assassination

[quiet oar]

Just cut a healer

[drifting cloud]

might not even have to

[quiet oar]

But i think that will be the play down the road

[golden loom]

U can probably 2 heal sprocket

[quiet oar]

I think you can

If you skip the Beam, Suck Combination

[golden loom]

Like the damage is so predictable and theres nothing else to use defensives on than mine explosions

[quiet oar]

the one before 2nd knock

[golden loom]

Yeah

[quiet oar]

If you cant skip i think its not worth

[hearty seal]

IME Undermine was a bit underwhelming as a raid compared to NP
is it just me?

[quiet oar]

I like Undermine more

[royal lantern]

undermine is a good heroic raid

[golden loom]

Need to fill up LFG in 2 months with 2-2-16 sprocket parserun advertisements

[royal lantern]

but mythic? oof

[quiet oar]

I really disliked Court

[golden loom]

Nerubar was also a insane heroic raid

[quiet oar]

Gallywix

Is still a tough Heal Fight

[golden loom]

I just wanna do more kyveza and ansurek heroic pugs man

[quiet oar]

Even with 670 you can 3 heal it with 25 people

[royal lantern]

my Problem is that this raid has not really a fight i would say plays/feels good? unless mugzee giga suprises me

[quiet oar]

Sprocket Mythic is the most fun fight

Yeah Mugzee is cool

[golden loom]

Honestly the only problem I have with heroic gallywix, SHADOWSTEP IS STILL BROKEN

[quiet oar]

im just annyoed by the Jails

Jails still has class / Race Requirement

[golden loom]

I am really sad I never got to fight mythic kyveza tho

[royal lantern]

blue collar/white male, is that good?

[quiet oar]

Its good for my Bed, but you wouldnt get into it with me hahaha, unless?

[royal lantern]

im at work

[quiet oar]

One of the fights i really liked like this. Was Rygelon

Rygelon was a really cool fight

Or Halondrus

[drifting cloud]

Technically it doesnt you can plan around it

[quiet oar]

But its still risky

AND

[drifting cloud]

No risk, just less boss dps

[quiet oar]

Our Raiders cant read

2 get right and 2 get left

what happesn?

4 Frostshatters behind one jail

[royal lantern]

bad

number lower = no unga bunga

[quiet oar]

Well thats not gucci for the 4 Heal push

[royal lantern]

me want unga bunga

[quiet oar]

me too

[drifting cloud]

Oh I meant for p2

[royal lantern]

https://tenor.com/view/monkey-smash-wood-playing-gif-17749007

[quiet oar]

Well yeah for P2 it doesnt matter yeah

[drifting cloud]

If you get 2nd jail you cant use void elf anyways

Or it will still be on cd

[quiet oar]

Im not sure which one ill void elf

2nd or 1st and 3rd

[royal lantern]

i just told my RL that i will never swap race

fuck off with that cringe shit

[quiet oar]

I had Faction cahnge anyways

and i dont know what to use it for

and for appearance it doesnt matter if im Blood Elf or Void Elf

[runic hinge]

@drifting cloud i finally made it

[drifting cloud]

Its not needed at all but atleast for assa its nice since you do more dmg to adds outside of jail assuming good positioning

[golden loom]

I would rather play my velf warrior instead of race changing

[final star]

Imagine this is your vault but socket is more of an upgrade

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/jEXo8zY1rya7rMthxtW8FY

[golden loom]

Or my 600ilvl velf outlaw rogue thats used for farming herbs

[runic hinge]

reported

[quiet oar]

Well 2nd Jails cant be cleaved

if you play 4 Heal

[balmy condor]

sim 15 min

[final star]

5t 5m

[quiet oar]

[subtle tundra]

wheres signet simmed?

why are you not taking in consideration youre going from a hc track to myth track on your trinket

[tall atlas]

idkkkkkkkkkkkk

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[final star]

It's included in the sim

[subtle tundra]

well if you dont want to upgrade your trinket, ever, take socket

[final star]

I mean house of cards exists lol

It's not a problem

I'm also holding for any potential crest savers

Cos that'll change a lot

Cos it's high value piece upgrades that are massive overpowering the trinkets

Save crests on those may make trinket picks more desirable

[worn marsh]

his sim prioritized upgrading pants, which definitely tracks, but also dinar means access to mythic HoC anyway

[subtle tundra]

when would that be

it would be 2nd dinar

not first

so what, 2 months from now?

[golden loom]

3 weeks after first no?

[runic hinge]

5 weeks?

[golden loom]

So uhhh 13th + 21 days

[final star]

There is plenty of time between then and now for me to get more upgrades lol

It's not that big a deal

[subtle tundra]

theres gonna be plenty of vaults with no good choices

where you can take socket

[worn marsh]

on the other hand, myth priory trinket very likely to never be seen again so if you think you'd run it over myth HoC long term then you should just take it regardless of current sim

[final star]

Tier over, no matter anyway

[golden loom]

Maybe eye of kezan for next tier then pog

[final star]

[runic hinge]

[balmy condor]

surely next tiers trinkets aren't dogshit right

[drifting cloud]

you got my fault

[runic hinge]

[drifting cloud]

give it back

[golden loom]

Okay day/week 1 of next tier pausechampington

[drifting cloud]

thats your guilds strat or something, I could cleave them just fine

[quiet oar]

SURELY

[balmy condor]

they bring back heroic week and we all play fatebound

[quiet oar]

You didnt put the Fire Puddle in the mid then

right?

[drifting cloud]

of the room? we did

[final star]

Fire puddle nothing to do with it

The first two gaol can be spattered

[golden loom]

Play fatebound to get DS buffed according to heroic week stats or?

[quiet oar]

Ye i know

[golden loom]

Whats the thinking there

[final star]

Every set you can spatter two

[quiet oar]

But if you ahve fire puddle in mid, and you want to clear it instantly lances come from mide

[final star]

That's like 15s after gaol spawn

[quiet oar]

and when boss stands between the two jails, the risk is to get hit my ice lances

[balmy condor]

fatebound is gonna crank surely

+25% fatebound buff

insano raid spec

[final star]

You don't have ice at same time as killing gaol

[golden loom]

Im gonna play fatebound on Court of Ethereals and get sin a 900% aura buff

[balmy condor]

no shot they let fatebound go unplayed a third tier in a row

right?

[midnight mist]

you dont want fb to be viable lol

[runic hinge]

Why not

[balmy condor]

killing spree deleted, fatebound giga dps

the outlaw guys deserve to eat good

[subtle tundra]

making fatebound the raid hero talent means assa m+ st dmg will be even worse cause you dont play the ST herotalent in m+

[balmy condor]

trickster good and fatebound good

amen

[final star]

It will never be good even if it does damage

It's slop

Same as deathstalker

It's not good by design

[balmy condor]

can you just let me fucking cope man

no wonder they stab people in your shit country

pmo

[final star]

Rogues always have some annoying ass bug that the rogue mains just learn to play around because at this point they're used to being ignored.

[quiet oar]

Idk it was close for us

[final star]

Never close and if you're in gaol you can't get them anyway

[quiet oar]

But my mates wont read their WA and stand with 4 People in one jail to snipe me

[neon bridge]

signet is hero, eye is champion track, i should go signet right?

[quiet oar]

but yeah i see what you mean

[balmy condor]

you'd probably never wear a champ eye and hero signet is farmable

probably doesn't matter either way

[royal lantern]

god i hope it stays that way

[subtle tundra]

kezan is a very bad trinket outside of like 3 places

[neon bridge]

my current trinkets are beyond dogshit so i would wear both

[red schooner]

I'd just play deathstalker regardless probably unless the gap was huge

[runic hinge]

I’d play fatebound if they made the capstone guaranteed in opener and made it not immediately shit if there’s a second target

[midnight mist]

Fb has the most trash damage profile ever + it's mega buggy

You lose prio whenever there is adds around

Like a lot of prior

5/10% idk

and thats the case even on fights where there is fake adds

like mugzee for example

with imune adds and bombs

and then in m+ you need to maintani the coin between packs

[royal lantern]

the funny thing is

yeha capstone guranteed would feel better, but at the same time kill the entire point of that tree

god its such a clusterfuck, who the hell thought fatebound is a good idea

[midnight mist]

so 15s, you have to do mega cringe to maintain it

and then every node is bugged (at least for outlaw)

[sonic schooner]

Meanwhile i m playing all 3 mages hero talents and they so good design

[midnight mist]

Like you can't ADR from stealth or you lose coins, ADR break stealth, you can't ADR (or dm I assume) to go from 6 to 7 or you won't ever proc the capstone

And I don't remember the other bugs

But if fateboudn was viable for assa

You wouldn't like it kekw

Ds is the most broken shit ever also

Funnel no capo

[quiet oar]

Zac in shambles

[midnight mist]

I'm not in shamble

Every hero talent is like

Terribler than the other

But I think fateboudn is one of the worse

Not like on surface

You have to dig slightly

On surface deathstalker is an abomination

[royal lantern]

yes on surfacr

its fucking coinflips lol

[midnight mist]

You understand by the first GCD how annoying it's gonna be

I think the only hero talent that is ok is trickster honestly

If you ignore killinspree

[royal lantern]

i mean yeha, rogues hero trees all suck

even as passive trees

[red schooner]

Deathstalkers doesn't feel too bad normally, though on court last season it was a twat to deal with

Especially in MA build and vanish being sent in cd windows

[midnight mist]

It's ok till you have to target swap

Or like till something break stealth in m+

[red schooner]

With VV it's alright enough

[midnight mist]

Or like you have phases in m+

[royal lantern]

like, leveed a bear druid, and lunar hero tree is passive af aswell

but like, passive af without the annoying deathstalker shit or everything around fatebound

they failed at making passive trees on rogue lol

[midnight mist]

Stuff like second boss in siege last tier

[red schooner]

Just cos we have vanish not tied to the cd window

[midnight mist]

Broke my mind

[keen tundra]

How does crimson tempest work in mass aoe? it says deals reduced damage past 5 targets , does that mean it splits it w the 5 or how is it?

[royal lantern]

more or less all abilitys do reduced dmg past 5targets so it doesnt grow out of controll

[bronze pike]

spliter one is shit

its just mage +

[dreamy rover]

pov: dk's blood beast

[bronze pike]

i hate hero trees that are just

"spec +"

[golden loom]

My favorite hero talent tree is mountain thane

That shits cool as fuck even if you play slayer on most raid fights

[royal lantern]

in a optimal world, all specs would have 1 option that is somewhat more involved/gameplay changing, and 1 that is passive with no changes

in reality, the entire system sucks, is rushed as hell and should have not been made

[bronze pike]

yes but also

thats kinda lamege

were supposed to have these trees for 2 more expansions allegedly

to have one of them being passive + and then like

have balancing issues

is silly

[royal lantern]

mate, so much stuff is silly about them

why add another layer on top of classes when a good chunk had still not really finished trees allready

why the akward and extremely forced "shared bettwen 2 specs"

[red schooner]

I like the idea in concept but the execution for rogue feels bad. Feral druid druid of the claw gives me the big ravages at least

[quiet oar]

It really only works for some classes

I mean Rogue and DH ones are prolly the worst

[bronze pike]

yep

nah

dh

has one good one

and one shit one

[quiet oar]

Which one is good

[bronze pike]

felscarred

is goated

burst profile

[quiet oar]

You only like it

Because it enhances your Meta

[bronze pike]

reaver doesnt work for havoc

cause souls

[quiet oar]

Both are shitty imo

especially as tnak

[bronze pike]

felscarred is goated as tank

[royal lantern]

monk is also weird

shado pan is basically deathstalker

conduit is buggy as hell

master of harmony can be akward to play with

[bronze pike]

i do big dam with my cd

[quiet oar]

Only because you do big dam

doesnt mean its good

[royal lantern]

^

[bronze pike]

i like the profile

[quiet oar]

Like it really does nothing

[bronze pike]

giving more burst dam in general, making meta a actual burst cd

[quiet oar]

other than enhancing your abilties

and forcing you to press meta on CD

[bronze pike]

you should be playing around your meta cd anyways as a tank

[dreamy tree]

whats the weakauras command?

!weakaura

[bronze pike]

pull big around your strongest defensive cd

[sharp viper]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[dreamy tree]

thx

[quiet oar]

Idk Rogue and DH ones are bad imo

[nova kelp]

awe did I miss out on bitching about coin flipping?

bah

[royal lantern]

(m+ is not the only content in the game)

[red schooner]

Nah we're just griping about hero talents in general now

[quiet oar]

I really like Totemic from Enhancer

Except the replacement

but in general good tree

[nova kelp]

well either way, fuck coin flipping

[radiant snow]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

There are no "recommended stat levels" or "breakpoint of X stat" or "required" amount of any stats. This is an outdated way to think about stats and simply is not relevant to the spec. If you're looking for a quick recommendation: Agi >> Crit = Mastery >= Haste > VersatilityIt's always more accurate to simulate your own character, as stat procs from trinkets/enchants can often de-value their stat relative to others. Stats are not a rigid construct, their values change constantly in relation to each other depending on your character.

• Signet of the Priory will require you have Mastery as your highest RATING (the actual number, not the %). Having Crit and Mastery close to one another will cause procs from Flask or Seaforium Pacemaker to cause your Signet to give you Crit. This is generally worse and will cause Signet to sim poorly.
• Compared to each other, Deathstalker wants more Mastery/Haste than Fatebound, and Fatebound wants more Crit than Deathstalker
• Always Always ALWAYS sim yourself through Top Gear and Droptimizer for accurate results

[bronze pike]

in raids frankly timers are so constant that you always press meta on cd anyways to block a big thingy

but ill yield on that tbh

i like felscarred cause for havoc it makes their big burst cd more of a burst cd instead of consistent damage profile

[royal lantern]

packleader on bm is also kinda stupid tbh

like, in raids its boring and in m+ its stupid to play at points cus its all just "pray that bear procs"

[bronze pike]

for veng it gives big value to my "big cd'

[red schooner]

Agreed. We are not coin flip enjoyers

[quiet oar]

Isnt it consistent Spawning

Like Bear, Wyvern Boar and again

I like it as Survival ngl

Having juiced ab Mongoose bite Cleave

Give Serotonin

https://tenor.com/view/serotonin-happy-chemical-brain-icecreamsandwich-ice-cream-short-gif-23090585

But coudlt also be the fact

That its interactive (to some degree) and Sentinel

Is just a Circle

[runic hinge]

Dark ranger kinda cool

[quiet oar]

I dont know

im Survival

The only Hunter Spec

[nova kelp]

gods survival was good pre legion

idk why they didn't make bm the melee spec

it would both make good sense, AND have fit mechanically

AND wouldn't have required rex lore rewrites

and wouldn't have resulted in a spec that throws EXPLOSIVE ORDINANCE IN CLOSE COMBAT

[quiet oar]

Only thing i would change on Survival

Make it Dual Wield

[runic hinge]

Black arrow lock and load was fun

Didn’t play surv again after cata

[nova kelp]

ranged survival being the pet spec, mm being no pet, and bm being one along side and WITH the pet would have made sense

making surv the melee spec was braindead

also while I'm at it, we should have never got demon hunters, fuck rule of cool
it needed full lore rewrites (again)
and prevented us from getting warden/spellbreakers in their place as a mail wearing tank/melee dps
instead we got ANOTHER leather tank/dps and oversaturated an already saturated armour type

AND took cool demon shit OFF warlocks while they were at it

AND it fucked us out of being able to xmog the warglaives from BT

[red schooner]

I don't care about demon hunters but, where bard class?

Cmon, pls

I want bard

[nova kelp]

don't ask for it

we won't get a bard CLASS

we'll get a 4th support spec for rogue

[red schooner]

Outlaw reworked into bard spec

Gg

[red schooner]

This works for me

[nova kelp]

realisitcally we'd lose sub before outlaw

lets be real

[spring stream]

There is even a Bard in rogue class hall

[red schooner]

Nah they'll throw us a curve ball and nuke sin

Sin but add a g, sing

Bard spec confirmed

[nova kelp]

imo if they ever went the route of nuking a spec they'd blend sub stuff split into sin/ol and replace it with bard

but then

[red schooner]

Just give us the 4th spec, if druids can have it why not us

[nova kelp]

they also deleted the best hunter spec to make a melee spec that made no lore or logical sense

so what the fuck do I know

[royal lantern]

you think they do something like that after the humiliation that was aug?

[red schooner]

Bard healer spec

[nova kelp]

I think that aug left them with 1 of 2 choices

either delete the test completely, OR rebalance the baseline to permanently include an aug spec AND make more of them

[red schooner]

Let's go I'm still down

I just wanna bard man let me be happy

[dawn warren]

is Eye of Kezan still decent for prog? Have the option for one in the vault but it sims less then the H track funhouse lense on 5min fights in my current gear set. For context we are at 60% on Sprok but I won't be on the rogue again till Mugzee (Asked to go back to ranged and do the coins on OAB as we have some silly goose ranged)

[nova kelp]

if they go the route of making more aug specs, we'd (rogues) likely end up with bard

[royal lantern]

"we know its impossible to ever make work, but TRUST US!!!! we can tune it!!!!!! it will work out!!!!!!"->aug was Broken OP untik they had to emergency nuke it into unplayable

man, they for sure managed that well

[nova kelp]

if they go the route of deleting the test all together

then we'll never get bard

of any kind

[royal lantern]

good for OAB/mugzee/gally mythic

[dawn warren]

Is it alright on Sproket or is it a meme with the intermissions?

I know its kinda bait for short fights

[nova kelp]

eye doesn't even sim better than pace maker for me on 7 min sims

[plucky canopy]

Make a 4th rogue spec and name it tinker

Let me have an engineer spec man

Let me build turrets

[quiet oar]

Its called Augmentation

[royal lantern]

play a rts

[red schooner]

No I must sing the song of my people

[dawn warren]

This is the vault in question that is causing pain, I still have 1 craft available so I feel the cloak can be skipped safely but the real pain point is the ring vs eye vs funhouse

[quiet oar]

I mean you still can

[plucky canopy]

No

[royal lantern]

kinda based tbh

[red schooner]

Yeah but augs current song is the sound of someone being choked to death

[bronze pike]

herald for ret is aids

for holy is really neat

[quiet oar]

Rets deserve it

Fuck Rets

I hope they delete Ret

[bronze pike]

https://tenor.com/view/rat-attack-gif-12798710424551752432

[red schooner]

I've hated that spec since wrath and my mind can't be changed

[quiet oar]

No Rats are cool

Rets are the cancer of wow

They are the ones making All the Bugs

They poison our wells

[red schooner]

Just had an expansion long run of terrible rets in my groups and now the spec scares me

[quiet oar]

And destroy or wheat

[rotund oak]

realistically we would lose both

outlaw in the current state is worse than sub

[prisma coral]

i think the trick here is finding a ret that loves their insane amount of utility more than anything else

and knows how to use mouse over macros/functionality

[tranquil crystal]

.

[red schooner]

See the ones I run into have four whole action bars with only divine storm on it

[prisma coral]

which is acctually fucking insane

and its real

like if there is a "skill ceiling" its in knowing how to use the other 50% of their abilites which dont do damage and bandwagon billy didnt read the tooltips

which sucks for everyone involved

[royal lantern]

thats fancy words for somebody in divine storm range

[prisma coral]

freedom is wildly good, bop is great, lay on hands, wog can heal keys and clutch out a dead healer

[tranquil crystal]

Blues

[prisma coral]

bubble is wildly amazing especially paired with a battle rez

but i hear ya

[tranquil crystal]

How can i get The bleed role?

[red schooner]

It's in the pins

[warm vortex]

Holy shit based

[red schooner]

Rat posted, ven immediately appears

[warm vortex]

Lmao I was gonna check in here and saw rat

[red schooner]

Nah you had your inner rat sense ping

[warm vortex]

Tbh I might just be playing BM next season because I tried rogue again and like

Blizzard doesn’t give a fuck about rogue so much it’s not even funny
Kinda is tbh

[red schooner]

I'm too locked in to the class to swap at this point

[warm vortex]

Do you love getting unshtealthed by something randomly targettinng you

How about huge bugs that don’t get fixed for weeks.

How about removing acro strikes

[subtle tundra]

WOMP WOMP CRY ABOUT ACRO

[prisma coral]

I have almost 2 years played on my rogue and it's an abusive relationship lol

[subtle tundra]

GET BETTER

[warm vortex]

I WILL

[warm vortex]

AND I

Probably won’t

[midnight mist]

still made the game less fun

[warm vortex]

But tbh it’s mainly just the stealth issues that really irk me

[last skiff]

I won

[warm vortex]

Boy I hope I can keep my stealth

The humble fixating walking mine:

[prisma coral]

i cant say i remember reading a post about a bug quite as wild as the "blade flurry reduces its target cap to 0" though

from this week

[warm vortex]

How about Coup de grace locking you out of doing anything for like a second

Making 9/10 trickster outlaw being better than 10/10

Or whatever it was

[midnight mist]

ks does that for 3 sec

[prisma coral]

i used that second to regret having to killing spree

[warm vortex]

But that’s intended

Coup wasn’t

Which idk if that is better or worse

[midnight mist]

I mean coup hasn't changed

It still longer gcd

Just you can use off GCDs during it now

[prisma coral]

"surrender to maddness is too much, here's killing spree"

[warm vortex]

Yea

[red schooner]

Idk I know the class is kinda forgotten about but my rogue was my first character and I am begrudged to ever swap. He's my boy.

We look after the boy

[warm vortex]

But hey you guys had that one week in season 1

So bliz doesn’t wanna make you too powerful

Even if it was a bug

That made you powerful

[warm vortex]

Same w my char (sorta)
But hey, I enjoy BM more atm and I think I’m doing better on it to

[iron vapor]

Been playing rogue since 2004, not changing now.

[warm vortex]

Also it’s funny gapping people as a brain dead class on meters

[subtle tundra]

thats assa

[prisma coral]

I look forward to the day when all 15 rogue players are in solidarity against nonsense in all 3 specs

[warm vortex]

Bro has been a rogue longer than I’ve been alive

[warm vortex]

True

[iron vapor]

.... Fuck you.

[red schooner]

[warm vortex]

Also how are things going Varas

You still doing mythic reclears

[red schooner]

I'm 32 I ain't old it's FINE

[prisma coral]

40 i made my rogue during molten core out of hate for my raid leader

[warm vortex]

Pfft
I sometimes have a group I play with and they are in this old person guild

Some of them have children older than me

Is funny

[iron vapor]

Wait til that 3 is a 4 and you're having to worry about controlling your ear hair.

[prisma coral]

my fingers hurt from tab targeting

[red schooner]

Terrifying

[subtle tundra]

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm good question

[warm vortex]

Also

[subtle tundra]

though im a detriment to the raid

[warm vortex]

I might play rogue next tier now I think about it

[iron vapor]

No one warms you... But I have, I'm warning you now that earlier hair is a thing that happens when you hit 40.

[warm vortex]

Because the tier set this season for BM

Is like

[subtle tundra]

cause i havent geared my character since we finish clear

[warm vortex]

https://tenor.com/view/cum-gif-20534148

[prisma coral]

dude phillips makes a great ear and nose hair trimmer

heard it hear in the rogue discord first

[warm vortex]

Meh you can buy mythic gear when dinars come out anyway

[subtle tundra]

you say that as if i care

[warm vortex]

I mean
You clearly care more than the people running mythic 18s and higher and shit sweating their nuts off

Hence why bliz allows you to buy gear

And not them

[subtle tundra]

no i dont care?

what

[warm vortex]

Making a joke

[iron vapor]

Surely if you're farming the raid on mythic already then further gear is just for ilvl bragging?

[warm vortex]

Because I fucking hate how dinars are implemented

[iron vapor]

Like, I get that ultimately that's kinda the point of the game ... But still

[warm vortex]

It’s bad luck protection
But only for mythic raiders

[iron vapor]

Dinar implementation is shit, but it's realistically free gear for everyone - just it's better for some people than others

[warm vortex]

Tbh on my hunter it’s free transmog

Even though I’m progging myth

Or ig an eye of kezan

[red schooner]

I mean you can't say you have bad luck for mythic loot without first doing mythic raids. So yeah, it's just bad luck protection

[warm vortex]

But that’s mostly it

[red schooner]

It's like me saying I've got bad luck with the lottery despite having never bought a ticket

That ain't bad luck

[prisma coral]

Across all the mythic tiers, thinking about gear, missing a key item becuase we locked out is what bugged me the most and dinar could help with that.

[midnight mist]

its bad luck protection for the contetn you do?

[prisma coral]

however, a item or 2 on me never was what made the difference

[warm vortex]

Tbh it’s a bigger problem doing it this season considering :

raid trinkets are so much better than mythic + ones this season

And the good mythic gear p much only comes from the last bosses

[midnight mist]

its also bad luck protection if you never gotten your item on hc gally lol

[warm vortex]

True true

But people expected it on mythic

[midnight mist]

thats mostly every season

[rain coral]

guys, with the new cartel chips, what they mean there will be a option for ppl who do normal to get 672 item

[warm vortex]

But I feel like the dungeon trinkets are much worse this season

[midnight mist]

Which would have been kinda dumb right

Now it's actually bad luck protection

[prisma coral]

for example slappy hands from ra'dan was an insane item that was doing a disgusting amount of your damage. not getting that to drop was heart breaking

[red schooner]

I like the idea in concept but yeah the communication on blizzards part was lacking a bit

[warm vortex]

I mean debatable

[midnight mist]

It's a good implementation of dinars that can stay forever

[red schooner]

Still, bad luck protection, good

[midnight mist]

Why would non raider suddenly get raid items tho

I'm confused

That has never happened ever

[grim jay]

Which is good. Mythic gear should never be free af

[midnight mist]

Outside of meme seasons

[warm vortex]

Weekly rewards

[midnight mist]

Wdym

[rain coral]

yeah but how you gonna get a 672 item, when you do only normal with the chip

[red schooner]

Like the time walking weeklies

[stable pasture]

We've only had dinars in meme seasons? maybe all seasons are meme now

[red schooner]

Can get raid gear I guess

[warm vortex]

Ik it’s barely anything

But technically

[midnight mist]

well its hc

[warm vortex]

Raider gear for non raiders

Yea

[midnight mist]

ye sure i mean

its still hc anywya

[warm vortex]

Yea
But I do get what you mean

[grim jay]

Nah they are actually a really good system for bad luck protection like that

Its not a meme season if you dont get stuff for free

[rain coral]

no but its a hc gear i guess, but if you do hc or only first bosses of mythic, dont you get better item?

[midnight mist]

ye s4 seasons

[stable pasture]

dont you get normal/hc gear for free?

[midnight mist]

for now

[stable pasture]

even without clearing hc

with this season dinars

[prisma coral]

I feel like for the vast majority of people gear isnt what is getting in the way of their goal. It's an easy fixation though

[rain coral]

you have to trade 3 chips for 1 item

[warm vortex]

But I feel like if they said it at the start
“Dinars will only award mythic gear if you have killed the boss in mythic”

It would be badly received yes but it wouldn’t be as bad as them telling us this late

[grim jay]

But who cares for normal and heroic

[stable pasture]

I mean

that's a bit meme tbh

lfr andys can get hc

[grim jay]

No its not really endgame gear

[stable pasture]

but hc andys that just push keys

cant get myth

k then

[warm vortex]

Also, it’s kinda unfair raid gets back luck protection but mythic + doesn’t

[red schooner]

Just don't have aspirations that's my plan. I get dragged along to raid, I stab bosses, I leave raid when raid is done. Life is simple

[rain coral]

but if you do normal, you can get a 672 item, but does this apply for hc too, that you do a hc raid and can get a mythic gear

[grim jay]

Everyone can get normal and heroic done with barely any effort.

[stable pasture]

cap

[rose ore]

Hey guys, have just picked up assassination as an alt and playing it in M+ - does anyone have any tips for tracking bleeds, kinda gets hard on packs of more than 5 mobs

[stable pasture]

go look at stats

[rain coral]

yes i get it

[stable pasture]

of guilds stuck on hc

[rain coral]

but not everybody gonna get the jastordiamant

in myhtic

how to get that one?

except killing gallywix

[grim jay]

Most put in less than barely any effort. Many even no effort at all because they just wanna have a good time

[warm vortex]

Tbh the common issue people have with mythic isn’t the difficulty, it’s the 20 man requirement

At least from what I’ve heard

[grim jay]

Buy a boost

[grim jay]

Thats part of it yes

[rain coral]

no its also the comp, you need to know and also have the comp

iam not boosting

[warm vortex]

Which also relates to getting 20 people

[rain coral]

and i dont think this is the way to go

[blazing pumice]

my name plates change colour depending what bleeds are on them

[dusty phoenix]

so I'm trying to restructure my gear to go from sub to assa for myth mugzee but for whatever reason my assa still sims 100k below my sub, is there anything that stands out to you guys looking at these 2? is there something I'm not seeing
sub https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/wNsAH2NtrKHJbSykPGmczC
assa https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/gjc5rBUo1J6agdhbPU3mWW

[rose ore]

I'm a 3200 m+ player who could probably get CE, but real life gets in the way and I just don't have the time to commit 3x3hrs a week on raid - that's the issue most people face I'd imagine

[scarlet sequoia]

then u wont get the items

simple

dunno how its even an argument

[warm vortex]

Yea
Tbh it’s the same with pushing keys
Ik I can get super high but it’s finding a group that’s the hard part

[grim jay]

Ye its like

You only wont get the items if you wouldnt get them anyways

But you will if you earned them

[prisma coral]

people should want to challenge themselves and make connections with people at a similar skill level in an mmo. If you are raiding mythic for a single item off the last boss you are fucking weird

[grim jay]

[scarlet sequoia]

its just bad luck protection really

[warm vortex]

Yea

[balmy condor]

@silk galleon haste does not outweigh crit/mast, it's simply better than it would be normally. players are not stacking vers at any key level currently

sim yourself

[warm vortex]

And that’s fine but just make it so M+ players have it too

[balmy condor]

assa sims lower, be like that

[rose ore]

Yea makes sense, I'm not mad at it - being able to buy a myth track pacemaker would be nice though

[dusty phoenix]

ic ok

[grim jay]

The only issue I personally have with the implementation is that the dinars are shared across difficulties. You should either have two separate for heroic/mythic or be able to upgrade the item from heroic to mythic with the mythic achievement.

[red schooner]

Just have an item you can spend vault coins on that let's you select a myth track m+ item

[scarlet sequoia]

theyve needed to fix myth track m+ items for ages now

[red schooner]

Easy

[scarlet sequoia]

dumb that they havent

[warm vortex]

Silly that they haven’t changed a lot of things

[balmy condor]

I don't get why they don't just add myth track items to like 12+

make it 14 for all I care idk

but everyone is crest capped anyway

[warm vortex]

Because you could be finished with gearing in like 2 days

[balmy condor]

what does the track even fucking matter

[balmy condor]

that's just simply not true

[scarlet sequoia]

or just make the first x amount of dungeons every week drop myth track

[balmy condor]

you're stuck on crest waiting game

[scarlet sequoia]

u should not be able to farm myth track items

[balmy condor]

for months

I mean in my world, there simply are no "tracks"

[warm vortex]

Depends on what level the gear drops is

Aka how far upgraded it is

[rain coral]

what you mean? how does that work?

[balmy condor]

if we're timegated on crests, what's the fucking point of tracks

[warm vortex]

To race on

[prisma coral]

i feel like its a blizz thing on trying to create incentive for raids outside of you know them being inherintly fun

[warm vortex]

Vroom

[red schooner]

My idea is to have an item from the vault coin vendor. 12 coins, purchase a m+ dinar that lets you get a piece of myth track m+ loot

Dunno there's probably some major flaw here

[rain coral]

how can you get as a M+ player a jastordiamont (Myhtic) with the dinar ?

[warm vortex]

You have to have meaningful rewards for raiding other than enjoyment

Remember BRD

No mast gear, no myth gear

[lavish wing]

buy a boost

[rain coral]

omg

[balmy condor]

you buy a mythic gally boost and then buy it

[red schooner]

Because the discussion went to mythic plus bad luck protection instead of just dinar

[warm vortex]

It’s called “turbo boost” for a reason

[rain coral]

yeah but they cost like 45kk gold#

[warm vortex]

Tough luck

[balmy condor]

yep

start farming now

:)

[prisma coral]

i get what you are saying and experienced that and it bugged me. I was like, "you guys really dont want to experience it?"

[rain coral]

hehehe

[dusty phoenix]

why should you be getting the absolute best gear from mythic raid without raiding mythic

[rain coral]

well i dont wanna endores boosting

so

[warm vortex]

What’s the point?

[prisma coral]

fun

its a game

[warm vortex]

If you do smth and you get no gain from it people won’t wanna do it

Even if it’s fun

Tbh I’d love to prog it too

[lavish wing]

imho vaults shouldnt be giving items, but valor tokens, the amount depending of how much content u did, and then after like a week or 2 u buy an item u want from the vendor

[grim jay]

How would you as an m+ player get the jastor on mythic without the dinars?

[warm vortex]

But it’s the simple fact that most players won’t do content if it doesn’t give rewards

[warm vortex]

Ask gally nicely

Maybe he could do like a mr beast challenge or smth

[dusty phoenix]

remember season 2 df when everyone was fully geared 3 weeks into the patch

[prisma coral]

I have spent 100s of hours slapping my dick against a mythic boss i was good on like 100 pulls ago and never did that for the gear. It was becuase I love overcoming stuff with this group of people

[warm vortex]

Yep
It fucking sucked

[prisma coral]

maybe i am just weird

[warm vortex]

God I wish I was the mythic boss

I mean huh

[prisma coral]

hahaha

[warm vortex]

Tbh I do enjoy it

But

If it’s like a couple few people messing up the same thing over and over

[grim jay]

Imo its just dented to cry about how you cant get an item because you need to kill the boss to buy it while you wouldnt get it in the first place without killing the boss

[warm vortex]

It becomes less fun

[warm vortex]

I think people are more upset as that’s what they were expecting

[balmy condor]

enjoying a game you play is super weird you fucking freak why don't you bitch and hate on the game like the rest of us miserable slobs

[warm vortex]

Whispyr secretly loves wow

[balmy condor]

games are not meant to be enjoyed

[warm vortex]

Constantly rock hard 24/7

[grim jay]

Ye they are upset because they want shit to get shoved up their chocolate starfishs

[prisma coral]

wow was my ex girlfriend I made all my friends hear me bitch about then we got back together

[balmy condor]

they're meant to give you an internet number to attach your worth to

[grim jay]

Without doing anything

[balmy condor]

like io score

and guild rank

[scarlet sequoia]

classic m+ players

[balmy condor]

and ilvl

[drifting cloud]

whispyr pulls out his internet cable on bandit and then says its a comcast issue

[balmy condor]

real

[warm vortex]

Actually true

Whispyr last night

Jkjk love you

[red schooner]

[balmy condor]

that is a real theater of pain

[warm vortex]

“At long last a worthy contender!”

[prisma coral]

side tangent. The last boss of ToP is the best boss this season right?

[warm vortex]

Tbh I do like how quotable the dungeons are this season

You could probably make a book about all the mead lines

[warm vortex]

Personally I like it but sometimes people find the mechanics a bit visually overwhelming
Or at least some of the people I play with

Also there are some bugs

But as a BM it’s chill
(Implying every fight isn’t chill as a BM)

[prisma coral]

I think thats whats wild about it, its intentionally design to be like that

3 card monte of bosses

[warm vortex]

But ye she is cool

To bad the dungeon kinda stinky

[prisma coral]

boss 1 is a trash pack, wall of hooks is like 2 minutes too long

[warm vortex]

Hook boss and PvP boss is annoying
Or well
PvP boss used to be annoying buts that’s a 100% bm take

[warm vortex]

Animal companion would be stuck in the bottom arena if I got pulled down

I think they fixed it so the fight is fine now

[red schooner]

PvP boss was fun when we could demise our allies

I had fun with that

[royal lantern]

mythic raids are so fucking bad for gear if you are not in the first half of HoF guilds, you literally only do it for fun (or because you are a wannabe m+ pusher that thinks 0,6% stronger trinkets will make the big difference in their +16keys)

[warm vortex]

If anyone ever stuns me I disengage, frost trap and type out a paragraph to explain how rude they are

[warm vortex]

Also hi tyran hope your doing good

[red schooner]

If a guildies chats shit I just throw out a blind immediately

No hesitation

[royal lantern]

its called "PvP Boss" and kidney shot is part of PvP

sorry mate, i dont make the rules

[warm vortex]

Yea but so is doxxing

And I don’t think leaking someone’s IP / home address mid boss is a good shout

“Haha thanks for the damage buff”

“53.185.87.213”

[grim jay]

BUT WHY CANT I GET STUFF I WOULDNT GET ANYWAYS, LIFE SO UNFAIR

[prisma coral]

exactly

[warm vortex]

David
It’s because people were under the assumption that would happen (no matter how silly that sounds)

If they said that at the start

I would be a bit eh but I’d be fine

Kinda like how they said we were getting corruptions back and made them like
Poopy

[prisma coral]

ehhhhhh corruption

be careful what you wish for

[grim jay]

Honestly you are kinda lost if you expect anything, especially like that in the second season. Being pissed about it, no matter what you expected, is kinda stupid either way

If its nonsense.

You as in people

Not you personally

[warm vortex]

That’s understandable, but people were taking and planning

[grim jay]

I love you

[warm vortex]

Yeye

Aww cheers

You too davyn :D

[grim jay]

Also people can just be like

[warm vortex]

Tbh the whole dinar situation is a bit of a mess

[grim jay]

Not poor I guess?

Just buy that mythic kill

For a few tokens

Smh my head

[warm vortex]

lol true

[grim jay]

It kinda turned into one, I do like it tho

[subtle tundra]

dm me now for a discount!

[warm vortex]

Yea

[warm vortex]

Gonna dm you the dogs

[subtle tundra]

gally mount, INCLUDED!

[red schooner]

Why pay for a boost when you can just join a prog guild for free

[subtle tundra]

that includes playing the game

who wants that

[warm vortex]

Yea and tbh
When you really get down to the numbers

Getting a heroic jasgot instead of a mythic one isn’t like

A gargantuan difference

Sure it would be better to have the mythic one but I think most people just say it feels worse to have a heroic one instead of a mythic

(However I’d need to sim personally to see how big a dif between mythic and heroic is)

[subtle tundra]

go ahead

sim it

[warm vortex]

Can’t

At uni

Or I mean I can

But cba

[subtle tundra]

stay bad

[red schooner]

Imagine not having your simc permanently loaded into your clipboard

Ready to SIM at any moment

[warm vortex]

On a different computer all together

[red schooner]

Excuses

[warm vortex]

Also thinking of taking my orphan to raid tonight

[grim jay]

8/8 mythic is only 2.7k

Seems decent

[royal lantern]

im down bad for you

[prisma coral]

I get it from a sellers perspective but 1) i really don't get the buyers and 2) this shit is gonna cost a fucking mint

[warm vortex]

$2,700?

[iron vapor]

I don't understand the argument of "how as a M+ player do I get the BIS raid items, this is not fair"

[grim jay]

Euro

[subtle tundra]

special price, 2.5k JUST FOR YOU. TONIGHT, READY.

[red schooner]

[warm vortex]

As said I think it’s moreso just how much stronger the raid trinkets are than the mythic + ones this season

[midnight mist]

No but the argument for m+ er should be that they shouldn't need to raid to push m+

Which I think is valid

It's just not how the game works rn

[prisma coral]

agreed

[warm vortex]

Bro I’d rather buy like
€2,700 of cat food
And I don’t even have a cat

[iron vapor]

I shouldn't have to do M+ to raid, but I kinda do still have to do M+

[royal lantern]

there is a truth to it that blizz should adress stuff in some way

but like, its never a reasonable discussions, its always WHY CANT I GET FULL MYTHIC BY DOING A SINGLE +13 HELLO????????? AND WHY IS THIS ITEM GOOD FOR ME BUT NOT FROM DUNGEONS????????

[midnight mist]

I do think it's silly that you kinda need gear for m+ when you don't get the gear from m+

[grim jay]

Everything comes full circle to

Just dont be poor

[warm vortex]

Just make us do PvP for gear again

[grim jay]

[warm vortex]

[royal lantern]

and you also spend 80% of raid gearing in m+ and for 95% of mythic raiders m+ and its vault is the main source of mythic gear aswell

[grim jay]

You dont need it

Its just better

[prisma coral]

"we want people to play the game often to interact with the store and continue to value their sub, while needing people to raid so that those people continue to renew their sub"

[midnight mist]

ye idk thats a cap

[iron vapor]

Don't get me wrong, I don't think the way M+ gearing works is effective right now... But complaining that you can't get the gear from the last boss of the raid without doing the last boss is just dumb

[royal lantern]

and yeha, make us pvp for gear again

go down the hater way

[royal lantern]

normal language please

[grim jay]

Cap

[iron vapor]

That would be like me complaining that I never got access to the pacemaker and then saying I never did a floodgate

[prisma coral]

gearing seriously has never been better

does anyone remember BFA?

[iron vapor]

Well obviously, you have to do the content to get the things that come from that content.

[midnight mist]

Doing m+ for gear for raid is only really important the first few weeks, you get all your bis from raid anyway, and in the end doing 8 10s is way less of a time commitment than raiding hall of fame

You know

[royal lantern]

just drop a m+ trinket from your weekly chest (aka 1 random item) :3

[royal lantern]

huh? i think we mean different stuff right now

[iron vapor]

I dunno, 8 10+ a week is realistically about 5 hours (with all the getting the group together etc)

[grim jay]

There are people in the hall of fame that raid 2 days a week iirc

Thats kinda close to 8 dungeons

As far as time investment purely for raiding goes

[prisma coral]

it's a dying breed and i think that's dope

[iron vapor]

We clear heroic undermine in under an hour and then prog mythic for 4 hours a week

Raiding is low time investment once it's on farm

[warm vortex]

I mean doesn’t blizzard balance things around raid first, M+ second and PvP not at all

[iron vapor]

Yeah of course, the raid is what gets all the coverage in the race to first

[grim jay]

Yeah those people are really good

[iron vapor]

No one gives much of a shit who clears the first +18

[warm vortex]

Unless it’s me

[prisma coral]

like being ready and not wasting time between pulls and having guild leadership that functions and is ready is so undervalued by most but you have to have that on a 2 night guild

[warm vortex]

Because if I clear the first 18 Imma cream

[iron vapor]

Well yeah, the person who does it has their own internal bragging rights, but no one else will care

Not really anyway

[royal lantern]

blizzard does whatever they want

[warm vortex]

Like
Buff mage

[iron vapor]

The implication that there's any 'balance' is laughable anyway

[royal lantern]

sometimes they kill stuff cus its OP in raid, soemtimes cus its OP in m+, Sometimes they just ignore it

[warm vortex]

Tbh it’s better than hearthstone where they just make Druid the favourite child

[grim jay]

Well most top end keys are just done by people that have insane amounts of time at their hand to just brick keys over and over until smth works

[devout jasper]

did they change the mythic rik amplification stuff about evasion?

[warm vortex]

Isn’t it relatively balanced atm

Like compared to other seasons

M+ wise I mean

[midnight mist]

you dont think its more time commitment to raid lol?

[viscid spear]

[iron vapor]

Well I don't commit much more time than that and I do raid... So it's not so much 'think'

[midnight mist]

Ye and they prep a lot out of raid

[iron vapor]

It's my actual lived experience

[midnight mist]

The time commitment for raiding is massive compared to filling your vault idk lol

Especially if you want mythic gear

[royal lantern]

how high do you play and do you do any out of raid stuff

[grim jay]

The 20 people that arent raidleading are dryhumping in dornogal for practice?

[midnight mist]

Like ye you can also just clear 2 bosses a week in raid

[royal lantern]

like, any decent mythic raidteam has a shitton of preperation each week needed

[midnight mist]

And that won't take time

[warm vortex]

Hello am dornogal

[midnight mist]

Is it what we are talking about tho

[prisma coral]

like i have lots of time and I love that M+ allows me to runs tons of M+ to make up for good people in my group who cant so our prog is just a bit better

[midnight mist]

if you think you can raid 2 days a week and get hallf of fame without even preparing a little bit lol

[warm vortex]

Can’t imagine pugging M+ to super high levels

[bronze plover]

hi did they change evasion on rik reverb because it stoned me

[iron vapor]

Mythic progress for the last 2 resets, 2/8, I play loads outside of raid - but I don't have to.

[midnight mist]

2/8

[viscid spear]

I'm good with 10s. I guess 3K rating would be nice but eh

[prisma coral]

I also really like wow

[midnight mist]

I don't think this was really a conversation about that

[warm vortex]

Bro I’m 2/8 and I’m more casual than socks and sandals

[iron vapor]

In 8 hours of progress with a bunch of casuals we're ok

[warm vortex]

Pugged up to 15

[grim jay]

Idk I dont raid Hof, especially not with 2 days. I just fail to see the insane amount of time investment thats required by every single random Andy in the team. Its mostly the rl investing way more time than anyone else in my head

[red schooner]

I'm gonna go for 3k when in maxed out gear so I can just mindlessly blast through it

[royal lantern]

its allready hard to do 2day and get above 1k in WR

getting HoF with 2days is like, insane hours on those 2days and a SHITTON of preprration/practice outside of those raiddays, and 20 giga cracked raiders that learn and improve fast as hell

[warm vortex]

So far

Just raid 5 days a week

[iron vapor]

What I'm saying is that 8 10s a week can be more time intensive than raiding

[warm vortex]

I don’t see the problem

[midnight mist]

well you are wrong then

If you raid 2 days and get hall of fame

[warm vortex]

It can be yes
But like 99 times out of 100 it isn’t

[royal lantern]

if you do 2days, you cant have "random andys" allready at lower ranks

if its HoF, its legit all insane players

[midnight mist]

Your raiders aren't clueless when they come into raid lol

[iron vapor]

You can obviously choose to join a guild that raids 5 hours a night 7 nights a week

[midnight mist]

They prep their fight

Their defs

Their offensives cds

Know everything about the fights

[grim jay]

Just random Andys as in they dont take part in planning the tactics etc

[warm vortex]

Those probably barely exist unless you find 20 people without a job or smth

[midnight mist]

They will have meetings to prep each fight

[scarlet sequoia]

ok mby not quite that much zac

[midnight mist]

You don't get Hof 2 days by jerking off and login in at 20h30

[scarlet sequoia]

hof is top 200

[midnight mist]

Nvm I forgot about that

Well

[scarlet sequoia]

doing that w 2 days is easy if u have ppl taht arent completely lost

[midnight mist]

Still

[royal lantern]

you realise that doing 8x a +10for vault and crests is part of raid preperation right

[scarlet sequoia]

i did almost none of that when i raided in group therapy

[midnight mist]

I forgot Hof wasn't toop 100 anymore

[scarlet sequoia]

and we got top 100

[grim jay]

Whats wrong with logging in at 2030

[midnight mist]

Nothing

[iron vapor]

Yes, I do it every week

[prisma coral]

like every minute you waste releasing is wasting 19 other minutes when you have limited time together, i dont mean to make it sound oppressive i love raiding its just really cool to me the respect and care there

[grim jay]

Dont hate on the night time raiders

[iron vapor]

But I don't think that bashing keys should entitle me to loot from the last boss of mythic - which is my point

[scarlet sequoia]

ye u can get m+ loot

from doing m+

[grim jay]

Which is a great point

[scarlet sequoia]

enjoy

[midnight mist]

I really don't think most guilds can get top 100 without having people pepped but ok

[scarlet sequoia]

ofc not

[midnight mist]

Anywya

All I was saying is

If you want gear from m+

You just login and jerk off over your keyboard in 10s

Every week

[drifting cloud]

bro waasnt half of group therapy top20 raiders on alts lol

[scarlet sequoia]

nah

[midnight mist]

The equivalent for raid is not even nearly the same

So I understand why m+ ers only feel like they are getting ripped off when they are forced to raid

[iron vapor]

The core complaint of the new Dinar system just seems to be that people can't get the mythic track items without killing the mythic boss - which is pants on head backwards

[iron vapor]

They're not forced to raid at all.

[midnight mist]

ok

[iron vapor]

If you want the items from the raid you have to do the raid

[midnight mist]

im trying to talk with people that understand whats happening here

[grim jay]

They really arent tho. Like I doubt having 2 effect items on a higher ilvl will make or break any key.
Tho imo raid items should have a dungeon version and vv

[prisma coral]

the expectation that you should be able to do content with limited to no communication or coordination and succeed is a multiplayer game is wild

[midnight mist]

You get way more gear and way better gear from raid

[iron vapor]

Yes, you do.

[royal lantern]

he means the average reddit/forum "m+ only player" that complains about "being forced into raids" when they never did keys above +12 in their entire life and will never go higher, and that they dont need full mythic bis in all slots

atleast how i understand it

[iron vapor]

Because it's a bigger investment collectively in effort than doing M+ as a 5 person group

[midnight mist]

Also the argument of "it won't break the key is moot", people time r1 keys with outlaw, doesn't mean it's not just harder for no reason

[grim jay]

In like the first few weeks of clearing quite a few bosses maybe

Which is kinda irrelevant for title

[midnight mist]

If you are trying to push keys

And you aren't raiding

[iron vapor]

If you want the thing, do the thing that gets you the thing.

[midnight mist]

You legit are trolling

Nowadays

Idk how that's even a take

[scarlet sequoia]

at the end of the day its an mmo and u should work for stuff

[prisma coral]

as an aside I have been doing 7s on an rat alt this week, if you want hard play against a dungeon and 4 other people shit is harder than 12+

[grim jay]

You also are trolling if you are raiding and dont do m+. that still doesnt change anything tho

[iron vapor]

Hard facts.

[bronze plover]

evasion doesnt works on rik reverb stone anymore /cry

[iron vapor]

Ok so the counter to this is that in S1 I didn't do M+ at all - but I wanted the sackbrood trinket. I couldn't get it because I didn't do the content.

[viscid spear]

[iron vapor]

The only difference is that clearing mythic raid is a shit load harder than clearing 10s

[grim jay]

If you are even remotely close to title time, you will have close to the same ilvl no matter if you only do mythic raid or m+. The 2 effect items you potentially have in heroic instead of mythic as an m+er wont change shit rn, items are weak af

[scarlet sequoia]

ye so why should ppl who dont do it get the items from it

make it make sense

[viscid spear]

Yeah but Sac was whack for almost everyone.

Whack as in good

[prisma coral]

say they did just make nothing unique and everything immediately available. Do you think anyone would be happy?

[scarlet sequoia]

yes some ppl would be

[prisma coral]

for how long

[scarlet sequoia]

fk knows

[iron vapor]

Yeah, so do the content and get the item!

[iron vapor]

This is exactly it! Take away the challenge and the things have no meaning

[prisma coral]

i think thats an actual question blizzard thinks about

[viscid spear]

But why didn't you?

[iron vapor]

Bad player.

[prisma coral]

tier wasnt available through M+

glad it is but it wasnt

[viscid spear]

[prisma coral]

bliz wants people to raid but knows it has to have a carrot on a stick

[iron vapor]

It's the 100% honest answer - I was playing bad and a liability in keys so I couldn't get into them

[midnight mist]

the difference is that m+ is barely any time/skill requirement? doing a few 10s a week lol

[grim jay]

Heroic takes no time either, which leads to the other point

[warm vortex]

Bliz should make all gear require a mission table grind

[amber brook]

Evasion is bugged on rik feels bad

[royal lantern]

eeeeeeeehhhh, its a slippery slope because thats HEAVY dictated by your guilds progress speed

the average mythic raid guild doesnt really get much gear from raiding itself

like, i do Mythic Raiding for a long time now, and since SL i getnCE everytime with 2-3 raid items equiped MAX, the rest is all m+ vault stuff

we recleared this raid 5x on mxthic and saved prog last week, and i have 2 raid items Equiped lol, 1 shoulder and a dagger

[subtle tundra]

the random raider(me) doesnt do a lot of prep.
all the healers do a lot of prep, especially the healer officer who does all the cds and looks at many logs and comps and such
the tanks have to do a lot of prep for every boss because its so important to have boss positions 100% correct from the first pull on all hard bosses
every raider has to know how every mechanic works before going in the raid for a boss(mostly)

[midnight mist]

Idk maybe it's just me I like prepping my stuffs

Wrong answer guy anyway

[prisma coral]

i think there is far too much value put on often tiny incremental stat increases by the community rather than wanting to be truthful about if they are having fun or not in their addiction

[midnight mist]

Idk why I'm talking with assa players

[subtle tundra]

my raid leader gives everyone homework before we start prog or even during

and its a lot of homework

[midnight mist]

So you prep stuffs ?

[subtle tundra]

like 20 questions for a boss

[midnight mist]

I'm confused

You just said you didn't

[subtle tundra]

i said a lot of prep

i cant go in a raid boss with no prep

i do bare minimum

[midnight mist]

how much time

say a number

[subtle tundra]

which is knowing mechanics

1 hr?

[midnight mist]

per boss?

[subtle tundra]

yes

[iron vapor]

Likewise, bare minimum. Watch a couple of videos on mechanics, have a think about when I'm gonna blast my cooldowns

[midnight mist]

ye i think thats like bare minimum indeed

[iron vapor]

Everything else can be learned during the many wipes

[midnight mist]

But I'm slow

So

[subtle tundra]

i dont look at every timing, every defensive, every cd press

[midnight mist]

I also don't think I even prep enough

I would like to do more

[subtle tundra]

thats part of the prog i like, figuring that out

[midnight mist]

Sure but you also lose time

When it's not figured out at least a little bit before

[iron vapor]

You also can do all the prep in the world but there's no substitute for actually doing it

Depending on your learning style anyway

Some people can do all the reading in the world and then execute a task perfectly - most cannot

[viscid spear]

Half my raid team does

[subtle tundra]

not really? cause there's other stuff we have to learn during prog
its not like when we wipe to some healer stuff or some mechanic we did wrong i dont understand my button presses

[subtle tundra]

lets not compare raid teams

[prisma coral]

i think the original convo was about HoF 2 night guilds while all your point might be true not really the same thing

[iron vapor]

Yeah, comparing teams is a slippery slope - unless you're in a genuine RTWF guild which always pushes for 100% best comp there will be weaknesses in your team

[viscid spear]

Oh we're terrible. We wiped on Bandit last night too many times and the RL decided we should just do our "End of Tier Achievement Run".

[subtle tundra]

i am a morale buff, when i meow and stuff

[midnight mist]

You play feral?

[iron vapor]

My guild for example is about 25 people who prog mythic - we rarely have many options for raid comp - just roll with what we have

[subtle tundra]

i cosplay as one

[midnight mist]

Nice

[iron vapor]

It's slower, obviously.

[subtle tundra]

well part of pushing world rank is progressively adding things to make the guild better
adding mandatory alts, deciding with the team what the alts are so you have more options for the comp

[iron vapor]

Exactly, it's the next level of commitment, the total football of WoW

[modest apex]

They really changed rik so we cant evasion the amplifier that drops on him??

[iron vapor]

Most guilds aren't there, never will be

[subtle tundra]

we did badly on this this tier, we didnt have a 2nd warlock at all for mugzee so we had to emergency gear one
we didnt have a boomy for stix, our healer went boomy
we didnt have a spriest for one armed bandit, another healer had to swap

[prisma coral]

and that's totally fine we all play the game differently, comparison is the death of joy. overcoming things with people a little big above and a little bit below where you are pushes you and makes the game fun

[midnight mist]

Thoughts on having 0 ww this tier

[subtle tundra]

our comp would've been significantly worse if i wasnt ww

[iron vapor]

This guy gets it.

[subtle tundra]

especially mugzee

[midnight mist]

Ye

It's fine

Our comp was just significantly worse

[iron vapor]

It's the journey that matters, not the destination.

[subtle tundra]

we wouldve had someone alt it btw, just like we did for a warlock

[subtle tundra]

and your pull count shows

[midnight mist]

Well

Idk if that's the comp entirely

Kekw

[subtle tundra]

well it isnt

but its part of it

[midnight mist]

Maybe

Small part

[iron vapor]

Optimal comp won't make up for someone being dogshit

[subtle tundra]

10 pulls is enough to warrant getting it

[midnight mist]

I think we were just bad on mugzee

[subtle tundra]

we had 100 wipes on mugzee(though we did fucking smurf on him)

[midnight mist]

We played well on bandit I thought tho so there is that

[subtle tundra]

dont remind me of bandit

also 100 pulls...

[prisma coral]

thats why you should always try to play with people a little bit better than you or a just a little bit worse competition is good, having distain for people you play a game with 8-10+ hours a week isnt

[subtle tundra]

same as mugzee