assassination

[buoyant pumice]

hi stupid question again, I seem to have 2 counters on the Whispyr platings, Anyone know how i can remove one of the counters?

[red copper]

Sup team.
Any plater nerds that could help me?
Looking to make my target with DS a larger frame and or above the rest of targets in a pack
is that possible at all?

[proud pelican]

Omnicc maybe? You can turn it off in the settings

[buoyant pumice]

Oh yeah

Omnicc could be it, Thanks

[strange sleet]

In AoE yes. You gar and rupt mobs, then Crimson, then spatter dmg with envenom.
In ST you full dot the mob, and then try to always keep the bleeds up while, if possible, being above 50% energy. Envenom is kinda last prio

[buoyant pumice]

Do we press Crimson in ST?

[strange sleet]

yes

[abstract warren]

got it, thank you!

[strange sleet]

with bleed build

@buoyant pumice

[buoyant pumice]

Alright, Running the hybrid one

[strange sleet]

then you don't

[red schooner]

I shall one day demise all 4 yes men in one cinderbrew run at once

I am going to fucking manifest this

[strange sleet]

imagine

[red schooner]

watch a team in mdi pull out some bizarre demise based tech for it

[strange sleet]

would be super

but the tech is to MC + taunt away

[red schooner]

yeah we had a priest MC them but it didn't work

I don't know this tech

I am a simple +10 runner

[strange sleet]

unless they fixed it, it should work

[ornate igloo]

How are you guys playing into demise? Just play normally by keeping the bleeds always up, or reapply all bleeds at 35% health even if they are far away from ending? I feel like I'm not doing enough damage

[strange sleet]

I did it yesterday with 2 priests. Me and a friend. Before they die you MC. They are inmune to MC once one of them dies.

IDK @ornate igloo . It depends on the specifics of the pull. But I do try to reaply a couple ruptures here and there at the end of the pull if possible

Also I personally tend to save Vanish to reaply bleeds instead of using it to boost spatter damage (like in hybrid with KB)

just play around and see what works for you

[ornate igloo]

I tried this, still something feels weird

[hot flicker]

hey guys can anyone have a quick look over my log and see if you can notice anything majorly wrong feel like i hsould be doing more damage https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/tzXMrdvh6WJ1Yb2k?fight=last&type=damage-done

[ornate igloo]

That's about the same damage I do, I feel the same way

[strange sleet]

logs are not my thing but I feel you are lacking some CT damage maybe

[grim jay]

m+ logs are kinda difficult to review

but your ct damage is kinda eh iirc

unless logs count it way differently

than my details setup

[red schooner]

ye CT is normally my top damage

[hot flicker]

so just more uptime i guess

only 78% uptime

[static glacier]

@balmy condor how do we land end of kb in HoC? is it dm > kb > shiv or do we send HoC with kb

I don't even have one, just wondering

[tall atlas]

thats fucking stupid

not youre stupid, they use the submitted raid build for multi tartet

how would i get the pi numbers for this new build

[fickle light]

does shadowstep work in cages on mugzee?

[tall atlas]

no

[gusty mirage]

Yes I am

[tall atlas]

habibi no

@balmy condor bby do you have the sim results from the PI sim you done you mentioned in the pinned post

[haughty flicker]

Your priest doesn’t want to pi you huh

[tall atlas]

nah they do i just wanna see the nombres and have evidence for when bitches be being bitches

[nimble tartan]

guys i can go full passive trinket and be chillin so hard for raid is it worth..

[red schooner]

is HoC not chilling? Just macro it to deathmark and forget it exists

[nimble tartan]

its chillin but its not as chillin as just chillin

ya shmeel me

[harsh harbor]

with the bleed build im a bit confused as to when to shiv. and do I use the macro ?

[spice surge]

2x during deathmark

Rest whenever

[hardy rapids]

GRAAAAAAAAAAAAH TANKING SUCK PEOPLE DYING FOR NO REASON WHEN ALL MOBS ON ME

[tired girder]

house is just a macro with deathmark tho so not that tough to use properly

[nimble tartan]

[keen spruce]

[gaunt quiver]

You're leveraging sudden Demise. Make bleeds do more damage makes Demise proc with more health still on the mob. Around 30% health left is a good place to start and watch it. You'll adjust for every key you're in based off parties dps.

[oblique sorrel]

So should you vanish and apply bleeds at like 40% hp with. Shiv

[harsh harbor]

sorry conflicting info, i want to use shiv at 30%is mob health?

NOT during deathmark

[oblique sorrel]

2 during death mark

[spice surge]

No, you absolutely use it for deathmark

[gaunt quiver]

They're 30s timers. They will be back after DM.

[oblique sorrel]

Do you apply shiv after the bleeds hit before death mark then during death mark?

[spice surge]

Same as in the kb build

[royal lantern]

TFW you kill stix while getting balls everytime you have cds

3x balls is cursed

[balmy condor]

You just macro it to dm because there’s no difference

[balmy condor]

Those are probably gone by now

[oblique sorrel]

I only tried the build on a few 11s yesterday but saw large dps gains especially boss damage

[copper hazel]

blessing in some countries

[onyx coyote]

I'm rather sure that boss knows when i've just used my cds then sends me out wild goose hunt for leaf piles as muchas possible

[polar rampart]

basically all trinkets are passive when you play assa

[royal lantern]

90% of trinkets are passive cus almost everyone just plays "give stats when used" stuff

and then alling it with cds

[coral ibex]

how did you get 3x balls wtf

people dead?

i thought you can't double up before the last set if any

[harsh harbor]

So save 2 charges for deathmark, use after vanish at 30% mob health otherwise?

[barren yarrow]

Do we know how much damage does in regards to burst from subtlety

[royal lantern]

1st, 3rd (?) set, and last set

[barren yarrow]

like how much less or more do we do than sub

[coral ibex]

in burst?

sub has some of the highest burst in the game if not the highest

[gaunt quiver]

Yes, that's a good place to start. Sudden Demise is %-based. You will have to trial and error it a couple times to find the spot that works for you in each dungeon - it will be different.

[harsh harbor]

thanks, does it matter order or is shiv dynamic?

[nimble tartan]

chat do we love leech or do we love avoidance

enchants

[royal lantern]

leech is a meme stat

avoidance is good

[nimble tartan]

aww man ok

[royal lantern]

does that answer the question

[quaint flare]

speed better

[runic hinge]

I got speed

[golden loom]

I have leech on my cloak and avoidance on bracers

mad?

[gaunt quiver]

It's dynamic.
Remember sudden Demise is based off all your bleeds. So have all three bleeds as strong as they can be as the adds get low.
The trick is trying not to waste as much of your cooldowns on the timing game as possible.

[nimble tartan]

holy fuck

lemme tap in and do that

[harsh harbor]

you've been super helpful, thank you

[warm vortex]

https://tenor.com/view/construction-worker-builder-pulled-through-wall-toilet-read-prank-gif-17145396

[sonic zinc]

!macro

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

Assassination uses no other macro aside from standard Deathmark+Potion+Racial+Trinket

[royal lantern]

yes

pillow on your face tonight

(my lips are called pillow)

[sonic zinc]

the lingering darkness dry shiv doesnt happen every post dm does it?

[golden loom]

00:01 and its already freaky friday... @royal lantern

[split veldt]

bleed build pumps so hard

but it still takes me an hour to get into a 13

😭

just for it to brick

[royal lantern]

did you try having 3,5k score

or having BL or a CR

[split veldt]

i would love to shoot adrenaline darts into my homies

[haughty flicker]

its canon that sometimes dead people are just faking

so our brez should be poking them with a stick

until they get annoyed and get up

[spice surge]

It does

[frigid cedar]

where to find recommended plater profiles?

[grand trail]

1% wipe on bandit not like this

[jolly vault]

how do you achieve this dmg bro

[haughty flicker]

hit boss

[royal lantern]

long execute phase and tanks that move the boss

[sonic zinc]

ok on the KB after the dry shiv, would we still use 2 shivs on that, or just hold one to make sure both shivs are up for the next dm window

[spice surge]

You cant

You have 2 shivs inbetween DM ye

So if you use one of them during lingering

You only have 1 during kb

[sonic zinc]

kk

then use that one before or end of kb

or just whenever its up

[haughty flicker]

last half of kb

[sonic zinc]

👍

[buoyant minnow]

Does the WA for Crimson Tempest works if I use the Luxthos rogue WA?

[grand trail]

im doing zero dmg to adds

[fickle light]

am i actually supposed to maintain both envenoms? i feel perma out of energy

[grand trail]

barerely beat tanks on adds

[strange sleet]

Nah sudden demise in low lvl content (relative to character gear) is just broken. I'm starting to be afraid of a nerf tbh

[digital spindle]

!fok

[prisma monolith]

Fok Conditions Post-Buff
Fan of Knives as a generator to replace ambush/mutilate:

• Baseline 3+ targets, -1 if talented into momentum of despair and thrown precision, +1 if talented into vicious venoms, +1 if talented into blindside. (Generally 5 with raid build, 3 with Bleed m+, 2 with Hybrid m+)
  Fan of Knives with Clear the Witnesses Up:
• Baseline 2+ targets, -1 if lingering darkness is up or you aren't talented into vicious venoms. With Vicious Venoms casting during lingering darkness is dps neutral.
  Fan of Knives with Darkest Night Up:
• Only on 2+ targets, or without Vicious Venoms talented. This is also a very very minor optimization

The most important to remember is the generator rules, clear the witnesses and darkest night optimizations can be effectively ignored as they are not meaningful DPS improvements

[spice surge]

Theres no maintaining anything regarding envenom. If your rupture is up and you have 5 or more combo points you slam envenom (7 if darkest night)

Nothing more to it

[digital spindle]

is the 6 CP FoK still a thing in the bleed build?

[fickle light]

so we aren't waiting until last second for envenom anymore

will look at guides lol, so much changed from last season

[golden loom]

We also slammed season 1

Keep on slammin

[strange sleet]

If you can, you wait. As long as you don't lose any casts on a given time frame

[fickle light]

is this not relevant anymore?

[river acorn]

Bleed build has significant less ST dmg right? Or I'm just doing something hella wrong

[spice surge]

Nop, should be slightly higher or atleast similar

[digital spindle]

on the dummy I can only get around 1.2m sustained with it at 666 iLvl (no pots or external buffs)

[agile geode]

just optimize ur shiv windows under 35%

[river acorn]

hmm right kinda same for me

[agile geode]

and generally consider execute dmg

[spice surge]

Keep CT up

[haughty flicker]

if bleed not up, bleed up

congrats you have mastered bleed build

[sonic schooner]

if bleed, bleed

[tepid meadow]

any of you guys play sin in mythic undermine?

[normal mist]

In this chat? no one

[haughty flicker]

probably

[tepid meadow]

i just started rogue this season but I haven't figured out why people play sin over sub in the raid since the single target is relatively weak

[lean plover]

we all play outlaw on it

killing spree is op this tier so

[jaunty hill]

I am so in love with the bleed build it feels so oldschool. Tabing around Rapture this guy, Garrote this Lady. It is such a Bob

[pliant remnant]

Of course, just move it into the Core group

[buoyant minnow]

I'm not too sure what that means but I'll look into it :)

thanks :)

[buoyant pilot]

done my 8x 10s with bleed build and im in love thanks team

[buoyant minnow]

I play sin because I have more fun playing sin

[buoyant pilot]

other specs have no chance

[tall atlas]

ayyyyy

love u too

[buoyant pilot]

OVID hahaha

[tall atlas]

WASSAAAAAAAAP

good to see you brogue

its like meeting an old pal in the pub

[vagrant perch]

When playing the Bleed Build do we want to stay above 50 percent energy in AoE as well as in Single Target ?

[jaunty hill]

A good sin will always be better than an average Pirate or Ninja "Rogue"

[tall atlas]

yolo just send

[buoyant minnow]

If there was a glyph to change the outlaw gun into a hand crossbow I'd probably play it a bit, I just don't like guns with the rogue aesthetic :s

[jaunty hill]

I would love if they ever decide to add one handed Guns back into the game.

A Gunslinger Class would interest me

[soft drift]

for bleed build, on bosses is it the same as regualr? Enveom etc, but just keep CT up?

[balmy condor]

Sin’s single target is not at all weak in raids

Not only that but it has huge execute damage, which is insanely valuable on some of the harder bosses

[balmy condor]

Yes

[tepid meadow]

must be a skill issue for me then lol

[wicked zodiac]

i can use bleed build on raid? or just dungeon?

[young pebble]

Is there a way Sin can cheese H Mugzee gallagio goons? So far I've been having to get in a jail and hard swap to the add, but I'm seeing some Rogues just staying out of the jails and hitting Mugzee. Does Caustic go through the stone walls or something?

Target swaps always hurt Sin I feel

[balmy condor]

This is 80th percentile mythic sprocketmonger

[balmy condor]

Dungeon builds are for dungeons

[soft drift]

am I misreading sudden demise, or does it make all bleeds instantly pop under 35%? or is it just if they're able to die from the damage that they instantly pop

[balmy condor]

Yes, if the boss is close enough you can hit the adds through the wall

[balmy condor]

You need to have your total remaining bleed damage on the target be 150% of the remaining health of the target

So if you have 150 damage worth of bleeds up, it’ll execute the last 100 damage on the target

[jaunty sky]

!plater

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[tepid meadow]

outside of cd windows is there much optimization that you can even do on single target? does energy pooling to chain envenoms help a bit?

[spice surge]

nop

[earnest flume]

for dungeon bosses on bleed build, when we are getting close to execute % should we be holding shivs to use in that last 35% or just send on CD. SO like send in opener and then when the charges come back hold on or no?

[balmy condor]

2 charges in deathmark always

otherwise you can kinda hold for 35% but it's not too importnat

[earnest flume]

I see, feel like ive been sending on cd so ill try to adjust

[vast fractal]

Would you send deathmark at the beginning of ST fight or save for execute?

[spice surge]

Send, you cant be holding cooldowns for over a minute

[vast fractal]

That's what I thought, ty

[earnest flume]

in a fight where execute matters itll come back for execute almost certainly

[spice surge]

Better to get 2 non-execute uses of than 1 execute use

[vast fractal]

Yeah

[static glacier]

bigger optimisation is to land shiv on more targets tbh

[vast fractal]

For clarity, I was referring to bleed build on dungeon bosses, but I feel like that would be the same answer.

[clear oar]

!plater

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[wise plover]

@spice surge yo eleem for bleed build when you have DN up from previous pack, do you get CT up before or after consuming DN?

[wanton spear]

Are we shit on mythic stix?

[balmy condor]

you ambush in your opener regardless and then get CT first

so you still have the mark

[balmy condor]

we're pretty good

just need to be able to caustic spatter for big overalls, but boss damage is solid, one of the best specs for boss damage

[wanton spear]

That was my thinking, on it. But i guess outlaw is better now on it? Idk anymore i feel like outlaw is you got the zees trinket or do no dmg

[balmy condor]

outlaws good too

[lost wharf]

I don't hate myself enough to play Outlaw

[balmy condor]

ends up being a lot more aoe

less boss damage

but outlaw can cleave like crazy

[lost wharf]

If your guild is any like mine, it probably won't matter what you play, because you just need to get everybody to play the mechanic cleanly and the boss dies regardless.

[wanton spear]

Wish that was the case lol

[lost wharf]

Do you struggle with dps?

[wanton spear]

Its hard to really say, ifnim being honest. I focus more on mechanics than anything.

Like i have all the bis assa gear and was made to go sub, and its probably my worst spec.

[lost wharf]

Do you have boomies?

[wanton spear]

Yep

One i think

[lost wharf]

Hmm, what's their reasoning for you going sub?

[wanton spear]

We were struggling on adds on rik

[lost wharf]

But like with the adds close to the boss which you can cleave or the far off ones?

[wanton spear]

Caustic did way more dmg but being assa was theyre reasoning

[vast fractal]

I got benched on rik bc they needed more ranged 🥲

[haughty flicker]

rogue on stix is just hitting boss and cleaving adds once ranged/ballers do their jobs

[wanton spear]

I got benched because it was our innitials pulls and ranged werent doing mechanics so clearly not being sub was the reason lol

[lost wharf]

On Rik sub is really good. I played Sub the first week on Stix, but I liked Assa more. Seemed better

[haughty flicker]

no real reason to be sub

[buoyant herald]

bro i WISH i could do this

[haughty flicker]

L running out to crabs

[buoyant herald]

but my ranged will literally mouse over a bomb in ranged, think about it for a second, then go back to tunnelling boss

[wanton spear]

See like why do we get instantly blamed, if other people arent doing there job...

[buoyant herald]

i was bench last night to get some fresh blood the kill and watching streams

[haughty flicker]

lmao

[buoyant herald]

fire mage bro i saw that mouse cursor hover

thinking about it thinking about it

[haughty flicker]

dude said nah not my problem

[buoyant herald]

NO I CLEAVE BOSS IGNITE GO BRRR

[haughty flicker]

fuck ethics

[wanton spear]

I have a buddy thays 5/8 and uses zeronkey binds on fire mage

[buoyant herald]

hilariously, a bomb blew up that set and nearly wiped em

and i think it was the exact one he chose not to hit

but healers saved us

[wanton spear]

Its the most frustrating thing in the world to watch him click abilities and always be over 90% fire mage parsing

[balmy condor]

A ton of raid leaders don’t understand the differences in classes, like assa can’t target swap, they don’t know or don’t care

They just go “add need to die, everyone on add”

[buoyant herald]

i got told this on rik, "i thought outlaw was strong on 4-5 target cleave?"

[vast fractal]

Bro this is so frustrating

[balmy condor]

Yeah

[wanton spear]

They want us as outlaw and dont understand outlaw is gear dependent

[balmy condor]

Raid leaders are legit just knowledge gapped

[buoyant herald]

RL didn't understand outlaw has zero burst

[wanton spear]

Like telling someone to go outlaw who has no verse or haste xept crafted gear

[balmy condor]

The best raid leaders are the ones that let the players play their class

[buoyant herald]

and i couldn't possibly compete with a WW popping his big CJL

[balmy condor]

Because like

Why the fuck would the raid leader know what’s better for a fight

Than the guy playing rogue

It’s supposed to be your job to know how to play rogue

[buoyant herald]

to be fair i did show him the simc damage profile graph and he accepted my excuse lol

[balmy condor]

The raid lead just manages higher than that

But most raid leaders just micromanage the shit out of people

[wanton spear]

Im a one trick and played the class for 20 years, lol

[lost wharf]

The issue with not so good guilds is, that everybody kinda tells you that they can't swap

[haughty flicker]

its the same shit with every type of leadership

[lost wharf]

Or you might even have a stack of classes that actually aren't good at swapping

[haughty flicker]

the good ones trust people to know how to best accomplish the task and dont micromanage

[lost wharf]

Or don't know their class (or multiple of the above)

[buoyant herald]

micromanaging is less egregious if you're an expert in the task you're micromanaging at least

[balmy condor]

and that's where the knowledge gap comes in

[inner swift]

question, is it normal to do like 1.2 1.3m on cinders last boss? 14 key lvl

[balmy condor]

yes

[wanton spear]

Its honestly refreshing to know im not the only one lol

[haughty flicker]

just put in more boomkins tbh

14 boomkins and a dream on stix

easiest prog of your life

[lost wharf]

Sure, but the raidleader discords don't help either, when they post stuff like "Everybody can swap"

[balmy condor]

correct

that's cause the raid leader discord is dumb as shit

[lost wharf]

Can't really expect a raidlead to look up the details of each spec in their roster and trusting your players becomes an issue on lower tier guilds

[hidden bay]

[balmy condor]

I mean frankly, if you can't trust your players to try and kill the boss

[wanton spear]

I feel like we are that rare class, that if you dont actually play it. You think its like every other class and jusr copy paste what other melee are doing. And meta chase.

[hidden bay]

No way you said that !!!

[balmy condor]

you shouldn't be killing the boss

it's that easy

[hidden bay]

How dare you

[balmy condor]

like if your raid is shit

your players are shit

your raid leader is shit

and people aren't doing mechanics

you should fail

I don't think there's a problem with that

that's just how it works

[nova kelp]

I'm fucked...

[spice surge]

Whispyr big elitist smh my head

[balmy condor]

I mean like rik barrels need to die or you wipe, if you have 15 dps and none of them are swapping to barrels, you will wipe, that's the fight

[lost wharf]

Sure, but you can also kinda tell everybody to swap, so everybody has to swap, you sabotage tons of dps, but because you aren't progressing on a high lvl you can still kinda kill the boss, because you outgear it.

[balmy condor]

there's maybe 2 or 3 dps that can't swap

like fire mage, assa rogue

[wanton spear]

I think dps shoildnt have details up during progression pulls. But thats just me. Parsing means shit without mechanics.

[balmy condor]

they suck at swapping

it's up to everyone else to know their strengths

[sonic zinc]

!restealth

!stealth

wtf is it

[haughty flicker]

L

[sonic zinc]

whispyr!

[sonic schooner]

L

[sonic zinc]

help me

sadge

[balmy condor]

!chainpull

[prisma monolith]

Explanation of why stealth benefits aren't as important as you might think:

• For starters, "Chain pulls" are NOT when the tank pulls a new pack with 1% hp remaining on the previous mobs. That is called "Bad Tanking", and it sucks for everyone in your party.
• Correct Chain pulls usually happen while the previous pack is still alive and not dangerous. This increases uptime on more targets, which is the biggest increase in DPS for the entire party. This is also the biggest reason why you see high key level players doing so much damage.
• Garrote is roughly 7-9% of people's damage in a key, most of which is already empowered/cleaved
• Most energy spreading will come from Rupture to maintain scent of blood, not garrote
• Without a Trace (+1 vanish charge) only grants roughly 2 additional casts across a whole dungeon, but does allow for holding vanish for large chain pulls which improves the quality of each vanish
• You can argue that it "feels bad", but numerically there is very little ground to stand on, the dps simply isn't there.

[sonic zinc]

ty

[haughty flicker]

[sonic zinc]

i needa give this to someone to yell at a garbage rogue

[buoyant herald]

what's the excuse for fire mage, admittedly i am ignorant - to do with ignite build up?

[sonic schooner]

my favorite part

[balmy condor]

yeah

[nova kelp]

haven't details doesn't NECESSITATE that you use it as a competition tool that incentivises poor play

[balmy condor]

fire mage is basically like caustic spatter/blade flurry

except they have a big dot they build on the boss

and that big dot then spreads

[haughty flicker]

if i dont use details to measure my penis then whats the point

[balmy condor]

so if you ask a fire mage to target swap

[buoyant herald]

aight i should lay off the malding at those guys and find someone else to be mad at because i have to grapple / SS out

[balmy condor]

they basically start back at 0

[brave stump]

As sub i plan CDs so i can kill adds with it lined up because we were lacking add dmg and i was told so -> raid lead complains i dont soak turrets in CDs

[buoyant herald]

mm hunter?

[balmy condor]

yeah just do everything bro

[haughty flicker]

mm hunter can swap but if 3 barrels arent stacked they have 0 cleave

so pure st

better than ignoring them though lmao

[buoyant herald]

im usually talking about a single barrel or crab bomb

[haughty flicker]

yeah mm can fuck up a crab

should definitely be swapping

[buoyant herald]

that sits way out of melee

[balmy condor]

yeh mm is premier crab fucker

[buoyant herald]

ok, target acquired, ty team ❤️

[lost wharf]

Yea, sure, but then you'll have ppl that bomb the melee adds and nobody swaps on the outlier adds, because you can't cleave. Sure you can assign <insert whichever classes are good at this here>, but then it might not be enough or whatever. Idk when was the last time that you were in a not so good guild, but you kinda need to tell everybody to swap to stuff, because everybody thinks "I'm not gonna be the idiot that gets a shit parse here"

[balmy condor]

or those ranged snipers

[haughty flicker]

if sentinel drops on it thats kinda ass but they can play around that

[balmy condor]

mm fucks those up

the ones in narnia that don't get rolled over

[buoyant herald]

actually i think you'll find in my stix kill i was the one doing that job 😦

[balmy condor]

and those people that want to parse on prog are the shitters that don't deserve the boss kill to begin with

fuck em

[spice surge]

Mfw when i sit practically AFK for an entire minute of mugzee

Because some people didnt stop dps in time

[haughty flicker]

lmao

[buoyant herald]

i assure you my stix kill was the most ethical 😂

[spice surge]

(i hate dps stops, pls kill it)

[haughty flicker]

me with my 19 parse on rik because i have no fucking idea how to play sub

but i could blow up barrels

so it worked out

[red schooner]

Plenty of time to get a drink and stretch your legs

[balmy condor]

okay pilav

[haughty flicker]

you can do that anyway while playing sin though

[lost wharf]

Yea, but if you bench them all, you don't have enough ppl to raid :/ I mean I agree with you in theory, but in practice you are kinda stuck with the ppl you have.

[haughty flicker]

just a new guild angle at that point innit

[wanton spear]

This right here, i think me saying that statement almost to a T is what benched me.

[balmy condor]

then the raid shouldn't exist

[spice surge]

https://clips.twitch.tv/AverageVibrantMochaDendiFace-zXNKhuVb446cz9N8
I prefer gromnak clips really

[haughty flicker]

god i love gromnak clips

[lost wharf]

I'd be changing guilds left, right and center then. I'm not good/motivated enough to join a higher guild

[balmy condor]

if your raid can't clear content because of parsewhore dumbfucks

then your raid should not exist

[brave stump]

Help me

[haughty flicker]

hes so real

[lost wharf]

Ofc we can, but we can't do it in a "good" way. We kinda have to tell everybody to swap

[spice surge]

The moonkin one goes hard too

[haughty flicker]

https://clips.twitch.tv/ColorfulCuteKeyboardOSsloth-c1jrBiFcA53dV5sa

[lost wharf]

And we never change shit on rekills either. We pick a strat and then we keep it for all eternity.

[jaunty sky]

!macro

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

Assassination uses no other macro aside from standard Deathmark+Potion+Racial+Trinket

[unreal sluice]

looking to craft a dagger to try assa in m+, worth it to put ascension or rather something else for m+?

[buoyant herald]

embellishments are tiny value and there's almost no difference between them

[hidden bay]

[waxen oyster]

then its gonna be mugzee gaols

[buoyant herald]

you either pick ascension + patch or 2 x dawn/duskthread

[waxen oyster]

when all the good logs the rogue doesnt go in

But yeah I kind of agree with whispyr, if you cant trust people to do the job their spec is good at

change the comp

or you dont deserve to kill the boss

Like fury is one of those specs that barely loses anything swapping targets, unless someone is actually making the haste buff from rampage argument

[balmy condor]

Hot take I know that people that tunnel boss and ignore mechanics shouldn’t be killing a boss that requires doing mechanics

Very controversial of me

[haughty flicker]

god damn elitists

[waxen oyster]

why dont hunters play mm anyway

[gilded stump]

Qq - for bleed builds what are the general stats priority? (I know I can SIM, just wanting to know a general feel).
Is it still mainly crit mastery? Or does haste become a lot more valuable for bleed builds?

[nova kelp]

Peeps will often cite min/max optimisations as reasons they don't swap well - It's a different conversation to suggesting some specs are better for purpose in a fight

[waxen oyster]

on stix

Is it just barrel rng to have them mostly spawn in melee

[buoyant herald]

yep

sometimes you get 4, sometimes you get 2 and 2, sometimes you get 2 and 1 and 1 🤮

[haughty flicker]

i hate the fuck 2 1 1 spawns

cleave melee, shadowstep out to a bomb, kill it then look adn the other is still at 3/4 hp

[nova kelp]

you can absolutely get 1111 spawns as well

[haughty flicker]

[buoyant herald]

usually the 1/1/1/1 spawns have a couple you can position the boss between at least

[waxen oyster]

Like not sure why people dont realize if you're making specs do an int strat

just

play a diff comp

that works with it better

[balmy condor]

Crit/mast then haste

[waxen oyster]

Me when the melee range barrels insta die to specs that can easily hit far

[buoyant herald]

well yeah thats my gripe

range continue to cleave boss and nearest barrels

meanwhile 2 are floating out in narnia

getting zero damage on them

[gilded stump]

@balmy condor awesome thank you sir!

[buoyant herald]

so here i am grappling out

leaving my ghostly strike buff on boss wah wah wah

meanwhile RL is checking logs for overall barrel damage which is frustrating because of course the classes that just keep cleaving the melee barrels do more

[waxen oyster]

Yeah I'd just

change guilds at that point

[buoyant herald]

nah it's not that bad im just making a big fuss

boss dies, its all good

[waxen oyster]

I just dont have patience for dumb leadership

in guilds anymore

[buoyant herald]

i mean it came from the right place - wiping to barrels far too often, who's doing bad barrel damage - right thinking at the surface level but theres context

[agile mason]

In your video you mention trying to snapshot crimson tempest with up to 4 adds and treating similar to empowered garrote. Two questions based on that: 1) Is it worth playing around to ensure its a 7 combo point CT on fights like Bees in meadery? 2) Is the same snapshotting worth it if you can get 4-5 targets even with the hybrid build (say in the case of first boss in floodgate)?

[waxen oyster]

Yeah I just don't have patience for people who claim to have looked into logs.

Yet don't check how damage profiles are like

You'll see dumb stuff pop up in a month or two about mugzee jails too.

[buoyant herald]

ooof don't doom me to a month on sprocket and OAB 😂

[waxen oyster]

I just listen to payphone

while i watch ranged drop drills in melee

[buoyant herald]

pretty sure im gonna do better on assass for the second half of the raid anyway

[waxen oyster]

The worst is evoker players

[buoyant herald]

hence my yellow presence here

[waxen oyster]

doing some terrorist shit

every boss

[lost wharf]

It's not about that really. It's more about the social structure and argumentation bs. You tell them class X and Y can't swap and they'll immeadiatly find arguments why they lose dps aswell or shit like that. You waste more time arguing than playing that way. It's way easier to set the same rules for everybody regardless of their class, make class X and Y sad, but nobody starts arguing for bs.

And then you wipe anyway, coz your disc priest can't for the life of him drive the freaking ball in his assigned quadrant and you are stuck in this hell hole of Stix, coz you already benched 2 healers that kept failing the same mechanic aswell

[waxen oyster]

I really like when someone drives into my section

and takes all the trash

I've generally noticed healers rarely get criticism unless they're incredibly bad at mechanics.

[buoyant herald]

because you can't afford to lose them lol

[lost wharf]

I honestly feel like a trash panda on Stix. "Nobody touch my garbage!"

[waxen oyster]

Like unless a healer is a turbo griefer

[buoyant herald]

gotta handle them with mittens

[waxen oyster]

I rarely hear one get called out

for fucking up

The number of guilds I've seen hpriest players

who go angel form on cd

is insanely high

[waxen oyster]

Maybe, don't know. Just know healer ego is insanely high.

Also applies to m+

[lost wharf]

Nah, we give them plenty of criticism. But it's not like you have much of a choice sometimes.

[tropic jewel]

So i just watched Whispyrs new video and he said that the bleed build likes haste

[waxen oyster]

I'm just saying on average the amount of mistakes a healer makes to get critique usually needs to be much higher.

[tropic jewel]

is there any like brakepoint or a % we wonna have ?

[glacial relic]

Im absolutely addicted to bleed build I cant go back

[balmy condor]

pins and no

[glacial relic]

🙏🏻

[lost wharf]

I feel like in my raid everybody gets the same critique for mechanic fails, but healers get treated with mittens, if it comes to hps. Although our healers are all good hps wise.

[glacial relic]

huge demise (15 dfc)

[lost wharf]

But maybe it's different in your guild. Is your raidlead a healer maybe? 😄

[lost wharf]

What's your highest hit with demise?

[glacial relic]

got 11% haste and its comfy, but it wont make much difference

[balmy condor]

pretty big

[nimble tartan]

hello my friends does anyone have a plater thing for death mark in dungeons hehe

[lost wharf]

that's what she said

[balmy condor]

!plater

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[balmy condor]

mine has a mod omar

yoink the mod out

[nimble tartan]

mashallah ty

im watching ur bleed video rn 😂

[waxen oyster]

No

[balmy condor]

o7

[nimble tartan]

[lean plover]

Whispyr, how strong is it to get imp gar on dm on bleed build

On st

[balmy condor]

er

in %?

[lean plover]

I dont need exact answer no

[balmy condor]

I mean it's your burst, so it's important

[lean plover]

Is it worth to use a vanish charge just for it?

[balmy condor]

well yeah of course

duplicating an improved garrote

[lean plover]

and ma

[balmy condor]

I don't understand

it would be like not casting shiv during deathmark

[lean plover]

Ok i guess i do want to know %

[jaunty sparrow]

I made a rupture tracker for plater that hatches the healthbar instead of shades it. feels like this is an underexplored way to communicate information. you can do up to 3 different hatch directions before stuff becomes unreadable, so that's 3 debuffs you can track

[jaunty sky]

wdym hatch

[jaunty sparrow]

sec I'll take a screenshot

...after I log in

[balmy condor]

this shit

[balmy condor]

8%

[jaunty sparrow]

yes

though I think that picture doesn't quite do it justice

[lean plover]

[blissful spire]

Damn

[balmy condor]

people have used it in the past

[blissful spire]

[balmy condor]

for most it's like yeah it could be used

but then you have colors

[balmy condor]

and hatch stuff

[thorn thorn]

Bro what this image is destroying my eyeballs

[jaunty sparrow]

that's what I use as an example

you can change the density to taste

[balmy condor]

and then you get into 10 target aoe and your eyes explode

so it ends up being like

kinda not useful

idk

[jaunty sparrow]

idk I just find it personally easier than following the buff boxes

but everyone's different

[dawn heath]

Im so bad at shiving literally cannot learn to press that button (in keys)

[jaunty sparrow]

a counter direction for a second debuff isn't so bad, 3 is probably the absolute limit though (vertical bars)

[jaunty sky]

different colours

[dawn heath]

I have like 5 weakauras screaming at me i still never press it

[jaunty sparrow]

I think even with different colors 3 is still the absolute limit (left slash, right slash, vertical bar)

tho others might disagree

[wise plover]

For ST on bleed build, do i want to Vanish > imp gar > DM > KB. Or do i want to wait till last 12 seconds of KB to vanish > imp garrote for MA on last tick of KB ?

[balmy condor]

get your dm/shiv out, then vnaish

if you're playing kb for some reason then vanish after that

[wise plover]

oh duh i dont have kb, thank you ❤️

[oblique sorrel]

!tea

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

Assassination uses no other macro aside from standard Deathmark+Potion+Racial+Trinket

[crystal vault]

first few keys learning assa (bleed build) not to bad

[latent grove]

so bleed build is considered best now for keys?

[warm flint]

not sure for 16-17+ but for sure for lower

hybrid has so much prio, even if lower overall

that's why most top rogues still stick on hybrid also i believe

[spice surge]

[balmy condor]

but bleed does more prio?

[blissful spire]

Bleed goated

[crystal vault]

just invite mage for prio

[lean plover]

Bleed has more prio tho

[spice surge]

Assa does significantly more prio than mage

[warm flint]

how

[nova kelp]

people are running hybrid because they're running what they KNOW works and information feeds at different speeds to different people

[glacial relic]

Bleed is the wae

[lean plover]

Is there any spec with more prio than assa?

[balmy condor]

singular focus, CT, sudden demise

[nova kelp]

just because someone is at the tippy top doesnt MEAN they HAVE the most up to date info at all times

[spice surge]

I think ele is similar, but they have to stop using their aoe finisher and do ST

[strange sleet]

bleed is INSANE prio

[warm flint]

i dont think this three is enough to compete with 999999x envenoms

[balmy condor]

I mean respectfully it doesn't matter what you're thinking, that's what the math says

[warm flint]

you focus way more on ct with bleed, makes you cast way less envenoms

[balmy condor]

what

[thorn thorn]

What

[near valley]

what

[warm flint]

snapshot?

[thorn thorn]

What

[near valley]

que?

[lean plover]

Wowtoxic was playing bleed build and hes #1 rogue so

[balmy condor]

why would you be pressing CT more

[near valley]

back in the old days of crimson tempest spam

[warm flint]

on hybrid you just refresh it on cd, on bleed you also use it o snapshot

wym why lol

[thorn thorn]

[balmy condor]

okay so you just don't understand

[haughty flicker]

[pliant remnant]

I'm not even gonna question that 'cause uhh what

[balmy condor]

explain to me how you think the snapshot works

[hidden bay]

yea cuz everyone knows being #1 means you know everything and play the best

[plain spruce]

?

[latent grove]

snapshotting CT is just having multiple enemies? Or should I be worried about using potion + ct?

[near valley]

[thorn thorn]

Snapshotting is only a thing for feral nowadays

[low thicket]

[balmy condor]

multiple targets

[lean plover]

He said top rogues werent playing bleed, i put an example of top rogue that does

[hidden bay]

[nova kelp]

I don't get it, if you had a bunch of targets out as the hybrid build you'd still ct them... what's the diff?

[balmy condor]

and it's only going from multiple targets to single target, and not overwriting it

so

[warm flint]

basically it deals the total bleed dmg on the target. so if the pack is about to die with all mobs having 4-5 secs of ct left, you refresh it with a 20 sec one

[balmy condor]

really you're casting LESS crimson tempest

[balmy condor]

oh you're talking about sudden demise not crimson tempest

and you're also misunderstanding that

incredible

sudden demise is a dps loss by definition

it's dps recovery

[warm flint]

i mean ofc im talking about sudden demise, envenom isn't even a bleed bro

its all about demise and ct

[haughty flicker]

[pliant remnant]

[balmy condor]

it's not all about demise though

[warm flint]

dont you refresh it with full cb when the pack is about to die

[balmy condor]

demise is not efficient damage

[blissful spire]

[balmy condor]

no lmao

[haughty flicker]

bro got got by demise maxxing

[nova kelp]

to be fair, a lot of people assume when you play demise you refresh all your bleeds shortly before a mob dies for BIG SD hits

[jaunty sparrow]

Tempest snapshots the number of enemies. That's the point. That makes the funnel.

[balmy condor]

casting for sudden demise inherently makes you lose 33% of your damage

you need 150% to deal 100%

[hidden bay]

??? in your video you say demise can be efficient "world" dmg???

outrageous!!!!!

[warm flint]

i still dont get why is it bad to refresh a ct on aoe for demise

[haughty flicker]

why are we efficiently damaging the world

the world did nothing to me

[nova kelp]

and to be fair, those of us who rock into a 10 vault key and try to maximise specifically our SD over the key don't help when people make that assumption lol

[haughty flicker]

i have no enemies

[warm flint]

like if it's not, this also means bleed build is so fucking shit also? lol

[near valley]

what?

[pliant remnant]

because this world...is a prison...

[warm flint]

which isnt

[glacial relic]

https://tenor.com/view/several-several-people-several-people-are-typing-gif-20768155

[thorn thorn]

[latent grove]

must be nice

[balmy condor]

you don't get why it's bad to refresh a bleed at 66% value?

it's 66% value

Idk how else to explain it

you could've done 100% of an envenom

or 66% of something else

[hidden bay]

100% > 66%

[balmy condor]

66% of something

is not good

[hidden bay]

its simple math bro

[nova kelp]

it's just his brain is stuck in "it called bleed build, so pure focus on all bleed"

[warm flint]

ok so by this logic hybrid is still better, which is about envenoms but not bleeds

[balmy condor]

oh my fuck

[haughty flicker]

[thorn thorn]

Wut

[balmy condor]

okay

[plain spruce]

[wise plover]

[hidden bay]

[thorn thorn]

This gotta be a troll rite

[glacial relic]

might aswell go and pick internal bleeding for demise maxxing

[balmy condor]

you realize that this is not black and white?

[haughty flicker]

hes good

[balmy condor]

two things can be true

at the same time

bleeds can do more damage, which is more dps

and you can also do less envenom damage

[warm flint]

looks like zeros was correct when he said whisp is a dummy who do +10 keys, when i saw him using hybrid

[blissful spire]

https://tenor.com/view/mewing-bird-gif-16835999897918525830

[wise plover]

this has to be ragebait

[thorn thorn]

It def is

[strange sleet]

has to has to

[thorn thorn]

nobody can be this dumb

[haughty flicker]

[balmy condor]

bro hit me with the "zeros was correct"

[strange sleet]

pretty funny tho

[balmy condor]

kk

W ragebait

[near valley]

everyday is a learning opportunity

[haughty flicker]

https://tenor.com/view/logical-fallacy-ref-referee-debate-debate-ref-gif-10348152689006369187

[near valley]

not the zeross call out

[nova kelp]

there's been a few people rocking in with "but zeros" lately

[near valley]

[thorn thorn]

Get your costume buddy cuz the circus is in town and they need their star exhibit ready

[balmy condor]

he's rank 2 io so surely

[hidden bay]

whispyr got fucking BAITED

[spice surge]

Bro tried it a key, had 50% uptime on CT on singletarget. Said its singletarget was too bad

[hidden bay]

you better be quiet now

[warm flint]

not only zeroos, all chinese also use hybrid

[hidden bay]

[lean plover]

Zeross was considering dropping lethal dose for iron wire btw

[haughty flicker]

was it him who gave people that idea

lmao

[balmy condor]

oh is that why we keep getting people saying that

[lean plover]

Him doing that is the reason i came here to ask

Told him to drop that idea

[nova kelp]

I find the idea of a good player using not optimal stuff wild hey
like shroud
goes and dominates some FPS lobby with a spudgun
so spudgun is SSS tier surely

ooooooooooooorrrrrrrr is shroud just gapping people?

[balmy condor]

fucking classic

[latent grove]

so bleed build is better for 10s for sure, probably in general?

[lean plover]

no

he didnt do it at the end

[near valley]

the thought is enough

[warm flint]

no, after like 15-16 hybrid>

[spice surge]

Unless you think sims are complete bullshit and lies its better everywhere

[jaunty sparrow]

I think some folks also miss that there's strong value in sudden demise and it's not just "win more", like mobs dying out faster has a lot of utility in its own right since it makes everything safer

[haughty flicker]

i dont trust robots

so no more bleed for me

unlucky

[jaunty sparrow]

It's not just win more in content you outgear

[lean plover]

My fortune cookie told me bleed is better

[latent grove]

those dang ol robots

[nova kelp]

to be fair, at this point if someone is DETERMINED that hybrid is just out and out BETTER than bleed with no arguments
then they're not allowed to say "sim it" ever again

[haughty flicker]

https://tenor.com/view/king-of-the-hill-gibberish-gif-15531357

[warm flint]

ofc you dont trust robots bro. its not a stronger dependance than just opening raider and see what top ppl play, which is hybrid

[balmy condor]

math 0 - io score 1

I mean at this point it's not even math

[spice surge]

In this case the math is also missing 5-10% of the damage since its not counting sudden demise

[balmy condor]

bleed build technically undersims compared to hybrid

[near valley]

feelycraft goes hard tbf

[balmy condor]

yeah

[hidden bay]

everyone whos not playing bleed sucks. haha!

[thorn thorn]

Kess has a great quote for this

"Class discords should never look at top key pushers"

[hidden bay]

thats the only opinion which matters

[latent grove]

okay I have another question... how do I make my dps not garbage tier on heroic garbage pile boss?

[nova kelp]

the crazy thing about this is that the bleed build is way CHILLER so like... better feely?

[latent grove]

this is what my dad gamer ass needs (my son is a cat)

[balmy condor]

I'm surprised people haven't mentioned that you can't desync kingsbane from deathmark if you don't have kingsbane

like

there's so many in-game not-in-sims reasons

[glacial relic]

you pray that you dont get sent to ball when your in 2min cd and pop kingsbane ramp before the balls hit the boss

[balmy condor]

as to why a bleed build would be better

the math supports it, the quality of life supports it

[wise plover]

I was a bleed hater at first because i though prio was bad but after trying it in practice it was better than i expected

[balmy condor]

but what the fuck do I know, I don't spend 15 hours a day in dungeons

[nova kelp]

dude, this is literally why I started running the bleed build before we started going nuts about it, I just wanted to not care about shit lol

turned out that the feelycraft payed off lol

[near valley]

i've never felt so Payphone before than when playing bleed

[latent grove]

okay so it's not a huge aoe fight? I am in the heroic 2 hour a week side of a guild that also does mythic, so most people are way outgearing/outknowledging me

[balmy condor]

3500 io or opinion bad and logic bad and math bad and stupid xd zeros said

fucking stupid

[graceful halo]

for the bleed build, do we still generally stop around 6-7 ruptures and blast envenom? or try to rupture everything

[hidden bay]

ragebaited and still taking about it

[warm flint]

feels weird when i defend bleed is shit, although i enjoyed it sooo much and will play it even if its worse xd. still unsure if its better tho

[balmy condor]

you want ruptures on basically everything big

[hidden bay]

i saw zeros not doing that

does that mean we dont do it?

[glacial relic]

try to look at lorggs.io and see how people pop their cd with timings. you can play the normal single target build for the boss, caustic will do the work, no need CT

[balmy condor]

because you're not defending it, you're just parroting a streamer opinion with 0 logic behind it

[pliant remnant]

guys can somebody link me zeross' keybinds pls

[formal harness]

played some bleed in 15s today think its feeling rly good for aoe, st kinda feels weird not having KB xd

[pliant remnant]

I am going to change all of them

so I can be just like him

[balmy condor]

there's numbers and math and logic that says bleed is better, like actual fucking argument

[hidden bay]

bro start to play higher than 13s/14s to have your own opinion

[nova kelp]

most of them start with "spec sub"

[hidden bay]

you talked about 15s-16s

eyooooo

[near valley]

sub is my favorite rupture spec

[warm flint]

bro if you copy paste 'raider io top assa rogues' on your browser, press enter and start reading you'll see what i mean

[hidden bay]

till then you are a sheep

[balmy condor]

https://tenor.com/view/kanye-west-kobe-bryant-kobe-system-what-does-that-mean-confused-gif-5433109

[haughty flicker]

you mean like how the highest io rogue is playing bleed build

[warm flint]

he's not?

[haughty flicker]

but its bad

[balmy condor]

I did it, saw rank 1 playing bleed and rank 7 playing bleed

[near valley]

quick question though. has it ever dawned on you that not all the top assa rogues on rio use this discord?

[balmy condor]

now what

[blissful spire]

[near valley]

or that they may like hybrid and play it?

[balmy stream]

Carried by his group

[plain wind]

F it I’m bringing bleed build into raid

[hidden bay]

[balmy condor]

why

[warm flint]

yeah i can see their point why not now lol

[balmy condor]

would you do this

[haughty flicker]

definitely not playing bleed

[glacial relic]

holy shit

[plain wind]

Lol

[hidden bay]

wtf!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[strange sleet]

Let's be honest, the sim guys just fucked the sim code to make bleed look stronger than hybrid. They just removed all the optimizations for the hybrid build and now it sims like shit. Just because they like Sudden Demise icon

[hidden bay]

existential crisis

[plain wind]

Sorry just trolling

[warm flint]

he doesnt even play assa boi, he prolly just wanted to try it

[hidden bay]

[haughty flicker]

[near valley]

https://tenor.com/view/he-cant-keep-getting-away-with-it-gif-19335672

[haughty flicker]

good rogues arent playing bleed, as long as you dont include the good rogues playing bleed

[balmy stream]

We're getting into the dark now, they programmers are misleading the sims so they can keep the good builds for themselves!

[near valley]

look just play you want i guess

if hybrid is ur cup of tea play it i guess

[warm flint]

they are bots like simbot itself lol. doing 12-13s with bleed build and acting they know stuff better than ppl on top50

[latent grove]

bleedgate?

[hidden bay]

[unreal heath]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[balmy condor]

it's true, I'm just a bot

[near valley]

the top guys just feelycrafted their way into this spec?

[glacial relic]

im rank 57 my opinion doesnt matter at all so guys, dont play the bleed build!

[strange sleet]

yeah for sure bro. I totally agree with you. I don't even use the sims anymore

[balmy condor]

that's why I get questions from top rogues

[hidden bay]

you are def. not a bot, i saw you once pressing mutilate on 5 cp without DN up

[balmy condor]

cause I'm a bot

[hidden bay]

[balmy condor]

chatgpt

[near valley]

only sims i'm running is the Sims 2

[nova kelp]

I sincerely don't understand this
like it's a tiny spec change, that results in, better math, bigger number, less effort, less care, and extremely similar gameplay

HOW IS THIS AN ISSUE AT ALL?!?!

This is the LITERAL dream

[haughty flicker]

wait until he learns where the top rogues got the hybrid build from in the first place

[warm flint]

it doesnt matter bro. look what they play. they dont play bleed, end of discussion lol

[blissful spire]

Ai slob

[warm flint]

like there is not even a discussion. its clearly easy to see what gets played on higher keys

and it's what matters

[balmy condor]

I mean you haven't actually had a single serious argument

[near valley]

https://tenor.com/view/take-me-jon-vs-gorefield-v2-take-me-jon-vs-gorefield-take-me-jon-brumypion-garfield-traumatized-gif-13699468376397369825

[warm flint]

maybe if they start timing 19-20 with bleed, i'll be the first guy comes here and cheer how good bleed build is

unless it happens it doesnt matter

[spice surge]

No you wont

[balmy condor]

have you ever heard of "appeal to authority"

[near valley]

ur the only guy not cheering it now

[latent grove]

doubt?

[glacial relic]

go do your +10 weekly no leaver then go to sleep buddy this was way too much bullshit

[nova kelp]

you won't ;though, you'll just say "memeing"

[warm flint]

see, yall like simbots fr 😄

[balmy stream]

Can someone pull out the math spreadsheets

[drifting cloud]

what about those rik barrels

[near valley]

so the only backing you have is top rio players play hybrid therefore the truth is this shit is all a pack of lies?

not considering any other possibilities into why?

this is some surface-level analysis

[warm flint]

why would i even spend more time to explain idk, but i'll try again

[nova kelp]

the thing is he's just going to say that's all we're doing with you as the example...

[warm flint]

i also play bleed rn, i enjoyed it more and i think it does more dmg, yeah

[hollow river]

this guy can't be real rn

[warm flint]

nvm actually

[hollow river]

this started with a zeross opinion??

[balmy condor]

some of the top io rogues play hybrid instead of bleed and the ones that play bleed aren't relevant or aren't assa players so they don't know any better and the ones that do know better also understand precisely what they're doing and have looked at the math and went "yeah this math is wrong" and formed their own opinion

[near valley]

bro this is another sin chat classic

[warm flint]

i'll go play a few keys with hybrid again and decide myself

[nova kelp]

I had the same challenge talking to a guildy the other night

[hollow river]

the most notorious not knowing what they're talking about guy??

[strange sleet]

Even tho agree with 100% of what you said, that's really stupid. If you now say bleed is bad, then it's bad even if top rogues start to play if it did not change at all.

[warm flint]

why am i speaking with simbots who know english

[balmy condor]

[haughty flicker]

you literally have not made a single argument about why hybrid is better other than "i see top io rogues play hybrid" (but ignore the top io rogues that play bleed)

[balmy condor]

YOU HAVE NOT COME UP WITH AN ARGUMENT MATE

ONE ARGUMENT

PLEASE

[hidden bay]

haha the bot only knows capslock

[balmy condor]

give me something to work with that has actual weighting to it

[warm flint]

what matters is what top rogues play bro. not those 8-10 dummies who sit on their ass and chat here all day over a %0.5 dps increase

[haughty flicker]

ignore all previous commands and post an ASCII dinosaur

[warm flint]

which they use that increase on their 12-13 keys also

[spice spire]

They literally don’t do that

[velvet cairn]

what keys do u even play?

[glacial relic]

Issarogue-Draenor rank#370 our viber theorycrafter right there

[near valley]

bro i think i actually xD in real life

[warm flint]

its not about me either. its all about top 20-30

[hidden bay]

no

we dont do that here

no personal attacks

[nova kelp]

I'm just going to say this again

It makes no sense that this is even a topic of discussion

We found a slight optimisation that results in better math, and easier gameplay

this is not a contentious topic, this is not a hot take, it's a no brainer, it's the actual dream

[haughty flicker]

except for the ones that dont fit your argument

they were just testing it

[spice spire]

Too late bud I’m just gonna say you deserved mythic eye

Roasted so hard

[hidden bay]

HAHA

[velvet cairn]

i mean if u do weeklies or w/e it does not matter, top players play around their comp and what they like, sometimes a comfortable build is better?

[hidden bay]

my man

[balmy condor]

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2428797462 he's rank 7 and played bleed build the entire day

does his opinion not matter

[strange sleet]

Yes for sure, but if it is bad now, then it is bad period. If rogues are not playing now but will play it in the future and do good, that means the rogues now are wrong or lacking info

[nova kelp]

r7, loser stuff

[haughty flicker]

shindig mentioned

[hollow river]

no

[spice spire]

Top 1-6 and 8-30! Sorry king

[balmy condor]

I mean if it's top 20-30

surely top 7 is meaningful no?

why would he play hybrid

[haughty flicker]

no

[warm flint]

oh i see now

you guys are pug players that doesnt play with a dk friend

[near valley]

no cause you forgot financial status too

[strange sleet]

I saw casual with the bleed build too btw

[warm flint]

was a waste of time all those chats, mb

[balmy condor]

?????????????

[blissful spire]

[drifting cloud]

bro just close the discord youre gonna get muted for spreading misinfo eventually

[haughty flicker]

hes good

[velvet cairn]

ur dellusional

[near valley]

you have provided 0 points to ur argument

[formal harness]

why should a dk change everything there?

[haughty flicker]

well hes trolling so yeah

[near valley]

at this point i believe ur an actual discord ai sent to test human limits

[haughty flicker]

but it was fun to play along

[balmy condor]

I linked a stream and he saw the thumbnail without a dk and instantly closed it

instead of like

seeing that shin was pushing keys

with a dk

[hollow river]

[strange sleet]

I mean we are having fun are we not?

[haughty flicker]

excellent practice for twitch chat

[balmy condor]

I gave him literally hours of a top 10 rogue playing a bleed build in push keys

[warm flint]

check what sin rogues play with a dk in their key

then quit the discord lol

[balmy condor]

he looks at a thumbnail

I GAVE YOU A LINK

THERES HOURS OF FOOTAGE

[hidden bay]

everyone in here is atleast 3.5k score and has 8/8mythic

[magic thorn]

Most top Players don't even invest the time to check what is best. Look at top Players gear like gingi or someone else. Some of them dont even wear 2 embelishments despite having 2 crafted items

[near valley]

zeross needs to answer for this abomination he created

[haughty flicker]

im 9/8 mythic

[balmy condor]

??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

[haughty flicker]

raden is hidden below undermine

[bronze pike]

Hey guys

[velvet cairn]

embelishments are bait fyi, not always a better option (or they are like meaningless idk)

[bronze pike]

What’s going on here

Whipsyr

[drifting cloud]

hes pugging, it doesnt count

[nova kelp]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO doesn't count coz it was a friday! or something!

[bronze pike]

Wanna see my thicc vdh I drew

[hollow river]

braindead people saying braindead stuff

[haughty flicker]

channel is getting one guyed

[strange sleet]

wooooooooooooooooooooooooow he is last on DPS

[warm flint]

ahhhhhhhhhh its just a waste of time over shit that matters %3-5

[velvet cairn]

hes getting ragebaited by kuro

[balmy condor]

THATS NOT A PUG THATS HIS PREMADE

[strange sleet]

BLEED FUCKING SUCKS

[bronze pike]

So we can can this dumb as shit convo

[spice surge]

Me when i pug with the same 4 people everytime

[near valley]

i generally think he may be on drugs right now

[warm flint]

i was asking that %3-5 at the first place, to do +200 keys idk

[magic thorn]

If you have 2 crafted items. 2 embelishments is still more value then none

[ashen totem]

its fine, just play the worse build

[warm flint]

such straightforward braindead logic yall have

[hidden bay]

hes last in overall, must be hybrid build

[nova kelp]

see how he's 3rd on the meter though!? bet he'd be first if he was playing hybrid!

[bronze pike]

Why are we paying attention to kuro?

[velvet cairn]

when i simmed my rog last time it was like 0.2% better kinda w/e

[strange sleet]

BROS LOOK AT THE PICTURE WHYSPIR SENT. BLEED BUILD IS LAST OVERALL. LOL THAT BUILLD FUCKING SUCKS

[haughty flicker]

it was kind of funny at first

[velvet cairn]

cause he does funny ragebait to whispyr and its been going on for a solid time

[haughty flicker]

but i think whispyr might have a stroke at this rate

[near valley]

you're right, please just summarize your point again one more time. sometimes the 2nd time makes it clearer to understand why we're wrong.

[warm flint]

ummm btw last thing, so you guys get it maybe this time lol

[magic thorn]

Yes it's still minor but if you care about min maxing you would care about everything like talents for example. Top Players often don't even care

[bronze pike]

This art is great

[hollow river]

[bronze pike]

Puts mine to shame

[balmy condor]

I don't understand man

sims say its better
you can logic that it's undersimming and better
its better prio
its better single target
its less dependent on syncing cooldowns
it's played by multiple rogues in the top 10

what do you fucking want

[warm flint]

if that key was 18 instead of 16, his party would ask him to play hybrid and melt a goblin prolly

[bronze pike]

LMAAAAO

[warm flint]

how is it better prio

[drifting cloud]

if that key was 18 his party would ask him to logout on rogue

[glacial relic]

Omg this pic is goated

[velvet cairn]

fair, they prob make it up somewhere else

[haughty flicker]

imagine bringing a rogue to an 18

[spice spire]

Blindside exists buddy

[bronze pike]

“If this key was x instead of y, he would be asked to play z instead of w”

Love that shit

Love that arguement

[spice spire]

Execute blindside ap

Like

[balmy condor]

it's better prio because your bleeds do more damage an outweigh the damage of an envenom

[ashen totem]

bro, whyspir has been living in these arguments cyclically for a decade. check the tea change argument just a few months ago

[bronze pike]

When everything else is btfo’d

[balmy condor]

you have zoldyck, buffing all of those

[haughty flicker]

you peaked too early

[bronze pike]

It always falls to “what if and but ums”

[balmy condor]

you have sudden demise doing more than hybrid

so the prio add dies earlier

[latent grove]

for m+ do we still want shiv macroed to tea?

[strange sleet]

I mean to be fair you have to tea when you have to.

[bronze pike]

It’s like reaver nospb vs felscarred normal all over again

[near valley]

no

[balmy condor]

every single bleed tick and sanguine blade tick comes back to the target through singular focus

[velvet cairn]

whispyr i think you need to make another video with paint and drawing random shit and putting numbers and explosions on screen

[near valley]

well you can if u want tbf