the row
#assassination
vernal adder
ripe crow
is 3= blindside etc?
honest compass
1=left talent 2=middle talent 3=right talent
ripe crow
oh
honest compass
0=doesnt matter
solemn trout
what Enchant Neck is best?
gilded arrow
do yout think sin can compete at high end M+ with the other 2?
ripe crow
ty
honest compass
currently hidden satyr
in BFA, not sure
for sin i would think the aps enchant would be best
but theres another one that looked good too
gilded arrow
high M+ outlaw is king ? followed by sub or sin next?
random furnace
Simulation craft is showing dps over 2M, so I guess we are waiting on an update for that?
ripe crow
whats recommended legendary now that pre patch is out?
random furnace
Got ya
solemn trout
Mantle+Sephuz
gilded arrow
got it TY @honest compass
lofty junco
but w/o bracers will we not lack dps <30%?
lone junco
remember bracer value depends on execute windows. The stronger your warrior/firemages are the shorter the execute window.
and if no people are dying.
in progress with 3 -4 dps dead the bracer value goes up.
so if all things were equal, you would probably avoid bracer.
honest compass
bracer is only good for fights with an extended >30%
say like a lot of mechs, or maybe just a lust phase
lone junco
nah. any dps deaths where you are still alive, are good for bracers
lofty junco
dual ring is then better cause we got the stats + the aoe mechanic from ravenhold ring+procc/haste from sephuz?
lone junco
but thats why I play rogue tbh, cheat death, and cloakk
fiery nest
sage viper
not 2+?
honest compass
not many fights have an interruptable
lone junco
#1 gl proccing sephuz in a raid.
fok on 2 vs mut on 2 was a function of crit and pk. now there is no PK, and lower mut crit, so Id have to see the numbers
honest compass
mut is 2 cp, up to 4 based on crits, and fok is 1 cp, 2 based on crits (+ multi target)
meanin there youd get 3 cps, on 2 targets if they both crit
4 cp > 3cp
on top of that mut is more damage
lone junco
mut crit helps with env uptimes. because it is a shorter window. not something I can guess at tbh.
honest compass
sephuz sims lower than duskwalkers still 
placid garnet
lone junco
if you have enough base haste/crit you prob dont need sephuz
My best is still coming in as shoulder/bracer. 5600 at ilvl 240
honest compass
21/21
lone junco
ah, 40c/24h
honest compass
i'm stacking mastery over crit though
lone junco
so you run MP then?
honest compass
yeah
lone junco
any haste benefit to bleeds will also come from EP. which is benefit by crit.
but the poison numbers are prob better if you just dont have the crit/haste ratios
honest compass
my thinking process was, haste now effects poisons and bleeds. Mastery is more poison damage, MP is more poison damage, if i stack haste and mastery poisons will do more damage faster
lone junco
Env uptime matters. But without 4p21 you are winging it anyway.
honest compass
i'm pretty good about env uptime
as well as managing garrote and rupture
even without wa i can do it
lone junco
No 4p. So we are talking ilvl 220 4000 dps sim?
lofty junco
have now 2 great auras the duration number will be green when its pandemic time and above it they will be transparent
honest compass
wait
has mastery for sin always been poisons and bleeds
i swear it was just poisons lmao
lone junco
Was just poison.
lone junco
Rip 4p21. Really solid bonuses.
honest compass
anyone know when titan panel is gettign updated
lofty junco
i had sim 3 gear setups with many different talent compare-setups. the difference is 29-46 dps. so just play whats feel comfortable?
honest compass
yeah
opal adder
lone junco
I'm on phone. But mp ns is shoulder Pbomb.
opal adder
The number in the Hit/Crit column are those damage amounts or counts?
Because my actual live numbers are way lower than those (even flasked, augmented and potioned)
lone junco
That is the average across a bunch of fights based on length.
5min is from 4 to 6mins
opal adder
Yep, any idea why its so much lower than the ability amounts on live? Against boss dummy in stormwind
opal adder
just autoattacking with buffs to see DP damage abouts
lone junco
Dh buff. Monk buff. Flask food.
lofty junco
i think i will stay with shoulders, bracers, NS+MP for ST and use ravenholdt instead of bracers for MT
lean hill
Potions
opal adder
Ok must be those class buffs then since I had food, flask and potions
lone junco
Ep uptime matters. And sim is good at that.
You can toggle the raidbots to sim with zero external buffs.
opal adder
Oh yeah? That would be very handy - would you know how to?
lone junco
There is a checkbox for "optimum raid buffs" When you uncheck it opens up. I use it to turn off lust at times.
honest compass
zzz i havent gotten a drop in 4 days
from daily heroics, or M+
this game hates me
lofty junco
its jsut prepatch^^
lone junco
I haven't gotten an upgrade since February
lone junco
Just saying stuff.
opal adder
thank you @lone junco and @lean hill
lone junco
@lofty junco if sims were equal, I would play ep subterfuge. It will scale much better for 2T. And almost impossible to mess up subterfuge with the 6s garrote.
And better use of lust.
And it's very likely you should run that in m+.
Sephuz on that garrote.
lean hill
This is purely personal opinion but I would try to play with whatever looks closer to bfa rotation. For instance the shoulder crutch is gone at 116 so I wouldnt be learning to play sin with the legendary shoulders
But prepatch, so try out whatever
lofty junco
i think thats the reason some people playing with ravenholdt+bracers
lean hill
I guess with sin there is the shoulder talent but it doesnt seem like itll be top choice as of right now
But it's nice not having a big chunk of damage tied into the vanish window
lofty junco
i think after mythic raid i will try bracers+ravenholdt
lean hill
And if you dont like it you can just switch lol
lofty junco
i jsut hope assa will stay a good choice in bfa. don't want to play outlaw/sub since legion, cause they castrated this 2 wonderfull specs to that bastard versions
lone junco
ive seen some raid testing and sin damage is pretty good relative, but the rotation slows down a lot
lofty junco
just don't want the same like to begin of WoD where rogue was scrap for the most raids
highmaul
opal adder
The haste and mastery changes at least provide hope that they are thinking the right way about assassination this time around. Fingers crossed for tuning...
lone junco
haste just means we get something out of lust.
which is a good thing
cause running 55c/2h was weird for me.
opal adder
helps with itemization also a bit i would think since you dont have the bench pieces because of haste on them or overtly bad stats as much as in legion
lone junco
thin gate
tyvm
pliant vortex
let's say u guys use Elaborate Planning on 15 talent. Do you use low bubble envenom for elaborate? or just ignore elaborate and use envenom on full bubble?
pliant vortex
@jovial kite thx
jovial kite
Np
strange python
check the pinned resources
pliant vortex
stealth - garrote - mut - rup - vendetta - toxic blade - mut - vanish - envenom
strange python
Isnt mut before toxic blade better ? You gain 1 envenom with toxic blade debuff
pliant vortex
sometimes when mut gets crit it wastes bubble
pliant vortex
subterfuge
weak pine
Then why vanish early?
pliant vortex
is my opening wrong? i was keep finding out the best way for opener
weak pine
Save vanish till you can refresh garrotte
pliant vortex
coz it has 100% increased damage?
spare cloud
It's the only reason you use subterfuge for
pliant vortex
so i need to save vanish till i refresh garrotte ye?
spare cloud
You vanish 1sec before garotte max pandemic window
weak pine
1 sec?
spare cloud
so you get a full duration garotte with subterfuge damage
weak pine
Not rly necessary
lone junco
as long as your using subterfuge. π
but taking a few sec of empowered garrote and adding it to the next one is a wash. just dont re apply early, or let it drop.
weak pine
If using Subterfuge and opening with empowered garrotte you can use banish when it has 4 seconds remaining all the same
pliant vortex
so it should be stealth - garrotte - mut - rup - vendetta - toxic - mut - envenom ...... (garrotte about to end) vanish - garrote?
spare cloud
Garotte in pandemic window
It doesn't really matter as long as you're inside
since your first garotte is subterfuged anyways
lone junco
6 sec cd on garrote really helps as well
cause i would often vanish with Garrote on CD like an idiot
spare cloud
doesn't change anything in that situation though, it can even be a loss in certain situations
Just focus on pandemic window
and refresh inside of it
On later vanishes (the next one in the fight) You want full pandemic window though
regal trellis
whats pandemic window?
strange python
^
gilded arrow
for example if you refresh a rupture with 4 secs left, those 4 secs get added on to the new rupture
regal trellis
i see, and i want them to stack? or i want them to get al ltheir ticks out?
gilded arrow
there is a cutoff
of when it is ok to refresh
not sure what it is right now in terms of exact seconds for garrote and rupture
regal trellis
y not the earlier the better? or they would stack too high and the ticks would never actaully do damage
gilded arrow
no
hollow gyro
Just look at the pinned guide?
gilded arrow
because it wont work over a certain amount of time
regal trellis
makes sense
hidden flint
Does anyone know how to do this weak aura https://i.imgur.com/qU8Y2HM.png , desaturate when i'm targeting someone enven when not in combat and when i apply it it's in color
gilded arrow
so if rupture ticks for 25 secs on a 5 pt for example, if you refresh with 8 secs on, your rup will be at 33 secs. hypothetically , but lets say that cutoff is 8, if you refresh it at 20 secs left you will still only get 33. So its about min maxing those windows
@regal trellis
spare cloud
@hidden flint Make 2 and lay them over each other
Make 1 that says "always active trigger and make the color darker or desaturate w/e
and the other one with a higher priority with the normal aura
and in color
hidden flint
Ooh okay, I was trying to do it in one WA, it's not possible ?
spare cloud
Probably is, I don't know how tho π
regal trellis
@gilded arrow ty makes sense
hidden flint
Okay ahah, thx ^^
gilded arrow
how far behind is sin from outlaw and sub right now for high m+ pushing
anticipated***
gilded arrow
anticpated to be well behind sub and outlaw ... CT is not OP
final sapphire
hey guys, rlly confused about trinkets atm, obv pantheon is bis, but my 2nd trinket i cant decide between momento/eoc, i dont have a shadowsinged fang, so thats out of play.... my momento is 250 and eoc 240
strange python
get a SSW
final sapphire
ssw?
strange python
yea
final sapphire
i thought its bad atm?
strange python
its really good rn
spare cloud
Sim your trinkets thats your best option
final sapphire
will use that then, have a 935 one
spare cloud
we can't tell you what is best for your character
spare cloud
burnt drum
!talents
supple hearth
@final sapphire tell me he didn't tell u it's bad so you would trade to him hehe
broken oasis
So from what ive seen in the beta assa isnt seen in PvE how about PvP?
spare cloud
royal lantern
? isnt sin the best in PvE right now? and good for raw dmg in pvp cus people still dont understand how you counter creeping venom
spare cloud
Sin is op in pvp right now, but he was asking about beta
I don't know from where he got that information though
plain thistle
π€
fossil crag
so now Toe's knees promise is op right ?
hollow rose
best neck enchant atm?
honest compass
Satyr
hollow rose
You sure?
honest compass
No
hollow rose
I thought it was hidden soldier
hollow rose
or whatever its called
spare cloud
Sim
hollow rose
yeah people keep saying that. I put my sim in and have no idea what to do next
All people say is "sim"
and thats it
super useful
spare cloud
You try different trinkets out
spare cloud
Or just use raidbots
hollow rose
I use raidbots
spare cloud
Yeah
honest compass
I donβt wanna wait 3 mins
austere trail
is warcraft logs uploader down or not working for anyone else?
spare cloud
set to 100000 iterations
honest compass
final sapphire
@supple hearth nah, was a friend of mine, we were discussing our numbers @the end of dht20 when he mentioned it
lofty junco
raidbots not working atm? had wanted to sim which legendarys to use and its not working just error
remote wing
just did stat weight sim work fine for me
royal bronze
Hey guys does anyone know how many targets askmrrobot assumes when selecting multiple targets
for gear in bag
lost wharf
Why does every sim suggest using double rings of some sort, yet nobody in top logs plays double rings? I always see shoulder and/or wrists
royal bronze
Wrists are super good, but with majority of peoples gear, the rings pull ahead due to the stats on them
Haste is huge dps increase like absolutely massive
Alot of the top loggers already have great haste on high ilvl gear so those leggos sim better
As the pins say, sim yourself
lost wharf
I used to have massive gear, but everything changed when the haste nation attacked... Alright, if the sims are fine then I'll keep trusting the math. I was just wondering if the sims might be bugged or something hence ppl using other legos.
What are the reasons tho that haste is suddenly so good with the patch? Looking from a "feelycraft" point of view I thought mastery should be even better now affecting bleeds now aswell. Is the energy reg so important now?
zealous lily
Haste makes it easier to maximize ep uptime along with crit
And mastery changed so stacking it high is less powerful
strange python
well, if you're looking at garothi/etc, remember that those fights might not be representative of a 5 minute sim
lost wharf
Oh, they reworked that? Nice. So the duration scales with cp, but the tickrate and the dmg increase scale with haste?
strange python
duration is the same but it ticks faster
lost wharf
Does haste affect poison too?
lost wharf
So essentially all stats have some value now, except for vers, coz fck that boring stat.
strange python
vers has decent value
my weight is haste > agi > crit > vers > mast
for single target anyway.
lost wharf
Yea I know, I just don't like the stat. I think it's really boring
strange python
just a dmg increase, mastery isn't any different π€·
lost wharf
I liked multistrike a lot. It's a shame they removed it
Mastery is kind of different, since envenom is your main dps I think as of now you get no value there, but in aoe that turns I'd assume
Is the haste meta expected to change in BfA?
lofty junco
my raidbot still not work....some help which legendarys for antorus hc?
civic palm
Multistrike waaaaaaaaas dumb.
Correct Mastery gains weight in AoE situations, expect it to remain that way in BfA.
lofty junco
have only full t21
dual rings, shoulders+insignia, wrist+insignia or shoulders+wrist?
wise frigate
Update your SimC addon. Prolly why it's broken for you.
lofty junco
i had used raidbots
civic palm
or stop using armory imports, if you are doing that.
wise frigate
^
Was gonna be the next thing I said.
If you don't have it, install the SimulationCraft addon. Lets you pull a direct character import ingame by typing "/simc" and then copying the data that pops up into the import box on Raidbots.
serene basin
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/hB6sbvDA6Runv5BCKmq8vs guess this is the best i can get with my gear π¦
winged belfry
bis legendaries are sephuz and ravenholdt?
serene basin
hmm, sim yourself
thats the only way you know
we all have different stats %
what works for me might not work for ya
placid egret
lofty junco
i think its not optimale to said "sim ya self" cause someone ask cause they want to know what legendary to buy for 1k essence, then they can't sim herself without that legendary
onyx rock
sure they can
civic palm
You can SIM yourself with w/e items you want.
void pecan
civic palm
ATTACK!!
onyx rock
royal bronze
Hey guys just a question, why aren't boots good at the moment?
civic palm
Vendetta CD is too long and the fights are too short.
royal bronze
Wouldn't the advantage of haste make boots like better (due to more energy usage)?
Even on like 5-8min raid fights?
civic palm
Yeah.
lofty junco
NS or subterfuge? both are extremly close
civic palm
Pick which you like.
slow mortar
Better than it was before. Also a +15 ilvl(pre squish) splinters of agro is slightly better than the singed fang
wanton plinth
I'm only iLvl 198 but I'm really happy with dungeon output - 3.5k on Violet Hold last boss. Not so bad for a nub maybe? QQ hahah
plain thistle
40% crit and 29.15% haste, https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/7mB6znqvrW8sFBGophw3Bz π€
finally T20 2p isn't a upgrade for me
civic palm
onyx rock
i am at 29 hast + 45 crit too
my best items (985+ socket) are crit/hast π finally i can use them
prime void
onyx rock
@plain thistle did you sim this setup with an scourgewing too ?
plain thistle
no I didnt, will try that next
wise frigate
You guys make me want to waste my gold and resub just to fuck with sims.
onyx rock
i guess its an 150+ dps increase
@wise frigate simming my char is more fun than playing the game right now
lofty junco
for me blizzard castrated sub and combat with legion to that bastard version on live now
wise frigate
I haven't been on WoW for the last like 3 months now. Can't afford sub without paying gold and I am terrible about making gold.
lofty junco
I'm talking about the changes from WoD to legion
plain thistle
logging right now to re sim π
onyx rock
@wise frigate you have to go through very Tough times if you can not afford wow... i am sry for you
wise frigate
That's one way to put it heh. I'll get through it eventually.
onyx rock
I wish you the best my friend
wise frigate
:) Thanks man.
lofty junco
enchants?
quartz depot
crit gems, hmm
plain thistle
lofty junco
rupture doesn't profit from stealth with subterfuge right?
lofty junco
and can it be that the prepatch ravenholdt guide doesn't showed the opener with subterfuge?
tender folio
Guys should i go crit after hitting 30% haste ?
tender folio
.> just asking if its a soft cap or something like that π
civic palm
IIRC people are seeing other stats win over Haste after 27% but at high item levels.
grand salmon
alright i have a question
ive been told both yes and no
do i need to be level 110 to get my hidden look to drop in the underbelly
drifting cloud
since it used to be tied to artifact knowledge im gonna say yes
upbeat mortar
Was just wondering...What is everyones top 2 leggo choice for mythic+... mine is seph and shoulders
hollow rose
I've been using shoulders + insignia
lofty junco
whats our actual opener with EP and subterfuge?
whole canyon
Seph + shoulders rules.. sephuz gives so nice stat.s
Been trying with sephuz + wrists for tyrannical, but it doesn't seem that good..
civic palm
EP/SUB opener is the same as the topic.
whole canyon
Will try going master poisoner with nighstalker instead of 2 2
tranquil sedge
If you have subt and you stealth -> garrote, then accidentally garrote again does it make it less damage? Or does it snapshot till it falls off ?
civic palm
If the second Garrote was within the Subterfuge window you will be fine, otherwise it will override with the new, Subterfuge-less Garrote.
lofty junco
just wondering why human>void elf?
lofty junco
and i won't never play dwarf xD
its a bit better for dps but i can't look at this character xD
tender folio
Female orc β€
fleet carbon
Everyone I know stacks the envenom trait and becomes a horde assassin
I rarely see them pve
deep beacon
Nah I enjoy the VE teleport to each their own.
fringe ginkgo
Does discord have a way to mark an image as a spoiler?
ebon bramble
whats the envenom trait?
ive heard of it too and hwo it makes your envenom ridiculous
fleet carbon
Twist the knife, envenom does x damage more per combo point and lasts longer if it crits
whole canyon
Nightstalker would become more powerful then.
strange python
Are u guys leveling as sin?
onyx rock
ask me in a month
civic palm
rough gazelle
Im leveling as outlaw because 30s grappling hook is great
Plus top dps in normal dungeons (this is with blues and greens though)
What I donβt like is Dispatch, feels very underwhelming.
Im so sorry forgot this was assassinations chat im ouuuut
glacial smelt
OH GOD
empty cairn
o/
cosmic mountain
It's probably been asked many times before, but has anybody run the numbers on Crimson Tempest vs Poison Bomb in single-target PvP?
Even if poison is better right now, I suspect Crimson Tempest will be better with more stats at 120.
supple hearth
Minimal difference but pb will be better st in current pre patch form.
cosmic mountain
I would love if its bleed granted energy.
supple hearth
Afaik the bleed in CT doesn't work with exang either so rip
Poison is the better build to go currently in that scenario anyways with bleeds shining more in bgs
desert orchid
is spiked counterweight any good now?
serene basin
sim yo self
oblique osprey
Any recommendations on leveling legendries for BFA?
steep obsidian
neck π
ripe yew
steep obsidian
shoulders maybe in the end it won't really matter
oblique osprey
Yeah, that's what I was thinking. It's the second on that I'm scratching my head. Just trying to find recommendations as I plan on doing warmode and anything that can help with both pve and anti rape is good.
true rapids
How do I gain the ability to talk in quick questions?
oblique osprey
Well the shoulders are 100% crit chance. So does it matter?
urban storm
150% chance to crit is not any more beneficial than 100%
oblique osprey
I tend to run Subterfuge
snow sail
assasination looks awesome in ST dps........i hope it will be ste spec going bfa XD
empty elbow
fiery jasper
stiff mountain
how close would a mastery build with master poisoner be too the current??
patent sluice
does master poisoner affect envenom?
civic palm
No.
calm bronze
Anyone ever post a nice sin WA? π
zealous lily
use google for searching wago
calm bronze
π
zealous lily
the wago internal search is real bad
calm bronze
roger
cosmic mountain
Venom rush is just the worst talent now. Useless. Just takes five energy off of Mutilate essentially. So bad compared to the other choices.
civic palm
-3% isn't the end of the world.
fleet whale
It's a bit boring but I think it's a trap talent atm. Really it should work with blindside
civic palm
I don't think Blizz wants Blindside to be spammed under 30%, so giving it more bonuses might push it too close to that.
and there is going to be a worst talent, that you really don't have to think about.
VR just so happens to be it.
fleet whale
if that's the case, they should re-design blindside
remote wing
lol well not til 8.1 but ya i think we will see alot of changes come 8.1
fleet whale
If assassin stays this strong I don't think we will see many changes :/
civic palm
Who says we're strong @ 120?
fleet whale
pvpers
civic palm
Blindside will be better for the first tier so long stat scaling doesn't get dumb again.
Then the scaling talents will beat it again.
Eventually when they come up with something better we will get Blindside baseline.
fallen rose
just wait for 8.1 :lul:
civic palm
It's a very Assassination ability and pretty easy to add to the kit without it just breaking everything.
fallen rose
oh where did my nitro go
fleet whale
I hope at the very least they add KB back as a talent
civic palm
Nah, so long we have Toxic Blade, Kingsbane ain't getting anywhere near us IMO.
fleet whale
what would you rather have?
I personally think TB is quite boring... literally our version of Colossus Smash
KB at least had a pretty interesting mechanic behind it
civic palm
It's the same gameplay though, between KB and TB.
Prepare some Energy, cast TB or KB;
over the course of TB make sure to cast Envenom 2-3 times.
over the course of KB makes sure to cast Envenom 2+ times.
If KB was changed to make the gameplay during it more interesting, bring it back, ezpz.
fleet whale
it's the same gameplay sure, but thematically and flavor wise KB wins every time. The "State of the Assassination Rogue" article on wowhead shares a similar opinion too
civic palm
Also the stacking damage on KB is interesting but there being no tracking of it on the UI made it so that without looking at your combat log there was no way of knowing whether you got a good KB cycle or not.
KB is way cooler than TB, no question.
Just combine the two O _O
wet otter
any recommended wa? the one i was using all legion is busted
civic palm
There are a few updated ones on WAGO, make sure to sort by DATE.
fleet whale
I would be fine if they combined the two abilities
strange python
is there any interaction between master poisoner and deadly brew / wound poison?
civic palm
cosmic frigate
question for my rogue alt- i just played her for the first time today after 8.0 hit, I am unable to use TotT on anyone, it just says invalid target, I've tried multiple groups, not using a focus macro (straight up targeting someone and clicking it from the spellbook!), and relogging. Is there something I'm missing or is TotT bugged currently?
elfin fossil
Forgetting youβre using some kind of target macro with it?
cosmic frigate
I've tried it without a macro, just the spell and targeting an ally
elfin fossil
Afaik you need to be in a group to tricks someone
ember vortex
if someone has on a neural silencer you cant tott them
elfin fossil
Then itβs wierd
cosmic frigate
also won't work on my friend standing here with me in dal
elfin fossil
Not sure it could fuck up using tott, but worth a try
cosmic frigate
well after turning my addons off (still didn't work) and back on, now it suddenly works, i don't get this game sometimes
thanks for the suggestions
elfin fossil
Indie company code π€·ββοΈ
strange python
@cosmic frigate I've had that problem too a couple of times, that tricks stops working after using a @focus macro. the spell just grays out on my bars and I cant cast it
quaint rune
Hey guys I am not sure where to ask this.. but is there any way i can anchor this sexycooldowns to my personal resource display? I have been trying for 1hour with no luck..
civic palm
I know how to anchor WeakAuras to the PRD but nothing about that addon sorry.
cosmic frigate
same ^^
dire spoke
wow
civic palm
Also, fucking WA still doesn't have the %HP display working right =\
Doesn't truncate at all.
dire spoke
go commit step on lego
civic palm
What was the other addon that locked like that cooldown bar?
Used to be a Warlock thing.
civic palm
Pretty much, though making Forte in WA is a bit annoying.
dire spoke
yeah, lots of overlapping bars
lost horizon
dire spoke
2210023 β standard AoE
2230023 β with resets
supple hearth
also my iq
spare cloud
= Torb right now
dire spoke
supple hearth
pressing 0
spare cloud
I use 0 as a normal bind
dire spoke
I have my calculator open so I can click
spare cloud
I have every ability bound to the correlating letter the spell starts with
and 1-0 for mounts
dire spoke
how do you vendetta without vanish?
solid nova
Evasion without eviscerate
dire spoke
spare cloud
Shift and ctrl
solid nova
Nice phone
dire spoke
shit control
spare cloud
mutilate on m
dire spoke
pressing with thumb
spare cloud
Yeah
civic palm
Is this fucking DotA Legacy Keys?
spare cloud
I legit had a friend that played like that
he bound b n m
and pressed them with thumb
supple hearth
numpad 0 is a million miles away too
civic palm
It's out of the way for sure, but it's "reasonable".
young dagger
so for AoE do we just apply garrote on every target now or do we still just stick to one? same question but with rupture
civic palm
Read guide in topic at top of discord. Note that it pertains specifically to BfA.
young dagger
thanks. i should have checked that first.
dire spoke
@supple hearth use your mousehand thumb to press 0, dummy
oh toph outsmarted already
nevermind
supple hearth
id rather just use 10 11 and 12 on my mouse
dire spoke
civic palm
Gotta make the game hard somehow.
hollow otter
Is there a way i can make a macro to use an ability and if it is on cd to use the following one? and they both are part of the gcd?
warm parcel
Nop
hollow otter
thanks :C
supple mesa
So, come bfa when we lose 4 set how do you guys think the spec will feel?
civic palm
Slower. O _O
strange python
Slow as balls, apparently haste at 120 will be lower than we currently have too
civic palm
Well we're going to lose a ton of stats from leveling period.
vestal wren
@hollow otter actually you can do that if the addon gnome-sequencer supports that still
supple mesa
I mean we are still losing value
vestal wren
however you will require the named addon and to write the macro in the right syntax/configuration
granite horizon
guys is it wort to buy The Sentinel's Eternal Refuge for leveling in bfa instead shoulders? I already have Sephuz
shrewd night
Depends if the boots work during leveling or not, we cant be 100% the flying will remain for BFA
granite horizon
oh ye thats true, forgot about flying
sudden canyon
wouldnt be surprised if they forgot to disable it seeing how much broken shit we had at prepatch
vestal wren
flying is likely dissabled by default iirc
strange python
We just have to hope the traits on Azerite armor balances everything out so we don't feel underpowered or slow >_>
Idk if its just rogues but dang I'm a little concerned about the gear builds lol
It seems like we just got needed to hell
Nerfed
north spruce
is there a ravenholdt ingame community?
north spruce
ah, ty!
strange python
jeez, that swifty starts behave like stupid kiddo, everyday he makes new video about "how broken is assa rogue in pvp" ...just rolling eyes when i see it
snow spruce
Is there anywhere I can find a good rotation? Cant seem to figure out a really good one on my own:/
Dont have alot of experience on rogue quite yet :/
shrewd night
and guide at the very top
dire spoke
I also suggest reading (and understanding) spell tooltips
most of it is fast forward like the connection between TB and Env
barren wave
limber pilot
guys how do i empower Garrote not being funny i thought rogues couldnt snap shot
shrewd night
Read the subterfuge talent
limber pilot
will do ty
copper sinew
@shadow wedge Notters WA pack contains a WA to track empowered Garrote/Rupture
deep beacon
Yeah i hacked it and am using my own variation of it π
copper sinew
Oh boy, we got a badass over there, hacking weakauras
shut crest
speaking of garotte, it seems to be calculated weirdly in sims, did everything basically picture perfect, same casts of vendetta, alligned with the subterfuge garotte, 2 garotte ticks off 173 instead of 175 due to 2 sec downtime letting it tick out, same ammount of casts, a 2% crit difference but it sims 20% more on average tick [tested on a training dummy in the classhall (4pt20)]
deep beacon
You hacked it too according to your private messages. Should really think before putting your mouth into action lol π
copper sinew
I don't think you understand what "hacking" is then. Plus, I was joking. Calm down π
@shut crest Did you vanish?
shut crest
yes, like i said i alligned vendetta perfectly with subterfuge = i vanished
copper sinew
Yeah, does your damage meter reset on Vanish?
shut crest
i logged it
copper sinew
Alright, that's good
warm parcel
Youre missing consumables, warrior buff, lust and monk aura unless you disabled those
shut crest
you are correct, weirdly all the other abilities have a max 5% margin, but i could have gotten lucky on crits
ah yea i forgot to diable flask + foodbuffs
ty, makes sense now
copper sinew
Did you disable everything raid related? Lust, Battle Shout, Potion, Debuffs and such? o.o
I mean, plus your flask and food obviously
shut crest
i did yea but i forgot flask and food ._.
shut crest
yea with the 2% crit differense its acceptable
copper sinew
But that would bring the other abilities' margin down as well Γ΄o
warm parcel
optimalraid=0
Was it?
shut crest
yea i had alot of crit luck for other abilities e.g envenom sim 38.6% : tested 43.9%
same with other abilities so i didnt notice it
is there an option to make the boss be above 30% health all the time in sims?
i wanna optimize my assassination gameplay as much as possible before bfa hits, so id love to compare the sims with my logs, but due to blindside it gets scewed quite a bit
warm parcel
You can try simc wiki
stark heart
enemy_death_pct=30
shut crest
awesome ty
little fiber
So what are people around 248-250 simming for currently? Just wondering if my gear set is fucked or not compared to before pre-patch
whole canyon
Guys, anyone from US? What can I expect tomorrow in my M+ chest?
copper sinew
Probably 240
lofty junco
so they fixed it without any loot?
whole canyon
And maybe some currency? But idk what.
Maybe Azerite? Would be cool.
Tooltip says "209" and "artifact power" like pls, they don't even care.
copper sinew
guess we'll know for sure in 4 hours 15 minutes
icy iris
tender folio
Oh I'm a be soo pissed if we dont get any gear tomorrow
limber pilot
Boys how is assassination looking for bfa mythic+ wise
tender folio
Pretty good so far
limber pilot
Are we gonna be able to compete with pirate rogue? Or should I change spec now
tender folio
Getting Dusk blade for tmog for 20k feelsgoodman
shrewd night
Nobody knows because tuning isnt done until heroic week. We dont own a crystal ball to tell the future unfortunately.
tender folio
And you should play what you enjoy , numbers wont be much of a difference
Unless you wanna go hardcore
limber pilot
We're gonna be the greatest rogue spec going boys dw Jesus told me
magic zenith
Jesus is never wrong.
lofty junco
yes got a hc vari trinket at last^^
magic zenith
Oh I highly doubt we're getting any gear from these quests. I don't recall there being any on beta or ptr
lofty junco
now i can replace my 245 eye with 225 SS^^
magic zenith
You get a shitty weapon from lorderan, but that's def not today.
strange python
There's going to be world quests in darkshore eventually
I doubt they'll wait for the end of the questline to do that.
Otherwise we'd only have like a week of it.
magic zenith
The natural cut off for first week seemed like malf putting up the wisp wall
strange python
Unless they want us to visit darkshore in bfa.
magic zenith
But even the dailies on beta had just resources and gold and shit.
young narwhal
sup guys, what do u run in m+? sephuz+/x?
final sapphire
ha, haha. wait for it.
jokes aside, im still testing
high keys i run prydaz+shoulders
20+
soft island
In high m+? I run.
lone junco
I ran sephuz + vig(DS).
Subterfuge garrotes the FOK Ct spam
But still keeps your single really strong.
magic zenith
190 huh? What ilvl is the Argus boa stuff?
lone junco
But for me Outlaw is absurdly higher cleave right now.
finite meadow
can anyone explain why/how [Insignia of Ravenholdt] works with melee attacks?
shrewd night
Whats confusing about it?
finite meadow
"your single target combo point generating attacks" =/= auto attacks
shrewd night
What attacks generate combo points?
Which of those are singletarget?
Gz, they now cleave.
dire spoke
hallow sage
"The list of spells this ring effects is:
Assassination: (Does not apply Poisons or Bleeds to targets hit)
Mutilate
Poisoned Knife
Toxic Blade
Hemorrhage
Kingsbane
Outlaw: ( Blade Flurry does not stop the ring from proccing. The spells still count as ST CPG's)
Sinister Strike
Pistol Shot
Ambush
Ghostly Strike
Subtelty:
Shadowstrike
Backstab
Shuriken Toss
Goremaw's Bite
Gloomblade"
Taken from: http://www.wowhead.com/item=137049/insignia-of-ravenholdt#comments
Comment by ExperimentX4d2
That was obviously during 7.3.5
So I'd assume now you take off Hemo/Kingsbane and add in Blindside and it'd be the same
hushed lotus
alright im kinda new at rogue, chu think i could do better itemisation-wise https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/hW698jLy5rAjQTesPpeVVh
hushed lotus
well im far from skill capped so i'm kinda new 
lament dove
then I'm kinda 12 years new
balmy condor
B O I
copper sinew
It has a socket
hushed lotus
ok i didnt want to start this lol pls help, is 27% haste or w/e soft cap?
shrewd night
SIM YOURSELF
shrewd pine
there is no haste cap
shrewd pine
^
balmy condor
Koffing I don't follow that logic
shrewd night
253 ilevel, sims himself
balmy condor
can you simplify it
strange python
Im actually new and just learned what sims are like 2 days ago... and i would really like for some very experienced assassin players to help me out. I have no idea how to navigate like 99% of the sites, sources, items, etc.
hushed lotus
lol the class discords are as bullshit as they told me
copper sinew
Nothing to do with experienced assassination player @strange python - read guides on how to sim yourself and you'll be guccy
lament dove
haste is when you want to do something quickly
shrewd pine
oh god
balmy condor
class discords work fine @hushed lotus, you're just asking dumb questions
copper sinew
^
shrewd pine
^
shrewd night
^
twin meadow
oof
copper sinew
can't break the chain
strange python
@copper sinew rompi have no idea where to even start, honestly. I just want to benefit my friends guild i recently joined.
copper sinew
DID YOU JUST CALL ME ROMPI
lament dove
cause we don't break the chain, we pick the lock
hushed lotus
i was asking about itemisation jesus christ
strange python
No, im using the phone app cuz im at work and it just adds words.
hushed lotus
whatever, have fun
weak isle
thanks π you too β€
copper sinew
That dude π
twin meadow
cy@
shrewd pine
@shrewd night classic fuking bully. Toxic. Mods ban him please
hushed lotus
im a lazy boi
balmy condor
@hushed lotus okay. Here's the dealio m80. You sim higher than 90% of the people here. You have BiS gear, and you obviously aren't enough of a clown to not understand stat weights. So use that BIG BRAIN and read what the stat weights say. If they say more haste, get more haste.
Does that help you more
hushed lotus
no shit
copper sinew
@strange python Get the simc addon. Type /simc ingame. Copy the string. Get to raidbots.com.
Wanna compare gear you have? Top Gear
Wanna compare gear you don't have? Gear Compare
Wanna compare talents? Talent Compare
Wanna know how much pew pew your current gear and talent setup does? Quick Sim
Wanna know which stats will contribute the most pew pew to your CURRENT gear? Stat Weights
Can do all the above while sleeping? Can read the discord pins? GUCCI -> Advanced
That's all the basics there is to raidbots/simming
hushed lotus
balmy condor
strange python
@copper sinew thank you, I'll look into those when i get off work. Would you be willing to help later on if i have further questions?
copper sinew
Yes, just message me privately so we don't spam the discord
strange python
Of course
balmy condor
@copper sinew thats what we do around here tho.
shrewd night
Can I get the same offer Romp 
?
copper sinew
@balmy condor What do you meeeean?
balmy condor
best song of 2017 tbh
copper sinew
@shrewd night I don't think your ape-level is high enough, but sure
shrewd night
Dw, I have nudes. You can confirm ape-level.
strange python
I feel like i should be offended by that lol
copper sinew
Wasn't meant as offense towards you though!
Everyone has been new to raidbots at some point
The point is there are so many guides for raidbots, simc, assa, rotation, stats, gear
It gets tedious answering the same questions over and over before people even read the pins
strange python
I just dont know where to start... theres so much.
copper sinew
But go ahead and message me, I won't bite
balmy condor
my interests have been awoken
copper sinew
Although I'm not simming as high as @hushed lotus , I know what Haste is.
God. I love this discord
lone junco
@hushed lotus 27% is a good number. Should drop behind crit some. If y u want to see "caps" you can graph the crit values from 25-30%. If it's linear then no break point. But if we remember, crit is the main contributor to ep uptime. Ep buffs bleeds at a different rate than haste. Stats are not an island.
dire spoke
FoK you Romp
balmy condor
not after HB + Cloak nerf
copper sinew
We Poison Bomb now
balmy condor
inb4 crimson tempest single target with exsang build
copper sinew
no u
balmy condor
the dream
lone junco
No dream.
balmy condor
DREAM I SAY
hushed lotus
@lone junco thanks for actually helping and not acting like i asked what haste is
lone junco
Exsang without 45 sec vendetta is fucking dumpster tier.
balmy condor
:( I play exsang in m+ cause I'm bored and like seeing 10k burst on pull
copper sinew
10k burst? Just play CT
shrewd night
lone junco
Outlaw is that 15k cleave tho.
balmy condor
bosses I mean
copper sinew
Oui Oui
balmy condor
outlaw is mad stanky in m+
hushed lotus
posion bomb is lit af π₯ π
lone junco
That pop is nice. But good single does not move the M+ needle for me. I need both.
balmy condor
tfw
exsang 1 min cd (was 45 sec)
ITS A BUFF BOYS
lone junco
If it aligns with every other vendetta then good. ESP if they buff it.
lone junco
It's almost 1k dps loss to my poison build.
Prob due to mis alignments and no fucking bota.
RIP!
balmy condor
oh yeah its a huge loss for me too, just huge burst and I'm getting tired of toxic blade poison bomb
thank god for ct in m+
lone junco
Oh. I love Ct. FOK Ct FOK Ct. FOK FOK Ct.
Range probably a bit small tho compared to Acro.
But if they nerf the hit component of Ct any more, just pack it up.
balmy condor
idk range feels like 5 yards too small, but its not that bad
its just small enough to feel weird every now and again
with subterfuge and CT I always get nervous because no poison spread though
lone junco
When tank is walking some stuff they get split. When you get to CT 10+ it's pretty good.
lone junco
On the largest packs. The first subterfuge is for sephuz, then Ct away.
lone junco
Ive been running sephuz + vig(DS). The 6cp FOK/Ct is nice.
balmy condor
you run talent ring over shoulders in m+?
lone junco
But that was seliathan recommendation for now. Can't sim sephuz tho.
He's running 27-30s. So what applies there doesn't really for me.
We don't do omega pulls.
lone junco
But it's a really strong single as well as cleave.
balmy condor
I'll have to try double ring
whole canyon
I agree about not having that juicy poison bombs.. CT is probably way better but ugh.
lone junco
I hesitate because my rings are really really good.
balmy condor
I have a decent ring, idk what I have for shoulders
lone junco
But to maximize CT.
balmy condor
might have a decent shoulder sitting around
whole canyon
Nightstalker Master Poisoner Shouldered Poison Bomb out of stealth could be fun.
Just got insignia, so will try double ring action.
balmy condor
insignia in m+ is awful
well
compared to other options
its decent single target
lone junco
FOK > insig mut.
balmy condor
yeah
whole canyon
So what for M+? Shoulders + sephuz?
whole canyon
Yea saw this top rogue running it. Interesting choice indeed. But do you really get that much out of stronger finishers? hm.
balmy condor
CT is strong as hell
I could imagine huge pull 6cp CT would be pretty hype
especially with sephuz
whole canyon
Oh yea, most likely.
I actually have one of those as well, just gonna upgrade with essences, good stuff.
balmy condor
idk, I was staring at raider.io for a bit, top rogues seem to be doing similar stuff, double ring is an outlier
sin = shoulder/sephuz
sub = shoulder/cloak
outlaw = shoulder/insig
seems to be the general meta
theres also some bracers floating around for some sin rogues
which is interesting
whole canyon
Yea I saw shoulder + bracer.
Maybe because it's tyrannical this week, idk.
I wonder if shoulders < vigor ring
You can use vanish to smash crit CT with shoulders.
balmy condor
bracers feels like it would be a banger on raging weeks
but then again, we can take away raging now
so I don't see the point of that as an execute
especially now that we can't change gear anymore
sephuz just seems much more reliable
hushed lotus
i played bracers in upper and eye they're pretty good
sephuz is beast when u can activate it 24/7
whole canyon
I haven't noticed much difference with bracers, idk.
balmy condor
I mean, iron wire subterfuge garrote on pull is basically 24/7
whole canyon
Sephuz feels strong, as do shoulders.
hushed lotus
with sephuz active the dots are so fast on your screen your nuts start shaking buddy
balmy condor
I broke all my sets and all my legendaries to stack as much haste as I could, and then ran exsang single target on a dummy
got tick rate down to 0.55sec
was pretty hype
I couldn't spend energy fast enough
shit damage though
like abysmal
whole canyon
Hmm.
Nightstalker + shoulders, max CT from stealth and immediately proc Sephuz
π
Almost everyone is playing elaborate planning + subterfuge
balmy condor
garrote silence is super strong
whole canyon
No love for nightstalker even though shoulder is M+ leggy.
balmy condor
and its really fast energy regen
you hit 3 garrotes from stealth and a fan of knives later you have all the energy you'll need
with NS you'd get a spicy CT off and then be starved for 10-15 seconds while you build up your bleeds
by the time you're done ramping stuffs dead
whole canyon
I guess.. eh got too used to juicy poison bomb. Gotta feel like sub now, no shit on the ground.