can we get like PSA about EB nerf ? so ppl will stop asking about it every other 15min
#assassination
late moat
edgy crystal
@vestal wren i got 390 x 3 EB
@vestal wren i can also play 2x390 EB + 1 390 Nothing personal
should i go 3x EB for M+?
or 2 + 1
late moat
cobalt gyro
After the nerf i wouldn't run more than 1 EB trait
edgy crystal
have they nerfed yet?
late moat
o holy shiet
cobalt gyro
Yes it has been
vestal wren
@edgy crystal i dont know tbh, you could run a sim on raidbots using m+ style
ye the eb nerf was big, tho it still seems to be a very strong trait
cobalt gyro
I've been running 1 eb + 2ss, feels fine to me, and running subt instead of MA so that I can garrote spread like usual. Eb just an extra for aoe filler
obsidian ridge
apparently it's not worth stacking EB, optimal setup for m+ (for me) seems to be 1 EB and double SS
timid grotto
how do i sim my stat weights for m+ ? hectic add cleave > 5 bosses > 1min ?
fiery cradle
buoyant coyote
hows the opener now with nothing personal?
sturdy python
Shouldn't change
grim wolf
feels exactly the same tbh
prisma monolithBOT
Use the fight style Dungeon Slice (Beta) for a M+ simulation on Raidbots.
buoyant coyote
i need to get used to zero SS
quaint frost
how the f you 18.6k dps
vast forum
I simmed 19k+ before patch
buoyant coyote
did we get nerfed?
worldly raft
I would say mythic geared, then 18-19+ is normal
vast forum
Will see when i get home from work
cobalt gyro
I was about 18.6k as well
buoyant coyote
I cant find anything (sin rogue )
vast forum
No nerfs in patch
valid moss
double dose still gucci https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/8tXuzQGV2GMdRckkzS9fRx
sturdy python
Well eb nerf lol
quaint frost
I'm 381 and im simmin 16.6k ...
but thats without 10 stack archive because im simmin for mythic pluses
sturdy python
Are you skmming archive
quaint frost
nah i dont run it in mythic plus
drifting cloud
well kinda obvious then isnt it
cobalt gyro
If you're built for m+ with lota of crit and low haste, yeah your ST will suffer
fiery cradle
750 secondary stat is pre large
neon nacelle
idk why, but ss lost so much simdps in my case
spice surge
Nothing has changed, so you've changed something
neon nacelle
let me check
patent topaz
ill run double archive, 1x ss forever because lul azerite
quick aurora
Is nothing personal worth replacing ss , archive or dd. ?there the 3 I have atm
sleek veldt
What do you guys sim against normally for M+? Is the Dungeon Slice (BETA) worth using?
neon nacelle
Doesnt seem to be an upgrade for me tho, maybe on fights like mother where u get the dmg amplifier in the third chamber
or Fetid with the 3 min burst tactic
wary anchor
nothing personal is good right
knotty lichen
What are you running usually Nola? 2 dd/1arch?
neon nacelle
Depends, mythrax for example i ran 2 SS/ 1 Arch
wary anchor
How is ancient bulwark
neon nacelle
Vectis 1 SS / 1 DD / 1 Laser (bcuz overwhelming on laser chest)
knotty lichen
Ok
quick aurora
Is blood mallet or herodamge the most accurate?
sturdy python
Herodamage for rogues at least
quick aurora
Sweet
timid grotto
damn my ass gear sims worse than sub 
sick frost
so this week one FoK trait and 2 ss?...talents - sub and CT?
keen inlet
oh boy spicy patch life
prisma monolithBOT
There is no specific week or affix that makes one or the other more viable.
CT vs PB is mainly down to your group, the dungeon itself and your pull sizes, with PB naturally having an edge in boss fights.
It's mainly the combination of affixes and dungeons that favour one or the other. High Tyr KR/Temple favour PB in general, due to low pulls and harder bosses.
In terms of Exsang vs TB; Exsang wins since it works well with SS traits and it's only 1 global on your priority target for some burst damage and extra energy.
TB usually locks you to that target to gain the most out of it.
steep ridge
with the nerf to Echoing Blades, is it still worth to use in m+?
verbal mantle
Why dont you go test it in M+ ? :D
shrewd folio
S I M I T
merry fox
@neon nacelle ss lost value becouse of stealth fix for vanish. It no longer gives you subterfuge buff -> so you got empowered garrote only when entering fight
ocean rune
Is Vendetta supposed to break stealth now?
steep ridge
@merry fox isn'T that fixed already?
neon nacelle
@merry fox Thats alrdy fixed and it would not have applied to simcraft
verbal mantle
@ocean rune fucking test it on a target dummy
ocean rune
Easy there, was just a question
knotty lichen
There’s a dot with the new trait, so it probably breaks stealth if you’re using it yeah
ocean rune
ohh, theres my answer, I had different traits prior to the patch
now i see I have 2x vendetta trait
ty bros
steep ridge
wtf
quick aurora
how do ppl have vendetta trait so quick?
steep ridge
Echoing blades is a 1k improvement over ss in m+ simulation :<
it replaced poison wire
wet oxide
Poisoned wire is vendeta now as far as i know
steep ridge
had one azerite piece with it
ocean rune
I had the trait that increased the crit rating of Mutilate @quick aurora
and that was changed
yeah, like Aedan said
quick aurora
oh i c let me check my bags
wet oxide
And FoK changed to EB
quick aurora
oh cool found it
so it actually procs even if vendetta is on cd?
nothing personal i mean
quick aurora
oh i see now ty
ocean rune
Extra burst
normal ridge
so need double dose x2 for be gucci no?
quick aurora
so if u choose it could you reduce your haste gems/gear etc ?
strange python
nothing personal really dat bad...-.-
knotty lichen
Haste still fasten bleeds, reduce gcd and augment your poison application rate so I don’t think so, the new trait may be interesting in fights like mother or fetid burst strat but I don’t see how it would change our stats weights
quick aurora
ok so looks like ill keep archive ss and dd for now for raid
vast forum
Doesn't reduce gcd (except vend) @knotty lichen
solid nova
^
quick aurora
makes sence tyvm
dapper wraith
Think the vanish thing will get reverted?
blazing tulip
It was already fixed if you are talking about the subterfuge Rasix
dapper wraith
oh, shit. whew.
echo cargo
So 2x NP isn’t preferable?
solid nova
quick aurora
one more question , if i was to use NP for say fetid/mother ...would i swap out a piece with dd or archive? as atm i use arch dd and ss
knotty lichen
2x NP only stacks the dot damage so it lose a bit of value
sturdy python
Still want array stacks
quick aurora
ok so Arch ,SS ,NP?
knotty lichen
I usually run only 1 array, and 1 NP is close to 1 DD damage, si I would try to run 1arch 1DD 1NP
echo cargo
Does 1x NP shift your stat weights to mastery tho?
strange python
no i dont think that
knotty lichen
Don’t think so but stats weights vary from 1 char to another so you should sim it to be sure
rare jackal
quick aurora
then i would have to switch playstyle from ss as i am speced subterfuge
knotty lichen
Why so?
lethal echo
Anyone know about that new trinket from the world boss ?
knotty lichen
Arch/ss/np should be fine aswell tbh
lethal echo
Not in bloodmallet yet
quick aurora
coolies ty
solid nova
Yes
quick ice
@lethal echo simmed it myself earlier (scroll way up for link) and it's worse than fathoms.
quaint sequoia
so after EB nerf, is it still best in aoe?
lethal echo
Jesus really?
Just got it to drop too not home atm
The uptime must be trash then
@quick ice thanks man
median notch
is hero damage updated? why both new traits suck so much ballz?
barren forge
guess it's time for fok again? 😄
strange python
its already fixed dude
wide pawn
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
barren forge
dont ruin it @strange python 😦
lone junco
@edgy crystal was really expecting a combo with SS to still come out on top. But this is a bit higher than what you have.https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/wjBQxgdqsLDxdsZnpT6yQs
lone junco
use the top gear sim on Dungeon slice.
pick your ss traits, and fok traits.
something will be tops
rose sapphire
patent spire
forest lords razorleaf anygood?
haughty flame
wut r our best traits atm then?
lone junco
sim your own stuff
echo geyser
anyone tested out hidden blades with Echoing blades? (i know theres been a 75% nerf to the trait)
lone junco
yes
shrewd bane
SS has been buffed ?
lone junco
no
shrewd bane
yes
echo geyser
so u get more dmg on the trait
shrewd bane
i saw the new formula a few weeks
patent spire
lol i have only 2% vers :d
lone junco
I heard it worked that way anyway.
echo geyser
vers is just a small bonus
shrewd bane
it's a buff
echo geyser
i mean the numbers didnt change before this patch
shrewd bane
i compared the dmg with the new formula a few weeks ago
shrewd bane
300 ~ dmg on dd
patent spire
cool i managed to get two ss traits 😃
shrewd bane
with my versa
patent spire
i m thinkin bout going 3 SS when i get my head piece
sturdy python
This was talked about during ptr, vers changed nothing
lone junco
just in time for fok schanges.
echo geyser
vers changed nothing before patch u mean?
sturdy python
...
Vers is no different in regards to ss than before
The tooltips were chanhed
That's it
Damage is the same
echo geyser
so i just wasnt paying attention to my vers and then checking the ss dmg on gear pieces then
rose sapphire
im simming 19400 with 384 eq + Double Dose, Dagger in the back and 1 archiv
patent spire
well im a failure
sturdy python
That's not what he means
lone junco
use
Smart raid buffs.
smart sim.
Patchwerk
Nightly
it didnt include your 10x stacks of haste.
sturdy python
Did you Sim with array stacks?
lone junco
patent spire
i simmed statweights
lone junco
do this.
patent spire
okay
compact void
How should i sim for m+ ? I mean which parameters ?
solid nova
!m+
prisma monolithBOT
Use the fight style Dungeon Slice (Beta) for a M+ simulation on Raidbots.
median notch
insane how crit got so much value on stat weights even with array. seems unreal
lone junco
for Fok weights?
median notch
no ST
lone junco
I havent seen any ST with crit above agi. the aoe fokkening. even with current iteration is very very high crit
but I didnt rerun my stuff recently
median notch
i got both crit and haste above agi and even crit is my array atm
just does not seem right at all dunno
dense quest
any one have spymaster's wraps on raidbots? its showing as not having DD when I know it does
dense quest
nvm wrong ring
patent spire
Thank you lad.
sturdy python
The fokkening will happen again one day don't worry
solid nova
patent spire
i replaced it with the meme cannon 370 item level
wonder if it was good idea or not
winged forge
For those of you who killed M zul last night, did you do it standard serving him? My guild was having trouble preventing the second hexed set
lone junco
patent spire
i mean i replaced the meme cannon LoL
lone junco
tab more ruptures.
pliant steeple
wasnt like that yesterday
lone junco
make sure your poisons are on.
wary ice
^ gets me every time tbh
pliant steeple
@lone junco hahaha poisons were off xD my WA didnt pop when they were off
cheers mate xd
solid nova
Fat yikes 😄
craggy helm
RIP EB. Dec. 11 - Dec. 12
compact void
Am i simming right please ?
craggy helm
That one time rogues did decent aoe damage.
spice surge
🤔
solid nova
Wat
craggy helm
Well...assas
spice surge
You know assa does some of (probably THE) highest sustained aoe in the entire game right now?
solid nova
Take your pick 😂
lone junco
@compact void relatively. try the 3rd ss if you ahve it.
wary ice
I literally never had a problem with ass aoe 😦
craggy helm
Maybe like 3 or 4 target
spice surge
Keyword: sustained
wary ice
now i just spin and get fucked the fuck up
wary ice
I got absolutely demolished yesterday in a 12 temple
no clue what i was doing wrong
kept dying to shit
compact void
@lone junco I don't have it , i'm actually running 2 SS + archive
wary ice
Literally never got hit by this stuff before 😦
compact void
@lone junco The parameters are good ?
lone junco
yeah. Slice sets them for you.
if you switch to any Fok traits, your haste trinket will go for that spyglass.
but the sim will tell you that.
compact void
Well
I have a fok trait on the head but if i take it , i give up the archive
is it worth ?
lone junco
@craggy helm they are cd dependant. sin just needs to stealth to maintain 35-40k forever. but no need arguing about sustained pulls.
talking 30s +
not 10 second blast packs.
astral hill
Yo, what is the best trait set now?
compact void
@lone junco
open stag
For what? Raid? M+?
frozen pecan
open world
tropic shadow
Play whatever you like most
craggy helm
Naw, it's a shit, knee jerk reaction. To do that aoe damage you literally have to put all your Azerite traits into it. Sacrificing tons of ST damage. That is exactly how it should work. They don't even give it a chance to play out and look at logs before nerfing.
modest badge
imagine imagining
open stag
So just leveling? World pvp? Or just a jack of all trades thing?
frozen pecan
wary ice
Has the EBFoK rotation been posted anywhere; namely at how many stacks of the trait does it start becoming more relevent
craggy helm
God forbid a 3 DPS spec class actually has a way to spec into heavy aoe.
frozen pecan
I need bis for pvp, raid and m+
solid nova
@frozen pecan I will confine you to ot 
frozen pecan
compact void
@lone junco Did you see what i said ? 😄
frozen pecan
don't do it
primal gazelle
DH isnt cd reliant
primal gazelle
eye beam is on a 30 sec cd and barrage is 1 min
lone junco
@compact void when you run top gear, select all of your SS, Archive, and Fok. then also pick subterfuge/MA CT/HB. run that as a dungeon slice. see what happens.
compact void
Ok ok
ashen lagoon
is stacking SS trait still the best way to go in M+ ?
frozen pecan
is this dh discord?
primal gazelle
yes
lone junco
if the fok if close at all, try more crit (trinkets)
astral hill
I mean bis for Raids and m+
frozen pecan
maybe I clicked the wrong inv
primal gazelle
eb is now trash
its a quality of life trait once you have access to 6 traits,
but scent ss archive probably better at this point
patent spire
Shrouded Suffocation > Archive/ Scent of Blood. ?
wary ice
dont ss and eb like prevent eachother's usefulness?
lone junco
depends on the target
ashen lagoon
so having 1 of each is the best i get out of this?
lone junco
got bosses to kill, and gigas to pull
high holly
going in to kr 14 how many EB traits should i go?
primal gazelle
0
lone junco
drowsy parcel
did they nerf EB already
wary ice
^
solid nova
Yes
drowsy parcel
source?
lone junco
I ran it for zul trash. and sustained higher than I think i normally would.
lone junco
but it was lot and lots of tabbed ruptures.
high holly
rly? i just tested on 4 dummies and i get 30k+ for 2 min straight
primal gazelle
screenshot it
lone junco
yeah. 30k isnt 100k
lone junco
i had a 4dummy test yesterday probably 50k.
lone junco
BTW the fok traits were buffing the FOK hit from HB.
thats why I hit 20k open on each target.
high holly
yeah but that was obvs OP getting nerfed
high holly
isn't it still good?
high holly
primal gazelle
literally bottom 4 azerite traits for dungeon
high holly
outdated i suppose?
primal gazelle
look at herodamage
click rogue, assassin, dungeon sim, and scroll alllll the way to the bottom
LOL
high holly
damn aight
glossy seal
is bloodmallet/herodamage/raidbots up to date?
primal gazelle
you need to use MA and HB to maximize EB, but at this point it isnt worth it to do that over using subtufge/PB or CT
solid nova
@normal ridge Why arent you simming with RA stacks?
lone crescent
wait so im not alone?
high holly
@strange python does TB sim higher than exsang for you?
lone junco
note. Dungeon slice pulls are relatively small and will lean toward ss. if you were teeming fort, and pulling 10+ EB would perform differentl.
strange python
Marginally lower, but i like TB Maxter.
fast nacelle
19.5k on sin and 20.2 sub - new st king
lone junco
oy
solid nova
patent spire
i eat subs for dinner
high holly
did sub get an st buff?
lone junco
the Christmas Spec.
fast nacelle
sub did get huge buff yes
strange python
It was like 30dps diff last i compared the two iirc Maxter
primal gazelle
sub feels awful outside of dance because you have literally no haste outside of it
high holly
oooo lemme sim
fast nacelle
idk how good alch trinket will be
but i think jc is BIS - mythic baseline ring with 100% socket
primal gazelle
overflowing with energy inside dance tho
fast nacelle
high holly
same traits, trinks & talents?
fast nacelle
current stats
lone junco
i play the spec that my wife can talk to me about laundry and bills, and i dont lose any dps.
lone junco
didnt you get that 395 wep week 1
patent spire
rigged
lone junco
no dfa alignments i guess.
Im pretty full heroic loots. 7-8 sockets. stacking avoidance now.
solid nova
lone junco
ded game for me.
solid nova
Cheer up pal
shrewd bane
I have the feeling that energy regeneration is slower
primal gazelle
how is this guy 19k and doesnt know how to sim 🤣
solid nova
Your feelings are wrong, sorry 😄
primal gazelle
mastery is my highest stat weight in sin now too idk why
high holly
@fast nacelle what talents did you go with that build?
primal gazelle
does NP scale harder with mastery?
high holly
ah sry
lone junco
@primal gazelle People ask me the weirdest questions. "im 386, why is my log so bad"
strange python
How can it be nerfed, i'm doing 30k dps on 4 target in 1min20
strange python
ye 75%
2x EB + 1 SS with Hidden Blades
did they reduce shroud from 18sek to 15 and did gave no patch info?
primal gazelle
its always been 15
fast nacelle
for assa i run exsang and for sub i run 232xx31 on 3+ min fights and 212xx31 on 1-2 min fights (taloc/vectis i guess)
mfd for vectis maybe
strange python
sure?
patent spire
😦
strange python
so why ppl say shroud in underot at begin wount gonna work anymore?
strange python
ohkay ty
lone junco
@strange python I didnt get a screen grab, but my non crits were 2999 crits at 6k went to 500 non crit 1k crit.
it was gross.
it is ok for massive pulls now.
I do remember that 3fok HB open was 19k crit on each target.
lone junco
yee
primal gazelle
compared to your 30k dps
strange python
my lord
lone junco
30k is pretty normal with SS and CT
vague lava
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
lone junco
so if you do the same and just mash fok and rupture, then seems good, but dead for bosses.
primal gazelle
this was the 1 min 6 target sim pre-eb nerf
pretty sure its like 20-30k now or so lol
lone junco
the weights for 10t40 was pretty funny
patent spire
why muricans always get to play first without nerfs 😄
lone junco
haste of 2
strange python
im at 18.1 to :/
fast nacelle
i lost 200 dps or so in assa cause i went for sub enchants
tall pond
i only have 9 sockets though
lone junco
is sub mastery vers?
lone junco
neat
lone junco
maybe when we get 6
shell zealot
hey guys, would love some opinions, who would deal more damage on a 5 min patchwerk: a full haste assa rogue or a full mastery assa rogue?
lone junco
I love the idea of 3scent tho.
shell zealot
im missing wrists and gloves to be able toi test this mysself
lone junco
but eb cleave isnt agi driven.
fast nacelle
haste takes over mastery at 3 min
strange python
sorry if im rude but im desperate on my assa, new traits cant figure out which to take^^ and its a lot sub posting in here 😮
fast nacelle
funnily enough for taloc mastery enchant is better than haste
if you sim 1 min and 2 min (p1 and p2) fight
crit mastery sims higher
shell zealot
hmm
fast nacelle
haste takes over with your second vendetta
lone junco
@strange python depends on the fight. archive + DD/SS for st raid. 3ss for M+
fast nacelle
2-3 min is break even when quick navi becomes better
lone junco
Haste is ONLY Energy
lone junco
like 2000 e per fight returned with 40haste instead of 40crit
fast nacelle
lone junco
I wanted to play crit array. but looking at the losses, the raw energy gain + venom return added up A LOT.
fast nacelle
yeah
lone junco
array is like cheats.
fast nacelle
but for st i ll go sub anyway i guess
you can go crit stuff for sub and still be fine with assa m+
cause crit mastery is good for sub and assa aoe
sand canyon
@fast nacelle PogChamp
shrewd bane
hey muscle
strange python
What do you think about Nothing Personal trait is it worthy for m+?
fast nacelle
@sand canyon 💪
nah
m+ is SS and Rupture
or titans if you dont have rup trait
idk all sims i made for nothing personal were underwhelming
lone junco
NP is single target. M+ is cleave.
fast nacelle
battlefield focus was way higher for me (both on the same piece)
sand canyon
hey mus
fast nacelle
@sand canyon sub aoe pewpew...
lone crescent
rip
fast nacelle
sstorm hurts actually 😄
fresh ginkgo
Damn didn't even take 2 days
shell zealot
One more question: I got 1 AOT(370), 1 DD(385), 1 SS(370) or 1 AOT(370) and 2 SS(370); and ican switch around other items and have stats: 26%cri, 15%haste, 33%mast 2% vers(381 total ilvl) or 25%crit, 20%haste, 29%mast, 2%vers. which item comp/stats should choose and what build: toxic blade or exsang? We still progging in mythic(taloc, mother,zek on farm).
fresh ginkgo
shell zealot
would really help out
had a full 2 weeks of work and havent been able to sim, or read up
test*
late moat
lone junco
@fresh ginkgo more like 3 hours.
fresh ginkgo
I'm guessing it's pretty bad now
shell zealot
and simcraft not working at all, giving me an error that it cant parse my helm
strange python
should i go 2x SS and 1 DD or 1 SS 1 Archive 1 DD for M+ dont have different traits for DD exchange and its 390 ilvl
strange python
archive and SS both are 375
fast nacelle
at 2-3 targets you dont need to fok that hard than in legion
strange python
slacking azerite gear
fast nacelle
you have 2x 375 ss and 1x 390 dd?
strange python
y
fast nacelle
sounds fine
you can just build cp with mut
on 2-3 targets
i think you start fok at 4 or if they have no poison but i think there's a command
or pin
strange python
trinkets im useing doomswake and dice but not sure that im losing singel dps
else im going with fathoms and galecallers
fast nacelle
doomswake is good
dice is fine
i still prefer shrine trinket for m+
its good for opener/bosses and also good for opener at packs
strange python
ty vm i will try out
pallid snow
also GCB + Exsan is a nice combo
strange python
ye im playing ex + Gcb and CT for m+
fast nacelle
yup
its not just good for exsan also for opener on big pulls
it helps a lot for your initial spread
of ct/rups
wanton pond
what do you guys think about TB in m+ ? I usually use ex for most with CT but a couple dungs I run tb and Pb
pallid snow
I like TB on Tyranical weeks
lost mist
im actually using NP+DD+AOT, and MA as a talent because it sim better for me, so i have a question: should i open: Garrote-Mut-Rupt-Mut-Vendetta-TB-Vanish-Spam envenom?
(385-385-375)
patent spire
what people dont use TB anymore?
wanton pond
I find tb is really only good for single target
so tyrannical weeks where you dont have to worry about hjelping as much with trash
I run that with PB
grand trail
any news for us this patch?
lone junco
meh. DD isnt that far ahead of SS that I would run 3 DD in M+. but you do you.
wanton pond
I think SS is priority in m+
imo
if you have a piece that is high enough with DD i would take it
fresh ginkgo
worth using one EB now?
strange python
Havent had the time to play much these days. Is there a significant change in our gameplay/azerite/statweight etc for m+?
fresh ginkgo
or nuked out into orbit
wanton pond
I sim higher ST with 1x SS 1x Archive and 1x DD but the DD is 390
having at least 2x SS is a huge boost imo
even if you are taking a hit on ilvls
high holly
for g'huun mythic worth to abandon SS with heed my call for metich scheeming with gutripper?
then i have 3x gutripper
lone junco
pretty sure there was a beta fight sim for mythic ghuun. for full execute
its not my concern, so Idk if it is good or not.
high holly
where?
lone junco
fast nacelle
@lone junco did you design new azerite traits?
i think we have ss on every piece
i like it a lot.. im a big fan of exsang and SS
fast nacelle
xD
lone junco
what would the raid bis be. without array
synergy wise. in feely craft world
not a lot buffs ss in st
ss and vendetta ?
bleh
fast nacelle
im not even sure if i would play assa at current sub state
strange python
I'm guessing herodamage has fixed traits?
fast nacelle
unless bosses have downtime heavy movement
hearty junco
anyone know how the new alchemy trinket faires compared to other trinkets?
strange python
Lmao is this correct? https://gyazo.com/e95e7d9dca74f999bb07c1d23f685863
EB that low?
hearty junco
[Zandalari Alchemy: Emblazoned Alchemist Stone]
high holly
i'm still a bit confused to how to play with exsang, if exsang is coming off cd do you not refresh dots until you can line up exsang? or do you refresh both just before exsang comes of cd? or do you hold exsang until dots are pandemicable then refresh and pop exsang?
lone junco
@strange python is that the slice sim stack?
strange python
true gyro
hmmm the new darkshore trinket not showing properly in raidbots
lone junco
st or cleave
true gyro
and can't find it in herodamage either
fresh ginkgo
yea i have that same trinket
strange python
What is the trinket called
warm sable
The best one is when you sim yourself 😄
fresh ginkgo
might be good in m+
normal ridge
@lone junco for m+ is better TB no?
true gyro
Forest Lord's Razorleaf or something
lone junco
can add this line to your Top gear sim list so it shows up in the stack.
trinket1=emblazoned_alchemist_stone,id=166976,ilevel=385
sick frost
this stats
dreamy fiber
Boois anyone can help me, google and my brain have failed me. - Since patch my combo points look like shit on target frame (i have copied wtf and addons from before patch and re installed addons to no avail) I cant however find any options for CP in elvui thru my lack of IQ i think - looks like this http://prntscr.com/lu32ij
sick frost
for aoe haste first?! O.o
dreamy fiber
Yeah but how do i turn that shit off
sick frost
and mastery last
quick ice
That's actually a default UI setting overwriting elvUI @dreamy fiber
Do it on interface, names iirc
strange python
Did u update ur Elvui?
dreamy fiber
Yeah, ELV updated
quick ice
Happened to me with sUF too.
true gyro
any idea what to add to topgear for it to show the razorleaf trinket
since it show's 0 agility atm
quick ice
It will work, it's a tooltip issue atm @true gyro
lone junco
which means. if you dont have fathoms yet, and stone is cheap, get it
true gyro
alright
lone junco
It will probably work better than fathoms in cleave anyway
strange python
uhhhh
sick frost
so any1 know what stats for AOE now?
strange python
@true gyro trinket1=forest_lords_razorleaf,id=166794
bronze kelp
stats for aoe? still crit mastery
strange python
but thats like 355
quick ice
Stone won't be cheap because you need like 55 expulsom to make it
true gyro
ye got the 385 version
lone junco
I reran that sim on dungeon slice. maybe it will work out better
strange python
@true gyro trinket1=forest_lords_razorleaf,id=166794,bonus_id=1502/5479
lone junco
anyway. it is in the gear compare lists.
fast nacelle
dont forget that alch stone will go to 415
true gyro
thx
strange python
😃
sick frost
@bronze kelp i sim...haste and crit for aoe
fast nacelle
mythic ring with 100% socket is too good
quick ice
You don't need to make the 385 to make the 415 though tyra
quick ice
The daz trinket had its own craft path starting from a bought recipe
fast nacelle
i thought you do the 385 to get the 400 one and then the 415
bronze kelp
@sick frost what fightstyle? dungeon slice ?
sick frost
yea
fast nacelle
good to know
sick frost
mastery is in last place
quick ice
I mean you do that still, but it's a different 385 to the one you can make
bronze kelp
@sick frost and on dungeon slice is a boss fight integrated, so its not an aoe sim
so haste is valued more, cause of the boss fight
crystal vault
how's the new vendetta trait ?
lone junco
meh
sick frost
i sim i beastlord now
lone junco
but I wouldnt scrap anything until a few weeks pass.
sick frost
in*
lone junco
@sick frost use dungeon slice for M+. patchwerk for ST boss.
lone junco
looks like the 385 alch is a bit better than the GCB i have.
but thats 360
in slicesim
strange python
A cool system is where you could reroll 2 of ur existing pieces eg. Chest and Head for a random Shoulder piece
unborn silo
What would u guys recommend for M+ 3 SS or 2 SS and 1 SoB
crude gate
Did EB get a hotfix yet?
crude gate
😩
hollow ivy
With that new ss trait is versa music re important?
crude gate
Thx
hollow ivy
More* lol
strange python
What
strange python
What new ss trait @hollow ivy ?
lone junco
hang on to them. they may balance agin and again
solid nova
It's just a tooltip update, the formula hasnt changed. @hollow ivy
strange python
tfw when EB sims lower than inner ring traits
sick frost
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/i3Dd5N1BsYX4gSpej4mhps its sim BEASTLORD
hollow ivy
Ahh okey, I wear some more versa gear and dmg at trait tooltip increase. That happened before?
solid nova
Yes
royal lantern
hmmm.....i must say, after sum runs with it, i like 1x EB
strange python
Its trash
royal lantern
the FoK dmg boost is not bad man
strange python
The trait is trash
solid nova
Why a beastlord sim :
crude gate
Got 385 EB head from darkshore quest...feelsbad
lone junco
EB nature is probably hard to balance. each crit fires again
which can crit
so fok on 20 mobs and get 5 crits. and 6 waves
analog glade
Best trait for zul now ?
lone junco
and the trait buffs Fok itself as well.
and we have infinite E to hammer overcapped Fok.
shy axle
sure it doubledips?
undone talon
!opener
lone junco
so in big boi crit numbers. MA fok crit, + 5 waves of possible critters.
velvet forge
EB 390 doing better than 375 SS on 4+ targets, but less than that, not so much
lone junco
idk. maybe they should have just had a running buff that scales fok white. based on crit, stacks to 5. and sustain fok buff.
lone junco
way down.
velvet forge
doesnt matter rofl
strange python
Huh?
lone junco
neg.
strange python
Oh interesting 🤔
lone junco
k
velvet forge
shouul.d be a night elf option
summer timber
so question of the day I'm sure how is the nothing persoanl trait in pve ?
strange python
Bad
celest swan
hey, the ravneholdt guide only says poison bomb for multi target now, any reasoning behind that?
velvet forge
meld/stealth doesnt go into sims
celest swan
afaik we use CT in M+ most of the times and nothing changed?
celest swan
jsut wondering why the guide changed it
velvet forge
well, in reality, on a big pull you are moving and PB is worse, that also doesnt show up on sims
wary ice
holy nerf batman
I take it the APL arent up to date and thats why shits are simming so high still?
lone junco
ss + ct is consistently great.
velvet forge
never standing still, PB probably gets 2-3 of 5-10 mobs ur kiting and CT gets all
strange python
@wary ice EB is trash
wary ice
Rip EB
lone junco
no shit. thats why SS CT is better than limp fokking eith eb
wary ice
u were a meme
velvet forge
on fortified, CT has to be better, on Tyrranical its a wash imo
wary ice
his name was fokker 😢
shy axle
@summer timber second best in a vacuum behind DD on ST if only using one of each
velvet forge
makes sense @wary ice
wary ice
its def a talent you swap though
velvet forge
yaya
strange python
I mean i'd still use CT on tyran
strange python
Kr as well
wary ice
my group doesnt pull large enough to justify ct in KR
velvet forge
a lot of it depends on how ur tank pulls, if ur in high keys with a boss tank u have so many more targets
wary ice
the only pull it gets value is the poison dudes
fast nacelle
who didnt like 2-18% variance
shy axle
man no offense but everything seems to be bad out of your mouth. It is tuned differently, thats it
fast nacelle
actually 0-20% or smth like that
sick frost
what fight style i need use to sim aoe for rouge assa?
solid nova
For M+ ?
sick frost
@solid nova yea
solid nova
!m+
prisma monolithBOT
Use the fight style Dungeon Slice (Beta) for a M+ simulation on Raidbots.
solid nova
^^This^^^
winter aurora
what does ct means?
wary ice
crimson tempest
solid nova
Crimson tempest
strange python
crimson tempest
wary ice
pb is peanut bomb
shy axle
crimson tempest
winter aurora
oh kk
summer timber
should we still use SS for that extra combo point as well?
wanton lava
did they hot fix EB yet?
solid nova
Yes
wanton lava
they did?
solid nova
75%
wary ice
i think with EB sucking shit, and NoThInG PeRsOnEl, KiD being lackluster
our azerite priotiy is the same, no?
velvet forge
yep, was doing 80-100k on decent pulls, was FUUnn
wanton lava
yea i had just 1 peice of armor with it on and was doing 60K aoe dps in 14 lol
summer timber
what people were useing Echo blades on single target???
quaint sequoia
rip being EU, never get to try the broken stuffs
they could atleast wait for eu to have for one day before hotfixing stuff like that 😛
lone junco
@summer timber no. but in cleave it was bonkers.
i had 6k crits per mob. dropped to 1k crits.
quaint sequoia
wow
lone junco
per fok
quaint sequoia
is EB rip now?
wanton lava
I think its still ok to use maybe for mythic + FORTIFIED week tho for good aoe dps maybe still
quaint sequoia
was looking forward to fok based aoe dmg again like in end of legion
ripe nimbus
More importantly it looks like this lethal (cheat death) not resetting when u die is intentional...... fk blizzard man so many pointless changes
quaint sequoia
thats stupid
ripe nimbus
Not even just ours. Every lethal. Last stand/purgatory
quaint sequoia
has there been a faction assault on EU yet?
sly talon
strange python
Yes
mighty yew
Is EB fix live on raidbots yet?
lone junco
prob
last parrot
How many of the new currency we gettin from scrappin? Got 72 from my 13 chest. 385 costs 1250(?) thats a joke at least 😂😂
hot flume
The vanish bug has been hotfixed ?
ripe nimbus
Scrapping 385 gets like 29
sick frost
before patch 8.1 stats for M+ forti is crit and mastery...and now its crit haste?
vapid moth
Welp. See yall next year when they break FoK again
mighty yew
Yeah, makes sense, cuz my sims are still busted
lone junco
must be an advanced coefficient override that herodamage used to push out new numbers.
mighty yew
Didn't expect it to drop so low tho on herodamage after the fix
last parrot
@ripe nimbus ty for info. So its a long run for a specific one. Easily save them for next patch with higher ilvl..
manic burrow
That's a big drop
unkempt karma
but do you get for every m+ you do or just in weekly chest?
unkempt karma
meaning if you hit like a +10 weekly until 22 second.
thats like 300 tops maybe, 350
nova gazelle
Did they atleast fix the Subterfuge issue as well, while they hotfixed the trait?
unkempt karma
for what content? m+?
unkempt karma
Sadly it did. By 75%
wary ice
still hurts to read
75% is just a QA issue tbh
something fell through the cracks some where
ruby idol
If it makes you feel any better a +22 was only 99 essence
strange python
so you don't run echoing blades for m+ anymore?
ruby idol
Diminishing returns are quite diminishing
quaint sequoia
primal egret
Where can you see the 75% Nerf?
unkempt karma
Wowhead
fleet anchor
Realistically, the main problem with EB is the Crit based nature and Master Assassin. The trait is basically impossible to balance with MA.
MA essentially triples the value of the trait in dungeons.
unkempt karma
Then why did they even make it, thats the following question
releasing and then nerfing not to be used again is a good wasted time.
fleet anchor
It was meant to scale with larger packs. But MA makes the proc rate so high that it blows away the “normal” value of the trait.
On 7 targets for example
Without MA you would expect to average 12.25 hits
With MA you average 35
It’s a ridiculous difference
And will be impossible to balance around
Especially since MA uptime is so different in raids vs M+
I don’t really see any way forward with this design unless they change the proc chance to be static.
wanton pond
whats MA?
tropic citrus
The new trinket from the world boss, is it workign to sim it? i cant seem to get it to sim correctly
wanton pond
ah
fleet anchor
(That’s also not considering that MA also increases the damage vis crits itself)
ruby idol
I mean the trait is p balanced now after the nerf, its just not SS
wary ice
I think it woulda been cooler if it intereacted with poisons
ie: damage came from mastery
opens up a poison build
Probably still balance issues
languid dawn
anyone elses SS stop procing again?
fleet anchor
When you consider the damage increase from MA crits as well
The difference between non-MA and MA on 7 targets is like 15.3x vs. 61.25x
lol
cinder yoke
we've had a version of MA for ~3 years
wary ice
MA EB was like ~14 globals per global in a pull of like 3
wary ice
IDK if zul was shit design tbh
cinder yoke
3 fights in the last 2 tiers of legion that could heavily use shuriken combo to massively inflate damage, and they didn't see that coming
well more than 3, but 3 that people regularly used it on
wary ice
again is that a problem with SC or with zul
gloomy steppe
What are our best pvp talents for world pvp?
wary ice
if a single passive on 1 spec completely nullifies an entire type of encounter
the problem probably isnt encounter design
cinder yoke
having adds that just don't matter in a fight and can be exploited to inflate damage
is shit design
shy axle
well thats just nitpickery
cinder yoke
that is exactly what SC fed off of
wary ice
So are you arguing that SC or Zul was shit design?
hidden anchor
Sooooooooo EB is busted in simc I take it?
wary ice
eb nerfed, sims not updated to represent that yet
hidden anchor
SS still better for dungeons than EB?
cinder yoke
it's both really, it's not that hard to make adds an effective threat, and it wouldn't be that hard to design sub around not needing SC for relevance
obtuse robin
so eb still busted if u pick ma?
wary ice
IDK how u think the adds make no difference in zul unless you're funneling boss damage
dusk sun
how is EB looking now?
wary ice
12:09 bullfango: eb nerfed, sims not updated to represent that yet
obtuse robin
50% nerf hmm alright
spice surge
75%
obtuse robin
says 50 in tc updates
dusk sun
dude btw how do i scrap azerite armor to get the currency
steep ridge
go to the scrapper and put it in
spice surge
Put it in the scrapper
spice surge
or disenchant
steep ridge
alliance or horde?
dusk sun
horde
steep ridge
than I can't answer :p