Guides are always for maxlevel chars
#assassination
dark crag
agile token
True, but I like to get myself comfortable with the rotation. Better to learn it once instead of having to relearn it when you hit 120 when the rotation is all muscle memory
dark crag
At 120 the playstyle can be different when you get different azerite pieces
Tb/exsang, sub/ma
Pb/ct in dungeons
agile token
Hmm...thats unfortunate...
dark crag
Different openers, different vendetta/ vanish use
flat ocean
In what world do you ever use vanish before vendetta?
Asking because Tawney mentioned vanish garrote vend use of cds
seems bad to me
dark crag
The one build uses vanish for garottes, the other for envenom spam
flat ocean
Yeah but with both builds you use vendetta before vanish?
Or you use vend after vanish with SS+Subt
?
sturdy python
He asked without any traits or anything
dark crag
Kind of, sub builds tend to wait longer until vanish is ready
flat ocean
If I was playing sub I'd use vend vanish garote
but he was saying it for something unrelated to max level
dark crag
Ma tb uses vanish only a few sec after vend, sub ss builds use vanish to reapply powerful garrottes
flat ocean
so doesnt really matter
sturdy python
Let me ask this, what benefit would vendetta before vanish give you?
flat ocean
I play MA+TB and u pool cps+energy then vend @ 4+ cp into vanish env mut env
sturdy python
One tick of garrote so I suppose I was wrong yes
dark crag
Longer poweredup garrotes inside vend
flat ocean
Yeah the tick of garrote and you start gaining energy faster
+it feels more fluid to me
ruby idol
full pandemic garrote is 24 seconds
vendetta 20
vanish first
dont waste gcds inside vendetta
dark crag
Vend is 20 sec full garrote is 23,4 sec
dark crag
If you play without exsang
sturdy python
Oh correct, I knew there was a reason I vendetta after but couldn't remember lol
Ty Dad
ruby idol
even with exsang
youre just trying to maximize valuable gcds inside vendetta
applying 2 garrotes is not value gcds
dark crag
The thing is vendetta will always come off cd before vanish after the opener
sturdy python
You hold it
flat ocean
That's not true
Should only be off cd before vanish the 1st time if you use it after
both have 2 min cds
dark crag
What does fight length change?
flat ocean
Nothing really
sturdy python
Holding a CD could result in a lost use
flat ocean
There should only be max 5 seconds difference between vend and vanish ever
sturdy python
Holding vendetta/vanish for 20s (or we it is) for exsang isn't an issue unless the fight is so long you lose a cast
flat ocean
That shouldnt ever happen
sturdy python
Yes it should
flat ocean
Just dont use exsang
sturdy python
This has been discussed a ton here
flat ocean
when theyre about to be off cd
dark crag
You hold vendetta only one time
sturdy python
And hold vendetta and vanish for 4th exsang
flat ocean
True
sullen pagoda
feelycrafting is strong here yikes
flat ocean
You gave me the impression you should hold vend/vanish for exsang
dark crag
Change exsang to 1 min cd
sturdy python
You do
sullen pagoda
you do hold vend/vanish for exsang @flat ocean
flat ocean
Every time?
sturdy python
3rd exsan is used around 20s left on vendetta cd
sturdy python
So yuo hold vendetta and vanish for about 20s for exsang
median tiger
i need more overwhelming power ...
flat ocean
God that must feel awful
sturdy python
Not an issue UNLESD the fights is so long this causes you to lose a cast of vendetta and vanish
No, feels fine
dark crag
45 90 135 180
flat ocean
You'd have to collectively hold them for 2 minutes to lose a cast
would have to be a pretty long fight
like 12 mins+
dark crag
Yes, that means you hold exsang for vend
sturdy python
Holding a 45s CD for 20s is much worse than a 2 min for 20
dark crag
180 is 20 secs away from vend, casting a new exsang means 180+45 = 225 + the few gcds in opener between vend and exsan
sturdy python
Ok
Again, you're arguing against Sims here
And even logically, holding vendetta loses you nothing
Unless the fight is ridiculously long
flat ocean
^this is a concept im familiar with
dark crag
And exsang just speeds bleeds up
sturdy python
Also incorrect
flat ocean
Still a part of why i like MA+TB is that i should never hold cds
And that feelsgoodman
flat ocean
But fml MA feels like shit when you don't crit
Would it even be that much stronger at 100%?
sturdy python
I just like exsang too much
flat ocean
Fair enough exsang is a cool skill
sullen pagoda
MA is really badly designed talent overall
dark crag
100% was the shoulder legy
flat ocean
Yeah 6 vs 3 is pretty big drop
And yeah i played legion with the shoulders
Felt good
dark crag
And only 50% crit
flat ocean
I would like to know the actual % increase in dps the talent would give at 100% vs 50%
I might work it out sometime and report my findings
dark crag
2 crit envenoms 1 muti vs maybe crit envenoms and muti
With crit array i would get 90% with ma
sullen pagoda
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/4wTdkMfJgdd7HiWxWyJtpZ mastery simming highest for me 🤔
dark crag
Life was simpler with crit/mastery in legion
neat beacon
agreed
dark crag
For subtlety mastery is also better after the tfd change
dark crag
I didn't say top stat, i said better
muted jacinth
thats nuts its saying your mastery is still highest weight even with masterful
masterful for me drops mastery looooow
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/4E2rdzDCqwnvBCmf9kNzum
spice sorrel
in TD if you LOS a cage with a hostile and buff mob, can you insta stealth or does it auto put you in combat?
dark crag
Line of sight?
inner pecan
you can stand between cages
and you won't get in combat
like this for reference. and you're still in range to open either cage
spice sorrel
Oh nice, thanks
coarse tangle
Hi folks, new to rogue, doing M+ mostly, is it worth dropping a 385 azirite piece without SS for a 340 piece with SS?
sturdy python
Probably not
undone verge
Sim it
coarse tangle
using the dungeon slice on raidbots?
coarse tangle
blightborne infusion or NP
primal gazelle
Anyone know how many TR it cost to buy a 370 specific Azerite piece ?
coarse tangle
dont think you can
vapid moth
Mastery was meant to be highest. It wasnt highest before cause we spent all of legion and early bfa with low ass haste
Watch by the end crit will be high again
primal gazelle
Oh
candid smelt
@coarse tangle just use the 345 SS, if you have a total of 3 SS
Or EoB @coarse tangle
strange python
For M+ if you are using an Echoing Blades trait and Hidden Blades talent, would you then use FoK on bosses?
prisma carbon
is construct overcharger any good for m+?
dark token
im debating using a 375 eb over my 390 SS in dungeons it feels sad to use only 1
someone talk me out of it pls
currently 1xEB 2xSS
vapid moth
@strange python only if at max sstacks i guess
bleak spoke
@dark token depends on the pulls u do doesn't it
if you're doing like a massive pull at every given moment might be worth?
dusk sun
running 2 eb 1 ss with subterfuge is so nice
I'm using it atm, I'd say im doing decent in m+ ^^
copper plover
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
vital coral
im currently 374 with 21% Crit, 15% Haste and 31% mastery, i find myself loosing dps towards DH and Hunter in M+.. is it me you think? that i don't dps correctly. i think the hunter last was a bit higher geared than me
unkempt karma
Great DH players who know their shit, will pull numbers ... Its rarely I win vs a great DH. I'm mostly on par or slightly below. But overall a good DH beats me.
amber quail
You mean in really short fight guys?
After burst phase them come in the planet
And with new EB in AoE sin is really good
And: @vital coral spec? Traits? Scenario?
If m+: afflix and dung ?
primal gazelle
@dark token do it, EB is pretty good at high io pulls where you do 2-3 packs at once
actually idk about sacrificing the 15 ilvls for it tho
round harbor
Two SS is still very very strong
primal gazelle
just swap it depending on the dungeon
fathom wyvern
cannonball trinket from TD any good?
round harbor
God no
Use ur brain
It's dogshit
Unless it's like +40ilvls over what you currently have
Don't trust Sims all the time. They lie to yoy
sturdy python
To be more accurate, it's bad if the target moves, is blocked by environment or it's aoe
So if something stands perfectly still it can be good
lost sentinel
hero damage seems to really prefer MFG over vigor
MFD*
with subterfuge
ah, they got a chart for exsanguinate heh
forgot about that, I been running toxicblade this week tho
cobalt gyro
mfd probably is better in raw dps, but it definitely feels worse to play, not having 170 energy would just make bosses feel awful
dawn coyote
Anyone able to tell me if there's an achievement for completing every m+15 dungeon in time?
round harbor
Yes it's a feat of strength
round harbor
It's a seasonal thing
sturdy python
Ah ok
dawn coyote
ok thank you @round harbor , that's why i wasnt' able to find it under achievements then!
paper heron
are any of the new profession items worth pursuing for us?
round harbor
It's a 3 second cast
round harbor
Yeah
It's also a short range
But yeah it's good
Jewelcrafting is a 415 socketed ring
I "think" you can make two but I'm not positive if it's unique equip
round harbor
Veiled crystals 😂
cobalt gyro
i guess technically you could make sure of the shield when hearthing
round harbor
Two hour flask is so nice
paper heron
hrmmm
fathom wyvern
what are the 2 best trinkets for m+ assa?
round harbor
It's not a static answer
A few really strong ones are a high ilvl 2minute on use, Harlan's, deadeye spyglass
fathom wyvern
is dice any good for m+?
round harbor
Yup
spark ermine
I have 375 pvp trinket with on use vest pro vs 370 gcb, I sum it, and the pvp trinket comes out on top
fathom wyvern
and basiclly i only do m+ on my rogue, 13-15 keys, but i somehow cant keep my dmg up after the first high dmged garrote ends from opener, any tip on what to do?
spark ermine
I thought gcb is like top trinket for Assassination
round harbor
Keep high uptime on EB
spark ermine
Also I have 375 spyglass and 375 dice
fathom wyvern
gcb??
spark ermine
Dice sims better
But I feel like I need more crit
Again talking about m+
Currently 24 20 30 stats
fathom wyvern
also, for m+
is it worth getting rup onto every mob
if its lets say 4 mobs
or just garrote, and evenom main target
pale agate
wait.. what is EB?
round harbor
Elaborate planning
fathom wyvern
elaborate planning
pale agate
ahhh
fathom wyvern
but
round harbor
Typing on my phone zzzz
fathom wyvern
how many mobs does it need to be
for crimson to be worth over PB?
for tyra weeks for example
fathom wyvern
but for dungs like atal, where theres only 1 big pull, PB is stronger?
pale agate
PB seems to always be 3-4% of my damage. never seen lower or higher
round harbor
I mean there is multiple big pulls in atal
If you are doing small pulls just go pb
Or get a better tank
spark ermine
Pb for kr and temple on tyra week?
fathom wyvern
2nd option sounds more fun 😄
spark ermine
When you play CT on trash mob
round harbor
@pale agate thing you gotta consider about PB is you waste no gcd on it, and it will make rupture higher on your overall dmg
fathom wyvern
but if you run crimson
do you use it for bosses too
or only for trash
if its a ST boss that is
spark ermine
What’s your rotation should be like? g g g ct fok r fok r fok ct?
pale agate
oh yeah i get that, I was just saying my damage % because someone else said "you don't lose much on ST taking pb"
spark ermine
I was kinda asking
round harbor
That's generally correct
For an aoe pack
I sometimes go g g g CT Fok fok r until CT refresh
nimble tartan
u know what i hecka undervalued how good scent of blood was
i usually dont do high keys or any keys at all but recently been doing some 15-16s and they r hot
nimble tartan
i was running ss scent archive teehee
round harbor
Decent
nimble tartan
i just put on all my 390 azerite that was the thought process
it did fine was big pumpin
round harbor
I've been playing basically 100% outlaw the last two weeks. But ss ss scent before
nimble tartan
outlaw seems fun as hell
nimble tartan
i have no mythic fist weapon
round harbor
Outlaw is actual good tier sleeper
nimble tartan
im so greeedy i have 2 390 daggers but still bonus roll daggers every week
instead of grabin an outlaw weap
dusk sun
I just wished they gave outlaw more backbone for ST tho
nimble tartan
pat scent gives u agility per rupture u have up
spark ermine
I have 2 375 SS chest and shoulder
nimble tartan
123 agi at 390
spark ermine
But only 1 390 head with dagger in the back
spark ermine
Is it worth to switch it to something else at 375?
Like a better trait than daggger in the back with 15 ilvl difference
nimble tartan
yeah if u loook at likie the top 5 mythic+ rogue streams
you see them using 375s
with better traits
spark ermine
Unfortunately I don’t have any SS on head
Anything else better than dagger in the back worth changing ?
nimble tartan
u can check out the herodungeon section on herodamage.com there are alot of things better for mythic+ than dagger in the back
archive is good, scent is good, any stat proc based ones are fine as well like blightborne if u dont have the top tier traits
round harbor
Archive, scent, echoing blades , hell even swirling sands
spark ermine
Ty
errant viper
Just to be sure, garrote and rupture do snapshot nightstalker, right?
paper heron
people hot on scent instead of eb now?
round harbor
Scent has always been good
And has single target value
Unlike eb
Scent + PB has always been a competitive build. But other things are definitely stronger
paper heron
ive got a 390 ss, 375 twist and then either 375 eb or scent for m+. do i just take the eb when pulls will be big?
round harbor
Start by never using twist
And yes you can just leave eb on it
But you really should be on the lookout for emissaries that give 370 caches
There is more than a few that have good traits
Also pvp azerite can be strong for chest/shoulder slots
bleak spoke
Seems like EB is super good, often like 3-4% dungeon overall not including the gains to fok damage, but I usually do eb/scent/ss and I’m not sure how good the stacking agility ends up being on those large packs
round harbor
Assuming you can actually get decent ilvl
Think about it like this
4 stacks of eb is more agi than fully stacked 390 archive
Nearly double the amount of agi
bleak spoke
Yeh I started using it over archive when seli pointed out that just two targets made it better than full stack
With regards to dying smallies is it worth to rupture them for energy refund or are those globals better to just use other abilities with?
Like the rat packs with the trapper in freehold for example
round harbor
I barely get a global on them
I just g g CT and they dead
Both garotes on the trapper
Maybe not be correct, but it's what I do
Our bdk usually beats for those few seconds
bleak spoke
Maybe bad example, more like the tidesage initiates that run away etc
round harbor
Sure
Small ruptures
Like 2 or 3 point ruptures max, if and only if all of elite mobs are fully dotted
If you have a firemage in group you might consider an envem on them instead
Since the passive dot spread can be very problematic with mobs like that. Especially in TD
bleak spoke
For a really large pull how much energy should I pool before I vanish?
Or is that stat dependent?
CT wrecks
round harbor
Again this may not be perfect but on pulls where I know there is 6 or more targets I go something like pot g ,g ,g ,CT wait millisecond for gcd/energy, vanish g g g rup
My thinking is to get as many empowered garrote out during my pot as possible
bleak spoke
Ah okay
round harbor
Seli,flawless, dad might do it differently though
I'm a bit lower than them at 2.1k
Dratnos too
bleak spoke
I’ve been kinda waiting till I had a ton of energy from ruptures but it seems like with the keys I’m running (especially this week) it’s too slow
(Just 12-15s)
round harbor
It's different from dungeon to dungeon
No two are the same
Sometimes u have big aoe pumpers sometimes u save vanish for utility or other things
slow finch
For Mythic zul now is sub still better even with nerfs or is assas better now?
round harbor
Sub is still the best prior Target dmg in the game by a decent margin
On a fight like that
vapid moth
i just realized vendetta doesnt reset after you kill a boss or wipe or whatever
static hedge
Merry Christmas my fellow sin rogues ❤️ keep being awesome.
(eastern time here)
acoustic atlas
is eb dead in M+?
civic palm
No
acoustic atlas
3 SS or 3 eb
nova viper
1 eb 2 SS
fringe estuary
I thought its all about SS still
dark token
thats bis for all but like 3 dungeons
underrot/KR/temple use SS
naw
triple garrote->CT -> fok and rupture 4x, -> spam fok overcapping cp
use CT at 2s left remaining on dot and refresh ruptures if they dropping
dark token
SS is good if you only pull 3-4 mobs at a time
but you can do 2-3 pack pulls pretty often in a lot of dungeons
gear for a lot of crit too
bleak spoke
If I had two ss I’d use that for sure, like I have 2 eb 1 ss but I swapped out an eb for scent cuz seems to do more prio damage, but I mostly pug so your mileage may vary
rough agate
need help with +15 or higher shrines whats the strat for tidesage council whats the strat with interrupts and stuff
fringe estuary
I have 2 ss 1 EB, but the ss is alot lower ilevel than my second EB
bleak spoke
Kick it so the green shit doesn’t cleanse your dots
Lots of that is tank dependent
If your tank doesn’t know how to move them out of the green circle you’ll want to die
Also if you stand in the green stuff it’ll cleanse stacks from the lady’s cast
rough agate
having trouble just completing that fight
bleak spoke
So it’s bad if the cast gets out but not terrible
rough agate
if we kick everything too much tornados if we relax during her blessing we are getting shit on by th stacking when there is a lull in rune
bleak spoke
Like she has 5-6 million health if you’re doing 15s she shouldn’t live more than like a minute thirty
rough agate
hate that boss
rough agate
yeah i think our tank needs to move more
bleak spoke
Like no disagreements here that boss blows
rough agate
its just so annoying lol
bleak spoke
The tornadoes won’t oneshot you but it’ll be close, they’re only really bad during the haste rune
Cuz same color or whatever zzzz
I think when I die it’s cuz I bounce into two of them
primal gazelle
think about it this way, SS has limited scaling, can only be applied to 3 targets, 6 if you count vanish. Meanwhile, EB has exponential scaling that does more damage the bigger you pull
quaint flare
tranquil wolf
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
dusky tinsel
its still all about SS, running more than 1 EB is crippling yourself unless you're pull 10+ mobs consistently. And with this past week being Tyrannical running multiples is a handicap to your group. Will be more beneficial this week., but if you have multiple SS then you can't go wrong in any situation.
hidden halo
Outlaw is the hardest spec in the game
its hard to find a reason to live while playing it
ebon pollen
I find it very easy
tender quail
its really cool to roll four dices and get shit buff
dreamy aurora
guys, is it better to buy specific 385 or random? since you can get 4 385s vs 1 specific one is the same amount of titan residue
considering that i dont have any 385 azerite piece
spice surge
If you don't have any get a random
dreamy aurora
alright, cheers mate
shy axle
you guys using CT only on fort weeks or using it even on tyran if the dungeon suits it ?
dusky tinsel
I use CT on every dungeon regardless of affix with the only exception really being Temple of Sethralis. There's a valid argument for PB on Tyrannical if your comp has good trash clear and you just want the additional boss damage.
spice surge
Pb is generally better, unless you know the group and pulls beforehand. Large pulls favor CT and small pulls favor Pb
leaden garden
is asa best ST rogue specc?
vestal wren
yes
winter valve
leaden garden
Bta, guides says use TB on cooldown, but shouldnt I pool up energy for it, or no?
spice surge
Use it on cooldown
rustic pecan
is the canonball trinket from TD still complete garbage? just got a 385 version
rustic pecan
the spirit of christmas just took a steaming dump on my 380+ item dreams
rocky blade
sims lower than a 355 GCB smh
dark crag
Canonball trinket is a waste of space
fading vigil
!macros
last parrot
Still going crit/mastery for m+?
I go crit haste (more crit) bcause of raiding favors haste?
jaunty crystal
yea crit/mastery is preferred in most dungeons. You don't need haste on multi target because your bleeds help you out enough.
but you want as much haste as possible basically when it comes to Uldir
mossy adder
I thought you were meant to pool for tb so you can get like 2 env casts in instead of using on cd?
visual topaz
some1 here linked the excel from the azerite armor and their traits. Any chance to get my hands on it still ?
sturdy python
Holding tb means you will likely lose casts, you should make sure bleeds are refreshed and you have energy before tb comes off cd
civic palm
Which azerite armor? New or old stuff?
Check #announcements
celest cobalt
Hello, I got a galecallers boon out of my chest so I'm going to try assass for a bit, had 2 questions about the guide. If we use CB on cd, can I just macro it to a few abilities so I make sure to use it right away? Also, for tricks of the trade can I do the same thing? Or is it on the global cooldown? Thanks 😃
jagged gazelle
Yo boys Im new here and have a simple question,on ravenholdt assa guide it says poison bomb is used all the time,but on the cleave rotation it says to use crimson tempest so am I stupid or?
sturdy python
I wouldn't aquatic, there are moments you may want to pop it at specific points. Yes tricks should work that way but you'd need to have it specify who you want to tricks
celest cobalt
Okay awesome! I have the focus macro set up so that should work. Thanks a bunch!
sturdy python
And for instance, you don't wanna use gcb right before the boss moves
celest cobalt
Yeah, I'll practice using it separately 😃
sturdy python
Moonman, not sure exactly what it says but CT is used in large or high health aoe however that only pertains to certain m+ keys. It may just be worded weird
jagged gazelle
oh ok
strange python
why would you wanna tricks on CD? oO
jagged gazelle
so poison bomb is basically all time pick except for high m+
sturdy python
Yes
jagged gazelle
good
sturdy python
Depends on dungeon, level, affixes, and how your group pulls
jagged gazelle
thank you
silk whale
quick question about multi target, if u have liek 3-4+ mobs do u use Toxic Blade in there at start when u trying to put garrote and rupture on all of them
vapid dock
you respec to exsanguinate ffirst
slim olive
Yeah If you're talking about mythic plus. Then you're kinda in the minority of using tb in mythic plus.
It's much cleaner and probably better to use exang. You don't have to worry about envenom uptime during tb, therefore you can spread dots and actually do more damage
vapid dock
you weoulsnt wanna tb at the star, its better to get your garrotes out first and then use tb bc remember it grants a combo point which you wouldnt want to waste/overcap your garrote openers
silk whale
true true
i gotta wait to use it after applying rupture on all other targets aswell right?
vapid dock
it depends if youre ready to start envenonming
bc tocic blade will only effect nature damage spells
not your bleeds like rupture and garrote
silk whale
true, so its better to apply tb after all bleeds r on targets so ic an focus on envenoms/
vapid dock
it depends how long the fight will last
sometimes its not worth the combo points spent to dot up everything
tbh
silk whale
kk so if its short adds, just garrotes is enough and not ruptures
vapid dock
im not sure about those specifics and i dont think its that important on just raid trash to be honest
if its m+ i would suggest exsang and crimson tempest
vapid dock
it can feel weird but its really strong
the best way to learn is just play it, jump in some low keys and smash
silk whale
does the ex affect only 1 target or all ur bleeds
vapid dock
it almost has a bursty feeling to it which is really satisfying
all your bleeds
so you can dot everything up and bleed it out
also when you pop exsang you let the bleeds fall all the way off
silk whale
ahhh interesting since in talent page it just says target's
ahh ok
so i refresh when they all fall off
silk whale
alrighty 😃
vapid dock
if you have 3 targets and you hit it thats instantly 15k damage with bleeds attached
silk whale
question about it tho will i have enough time to put all garrotes up and rupt up and then exanguinate while they above 50% duration?
vapid dock
depends on the fight i reckon
and how much burst is in your group
thats why i say like you gotta feel it, just play it and experience it in as many situations as you can
silk whale
kk
vapid dock
before you jmake you conclusions about it
vapid dock
ofc
silk whale
like on a trash pull of 4 mobs do u feel like have time to garote and rup everything and then ex
vapid dock
if im doing a +17 yeah
silk whale
kk lol
round harbor
Exsang only happens on one target
silk whale
ahh :/
paper heron
no way
primal gazelle
how does this guy talk about doing +17s but claims exsang hits all targets???
lunar merlin
Well you've read the description
primal gazelle
im just mindblown how someone made it this far into the expansion doing 17s while thinking exsang is an AOE spell
round harbor
I'm amazed at how many 1.8k-2.1k players I've met that are completely clueless on how things in dungeons work
honest iris
got cowl from random helm. So happy 😄
primal gazelle
why waste TR on random helm when it gets replaced in a 3 weeks with a 370 with 2 dps rings lol
cobalt flint
The guy who says he’s doing 17 is not the one that has confusion about exhang being aoe, that’s the one asking the questions. what are you all confused about lol
silk whale
wat
primal gazelle
no... "Duck" is the one doing 17s and answering that exsang hits all bleeds
tfw the one who cant read is telling us that we're confused lul
cobalt flint
Ah I only saw the one where Janko said it, didn’t scroll all the way up where apparently Duck told him earlier it is that way, that was the reason for my comment lul
errant viper
is shrouded suffocation still the best azerite trait if NOT playing exsang? 😮
cobalt flint
Not that it is anything mindblowing probably has minimal effect on overall dps
So even if he didn’t know about it probably won’t hold anyone back from doing 17s
fluid mist
My Sim with exsang is less then 100 dps higher then with tb on dungeon slice. 20978 Tb 21031 with exsang i have 2 ss traits so not that big a difference
Also i had a little to much wine and completely misread your question disregard what i said lol
sick coral
sturdy python
If you pull big enough yes
final hull
hmm ... Herdomage says : DD is little better than NP but why is SS so down in that tab . Should i take SS or no for ST , and what should i take for multitarget (Dungeons) ?
sturdy python
SS is very good in multitarget and isn't a chump in st
Change the chart to the m+ section
What you take depends on what you have and what you're doing
final hull
hmm , andhow much SS should i have on my gear
for dungs can i use 2xSS and 1xEB and in add buff affix week 2xEB and 1xSS ?
sturdy python
For most ppl SS is going to be the best for me+
Scent becomes good in large, long lasting pulls and the same goes for eb
silk whale
if ex and TB are both single target, why is ex better for m+?
sturdy python
Higher burst on priority target and gives energy for early in pulls
silk whale
ahh oki ty
sturdy python
And in most keys you might not find a ton of time to tb and envrnom. But there are plenty of people who run tb still
final hull
hmm , then next week (science tomorrow) i should take 2x EB 1xSS (next affixes : Fortified , Bolstering , Skittish )
sturdy python
That's already these affixes
And if you aren't pulling 5+ mobs consistently eb has little value
Lower than that SS will likely out perform it especially considering eb is worthless on st
Also consider, doing aoe damage with eb isn't always beneficial with bolstering
final hull
ok then i ll run 2x SS ,1xEB
sturdy python
Probably your best option yes
fading wigeon
Hey guys. I'm having a hard time understanding my stat weights. Is it okay if I post a screen cap of it?
fading wigeon
Thanks @sturdy python . Unfortunately inclosed my browser. But here is the screen cap.
Unused patchwork 5 min single boss
I used*
sturdy python
Okay so from your current gear setup every 1 of those stats will increase your dps by the number given in St
fading wigeon
Ah ok. So they are all close? I don't need to prioritize anything?
And why is my priority stat so low in the order?
sturdy python
You want to get haste and crit mostly but everything is so close besides vers highest ilvl will probably be best
fading wigeon
Gotcha
sturdy python
Agility? It's normal, just has to do with how secondaries stack
sturdy python
Someone more knowledgeable could explain. They're multiplicative or something
fading wigeon
Thanks so much for taking the time to explain it
I am hoping to main this rogue in the new raid
Do you guys use SS or DD in raids?
honest iris
lapis herald
aye
sturdy python
@fading wigeon just depends what you have. DD is great in St, SS shines when there's multiple targets. I use one of each ATM because it's the best I have
You can look up fights on warcraftlogs and see what most people run, you'll definitely see some SS because of cleave
radiant fossil
Hey guys, im going for a +12. I have choice between 2x EB + 1 SS or 1 EB + 1 DD + 1 NP. I feel like i need to do more damage boss so 2nd setup. But im not sure.
sturdy python
Can Sim dungeon slice for an idea
tropic helm
SS is still pretty good for st and you gain so much more dmg throughout the rest of the dungeon
fading wigeon
@sturdy python thanks for all the advice
tropic helm
I never m+ w/o it but that’s my opinion
sturdy python
Np, frostmage, and yeah I'd definitely pick ss
paper heron
if youre raiding with ss you hold vanish for multiple targets?
sturdy python
For pure dps, not usually going to hold vanish
If we're talking like progression and specific mechanics maybe
tropic helm
Well as long as you don’t lose a usage of it over the course of the fight 2-3x garroting with your ss vanishes will so more dmg than using it on one target
sturdy python
Ya that's true
obsidian ridge
Hi
do you hold exsang for galecaller's? Can't figure it out
dark token
if the fight is short yes
if its > 2:25 no
unless casting exang on cd delays vanish/vendetta by 10s which makes it not usable before the end of the fight such as in a 4:25 duration fight
obsidian ridge
makes sense. ty
spice surge
Its also in the pins
wide dew
sturdy python
Probably not but depends on your character. Use top gear and see
jaunty crystal
You need the big boy enchants my dude
JK they are probably too expensive to justify 10 extra haste lol
modest badge
are u suppose to be able to get axe wpns in assault caches when loot speced assassin?
sturdy python
Not sure if it's meant to happen but others have had the same happen
summer valve
assault caches are like emissaries, they don't follow lootspec at all it's just completely random
civic palm
Yes but you shouldn't follow them.
Because you'd need multiple lists for the scenarios you might find yourself in. So there isn't a list.
tropic helm
Crit/mastery is better than haste for m+ in my experience; unless you want to focus exclusively on boss dmg
civic palm
Level cap has not increased IIRC.
cold meteor
I had my AoE rings in the sim, but it took my haste rings 
vapid moth
i thought 400 was the level cap
cold meteor
395
vapid moth
401 is 39
80k ap to go from 38-39. bout 50k AP to get in a week. if you already have 39 by now youve grinded at least an extra week
so yeah that is wow imo
paper mural
Hey guys, just starting up with BFA, which bosses do I want to bonus roll on in the current raid?
paper mural
Nice! Thanks, the rest not so much?
paper heron
i mean just depends what you have
paper heron
the trait on fetid chest is pretty big id go for that
mother and zul have the daggers
vapid moth
easier to kill mother than zul though
maiden raptor
Is shrouded suffocation still the bis trait? cause i check bloodmallet and apperently it says that f/e double dose is better when trait stacking?
civic palm
Stop looking at Bloodmallet, ezpz.
unkempt karma
SS is strong for multi target like m+
DD for single target.
maiden raptor
Gotcha thanks a lot
lost horizon
SS is still good for ST, using exsang
civic palm
On short fights it's pretty great.
maiden raptor
exsang?
lost horizon
Talent, same row as TB
maiden raptor
gotta try that talent sometime thanks for the advice
lost horizon
Exsang is generally recommended for M+, since you can actually still get value from it on trash
maiden raptor
Ic so do you use it on cooldown or only with a buffed garrote up?
round harbor
It's a little more complicated than that. I'd read a guide
lost horizon
On trash or in general? On trash you always open with garrotes anyway
round harbor
If I were you
maiden raptor
Oh yeah should've checked the pins before asking haha. Thanks gonna do that
still pewter
civic palm
The DMG probably stacks, and the NRG regen doesn't.
Would be odd if none of it stacked yet having another one is still a DPS increase.
jaunty crystal
I feel like I don't give up SS here for the small dps increase. SS is too relaxing 😦
supple hearth
the ones where ur tank is pulling 4+ mobs at once
supple hearth
yep. If they are pulling smaller groups then you're prob better off playing pb. Doesn't hurt to always play pb imo.
but if youre min maxing and ur group does big pulls then CT might be better
jaunty crystal
PB is generally preferable in temple
otherwise it depends on key level and pull size and giggle said
as*
short relic
cool. I mostly run PB but im looking to run CT for a possble dps increase. Thanks for all the info.
supple hearth
I dont feel like its a noticeable difference either way, but I also dont do super high m+ or run with tanks that pull big
grave elk
what would top alliance race be for rogue? pve only
weak rose
Gnome or nelf are typically the two favorites from what I’ve seen
robust spire
Hey, guys. Frenetic Corpuscle 385+soc or dead eye 370 or harlan’s loaded dice 370. Which one is best for uldir. I simed those trinket with patchwalk and cleave add but they say those are similar, but i think not considered boss condition like vectis or mythrax
Because when i get higher spec. Crit is important stat in general
grave elk
@weak rose where can I look at information like that
paper heron
twist is simming slightly higher than laser matrix (my only two head options) in M+ slice. is that right? someone made it sound like twist was awful in m+ at some point but i cant remember exaclt
y
civic palm
Any item level difference between the two?
paper heron
no
375s
the twist gets overwhelming power and the matrix gets elemental whirl tho so i guess a little bit more on the twist middle row
civic palm
It's not awful it's just not strictly oriented towards cleave/aoe and that's like 75% of M+ dungeons.
OP is however, very powerful.
But overvalued as I believe it assumes you don't drop stacks from getting hit.
or at least the SIM does better than people can do with the triat.
Same probably it has with simulating something like Dagger in the Back. The SIM has way higher than possible time only attacking the backs of every target.
paper heron
well so you think twist is overvalued then?
civic palm
No, OP is overvalued on the SIM outputs because it doesn't SIM a realistic scenario. It has more stacks on average of OP than players do, making the trait worth more than it can be worth.
It's still probably better though
errant viper
Guys
I'm trying to make a weak aura
that can track ONLY empowered garrote
But I'm not sure how to do it; how can I make weak aura check if garrote is empowered?
civic palm
By programming the LUA to check for whether you have or have not cast Garrote while being under the effect of Stealth and/or Subterfuge.
paper heron
i have a wa that tracks both styles of garrote
errant viper
Is that simple to do @civic palm or do I need some programming knowledge to do that? 😮
@paper heron Any chance I could have the string? 😮
civic palm
Not simple.
errant viper
Can't even get a color change to work D:
paper heron
yeah you in game? hit me up at arriflex#1703 @errant viper
civic palm
hmmm
vapid moth
sometimes i wish we could pick both CT and PB and then just use whichever wed like based on the pull
errant viper
Guys
One last question
I want a weak aura to only show in combat
What's the trigger for that again? 😮
spice surge
Ct wasn't a thing in legion though
safe matrix
fluid mist
Why is this considered a major point of improvement. I used it on cd..
As i should right?
errant viper
Guys
Are azerite traits predetermined on items?
Like, will all Irontide Captain's Hats that drop have the same available traits?
Or will they have different, randomly assigned traits to choose from?
carmine sierra
Set ones
errant viper
Where can I find which piece has which traits? 😮
I was searching on WoWhead but it listed some traits a piece didn't actually have
Which led me to ask the question haha
paper mural
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
final hull
which is better to take : Unstable Flames , Heed my Call , Overwhelming Power
strange python
final hull
--_--
vestal wren
!sims
prisma monolithBOT
BfA Simulations:
Herodamage: https://www.herodamage.com/rogue/
Bloodmallet: https://bloodmallet.com/index.html
junior citrus
Any specific dungeons tied to [Poison Bomb] or [Crimson Tempest]?
long geyser
do you just go mythic + with ur st gear or
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste or do u follow this for dungeons
lost horizon
I drop some haste in favour of Crit/mast for M+, compared to my ST raid set
dark crag
Mastery/crit rings on the side help a lot
fringe estuary
What is the warfront status this week for horde?
vivid hearth
How should one use the simulations, i mean, im getting way lower sims with the trinkets listed on the top of bloodmallet compared to when i sim myslef
*myself
flint verge
++
wary anchor
what tricks macro do u guys use?
dark crag
A creative one
spice surge
Dont you mean a creative one.... 😉
dark crag
Target,focus,targettarget,manual
spice surge
I mostly just edit my macro and type in the name of the tank if its any serious content
dark crag
#showtooltip /cast [@target,exists, help,nodead][@focus,exists,help,nodead][@targettarget,exists,help,nodead][]Tricks of the Trade
I don't know if exists is necessary, but it works
http://www.macroexplain.com
with that you can see what a basic macro does
Although some newer macro things are not in like talents:x/x, but spec:x works instead
obsidian girder
how to use exsanguine midfight ? refresh both garrote & rupture no matter how much they got left or wait for pandemic, refresh them and then do exsang ?
spice surge
Refresh rupture if it has below 20s left and only refresh garrote if it is in pandemic
But you do that before exsang comes of cd so you can press it asap
obsidian girder
thanks mate!"
strange python
Does shrouded suffocation scale with vers?
spice surge
Why wouldnt it?
strange python
idk - hence the question
echo night
Wowhead it
ocean rain
iirc they changed it so it does scale with vers now
solid nova
That was a tooltip change, nothing more.
echo night
Garrote itself is magnified by AP only but SS trait is increased by versa
spice surge
???
echo night
The additional dmg that is, not the total dmg of garrote on SS apply
spice surge
Garrote does more damage if you have more vers, regardless if you have ss or not
echo night
Versa is just a bonus stat to not really consider, nice to have, but not a major factor like crit/haste/mastery untill your ilvl and stat balance increase :)
Id recon versa scales better when people start touching 415-420 ilvl :)
spice surge
Vers scaling is incredibly linear, there is no reason for it to suddenly rise in value when you get 415 ilvl
vivid hearth
§h
strange python
Being on christmas break, and trying to find a decent pug for mythic clear is impossible 😭
vapid moth
It's still early morning-_-
strange python
not in the EU 😃
vapid moth
Oof
solid nova
Yeah pugging on boxing day is gonna be rough for numbers
weak rose
@grave elk you can look at race sims of the default profile on bloodmallet or even just sim your own toon with different races by changing
‘race=your_race_here’ in sims
fading vigil
Can some one look st my rogue and see what is wrong, I still can’t break an 18k sim. Character:
Author: @fading vigil
Updated: 13 hours ago.
Character: Gruthalogy (US-Illidan)
**Spec & Class: **Assassination Rogue
**Equipped ilvl: **379
Custom Options:
Reorigination Array: 10
Simulation:
Report: https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/83a6ARbzK7w9jkk2KYRUqy
DPS: 17,923
Elapsed Time: 01:58.
fading vigil
12/25/2018 https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/hv3Bp4kW9Q2yADwx/ and if some one can look at my logs and tell my why I can’t get better parses 😦 I’ve studied and studied don’t know if I’m Messi g up encounters.
@solid nova it’s that big off a difference?
solid nova
Gems are massive.
fading vigil
I’ve seen some rogues in here like 18.4 at lower item lvl and I’m like what the fuck am I doing wrong
solid nova
Better traits, more sockets, better weapons. All can equate to lower ilvl but better optimised
fading vigil
You a top rogue bro? Can I see your logs and character name? So I can compare
solid nova
Far from it. It's just common knowledge on item level vs optimisation
fading vigil
Lol, it’s all good bro. I’m just trying to better my self
midnight ledge
U got sims with 1k dps more then u @fading vigil and difference is the traits one trinket
fading vigil
So I’m very open to critdism and critiquing
@midnight ledge what you talking about sir?
midnight ledge
About the sim that u posted
fading vigil
Yes sir?
midnight ledge
Try to put logs on wowanalizer better to see what u doing wrong
Cuz overcapping cps and incorrect use of cds are probably the issue
outer yacht
should you use galecaller's and doom's wake together?
solid nova
???
shrewd night
midnight ledge
@gusty kestrel if u say...
solid nova
@outer yacht Having 2 on use trinkets, will be the other on a CD when used.
@midnight ledge Not sure how that answer even remotely comes close to plausible
grim wolf
just finished uploading my Wa package to WAGO, in case anyone wants to take a gander and likes it enough to use it. let me know what you guys think! https://wago.io/9qYBFV6Tx
languid ore
Damn that was super quick
solid nova
Next ones a mute, your call 🙃
languid ore
Merry christmas Richard
solid nova
Happy New Year
fading vigil
Looking for a solid mythic plus rogue like 1800plus io opinion on mythic plus as assasination. Throughout the weeks tyrannical or fortitude what are the best azerite trait set ups?
granite rampart
I think it’s more of a ‘which dungeon’ instead of ‘which affix’. Stacking 2/3 SS will always be more powerful imo the fewer targets you have. so in dungeons like UR, ToS, and KR where the packs are smaller, but bulkier, I run 3 SS. Echoing blades is a really good trait when there’s tons of targets. what that’s trait really did is give assassination a way to keep up with DHs and mages on mega pulls in dungeons like FH and ML.
so on ML, FH, waycrest, dungeons with higher mob density having 2 EB is the way to go. I would never run 3 EB however in any situation.
just one thing you should think about is that if you are running 2 EBs on a tyrannical week, those provide zero single target value, so if the single target in your group is weak, then I would consider swapping to 2 SS/1 EB, but if the aoe is weaker, then running 2 EB is still perfectly fine as long as your group is comfortable with the single target loss
grim wolf
i think i need to do more testing or something EB, i did an UR last night and i felt like it did really low damage overall. less than 1% 🤔
dense delta
Is the extra dmg from teh SS trait for the g out of stealth or for all g ??
grim wolf
also pretty small pulls just because of bolstering :X
spice surge
Well yes, EB is less good in underrot, because you cant really pull big there
grim wolf
yeah
granite rampart
I would not run EB on UR unless your tank does 2nd boss room fucking huge
grim wolf
I realized that as soon as i typed it, just wanted to check it out
granite rampart
as far as other traits tho, I wouldn’t run DD ever in dungeons, mainly because it works against aoe’ing in general. It makes your mutilate target cap go up to like 3 I think, so let that be the heavy hitter in raid. Scent of blood can be a good replacement for SS if you have a high item level over an SS of the slot. for example if you only have the 345 ss helm, but 390 scent helm, use the SoB
but when using double dose you only fok to put deadly poison on targets, then you mutilate if at 3, maybe even 4 targets, don’t remember for sure, and EB makes you fok at 2 so they essentially work against each other. maybe tyrannical KR is the only place I could see DD being good in.
paper heron
You fok at 2 with eb?
fading vigil
@granite rampart can I add you real I’d?
granite rampart
yeah, some people fok at 2 even without eb
the dps difference between mutilating at 2 or fok at 2 is also super small.
fading vigil
Is archive of the titans and good for mythic plus bro?
granite rampart
I never run it as assassination.
fading vigil
Not even in raid?
granite rampart
well it’s required in raid
fading vigil
Just making sure I understand the difference haha
Do you have separate gear for mythic plus, to raid?
granite rampart
yep, I have many gearsets
fading vigil
Smfh I guess I’m slacking as a rogue
Only have 1 set I use for raid and mythic plus :/
granite rampart
lmao it’s ok if you’re new to rogue
sturdy python
Supposed to mut at 3 unless you need poisons up on multiple targets btw
granite rampart
anyone else looked at the azerite pieces that drop from next raid? a lot of interesting combinations. I’m excited for it
I’m just happy no one will be using archive anymore. there will actually be more options for gearing
dark token
so excited for rolling random 415s because specific azerite gear costs way too much
granite rampart
SAME
and waiting 2 months to be able to do it
but looking at the loot table it looks like most situations are covered from azerite that drops from the raid.
spice surge
^
unkempt karma
random 415, and if you hit rock bottom, then wat? xD
spice surge
If youre playing assa you basicly wont need to buy things for residium
granite rampart
yeah unless you don’t mythic raid
granite rampart
you’re right frozen, but at least they made every boss drop azerite so at least it will easier
unkempt karma
1600 or so, get back like 500 or so
dark token
ah they did huh
i didnt check loot tables i assumed some pieces would be locked to later bosses
like uldir
noice
granite rampart
yeah, so getting raid pieces early is more likely than buying specifics.
so I saw that both daggers drop for alliance bosses, does that actually mean horde players won’t be able to get them until after they kill jaina?
they drop from oppulence and rastakhan. I know rastakhan is an alliance boss, and I think oppulence is too
grim wolf
2 "daggers" one of the daggers looks like a damn sword
spice surge
There are no horde or alliance bosses
spice surge
🤔 Warmode in raid 🤔
granite rampart
another pvp raid yikes
granite rampart
:puke:
dark token
that handle
grim wolf
🤢
dark token
y u c k
grim wolf
the mythic cloth set looks badass
granite rampart
they get a triceratops skull on their shoulder
grim wolf
idk how i feel about the leather set
granite rampart
that’s sick
grim wolf
yeah that shoulder pad
granite rampart
blizzard loves shoulders
strange python
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
queen fjord
Do you think 375 with echoing blades is better than 390 with Archive. secondaries in both are shit
I mean tier 2 traits
That would be my only archive and or only echoing. for M+ ofc
empty tide
vapid moth
i like to think that even if he had done a +10 he woulda gotten that. just 5 ilvl higher
jagged gazelle
just a quick question guys,if there is more than 3 mobs should I just spam fan of knives and tunnel envenoms into a single target in mythic + dungs?
bleak spoke
Too bad I don’t play outlaw, the sword from Jaina is soooo pretty
formal falcon
For m+ without shrouded, do you go toxic blade master assasin or stick with exsanguinate subterfuge
primal gazelle
Do whatever your heart desires
im running 3x EB this week cos yolo
feels nice to beat dh's
sturdy python
No moonman, you need ruptured to keep energy up
grave elk
crimson tempest or poison bomb for waycrest?
primal gazelle
ct for the pad
prime stirrup
Whats going on with nighly build on simc? I just simmed at 17.5k down from 19.3k last week
primal gazelle
did u forget to click on RA
prime stirrup
nope
primal gazelle
sounds like a user error tbh
prime stirrup
Doubtful
primal gazelle
hey dumbass
youre not wearing archives
or laser matrix
aka NO RA
venmo me 100$ @ jin-cobra
thanks
prime stirrup
oh rip. Didnt swap chest trait
unborn barn
awkward
dark token
rekt
prime stirrup
Its not really awkward. Im glad he pointed out I didnt sim the correct trait. He may be an asshole, but he was right on this one.
primal gazelle
i wasnt an asshole until you decided to be smart with me saying "i accept paypal or wow tokens"
prime stirrup
It became smart only after I responded to your bet? Gotcha, makes sense.
little kestrel
Rekt
lost horizon
@prime stirrup doofus, do less m+
opaque grotto
I think it became smart when you said “doubtful” when he said it was likely user error
prime stirrup
cant till i hit my goal. bout to chest this 17ur
opaque grotto
The sims don’t just break
opaque grotto
Nothing new was added this week, not likely it would have broken
prime stirrup
but he was right. i copied simc data from before azerite reforge, so i didnt have archive on
lost horizon
@opaque grotto there's a screenshot of spriests simming like over 100mil
opaque grotto
That was because the spriest mods fucked up real bad
lost horizon
Shit does break sometimes 🤷
weak rose
Sims only break when an error was pushed but that’s usually only when something in game has changed and something new had to be implemented/changed
lost horizon
Someone not keeping up on spriest disc would find it random
Obviously there's always a cause
It's not magic
opaque grotto
It was even pinned in their discord basically saying “we fucked up”
primal gazelle
anyone know if enchanters getting anything cool with the new raid?
like jc gets 415 rings, leatherwork gets pants/boots 415 etc
grave elk
poison bomb or CT for underrot?
prisma monolithBOT
There is no specific week or affix that makes one or the other more viable.
CT vs PB is mainly down to your group, the dungeon itself and your pull sizes, with PB naturally having an edge in boss fights.
It's mainly the combination of affixes and dungeons that favour one or the other. High Tyr KR/Temple favour PB in general, due to low pulls and harder bosses.
In terms of Exsang vs TB; Exsang wins since it works well with SS traits and it's only 1 global on your priority target for some burst damage and extra energy.
TB usually locks you to that target to gain the most out of it.
grave elk
so i lose a lot of dps i think if i sim exsang vs TB but i do have 1 SS trait