assassination

[silent parcel]

Okay thanks

[rigid mango]

Crit mast for M+, haste crit for raid

[tender drift]

If you end up playing with Vision essence once it’s released the value of NP ought to go up

[rigid mango]

No

You wont play vision for raid

[tender drift]

I know

[rigid mango]

Soooo?

[tender drift]

Hence the if, if he ends up playing it because he has nothing better/enjoys it

Or alternatives are nerfed at some point

[rigid mango]

That's a lot of ifs

[tender drift]

As is life, we’re having a deep moment bro

[rigid mango]

Unless blizzard shits on like

4 essences

we're not playing vision for st, ever

[mighty elm]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/onykzQjQuJwzyrpbcEd4Nm

Y U G E

[hollow haven]

Lucid is bis for st?

[rigid mango]

Yes

[tender drift]

Lucid is like cold beer on a warm day, gotta have it

[hollow haven]

For aoe?

[rigid mango]

Aoe in what sense

[hollow haven]

M+

[rigid mango]

It's still sorta in the works

but yes, it looks like lucid could be a contender for the best trait for m+

with 3 ttk and deeper stratagem

[gentle path]

Rise why the gemming haste if your running lucid, wouldnt mastery be better?

[crisp steppe]

im assuming he gems haste because topgear tells him to

thats pretty much it

[gentle path]

topgear tells me to gem mastery when i run lucid, haste when i dont

whelp, apparently things changed since yesterday

[rigid mango]

Telling me to gem/ench both haste and masteyr

[gentle path]

has everything back to haste for me again , yesterday it was all mastery

[tawny nimbus]

so are the nightborne trinkets good? Just check Bloodmallet and it's saying amazing? https://bloodmallet.com/index.html#rogue_assassination

[languid ore]

What's the difference in dps. ~300?

[gentle path]

558

[tawny nimbus]

highbourne, sorry

[languid ore]

Just use haste

So you can swap between specs easier

[rigid mango]

Just use mastery

so you can gem easier for m+

and not waste money/more pieces because of 2 sets

@tawny nimbus check #tc-research for the explanation

[gentle path]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/bH78Veb6QnLSc22u4yrAM1

i just run outlaw in m+, im a pleb i know

[tawny nimbus]

Ty Zine. Just so im 100%, seems like they ARE great, but currenlty bugged?

[languid ore]

Waste money for more sets? Wut

[rigid mango]

Waste money on gemming/enchanting for both m+ and raid

[languid ore]

So just go haste and play both

[gentle path]

not really wasting money lol im not paying for much of anything

[languid ore]

Outlaw still good in m+

[rigid mango]

but sin is better

or is it?

Who knows.

[languid ore]

You dont

[gentle path]

not if you dont have the azerite

[rigid mango]

I'm just betting on assa

[languid ore]

I bet on rogue

It's fun to swap specs accordingly

[rigid mango]

I bet on sin being better in every situation

[languid ore]

But do as you like

I bet on rogue

[rigid mango]

regardless, they're going to be the top two specs for m+ by a longshot

but sin's looking better and better

And outlaw the other way

[languid ore]

Outlaw is fine

[crisp steppe]

outlaw has better utility

[languid ore]

And gouge is so good in m+

[crisp steppe]

if you need that to facilitate ur pulls or just prefer that to make some pulls safer its great.

for damage its just tuning. both specs are great

[rigid mango]

Comes down to affix which we don't know yet

[crisp steppe]

yeah

[rigid mango]

All I'm saying is assa was so close before s3

arguably better in some scenarios

And now, I don't see outlaw being better

[languid ore]

It's a lot less work as outlaw I'll be honest

[rigid mango]

Even though it was a perfect season for outlaw, sin was so insanely close

Of course

getting the same 6 traits for all content is nice and easy

[languid ore]

Press BF, ezpz

[gentle path]

i feel like you just dont like outlaw

[rigid mango]

Me?

[languid ore]

He doesnt

[rigid mango]

I like it very much

[gentle path]

yep

[rigid mango]

I play it often

[languid ore]

Outlaw is hella fun too

[rigid mango]

It is

That's why I like it

[languid ore]

I wish it was stronger to play in raids

[empty tide]

Sub could be the go too, depending on how people are playing new affix

[rigid mango]

It looks quite behind for raid now

Sub wont be the go to

[crisp steppe]

who knows what tuning ends up being

[languid ore]

Ufff. Hopefully they just get rid of sub

[vocal kelp]

sub is the most fun specc imo

[crisp steppe]

agree

multidotting I like assa

[vocal kelp]

loved it pre-shuriken nerf

[rigid mango]

I just don't see outlaw being better

[crisp steppe]

its not impossible. it just seems more unlikely because you'd need assassination to be nerfed and outlaw to be buffed

thats assuming assa is better right now. I haven't looked deep into it

not sure what the loaded dice memes do for the spec

[crystal barn]

you guys are talking specifically about m+ right now yea?

[rigid mango]

Yeah

[crisp steppe]

m+ yeah but also in general

[rigid mango]

There's no way they end up better for st

Just down to m+

[crisp steppe]

how do you know

[languid ore]

I almost want it to be better now. Just to come back to this chat. And tag you. With a Tom Cruise laughing gif

[rigid mango]

I want outlaw to be good

for sure

[crisp steppe]

I'd prefer assa to be better but yeah what can u do

[rigid mango]

I want to have two functioning specs to play at all times

[crisp steppe]

like maybe it requires tuning where everyone is like ??? but that really wouldn't be the first time blizzard did that

[languid ore]

They should just have it as outlaw = aoe, sub = st and sin somewhere in the middle

[empty tide]

Outlaw AoE sub aoe single and assa single

[languid ore]

Nah make sub a little tougher but rewarding and leave sin as entry level mid spec

[empty tide]

But they Cannot return sub to its cleave age cause breaks the game

[grim canopy]

mm cleavage

[languid ore]

Because sin is a 🛌 spec

[rigid mango]

Or just assa being best on all apart from possibly 2-3t cleave

[empty tide]

Having to play sin, expecially with DD build is so

Talking bout raid ofc

[rigid mango]

I like how TB plays, but yeah

It's much slower

[empty tide]

Ye , and because of DD there are some cases where you would spam FoK, but you have to mut for DD damage

[strange python]

How do you add essence calculations into your Sim?

[rigid mango]

I mean

where would you fok but mut instead

I wouldn't say it's often at all

[marble hemlock]

uunat

[rigid mango]

uWunat

[marble hemlock]

since its usually boss, guardian, and 2-3 adds in range

but still not worth fokking

:/

[empty tide]

Ye , the best exemple xd,

[pseudo hamlet]

!essence

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[stark oxide]

so I seem to see some mixed signals on what's best, trying to get some clarity.

For ST we want to stack DD and NP, with TTK being right behind them. On 2-3 cleave we basically just add 2-3 SS traits

For aoe/m+ its 3x EB 3x SS, and from there any of the ST traits are fine.

Most of that info is just from looking at warcraftlogs but the things people say in guides and this chat don't necessarily always agree with the top logs it seems. Does everything sound about right?

[rigid mango]

For ST, SS isn't far behind at all

[timber meadow]

3 shrouded and 3 eb for M+?

[rigid mango]

It's really a good trait even for one target, just outperformed by DD and Np

[timber meadow]

seems tough to get those resets

[empty tide]

The only reason you to TTK is cause of the overwhelming power chest

[rigid mango]

^

[empty tide]

Só you have 3xOP

[rigid mango]

For M+, you take any mix of SS/TTK/EB

[timber meadow]

like a lot of risk you're taking for potentially not getting the resets

[grim canopy]

Which essence?

for m+

[empty tide]

Talking single

[timber meadow]

my intuition would say like 1 ss and 3 eb

[rigid mango]

Like, 3 SS isn't that bad

but it's not that good either

for m+

[grim canopy]

not great not terrible

[rigid mango]

Unless it's KR, where you get obv resets and you're always fighting 3-4 where it's peak dmg

[fresh robin]

feel like 1 is juicy depending on tank ofc

[rigid mango]

1 is minimum

[grim canopy]

what have you been using for essence in m+ this week?

[rigid mango]

You can go up to 3, for sure

[timber meadow]

if you get the resets obv it's pretty godly

[rigid mango]

even then

it's not that good

[empty tide]

Ye i can only go 3xSS 1TTk 2EB is not that bad

[timber meadow]

oh really?

[fresh robin]

im using lucid until i unlock it on my minor

almost there hnghhh

[grim canopy]

So no aoe essence in major for m=?

wanted to know if i should grind for blood of the enemy

[empty tide]

And for st the best combination atm is 3xDD 1xblightborne 1xNP 1xTTK

For the 3xOP

[warped wind]

What are the best 2 traits for major and minor when we are 55

[worldly seal]

assassins really nice when u get thje hang of it

im bursitng like 22k on elites

at il 365

aoe is kinda pepega tho

[grim canopy]

does anyone here use blood of the enemy for m+

[stark oxide]

pretty sure we'll use blood for m+

[stable plinth]

I tried it solely cause I have rank 3

i still prefer lucid

lucid felt good with deeper strat in some dungeons

the seli special

[gentle path]

3DD 1NP 1BBI 1TTK for ST is what i run

[empty tide]

Sadly next raid gotta gamble again for the same chest/shoulders

[rigid mango]

@timber meadow It's aight, but the higher the key you go the worse it gets

the longer shit survives, the worse it gets

[grim canopy]

who is the top sin rogue for m+ atm

[rigid mango]

Seli

[timber meadow]

@rigid mango gotcha, seems like in dungeons like KR where it's always packs of 3-4 it would hard carry

[grim canopy]

what essence does he use

[rigid mango]

SS is very good there ye

Lucid atm

[grim canopy]

o ok

[rigid mango]

Lucid with 3 ttk and deeper strat

For juicy 140k envenmos

envenoms*

It's like, giga prio pump

[grim canopy]

how much EB

[rigid mango]

He uses 2

[grim canopy]

i see

[rigid mango]

3ttk 2eb 1ss

[distant moon]

coming back to wow, did essences change playstyle in any way or is sin still boring?

[stark oxide]

so does that mean he just ruptures 1 or 2 prio targets and then dumps envenoms rather than rupture spreading? or is rupture spreading still prio on any targets that will live awhile?

lucid gives us a lot of energy regen and they all come with an active that doesn't take much thought, makes it slightly faster but not...difficult

[marble hemlock]

well, before essences it was 4-5 ruptures for energy sustain, then either spam fok for aoe or use cp on envenom for prio/targeted damage

[timber meadow]

for ST - you goin deeper strat?

[marble hemlock]

with lucid you can usually drop atleast 1 rupture and still be able to sustain, so with deeper its generally 4 ruptures to be on the safe side in case you dont get any procs for a bit

so 3g+2rupture, or 4rupture with lucid+deeper is generally enough

[timber meadow]

how's the crit essence look?

[marble hemlock]

for st you can just check herodamage sims to get a general idea

for m+, i personally dont like it, mostly helps on aoe and its not really something we need any more help with

but might be worth picking up for dungeons that actually require burst-aoe, like atal

thats where it helps the most

on 5-7t burst aoe

[stark oxide]

when you say 3g 2r, are you dotting 5 different targets there, or rupturing the targets you garrote?

[marble hemlock]

rupture the targets you garrote

[rigid mango]

Aslong as they have dp we gucci

[marble hemlock]

with that build in particular, you wanna make sure all targets that have bleeds get deadly poison as quickly as possible so you get the energy returns from venomous wounds

and sometimes the first fok or two dont apply it, so you make sure to atleast autoattack them, so having both bleeds on the same target makes things easier

[stable plinth]

How much crit do you need btw for that build to feel good Seli?

[serene elbow]

blood of the enemy essence + EB traits seem to have good synergy

[spring iron]

should I still run Deadly and quick for weapons?

[rigid mango]

35%+ is good for eb in general

He's insanely geared, so he has like 45%

[marble hemlock]

the more you have, the better really

[stable plinth]

Cause disclaimer for everyone else but achieving seli's secondary stats is hard with how many sockets he has

[rigid mango]

^

[stable plinth]

Saw some guy saying he couldn't get seli's stats but the guy had 1 socket lol

[marble hemlock]

tbf, running a bit more haste might make things easier, not harder

[rigid mango]

@spring iron sim it, 1 force + highest simming one

Maybe blood minor wont be bad seli

[stable plinth]

well with lucid major

[marble hemlock]

meh, its basically just 500haste passively

[stable plinth]

how often do you pop it on a pack?

[rigid mango]

Exactly

[stable plinth]

feels like you have infinite regen

[marble hemlock]

whenever its up, you can just shorten your opener a bit before you start using CP for envenom

i.e. you just go 3g>r>fok>lucid>tb>env

[lone mirage]

Hi guys im reroll a rogue so im new to this ^^ i do 18k overall globaly with 393 ilvl, does it sounds good To you

?

In mm+

[marble hemlock]

then again, i feel youre better off holding lucid major for when you actually need it

i.e. if you end a pull with 2 mobs still at 20%

[stable plinth]

no one can answer that

1. you didnt say what dungeon
2. no one knows what you should be doing at 393 probably
3. no one knows what your actual gear is and azerites (ilvl doesnt mean anything with that or trinkets)

[marble hemlock]

thats pretty much the perfect moment to pop lucid

[stable plinth]

little too broad of a question

[rigid mango]

Ideal to pop to just finish off?

[marble hemlock]

yeah

[stable plinth]

yeah thats what i was thinking when I played with it cause

i felt pretty bad honestly just being energy capped

[marble hemlock]

when the last mobs are still alive, you generally get TB back up, so popping another set of envenoms in there is the best value, and you cant do that with just 2 mobs with bleeds, youre gonna starve (or go into the next pull without max energy)

[rigid mango]

ah right

[marble hemlock]

but in general, as with almost everything with assa, its just very situational

[rigid mango]

I like the sound of that

[stable plinth]

do you think once you get both major and minor

you'd still slot lucid in major?

[marble hemlock]

for sure, ye

[rigid mango]

This isn't a like

You have to use it sorta deal

[marble hemlock]

its incredibly helpful to finish packs off or on 2-3target pulls. even on burst aoe, you can just pop it to remove the pressure of having to multidot early on

[rigid mango]

This is possibly the meta build

and I hope it is

Do you think we'll run blood for shit like fh/ml fort seli?

[stable plinth]

yeah that makes sense, just gotta get accustomed to it

[marble hemlock]

say you get a big burst aoe pull, you can just garrote+rupture and then pop lucid and fok

and thats enough to sustain

[rigid mango]

or do you think running lucid n shite is still better off

[marble hemlock]

allowing you to start fok much earlier

doubt it zine

[rigid mango]

Doubt what, running blood?

[marble hemlock]

mhye, blood major

i really dont like it :p

[rigid mango]

I can see it being cool for big ML keys

[marble hemlock]

purification or iris major might be better

[rigid mango]

Yeah I know you don't

nor do I

[stable plinth]

feel like iris might actually pump

[marble hemlock]

problem with iris is the casttime

[rigid mango]

but that crit with 3 eb degen shit might just be good for ML/FH

[marble hemlock]

but we could work that into the ds/ttk build, by going 3g->r>fok>r and then cast iris, and then once its done you have some more energy to continue your rotation

so it might be a good filler in that sense

[woven summit]

I sim better with rank 1 Lucid than rank 2 Blood

[marble hemlock]

problem with iris is that its minor is kinda ass

[stark oxide]

I mean, if he doesn't think we should use it currently when we have reaping, what are the odds we can make use of it without reaping, even on the mass aoe dungeons?

[marble hemlock]

its less useful on reaping

the big gain from blood isnt raelly from the crit improving our damage directly

[stable plinth]

yeah i dont think reaping makes blood better

[marble hemlock]

its from getting more echoes per fok than we would get without

[vast forum]

using blood on reaping is just pure padding

[marble hemlock]

so on a really big pull, we already get the 5echoes per fok

[vast forum]

tbh higher ranks of blood also increase echo dmg

[marble hemlock]

blood is best on those 5-7t pulls where we would normally get 2-3 echoes per fok, and with the blood use we get 4-5

[vast forum]

but still, blood on reaping is not advised

[marble hemlock]

the crit-damage increase from t3 blood is very nice for echo obviously

but then again, its 25% for 5sec

so thats basically 1.25x worth of a fok in extra damage

in a pull where you do 15-20foks, is that really that big of a deal? 😄

[vast forum]

it's good for burst 😛

[marble hemlock]

for sure

[cursive onyx]

Hey

[silver zenith]

Hi

[cursive onyx]

You are still playing 3 EB 2 TTK 1 SS Seli ?

[marble hemlock]

nah, 3ttk 2eb 1ss

dont think theres a reason to play 3eb again now that weve got essences and stuff

maybe freehold

[cursive onyx]

Yeah right

[stable plinth]

seli do you ever have people complain about FoK and EB being annoying as fuck on their screen

[cursive onyx]

Only big pulls instances

[stark oxide]

Are there any dungeons with aberrations? I'm thinking that would be underrot and maybe Raal in waycrest? not sure what they classify as

Obviously speaking on when we might want to run purification beam essence + the aberration benthic gears

[rigid mango]

UR and WM has abberations ye

[stark oxide]

although i doubt one boss would be enough to justify a swap

[rigid mango]

It's not only bosses tho

[fast canopy]

Anyone happen to know with the benthic gear if the benthic traits are worth it?

[rigid mango]

It's mobs too

[vast forum]

why would you care about dungeons with aberrations tho?

[fast canopy]

Im kind of an idiot when it comes to this kind of thing. I dont think they are

[vast forum]

isn't the belt only "in nazjatar and eternal palace?:

[stark oxide]

right but i can't think of something aberration like in waycrest for trash, its mostly undead yeah?

[rigid mango]

It's for the essence

purification thingy

[stark oxide]

yeah the essence

[marble hemlock]

eels in shrine are aberrations too

so can do gigapad there :p

[rigid mango]

does more dmg to abberations w minor, stuns with major iir

iirc*

[stark oxide]

oh well thats an obvious take then, thats the funnest pull out of all the dungeons in pubs

[silent parcel]

Is it worth to pool up energy before toxic blade on pure ST fight?

[vast forum]

not only worth but recommended

[stark oxide]

yes the major stuns aberrations, and the minor does 50% more damage. and on sims, the minor is already really strong for us from what ive seen on cleave, so cleaving aberrations it should be an insane trait (but you likely still stick with minor since we don't care about the stun probs)

[nocturne gate]

start pooling before it come off cd . delaying tb isnt the way 2 go

[marble hemlock]

one thing people underestimate for m+ as well is that purification/lucid minor heal you

[tawdry rune]

! Wago

!wago

[rigid mango]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[tawdry rune]

Ty

[rigid mango]

Yeah, I mean it's quite good

If you get that heal at the right times it could be substantial

[stable plinth]

lucid heals a LOT

[marble hemlock]

thats not a negligible amount of healing (~35% overheal)

[stark oxide]

or just play leeching poison

[fast canopy]

anyone know if the benthic gear has random traits or if its the same every time

[crisp steppe]

random traits

https://www.wowhead.com/guides/benthic-gear-effects-nazjatar#full-list-of-benthic-armor

you can basicly get any of these

[fast canopy]

Thank you

It just doesnt tell me what traits can occur it seems like its not random

for the helm, spaulders and chestguard

[nocturne gate]

azerite are everytime the same

the other pieces have 2-3 versions

[fast canopy]

Ah ok kind of shitty traits no?

[short token]

is there a better enchant now?

[rigid mango]

Force

Is good on one weapon

[short token]

ok

force multiplier?

[nocturne gate]

yes

[short token]

ok ty

[grim canopy]

guys is there any trick to getting blood of the hero?

like any discord were people are setting up premades or something

i've lost 90% of my matches and im at 4k and this is going badly

i just hope blood sims poorly

i can't do this

[rigid mango]

Check in #wow-general much more people there who've done the grind you're trying

[grim canopy]

i did now they're just telling me to l2p and "git gud" lol

meh i'm just not gonna use that essence

oh thats a diff discord srry

[crisp steppe]

well you might just be having poor luck

or alternatively

are not good at pvp and tank your teams winrating by a lot

winrates in most bgs are close enough to 50/50. I don't know how soloqueing for normal bgs plays into this. you might face a team with 2x 5 man stack while yours has only one.

[prisma carbon]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[fast canopy]

Force Multiplier and Quick navigation?

[woven summit]

I go masterful navigation in off hand sims better for lucid

[fast canopy]

ty

[nocturne gate]

just sim it

[woven summit]

@grim canopy How long are your queues? And are you Horde? If so and you wait long queues go as a mercenary for the alliance. Short queues, in and out of bgs quickly faster grind

[dire yacht]

Hey guys do you think echoing blades will still be good to go in s3 without reaping? or will it more like 3x shrouded suffocation?

(m+)^^

[rigid mango]

Yes, eb will still be good

eb/ttk/ss

[gentle path]

once we hit 55 whats the go-to going to be for major / minor

[vagrant wigeon]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/443009728746881026.gif?v=1

[strange python]

Would Assa become the ultimate spec if Crimson tempest could proc VW?

[rigid mango]

Yes, it would be balistically broken in every way for m+

and no it wont ever happen

[warm harbor]

bit late too the party, any tried lucid/DS for tasty envoms in m+?

[empty tide]

seli was running 3xTTK Lucid DS

[warm harbor]

how'd it go?

[rigid mango]

He says it's really good

Seems like potential main build for next season

[warm harbor]

damn content

[stuck ravine]

okay couple questions regarding min-maxing TB

how much energy do you usually pool up to as TB comes off CD

and do you ever pop TB even when you have 5 combo points and rupture is already refreshed

like is it okay to overcap

[warm harbor]

never over cap

[rigid mango]

Yes

[vast forum]

do overcap CP

[rigid mango]

it is fine to pop tb whilst on 5 cp

[vast forum]

if you're 5CP and TB is off CD

[rigid mango]

Entirely so

[vast forum]

pop TB

then env

[stuck ravine]

alright thought so

[rigid mango]

You press it on cd regardless of what

[stuck ravine]

and is pooling like 100 energy good

or do you want more

[rigid mango]

Depends on your haste

You need 2 env minimum

3 with luck

[vast forum]

pool as much as you can BEFORE it comes off CD without losing dot uptime and shit

[stuck ravine]

I seem to be able to get 3 with 5 CP and 100 energy

but usually only 2 with no CP and 100 energy

[zenith gust]

any idea what traits might be the go to for next raid? raid azerite pieces seem to be pretty shitty right? i'm kinda worried. M+ farming for a raid azerite set?

[strange python]

What is TTK if I may ask?

[zenith gust]

twist the knife

[strange python]

ah ok

[brazen needle]

!essence

[zenith gust]

@rigid mango what was seli using? 3xTTK + 1xSS + 2xEB ?

[rigid mango]

yep

[zenith gust]

but like good for pre-season, or good for next season?

[rigid mango]

Both

It's a potential top tier build next season

[zenith gust]

nice

[warm harbor]

@zenith gust only one DD/NP piece in the next raid and its from the second last boss, assuming that the DD/NP/BI traits are still bis next tier which remains to be seen as lucid has lowered the value of haste meaning that TTK may aswell be good for raid as we can stack more mastery

and if thats the case we have pieces in the raid that are TTK/DD which will make things easier

already some logs from the latest reset which are rocking mast=haste with a TTK trait that are performing well

[rigid mango]

one ttk is already bis

So I wouldn't be particularly surprised at that

[ruby idol]

Its bis cause it has dd and op on it

[rigid mango]

Yes

[ruby idol]

Not cause its ttk

[rigid mango]

^

[dense blaze]

What is randomly taking me out of stealth

[vast forum]

if you have dots on something and blood of the enemy essence, your crit ticks take you out of stealth

welcome to world of warcraft

[royal lantern]

tbf, stealth is shit since 8.2

[dense blaze]

Why is that still in the game

[royal lantern]

even without blood

[vast forum]

stealth is shit since 7.0

[dense blaze]

Seems like a day one fix

[vast forum]

it's only been 5 days, they don't care about fixing classes yet

[royal lantern]

every single bg i die 2x because stealth ends without any reason

[vast forum]

yea BG stealth has been shit since 7.0

idk wtf they did with it but it was never this bad pre-legion

[rigid mango]

if anything, we'll not run cepha because op loses value

And instead just run spymasters

[vast forum]

i don't think OP loses much value tbh, it's called OP for a reason xD

[rigid mango]

Aye nor do i

[vast forum]

the problem with OP is that it's a massive haste RPPM proc, which, by default, has increased proc-rate with high haste

[rigid mango]

idd

[vast forum]

so you proc OP and suddenly, your OP makes your OP proc more

[rigid mango]

idk

the diff between spymast and cepha is prob the same

[vast forum]

good class design died for this btw

[rigid mango]

^

just be 7th boss goraks cepha

again

[warm harbor]

Are there any results on whether Loyal to the End is going to be any good?

[rigid mango]

aint seen any sims yet

[marble hemlock]

might be worth if blizzard continues designing encounters to be tuned so tightly that its easier to sacrifice people instead of playing mechanics (siegebreaker on jaina, torments on uunat)

[rough agate]

Im seeing this stealth bug in bg as well now bah

[blissful saddle]

!essence

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[zenith gust]

where do you get purification protocol from?

[vapid scarab]

honored with mechagon

[zenith gust]

but who sells it?

oh, found it

wait, seli playing with 44% crit and 38% mastery ? only 3% versa? thats new to me

3% versa jesus chrsit

[rigid mango]

Versa is good for eb dmg

mastery is good for ttk prio

[zenith gust]

i see

i guess low haste at bosses with lucid is not an "issue" now

[rigid mango]

Indeed

Lucid + OP might just be enough

To have relativly smooth boss dmg

[zenith gust]

lucid feels so good

[honest needle]

does killing bosses give u ap now per boss kill ?

[rigid mango]

What?

[zenith gust]

in BoD?

[honest needle]

does killing raid bosses give u ap now per boss kill

like last expansion

some 1 said it did again

[zenith gust]

probably does

ez to find out tho

just kill first boss and see

[honest needle]

thats why im asking

[rigid mango]

What does it matter?

[honest needle]

cause if u dont get ap for killing bosses i dont wanna waste time

killing bosses

that i dont need

[drifting cloud]

its always given ap?

[honest needle]

no it hasnt

not this expansion

[lone junco]

"waste time" as in you wont farm with guild, or you rather they bench you?

[drifting cloud]

well if youre at 50 neck its hard to get ap from bosses

[honest needle]

its a casual group

[lone junco]

or you pug raids and dont care to do bosses you dont need

[drifting cloud]

but you definetly got it, it might have just gotten buffed aswell

which I dont remember

[chilly marsh]

if youre casual your ap dont matter lol

can prob do a 15 m+ with colar 0 ap

no kidding

[lone junco]

if someone asked to be benched for bosses 1-4 but in for 5,6. better lie to me and say you just got off work. that bullshit wont fly.

I guess if you pug everything, it doesnt really matter.

[chilly marsh]

^ if raids groups had those kind of people that only wanna do bosses they need

would be the kind paying for the rush

[karmic galleon]

hey guys, i see that in some guides the suggested talent for m+ is crimson tempest instead of poison bomb, is this still the case?

[rigid mango]

No

PB is still the play.

[devout gazelle]

So guys the plan for the start is lucid on major and blood at minor generally?

[rigid mango]

Not so sure about blood

[chilly marsh]

im capping energy a lot with lucid

for me lucid is a way better passive

[rigid mango]

Yes, the minor is the good part of lucid

[chilly marsh]

prob will use crusible + lucid passive anf replace after gettign raid one

[devout gazelle]

i guess then you never use it with vendeta together?

[rigid mango]

You use it when sub 50 energy

Regardless of any syncing

It normally happens 10-15 sec into vend

Havn't seen if it's more worth while to sync it with tb or just using it when at under 50

but under 50 is the safe way to go

[surreal solar]

any changes to enchantments?

[rigid mango]

Apart from weapons, no

Well, weapon

They're all simmable, though

[surreal solar]

force multiplier on both?

[gloomy jolt]

what stats are on the sin benethic gear

[rigid mango]

Force doesn't satck

So force + best simming 2nd one

[surreal solar]

ah, thanks

[rigid mango]

The stats on benthic gear are all a google away my good sir

[surreal solar]

^ benthic aint that great anyways

[gloomy jolt]

tried googling. i'll dive deeper. just figured someone could help a brotha out

[rigid mango]

idk it, it's catch up gear that'll be irrelevant in a week pretty much

[gloomy jolt]

good for targeting certain stats though on low pieces

[chilly marsh]

the bentic belt

can be OP in raid

have a bonus that give extra dmg for abominations i think?

[rigid mango]

Abberations, yeah

[chilly marsh]

and teh raid have 2 of those

maybe a 425> 245

for thsoe bosses

[rigid mango]

Yeah, orgozoa and zaquul are abberations

[chilly marsh]

yep

belt can be the bis those fights

need sims check ofc

[rigid mango]

And so can the feet w crit dmg

[chilly marsh]

dont know about it 3% only crits dmgs dont look that good

but 2% every dmg vs 2 bosses can be busted

benthic gear can forge ?

like a socket ? if so i might only level a socket one

[rigid mango]

Yes, socket

[vapid scarab]

yes you need a socket to really care

[rigid mango]

I'm not getting one unless it's socketed

For either piece

But that being said I'll be getting the LW feet anyways, so probs only belt

[chilly marsh]

a 425 socketed

is like a 435

[vapid scarab]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/400955953559633921/595411922996822026/2342343243.png
supposedly these are looking to be pretty good to

[chilly marsh]

so can rally be better thana 445 vs thsoe 2 bosses

[nimble tartan]

I’m already burnt on wow the raid hasn’t dropped yet help

[chilly marsh]

im 55 AP and 11k/12k on reps

im burnout

lol

[nimble tartan]

dam I didn’t even do much and I’m feelin that haha

Shooo

[chilly marsh]

want at least 57 fro raid

[nimble tartan]

Is 57 Stan

Stam

[zealous lily]

!essence

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[chilly marsh]

YES

[carmine valve]

best way of getting dagger, highest ilvl with minimal effort?

[rigid mango]

I'm going for 60

for r3 flame

[nimble tartan]

You crazy man

Did u farm honor

Legit I cba doing all this farmin shit bro

[chilly marsh]

buying from BS

370

[rigid mango]

I aint farming honor

Maybe I'll delay 60 to mythic

but idk

[chilly marsh]

IF the nerf ak tomorrow reset

ak lower needed value

i will go for 60

if they dont 57

already needing 60k each level

60 must be like 250k AP

if tehy dotn nerf

[carmine valve]

bs?

[chilly marsh]

blacksmith

370

first boss new raid drop daggers so...🙏

[blazing matrix]

is treacherous covenant still viable ?

[rigid mango]

Viable, but not BiS

[formal anchor]

!essence

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[stone crescent]

cant seem to find the azerite traits for the benthic armor. any of them with TTK/echoing blades?

[zenith gust]

Chest

If i recall correctly

Not on my pc rn so cant double check

I just upgraded a piece that had ttk/ss/eb

Nice to have

[stone crescent]

Ah nice!

yeah I'm trying to get the same traits as seli's build but not sure which pieces have those

and cant find anything on the benthic gear traits online

[echo jay]

I feel like I'm simming super low for my gear. anyone have any ideas? is it my weapons?

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/UdfpuC1VRfmipnhCo4p8

[rigid mango]

You have meh trinketws

meh azerite

one socket

It's not shocking that you're simming low when your gear isn't very optimised :/

[echo jay]

ok, then im not crazy then

[rigid mango]

Not at al

I would assume people 4 ilvls ish lower with better gear could sim higher

It's all just down to optimising it at this point

[echo jay]

makes sense. thanks Zine. I knew my gear wasnt fantastically optimized, but I guess I didn't realize how bad

[lone junco]

@echo jay prob your mh wep.

[royal lantern]

how2bfa sim

[lone junco]

thats pretty low these days

[royal lantern]

get good weapons->kill a newborn child too get 40sockets->high sim

[rigid mango]

Yeah, weapon, trinket, azerite

and then ofc just high roll some sockets whilst you're at it

[echo jay]

yea, I figured @lone junco that my weps were definitely holding me back a lot

[royal lantern]

''just roll sockets, its that ez man''

[rigid mango]

Yah I mean what else

[royal lantern]

😄

[rigid mango]

just roll sockets loool

[lone junco]

you can do a gear compare and duplicate the wep, see what 420 would do for you. but your non DD + Vend traits are big meh.

[royal lantern]

didnt sim myself since 8.2 is out

brb

[hasty brook]

What is he new enchant name and is it worth it?

[rigid mango]

Force

and yes

[hasty brook]

On main weapon?

[rigid mango]

Either

But one

[hasty brook]

kk so that and haste?

[rigid mango]

And whatever sims the highest

[hasty brook]

kk ty

Odd. Aimmed with force and it said haste and mastery were better

Simmed*

nvm

[short depot]

what is the stat for assass ?

[midnight flower]

[short depot]

great 😃

raidbot is on point now ?

[midnight flower]

Of course not we not even in raid yet

But finding your specific stat weights will show up

[short depot]

mastery for me

3.70

haste 3.50

[keen elk]

!essences

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[hot snow]

Just curious, how many of you run SS build vs MA/toxic blade for raid?

[rigid mango]

I run both ma/ss

[vapid scarab]

and you use TB with both

[rigid mango]

both w tb ofc

why?

[hot snow]

Just alt per boss situation?

[rigid mango]

Yep

Cleave = sub ss

patchwerky shit = ma

[hot snow]

Well I’ve only just gotten decent shoulders and tossing up between the two 🤔 but also I’m lazy and don’t carry enough tomes

[rigid mango]

Yeah well both work tbh

Just down to encounter

[hot snow]

Guess I’m just gonna have to commit to farming again if I want mythic raid this tier

[rigid mango]

Myeh

That's one of the "issues" with sin

[hot snow]

Tbh I haven’t really committed to this xpac. It’s been pretty shit for me

Here’s hoping this tier is better 😒

[rigid mango]

Yeah well rng'ing two pieces for raid minimum sounds great

Just like this tier

[hot snow]

I lucked out last night. Got the shoulders I wanted from the vendor first attempt

[rigid mango]

Here's to mentally prepare for 4x sang monstrosity shoulders

[hot snow]

Gimme back legion relics any day. At least you could farm those

[lone junco]

god no

[keen elk]

but in legion you had to run maw of souls 137,000 times to farm ap and specific legondaries while watching everyone else in your guild with bis legondaries until you decide to quit because you cant take another maw of souls

[lone junco]

they destroy when you want to swap them.

[hot snow]

Yes that was shit but this non farming is also ridiculous. Now I’ve just gotta pray for drops from weekly chest or my rolls in raid get them

I know you can buy them but it’s still a lot

[onyx rock]

Hmm the Highborne Compendium of Sundering sim changed again. It now sims 200 DPS lower than 12 Hours ago...

[lusty narwhal]

Expected

[onyx rock]

Rip 50k

[white basalt]

I raided with SS and sub all tier just cause I had bad luck with azerite and that's what seemed to be best for me. With the gear I had SS sub simmed better even for patchwerk

[lusty narwhal]

50k, huh?

[onyx rock]

Yeah thats what i payed for the trinket

[vapid scarab]

paid 11k today

[onyx rock]

German Servers rip

I just dont understand why its simming lower now. the dmg it dit and the uptime is the same like in the sim 12 hours ago... i just double checked

[arctic walrus]

Is it worth to drop NP for new loyal to the end trait? seems to be simming better for me

[lone junco]

1np is a worth a lot. Maybe you can get it back in another slot.

[arctic walrus]

Best I can do is replace Blightborne, but I keep x3 OP if I do so

[weary lagoon]

give up 2nd DD to obtain 3rd NP, is it worth?

[lone junco]

Legit got to sim those things. The ilvl and 3rd row matters.

[arctic walrus]

2nd DD is probably worth more than 3rd NP though

[austere ruin]

so people are using lucid for Major

what about minor?

[arctic walrus]

lucid major only until you unlock minor

[austere ruin]

so your saying once we unlock lucid minor, we switch major to something else?

[arctic walrus]

Yeah

Most likely flame then going life force once you unlock it

[austere ruin]

koo, thanks

[steel wagon]

according to like herodamage and stuff isnt lucid simming higher ?

if u only have rank 1 or two unlocked?

[arctic walrus]

Bloodmallet includes the minor effect as well as major

If you check, you'll see that the majority of lucid's damage comes from the minor

[grave elk]

are the essences spread across your account? like if i get lucid to rank 2 on my rogue and play my alt do i then have to refarm for it?

cuz that would truly suck

[stuck knoll]

You have to refarm yes

[grave elk]

i hate blizzard

[hasty brook]

gonna be a yikes for me on having to refarm

[meager nebula]

unless they change it, essences are not alt friendly at all

[civic palm]

Much like...

gearing.

[raven locust]

Yea then you add essence farming ontop of gearing alts, it's not an enjoyable system.

[civic palm]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

There's a reason that most of the power in essences is @ rank 1.

[subtle aurora]

Hey guys mana pearls are solely for buying/upgrading bentich gear right?

[lime path]

Sorry in advance if this question has been asked to death already, but any word on essences and how they're simming?

[subtle aurora]

I have a bag full of 385 benitch gear now, should I just spend all my pearls on them?

[lime path]

no, not unless each one has a socket

you can rng for sockets

[carmine valve]

You can buy essence with mana pearl if you visit the quarter master

[subtle aurora]

Oh I can buy essence!

Lol gona sell the benitch gear then

[civic palm]

You get a shit ton of pearls from the quests as you go forward.

[silver quiver]

how should we know what the best heart choice is?

[cobalt gyro]

you could farm algans as wel

[carmine valve]

!essence

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[subtle aurora]

I mean I'm quite geared, 418. No point upping the benitch. May as well buy some essence

[silver quiver]

ty steward

[raven locust]

The belt is definitely worth getting and upgrading, and any non-420 piece that doesnt have optimal stats

[subtle aurora]

Makes sense. But I spam m+ and I was thinking it will be easy to gear up from m+ lol

Where's this essence vendor btw?

[meager shoal]

which belt are we looking for from the benthic gear?

[meager nebula]

the one that does 2% more damage to aberrations

[meager shoal]

ah kay

[meager nebula]

with a socket, ideally

[meager shoal]

I keep getting Vims

[untold current]

Belt just says increased dmg to abberations, doesnt say 2%

[urban junco]

are the gloves worth it too? It procs some kind of frost damage amount as well.

[austere wadi]

So lucid sims hella high but blood feels better, anyone else feel the same?

[junior ridge]

lucid in raid setting

blood for m+

[austere wadi]

maybe it's just because kill times are so low right now, but blood is putting up good numbers at least on short encounters.

[shy dust]

Id disagree on lucid feeling better than blood

[topaz trout]

whats the optimal blood opener?

[civic palm]

?

[floral condor]

Do you guys think exsanguinate or normal TB Build/opener is better at the moment?

[topaz trout]

opener with blood of my enemy

[civic palm]

Since it's a 2min CD use it during Vendetta.

[topaz trout]

i know to line it up

[civic palm]

Yeah well there ya go.

[lusty narwhal]

LOL

[topaz trout]

yeah... except im asking where in the opener does it fall into. since it does damage and im using MA, it matters.
I have been doing G > M > R > Ven > M > TB > Vanish > Blood > Envenom

[civic palm]

Yeah I am drawing you a picture one second.

[topaz trout]

that sounds bad

[civic palm]

There's technically no drawing.

[floral condor]

Rofl

[civic palm]

If you wanna TB before Vanish, go ahead and do that.

Blood is 10 seconds, TB is 9, cover the thing with the thing.

Also, don't use Blood Major for ST.

[floral condor]

How is the new compendium working for assa? Saw it sims pretty high but would it be worth swapping active mainstat trinket for it? 40 ilvl difference

[strange python]

!azerite

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Azerite overview: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o

[civic palm]

@floral condor It's is 2 - 4% ST damage so long there's no weirdness with the DoT.

[floral condor]

Oh dear, sounds pretty good

[vapid scarab]

you have a 440 trinket?

[civic palm]

Could be pretty cheap depending on where you are as well.

[floral condor]

365 mainstat active

[vapid scarab]

that's really bad

[floral condor]

11k on my server

[civic palm]

yum

[floral condor]

Sims pretty high

But yeah I’m a complete assa noob

Hence me asking ^^

[topaz trout]

blood r2 is simming ~100 higher than lucid r1 for me ST

and r3 is a few bg away

and by raid ill have 55 so i can use lucid minor

[autumn slate]

Uhh, can I post my logs here and get roasted for every single mistake I have made? Im new to assa and Im still learning

[topaz trout]

why wouldnt I use blood major

[civic palm]

Shouldn't but if that's the result you get then 👍

[topaz trout]

with 3x nothing personal and 2x double dose, it makes sense why blood is simming higher with MA

and 22% haste

[civic palm]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

If that's what you get then that's what you get.

[bronze kelp]

blood as major for m+? had not that good results as with lucid major in post season. for season 3 focusing iris seems to be very good. or why is everyone talking about blood ?

and looking at the sims even puts life-force ahead of blood

[topaz trout]

large aoe burst with 1.5 minute cd r2/r3 and enhanced crit and crit damage vs all targets hit

[bronze kelp]

yeah, and focusing does also a large aoe burst, and even bigger one

and lucid has also a good point, cause on big pulls u can insta burst with fok spam without ramp up time (if this is in favour of the key, i guess not, but just for numbers)

[topaz trout]

my guess is sustain

[bronze kelp]

blood is my sec choice atm

[topaz trout]

lucid will always be your minor

[bronze kelp]

yep

[topaz trout]

you'll never swap it out once its a minor

[bronze kelp]

ill try the blood major / lucid minor combo until season 3 hits

but i guess ill then go iris major

also sure will test life-force major

[topaz trout]

im prob sticking with r3 blood until raid essence

[bronze kelp]

u already got r3 blood ?

[topaz trout]

few bgs yeah

[bronze kelp]

nice

[topaz trout]

like 3k honor left or less

[shy dust]

People rly wanna make blood work

[topaz trout]

its more interesting but with 3x nothing personal, your opener is stupid strong with it

and any reset with vanish too

[bronze kelp]

need to test it for m+ a bit mor

aiming for a 3 ttk build with 1/2 eb 1/2 ss

[topaz trout]

on reaping i burst for 100K and it dropped to about 60-70K without eb

so its decent for sin

[civic palm]

ok

[topaz trout]

wont mean as much s3 but ok

[bronze kelp]

with lucid active i went instan 200k+ on repaing dropping to 170k in the end

^^

but with 3 eb to be fair 😉

but i like the essence system so far

only one essence u need to hard farm is a good state 😉

[ionic matrix]

Did we ever figure out why highborne was simming higher than reality? And no, i don't mean that the dot is shared among all players. Even alone at a dummy it's not the same as its simming.

[onyx rock]

Sims should be correct now. They changed over the last 12 hours.

For me Kimbul 415 is simming 300 dps more now. 12 hours ago it was the opposite

[upbeat geode]

!essences

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[nimble tartan]

🤤

[solid nova]

@ionic matrix Yes, its pinned. There hasnt been any change made to it currently.

[stray ivy]

Blood isn't on any of those sites, so why u guys farmin git

[tame cobalt]

!essencerank

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essence chart: https://bit.ly/2xdr7P8

[tame cobalt]

@stray ivy this is why

[stray ivy]

seems like it gets beat

[vapid scarab]

Because 1. There’s not much else to do after dailies and there is going to be a tuning pass so it saves time now if things potentially change
2. Blood scales the best of any essence and it’s probably going to be pretty crazy once we actually get into raid gear

[stray ivy]

i see

I'm almost rank 2 but it was a nightmare, I solo queue and im not into wow's "pvp"

i play actual pvp games for that lol

But ill slowly work ther

[vapid scarab]

I’m just doing the daily win for each category

Decent ap farm at the same time

[stray ivy]

i sometimes can't even get that done

[vapid scarab]

And there’s no rush for blood

[stray ivy]

like several losses in a row takes a while for each

i need to find a pvp group that does non rbg premades

which is rough

[bronze kelp]

im glad blood is not that high rated for m+ so far

[stray ivy]

So Sin or Outlaw for Season3 btw

[winter moss]

whatever you prefer to play and can excel at

[bronze kelp]

what youre best at ^^

[stray ivy]

both are pretty easy, and fun. I guess both lol

[bronze kelp]

sin is in a very good state due to TTK

outlaw is a bit more easy

imho

[stray ivy]

i love outlaw's 8 yard range, but i assassin is more fluid (imo)

[bronze kelp]

also it depends on what level u wanna play m+

[winter moss]

every spec has its perks, due outlaw cutting the edge due to his built in utility

[bronze kelp]

if youre only doing some 15 keys, play what you want

[stray ivy]

is it hard to keep 2specs geared

[winter moss]

choosing a spec shouldnt be bound to the key level

[bronze kelp]

if you wanna push on really high keys, you maybe have to pick one or the other

[stray ivy]

I see

[winter moss]

it just in on your hands what you pick due to affixes/level/comp/gear

in that order

*skilllevel

[bronze kelp]

i guess the group composition is more important

and the role you wanna fulfill

assa has a pretty unique state with his prio dmg trait

that makes it extremely powerful with the new affix i guess

[winter moss]

well imo why should you play a spec you are not as good as with the other spec, if you comp would neither gain or lose from it

[bronze kelp]

but what it really will be like, we will know some weeks after s3 is live

then there is something missing whats important 😉 the personal skill level

[winter moss]

macToday at 09:06
*skilllevel

[bronze kelp]

if you just are not comfortable with one specc, you should not play it ^^

ouh sorry

overread that

but to be fair, both speccs will be viable enough to push really high keys with it

[winter moss]

yes, we got various streamers who proof it

[bronze kelp]

outlaw has gouge, as a unique skill + hook + 8 yards range

[lime path]

a lot of the inflated value for outlaw will go away when reaping is gone

from the aoe pad

still good spec tho

[winter moss]

thanks for the summary

we arent talking about s2

[lime path]

oh my bad then

[winter moss]

IF sin's kidney shot would deal dmg according to the combo points spent it would be a major boost utility wise

compared to BTE

now we either spec into the dmg part if internal bleeding

or we straight up lose dmg due to CP loss

[shrewd night]

a lot of the inflated value for outlaw will go away when reaping is gone

[cobalt gyro]

its utility isn't going away

[vestal wren]

i dont think outlaw will be bad next season

[dark crag]

You will have more bf charges for actuall dungeon trash and don't need to worry about reaping waves

[winter moss]

gotta hold cd's aswell for the important packs

[short crypt]

What's the best banthic gear for sin?

[winter moss]

socketed ones

[short crypt]

can they proc gems?

[solid nova]

Proc sockets, yes

[short crypt]

wtf, so you have to keep buying them until they proc a socket?

[solid nova]

Yes

[pure monolith]

!Essence

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[honest needle]

is that new trinket really bis at 400 ilvl

[winter moss]

what trinket

[honest needle]

highborne

its super cheap on the ah

n bloodmallet shows it as a top trinekt

and its only 10k gold

[winter moss]

sim it

[solid nova]

@honest needle Yes its good,

[spice frost]

It’s good but bugged right now. Check the pin

[tame cobalt]

lucid lvl 2 is pretty pog

[winter moss]

3 more seconds, It's not that big of a deal

[marble hemlock]

kinda is, since you pop it after/at the end of vendetta when you dip low on energy f or the first time

[elfin fossil]

!essence

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[marble hemlock]

having 3 extra seconds means it reaches further into your 2nd TB

[tame cobalt]

Idk, a few more seconds every time feels realy good

[winter moss]

1% increase tops

[spice cloak]

!trinkets

[marble hemlock]

well yeah, obviously its no insane increase

[winter moss]

sure it's very good.

but increase is not that high

[marble hemlock]

not comparable to, say, the dps increase you get from crucible r2

[winter moss]

well r1 lucid outsims crucible r2

but i get what you mean

lucid minor and vision major seems pretty strong for ST

[river vessel]

how are you guys currently using lucid in your rotations?

[royal lantern]

when you are low energy

and NOT togheter with vendetta

[winter moss]

vendetta provides 60 nrg over 3 seconds, then you should be in a mid/high range of nrg

use it when at 40 or 50 NRG and your are NOT in a TB window

[river vessel]

awesome, thats what i was thinking but wanted a 2nd opinion.

[winter moss]

or if you were lucky and had a lot of crits and it would higher the chances of getting the 4 env into a tb window

[river vessel]

thanks guys

[waxen valve]

There is a 3-4 sec gap to sync it 2nd tb window. As seliathan said rank2 will be a good qol increase.

And a small dps increase ofc.

[restive inlet]

Combining lucid dreams with the second toxic blade window makes sense

[waxen valve]

At rank1 when your energy low, there is an annoying 3-4 sec gap. Ya, rank2 will eliminate it.

[winter moss]

simmed increase is 0.83%

[restive inlet]

That is pretty good. Idk how it is compared to other rank 2s tho

[wild stone]

Do you ever hold on to TB for a few seconds to reapply rupture first, then mutilate once for CPs, then pool energy and TB when near max energy? Seems logical but I see to use it on CD

[winter moss]

well you dont have to pool to full

and you dont have to refresh rupture at exactly 7 seconds

[restive inlet]

On cd mostly. I Plan it out by reapplying rupture a bit early sometimes, or lose a second or two of uptime

[winter moss]

if rupture is around 11 seconds you should be safe

losing uptime is never the answer

[winter gale]

Guys, where and how do u apply lucid dreams ?

[wild stone]

Scroll up

[upbeat geode]

with 2nd tb

[wild stone]

Do you Pool at all for TB ?

[winter gale]

With 2nd toxic blade after each vendetta

[winter moss]

@wild stone yes

[restive inlet]

@wild stone yes, as much as possible, worth getting as many envenoms in as possible. It's all about planning out your bleed and cd timers

[winter moss]

but dont clip awfully many ruptures

as said tb is 9 seconds, if ruptutre is still at 12 you a probably fine

[upbeat geode]

do you guys also pool before using a finisher (outside of tb)

[winter moss]

i pool to ~60 nrg before i envenom

[restive inlet]

It's nice being able to use envenom inside elaborate planning

Spamming is almost never beneficial, even if it's tempting

[winter moss]

clip env to the las .2 seconds of EP

[upbeat geode]

will you be able to cast envenom in Eloborate window wihout ventetta or lucid dreams?

[winter moss]

yep

should be

[restive inlet]

With lucky crits

[upbeat geode]

well, you can do everything with lucky crits ;D

[winter moss]

it's not always the case

but EP uptime isnt relevant

Bleeds > Env during TB > rest

[restive inlet]

Yeah, it's just nice when you have room to do it

[wild stone]

@restive inlet thanks (about holding TB). That's what I was doing but all the guides say to use on CD which didn't make sense to me if you need to refresh rupture or if you're at min energy with no CPs

[rigid pasture]

bleeds > env during TB? I thought you spammed env during TB

[restive inlet]

Without bleeds, spamming envenoms become hard

[unborn silo]

Do u guys prefer Lucid Dreams or Protocol as Major Essence?

[restive inlet]

No energy

[winter moss]

@rigid pasture dont be a silly. prio is to keep your bleeds on the target

THEN the next prio should be to cast as many env during tb as possible

[rigid pasture]

right, I read what you wrote wrong

I thought you were saying apply bleeds DURING TB

[restive inlet]

That's why planning is important. To avoid that

[uncut nova]

Whats tb

[winter moss]

sometimes it helps to read the whole line not only the first four words

[upbeat geode]

tb = toxic blade

[woven summit]

Yeah sometimes It happens for me to mess it up and forget to refresh rupture and then I TB 7 seconds before rupture expires and I just finish the envenoms during TB before refreshing rupture

shit happens

[wild stone]

Is applying gsrrote during TB normal or am I planning wrong?

[woven summit]

I think you should avoid that

bleeds should be properly refreshed before TB

[wild stone]

Ok

[woven summit]

But you know if it happens it's not the end of the world, just avoid it