#assassination
severe bough
lost horizon
But MA is better for pure ST when you drop all SS traits
And start running the better traits like DD/NP only
severe bough
MA feels so great to play with
vapid scarab
every single question you've asked, would be answered definitively with a 5 minute sim
lost horizon
(loyal pumps too with enough people)
severe bough
you just will have numbers
lost horizon
There's still a 'why' my guy @vapid scarab
severe bough
and no explanation
vapid scarab
why do you need an explanation for why something does more damage
it does more damage, you use it
lost horizon
The 'why' comes into play when you need to make decisions around comparable sims
fallow otter
(tbh i will swap for 10dps but i wont enjoy it)
agile oar
hey guys what's a good stat weight for rogue
lost horizon
Okay @vapid scarab this one is all you buddy
meager nebula
@agile oar
spark tiger
Sorry for trying to be social. Thanks for the help fellas
lost horizon
They're nice for a direction, but to evaluate actual upgrades always sim the pieces directly
meager nebula
in terms of stats, its always good to have a starting point
lost horizon
@spark tiger don't stress, some people get pissed off when people don't already know everything
Keep an eye on the pins though
vapid scarab
almost like giving people a generic set of talents when there are multiple viable ones that depend on your traits is also not the way to go
lost horizon
They'll answer most basic questions
vapid scarab
nobody gives a shit about people not knowing things
but give people a correct answer
tribal marlin
Subter feels easier to use
fallow otter
there are levels tho bro, some people dont care about that last 10% dmg
so they only need a generic reply to a generic question
vapid scarab
he didn't ask what talent was more fun or easier, he asked what is best
shy grove
what essences do any of you like to run on ashvane mythic
cause i cant decide between clf major lucid minor or lucid major
vapid scarab
and the best is to sim yourself, end of discussion
tribal marlin
What is best depend on your character
lost horizon
Even if the answer is just 'sim it' you can still be nice about it
fallow otter
^
vapid scarab
in what way was I not nice about it
lost horizon
You're very abbraisive, just look at the guy apologizing for asking his question
tribal marlin
A lot of people ask some question that can easily be answer with a quick simulation tho
severe bough
as squawkk said, there're levels
lost horizon
Absolutely, but point them to guides pins and sims or they'll never learn, and you don't have to complain when they ask multiple questions
severe bough
some people straight dont want/have no idea how to sim
or don't really need it
because they raid like, normal
vapid scarab
then they also have no need to use the correct talents
lost horizon
A lot of people don't
But if someone is looking to improve to any degree
I'd like to help em
vapid scarab
then they should sim their character
lost horizon
If I'm gonna take the time to respond anyways, might as well be friendly with the info
vapid scarab
it's literally that simple
lost horizon
Otherwise we become the cesspool that is hunter discord
vapid scarab
if they don't know how to sim, or what that is, then ask
shy grove
hey how do i sim my character
shy dust
The hunter discord is terrible it’s a joke
lost horizon
'do I need to line up vendetta and vanish?'
Go check the sample sequence the APL runs
Aka sim yourself
shy grove
hey my sim doesnt tell me to pool energy for toxic blades
lost horizon
Nah just give em the reason why
vapid scarab
teach a man to fish
shy grove
i wrote that guide
lost horizon
That's a really good resource for people who might come in unfamiliar
That'd be nice to have in the rules/guides channel tbh
meager nebula
i'll speak to richard about adding it into his post
lost horizon
I think there's a doc in there somewhere
But wowhead is accessible
Or well, better known
meager nebula
oh its already there
lost horizon
Is it the same guide?
meager nebula
not the same, but its a google doc
lost horizon
Yeah saw the doc, I guess that does the trick
meager nebula
yeah, most people likely skim over it
in relation to the whole "sim yourself" discussion, i think its fine to answer a majority of questions with that, but with new players they do tend to appreciate a bit more input in some answers to their question
lost horizon
It's pretty dense, but good to know there's something to point at
meager nebula
but obviously how everyone answers a question is up-to them
lost horizon
(the rules/guides post, I haven't looked at the doc tbh)
meager nebula
wouldn't surprise me if many people have 
glossy shoal
Anyone know if bgs or brawl is better for honor atm?
vapid scarab
I mean, would you rather answer one question one time with an answer that they can then use for 10 other questions, or continue to answer basic question after basic question with basic answer after basic answer
meager nebula
it depends, if its someone new to the class/spec i will direct them to the guide and then walk them through anything they don't understand
obviously a more seasoned player will be fine with the sim answer
vapid scarab
a more seasoned player would know that in the first place and not even ask it
meager nebula
there isn't really a right or wrong answer, it just depends on how you want to answer questions
lost horizon
This isn't a 'seasoned player' only discord
spice frost
Epic bgs can be good if you don’t get ashran. Personally I try for 1 win in each then spam randons
woeful minnow
epic bgs 🤢
lost horizon
I think it's valid to give the quick sim it answer
spice frost
The brawl is pretty abysmal honor but it’s easy
woeful minnow
just the chance of getting ashran makes it not worth even queuing
spice frost
I’ve been doing 1 win in it a day this week. Will be done this morning after work
lost horizon
But understand at least that people will always ask those questions
hazy iron
It's not hard, some people want to get better and understand concepts better if they're explained to them, something which a sim isn't going to tell you
lost horizon
Doesn't help to try to run them off
vapid scarab
answering in the most accurate way possible is not running them off
it is informing them how the game currently works
hazy iron
Simming doesnt explain why pooling is important dude
vapid scarab
that's what you do
vapid scarab
when have I ever said asking a question that has nothing at all to do with simming should be answered by telling somebody to sim themselves
hazy iron
like literally 20 or so comments above
vapid scarab
find me a quote, otherwise you're a dumbass
lost horizon
'every single question you've asked, would be answered definitively with a 5 minute sim' he literally asked about lining up vanish/vendetta, yet you felt the need to drop this kind of comment, I'm not bringing it up to try to antagonize you about it specifically, but what part of that is welcoming?
Or even accurate?
spice frost
Hey @meager nebula speaking of helping people, how do I view an apl? Like what the sim uses when. Know of a guide or something?
meager nebula
if you run a quick sim there is an ability breakdown of one of the iterations it runs
lost horizon
@spice frost if you use raidbots, go to the full html versions
vapid scarab
Judging by what I'm reading here I should be running ma instead of subterfuge too? Also what about master poisoner vs uhhh the combo point 10% damage talent?```
this is what he asked, I did not reply to lining up vanish with vendettaYou can see a sample sequence and the actual APL itself, which is just a ruleset for when to use things
hazy iron
no problem, dumbass
spice frost
Can only be done in quick sim? I pretty much only do stat weighs and top gear 😩
meager nebula
well no, you can check the apl in other ways
but it does give you a sample log to easily check through
split grail
Is Crit better than Haste now?
spice frost
Thank you though, I’ll look deeer today. I’m probably blind
lost horizon
@vapid scarab yet you said 'every single question', it's nitpicking but you're still being abbraisive
vapid scarab
@hazy iron if somebody is looking to improve their character, they should probably start simming themselves, I don't see your point
hazy iron
the context of the convo was being more helpful
sometimes simply saying 'sim it' makes no sense
bronze kelp
@hazy iron stop insulting people 😠
hazy iron
righto
vapid scarab
if sim it is the most accurate answer, then answer that way
if sim it is not an accurate answer, don't
meager nebula
okay, this discussion isn't really going anywhere, i would appreciate it if you all can respect the ways people answer questions, even if you yourself don't agree with it
hazy iron
@bronze kelp he called me a dumbass first
lost horizon
but mooom
meager nebula
also please don't insult each other
hazy iron
but thanks, noted champ
river hearth
i'm going to tip toe back to the outlaw channel
meager nebula
see you there 👀
do you still need to see where you can view a sample iteration @hazy iron or are you good
hazy iron
huh?
meager nebula
for the apl
vapid scarab
@spice frost
hazy iron
lol all good
bronze kelp
@hazy iron only read yours. But its not okay from both of you 😉
spice frost
I’m at work right now so can’t really look. Just needed a starting point for where to search. I’ll come back if I can’t figure it out. Thank you
split grail
So is crit better than haste now? I'm getting conflicting reports
quasi pewter
crit is better than haste if ur sim says so
shy dust
Sim your best gear combinations. It’s hard to tell you what stat is better when which when it’s dynamic and based on your gear and talent choices etc
split grail
I was thinking more along the lines of gems and enchants
Guess I'll jsut have to constantly sim with both options
vapid scarab
welcome to the game for the past 3 years
drifting cloud
just the essences alone put your stat weights all over the place, let alone the rest of the gear
median sand
I'm just not sure how people are getting a 4k jump on me around my ilvl
drifting cloud
im 41.5 at 425 with 420 dagger mh
severe bough
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/5btPhPzNMHsgHwriKgNxw1
i got 39900 but rn im about to hit the sack so i dont want to sim it
drifting cloud
its just better gear in literally every slot, its just not higher ilvl
severe bough
i'd say, benthic
balmy quest
Your trinket and azerite are hot trash, and yeah 2 benthic pieces is a fair bit of DPS
severe bough
tht bijou is poopoo
also, t least for me
with BOTE, haste simmed a lot better than crit
up to a point
inner tree
why you disable dh debuff in sim option
median sand
how is x3 dd, x2 np, x1 ttk hot trash?
vapid scarab
no OP
vital haven
tbhere are a lot of things that add up @median sand
balmy quest
Because it is really low ilvl relative to the currently available, and the power of the trait scales with the gear
drifting cloud
is the trinket simming correct? because theres no way it should be 432
mine is 425 with a 435 yellow
balmy quest
Having low ilvl azerite versus low level cloak and rings is going to produce the same "equipped ilvl" but have drastically different sim DPS
vital haven
no dh debuff, no OP, no benthic pieces other than boots (aberration waist is not factored into raidbots) l;ow amount of socekts'
median sand
I've rerolled benthic over 150 times
vital haven
ya i didnt say it was hot trash
median sand
only just now got crit boots
severe bough
OP is... OP, actually
vital haven
farm manapearls on them and feed them to your main
vital haven
ye
median sand
432 is correct, that's a 450 tf yellow card
inner tree
need more gems in that gear
median sand
It's inflated....hate this trinket
severe bough
really overwhelming power is
pretty over-budged
for a tertiary
pretty much BIS for every class
balmy quest
Similar to Undulating Tides, sims amazingly but rarely performs as well as it sims
vital haven
ye me sim is boosted by like 1k dps
balmy quest
Doesn't mean it is bad just that it needs to be taken into consideration
vital haven
it should be like 42k
drifting cloud
OP probably performs atleast 90% of what it sims
UT is depending on the fight closer to 50
balmy quest
Mythic radiance doesn't proc it if you feint and have 1+ resounding protection
balmy quest
So you can maintain good UT uptime
severe bough
perhaps
vital haven
not ideal but ye
severe bough
i did get a 430 cepha
drifting cloud
thats alot of feinting
severe bough
inner tree
imo traits like UT are garbo for progress
vital haven
true
severe bough
im holding onto that until i get a -... 445 cepha
balmy quest
It isn't that much feinting...
severe bough
D:
severe bough
Well, yeah if it like, beats your 430 for like 800 dps
vital haven
fucking azerite pieces in this tier are trash
severe bough
you need to game it
vital haven
bring back bod azerite pieces
inner tree
loyal is pog
inner tree
actually
severe bough
not just simming
but performing high af
I really like that trait after 2 days of ashvane prog
inner tree
even more in progress when other people die lul
severe bough
inner tree
i think it's giga bis for healers so that's that
severe bough
Well, you tend to prog in a guild
and even on a pug you can ask around
or watch your secondaries
you'd be surprised
fallow otter
pretty unlikely you dont have 4 in guild using it tbh
vital haven
guild by guild basis
fallow otter
especially after 1 clear
severe bough
Yes
i made the loyal to the end meta solidify in my guild
a boomkin and i wanted to use it
then 2 other healers had it
inner tree
yea same trying to preach it
severe bough
inner tree
behemot not dropping chest tho :/
inner tree
shoulders from radiance has loyal too but i wonder if 2 loyals is actually good
fallow otter
civic palm
More clears = Higher Average Item Level = Fewer Deaths
USUALLY
fallow otter
squeezed some more for oyu
civic palm
So LttE loses value the longer the tier is active.
nimble tartan
omfg....
severe bough
Just the mastery
nimble tartan
i cant believe....
inner tree
yea
nimble tartan
how much i love wow and sin rogue..
vital haven
dont think
civic palm
omrplease
severe bough
Rip
inner tree
yes behemot chest has OP
severe bough
Nice
Well lets pray for behemoth then
It will mosr likely outsim a 435 cepha
Although cepha is
inner tree
cba gambling for a chest when 2nd boss has a really good one
severe bough
I did it only
inner tree
just get gorak tul's :4HEad:
severe bough
Nice
inner tree
instant scrap
severe bough
xd
Doesnt it have like EB or SS or outlaw m+ traits?
I hardly just scrap azerite
It has to be unsalvageable or just too low ilvl
inner tree
nope even for outlaw it's hot trash
balmy quest
It has EB + Scent of Blood
It isn't great but sadly still better than my current shoulders, NP+Blood Rite 😦
balmy quest
If only I had received Gorak Tul's instead 💔
I lost again at the Blizzard Casino
Who needs good content when you can just make everything RNG
Is there a range on Loyal to the End?
balmy quest
oof
inner tree
f
strange python
severe bough
@balmy quest it looks to be like an aura
strange python
tryna get more dps out let me know what i need to do
severe bough
I wa getting loyal stacks on org
As closer to the group i got
So you dont even need to be on a party to take advantage of it, it seem
inner tree
benthic
civic palm
Drop GCB for damn near anything.
inner tree
nice shoulders kapp
if people in your raid have loyal to the end trait you should take it too
on your chest
instead of ss
and go MA
civic palm
@strange python Does the SIM show Quick being better than Deadly for you atm?
inner tree
galecaller
severe bough
Galecaller is poopoo
strange python
gotcha i got a 440 plumage
strange python
lol just sent over what my highest was
strange python
anything else i can change?
severe bough
Jar was simming decently for outlaw mind you
Well, benthic
1 SS isnt ideal either
inner tree
yea i use it does 3% of my dmg approx not too bad
severe bough
Whats the other alternative
civic palm
Top to Bottom, get one of each, socketed, SIM to see how high you need to go for each piece until you are happy.
severe bough
^
civic palm
Lists don't include Neri's, that's an error on their part, sims well enough.
strange python
anyway to blow that up so i can read it ?
fallow otter
fallow otter
he wants the link lol
but you can just click the open original link at the bottom
@strange python https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/uRvS4VDXuds3Q1zqYmow6M
winter moss
????
civic palm
🗡
strange python
gotcha thanks
civic palm
strange python
!essence
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
tiny granite
best way to get daggers outside of raiding? stuck with 385 OH dagger still. have a 415 from pvp
fallow otter
430 m+ lvl10 chest, 440 weekly cache
strange python
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/bSH3Gr2rNWG5hazr9JYbkk Never had BOTE sim higher than any other relevant essence. Thinking I need more haste and a better chest for it
fallow otter
gimme your gamble luck
plzplz
got you some more dps
with CLF/lucid and a few tweaks @strange python
tropic ocean
@tiny granite just pugchain the relevant keys underrot/freehold/tol dagor (depending on your stat weights)
strange python
lol nice, thanks. wtf I've been simming constantly, how'd you catch that?
fallow otter
for some reason i really like simming and improving gear so i sorta knew what might work better just from my own gear optimising
i think i might have a fetish
strange python
that's dope! that 80 agi feels weird but I buy it
fallow otter
you can juggle between loyal til the end from helm and BBI from shoulders aswell
i didnt sim those 2
ok fine ill do it now
hahah
strange python
:D:D
fallow otter
ohhh nup i did sim that, this is the best
strange python
was getting sick of running SS too. Is the MA opener still Garrote>mut>rup>mut>vanish vendetta> toxic?
vendetta>vanish i mean
tropic ocean
no
mutilate->rupture->mutilate->garrote>vendetta->toxic blade->vanish>envenom>mutilate>envenom
strange python
rly? never seen that
bronze kelp
both are good
tropic ocean
^no
bronze kelp
mut -> rupt -> mut is a very minor dmg increase
fiery sage
<3*
civic palm
Just get your DoTs up, your shit on CD, and use your trinkets correctly, will be fine.
inner tree
if you take loyal to the end make sure other people in your raid have it too
strange python
what does the sim assume? Full uptime?
fallow otter
4people
strange python
prob wont have that
fallow otter
we have 3 rogues, we all use
restor druid
disc preist
i didnt even bother counting more
strange python
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/BVQk8PWrH7FfwNn6#fight=38&type=auras don't even see one on our best pull
inner tree
usually healers run it because it's rly good for them
fallow otter
"Loyal to the End 3 4.19%"
strange python
at the bottom, missed it
white basalt
anyone got a good all in one trinket wa?
strange python
that's smart. will suggest that
fallow otter
i only thought of it just now tbh
well actually when i did your sim
then posted it to guild prog channel 😃
lol @strange python you made me check our log from same fight lastnight
Loyal to the End 15
strange python
yea should def be stacking it if it's simming well for people
fallow otter
i was shocked @ 15 tho haha
i dont expect your outlaw rogue will be using but im sure you can get 1 or 2 to use then its fully stacked
tropic ocean
yes
its very strong
(from a pure dps perspective)
for progress i'd take coral+inkpod over it
fallow otter
i really like it, but i can see the motivation not to use it for prog
but im still using
for prog
but if i had a fat inkpod then i would def look at using that instead
tropic ocean
pretty much the same, inkpod with coral active just helps so much for the last phase of bosses
fallow otter
i think i would enjoy the mini game of stacking the cirt for the massive pop
but i also like the mini game of channeling inbetween mechanics
lol
tropic ocean
font isnt as bad as I thought i just channel it when i would pool anyways
and just watch to get full duration in vendetta
civic palm
Purty murch.
tropic ocean
though you really need to watch bigwigs/dbm timers so u don't get it canceled half channel (heard that happened to someone I know cough)
fallow otter
hahaha i committed to the channel one time that i shouldn't have, not sure what i was expecting
winter moss
cough why you had to expose me cough
wild oriole
On stand alone for Queens Court how do you maximize your up time? Do you just position your self so you can still hit boss? Finding it hard in pug groups 😄
tropic ocean
i stand alone while still being able to hit the boss
fallow otter
i definitely didnt get hit by upsurge lastnight and step asap
tropic ocean
if ppl walk in me i tell them gtfo
wild oriole
ye imma do that from now on
fallow otter
im glad i dont have to pug
wild oriole
You are lucky. I cant seem to find any proper guilds on my realm
so i just pug it all 😛
fallow otter
where are you just from interest
my realm is empty now aswell, but we are the last competitve guild
kind steppe
Hey ! I'm not sure how to use the envenom buff, when I compare my log and sim, there is a difference on the dmg from instant deadly poison damage, I guess it's because of that or TB but I doubt it's from TB so if anyone can light me
winter moss
or mut or melees
kind steppe
I'm trying to TB with 3/4 CP but I heard that you just throw it on CD now
and what about elaborate planning ?
winter moss
since bfa you do it on cd
fallow otter
"Your finishing moves grant 10% increased damage done for 4 sec."
kind steppe
y I know what elaborate planning is but
( and okay mac didn't knew that )
80% uptime on log, 75% uptime on sim
for elaborate
fallow otter
ok i got your question correct now
kind steppe
it's just the TB I think
fallow otter
but yeh
winter moss
dont get me wrong, you use it on cd
fallow otter
its likely you can tb more
winter moss
but you plan a head an try to sit on 3cp/4cp when it comes off cd
kind steppe
well that's basically what I do then
modest tendon
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
fallow otter
have you got a real log @kind steppe
winter moss
last tb window only were tu envenoms aswell
kind steppe
can give u 1st boss EP in normal that I did 2 min ago
but ya on 2 min fight the last TB is always at the end, it may be that aswell
tropic ocean
when a boss is about to die you change your rotation anyway
dont refresh dots just pump as much dmg in as u can
kind steppe
yup
well with all you told me I'll try to figure out myself where it come from exactly and if there are special things
thanks for the help lads
fallow otter
is your sim vs real life way off?
kind steppe
wtf
fallow otter
always stab the back! 😄
kind steppe
( didn't understood what you mean stun )
ya but
It's a dummy
I was behind him
all the time
kind steppe
small, it's like just the instant damage from deadly that changes
winter moss
oh sorry not parry
kind steppe
I think
winter moss
*miss
tropic ocean
dont worry too much about what does your most dmg as long as you are not terribly off your sim dps
like in sim mutilate is highest dmg but in real raid scenario its not like that due to movement etc
formal willow
why does everyone who ranked in warcraftlogs use the pocket-sized computation device? is it that strong?
would it warrant using 2 on use trinkets?
faint harness
It doesnt suffer from the usual 2 use trinket issue since you naturally delay pocket-sized anyway
formal willow
i currently have ashvane 420 and a deadeye spyglass 410+socket
when do i use the trinket infight?
tropic ocean
best is to top gear sim it
what trinket combination you should use on your character
but im pretty confident it will be better than deadeye 😄
narrow meteor
With Inkpod is it worth to active coral at 30%?
tropic ocean
yes
narrow meteor
Ok ty
tropic ocean
you want to get the crit conversion before trinket procs as it can crit
tropic ocean
I just bonus roll gorgonzola hc for the inkpod
fallow otter
@tropic ocean is right @formal willow you should be using cyclo over the spyglass i dont think there is a way it can sim higher
tropic ocean
we already stack eligible classes in hc split and healrs tanks take spec that can loo it
but didnt get 1 drop in last id 😄
fallow otter
im pretty excited for when lady is dead, so that i can go outlaw for gorgonzola
tropic ocean
i'm not as I still only have 415 outlaw weap from jaina, not sure if -30ilvl mainhand is worth it
fallow otter
i like both specs but rarely get to play it outside of m+
i got a 425 jaina but its RIP now since i got a 430 fist from chest coz mastery blows
tropic ocean
formal willow
ok so cyclo simmed 130 dps higher, curiously phial of the arcane tempest simmed even higher for single target even though its supposed to be an aoe trinket
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
scenic saffron
!Essence
winter moss
dw spartaklaus we are used to it
tribal marlin
Is Ripple in Space minor any good in M+ ?
near python
N
rigid mango
if you can proc it on cd it's potentially really good yeah
but I've not seen anyone using it, I've not seen any higher rating one recommend it either
I heard seli talk about it a while ago
rigid mango
yeah I mean it'd be pretty nuts if you can pre run most of it before combat
tribal marlin
ye :/
rigid mango
You have a small, 30 sec font in that case
tropic ocean
15sec
tribal marlin
20sec with rank2
tribal marlin
What does rank3 do ?
austere ruin
question, when is the best time to use cyclotronic blast in your rotation for MA
tropic ocean
5% movement speed buff
tropic ocean
i can'T see it being good in m+ as theres much non predictable movement involed
involved*
rigid mango
http://prntscr.com/okabuj @tribal marlin
tropic ocean
like if u ned to move due to mechanic and proc it 🤷
better take essence that u can use on demand
fervent jasper
How good is the ink pod trinket? I got a 430 one from heroic EP but it doesnt sim higher than my 420 pocketed dice on single target
tropic ocean
tribal marlin
well 2/3 uptime
rigid mango
thing is like, there's a lot of stuff you could do
tribal marlin
still good shit
tribal marlin
I'm trying to see what I could replace Minor Lucid
tribal marlin
oh right
tropic ocean
compared to the ripplething
tribal marlin
forget about this
tropic ocean
I just see it as being not as good as you can't really influence the procs some times
like you need to move a lot in m+
so you can't really control to proc it or not
tropic ocean
think it will either be lucid or bote minor in the long run
tropic ocean
or maybe even clf if it drops off multitarget
rigid mango
Yeah but still
near python
Just go bote/beam major and lucid minor ^^
tropic ocean
like there snot so many options once we have 3 slots
rigid mango
Yeah
tropic ocean
pretty sure its protocol/iris major
tropic ocean
(lucid if u dont need aoe)
rigid mango
I understand the major
tropic ocean
if u dont use lucid major, u use 1 minor for bosses anyway
and versa buff
so 3rd idk
need to see if clf procs off multitarget
as the procrate is insane
rigid mango
ye that shit is potentially giga
tropic ocean
if fok can proc it on multiple enemies it can be really strong yeah
tropic ocean
- don't have it yet
rigid mango
ah
tropic ocean
i've been slacking rustbolt hard
rigid mango
F
tropic ocean
grinding benthic on 14 alts fml
rigid mango
I'm unsure if it's worth > lucid with iris or not
tropic ocean
basically a worse poison bomb from looking at it
tropic ocean
yeah
rigid mango
yeah sorta, potentially anyways
tropic ocean
need to test everything but I think the "safe" essences can be huge like with bote minor and the stacking crit u can blast
or either drop crit and get more mastery
or drop even more haste
rigid mango
I'm pretty sure iris + lucid, lucid + proto, proto + lucid always work
It's just more about the other shit that fewer ppl run
tropic ocean
just personally not the biggest fan of rng stuff
austere ruin
for MA rotation, do u guys TB before vanish or after?
tropic ocean
before
austere ruin
i see people pull 120k deeps at start
tropic ocean
yeah if everything crits
austere ruin
so best gamble is TB before vanish
rigid mango
CLF does surprisingly big openers
tropic ocean
not uncommon
rigid mango
ngl
rigid mango
like, as a person who didn't use blood before
austere ruin
gar > mut > rup > ven > mut > TB > BOTE > Vanish > enven > mut > enven
rigid mango
peaking at 90k openers 
tropic ocean
I think you use mut > rup >mut > garr with ma and bote
at least thats what top log ppl do
rigid mango
Yeah
the diff is tiny though
odds are it has 0 diff on end dps
0 noticable diff, anyways
tropic ocean
i think the big profit from it is the burst
like in ashvane where u have small dps windows
pretty good
rigid mango
What, bote?
tropic ocean
no the difference in opener
rigid mango
Ah
austere ruin
blood of the enemy
tropic ocean
bote is decent but the guardian is just pumping so much
rigid mango
Nah it's still very, very tiny
tropic ocean
we save guard for dps phase and it just does so much dmg
rigid mango
It's just such a giga consistant dps thing
tropic ocean
yeah and its so safe like
having lucid on and getting briny
guard doesnt matter still pumping
winter moss
100k openers 
austere ruin
@ ausgelebt, u said top logs people are doing mut > rup >mut > garr with ma and bote?
rigid mango
yes
tropic ocean
yeah
rigid mango
it's a small dps upgrade doing so
tropic ocean
but thats like tip of the toe min maxing
winter moss
even without bote.
tropic ocean
so if u feel not confident or fail to fit the globals into ma buff
just do ur normal thing
austere ruin
koo
tropic ocean
I mean r1 1st boss rogue did mutilate garrote rupture mutilate so XD
difference is very little
austere ruin
so i assume there rotation is mut > rup >mut > garr > vendetta > mut > BOTE > TB > Vanish > enven > mut . enven
correct me if i am wrong
scarlet sequoia
you are
winter moss
wait
austere ruin
great
winter moss
kayo no
tropic ocean
bote after tb
austere ruin
ur right
harsh sphinx
Mutilate > Rupture > Mutilate > Garrote -> Vendetta + On Uses > Toxic Blade > Blood of The Enemy > Vanish > Env > Mut > Env
austere ruin
so no need mut after vendetta, just TB > BOTE
winter moss
clf > bote change my mind
rigid mango
ye that's wrong 
winter moss
those are the people that say "i heard perfecto opens with mut not gar" and just press mut first instead of gar
winter moss
marginal gain is still a gain. why not maximize dps with every chance possible
tropic ocean
yeah especially as it adds up
"ah its just 0.1% dps cant bothjer"
ah regemming is just 0.2% dps cant bother
etc etc
rigid mango
That diff is so small it wont make a diff to the end on the logs, probs
I know that feel mac
rigid mango
Ench are the ones that suck ass
tropic ocean
i can't wait if they bring out portable azerite changer
oh boy im changing for trash as well
harsh sphinx
for M+ or just cuz stats changed
tropic ocean
for me it tells me to just go haste everything since i changed to clf
rigid mango
Same but it makes sense
tropic ocean
but I had 32% crit before so probably right
rigid mango
I dropped all of my haste when I was running lucid + iris
tropic ocean
yeah same
tropic ocean
maybe 1 or 2% more haste and crit will overtake for me
rigid mango
tropic ocean
but yeah this is like the moment where stat weights are out of control
at least since I play again 😄
winter moss
its a 3dps gain if enchant haste on ring one and crit on ring two
currently i have crit on ring one and haste on ring two
rigid mango
tropic ocean
but its way better this season actually
summer marten
it doesnt, its just margin of error
tropic ocean
like its not dogshit when u get crit vers
or mastery crit or we
better than legion haste instant disenchant
dusky summit
hi guys, short question: Ive switched from Outlaw to Assa and play mostly M+. Should i sim and gear after single or multitarget or a mix between those? What are the best results? 😃 Thank you!
tropic ocean
@dusky summit watch twitch.tv/incarnated you will learn everything needed to successful do mythic+ as assa rogue
rigid mango
^
signal summit
How many here have switched from bote to raid essence ? Im at vacay and just wanna know If Ppl are running raid essence instead now or bote
spice frost
my only issue with the bote opener is you dont have EP up for the first env. wish there was a way to get that
spice frost
yea, that first env is the guaranteed 5cp one inside bote
juicy dmg if there was a way to get ep
XD
tropic ocean
well
guess it would be pretty big to get 10% buff on 110k dmg envenom but
in the long run it will be a small diff
rigid mango
I prefer the damage
spice frost
i can get 145k env with 3 ttks
tropic ocean
but u shouldnt have 3 ttks 😄
opal meadow
its early in the season gotta go with what you get
tropic ocean
like with bis pieces the impact the non ep makes on first envenom
gets smaller
not saying ttk is bad 🤷
rigid mango
I mean, with bis pieces your damage goes up
thus the 10% is worth more
One could argue it's more worth while thten
rigid mango
1dp?
winter moss
doublepen 
spice frost
yea boi
spice frost
tryin to not get flagged afk in this brawl while typing XD
crisp hollow
hi friends! off the top of your heads, what can I be doing to further optimize my rogue? currently farming pearls obsessively for socketed benthic on multiple toons, farming honor for BOTE (cuz behind on raid essence) and doing professions for more socketed pieces. Is there anything more I can do to actively optimize besides running keys for ilvl/spyglass/offhand and raid drops? I think I have all the grinds down https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/n3ccWrPVngNAXstDnYuG4s
night vale
benthic and raid trinkets are massive too
tropic ocean
(save pearls on main) use alts to grind the tokens
rigid mango
Benthic, trinkets, sockets
tropic ocean
if you have the money craft 445 helm
rigid mango
you have two of the worst azerite pieces there is
rigid mango
like fucking horrendous chest and sockets
crisp hollow
yeah i have a socketed belt im working on for the benthic, alts farming for socketed wrists and boots rn
tropic ocean
like im using 415 socketed off hand when I have 440 in inventory
socket is huge on off hand
crisp hollow
i have a 2EB/2TTK/2SS setup i run keys with but yeah this is the closest thing i get to a patchwerk setup rn
night vale
yeah cause im like 3 ilvls higher but simming 11k more
tropic ocean
if u have a 400 or even 395 off hand with sock it will mostly beat this one u are using
rigid mango
Yeah it fucking blows
You're just going to have to grind benthic + actually raid
and then u should be fine
trinkets and aze from raid, benthic from naz
that's all you need.
And ofc better essences.
crisp hollow
working on the essences part!
night vale
r3 lucid is pretty nice too
crisp hollow
im grinding pearls already so its good
rigid mango
r3 lucid is quite big
tropic ocean
prioritize upgrading wrist/belt/gloves over boots
crisp hollow
3 alts for rolling for trinkets
summer marten
You have worst shoulders in the game... didnt you get anything better from all those emissaries?
tropic ocean
as the ilvl increases the dmg proc while boots have 3% anyway
crisp hollow
wasn't "all those emissaries" for me sadly, this was an alt until recently
im catching up, hence the multiple grinds
summer marten
ah, but those are so bad... my pvp 420 ones sim 40dps lower than 450ilvl sanguine monstrosity
crisp hollow
yeah i wasnt thrilled with it either
dont wanna spend chalk tho
i think i clear H on saturday
lets hope for the best
i want ashvane and orgo trinkets yeah?
scarlet sequoia
ashvane and orgo trinkets are good too yes
opal meadow
i dont think orgo beat my CoS trinket 😦
455 ashvane trinket gives me 2k more damage over 410 CoS
scarlet sequoia
dont think sims use it correctly
karmic kite
would anyone be willing to go through logs and tell me what i can do better
probably just a couple pulls
opal meadow
Also cyclotronic is really strong still
rigid mango
sang monstrocity
crisp hollow
ok so checklist: clear H, R3 Lucid, R3 BOTE, keep farming for benthic, keep grinding AP
summer marten
30ilvl for a total of 13dps... on azerite piece is beyond terrible
opal meadow
at least you're not me and lose 270 dps with +30 ilvls
summer marten
blighted tribe chest looks like a steal compared to those lol
opal meadow
blighted tribe, -163 dps lol
I got reverant adoration when i rolled :/ better than Blighted tribe i guess
opal meadow
nice
summer marten
ah, you have cephalohide, thats why
opal meadow
ye but it was 420
summer marten
gorak tul, the jackpot
pulsar dirge
!Essence
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
summer marten
so many gorak tul's... wonder how much did inability for shoulder to give sanguine monstrosity helped that
wish that hotfix never happened
sullen pagoda
isnt that only for cloth
opal meadow
that was a thing?
summer marten
as ive seen it was 1 cloth shoulder and monstrosity
my bad, it was fastidious machinations
scarlet sequoia
it was kings rest items
vagrant tapir
whats this?
summer marten
Fixed a bug that caused Relinquished Azerite Spaulders tokens to not generate Mantle of Ceremonial Ascension or Mantle of Fastidious Machinations.
2nd ones are leather
so it was higher chance to get good stuff
olive tulip
!coral
frigid briar
Has anyone ran sims on undilating waters for 50% and 75% uptimes?
rigid mango
http://prntscr.com/okc1yq @frigid briar
That's the only thing I've seen anyways
Wouldn't recommend using it for prog though, can't find a fight where it'd be worth
frigid briar
Zine you missed the question
rigid mango
frigid briar
😂
frigid briar
Again, not what I asked lol. I'd like to know if there was some sims done to see on patchwork where the talent fell behind others
For example 400 azerite vs 445
rigid mango
But u asked about uptime
dusky tinsel
The sim chart shows the trait with 25% lockout per minute in comparison to others, but I don't think there's currently a chart that compares ilvl of azerite to one another, if that's what you're asking.