assassination

[cunning basin]

Unluck

[slim hamlet]

Should've vanish cheesed it

[cunning basin]

I hold vanish on blight for if I get corrosion bro

[slim hamlet]

Using it for dmg like a noob

[cunning basin]

That shit goes on me I am TOAST without divine intervention

[slim hamlet]

krill issue

[static glacier]

Can you vanish it to make another bozo get it?

[slim hamlet]

But yea would be smart

Another one of the oneshots in 25+

[cunning basin]

It skips the whole cast

[static glacier]

AYO

[cunning basin]

You can also meld and I think feign it?

[static glacier]

This is the info I need from sin chat

[sharp dagger]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[static glacier]

Thanks guys for being here for my long journeys away from home

[cunning basin]

I know you can meld it but like every other meld cheese the timing is way tighter than vanish

[slim hamlet]

Unlucky you are playing a 2 min vanish instead of 10 sec vanish spec

[compact latch]

Is it possible in plater to change the color of the bar when a mob has KG applied?

[cunning basin]

On god

But that dot doesn't do shit to outlaw

40% vers says what dot?

[slim hamlet]

idk

My sims want me to keep getting vers

at 24%

[cunning basin]

[quartz kraken]

I'm ashamed about this but I decide to speak out. How do I reliably master the stupid orb run on the twisted timeway boss in DoTI?

[cosmic rivet]

!up

[prisma monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/486284970806083584/1165033412827037806/image.png

[cunning basin]

Mine had me stop at like 15%

I think

Idr

I have a shitload of haste now

[slim hamlet]

Just stand in dark zones, and if it doesn't automatically make a whole you can run through, just run right to the next dark zone and do the same thing

[cunning basin]

I'm at like 22% haste

[slim hamlet]

Wants me to get vers neck

I got crit mast neck

[cunning basin]

The fuck?

Over the eye??

[steel ridge]

with 38% mastery?!

[cunning basin]

That gives like 1600 mastery??

[steel ridge]

i have 65% mastery

[slim hamlet]

The raid one is better yea

[cunning basin]

Bro sims are on something

[slim hamlet]

But I dont have branch

Which will make mastery worse

[cunning basin]

Oof

No branch is a rip

Mine is only 476

Rocking 476 branch/483 signet brand but honestly

Really want pip's for m+

[slim hamlet]

I am a signet hater

fuck that stupid ass trinket

Getting rid of it as fast as I can

[cunning basin]

It does an absurd amount of damage in st

[slim hamlet]

no

It's fake

[cunning basin]

But same problem as bomb dispenser

[slim hamlet]

it does 1% dmg 90% of fights

[cunning basin]

For me it does xd

[slim hamlet]

and 6% on the other 10%

[cunning notch]

True. Dont Think i should bother with assa in lower than 20 maybe?

[slim hamlet]

dumbass trinket

[misty holly]

Dude don't even worry about it, just open one in your vault this week.

Why stress

[uncut hearth]

Meanwhile I can’t get rid of my 450 azzinoth

[cunning basin]

Based take honestly

[dark token]

its still good

it doesnt really matter

[cunning notch]

Nah true

[dark token]

i play sub below 20 just to practice

[slim hamlet]

Sin is not bad in any key level

[dark token]

even tho sub is shit in keys

[cunning notch]

Havent tried assa tho

[cunning basin]

To be 100% real and honest

[slim hamlet]

It just feels bad in like 15 and lower

[cunning basin]

Spec genuinely doesn't matter in like 21s and below

[slim hamlet]

Doesn't mean it is bad in 15 and lower tho

[cunning basin]

Cuz it's like those keys are kinda just not real

[slim hamlet]

Like your prio target explodes even on a 24

[static glacier]

Assuming you’re good enough I agree, but assuming you’re not that good you could kinda carry and play easier with some specs

[cunning basin]

Also if everything is dying too fast for you to do damage

You're still gonna time the key

Sit back and enjoy the carry king

[paper arch]

Guys is there any wa showing when to press tea and shiv during kingsbane?

[cunning basin]

Yes this is assuming you know how to play the spec lol

If you don't know how to play the spec, it still doesn't matter bc you don't know how to play anyways

[static glacier]

Almost always player matters more than spec

[cunning basin]

100% until you get to places where damage optimization is literally necessary to get through things

Rwf, 29+ keys, etc

[cunning notch]

Thing with outlaw is, if i Press wrong like my bte out of stealth im fucked

[static glacier]

For the most part it feels like higher end keys are more survival checks

Atleast until the most bleeding edge of keys

[cunning notch]

And i do this some times lol

I know it will get better with practice

[static glacier]

You’ll get it back within 10 secs

[cunning notch]

But does assa have those drawbacks?

[strange python]

yeah same - you wanna hold BTE if there are 15 sec or less left on your dance. (or some number on vanish, haven't gotten there yet)

[cunning basin]

It's tough bc unless something is hyper overtuned in terms of damage is both a survivability and DPS check, m+ is dope as fuck for that

[cunning notch]

Yeah but still loads of dmg wasted

[cunning basin]

45s on vanish

[cunning notch]

45 yeah

[strange python]

it is kinda a lot to pay attention to really

[cunning basin]

I'm somewhat of an outlaw gamer

I read a guide once

[cunning notch]

Really might give assa a chance, but im not tjat great geared.. only do 16 Keys

[static glacier]

The damage loss manifests over a longer period of time, since you’ll on average have less cps spent and generated if you’re misusing bte and having to keep vanish and dance off cd

[strange python]

I dont wanna tell you guys how many keys i did as outlaw so far and didn't even realize the no-cd bte thing existed.

i just thought i sucked

[cunning basin]

Holy shit bro crackshot is the best part of new outlaw

[static glacier]

[strange python]

[cunning basin]

Crackshot+ace is literally an addiction

[static glacier]

I’m still a little sad non crackshot sees no play

Feels like a missed opportunity

[cunning notch]

Exactly, im kinda stressed out when playing outlaw lol.. need to chill

[strange python]

wait is this an option?

[cunning basin]

I'm not, crackshot is the coolest fuckin talent in the game

[cunning basin]

No

[strange python]

i want outlaw that played like 9.x outlaw

oh ok

[cunning basin]

I mean yes, but in reality, no

You get my drift?

[strange python]

it's like kingsbane basically

yeah you can build without it but good f'in luck

[cunning basin]

Yeah kinda

Pretty much LMAO

It makes BtE giga

Just so much free damage

Blizz was on smth when they made that and UHUH

[cunning notch]

Crackshot is lovely, but with BL and too much haste, i often Press wrong cause too fast lol

[cunning basin]

Haste doesn't change your gcd

Only adrenaline rush does

[cunning notch]

I might try assa even in low keys lol

[strange python]

I mean there's a lot there. sometimes you BTE and you gotta BTE again. Other times no

etc

[cunning notch]

Thats what fucks me up yeah haha

[strange python]

i'm gonna go ask in outalw

[cunning basin]

I go off sound cues cuz the crackshot sound is PEAK

[strange python]

cause i feel bad asking here

[cunning basin]

Sounds like a shotgun cocking

[cursive frost]

is blazefury medallion worth pursuing?

[gray crest]

its pretty good. I think someone said it was 0.9% off bis for sin

[cunning basin]

If you don't have a really good neck yeah probably

[strange python]

Thanks @cunning basin

[cunning basin]

😉

[hexed willow]

0.6% worse than 489 bis

[cunning basin]

Certified outlaw enjoyer, I read a guide one(1) time

[hexed willow]

So i picked it up until then

[strange python]

jesus you musta really ingested that

i gotta go back to guides like 18-19 times a piece

[cursive frost]

is there a way to sim it, i cannot find it in droptimizer

[dark token]

alright this is looking clean

[cunning basin]

my perma tabs

[strange python]

i feel that

[cursive frost]

!WA

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Afenar's Group
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[misty holly]

It's worth getting if you aren't getting myth track necklaces. It's honestly not -great- though. About equal to hero track item for dps, but you lose stamina, so probably hero track is still better.

[cursive frost]

currently running a hero track neck from BRH

so probably not going after it

[cunning notch]

Honestly guys, which spec do you Think is the most fun of outlaw and assasination?

[static glacier]

I’ve still got the blaze fury medallion

[cunning basin]

both

[cursive frost]

sin is so much fun

[static glacier]

That’s an incredibly subjective question, I like both - probably prefer sin more though, longtime sin enjoyer here since wod

Getting a chain of bte resets feels so good though

[cunning basin]

im just a rogue enjoyer

[static glacier]

I play all specs but I generally gravitate to sin more historically

[cunning basin]

accidentally'd myself into becoming the resident one trick for my team

[eternal timber]

Hey folks - I’m coming back for 10.2 after leaving in 10.0. I missed the rework entirely and I’m reading mixed reviews on the new single -> multi-target talents.

How does the new flow and rotation feel vs. the old one? It seems more interesting at least and the bleed capstone seems like it’ll help noobs like me.

[grizzled storm]

got me a porcelain crab today, it seems to be simming well now

[still steppe]

!dagger

[prisma monolith]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/842817103354658817/1154475731108249700/image.png

[cunning basin]

last tier was my first tier ever actually maining rogue and not playing as an alt

[cunning basin]

oh it feels 100% better

[hexed willow]

I like sinms current rotation, it’s satisfying and doesn’t give me carpal tunnel. Outlaw is a huge rush though when you get multiple ace procs though

[cunning basin]

especially in aoe

[eternal timber]

Hell yeah.

[jovial verge]

Ye it ain't close really in terms of AOE compairson

[vagrant salmon]

Anyone else getting that awkward pause when subterfuge expires as you’re trying to hit ambush but it’s changing to mutilate? There a macro to get past that?

[static glacier]

Your bleeds apply to 3 targets for 10s after leaving stealth / vanish and during shadow dance. We have a poison dmg blade flurry effect in the talent caustic spatter that turns kingsbane into a serious aoe cd and makes deathmark also matter in aoe. Sin aoe can feel overwhelming when you first start due to a lot of steps needed before you can fok > envenom but it feels satisfying when you are used to it and execute correctly

[cunning basin]

think thats just a wow problem with stance changes, same thing happens in dance

[eternal timber]

Is the AOE higher DPS (and thus better) or easier/better flow? Or both?

[hexed willow]

/cast [stance] Ambush; Mutilate

[cunning notch]

Do you guys get into m+ keys easy as rogue/dps?

[strange python]

nope

[cunning notch]

Cause to me its kinda hard, which makes me want to reroll

[strange python]

we dont bring any of the "required" things. brez, lust...once those are filled, if there's still a spot for dps, we'd be on the list.

[vagrant salmon]

Thank you kindly

[cunning basin]

not really, idk why

[eternal timber]

Oh no - that sounds complicated. Wah. I liked Assassination because it was the “easy” rogue spec. Loool

[cunning basin]

there's a shroud skip in like almost every dungeon

[cunning basin]

i mean its still "easy" once you understand it

since the apm on it is much lower than other specs

[hexed willow]

Sin isn’t really hard, just lots of stuff going on initially

[bleak ivy]

is 144k decent for smolderon or am I selling

[jovial verge]

Its also easy to do respectable damage whilst not playing the rotation optimally esp if you aren't pushing super high keys

[hexed willow]

Practice make perfect

[static glacier]

The damage is certainly higher, flow depends on your definition- 10.2 sin has a longer ramp up time than 10.1 sin in m+ but the payoff is a lot higher, especially since after all dots are up the tier set and caustic make pressing envenom feel quite good and remembering to maintain CT / spatter stops it getting stale

[cunning basin]

what ilevel are you and was it heroic or normal

[hexed willow]

Uncertain based on gear, kill time, externals etc. just play your best and it’ll keep going up

[strange python]

pretty low

They make a site for that though

[split jewel]

anyway we could petition to Details to have Iron Wire count as interrupts

[bleak ivy]

I thought I joined for a HC but it was actually normal I got scammed im 469 with no nick of time

[cunning basin]

why you gotta go doin that iwas asking so i could say it was shit

[dark token]

hc?

pretty low

[bleak ivy]

its nm

[dark token]

normal/lfr? ok i guess

[cunning notch]

Hmm, whats ur ilvl?

[cunning basin]

472 and 2759 io

[strange python]

I suck and i did 165k on smolderon

[cunning basin]

i have all 20s timed and struggle to get into 17s often

[bleak ivy]

im getting cucked by galakronds fall

[cunning basin]

pretty cringe

[manic coral]

is stat weights tweaking or what

[strange python]

I mean you can't change perception - or the "need" for that lust and brez i dunno. Although a random distribution of 3 dps pretty much should cover the lust anyway.

[manic coral]

why the fuck am i supposed to have more versa with 38 % mastery?

[bleak ivy]

HC?

[strange python]

yeah that was HC - i would think normal should be higher? or no?

[bleak ivy]

no

[cunning basin]

normal probs lower

kill time way more awkward for cds

[bleak ivy]

on normals way lower it doesnt live to see another burst of yours

[strange python]

I'd say just look at your rankings on WCL and compare it to people with your ilvl?

There's some weird territory there though - like if you are higher ilvl and dont have 4p your ilvl numbers are gonna be scuffed.

[bleak ivy]

Im 3p sadly

[clever niche]

!pooling

[prisma monolith]

Read About Pooling
Video
TLDR:```- Outside of Cooldowns, you want to wait until your envenom is in pandemic/around 1 second in order to proc tier. This is the core concept of "chaining", where you clip envenoms back to back

• If it's getting uncomfortable to chain, or you have to let envenom drop, pool back up to around 80% energy, and then start another chain
• Always wait to envenom, never wait to mutilate/ambush. You want to generate your combo points as soon as possible, and then evaluate whether you should pool or use a finisher
• Without 4 piece, chaining envenoms has no benefit and you can try to be above 50% energy for sanguine
• With 4 piece, the chain takes priority over sanguine and you would play around the tier, not sanguine```The reason we do this is to maximize uptimes and tier procs which is a more efficient energy use

[bleak ivy]

I'm 3p with 0 nnick of times

[strange python]

tuesday crew (checking in)

[bleak ivy]

blizzard hatiing

[lofty junco]

do u ahve big problems finding mythic raid guilde as assa, if u can't show any DF logs on rogue?

since aftger legion i did switch from rogue to shadow, and just returned to rogue main now

[strange python]

maint is gonna be 4 hours on tues

[bleak ivy]

im from EU

[steel ridge]

i know what you mean... stupid bar lag

[strange python]

oh yeah i dunno what yours is then

[static glacier]

I did 207k on smolderon and I consider that was misplayed due to only getting 2 balls on 2nd intermission and dying

[bleak ivy]

its wednesday

[static glacier]

It’s also my worst log this week

[bleak ivy]

you got fed PIs or what

[static glacier]

Yeah I get pi and I’m geared

[cunning basin]

my smoldy was 175

[strange python]

do you guys save DM for the middle phase on smolderon right?

or you opening with it

[cunning basin]

pretty shit bc i just send everything on cd

[static glacier]

I held 2nd dm for the intermission I think

[bleak ivy]

my priests dont know that assa benefits from PI

[cunning basin]

fight's kind of a joke on heroic anyways so i just wanna kill the boss

[static glacier]

Link them bloodmallet

[cunning notch]

Oh i thought u Said u could get in easy

[cunning basin]

i send everything on cd. Probs be different for mythic if im not on sub bc we'll need optimized damage but idk

i cba to optimize my cds on fucking heroic

[strange python]

I mean if the group is saving lust for that first middle phase...i think it'd be nuts to DM on pull

[cunning basin]

we lust on pull

because we all cba

[strange python]

yea

[cunning basin]

lmao

[static glacier]

Tbh now look

[strange python]

that complicates things

[bleak ivy]

thats like 96-97 percentile on WCL?

[static glacier]

85 for hc

Or 86

On normal I did 217

A lot of it is gear / externals and kill timer

[cunning basin]

on normal i did 237 LMAO

[bleak ivy]

is it possible to get a good parse when u aint ggetting fed PI when every other rogue is

[strange python]

https://lorrgs.io/spec_ranking/rogue-assassination/smolderon?difficulty=heroic

[cunning basin]

2:05 fight XD

[bleak ivy]

scuffed ahh statistic

[static glacier]

Focus on pressing the right buttons and properly executing pooling and cds and the damage will come

[strange python]

Looks like most people are just DM on pull

[cunning basin]

you can get a decent one

but you won't be orange parsing without pi as a pi class most of the time

[bleak ivy]

delete priests?

[cunning basin]

no just make pi self cast only

gg

[strange python]

sometimes you gotta offer the priests gold or other services for it

[cunning basin]

sick of externals and raid buffs

[static glacier]

I think pi is super cringe ngl

In raid anyway

[strange python]

i mean it really is

[cunning basin]

the service i offer for pi is killing the boss faster

[static glacier]

In keys and pvp it’s a bit more dynamic and impactful

[cunning basin]

bc its turbo cringe when people play the "pi me" game

[bleak ivy]

what if someone else can kill it faster tho

[cunning basin]

statistically speaking only an unholy dk would do more with it than me so

shrug

[bleak ivy]

average priest brain is =PI mage zug zug

[static glacier]

I think it should always go to the optimal target, if that’s me cool, if not also cool

[strange python]

yeah this i agree with

it just sucks knowing you are optimal

and not getting it

[static glacier]

Last tier I was dev for all prog except sark and we recruited a blaster UH late in the tier, I was happy for him to have my pi since I have full confidence in his performance

[bleak ivy]

theres always that guy that gives PI to his friend who is ann absolute shitter

[strange python]

it's like checking groups before boss and seeing the other two rogues, an arms war, and a frost dk in the wft group or something

[static glacier]

In hindsight he did make better use out of it than I could have

Due to class

[manic quartz]

in one of our raid i was getting PI from priest but they had to go afk for a few pulls so the oeher priest yoinked hunters PI and gave it to me lmao

[strange python]

just feels sadge

[static glacier]

Wft is sadge but not much you can do, for pi you can always play sub or OL, both are competitive with non pi sin

[strange python]

yeah

[lofty junco]

[bleak ivy]

the situation here not looking good

[pulsar apex]

is it bad form to take twist the knife while learning pooling?

[willow void]

my sundden demise is really low when i get another rogue on m+ with me. 3 times less. I keep trying to understand why

[static glacier]

I see that DHT mastery socketed ring tho 👀

[bleak ivy]

yeah some guy didint need it so I got it

[static glacier]

Theirs could be proccing first and denying yours

[pure moth]

I always hit "not ready" on ready check if group isnt set up. After the 2nd not ready, they ask why and i go fix groups please. That was my last guild lol

[willow void]

it makes sense, but 3 times less

that some bad rng to my side

[static glacier]

It’s no rng

If they have stronger / longer dots

Yours will never proc on a mob before theirs

[willow void]

understood

[static glacier]

And once theirs procs it outright kills the mobs

Don’t worry too much, the majority of SD’s value is in the 10% bleed damage

[slim hamlet]

Does elusiveness not actually give dr for evasion or is it tooltip bug

[jaunty phoenix]

why dont we rupture during dance in our opener?

[static glacier]

On st or aoe?

[jaunty phoenix]

st

[static glacier]

You send a high co rupture in the opener which lasts until you dance at the end of KB where you refresh it

Cp*

[jaunty phoenix]

yea but isnt teh snapshop worth

snapshot

[static glacier]

The potential loss in envenom uptime is costly I think

[jaunty phoenix]

ye i thought so

[static glacier]

It’s close either way, if you send a 3xp rupture in opener it’s worth to rupture again in dance

If you send 5+ then it’s not

Whispyr worked out this optimisation not too long ago

[violet plaza]

You guys sending 4p envenoms during pool rotation or 6ps to keep debuff rolling?

[lavish wagon]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[jaunty phoenix]

ty mo

[static glacier]

You send 4cp envenoms in general this tier homie

[midnight atlas]

anyone tried this build in m+ without iron wire and a single shiv?

[static glacier]

Looks very st focused

[violet plaza]

Cheers dude

[manic coral]

what should optimal kingsbane damage be during cds?

[static glacier]

Idk how I feel about losing scent of blood- talent is cracked

[manic coral]

with like 475 or so ish

[static glacier]

You got 2pc?

[manic coral]

4p

[static glacier]

During dm or outside

[manic coral]

during

[static glacier]

Assuming correct execution 2m+ is definitely possible as a baseline benchmark

[manic coral]

im hitting 2m or so but i feel its really low

[midnight atlas]

yeah, sudden demise is cool also, and poison bomb is bad in some situations

[static glacier]

You can push higher, so long as you’re hitting 1.9-2m at minimum that’s good enough imo

[manic coral]

yeah idk if im just missing some important thumb rule or something bc they feel hella inconsistent

[static glacier]

You always covering end of KB with tea?

Do you have notter’s WA that shows shiv and env uptime?

[knotty dome]

hey guys i got a question, is it possible to macro dance with kingsbane or it might cast kingsbane before entering dance?

been struggling with that tbh

[tawny pagoda]

hey guys, can i macro dance with kingsbane together? like cast Shadow Dance cast kingsbane?

[static glacier]

It can’t ever do that unless you press it while dance is on cd since dance is off gcd while kb isn’t

[midnight atlas]

yes but put dance first

[static glacier]

I reccomend having two binds, one for dance + kb and one for dance alone

[manic coral]

yeye i managed to sync shyv and tea for almost 100 % uptime every single time but

i believe im misplaying branch somehow

[knotty dome]

nice to know

[manic coral]

cba this fucking rat trinket its so fucking bad

[static glacier]

Biggest optimisation for branch Imo is watching ur kb timer, if its 10s run into the last orb

[manic coral]

aight sick tyvm

[knotty dome]

the problem with the branch the orbs is not visible i can hardly see them in some fights

[steel spire]

yolo send dm kb on colossus h fyr

[calm tendon]

!up

[prisma monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/486284970806083584/1165033412827037806/image.png

[midnight atlas]

in some m+ scenarios i just cba with branch and let the orbs come to me

too much stuff going on and one orb is inside some bad stuff

[knotty dome]

imagine waycrest manor and branch

oh hell no i'm not optimizing that hahahaha

[midnight atlas]

yeah, i optimize when i can but sometimes it simply cannot be optimized

[static glacier]

The realest issue with them is you can’t tell which are yours and which belong to others

[knotty dome]

that another issue

[errant willow]

What's the strategy for pooling when we don't have the 4pc?

[midnight atlas]

cant wait to loot porcelain crab and just roll with 2 passive ones cba with these rotations and optimizations sometimes

[white pumice]

is it worth to lose our old set bonus for higher ilvl?

[static glacier]

Try to stay above 50% energy

[midnight atlas]

sim it. i lost 4set for ilvl in m+

[static glacier]

Go to like 60% before finishing

[errant willow]

No matter if the envenom drops off?

Playing ST with m+ talents is really hard to control energy :/

blindside + venom rush are quite helpful for that

[real stirrup]

Yeah I also find ST with Arterial Shock can be bad 50% of the time

[lament dagger]

i recommend learning the movement pattern, that way you don't have to rely on actually seeing the orbs

[bleak ivy]

which build are u all playing?

[cunning basin]

AP

[bleak ivy]

same but I see ppl hopping on hybrid?

[dark token]

It depends if u have 4p or not

Hybrid simmed best for me with 4p, AP without

[bleak ivy]

I dont

[dark token]

just sim em

[bleak ivy]

which sim u running?

[dark token]

dungeonslice?

[fossil gyro]

https://wago.io/4Q2L1LNd5

[strange python]

If you have a 483 dagger, does that count for upgrade discount with sword/axe/mace/fist

[errant willow]

With AP for m+ are you guys using flying daggers or venum rush?

[strange python]

I've been using flying daggers, but i considered the same thing as you are

[bleak ivy]

Oh I didint see that option before

[errant willow]

This week being tyrannical made me doubt some talent choices

[slim hamlet]

Some questions about elusiveness: Does it work with evasion, since tooltip doesn't show it does, but it does for feint. And does it make feint 60% DR for aoe dmg, or is it just 40% for aoe and 20% for direct dmg. And lastly does elusiveness DR from evasion and feint stack?

[tardy lance]

Is there any situation where sub is better than Assassination?

[slim pebble]

Mythic smolderon

[sharp hazel]

Do you guys think there is going to be tuning to sin after rwf?

[runic basin]

Yes they will tune a bit as always that we compete with tanks in dps

[hoary remnant]

No one knows. But I don't think so. The legendary weapon will boost all of the none melee classes

[fleet whale]

How surprising Reddit is complaining about rogue damage

[midnight atlas]

when warlocks and dks were topping the meters they didnt complain

[cunning basin]

thats my thing

uhdk ran rampant all last tier

no nerfs lol

[fleet whale]

People still think that rogues have God utility and Survivability lol

This is the first season that assassin is actually playable in high keys for M+ in idk how long

[bleak ivy]

I did what u said and hybrid build came out 40k dps higher without 4p lol

shit cant be true

[dark token]

thats a bad sim

link it

[haughty flicker]

yeah something sounds weird about that

[bleak ivy]

yeah im redoing it rn

[hexed willow]

They simmed the same for me and I don’t have 4p 😦

[haughty flicker]

one build or the other was only like 2k difference for me

40k sounds a bit weird

[bleak ivy]

I know that this sim is bullshit

im redoing it

[dark token]

link it

[bleak ivy]

now its fine

1.4k diffrence

hybrid still better without 4p

AP

hybrid

[dark token]

sim ap blindisde with VR

[bleak ivy]

venom rush?

[hexed willow]

Yeah

Smooths out the energy curve

[bleak ivy]

1 sec

[real stirrup]

!dagger

[prisma monolith]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/842817103354658817/1154475731108249700/image.png

[bleak ivy]

the que is 400 to sim

[thorny pond]

Can’t get AP even close to hybrid with 4pc in sims

[bleak ivy]

then run hybrid

lol

[hexed willow]

I like the AP build better ¯_(ツ)_/¯

Both are great

[bleak ivy]

nah VR simmedd 3k lower

thhan hybrid

[shy axle]

How do you use your cds on smolderon hc? I used to use kb on pull and Dm/KB on first intermission, only kb on second and both togheter again on 3rd ( bl is on first). I saw some using everything on pull tho

[strange python]

Hey guys, quick question, deathmark is real time, not snapshot? If I improved garrote after dm, it still ticks ig aye?

[spice surge]

Both dots applied before and after dm are duplicated

[strange python]

Aight thank you

[spice surge]

And then they all get removed once dm ends

(the extra ones that is)

[strange python]

Yea, I basically just lose the combo points and a tick

Alright thanks

[grim jay]

there are people that call that build bad

[dark token]

@bleak ivy

link ur sim

not a screenshot

[bleak ivy]

I dm u

[dark token]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/rRFJ5XUcxH2B5cjvg9SWFZ this is ur top dslice build

dont use a bunch of quick sims

do a top gear talent combinations sim

[bleak ivy]

oh nice

actual 5k increase

[dark token]

these 2 are close so pick VR for tyrannical and fok for fort

resim when u get 4p

[bleak ivy]

and this is till I get 4p?

yea

nice

Aparantly I didint know how to sim correctly

[hasty fiber]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Afenar's Group
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[dark token]

ur talents are diff than everyone else because u only have 2p

and no old tier

[bleak ivy]

Yeah

[fervent jasper]

FFS I just failed a 19 AD that was about to be 2 chested because 2 people died in the 1st half and they wanted to try and 3 man it

like

just wipe

and pull agin

[bleak ivy]

is old tier a big increase?

[dark token]

yes its still good

[bleak ivy]

frankly I didint play rogue lasst season

[dark token]

and makes bleed builds a lot better

[bleak ivy]

I had a rogue leveled but didint raid or anything serious

ill try some m+ with the build u showed see how it plays

[blazing roost]

can someone recommend good sin pov for mythic council fight?

[oak tangle]

is there an easy way (no expressions) to show both target debuff times and personal buff times?

in logs

[glossy imp]

Man am I crazy in feeling like 4pc isn’t a big jump over 2 + 2? It’s only simming 4k difference for me

[coarse bear]

What is the best way to farm flightstones?

[neat pulsar]

Play the game 😄

[fathom oracle]

seed farm

[frigid lagoon]

So I didn't play last patch, is life bound cap good? It doesn't sim very well for me

[hexed willow]

It’s good for sub

We like tier helm and go with non-tier pants

[flint tusk]

When your rogue bro has the best luck and decides to bestow you with heaven.
this was his 3rd dagger
https://i.imgur.com/U8sE2Ud.png

[lament dagger]

gz man

33 runs no dagger

[ancient rain]

33 everblooms, im free from flower prison

[frigid lagoon]

the pants don't sim well for me either https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/vTLxRh5972RdGGD32aaCS5

why do I want a life-bound piece? what does it do

or do you mean fyrakk legs

[eternal nymph]

It's just a crafted piece

With stats that you want

[gusty mirage]

Because you can’t put a toxic patch on any other piece of gear

And you need the patch to empower the toxic thorns boots

[slim hamlet]

Some questions about elusiveness: Does it work with evasion, since tooltip doesn't show it does, but it does for feint. And does it make feint 60% DR for aoe dmg, or is it just 40% for aoe and 20% for direct dmg. And lastly does elusiveness DR from evasion and feint stack?

Any knowers?

[eternal nymph]

Doesn't amp the aoe dr further

Stays 40

[gusty mirage]

Evasion DR and feint would stack though

Or at least should

[slim hamlet]

Which would make it 40% dr right?

[gusty mirage]

Ngl I don’t know the exact numbers and I don’t want to give you wrong info

[stuck seal]

vanish

[gusty mirage]

sorry

[slim hamlet]

Fair

Seems like no one really knows

[gusty mirage]

Seli might tbh

[slim hamlet]

But main thing was also if Feint made it 60% or stayed at 40% for aoe

[gusty mirage]

He’s always been a fan of elusiveness even way back in the day

[eternal nymph]

It stays 40 for AoE

[slim hamlet]

and if evasion part actually works considering tooltip doesn't get updated but feint does

[gusty mirage]

If you can peel him away from RWF coverage

[austere fulcrum]

can somone share dm + brach macro pls

[slim hamlet]

Do I dare ping him

[stuck seal]

Do y'all use shadow dance for reupping bleeds or for kb in m+

[spice surge]

It does not make feint 60% for aoe, its either the 20% or the 40%

But yes, evasion's DR works with feint

[slim hamlet]

Sick

Still sus about the tooltip updating for feint but no for evasion

[misty holly]

Dont think I can give up cheat death. That shit is pretty much on cooldown for me lol.

[slim hamlet]

I am just trying it because I am hard stuck on 25's otherwise

Literal overkill from full hp with pretty high vers + aug + priest buff

Last ditch effort will be icy preservation

[stuck seal]

More surprised the priest is alive

[spice surge]

For what mechanic specifically

[slim hamlet]

The specific oneshots were AD last boss add spawn + first boss throne

[austere fulcrum]

can somone share dm + brach macro pls

[slim hamlet]

2x lightnings in a row = oneshot

or 2x circle thingy in a row = dead with no cloak

[misty holly]

cloak the first one, cheat death the second one, kill boss before third.

[slim hamlet]

I got like 3 more ilvl with the rest of my crests + elusiveness now so shouldn't be actual oneshots

[slim hamlet]

Yes if it died that fast lol

[novel veldt]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[slim hamlet]

There are like 2-4 circles in each phase

!dagger

[prisma monolith]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/842817103354658817/1154475731108249700/image.png

[hasty fiber]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Afenar's Group
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[ancient rain]

why dont ppl play bonespike if it sims higher?

[cunning notch]

The fuu sims assa 70k dmg lower in m+.. but they are about equal in reality?

[cunning basin]

Bc fuck bonespike, me and all my homies hate bonespike

[ancient rain]

i hate bonespike too

[cunning basin]

Exactly so fuck them sims

We out here

Not bonespikin

[slim hamlet]

Because it doesn't always sim higher, and if it does it's by very little

[marble pebble]

for the arterial shock build in mythic +, we run instant poison correct?

[cunning basin]

The real answer to your question is that dslice sims are like not real at all

[slim hamlet]

no

If you read the tooltip it's obvious you never run instant poison

[cunning basin]

They exist, but they don't really represent anything tangible

[ancient rain]

I remember reading here that dslice is very good for the rogue apl

[cunning basin]

Amp > deadly >>>>>>>>instant>>>>>>>>>>>>>no poison > wound

[cunning notch]

What is dslice exactly?

[spice surge]

A randomized set of mobs spawning at random intervals

[cunning basin]

Dungeon slice is what people use for m+ sims. But the environment of mythic plus is that it is ever changing and rarely ever exactly the same

So dungeon slice is not a great representation of anything, for any spec, imo

[spice surge]

It almost always spits out the same outputs as MDT sims

[flint tusk]

timestrike doesn't scale with ilvl does it?
like as in you upgrade the dagger it still has 315 TS

[spice surge]

But randomized so theres no local maximums/minimums etc

[spice surge]

It doesnt, its just 10% for 10% all the time

[flint tusk]

perfect thanks

[severe halo]

Just asked that in the sub discord, they said for the spreadsheet we made our own dslice that's supposedly way more accurate than the scuffed one from raidbots

[slate crown]

And if you have 2 it’s 20% for 10%?

[eternal nymph]

It's fight style for sims made to represent a "slice'" of a dungeon.

Few mins of singletarget followed by mob packs of alternating size and length. Some get chained into each, for some it drops combat and the sim restealths.

Just trying to replicate a bit of a dungeon environment with variance.

Many spec APLs don't work properly with it, but the rogue ones do.

[spice surge]

No, he meant that the APL for dslice (for example dont use big cds if 8 adds are about to spawn in 10 seconds) is good for rogues

[severe halo]

Ahhh

[eternal nymph]

Dslice has variance built in. It's not static.
Not saying it's perfect tho.

[cunning basin]

I am a firm non-believer in dslice

[frigid lagoon]

does anyone have an addon for unlimited talent trees?

[cunning basin]

I am aware. I still don't think it's particularly accurate or useful.

[severe halo]

So the spreadsheet isn't accurate for the specs and they are all kinda close? I just wondered why we play assa (or sub) if outlaw Sims so much higher

[keen flume]

What damage is timestrike go off of?

[slate crown]

Yeah, d slice has limitations and is a tool meant for a specific purpose, primarily to compare talents/gear against each other for the same spec).

[eternal nymph]

All good, it just sounded like you were implying that dslice is rather static to me so I wanted to say that.

[keen flume]

When I look at logs some peoples time strike are hitting close to a mil or more in fights they play out the same kill time

[cunning basin]

The real answer is that the specs fundamentally do different things. They have 3 different damage profiles with nuances in playstyle, so it's up to you to decide which playstyle you prefer

[keen flume]

Where I’m at like 600-700k

[slate crown]

It just gives a talent set/ gear a variety of kill times and pulls with various mob counts and adds it all up

[cunning basin]

Yeah no I just think it's borderline worthless. I'm sure some disagree but 🤷

[finite echo]

does anyone have an envenom wa that tracks pandemic with a glow handy?

[cunning basin]

I believe whispyr's has a pandemic glow during cds

[misty holly]

Anyone else feel like aoe is a lot harder to manage with kingsbane than it was before. Sticking to one target for 14 seconds to get big Kingsbane damage is impossible in most packs where you need to tab for kick and kidney shots.

[cunning basin]

I don't pay close enough attention to know if it does outside of them tho

[slate crown]

!wa sounds like afenar or Whispyr’s afenar. I also have a progress bar version with a tick for pandemic. It’s in my pack and in my profile stand-alone

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Afenar's Group
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[misty holly]

I mean it's great when I can just tunnel and see a 400k pull, but 90% of the time my kingsbanes are complete garbage because half the time Im targetting something else

[hexed willow]

You can use mouseover kicks/stuns

[cunning basin]

I kinda just like send KB and if I can stick to the target great, if not, oh well who cares

[hexed willow]

shouldn’t need to change targets

[finite echo]

im looking for specifically an icon to replace the envenom in luxthos, ill try ripping one out of afenar/whispyr

[severe halo]

Just use mouseover macros

[cunning basin]

Min-maxing stuff like that isn't really something you should be worried about till you're pushing higher keys and NEED the damage. Most pulls I crank around 400-450 in a reasonable 6-8 target pull without kb so

[slate crown]

If you don’t find what you need can hmu, it’d be a pretty simple aura to make

[misty holly]

I pretty much dont play with my mouse cursor at all in combat...

dont think I could handle trying to do mouse over abilities

[runic hinge]

I send kingsbane into the target I need to kick and then it usually dies before I need to kick it so it works out.

[cunning basin]

Kinda based tbh

[severe halo]

And I get that, but a 20-30% difference in dmg is so significant that the difference isnt like "ignorable" on paper and that's why I'm asking if sub and assa are still on par with outlaw dmgwise

[cunning basin]

I mean... Sure. Why not

[slate crown]

Yes they are.

[cunning basin]

Some people think assa is better than outlaw in higher keys

[severe halo]

Idk, that's why I'm asking 😭

[runic hinge]

I play what I find fun. Sim chasing is wack

[slate crown]

Are you pushing title?

[marble pebble]

when not running corrupting rage phial, is vers or elemental chaos better?

[glossy mesa]

both specs are pretty good, imo outlaw still pulls forward in packs,while assa at bosses

[cunning basin]

I already told you, play the one you like. I'm not gonna say assa or outlaw or sub is better because I don't think anyone actually knows. We're all just kinda going by feel and personal experience

[runic hinge]

Vers is good

[cunning basin]

Like I beat outlaw rogues in every key I'm in so I could tell you that assa is better. But my guildies run with outlaw rogues that crank too. So it's like 🤷

[severe halo]

I dont push title and I don't want an answer to what to play, I wanted to understand why the sims are so different and how the differences in the specs play out so I can answer my questions myself next time

[finite echo]

ah whispyrs doesn't do true pandemic, just <=2 seconds on duration. since pandemic is 1.2-1.8, i think i'll just go with a glow on <=2 as well, probably better any way to give time to react.

[cunning basin]

The sims are different because the specs do different things fundamentally, and dslice is a pretty bad judge of an actual m+ dungeon

[severe halo]

Yes thanks for the answers

[slate crown]

Well to be fair, last I checked the sims do 2 sec as well. I think 2sec is perfectly fine

[finite echo]

yea makes complete since, .2-.8 seconds shouldn't matter much and it's likely less than that if you are reacting to it anyways

[slate crown]

You may end up with some clips but not terribly much. True pandemic is also just annoying (though not difficult) to implement for dynamic duration buffs based on CP

[cyan dew]

why does echoes and liquid rogues going for 6cp all the time? It's optimal?

[cunning basin]

Idk, guide says 4+ is fine

[slate crown]

Is it all the time? I see 4pc finishers frequently from them too

[strange python]

shoot you guys have 6 cp? mine tops out at 5

[cunning basin]

Yeah pretty sure when I watched jpc's perspective it looked pretty normal

[kind jacinth]

icey veins guide up to date ?

[slate crown]

Also, using 4+ and 5+ as a rule are very very close

[cunning basin]

🅱️ruh

[strange python]

had to get that acro man

[oak tangle]

what is this strategem

[strange python]

things are getting deeper

[cunning basin]

Acro is a crutch

[icy acorn]

i use 4+ cp for envenom when i chain them and when i need to reapply rupture i try to use 5+ cp, so i can continue to chain envenoms

[slate crown]

So they may just be doing the 5+ rule that was present for years instinctively

[oak tangle]

also pogcrazy
Mèmz Kingsbane Gnarlroot Tick 1940949

[strange python]

then consider me crutched

[slate crown]

And that’s fine

Are you finding acro actually helping on fights? I tried it and was just standing in normal melee range

[cunning basin]

Gottem

[slate crown]

And I was fine

[strange python]

every time i'm in any fight - without acro - i'm just like "man i could fucking be standing over there with acro" and i just hate myself

[slate crown]

I still always want it for like Larodar tho

[strange python]

or i'm like "i wonder how many hits i missed and poison applicatons" from this tank's shitty movement

[cunning basin]

I miss having acro for sure but it's like

Meh

[icy acorn]

!pooling

[prisma monolith]

Read About Pooling
Video
TLDR:```- Outside of Cooldowns, you want to wait until your envenom is in pandemic/around 1 second in order to proc tier. This is the core concept of "chaining", where you clip envenoms back to back

• If it's getting uncomfortable to chain, or you have to let envenom drop, pool back up to around 80% energy, and then start another chain
• Always wait to envenom, never wait to mutilate/ambush. You want to generate your combo points as soon as possible, and then evaluate whether you should pool or use a finisher
• Without 4 piece, chaining envenoms has no benefit and you can try to be above 50% energy for sanguine
• With 4 piece, the chain takes priority over sanguine and you would play around the tier, not sanguine```The reason we do this is to maximize uptimes and tier procs which is a more efficient energy use

[slate crown]

Larodar pugs suck for that

[oak tangle]

the only times so far i have missed acro, is on volkal boss in atal, and trying to refresh on igira when she jumps

[strange python]

plus i get that 2% crit - that has to account for something 😄

[icy iron]

Does acro make spatter +3yards in all directions like bladeflurry for outlaw

[tough gorge]

Does 4p proc spatter as well?

[icy iron]

Or nah

[steel ridge]

no

[icy iron]

good

[fallen ginkgo]

any guidline on which target to use CD's on HC fyrakk?

1. boss
2. only kb + dance boss
3. comes up kinda late for barrier / intermission so KB ramp goes into nothing i feel like

• just hold for when he comes down in normal form?

4. 1x goliath / or slam into boss when hes actually on platform in p2?

[vital depot]

Is it possible to make macro for Blindside?

to just swap Muti with Ambush etc?

[steel ridge]

why?

[strange python]

just hit em on cd?

[vital depot]

to have less buttons

[steel ridge]

why?

its one button

[strange python]

lol game does this automatically now

[steel ridge]

have you actually played the game or are you just asking random stuff

😄

[vital depot]

I am a silly goober

[drowsy crow]

hey guys, in details, does the amplifying poison also count the envenom bonus damage? or is it added to envenom itself

[steel ridge]

added to envenom

[vital depot]

sorry D:

[drowsy crow]

thx

[fallen ginkgo]

DUH, thanks

[strange python]

Just use your cd's as close to when they come up as possible - assuming there is something to put the full cd into - that's it

hah

You can always check here though

https://lorrgs.io/spec_ranking/rogue-assassination/fyrakk-the-blazing?difficulty=heroic

click power infusion buff - and the whole screen goes yellow

[raw raft]

so what do we think is gonna happen to sin after the race

[strange python]

I mean it's anyone's guess.
There are timestrike doubling bugs.
There are aug log bugs.
There are also the fact that we get pi's - greatly inflating the top of the charts.

[steel ridge]

-10% kingsbane or -3% aura is my guess

[strange python]

yeah nerf all sin rogues cause the ones that get pi and because aug dmg gets attributed to us.

[raw raft]

i think it's also quite hard because sin without pi is a completely different world compared to someone who gets pi

[strange python]

just delete pi, rework aug, and fix the timestrike bug

[hexed willow]

Already does it but you can do
/cast [stance] Ambush; Mutilate

[steel ridge]

whats buggy about timestrike? i know about the aug log bug

[hexed willow]

And just replace that on your stealth and normal bar

[warm fog]

Guys any form to hide npc names in nameplates in Plater addon?

[marble pebble]

currently, what are the best combinations for embellishments?

[strange python]

It doubles up on some damage increase phases

[jovial spear]

!dagger

[prisma monolith]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/842817103354658817/1154475731108249700/image.png

[hexed willow]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[hexed willow]

But it’s toxic boots and patch

[strange python]

It's just super more apparent on BIG AMPS like ozumat

[vital depot]

Thanks alot @hexed willow

[marble pebble]

is this for both mythic + and raid?

[fallen ginkgo]

yea ive checked on that page, but as i said, i felt like the 2nd Deathmark is kinda meh since boss goes immune up into the air. Can you check the target on lorrgz? either Goliath or the very short duration boss is down in p2?

[steel ridge]

bug or feature, who knows

[hexed willow]

Yes for now. I believe lariat BSL becomes better in m+ later in the season. Toxic boots+patch is also good if your multi-speccing (bis for outlaw at 0.2% worse for sub)

[strange python]

yeah not sure - but they all looked really close to the cd's when i looked.

so they're slammin something

hah

[fallen ginkgo]

yea i guess

the goliaths just die so fast

[strange python]

We just got to fryak thursday, and only put like 14 mins into it

so not too familiar otherwise i'm sure i'd come up with some other wrong answer for you

[fallen ginkgo]

yea also only killed it once on HC

[willow void]

[Nick of Time] does this actually drops from Dawn of the Infinite: Galakrond's Fall ?

[cyan dew]

Do I ever reapply rupture during burst or keep evenoms going?

[willow void]

or the trinket ?

[deft vault]

yes they do drop

[willow void]

what the drop minus something 😦

rate*

[eternal nymph]

It's normal

You're just unlucky

I'm at 32 or so runs without one, and there are people that have it worse.
And there are also people that got 2 in 2 runs

[spice surge]

All items have the exact same drop rate in m+. So 1/6

[eternal nymph]

Rng be rng

[willow void]

might be 😢

[eternal nymph]

Also make double sure that your lootspec isn't outlaw

[forest notch]

Hmm why is Feast better but the devilled eggs isnt the personal food of choice? or is the crit/mastery food even better than feast and this just means if a feast is available use it if you dont want ot use personal food

[hexed willow]

The latter pretty sure

[stark kraken]

Agility is better than secondary stats

[strange python]

point for point yeah

[eternal nymph]

Some person in #outlaw realised that they had the wrong loot spec after 20 or so falls earlier

[strange python]

wonder how many he woulda got

[spice surge]

True, but its 75 agi vs 134 secondaries. The secondaries end up been slightly better when ilvls get high enough

[hexed willow]

Especially at a higher ilvl, secondaries pull ahead

[smoky helm]

if he didn't drop any sword, that it didn't matter

[hexed willow]

Damn eleem beat me

[smoky helm]

good copium thought

[eternal nymph]

? If you go law lootspec, you can't get the dagger

[stark kraken]

[eternal nymph]

Which is what he was playing fall for

[smoky helm]

ye

[cyan dew]

"wa

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Afenar's Group
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[eternal nymph]

So he wasted those 20 runs

[smoky helm]

but he didn't drop any weapon at all

[strange python]

yeah you guys are so fast ... if only someone pointed that out like within 5 seconds of them typing it

[forest notch]

well basically im bulk buying personal food so was deciding between, the eggs being the same as feast

[strange python]

i mean i dont think it's gonna affect anything, which one you choose

[forest notch]

cool, I just didnt know class well enough to infer that. will just go with eggs then

thanks

[strange python]

you just wanna go into battle well fed

[stark kraken]

Yea how big the difference can be

[strange python]

"damn i parsed a 38...guess i shoulda simmed that food difference"

[icy acorn]

you could sim it though.
for me it is a difference of 83 dps in favor of the secondary stat food

patchwerk that is

[forest notch]

haha

Im new dont bully me

I know some of the questions are likely obvious though but you never know

[strange python]

We're just having fun at the topic at hand, not at your expense

[forest notch]

haha I know not actually offened

[hexed willow]

It’s like buzzing vs hissing runes

[spice spire]

Don’t ever apologize for earnestly seeking knowledge - it doesn’t matter if it’s a noob question. Glad to help, even if it’s a “hey this is in the guide”

[strange python]

i mean all those 83 dps will eventually add up to like 170 dps or so

[spice spire]

Machine gunning guide questions though, that’s what villains do

[forest notch]

My friend keeps telling me to outlaw for M+ but Assass feels more fun lol

[strange python]

yeah sin is more than fine in m+, if that's what you like.

outlaw is f'in weird this season

i saw those guys in there talking about some old neck from like 2 patches ago the other day

[forest notch]

Ive seen a lot of sin in M+ on my Devoker and honestly there dmg seems the same as outlaw ngl

I assume 2 equal skill players outlaw is better?

[strange python]

not necesarilly

[spice spire]

Outlaw is very cut and dry while sin takes some working with but the payoff is actually really really good this season for once

[strange python]

target count matters, etc.

[hexed willow]

The neck is new! It’s the ring that’s old

[forest notch]

but sin also does more dmg to bosses I think

[spice spire]

What avih said

[steel stump]

miss bte and you can sit ouf of the fight and wait for the next

[strange python]

[spice spire]

It’s not cut and dry on what’s better for x y or z for once

[dull cloak]

sin literally got a built in bladeflurry for poisons

[forest notch]

ya

[spice spire]

Historically for the last like ton of tiers outlaw has been better

But this season

We flip

[royal lantern]

and they go crazy

[strange python]

Truth be told - i think sub is gonna be nasty later in the season...like real nasty

[royal lantern]

[forest notch]

ya, thankfully I played monk in M+ for years and very used to tab targetting to spread some buff/debuff

[strange python]

aight boys - football time

[hexed willow]

We got 18m!

[spice spire]

Raiders don’t play until 3:25 do not care

(We’re going to get dumpstered by the chiefs)

[royal lantern]

oh

football

and not football

[spice spire]

American

[hexed willow]

I can’t wait till you guys upset the chiefs

[royal lantern]

[spice spire]

Buddy what the fuck is a kilometer

[steel stump]

Should be called american rugby tbh

[grand trail]

funny kush stopped playing spatter

[copper hazel]

dont insult rugby like that

[spice spire]

Different rule set from rugby. And honestly less violent 99% of the time

[gusty mirage]

What are we league starting

[copper hazel]

BONEZONEEEEEE

[gusty mirage]

No man

[hexed willow]

I’d argue more violent, rugby you learn to play without excessive padding

[forest notch]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Afenar's Group
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[slow tulip]

1. guys do you actually kite the orbs from the witherbarks's branch trinket or no
2. do you prefer ashen trinket over the branch despite the sim dps ?

[copper hazel]

(but most likely traps or i might even go LA this time)

[slow tulip]

thx in advance

[spice spire]

Oh I meant American football is less violent than rugby

[hexed willow]

Who’s Kush and why do we care what they do

[spice spire]

Then there’s sometimes the random guy who just dies

[spice spire]

Echo rogue. Good player, unfortunate feelcrafter

[steel stump]

echo raider on fyrakk mm

[hexed willow]

Rip

[spice spire]

Iirc kush was one of the ones dancing at 6s left of KB instead of snapshotting and MA the end

[forest notch]

most of these "groups" just personal preference? Also for Whispyr's Afenar Edit Do I need Afenars group first?

[spice spire]

Personal preference and no

It’s an alter of afenar

[royal lantern]

i just collect 2 orbs and then stop moving, collects the 3rd one after a couple seconds

[spice spire]

But close enough he wants to keep giving afenar credit

[forest notch]

cool

[hexed willow]

Ah the feels not reals strat

[slow tulip]

thx

[hexed willow]

“Hidden tech”

[spice spire]

Yeah but he’s also just an insane player

So he can get away with it

[hexed willow]

True

[dark token]

Rofl

[hexed willow]

Ty kush for sandbagging for us

[tawny geyser]

Guide says Wafting Devotion on Weapons, but then, why would we need Haste?
Do I really go Wafting Devotion enchant on my weps or smt else?

[steel stump]

sim it it's like a 500dps diff for me

better stay sophic if you play sub on the side

[forest notch]

how do I make use of this Pooling Practice Tool? Just push the button it shows? Is there a section in the guide I should read about pooling?

[hexed willow]

!pooling

[prisma monolith]

Read About Pooling
Video
TLDR:```- Outside of Cooldowns, you want to wait until your envenom is in pandemic/around 1 second in order to proc tier. This is the core concept of "chaining", where you clip envenoms back to back

• If it's getting uncomfortable to chain, or you have to let envenom drop, pool back up to around 80% energy, and then start another chain
• Always wait to envenom, never wait to mutilate/ambush. You want to generate your combo points as soon as possible, and then evaluate whether you should pool or use a finisher
• Without 4 piece, chaining envenoms has no benefit and you can try to be above 50% energy for sanguine
• With 4 piece, the chain takes priority over sanguine and you would play around the tier, not sanguine```The reason we do this is to maximize uptimes and tier procs which is a more efficient energy use

[forest notch]

ty

[grand trail]

yeah thats how some people played it on ptr until it was proven that otherway around is little bit better

[spice spire]

Ye

Theorycrafting deniers

[grand trail]

well they play maxium ST build cant wait to see branch played surely soon

[steel stump]

I mean keeping evenom up and getting dance/shiv/kb/garrot in is a tight squeeze

[dark token]

Flat earther rogues fr

[steel stump]

I still struggle with it

[marble pebble]

question, I'm new to assassination and reading over the rotation. In aoe, it says to rupture 3 times on big aoe pulls before using envenom and popping CDs. Is this basically just saying to rupture as many targets as you can while everything is being gathered with tricks? Or should we really be prioritizing putting rupture on everything before going into envenom and CDs?

[dark token]

I feel the earth is flat because I can see it

[dark token]

Scent of blood

[marble pebble]

that answers that ^ LOL

ty

[steel stump]

Better wait till everything is packed before getting out of invis if you want the garot / ruptures to be empowered, then pick the biggest mob and do the kb thing

[gusty mirage]

Based

Don’t let NASA lie to you guys

[steel stump]

And in lower tyra key the pack is dead before you can kb sometimes x)

got in a key with a BM hunter and fury war I could not get a kb off

[slim hamlet]

Bro with a havoc, the packs die too fast for KB on every key level

[steel stump]

[devout mirage]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[arctic juniper]

What am I doing wrong and need to improve on? My ILVL parse is so low.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/8FjGYkqrCLp3hHBW#fight=11&type=damage-done

https://wowanalyzer.com/report/B8wzWTV9YAZmjbcd/8-Normal+Volcoross+-+Kill+(2:31)/Koborai/standard/overview

[forest notch]

I cant figure out what symbol this is in the pooling practice WA

[weak crescent]

4piece ?

[royal lantern]

4set

[forest notch]

oh I dont have that

ok

[proven jasper]

Yeah pretty sure

[forest notch]

cool

lol

I have 0 tier, life of boosted

will have 4set next week though

with cata x2, Vault and 2kio

unless fault trolls me

Though I assume I should take a good trink/wep out of vault if I get it

as tier will come

much easier

We want the Nick of time x2 I assume

[lucid rain]

have you done lfr/normal?

[forest notch]

oo I haventdone LFR actually

good call

forgot

[grand trail]

btw i just simmed that corruptuion flask is only 700dps gain? sound about right?

[flint tusk]

i've been truely blessed
NoT and Branch in 2 dungeons 🥹

[forest notch]

I always wonder about those, I assume more value if you have less crit though?

[young delta]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Weakauras/Plater profiles:
Afenar's Group
Luxthos's Group
LE's Group
LE's Profile (lots of one-off weakauras)
Devlin's Group
Ceverion's Plater
Whispyr's Afenar Edit
Whispyr's Plater
Pooling Practice Tool

[grand trail]

propably

[cinder quartz]

Everbloom jail

[dark token]

It's the same value

Flask crit isn't DRd

Sim at 85% uotime

[forest notch]

oh didnt knwo that

[steel spire]

we got 4p its time to pump

[misty holly]

How big of an upgrade is 4 set

[marble pebble]

question on the rotation in aoe, after applying garrotes, rupture, and crimson tempest, and popping CDs, do we spend on envenom if nothing needs to be refreshed to try to proc 4piece?

[steel spire]

who knows

[slate crown]

I mean what else would you spend cp on?

[real stirrup]

Putting all those poisons in ST feels like putting on all of the infinity stones

[real stirrup]

yeah go for FoK + Envenom and a cheeky little mutilate when you've done your CDS

[forest notch]

omg

1.8% wipe

so closee

[copper hazel]

ooooooof

tight

[real stirrup]

wow close

[slate crown]

How long has echo been raiding tho?

like haven't they been going for 12+ hours?

[grand trail]

nah they started late today

[copper hazel]

no like 6 hrs

[forest notch]

ya

[hallow sonnet]

that was so sad to see

[slate crown]

Ahh

[forest notch]

Liquid sweating now

after that pull

[marble pebble]

outside of using shiv for deathmark, when do we use it in our rotation?

[shy axle]

do you pump your cds in the shield7% dmg phase on findral or do you prefer to delay kb for aoe hits with splatter?

[slate crown]

Shiv is saved for kingsbane. Both charges. It is for kingsbane in ST (and for the most part also in aoe)

[slate crown]

Depends on what your raid needs but generally the raid shouldn't be relying on your spatter damage for adds. In most circumstances, just nuke shield on CD, never delay

The timings on the fight work out so the shield goes up as deathmark becomes ready if you do accelerated opener, and use KB on CD, on all phases

[marble pebble]

make sense, so just never shiv outside of using it for kingsbane? Why take the talent that gives us 2 charges of shiv if we save it for kingsbane that's on a 1 min CD

[uncut nexus]

Are there any resources I can use to figure out what I could do better in my rotation?

[slate crown]

Because shiv lasts 8 seconds and KB lasts 14

you want full coverage

[bleak ivy]

echo 1% wipe?

[slate crown]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[marble pebble]

OH, that makes sense. Duh

[young delta]

any legit aoe rotation? when should i use knives? and how can i maintain rupture on every tagrget

[forest notch]

ya soooo close, I main Devoker and want this race over so maybe I get buffs lol copium

[arctic juniper]

What am I doing wrong and need to improve on? My ILVL parse is so low.
I can't seem to figure out.. I think I am doing the rotation correctly after looking through guides?

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/8FjGYkqrCLp3hHBW#fight=11&type=damage-done

https://wowanalyzer.com/report/B8wzWTV9YAZmjbcd/8-Normal+Volcoross+-+Kill+(2:31)/Koborai/standard/overview

[slate crown]

In single target, yes. In M+ there's a bit more flexability because A) you don't necessarily use KB on CD depending on packs/pull sizes, which is really subjective/casebycase/keylevel dependent. In those times, you can use Shiv in between if you are taking Arterial Shock build for bleed damage. Also B) you may need to dispel enrages in M+ with shiv

[slate crown]

!guide I don't know what a legit aoe rotation means. Wowhead has a priority / opener for aoe just like it does for ST which is good.

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[grim tree]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[marble pebble]

if we're still in shadow dance after using kingsbane and everything already has empowered garrote, would we still use garrote or FoK?

not sure if we would just refresh it anyway with more garrote

[real stirrup]

you can refresh garrote and rupture during the vanish at the end of KB

[slate crown]

If everything already has garrote I would fok

[real stirrup]

orite yeah if already empowered then go fok

[strange python]

Super sad seeing perma "can't wait for rogue nerfs" comments

[tender osprey]

I either fok or garrote again if I missed something, or mutilate if CS about to drop

Then just reapply garrote and rupture during vanish

[gray hazel]

Do we always save double shiv for KB?

[pine dew]

How can i avoid energy Issues?...

[fringe token]

Hi all
Any chance some nice guy can do a log review? 🙂

[deft vault]

You cant thats assasination

[pine dew]

How can i manage then to stay above 50% energy?

[deft vault]

send me some logs in dm and i can take a look

[fringe token]

Done job, thanks!

[arctic juniper]

Sent you a DM @deft vault

[odd python]

what posions do i use on assa

deadly./ amp ?

[stark kraken]

Yes

[slate crown]

By not spending below 50%. Pool your energy. You will have a lot of moments where you stand there auto-attacking, regenerating energy, or waiting for envenom to reach pandemic

!pooling

[prisma monolith]

Read About Pooling
Video
TLDR:```- Outside of Cooldowns, you want to wait until your envenom is in pandemic/around 1 second in order to proc tier. This is the core concept of "chaining", where you clip envenoms back to back

• If it's getting uncomfortable to chain, or you have to let envenom drop, pool back up to around 80% energy, and then start another chain
• Always wait to envenom, never wait to mutilate/ambush. You want to generate your combo points as soon as possible, and then evaluate whether you should pool or use a finisher
• Without 4 piece, chaining envenoms has no benefit and you can try to be above 50% energy for sanguine
• With 4 piece, the chain takes priority over sanguine and you would play around the tier, not sanguine```The reason we do this is to maximize uptimes and tier procs which is a more efficient energy use

[slate crown]

Also you shouldn't aim for 50% energy if you have the new tier set. And even before having the tier set, it isn't super important to do so.

[pine dew]

okay, thx still on 2p

[slate crown]

I'm on 0pc

And I don't even try for staying above 50%. I just chain envenoms anyways because it's generally good practice to not waste envenom uptime

And because I want to keep the muscle memory for when I do get tier

[pine dew]

but you are then under 50%?

[slate crown]

Yup

[pine dew]

How mich haste is recommend?

[slate crown]

There isn't a recommendation

[balmy condor]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

There are no "recommended stat levels" or "breakpoint of X stat" or "required" amount of any stats. This is an outdated way to think about stats and simply is not relevant to the spec. If you're looking for a quick recommendation: **Agi >> Mast = Crit = Haste > Versatility**It's always more accurate to simulate your own character, as stat procs like Witherbark's Branch and Wafting Devotion can often de-value the stat in question. Stats are not a rigid construct, their values change constantly in relation to each other depending on your character.

[pine dew]

Thx @slate crown

[fringe jasper]

I've come back from a long break and... when fighting trash packs don't seem to be able to Shadowmeld-->Stealth and open again. Was there some kind of hotfix? (**I know some packs with minibosses force you to be in combat). Just wondering what the issue might be?. (I use a /cast !stealth macro so I can mongoloid mash it). Thanks in advance

[bleak ivy]

how do I find the best build for my characterr on ST raid bosses

I do not have a 4p

[slate crown]

!guide Wowhead has the most commonly used / highest simmed builds. If you want to compare their output, you can compare all of them in a Top Gear sim with your character's input.

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[junior olive]

really confused on which build we're supposed to be doing...is is the Art build for lower keys..then other build for higher up keys?

[bleak ivy]

alright gonna check it out

[frozen iris]

You guys feel a nerf coming after the RWF

[clear shell]

On aoe should i apply rupture to all targets and mantain it? Or its better to apply on subterfuge window and then use envenom with caustic and t4?

[slate crown]

This is a video game and you should play the build you want. There is no "supposed".

That said, the two major builds (though don't sleep on Utilitarian) do not have major performance differences, they are mostly preference based. I would recommend you try multiple and see how you like them, and come to the decision on your own :). Nobody is going to police your key logs and yell at you for playing the "wrong" thing.

Personally I play Art at all times (in keys)

[bleak ivy]

yeah its also dyinng today

Echo got to 1% and wiped which is sad af

[dreamy elk]

What talent would you drop to take acro strikes, and how much % loss would it be on paper?

[rare jackal]

when you pop branch with deathmark the optimal time to pick up the last orb is at 7 seconds remaining right?

[junior olive]

ok thank you so much

[stiff kernel]

In m+ build, is pooling still a thing with the 4p? On ST, I watched @balmy condor video on it but I just can’t seem to get the energy regeneration to do it efficiently, seems like by the time I get above 50% envenom falls off