True story btw
#assassination
dark crag
dark crag
It was the funniest ab i ever played
mint prairie
Hey, anyone know if Inkpod is good in M+? I have the spyglass, dice, inkpod and font
rigid mango
Inkpod seems aight,possibly better on tyr, esp if you're running coral with it
olive galleon
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > vers => mastery > haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
daring cave
How is Sin doing in mythics? Just curious
sudden trench
Very well
frail quiver
Tbh i think it might be personal pref. like most combinations of SS, TTK and EB will perform well.
I think 3 EB is overkill
daring cave
Ah ok, Maybe 2 then. Just curious i miss Sin in mythics lol
vast forum
my problem with assa in m+ is that i'm nelf and i value SS a lot because of it, so i'd like to play 3xSS
and then if i run 2xEB i feel like a single TtK isn't worth a lot so i'd go 3x EB but then i feel kinda shit on bosses
shy dust
Most recommend either 2/2/2 or the newer 3 SS 2 EB 1 TTK
Ttk still brings more ST and priority damage
vast forum
i know what's recommended but 1 ttk just feels meh
tropic ocean
ttk is inferior for st compared to ss
atm i run 3ss2ttk 1eb
but probably 2eb better for this week
cobalt pelican
1 ttk is the most valuable ttk
i understand it might not feel 'good' to be casting envenoms with 1 ttk but realistically in terms of numbers
it's either worth to spend cp or not and the shift from 1 to 2 ttk likely plays a super negligle part in that equation
and the majority of the decision comes with target count and elaborate planning
arctic walrus
Was it 1 ttk or eb
desert vault
3ss, 2eb, 1ttk feels pretty good this week
it is like whenever you buy azerite gear with using a lot of scrapped mythic garbage pieces it must punish you 🙂
Venture Co chest ... oh boy 😐
finite yarrow
can rogue evasion zaqul delirium tentacle?
fleet whale
the other build to consider is 3 SS, 1 TTK, 1 EB, and 1 BBI
that is a very well versed build
grave trail
whats a good haste % in your opinion
upper canyon
at 17.3% haste you'll be mailed $1,000 per key you do
random comet
oy, anyone else have problems with the focused azerite beam? i was doing M+ and it was "fire locking" on me 1/3 of the time. wouldnt work and give me a 5 sec CD instead
random comet
ooh... thats garbo
lost horizon
Not something melee has ever had to worry about really
Yeah, just don't cast during quaking
If the quake hits as you're casting it won't go on cooldown
But if you're channeling it will interrupt the channel which sucks ass
frosty obsidian
!essence
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
frosty obsidian
!azerite
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Azerite overview: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o
cloud lichen
https://it.warcraftlogs.com/reports/Tpta2xJkD7rCm3yG/ hi guys, i need some help. I feel like i'm improved a lot, but still my logs sucks. Can anyone please spot errrors i'm doing in order to improve? i'm icèrain
arctic walrus
line up your 2nd set of cds
you refresh bleeds during tb which in of itself shouldn't happen quite often
cloud lichen
i see, but i find myself in the situation of have to that
there is a way to avoid it?
modest tendon
You hold onto your vendetta for an extra 30 seconds
vagrant urchin
Hey guys, just killd Queen's court and now it's Za'qul prog time, any tips or suggestions?
- what essences should i take?
rigid mango
Blood + lucid + Vision
novel cargo
Would someone mind looking over the fmy logs to see what I need to change/do to improve using MA talent. (Kids interrupted mid ashvane/missed orga fight so ignore them) My guild suggested I changed to MA instead of SUB. I’m finding the change in opener and timings of CDs a bit confusing since I’ve played SUB since I started playing rogue. Gear/AZ traits are all simmed for MA talent.
winter moss
what is confusing you about the cd timing in ma
you pair them - done
which rogue shall we check?
novel cargo
Ancelia. Sorry
winter moss
playing with WV-Essence 
rather go with vision minor or c&s minor
dunno bout the 415 trinke bruv
flask would help also 
debuff uptime is good
novel cargo
And TB in vanish window or not? Seen conflicting - guide says in window. And yea Running WV was a stupid
Flask was only as it was a pug
Was “trying it out”
Cora simmed highest even with a 440 sots haste trinket
winter moss
so opener: mut - rupt - mut - gar - rockboi - vendetta - tb - vanish - env - mut (till 4cp) - env ....
galecaller is not so good on fights in TEP :)
and as you come across to pop your cds a second time
it's basically the same
mean basically thats what is in the guide
your opener
sorry for clunkyness am at work
winter moss
not to offend you
wtf did you do after tb
or what made you think tb would be right there
novel cargo
Put my face on my keyboard and just rolled apparently...
winter moss
i mean you do good through out the fight
distant lava
hey that's what I do
winter moss
second tb was clean af
pooled abit, refreshed bleed. go blast
nvm
last cast in tb was rupt
novel cargo
Garrotte opener is just muscle memory from using sub talent.
novel cargo
Okay, so change essences, revisit CD timings in which windows and planning dots for TB. Pray to god for a better coral or a font and stop sleeping on the keyboard?
winter moss
sleeping ond the keyboard is fine tho
you clearly know what you should do
sometimes not often tho you should question the when
but rest imo is gucci
bleed uptime ✅
not missing out on cds: ✅
not dying: ✅
what you can also do is to check some top logs
raz, vel, tisumi, all doing good work
arctic walrus
You know you have mastered this spec when you can type full sentences during prog pulls during down time
young portal
Looking at your annotation mac, CLF should be popped before Vendetta yeah?
young portal
Ah shit, I've been fucking up and doing it the other way round as well. Ty
winter moss
i mean diffrence wouldnt be to much
but that one gcd missing in vendetta could have been an env
young portal
Which is quite big in the grand scheme of things yeah, fair enough. Point noted, thank you
scarlet sequoia
😎
winter moss
glad if i could help
arctic walrus
Yeah check my logs 
rigid mango
Sneak peak 
arctic walrus
Top secret classified information sorry can't do
scarlet sequoia
all greens
arctic walrus
Thanks for the compliment but grey is my favorite color
What's your new name raz
On new server
scarlet sequoia
råz-stormscale
hidden bay
Hidden logs everywhere 
arctic walrus
Smh you beat me in logs now too
hidden bay
arctic walrus
Not allowed to give advice
scarlet sequoia
smh
arctic walrus
Raiding next week it's over for you then
hidden bay
scarlet sequoia
arctic walrus
I'll beat you with 150 ms, apping to cyathursday
scarlet sequoia
oof
strange python
Yo how do you guys sim M+ gear on fort?
rigid mango
I don't.
jovial canopy
does anyone else have an issue with leaving stealth as u shroud which then ends shroud? have a few clips all similar to this
winter moss
/cast !shroud of concealment``` I've had 0 issues doing that
jovial canopy
its doesnt make sense as stealth is required to use it..
rigid mango
Dunno, I just press it and off it goes 
jovial canopy
having a macro shouldnt make a difference? o.0
winter moss
it makes a diffrence
i mean ngl /cast !yadayada is the oldest macro ever
as it prevents cancelling skills by accidental key press
dusty crow
(using subterfuge) do you guys get a 20+second rupture before you start the vendetta window on pull?
ie: gar,rupture,gar,mut,rupture,CLF,vend,tb.............
then you dont have to reapply rupture during vend
winter moss
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Guide: http://www.ravenholdt.net/assassination-guide/
winter moss
dusty crow
the guide clearly doesnt
i can read
but the guide doesnt mention rupturing during vendetta
dusty crow
if you use that opener, do you reapply rupture during vendetta? or let it run off and reapply after?
winter moss
re-apply when ever 4.2 sec
dusty crow
that would also be within your TB window of your vendetta
winter moss
talking m+ boss fight i assume
dusty crow
raid opener
winter moss
doesnt matter
tropic ocean
? with normal opener
you won't refresh during tb in opener
but after
and yes during duration you will need to refresh during tb sometimes but as long as u fit 2 envenom in at least you are fine
winter moss
should happen 1-2 times over the course of a 2:30 fight
that you need to refresh at the end of tb
or during
languid shoal
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
tough dome
what is the best way to sim for m+ as opposed to single target? Unclick Nazj button and change the amount of enemies around?
ember rover
rigid mango
Just go 3 ss 1 eb + any decent traits and stack mastery as high as possible and crit yo 35% ish
mystic dragon
Is 3 eb too much cleave for a week like this with all the extra trash? Currently have 3eb, 1 ss, 1 DD, and 1 TTK
rigid mango
Dd is garbate
You could maybe use 3 eb this week
But even now I'd value 3 ss super highly and stacking eb after it
mystic dragon
Yeah and normally my guild groups pull pretty large to accommodate our fire mage, I feel pretty limp with shrouded for some reason, what’s a comparable trait to go alongside 3 ss, 1 eb?
arctic walrus
1ttk 1 bbi
mystic dragon
Gorak’s has shrouded on it? Sorry, I’m afk right now
arctic walrus
yes
short arch
3 ttk, 2 ss, 1 eb fine for now or should I aim for 3 ss instead
rigid mango
More eb = more aoe, but lacks ST, wouldn't go above 2.
Bbi = potentially bonkers on aoe or ST, really good but slightly inconsistant
TTK = some prio, good ST, alround good trait for w/ever
3 ttk is quite meh
dark crag
If in doubt go 222
rigid mango
Bingo
tough dome
Cool thanks, so avoid dd in m+ all together?
dark crag
Yes
tough dome
appreciate the help 
scarlet sequoia
np
solar crest
Hello gents, is Crimson Tempest pog for m+?
rigid mango
Nope.
young portal
Gash
rigid mango
Undertuned and never used
solar crest
seen some people use it, thats why asking
rigid mango
Well, they shouldn't.
solar crest
aight, thanks 🙂
glass aspen
can anyone give me tips on using coral and font in my rotation?
arctic walrus
Pins and #tc-updates
glass aspen
1thank you
strange python
hi guys i only got 1 double douse , but 3x shrouded , should i go with 3x shrouded build ? ( for raid)
arctic walrus
Sim yourself in topgear on raidbots
winter gale
Ok. So for Coral+ Font usage. I use Font 5 seconds prio so I can use prepot and stealth? And when useCD is done I use Coral. When do I convert Coral then ?
I just got that Font trinket and I know like million ppl asked already 😄
Oh, someone above just asked :D. Ty ty 🙂
empty tide
ye just pull coral on vendetta
arctic walrus
what are your other traits
rancid bobcat
what are people using for dungeon essences?
cloud sandal
BOTE, lucid, conflict
rancid bobcat
i've got r3 everything
arctic walrus
can you replace your np at all
rancid bobcat
any suggestions for 2 dungeon trinkets?
cloud sandal
probs coral dead eye
rancid bobcat
coral feels even worse than on outlaw
mainly cause it sticks you on 1 target
and then there's the improper rollover stacks
steady owl
polar cape
In m+ i use coral like a mfd
rancid bobcat
hmm, guess it does
idk, there's still the weird issue of rollover stacks too
well inkpod might actually be pretty good with spreading by fok
fierce hound
Question for M+ , should I focus more on SS traits or EB? My current m+ traits are 3xEB , 1xSS, 2x Ttk ,
Nvm I managed to find an answer above !
pseudo hamlet
How good are the mechagon rings? I've got a few ~430 rings, some with sockets. Not sure if I should go for them.
drifting cloud
better than that
chilly marsh
mechagon haste ring is broken OP
160 free haste 100% uptime
its like 3 extra sockets
timid python
what talent build should i go as assassin this TB/PB or Exg/crmison?
rigid mango
first
cloud sandal
what is good overall m+ dps?
rigid mango
Aim for 40k+, 45k+ good, 50k+ exceptional, hard to gauge with the amount of variables and dungeon to dungeon dps, but yeah
rancid granite
Is vers any good for m+ ? Got 34crit 38mas and 17vers, with my ‘best’ gear... or should i switch to more crit?
sick eagle
Any assass changes that we are gonna get in 8.2.5?
@rancid granite depends what traits you have
but crit softcap with EB is 33% iirc
rancid granite
@sick eagle currently running 2/2/2
sick eagle
when I play assass I got 3 SS so I go full Crit mastry but since you have to you can prob go for vers but mastry is still really good for Deadly Poison
rancid granite
@sick eagle i dont have the right pieces for 3xss atm... just switches from 3xeb, 1xss to 2/2/2. Gonna try it with these stats, otherwise trying to use more crit/mas gear (rings mostly). I felt kinda useless with 3eb
rancid granite
Ye, im fairly new in m+ maybe thats my issue too :d
sick eagle
if I had perfect traits I'd run 3SS 2EB 1TTK/Blightborne for Forti and 3SS 1EB 2TTK/or 1NP/or 1Blight borne for Tyran
rancid granite
Praying for gorak shoulders next reset! 🙂
rancid bobcat
430 socketed mechagon rings i wish 
shut garnet
mechagon will be m+ soon so 455 socketted are on their way 
that shit would actually be bis until the exp after next
rancid bobcat
gonna be lame
stray zodiac
how do i use BoTE at pulls????
empty tide
If you meant ST , before your vanish
grave trail
do you guys switch gear to triple echoing blades + triple scent of blood for M orgozoa
?
deft nymph
boss dmg is more valuable imo
if you're not gonna go outlaw i'd stay with ST pumper build
but if your raid needs help on adds and you're not going outlaw for some reason i suppose an EB spam build would be good
sullen pagoda
u need aoe on orgozoa sure but not so much that u do 0 ST lmao
cloud sandal
what are best m+ trinkets?
dont have coral atm running 445 dribblign adn 430 spyglass socket
also have 440 tiny electo socket and phial
rigid mango
Sounds aight
young portal
I know spyglass is very good, seen a lot of debate over the second though
rigid mango
if you can't pull very organised with coral, it's not super good on fort
it's better on tyr
You don't normally get more than 1 coral with a vend on fort bosses max, I normally don't even get a single one or the first few seconds of it
however
If you can put coral on the target dying last and you're playing with a confident group, you can gain yuge stacks on a pack, and then have 1 sec downtime before next pack to get stealth off
and then open with a huge amount of crit, which is super good
cloud sandal
hmm alright
been running hc eternal for a few weeks with bonus rolls
no coral yet
sitting on 40% crit
but only 1 EB
so thats unfortunate
rigid mango
I mean I play 35% crit ish
but stack my mastery sky high
Since I'm running more SS and TTK
sullen pagoda
doubt u will get people for loyal in dungeons
cloud sandal
Flat mastery looked like the best instead of DD
rigid mango
Yah for sure
cloud sandal
I really need BOTe
sullen pagoda
wait loyal is in the row with NP, idk personally id rather go NP than loyal
sullen pagoda
solo loyal is pretty weak
would rather have the np dmg so u can at least delete emissary in packs
rigid mango
He already has 1 NP
2nd one would just be DR on the value
and the mastery scales w nearly everything he has
I'd stick to mastery tbh
rigid mango
Like, I didn't think it was "much" better
but bote is genuinly a huge diff to iris
It's good for every aspect of sin
cloud sandal
Ye but loyal and np are trash
sullen pagoda
in the end both are just trash and its picking between two trash ye
rigid mango
I think 1 NP has niche uses
in high tyr tos/kr
it's quite aight
but everything else it's v meh
cloud sandal
Also quick question, poison bomb or the fok talent? When do i keep spamming fok and when do i rupt or envenom
rigid mango
PB
And with 1 EB it's like, 11 targets you need before you fok spam
so nearly never
cloud sandal
Alright and do i just rupture everyone or do i envenom spam, in the keys i’m running i feel like the rupture doesnt get its value sometimes
rigid mango
You need 4-5 bleeds for inf energy dependant on haste
But you wanna keep them up, and just slam envenoms
cloud sandal
Bleeds as in garotte or rupture
rigid mango
Well
You open w 3 empowered garrotes, but you don't refresh them as garrotes
Unless they're also empowered, i.e vanish
rigid mango
Bec un-empowered garrotes are pretty useless
- they don't give the 2nd part of VW like rupture does
cloud sandal
Ohh shit okay
rigid mango
So you can "rupture snipe" low hp targets
cloud sandal
Thanks alot man
cloud sandal
Thanks
sullen pagoda
just go with what sims the most for you 🤷🏿
rigid mango
Don't try to compare yourself to others
Your stats are personal
There's too many things that affect how stats are weighted to you compared to others
winter gale
This is what sims best but maybe I need more haste so I can aim for a specific haste item. If u get my point, dunno how to explain it better 😂
sullen pagoda
rogue stat weights are very very close to each other and just 1 different item can make everything sim different
theres no " go this for this"
winter gale
Ok
I guess I am good since 2 same sims told me to change socket once and once to keep it like it was.
To make my question simple as it can be...I was curious is life easier if haste is 25+%
sullen pagoda
In a lot of cases those changing sockets doesnt really impact you that much
like swapping between best and my 2nd best for ex isnt even 50 dps difference
so personally i just roll with crit so pieces are good for outlaw too if im feeling like playing outlaw
winter gale
U see, I also play outlaw sometimes so I got myself a good advice that sim wouldnt tell me :P
sullen pagoda
hehe
dark crag
Crit gems are usefull for all specs and also m+
I socket haste in pieces i only use in raid like benthic. Everything else gets crit
All gems+ench sim results in a mix of haste and crit for me
If the other raider finally trades me the court mythic ring with socket it probably shifts to full haste
I am waiting since wednesday
topaz blaze
What talents do i take for M+
rigid mango
2212221
scarlet escarp
alright so if i have shrouded suffocation on 3 pieces of gear the only time i should use garrote is in my opening rotation then after vanish? not sure if i read what you were saying right
rigid mango
What?
You still use garrote as usual
Just that it's part of your vanish usage since that's what it's used for when running SS and Subt
sudden ocean
scarlet escarp
alright i was half asleep when i read that ealier and it only slightly halfway confused me but if youre running double dose on 3 pieces of gear do you actually switch to the master assassin talent and open from stealth with mutilate in your opener and then envenom out of vanish with 4-5 combo points?
ruby notch
is the ring set from operation: mechagon viable for m+?
lost horizon
You don't really want haste in keys
@scarlet escarp the swap to MA isn't necessarily dependent on having 3 DD
You can sim it out to compare them, but yeah you can swap to the mut first opener with MA
And you wanna vanish envenom during TB+vendetta
Can also vanish TB->env
scarlet escarp
i actually tried the 3 dd thing a couple days ago and i just couldnt pull dps like i was with what i was running with maybe it was just a different play style than what im used to
lost horizon
You kinda do the same shit with either set up tbh
Outside of vanish you can aim to mut more inside envenom buff than not when using DD but that's all that really changes
scarlet escarp
i havent really had good luck with gear lately but if i have an option of having nothing personal twice over double dose twice ........should i stick with the DD x2 or NP x2.....maybe i should sim it
but ive also had an issue lately trying to sim myself
and getting some azerite something blah blah blah error
scarlet escarp
pretty sure it is ill have to check shortly
yea my simc addon is up to day and i tried again and still got this Setup failure: Unknown option 'azerite_essences' with value
lost horizon
Post a screenshot
scarlet escarp
lost horizon
Just use raidbots
Your add-on is up to date but your simcraft application is probably not
scarlet escarp
ok im slow i wasnt paying attention and didnt see a new version was available to DL when i opened the SIMC program ....😒
lost horizon
Honestly I wouldn't bother with the actual application
Just use the in-game add-on (which you should be anyways) and raidbots.com
Unless you're either developing the application or doing serious APL tinkering there's no real reason to use the actual application anymore
lost wharf
Is there a specific pot we wanna use? The crit one seems good, but everybody seems to just use the one that deals passive damage. Is that because it is cheaper or because it is actually the best one?
arctic walrus
Is it better or the best one to use 
Unbridled fury is the better and best one to use over crit pot
lost wharf
I meant cheaper, I brain lagged. Corrected it tho and thanks for the answer
And the agi pot isn't good either? (at least not the single target one)?
mystic dragon
It takes a lot of Agi to outweigh all the other secondary stats, like the boost from font is the only real significant boost that focuses on upping your agility
daring olive
Tbh its not really needing more agi on the pot, you have a 25 second duration on the agi pot, so it sucks compared to a 1 min unbridled fury
tropic ocean
it depends on what you want to use it for
e.g. I used agi pot in delirium on zaqul for the burst dmg
🙂
overall its weaker though
daring olive
I mean, if you're in delirium, why would you want more agility, and not 1 minute of increased Unbridled fury procs since you have increased haste 
rigid mango
I think agi gives more damage for the echo iirc
daring olive
2.5k agi most likely wont make or break an echo kill tbh xD
rigid mango
I mean it wont, but on prog I can see why people'd use it
daring olive
You're already saving everything for the echo, it's a waste to use a 25 second pot over a 1 minute
rigid mango
I mean, does using the other one making killing zaq any easier?
daring olive
Considering you use it to push during Punctured darkness, yes
rigid mango
Wont be the matter of killing the boss either way
If you want more consistancy on the adds, you use agi, if not/don't care or whatever, you don't
There's no reason either is better than the other
daring olive
👍
lucid garden
Hello, I was wondering if someone might be able to help me out and catch me up to speed by any chance? BLUF: Came back to the game after not playing for over a year, close to 2 years. I mainly PvP'd and arena'd. I would appreciate it if someone could help catch me back up to speed and help me with a way forward to get my feet back under me and get back after rogue PvP. Appreciate the help!
dark crag
But as a start get lvl 120, do the war campaign, do nazjatar and mechagon, do wqs and m0 for starter gear, do more wqs, maybe low m+/arena/bgs for more gear
From 0 into arena can work if you have mates but with pugs it will be hard
rigid mango
Ehh
rigid mango
3 ss 1/2 eb + ttk + bbi
fading ocean
kk
fading ocean
if i respec my gear i can have 2 ss 3 twist 1 echo
rigid mango
That's aight
fading ocean
and 2 OP
rigid mango
stack crit to 35% and mastery sky high
fading ocean
okie dokie
rigid mango
p much it
rigid mango
If you can p much guarantee getting full cp fok > env > fok > env > fok > env
it's a lot better
fading ocean
does it change at all with fort/tyran
rigid mango
but in this season you don't really
ehh, nah
You change more dependant on dungeon or other affix
fading ocean
alright
im so bored of retail i MIGHT respec sin
to make the game fun agajn
but i only have 430 daggers
rigid mango
Spyglass is giga for sure
fading ocean
yeah i honestl dont even like it as outlaw
feels shit to use, feel obligated to use bc 450
rigid mango
You want to put it on non-prio target and stack sky high and restealth into next pack insta
get like, 18-19 sec of crit
into new pack
or do on prio
but that's jank af
loses a lot of value too if u don't get 2nd vend with it on bosses
like you probs wont on fort weeks
fading ocean
hmmm that’s a good point
rigid mango
+- outlaw
If pulls are good you'll go over outlaw
if they're jank and clunky, sin suffers more than outlaw
fading ocean
and if i dont have r3 blood? 
rancid bobcat
For those of you using coral for dungeons how many stacks are you getting per pack do you feel
Feels like I never get above like 5
And average around like 2
dark crag
Maybe the keys are not high enough and stuff dies super fast
rancid bobcat
was doing pug 18s which is about as high as pugs go
bleak spoke
Make sure you’re targeting your coral target the autos stack it pretty fast
rancid bobcat
i don't wanna make mouseover macros 
is there any way to prevent the 2 stack reset shit
driving me crazy
actually do the stacks even add up properly in the first place?
or does it always overwrite with the new stack amount
too busy doing the dungeon to fully pay attention
rigid mango
Huh?
rancid bobcat
so i've been noticing that i'll have like a 5 stack coral buff active on me and when i proc it again, it goes down to 2 stacks
is that's just what's supposed to happen?
rancid bobcat
i mean, that's what i'm talking about. is that the actual functionality
rigid mango
I mean, I don't see why it wouldn't be
rancid bobcat
i remember one of the early videos i've watched on it, a guy talks about maintaining big stacks if done right
hmm
fluid falcon
Is nothing personal overvalued in sims? It’s telling me to go a second nothing personal instead of a second double dose
rigid mango
Link it
rigid mango
Bingo.
fluid falcon
ty
round nimbus
So quick question. Assuming all essences are rank 3, what are the ideal ones for raiding?
hidden bay
clf+lucid+Iris on ST
lost horizon
^sim to be sure, can vary for your character
round nimbus
So I am still new to the abbreviations. What are clf and ST?
hidden bay
Condensed Life Force, its the raid essence
rigid mango
condensed life force and single target
round nimbus
Ok thanks
robust river
Clockwork Heart trait... Is it good?
It's simming well but looks gash...
TTK+DD vs SS+CLockwork. Says to use Ss/CW....
grave trail
wait wtf 40% crit
i only have 26% crit
is that too low for as?
i got coral 415 which i use instead of tempest for raid
and ob the boots and bracer
someone rate k thanks
grave trail
so how do i sim properly for m+
scarlet sequoia
you dont
grave trail
just stack crit?
scarlet sequoia
just go for crit and mastery
mainly crit till at least 40%
use your brain to speculate upgrades etc
no way to really sim it
grave trail
gotcha, hey so do you think its worth to change for aoe build on m orgozoa
just to have big numbers
scarlet sequoia
yes
scarlet sequoia
yeah bote major, lucid minor strife or purification protocol minor
grave trail
i know in general is lifeforce with dreams + iris secondary correct?
ok thanks
better farm it its only level 2
i dont like pvping that much lol
scarlet sequoia
ah i mean
if your guild is enough add damage
you can just go full single target tbh
its more boss dmg
grave trail
numbers feel so bad tho and i feel in the last phase since theres like 6 adds at time
aoe is kinda good but you're right
scarlet sequoia
yeah i mean i usually just play m+ stuff but with benthic items equipped
if you play 3 twist the knife your boss dmg is gonna be quite insane spamming fok > envenom
rigid mango
I mean, it's really quite meh with 3 ttk still
not using muti on boss is a huge dps loss for the 1 target
sour wasp
yeah but muh parses
stuck knoll
Yeah muti + dd is much better prio
rigid mango
The diff is quite huge
if u wanna parse just go ape eb build
Spin 2 win
make most of your group cut down on aoe so you can have perfect add transitions where you're allowed to fok for entire p1 and most of p2
doopid damage
scarlet sequoia
thats why i said if your guild has enough add dmg you can go full single target
🙂
but if you lack add dmg you can still do good boss dmg with the other gear
raven mica
or just play outlaw
rigid mango
It's the TTK build but slaps harder
1 use for sub this entire tier
Would be exactly that
rare pond
Does feint work for arcing in orgo?
rare pond
thank ye
steep obsidian
it does mitigate pervasive shock though i believe which can line up with the arcing and burst ya down
swift moss
How long does it take to get conflict and strife rank 3?
drifting cloud
4 weeks at 1.6k if you have r1
swift moss
if I have rank 2?
drifting cloud
3 weeks
drifting cloud
well its not
deft nymph
i feel like they could've just let 2400+ people get all 15 the first week
fleet whale
Not as bad as BoTE imo, well, i guess it depends on how you look at it
shut pasture
imagine I'm fighting 10 roughly same HP mobs
imagine I get 4-5 CP every time i FoK
is it worth to rupture them all?
sour wraith
4 bleeds is enough i believe
cobalt pelican
if they will live the entire course of rupture yes it is a gain to have rupture ticking on all of them until pack size scales unreasonably
proven wasp
is it better to use r3 blood or beam in higher keys?
shy dust
Blood is considered better
topaz blaze
When should i pop Coral in a boss fight?
arctic walrus
With vendetta
topaz blaze
Cheers mate
How many stacks should i reactivate it on?
Also what talents should i run for M+?
golden plume
MM+ => Subterfuge with atleast one SS
sudden ocean
@rigid mango no you go DD on org because it sims higher than ttk IDIOT
t. green parsers
golden plume
@grave trail If I remember correctly essences only benefit from Versa
crisp shard
yo what prepots do you guys tend to use? I trialled unbridled fury for a bit and it felt alright
greater agi still best?
visual topaz
Hi, my dps is shit. Haven't played much S3 so don't know what's the problem. Could some1 push me in the right direction ? https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/wTqtc7XJ4HZb9MFFGyicrT https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-gb/character/eu/draenor/twerksteve
tropic ocean
echoing blades is bad for st
get benthic
get better trinkets
get socketed items
get neck 65 and proper essences
visual topaz
What essences do you suggest ?
tropic ocean
crimson tempest is bad as well
visual topaz
Bloodmallet says Condesed and Lucid Dreams
tropic ocean
condensed-life force/lucid dreams/iris major/minor/minor (for pure st)
visual topaz
Ok
tropic ocean
for fights with a lot of target switching (condensed-life force/lucid dreams/conflict and strife)
visual topaz
Ok, need to rank them up
tropic ocean
ur talents are bad
use toxic blade use poison bomb
read wowhead/ravenholdt assassination guide
visual topaz
I have, thought TB and Exsanguinate difference ins't so big
well thanks, i'll start with those
obtuse sequoia
is this classs os fucking weak only during the lvling phase or its the same thing on 120 lvl?
cuz 2 fucking mobs attack me and im dead
scarlet sequoia
are u playing classic mate
obtuse sequoia
no fucking wod atm
drifting cloud
Its not a good lvling spec in looms
small thicket
Outlaw is much better to level as
distant lava
distant lava
no
distant lava
pseudo hamlet
I spent about ~450 mana pearls till I get the right bracers, gl hf.
tropic ocean
rookies
strange python
cba for this rogue anyway
i spent last pearls i had and thats it
rerolling anyway soon 
nocturne gate
its absolulty annoying i use the pufferfish its only a simdifference of 100~dps but i got one with socket so i dont give a fuck anymore to get oris but i guess this is something for #wow-general
rigid mango
Bingo.
cobalt pelican
bongo
rigid mango
mortal trail
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/tQCR99aEeJQV8s76Fg8ydu
any advices for siming higher i think my sim is kinda low with this gear
mortal trail
no luck on font
mortal trail
its good but it also depends on the raid too
arctic walrus
I mean it's assumed you have 4 loyals
cuz that's literally what's the most beneficial to everyone
rigid mango
Most raid groups should have loyals
shy axle
if i have ~ 12 stacks of coral and both trinekts, coral and azshara are ready to use, which one would you use first? eg behemoth after transition
shy axle
yes
the question is, which to use first if both are usable at the same time with given circumstances. The flatout agi boost or the crit gain, while getting the other one 20 secs later
arctic walrus
If you're asking this then you don't know how to use them together
Same rules still apply, regardless of what is off cd or not
rain pewter
Lies
arctic walrus
There's better 3-letter-named rogues out there
vestal wren
huh?
shy axle
@arctic walrus nah, i know it. The situation may be really niche, but can happen. My vendetta is ready shortly before i swimm to the second plattform, i got some stacks on the boss. Azshara trinket comes off cd as well while swimming. Boom, standing there, both there to activate
but it is okay, i figured it out from your comment
tropic ocean
the usage never changes unless you need burst on different targets (so u delay coral) other than that u always use them the same to get benefit from both during vendetta
iron heath
hey what traits for m plus?
vernal fern
A combination of SS EB and TTK
iron heath
and talents same ?
feral shuttle
Does anyone know if the damage from manic dread on zaqul can be cloaked? Thinking about standing outside the barrier. If not cloaked can it be survived any other way?
vernal fern
talents are 2212221
arctic walrus
Survivable with feint
feral shuttle
Ty that's good to know. @arctic walrus
molten mist
do the coral use pull the boss?
arctic walrus
Yes
neon tendon
Hey, can some1 post me his simc for the ingi helmet i want to test it for simulation
rigid mango
You can use gear compare if you want to see how much better/worse it'd be
neon tendon
i cant craft it rn
rigid mango
Yes, you can use gear compare
You stick your normal simc input into gear compare
and pick the engineering helm to compare your pieces with
neon tendon
Thanks alot
vernal fern
guys what's up with hidden blades ? some top assa rogues seem to be currently running it in m+
rigid mango
It's bad
vernal fern
yeah cuz its like giga pump but only once on pull when you have 20 stacks with bote but otherwise i dont really see the value
rigid mango
Unless someone's found something insane with it, it's not anything good
worldly condor
what azerite traits are you guys running on mythic Zaq? Ive seen some 3EB builds on logs that are interesting
Im still running my DD single target traits with BotE major, MOLD/puri minor
stuck knoll
3EB is literally nothing but pad pay 0 mind to them if you’re progging on the boss
If you’re running sin you’re just gonna want to play ST on boss
If you’re going downstairs blood + visions minor
untold stream
Do you know if the ilvl of the benthic boots increases the crit it provides ?
distant lava
it doesn't
untold stream
Okay, thanks
hollow chasm
guys, how do I convince the other two rogues in my raid to stop using leeching poison during orgozoa progress?
99% of the time I'm still alive when they're dead and I tried telling them cheat death is superior or even elusiveness
they think cheat death and elusiveness are noob talents for when you don't know mechanics and they must think I'm bad at the game or something despite doing better most of the time without ever padding
hollow chasm
I know, but they keep linking their healing logs
hallow coyote
Who the fuck uses Leeching Poison
hollow chasm
I'm just out of ideas 
hallow coyote
What smooth brain shit is that
tropic ocean
leeching is good
if u don't die
I used it on jaina, on zaqul
@hollow chasm
link em this
hollow chasm
on zaqul I can see how you can cheese with it, but on ashvane I really don't see the point tbh
I linked top logs before, but they focus on the one or two dudes who use leeching poison
it's crazy
today's raid was weird cause we were missing core raiders, but you see how one of them died like 2 min in
tropic ocean
leeching poison is superior to cheat death
if you play super clean and dont die
otherwise it isnt so if they die they shouldnt use it
hollow chasm
it really depends on your healers
near python
obv cheat death is dead talent if you "play clean"
but cheat death is super broken, because no one plays clean 100% of the time (:
tropic ocean
I mean asak rogue is attacking boss before tank
and gets meleed
cant help stupidity
weidu rogue is standing in tank soak
can't help stupidity either
lean veldt
question..
hollow chasm
I'm Weidu, btw, the rl told me to try soaking F
lean veldt
doing heroic EP... if my vendetta is up, and the boss is at 40 pct (i have coral + inkpod)
should i hold on using vendetta/coral until around 33 pct to take crit advantage of the coral for inkpod
near python
if you don't lose another vendetta, you hold
tropic ocean
that solely depends on how fast you finish the boss
lean veldt
yeah i wouldnt (boss would die before it is up again)
lean veldt
ok thanks
tropic ocean
@hollow chasm idk your raid plays very poorly in ashvane killing each other with coral cuts
standing in coral 24/7
getting hit by upsurge
but still no point in not using cheat death when you execute mechanics so poorly
scarlet sequoia
@hollow chasm you can tell them theyre stupid, if a boss has some sort of mechanic where cheat death can be useful you obviously play it, the only boss in tep you should use leeching poison is if you go down on zaqul
lean veldt
one more question..
not using shrouded suff (have master assassin). would i not open with Garrote?
scarlet sequoia
cheat death is far superior on orgozoa especially because you can use cheat death to soak the pools after killing the adds in case your tanks fuck up
lean veldt
the guide im seeing says open with mutilate until 4 cp, then use rupture
tropic ocean
riegeth rogue dying 2x to upsurge 1x to cutting 1x gets meleed cuz hes standing next boss like a monkey, 1 time he even dies cuz he stands on coral spawn
that guy needs to use cheat death 100%
scarlet sequoia
@lean veldt u mutilate in opener
get 4 cp > rupture > mutilate > garrote > tb > etc
hollow chasm
yeah, I think cheat death would help them a lot
I'll see if I can find some video guide and link them
tropic ocean
idk how your tanks position the boss but
lean veldt
ok
tropic ocean
pala and asak take almost as much dmg from coral as the tanks
idk they are standing in it 24/7
unholy dk too
scarlet sequoia
probably to pad healing logs 
hollow chasm
the DK tank has this fetish for never moving
scarlet sequoia
not to be toxic here but wtf is your guild lol
hollow chasm
LOL
tropic ocean
I mean I can see why they need leeching poison
if you take 8k dtps by avoidable mechanics
its good
same with arcing azerite
are they trying to sniper each other on purpose?
🤔
hollow chasm
I saw them die to that a lot but i've no idea how
tropic ocean
well if you have arcing you need to place a coral between yourself and your partner
or stack close to each other if theres no coral
hollow chasm
yeah, I don't know if its them or just the subs messing up
tropic ocean
doesn't matter
you position your character yourself
so if others stand bad you can still move
hollow chasm
man, I can't believe they think cheat death is bad 
tropic ocean
best advice I can give you is, always play like you're in singleplayer don't expect anyone doing anything
if you're in danger move yourself
if something needs to be soaked soak it yourself etc etc
hollow chasm
thanks for the analysis @tropic ocean
tropic ocean
if they don't trust you just make them come here
so every top rogue can tell them the same
some people only believe things when they are said by the very best players
hollow chasm
I'll try to have a 1 on 1 with each of them, maybe they'll see the light
hollow chasm
tbh if you look at the hps of riegeth even on the fight where he had top healing logs
I think he would have avoided more damage overall with elusiveness 
tropic ocean
or by wasd
I mean in ashvane, y it sucks sometimes u can't attack from behind but
thats not an excuse to soak 800k smth coral dmg
tropic ocean
I wouldn't call that pretty alright, but I guess each has its own perception 😛
hollow chasm
like on behemoth, a lot of times they're dead by the last phase
tropic ocean
some weeks ago when fight was hard the healers would've thrown shit at them
sand whale
can't convince people to stop being stupid you can just educate them
rancid bobcat
tell them they're not good enough to not run cheat death
cobalt pelican
leeching poison is the kind of healing that healers just do like.. passively
there's like no current content boss where leeching changes the strain on healing on you at all cause there's like no significant 'bleed out' bosses like jaina
heavy haven
perhaps i'm mistaken, but i thought during the opener when you get to the vendetta its vendetta -> TB -> vanish -> envenom into muting for more envenom
but i'm seeing some higher logs where they vanish before the TB
stuck knoll
Vanish before tb is the consistent safe play
Though I do think that it’s now just more worth with how much crit we have now + blood to tb van env mut env
vast forum
if running blood, you have 100% crit in vanish + blood, so it's always worth to vanish env-mut-env
but if you're running CLF, then vanish before TB might yield better average results, could even be a case-by-case thing
plucky sluice
for m+ should i be using unbridled fury or stat potion?
placid mulch
By the numbers CLF is better after opener rather than 1-2 sec prepull ya?
I was trying it last night on qc prog and getting higher numbers but no idea if it’s just feelycraft or if the idea might have legs
arctic walrus
1 gcd difference in your rotation will not make a noticable difference
drifting cloud
I remember a guy had custom sims for it and it was basically a wash
maybe it was like a 50 dps gain, dont remember the exact numbers
winter gale
When do we use Guardian after opener ? Wait on it to line it up or just on cd?
I found it, ty 😄
rigid mango
Bingo
robust river
Morning all! What’s priority order of Nazjatar pieces?
robust river
And I want socket with them all?
rigid mango
So if you're not high on pearls, getting feet first and then waist isn't bad
Yes, sockets only
robust river
K. Will keep fishing. Spent 160 pearls so far and don’t have any correct pieces with socket :/
robust river
Yeah. I only have 1x120 alt too which makes it slower haha
rigid mango
Ye.
robust river
Trinkets. What are seen in BIS for us? I'm running 415 Coral and 405 Font currently but simming suggest the inscription trinket is better?
Pufferfish seems to be simming higher on wrists than frost damage too (AskMrRobot)... Is that normal? I thought Frost was the go to?
spare dust
Raid heroic
distant lava
Its not normal
dark crag
Don't trust amr
distant lava
I would sim with raidbots
rigid mango
Amr uses its own custom apl that is generally considered worse
And isn't updated as frequently or as well as the regular one
robust river
The interface and best in bags features is so good in AMR though haha
Will run through RaidBots I guess!
rigid mango
Best in bags is top gear tho
robust river
Yeah but best in bags is like a 10 seconds feature rather than running loads of sims haha
young portal
Raidbots interface is decent too though, I'd rather run sims, wait a few minutes and it be reliable. Than use something that takes a few seconds and be unreliable
robust river
With premium raid bots
Can you choose unlimited iterations of gear when doing top-gear?
distant lava
12 million
robust river
Or is it still capped at 300k
distant lava
so not unlimited
robust river
How do you sim everything then? How can you compare everything if you can't actually sim everything together?
lost horizon
Use your noggin to eliminate the bad stuff
Got a pair of 400 gloves from some random emissary? Don't select them against 425 socketed benthic
robust river
But don't just Azerite pieces cause a fair bit of difference? Like a 400 vs a 420 would need simming there cause of traits no?
scarlet sequoia
link me your simc
robust river
For example these
scarlet sequoia
ill sort it for you
robust river
How do I link a sim? As in paste you the copy/paste data from app?
Sorry, I'm fairly new to Assassination and simming in general
scarlet sequoia
or just link the raidbots
robust river
Right, download SimCraft add-on
Got the paste string for Raid Bots
So I need to run a top gear so I can share raidbots or is there another way to shrae it?
rigid mango
Just run 1
scarlet sequoia
ye just run a quick one
then link it
just select like 1 extra item and its fast
robust river
Ok running now
Well in queue
Thanks for this in advance @scarlet sequoia
Once I sort of understand it I shoudl be good to run on my own 😄
scarlet sequoia
np
robust river
Can you share a raidbots account btw or is it one per person?
scarlet sequoia
u can share it i guess