assassination

[north basin]

ohh good. now got it.

[jade abyss]

Is no running ER a big loss?

[north basin]

iam just started to read faq so got confused with new things in df talent system

[dim yacht]

it definitely feels like it, yeah. i sim an extra 3k dps by having ER in single target. i dont use it in aoe despite being recommended

ive been playing a talent point down even without realising it due to nightstalker being useless, so even in m+ seems like you can get away with it

[north basin]

damn this talent system looks so complicated. like zillion of options.

i like it

[dim yacht]

theres definitely a fair bit to take in, but you can play a more passive build, and move into more things as you go

it wont be optimal, but you can still do decent ST damage with subpar talents

aoe might be another story

[north basin]

back in SL i didnt like ER subtetly build alot... so now its hunting me down again in sin builds... why /sad

[jade abyss]

In my opinion its easier to hit the cps with assa instead with sub ^^

[north basin]

it is ye. but anyway i prefer build without ER

if its exists

[jade abyss]

But i would trade ER with the mastery flag from sub x)

[north basin]

didnt try sub yet. need to master sin first )

so dont know the options there

[jade abyss]

Sin is love

[high wagon]

@dim yacht just curious who are the top 2 rogues that stream?

[true thorn]

same question for me so i can look them up

[cerulean nest]

when do you use storm eaters in opener?

[balmy condor]

seliathan is rank 1 assa

idk who rank 2 is right now

varas maybe

[balmy condor]

whenever

it's just a push button do damage

[cerulean nest]

cool

[dim yacht]

selathian as whispyr mentioned is top, and his RIO says he has a discord to ask questions too. second is zerocool, who streams for sure, link on his RIO aswell

[high wagon]

Thanks I found them both!

[oak sky]

Varas 😈

[balmy condor]

is zerocool actually rank 2 right now?

what a terrible timeline we're in

[spice spire]

Nochill

[drifting cosmos]

Do you still use IC + KB or just DTB everywhere?

[balmy condor]

@subtle tundra I need you to save me before the "why does zerocool" questions come in

can you no life harder

[balmy condor]

I use IC KB on every key this week

[spice spire]

Varas is a boon enjoyer tho 🤨

[balmy condor]

idc

zerocool is a very artistic player

he's creative

inventing new strats

ya know

[spice spire]

[balmy condor]

he's an out of the box thinker

[spice spire]

No CttC no IC, but kb build when

[dim yacht]

i really wish there werent so many shit trinkets

i have the nok one at 382, ruby shell at 396, 411 spite, and 418 alchemist stone. made the stone cause my trinkets were so bad

infinite phial is nice i guess lol

[gusty mirage]

the fan of knives in ST strat

[oak sky]

Out of the puzzle box?

[oak sky]

I still remember ramfam asking me about some of the stuff he was doing

[north basin]

guys how u deal with additional buttons added in this xpac. last 10 mins iam trying to fogure out how to add another hotkey to abilities. iam running out of options...

iam feeling like i need another +2/3 buttons to assign damn

[dim yacht]

i have a similar issue. theres obviously the choice of modifiers, but i cant manage them for the life of me.

im using 1-5, 6/7 in a pinch for abilities not often used, qefghxcv, and middle mouse button

you could always use r and z aswell

anything else is me being a clicker

alt could also be a good option if youre not using it for a modifier

crtl and ` too maybe?

[idle coyote]

Shift and then I use ctrl on 2 spells is enough for me

[north basin]

iam using alt + mouse keys + wheel. also FGH and 1-6 and ~. and still have buttons to add..

[dim yacht]

zxcv are all reasonable options

[north basin]

but iam feeling like my fingers wont adapt to distant keys...

[dim yacht]

i get that. i dont think those four are too distant though

[idle coyote]

Spam m+

You’ll be fine after 6-7

[dim yacht]

c and v are very easy hit with your index finger

x and z might be slightly more awkward

[north basin]

z for weapon x for sit and c for character info. didnt touch those for 10+ years

[dim yacht]

i rebound character info to crtl + c

[north basin]

i dont feel comfortable redifine em )

[dim yacht]

i get you on the others. im a moonguard player and actively RP. x and z are both a big deal

i just dealt with it on x

and started typing /sit lol. and really, as a roleplayer thats actually annoying as shit

[north basin]

like its first time iam stuck with buttons add. and i played piano warlock. this xpac have the largest amount of buttons in my memory. its good part i think. but i need to overcome this struggle somehow ))

[dim yacht]

yeah, i know its not easy. ive been there

i think you just need to start changing things that have been for a while. like, is it really a big deal to rebind c?

i just have character on crtl + c instead, and got used to it

and unless youre a roleplayer like me, do you actually use sit often?

[north basin]

i will try the C button. but rly i feel like my muscle memory will fuck me)

[dim yacht]

it will at first. like i said, ive been there

i didnt rebind z, because years of roleplay has me in the habit of sheathing my weapons after combat when a mob gets in the way during RP, and i realised i do it even during content, so that was out of the question for me, as i was hitting z at bad times. but the way you should look at it is, what harm can do it? accidentally hitting a keybind when trying to open your character window, or when trying to sit?

youre not going to be penalised for hitting it at a bad time, because you would presumably not be in any combat when doing so

[north basin]

yep agree

[dim yacht]

z was an exception for me because of what i mentioned lol, so i cant rebind it

[north basin]

the C button seems acceptable for me to change. iam not sure about z and x

[dim yacht]

fair enough, everyone is different

[oak sky]

Modifiers and mouse buttons are definitely the easiest ways to add binds

[dim yacht]

i agree, they just dont work for everyone

[north basin]

i have all stuns and interupts binded. now i need to find something for kingsbane

and CT

[dim yacht]

do you play multiple classes rey? if so, try to keep your bindings similar between classes

for example, q is my big CD for all classes, v is my movement cd etc

[oak sky]

Of course, but for anyone looking to setup keybinds mouse buttons and modifiers are at least good to try

[north basin]

ye iam playing 4 classes at general. trying to keep em same binds. but now iam only playing rogue,

like 1 min cd and 2 min cd on same buttons across all chars

[dim yacht]

agreed. the advice i always give to people trying to get into more keybinding is to try modifiers, and remember that keys other than numbers exist

i was top 500 NA for a while in bfa season 2, and i didnt even have my kick on a keybind 😂

[north basin]

but rogue have so many interupts now and utility stuff. also rotation have like 10+ buttons.

[dim yacht]

yeah i feel you. its why theres some stuff i just dont even use, despite being recommended

[oak sky]

Personally i've been able to bind everything and I don't even use every single bind in my arsenal

Still have room for 2-3 more abilities

Its tight though these days

[dim yacht]

def becomes easier if youre using modifiers

harder if youre not

[oak sky]

Absolutely

[dim yacht]

im definitely at my limit due to sucking at modifiers

[north basin]

i use f1 nd f2 and f3 too. and still runout of options)

f4 too far for my fingers

[oak sky]

I pretty much do shift mods and a couple alt mods

[dim yacht]

rey, it sounds like maybe youre keybinding too much. not everything needs to be keybound

if its something you dont use often, consider if it really needs a keybind

[oak sky]

Mmm

[dim yacht]

lots of things are okay to be clicked, depending on content ofc. sap is fine to be clicked in pve, not so much in pvp

[oak sky]

I like having sap on a bind i would never use for a rotational abiliry

Ability

[dim yacht]

yeah, either is fine

[oak sky]

Something really far off but still easy to find

[north basin]

like 15 years ago ihave learned a lesson. u dont have to click nothing with mouse. i try to stick with that rule )

[dim yacht]

you dont have to. but you dont have to keybind everything, either

[oak sky]

The only things i click are like poisons and mount basically

Or rp stuff like pick lock or pickpocket

[vestal abyss]

E for sprint/dh jump etc
F for interrupt/kick
X for the most often used cooldown (however having both exsang and deathmark annoys the hell out of me on this)
Then try and bind the rotation into key 1-5(+6-7)
AOE is a mess, but trying it out currently on shift modifier 1+
And then mirror similar ability locations on stealth bar
...and then there's all the other stuff. I have 4 bars filled now.

[north basin]

i feel i have to bind everything with rogue. coz everything is valuable. in raid and in m+

[dim yacht]

hey we have something in common, F is my kick now lol

[north basin]

all these stuns distracts and feints

and vials

[oak sky]

For the most part i would say anything you might need during combat should be bound

Or anything you press a ton

[north basin]

F is my deathmark hotkey

xD

[oak sky]

F is my kick as well

[north basin]

i kick with addition mouse button. i have g502

[dim yacht]

okay but again, does it need to be keybound. i support the fact that if you dont like clicking, have it keybound. but put them on keybinds you dont use often if youre going to do that. you dont sap in pve all that often, or blind. both can be on a weird keybind or clicked. same with evasion, feint to a degree, stealth (i just click it between packs), poison knife, shadowstep maybe, poisons

[vestal abyss]

I even tried hardware binding an opening rotation macro onto my mouse, but it was more of a hassle with Rogue specs

[north basin]

actually i click only poison apply on rogue.

coz i need to do it 1 per hour

[dim yacht]

youll probably use poisoned knife less often than you apply poisons 😂

hell, i probably evade less often than i apply poisons, not often i end up with aggro

considering im managing just fine without any modifiers and youre using modifiers, it sounds to me like you need to do a better job at setting priorities for your keybinds

[north basin]

actally poisoned knife is binded on cntrl+ right wheel )

[oak sky]

Blind should be used sometimes in m+ for a st stop

Or to keep adds away like plaguefall first boss, hov last trash

[dim yacht]

blind def has a use

[north basin]

my goal is to never fuck up during rotation and make it as quick as possible. so rotational buttons all in good range of my fingers reach. coz milliseconds is sometimes all u have between 99% log and 100% log )

[dim yacht]

just not enough of a use that i feel the need to put it on a easy keybind

i find that most of the time i need to use blind, i know im going to be using it

[oak sky]

Idk about shadowstep and defensives man

Those are like

Things that need to be pressed on the fly often

Which means you need to not fuck it up

Which means if you care about your performance you bind them

[dim yacht]

agreed. evade is on a harder to reach keybind, but enough that i can do it on demand

[vestal abyss]

Shadowstep on Z for me. Distance closing is important

[dim yacht]

im not saying bind everything to a click if you cant find a quick easy bind. im just saying find a priority for them

[north basin]

ye defensives are pressed very often by me. so need to be in good fingers reach too

[oak sky]

I would almost rather click a rotational button than a defensive or movement button

[dim yacht]

for me, ive never had an issue evading in time. if the tanks gonna die, i can usually see it happening before it actually happens, and its still actually keybound

[oak sky]

Evasion is definitely less important

[dim yacht]

it just means i lose 1% dps evading because of a slightly more awkward keybind

feint is easily useable for me too

[oak sky]

Feint and cloak really need binds

Personally i use crimson vial a lot

[dim yacht]

same

crimson is on H for me

the point im really getting at isnt "x ability isnt important" thats not what im saying. im just saying find a priority for it

how people find that priority is up to them, and might change based on if youre pugging or consistent group, what level youre playing at raid wise/key level wise etc. theres a lot of factors

i know its not world top level, but i hit 2500 yesterday which i think is pretty decent, and im getting by with some pretty shit keybinds for some of my stuff, and still manage to get shit done in clutch moments

[oak sky]

You can definitely get results with bad keybinds or not having things keybound

At a certain level it definitely becomes more and more likely that you gimp yourself by having a bad setup though

[dim yacht]

your point is fair. i just think people shouldnt overthink it is all

losing 0.1% dps overall, because you had to reach for an awkward keybind to evade when the tank dies isnt going to deplete your key

as long as you can actually hit it when you need to, i think thats the important factor

[north basin]

agree. but sometimes brain wired in a way what u think something is too important to just make it a weird shortcut. or click it with mouse. cant help it ))

so need to fight with myself first )

[dim yacht]

thats when you just gotta force out the muscle memory, coming from the guy who uses /sit in roleplay all the time, and rebound his x key

might not be easy, but its doable

[oak sky]

I started out clicking too, but one day i just decided it was important to have keybinds and got it done

If you can learn a new spec entirely from the ground up you can learn new keybinds

[dim yacht]

yeah, same. if its something i need on the fly, its probably keybound

[rough stump]

buy some foot pedals and bind the "oh shit" buttons to them

[oak sky]

There was stuff i didnt have keybound then added to a keybind as needed

[dim yacht]

got a few exceptions, but ive managed without any real issues. i dont remember the last time i died or missed something because it was something i had to click and forgot/didnt click in time/we

[oak sky]

Any time i had something cause an issue if i missed it then i keybound it

Havent had a problem in ages

[dim yacht]

im gonna buy one of those steering wheels and use that to move my character 😂

bind foot pedal to sprint, lets go

[north basin]

=)

[rough stump]

vehicle rogue meta

[balmy condor]

Didn’t @gray fjord do a video like that

[dim yacht]

ive never heard of it, would love to see it lol

do some sick drive by gankings

give back the old sepsis build, bind one shot macro to your horn honk

[balmy condor]

I think he played his outlaw rogue with a sim racing setup

Pedals and all

[dim yacht]

that sounds amazing

if you ever find a link, please @ me

or dm me, even better

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JRYSaeezIOU is this it

[marble hemlock]

Outlaw. Not even once.

[balmy condor]

Yeah

That’s the one

[dim yacht]

@marble hemlock youre an inspiration to all m+ sin rogues

[marble hemlock]

Am i? I'm just pressing W

[balmy condor]

@marble hemlock I hate you for doing a 140k council I can’t beat that anytime soon

But you have a cat

So I guess you’re okay

[marble hemlock]

[balmy condor]

Gonna buy some tokens and bribe my priests

My morals are gone

[marble hemlock]

Pretty sure i still fucked up a lot on that fight

[balmy condor]

That’s how I felt on first kill

[marble hemlock]

But yeah with gear assa ain't bad

[balmy condor]

But then I felt like I did better on rekill

But the damage wasn’t better

So

Idfk

Maybe I’m an idiot

[marble hemlock]

I'm like 90% sure i didn't apply the 4th SBS until i had max charges again

[balmy condor]

Opening on that fight is so fucked tho

[marble hemlock]

Ye

[balmy condor]

It’s like 45 second opener

Real dumb

[marble hemlock]

[thorn crater]

u need ranged to interrupt dathea and the tanks to actually pull the 2 melee to them right?

[marble hemlock]

And deathmark is awkward

Cuz you wanna spend every GCD doing something else

[dim yacht]

idk wtf to do on council honestly

[jade abyss]

Cats op

[dim yacht]

i just try to keep bleeds on everything, and hit envenom otherwise

[balmy condor]

If that’s an issue you’re not killing the boss lmao

[marble hemlock]

Cat affix worst affix

[balmy condor]

We have a rotation for both bosses

Those things hurt

[thorn crater]

oh i am.... but with a shit ton of 4 fingered no opposable thumb chimps

[balmy condor]

Is it worse than infested

[marble hemlock]

Yes

[balmy condor]

Wow

That’s pretty bad

[dim yacht]

what do you mean, infested was a very fun affix /s

[balmy condor]

Yeah best they made

[devout prism]

Reaping was the most fun

[vestal wren]

reaping was a affix you ignored

[jade abyss]

Echoing blades was fun with reaping

[rough stump]

what're my stat weights like?

im finding myself energy starved quite often even with full bleeds, thinking i might need to up my haste a bit

[vestal abyss]

Well you have 37% crit

And 9% haste

Sorry, being funny on my own accord

[rough stump]

is 37% crit too much? too little?

[vestal abyss]

I'm not the correct person to evaluate it.

[dim yacht]

bring back echoing blades

this was actually massive for me

got a pretty big bump in my dps thanks to this, thank you

[dim yacht]

im pretty similar

[devout prism]

Stat weights aren't generally a useful metric to gauge performance since there are so many other variables to consider. Best you can do is learn to use raidbots to sim your own gear

[rough stump]

have been simming things, just wasn’t sure if there was a hard cap for any of the stats/diminishing returns

[dim yacht]

theres rarely hard caps. granted was an edge case, but with bfa s4 corruption, sin rogues were running 100% crit builds lol

[oak sky]

The sim will recommend different gear if DRs are starting to have a big impact

As long as you roll with sims your gear is all good

[rough stump]

cool cool, will continue to do that 👍🏻

thanks guys!

[thorn crater]

Guys let’s take a minute to wish happy new year to each other since people might be poppin in for a minute or two. I know I am. Wish you all the best. Even you Varas. Enjoy today and tomorrow

[subtle tundra]

wow dude! thank you for naming me personally. i always knew people cared about me!

[thorn crater]

What can I say

You’re rent free my dude

Happy holidays

[subtle tundra]

you too buddy!(i clearly see you guys as people and not just text)

[vestal abyss]

I'm new to rogueing, but your community seems nice and welcoming! Happy new year!

[storm onyx]

!neck

[prisma monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/316923750073499648/1055055765980844093/image.png

[silver loom]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/LuxthosRogueDragonflight (Luxthos's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[dull crypt]

Am I okay to keep my weapon embellishment on a 418 recraft and take it off later when cowl/ring becomes available for me?

[royal lantern]

you probs need a couple of recrafts then for 418

but its ok yeha

[dull crypt]

Alrighty thats fine, thanks

[ebon notch]

varas im gonna clap ur fat cheeks i swear

[royal lantern]

uwu?

[timber meadow]

damn kingsbane burst is crackedwhen everything lines up

[prime anchor]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[eternal vortex]

i sim +600 more with haste-mastery gems

[vestal wren]

yes, haste is fairly undervalued

people kinda slept on it

[timber meadow]

mastery gang

[subtle tundra]

o-ok papa ;3

[subtle tundra]

almost like whispyr said its still really good just loses value when you have a lot

[vestal wren]

i haven't followed the channel enough

so can't say much who did talk about haste or didn't

what i can say is

when i followed chat i saw people usually say haste is terrible/bad and you should only get mastery and crit

[eternal vortex]

i was simmed for crit-mast for the whole time i think and it just shifted now

[neon oxide]

Having no haste feels like playing on a nintendo64

just like when you run no vers you are squishy af

[storm onyx]

There is a point haste catches to mastery, yea

[vestal wren]

but stats seem to be fairly similar on all 3

crit is rly good always and probably the best stat

and after that it depends

[eternal vortex]

ye i have almost 5k crit base

[vestal wren]

my profile in the spreadsheet for assassination does use quite some haste, and iirc recent changes to trinkets, puzzle box likely does shift it even more heavy towards haste

[eternal vortex]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[vestal wren]

i know cev did look into a updated profile for puzzle box, and it pushes assassinaiton even higher in output

so probably somewhere around subtlety numbers on single target

[royal lantern]

i wont touch puzzlebox

cus then i would had to play double active trinket

fuck no

2 trinkets with a 2sec cast

[subtle tundra]

fuck that

im gaming that boon tho

give me mythic boon

i will go HAM

my favorite trinket

literally half of my mistakes in m+ are from pressing it

[royal lantern]

just dont have any aoe be placed over you for 10sec

duh

[vestal wren]

but its rly good on assassination

[royal lantern]

double active

not worth the hustle

[subtle tundra]

i played boon over grieftorch on terros

i love elemental

[royal lantern]

will not play the shity KB build with grieftorch+puzzle box in raids

[subtle tundra]

DO NOT call KB BUILD SHIT

THIS IS WAR

[royal lantern]

ah yes, just juggle perfect box+exsang+torch+kb on the opener

[royal lantern]

nobody cares about m+ builds, talking about raids

[subtle tundra]

yes

[lament warren]

nothing to juggle w double on use

it just goes on cd

[subtle tundra]

i like kb in raid

[royal lantern]

kb is ok

playing KB cus of double active is not

[subtle tundra]

i play for fun

and yes double active is cringe

kb is fun tho

[ebon notch]

just step

lmao

what build you running in m+ rn varas

[subtle tundra]

rn im running eft

just found a slick lets go

[teal bloom]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[subtle tundra]

oh yea im play ic kb basically everywhere

havent even tried dtb

[timber meadow]

im a kb convert

i like it

[teal bloom]

I am too bad for IC/KB, DTB is familiar and safe

[ebon notch]

wat

[thorny pond]

Electronic Funds Transfer - he is a bank tbh, may be laundering monies

[uncut echo]

Escape froM tarkov

[timber meadow]

with kb do you puzzle right before every exanguinate after opener?

[thorn crater]

is there a way to implement 2 platers at the same time?

[thorny pond]

Like profiles? No. You'll want to grab elements from each that you want and create a new

[abstract flax]

is the dragon tempered blades build viable for m+ at all or is it only kingsbane?

[thorny pond]

You can DTB + CT build found in #assassination-faq

Just know that the potential isn't that great

[abstract flax]

mmm, makes sense

[teal bloom]

More boss damage but less aoe

[abstract flax]

So probably decent on tyrannical weeks, not so much fortified

[round topaz]

What is the max number of targets i should try to maintain rupture on?

[signal pier]

!lariat

where's that nice image with the lariat effects?

[lament warren]

!neck

[prisma monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/316923750073499648/1055055765980844093/image.png

[urban mantle]

Guys. If i wanna play assassin um Mythic Plus 8-14 keys. What stats should i focus, and its good play assassin in mythic that adds die quickly?

[thorny pond]

Just go top gear sims

and play what you want, it's 8-14s

[timber meadow]

assasin sucks in M+ relative to your other options assuming you're equally good at outlaw/sub as you are at assa

[turbid heath]

If you do +15 do you still unlock your old school legion artifact appearances for doing one?

[pseudo hamlet]

If Crit > Mast, then why 45crit+45mast food > 105 crit food?

[thorny pond]

Because you probably have too much crit relative to mastery for the sims

main stat is gonna be better though

[hot goblet]

Got Primal Ritual Shell, also got Seal of Fillal Duty (the ring that gives you a shield when you deal fire damage). Do I just take mastery buff, or could there be a benefit to taking the fire damage buff to pop the absorb shield in M+. Do we know how far apart the flat damage vs mastery is?

[thorny pond]

If you have flaming cowl, the ring is value there. Ritual shell I would just sim, but for DPS is flat buff me thinks

[subtle tundra]

It's a game. Maybe you'll grow out of wow(kid)

[brisk zealot]

Where's Exsang at for raid environment, still vital or interchangeable? Got a second active trinket and just looking to trim down on buttons if it's not much of a hit

[turbid heath]

I got rid of KB cause of less buttons in a raid environment. Does that make me a bad rogue?

[brisk zealot]

Honestly I find KB easier because I can just castsequence to roll it into the same button as Shiv

[turbid heath]

Can you DM me your macro please?

[pseudo python]

Is there a way to dictate which combo point is empowered with echoing reprimand or is it random?

[turbid heath]

They glow on your interface unless you're using a UI addon?

[cloud moat]

Random afaik

[proper tapir]

Random, but if you take RC it will be 2, 3 and 4 everytime

[pseudo python]

I can see which one it is, just curious if when u cast it if it just chooses a random combo point or do you cast it at a certain time

[cloud moat]

Thank Mr Bliz for clunky ass nerfs

[vestal wren]

huh, was there a new nerf?

[cloud moat]

No new one

[vestal wren]

2,3 and 4 seems fine

no randomness

5 was the lowest impact finisher already

[cloud moat]

Gotta admit I haven't paid attention what they go on

[vestal wren]

so most of the value of er was kept

[cloud moat]

True

[vestal wren]

to explain what i mean

the value you get is basically the diffrence between the combo point you finish on and 7 cp

higher means you get more combo point benefits what is good

5 to 7 is 2 combo points

while 2 to 7 is worth 5 points

[pseudo python]

Wait, it’s not just consumed as a “7 combo point finisher” regardless?

[cloud moat]

Ofc but you get to press big boy buttons more often rather than wasting energy and time on peasant mutilate to build those points

[pseudo python]

Oh, I gotcha. Should I be saving it for a certain finisher(ie rupture refresh) or just cash in immediately when I hit the animacharged point?

[true thorn]

in m+ can we pick up master assassin instead of exsanguinate?

[brisk zealot]

I was looking for an exsang replacement for raid too lol
Though I don't know if Master Assassin would be a good choice since coming out of stealth is usually just putting out Garrotes so it'd only be noticeable with Vanish

I just had an upsetting thought. Master Assassin's 30% crit bonus works while in stealth, would that mean it could be a viable strat to Exsang -> Deathmark -> Vanish and then just stay in stealth until there's about 3 seconds left of Exsang'd bleeds?

[vocal gazelle]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[glass junco]

!neck

[prisma monolith]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/316923750073499648/1055055765980844093/image.png

[digital zodiac]

Slightly new back to the game after a break, assass playing well this tier?

[glass junco]

depends on the content

its decent in m+, but sub and outlaw are better

and, as always, its very good in ST

[brisk zealot]

If you got a tank that will coordinate with you for restealths and good pulls for IC it can help fill that spec gap a lot

[digital zodiac]

Okay cool, so for Raid and Tyran weeks its decent,

But Outlaw/Sub might be the more go to choice for m+

[gusty mirage]

idk why people think outlaw is better for keys than assassination

outlaw has less utility and is squishier to do more dps

[thorny pond]

Shadow Dance is a defensive I mean

[gusty mirage]

is it?

[thorny pond]

It is

[gusty mirage]

wahoo

[thorny pond]

Soothing Darkness

[gusty mirage]

lmao

[thorny pond]

So Point for Outlul

[gusty mirage]

if people are worried about damage

no one would play outlaw

sub shits on outlaw in m+

[thorny pond]

Eh

[gusty mirage]

it does

there's no debate

it does better ST and better aoe than outlaw

[thorny pond]

Sub does more ST in raid but not every tank can stop chain pulling

then Sub sad

[obtuse ruin]

Not really

[gusty mirage]

sub is more than fine even without restealths

[glass junco]

Sub is omega boring in m+ tho

[gusty mirage]

versus what

[obtuse ruin]

You get one extra shadowstrike? Not a difference at all

[gusty mirage]

pressing blade flurry & doing your ST rotation?

wahoo

intriguing gameplay

[thorny pond]

It absolutely in

is

[glass junco]

at least I have a rotation, im looking at buffs, waiting for procs etc, there are more elements to outlaw's rotation, compared to sub in AoE

[gusty mirage]

I mean sure

[glass junco]

where you just press 2 buttons 90% of the time

[gusty mirage]

why not

and outlaw presses how many more?

[glass junco]

Im not saying that everyone should enjoy outlaw more or something like that

[gusty mirage]

rogues are so funny man

[thorny pond]

Sin has the most complex AoE by that measure and even that isn't anything extravagent

[glass junco]

dont get to pressed over it

so*

[gusty mirage]

we all pretend our spec is some complex thing

assassination rogues are like WOW WE BLEED THINGS

SO MUCH MORE SKILL

FoK -> Tab Target -> Rupture

[thorny pond]

Tab targeting hell

I have three braincells, two of which are macro'd to kicks and stuns

Don't make me count bleeds mang

[gusty mirage]

well you're already better than 99% of the players I've pugged with

becaus they have 0 braincells tied to interrupting/stunning

ran with a DH that had 4 interrupts

an entire dungeon

four

[thorny pond]

"Rogue, gouge!"

"Didn't spec it"

[lament warren]

restealths are probably least valuable for sub of all specs

in m+

[vestal wren]

but aoe

you need to multidot

[gusty mirage]

[frigid python]

Pandemic is 30%?

[thorny pond]

It's not AoE, just multi-single target

[gusty mirage]

yes

[frigid python]

Thank you

[gusty mirage]

anyway, back to poe

also @vestal wren why the fuck are sub rogues unironically playing wound poison in M+

[lament warren]

miss u oxi

[gusty mirage]

what is going on over there

[lament warren]

it’s good

i’ve done the math

[gusty mirage]

[lament warren]

“the math”

i picked out one random log

[vestal wren]

(lets just pretend this does not exist)

[gusty mirage]

you know what's better? the damage from instant poison and a tank playing sanguine not like shit

[lament warren]

and on that log wound is a 900k gain

well

[gusty mirage]

stop you'll get seli angry gain

[lament warren]

my tank was yoda and that shit still happened

sanguine just does that

[gusty mirage]

ah yes

mr. "class discords are full of idiots who are bad at the game telling other people how to play the game"

[lament warren]

huh

[thorny pond]

I will 7point KS a prio mob in sanguine

[gusty mirage]

[thorny pond]

do not test me Mr.Tank

[lament warren]

he’s right actually

that’s kinda true

[gusty mirage]

oh so you've been the other rogues I've played with?

[lament warren]

half the ppl i speak to here have done like 11s

and they talk about that perspective which is fair

[vestal wren]

https://clips.twitch.tv/PhilanthropicBeautifulOctopusJebaited-V4UFgVEfzzhkapzB

^ he is already firing the machine gun at subtlety

[thorny pond]

Tanks wanna yell at me

I will be aggressive asf

even if it is my key

[vapid stone]

im pretty new to assasination rogue should i run kings bane or the other one (i do alot of m+)

[gusty mirage]

dragontempered is a lot easier to stomach if you're brand new to the spec

[vapid stone]

okay

thanks

[thorny pond]

If sub is so cracked then why would I ignore that

Why would someone ignore 33% of a class

[gusty mirage]

same reason you ignore outlaw

you dirty one trick

[thorny pond]

Check my io

[lament warren]

it’s not that cracked

outlaw is better in almost every dungeon

[gusty mirage]

https://tenor.com/view/no-i-dont-think-i-will-captain-america-old-capt-gif-17162888

[thorny pond]

I have tried sub

[lament warren]

also ignoring specs is kinda based

[thorny pond]

I prefer my subs to be italian BMTs

[lament warren]

in the same way that playing all 3 is

but if you play 2/3 it’s just weird

[sand inlet]

What are the chances that sin will be supported in wowanalyzer this expansion? Is anyone working on it?

[thorny pond]

Sin logs are easy enough to read, just post them here

Law for keys, Sin for raids

[gusty mirage]

uh ngl about 0

everyone who has come in here to try to get it working

has disappeared into the night to never be seen again

[thorny pond]

sub is the hipster spec "yeah I play sub. hits vape"

[sand inlet]

Ya, it's just so convenient to be able to upload somewhere and have it spit out where you are being stupid.

[thorny pond]

We can do that for you

[subtle tundra]

Sub is extremely slept on idk why people even push as outlaw

[lament warren]

sub is overrated

[thorny pond]

What flavor juul you got?

[lament warren]

and too squishy

[subtle tundra]

Huh

[lament warren]

outlaw does everything and is more survivable

academy is an outlier

[gusty mirage]

because M+ rats are all outlaw one tricks

[lament warren]

that too

partially bc sub is almost never good

[thorny pond]

Why learn sub when they will never touch outlaw

all it takes is one bad day at Blizz HQ and they get Zul'd again

[digital zodiac]

We want fang embellishment on wep yeah?

[thorny pond]

Fang is cheaper

[subtle tundra]

I hope outlaw gets nerfed and everyone plays sub

I would play sub

[thorny pond]

you're funny

[subtle tundra]

I'm smart

[thorny pond]

Based and modest

these low pop realms suck

only two people can recraft on this entire fning realm

[ebon notch]

if you lie again

i will strike you off the face of the earth

[lament warren]

kinda feels nice on bigger realms tho

the crafting sucks but it’s cool to actually interact with people

[wide gazelle]

Any feelgood PvP builds?

[thorny pond]

#pvp

[subtle tundra]

I'm the smartest guy that can hear my thoughts

[ebon notch]

you type all your thoughts here bro wdym

[subtle tundra]

I don't think before typing here

[wide gazelle]

Tried that, but this is for spec discussion. does not say pve nor pvp.

[ebon notch]

if there's a pvp channel its for all things pvp

hence we dont discuss pvp outside of it

[vestal wren]

subtlety so cracked, moment

[cold rampart]

whats the best build for single with 4 set?

[vestal wren]

what line do you think is subtlety

[thorny pond]

less than 1%

[vestal wren]

of the 3 rogue specs

[eternal vortex]

0.4

[vestal wren]

na its the 2.3% one

nobody plays assassinaiton (outside of seli)

[pseudo hamlet]

How

[subtle tundra]

0.4% be like 5 players

[pseudo hamlet]

is DTB compared to KB in M+ scenarios?

[subtle tundra]

I will strike you

[vestal wren]

but the point is, if subtlety is so cracked/op

[eternal vortex]

im in the 0.4 gang

[vestal wren]

why is it like 4% of dps specs

when outlaw is 4 times that

[gusty mirage]

[vestal wren]

in high keys

[thorny pond]

Sub utility is obviously trash duh

[vestal wren]

also sorry varas probably does too

[subtle tundra]

I will strike you

[vestal wren]

and cev, oxi, makeit (i assume)

[cold rampart]

whats the best build for single with 4 set?

[pallid bough]

I mean it’s the same argument about why people play Outlaw on Council (albeit it’s a joke of a boss) over Sub

[subtle tundra]

Just havent had time to push over 20

[pallid bough]

Sub definitely out performs

[thorny pond]

Pins matte

[vestal wren]

i think subtlety performs rly well in academy

[eternal vortex]

Seli also made a point about it yesterday stream ppl playing comfort no?

[vestal wren]

don't think it outperforms always

[pallid bough]

Talking about raid

For 4 target

[pseudo hamlet]

I am playing DTB in M+ and the DPS seems low. May be a skill issue, but that wasn't happening in SL.
And by low I mean like ~40-45k in keys such as Jade Serpent or Academy. Compared to mages it's not that high...

[vestal wren]

wcl statistics

was first 3 bosses for a week

now its on 4 for a bit more than a day

[lament warren]

sub is just not that good for most dungeons

[subtle tundra]

It is low

[vestal wren]

3rd boss is council

so 4 target sustained cleave

[pallid bough]

Yeah idk why people opted to play outlaw

Over sub

[cold rampart]

where does this build stand with 4pc?

[pallid bough]

Sub is giga dam

[vestal wren]

so ye... if subtlety would be bad in statistics with literally 3 bosses and one of them is 4 target cleave

[pallid bough]

Xd

[vestal wren]

it would be... weird

[pseudo hamlet]

You mean like assa DPS is low or what lol

[lament warren]

because it’s a relatively niche fact that vv 4 targets is where sub outperforms

and also when the difference is so close nobody cares

[subtle tundra]

Yours is

[lament warren]

also it’s a fallover boss in a fallover tier

doesn’t matter what you play

[pseudo hamlet]

Can you help me then?

[pallid bough]

Yeah ig that is also true

Boss is irrelevant

Doesn’t really matter

[subtle tundra]

I'm not good at the game sorry

I just watched zero

[pseudo hamlet]

understandable, will ask someone else then

[vestal wren]

i mean, i won't lie

rogue in general performs well

and some others (e.g. sv hunter) don't seem to do that good

[eternal vortex]

sv hunter

they lived their dream for like 1-2 patch then bb

[pseudo hamlet]

Anyone know any good Assa rogue that does M+ and maybe stream or have video guides?

[eternal vortex]

Seliathan

he is streaming rn

[pseudo hamlet]

Thanks, will watch him 😄

[cold rampart]

is this good with 4pc?

[eternal vortex]

there are a few builds in pins

for 4pc

[prisma cypress]

what are people using their sparks on?

[hot goblet]

Cowl and Lariat i suspect

[prisma cypress]

what about the additional ones

[eternal vortex]

weapon

cowl only if u have the ring aswell no?

[vestal wren]

only with ring, correct

[neon oxide]

Spark on weapon too, x2 if you can

and then use additional sparks to flex off-set pieces that suck

[cold rampart]

guys when playing with DTB EXANG NO CTTC

should i deathmark/vanish on cd?

• 2nd exang on cd ?

[brisk zealot]

I believe vanish/deathmark on cd is fine if you don't have a buff coming soon. Hold exang for (right before) deathmark as it basically doubles it. Only use Exang without DM if the encounter will end before DM comes off cooldown

[storm onyx]

If you are not missing a cast, you delay 2nd Exsan to bake in to DM at 4 min mark

[cold rampart]

cant

exsan is 3 min

dm/vanish will be ready

when exsan needs 1 more min

[kind summit]

Embellishments.... Bronze Grip or Fang?? Assuming bronze is better for single while fang for overall??

[storm onyx]

Exsan is 3 min CD, it will be up around 3min mark

You delay it to 4min mark to use before DM

That is unless the fight ends before that

[ruby lotus]

also if the fight is more then 6 mins you ship it on CD cause itll line up naturrally again @ 6 mins

otherwise youll lose a use

[brisk zealot]

Unless if the fight goes to 7 minutes, then you can use it on its own at the end if you were holding for DM

Breaking News alert: Exang is a messy and annoying ability

[dark token]

Eh I think a usage of 0 mins (with dm), 3 mins (solo), 6 mins (with dm, in execute) is better

Than just sending it at 7 min solo

[brisk zealot]

If counting DM uses as a 2x multiplier you're getting 5 exsangs either way

[devout prism]

They're both only tiny damage increases (like 0.9%) so if you wanna make your life easier just craft the items without them so it's easier to get higher rank craft, and then make a flaring cowl later with eranog ring

[cold rampart]

so i use exsan with the 3rd mark?

[winter hawk]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[storm onyx]

If the fight duration is suitable for that yes

[brisk zealot]

Really it all depends on fight length. If less than 6 minutes, always save for DM. If between 6 and 7 minutes, use Exang on CD. If 7 minutes, use either method. At 8, save for DM.

[cold rampart]

@storm onyx @brisk zealot ty all

[brisk zealot]

The real moral of the story is to take a different talent and accept the small dps loss in bliss lol

[lament warren]

the apl sends exsang on cd, correct?

[royal lantern]

tbf, it doesnt change shit for crafting lol

like, with or without.embelishment, you need that inspiriation proc for t5 anyway

that added 30-15difficulty doesnt change that lmao

[teal bloom]

@lament warren I'm pretty sure apl sends/holds cds based on time fight time left, like it would hold exsang for 3rd deathmark in 5min fight

[cyan wharf]

Out of curiosity, if you drop exsang where would you put that extra talent

[glass junco]

Where can I ask for a log analysis?

!log

aha

[royal lantern]

double shiv/master assassin

[cyan wharf]

I have double shiv, is master assassin worth over say like tiny toxic blade or a point in vicious venoms

I'm just not vibing with the extra button and CD management of exsang so genuinely trying to figure out what is worthwhile in place of it

[brisk zealot]

I think TTB comes out over Vicious Venom but not sure how TTB compares to Master Assassin. Exsang tends to be my go-to to switch when I want Crimson Tempest

[cyan wharf]

I'll have to sim on some dummies and see. it could be a pretty insignificant difference in the long run.

between TTB and Master Assassin that is

[brisk zealot]

Also brings me back to a question I posed earlier about Master Assassin. If when using it instead of Vanish -> Garrote -> Exsang -> DM how it would compare to Exsang -> DM -> Vanish and holding in stealth for a few seconds so the crit bonus applies to the full Exsang duration

[thorny pond]

Not worth

[thorny pond]

Probably a wash, but VV will gain value with Blindside procs. I think VV is like .5% ahead iirc

[cyan wharf]

Interesting. I wish there was a way for me to grab both points of VV without sacrificing something

[thorny pond]

for ST?

[cyan wharf]

Yea

[brisk zealot]

I was just doing napkin math with my last boss chart (Eranog) and Ambush + Mut did about 6% dps so adding 10% makes it a 0.6% increase, maybe a bit more because nature damage. Shiv was 0.2% so +500% is about a full 1% increase. But that could just have been how that specific fight rolled out

[thorny pond]

Just copy one of the builds w/o exsang. DTB and KB both have builds posted without exsang

[thorny pond]

Do numbers based on damage done, don't percent percents

For your example: Take Shiv damage * 5 compared against Mut + Ambush damage * .2

[strange python]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[strange python]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[devout prism]

Yeah but rerolling with an embellishment takes more mettle for the crafter than non embellished stuff

[thorn crater]

sigh trying to play sub is hard for me and i dno why. i dno if im missing macros or youth reactoin or whta

i keep messing up the simple things and missing windows with tornado

its easier to multidot and keep track of bleed duration than to spam 2 buttons

i dontk now why

[royal lantern]

cus you are not used to the spec and never played it for more then 1hour

like, muscle memory alone is like 80%in wow

[thorn crater]

ive spent like 4 hours hitting a doll

still isnt clicking

[brisk zealot]

I had neither VV or TTB for that fight so these are both done based on adding only 1 point to either.
Shiv did 30.3k damage, so x6 is 181.8k, so +151.5k Damage.
Mut+Amb was 946k, so x1.13 (extra 0.03 for armor bypass) is 1068.98k, or +122.98k damage.

[thorn crater]

guess i need to run 4s and 5s keys

[royal lantern]

in my expirience

[thorn crater]

till i figure it out

[royal lantern]

just do some 14-15 keys

and it starts going fine after some

[thorn crater]

im gonna be laughed into oblivion bruh

prolly better to start with lowers

and just improve the dps

[devout prism]

If you're running really low keys it's harder to get a feel for it because things die too fast

[thorn crater]

queue up for an 8

oh look a 403 rogue that should be good

do 20k overall

lol

[royal lantern]

blame lag

[thorn crater]

i think i need someone to walk me through it cause i aint geettin it

unless there are macros that make this playable

that people are using

ive tried asking for basic things in sub chat, people there are WILD

imagine been told go look at faq when faq explains nothing for a newbie

[cyan wharf]

so the TTB is going to give more value in the long run is what I'm reading right lol

[thorny pond]

no

But like, is this AoE build then? I don't understand

where this thought experiment came from

[cyan wharf]

I'm strictly going for ST and want to drop Exsang from my rotation

[thorny pond]

Then you can't even get to TTB without VV

like this is a non-starter

[cyan wharf]

Flying daggers is an option to get down to kingsbane as well and only a 1 point which gives you the flexible 1 point of removing exsang

[thorny pond]

Yea, that's dumb man

Just run the sims

[cyan wharf]

true

but having a small buff to the amount of cleave isn't horrible

it also doesn't force you into a 2 point investment if you don't want to

[thorn crater]

uhm

the FD route is valid

but you need to swap the poison talents for shiv and venom rush

[thorn crater]

that way dropping VV doesnt hurt as much

at the end of the day

it depends on ur secondaries

whether you have 2p 4p etc

[cyan wharf]

this is where I'm at right now

with my one point floating from no exsang

sorry minus the 1 vv

[thorn crater]

im confused

why take FD then

[thorny pond]

Yea, again, this is a non-starter. You've thought experimented yourself into a corner

[cyan wharf]

yea I realize that now lmao

I'm so tired man

[thorny pond]

Because now the choice becomes BS vs TTB

[thorn crater]

do u have 4 piece?

[cyan wharf]

No

[thorn crater]

do u have 2 piece?

[cyan wharf]

nah, I'm still working on gear

[thorn crater]

then why on gods green earth does this matter at this point?

its prolly safer to go with DTB and ease into the rest

if u want to play with KB

just take the poison nodes

[thorny pond]

If you are trying to avoid complexity, then yea DTB

[thorn crater]

its more than just complexity

[eternal vortex]

17 SBG

[thorny pond]

and Sangreal is right, if you're KB, then skipping poison nodes is a loss

[thorn crater]

i mena

even if u are DTB skipping poison nodes is a loss XD

[cyan wharf]

I enjoy the KB play, and just really wanted to drop exsang is all man, I dug myself into corner

[thorny pond]

His whole scenario was coked up because he doesn't want exsang

[thorn crater]

he has no bleed 4p

use the base DTB build that is suggested

then remove scoundrel and DTB and take KB

problme solved

everything else u can get is a bonus

[pastel onyx]

Happy new year my fellow assa enjoyers

Wait my nitro died

[thorn crater]

hold on

[oak sky]

Wait what the poison nodes are literally better for dtb than kb

[thorny pond]

Shiv combos with KB

More poison apps = more KB damage

TTB has no synergy, it's just making shiv show up two spots higher on your details

[oak sky]

Fact

[thorn crater]

ok so

if u wanna play KB with no exsang

[brisk zealot]

Don't think Fatal Concoction is worth it though, unless it's poorly worded and actually does apply to KB

[thorny pond]

So take that one point

[thorn crater]

try one of these two i guess?

[thorny pond]

and put it somewhere else

[thorn crater]

sim those two for u together with DTB full poison

[thorny pond]

Just move it to MA

[thorn crater]

whichever comes ahead use it

[thorny pond]

That's been the play forever. Don't want exsang? Take MA

[cyan wharf]

Can confirm Fatal does boost KB, unless details is just stupid

[brisk zealot]

Interesting, might have to play around with that at some point, though losing the points in Bloody Mess wouldn't be good unless it's entirely single target

[umbral flint]

Hey guys, happy new year!

After what key level on fortified is assa viable?

[thick bay]

vers>haste or vers>mastery?

[brisk zealot]

I'd say just at whatever level your tank stops chain pulling so you can restealth

[limpid ermine]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[dim yacht]

the worst is when they chain pull right before the mob in your current pack dies, so you stay back for a few seconds to try and not get in combat, but then he kites towards you anyway

[ebon notch]

Just play nelf

Easy combat break

[agile talon]

Playing DTB for raids but i want a second Shadowstep. What should i move around?

[steel sorrel]

some builds in pinned have it I think, try them out

[agile talon]

I only see 4p/2p/mythic so i didn't know. I think one says to take a point from zold for shadowstep though.

[steel sorrel]

You can import them and compare, if you arent fuzzy about min maxing do that and gg 🙂

[sterile chasm]

Hello

what is the ideal place to make 3rd spark?

I have lariat and will craft weapon

[hot goblet]

can anyone explain why on 3/4 targets cleave, Kingsbane is stronger than double poisons? Yet every other fight it is better to have double poisons? I can't work it out in my head

[brisk zealot]

My guess would be because of Zoldyck since you would try to have bleeds maintained on all targets

[true thorn]

@balmy condor i got the 4pc last night, trying out m plus today and its a lot better with the 4c pc kingsbane build, was doing on avg 65-70k DPS

prior was doing 55-60k dps

[steel sorrel]

Well, amp poison only applies on one target and give best dmg if you use envenom. On 4 target cleave your prio isnt envenom, so KB is a button you press vs envenom a button you only press to get snd extended. Hence better sims 🙂

[true thorn]

i believe you're still envenoming below 6 targets

but yeah you're spending more globals on bleeds

[steel sorrel]

If you look at council logs dmg spread you will see what I mean 🙂

[royal lantern]

yes, but council is a really special fight

not normal aoe stuff

[balmy condor]

Yap

[steel sorrel]

Yes but he specificly asked about 3-4 target cleave..

[royal lantern]

almost as if the 4set boosts our bleed dmg by 20%,and bleeds are 90%of assa rogues m+ aoe dmg

[grim tangle]

90% is an insane exaggeration

[royal lantern]

well yes, thats the point of an exaggeration

[brazen zodiac]

xd

[hot goblet]

I guess thats pretty relevant, the builds are based on full gear. So if you haven't got 4 set, perhaps the maths changes

Heres another question. What damage profile are you looking at on eranog. Focus on the single target? or go Dungeon Slice/Mythic+ because of the ad phase

[oak sky]

Just go single target

Sbs will help with prio cleave

[balmy condor]

Assassination doesn’t care about adds

[royal lantern]

i put a spear on the big add and then ignored it

on normal/heroic? lmao adds

[hot goblet]

So my thinking:
Eranog - Single
Terros - Single
Primal - 4 Way Cleave
Sennarth - Dungeon
Dathea - Single
Kurog - 2 Way Cleave
Broodkeeper - Dungeon
Raszageth - ??? Not actually downed it yet 😄

[royal lantern]

razageth is ST aswell for assa

and broodkeeper aswell

you wont do adds as assassination

same with sennarth

like, if you play assassination, play to your strenghts, aka Single target

[viscid spear]

As a Frost Mage I just go Cleave for every fight besides Terros

[royal lantern]

and not shity aoe that you cant do anyway

[flint pond]

race changing shouldn't bug anything right? not like server transfering?

[balmy condor]

Eranog - Single
Terros - Single
Primal - 4 Way Cleave
Sennarth - Single
Dathea - Single
Kurog - 2 Way Cleave
Broodkeeper - Single
Raszageth - Single

And kurog only 2 target on mythic

On non-mythic it’s single target

[royal lantern]

wowlogs can be funky for a while

[urban mantle]

For Raid and Mythic plus assassin use the same stats priority right? just switch trinkets if needed

[flint pond]

ye want to race change for that fat war stomp

[steel sedge]

How do you guys feel about Primary stat / Crit for Inscribed Diamond

[thorny pond]

Yep

rogues like

[quiet fiber]

What missive would be best for elemental lariat?

[steel sedge]

I did crit mastery

[quiet fiber]

Thats what I was thinking

[steel sedge]

sucks for outlaw but rip rather have for ass

[thick bay]

is lariat bis for pvp?

no way it is right?

[true thorn]

no you need the pvp neck

for the versatility or you goina die

[thick bay]

makes sense yeh

[charred raptor]

For garrotes that are applied from stealth, I let them fall off and not pandemic them with a regular garrote, right?

[brisk zealot]

Yeah, otherwise you'll overwrite the empowerment

[charred raptor]

I thought so. I'm also close to closing in on my concentrated infusion. Should I just get Lariat upgraded or empower my daggers first?

[royal lantern]

mainhand weapons are BY FAR the most important slot soooo.....

[subtle tundra]

Un mmmmm happy new year!!!!!!!!!

[potent forge]

in the DTB opener, where would you puzzble box

no exsang

[woeful meteor]

before deathmark

[charred raptor]

That's where I was using it before I got H Grieftorch.

Since both puzzle and guzzle line up with DM, seems natural to use them before the burst window.

[glass junco]

do people usually look at log reviews?

[brazen zodiac]

yes!!!!!!!! happy!!!!

i love the crafting system being bugged and it being such a huge part of the xpac

[lean fossil]

@balmy condor did they ever fix how echo worked for us? sorry i havent been tracking it

[balmy condor]

What’s to fix

[lean fossil]

wasnt it procing of our leech and not dmg?

[balmy condor]

Nah that ended up being a rumor, the actual way it works is that random abilities will heal like ambush

[brazen zodiac]

sup whisp

[balmy condor]

Sims reflect it and actually were under simming before

[lean fossil]

ok sweet, so i can get rid of the fang and take wraps instead 😄

[balmy condor]

I mean they’re about the same

I wouldn’t bother swapping

[ancient peak]

There’s no interactions for assa with the eranog ring other than the crafted helm right?

And I’m guessing that helm probably isn’t worth crafting until you’ve got the mythic ring and all mythic non head tier pieces

[woeful meteor]

Think so for Sin, but you can Sim it to make sure

[dim shoal]

I mean if you have low ilvl helm and 4 Set without helm

Probably Not a Bad Craft

Even without the Ring

[fervent fog]

Happy New Years to all the Sin' God 🙂

[cloud moat]

How does the Flare Cowl sim in M+ pulls without the ring

[balmy condor]

not good

[cloud moat]

Surely better than Fangs?

[balmy condor]

not noticeably so

but yeh, a little

[cloud moat]

That's a bit surprising

[balmy condor]

I mean the helmet is shit

is it that surprising?

it's one purpose in life is to enable a ring

[cloud moat]

Does the damage it deals get capped or spread

[balmy condor]

I believe it's split

[cloud moat]

Oof

Does the ring have an internal cd

[marble hemlock]

everytime you read smth that makes you think "this sounds insane in aoe" compared to smth that only procs on one target, odds are they both do the same damage in aoe

[cloud moat]

So true but I want to keep dreaming

What spec have you lads ran on Rasza Heroic/Mythic or have you just switched to Sub

Assa feels a little bit janky on that fight because of the intermission phases. I guess the DTB mythic talents could be solid for the fight but I haven't tried it out yet

[frank stone]

nvm

[balmy condor]

kingsbane

[crisp shard]

If you are running Assa on Rasza its for shield and execute so KB

[normal mist]

Happy new year my doods

[royal lantern]

go vulpera, change the racial to fire dmg, be a stupid idiot that uses the vulpera racial for dmg instead of healing

[dark token]

Sub

If you don't play sub play kingsbane

If you don't play sub or kingsbane play outlaw

Under no circumstances go IC

[balmy condor]

BUT THE PADDDDDDDDDD

[cloud moat]

Good point. Just feels bad to watch the damage meters after wiping before the last phase

[remote oak]

Does anyone know if cold blood snapshots on bleeds like CT or if it just bolsters the initial damage

[balmy condor]

cold blood does nothing for dot damage

[outer cairn]

All you toxic ass rogues, thieves, beggars, and scallywags. Happy New Year. Keep that yellow bar at the top and remind them that rogues do it from behind

[lavish linden]

what are the best embellishments

[outer cairn]

Hold second Exsang for first shield?

[balmy condor]

lariat and flaring cowl with the ring

if you don't have the ring, take fang on a dagger

[balmy condor]

yeah or just don't run exsang

[lavish linden]

ok i clearly dont have the ring but what ring?

[outer cairn]

KB with Exsang sims at my highest currently.

I like playing KB though

[balmy condor]

first boss diurna ring

flaring cowl is the proc that enables the effect

[balmy condor]

yeah but you would have to play exsang

a little unfortunate

[outer cairn]

You’re basically safe to run fangs and lariat until you’re killing mythic eranog. Then when you get ring you can make the switch

[outer cairn]

But we love extra buttons

It’s the rogue way

[lavish linden]

ok i understand better now but what ring

[outer cairn]

Honestly need to relook at the difference between dtb bleed a/out Exsang and the kb Exsang build. I think it’s not even a 1% diff

[subtle tundra]

When is your new year

In 4h?

[balmy condor]

6 hours

6pm atm

[subtle tundra]

Ah

[royal lantern]

wait

[subtle tundra]

Just like Cali

[royal lantern]

that means whispyr is from the past

[balmy condor]

how is this not clear?

[royal lantern]

[outer cairn]

It’s 9pm here. I’m fucking tired

[royal lantern]

3am

and im doing keys

[lavish linden]

ok thanks

[outer cairn]

Is he from the past or is he so far in the future that he’s just behind us?

Things that keep people awake at night

[undone eagle]

Guys a little stupid question, but does the meaning ''beckon order'' on sophic writ & ''harness order'' on sophic devotion have any difference? I know that the primary stat difference is about 200~ but the ''beckon'' and ''harness'' thing? does it have any meaning?

when i read the enchant

[outer cairn]

Uh

[balmy condor]

bro what

[outer cairn]

Do you have a crafted dagger at 405

Or higher

[balmy condor]

this dude reading tooltips

[undone eagle]

im just curious, u never know 😂

yea i got one 418 and one 405

[viscid spear]

[outer cairn]

Then just our devotion 3 on it

Put

[undone eagle]

yea but since im not very pro english i just wonder if the words have any meaning except the primary stat difference?

[outer cairn]

It does. I’m translating for you. Devotion 3

[balmy condor]

yeah you know, now that you mention it, why is our crafted dagger called "primal" molten shortblade. I thought we were fighting the primalists?

[royal lantern]

all raidsets is cultist armor

[undone eagle]

but fr... not capping br0o

[outer cairn]

Cause rogues steal things?

[royal lantern]

and the weapons are stuff made out of elemental energy

[undone eagle]

as i mentioned

stupid question right

[outer cairn]

So we are Captain Azeroth

[pulsar fog]

We are killing primalists and taking their clothes

[undone eagle]

just wanted a clear answer

since idk if this shit has any impact

[royal lantern]

i mean, yeha