#assassination

1 messages · Page 849 of 1

balmy condor
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and you pressed exsang

sullen quest
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IT was only briefly during the beta

balmy condor
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yeah

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exsang was 400% on beta

sullen quest
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Yeah

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if you pressed exsang in a duel, the other person would die within a second

balmy condor
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that's not double dipping

sullen quest
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I thought something was double dipping too, maybe I remembered wrong

storm forum
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things werent hasted back then right?

balmy condor
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correct

sullen quest
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yeah

balmy condor
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hasted only came with bfa

past forum
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So if you wanna hold DM cause boss or other big baddie is coming up but Vanish would be big stonks in aoe on the current pack, it’s better to just send DM without Vanish cause all you’re losing is a few seconds of KB crit, right?

storm forum
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iirc in BFA we said we were "double dipping" in haste trinkets cause of how exang was coded to snapshot haste and kind of sort of double it

balmy condor
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yes

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in m+ your vanish is basically exclusively used for carnage

past forum
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Yeah I think that’s been my biggest issue so far

storm forum
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if packs live long enough, you can do both

sullen quest
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Never ever send DM on its own basically is what I understood

past forum
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Tho in Fall there are actually a lot of enemies worth using DM and Vanish on fortified weeks

storm forum
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vanish at the end of DM and just send out 3 gars as they fade on the pack

balmy condor
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given the choice of vanish for kb and vanish for spreading bleeds with carnage

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you take carnage

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11 out of 10 times

sullen quest
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makes sense

past forum
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Other than Dawn there aren’t a crazy amount of adds that survive a DM on like 20-22 keys. Would you still send DM on them and just massively overkill them?

sullen quest
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Is double tea on DM KB and single tea on solo KB a good way to approach tea usage?

sullen quest
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should both be sustainable that way right

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oh

balmy condor
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it's already a min-max to do a single tea at the end of kingsbane

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now you're going to send a second charge at the start when its not doing damage

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and when you're getting a fuck ton of energy back from deathmark already

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so you're actually just getting the worst of both the mastery

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and the energy

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it's an actually terrible waste of tea

sullen quest
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What's the play in m+, just energy?

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or last 6 of KB if you're otherwise overcapping

balmy condor
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well last 6 of kb always

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tea and kingsbane are both 1 min cooldowns

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it lines up

sullen quest
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yeah so that leaves you with 2 tea stacks to juggle outside of it

storm forum
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i send at the end of KB, and chain pulls sometimes need a bit of juice to get DoTs back up if the timing is bad

balmy condor
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the other charges, or if you get another charge from downtime, you just send for energy or in big aoe

sullen quest
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cool

storm forum
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I do admit, I do sometimes press tea at the start of the first pull to get it on CD ASAP cause thats coded into my brain

balmy condor
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there's worse things to do

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I don't hate that

storm monolith
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you could

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not take tea

storm forum
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and I'll call you a psycho

drifting cedar
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With DM available and boss at 40%, do we wait for it to drop to 35 % before sending?

sullen quest
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Can you still acquire these ?

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or is this legacy

storm forum
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I'm actually really surprized that I would rather have tea or dance or ds than acro like 99% of the time

balmy condor
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and share a cooldown with combat potions

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so

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dogshit

sullen quest
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ah

storm monolith
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sometimes i forget consumables exist

sullen quest
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thistle teas used to be the shit

storm monolith
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we've got combat potions, elixirs, food, enchants, gems, etc

proven jasper
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Current thistle tea IS the shit

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smh

old halo
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!dagger

storm monolith
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i just can't mentally reconcile using enchants on gear that isn't 15+

glacial lantern
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Caustic spatter has no st interactions right?

balmy condor
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correct

glacial lantern
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How much aoe would you lose if you were to run internal bleeding?

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Probably quite a lot with the set actually

balmy condor
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depends on build and situation I guess

glacial lantern
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Considering they pair quite well

balmy condor
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the reality is that caustic is always better in aoe

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it's just a question of how much

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sometimes caustic will be doing 10-12% of your overall in a dungeon when internal would be doing like maybe 2%

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on a tyrannical week maybe you can get internal to like 4%

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and then caustic would be maybe 5-6%

blazing jewel
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I’m going to spatter whispyr

devout karma
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I just hate pugging in spiteful week, any suggestions ? 😄

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other then skip

storm forum
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i am also going to spatter all over whispyr

balmy condor
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spiteful is the biggest dps week in rotation

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just enjoy seeing big overall numbers

devout karma
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Dunno, but none is killin' em

past forum
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More bodies for the FoK

balmy condor
devout karma
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cant restealth 😄

balmy condor
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that's fine

devout karma
storm forum
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more bodies to spatter all over

balmy condor
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I wouldn't change the build

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tyrannical week

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single target good

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if you're gonna change, you'd probably want to play like arterial or something

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but that would be a pretty big shift

fleet pagoda
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playing SoB on tyran weeks feels like bait

past forum
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I used to love playing AP build in keys, now I only play it on raid trash when the tanks pull the whole hallway and lust

fleet pagoda
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by the time you get stacks they're gone anyways

balmy condor
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scent of blood in single target is near the value of dashing

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it's a real good talent

fleet pagoda
storm forum
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how good is sudden demise on ST?

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+10% bleed

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how many dashing scoundrels of value is that?

balmy condor
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point for point sudden demise would be better than dashing in single target

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but it's also a capstone

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so

storm forum
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mhm

balmy condor
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But yeah, scent of blood is CRAZY good

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People just don’t really have a frame of reference for what %agi does

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Cant open details and go “oh yeh, it’s doing x%”

glacial lantern
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Do you think IC is currently well designed?

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i wonder if it really deserves to be a capstone personally

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No st interactions at all, full aoe

craggy oak
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Ic crazy good in design, got power and fun gameplay loops

storm forum
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i dont think all capstones need ST implications

sullen quest
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I love IC

craggy oak
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Ic single handedly gives us actuall aoe gameplay loops, and enables very nice dance builds

tall basalt
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ik this would be broken but part of me wishes IC hit everything in melee

balmy condor
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Ic has its issues but it’s definitely worth the capstone

storm forum
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yeah i think IC is a good design. it's a the duplicating DoT talent that we've wanted for a long while. it's not perfect, but I think its good.

balmy condor
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Caustic exists as the easily accessible aoe talent

storm monolith
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wait i'm MEGA dumb

glacial lantern
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What is the issue with ic?

storm monolith
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if i wanna craft a weapon, i can just make a dragon and then IMMEDIATELY level smithing

storm forum
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only issue I think IC really has is that it's tied to stealth, but i dont think its that bad

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its kind of on theme with the stealth gar thing we have

glacial lantern
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I would prefer something more similar to s crash personally

craggy oak
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The stealth issue is a none issue

storm monolith
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i wish there was a solid way to sim healing

craggy oak
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Stealth as sin actually super whatever and always have been

storm forum
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we used to have IC as Shadow Crash, it was 45 sec CD and applied to like 8 targets and it was okay.

sullen quest
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with SD available to assa, IC works imo

storm forum
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i like the current version more

storm monolith
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@balmy condor where video link

craggy oak
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Old ic was way stronger

static glacier
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ravec made it over to rogue, rip boomie

proven jasper
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Old ic was only way stronger bc it instant applied to 8 targets or whatever

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I think the current version is great

sullen quest
storm monolith
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also is there any way to make gold faster than just killing old xpac overworld mobs? if there isn't, does anyone have recommendations for places?

sullen quest
storm forum
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i meant it was only ok thematically, it was crazy strong. But I missed the triple gar opener that sass is kind of known for.

proven jasper
storm monolith
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never

proven jasper
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🤷🏼‍♂️

storm monolith
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*is there any way to make gold faster than killing old xpac overworld mobs that doesn't involve spending actual money?

craggy oak
sullen quest
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100-300k/hr

storm forum
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I used to do M+ boosting, but the community I used to do it for died and I can't be bothered to find another

static glacier
storm monolith
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lmao not only do i not have the gear for that, i'm not skilled enough to boost people. i'm still learning these classes. if it were mage it'd be a different story, but i wanna branch out

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please appreciate the branch joke

proven jasper
storm forum
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boost on your mage and then send the money to your rogue

sullen quest
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you don't have to be a god to raid boost, just decent

storm forum
storm monolith
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: ^)

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WAIT WHISPYR I SEE YOU TYPING DON'T TIME ME OUT

slate crown
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I predict you are the target

storm forum
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i think hes doing a write up on IC

glacial lantern
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Gonna give us the full rundown of the problem with ic since i asked

storm forum
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but he might also be having a mental breakdown

slate crown
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But I can’t predict for shit so

sullen quest
storm monolith
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ayyyyy there's a new video idea. make one about IC

glacial lantern
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Honestly though, i don't get how old ic was "crazy strong" when we have things like shadow crash

balmy condor
# glacial lantern What is the issue with ic?

IC is a talent that rewards the opener, but it slows down all of the other opener events. It’s designed to be in that part of the rotation. But how do you utilize it without giga slowing down the rest of your cooldowns? Well you have 2 options, you can either make it apply quicker but stronger, or over longer duration but weaker.

Option 1 is the old carnage which was a nightmare and you just gotta sit in stealth and wait for mobs to group and you got one shot for targeting mobs and now it really should be a button again but then button bloat, so it can’t be a button, but if you reduce the duration to 4 seconds and make it cleave say 4 targets, well now you’re not able to cleave the ruptures as easily anymore and you’re back to targeting issues and nonsense. Big mess, so let’s go option 2

Option 2 you have the nuclear option of just making carnage a passive +1 target, but that causes a whole new set of issues, cause now technically it’s EVEN SLOWER in the opener and you still have stuff like improved garrote that’s 3 seconds long, so you’re still tied to a timer, and you want to get ruptures out still for scent and energy and now you’re looking at having to multidot way more, which is kinda the opposite of what we wanted in the first place.

So you can’t make it faster, and you can’t make it slower, so what do you do?

storm monolith
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remove it

glacial lantern
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Honestly, i am not nearly knowledgeable enough about sin rogue to answer this

storm forum
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please dont remove IC

glacial lantern
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Sin rogue is one of my least played specs

storm monolith
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idk. shot in the dark: replace it with something that says "when you apply rupture, you apply garrote as well"

glacial lantern
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That's kinda like misery from s priest

balmy condor
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If anything you’d need to do that the other way around

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Rupture is the more prohibitive cast

storm monolith
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that's giving away free finishers though

balmy condor
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Yes

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That’s the point

storm forum
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you could tie it to stealth or the opener again

balmy condor
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Building cp and spending cp on rupture is the slow part of the opener

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Garrote is very fast

glacial lantern
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Well it's not like combo points are THAT important for sin rogue right? I don't think there is any cdr mechanic on cps etc

balmy condor
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So if you attach rupture to garrote, that’s fine

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Attaching garrote to rupture is a mess

storm monolith
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lmao

balmy condor
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You cast your improved garrotes from stealth, and then you rupture a mob

storm monolith
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you could take rupture off your hotbar

balmy condor
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So now you… overwrite the stealth garrote?

storm monolith
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i was thinking more generally. you apply rupture every time you garrote, not just during stealth windows

balmy condor
tall basalt
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what about making IC a hunters mark like debuff that says your garr/ruptures against this target cleave to 2 nearby targets or smth

glacial lantern
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Wouldn't it be just simpler to have crimson tempest spread your other dots or something? So you apply on 1 mob and then spread with tempest?

glacial lantern
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Maybe too strong?

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That's basically crash but better

storm monolith
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ah yes, the PURE single target rotation in aoe

tall basalt
gray hazel
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i tried the cleave build in M+, felt like it was weaker 😦

storm monolith
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call it bloody tempest

fleet pagoda
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Indiscriminate Caustic Spatter PogO

balmy condor
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So then you gotta be like above 80% hp and also below 35% hp

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Or some shit

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And at that point it’s 1. Still a mess to play around

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  1. Probably should just be a passive (issues on that above)
glacial lantern
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I think what he meant was that it's always active

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So basically you brand 1 target and it just spreads

tall basalt
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^

balmy condor
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Yeh so caustic

tall basalt
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when that target dies you just mark whatever ur on now

balmy condor
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That’s not happening

glacial lantern
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Honestly, is there a problem with just having something like shadow crash? On a 30 sec cd?

storm forum
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new choice node for caustic: splatters bleeds instead of poisons

proven jasper
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Pog

balmy condor
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Yes

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That’s why it changed in the first place

storm forum
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we did that already and it wasnt great. you either need to sit in stealth to wait for mobs grouped up for SS/subterfuge value, or you just send it later and lose the synergy stuff and that feels bad either way

slate crown
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Why not just what it is now pepehands pepehands I was looking for a gif and couldn’t find it I’m sick and slow rn

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I like the new version

dark token
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Sin plays fine imo

proven jasper
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Ive been saying current ic is fine

dark token
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If they want some tuning nobs for more aoe dam, crank sudden demise or scent of blood or crimson tempest

proven jasper
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it frels fine to me

balmy condor
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current IC is fine

storm forum
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i think most of us are saying that current IC is good/fine

balmy condor
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but it'll be not fine in a year or two down the road

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it's like with most things

dark token
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Sudden demise could use a buff imo, not taking it in keys is becoming optimal and it's quite a fun talent

balmy condor
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you see the one tile in your floor that's slightly off

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and it starts to eat at you

dark token
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If it's not useful in m+ it is not useful anywhere

proven jasper
tall basalt
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SD looks so fun on paper until you actually use it

balmy condor
dark token
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Nah it's still fun for me

storm forum
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how nuts would it be to combine IC and sudden desmise and get a new talent where demise is?

balmy condor
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like if we had any other tier set where it wasn't full bore into envenom and nature damage

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demise would be big

dark token
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I really enjoyed sudden demise with previous tier that amped bleeds, in first 2 weeks of m+

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Huge procs

storm forum
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sudden demise with AP/Zoldyck, old tier set and in +9s

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was really fun

proven jasper
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Yeah it was

storm forum
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pressing shiv and watching everything fucking explode at 35%

balmy condor
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I completely expect sudden demise to be perma pick m+ with no tuning the next tier set

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I mean people at the start of the season were arguing that caustic wasn't worth using in m+

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over internal bleeding

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it doesn't take a lot

dark token
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Those guys were dumb

balmy condor
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to sway the community

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ofc they were dumb

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but it was working out kinda fine

dark token
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I would like sudden demise to be perma pick now as well but yeah

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Imo it should be the go to dungeon talent besides IC

balmy condor
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it's just full nature damage tier set + an unusually single target heavy dungeon season

dark token
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Just huge qol for sin having the bleeds expire

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Yeah

balmy condor
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means sudden demise isn't crack cocaine for the +30 pushers

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but give it a season and they pendelum will swing the other way

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and sudden demise will be the best thing since electricity

fleet pagoda
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you mean +10% doomblade damage poggers

dark token
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Make sudden demise give a 0.5% agi bonus for each exploded bleed fatexplode

storm forum
dark token
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Old torghast power

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Or cleave nearby targets when bleed explodes

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Poe style

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Probably too much fps loss there

storm forum
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sudden demise giving half a stack of scent for X seconds, not counting towards scent, could be kind of pog

dark token
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The chain sudden demise explosion would be very cool tho

tall basalt
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make sudden demise transfer the remaining time of a bleed to a nearby target without that bleed

dark token
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Popopopopop

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So ur last target has 2 mins of rupture

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And just pops from 30%

tall basalt
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maybe not stacking

glacial lantern
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Shadow dance feels 100 times better than echo in aoe

balmy condor
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not a hard bar to clear

storm forum
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echo was kind of mid

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dont miss it

proven jasper
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Echo was mid

balmy condor
#

drinking nail polish is probably better than peeling your nail off one by one

storm forum
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idk if i miss sepsis or not

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I think I don't

balmy condor
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the only thing ER has going for it is that its trying to do something interesting with combo points

glacial lantern
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How are you supposed to use vanish though? On pull you have garrote already, but then vanish desynchs from deathmark if you don't send vanish immediately

balmy condor
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which is sorely missing from every rogue spec

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at least imo

tall basalt
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shadowlands sepsis was goated

dark token
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ER was ok on sin it was stabbing myself with a hot poker on sub

tall basalt
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the new sepsis is meh

balmy condor
#

combo points are incredibly boring and under-developed as a resource

balmy condor
dark token
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They should really bake in the unity effects into the covenant abilities they copied imo

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They are all pretty meh without it

storm forum
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15+ seconds?

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they wont die immediately and you get some value from it

dark token
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Or if ur chain pulling to a new pack in spiteful week and u need to get bleeds up

storm forum
glacial lantern
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I mean mostly for st

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Well i guess you just wait a few seconds before sending mark?

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So you line it up with empowered garrote?

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Also with shadow dance it should be a bit easier

slow needle
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Same with Dust.

storm forum
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we want the crit from Master Assassin talent there, and we can refresh gar there and sometimes we can refresh rup there

velvet siren
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Does Demo play like Sin? Looking for a range dps but more dps

sullen quest
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nah not at all

storm forum
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I think the CD DoT specs like shadow and boomie play most like sass

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I don't think they play that similarly though

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To current sass at least

sullen quest
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Sin is a spec that's more methodical with the pooling, I don't know of any ranged spec that has that

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maybe BM?

rotund idol
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How do we cleave on bosses like tindral (roots) with sin is it just caustic splash?

sullen quest
#

but i havent played BM since BFA

storm forum
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Yeah I wouldn't invest into AoE more than just spatter and making sure you can spam envs to proc tier set when they come out

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At least for those burst AoE fights (tindral/gnarlroot/igara)

cerulean walrus
#

!whispyr

storm forum
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!whispyr

royal lantern
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!whispyr

sullen quest
#

!whispyr

cerulean walrus
#

loading Whispyr is typing…

merry thunder
#

does outlaw always sim higher than assas o.O?

royal lantern
balmy condor
# storm forum CP are only kind of interesting as a piece of the 2 part resource system we have...

it doesn't have to be complex, but the interplay between combbo points and energy for assassination has always been a staple considering it's basically the post child for resource management. You got energy being much more valuable in single target than combo points, but as you get more targets and more bleeds, combo points become more important than energy. Things like sanguine blades, vicious venom play into that. The only thing playing into it from the other side though is seal fate giving random extra combo points. So let me just fire off a couple of ideas in no order, that could be completely passive if designed properly and not too complicated:

  • using combo points have a chance to do X, this could be:
  • giving energy back over time (reinforces pooling)
  • giving additional combo points (similar to ruthlessness on outlaw), or making the next generator more combo points
  • decreasing the cost on the next 2 generators
  • increasing the cost/damage on the next generator

More complex could be like echoing reprimand where it empowers a slot, issue with that is there needs to be a reason for combo points to be more interesting than "more damage". It's gonna interact, could for example change it to do the same damage, but apply to effects as if it was 15 combo points for example. So poison bomb would guarantee proc on ER combo points, or you could make something super wild like a choice node with seal fate. Might be way too out there, but imagine it cuts your combo points down to 3 max, and it caps your generators to 1 combo point. Combo point 1 adds poison application for a couple second, Combo point 2 makes the finisher deal 50% more damage, combo point 3 increases bleed damage for a couple seconds. So you have to hit combo points as an uptime, poison in single target, then you spam out 2cp finishers until you need to do 1cp again, in aoe you can build to 3 and big buff bleeds, or spam out 1-2cp like in single target.

There's plenty of shit to do with it on various levels of complexity, but imo there's gotta be something more

cerulean walrus
#

Gotta get my restealth don’t you know?

storm forum
balmy condor
royal lantern
cerulean walrus
#

loading Whispyr is typing…

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Again

merry thunder
#

ahh is ee

balmy condor
#

y'all act like you aint ever seen a brother make a well thought out post before

cerulean walrus
#

Whispyr

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I’ve seen you after downing a handle of whatever alcohol you could get your grubby hands on at 4am

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And then posting

balmy condor
#

always vodka

cerulean walrus
#

I’ve seen MORE than just a well thought out post

royal lantern
#

with or without energy?

sullen quest
#

vodka bis

cerulean walrus
#

I’ve seen drunk posts

sullen quest
#

you drink it clean without ice?

cerulean walrus
#

Can’t wait for the drunk Whispyr pin

balmy condor
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no I mix it with redbulll and hope for heart failure

sullen quest
#

ah that's a good way to do it too

storm forum
cerulean walrus
#

Hiya! Today I’m gonna drink this Everclear

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Whispyr’s next pin will just be something akin to

modest glen
#

is sub considered to perform better than assa in keys now or pretty much the same? been trying outlaw but cba

cerulean walrus
#

“AHHHHHHHHHHHH AHHHHH AHHHHHHH”

balmy condor
cerulean walrus
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Can’t wait for the video bro

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Sounds like a banger

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And please do a Sin Q&A while drinking

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Or be on Max’s stream again

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While doing this

balmy condor
#

I need a new bit if I'm going on max's stream again, I ran out of 3 letter acronyms for the boy

cerulean walrus
#

Drunk mayo vodka Whispyr is the new bit

balmy condor
cerulean walrus
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Absolutely

balmy condor
#

mayo and alcohol would curdle right

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google stop

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I'm not trying to be productive

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I'm trying to look up if mayonnaise curdles

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it does

desert inlet
balmy condor
#

you want a glass of mayodka endwyr?

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on the house

desert inlet
slate crown
#

I tried mixing a splash of lime juice with a splash of soy sauce with a dab of peanut butter with soy milk and vodka. Instant taste aversion developed right there.

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I will not be elaborating further

storm forum
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I do like most of the suggestions though. Except the ruthlessness one. I like the interplay between energy and CP, so I think spending CP should give something for energy, like you said, either energy refund, or decreased cost of builders. Increased cost & damage of generators could be interesting with additional changes to energy economy, but I would prefer if they didn't. I like consuming charged CPs giving other benefits (guranteed PB, maybe rup could extend DoTs.) Your 3 CP idea sounds more like a season of discovery rework tbh. Kinda wanna try it, but I think it would be bad. Removing all builder RNG sounds like it would get boring quick.

slate crown
#

Too real

storm forum
#

I like those citrus soy sauces, so I started reading it and thought it was something good and now im throwing up in my mouth

chrome lynx
#

so exactly how far are we behind outlaw in m+ ?

balmy condor
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3

storm forum
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damn thats generous, I was going to say

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!vibe

onyx swallow
#

outlaw gave me a headache man

storm forum
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82

onyx swallow
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too much adhd required

storm forum
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the OL player in my guild is like 10+ years older than me

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so i dont even know anymore

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i think i might have just huffed too much/not enough paint for OL

onyx swallow
#

I'll just make a bm hunter and top the meters without thinking about it

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xD

surreal citrus
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having played fighting games for 15 years makes outlaw button pressing a cakewalk

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my joints are so oiled

storm forum
#

how many hours do i need to put into IS or BB before I craft a sword?

quiet oar
#

What

#

Is is or bb

thorn lynx
#

Hey @balmy condor, with sin being the worst of the three specs now, what do you think of untalenting Fleet Footed and putting the point somewhere else if you have the Cruel Dreamcarver with the Dragonkin buff?

blazing jewel
#

This will be good

thorn lynx
#

Do we put the point into Acro?

quiet oar
balmy condor
#

Y’all don’t know that copypasta

blazing jewel
earnest remnant
thorn lynx
#

Ashes>Branch

keen spruce
#

@blazing jewel we figured out the macro... if everyone wasn't off doin xmas shit tomorrow

#

we'd probably kill smoldy

#

seems very ez now

#

with changes

#

but we also probably cn't do real prog next week cuz of new years

balmy condor
# blazing jewel <:caterm:1114018777894506606>

Someone came into my stream and asked what I thought about dropping feel footwork if they have the 10% buff from Igira dagger, and my brain actually fried trying to figure out what the fuck they were talking about because fleet is the point before atrophic/numbing

keen spruce
#

so we just get 2 weeks of dicking cuz we're a weekend guild

cerulean walrus
#

L

thorn lynx
balmy condor
#

Afterwards I was like, I probably fell for bait

#

But dude never said anything again

blazing jewel
balmy condor
#

So

#

I’m thinking not bait

#

But if it’s not bait

#

It’s probably one of the dumbest things anyone has ever asked me

past forum
#

If you take the cheat death on the dagger then isnt Elusiveness just free, tho?

balmy condor
#

It’s hella up there

wild birch
#

Is it normal to be energy starved on bosses in M+ with a hybrid build? I have quite a chunk of haste (~23%), but only with this build I have trouble keeping envenom up

balmy condor
#

It’s just written as a cheat death on the infographic because idk

#

Funny haha

earnest remnant
past forum
#

🎣

balmy condor
thorn lynx
#

What about leeching poison? Take beast on dagger and skip leeching?

balmy condor
#

Real

#

Could just skip the last 70 years of your life as well

#

And end it all

#

In game

past forum
#

With the magic dr you can pretty much skip taking Cloak no problem

next jackal
#

So I just did a heroic raid full clear. I got the green orb that I turned in for a piece of the tier set. Do you only get the green orb once? Or can you get it every week

thorn lynx
#

Once for AOTC or 2k rating (whichever is first)

balmy condor
#

^

next jackal
#

Oh ok thank you 🙂

balmy condor
#

well to you, 0 value

#

because all their damage gets re-attributed back to them in logs

#

for them, they have short term buffs that increase vers and replicate damage dealt

#

so the fact that we have a lot of burst

keen spruce
#

we haven't had a mythic igira dagger drop yet

balmy condor
#

means we're valuable to their buffs

rotund idol
#

Alright thanks!

quiet oar
#

But i said, dude i need to be there. What if a dagger Drops

keen spruce
#

"we neither" is a banger

#

but also

#

why u gettin benched

#

do more dmg

balmy condor
#

outlaw player

#

nothing to be done

thorn lynx
#

Opening my vault as outlaw next week. Thorncaller incoming.

faint spoke
#

I'm trying to melt into stealth vs the training dummies but it doesn't work, tried different macros help

crisp pine
#

Is the mayodka gone already?

quiet oar
#

Guild leading tries to give everyone vaults

oak tangle
#

Gotta love Xmas time in Australia it’s either 40C days or severe thunderstorm,
Currently it’s raining sideways

quiet oar
#

And i was the only rogue this week

quiet oar
balmy condor
unkempt osprey
#

Can someone guide me on how they do council fight? Should i be trying to run around and keep my rupture and garrote on each target or just focus on 1 and apply bleeds when one is near?

balmy condor
#

two of them should always be stacked

#

hit one of the two

#

let caustic do the work

unkempt osprey
#

Ok, gotcha, thank you

faint spoke
#

does anyone happen to have something that they are sure works?

balmy condor
#

mate there's nothing about it to work

#

you're in combat

#

you can't stealth

#

nothing to do about it

quiet oar
#

Just press stealth Hard enough

#

And use your Imagination

faint spoke
#

k, ty

quiet oar
#

Its Not as Bad as you might think

#

It feels Bad

#

But it isnt actually

scarlet sable
#

pips on council fight or mirror

balmy condor
#

pips for sure

#

mirror would be a second on use

scarlet sable
#

sandglass i mean

balmy condor
#

probably would still be pips at equal ilvl

#

but you can just sim 2 target patchwerk

scarlet sable
#

WORD

#

caps

balmy condor
#

if they're different ilvl might get messy

unkempt osprey
#

Has anyone tested Ashes and branch to see what they burst higher with? My sim says Branch but i also see most people using ashes which could be because m+ is more rng but was curious on yalls opinions

balmy condor
#

people use ashes cause the orbs on branch are weird and sometimes difficult to pick up

#

but if you can pick up the orbs, branch is simply better

unkempt osprey
#

You know, i never actually read the caption and realized there were orbs to get for the mastery...

balmy condor
#

yeh you pick up 2/3 of them instantly

#

then kite the last one for 4-5 seconds

unkempt osprey
#

oh gotcha

balmy condor
#

they work basically the same as the orbs from the actual boss

#

just much smaller

#

but they'll slowly float to you

#

other issue with ashes is that you get the haste debuff after

#

so looking at just the burst is a little bit misleading

slate crown
#

They're just floaty little guys

rotund idol
#

Can someone quickly check my log? What am I doing wrong

#

!logs

prisma monolithBOT
#

Wowanalyzer now has good initial support for Assassination. We suggest using it to quickly see any big rotational mistakes and analyze your ability usage

Link: https://wowanalyzer.com/

rotund idol
#

Or is it just my outlaw gear that sucks

quiet oar
#

Where is quake PES_Suspicious

wild birch
#

And that's on the wipe you linked, sry didn't look at kill

rotund idol
#

Ah no I wanted feedback on the wipe

#

Thanks!

storm forum
#

Is wowanalyzer updated for the rework yet?

#

i'll take that as a no

royal lantern
#

iirc no

balmy condor
# rotund idol https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/yhwhhfbenja#fight=9&type=casts&source=3&vie...

the opener is all sorts of messed up, 15 seconds before you slice and dice is a huge loss and the general sequencing of stuff is kinda whack the double garrote from vanish is bad as well

1 min cooldowns are fine

2 min cooldowns just..... didn't exist? your shiv/dance was at 2:12 and then you deathmark/kingsbaned 15 seconds later, no clue why. Then at 2:38 you garrote and at 2:40 you vanish, so you just screwed over your improved garrote there

3 minute cooldowns fell apart because the 2 min cooldowns were so omega scuffed

4 minute cooldowns look fine except for the rupture during kingsbane cause you dropped envenom, the tea was too early, you didn't vanish

outside of your cooldowns your pooling seems pretty questionable, like you envenom at 0:37, rupture, the chain drops, and you just insta slam out another envenom. It seems like you're prepping for vines to spawn almost, but that's almost 20 seconds later so not sure whats going on there.

also your trinkets are giga suck, you have to have an on-use, either ashes or branch it's not optional and a huge loss

#

so

#

tldr gotta learn the cooldown sequence better, farm a trinket, play around vines and pooling better

wild birch
#

Now this is a proper review, I was just looking at KB windows, didn't even thought about messing up kb/mark timings

balmy condor
#

yeh, burst class means you gotta look at the how and the when

#

I also have a video going over a log review

#

which I'm gonna shamelessly plug

#

cause learning how to help yourself is good

rotund idol
#

I appreciate it

#

Gonna check out that video 💀

wild birch
balmy condor
#

I mean you could

#

in my head it's easier to do a ratio

#

so I'm just going big number small number

#

doesn't really matter which way you go about it

#

I do envenom divided by explosions

#

and look at that number

#

if you wanna do explosions divided by envenoms knock yourself out

wild birch
#

Yeah, I was just curious

balmy condor
#

yeh

#

just ends up being I had to pick one way to do it, and envenom is always first in the order on logs

#

so doing top/bottom was just the easiest to remember for me

tall jay
#

Whispyr is like a 1.15 ratio god

balmy condor
#

1.15 is good

#

anything under 1.2 is pretty much as good as it gets

tall jay
#

No you are a 1.15 ratio GOD

balmy condor
#

oh

#

yeh not really

wild birch
#

When it's bad?

#

Like you should look into how you play

tall jay
#

1.3 or higher

balmy condor
#

I did a log review for mythic fyrakk prog

tall jay
#

Or is it 1.4

balmy condor
#

and dude was at like 1.118

#

and I was like

#

god damn

#

1.4 is pretty bad yeh

#

1.3 is kinda bad

wild birch
#

One of echo players was using TTN

balmy condor
#

it's basically every .1 for me as a rule

#

1.1 is insane
1.2 is fine
1.3 is not good
1.4 is awful
1.5 you gotta play a different spec
1.6 time to play a different game
1.7 time to quit your job, change your name, move to the jungles of south america and live your life as a hermit

tall jay
#

Hahaha

balmy condor
earnest remnant
#

my raccoon brain doesent get this

balmy condor
#

like it's fine on tindral for roots and stuff

#

I think it's just bad everywhere else though

#

but the echo rogues did a lot of..... curious things

#

so

earnest remnant
#

THE NUMBERS WHISPYR WHAT DO THEY MEAN

#

i need to know

wild birch
#

He was using it on Fyrakk kill, dropped improved poisons for it

earnest remnant
#

im turning into fucking mason from black ops 1 man

balmy condor
balmy condor
#

but yeh idk

#

the last couple bosses this tier

earnest remnant
balmy condor
#

brought out some insane feelcraft

balmy condor
tall jay
#

Tells us if we should play sub or not

earnest remnant
royal lantern
#

maybe

#

the answer is maybe stealthi

earnest remnant
#

but maybe what?

balmy condor
# earnest remnant <a:NOTED:1154029517816479805>

cause like I had 1.14 or 1.15 or whatever on smold thursday, which means I get 100 tier procs in 115 envenoms, but if that would be 1.4, it would be 100 tier procs in 140 envenoms, so that would mean I probably fucked up pooling on that pull pretty bad

#

sorta works out

#

but twist the knife means you should basically be perma 1.1

#

or else why even play ttk

earnest remnant
#

Maybe outlaw nerfs after new years?

proven jasper
royal lantern
tall jay
#

Maybe 10.2.6 they will revert the changes

wild birch
#

Is there a way to sim so your envenom ratio is 1.2 and compare it to TTK build with 1.1 ratio and see which one is better?

olive veldt
#

Is there a way to see how many combo points were used on finishers when looking at logs?

royal lantern
scarlet sable
#

is sin still best raid spec

#

our other rogue is playing sub and blasting

oak tangle
#

best raid spec is the spec you play the best, in saying that do you get pi

scarlet sable
#

i think i am

#

yea getting giga PI

oak tangle
#

shiettttttttt 1:1

#

no idea how that's possible

blazing jewel
#

have to check hits not casts

oak tangle
#

ahh yep, 1.13

scarlet sable
#

Theres a loggy poo

#

if the boys wanna roast

oak tangle
#

u anxiety?

slate crown
oak tangle
#

scana insta dispelled the rumor

slate crown
#

oh I hadn't gotten that far (2 lines down 😦 )

scarlet sable
#

I am

scarlet sable
#

Oh look at gnarlroot I died on igira

oak tangle
#

im checking vol heroic

scarlet sable
#

Shore shore

oak tangle
#

do you not have branch? or just dont want to use it

scarlet sable
#

I do not have

earnest remnant
scarlet sable
#

Just got an off hand at tindral

blazing jewel
#

ill play outlaw before I move my cds

oak tangle
#

the kill timer is a bit rough on volc, but you also get pi too early, not sure if there is much you can do about that though

earnest remnant
#

thanks

#

see you on outlaw bozo

scarlet sable
#

Rotations fine then?

oak tangle
#

looks dece

scarlet sable
#

I just don’t get how he’s doing so much more

oak tangle
#

6 ilvl

blazing jewel
scarlet sable
#

I’m just bad

oak tangle
#

there is some things in the opener to touch up on, but it's mostly ok

scarlet sable
#

sometimes I greed an extra rupture

#

What are you seeing thought I had opener down

#

I’ll do garrote ambush rupture mutilate slice 5cp envenom pop booldowns blah blah

oak tangle
#

nvm the timing looked off for me on tea, but you did it fine

#

but you did drop shiv for a kb tick

hushed fable
#

How does that look then?

oak tangle
#

1.09

hushed fable
#

So by the scale is...? Good or bad? I would assume not that bad.

oak tangle
#

good, closer to 1 is better

#

can never get 1, as the first cast will aslways not do explosion

scarlet sable
#

Ty

#

Idk other rogues just a blaster

oak tangle
#

i don't know a whole lot about sub's cd windows this tier, but fight could line up nicer for him, you did better parse for your ilvl

scarlet sable
#

think my second Dm windows didn’t hit there

oak tangle
#

you also dropped envenom right at the start of the dm

#

make sure you are 5+ cp into a dm window

balmy condor
#

also when you guys are doing the envenom division

#

make sure you filtered to the boss

#

cause tier hits in aoe

#

so it'll inflate

oak tangle
scarlet sable
#

Doesn’t sim as that much higher

oak tangle
#

do a 2.5 min sim with them, and that will represent your H clears

scarlet sable
#

I see

#

We’ll be full mythic next week so times will be linger

#

I’m still farming Nick and branch

tall jay
oak tangle
#

also, keep in mind parse percents will be harder to get now with the nerfs

tall jay
#

Any one have any tips for council

#

Here’s my best one

slate crown
#

!wa @stable moss see LE’s profile, there’s a Lucid Shadewalker aura which is the standalone version of the proc chance

marble hemlock
# earnest remnant i need to know

id assume it has something to do with uptime being dogshit on that fight cuz of how much you have to run around and dodge, so TTN makes it a bit more forgiving to keep up your envenom chain

#

was legit considering playing acro on that fight cuz the amount of times the boss gets moved and you might be out of range for 1-2 or some dumb shit happens is just... infuriating, really

slate crown
#

I was asked by name!

balmy condor
#

gulag time

spice spire
#

What I’m saying

tall basalt
#

yo got a m+ question - on timelost battlefield in rise, how much should i be committing to killing adds? i feel like i do 0 dmg to boss if i even try to hit adds beyond fan and ct

balmy condor
#

Pretty much 0

#

Rupture sniping the odd one here or there is fine

#

Otherwise just let caustic cleave them

tall basalt
#

gotcha, thanks

balmy condor
#

Shouldn’t even have enough to warrant a CT

#

Now that I’m thinking about it

tall basalt
#

just did an 18 and we got overrun with them lol

balmy condor
#

Yeh well

tall basalt
#

other 2 dps were demo locks so im gonna say it wasnt my fault :p

balmy condor
#

That’s mechanic issue

#

The entire fight is about avoiding spawning adds lmao

lime crypt
balmy condor
#

You don’t hit them with mechanics?

midnight atlas
#

bait shockwave outside and kite bladestorm on the outside of circle

lime crypt
#

if you hit mobs with mechanics, they die and boss gets stack for aoe dmg no?

#

adds "awakening" or whatever u wanna call it is simply by the boss casting it on cooldown

#

i thought the idea would be to constantly kill the enemy mobs before they get "awakened"

#

but idk, im dodging rise as much as i can

#

so i dont fully understand how it works

midnight atlas
#

it spawns 3 adds always whenever he does for the horde/alliance. you can throw a kick on caster, put a bleed or so but only if the boss needs kiting

kindred ingot
#

a little question should i change from dwarf to night elf

midnight atlas
#

its up to you what you do

lime crypt
kindred ingot
#

no

lime crypt
#

higher?

kindred ingot
#

around 25

lime crypt
#

then play what you feel like looks the best

#

mby 25s might be the breakpoint where you might invest into changing race, but its usually not the case why you cant time a dungeon or something

midnight atlas
#

both dwarf and nelf are good for m+. if you played like draenei maybe that would matter but between dwarf and nelf just chill with race change

kindred ingot
#

now my crit 40% mastery 44% Ver 15% and haste 14%

#

i have branch and sandglass

#

so should i get more mastery and Ver and to less crit?

sweet shore
#

Uh hard to say you should just sim your gear/envhants

balmy condor
#

Should sim yeh

sweet shore
#

Like just saying get more of this vs that is not helpful for you tbh

balmy condor
#

Every time someone starts typing out stats my eyes glaze over and I don’t read the message

sweet shore
#

The answer is always just sim it lol

balmy condor
#

I have 4300 mastery 2400 haste 3900 crit 3000 vers

#

My brain just

#

Auto-skips it like a cutscene

sweet shore
#

Well according to the guide our best stat is mastery and I think I need more of it!

balmy condor
#

Real and true

#

Full stack mastery (I have a trinket that gives me nearly 7000 mastery every time I use my big cooldowns)

dire veldt
#

hey guys, quick question:
are we trying to stay above 50% energy to profit from sanguine blades even in pure single target situations?

balmy condor
#

No

#

!pooling

prisma monolithBOT
#

Read About Pooling
Video
TLDR:```- Outside of Cooldowns, you want to wait until your envenom is in pandemic/around 1 second in order to proc tier. This is the core concept of "chaining", where you clip envenoms back to back

  • If it's getting uncomfortable to chain, or you have to let envenom drop, pool back up to around 80% energy, and then start another chain
  • Always wait to envenom, never wait to mutilate/ambush. You want to generate your combo points as soon as possible, and then evaluate whether you should pool or use a finisher
  • Without 4 piece, chaining envenoms has no benefit and you can try to be above 50% energy for sanguine
  • With 4 piece, the chain takes priority over sanguine and you would play around the tier, not sanguine```The reason we do this is to maximize uptimes and tier procs which is a more efficient energy use
balmy condor
#

Read

dire veldt
#

alright, thanks 🙂

balmy condor
#

Np

sweet shore
#

No not with 4 set

#

Oh lol I’m late rip

balmy condor
#

Same except stat weights are dumb

#

No no come back

#

I haven’t clowned you enough for simming stat weights

sullen quest
#

I gear my characters exclusively using pawn

sweet shore
#

I only use pawn strings to evaluate my gear

#

And stat weights

sullen quest
#

Yeah that's the best way honestly

sweet shore
#

That’s why I never ask

#

You don’t need to ask when pawn is there to tell you a ring is a 12 percent increase

sullen quest
#

True brother

#

Pawn doesn't lie to you, and pawn keeps things nice and simple. Unlike raidbots which is way too complicated with all its variables and such.

sweet shore
#

Yeah agreed pawn is the only truth you need

sullen quest
#

Imagine going to an external website to play game

sweet shore
#

🤢

lime crypt
normal mist
sullen quest
#

I don't think I could've added on more sarcasm if I tried

normal mist
#

Same xD

#

Maybe I failed on not adding emojis 😦

sullen quest
#

pawn makes me very sad

quiet oar
sullen quest
#

Imagine if there was like a massive asterix on the stat weight portion of raid bots that explains exactly why you shouldnt use stat weights or pawn

quiet oar
#

Good

sullen quest
#

that would be crazy

quiet oar
#

Ye

sweet shore
#

Oh I just got a new piece of gear

#

Gotta update my pawn string!

sullen quest
#

true!

fallen forge
sullen quest
#

Atleast it's hidden under a dropdown menu now

sweet shore
#

Cause how am I gonna know what to use

sullen quest
#

They probably keep it around for traffic or something

#

Same reason wowhead forces writers to talk about stats

sweet shore
#

Look I’m not gonna be on here asking whispyr what stats I need more of when I could just use pawn

sullen quest
#

Pawn = we have whispyr at home

#

Or maybe the other way around

sweet shore
#

Yeah I don’t wanna look like I have room temp iq asking about stats when pawn exists

solid mica
#

anyone know if this trinket is usable on yourself?

sweet shore
#

wtf is that lol

#

What does pawn say

oak tangle
#

pawn is ummm an addon of all time

normal mist
#

Guys i wanna share something that just happened in a fyrakk normal weekly clear with pugs

#

shouldnt have talked shit

sullen quest
#

As a ret main I am both sad and astonished that another ret player is as dumb to believe he could outdps a rogue

normal mist
#

firstly he would beat me no matter what

#

then:

sullen quest
pseudo hamlet
normal mist
#

I didnt even understand why he started shit

pseudo hamlet
#

Probably realised he won't get the present he wanted under the Cristmass tree and had to vent his emotions somehow peeposhrug

normal mist
#

i wish i could have seen his face, when boss transitioned at 20% (our good execute phase) and BL is popped and my dps just went to the moon

#

We didnt even do seeds xD it was a really good kill

pseudo hamlet
#

Wait, it was Fyrakk?

normal mist
#

yeah

#

a weekly normal kill

#

for the mount skin :3

pseudo hamlet
#

Damn, you destroyed him 😄

#

and probably ruined his christmass also OMEGAKEKW

normal mist
#

I was just doing my thing, trying to improve myself, but we didnt have dks so hard to pad on p2 adds 😦

pseudo hamlet
#

You can feel the seethe from miles away

normal mist
#

This was an amazing christmas early gift, ret tears

sullen quest
#

I love people that start a conflict by acting superior, and then lose and go on this insanely wild excuses/justification spree where they just whip out all the creativity

#

It truely is a christmas wonder

quiet oar
#

And say "i have no fire gear, im usually playing arcane"

#

With So much confidence

sullen quest
#

Yeah having slightly less mastery and a bit more haste easily multiplies your damage by 0.1

slim hamlet
rotund oak
strange trail
#

would you guys recommend macroing shadowdance and kingsbane togetherr?

balmy condor
#

Yep

strange trail
#

should i also put kingsbane in another slot, to i know it's off GCD?

spice spire
#

You can show kingsbane as the template. Or you can have a handy dandy weak aura with all cd timers.

#

Also off topic but I’d never ping you there @desert inlet shower orange was a troll wtf 😦

desert inlet
#

you didn't like it??

spice spire
#

Nah. I think body hair (don’t be gross, random person 😡) came into play here.
Also I chew around my nails (weird habit I know) so the citrus burned.

All around unpleasant but the smell was good. That’s about all I got tho, even if it was a troll. It was.. an experience

desert inlet
#

D:

#

rip

#

me no have that problem so I'm a shower orange enjoyer

sullen quest
#

get a good weakaura pack for the former, this game isn't the same without one

#

game is actually unplayable without weakauras imo lmao

spice spire
desert inlet
#

I will make sure to get a good festive boots picture

spice spire
#

Ty so much. There’s a reason you’re the goat

desert inlet
strange trail
#

and thank you everyone for the help!

sullen quest
#

!wa

royal lantern
strange trail
desert inlet
desert inlet
sullen quest
balmy condor
#

(Me)

spice spire
spice spire
desert inlet
blazing jewel
#

Quake ain’t no way you actually did the shower orange

strange trail
#

like the having the bar there

desert inlet
#

prob not

#

me no track

desert inlet
blazing jewel
#

Track sitmadge

desert inlet
#

oh jk track it ig

strange trail
blazing jewel
#

@keen spruce track or no track

desert inlet
#

I do track the empowered garrote window

slim hamlet
#

Imagine not just using your brain and probably overwriting it often

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Just because u are too stubborn to track

desert inlet
#

overwriting what

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my brain?

strange trail
desert inlet
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I would def track improved garrote

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I don't think tracking IC is strictly required but if that's where garrote is tracked then it works

blazing jewel
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Head empty

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No thoughts

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Can’t overwrite the dot if you can’t write

desert inlet
blazing jewel
desert inlet
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scana r u gonna try the shower orange

blazing jewel
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No

desert inlet
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coward

blazing jewel
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Is this a challenge now

desert inlet
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i guess so

blazing jewel
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I’ll try the shower orange

desert inlet
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it is a good

blazing jewel
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If you get me the chinchilla I wanted

desert inlet
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chinchillas are cute

blazing jewel
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He looked sad and sleepy

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I wanted to take him so he would be sleepy but not sad

desert inlet
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poor lil sleepy guy

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why no take

blazing jewel
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No room for chinchilla

desert inlet
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D:

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but then wouldn't it be a bad thing if I got him for u

blazing jewel
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I need to train mochi to play rogue

spice spire
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Head empty no thoughts

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Just like me fr

blazing jewel
strange trail
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one more question, and im sorry if this a dumb one. what do the orange and red tick mean on the envenom tracking bar in the weakaura?

blazing jewel
#

Which weakaura PogO

strange trail
blazing jewel
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I’m guessing it’s a pandemic tracker but it’s hard to tell looking at it on mobile

desert inlet
#

the red one is

strange trail
spice spire
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This is my worst nightmare

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I literally don’t see orange

blazing jewel
#

I wonder if it’s a energy/pooling logic thing

strange trail
desert inlet
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it only shows if you have the 4p equipped

blazing jewel
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LE is big smart so they could probably do something like that

desert inlet
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but idk why

strange trail
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this is hurting my brain

blazing jewel
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I have an idea

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Let me cook

desert inlet
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that option just moves the red tick dynamically to make it accurate to your current combo point count

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I think

strange trail
spice spire
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Y’know what I’ll ping her @slate crown hey what does orange (if it exists, I’m convinced that I’m being gaslit rn) mean? Is it what endwyr said above? Hmm

strange trail
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im ready

blazing jewel
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Okay my cook was wrong

spice spire
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I mean she’s probably asleep. So it’ll be a bit but hopefully she reads and knows to ping you

desert inlet
#

burnt

strange trail
spice spire
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If not I’ll try to remember ReallyMad

strange trail
#

. _ .

desert inlet
#

yeah leave that one checked

strange trail
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thank you guys for te help

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i really appericate it

blazing jewel
spice spire
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I did absolutely nothing so Yw WideGeorgeHappy

spice spire
blazing jewel
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This is like when someone orders Indian hot without knowing what spice is

strange trail
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are these two things that should be checked off?

desert inlet
#

man

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now I gotta read

spice spire
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I ain’t reading that essay

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I’m ngl

strange trail
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IM SORRY

spice spire
desert inlet
strange trail
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i know i know

devout karma
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Anyone has WA which shows on how many targets do I have garrote active, cant find it on wago anymore

strange trail
blazing jewel
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LE Harvard 200 iq wa shattering our skulls rn

desert inlet
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I think unchecked

spice spire
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Plater profiles

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Swear by them

blazing jewel
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Plate this

desert inlet
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idk what features in the pack that setting would enable since I don't use it

spice spire
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Okay Kyle

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See you soon pal (10 hour drive)

strange trail
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maybe this is too advanced for my brain

blazing jewel
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I’ll throw a monster energy drink at you or something

spice spire
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I’m fried on 3 hours currently so it’s too advanced for me rn

desert inlet
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it seems like it's something for like, your next garrote would be empowered

strange trail
desert inlet
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while trying to account for the gcd

strange trail
spice spire
desert inlet
#

but idk

desert inlet
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me no harvard brain

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me drop out of public university

strange trail
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I would LOVE to understand this weakaura, but until then, I will try out another one

desert inlet
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I think WA pack good

strange trail
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it is

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nitty gritty

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stuffs

blazing jewel
spice spire
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LE literally astrophysicist of weak auras

spice spire
desert inlet
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I just make my own stinky little WAs

blazing jewel
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Oh you know