thats some feelycraft if i've ever seen it
#assassination
exotic glen
grim wolf
New Sims updated yet for the changes tomorrow?
sharp pond
🙃
silk sundial
What is changing tomorrow?
grim wolf
Like elemental buffs and stuff other classes I think was curious how it changed the rankings
safe matrix
Do you mind linking these? I don't see anything on wowhead or mmochamp
unless its part of an 8.1 build
exotic glen
it is
grim wolf
Yeah was just trying to link that
solid mural
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
tender frost
Whats the MA opener again? mut>rup>mut>garrote>vend>vanish>Toxic blade> envenom ?
sound right?
exotic glen
read the guide
tender frost
is it actually updated? cause i was told there was a diff opener.
exotic glen
the guides are always updated because its made by people from this server
if something is wrong in the guide, we'd know
desert pelican
max pandemed garrote is 24 , y?
exotic glen
im really not hostile
tender frost
myself and another rogue were testing an opener bursting at like 50k
exotic glen
just saying if i knew something was wrong with the guide
i wouldnt point you that way
@desert pelican pandemic is 30%
desert pelican
yeah so 18 + 6
so i just didnt know the pattern of sim right now
trying to figure how to play through exhsang
sim just have no 100% uptime of bleeds, + always used exhang on <17 seconds garrote
someone says here garrote need to be 20+ on exshang
and on 2^20 sync he used vanish\1 garrote and than used mutilate again. is this right pattern? oO
exotic glen
i have no idea what you're trying to say
quiet spruce
@daring imp nope, heroic lol
desert pelican
@Cargo trying to figure how to play better as exhang build. and looking for sim apl for this. seems totally diferrent from every rogue on warcraftlogs. how can i trust simc now 😉
fringe valley
are you guys pooling energy for toxic blade to try and squeeze as many envenoms while TB is up?
desert pelican
@exotic glen apl from raidbots is wrong? im just look at sample sequence of raidbots exshang apl, and this is why i ask about 16 sec garrote
exotic glen
do you have a sim of your character
desert pelican
yeah, and then i seemd through sample sequence list
exotic glen
? <- me right now
desert pelican
exotic glen
what is the problem if you can look at the apl
exotic glen
he actually does pretty mong dps for his ilvl yeah
idk hes got nice weapons and a galecallers
so
desert pelican
question about dropped garrote from target on 0:41 before next garrote on 0:45, and always exshang on 16 seconds garrote. there is no points in the guides about when to use exshang effictively, and in this channel i seems someone says garrote always need to be 20+ seconds.
trying to figure is this the best way to use exhang
upper island
its 3 minutes
upper island
3 minute sim
desert pelican
yeah its only 3 min
exotic glen
that changes nothing about his question
it does change his sim dps tho
if thats what you are talking about
upper island
yep
quiet spruce
ah ya, its 3 min
somber otter
Toxic blade VS Essang
I see a lot of both, Essang sims slightly higher
but from what I understand Essang needs proper set up (full rup and Garrote)
desert pelican
thats why im asked, coz sim used exshang ion apl on 16 sec garrote but only on fulled pandemic rupture.
exotic glen
idk i give up for today, im tired
desert pelican
)
exotic glen
questions are getting incomprehensible
lyric gust
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
uneven ibex
Question for sin rogues on mythic vectis- are you guys prioritising garrote uptime on vectis (including SS garrote) or saving 3 vanish ss garrotes for boss > add > boss when add spawns
uneven ibex
I was having trouble saving SS garrote for adds because of the 4s CD, while waiting for add it drops off
Are you reapplying garrote (non SS) 4s before add spawn to avoid the CD lockout ?
Or earlier
As opposed to letting it run down to 0 seconds
The only thing I can think off is to reapply non SS garrote over the top of existing garrote (more than) 4 seconds before adds spawn
Despite it possibly missing the pandemic window
zealous lily
does anyone know for 2 target cleave if you 1 double dose trait if you should build with mut instead of fok?
mythic vectis in mind
it's a 385 trait
scarlet escarp
well as I haven't done mythic Vectis idk about that fight itself but generally if I don't think ill get a crit ill mutilate instead of FOK but I also second guess everything I do so
zealous lily
these are our wipes on farm if it helps https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/pRQrvq3bMfBK9H7m/#boss=2134&difficulty=5&wipes=1&type=damage-done
i guess this answers my question
double dose basically doubles mut damage for me
it does slightly more damage than the avg fok on this fight which is always 2 targets
well, quite a bit more really
so mut instead of fok for this fight
although fok costs less energy so ???
generates fewer CP on averager
i'll try to figure it out more on my own from logs I guess
mental fiber
what do you guys feel is the best way to burst the adds on m vectis?
quaint rune
sup guys
idk what the hell is up but im struggling in m+ now to do as much overall dmg as other classes
should i be running all double dose?
pallid bluff
no
quaint rune
i have 385/370/355 pieces
pallid bluff
you should run 3x SS
quaint rune
still?
slender shard
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/85meMxuw1CN3UoMrQbSkMi im really trying to figure out why my sims are so low for 360 I feel I see everyone doing much more
quaint rune
i have 3x SS still
slender shard
yea 3 is best for aoe
pallid bluff
and if you arent doign high keys you are gonna struggle
ecspecially aganist burst classes
quaint rune
damn
okay well ill still run 3x SS
also im running 1100 crit, 1048 haste, 614 mastery
should i stack more of something else and less of something else? bc i have the items to manipulate those stats
inner pecan
If you want to focus on trash damage then you don't need so much haste
It's your best ST stat but your worst AoE stat
So play around with that until you find a happy medium, or specialize in either depending on your group comp
lethal iris
Battle potion of agility, or bursting blood for single target?
devout hamlet
Yo got a question for clarity the shrouded suffocation big with subterfuge can I garrote a 4th target after subterfuge window has ended and continue to get the bonus dmg on the first 3 garrote targets or doesn’t matter when I garrote a 4th target it fucks up the garrote dmg period
Bug** not big
Anyone?
thorn grove
You can garrote 4th target but its not gonna be empowered
So as long as you dont use it on target with empowered garrote it should be fine
devout hamlet
Yea I get that but will it reduce the dmg of the first 3 subterfuge garrotes or it’s ok as long as I garrote the 4 target after subterfuge window has ended
Maybe I’m not fully understanding how the big works
Bug
thorn grove
It's not gonna affect other garrotes
fleet anchor
No, the bug is that if you use it on any target from outside of stealth that all your boosted ones become normal ones right away
devout hamlet
It doesn’t
fleet anchor
TB vs Exsang is super close and just depends on stats
devout hamlet
Your stat weights change which also changes talents
fleet anchor
It's within like 1% +-
harsh glacier
simcraft using TB > Exsg now
was using Exsg a few days ago
so assuming something changed
fleet anchor
Well the main reason the default profiles will use TB is because it boosts Double Dose, which is currently the best ST trait
thorn grove
If you run ss then exsan
fleet anchor
M+ is probably still mostly SS with an edge but the multi-target optimizations I made today for DD should make it a bit more competitive
harsh glacier
tho got a 385 Harlans Dice last night, so not that unlucky XD
Where can I find those Koji? I can run 3x DD I think
fleet anchor
SS for Exsang vs. TB is still mostly stat preference though, SS is fine with both
I've had it go back and forth for my personal gearset quite a bit
Notes are in #tc-updates
harsh glacier
Thanks, I might check it out and run some sims
fleet anchor
Profile on the wiki is updated
For 3T with 3x DD, it's like a 3k DPS gain over the previous APL
SS probably going to have a bit of an edge still but makes DD pretty reasonable as long as you're in the 2-4 target range
harsh glacier
Yeah, seeing as I only have 1 SS its probably better for me to run DD if it can be competitive
and the ST boost is a plus
devout hamlet
#kojiyama yo
harsh glacier
What is the wiki btw?
vital crater
blood mallet says laser matrix is good for us but i still see more people run ss, why? :))
devout hamlet
@fleet anchor so in m+ it’s optimal to hold on casting more garrotes until after the SS/subterfuge garrotes have ended when aoeing?
fleet anchor
Until they fix the bug (hopefully soon)
fleet anchor
Pretty sure it will get fixed, not sure when exactly though
elder cypress
if the bug isnt fixed until now an unbuffed garrote debuffs ur buffed garrotes after subterfuge
vital crater
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
harsh glacier
If I'm not running SS do I take MAssassin instead of Sub?
dull cargo
I've set a weakaura to remind me of the buffed garrotes, and had to change my out of stealth combat bar button config to not accidentally apply the 4th garrote
I'll try to remember to export it and send it to anyone who wants it.
Also helps with timing the application on AoE packs where you aren't focusing the last one applied.
Targetting**
deft sparrow
Nixxenvandaag om 07:51
You can garrote 4th target but its not gonna be empowered
So as long as you dont use it on target with empowered garrote it should be fine
So this is wrong
hazy pebble
@deft sparrow very wrong
strange python
anyone know if there's a way to disable omnicc from showing on your nameplate buffs (plater)
civic palm
Go into OMNICC, make a profile called 'blacklist', go to rules, add w/e addon you do not want it interacting with @strange python
strange python
@civic palm ty mate
civic palm
👍
lilac fern
Wait have they fixed the SS bug?
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
atomic karma
yo guys is there any way to sim different trinkets for m+
li ke using the top gear thing
simple sage
atomic karma
or do i have to change the trinket in the sim and sim it like 5 seperate times with just changing the trinket slots around
atomic karma
just galecallers with vendetta bro
simple sage
ok
opal sphinx
does dagger in the back gives energy?
torn junco
No "bleed" except rupture and garrote give energy
vestal venture
aight thanks
unique axle
You then click on "Action priority List"
vestal venture
oh tyvm
unique axle
Then on "Sample sequence table"
atomic karma
can anyone help me with simming top gear for m+ trinkets
in the pins it says to use this on the quick sim
raid_events+=/stun,first=48,cooldown=60,duration=12
raid_events+=/adds,count=1,first=0,cooldown=60,duration=44
raid_events+=/adds,count=1,first=0,cooldown=60,duration=46
raid_events+=/adds,count=1,first=0,cooldown=60,duration=48
but wwhat is the equivalent on the top gear settings
is it hectic add cleave 1 boss 40 seconds?
serene hinge
is something wrong with Raidbots or was there a chnage to assa recently that i missed?
all of a sudden simming 600 dps lower than i was earlier today even swapping back to original gear
civic palm
Make sure you talents and traits are right.
flint jetty
@atomic karma iirc you put that line in when you're simming MFD on advanced sim, at leasty for sub. Idk about hectic ad cleave but you can do 5 boss 40 seconds or something like that.
serene hinge
yeah i've checked everything and i cant figure out what happened
reset raidbots to default setting
so confused
prime void
uneven swallow
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
safe matrix
you havent hit the stride yet
safe matrix
My bad, please resume all forms of #assassination talk
strange python
What makes assassination so popular in m+ atm over the other specs? Is it the slow?
chilly obsidian
Damage too
slender smelt
quick question, what happens when you refresh the same bleed effect while one is exsanged
safe matrix
a new buff gets applied
the exsang buff doesnt get extended
it get overwritten by an unbuffed one
slender smelt
oh so never refresh something while exsanged ok
civic palm
Yeah that's what the guide says :3
smoky prism
jade patrol
Hi, does it makes sense to stack AoT for M+? The latest Simcraft results have 2x AoT equipped.
Currently I am running 2x AoT + 1x SS. The results are OK. I need more haste I guess.
I am around 18%
abstract raven
I thought triple ss was still best for m+ because of the shorter fights. I guess if you're doing 15s on tyrannical then keep the five minute sim. I like to do 45 seconds on five targets myself. Then a three minute sim for the boss
meager basalt
anyone wanna do arena 2s or 3s
serene hinge
can someone explain to me why i sim the exact same gear set above, from a week ago, now
and it comes out 400 dps lower?
im losing my mind trying to figure this out
clear blaze
feelsweird to press exsan and galecallers on cd without syncing, but raidsbots says its best 
meager basalt
x
shrewd night
There were trait adjustments which are well documented in the theorycrafting channels
fiery oxide
Haven’t been up-to-date with assa since SS nerf. Is it still the most competitive rogue spec in M+? Pardon me if it’s documented in the pins already
civic palm
Yes
vestal wren
herodamage sims take a bit so update is soon™ (probably later today)
normal ridge
rogue assa have haste cap?
solid nova
No, Follow your stat weights
normal ridge
ty richard 😄
high siren
hey guys, is it worth to refresh garrote rupture sooner, so you don't have to refresh during TB ?
icy iris
depends if you are SS or not @high siren
TB is ur burst window with envenoms so yes
u wanna smash 2 envenoms during your tb atl
high siren
I try to aim for 3
but it requieres to refresh sometimes really soon, so I can pool to 125+ energy
spice surge
@serene hinge Because one of them has 3 origination stacks, one doesnt
devout glen
why is shrouded still the best choice but on blood mallet sims like 130 dps x3
slim olive
Because it doesn't take into account resealths
safe matrix
#tc-updates has a few answers to that
high ingot
and it doesn't use subterfuge
safe matrix
The default simc sin model has master assassin
Not subterfuge, which greatly reduces SS
icy cedar
Hey guys, question, is 1 x AGI gem required always?
icy iris
@icy cedar nothing is required, sim your character and socket accordingly. If haste is like 1.89 and agility is 1.7 then you gem haste.
wary anchor
Anyone have a toxic blade / exanguinate talent specced macro i can use?
stoic gulch
Should I be trying to jam as many envenoms as I can during Toxic Blades or just trying to keep the buff up, anyone know?
icy iris
@icy cedar yes
mortal warren
@wary anchor #showtooltip
/cast [talent:6/2] Toxic Blade; [talent:6/3] Exsanguinate
zealous dew
Or you can dungeon with those stupid protection palas not lettting you stealtj between packs
Happens every weekly I do
astral shadow
Does mh/oh matter for enchants?
long portal
No sir
wooden island
tardy narwhal
How come Landois Scrutiny is simming higher in aoe for me than Overcharger? 🤔
Sounds trash in aoe
mighty yew
For m+ purposes should I look on Archive of the Titans without any + after it on herodamage?
slender hare
yes
vast forum
not really, since those are 5-min sims
mighty yew
Yeah, but I more meant the +5 or +10 buff that is not active in m+
Which makes it even worse
slender hare
but archive gains value in aoe
vast forum
archive loses a LOT of value if u die in m+
slender hare
and that yea
vast forum
if you pull relatively quickly without dropping combat often, you can keep it at 19-20 stacks whole dungeon
if you die every once in a while, you better not wear it
twin hatch
yo, in st out of haste cd to u tc about energy pool for the dmg buff from finisher or just spam ability when they are up?
velvet kernel
what?
vestal abyss
what?
strange python
what?
twin hatch
when u are in single target. after exa and vendetta, so normal rotation. u take care about energy pool before use finisher or just spam finisher and mutilate when they are able to use?
i mean for elaborate planning buff
because every time i use envenom i cant cast the second one in the ep window coz non energy to cap cps again
short arch
For m+ situations.. Any idea on how to sim 2xAoT + 1xSS sin rogue vs 2x AoT + 1x whatever sub rogue? Also would you think that sin in m+ is ahead of sub even without 2/3x SS?
strange python
@twin hatch you dont need to pool really. Just keep refreshing bleeds at pandemic timer. And maximise ep uptime. If using TB i pool to maximise ep and envenoms during TB
@short arch its not that straight forward
Sub shines at priority add damage within a group of adds due to shuriken storm combo
Assa can do better aoe and solid boss damage. But its priority damage in a group isnt as high as a sub rogues can be
There was a video out from fragnance today or yesterday. Worth a watch
short arch
Thanks mate! 😬
bold fable
Is anyone using an addon like herorotation or do you just use a weak aura to manage everything ?
slender hare
CT? yes always
turbid zephyr
hey guys im trying to figure out what is a good bench mark for dps currently 359 ilvl
twin hatch
@strange python ty mate
north charm
Yeah CT sorry
mystic glade
hey everyone i got a question : ) so the ST and multi target specc look much alike except for crimson tempest being optional. I no SS traits, so for like +8 and higher should i just run poison Tb/bomb or go crimson ?:)
i got no *
twin hatch
and about ct? only on 4+ or also 3?
slender hare
go crimson tempest
strange python
@turbid zephyr its not a plausible question. As you could have the best possible inslot gear and traits and be simming higher than those in 365+ or you could have trash gear and traits trinkets etx and sim lower than a 345. This is all hyperthetical
north charm
Oppening on trash with CT,SS and exsanguinate is this?:
Garrote (3 time)
Rupture
Mutilate for 5 combo point
CT
Exsanguinate
Or u use exsanguinate before?
strange python
@mystic glade CT only outside of tyrannical weeks and if the dungeon permits bigger pack pulls. Some m+ pb is always better as pack sizes are small with high HP mobs to burn down
mystic glade
man this channel is bomb, ty!
strange python
@north charm ggg rupture for main target damage if priority add and use vendetta else CT, then FoK, rupture or CT dpending on what you just did but you want deadly poisons ticking on garroted targets for venomous wounds. vanish ggg (clip the priority target as the last garrote for pandemic timer, rupture priroity target again for pandemic timer and exang
chrome umbra
You play CT 95% of the time
strange python
Exactly
So you cant outright say CT
There needs to be an understanding of the situations
north charm
Ok ok thx @strange python
strange python
If im playing with a poor tank thay pulls 1 pack of 2-3 at a time wanting everything else CCd, CT is pointless
chrome umbra
the only time I wouldn’t play CT in that 5% is if the key is a +2 or something but you’d still play CT 100% of the time if the key is relevant to your ilvl
mighty yew
@strange python was that video you are talking about available for his subs only? Or is it on YT?
mighty yew
Ah, nvm then
strange python
So anyone of a decent level will not learn a single thing
But it was repsctable for someone looking to get into m+ and not knowing what spec to go for etc
@north charm
He demonstrates his opener on upto 6 targets
thorn pasture
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
pure epoch
small indie company
cyan stump
why the trinket sims arw with and without mfd on the herodamage?
timid grotto
how do I sim best for m+ ? hectic addcleave and fight length 1-2min ?
robust halo
Patchwerk - 6 Bosses - 40 secs - No Buffs
timid grotto
oh ok
hot flume
Is it me or blizz are spamming buffs on feral on weekly basis ?
high siren
they might do that until players start playing this dead spec
then the spec will be op, so they'll nerf it again
the cycle of life
hot flume
Total nonsense
Was about to main feral beginning of xpac, left it coz of dmg and gameplay felt lucklustre
And now all I see is damage buff, the gameplay is still crappy, but whatever, we gave them dmg
slender hare
same, was torn between elemental and feral, but they both seemed shit during beta, so was like, well, guess ill just go rogue
high siren
you just dodged a bullet
hot flume
Now that I got into rogue, I don't feel like leaving it
slender hare
yeah man, i feel relieved lol
hot flume
I loved feral to be honest, being a cat was really cool, but being a rogue is even better
Personal opinion
dawn dragon
remember LK & cata ? when rogues were the poverty ferals :>
regal snow
is there any rotation listed for MA ?
unreal coyote
dmg doesnt matter
dawn dragon
not damage wise
unreal coyote
they arent a real spec
hot flume
I don't agree @unreal coyote but as you said, it's personal
though feral look really similar to assa rogue. But it has some cool utiliy as well
lucid blaze
why is exang a thing in m+? doesnt it just make it cancer as you end up with 2 garrotes ticking whilst being unable to reapply one due to SS traits?
hot flume
You can burn down a high priority target very quickly
lucid blaze
hmm alright, if thats the reason i wont bother then
unreal coyote
lucid blaze
i thought it was some clever usage of game mechanics but its legit just that 
hot flume
Kinda agree, not a fan of exsang gameplay
high siren
so much blood
unreal coyote
when you arent edgy enough to reroll havoc
but just edgy enough
you talent exsang
high siren
yeah, sure havoc like their st damages
unreal coyote
exsang is like that hat you buy that no one is wearing that you think you pull off
but you dont
lucid blaze
but does any priority target die in 10 seconds?
strange python
@lucid blaze 
strange python
Certain packs have a target that needs to die first
hot flume
on infested target
unreal coyote
because last time i checked on single target it still loses to tb
i know what priority target is
holy shit
mellow cypress
Happy Tuesday rogue bois
high siren
you think you do
lucid blaze
i get it bros but it makes the gameplay feel very yikes are you just sit there not garroting anything for forever with only 2 ticking
hot flume
On ST TB pulls ahead of exsang as well. The focus here is a 10s living mob
high siren
not with 3* SS
unreal coyote
i mean even the m+ sims on herodmg -exsang is not on the front page
unreal coyote
better if you had 3 and the right amount of haste
i had 2 and it it never passed tb 🤷
high siren
you didnt need 3 pre nerf
unreal coyote
i suppose thats depending on your stats
or was
point is
its graveyard now
lol
lucid blaze
what is the right amount of haste for m+?
unreal coyote
not what i meant
mellow cypress
All the haste
hot flume
As much as you can @lucid blaze
lucid blaze
what? i thought you wanted low haste in m+
hot flume
I'm running full haste and it's running well for me
tacit steppe
I run like almost no haste, high crit feels almost as good st cause you get extra cps anyway and on multi target it’s 🤤
unreal coyote
Oo
hot flume
That's a lot of rng @tacit steppe
tacit steppe
I mean
Over the whole dungeon it’s not that much rng
In the span of like 2 mins sure
hot flume
On a tyrannical week I won't try the rng over a boss
tacit steppe
But when buffs are rolling i have well over 33% crit
high siren
crit mastery is ahead in m+, you'll save so much time
hot flume
No crit and no energy regen...
lucid blaze
trash is everything regardless of tyra/fort anyway
tacit steppe
If you think tyrannical is the reason not to go haste you don’t do m+
hot flume
This will depend on key level as well
tacit steppe
^^^^
high siren
you don't need energy regen when you have 4 rupture up
lucid blaze
yea thats what i feel too
hot flume
If packs won't live long, sure mastery and crit will be far ahead
tacit steppe
????
lucid blaze
the big m+ boys are going 0 haste
tacit steppe
If packs are living long i have 3 ruptures up and I’m swimming in energy anyway
lucid blaze
so im gonna copy that
hot flume
@high siren agreed, but not on bosses
high siren
the time you save on pack > the time you lose on boss
tacit steppe
^^^
fossil agate
Its true but it feels so bad on bosses 😭
tacit steppe
Feelycraft <<<
unreal coyote
i think i would sooner jerk off with sandpaper than keep a different statted gearset for m+ and raids
lol
fossil agate
I usually drop my haste rings and trink for crit but its less fun lmao
hot flume
Might start looking at my m+ gear anyhow, had so much trouble getting a decent raiding gear
fossil agate
General gear is also more available then ever
delicate horizon
It's not as if crit and mastery I bad on bosses 😊
fossil agate
Ill sooner KMS then have multiple azerite sets tho
unreal coyote
^
tacit steppe
I geared for m+, swap rings, food buff and sometimes trinkets in raids, and i still get purple/orange parses so 🤷🏽♂️
It also lets me be able to play sub
When needed
unreal coyote
i cant wait to see what trash i get out of the chest this week
tacit steppe
Cuz sub with haste... lol
unreal coyote
the scrapper is ready for my offering
fossil agate
0 chance im getting the shoulders i need
tacit steppe
I’m ready for a vers/haste ring for third week in a row
pearl fulcrum
Just to clarify for pushing high keys I want to stack mastery/crit, run CT, and have 3 SS traits right?
fossil agate
Nothing feels as good as mythic raiding with dungeon gear on a month in
lone junco
@lucid blaze haste and crit relationship in m+ is tied to pull count avg.
tacit steppe
I wasn’t going to go into the math as to why it’s not rly rng in m+ bc sleepy but yeah tldr what noobe said
bright vessel
is SS still worth using? I just got an upgrade that will replace my last SS piece 😦
also, does double dose stack?
strange python
@pearl fulcrum i tried crit mastery and the energy regen was garbage. I found balancing crit haste mastery far more stable and smooth.
mellow cypress
I still use 2 SS pieces in m+ even Though they are 30 ilvl downgrades
mellow cypress
Try simming it. Ss seems to be king in m+ b/c of the restealth and openers. Unless your tank chain pulls. Which will 100% make me rage lol
strange python
@bright vessel i run 3 x 340 ss over 370 pieces. Much better
ember ermine
I some times have to Vanish to get the restealth knowing how long we are chain pulling for
bright vessel
even after the nerf? I thought I read somewhere that DD was a good alternative
pearl fulcrum
Thx rep
mellow cypress
Someone said earlier if you scroll up. Patchwerk 6 bosses no buffs. Something like that
dark token
thats a pretty yikes way of simming m+
strange python
I run my ST sims in m+ and do insane dps on trash and aoe
mellow cypress
Iirc pins said they’re working on a better m+ sim to be released soon
lone junco
@dark token "yikes" ? current sims has SS off the list. due to no restealth. 6t 40s is mostly bad because it doesnt do the 3rd garrote.
lone junco
that was added in the last 24hrs
the last 3 weeks used 6t40
dont act like that dungeon sim was there and or good for ss sims
dark token
it wasnt
mellow cypress
Hmm ss and mfd ehh.
lone junco
an prior sim that showed sharp knife as a M+ build was blatantly wrong.
dark token
but a little bit of brain powa means anyone could recognize the value of stacking ss for m+ unless its like a 340 vs 385
even tho sims didnt show it
lone junco
yikes tho?
dark token
im not talking about that
mellow cypress
Also @bright vessel DD is better for longer fights in ST like raids. Won’t be mutilating much at all in m+ trash
bright vessel
yea fair enough
mellow cypress
Hey frozen maybe if you try hard, you can be just a little more condescending
lone junco
maybe for other classes or builds. but SS restealth and trash packs are fine.
look forward to a better tool like hero dungeon or what not.
warm sable
Whats the rotation with MfD and SS ?
lone junco
run a sim of your preferred size (6t40) and read the apl sample sequence
i would expect
Pre-mark, rupture g tab g rupture.
but apl doesnt use all 3 garrotes anyway
3x SS is +20% due to cleave values.
lol
even higher if you did the 3rd garrote
grats
paper aspen
I have a piece of gear with Dagger in the Back simming better than my current and I realized I haven't used that trait before. Is it just a stacking dot from stabbing from behind?
quick fog
It stacks regardless of where you are, but can stack faster if you're behind them.
languid seal
How do I make pawn make my haste weigh more? After a certain point it keeps going for mastery D:
hot flume
what's the point of using stat weights generator if u wanna equip haste whatsoever ?
naive trellis
😂😂
fossil agate
Sim your stat weights then import to pawn for better usage
Yall so mean, mans was just trying to use the tools 😭
proven pumice
I guess you could replace pieces of gear with haste on them with pieces that don't have haste, resim for stat weights, and then at that point your haste weight would be higher again
But it is important to understand that the nature of stats is that they're fluid and their scaling factors change as your gear changes.
lone junco
@languid seal you can just edit the haste value, bump by 0.5 or something if you want to break it
I use top gear instead of weights tho
lone junco
weight lets me decide to Need on raid items
lone junco
run your sim and read the apl.
inner leaf
with SS
lone junco
your traits/talents matter
hollow stone
Its on ravenholdt in pins
strange python
its in the guide on top
garrote >rupture >garrote > vendetta > mutilate > rupture > exsg
for ss trait
languid seal
Cool thanks guys
proven pumice
I finally got some pieces that let me not use SS anymore, but now assassination feels like it plays so much differently, lol
My fingers don't want to do the things
Might just go back to using SS
hollow stone
And on that note... Our RNGzus who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done, in Azeroth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our weekly chest; and give us our azerite pieces, as we give those when we do not need an azerite piece; and lead us not into another veiled crystal, but deliver us from evil. Amen.
Eu can save this for tomorrow
strange python
sin singletarget is really boring and with TB its even more so imo
its fun in dungeons tho
strange python
@frigid lagoon
pearl fulcrum
I like the burst windows with tb
quasi swan
does posion blade increase dmg of anything else but envenom and deadly poison?
toxic*
high siren
poison bomb
hollow stone
Nature dmg you deal
valid meadow
ey boys
Why isnt poisoned wire talked about more?
It gives me 1700 crit for my next TWO mutilates, so the tooltip is off as hell
It SHOULD be higher on the traitlist on bloodmallet
rocky ruin
Which dungeon for daggers?
wary flax
shift+j
valid meadow
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/sbnuWy75Pb4h5ptVGwQfEU I know my dps is low for my ilvl, because i have a shit ton of crit instead of haste, and bad trinkets
But idk what traits to prioritize
primal sigil
with tons of crit id prio double dose but who knows
strange python
yo guys which specc is best rn?
valid meadow
With poisoned wire, i have like 80% crit on my next two mutis after garrote
so i have combo points for days
but 0 energy regen without vigor
lone junco
ish
subterfuge has a direct gain to SS.
DD is raw damage.
PW is a bit wonky with MA due to overlapping crit windows.
valid meadow
I dropped SS long ago when they nerfed it, hated it
lone junco
not playing SS in M+?
strange python
what traits are you guys using for raid?
valid meadow
I hardly play M+ at all
strange python
lmao
valid meadow
I got two laser matrix, and one archive of the titan
strange python
thats why you have 14k I guess
or thats just me thinkiing laser is shit
I fucking hate laser matrix
valid meadow
First laser is good
Second one isnt that good
I'd be better off getting double dose
strange python
so which traits are best for raid like 2x archive and 2x double dose?
valid meadow
second laser is 500 dps increase, while one double dose is 650~
strange python
is assa still best rogue specc for m+ and raid?
valid meadow
I'd say yes
shadow pivot
Best traits for raid are the highest lvl ones you have
valid meadow
Outlaw can't win single target
strange python
why?
strange python
wdym subpar?
hollow stone
Damn son. All dem opinions, no support
hollow stone
And misinformation about laser matrix. Ayya. Do you want advice or just telling us why youre right?
shadow pivot
About m+ sectec sub rogue is insane too in big packs dungeons
valid meadow
Opinions->facts
ionic charm
Just seems like trash lives for so long in meaningful keys right now, can’t imagine sectec being stronger for m+
valid meadow
Last time i checked, sin was topping single target on the rogue specs
But that was a while ago
I needed help with my traits @hollow stone
hollow stone
Excellent. That i can do. So if youre using 3x raid traits, only one of then gets you array stacks in raid. So the first laser matrix youre running is not that great; bloodmallet shows the weight of LM and archive's first stack with the array stacks which drastically sways it
strange python
Good luck on the work Noobe <3
hollow stone
So in short, LM is not that great for us. Its like 10th or something in st
valid meadow
Wait, which one is LM?
valid meadow
Ah, gotcha
So having 3 is overkill as hell?
I should focus on one archive and 2 others?
hollow stone
Yea. Its likely lowering your dps depending on the other trait options you have
Yea
strange python
Laser matrix is bis in Uldir
hollow stone
And even 2x archive is misrepresented on bloodmallet due to how much 1x gives. You wanna look at the dps of the 2nd lm or archive and compare that to the other trait you can run. Or you can do best gear sim and select the traits available for you to find your best st raid combo
strange python
According to herodamage
valid meadow
yeah i noticed the second LM gives me 400 dps roughly
hollow stone
1x lm or archive is bis in uldir; the subsequent stacks of either are not
valid meadow
while one double dose gives me 600+
valid meadow
I still think poisoned wire is super strong right now
just that the tooltip is misleading
hollow stone
So as long as youre getting your array in uldir from your archive, your 2x lm are both giving 400dps ea
valid meadow
first of all, its 1700, not 1300 crit, and its two mutilates, not one
hollow stone
So you have potential for more dps
valid meadow
aw man
strange python
where
inner leaf
i see streamers use that stuff
hollow stone
For m+ and specific boss fights
inner leaf
also some peeps in raid
strange python
Its good for nearly all M+
ionic charm
3+ targets crimson pulls ahead, and good for consistent and “instant” aoe
strange python
Except shit like kings rest
inner leaf
do you spam it on 3+ target? or you let the dot fall off
final stone
wooo bois this is my week something good out of weekly cache!! last week was a dud so this week we golden!!!
inner leaf
k
strange python
But you should always look at ur group
ionic charm
Guide says refresh at 2, but pandemic range is 6 or under
strange python
Especially on tyrannical
ionic charm
Sooo idk
strange python
If u got a strong AoE group, just go into ST
Pandemic 6 secpmds?
Isnt it like 4
ionic charm
It seemed useful for mythic zek, but idk, only ended up 9% of my damage
strange python
5 points: [(3.6% of Attack power) * 6] plus [(9% of Attack power) * 6] over 12 sec
Pandemic is 30%
So 12*0,3 = 3,6 seconds
ionic charm
Huh looks like you are right
strange python
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8aPt_qLt08&feature=youtu.be watch this mate
scenic hollow
is there a big difference with how weapon enchants work and wether haste is on mh or oh?
valid meadow
gimme
strange python
@oblique raven Did u try simming with master assassin?
hollow stone
If youre not running outlaw on m zek, you should definitely be running ct unless your raid is like ALL aoe classes and you
oblique raven
nawh ima try right now
strange python
@tropic heron For toxic blade its really good
So shit like 1 archive / 1 matrix with 2 DD in uldir is beast
tropic heron
yeah i use toxic blade
yeah thats what i plan on running this week
i got a 385 DD chest from my M+ weekly
strange python
26 dps increase
strange python
so just choose whatever u like best
round harbor
think ill hit 17k sim this afternoon
oblique raven
yea rawrz i been noticing your shit crazy
tropic heron
damn 17k?
my guild is still trying to work its way through heroic im only like 356 ilvl
round harbor
i was 16,950 earlier in the week, with one more stack of reoringarion ray i should get over the hill
- if i can get a nice ring or trinket or weapon from my cache
valid meadow
What trinkets drop for us in uldir, it's only the taloc one and ghuun one, right?
onyx wind
Right
valid meadow
Too bad they both suck ass because i got both at 385, still a downgrade from 340 harlans
round harbor
tru
strange python
they raise your bag ilvl at least
valid meadow
made me furious, hopefully i can get something better this time in the warfront cache
strange python
shrug
valid meadow
Tru tru, and the beast trinket i need to replace my darkmoon faire one is also ridicolous
paper aspen
You could go after a higher ilvl harlans though
valid meadow
I really should, i've been running countless +6-+10 SoTS
onyx wind
Eh, harlans 370 is similar to fathoms
onyx wind
boons balecaller
novel island
385 Irontide Captain's Hat azerite head piece. I can live with that.
quick fog
Galecaller's Boon
novel island
Good chest
onyx wind
It is
void pecan
frosty gyro
I got a 2nd 385 SS piece
onyx wind
Gz
tropic heron
you wanna donate that piece to me man
inner pulsar
I hate this game
tropic heron
im an impoverished rogue from a peasant guild that barely cleared normal
it would go to a good cause
paper aspen
I kinda feel bad for Blizz when it comes to designing interesting trinkets for raids.
round harbor
i dont
onyx wind
Feel bad for them?
cedar elk
hazy sphinx
I just got a 380 plumage from kings rest
cedar elk
when a 385
tropic heron
better than in legion with that ursoc trinket
onyx wind
I would much rather have fun/interesting trinkets drop from dungeons than raids
hazy sphinx
and its somehow still worse than fathoms?
valid meadow
Yeah, trinket tuning is a load of shit
onyx wind
@cedar elk where did you get a 360 azerite piece
cedar elk
Uldir
tropic heron
you mean 355?
kindred flame
355+ high enough levle on neck
tropic heron
i didnt know 360 was possible
cedar elk
its 355 with all traits
paper aspen
They aren't thematically bad, it's just that due to scaling, unless the trinket is absurd, we'll have a better option from a mythic + trinket.
cedar elk
last trait gives +5
onyx wind
Ohh
hazy sphinx
he got 5ilvl on it
cedar elk
25
tropic heron
wait wtf
onyx wind
Same
tropic heron
my 340 shoulders
need heart lv 27
to unlock the last one
???
how does that even make sense
cedar elk
just farm islands 
onyx wind
wq ones have lower threshholds
inner pulsar
Another week, another cloak
onyx wind
than dungeon ones
tropic heron
who came up with this Hoa stuff
i already pay my HoA fees every month i dont need it in wow too
valid meadow
Why not add AP rewards on every boss kill in dungeons and raids
valid meadow
instead of having people do shitty expeditions and WQuests
strange python
Fok trait op in rbgs
valid meadow
give
astral hound
why is ruinous bolt so shitty ...
delicate crater
not even an upgrade for the hunter. Already using Gailcallers 😦
astral hound
its literally half of all the other generic traits
pastel crystal
wow I have not gotten 1 piece of useable loot from the cache so far
3 rings
in a row
that are garbage
god dam it
kindred flame
You will get azerite next week then
frosty gyro
That's what you get for playing wow
round harbor
just get good loot 4head
one tank i our raid is 383 equipped the other is 367. gearing really is fun with personal loot
makes alot of sense
🤔
onyx wind
He can just do mythic+
inner pulsar
I hate M+ pugs....so much
onyx wind
We all do
inner pulsar
Wait. its not just cloaks in the weelkly chest?!
ionic charm
I’m gonna get a 4th azerite chest piece i fuckin know it
onyx wind
How unlucky
ionic charm
I can’t say I’m not getting azerite, but the same slot....
glass saddle
how do u sim for M+ with adds
primal gazelle
what are the affix for this week
wowhead says bolstering teeming but that doesnt sound right
round harbor
bolstering, skit, fort
hollow junco
it's bolstering skittish fortified
kindred flame
There will be some fun isntances and bad tanks involved
round harbor
shrine of the storm monkaS
astral shadow
don't blame tanks pls
round harbor
idiot mongos gonna make a mega templart
inner pulsar
Underrot is going to be aAWEOSME
frosty gyro
Do you think they will every fix the shrouded suffocation bug?
final dust
Maybe it’s not a bug /s
kindred flame
KR/TD where i need daggers will be easy this week so i am happy
glacial steppe
so Poison Wire says that Garotte increases the crit rating of my next Mut by X
hazy sphinx
It wont
kindred flame
I am still 340 on daggers 😃
ionic charm
Imagine if the little dispellable adds bolster the big fuckers at the start of KR. Rip everyone
frosty gyro
probably a 370 hand of midas to someone else in the group
glacial steppe
but it actually increses for the next 2 Muts
kindred flame
You shroud skip that part
ionic charm
Believe me I try to tell people
kindred flame
Shroud first big adds + one on bridge still 102%
wary anchor
How do i sim different talent with a different trait as well? I dont want to pay to change trait
kindred flame
But is the best you can get
cedar elk
well this week if you have lazer or archive, its better now than anything since its at +5 threshhold right?
inner pulsar
@wary anchor Top Gear sim does exactly that
frosty gyro
I prefer to shroud the pack right before the bridge/the first pack on the bridge
hazy sphinx
Running my LFR right now
kindred flame
It is getting confusing sometimes
verbal nimbus
its a stupid system
inner pulsar
I just wish people would stop getting wrecked by Shark Boss in Freehold
kindred flame
You can take the big add (patrol) and skip 2 packs, but those at start are harder (more life) to handle
ionic charm
@inner pulsar just bring a hunter and abuse tar trap bug ofc
kindred flame
And ppl undrestemite the knockback on deadly shot on the zul bridge and pull
inner pulsar
Nope, they just hug the shark
ionic charm
That’s why I like the tar trap, he just cuddles with you
cedar meteor
what webside is beter for import azerite power weights ...hero demage or bloodmalet ?
tough lantern
for M+ a 370 Double dose or 355 SS? i already have 2 SS
inner pulsar
Someone in my group, every time
round harbor
it "feels" that strong, yes
i idnt think so at first but it really is god tier on 2-3 target
red plaza
With Sharpened Blades, do you hold it for anything or just use when it reaches 30 stacks?
round harbor
and not getting 3cp on garrote really grinds my gears
last mist
Quick question, do I overwrite a SS Garrote at 5.4 second or is it only for non empowered garrotes?
tough lantern
i already have 2 SS tho
red plaza
never override ss garrote
inner pulsar
You can't triple stamp a double stamp
last mist
Okay thanks
frosty gyro
SS is OP in M+ because you can restealth way more than you can in a boss fight
And you also usually get to apply it to 3 targets instead of a double stack
ionic charm
While ss is out you shouldn’t even cast garrote on other targets because of the bug
deft tide
So SS is better than archive of the titans?
frosty gyro
Yes
mossy hazel
For M+ yea
hazy sphinx
Nope.
frosty gyro
Unless you're in uldir without array
hazy sphinx
Not at 5 stacks.
mossy hazel
You're not getting those stacks in M+ though
glass saddle
how do you guys sim for M+ adds
hazy sphinx
You dont sim for that.
verbal nimbus
sure you do
inner pulsar
and depending on the ilvl, Archive can be better than SS straight up on it's own
hazy sphinx
no point in doing so
glass saddle
all my SS pieces are at 340 idk if its still worth it to bring for M+
verbal nimbus
this guys lost his got dang mind
round harbor
trash dmg is important
solid nova
@inner pulsar Don't post pictures like that in the spec channels.
last mist
Oh and also for M+ bosses, do I Garrote - rupture - garrote when coming out of stealth?
mossy hazel
@last mist that's the standard opener if you have SS, yes
frosty gyro
Unless you have CP from trash
last mist
Is three garrotes a waste?
grim wolf
for the Sharpened Blades trait do you just throw knife at 30 stacks, or does that trait affect your opener?
round harbor
yes
last mist
Alright, thank you
mossy hazel
If you have the cp from trash I would assume you would actually open with RGG?
frosty gyro
I think 2+CP you go gar>rup>gar>vendetta>exsang and 5CP you just go rup>gar>gar>vendetta>exsang
ionic charm
@grim wolf throw at 30 with EP up
inner pulsar
@solid nova Forgot we needed to be answering the same question for the 1,948,076th time
frosty gyro
?
round harbor
working as intended
frosty gyro
Is that a question or a statment
hollow stone
What is best rogue spec now? @inner pulsar
round harbor
REEEE
lone junco
@grim wolf plan to throw at 29. It stacks quickly in the open. Run a sim and read the apl, and see that you have a vanish combo near the end of vendetta.
inner pulsar
@hollow stone Triage Rogue
strange python
@inner pulsar hi what is best weapon for rogue
hollow stone
O rite. Thx
round harbor
crimson vial healing rouge fotm
last mist
Oh do you actually use Exsang for m+ instead of TB? TB sims better for ST for me
round harbor
feint on cd
inner pulsar
@strange python Polearm
solid nova
@inner pulsar There's no obligation to answer anything. Don't post pictures like that.
tough lantern
best way to sim stat weights for M+?
grim wolf
yeah def gonna need to practice with SB...thanks @lone junco
strange python
@warm geode 4-6 targets 40sec-1min 20 sec
round harbor
doki crit > mast> vers > haste generally
frosty gyro
SB in 2018
round harbor
it can vary
lone junco
SB is a sort or dead imo. But there are some wonky combos due to high ilvl.
grim wolf
yeah i got a 385 piece with SB on it.
frosty gyro
What is the neutral?
lone junco
1archive. +some st traits. But the gear and talents and rotation all changes up. Once you have some very good combos. Use top gear and select subterfuge+ma. And exang+tb.
tough lantern
@strange python is that how you sim for M+?
last mist
Which talent is better for m+, TB or Exsanguinate? Or is it just a matter of preferance?
sterile marten
I wonder if cannonball runner is gonna get fixed
strange python
No i dont sim for m+
sterile marten
that stupid trinket seems bugged
lone junco
Free version should be able to smart sim at least. Ma/subterfuge. With tb.
strange python
Simming for m+ is kinda hard
tough lantern
how does herodmg sim it
strange python
But you generally go crit > mast > hast for m+
tropic rover
For M+, are the sims relevant re: exsang vs. toxic blade because the APL doesn't account for restealths with shrouded suffocation?
peak jungle
Hoping to get some clarification. I got a 385 helm with Swirling Sands and Overwhelming Power, compared to my 370 helm with Archive of the Titans. The 385 sims higher, but per HeroDamage, Archive of the Titans is drastically better than those two traits regardless of agility increase
mint oar
Is there a way to change the azerite trait in the simc string without reforging?
round harbor
Khal you need 1 piece of raid gear while in raid.
outside of raid you pick whichever sims higher
strange python
@mint oar Top gear on raidbots
lone junco
Herodamage uses a fancy tool that isn't public yet.
mint oar
@strange python how does that work?
lone junco
It will go to simc when it is done being tweaked.
peak jungle
So the 370 helm WITH Archive is better just in Uldir, but otherwise use the 385 helm?