste because youll lose the procs from bote
which is quite massive
sure clf is hasted but the bote minor pushes down haste even more
and what my point was that you said and i qt
AdriänToday at 10:22
You mean, BotE, right Zine?
CLF favors haste, not Versa, from what I know.
where the tooltip shows that the vers scaling is pretty darn high on clf (almost every essence)
rigid mango
CLF favours versa
And crit, and haste
CLF combined with benthic all value everything but mastery, which ends with mastery being valued quite low even though it'd be in the top ig we had none of the above
robust river
Is there any M+ or EP bosses were wounding poison is viable? I assume not with the massive dps loss?
dark crag
Negate ashvanes shield with wound poison, why didn't we think of that?
jaunty arrow
Wut?
dark crag
It was a joke
jaunty arrow
Thats the point sometimes is smth joke but there is a blizzard factor 😂
robust river
Haha, you never know 😄
winter moss
i like the blizzard factor
bleak spoke
Man clf favors haste because the procs are ppm + haste like benthic
tropic ocean
@distant lava i suppose in a 2t sim it also sims poison bomb hitting 2 targets, or clf aoe
robust river
Just stack bosses on QC 
ember rover
I mean, how would you SIM it?
robust river
As single target basically.
distant lava
1 target patchwerk
robust river
I haven't done the boss on M+ but can't you swap every time tanks swap anyway?
shut garnet
yeah but your "swap" just dots
robust river
A second rupture and garrotte going is a pretty big increase though no? Extra energy and extra bleed damage.
shut garnet
so if you play the fight PERFECTLY you might get idk, 2-3k MAYBE above the dps your sim says
you have to remember patchwerk is no movement
and not only is QC a lot of movement, there are also a lot of things that dont allow you to perma multidot
i guess you still could try but idk that fight is awkward as fuck
robust river
Yeah, I'm not talking about whether it's realistic. He asked how to sim it. All you can do is sim as single target really.
tropic ocean
so did you do 64k dps on qc?
ember rover
Do you do the 52-53k on 5min that the patchewerks sims say you do?
shut garnet
on sivara yes
tropic ocean
if i dont have to move close yeah
shut garnet
shut garnet
dummy****
winter moss
buddy
shut garnet
my man
winter moss
wrong direction
robust river
Just do what I do. Sim yourself naked then feel like a god when you smash your sim. That's the big brain play.
tropic ocean
at least i know how to sim QA now
robust river
But this is probably #wow-general chat.
shut garnet
whats everyone running for trinkets in m+
im thinking of ditching coral+inkpod it feels so bad
is font that terrible if you get to channel between gigapulls
robust river
Coral + Dice in my lowbies but I don't have spyglass or anything so :\
winter moss
running spyglass coral
robust river
Font is top tier if you actually get to channel IIRC.
winter moss
and on bossfights spyglass feels kinda good
winter moss
i still like it
winter moss
^
shut garnet
till i get ML trinket 455 with a socket 
opal scroll
Guys whats the best race for sin rogue? Including allied
winter moss
human
opal scroll
Horde only 
opal scroll
opal scroll
Have seen my fare share of maghar orcs once the question
robust river
Definitely not worgen
winter moss
but i recommend to play what ever race you want
winter moss
RACE DPS GAIN is almost nothing
winter moss
on hero dmg yea
opal scroll
Just pondering
robust river
That's based on hero damage 445/450 though so 😄
)
opal scroll
Smorc orc makes me 
Already a belf
Like it but was wondering on why I see top logs with maghar orc
Feeling like rerolling, might delete later
worldly iron
you won't improve your own logs by following a pattern of races on warcraftlogs
opal scroll
Yeah I know
Was just curious
Wouldn't mind maghar since they are cool and they weren't around when I made the rogue so
tropic ocean
race legit no dps difference that is noticeable
blissful lynx
though look cool = more dam
opal scroll
But it makes up for charming your opponent has a belf or just smorcing has a orc
ember rover
Belf is really good for M+ though
opal scroll
One more question, how viable is flames over beam essence on third slot in azshara?
ember rover
Numberwise they might be the asme, but belf is so much better for M+
tropic ocean
u can sim it
the important part about azshara is killing the adds in time and then just burning boss so
crucible is a proc, while iris is just flat dps with no rng
cursive stream
Hi. I am currently transitioning from my mage to my rogue alt and love it so far! I am however behind on all the grinds and would like to hear you guys on essences. With my limited grind time, which would you recommend me to chase if I mainly do M+ and arena? Thanks!
opal scroll
@tropic ocean just asking cause cant sim atm and people might have the answer now. Will try later on then
@cursive stream beam is a must
Then I think its lucid and BotE
Or strife not sure which one is better
tropic ocean
well majority of rogues use c&s
and the rest uses iris
for major its bote or clf and lucid minor is set as well
opal scroll
There u have it, I'm a pleb
tropic ocean
its not a bad thing to not kow everything and ask 🙂
opal scroll
Just mainly use beam but I don't push high keys beside 15
tropic ocean
oooh u asking about m+
opal scroll
Yeah
tropic ocean
iris major is fine, but bote is better
i thought we were still talking about azshara
opal scroll
Was answering to froomel
cursive stream
Thanks 🙏I will get iris and c&s automatically so I guess it’s bote and/or lucid that needs grinding
tropic ocean
i mean lucid is no grind
you should basically have it just from doing nazjatar to upgrade benthic anyway
cursive stream
But as I don’t raid benthic is not really on my to do list (fortunately)
cursive stream
True it’s not too bad. Thanks for the help guys!
oak flower
hey guys took a little month or so break any build or trait changes ? currently using triple s with this shit gear
tropic ocean
for what content
oak flower
pvp
oak flower
hence 0 benthic
tropic ocean
but afaik in pvp u want 1 shrouded and rest rest ttk/np
oak flower
ok ty
tropic ocean
and those battle field focus things for arena
robust river
Bolstering / Grievous / Fortified. Any of these affect the standard SS>EB trait priority?
WOuld leeching poison or leech on any of the inner ring traits be viable to try and keep you out of grevious?
rigid mango
You could argue leeching would be decent, but if you ever proc cheat death in m+ you'll have saved way more time
winter moss
rigid mango
from not dying
I don't swap that row apart from tyr kr/tos for elusiveness
or FH too
robust river
I run elusivenss as default from habit. Cheat Death sounds sensible though... 6min CD is dirty though
tropic ocean
cheat death is really good
as u can also use it to cheese mechanics by proccing it
to tunnel uptime
robust river
Any list of cheesable mechanics with it? I never trust WOW to be consistent on what it works/doesn't work on. Same as feint/cloak.
rigid mango
You don't really try to cheese stuff with it
it's more a safety net
bec a death can ruin a pull
and a key in that
tropic ocean
theres a thing from eleem I think that has most stuff that is feintable/cloakable
robust river
What's eleem?
spice surge
rigid mango
robust river
Sorry @spice surge 😄 Is the list available somewhere for M+?
spice surge
Most things in dungeons work as expected
The only thing i can remember not is the aoe on the first boss of temple
But no
robust river
The dash attack thing?
fathom wyvern
what essence is best for pvp?
fathom wyvern
i asked there an hour ago no response
winter moss
imagine people having a rl and not hanging on discord 24/7
strange python
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
rocky ruin
Just reading Blood of the Enemy farming quite harder now. It is mandatory or it is more like its nice to have but not really?
final dust
Depends on what content your doing
final dust
Certain fights it’s better on but not mandatory but I would get it
If you win 1 a day it’s like 1k honor so after like 2 months ur done
rigid mango
Bg event is next week
So it'll be easy
It's good on last bosses, and a good setup up for melee
m+*
stuck knoll
They removed the stacking of merc mode and the bg event
woven summit
strife is more complicated if you haven't done arena in quite some time
oh shit
so you can do only one merc mode a day or what?
rocky ruin
for rank 3 you need 100k honor
final dust
No
woven summit
nah that's for rank 4
final dust
That’s rank 4
rocky ruin
ohh
woven summit
stop scaring people 😂
rocky ruin
50k seems a like a pain in ass number
spiral escarp
What is “merc”? 🙂
woven summit
mercenary
when you choose to go as alliance if you horde
there's no vice versa tho
spiral escarp
I’m alliance, so guess not?
woven summit
nah, but you don't need it you got low queues
spiral escarp
I see, thanks 🙂
woven summit
horde has big queues because inbalanced factions
i don't know if that's still the case after classic
wonder how the queues are now
true nexus
how do i activate merc
solid nova
Talk to the NPC by the PvP chest #wow-general
halcyon saddle
I need some serious help with my dps. I am supposed to be simming at 40k but i've been only getting gray parses. Please assist if possible. Character name is Zyerintus on Dalaran
worldly iron
we'd need logs to see what's wrong
final dust
^^
halcyon saddle
This is from a kill in which I survived until the bosses death.
I am missing benthic pieces which is a significant dps loss and my daggers are suboptimal but grey parses... I am at odds with my performance
worldly iron
one glaring issue I see is your rotation, you pop vendetta way too late from the pull, you don't pair toxic blade with vanish and your opener isn't the MA one
nocturne roost
worldly iron
I can't really help that well right now as I'm commuting and phone is doodoo
solid nova
Your opener is wrong, you didnt use raid essence until 28 seconds in either
Vanish and vendetta is late
rigid mango
It depends on your traits whether you use subterfuge or master assassin
solid nova
Triple mutilates, over capping CPs
rigid mango
in your case, MA
solid nova
Coral usage isn't correct either
distant lava
dagger in the back 
rigid mango
You're using dagger in the back instead of ttk on cephalohide
solid nova
And your TB windows are extremely lack luster