assassination

[midnight mist]

how do you know which is whcih as a melee

[hearty seal]

uhhh
I don't see how it works for range but doesn't for melee

[buoyant herald]

does playing fatebound for ST feel any different? vibe check?

[midnight mist]

well you have to face + be in range of the guys

ranges dont care about that

[runic hinge]

It feels like shit when you don’t capstone in opener

[buoyant herald]

true

[runic hinge]

Other than that it feels pretty nice to not force to 7

Extra combo point from deal fate kinda good too

No Fok in ST either

Honestly pretty comfy if not for the shitty parts

[buoyant herald]

i'll try for a few pulls on monday, its simming 3% better for me which seems enough to be worth if there's not really any annoyances

[hearty seal]

yeah but what does it have to do with a list of enemies in combat
the help would be in finding the important ones/guys with your debuffs on them more easily

[midnight mist]

ok but you still wanna press these ennemies in the grid

to target them or whatever

and then you have no idea where they are

as a mlee

how does it work in ff14 tho cause i do not know

i just dont really get how that would work for melees

[hearty seal]

ngl I don't particularly care where they are 99% of the time, because they're all bunched up in a pack

it looks like this in FFXIV

[coral ibex]

enemy list would go hard af

[midnight mist]

i mean

idk

[hearty seal]

like this thingy is under your party list, listing all the enemies in combat with you

[coral ibex]

i use it all the time in ff14

[midnight mist]

i mean its cool

but it would still be weird for melees

you select a guy and turns out he is behind you

or not in range

with plates (i hate the plate system but) at least you know where they are mostly

[hearty seal]

maybe? IDK, you'd get the same issues by clicking on nameplates

[midnight mist]

as long as there isnt 20 plates

[coral ibex]

you could just alter the display for something not in range

[midnight mist]

well nameplates are aboves npcs at least

[coral ibex]

its entirely possible to click the nameplate of a guy behind you

[hearty seal]

well that's the worst time for you to be looking for a single specific mob

[coral ibex]

[midnight mist]

for packs of 20s its hard but

[runic hinge]

I played it on our stix kill this week (heroic) and I did 300k less damage and didn’t hit capstone until my 4 min dm and boss died at 4:30

[midnight mist]

for more simple packs you know where the mob with the plate is

cause you see it actively above its head

[midnight mist]

sure but at this point its mostly skill issue, unelss again there is 20 mobs then nameplates dont really work anymore anyway

[hearty seal]

maybe I don't have enough practice with that yet, but sometimes I really don't because there's like 10 plates all in a small location on the screen

I do have to note that I'm playing on a 15 inch screen so a lot of UI is pretty cramped

[coral ibex]

i think this "but what if ur not in range" thing is just made up

the whole point is that in a massive stack of nameplates

finding one guy is annoying

the enemy list would simplify that

[hearty seal]

ya

[royal lantern]

you KINDA dont mention that ff14 also has 0 aoe/multitarget fights (outside of trivial dungeon trash that you kill by pressing the 1-2-3 aoe buttons on repeat as every class), no real aoe gameplay in general, and no debuff/dot gameplay

[coral ibex]

that's not really true

[royal lantern]

so like, the enemy list exist, and is also giga pointless there, i legit never used it lol

[coral ibex]

or the report of a turbo casual

[hearty seal]

not anymore, but it used to have all these things back in HW

also apparently the new savage tier has AoE phases

[coral ibex]

there are multi target fights in high end raiding going back many expansions

if you only ever do normal raids then yea that's true

but that's basically story mode

[hearty seal]

I used to use it a lot as a tank back in HW/StB when even regular dungeon big pulls were actually threatening and you had to kick some things and keep aggro up
there days you keep aggro automatically and I'm not sure I've seen a single EW dungeon where you actually need to kick anything, but it's not like it's been like this since day 1

[wet roost]

in M+, feels like sub dmg doesnt scale well with higher key lvls. Have done everything on 14s but feels like i hit a wall

[hearty seal]

I'd probably be fine if you could just make plater plates form a straight column above the pack rather than each plate floating over an enemy and fighting other plates for space
I tinkered with Plater a bit in an attempt to make it do that, but couldn't achieve it

[runic hinge]

Ahhh ye. Assa aoe kinda bonkers and always on. In raid tho it is also a burst class.

[coral ibex]

that'd be a good compromise

[iron vapor]

Agree, or if we could have it so the deathstalkers mark target is always on top, that would help.

That actually probably can be done.

[jaunty matrix]

considering you can change colors of nameplates based on whether you have aggro or not it should be possible to do the same if there is an effect on the target or not

i imagine

[royal lantern]

if you could, they would probs disable it

blizz doesnt want enemys to turn into stacked hp bars where you just click on the "right one"

we had that as an addon, it got killed for excatly that reason

[hearty seal]

tbh according to my research
they already have

[royal lantern]

yes

[hearty seal]

back in Legion's first patch

[royal lantern]

eh, was more midway during legion

but yes, they did

[coral ibex]

what is their reasoning for that

do they think that click accuracy on nameplate selection matters as a player skill?

[royal lantern]

when warlock/spriest/boomkin gameplay turned into "click raidframes"

[hearty seal]

at least some claim it was because suddenly affliction warlock could so easily multidot a pull, their performance was incredible

[royal lantern]

cus thats what it does with dottting/debuff spreading

[coral ibex]

i mean isn't that literally healer gameplay

thats an awful argument

[royal lantern]

there is a difference bettwen a healer healing some guy up when dmg happens

and a warlock having a mousover corrption macro and hovering over every enemy hp bar as a raidframe

[coral ibex]

i guess? they seem identical in how much easier it makes target selection

[hearty seal]

you see, healers have been doing it since vanilla because healbot was a thing since vanilla
I expect they'd ban it too if it wasn't so old

[jaunty matrix]

they think being able to see a barely visible effect that also crops under the ground sometimes as a player skill

so its not that far fetched

[coral ibex]

if the argument is that healers are just too stupid to learn how to play otherwise

maybe i'd believe you

[royal lantern]

no?

healers use raidframes

cus how else are they supposed to heal

[ebon olive]

Do u spread Bleeds on the tiny Melee add on MUg ?

[coral ibex]

raidframes is just the enemy list from the mob's perspective

[royal lantern]

@coral ibex genuine question

are you trolling rn

or just not thinking stuff trought

cus like, you know how a raid looks with players, right

[coral ibex]

yea how is that different to an m+ pull with 20 mobs

genuinely

[hearty seal]

I remember either vanilla or TBC already having healbot frames with smart heals/dispels on click, rather than just people clicking raid frames to select a target and casting whatever spell manually

[royal lantern]

if healers had no raidframes, they would have to spin their camera around all the time 360 degree to see who lost hp or has dispell debuffs

lol

and even worse with precise stuff

like, 5 guys take dmg, now do that with moving hp bars and click the right guy

[coral ibex]

i'm obviously not saying that healers shouldnt be able to use raid frames

i'm saying there's no reason to allow that and also think an enemy list is OP for dots

[golden loom]

isnt the argument to put mobs into a raidframe system?

[royal lantern]

healbots back then was literally a bot

thats why the name is that

[golden loom]

no?

healbot is just being able to click to heal on raidframes without mouseovers

[royal lantern]

talking abot the OG healbots mate

[golden loom]

so u can bind different heals to left/right click

[royal lantern]

like, back in vanilla

[coral ibex]

https://youtu.be/8iEidQChIog?t=2668

timestamp, me using the enemy list in ff14 current savage tier

[grizzled mist]

how are people liking bleed build in 12+'s? do you folks still prefer Hybrid?

[royal lantern]

where it was "press a button and it did the most effective heal"

[coral ibex]

to select mobs while they bounce around the arena

[hearty seal]

vid unavailable mate

[coral ibex]

oh yea prob no embed

[royal lantern]

like, the OG healbot addon is 1 of the reasons why addons evolved over time into what they are rn where they cant have very direct gameplay impact

[coral ibex]

i listen to hella copyrighted music

[royal lantern]

im calling youtube to execute you tonight

copyrighted music plays in your head

[hearty seal]

nah same on YT proper

[coral ibex]

huh

wtf

[royal lantern]

im pretty sure everyone at this point kinda agrees that Bleed is more or less just better everywhere

[coral ibex]

must be a regional thing

[royal lantern]

outside of like, MAYBE some ToP edge cases you can make

[coral ibex]

it plays in incognito mode for me

[hearty seal]

this has been my experience also, ye

[coral ibex]

i click this

while the gimme cat add is literally bouncing from corner to corner of the arena

[royal lantern]

turns out, the build that is doing more raw mass aoe while having a bit more boss dmg, while not needing a big target that stays alive on each pull

is kinda neat

[hearty seal]

ye I've heard M6S is actually a mess because people kinda forgot how to handle multiple enemies at once (but also because Square kinda messed up in how they can be CCd?)

[coral ibex]

its just a mess bc many players are not used to AOE actually mattering

[thorn thorn]

When will the lies end???

[hearty seal]

better nerf MCH's Scattergun again

[coral ibex]

my static didn't have an issue but we do other high end content where aoe matters

[royal lantern]

buff scholar aswell while you are at it

[coral ibex]

unsurprisingly me and the other dps who also play wow understood exactly how the phase should play and how to prio damage targets

so it was an easy prog

one spec, viper, is doing like 50% more damage than any other spec rn tho because they get an extended ST burst during adds which also has passive cleave

[hearty seal]

good that Square are branching out in their enc design
ShB/EW got way complicated with dances around a single target
(huffing hopium for 8.0 job rework to actually be good and bring some major job diversity back, at least to StB levels)

[coral ibex]

so pugs should just lock at least one slot to that spec

to make it easy

[hearty seal]

oh so like PCT's alignment with FRU
(nerfs incoming for no real reason, trust)

[coral ibex]

exactly

[wise plume]

for bleed build st, should I be trying to stay above 50% energy for sb and only using tea charges w/ cd's?

[trail slate]

I got a question about Deathmark
does it duplicate the bleed damage of the bleeds already applied, or only after itself has been applied?
so will Garrote into Deathmark have it's damage increased, or only Deathmark into Garrote? trying to figure out a PvP opening

[golden loom]

its all dynamic

so any garotte/rupture u have on the target is duplicated during DM, regardless of when its applied

[hollow river]

you want bleeds up before you cast Deathmark so that you're not wasting any of your Deathmark, and reapplying those bleeds if they go into pendemic is fine they will still duplicate

[shell crater]

at what key level does hybrid outdamage bleed?

or is it negligable

[hollow river]

afaik the people running hybrid still are doing like 17-18s

but bleed build has been used up in that key range as well

[shell crater]

gotcha

[lunar pond]

On everything but the mega pulls, it (bleed) seems better. Anecdotally hybrid felt better on the big hero add pulls but I could just be playing poorly on those sections in the bleed build

[muted nebula]

What is the best build for m+ now?

Bleed ?

[earnest robin]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/DtGx4p1avwPkzjcL?fight=13&type=damage-done&source=1

anyone here can tell me if I'm messing up a lot or am I doing fine and just have bad killtimes for my logs? Finding it hard to 95+ log even on heroic atm on assa

Giinsin is me if link is weird

[royal lantern]

kinda, yeha

[earnest robin]

Just play bleed ye

[wind totem]

bad boss positioning. Your caustic only did 4 mil dmg on the adds inside the prisons. Also you fucked up your shiv/kingsbane order at the 1 min mark:
https://i.imgur.com/4rfVatw.png
You also fucked up your shivs on your second DM:
https://i.imgur.com/5e3Q7D7.png

You also fucked it up at the 3 min mark

You basically did exactly one shiv/kingsbane order right. On the pull.

You also haven't done a single rupture on an add for energy.

[glacial relic]

bleed is everything. (+16ML in the pic)

[coral oracle]

anyone have a good assasin guide rotation youtube for single target raid, i was just gonna watch whispyr old videos but was wondering if there was anything for lou maybe

i understand assasin for m+ but st is more confusing

[strange sleet]

it was a thing. Back in the day there was an addon that showed all enemies in X range in a list for you to click. Just like boss frames but for every mob. Blizzard removed it, and it makes sense. In wow you already play the interface way too much, with that kind of functionality you almost don't need to look at the actual field

[ebon olive]

Hey its not a kill but can anyone tell me why my Deathmark is so low and maybe Major FUck upos ?

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/BdYqhAf7n9pwZt62?fight=12&type=damage-done&source=4

[cerulean plank]

anyone know what talent i drop for ironwire (not bleed build)

[wind totem]

How much more do you want it to be?

[buoyant herald]

you're kinda limited to bonespike or master assassin or sanguine blades

and they're all tough drops

[wind totem]

Wrong Embelishments. Terrible trinkets. Myth track weapon in MH not fully upgraded. You have items that aren't upgraded to 658. Runed crests are free. You should have more than enough to get everything up to 658.

What is this shiv even doing there.

Why is there an envenom after shiv?

Random shiv again.

[buoyant herald]

he's talking about hybrid, but the choices are mostly the same yeah

[jaunty sky]

!tea

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

Assassination uses no other macro aside from standard Deathmark+Potion+Racial+Trinket

[oblique jackal]

I just did a +12 priory. Signet dropped and the dude gave it to a guildy without rolling :/

[glacial relic]

yeah, not much choices to be made. best if you just dont try to take it. major loss of dps everywhere

[waxen oyster]

Ideal is you drop bonespike for bleed.

[wind totem]

Nah it's minor for hybrid build.

MA is not that great in the hybrid build so the silence is worth it imo

[waxen oyster]

It just slows down your opener a bit

hybrid drops sb normally

[buoyant herald]

well we've got two different answers immediately here lol

[glacial relic]

playing without spike is madness, fucks up the opener muscle memory xD

[wind totem]

Yeah. I cant imagine playing without spike.

[waxen oyster]

Its not that bad

[wind totem]

Especially in hybrid where you have even less globals to apply aoe bleeds.

[waxen oyster]

If you’ve played before it was a thing

[silver verge]

hey dudes, what settings are we using to sim for m+. Dundeonslice, patchwerk etc?

[wind totem]

I have and I can't believe I have lmao

[buoyant herald]

dslice

[silver verge]

my guy. thanks

[buoyant herald]

eye check would say best to drop SB in hybrid but cbf simming

[waxen oyster]

Dropping sb as hybrid isnt bad

its practically a dead talent in st for that build

[glacial relic]

losing sb, the 5th overall of your damage? I would say its bad

idk I just accepted that Im doing shit single target forever if theres no adds pulled to the boss

[buoyant herald]

thats true no matter which way you slice it

well im gonna sim it because im bored, so brb

[ebon olive]

Sorry what is a good use Of Shiv ?

[waxen oyster]

Its like 3-4% of your damage

also dry shivs are real

but only during lingering

[wind totem]

Shiv>Kingsbane>something rotational>Shiv again when the previous one is over.

You want your kingsbane to have a shiv effect for the whole duration.

You wasted a global by putting that envenom there.

[ebon olive]

Thanks

[wind totem]

You could've just envenomed first and then delayed the cds by a few seconds.

Although personally I just waste a few cp in that kind of situation just envenom after the kingsbane.

[ebon olive]

btw for trinkets, i have a magnet and Pacemaker but he sims me to these ones..

[wind totem]

That was not a lingering shiv and I don't recommend people try that until they've got the fundamentals ironed out.

[buoyant herald]

you really want a decent stat on use to buff your cd windows

[wind totem]

Pacemaker + Signet/House of Cards.

Those are your trinkets.

[buoyant herald]

if you need something ASAP then go farm the agi-on-use pvp trinket

caps at 658 but it's pretty good for ilvl

[earnest robin]

Thanks alot for the reply! So basically fix my shiv usage, donno if it's vicible in logs but adds died within 5-10 seconds so it felt like a waste tho I could be wrong!

So shivs during last 8 seconds on kingsbane and both for DM? Or do I not blow one for big envenoms at all between naked kingsbane?

[waxen oyster]

dry shiv is a minmax

[wind totem]

Your baseline is you do double shiv around your kingsbanes to cover the whole duration. There is a 0.5% minmax shiv

that honestly oyu should ignore for now.

[waxen oyster]

if you have forced downtime you often miss the window

[ebon olive]

The Macro always uses TEa and Shiv togehter right?

[waxen oyster]

that you have dn and lingering with a shiv charge

[wind totem]

How does the sim use vanish for MA?

[glacial relic]

[earnest robin]

So not being perfect with the dry shivs is dps loss I assume then? My understanding was before KB solo window I only want one shiv and send the first one on DN between DM and solo KB

[lyric vale]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[wind totem]

You want your dry shiv during a DN and Lingering Darkness.

That's about 20 seconds after your DM usually ends.

[buoyant herald]

i mean its a moot point for me because im a bleed enjoyer and don't need IW but the people wanted to know 🤷‍♂️

[lyric vale]

!macro

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

Assassination uses no other macro aside from standard Deathmark+Potion+Racial+Trinket

[wind totem]

And that's very minor dps increase and you shouldn't really bother with it until you got the fundamentals iron out.

[lyric vale]

@balmy condor love u man

[buoyant herald]

dry shiv does throw out some massive envenoms though which is fun

[wind totem]

Sure is but like I said 10 times already, it should be ignored if you are still learning the spec.

It's too minor to bother with it until you have the rest figured out.

[buoyant herald]

yeah i can imagine less experienced players ruining their entire rota trying to hunt for that perfect dry shiv moment

[earnest robin]

Gotcha @wind totem thanks for the help, really appreciate it!

[wind totem]

Yeap. Exactly

[earnest robin]

Sent like 5 bosses as assa so I'm still trying to iron out the spec been sub boi before

[lyric vale]

jesus back side of my chair fel down while i was testing my rotation

gods dont want me to learn this spec ig

[glacial relic]

same. Im 99% pugging keys and bleed plays smooth af. while with hybrid I feel like Im on a tight timer with the 1m kingsbane and shiv usages, if theres no high hp target to use on, if I delay than I get desynced from next deathmark, what if we are out of combat for 20 then its screwed again 🥹

[wind totem]

Yeah bleed is super comfi with pugs

It's also way better to play when you encounter one of those tanks that don't know what a rogue is that just chain pull everything.

[glacial relic]

so, all of them?

😂

[wind totem]

Not in my experience. Those idiots are usually like

[glacial relic]

its very rare that they care about restealth going into a huge pack with 2 min's up

[wind totem]

40% of tanks

Most tanks are just afraid of chain pulling in general for some reason

but that works for me.

[glacial relic]

I wish I had those in my keys

[keen spruce]

Chain pull gud

Faster key more io

[glacial relic]

I dont care about chain pulling in general but when its before cooldowns the bleed setup is pain in the azz

[jaunty matrix]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[keen spruce]

Gud thing vanish is the same cd as our damage

[buoyant herald]

yeah i dropped hybrid because i got sick of KB mob dying with like 5-6 seconds left as i was doing lower keys, bleed just more enjoyable

[waxen oyster]

nah you usually get the guys who leave one straggler mob at 5%

[twilit flint]

is simming patchwork for a boss like bandit okay?

[waxen oyster]

And go into another pack

[wind totem]

That's actually fine

[glacial relic]

cinderbrew hobgoblin charge into the far wall with kingsbane is a classic.

[wind totem]

If you dont actually get near the other pack

you can still drop combat

[waxen oyster]

Only if you kill the mob and restealth

[runic hinge]

Tanks keep asking me if I want restealths and I’m like bruh I got meld and 2 vanish charges. I’m so gucci

[waxen oyster]

sometimes its 10%

Idk whenever i tank i pull big

if i have cds

[wind totem]

Yeah and then you encounter that one guy that just chain pulls everything and suddenly you are out of restealths.

[runic hinge]

Doesn’t happen except maybe that one hallway in cinderbrew

Have been fine almost the whole season

[wind totem]

Yeah me too but I've seen those guys once in a while. Happened to me last week in the trash before first boss in Darkflame.

[runic hinge]

You’re outta vanishes in the first hallway? Damn bruh

[lyric vale]

bleed build feel fun asf

[kindred timber]

sorry i moved from sub to assa , is bleed build dont have kingsbane?

[lyric vale]

ya

[kindred timber]

so you will be fine in boss n m+? or worse that the other build

[lyric vale]

well idk myself that much but im preety sure u feel less damage on boss as i check on dummy

check first pin video

he explained well

[kindred timber]

thanks alot

[lyric vale]

" "

[blazing pumice]

bleed build does more

[ocean fable]

I'm not a great player at all, but bleed build got me over 4b overall in a 12. Really fun

[lucid rune]

anyone having issues seeing the green and purple indicators on Whispyr's plater profile?

[solar wyvern]

Kujo change kinda big for bleed build, not punished very hard for being los

Get rekt other classes!

[rocky zodiac]

!rik

[prisma monolith]

Rik Reverb Barrels (and similar spread cleave in raid)

• Not your problem.
• Assassination is the worst target swapping spec in the game, and we have no tools available to deal with the situation of priority spread cleave. Caustic can reach sometimes but similar to fire mage, the boss needs to be on top of the adds, causing caustic to often be out of range.
• If you're truly hellbent on swapping to barrels, hold your nearest darkest night and just slam a darkest night envenom into them and pray. If you're quick enough you can also pool combo points/energy and cast a rupture on a barrel to try and caustic off of them. This still will not do good barrel damage, again, the spec is doomed for it
• Another possible option would be talenting into Crimson Tempest by untalenting Bone Spike and Doomblade. This CAN TECHNICALLY provide a bit of barrel damage, but the spawns need to be immaculate and any difficult spawns will just result in no barrel damage again.
  With all that, the best advice we have for swapping barrels:
• Swap to Subtletly.

[solar wyvern]

!richard

[prisma monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/316923750073499648/1356363029951938700/image.png?ex=67ec4b02&is=67eaf982&hm=0780c2bf8a3eda7b622f455daac5267c32f3074f79ab55d181e8de68faf2a64e&=&format=webp&quality=lossless

[lyric vale]

check this out

anythings u think i need to work on?

[thorn thorn]

In general if you are looking for feedback on your play a log will be way more helpful than just details

[lyric vale]

sooo i will log next one

[keen spruce]

I used to get that a lot. I try to spread the good word of keep it moving

[lyric vale]

!plater

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[balmy condor]

It looks like a bleed build but envenom and caustic spatter are so high

Bit strange

[lyric vale]

im cooking

in wrong addres

[lyric vale]

my talent were wrong
CMQAA0tw2gAD7pPTLoW5IGZDeYmZmZGmBAAAAAAYWMmtZAAAAAAottZmBzMGzMzysMYMmZGzMzMDbbLjZA2MLDMglgthJwwyA
and seems like it should ve been this
CMQAA0tw2gAD7pPTLoW5IGZDeYmZMzMmBAAAAAAYWMmtZAAAAAAottZmZYmBzMzysMYMmZmZmZmZYzyYGgNzyADYJYbYCMsMA

damn now that i fixed it i notice i was nerfing myself

@balmy condor love u again man

[balmy condor]

Idk what those talents are but I’m glad you got it

[lyric vale]

no sang blade

and shive talent kekw

[quaint flare]

whats the biggest demise hit u boys have gotten so far

[balmy condor]

39m

[drifting cloud]

ok nerd

[balmy condor]

oh, yeah that's troll

[drifting cloud]

[quaint flare]

fuck u win

[lyric vale]

xD

[quaint flare]

wasnt even on a mob with increased damage taken

[lyric vale]

/cry

[quaint flare]

does demise have a timer on when it checks if it should pop or not

or how does it work

[runic hinge]

Takes one to know one

[drifting cloud]

I dont even play with dmg numbers

get pranked

[runic hinge]

Feelcrafter

[balmy condor]

it checks whenever a dot ticks

[quaint flare]

cool

ty for info

[balmy condor]

improved ambush my boy

[lyric vale]

damnn

fixed

sorry i do some nerd stuff and do my thing wrong wayy

[balmy condor]

it's a minor thing

but blindside good

[lyric vale]

" "

[errant path]

Do you always cast shiv+tea together, or is there situations you'd want to have a shiv only button?

[drifting cloud]

not worth thinking about but yeah theres probably situations where youre losing like 0.1% dps

[thorn thorn]

Macro shiv and tea together

[drifting cloud]

which is most likely 10x less than youre losing from being the wrong race

[pliant remnant]

Bro with the social commentary in Ravenholdt

[candid jasper]

I saw a post earlier from a friend that had a rogue doing incredibly high aoe damage but with extremely high amounts coming from crimson tempest (primary source of damage). I've only been applying crimson in the pandemic window rather than using it outside of that. Is there something I'm missing?

[balmy condor]

what talents are you playing

[severe silo]

How much haste is recommended for a raid?

[balmy condor]

whatever raidbots equips on your character

[candid jasper]

Just the cookie cutter one from wowhead for m+

[balmy condor]

then good to go, ct should be your highest

big damage with a bleed build

[wise plume]

ct big dam

[craggy ruin]

is it normal that eye of kezan takes loger with rouge? I saw shadowpriest and they stacked it to 20 areoudn 3 min

[royal lantern]

rng gonna rng

[balmy condor]

I mean it also depends if they can saturate the proc rate

but yeah that can happen

idk what counts on shadow priest

[royal lantern]

and why do you look at a single pull and then maje conclusions

[craggy ruin]

i saw 35 tries on mugzee

trinket stacked around 3:40 -3;50

[balmy condor]

be like that

[craggy ruin]

and the shadow priest i have in raid stack it around 3- 3:10

[hidden bay]

bro i am so hyped for reclear on sunday

since last raid i got 4 ilvl, mythic eye and jastor

[wise goblet]

how could i have a 13m caustic hit when my highest envenom hit was 15m? Heroic Mugz https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/DLbtVQMnzcZWq93T?fight=14&source=21&view=rankings

[balmy condor]

yeah that sounds right, no?

caustic is 40%, the shockers take 100% increased when stunned

so that's essentially 80%

[hardy rapids]

nuh uh

[balmy condor]

80% of your envenom would be 12.487mil

dh debuff and you get there

[drifting cloud]

they do?

[balmy condor]

[drifting cloud]

I swear I didnt know

[drifting cloud]

mythic only? or all diffs

[wise goblet]

i had no idea lol

super lucky high roll crit then lol

[balmy condor]

all

[balmy condor]

yeh just big envenom splashing onto an add taking increased damage

[outer sundial]

!dry

!shiv

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

Assassination uses no other macro aside from standard Deathmark+Potion+Racial+Trinket

[vapid sierra]

caustic has a bug

it just didnt apply

[drifting cloud]

equip deadly poison

[vapid sierra]

ty

[terse stirrup]

its ok for flood +8?

im new in assassin

3 years main outlaw

[runic hinge]

Did you time key?

[terse stirrup]

Yes

24:29

correcting, it was a +9

[runic hinge]

Very proud

[dawn heath]

hm do i take this ring or socket

[tulip tide]

!macro

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

Assassination uses no other macro aside from standard Deathmark+Potion+Racial+Trinket

[dawn heath]

equipping this would shift my circlet to crit instead of mastery so unsure

socket angle

[unreal tide]

are we FoK for clear the witness in ST while using Vicious Venoms, I thought no but my quick sim is sending it

[balmy condor]

link the sim

[unreal tide]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/a5pTwSYmGcwSimn9sVVQAb

[balmy condor]

yeah that's normal

its using it during lingering darkness

intended

[unreal tide]

sounds good, thanks

[keen spruce]

@runic hinge

[runic hinge]

[snow hamlet]

Why? Doesn't lingering work on VV?

[balmy condor]

it does

but ctw is strong

[snow hamlet]

Sorry, but I don't understand the logic. Since it works on VV, then ctw should not be used regardless of lingering.

[gloomy heart]

are ppl using ah bought thistle tea in keys 🤣

[balmy condor]

that's not how that works mate

they're different energy efficiencies and vicious venoms/ctw (fok/mut) are not the same nature damage that gets buffed

you're oversimplifying it

it doesn't matter regardless, ctw in lingering is net neutral

[timber meadow]

yeah its better than the one we get

you can sim ah thistle tea, it's huge gainz

[gloomy heart]

thisle tea stonks 🆙

[balmy condor]

it shares cd with combat potions

[gloomy heart]

i see

[timber meadow]

bro

whispyr actual destroyer of fun

[balmy condor]

destroyer of misinformation

[fallow canopy]

Same thing really

[snow hamlet]

got it ty

[timber meadow]

we had a raider buy a control shard from ah completely unironically

think its there like 2nd season playing wow or smthn was pretty top tier

[dreamy rover]

when i came back to wow during DF, I saw thistle tea in subtlety opener in wowhead and bought up about 2000 thistle teas from AH thinking i'd be using them every opener

literally ended up destroying every single one of those thistle teas after they wouldnt sell for shit

crazy times

[amber brook]

Fatebound feels smooth

[timber meadow]

that's amazing lol

[dreamy rover]

insane work on my part looking back lol

[storm forum]

i never use pots in keys, im going to start using thistle tea

[rotund oak]

im chuggin' them like whispyr drinks energy drinks

next step is directly into the bloodstream

😂

[pastel apex]

Hey guys one question, at 10+keys in pull with 10+ target on opening how many rupture you put on?

Ydo you dot all the target?

[rotund oak]

if u are going with bleed spec as many as u can

spread those bleeds,press ur ct

u know the rest

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[solar wyvern]

5 rupture ct, more rupturing

[rotund oak]

its when a rogue has a real kink for bleeds

aka the bleed build

[pastel apex]

So only 5 rupture? I m not on bleed build

So only 5 rupture the envenom spam?

[rotund oak]

it would be better to specify what u are playing,but yes assuming u arent into bleed tech u spread those bleeds,press ct pick a target and spatter from it

that would be how u play e.g the hybrid build

[pastel apex]

I m not on bleed build i m on the normal hybrid build

I just want know how we have to play in istance like cinderblew

With 10 more target

[rotund oak]

yeah so u preferably pick the highest/more durable target,spread ur bleeds/press ct and spatter from it

[pastel apex]

So if i understand

We have to put 5 rupture on

[rotund oak]

yes for scent stacks

[pastel apex]

Then ct then again rupture right?

[rotund oak]

u can press garrote couple of times more after ct but no

[pastel apex]

Then spam envenom

[rotund oak]

u have IC to spread some bleeds but most mobs there although in big numbers die rly fast

like those lil bees

[pastel apex]

Not on 13

So if i understand: fron opening ambush garrote rupture rupture garrote 5 combo point ct mutilate for spatter then fok rupture when we end the buff of spread dot fok envenom, right?

[quartz cloak]

You could fok envenom right away and then throw deathmark and kingsbane on the spatter target

If you are hybrid build you generally don’t have to rupture more than 5 targets for the scent buff m, then you are good to go for fok envenom spam

[frank trench]

what makes kingsbane aoe?

[buoyant herald]

caustic spatter

[rotund oak]

spatter

[frank trench]

gotcha

so in hybrid

you open with all fiverupture garottes but then dont go into refresh mode

and focus on spatering

[quartz cloak]

It’s worth to reapply rupture when targets live longer

[rotund oak]

Yup

[frank trench]

im having a really hard time with mouse over rupturing

[rotund oak]

if u dont like mouseover rup u can always do it manually

[frank trench]

tab ruptures?

[rotund oak]

platter does help alot in refreshing dots in general

manually as clicking frames

[frank trench]

i find after i kick i end up jamming ruptures on the targets im waiting to kick lol

[quartz cloak]

In hybrid it doesn’t really matter too much, you can just throw ruptures at your target and it will smart apply

[rotund oak]

i kick from focus only but ye depends

its a vibe

[quartz cloak]

You lose a bit of dmg

[frank trench]

sap do you have a macro for foxus target?

[rotund oak]

as long as carnage is active yes

[frank trench]

i can't seem to find a focus macro that works

[rotund oak]

im using an old mouseover target macro

then have focus kick/gouge etc

20yo rogue here

so i can swap back and forth in any given time

[quartz cloak]

/cast [@focus] Kick

Should work no?

[frank trench]

the kicing isnt the problem its the focus macro

to set the focus

my old focus macro seems to be broken

[rotund oak]

should work ye

[quartz cloak]

Ah I see

[rotund oak]

its a vibe,if u have gotten used to it its whatever

[frank trench]

/macro

[bright tartan]

You can key bind focus directly in options

[frank trench]

/focus [nomod]
/focus [mod: alt, @mouseover]

[rotund oak]

u mouseover a frame it goes on focus then u can abuse it as we oldies say

[frank trench]

wait is that a thing now?

[rotund oak]

for some it is

it was mostly an arena thing

and yes it is a next lvl of control

[timber meadow]

is there something i can buy on ah that'll give me a debuff? wanna test something

[buoyant herald]

drums

[timber meadow]

oh true

[wary light]

!log

[prisma monolith]

Wowanalyzer now has good initial support for Assassination. We suggest using it to quickly see any big rotational mistakes and analyze your ability usage

Link: https://wowanalyzer.com/

[wary light]

Ooh is there not a log function like in the sub channel?.

I'm infinitely purple logging and I need to improve 🙃

[runic hinge]

purple is pretty fine

probably kill time and if you're getting to pad matters

[buoyant herald]

play very well in an average guild and you're purple
play very well in a great guild and you're orange
play very well in a great guild and get good rng and you're pink or gold

[solar wyvern]

Or in the case of last tier, play very well in a bad guild and have more time to pad on broodtwister

!

[wary light]

Hmm, I've been able to orange pretty consistently on other classes before in worse guilds (in both HC and Myth), I worry I'm just not as vibey on rogue yet or are our logs genuinely dictated by pad on a lot of fights?

Purple is fine, I'm aware, but I'm like 670 ilvl and 12 ilvl logging on every HC fight as Assa, clearly something going wrong 😅

[solar wyvern]

Assa really is just rng and pad to go orange/pink on any fight with adds. Like you're just never beating someone who gets blindside 12 times before their second kingsbane

[buoyant herald]

there is a bit of an exception

which is play with utter monkeys who don't know how to cleave adds

so you get all the extra damage

which is why they usually exclude adds on things like brood and stix

[buoyant herald]

mmm grey logs certainly indicate doing somethiung fundamentally wrong, like dying

[runic hinge]

I mean ilvl parses are a meme

You could also link the log and maybe someone will be around to thread it for you

[wary light]

Sure sure, just means compared to all the other very geared Assa rogues I'm dog

[runic hinge]

670 ilvl could mean theres like 12 people in your bracket

[wary light]

If that's fine I'll do that yeah, any big brainers willing to contribute I'd love some help

[runic hinge]

yeah that's fine

[wary light]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/PZxM7fDNCFW1qJbh

This is just a log from our last clear of last 3 myth + first 3, I was benched on sprocket and we're extending now, pretty consistently blue/purple in this log, not sure if there are any common themes.

[runic hinge]

@spice spire

anyways

first thing is like those kill times are not great, but like for OAB its gonna depend on how well your tanks move so you can spatter

vexie is also can you spatter adds or not, cauldron is fine but bad kill time, rik is like you're almost back to cds so probably as low as you can be and also its a spatter thing

[runic hinge]

kill times make a huge difference on this spec and if you can get a dm in execute, I'm not gonna go gcd by gcd in your logs cause im tired and its late but just know none of those kill times are particularly great, except mugzee which was your 91

[wary light]

Thank you for the feedback, appreciate you doing it whilst it's late for you!

[runic hinge]

quake might still be awake and he can thread it for you and maybe take a deeper look but probably not tonight? idk but i should

[spice spire]

Riltro Log Review

[scarlet spade]

Are there any dungeons you guys run ironwire for?

[buoyant herald]

i think the only one you can really justify it for is priory

unless you just wanna help out instead of do damage

[kindred timber]

guys how much haste is good for bleed build?

[night cipher]

6-10 for me. 8-10 for general consensus. Don’t gimp crit and mastery too much for it to

[golden loom]

General consensus?

General consensus is vers stacking is bis (i made it up)

[wary light]

It's simming highest for me at approx 12%

[foggy orbit]

fast question without reading absolutely nothing. Is there a way for me to macro autotarget my deathstalker target again after kicking another mob that casts a spell?

[balmy condor]

/targetlasttarget I guess

most people just focus/mouseover kick

[sharp viper]

i use two macros
/focus
and
/target [@focus]

[foggy orbit]

i thank you dearly!

[sharp viper]

target previous enemy should also be an option as a normal keybinding

[neat jacinth]

Are there any sheets regarding which abilities you can outplay with Evasion in M+?

[balmy condor]

no

Evasion is basically just used for the damage reduction

[sharp viper]

i think you can evasion some stuff like arbalest shots in top or the knight impale in priory

but don't know of any specific boss mechanics

[golden loom]

cant u also evasion the pot shot or whatever in priory from sharpshooters

[buoyant herald]

can evasion the hobgobby charges in bee land

[sharp viper]

I didn't know that 😮 will have to test

[buoyant herald]

pretty low value but it's there

since you can just dodge

[balmy condor]

yeh

and all of these things will just get reduced by casting evasion in the first place

[sharp viper]

100% > 20%/36%

[balmy condor]

true

[sharp viper]

speaking of damage reduction, I always wondered but never knew if elusiveness dr stacks on top of feint aoe dr for incoming aoe dmg

[balmy condor]

I don't believe so

cause it says "feint reduces non-area-of-effect damage by 20%"

so like evasion + feint would stack obviously

but it doesn't double feint

cause feint is aoe, and elusiveness feint is non-aoe

[sharp viper]

true, that would be in the wording, I still had the old one in mind

[kindred timber]

gusy is there any WA or plater scripts when mobs reach 35% hp for execute shiv mobs plater color change for awareness?

[iron vapor]

Oooh, that's a good shout.

[buoyant herald]

most profiles have the spark line at 35% but it's not always super obvious when it happens

[warm vortex]

You get a massive sparkle effect and a “yippee!” Sound plays whenever any mob reaches 35%

[kindred timber]

yes

[kindred timber]

possible to add some sound in spark line?

[uneven tundra]

does anybody have a good plater profile for assa?

[iron carbon]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[iron carbon]

Whispyr's great

[uneven tundra]

sweet thanks guys

[buoyant herald]

i mean you could easily make a WA to play a sound when your target hit 35%

ooo we got any demise-maxers in the chat?

[round cypress]

Just to be sure, when you have supercharged CB, you send your spender at 2+ CB right ?

[balmy condor]

no

you just go to 5 like normal

[tiny inlet]

hey can anyone check how come circlet is getting outperformed by a 678 ring in my sim? simmed a few times thinking ive done something wrong but maybe my char is just desperate for crit
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/hRnjtCP6cxVctCLsq7vENC

[loud hearth]

!fok

[prisma monolith]

Fok Conditions Post-Buff
Fan of Knives as a generator to replace ambush/mutilate:

• Baseline 3+ targets, -1 if talented into momentum of despair and thrown precision, +1 if talented into vicious venoms, +1 if talented into blindside. (Generally 5 with raid build, 3 with Bleed m+, 2 with Hybrid m+)
  Fan of Knives with Clear the Witnesses Up:
• Baseline 2+ targets, -1 if lingering darkness is up or you aren't talented into vicious venoms. With Vicious Venoms casting during lingering darkness is dps neutral.
  Fan of Knives with Darkest Night Up:
• Only on 2+ targets, or without Vicious Venoms talented. This is also a very very minor optimization

The most important to remember is the generator rules, clear the witnesses and darkest night optimizations can be effectively ignored as they are not meaningful DPS improvements

[static glacier]

I've done a lot of my weekly keys as outlaw this week 😦

betrayed the cause

[sharp viper]

outlaw is a lot of fun

and the thrill of killing yourself with killing spree is exciting!

[eager bough]

hello

any know how can i hide them?

[sharp viper]

shift+V is standard keybinding to toggle friendly nameplates

[eager bough]

didnt work its for elvui

[sharp viper]

try looking for this keybinding, assign it something if you haven't to turn it off

[shell crater]

Finally managed to time my first 13 🙂

[eager bough]

i mean this one

[vale marten]

your gear is kinda weird for assa, im guessing you played sub and now swapped, first thing you should do if youre simming 5 min patchwerk is replace caustic with internal bleeding

[iron vapor]

His gear is great for assassination. Gems/enchants lean a little more into versatility than optimal but it's not a huge loss.

[tiny inlet]

thanks for looking, i actually play assa mainly lol but changed some stuff around to play sub for OaB but didnt like it and we dont need the add dmg anymore, but if i sim changing all my gear back to better assa stats with ascendance and writhing banding its 'only' 5k dps anyway (also seems weird) and is still telling me to swap out circlet lol

[vale marten]

im guessing the crit ring is better because youre not playing pacemaker and have a lot of mastery with kezan, only thing i see that would explain it

[royal lantern]

are you using priory trinket?

if yes, its possible because pacemaker+ring could push you into more crit then, which is kinda bad

[tiny inlet]

currently use 659 HoC and a 665 Kezan

[iron vapor]

Circlet gives a lot of mastery, which you don't really need much more of - the extra crit must be more valuable

[vast shuttle]

do u use any diffrent gear build when u raid?

[royal lantern]

lmao no

the day im making another gearset for m+ because its 0,3% "higher" in sims, im gonna shoot myself cus i lost it

[tiny inlet]

haha yeah

[vast shuttle]

so u go in with ur m+ build in raids aswell then?

u dont change any trinkets ?

[royal lantern]

what is there to change with trinkets

[tiny inlet]

not sure about eye of kezan, i only just got that in vault, i dont think i would use it in M+ though personally

[royal lantern]

eye is kinda bad ye

[vale marten]

no its shit in m+

[royal lantern]

only really good in the last couple mythic raid bosses

[tiny inlet]

im using it for last 3 mythic bosses

^^

[gusty mirage]

just never stop pulling in keys and it's fine

the entire dungeon is one pull

yolo

[royal lantern]

forced RP sections be like:

[gusty mirage]

auto attack a mob while the RP happens

[royal lantern]

or your boomkin dying cus they are braindead birds

[gusty mirage]

don't let your dreams be dreams tryan

if there's a will there's a way

just don't do workshop ever

[tiny inlet]

my kingsbanes feel really weak now though with my gear opener KB with lust i feel really lucky if i get a 15M total with it, and from memory thats not much more than i was getting in S1

[royal lantern]

kingsbane is just not strong rn

[gusty mirage]

🍜

kingsbane atm

[royal lantern]

darkest night envenom does more dmg then a kingsbane

[broken chasm]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/whBTGPdCzry7qQf6?fight=30&type=damage-done&source=320

Can someone tell me what I'm doing wrong and why I can't make good logos? I'll add that I have 98 on heroic

[royal lantern]

kill the boss during cds

[wary light]

You send 3rd set of CDs randomly and not during the damage amp that starts at 5mins, you always want to hold on Vexie for each subsequent set

You also pot on pull instead of at 2mins when you get first amp + lust

[vast shuttle]

is the house of card good?

for raiding?

[wary light]

Yes, at equal item level only signet is slightly better

[vast shuttle]

i did raid sim and it was just 0.1 better

[wary light]

You have a priory at the same ilvl?

[eager bough]

ez

last boss damage to boss

[royal lantern]

what are we supposed to see there

[vast shuttle]

Best in slot all bis gear in m+

all maxed

[wary light]

Can I get a yes or a no gamer? Are you comparing 665 house and 665 priory? If you get 0.1% could be slightly better for you depending on stat weights or just sim variance

[vast shuttle]

Yes

Gamer

[royal lantern]

i mean

0,1 is margin of error lol

reminder that blue sim numbers can be kinda ignorer because of that

[wary light]

Yeah, @vast shuttle run the sim 10 times you'll likely get some where priory is 0.1 better etc

[desert crest]

Nahh just run the sim 10x that reduces the error by a factor 1/sqrt(10)

[wary light]

I run my great vault Sims 100 times before I pick so the margin of error is infinitesimally small 😤😤

[vast shuttle]

wtf do u mean house of card with seaforium was 0.1 better but it dosent even matter cause it so small

that says that i dont need better trinkets for my raid

and thats what i asked

[wary light]

And I replied with "Yes"

[desert crest]

The result is not exact tho

Also try again but with an 8 min sim

U will find that eye is good

[vast shuttle]

ok

[balmy condor]

simulations are not perfectly accurate

[balmy condor]

they're only accurate within 0.1%

[vast shuttle]

8min

[balmy condor]

yeh so the highlighted rows are actually just equal

sims can't tell the difference

[ancient rain]

why does it say 1% better if it can't tell the difference

[desert crest]

It does not tho?

[balmy condor]

[ancient rain]

nvm i ... nvm

[wary light]

No it's saying the top 3, which are all similar, are highlighted

[balmy condor]

yeh...

number hard

I get it

[wary light]

I don't like to be a discord class snot because I'm not that good but sometimes I'm being baited hard I think

[desert crest]

If u run the sim 4 times and manually add all the dmg numbers for each combination u get twice the accuracy tho kinda annyoing that u can't do that on raidbots but i guess they have to stop me at some point

[ancient rain]

[desert crest]

Just anoying when doing gem sims

and they are all blue

[balmy condor]

nah it's just math hard and number hard and just equip green number cause green number

no snobbin

it's just very uncommon to find people that actually read numbers and know what the hell they're looking at other than "oh that number is bigger than that other number"

[tawny quartz]

Am I able to post a log in this chat for y'all to review? My buddy is needing help figuring out why his damage is so low on our prog fights.

[balmy condor]

I'm sure quake is awake soon for log reviews

[red schooner]

Ye go for it bud

[balmy condor]

I'll thread you

[wary light]

I did earlier and someone was able to thread me

Gave my dumbass some useful tips

Sick of being purp in heroic 🙃

[mystic osprey]

!pooling

[prisma monolith]

• Energy just is low on the spec there's nothing to do about it, you will run out
• Only one pooling condition exists (pool around 4 seconds before non-deathmark kingsbanes until 150ish energy). This is worth 0.3%
• Other optimizations are simply not impactful enough to show a benefit in sims, but pooling before quick-dying add spawns could in theory be a practical gain to pad.

[mystic osprey]

!bleed

Do we pool energy on ST in M+ with the bleed build?

[glacial relic]

Yep stay above 150 for SB

[royal lantern]

very very very minor

like, in the neglectable range

if you dont wanna do it, not really worth the hussle tbh, but technically its a gain in the 0,4% something range

[warm vortex]

Tbh this is kinda misleading

"nothing to do about it"

the stereroids in question:

[summer bramble]

The new bleed build I'm hearing about, is that the m+ build on wowhead without kingsbane, i did not see it on fu spreadsheet or IV so I wanted to make sure

[red schooner]

It is!

[ebon olive]

Do i see this correct that CD wise it goes off best if i use Shiv and Tea for Kingsbane Phase and bc of SHiv CD its optimal to not use it until Kingsbane is back so i have 2 Stacks + Tea again for Bane window ?

[balmy condor]

Yes we hold shivs for kingsbane

That’s when we’re doin dam

[ebon olive]

OK thats kinda good to understand 😄

No i just need to figure out the whole Deathmark thing and Envenom with DN,

[balmy condor]

Well deathmark you press right before kingsbane

That’s when we’re doin dam

[ebon olive]

Sorry i ment Deathstalkjers mark

[balmy condor]

Oh

Even easier

Ambush from stealth to get it

Use finishers

Get darkest night

Generate max combo points

Envenom

Repeat

[ebon olive]

Maybe i missunderstand the Guide but it sounds like im suppoes to get DN before i get into Deathmark KB window?

[balmy condor]

Well you should ambush from stealth to get the mark

Past that it doesn’t matter when you get what

[charred mango]

is iron wire not worth trying to reach in the m+ build? looks like everythings important

[balmy condor]

You just finish and if you have darkest night you go to max and envenom and repeat

[ebon olive]

Ahh ok i thought i am doing something wrong not getting it before Deathmark WIndow

And when Deathstalkers Mark is consumed all 3 i go for Vanish Ambush again ?

[balmy condor]

It’s very good but getting more damage and your group not being shitters with kicks is better

[balmy condor]

When you consume the mark you get darkest night

So you generate to max

You envenom

It gives you the mark back

Rinse repeat

[ebon olive]

https://tenor.com/view/mind-blown-thinking-smart-gif-12194315

THats why no Subterfuge in Raid Build. I think im on to something right :D?

[balmy condor]

Not really no

Subterfuge extends stealth effects, so its main use is for master assassin/improved garrote/carnage

If you just ambush from stealth then subterfuge is entirely pointless for the mark, you already have it applied, why do you need to ambush again? :P

[ebon olive]

OK sorry its a bit confusing with Raid and Mythic DUngeons. SO in Raid Vanish is not used at all then ? We talked about this before when i used Vanish Envenom or something 😄

[balmy condor]

Depends on your talents

[ebon olive]

Taking Builds from Lorgs but this is mug for Example

[balmy condor]

^ this ends up being true for vanish as well

[balmy condor]

Yeh so you don’t have any stealth talents in this build

So no point in vanishing

[ebon olive]

But if i would have, what would i vanish for then ? Reapply Garrote and Rupture?

[balmy condor]

^

[ebon olive]

nvm 😄

[storm forum]

vanish back to a defensive, as god intended

[balmy condor]

It’s legit never been a defensive

[cerulean walrus]

But Whispyr….. soothing darkness

[balmy condor]

Mfers be sayin shit like “ah vanish as a defensive, just like the old days” and then log into classic and vanish for damage

[cerulean walrus]

[storm forum]

i dont think i was alive back then

rogue has been a damage button my whole life

[balmy condor]

All of rogue

[storm forum]

a damage button that resets mobs and pisses me off when it happens

vanish*

[cerulean walrus]

I can count on like one hand the number of times vanish has been good defensively on a boss

[storm forum]

lots of bosses its good

mechagon final boss

[balmy condor]

What

[cerulean walrus]

Bro really trying to elude those targeting systems

[balmy condor]

What’s vanish do aside from giving the beam to someone else

[storm forum]

add bosses occasionally

[near lark]

Prepping to pump OAB, any tippos?

(mythic)

[storm forum]

vanish doesnt give it to someone else?

[balmy condor]

Ye it does

[storm forum]

if it does its fake

only 2 DoTs go out when i meld or vanish it

[balmy condor]

[foggy orbit]

what is the best use of shadowmeld as assa rogue? noticed u cant proc deatstalkers mark by melding and ambushing, or proc indiscriminate carnage talent with garrotes from shadowmeld

[storm forum]

ill record my next mechagon

[storm forum]

you cant use it to restealth in boss combat, but you can do it sometimes in m+

[lethal heart]

it doesnt give it to someone else but also its rare its useful as a defensive

[storm forum]

it's inconsistent though

[desert crest]

U need to spam stealth after u press meld and not take dmg

[balmy condor]

You either meld on trash and cope that you can get a stealth off before watching it not work and you realize you just afk’d for 5 seconds like a dumbfuck, use it as a skip, or to try and cheese some targeted mechanic

[cerulean walrus]

[storm forum]

the meld restealth should be nearly instant if it works, so dont waste more than 1 gcd waiting for it

[desert crest]

In general meld should be very strong but bliz hates rogue

[analog field]

Guys on bloodhorn does shiv negate tantrum ? how does exactly work ? i cast after he casts it or ?

[balmy condor]

Tf you mean should be very strong

[cerulean walrus]

?????

[foggy orbit]

allright thx alot, will try to see if i happen to get it to proc. Happy easter!

[balmy condor]

Meld is just miles crazier than anything else for no reason lmao

[desert crest]

I mean in if it works consistently it gives good dmg in m+

[storm forum]

yes, after he starts the channel, shiv will end it

[vapid sierra]

!up

[prisma monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/316923682607857685/1346745738532491296/New_Project.jpg

[analog field]

so after channel and before it finishes

[desert crest]

MA + imp garrote and being able to reapply bleeds

[analog field]

i am pretty sure i did it but it didnt happen

maybe mistimed

[balmy condor]

Forget the damage from meld, it could give 0 dps and still just be auto-required

[lethal heart]

surprisingly many things are meldable this season in m+

[storm forum]

are the targeted 1 shots in Stix meld/vanish-able?

[lethal heart]

no

[desert crest]

Yeah okay I see what u mean we are in agreement then

[lethal heart]

you can cloak it tho if you see its going off on you

[balmy condor]

Meld just needs removed

Stupid fucking racial man

[desert crest]

I was just saying that if it worked consistently it would be strong dmg wise aswell

[storm forum]

damn

cant believe whisp hates me

[lethal heart]

racials need to go

[storm forum]

and my entire race

[balmy condor]

True

[lethal heart]

or let people choose them but it makes them too much money

[desert crest]

They could just make it put us into stealth instead of whatever the fuck it does

[lethal heart]

so gg

[cerulean walrus]

But my underwater breathing

[balmy condor]

So you want the best racial to just be broken op

[desert crest]

No but would fix the annoyance

i play tauren so

[balmy condor]

Dawg

The fact that meld can give you a stealth in the first place is insane

[storm forum]

to be fair, meld does count as full stealth for druid cat form rake, so it would be nice if it was consistent. it would make it incredibly broken for us though

[desert crest]

Only more broken for rouge tho

so we happy

[balmy condor]

Melds just gotta not drop combat

[cerulean walrus]

Yeah but who cares about Feral?

[desert crest]

i would race swap

[blissful spire]

[balmy condor]

Routes this season requiring meld to skip

[desert crest]

Yeah meld skips are cringe

[balmy condor]

When rogues have shroud and mages have mass invis and neither works

What’s the fucking point

[lethal heart]

cant have shroud be good anymore because it was too good in bfa

suffering from success

[balmy condor]

Yeah so we just make meld replace it

Gg

[lethal heart]

meld was always better anyway

[desert crest]

They just need to make eagle eyed true sight mobs that arn't meld'able

[lethal heart]

will always be

[indigo sphinx]

Yeah idk if they remove meld, then we are just vanish skipping stuff perma and then they have to try and fix that probably

[lethal heart]

meld gives you infinity pathing options

[balmy condor]

Or, right here me out now instead of this convoluted nightmare

Just nerf meld?

[lethal heart]

its crazy for endgame geeks/high end geeks whatever you would call them

[desert crest]

Double eye mob

Red eye

[indigo sphinx]

Fucking nerds

[desert crest]

Or just remove truesight tbh

[golden loom]

Meld has also been broken in pvp for like 20 years right?

[subtle tundra]

ok but who cares about high m+ balancing

[lethal heart]

should let people choose racials and swap them whenever they want ofc

[subtle tundra]

why does it affect people

y'all aint doing keys high enough to affect you

[lethal heart]

because people wanna copy streamers even in their weekly 12s

[balmy condor]

+7 need meld

[lethal heart]

totally normal behavior

[balmy condor]

Need vdh

[desert crest]

All (nearly) mobs that u would want to skip have true sight bliz might aswell remove shroud from the game

[subtle tundra]

shrigma ass

[balmy condor]

Deplete their 10 go to a 9 cause they didn’t get the double hobgoblin skip

On jod bro

[subtle tundra]

idk make it so if they have le eyes you cant drop combat with them or something

the point of le eyes is to not skip the mob

[desert crest]

.

[balmy condor]

OR

WE

JUST

NERF

FUCKING

MELD

Y’all gonna make me crash out like Zac

[warm vortex]

[desert crest]

Carefull guys soon he is gonna write a novel on apples and pears

[storm forum]

smh, didnt want big boss damage bm

[lethal heart]

reject stupidity

embrace

[subtle tundra]

idk we didnt have a meld and we were just fine, last season there was a single place where we "suffered"

in arakara there was a skip doable by the priest with meld and he wasnt nelf but we didnt care

[balmy condor]

Super red giga eyeball of more truer farsightedness be so fucking for real please

Y’all could find a way to starve in a grocery store

[lethal heart]

i play dwarf and i hate how it looks

need to fix

[subtle tundra]

i love my dwarf monk

[storm forum]

we're vegan, and don't trust any company that says they are

[subtle tundra]

he is so cool

[viscid spear]

Arcane Torrent, you are my only friend.
When Shadowmeld fails, I know you got me.

[subtle tundra]

but the problem with shadowmeld isnt the skips

tbh

its the using it on mechanics

so you negate the mechanic

thats worse

[balmy condor]

Why not just give the mechanics a big red eyeball or something then

[lethal heart]

yea which this season there are surprisingly many

[viscid spear]

https://tenor.com/view/lord-of-the-rings-one-does-not-walk-into-mordor-sean-bean-boromir-gif-5207364

[storm forum]

i like meld

[earnest flume]

Nah getting to dodge a mechanic once a fight that will come back is not nearly as broken as skipping whole packs and saving multiple minutes

[lethal heart]

last season nothing worked or barely anything now i can think of 4 mechanics right away

[balmy condor]

Instead of deleting meld, what if each mechanic made in the last 20 years just gets a special “can meld” or “no meld” tag in the journal instead

That way we don’t have to guess anymore

[lethal heart]

[balmy condor]

So much simpler!

[storm forum]

then they'd have to standardize between "can meld cast" vs "can meld projectile"

or we'd still be guessing

[subtle tundra]

ok i know youre sarcastic, but making things un-meldable is not the best solution either, would suck for hunters

and they suck already

[balmy condor]

Those are separate problems

[desert crest]

Who cares about hunters???

[balmy condor]

Meld shouldn’t be allowed to exist just because it band-aids bad class design

You can delete meld and fix the defensive issue

These things are not linked

[subtle tundra]

its a form of skill expression

limited to hunter and rogue

[balmy condor]

Buying a race change, skillfully

[subtle tundra]

mate

wasnt it clear

[golden loom]

For the Alliance!

[subtle tundra]

what

that SHOULD be , or if you cant extrapolate

[balmy condor]

For the cheese 🐀

[sonic schooner]

for the pineapple pizza 🍍

[viscid spear]

[storm forum]

[hollow walrus]

@balmy condor its commonly said that rouges are overpowdered. Is there an apl with better balance for my blush to match my lipstick better? Id like to slay like the rest of you assassins

[balmy condor]

I hope your blush has arsenic in it

[hollow walrus]

Cuz of the poison synergy talents?

[balmy condor]

Yes exactly

[viscid spear]

What does a bat have to do with WoW?

Amy is the better female character anyway

[hollow walrus]

I was told by a high key pusher that lead based face paints were cool so maybe thats the trick

[bronze pike]

What if

What if

What if

I’m allergic? What build should I use then with my makeup routine?

[viscid spear]

Your bloodline will not survive the winter

[worldly bridge]

is caustic spatter actually worth it for mugzee ?

[red schooner]

ye, internal bleeding is weak as shit

as a rule of thumb, if you can get ANY usage out of spatter, its worth taking over IB

[coral ibex]

only if you care about doing damage

[red schooner]

Like, its better on cauldron

despite it having limited uptime

[worldly bridge]

how many envenoms do you cleave during the fight like less than 10 no ?

[red schooner]

enough to make it worth taking over IB

[worldly bridge]

i was thinking about trying to play it fatebound with IB

idk

[golden loom]

sounds awful

[warm vortex]

Just had a run in rook where i gave the healer the DoT on 2nd boss then rn away and he just stood there x.x

So i got it again