and hoj/binding on top of it
#assassination
tropic ocean
to extend cc
rn I kidney it 5cp as soon as it spawns in middle of room and then we just kidney it again and it is dead mostly when reaching outside of circle
gray pawn
How do you get a second kidney? The hulk becomes immune to CC after the first one is applied.
ember rover
You cant do what oyu said, Aus.
The way the stun is tracked from what I noticed is, you can extend only if you use the same spell.
cobalt pelican
on wcl is fok avg cast dmg including the ebs that echo from it does anyone know
ember rover
As in, if you do 2x kindye, you can extend.
If you do kidney + HoJ, you can't extend.
If you do hoj + hoj, again, you can extend.
it has to be same spell.
gray pawn
It won't extend either.
However, once the add has been crowd controlled a single time, it will gain the Infuriated debuff which makes it immune to all further CC.
tropic ocean
yes you can
tropic ocean
we did it just yesterday
ember rover
It does extend.
tropic ocean
we extend
ember rover
But it HAS to be same spell ID.
tropic ocean
kidney+hoj
gray pawn
Hmmm, I guess I have never had to worry about extending it, We have always gotten it down in the first CC window.
ember rover
I haven't tried kidney + hoj.
But when we had monk legsweep + kidney
It didnt extend.
tropic ocean
afaik they only condition u need is to apply 2nd cc when first is still running
@ember rover found it for u
tropic ocean
stun was extended with hoj on kidney
y
u can stun him for max duration no matter what cc u chain
ember rover
It sometimes happened to us too.
Very rarely.
CC breaks after 2s of CC.
With nothing else affecting it.
mystic vault
it wasn't even ccd for a full second
I 1cp kidneyd .6s after the binding and it became infuriated .2s after the kidney
mystic vault
do slows count?
I guess it could be the shamans benthic bracers then
but that seems really dumb if a random proc like that can fuck up the cc
ember rover
Slows dont count.
shut pasture
@tropic ocean wait you can perma-stun him?
shut pasture
so before the first sun wears off chain it?
tropic ocean
yes
strange python
elusiveness for high kings rest tyrannical good idea?
sullen stag
any know the opener with guardian of azeroth
wide lake
errant shadow
for that hunter is the best, with binding shot
clear schooner
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > vers => mastery > haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
outer venture
on what timer do you guys start the azshara trinket? since you have to stealth and also pot before the fight
the 4 in the tc-updates cant be accurate since u cant stealth and pot anymore if you time it with pull
outer venture
I see
cobalt pelican
yee i always just cast a little before 5
but it really does depend how many players you have that 'mistime' their first solar wrath cast
night vale
Or when the console is clicked on this case :p
deft nymph
I do 7 cause I can't trust these fools
Plus I gotta stealth and run to the boss after
tropic ocean
@night vale for azshara trinket at azshara its different
just use this in azshara
night vale
Oh yeah I knew that... found out through my trial and error on azshara!
dapper wraith
I have to do 6 for my font because I can't trust these hoes
tropic ocean
@dapper wraith these hoes ain't loyal 😄 😄
dapper wraith
THEY DONT RUN LOYAL EITHER
cunning blaze
Wich second minor should i use on orgozoa if im not on add duty?
rigid mango
What are you using currently?
arctic walrus
Blood is not a good minor at all
arctic walrus
You can take iris or c&s
cunning blaze
Alright
bleak spoke
Cof is also pretty good
bleak spoke
Does conflict sim better for most ppl
rigid mango
nah it's p much equal to iris
cunning blaze
Yeah got conflict rank 3
rigid mango
but Since you can spread bleeds on orgo
bleak spoke
It’s pretty even between iris cof and conflict for me
rigid mango
conflict > iris
bleak spoke
With cof winning by just a bit
bleak spoke
My gear is kinda weird though
cunning blaze
Why CLF over blood major on orgozoa?
rigid mango
CLF for boss damage
bleak spoke
Clf does more tunnel damage to the boss
rigid mango
if that's what you're going for
arctic walrus
I haven't simmed in a while but I believe flame was 2nd behind iris
rigid mango
When i did it a while back cof was 3rd behind strife and iris
but they were all within margin
scarlet sequoia
fuck that bros
arctic walrus
Maybe I'll try again when I'm home but yeah all those 3 are all pretty close
arctic walrus
Raz just picks pp and calls it a day
scarlet sequoia
pp is insane what do you mean
rigid mango
🤔 pp
scarlet sequoia
youre trolling if u dont take it
bleak spoke
Is it actually best
scarlet sequoia
430 vers will never be better than pp on aberration bosses
bleak spoke
Probably zaqul too
scarlet sequoia
if u dont go delirium on zaqul yes
bleak spoke
I think I’m gonna get to not go delirium
scarlet sequoia
blood lucid and pp
scarlet sequoia
more pad on adds u know
bleak spoke
I’m supposed to go down on the second delirium which kinda lines with clf
rigid mango
Or just for kek reasons
arctic walrus
I only have rank 1 though 
bleak spoke
But I guess if I smack blood on cd I’d have it there too for a tb
bleak spoke
Wait will I
scarlet sequoia
slackers
bleak spoke
No I won’t damn it
scarlet sequoia
imagine not having all relevant essences at rank 3 or higher now
bleak spoke
arctic walrus
How many oscillators to get rank 3 from rank 1
arctic walrus
19 days 
rigid mango
19 days 
rigid mango
Sold them?
arctic walrus
Either sold them or wasted them on crafting some of the mechagon shit
tropic ocean
sold to npc?
tacit knoll
if i take master poisoner will it affect leech poison talent?
opaque tree
Protocol, is actually a pretty good minor essence for mythic plus
manic cairn
ripe portal
Sim is best option. Iris is a good normally. Maybe flame if you already have a ton of haste.
grand matrix
How do you set up dungeon slice to sim (for m+) ?
rigid mango
You can't, really
muted maple
its by the options where you set patchwerk/hectic add cleave
if you're using raidbots
just before you hit simulate, you'll have simulation options.
rigid mango
You shouldn't really be using dslice though.
grand matrix
ah ? i thought it was the best for m+
rigid mango
Not for sin, it's very uhh, innacurate
tropic ocean
cheers love
pliant apex
if no shrouded suffocation and master assasin , open with garrote ,mutilate , and then no point in using vanish ever in encounter right?
tropic ocean
pliant apex
im really confused, if no subterfuge or shrouded suffocation, should i follow 'No Shrouded Suffocation powers for Toxic Blade' opener or 'Master Assassin talented'
since im using master assasin
those 2 have different rotation
what category to follow
muted maple
you dont have any shrouded, you use MA. so you will want to use the MA opener.
royal lantern
tbh, why is stuff like exsang even in the pins....?
dapper wraith
@pliant apex I agree the wording is a little silly. you're running MA/TB so under the TB section you want the area where it says "Master Assassin Talented"
solemn meadow
tropic ocean
big gz
rigid mango
Neither, really
desert vault
It's pretty bad. I think I've had 3 of them drop for me at this point. Super annoying.
turbid osprey
Another farm clear, still no 2nd dagger 😦
And our dh just got his 3rd Gorak’s from the vendor to immediately scrap 😡
turbid osprey
I want to
celest swan
is it worth it to play BotE at Zaqul if the Echoes die "easily"? cause even with Vision of Perfection as Minor it sims 1,2k dps less then CLF
tropic ocean
you answered yourself
rigid mango
I'd play it regardless, having any wipes bec of lack of dps on them
is a yikes
better safe than sorry
celest swan
ye just try to udnerstand
i play vision for the vendetta cd but wasnt sure if BotE is a huge difference aswell
tropic ocean
its significant higher burst than clf
rigid mango
It means you have another cd for both
Which is super good
just use it for safe kills
it's prog, jank shit for parsing later
celest swan
true
rigid mango
Yeah, just no reason to play like that on prog
celest swan
but then i dont get people that play BotE but not Vision
celest swan
3 and 4 so i need vision for me vendetta, right?
celest swan
ok, but BotE has basicly a higher prio then vendetta?
tropic ocean
if you for both adds down you use it if you dont no point gimping your dps with it
err no?
celest swan
ah so rogue without vision dont go down twice
tropic ocean
Vendetta>>>>> bote
celest swan
but why would u not send them both?^^
celest swan
true, but i guess for progression its the safest to do rogues twice with bote/vision check
tropic ocean
the safest is to put your best players who do the most burst down and dont fail coming up to early
No matter what class
shut pasture
is there a TTK/SS helmet
tropic ocean
rogue is one of the best picks for it but if your rogues suck well
shut pasture
on azerite vendor
tropic ocean
@shut pasture irontide
tropic ocean
we tried fire mage as well but u cant send rogues with fire mage cuz
They blow em up
tropic ocean
less dmg
shut pasture
where
tropic ocean
wdym where
tropic ocean
ss trait does more dmg than ttk trait
So you will deal less dmg
however having less ss traits can also be beneficial in many circumstances so its down to your group
if your tank constantly chainpulls and you dont drop combat the value of your ss traits will decrease
tropic ocean
3 op
celest swan
@gusty kestrel why demo lock is good down their?
shut pasture
I have no 3rd op
shut pasture
I can only get 2 flames 1 op
tropic ocean
U usually dont need the crit from flames as you use spyglass ashvane deadly nav and generally high crit so
Op is for carrying boss dps
Definetely take op wherever you can
shut pasture
BlessRNG for ttk/ss helmet next
shut pasture
wouldnt it be better to just instantly double garrote into rupture for 4-5 combopoint rupture?
lost horizon
nah, 3CP rupture lasts till after your first TB anyways
garrote (3cp) -> rupture (0cp) -> garrote (3cp) -> TB (4-5cp)
works really nice
shut pasture
all them from M raid
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
dense cedar
@tropic ocean how many sin rogues in ur raid team?
tropic ocean
3
dense cedar
💪
tropic ocean
we use 3 on queen too
tropic ocean
I hope we can be more competitive when we get to kill
Rn we get to 2nd decree and cant compete due to kidney ans add cleave of locks shadows etc
(Dps wise)
doing like 35-40k while everyone else is 50k + 😫
celest swan
ye basicly they burst hard wiht cooldowns on echoes
is demo survival still op aswell?
tropic ocean
idk but ours had no issue
simple rivet
don't play sin much, but can anyone tell me the most desired azerite pieces
arctic walrus
For
sour wasp
za qul head, gorak shoulders, cepalohide / behemoth chest
simple rivet
thanks @sour wasp
drifting cloud
radiance shoulders arent alot worse than gorak
same goes for 1-2 gambled azerite helms instead of zaqul mythic
if you even meant for raiding, not m+
simple rivet
yeh, raiding
sour wasp
sure you have alternatives
cobalt pelican
blizzard actually scammed me out of 20k residuum
or i'd have gambled goraks tonight
sour wasp
for head, pvp head/ slithering/ engi one
sup @cobalt pelican ?
how did you get scammed?
sour wasp
wut
cobalt pelican
now i must wait
2 just straight didn't give residuum for some reason and i have no idea why
swift moss
You only get 10k for scrapping
swift moss
oh nvm he said 5 I am dumb
Do sims undervalue the mecha rings? Or is the APL just not using them properly? https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/ahTdqCHgUPbAtZWpeJdXkM
arctic walrus
Well, you didn't sim a 2nd ring in the set
swift moss
I guess that would be a problem
jovial adder
hey can cloak save me from getting knocked out when im on Echo of Delirium?
drifting cloud
I mean you get knocked out when your hp reaches 1
cloak isnt making you immune to all dmg
just most of it
lusty narwhal
Can cloak stacks
sterile ocean
How do i use Coral and Font of power? do i just not use coral?
lusty narwhal
You do
sterile ocean
ok
fading stag
Is the chest of Queen's Court worth going for? I heard undulating tides isn't that good of a trait
off
arctic walrus
It's not an item worth "going for"
fading stag
Is there a site where I can check specific azerite traits and which gear it's on?
granite rampart
i think wowhead had a way that you could filter azerite pieces by traits but im not sure how up to date it is.
fading stag
I'm just wondering how I should be determining what pieces of gear to go for in Heroic, or how to sim which would be better for me if I can
granite rampart
you can do droptimizer sims on raidbots to see which pieces sim the best for you. you can see what pieces from the raid would be good and which pieces from residuum vendor would be good.
typically though, it will be chest from blackwater and helm from zaqul from the raid, and gorak tuls from residuum vendor.
fading stag
Why the blackwater chest? It has DD but I thought the loyal was only good if multiple people had it
granite rampart
loyal is good for a lot of classes so its pretty common to have raid groups with 4+
fading stag
I know zaqul is good, but my guild hasn't gotten him down yet
is there somewhere in logs I can check what traits people have?
granite rampart
yea you can go to the rankings tab on any given fight and select rogue > assassination and youll see that traits that top parsers were using
fading stag
No I meant what people in my guild had
granite rampart
did you kill zaqul tonight?
bleak spoke
Ayy it died though Pog
dense cedar
that queen's court chest piece is really bad
flint jetty
Does the Simc APL take into account that Font of Power destealths you when you use it? At least on the sample sequence table it doesn't seem to.
tropic ocean
afaik you can see it from the ability log if your ma buff is active after opener or not
if apl uses font prepull
which it should according to tc updates
Mystler08/02/2019
Updated SimC usage of Font+Coral for Assa. This change seemed to net solid 0.8-1% gains depending on build and the best I've found so far.
- Use font 4s precombat and after that pretty much on cooldown as long as Vendetta has less than 20s on its cooldown.
upbeat geode
is there a reason why you could not just enter stealth after you channel font?
tropic ocean
no, you can
you need to channel it slightly earlier 5-6s
i usually channel at 6s to be safe cuz u know those boomkins cant max range their solar wraths ninjas
bronze spire
Has outlaw overtaken sin for EP? o.0
tropic ocean
no?
upbeat geode
not as far as i know
tropic ocean
why'd you think so?
upbeat geode
whats a decent dps to sim right now? im on 47.5K is this decent?
tropic ocean
its decent
most geared rogues are some where 51~52k
(thats with full benthic, good azerite and mythic weapons trinkets)
upbeat geode
i guess i'll have to farm more benthic then
verbal knot
how much do we trust herodamage? It says blightborn is our highest simming azerite trait
worldly iron
BBI is massive for assassination
just keep simming yourself with whatever azerite gear you come across, but avoid Undulating Tides since it has very poor uptime in actual fights
woeful hare
Is the crafted leather helmet from engineering worth getting for sin rogue?
tropic ocean
the engineering one?
woeful hare
Yup
woeful hare
I feel like i could not find any really good ones for ST from the dungeons
tropic ocean
hood of slithering loa or smth is decent
(if you have np in shoulders)
and u can get big helm from either pvp or zaqul
woeful hare
I do have helmet from zaqul at 435 ilvl
woeful hare
Will do that, thanks
If i would use the slithering loa helmet, is the swirling sands trait the one i should go for?
tropic ocean
yes sir
strange python
Is the shoulders from Radiance worth for st?
worldly iron
they're good, especially if you've got multiple LTTE in the raid
strange python
Oh my bad.. i mean the chest from Blackwater
worldly iron
it's good, especially if you've got multiple LTTE in the raid
tropic ocean
hahahaha very efficient 😄
tropic ocean
hood of slithering loa is +240 dps on zaqul helmet for me
but that probably will change once I got gorak tuls 🤔
tropic ocean
pretty sure its dependant on the np trait
i have shoulders with np trait now so the 2nd np in zaqul will give less value than swirling sands i guess
woeful hare
my only NP trait is in my helmet aswell
sullen pagoda
yea its pretty close to each other tho so we need to wait for boomkins to have it 
real bay
yoinked zaqul head on first kill 
sullen pagoda
i wrote its w.e for me since i got slithering like 200 dps diff max
our boomkin managed to press pass by accident ape
so other rogue got it
sullen pagoda
u mean p3 adds?
we didnt get there yet but they want me to play my lock on azshara 
tropic ocean
well lock is pretty strong on it
basically any ranged dps
I find myself gimping my dmg often by not positioning fast and good enough for the laser =/
I mean rogue is good on it and vendetta does a good job for needed burst dmg but overall cant compete with lock shadow etc. I just hope on the kill my dmg will even out and be somewhat competitive 😄
rn im like 10~15k or more behind on overall
compared to shadow/locks
sullen pagoda
im just kinda a bit annoyed that i farmed 65 traits and now ill probably go lock
at least i find destro quite enjoyable
went from rogue one trick to playing all kinds of alts when needed 
bronze kelp
thats how progress guilds work 😉
winter moss
got banned of twitch i see
tropic ocean
yeah progress guilds
unless you are top 100 pushing it shouldnt be necessary honestly
and most of the time the issue is not you playing rogue
but rest sucking somewhere
steady owl
maybe this is a stupid question. but when im playing sin on za'qul with purely st gear and im asked to kill the adds. do i use fan of knives or mutilate to build combo points? i got 3 dd
tropic ocean
I mean yeah, lets stack 8 shadowpriests on court cuz our dps are too shit
@steady owl which adds?
the small adds usually just die from everyone cleaving
steady owl
so the people who told everyone to go to the fear realm and kill them are just idiots then?
it just feel really weird to be asked to do that when i cant do aoe
scarlet sequoia
think they mean the summoners
i do the same job as you on zaqul and i never really touch the summoners much apart from rupturing
steady owl
they said horrific visions. but this was in a hc pug
scarlet sequoia
oh
yeah you fok
just rupture them and fok
once u have enough energy regen u can mutilate
steady owl
the boss?
tropic ocean
there shouldnt be any need for u to hard switch to summoners
unless they raid is dog
even in mythic i just rupture them
and for horrific vision basically same
steady owl
ok thanks
rigid mango
had a guy rage at me after he applied with "full St for tyr weeks n shit" and I told him DD was bad in m+
sullen pagoda
i see that a lot, i actually have a rule when inviting rogues i consider their rio -500
turbid osprey
Just play outlaw 9head
distant lava
My rule is I see dd you are gone
winter moss
^
vestal wren
maybe he is going for priority damage with dd
distant lava
He can go do that in a 10
Once I tagged into a 20 last season with a sin rogue playing 3 eb 3 dd
royal lantern
DD is best for ST, EB is best for aoe, duuuuh 
cloud sandal
Anyone ever goes ST build for m+ or is that just stupid
distant lava
Thats just stupid
cloud sandal
So for like azerite pieces to people collect multiple ones or do you reforge
rigid mango
Bit of both
placid mulch
That feeling when you need to take a week off to drop your reforge from 10k back down
prime geode
for m+ is deeper better than vigor ?
rigid mango
Nope
tranquil lodge
@prime geode both are competitive but imo deeper slightly edges vigor build out, especially when you consider how powerful it is with diver's folly proc.
turbid osprey
Sin channel bro
tranquil lodge
that too 
rigid mango
tame basin
Hey guys, I would like to know if TB has high chance to be missed (blocked / parried or something else), since I often notice that when tank turn boss when I use TB it just fails to hit
rigid mango
No
tame basin
Don't have TB debuff nor combo points
I didn't have this issue with any other ability
rigid mango
Parry is a flat %
tranquil lodge
nothing like getting your TB parried as you go into your vendetta window 
tame basin
I usually do, but not always I can especially if only safe place is in front of her
I was thinking of Ashvane
😛
hidden bay
quick question, if i play coral and inkpod; does coral get used in sims for 30%? i was reading a bit in the discord here but didnt find any clear answer
tropic ocean
you don't need to stand 100% behind you can stand side-ish and still not parry stuff
but yeah every spell has the same chance to be deflected if you attack from the front, you just notice it more when it happens to toxic blade 😉
@hidden bay you should be able to see it from ability log iirc if coral is extracted before inkpod pops
rigid mango
It uses it with vend, not inkpod proc
shut garnet
is 3ss 2ttk 1eb good on anything except kings rest?
scarlet sequoia
tos
hidden bay
@rigid mango can u help me to sim it correct?
rigid mango
Sup
hidden bay
the way i want it
rigid mango
I've been meaning to check it myself
It used to do what you said before, but it doesn't anymore so it's 1 of 2 options
tropic ocean
you can do it by custom script im pretty sure
probably fuu can help you out what lines to put it to let it stack and use before 30%
rigid mango
- It's simply a dps loss to not only use with inkpod
- Something with how font + coral prio is used fucked up the APL or something else to the point where it now prios coral with vend
Unsure which one it is, but the APL for sure uses it with vendetta atm.
So that's what I'd do
shut garnet
also if you're 2/2/2 and your crit is like 40% should you fan 2 targets or is still DD more damage theoretically
hidden bay
yy same, but lately i was playing abit with inkpod
rigid mango
Any EB makes 2T damage increase to fok at
If I wasn't hopeless at editing the APL and scared my inexperience would fuck something up and alter the result to not be truthful, I'd have checked it by now
Alas, I haven't.
hidden bay
sadly inkpod is simming 500 dps less 
cba playing with 2 on-use
but its all for the deeps https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/bULzcgXav77P9Yf2bGvHjz 
rigid mango
Well, font coral is sorta nuts, so.
royal lantern
font coral in raids is not that bad if you try it out
sounds more complicated then it is
raven mica
royal lantern
rank4 lucid in 3days
wet ruin
@hidden bay not sure if you got your answer, I noticed that the APL uses it with vendetta as well, then I tried custom APL to use it with inkpod at 31% but it is a dps loss, like 500-600 dps loss in my case, so using it with vendetta is better
tropic ocean
@wet ruin did it crit in that sim
wet ruin
the sim won't be different if it crit or not, as its not one iteration 😄
but I think in the one that was chosen it did crit, but I am not 100% sure
since the chance for it critting is > 50% I would assume the mean would be closer to the inkpod critting
@hidden bay and is bbi simming better than NP on gorak'tul, seems strange
sour wasp
how do i get my real overall dps in tol dagor if i operated the cannons?
rigid mango
Maths
rigid mango
Use head
sour wasp
ecks dee
rigid mango
strange python
did anyone elses WA get fucked up with the update? Says that my was packaged for classic and to install retail version, but I did install retail and getting same thing
rigid mango
wheat vigil
Sorry if I missed this in the pins but Loyal to the End... worth using if others in the raid have it? Or useless in all cases like the other EP traits
dire spoke
You can answer that question with a simulation, there are advanced sim options on raidbots
wheat vigil
I know, I’ve done that. Forgot that was the answer to everything here
rigid mango
It's very good if others have it.
small crypt
@sour wasp there are custom strings for details to filter specific dmg and so for the cannon dmg in TD
tropic ocean
@wheat vigil its not the answer to everything
severe sedge
does this look like my best setup for m+?
tropic ocean
but no human can tell you what trait is good for your individual character
tropic ocean
it may sound a bit harsh or "unhelpful" but it simply is the only accurate answer someone can give you
tropic ocean
m+ is more like 5-6 targets though unless you are pulling super big
tropic ocean
which you cant do constantly due to voids
other than that just use fuu's custom apl its pretty good
golden plume
Hello, can someone tell me when should i use blood of the ennemy in MM+ ? (playing subterfurge + SS)
shut garnet
i think anything over 8% is pretty eh for m+
severe sedge
ye
tropic ocean
afaik u use bote when u put ur bleeds to sustain energy
and start fok/evenoming
in multi target
shut garnet
if tb just came off cd, your bleeds are like ~6s to drop and vendetta is ready in like 10s should you hold onto tb
just generally actually, if tb comes off cd before vendetta and obvs the gap isnt ~25sec
swift moss
For queens court does detection use energy?
rigid mango
unless iyou'll lose a cast
viscid onyx
Do i choose dungeonslice for m+ sims on the website simbots?
tropic ocean
@vestal wren can u pin ur custom apl somewhere
rigid mango
When it's updated to s3 pulls it seems like a good choice
but it's s2 pulls atm, so not yet I wouldn't say
vestal wren
did in wow-general
barren cradle
tropic ocean
oh that'd be even better i suppose
vestal wren
i keep it in wow-general for now
i somewhat would be interessted to fine tune/update it a bit
but atm a busy setting up my laptop i got back from repair
small belfry
guys shoud i go for x3 ss or 2x DD and 1x ss ?»
vast forum
for what?
small belfry
m+
small belfry
oki ty very mutch, i was watching alot people with DD now was thinking some update happen or was because of the afix
royal lantern
DD is the best trait for raids, and you want too stack it for that
for m+ is crap
focus on EB/SS for m+
small belfry
ok awsome, ty for the advice unfortunely my traits dont let me have EB 😭
royal lantern
sin life hard too get the gear/traits for both content
small belfry
yeas im struglin alot, we need to have more than 1 set of gear, outlaw have those perfet items that got deadshot and ace up xd
royal lantern
eh, problem is more that you need different stats too get a REALLY good m+ setup
cus haste has really low value in m+, but in raids its pretty much the best stat
outlaw is more easy not only because of the azerite stuff, but because of how the outlaw aoe works with ST=AoE, wich makes gearing WAY more easy
small belfry
dam it, i neet to cut my haste xD the guides says its main stat~
trail anvil
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
royal lantern
for m+ you want crit/mastery
small belfry
ok ok ty very mutch «3 going to make those changes right now
for my weapons what enchants its better for m+
?
royal lantern
enchants will not make or break a key🤷
frigid briar
anyone killed mythic azshara? finding it hard to get good value from coral. changing targets alot, no stacks for P2 burn phase ect. any tips
I mean im top dps on all p3 adds ect, just feels terrible at times
frigid briar
lol, i'd take any input tbh, just anything that gives extra stacks in places ect, we making it to last phase but want to do more and have stacks for p4 lust burn
royal lantern
how many stacks do you get on average?
never saw m azshara myself sorry, hardstuck on ashvane
frigid briar
no idea exactly in each place, P2 start with none but you can put the trinket on boss before decree starts, not sure if worth and hold font for 20 seconds into P2
P3 I usually use it when ever I need to melt an add
and P4 Im usually low on stacks due to using to kill 2nd or 3rd and and not having much boss cleave
sullen pagoda
pretty sure its not worth using coral first since u want font with ur cds and u dont delay them so uhave it for first add p3
granite rampart
use coral in phase 1 on the boss your hitting and then crit conversion it for 2nd hulk. the moment first decrees end i use font and then put coral on boss asap in p2. build stacks on boss until vendetta on whichever tidemistress you use cds on and then use font, then target boss to do crit conversion when you can while still hitting add. then what i do after that i put coral back on boss and keep boss dotted the whole time to build stacks for first vendetta in p4
bleak spoke
Dotting it is enough to build stacks at an okay rate?
Or is there so much time that you get a good amount of stacks anyway
granite rampart
i dont get a ton of stacks for my first vendetta in p4. usually like 8-10. but on that 3rd tidemistress there isnt really a way i know of that you can really stack up coral.
but stacks can build off dot ticks. and i spend more time than others in my raid hitting the boss during 3rd add. to try to get her as close to 50% as possible
strange python
How much haste is too little/ too much in m+?
tawdry bramble
west trench
nice
sharp wigeon
what is the best potion for Assassination rogues?
sharp wigeon
thx. I saw a guide saying it's Focused Resolve
scarlet sequoia
thats bait
civic palm
or old.
regal moss
hmm missed that, thnx
granite rampart
it doesnt suck hard enough to not use it. pretty much every top parse on azshara is using it
lyric galleon
I just hit 65, do you guys do Memory and Crucible as minors and Focusing Iris as major in M+ aoe too? i feel like Memory works really well as the 3rd slot for aoe.
solar crest
Evening gents, i was wondering which dps meter are u using?
I am currently using Skada, but i recently tried Recount, and i noticed a little difference
lost horizon
Details is popular, I think heavier on resource usage than skada
solar crest
Recount was showing me 3k more dps, i was wondering what was the reason so i checked out all dps instances 1 by 1, i noticed that recount shows both dot and flat damage
while skada shows only flat
lost horizon
@lyric galleon BotE major if rank 3 is really good, lucid minor is kind of locked in, last slot is a bit variable
lyric galleon
@lost horizon Blood of the enemy?!
lost horizon
Yeah
lyric galleon
I have rank 3 iris, rank 2 bote
lyric galleon
I assume iris is a decent minor then.
lost horizon
I'm talking major
shy dust
Iris is a good major choice if you don’t got rank 3 blood
lost horizon
Iris minor is good ST, and the major is next best over BotE for AoE
lyric galleon
Thank you guys!
balmy condor
anyone know how to tell simc that you have a 65 level neck? been fiddling with azerite_essences and azerite_essences_available but its a lot of gibberish
tbh if someone wants to DM me their simc input with a 65 level neck I can probably use that too
grave trail
IS Focus resolve better than unbrindled fury for potion?
rigid mango
No
grave trail
thank you, what about for food
balmy condor
feasts
grave trail
so haste for me
balmy condor
interesting
grave trail
whats the best sim stat for you zine
rigid mango
Crit, currently
Has been for a long while, makes it easier to buy food for m+ and raid too
grave trail
gotcha one last question just to make sure, to figure out your stat you just sim "stats weights" correct
rigid mango
Yeah, but I wouldn't use it for gearing
grave trail
hmm wym
grave trail
ohh yeah i use top gear, alright thanks for help @rigid mango
rigid mango
Anytime 
tropic ocean
@balmy condor in ur sim c input just set ur neck to 65
shut garnet
youre gonna have to find the code line where it says
heart of azeroth level
im guessing 
tropic ocean
np man
scarlet sequoia
hello!
cobalt pelican
bye
desert vault
3x ss, 2x ttk, 1x eb or 3x ss, 2x ttk, 1x eb this week?
desert vault
heh, oops 3x SS, 2x ttk, 1x EB or 3x SS, 1x tkk and 2x ttk 😛
desert vault
man, my brain ...
ok, focus
3x SS, 2x TTK, 1x EB ---or--- 3x SS, 1x TTK, 2x EB
I mean the real answer is log off from WoW and see a doctor, but meh, what fun is that really
golden plume
is that even accurate ? patchwerk 4 boss target to simulate MM+ pack
rigid mango
@desert vault 2nd one
golden plume
playing with sub 2x SS 2xEB
rigid mango
It seems pretty accurate, yeah @golden plume
shut garnet
how many crit mastery rings are there
usable ones in bfa i mean
like what would be BiS for m+
rigid mango
QC and shrine
golden plume
so assa for m+ would be smth like crit > haste = mastery ?
shut garnet
so would the shrine ring 430 socket be better than waycrest ring 430 socket
for m+, theoretically
since vers isnt that relevant
rigid mango
@golden plume how did u get that from that stat weight 🤔
Vers is very relevant @shut garnet
rigid mango
Yeah, but you don't gear for that.
Haste is a near dead stat as soon as you hit infinte energy reg in comparison to the other 3
golden plume
by infinite energy reg u mean never be starved ?
rigid mango
I mean by you get enough energy reg to GCD cap and not be able to spend it faster than you're gaining
aka, 4 bleeds if over 11% haste, 5 if under 11%
tropic ocean
@desert vault depending on dungeon 3 eb is not really needed this week
personally i play with 3 ss 2 eb 1ttk atm
tropic ocean
so?
rigid mango
Why are you brnging it up then
fleet whale
SoB also has a crit mastery ring
shut garnet
dunno if i should lower vers for m+ now, im pretty much 39crit 7haste 35mastery 10vers
shut garnet
idk how much impact itd have if i got more mastery and less vers
rigid mango
Depends on traits
shut garnet
2/2/2
rigid mango
Then mastery's great, vers too for that matter
but I wouldn'tm drop mastery for the sake of vers
shut garnet
could also use plumage instead of coral in that case for gigapulls 
rigid mango
I would just value them very closely to one another
shut garnet
is phial any good btw i dont really see many people using it
rigid mango
Nope
fleet whale
It's not as good as it looks
rigid mango
With how sin scales with stats, generally damage trinks aren't worth it in aoe
It's not necessarily how good phial is, just how much better stats are for sin
shut garnet
so stuff like loaded dice, spyglass would outsim it by far
rigid mango
It'd be better for sure
shut garnet
basically anything that gives you extra good stats
rigid mango
Spyglass + stat trink is generally a really good way to go
Coral I'd regard as BiS, plumage, ttf'd lurkers if you can get it, and font are all good too
fleet whale
I've had good results from inkpod in M+ but it's a little rng
shut garnet
sim was saying inkpod coral is apparently my best trinket setup so im giving that a go but its a bit weird
tho
shut garnet
seems to only do stuff on bosses since most the time prio targets go down too quickly
and coral bis for m+ really?
rigid mango
Corals nutty, aye
fleet whale
well inkpod can get stacks on multiple targets when using FoK, and Coral is good because when a target dies, you get the crit buff from the stacks you had on that mob
without triggering a cd
shut garnet
didnt know you can multistack inkpod with FoK 
i thought itd interact the same it does with outlaw and bladeflurry
aka only put stacks on your focus target
fleet whale
nah, you can get stacks from other targets
grand matrix
Is raidbots working well ? it told me i have to play with Crucible of Flame as major for Single target
while i have Lucid dream r3
rigid mango
Lucid isn't great as a major
The reason it's so high up on shit like bloodmallet or herodamage where I presume you get your info from
is because the minor is stupid good for sin
The major? Very middle of the pack.
bleak spoke
Huh lucid sims pretty decent for me as a major
rigid mango
By not great I mean outsimmed by like
grand matrix
ahaha yes my info are from bloodmallet
bleak spoke
It’s just that most of the value comes from the minor and there isn’t any other minor nearly as dominant
rigid mango
all outsim luciod
grand matrix
and maybe because i have 450 gear with versa = boosted crucible
rigid mango
irrespective on versa gear you'd probably be simming CoF > Lucid
the biggest chunk of that lucid bar on bloodmallet is the minor hard carrying
esp r3
grand matrix
oh ok thanks
i'm trying to build one set for some dungeon like KR, TOS that have small pack
without EB
and i'm looking for the best essence ^^
fleet whale
It's pretty good for raiding too, CLF outshines it but it's still usable and even optimal in some bosses
grand matrix
everything good from it ? major & minor ?
grand matrix
hmm ok thanks for the advice
rigid mango
It's a huge step up from any other essence in m+
And as a side note, I'd recommend as many SS as possible in KR/ToS
grand matrix
also i've tried Crimson Tempest in some 16 / 17 keys (FH & Motherlode mainly) it's look descent
rigid mango
It's straight bad, but sure
It's a dps loss to press as a button
Compared to EB empowered FoK's
grand matrix
Hmmm but you have to use combo point when u're at 5 right ?
rigid mango
If you're at 5+ targets and you have no prio
grand matrix
and crimson deal like 7% on overall instead of poison bomb that deal like 3 or 4%
rigid mango
You fok spam and ignore CP
grand matrix
ah
rigid mango
Yeah well think about how much damage
3-4% is in the diff between the two
in how many CP you used to cast it
how many GCD's you lost of FoK
How much boss damage you lost
etc.
grand matrix
Ok i see and u still keeping up Garrot / rutpure on two mobs even when +5 targets to get good energy regen ?
rigid mango
You don't reapply garrotes
if they aren't empowered
So you keep your bleeds up with ruptures, not weak garrotes
grand matrix
ok sometime i use melt as NE to empower it
rigid mango
Yeah, if you use meld > stealth > 3x garrotes
civic palm
ShadowmelT 👌
grand matrix
ahaha sorry i'm french sometiems i have trouble with the spell name in english Mizerok :p
rigid mango
Although in a lot of scenarios suboptimal as the ramp up time is several GCD's slower and you might aswell just save it for utility + damage instead of just damage
Don't worry, miz is dumb 
grand matrix
Ok i'll take note of what you say, thanks ! just have to pray for my next azerite gear, i always have Ttk/ NP and Double dose on the same circle as SS
grand matrix
ok raidbots tell me to take it for patchwerk but i knew you lose many dmg if you don't take SS
rigid mango
Well, SS is super good for m+
And SS is also a hard need for m+, if you don't have atleast one you shouldn't be playing sin
grand matrix
yep i have one, other are on 420 azerite gear
idk if it's worth to take my 420 instead of 450
rigid mango
Ehh, depends on what traits your gaining/losing
rigid mango
yy
teal trench
Assassination good for mythics or not?
grand matrix
Ok nice i'm already using these for my "aoe" set up
rigid mango
That's what I'd run for every dungeon, p much
grand matrix
thanks again, i think i have to work my cycle on boss so cause i find it a bit low
rigid mango
Gravethorn hood w bbi + SS for KR/ToS
grand matrix
Ok i'll try that ! 🙇🏻
rigid mango
grand matrix
and it's time to farm the essence BotE
rigid mango
Have fun, next BG event week is 2nd october
grand matrix
thanks 😄
midnight belfry
does master assassin effect essences? Its worded like it would but doesnt seem to be
civic palm
It effects Rogue Abilities.
midnight belfry
thanks
fair relic
Is scent of blood worth it in m+ over twist the knife for fortified weeks?
cobalt pelican
sob is very bad and should only be taken if you have no other alternatives
exceptions might be if packs live stupid lengths of time to the point you can churn a higher amount of ruptures
fair relic
Kk thank you, sims were telling me it was higher so I was confuse.
cobalt pelican
in what kind of sim?
marble hemlock
Scent is decent for m+, but its worse for AoE than EB, worse for low-target cleave than SS, and about on par on prio-damage with TTK but requires much longer ramp-up and then is much worse on ST than TTK
So while its does all of these to a certain extent, theres always (much) better options to improve any part of your damage-composition
fair relic
I did it for dungeon slice to see what was my best traits for m+
elder gulch
marble hemlock
Dice. Ashvane one is awkward to use and seldom useful on any of the bossfights
cobalt pelican
ya idk i want to like coral but it always ends the dungeon <3% of my dmg and like 50% of the crit uptime feeling like it's not all that useful
having every single coral manual consumption be just because boss ttd <20s feels pretty bad, though i guess that problem might remedy itself if i did slightly higher keys
marble hemlock
Well, coral has the upside of also extracting the crit when a mob dies, and you can do some crazy stuff with it if the stars align
By extending and stacking the effect a few times if mobs die at the right times
The biggest issue with coral, is that it doesn't do anything for your opener on bosses
cobalt pelican
mm yeah i know, i just d on't really find that many packs where it's actually realistic
like i can maintain the crit buff for a decent while in siege
marble hemlock
And with the heavy focus on stacking SS again that we're seeing currently, coral doesnt really do much for that either since you will only be able to extract the crit by the time that SS has already run out
cobalt pelican
but in the majority of packs there's just not a way for me to get any sort of crit value out of it while the pack is relevant, might just be me sucking though
fleet whale
tbh i prefer spyglass way more than coral on M+
cobalt pelican
i'm at that awkward crossroads with my assassination dungeon gear now where i have a pretty passable set but if i want a 3ss set i'm basically aiming for a single residuum piece, while still not having the raid gear i need for the end of progress
i kinda wanna go get a bigger lurkers..
hot flume
Folks I've something troubling me. I'm playing with 3 * TTK (don't judge, bad azerites :D). While I would hold toxic blade until 3+ CP to spam as much Envenom as I can during TB window and take advantage of my traits, SimCraft is still telling me to TB on cooldown no matter what https://gyazo.com/d9308bf2d0386f8f45f8efb31e225eb0
Isn't it worth to hold TB to spam max Envenoms ?
Here is the full report just in case. Thanks for your help and time guys https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/7WgHCMes8RgtQg9oBnKKWy/simc
rigid mango
Are we talking m+ or raid here
Looks like raid, you should always just tb on cd
Regardless of it all
hot flume
Yeah it's raid
rigid mango
Then you press TB on cd, regardless of cp, energy or traits
bright tusk
Do you guys use crimson tempest in mythic+ or?
atomic willow
for M+ would you take helm with EB and SoB ....or a helm with EB and either DD or Undulating Tides
rigid mango
Sob for sure
shut garnet
does anyone know off by heart which dgs are best to have 3ss 2ttk 1eb, 3ttk 2eb 1ss etc in
sounds very minmax i know but i think i might have the pieces so why not
rigid mango
It's a really good baseline for everything, yeah
I'm seeing more and more 3 SS though
shut garnet
and when you g g r the boss as an opener, do you wait a second before applying 2nd garrote so u get a tick of the empowered one?
or just insta g g
rigid mango
g rup g
shut garnet
so u wanna start the fight with 2cp preferably?
rigid mango
yah
bright tusk
EB = Echoing blades?
So am I even supposed to dump my combo points when spamming FoK?
bright tusk
alright ty, It's hard to find this info elsewhere
rigid mango
It's what I'm here for dw
bright tusk
❤
wet ruin
is it actually better to just spam fok, are you not losing more by ignoring poison bomb and elaborate planning
wet ruin
I am assuming this should be with X mount of EB traits?
wet ruin
just one? even if you have lets say 2 TTK
lofty viper
i just got the pufferfish wrist benthic piece with socket. is it worth or should i wait for the frost ones
or are they pretty much same
lofty viper
okay, ty
fading sparrow
With benthic gear, is is better to upgrade my crit boots + socket from 415 to 425, or gamble for the frost gloves?
rigid mango
Probably not 425
And most likely RNG
I wouldn't upgrade last 5 ilvls before having all 4
vestal wren
420 to 425 is hella expensive, upgrade to 420 then gamble for other slots
fading sparrow
Sounds fair, cheers
digital shore
Guys, my azerite pieces are not great (1SS, 2EB, 1TTK, 1SoB, 1NP) and next week I am looking to get a 445 one from residuum. I only play M+. Should I replace my 420 one with SS instead of the 435 ones or do I aim for a second SS, lose 1 EB and replace a 435? I assume the latter and if so, what has the best chance for SS? Shoulder or chest?
arctic walrus
Which pieces have the sob and np
digital shore
I believe shoulders are SoB and chest is NP. Currently on mobile. I'll check it.
arctic walrus
Where's your 1 ss
digital shore
Headpiece
arctic walrus
Chest is a bigger upgrade, but a bigger gamble
digital shore
How much of one? If you know
arctic walrus
Someone with more knowledge can correct me, but I believe your best bet is only 2/6 with chests, while shoulders offer a 4/6 chance at an upgrade
I only considered pieces that offered ss/ttk/eb on them
rigid mango
Shoulders and helms have a lot of upgrades
Shoulders and chest are good from the raid
arctic walrus
ceph and blighted tribe are your only shot at a decent chest
digital shore
Is there a site where I can see them all? I ran a sim but can't show my gear without simc. Name is Cyraell. I'm gonna start raiding Sunday so maybe I get lucky. Thanks for the advice!
