assassination

[spark scaffold]

but maybe thats just the sub in me talking

[keen spruce]

mythic https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/2kVc4gXnQgTB5FnJpGsPEZ

[marble hemlock]

were already pretty saturated on st

[keen spruce]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/gydDoLYnykg7x5BMJA9FP4 heroic

[marble hemlock]

hitting like 90% ep/envenom uptimes isnt an issue

[keen spruce]

but idk how much to discount fragment now

[marble hemlock]

so beyond that, extra energy is just a bit more mutilate damage or envenoms

[keen spruce]

[spark scaffold]

yeah, fight seems super good for assa anyway

[oak ore]

lmaooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

[marble hemlock]

i mean the fight is shit for rogue in general i feel

90sec cds suck on sarka

[spark scaffold]

i had to reroll for this tier, but 50% haste on every DM is super good imo

[marble hemlock]

its not bad but

people overvalue DM

especially now with 4pc putting a lot of damage outside of DM

[gusty mirage]

do they

[marble hemlock]

compared to old 4pc

[spark scaffold]

yeah that's fair

[marble hemlock]

DM is kind of a shitty dps cd

[gusty mirage]

?

how

[spark scaffold]

its not frontloaded dmg

which is what would be best for sarka

[marble hemlock]

cuz a dpc cd that requires you to hit a target for 45sec to get full efficiency out of it kinda sucks

[steel spire]

no bacon after dm right

[marble hemlock]

shit like temporary buffs, like the 50% haste, run out long before you get the full value out of DM

[upper trail]

so like.. I dont hold second sepsis right? i just send that shit

[spark scaffold]

bring back vendetta

[marble hemlock]

i like DM very much

i just

dont like our 4pc

[keen spruce]

not lusted non execute DM kinda ass

[marble hemlock]

ye

mosts classes peak like >200k during their 2mins

[spark scaffold]

your DM spikes look awfully similar to sepsis ones

[marble hemlock]

were not even remotely close to it

[spark scaffold]

[upper trail]

almost every rogue spec is flat these days

kind of boring

[spark scaffold]

wdym man

[marble hemlock]

our on-pull burst is fucking atrocious, its kinda dampened by beacon

[spark scaffold]

the bacon dopamine hit

[marble hemlock]

but without beacon wed literally be opening at like 70-100k less every fight

than 10 other classes

[keen spruce]

200k opener if beacon crit

130k if beacon don't crit

like 150k with fragment

[spark scaffold]

tbf this was just not a rogue tier

[marble hemlock]

i dont mind a flat damage curve, but id like my 2min cd to not hit like a wet noodle

[spark scaffold]

its not assa specific really

every spec was kinda shambles

[keen spruce]

rogue always feels fine if you're in a mid-late ce guild

[spark scaffold]

praise the raid buff though

[marble hemlock]

rogue is fine cuz its a good prog class

cuz you cant die

[spark scaffold]

yeah, i mean purely dmg numbers

[keen spruce]

immortal, good execute, good utility for mechanics

[marble hemlock]

but when it comes to actually being in a position where every pull can be a kill

you kinda wanna ditch your rogue

good execute

hahahaha

[gilded burrow]

why doesn’t FOK work like SS and award a ton of combo points for no reason

[spark scaffold]

worst tier for execute tbf

[oak ore]

good execute on raszageth mayb

and exe on sark doesnt matter

[keen spruce]

good not amazing

[marble hemlock]

ye i could really feel the usefulness of my good execute on echo last phase

sick shit

[keen spruce]

sort by boss damage

[marble hemlock]

that is boss damage

[keen spruce]

[spark scaffold]

whats the point of execute when demolock and UH DK just do 2x your dmg on their cds and they can just sync them with the execute phase

[marble hemlock]

ye

exactly

lol

[keen spruce]

i'm guess UH holds army till p3?

[marble hemlock]

ye

[spark scaffold]

well

[marble hemlock]

i mean they dont lose a cast so

why wouldnt they

[keen spruce]

was demo even have built in execute

or is that also just holding everything

[spark scaffold]

army is a 3 min CD now no?

[marble hemlock]

thats just demo with PI i think

[spark scaffold]

same as warlock

[marble hemlock]

just demolock things

[keen spruce]

okay but u third tho

[spark scaffold]

he probably held class trinket

[marble hemlock]

sick

[keen spruce]

so good execute

[marble hemlock]

ya know

we had these times where youd play an assa or a warrior

cuz theyd be ahead by like

30-50%

in last phase

ig technically i am

compared to most others

[spark scaffold]

hey, that's not so far behind

[marble hemlock]

it just doesnt feel like it

[spark scaffold]

kingsbane rasza

[marble hemlock]

ye

[keen spruce]

yeah i mean you're fighting against PI and army

[marble hemlock]

that was good stuff for shields

[keen spruce]

[marble hemlock]

but ive talked about it before, with the more recent boss design, execute just isnt all that useful anymore

which i think is good, overall. it just sucks for us

[keen spruce]

I think it is for mid-late CE guilds

[marble hemlock]

but having bosses phase on time and not percentage is good for the game

[keen spruce]

that have a lot of ugly bleed out prog kills

but i see your point

[marble hemlock]

fuck dps stops

[spark scaffold]

well

[oak ore]

i think execute boss design owns

[keen spruce]

certainly not as good as it used to be

[spark scaffold]

if you do more dmg p1-p2 sarka that translates into less time in p3 aswell

[marble hemlock]

execute is entirely useless on a fight like sarkareth

very good on echo tho

but on sarkareth its literally useless

cuz you can just do more dam in p1/p2 and spend less time in p3

[spark scaffold]

did you guys not hold dps in p2 on echo

[upper trail]

feels good on a fight like rashokk maybe

[marble hemlock]

i mean

[spark scaffold]

we afked for a bit end of p2

[keen spruce]

even rashokk tho

[marble hemlock]

we had boss at 35%

[keen spruce]

it doesn't really matter

[marble hemlock]

when add was still half HP

[keen spruce]

cuz if you have better overall

[marble hemlock]

so echo you actually get full execute value

[keen spruce]

it's not like there's any additional weight to the execute phase

[marble hemlock]

rashok is awful imo

cuz youre like

getting 3rd DM at around 35% boss HP

[steel spire]

i guess making deathmark give raid wide execute when the target is below 35% would be op huh

[marble hemlock]

and then if people bleed out, you get a 4th

right at the end

with 2nd pot

but if everybody is alive

you dont

[keen spruce]

yeah rashcock timing is rough

[spark scaffold]

but rogue is good on rashok purely for the p3 cloak

it makes a huge difference

[keen spruce]

and you're in full lava coom bukkake so maximizing performance in execute is tough

felt pretty good on amalg cuz we lusted p1 and never swapped so we had a long p2

[marble hemlock]

ye

its same on echo

cloak stacks

and evasion wall damage as well in p2

is just

omega safe

[keen spruce]

feels like dog on experiements cuz your last deathmarks tends to line up with deep breath

or can

[spark scaffold]

you can evasion wall dmg?

today i learned

[marble hemlock]

ye

look at boss and evasion

and you dont get stacks

from the wallbreaks

[keen spruce]

very nice tech

[spark scaffold]

yep

[marble hemlock]

pretty big on the nasty overlap in p2 when you gate

[vital haven]

Holy shit sela

You a genius

[marble hemlock]

not my tech

[spark scaffold]

blizzard before this tier "we will make bosses not require weakauras"

[marble hemlock]

i saw @spice surge talk about it

[limber lion]

sela

[spark scaffold]

also blizzard "creates echo of neltharion"

[keen spruce]

i was watching whispyr last night that p2 gate looks nasty

[marble hemlock]

so credit should go to him, or whoever found out about it and told him

[keen spruce]

many deadge

[gaunt moat]

is it when other breaks or only if you get targeted?

[spark scaffold]

that gate is most of the time also friendly fire

[marble hemlock]

if anybody breaks wall

you just have to face the boss, cuz hes the source of the dot

so tanks get ready to break wall in p2

you look at boss and evasion

no stacks

[tall atlas]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[keen spruce]

so you're saying to play OL and run float like a butterfly

[spice surge]

Huh

[marble hemlock]

evasion on echo wall dot

http://puu.sh/JIwzZ/23c74f35bf.png

you posted this in sub

like 2weeks ago or smth

warriors dont play arms atm

and yeah, rogue is very good on echo

and personally, i feel its basically useless on sarkareth

you bring one for atrophic and thats it

[keen spruce]

90s timers are so fucked on sark

[marble hemlock]

ye

[keen spruce]

I end up goin into p2 with deathmark and sepsis and vanish just sittin there while adds spawn that i can't hit

[marble hemlock]

but ye, echo is a very good rogue fight cuz its high damage intake all throughout and you have a lot of tools to stay alive. makes prog easier, and you do good damage in last phase, and nowadays people do hit the 35% threshold before phasing into p3

[vapid sierra]

do you guys play zoldick on echjo?>

[marble hemlock]

definitely should, yes

[vapid sierra]

when do i know when to takle zoldickj

[keen spruce]

if you're making the p1 check easily then 3/3 zold probably the move

[strange python]

where's the no xsang opener

[vapid sierra]

just in general

[strange python]

faq?

[vapid sierra]

yes

[royal lantern]

isnt it good in m+ atleast?

[keen spruce]

that's the only time rn

you lose too much overall

to take 3/3

and like sel was sayin

execute kinda cheeks this tier

[marble hemlock]

no idea, havent had time to play m+ in a long time

[keen spruce]

arms is good in m+ yeah

they were fine in raid too

[strange python]

that one doesnt include beacon

[spice spire]

Issue with arms is that it’s tier is buns

Same issue with Fury last season

[keen spruce]

i think you bomb in the opener then just beacon 10s later @strange python

[strange python]

kk

[keen spruce]

beacon puts bomb on a 20s icd, bomb only puts beacon on 10s so that makes sense in my head

and i think that's what whispyr was doin

i have no fuckin idea i might leave this beacon in my vault cuz raidbots thinks i'm a special boi that needs a special dice for some reason

[spice surge]

Ye having evasion up for the rough intermission where you break walls later is really good

[gaunt moat]

what's beacon's CD? 3 minutes?

[marble hemlock]

i do bomb>beacon>bomb too. think ideally youd do prepull beacon cast but thats super sketch for obvious reasons

2:30

[vapid sierra]

so on reclear?

essentailly

and echo

[keen spruce]

well not on reclear

cuz you lose overall

to spec into 3/3z

[vapid sierra]

then when?

long bosses where we melt early?

[keen spruce]

literally only on echo

if your guild is meeting the p1 check easily

[vapid sierra]

gotcha ty

[keen spruce]

how tf do you get a restealth

or can you bacon from stealth

[marble hemlock]

do you even lose stealth?

[keen spruce]

i have no idea

[fallen charm]

you could vanish since we were holding for the second dm anyways

[vapid sierra]

how worthwile is it to keep eranog ring and put shadowflame wreahte on weapons>

[fallen charm]

but idk with the new no exsanguinate build

[keen spruce]

that's actually a good point

free vanish

[marble hemlock]

ye

[keen spruce]

bacon prepull vanish open

u might be onto somethin here

what's the range on bacon

so i don't get clobbered by a boss melee

[marble hemlock]

enough to precast it on a mindsoothed boss

its like 25 or 30y

[ruby birch]

Rogues pulling early now

[agile osprey]

Just blame the hunters

[marble hemlock]

i mean

bosses dont get pulled at 0 anymore anyway

but you dont need to vanish either

beacon is hasted 2.5sec cast

imp garrote buff is 3sec

so you can cast vanish, it destealths you, but you can still cast emp garrote for another half second or so

[vapid sierra]

what if you spam garrote whilei tcasts

does it cancel

[marble hemlock]

only if youre in melee of the boss i think

you can just

prepull beacon, step, garrote

and youll still have vanish

[keen spruce]

but you can just step vanish garrote

cuz you're not usin that vanish anyways

[vapid sierra]

now that i thinka bout it

never once have i had to vanish for sepsis

because of shit timing

[fleet pagoda]

hol' up... have we been sandbagging with exsang for 5 months

[keen spruce]

yall have been

[vapid sierra]

no the opposite

[keen spruce]

[timber kelp]

I feel like when I play assassination, I often run out of energy before deathmark comes up at 2 min. Any tips, or is that just the way it goes?

[royal lantern]

our tc are warlock players now

making us all sandbag

[timber kelp]

I'm playin sepsis/exsang btw

[fleet pagoda]

it's working! 5% buffs!

[runic hinge]

Unless you just didn’t play exsang the last 5 months

[gusty mirage]

[agile osprey]

I just make sure I have a tea ready when deathmark comes up.

[timber kelp]

Does sepsis not take the place of a vanish for the purpose of a stealthed garrote?

[gusty mirage]

dangerous rhetoric to spread even as a joke mr. tryan

[tall atlas]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/751133387905040425/1110297654820360307/03sepsis.png

in this image

is the blue garrote a vanish garrote

[keen spruce]

no more exang

exang is deadge

[marble hemlock]

its a sepsis garrote

[timber kelp]

Why?

[keen spruce]

pins

it's been bugged since january

and it's dogshit

[timber kelp]

I'm seein #1 parsing assassin on kaz used exsan

[keen spruce]

yeah everyone found out like 2 days ago

and by 2 days i mean yesterday

[timber kelp]

Ah, what do you replace it with?

[royal lantern]

the non exsang build

[timber kelp]

ty

[fleet pagoda]

venom rush feels better to play with

[timber kelp]

Yeah i bet, solves my energy problems

[fleet pagoda]

so it's a nice L to take

[keen spruce]

i just noticed

[timber kelp]

That's why i switched to sub; never worry about energy

[keen spruce]

that exang is falling out of valeera's b-hole

checks out

[marble hemlock]

i mean

i think if you expect to never run out of your primary resource, rogue is kinda the wrong class to go into

energy shortages are kinda core to the class design, if we had endless amounts of resources, that would feel weird

[keen spruce]

you still go dry before the 2m mark

but it's better

[royal lantern]

outlaw players getting angry when reading that message

[keen spruce]

how much crit does everyone have

[gusty mirage]

they can't read

[keen spruce]

i'm lost in the sauce rn

[gusty mirage]

[royal lantern]

with rune stones active 40%

[keen spruce]

wtf is a rune stone

[gusty mirage]

the buzzing runes

[keen spruce]

oh

[royal lantern]

wepon stones

[gusty mirage]

no don't explain yourself to this guy

sitting there all smug

like hehehehehe i didn't play exsang

[keen spruce]

[gusty mirage]

enjoy your 447 fragment

[keen spruce]

okay i have a theory

[gusty mirage]

nerd

[cobalt hemlock]

whats the thing we replace exsang with please?

[gusty mirage]

the non-exsang build

[keen spruce]

i think this little weasel

[gusty mirage]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[storm forum]

31% crit unbuffed

[keen spruce]

is causing all of my sim weirdness

[gusty mirage]

imagine not having the superior version of that

or this one

[royal lantern]

@keen spruce my stats with flask+stones, no raidbuffs

[gusty mirage]

reapply your lethal poisons smh

you're missing leech

[royal lantern]

mate

i zoned

[keen spruce]

oxi was your trinket sim with bromach's on

or somethin else

[gusty mirage]

no

[marble hemlock]

yall animals not putting the primary gem in the middle hole

[gusty mirage]

they'll fix it any day now

[keen spruce]

can u do it with bromachs

[gusty mirage]

it's coming with the crimson vial buffs

trust

[keen spruce]

and see if dice is better

for science

i'm in deep

https://tenor.com/view/conspiracy-theory-explaining-gif-13403485

maybe it's cuz everyone is still usin annulet

[gusty mirage]

bruh

[keen spruce]

don't bruh me

[gusty mirage]

you think

a little more haste is going to make dice better?

[keen spruce]

no

[earnest remnant]

[keen spruce]

but my brain is melting

[spice spire]

Certified menace shmeeps

[gusty mirage]

there's been a heatwave

[spice spire]

Off the zaza

[gusty mirage]

bro

dice

are

dogshit

stop it

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/gryr8Mfg3E1B3d5jYSRZsp

here

[keen spruce]

https://tenor.com/view/hooker-funny-youre-a-hooker-gif-16626913

[gusty mirage]

it is true

I am essentially a hooker

people pay me hourly

[earnest remnant]

id only need you for 40 sec

[keen spruce]

i feel like i'm takin crazy pills

[gusty mirage]

you are

you are 100% taking crazy pills

@earnest remnant this guy was about to take a socket over beacon

because he thinks dice sims higher than beacon

[keen spruce]

raidbots sending me off the annulet, build more mastery when i have 4800, take dice over beacon

[earnest remnant]

[keen spruce]

why does it hate me

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/gydDoLYnykg7x5BMJA9FP4

IM NOT MAKIN IT UP I SWEAR

ignore that they're all negative

[bleak dove]

isnt fragment oversimming?

[gusty mirage]

very much so yes

[keen spruce]

yes all of those negative trinkets are upgardes, but dice is less negative

[gusty mirage]

[proper tapir]

Bro, my dice is also simming better than bacon

[gusty mirage]

its your piece of shit fragment

[keen spruce]

how can i trust any of you anymore

you made me build wrong boots

exang bugged for 6 months

fragment lied to me

[gusty mirage]

true

you should swap warlock

or mage

[earnest remnant]

get fucked

[keen spruce]

https://tenor.com/view/the-room-tommy-wiseau-youre-gif-10860014

[bleak dove]

i heard evokers have a legendary wep

could try that class

[earnest remnant]

im scared to see what i might sim as assa when i wake up tmrw

[vapid sierra]

we hold vanish for the second dm

[agile osprey]

Are people inferring that dice are simbait too?

[gusty mirage]

no

[vapid sierra]

and use it for sepsis incase something goes wrong

[gusty mirage]

dice are simming fine

they're just not a great trinket

[vapid sierra]

97 parse today

[keen spruce]

okay here i put on dogshit mark of dargul instead of fragment

[grim jay]

same

[keen spruce]

and do it again

[gusty mirage]

@earnest remnant why

[keen spruce]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/amTT9z8psEQKy1g7i74aYS

[gusty mirage]

crazy

I told you it was the fragment causing this

like 45 minutes ago

[keen spruce]

I wasn't worried about hte negative numbers

[brazen zodiac]

oxi c:

[earnest remnant]

cuz i might have to sit down and learn it for Sark stuff, i wanna be slightly more useful

[gusty mirage]

yeah dunno what to tell you man

delete your rogue

its the only answer

[gusty mirage]

I offered to teach you yesterday

and you ignored me

[earnest remnant]

i went to bed

[gusty mirage]

yeah but it wasn't MY bed

so

[earnest remnant]

after i typed it

[gusty mirage]

[runic hinge]

Is the beacon max ilvl? Or is the the ilvl you have it at in vault

[keen spruce]

it's 441

i just take beacon and go farm a dice anyways

[runic hinge]

Just checking you aren’t simming like an 3/5 hero or whatever

[earnest remnant]

also my sleep schedule is on normie hours atm

[keen spruce]

gulag'd to freehold either way

[earnest remnant]

its not good

[grand trail]

Stealthi assa gamer from tommorow?

[earnest remnant]

no

[gusty mirage]

[earnest remnant]

probably mostly just gonna be a Sark thing

[gusty mirage]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/sxiN3ng6DqMwX6wj4mykyR @keen spruce

you owe me $50

[keen spruce]

it was that stupid ring

that's also 800dps less

[gusty mirage]

wait

I didn't do dice

sec

[timber kelp]

dm?

[vapid sierra]

deathmark

[timber kelp]

wait, we hold assassination for 2 min?

[keen spruce]

hold vanish

[timber kelp]

er vanish for 2 min?

[keen spruce]

it's goofy

[timber kelp]

isnt vanish a 2 min cd?

[keen spruce]

yeah

[frigid kestrel]

Ye

Use it with Second DM

[timber kelp]

so why hold it? it'll basically be back up, no?

[keen spruce]

sepsis gives us enough imp garrote coverage

well all of the imp garrote coverage

[frigid kestrel]

^

[keen spruce]

and you can't delay the vanish cuz you need it at 2m

it's weird

[frigid kestrel]

But sepsis wont cover the second DM, so Vanish

[limber lion]

You literally gain nothing from pressing Vanish in the opener

[timber kelp]

oh, think i get it

[frigid kestrel]

Vanish gives no real value early on

[timber kelp]

so if you sepsis on cd, that's at 1:30, so you cant really hold for dm

[gusty mirage]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/h2AnQuHMER3kPJFEgSoAfS yeah your shit's cursed @keen spruce

[timber kelp]

so hold vanish for dm

[gusty mirage]

with the ring

harlan's dice wins

[keen spruce]

jfc

maybe i just cracked the code

[timber kelp]

shiv on cd?

[keen spruce]

and reached enlightenment

[gusty mirage]

let's see if I replace annulet

it wins

[keen spruce]

reject annulet

reject beacon

[gusty mirage]

ye, save a charge for sepsis and for dm

[keen spruce]

reject exang

[gusty mirage]

otherwise slam on cd

[keen spruce]

accend to dice

[timber kelp]

shiv before dm/sep?

or does it matter?

[keen spruce]

until i get a class trinket

[gusty mirage]

you sepsis before shiv

[timber kelp]

k

[royal lantern]

you send the 2 charges on opener, and then on CD, keep a charge for sepsis/dm

thats it

[gusty mirage]

you want the last dot tick to be inside of the shiv window

it does the most dam

[bleak dove]

sep > shiv > garr?

[timber kelp]

ah

[keen spruce]

normally sep gar shiv

but idk if it matters that much

[gusty mirage]

but if you're playing 2 charges you could always shiv -> sepsis and then shiv when the first one runs out

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/8Y6f5gupJjCRAqa177U6GF @keen spruce ya I got nothing bro

[keen spruce]

I think i've reached rogue nirvana

no annulet no beacon no exang

[gusty mirage]

no bacon = no bacon crits = no parsing

[keen spruce]

just class trinket waiting room

[gusty mirage]

unlucky

[keen spruce]

look imma cling to my r1 rashosh heroic parse till the day i die

[gusty mirage]

that's it

I'm coming for you

[keen spruce]

my gear looks like a fat kid ran a 4 minute mile

[gusty mirage]

🐍

[keen spruce]

no annulet, pi, beacon, exang

[ruby birch]

Same but for sennarth mythic

Idek how it ended as r1

[gusty mirage]

great boss

very gud design

almost as good as zskarn

[keen spruce]

my favorite part

was when it ran away 2 platforms early

[ruby birch]

I had r1 broodkeeper for a bit too

[keen spruce]

[ruby birch]

But it got yoinked

[keen spruce]

also in mythic you only had to beat the 13 other idiots playin sin until this week

so my parses are fine

except assualt don't look at assault

it was rank 17 boss damage and a 28 parse

[ruby birch]

On farm I’m yoinking every log that isn’t cringe

Mark my words alchemists

[royal lantern]

you know, i hate hating on devs from capital G gamers so much

but zskarn is such a funny story

[keen spruce]

nerfing boss health by 25% and having it be one of the most oppressive buffs in recent history

[royal lantern]

guy makes the boss->people cheese it->dev says on twitter that he is sad people cheese it->is cheesing it himself->gets fixed->everyone agrees its the worst boss in a long time

🙂

entire fight is such a dumpster fire

[agile osprey]

How many externals can I receive and my parse still count?

[royal lantern]

just nuke it into the ground and call it a day

[gusty mirage]

the last step should be #2

but yeah

timelines spot on

[royal lantern]

i mean yeha

but the cheese atleast made you skip the total shitshow that is this fight

now you cant do that anymore

and have to progress the most un-fun and shity fight in a long time

[ruby birch]

We only extended because we didn’t wanna kill zskarn without cheese

[royal lantern]

🙂

[ruby birch]

Cba

Such an unfun boss

It’s not even a hard fight it’s just annoying

[gusty mirage]

AND THEY MADE IT WORSE

[keen spruce]

@gusty mirage

https://tenor.com/view/sloth-fancy-swine-monocle-top-hat-gif-3893444

[royal lantern]

the dev guy should look at the fight and re-think again what happend

[gusty mirage]

[keen spruce]

[runic hinge]

Look at normal for that same fight 3 spots above you

[gusty mirage]

whoever's getting PI

your mom's a ho

[marble hemlock]

hideout?

[gusty mirage]

yes

[acoustic glacier]

Ney

[gusty mirage]

cause the entire block be hiding out in it

[keen spruce]

class trinket abuser

[marble hemlock]

well played sir

[runic hinge]

Rather be lucky than good. Or something like that

[minor gate]

Class trinket, I wish I had A trinket

[arctic current]

Are you guys changing from slimy to thorn boots or crafting another 447 with next spark?

[keen spruce]

it's gonna depend on drops

[ruby birch]

Whatever number biggest in sim

[runic hinge]

447 engi goggles so I can brez my trash friends

Which is also my biggest number

[arctic current]

I'm guessing they fixed slimy boots on Sims now?

[limber lion]

Yes

[arctic current]

Ah nice

[keen spruce]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/b1nNdybEeL9dUWD1tUeGBd

lookin like a boot swap angle

next week

or is toxic still goofin on sims too

i thought u guys added some secret sauce to sorta fix it

[thorn fjord]

@keen spruce you’ve been going in all day bro 🤣

[keen spruce]

I've literally been simming

since servers came up

alright i took the fkin bacon

[thorn fjord]

New boot goofin

[keen spruce]

[thorn fjord]

Yeah man that was an easy choice lmao

[keen spruce]

I still think i cracked the code

once everyone starts gettin rid of their annulets

[gusty mirage]

this man still simming fragment

[keen spruce]

I'm just ignoring the fragment part

it won't let me sim with an empty slot

and my only other trinket is mark of dargul

if this fkin darkmoon deck outsims beacon

[gusty mirage]

[limber lion]

Nah toxic sims right

[gusty mirage]

@limber lion

[keen spruce]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/6FWQHt1mPfJswL7YwiYgoa

still new boot goofin

[limber lion]

[gusty mirage]

[keen spruce]

https://tenor.com/view/reno911-gif-4851667

[gusty mirage]

are the sims doing what correctly

[keen spruce]

they are correctly not having you play kingsbane

[gusty mirage]

there isn't a special way to play kingsbane

you just make sure your shiv covers the entire kingsbane window

it's just a bad alternative

it will never beat DTB

[autumn frost]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[autumn frost]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[strange niche]

is fragment dead because exsang is dead?

[gusty mirage]

fragment isn't dead

it's just oversimming

idk if it was fixed in sims

[arctic current]

All hail Txt "killer of exsang"

[gusty mirage]

@keen spruce link me one of your quick sims

[autumn frost]

wait stormeaters is still bis?

[gusty mirage]

for aoe? yes

it's just stupidly strong

[keen spruce]

standby

[copper hazel]

Txt legit more power over blood than Lileth

[keen spruce]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/rAhc973bGVUNUk998iW1MC

[gusty mirage]

ty ily

[autumn frost]

am I crazy, but is there a place with a tier list for trinkets?

[gusty mirage]

wait I need one with fragment

[autumn frost]

I only see the best in slot ones

[keen spruce]

o one sec

[gusty mirage]

all combos will list them

but generally

[keen spruce]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/2zYSKMUP2XSVeyae3LVxiB

[gusty mirage]

assuming max ilvl generalized recommendations: bomba > nelth class trinket => beacon > dice >= fragment

can toss mark of durghul on there too

for funsies

[autumn frost]

KK. So i pass on essence

[gusty mirage]

oh right I forgot about essence

essence between bacon and dice assuming all buffs

w/o all bufs probably between dice and fragment

solid trinket just not amazing

which seems to be the common theme this tier

[strange niche]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[gaunt moat]

Does nelth trinket take you out of stealth?

[gusty mirage]

probably

I know it can ninja pull

so that's neat

[keen spruce]

i have heard something about that yes

[gusty mirage]

toxic thorns can do that too

if you have something targeted and it procs the dmg proc lol

[gaunt moat]

put it after fragment then

[gusty mirage]

bomb trinket being essentially ranged is also kinda cringe

[keen spruce]

why is beacon averaging 3/4 crits on a 10m sim when i have <40% crit fully buffed

[gusty mirage]

because you're built diffy

[bleak dove]

rng

[keen spruce]

i've run this thing like

8 times

[gusty mirage]

assembled uniquely if you will

[keen spruce]

oh wa it nvm

corrupting rage

[gaunt moat]

me when I'm just fighting random mobs outside and pulling something for 50y away with a bomb

[keen spruce]

much more than 40%

[tacit otter]

news

[gaunt moat]

Oh cool more druid talent changes for the 10th time

[gusty mirage]

but guys

you're missing the biggest part

[keen spruce]

monk discord suggesting that toxic still oversimming i have heard through the grapefine

are they just high

[gusty mirage]

[keen spruce]

or are the rogue sims seperate

or what

[gusty mirage]

okay lemme give you a tldr

gastank implemented them into simc

and he took into account period heals triggering the heal proc

I got this info from fuu

so it's about as accurate as we'll get it

is it oversimming a bit? probably

[midnight mist]

you would still need to have your specific spec/class healing stuff to be correctly implemented into simc tho

[keen spruce]

okay that's kinda what i thought, rough estimate but close enough

[gusty mirage]

as a rogue, your snd will proc the heal even if you aren't specced into recoup because of the way they coded it

[midnight mist]

which maybe monks dont ?

[gusty mirage]

so you could get fucked by rng

[karmic cedar]

Zero rogue updates again

[gusty mirage]

blizzard for whatever reason moved away from just slamming all the info in the spell data for a lot of things

[spice spire]

I mean there’s a lot to unpack with boots.
There’s also apparently a dh bug where toxic triple procs off dance?

[gaunt moat]

Did you expect otherwise?

[gusty mirage]

so most of the shit is just approximations

[spice spire]

[keen spruce]

makes sense ty sir o7

[karmic cedar]

I was high on hopium

[keen spruce]

welcome to the doomer trenches

[bleak dove]

https://tenor.com/view/help-me-sponge-bob-squidward-tentacles-beg-gif-17392663

one rogue change please

[keen spruce]

we got one change

we got a 5% aura buff

[spice spire]

You got a 5% aura buff

Yw

[gusty mirage]

5% aura buff! (that's actually 4% cause ya know melee swings)

[keen spruce]

2 changes actually cuz it turns out exang is dead

[bleak dove]

[gusty mirage]

that wasn't a new change

[keen spruce]

yeah but it's new to us

[gusty mirage]

it wasn't, it was hiding right in front of us in plain sight

[gaunt moat]

5% cause we're not gonna int ourself on exsang anymore

[gusty mirage]

like the evil little fucker that exsang is

[gusty mirage]

TRUE

[keen spruce]

fax

oxi why did you want my fragment sim

[bleak dove]

three rogue changes please ** fixed it

[keen spruce]

i was expecting follow up science

[gusty mirage]

to see if it was calculating stacks properly yet or not

[keen spruce]

oh

it's not i'm assuming

[gusty mirage]

its not

[keen spruce]

[gusty mirage]

something's wonky w/ mutilate

[keen spruce]

idk how the logic in the apl works but can't that be hard coded to fix that

[gusty mirage]

it'd have to be edited in the item itself

with the way that was imported into simc

[keen spruce]

if mutilate & fragment
then fragment stacks -1

type of situation

[gusty mirage]

there's a group of item dudes for simc

that kind of handle all of that

I'm p. sure koji was working on addressing it

idk where we are in that process

[keen spruce]

[gusty mirage]

or even how we'd go about fixing it in the sims

cuz I'm a dum dum

[keen spruce]

i'm sure they'll figure it out

[proud basin]

!whisper\

[keen spruce]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[proud basin]

LOL thanks

[gusty mirage]

until then we need a shmeeps special, instead of pbox getting yeeted we need fragment

[keen spruce]

o7

bruther i'm down to ride this fragment copium all the way to the grey parses

[strange niche]

when we use our first sepsis are we supposed to refresh the original stealthed garrote or use a different ability?

[gusty mirage]

you're a gamer

you won't gray parse

that's for shitters like me

[keen spruce]

beacon even has a cast time

so it's basically puzzlebox 2 electric boogaloo

[gusty mirage]

except it does big dam when it crits

so you feel better about it

[keen spruce]

troo

[gusty mirage]

like people hated pbox for the cast

but liked grieftorch

[keen spruce]

me

[bleak dove]

me

[gaunt moat]

Because PB we actually had to sync and it feels bad to have a CD ready and not use it

[gusty mirage]

pushing button then big number better than pushing button and you get another square in the top right of your screen ig

[keen spruce]

i mean tbh even if grieftorch gave mastery instead

cooming fire all over the boss

was pretty fun

[gaunt moat]

also you don't "feel" you do damage with PB

[gusty mirage]

you could also grief your grieftorch

[thorn fjord]

When you see that 1.4 mil dmg after pressing beaqcon

[gusty mirage]

w/ spell queue

[thorn fjord]

that dopamine rush is nice

[wind condor]

Gm hit me with “subs still better for funnel so you’ll be playing that until we kill sark/nelth”:)

[gusty mirage]

[thorn fjord]

Oh yeah sub that AMAZING funnel spec

[keen spruce]

sub funnel

[gusty mirage]

p. sure shuriken storm into evisc is less prio damage than spamming black powder

[keen spruce]

https://tenor.com/view/robin-williams-gif-6037089

[balmy condor]

correct

[wind condor]

Ima just play sin and if I’m t3 they can’t say anything regardless lol

Sub hurts my old man hands

[gray horizon]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[spice surge]

Nah its not

[gusty mirage]

[spice surge]

The thing is that regular singletarget is slightly more than storm>evis

[gusty mirage]

so funnel is a meme

got it

hear me out eleem

what if

[keen spruce]

if single target is > funnel

[spice surge]

With full ST build its slightly worse yes

[drifting cloud]

not only its a meme

[keen spruce]

then it's not funnel

[gusty mirage]

they brought back shuriken combo

[thorn fjord]

https://tenor.com/view/old-school-will-ferrell-frank-ricard-beer-bong-drink-gif-5072664

[drifting cloud]

its worse than not funneling

[spice surge]

With aoe build its a sizeable gain to funnel because you spec out of stuff like inev etc

And nado and stuff helps too

[gusty mirage]

https://tenor.com/view/star-wars-chosen-one-you-were-the-chosen-one-gif-7521423

[keen spruce]

hmm yes just run full m+ talents on sark

for all of that juicy funnel

[spice surge]

Bro im blasting

(in p1, in p2 im cosmetic)

[gusty mirage]

on sark?

#justrogueproblems

[spice surge]

Yep

[keen spruce]

we're all cosmetic

people just bring assas rogues cuz we're pretty

[drifting cloud]

wait eleem is in a guild thats on sark?

[gusty mirage]

true

ryler's cute as fuck

[drifting cloud]

this man was m+ casual player start of xpac

what a scammer

[gusty mirage]

eleem is a legend

[spice surge]

[gusty mirage]

you wouldn't take eleem on your team?

[spice surge]

I got title in s1

Is that casual?

[gusty mirage]

yes

[steel ridge]

time for slow mode

[gusty mirage]

because most of that time was spent afk waiting for the group to fill in LFG

I'll start deleting messages left and right

I'm not slowmoding shit

[drifting cloud]

you know what I mean

[gusty mirage]

if round number 3438743 of this hasn't taught people to act like adults

then maybe some 2d mutes will

[keen spruce]

wait i tabbed out

what did i miss

[gusty mirage]

Eleem's a gamer

and PTR notes came out sans rogue

[keen spruce]

i didn't miss that

[gusty mirage]

so people will cry

[keen spruce]

this is known

eleem big pp

[gusty mirage]

and I will start deleting messages

I got 3 hours until raid

I got nothing but time

work's done

[keen spruce]

oh i htought you just deleted somethin

nvm

i can't read

[burnt latch]

Great changes, hope they keep it up.

[keen spruce]

spent too much time in s1 playin outlaw

[gusty mirage]

warcieft

[keen spruce]

[gusty mirage]

how's farm my friend

[burnt latch]

Couldnt tell you brother, havent been playing since the kill

[gusty mirage]

BASED AS FUCK

[burnt latch]

Tagged along on some alt mythic 3 bosses today though for a vault

[gusty mirage]

imma touch some grass when sark is deadge

then start planning my trip to euroland

[burnt latch]

Dude ive been doing the same

[gusty mirage]

first order of business, fly to sweden and kiss @rigid mango on the forehead

[burnt latch]

Feels so good not having to log in every day

[keen spruce]

oh another question

is it a bug that corrupting rage just randomly procs

while you're afk

the debuff damage thing

[gusty mirage]

I think that's just how it works

but who knows anymore

nothing makes sense

[burnt latch]

No it does that

[gusty mirage]

[burnt latch]

Its a thing it does

[rigid mango]

[keen spruce]

but it also doesn't drop the buff

when it procs randomly

[gusty mirage]

[keen spruce]

the crit buff

[burnt latch]

Yup

Thats how its supposed to work

[gusty mirage]

yea its a specific debuff that starts the cycle again

[keen spruce]

but it will drop the crit buff if it procs from damage

[gusty mirage]

it's like the angry orc

[keen spruce]

okay

glad that is clear on the tooltip

[gusty mirage]

I got another banger of a tooltip for you shmeeps dw

[drifting cloud]

what was in vault oxi

[gusty mirage]

how about this one

[gusty mirage]

447 crit mastery cloak, 447 haste/mastery belt w/ socket, and heroic bomba

I took heroic bomba

[keen spruce]

imma be honest

[gusty mirage]

was tempted to take socket tbh

[keen spruce]

i have no idea what spores do

i never looked at em

[gusty mirage]

so it reads that it'll apply stacks

[drifting cloud]

belt with socket

[gusty mirage]

I have a 441 crit/mastery w/ socket

from heroic sark

[drifting cloud]

oh

[keen spruce]

let me guess.. it does not

[gusty mirage]

ye so it woulda been a 6 ilvl upgrade to belt

[gusty mirage]

not while the dot is up

it won't reapply stacks until the dot finishes

[keen spruce]

well they shoulda added "before a cycle starts anew"

that woulda cleared everything up

[gusty mirage]

[lean fossil]

are we getting another 5% buff come 10.1.5?

[gusty mirage]

[runic hinge]

5% every day until 1.5

[lean fossil]

saw the ptr build that just got posted

[oak sky]

If its datamined

Its probably just updated based on the hotfix

[karmic cedar]

It's just the live buff being applied to PTR

[oak sky]

Yea

[keen spruce]

yeah but this is gonna shake things up

for the pirates

[copper hazel]

huge

[keen spruce]

gamba into grand melee do 10% more ST

press BF in single

[spiral pasture]

i guess its pretty much confirmed at this point we arent getting the promised changes

[lean fossil]

the change was them killing exsang lol

[lean fossil]

im blind, dont make fun of me

[karmic cedar]

Was there actually a blue post that promised rogue talent updates? I thought there was, but I can't find it

[spiral pasture]

like a month ago now

ish

[karmic cedar]

All I see is a Wowhead article that mentions rogue talent updates because of the one Outlaw change

[strange python]

buffs are live from today right

[keen spruce]

yeah

[karmic cedar]

Should be, yes

[strange python]

trying out assa tmrw for raid thank god

[burnt latch]

My son works at blizzard, he said rogue was mentioned in the original blue post by accident, rogue rework is planned for 11.0

[inland dirge]

that was the post

[spiral pasture]

i mean rtb isnt even a talent

so we can definitely say they didnt deliver on their promise

[old pine]

This was the original I believe

[karmic cedar]

Aha, thanks

[spiral pasture]

wish they just came out and said something happened idk what their excuse is but anyway no rogue changes next patch so we can stop copiuming

[oak sky]

Ok don

[old pine]

(can't remember the post date, I had taken a screenshot because I didn't believe it would happen...)

[marble hemlock]

they never specified when so put down your pitchforks

[spiral pasture]

wdym

[marble hemlock]

heat death of the universe is coming too

[spiral pasture]

specified that its coming in next patch

[marble hemlock]

well there was a grandmelee buff soooo

[spiral pasture]

its not a talent change

[marble hemlock]

they said class balance and tuning. not talent changes

(im really just trying to not doom too much, i get your frustration)

[spiral pasture]

its literally under class talent updates tho

and the other classes got mega changed

and also weekly iteration for the past 3 weeks which makes me think we are 100% in the bin at this point

[ripe bone]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[restive falcon]

where do u put beacon in the opener? its Gar -> Slice -> Gar -> Rupture -> Er -> Rupture -> sepsis -> shiv -> garrote -> deathmark ->

[limber lion]

You've got it wrong

We don't play Exsang anymore

[restive falcon]

err yea thats old copy i had

[thorn fjord]

Exsang is dead in the water

[limber lion]

Opener is Gar - Slice - Muti to 5-6CP - Rupture - Beacon - Sepsis - DM - Shiv - ER - Envenom

[thorn fjord]

Ah that makes sense