assassination

[merry bison]

I woke up like 3 hours ago and you had to go to sleep cuz of work and now you're still here

[balmy condor]

Such is my stupid brain

[merry bison]

rest your paws

[balmy condor]

My paws look like this so hers can look like this

[final star]

Might help with the "I was not in that" too

[merry bison]

https://tenor.com/view/orange-cat-cat-side-eye-cat-side-eye-orange-cat-staring-gif-4749659952322810298

u spoke like a lion

[sharp viper]

I wish I had an apartment big enough to get a cat

[subtle tundra]

how can you go to work with shit sleep

i am dying

and i slept during the weekend 11 hrs and 10 hrs

[royal lantern]

caffein addiction?

[balmy condor]

The trick is to just like be different idk

[subtle tundra]

i drink 2-3 coffees

[royal lantern]

yeha, thats it then

[subtle tundra]

?!?!

[balmy condor]

I’m fine with 4 hours of sleep but I can also do 15 hours of sleep

[subtle tundra]

i sleep 5-6hrs during the week

😦

not enough...

[royal lantern]

mate if you constantly pump down coffe/energy drinks, you hardwire your body for caffein to function

[subtle tundra]

i dont need coffee if i sleep enough

lol

[royal lantern]

• not regular sleep schedule + wrong amount of sleep is a shit combination aswell

[subtle tundra]

i dont need them now either

[balmy condor]

Consider the following

[subtle tundra]

ok my sleep schedule is pretty regular

just not...

good

[royal lantern]

this could be you

[subtle tundra]

he can sleep why cant i

[balmy condor]

Technically it is me

Those are my legs

[balmy condor]

Same

[solemn forum]

hey guys, quick question, I always get killed with fixate on NW when my evade is up. Should the evade work on this spell?

[subtle oyster]

It doesnt work no

[subtle tundra]

it works but the mob does have a tank buster that goes through evasion

so you die

[subtle oyster]

Not once did my evasion work on the fixate

[warm vortex]

Whysp are you even gonna sleep tonight

[subtle tundra]

you need to vanish

or maybe it doesnt work at all

but yea evasion is not the answer

[subtle oyster]

He asked for evasion specifically though

[subtle tundra]

vanish/bop

[subtle tundra]

and im allowed to help further

[proud badge]

Why is Outlaw simming higher but everyone and their mother plays assassination? Is it impossible to do those numbers on Outlaw?

[subtle oyster]

Some people value the health of their wrist

[proud badge]

lmfao, what is the current APM of outlaw? SC2 Level probably

[hard garnet]

It’s also more down to the overall Utility of Ass as well

[proud badge]

But for raid? I get it in m+ with garrote

[hard garnet]

In raid you run 4 poisons

And on top of that as Ass is dot heavy, as there are a lot of fights where you have downtime of not be able to be stuck to the boss

The Dots help reduce the impact of that downtime

For example rash

[coral ibex]

raid fights are not 5 min patchwerks

[proud badge]

That actually makes a lot of sense ye, tyty was just wondering because outlaw sims so high and I've barely seen any

[subtle tundra]

the 4 poisons are exactly 0 utility more than 2 poisons

dot heavy has nothing to do with viability

man

[hard garnet]

Broodtwister crippling and atrophic

[subtle tundra]

crippling is 0 utility

[hard garnet]

Huh?

[subtle tundra]

cause the mobs already get 2 billion % slowed

by other specs

[hard garnet]

Well agree to disagree

[subtle tundra]

nope

nothing to disagree with

[hard garnet]

We’ll

[spring sigil]

Stupid question. Can i interrupt a mob without having to specifically tab target to it and lose the focus on my current enemy?

[subtle tundra]

youre just wrong

[hard garnet]

The top 100 rogues ratio of brood logs seems to say otherwise

[subtle tundra]

????

[nova aspen]

yes, mouseover macros

[subtle tundra]

nah

youre just

dumb

ok

[hard garnet]

Count how many outlaw rogues vs ass rogues

[subtle tundra]

LOL

conversation over

ty

[hard garnet]

Also have a look at how many use the 4 poisons

[spring sigil]

Ooo i need to look into a mouseover macro then

[hard garnet]

Yeah it’s a must have for interrupts

[sharp viper]

you can use a mouseover kick macro like
/use [@mouseover]Kick

[hard garnet]

Can also use mouseover for kidney etc if you want to be giga efficient in M+ content

[sharp viper]

or use shift+tab to go back to your previous target (not sure about the standard keybinding for that)

[hard garnet]

I think it’s called in keybind focuselasttarget

[marble tusk]

hello again

[elfin rock]

Wait, thats a thing?

[hard garnet]

Yeah it’s in keybinds under focuslasttarget

[strange python]

hey, someone told me that i shouldnt spend gilded on hero gear pass 619, can anyone verify if that is the most effcient way to spend? which also means 619 champion gear is good til i replace it with myth gear?

[sharp viper]

it should be targetlasttarget, you can put
/targetlasttarget
in a macro and it will go to your previous target

[marble tusk]

I brought my logs again, is it cringe this time too?
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/rvVQGgxR4yAJ6dnB#fight=19&type=damage-done&source=228

[royal lantern]

you use 4 cus lethal dose wants you to use 4

but allright

nobody is using crippling for "lol slow utility"

cus thats not a thing in raids

ita a stack for lethal dose, nothing more

shit is slowed anyway in raids by default

[subtle oyster]

And the ghuunis get vaporized nowadays anyway ontop of it.

[spice spire]

You’re kingsbaning before shiv for some reason

It’s shiv > kingsbane

[tired girder]

is there anything special that goes into using sikran's endless aresenal? or just use it on cd?

[lunar sonnet]

you missed your first transmitter, the buff never gets applied the first time you pressed it

[delicate atlas]

yo guys is there any information about fatebound flips minmax do u just play normally or u need to play around them ?

[sharp viper]

completely ignore them

[marble tusk]

I know. There was a sphere, and I didn't notice which direction it went

[delicate atlas]

aight ty man

[lunar sonnet]

from a glance, other than the sequencing quake said, you arent using master assassin at all, you want to vanish around 7 seconds left on your kingsbane (reapply improved garrote too)

during deathmark **

[subtle tundra]

do you not shiv to get huge aoe slow with ap? i hold it

[tired girder]

Anyone know hot to use sikran's endless aresenal trinket? anything special?

[lunar sonnet]

i think 2 of the "stances" are directional, and will do damage where your character is facing, so just keep that in mind when pressing it

[oak pollen]

Guys, whats the deal of playing double vanish on m+? Is it really better than 1 lethality?

[limber spire]

Hi there, I've got a question here my simulation linked : https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/2uSunZm6jTBCh93Ex5QGud I think it's a pretty bad simulation damage for mono. The question is first is that really bad or are my inputs stupid and 2nd what gear should i prioritize to improve it the fastest way ?

[marble tusk]

I’ll be back after the reset and continue working on my CD sequence

[vagrant brook]

in a standard patchwerk 5min fight your damage seems okay
just pick master assassin instead of improved poisons, and forced induction
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/o1QjW9RVQZJJDzYkdvHKkb

[normal mist]

Usually ilvl is king, other than that you sim.
Good trinkets and a good MH make huge difference

[limber spire]

Ok so it was the input that was incorrecty i see You used patchwerk what's the difference between patchwerk and dummy ?

[marble tusk]

I missed the timing to refresh Rupture a few times. Need to put a WA with the duration across the whole screen

[normal mist]

Raid buffs

[vagrant brook]

target dummy is no raid buffs, no consumables, and the target is at 100% hp all the time so you don't benefit from our execute under 35%

[silver wyvern]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/BKdk7jw284YpP9DQ#fight=1&type=damage-done guys can you help me analyze this log ? Is there obvious improvments ?

[limber spire]

Ah Yes that change a lot

Thank You !

[solar wyvern]

I've got a question thats been at the back of my mind. When I tab target it almost always prioritizes a casting mob

Is there a hidden logic in the game?

Or am i just really good at positioning myself so that it always tabs to a cast I'm kicking

[royal lantern]

tab targeting puts priority on enemys that are casting yes

[solar wyvern]

I knew it, ty

[royal lantern]

so its easier to interupt with tab

[vast patio]

for m+, do we ever drop bonespike in a non-subterfuge build?

[solar wyvern]

Yeah for a long time i would manually click the caster mob and fuckup kicks

[oak pollen]

Guys whats the point of playing double vanish on m+?

[solar wyvern]

Then i just noticed a trend, good to know its true

[frosty bridge]

Utility, makes chaining less punishing, allows for easier switching of DSM etc

[solar wyvern]

Drop it for what is the question, lightweight shiv/dashing?

No point in taking the mutilate bleed talent either if you're not taking sbs

So u get 2 points

[vast patio]

Twist+iron wire+ma

[frosty bridge]

yeah you can definitely do this

[solar wyvern]

Ahh scent. Its doable, i just think sbs is more value

[royal lantern]

eh, no lol

[vast patio]

Do you ever not take scent in +?

[royal lantern]

scent is big value

sbs is mostly a "feel good" talent

[solar wyvern]

Depends on the key level you're doing ig

[shy marten]

what's sbs

[royal lantern]

like, sbs speeds things up, but without sbs you just press FoK once

[solar wyvern]

If its lower sbs is real good

[royal lantern]

bonespike

[solar wyvern]

Serrated bone spike

[frosty bridge]

no way you ever drop scent

[royal lantern]

full name is serrated bone spike

[shy marten]

ah

[vast patio]

I'm just not using sbs so I'm used to not having it. I've only been playing with it atm

but I'm curious if you'd ever drop it without subterfuge because of how small your carnage window is without it

[shy marten]

are people playing the stealth talent now?

[frosty bridge]

you can easily drop sbs and doomblade, can grab DS/TTK/Iron wire/MA

you can easily drop SD etc, its kinda crazy how many builds there are

[vast patio]

the build variety is definitely real nice

[silver wyvern]

what do we mean by lower ? for example is an +8 consider as lower ?

[solar wyvern]

Imo yeah, if a pack dies in 15 seconds having that extra global is definitely nice

So you can start caustic envenoms

[frosty bridge]

i love it but its also a bit intimidating not knowing if what im running is optimal

scawwy stuff

I just wish they would switch SBS and Doomblade positions

[proud dune]

hey guys, i am currently not on my pc to sim. but is it wortth to craft an amber gem (stamina +x) for the meta gem +0.15 crit effect for m+ and raid?

[vast patio]

I usually don't play sin when I play rogue so this is all new to me lol

[solar wyvern]

No

[proud dune]

ty

[solar wyvern]

I was thinking of running something like this without subt, going forced induction, dropping IW for lightweight shiv. Just max dps. But then i wasn't sure if losing 6 seconds of MA was worth

[oak tangle]

i would like to have a replacement for crippling, that does nothing but supply a lethal dose stack

[vast patio]

So would you ever drop sbs without subterfuge? I don't know how you'd fit all your bleeds in on a big pull without one or the other

[solar wyvern]

I mean, ambush>garrote>rupture>fol>rupture

[oak pollen]

tyvm

[solar wyvern]

Is 5 globals in a 6 global window

Its not awful

[vast patio]

well I guess MA would make the combo gen less ass

[little furnace]

Looking at Twist the knife, does anyone know what envenom can overlap twice means?

[oak tangle]

when someone says that sin is taken in raids for poisons and dot damage style

just link this

[frosty bridge]

You get 2 of the envenom buff

[vast patio]

2x rapid injection too

[frosty bridge]

and 2x DS

[silver wyvern]

%30 extra chance for your poisons

[little furnace]

Will it still refresh itself?

[frosty bridge]

it's two seperate buffs

[solar wyvern]

The third envenom will refresh the oldest one

[frosty bridge]

or rather, what Charrend says

[solar wyvern]

And so on and so forth

[little furnace]

Okay, thx

[solar wyvern]

You cant maintain

100% uptime on both

Jsyk

[oak tangle]

can get close

but yeah

[solar wyvern]

Its like 165% uptime-ish?

[vast patio]

does refreshing an improved garrote with a non-improved one lose you damage or does it get baked into the new duration

[wispy epoch]

We talking about ttk?

[solar wyvern]

Really good

Yeah someone asked about it

[vast patio]

want to iron out the little things

[silver wyvern]

they applied like 2 diffrent garrotes

[wispy epoch]

Every second you’re off your main target due to aoe or other shit, also hurts your uptime

Why I just forgo ttk

[spice surge]

You lose the empowered part

[vast patio]

so you lose all the remaining improved dam, ye?

[wispy epoch]

It it’s not in it’s like last tick window

[silver wyvern]

nop 2 of them ticking diffrently from each other

[solar wyvern]

Eh its just a passive effect you don't play around

If you're following envenom rules it irons itself out

[solar wyvern]

Im almost 100% sure you're wrong

[lunar sonnet]

i am 100% sure hes wrong

[silver wyvern]

if you use proper plates, when you apply improved garrote into normal garrote there is a indications under your enemies garrote says 2

[solar wyvern]

Are you certain

You're not seeing

Iron wire

[lunar sonnet]

this is iron wire

[silver wyvern]

nop i never use ironwire

[lunar sonnet]

okay show us then

the proper plates

[silver wyvern]

let me find the article

[vast patio]

I love iron wire too much for pugging.

[solar wyvern]

@balmy condor sorry for ping love you, is this true?

[spice surge]

Its not

[wispy epoch]

Hold up

[silver wyvern]

not when you applied back to back back i think it was like 6 second before it runs out

[wispy epoch]

Yes pandemic window

Otherwise you overlap

And fuck it

[silver wyvern]

yea yea that what i was talking about, overlap back to back don't works ofcourse

[lunar sonnet]

no in pandemic you still overrite it

[vast patio]

Is sudden demise nerfed in delves btw?

[silver wyvern]

just forgot the name

[vast patio]

weirdly just never seems to execute

[blazing warren]

Hey, i have few questions if you dont mind
First, doesnt Subterfurge get overshadowed by other talents (Improved Garrote, Master Assassin, Indiscriminate Carnage)?

What buffs should i be tracking? Assuming Subterfurge and the talents above kinda do the same could i just track 1 of them? Darkest Night, Clear the Witnesses, is there anything else?

What debuffs can i hide from tracking? Can i hide Serrated Bone Spike, Fatal Intent, Deadly Poison, Amplifying Poison, Crippling/Numbing Poison, Kingsbane, and Deathmark?

[spice surge]

(this is per point so its +6 seconds to MA, Imp garrote and IC)

[wispy epoch]

Sudden Femise has been bugged since beta. It does a one time check at 35% hp and if the bleeds are below the insta kill threshold it doesn’t do it

[spice surge]

Would not suggest hiding kingsbane and deathmark

[vast patio]

tf

[spice surge]

The others go ahead though

[blazing warren]

Why not? Yeah it kinda does the same does it not?

[solar wyvern]

I recommend tracking DM and KB, Darkest Night and Clear the Witnesses are also good tracks

[wispy epoch]

25 or 35 forgot the %

[solar wyvern]

Because if you're playing master assassin you want to know when to vanish, also shiv

[frosty bridge]

Feel like

You might tab target

and forget what to tab back to

otherwise you should be tracking when to vanish, shiv etc with weakauras instead of nameplates

so yeah, hide stuff that doesn't change how you play

[blazing warren]

Yeah but a single buff from the 4 already shows you that you get benefit from others, since they do the same and last the same

What do you mean by "also Shiv"?

[feral wasp]

!up

[prisma monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/304343434137960449/1283842520308256858/image.png

[blazing warren]

I mean if i track Improved Garrote, that already shows me stuff like Subterfurge, Master Assassin, Indiscrimating Carnage since they have the same conditions/duration?

[wispy epoch]

Shiv is such a meme, I think whispyr says it accounts for like .05% of dmg when done right

The kingsbane shiv shit

Meanwhile it’s all I ever seen on here

Posted at least once an hour

[spice surge]

Yes

Subterfuge is only 6 seconds though

[blazing warren]

Yeah but it does the same stuff as other talents no?

[spice surge]

For ambush purposes

The others are 12

[little furnace]

could track subterfuge if you like cheap shot

[blazing warren]

Yeah but they do the same

So why track Subterfurge instead of just 1 12s buff?

[wispy epoch]

Is it worth having a shift modifier for mutilate if I’m ambushing single target and want to start mutilating after?

In my stealth bar

[spice surge]

what?

Just track one of the others

[blazing warren]

I made Weakaura that shows me when i can use Cheap Shot from Stealth insead of Kidney Shot so that is taken care of

[blazing warren]

Is Mutilate better to use than Ambush in Stealth outside of marking?

[nova quail]

hi all this far into the expansion is it just beter to craft daggers than famr bloodkiss or regicide?

[wispy epoch]

Up to 4 combo points vs 2

[spice surge]

Slightly but its negligible

[wispy epoch]

So yes technically

[blazing warren]

Hm? Both give 2 no?

[wispy epoch]

Mutilate gives 2 base, then 1 more per crit

If both weps crit, that’s 4

[vast patio]

world questing with subt is kinda hilarious though. Just kinda glide through a zone and kill everything

[blazing warren]

Oh it works like Sinister Strike kinda?

[wispy epoch]

I don’t know what that means

I just wanna go back to playing Outlaw

[blazing warren]

Sinister Strike from Outlaw has like a chance to hit again, giving you more Combo Points

So kinda similar to this if Mutilate crits twice?

[spice surge]

Mutilate always hits twice

[blazing warren]

Like its a 2 hit attack?

[wispy epoch]

Everything outlaw does generates extra combo points I feel

[spice surge]

Seal fate gives you 1 cp for every crit you do

[golden loom]

you strike with both daggers and then via seal fate u get extra cp on crit

[nova quail]

bump

[blazing warren]

Oh okay

Does Assassination try to snipe Amplifying Poison stacks for Envenon on different targets?

[spice surge]

no

[lunar sonnet]

crafting a main hand dagger is most likely your best bet, depends on how easily your farming myth track daggers

[nova quail]

thx for ur reply ...ive crafted one allrdy but off hand is letting me down and no such luck on drops

[spice surge]

Dont craft an offhand

[nova quail]

only doing 5's atm as an alt

[golden loom]

OH is pretty much irrelevant

[lunar sonnet]

oh yeah dont worry about offhand, if you want to see the value, sim an offhand, it is pretty much just a stat stick

[nova quail]

ok so for mythic farm dawnbreaks

ok thankyou ...what other crafted items we equiping ?

[golden loom]

like ofc u want a higher ilvl OH but dont stress about it

[nova quail]

bracers and belt?

[vast patio]

Is a mythic skardyn better than a mythic transmitter?

[fallen arch]

Yes

[lunar sonnet]

yeah those two are good slots, if you crafted the dagger with ascension then youll just want 1 crafted out of those -- just pick whatever you dont get in vault

[nova quail]

thx yer did craft with accension

[lunar sonnet]

yeah so get the writhing armor band on whatever you craft next, then no need to craft any more

unless unlucky stuff or whatever, but sims will tell you that

[nova quail]

ok currently have hero bracers and vert belt

[quaint depot]

So for M+ we should always be using Tricks over black jack? i noticed 49 of the top 50 assa rogues on raider io for M+ are taking tricks, I assume its just needede for certain pulls on those 16+ keys? Blackjack seems like really good utility

[fallen arch]

Don’t overthink it

Blackjack is better yes probably in a perfect world

But Tricks had its niche uses

[hot jay]

Those rogues might be using tricks to help create giga pulls

Without the tank

[lunar sonnet]

main value i find in tricks is i get to open faster

[fallen arch]

Yes

[sly ocean]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[quaint depot]

Yeah, people i play with were annoyed at me for not having tricks because they died to melee because they blasted a pull before tank got aggro lol

[crimson zephyr]

I think I do less overall dmg in GB7 than GB9 or GB10 - feels like shit dies too fast before I can do anything. Is that expected or me noob?

[hot jay]

But I only do 10 keys so I will simply run tricks to protect myself

[spice surge]

How helpful do you think 1 tick of garrote with tricks is

[fallen arch]

Ofc thats the case

Especially on a tyran week

[lunar sonnet]

oh these people are just wrong, wait longer LOL

[hot jay]

Too often on my warrior I've been killed for using a weak filler ability while the mobs are being grouped and wondering how on earth I pulled aggro

[crimson zephyr]

man I really don't like tyrants 😦

[hot jay]

Like something that does less than 100k

[quaint depot]

Depends on the other dps for sure, I was carrying some people through a 7 and since hte other dps were doing like 500k overall i was at like over 2m overall and on the 9 we ran right after i was at like 1.7m overall

[fallen arch]

It’s probably because of the comp as well

If u play with a warrior and a ret they kill all the smallies before u can ramp

And they kill off your sob stack targets and stuff

[quaint depot]

Yeah, the ret in the GB 9 was killing all the smallies instantly lmao

[crimson zephyr]

I mean complete overgeared groups 😄

[summer patrol]

Can someone explain why ritual daggers sims so good? I have 626 one, how is it really better than empowering crystal?

[spice surge]

it gives more stats on average

[quaint depot]

For sure, you will do less in lower keys because our damage relies on like 5 more globals happening than other specs like ret anmd fury

[hot jay]

I did a 10 GB last night with some friends on my rat alt, they are fairly geared like 628+ but my rogue is only 613

Still did 1.3m overall because the tank did some big pulls

[proper seal]

Is there a list somewhere on what abilities feint works on?

[hot jay]

Having a lot of fun with the rogue I need to put more time into it

[crimson zephyr]

abilities of mobs?

[limber lion]

No

[proper seal]

yes

[woeful meteor]

raid or m+?

[lunar sonnet]

if you were curious about raid abilities, theres info about if abilities are affected by avoidance on viserio's website, which is the same as feint

[proper seal]

m+

[little furnace]

take the elusiveness talent and it will work for everything

[lunar sonnet]

ahh

[tired kelp]

in terms of difficulty, which spec is easier to play? assa or outlaw

[oak pollen]

Guys, im struggling REAL hard on pooling my energy while i maintain envenom and DoTs up on ST in m+ environment or even in raids. Do you guys have any tip pls?

[lunar sonnet]

assa

[proper seal]

ah thought most people were running cheat death but maybe that is the play instead

[quaint depot]

Most people probably are, but i think when you push past a certain point, probably like above M+15s, you probably just need elusiveness to surivive certain thigns

[hot jay]

I think elusiveness might just be better, doing a few 10 gbs as an undergeared rogue made me want elusiveness

At any key range

[little furnace]

Cheat death is nice while you are learning the dungeons, but elusiveness is probably better once you know when damage is high

[coral ibex]

there should be no issue in raid, if there is you are mindlessly spamming your energy away. in m+ play for envenom uptime

[hot jay]

Cuz in aoe pulls you won't mind the feint cost

[proper seal]

i got one shot in COT on each doubt dispel on a +10, only 610 ilvl but maybe theres some other way to deal with it

[solar wyvern]

Ik you're referring to shiv kb being whatever and i agree, but tracking which target nameplate you applied shiv to is a pretty good thing to track is all I was saying

[hot jay]

So it's just an on-demand free defensive

[hot jay]

Yeah I'm finding out if your doing weekly 10s on low ilvl, you must run elusiveness

[oak pollen]

even playing for envenom uptime, it sometimes drops or my dots

[hot jay]

Because regular stuff will end you

[quaint depot]

So much of the damage you are taking is just already AoE i feel, but im thinking of things like the abyssal blast DOT in Dawnbreaker and such at like +15 that thing has to be pretty rough, I know it is in 14s, evasion might not be enough after youve already cloaked one and your pot is on CD, etc

I dont find theres enough damage in anything under like an 11 that you need to do much other than actually use defensives at all

[solar wyvern]

You're probably not spending energy efficiently, if you know you're refreshing garrote/rupture just pandemic envenom with high energy and refresh dots. Shouldn't even runout

[solar wyvern]

Getting triple Abyssal'd is death xd

Pray i have an external

Or that my healer is the goat

[quaint depot]

I main rsham, Ive 1 DB 13 where nobody died to Abyssal, its just so hard to keep people up through it lmao. the mage got it like 6 times in a row i was just like PLEASE JSUT PUT IT ON ME I HAVE A POTION AND 3 DEFENSIVES

[royal lantern]

bro it a mage

you have 3 deffensives, they have 32

[quaint depot]

yeah lol

if it was anyone else in the group they probably were dead, But the last few felt like he had nothing left and it was just me barely keeping him up

[young rune]

!mastery

dang. is there a mastery cap?

[spice spire]

No

[royal lantern]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

There are no "recommended stat levels" or "breakpoint of X stat" or "required" amount of any stats. This is an outdated way to think about stats and simply is not relevant to the spec. If you're looking for a quick recommendation: Agi >> Crit = Mastery >= Haste > VersatilityIt's always more accurate to simulate your own character, as stat procs from trinkets/enchants can often de-value their stat relative to others. Stats are not a rigid construct, their values change constantly in relation to each other depending on your character.

• Fatebound will generally want more crit than Deathstalker due to Deal Fate
• Deathstalker prefers more Mastery/Haste due to Darkest Night guaranteeing a crit
• Always Always ALWAYS sim yourself through Top Gear and Droptimizer for accurate results

[young rune]

ty!

[royal lantern]

stat caps dont exist in 2024 wow

and people that tell you they do dont know how the game works really

[hot jay]

Is barrier a real defensive when your going past 12 though? Wouldn't like 1 tick of any damage effect just kill the entire shield

[quaint depot]

Yeah they just DR at some point

[hot jay]

I know they have more than just barrier but that's one down

[quaint depot]

Barrier is definitely pretty nice, speaking as a healer lol

[coral ibex]

not a problem for me, refresh dots in pandemic and don’t waste your energy

[royal lantern]

and envenom dropping is w/e anyway

[quaint depot]

sorry, Mass barrier is nice, IDK if the normal barrier matters a ton lol

[royal lantern]

you do no real dmg outside of cd windows

[quaint depot]

yeah in my experience if you do your burst window properly and dont let bleeds fall off, even if you arent really playing for envenom uptime, its not a huge difference

[thick sail]

Assassination feels so good right now. Never having to press Slice and Dice has made it feel so much better in pve and pvp. I've been playing new retail since Shadowlands and this is by far the best our talent trees and rotation has felt, we have optional real utility via Iron Wire + Subterfuge, and our damage is solid. Devs are doing good.

My only real complaint about our choices is we can't use the Trickster hero tree, which was the one I was most interested in

Oh, and Feint off the gcd = ❤️

[sonic raven]

i guess i just need to ask since im seeing it alot and googling 'pandemic' is very difficult for obvious reasons, what does pandemic mean? (fresh to retail from SoD)

[spice surge]

!pandemic

[prisma monolith]

Pandemic takes up to 30% of the duration of a applied dot/buff and adds it to your new applied one. The duration depends on the new instance.
Example: Garrote (18 sec) can be extended by up to 5.4 seconds from an existing instance.
Note: Pandemic applies to most but not all debuffs/buffs

[sonic raven]

so if theres 3s left on garrote, its added to next? or 30% of the 3s

[spice surge]

If you have 3s left and garrote again you will have a 21s garrote

[sonic raven]

thanks

[spice surge]

But it cant be longer than 30%

[sonic raven]

okay, got it. makes sense

[spice surge]

So 7s left on garrote would still be 23.4, not 25 (18+7)

[sonic raven]

that's a great QoL change, impressed.

(im sure its old, my last 'serious' retail run was WoD)

[quaint depot]

Yeah pandemic is an old warlock passive i believe

[solar wyvern]

I think it was added in WoD?

[quaint depot]

that got rolled into basically all effects eventually

[spice surge]

Most effects

[sonic raven]

healing too?

[quaint depot]

I think its just for debuffs

[spice surge]

Its for most buffs and debuffs

[oak pollen]

whats "high energy"? Im actually trying to refresh my dots AND envenom on pandemic window

[solar wyvern]

Yeah pandemic for rdruid is very big

[solar wyvern]

For example, I just envenomed, and now I'm at 50 energy. Rupture and garrote are at 12s. Instead of envenoming again immediately, i will wait for the last second and pool, envenom, build, pool and refresh rupture and garrote once its at 6ish seconds, then build and envenom again with my extra energy

Numbers aren't exact this is just off the top of my head

Its kindof a thing you get a feel for.

[quaint depot]

Yeah, I mean I think the main thing is you cant let your garrote or rupture fall off, sometimes that means waiting for an envenmon possibly

you are going to be energy starved for the entire fight if you let them fall off, or for a very long time

[solar wyvern]

Yeah its much more important to keep bleeds rolling, drop envenom if you have to

But if you play with a bit of foresight to when your buffs are getting in pandemic range, that almost never happens

[quaint depot]

True, I still think the damage difference is pretty minimal even when you are playing kinda brain dead and spamming as long as you keep your bleeds up the entire time and do your burst window correctly

so if you need to focus on one thing at a time

get that correct first, bleeds always up, then burst window perfection, then energy pooling/ envenom uptime

[solar wyvern]

And if there's ever a time to spam buttons, its your cds, Deathmark doubling poisons and bleeds means it doubles your energy gain from venomous eounds

[heavy canopy]

Hey guys, on Rasha’nan, my Caustic Spatter is doing negligible amounts of damage, but all the top rogues in logs are using it. I’m guessing it’s because they position adds closer to boss than we do, but just to make sure - I just keep pumping on boss, right?

[twin bay]

in pugs or if your raid decides to spawn adds away from boss spatter wont hit

[heavy canopy]

They place them in front of boss, right outside its big red targeting circle thingy

I just think it’s barely out of range, unfortunately

[twin bay]

i never bothered with spatter because we have 2 furys sniping them anyway 😄

[heavy canopy]

Haha, fair enough

[limber lion]

bleed build good

[heavy canopy]

I switched to full single-target anyway, as adds were getting blown up by our Outlaw and Fury, so doesn’t matter in the end

[oak pollen]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ONiUTDXddo this is exactly what im doing atm

[limber lion]

who needs kb anyways

[quaint depot]

What is the auto tank tricks macro again?

[limber lion]

!tott

[prisma monolith]

Smart tricks WA on tank, this require the following macro:

/click SmartMisdirect LeftButton 1
/click SmartMisdirect LeftButton 0

[quaint depot]

ty

[twin spoke]

!tea

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

[twin spoke]

guys whats the true usage of tea

[quaint depot]

you use it when you shiv and also dont waste the energy ideally

[rare isle]

What does the reset=5 do? It makes it so that the castsequence can be initiated every 5 sec only? Do I understand it correctly?

[twin spoke]

like i use double tea

in big cd

when im looking at the logs ppl dont do it like that

[quaint depot]

probably not because itll probably waste the energy

in your cooldowns you dont have many energy problems because you have double bleeds and poisons on the target

you use it once on your burst window with DM, then you use it 1 minute later when you do KB + Shiv, then probably just use it on your next shiv after that, kinda contextual to how much of the fight is left at that point

[twin spoke]

so you always save 1 for bad situtaions?

[quaint depot]

not neccesarily no, Im just saying probably dont use one if the boss is at 3 percent or whatever

THe only place you ever really need tea is on bosses in M+, in trash you have plenty of energy because you have so many bleeds applied

or if you have a tank chain pulling every single pack then you just say RIP to your dmg

[solar wyvern]

You put yourself at 7 cp for no reason a few times, finish at +5 using all those extra mutilates is what's killing your energy

Obviously go 7 for darkest night

[real pike]

he also finishes on 5 with DN up by the looks of things

[warm vortex]

Ok so

for key logs

what percent is the one that matters

is it key %

or parse %

[real pike]

neither

[solar wyvern]

M+ parse is a meme

[warm vortex]

:(

[solar wyvern]

Maybe even more of a meme than healer parses

[quaint depot]

Key percent compares you to other assa rogues doing that level of key, parse compares you to assa rogues doing any key of any level, But neither yeah

[real pike]

all parses are memes #enlightened

[warm vortex]

ah ok ok

was happy with my 98

ihbdshbds

[solar wyvern]

Sorry brother

[warm vortex]

Fuck it imma still be happy with it

[solar wyvern]

Too many variables for a key parse to be reliable

[warm vortex]

Number big

[quaint depot]

only thing that matters in a key is if you timed it or not

lol

[warm vortex]

Yea we +2ed it

[real pike]

this view has nothing to do with my 3 parse after dying on kyveza kill last night

[warm vortex]

but it was just a chill ten

Sure

sure combat

[harsh anchor]

Is there a dmg % increase to use the combo points from shiv over just playing normally and forgetting it

[warm vortex]

But eh
still happy with it :D

[solar wyvern]

Like your overall and "parse" will look a lot better on a mists key if you do wall pulls and doubles

So its too unreliable from group to group

[warm vortex]

Even if it doesn't matter
if we timed it
i guess it is ok
IK it isnt defining but still let me be happy

Yea true

[solar wyvern]

Yeye you're the goat

Killin these leys

Keys

[warm vortex]

Ok tbf
i did kinda die

[solar wyvern]

Bees

[warm vortex]

2 times

but once was cause we missed a kick

and the other was we had double ascend at same time before 3rd boss

like EXACT same time

[solar wyvern]

Cloak

Healer problem

Hehe

[harsh anchor]

Like use at 5 instead of 7 after shiv

[warm vortex]

True

was mb

if my dps breakdown is this

i know im doing it properly though

Ok CT higher

but mainly splatter high is good

[real pike]

I don't know what you mean

[quaint depot]

Well if you use it at 7 it will count as if you used 9 combo points

[real pike]

you use shiv just before KB and at 7 secs left of KB

ohhhh that thing

[quaint depot]

hes talking about the supercharged points

[real pike]

I forgot it exists lmao

[solar wyvern]

Are you saying the combo points generated by the shiv cast itself?

[quaint depot]

Your Envenoms will crit for likr 5-6mil on 9 combo points lol

[solar wyvern]

Or what are we talking about

[little furnace]

The replacement for echoing

[quaint depot]

Yeah hes talking about supercharged

[harsh anchor]

Yeah so is it a negligible increase to just build normal 5+ or play around the anima charged ones as if they are cp. Might be a little confusing, I’m having a hard time explaining what I mean exactly this morning

[twin spoke]

@quaint depot i was thinking when boss pulled with bl i use double tea

[quaint depot]

Its probably negligable i assume you still play to 7 combo pts on darknest night and 5 on everything else

[twin spoke]

i get the mastery buff

[real pike]

ignore the entire mechanic

[harsh anchor]

Because at times I send a 5 with anima charged for DN and most times I’m just sending at 9

[real pike]

just forget it exists

[twin spoke]

i do more damage min max so its not good?

[solar wyvern]

Yeah its an ignore and do more damage angle

[quaint depot]

Yeah its basically just a passive DPS increase

[harsh anchor]

Okay good I’ve been doing that. Was looking around for small things I can improve

[faint vessel]

bad tea usage vs perfect tea usage is iirc 0.2%?

[quaint depot]

you dont need to muddy the waters thinking about it

[real pike]

you'll likely get much bigger gains from improving on boss/dungeon mechanics

[solar wyvern]

Bad tea usage was a trip to the hospital last time, definitely more than .2% of my paycheck

[quaint depot]

I dont think about the supercharged points much, but It does feel real nice to get a 9 combo point DN envenom

[faint vessel]

mushroom tea sent me on a wild trip once but probably a diff discord to chat about that

[solar wyvern]

👀

[faint vessel]

yeah I hit an 8m envenom randomly and someone pulled it from a log and sent me the ss, I didnt even notice it at the time

like others say, just hit the buttons and do the thing

[solar wyvern]

Im sad they fixed the ttk envenom bug

[harsh anchor]

Mostly looking for energy efficiency and damage efficiency for court and ansurek coming up. Appreciate it 🙂

[solar wyvern]

With supercharger

[coral ibex]

tried a db12, mage whose key it is wipes us twice on minibosses, says gg, crashes out in my dm’s about it

[solar wyvern]

A 10 cp envenom being 18 seconds was topkek

[coral ibex]

i love pugs

[quaint depot]

how we gettin 10cp envenoms

[hushed hearth]

heyo, sanguine blades duplicates dmg per bleed effect or just once?

[late surge]

hes hacking

[coral ibex]

7cp + forced induction

[solar wyvern]

Forced induction is +3cp

[faint vessel]

DMing after bricked keys is wild

[quaint depot]

Ohh raid build got it

makes sense

[solar wyvern]

Its my new key cook

Too

[harsh anchor]

OH right it’s +3. Makes my 16m envenom make more sense

[solar wyvern]

Fat damage

[quaint depot]

Yeah, i forgot about that talent because i dont really raid and dont take it in M+

i just put 1 point in supercharger

[coral ibex]

forced induction is best in raid afaik

[late surge]

yes

[solar wyvern]

Yesh lethality is beans

[quaint depot]

Yeah i think it is, I have it in my raid build, I just am never in the raid so wasnt thinking about it lmoa

[coral ibex]

2/2 lethality is worse since kb doesn’t double dip

[half tartan]

How are you guys feeling about our boss damage in dungeons?

[upper oak]

!tea

[prisma monolith]

Shiv/Tea Macro
With this you will not accidently use more than 1 charge of tea if youre spamming:

/cast Shiv 
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null

[late surge]

mid

[quaint depot]

Yeah mid

[solar wyvern]

Not what we're taken to keys for

[half tartan]

Is there a build that does it a good amount better without sacing a lot of trash dams

[solar wyvern]

Let the enh shaman deal with it

[quaint depot]

Its not awful, we have a similiar profile to ret pally in terms of damage

[late surge]

play forced induction over subt

if u want more boss dam

[quaint depot]

i dont play either

[solar wyvern]

My current cook is forced induction + lightweight shiv/sanguine/scent. -sbs, IW, Doomblade

Will get back on how that goes

[quartz spear]

How do you guys navigate the, "my sim says use X trinket but 75% of all high parses are using Y trinket" problem

[solar wyvern]

Idk if dashing > lwshiv or not. Obviously IW is goated

[coral ibex]

what are you playing if not subt or forced induction

[half tartan]

How much does it sacrifice?

[coral ibex]

[solar wyvern]

Fatebound cold-blood 8(

??

[quaint depot]

Happy to hear an improvement

[late surge]

for keys?

CASUAL

forced is ur cook

how much aoe loss is it

[solar wyvern]

MonkaS

[late surge]

remove double lethality for forced induction

xd

imo

[solar wyvern]

Or if you really wanna be weird, 1 point subterfuge

9sec MA aint bad

[quaint depot]

I dont have MA either tho

[late surge]

then dont go subt

[solar wyvern]

So you're running the old build basically

[late surge]

im p sure forced induction is more dam than subt if u dont have MA

[quaint depot]

Yeah, This is my alt so probably just behind the new info

[half tartan]

What is the main value of subt? Longer iron wire DR?

[molten echo]

Longer MA.

[late surge]

longer MA and iron wire tbf

[half tartan]

You dont take MA in dungeons generally

[solar wyvern]

Yes you do

[molten echo]

A lot of people play MA in keys

[quaint depot]

So the updated M plus talents without MA are just minus 2 lethality and take forced induction?

[coral ibex]

you totally do take MA

it’s very strong atm

[solar wyvern]

Pmuch

[half tartan]

so am I running a fucked build

[solar wyvern]

Yeah

[coral ibex]

yes

[late surge]

ur losing a bit of dam with that yes

[coral ibex]

why subt with no MA

[solar wyvern]

Drop scent or sanguine and take MA

[keen mantle]

I’ve seen some msges about whispyr I really feel the need to take place to that. First of all different builds are to be tested and ofc we will try different variations of talents and shit. Also rogue is a complicated class that even if you read a guide it might still look difficult so a lot of stuff are coming from experience. There are some other stuff tho like sims and optimisations and thank god there are people like whispyr or fuu or zac (those are the ones I’m talking with at least , sorry if there are more behind sims and I didn’t say you , I’m just not aware) that do more than incredible job out there , and guess what even we experienced players can still learn shit so when I have something to ask about Assa I still ask Whispyr to get his opinion. Knowledge is a completely different part of logs and Rio and fking numbers. So instead of shit talking ppl for trying to help (AND FOR FREE) just be a good kind of human and be thankful , and also if you don’t like sth about whispyr or any whispyr just ignore and move on. Thank you @balmy condor for what you have done for assassination rogue community. And also it’s not “casuals or whoever’s build if we try some talent build” , it’s just choices that ppl prefer.

[molten echo]

No point to use subt without MA

[half tartan]

thats what i was asking myself

[real onyx]

hey someone linked some sick wa's to me but it was on my other pc, one with the deathstalker envenom proc (when your mark is out and needs reapplying), anyone got it?

[half tartan]

why do i hae subt for just iron wire?

[tawny rapids]

!macros

[late surge]

troller puff

[real onyx]

!weakauras

[late surge]

I mean refrshing iron wire is also insane for pugs

so its not completely shit

you just lose some dam

[vernal turret]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[real onyx]

tyty

[half tartan]

yeah but if I can get some boss damdams it would be nice

[late surge]

ppl been talking shit about my goat whispyr?

[quaint depot]

Maybe ill try the subt MA build

[late surge]

its fun

[quaint depot]

I do pretty solid dam with what im doing, even though its behind lol

[late surge]

big dam

[solar wyvern]

Scroll up to like 6am today he had a rant post

[quaint depot]

sounds like i can make solid improvements

[marble hemlock]

paid actor

[late surge]

IM EU

[solar wyvern]

Uh, 4 hrs ago

[late surge]

OK ty

[solar wyvern]

Sorry the only timezone is AMERICA

[keen mantle]

I should rename to Casualaddict - whispyr’s student

[molten echo]

Sounds like a lot of scrolling

[keen mantle]

Then it will sound better

[quaint depot]

Anyone have a link to the MA M+ build, do i change my playstyle at all or am i doing the exact same thing?

[marble hemlock]

paid chatter vibes

[half tartan]

One time my blood sugar was fucked and Whysper let me drink from his arm and saved my life.

[marble hemlock]

but nah youre totally right

[keen mantle]

Seliathan start doing some high keys bro , ppl think frost dk is bis comp instead of rogue just because we have no representation. I will start pushing after mdi but now it’s rip

Don’t pussy out

[solar wyvern]

Anybody with a brain knows whyspyr is the goat

[late surge]

idd

[quaint depot]

people want that amz i guess

[tawny rapids]

@keen mantle hey mate, on large pack opener (10+) are you applying rupture to more addss before popping CD or just using the 5 applied out of stealth

[marble hemlock]

i remember butting heads a lot with fuu back in the day on some disagreements between gameplay preferences and what the sim said, and sometimes it just do be like that, but that doesnt invalidate their incredibly hard work or mean that their findings are wrong

[marble hemlock]

wdym im slamming https://i.imgur.com/OF5Ad3O.jpeg

[vast patio]

"why isn't my kick macro working" - me who hasn't played sin in two expacs and never had it on the bars.

[quaint depot]

lol

[keen mantle]

On 5-1.000.000 targets I apply ruptures for my carnage duration , then tempest them envenom then CDs zug zug

[quaint depot]

Im a pleb and dont use a kick macro, then cry when i lose my prio target

[keen mantle]

Prodigy of weeklies

[marble hemlock]

theres just so few fun peopel to play keys with

most people are just giga tryhards that tilt when you deplete a key or two instead of having fun just cause you get to hang with the gang

[solar wyvern]

Fuck it, triple rogue. Show them what real fun is

[keen mantle]

Yday a mf asked me when to black powder on sub , I told him you don’t black powder on the new patch anymore you send on cd , and he said but rank 1 log black powders. What do I tell him ?

[half tartan]

The one piece is the fun you had along the way

[marble hemlock]

clearly brainrot, tell them to play outlaw

[keen mantle]

Biggest issue nowadays is that tanks cannot play around Assa anymore even if you explain them how to. And this is not even about restealth. My guess is that on the next year I will be maining tank no cap.

[solar wyvern]

When they release a tank spec for rogue right?

Right???

[keen mantle]

I’ve played with millions of high level tanks, only Kira was doing his job well enough.

[quaint depot]

I think you just link them this if they tell you what to do at all

lmao

[keen mantle]

Ye evasion zug

[vast patio]

I'll probs be maining rogue all expac unless it gets nerfed to dogfood status

[quartz spear]

Does Dead-Eye Spyglass stacks proc off bleeds/poisons? Or does it have to be direct attacks like auto/Mut?

[keen mantle]

My Rio was like this 3 weeks ago haha , I feel ashamed of this. Will be pushing after mdi delete that

[marble hemlock]

ye i know legit 2 tanks

that did great chainpulls

fem and robin

and fem quit a while ago so

[quaint depot]

lol ashamed of 5th best rogue in the game is wild

[keen mantle]

I met him this season once but he’s not tryharding I think

[marble hemlock]

ye fem is just bingchilling

but always super fun to play with

top lad

and robin mostly plays with the echo gang for obvious reasons so

idk

tanking is hard

[keen mantle]

Ye I mean I played with naowh too , all I’m saying is that Assa is a special spec to play with so tanks got to adapt a bit.

[marble hemlock]

ye

and the other DPS too

cuz you kinda just

wanna kill whatever threatening mob is in the pack and then go next

[quaint depot]

What do you mean if it isnt about restealth?

[keen mantle]

Like stacking the pack in 3 secs and having scripted pulls for CDs and reset combat is massive , and funnel on top of bosses and shit.

Very few think about those

[marble hemlock]

kill caster, kite rest, run into next pack

[half tartan]

The restealths are less important?

[quaint depot]

Yeah, its really furstrating to have to like shadow step around to get your bleeds applied

on bad chain pulls and stuff

[marble hemlock]

ye, the prio damage from aoe just isnt noticeable enough compared to the old prio damage days of aflli lock, sub rogue or ele sham

so people dont relaly play around it

[marble hemlock]

restealths have never been important

[keen mantle]

Ye all I’m saying is if ppl won’t play around be I might aswell slam dk , same value.

[quaint depot]

Really? It feels important to me, not being able to apply garrote and rupture to most of the targets feels bad

[marble hemlock]

yep

[keen mantle]

Ye restealth is whatever rly

[marble hemlock]

and its

4x easier to play

and twice as tanky

[keen mantle]

And knowing the route and shit you can hold vanish and shit

Or even slam 2x vanish

[marble hemlock]

ye

using vanish as a DPS cooldown is still cringe imo

[keen mantle]

I would say meld too but it is 50/50 if it’s gonna work kekW

Rogue devs you listening?

Meld is bugged for some years now

I love you guys

[marble hemlock]

cuz 999/1000 keys you dont deplete cuz of lack of DPS

certainly not cause of one extra set of stealth garrotes and a bit of MA crit

[quaint depot]

Is restealth not that imortant because most of your damage is coming from tempest and caustic anyways so you just need the bleeds on the prio?

[marble hemlock]

isnt everybody just playing dwarf in m+ anyway?

[keen mantle]

When it comes to vanish on cds or not I think it depends what’s the difference

If ma makes significant diff then yes sure

If not fk it I’m not playing it for dmg

[solar wyvern]

You just want 5 stacks of scent really, garrote is fake

[marble hemlock]

its not important because damage really isnt all that important, and getting a stealth opener may increase your overall DPS, but not by nearly as much

[keen mantle]

Ye but if it worked properly you surely could utilise that for chain pulls.

[marble hemlock]

only thing you care about is scent stacks, CT and keeping spatter up

[marble hemlock]

ye

i think the culprit is SBS still

[quaint depot]

Yeah garrote is just for iron wire

[marble hemlock]

cuz i dont remember having issues restealthing with mobs having 500 dots ticking prior to SL

but once SBS was a thing, youd die, and get insta put in combat from 500y away at the dungeon entrance

good stuff

[limber lion]

hey now, my garrote did pretty good dam

smilers

[marble hemlock]

20% sudden demise

was that a heroic dungeon?

[keen mantle]

Chaining on 50% hp is more than fine , mobs still have ruptures anyway and you’re chilling. Chaining on 5-10% tho is suss

[limber lion]

hey now it was a massive +5 okay

[quaint depot]

Well my garrote does a ton of dam too, but i mean the main importance of it is the silence and DR lol

[marble hemlock]

[limber lion]

great fun

didn't even spec into kb

[marble hemlock]

ye, and you can get that on demand with vanish

[limber lion]

full bleed

[marble hemlock]

if you just dont vanish on CD for DPS

which a lot of people do

and then they struggle with bad chains

[quaint depot]

True, but on a 2m cooldown if a tank is chain pulling every pack it starts to feel bad

[marble hemlock]

but if you just dont, which may cost you maybe 3% overall DPS in the entire key, and hold it for utility or bad stealths or to dodge mechanics

youll end up timing more keys

[marble hemlock]

idk, never really encountered that

[late tusk]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Rogue Collection
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Plater

[solar wyvern]

The young 12 minute keystone

[marble hemlock]

just stand in poop so the healer has to spamheal you, then the tank will stop chainpulling cuz of healer mana

[solar wyvern]

Banger

[quaint depot]

Lol really? Ive played with tanks that will literally chain pull every pack, I made a macro at this point to spam party chat "Desperate for a restealth"

[marble hemlock]

chainpulling is fine tho

theres a small window where a chainpull is bad

which is when theres only a few mobs left and all are at like sub 5% HP, and they pull the next pack

but even then its like

who cares

youll do less dam for a pull

[keen mantle]

Ye I totally agree. Some dungeons tho are omega tight and you have to utilize every resource possible. That means you need to know and have a plan of those shit in advanced. Even if you gonna use vanish for dmg should be scheduled in advanced which is a thing in rank 1 keys , I fking know when I will use what Im advance.

[marble hemlock]

are you still timing the key? okay who cares. tell them after the dungeon that itd be better if they chain with the previous pack at like 10-20% HP instead

[limber lion]

14!

[marble hemlock]

so you still have dots rolling

when going into the new pack

[quaint depot]

Yeah that is fair

[marble hemlock]

you can also just not chase after the tank, finish off the old one, and then you still get a restealth

[solar wyvern]

Must have had deaths, math doesn't checkout

[marble hemlock]

because very very few trashmobs end up putting you in global combat

[green nebula]

I started running double vanish in M+ for that reason goes pretty hard

[marble hemlock]

oh for sure, at the very very top-end thats always a concern

[quaint depot]

Thats what i typically try to do for sure

[limber lion]

2 deaths unlucky

also not permanently in combat either

[marble hemlock]

but the people complaining about wääääääh restealth are not at that level

[limber lion]

there's travel time

:)

[solar wyvern]

Hehe true, but i gotcha on the deaths!

[marble hemlock]

DPS optimization is the LAST thing you do when pushing higher keys, not the first thing

[limber lion]

truee

gotta help the homies out

[onyx musk]

Play night elf and just immune the chain

[marble hemlock]

first you live, do a clean 0death run, get better interrupts/stuns/bigger pulls etc.

[quaint depot]

Yeah, the most im doing atm is 13 keys, but i have a few IRL friends who tank that i run with, and they seem to intentionally not allow me to stealth lol

[keen mantle]

I’m just never thinking of the “can we time the key ? It’s fine” I’m always thinking if I/we do the same on a +18-+19 Do we time it ? Might be sounding elitist a bit but idk that’s how my brain functions on those shit.

[marble hemlock]

nah thats totally right

when you time a key by 2min

[solar wyvern]

Nah thats a good thought process to have

[marble hemlock]

and youre like "okay, we cant do this 1 key higher unless we find another 30sec"

thats a very different environment

but theres maybe like

50people in the world who are in that position

[quaint depot]

Yeah, probably less lol

[marble hemlock]

vast majority of people are severely overthinking their DPS stuff, while dying 1-3x times in keys

or doing inefficient pulls

[keen mantle]

Same conversation I had with a paladin that played sentinel (defensive wings) in my key. So when it comes to a deplete with me knowing that a crit wings pala would do 400k more overall it’s exactly the same thing as me playing a scuffed build doing much less but getting away with it cause key was low enought so we timed it.

[marble hemlock]

or could do bigger pulls with better utility usage

[keen mantle]

I literally asked him if you play defensive wings why don’t you play warrior instead to buff us ? Haha , not toxic if true I guess. I wasn’t mean to be disrespectful ofc.

[marble hemlock]

ye i mean

protpal is kinda dumb atm ngl

its like bfa warrior

[harsh anchor]

I’ve been liking going into induction and dropping lethality entirely

[quaint depot]

I mean theyre just so much better than any other tank lol

[half tartan]

Mor boss dams?

[keen mantle]

Ye the thing is that if you are not gonna play the full aggressive prot pala and do high keys then play warrior instead , I see no value on playing defensive pala rn.

[marble hemlock]

ye

[keen mantle]

I’m gonna send full st build with spatter then fk it

[marble hemlock]

i mean its the reason we kinda dont see protpal much in MDI still

[keen mantle]

Will be fun

[marble hemlock]

cuz its just safer to go warr

warr+druid for motw+battleshout

vs going protpal/disc

[solar wyvern]

Warrior meta to start, paladin reworked mid tier, becomes meta... Wait I've seen this one before!

[marble hemlock]

warrior comp is just so much safer and that matters more these days

[keen mantle]

First time I see that again!

[marble hemlock]

warrior has been pretty dogshit for m+ since bfa

[solar wyvern]

Bear, hpal, aug, mage, spriest coming soon!

[keen mantle]

That’s exaxtly why ppl out there playing dk even tho they know rogue is better and faster but way more sweaty.

[marble hemlock]

yep

why worry about perfectly multidotting and managing multiple resources and buffs

when breath go brrrr

[keen mantle]

I was taking with supremez (rank 1 dk) and he told me he would 100% reroll to rogue and he’s trying to but he’s struggling performing on it

[marble hemlock]

plus, boss dam on rogue is still kinda ass in terms of variance

[oak pollen]

oooh, thank you very much. I thought going on 6+ was always better than 5, but ty ❤️

gonna fix it

[marble hemlock]

low crit on KB and boss takes 10sec longer

[keen mantle]

My rogue ready , the defensive rogue

[quaint depot]

The main thing I need to improve is spreading bleeds at the start of a pull, I tend to stay on my prio target, which i know spreads them slower, because I dont want to deal with the hassle of "re finding:" it

[marble hemlock]

thats one ugly ass dwarf

[keen mantle]

Eyo

That’s vacationaddict mog

[marble hemlock]

some dude posted this yday

just live 17mil hit

will of the necropolis is so dumb honestly

[keen mantle]

I did mythic raid yday on dk , I soaked all mechanics possible

Like all

No issue

[marble hemlock]

ye was fun on ovinax prog

if i got hit by 2 swirls i die

if dk got hit by 4

hes still 20% hp

[keen mantle]

Soaking poop it’s more runic power

I’ll take that

[marble hemlock]

ye our dk is complaining on ansurek

having to use ams for roots

instead of dps

sadeg

[keen mantle]

So ye were waiting for Tief to finish mdi to play high keys. My hopes are we will be able to communicate to do highest keys

If not, lfgaddict out of garage

[royal lantern]

the horror

[snow kindle]

DKs can soak so many wen blades it’s insane

[marble hemlock]

ye, losing the good tanks to MDI sucks

[snow kindle]

Why class so Tanky

[marble hemlock]

was what happened with us at start of DF as well

[keen mantle]

Ye I’m in pain nowadays with tanks idk. Can’t communicate well.

[marble hemlock]

its a shit role honestly for m+

especially with how many groups expect you to shotcall as well

and having to swap classes all the time

[keen mantle]

Ye , carnage should just be 30sec cd and like 9-10sec and fml

It’s scuffed like it is

[marble hemlock]

carnage should just not exist

just gives us double rupture on cast instead like sub

[keen mantle]

Or that ye

The only spec I can’t call shit is outlaw

Fking freak fast shit

[marble hemlock]

carnage big poop ability

[keen mantle]

It’s my favorite tho , pirate gang

But capped kekW

[marble hemlock]

eww

[snow kindle]

I opposite I can call on outlaw I can’t call for shit on tank

[keen mantle]

Sub is cool after latest rework I’m vibing , downtime is a bit poop tho

[snow kindle]

Way too focused on living for me

[slate crown]

11.0.5 sub good

feels fun

[slate crown]

still has thinking, but easier to get into

[keen mantle]

When I’m playing with Kira I’m impressed more of this motherfucker

He’s tanking the hardest packs and calling everything

[slate crown]

and has very strong st in keys because the build is basically the st build

[marble hemlock]

ye

[keen mantle]

And even watching shit like my tricks and shit and calling those

That dude bro

[marble hemlock]

some people are just

insane

i still prefer having ranged DPS call

well, this season thats kinda hard ig

[keen mantle]

This season is way too chill in terms of calls

Compared to previous I feel like

Very few packs require shoot calling

[marble hemlock]

thats good, imo

i dont like blizz overdoing it

with the trashmobs that need perma cc/disrupts

i just wish most of the dungeons werent so linear

barely any routing shit you can do

[keen mantle]

They did the change tho that when you stop a cast it recasts instantly so calls have to be faster , but they are not that rough

Some keys are still hell tho like grim batol

If you do sweaty routes oh my god

[real pike]

is warcraftlogs being fucky for anyone else today?

[real pike]

you're not running blackjack?

[rain mortar]

A bit? It’s horrendous and Sub is a spec that’s honestly unplayable without nimble sadly

It’s awesome during blades

[ornate harbor]

Rogue is kinda meh compared to hekili enhance mongos

So annoying

[rain mortar]

But my god if you don’t have it the downtime is depressing

[broken moth]

:fuu

[rain mortar]

What is “hekili enhance mongos” haha

[broken moth]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[warm ravine]

Are the theee main poisons we need to track caustic garrote and rupture? I wanna only track these so my into frames aren’t eye vomit

[royal lantern]

he means people that play enhance shaman, use hekili and still do 80% more dmg then everyone else cus its just so ridicolous overtuned

[ornate harbor]

Rotation helper addon + enhance with 600 ilvl

Easily beat sweaty 625 rogue tryhardung

Kinda sad

[spice surge]

Absolutely not true

But ok

[rain mortar]

That’s not even close to true haha

Assa rogue is honestly pretty easy and you can beat enhance

[keen mantle]

I think it’s a good option but when I’ll play with enhancement I think I can’t skip tricks

[ornate harbor]

I know i know

Enha can casino into insane clutch pulls/aoe

But cba taking bout enha today 🙂

[keen mantle]

An insane rogue cannot beat an insane enhance

[ornate harbor]

Fuck em

[keen mantle]

Whoever the rogue is

[rain mortar]

I mean assa does more aoe than enhance, but enhance does more funnel

[ornate harbor]

Idd

[rain mortar]

I know this isn’t a “normal” scenario but the assa rogues were beating enhance in overall for much of MDI

I would say they are insane players

[ornate harbor]

Mdi…

[keen mantle]

Mdi is a speedrun

Says nothing about power of it

And on +5 keys I can play sudden demise and zoldyck and one shot all mobs whatever

I thought conversation was about high keys

And top performances

[ornate harbor]

Enha is just stupid man, fucking annoying. Spamming 6,5m bolts and shit man dont understand it

[keen mantle]

Also isn’t that weird that no rogue in mdi sending demise + zoldyck combo ? Idk I feel like it could work in a lot of mdi scenarios @marble hemlock

[spice surge]

MDI is all about boss damage

And scent is too good for that

[marble hemlock]

i think most people playing rogue arent rogue mains so theres a lot of errors i noticed

i.e. some people not playing cheat is just... why?

i think overall its just a lot of singular focus and scent value on bosses

[novel star]

+9 elu value

pog

[marble hemlock]

they showed a screen once on one of the pulls with singular focus being 10% of the damage

which is kinda nuts

[final star]

especially if you just don't mut

[keen mantle]

Ye you can still send zoldyck and scent

[final star]

and keep adds alive for longer

[rain mortar]

I am by no means “elite” but I do fairly high keys and play with some good enhance shaman and beat them half the time. I don’t think there is nearly as big a difference in assa vs enhance as some of you make it out to seem.

They do a lot more utility wise though

[keen mantle]

But when packs are that much of a speedrun I think zoldyck and demise would fkin execute mobs from very high hp

And on bosses when bosses get low there comes the execute instantly

[real pike]

my guild doesn't have any of those 🥲

[green nebula]

I think it’s the nature of a burst vs ramping class

The affix this week is ass for us as well

[final star]

ready to blast team

[ornate harbor]

Top enha beats top rogue 8/10 times

[subtle tundra]

a good shaman puts any good rogue in the dirt no chance

youre just playing with shitters

[ornate harbor]

But who cares

[rain mortar]

This is just simply not true

[final star]

ready to blast more!!!

[keen mantle]

That’s the talent tree when I finished a boss and there are trash mobs

Haha

On raid

[final star]

don't think it's possible to get 2x zoldyck and demise

unless you drop dtb or kb

[keen mantle]

Ye dtb drop

[subtle tundra]

4x capstone is the max

[final star]

that's an ungodly cook

🤢