assassination

[mystic gate]

yo why dont we use exang on deathmark ?

[blazing totem]

cuz then you are cutting your deathmark short

you want your bleeds to be duplicated during deathmark and with exsang you can squeeze in more of those duplicated bleeds

so you use it right before casting DM

[slim hamlet]

Its ~-10% dmg decrease to use on dm

[midnight atlas]

Does exang affect sepsis?

[meager granite]

DM into exsang will be the noob bait of the expac

[little forge]

So what is the interaction if you have both off cd? Pandemic bleeds - exsang - deathmark in that order?

[copper hazel]

im sure there will be plenty of log check threads where people are DM > exsanging

[midnight atlas]

Ty, im blind

[night delta]

Which will realistically only happen in opener anyway

With exsang 45s CD

[little forge]

I'm trying to find comfy keybinds for this all, but there's so many

[slim hamlet]

There definitely is

[meager granite]

We should create a weak aura where if you exsang with DM. Huge "YOU SUCK" appears on the screen

[little forge]

I think I count 16 spells I need to keybind for just dps in M+ specc

[slim hamlet]

I would download that

[night delta]

Yeah it feels a bit overboard

Contrast with evoker spellcount x)

[meager granite]

And until you cast exsang or DM in opener " will you be dumb this time again?"

And with a fail counter

[night delta]

Now this is peak WA

[slim hamlet]

fail counter

[night delta]

Add it to Raid tools wipe counter

[storm onyx]

They should just let Exsang lower DM cd relatively too, then no brainer!

[slim hamlet]

Eh

No

Because of KB

[night delta]

"You've wiped 45 times on this encounter, and played like a scrub 20 times"

[slim hamlet]

But it's not very often you're even able to fuck it up because of the 45 sec cd anyways

[night delta]

Confluence comes back at a whopping 6 mins

[meager granite]

"you don't know the opener. Go on ravenholdt and ask Whyspir by pinging him"

[slim hamlet]

epic

Don't know what your special first word in that sentence means

[copper hazel]

can we make it auto tab to discord and do this?

[slim hamlet]

But I can guess the meaning

[night delta]

When celestial bodies align

[slim hamlet]

Damn

nerd

[night delta]

[little forge]

Only if I actually play well enough to cast it on cd and don't mess up before then 😛

[blazing totem]

pretty sure some people gonna hold exsang for next DM anyways

perfect sync

[slim hamlet]

Whispyr made a sim with the diff

if you hold or not

And it was not pretty

on CD was quite a bit better

[blazing totem]

I dont doubt that

just saying that people who exsang DM will also hold exsang for it

[violet jackal]

What was the difference if never casted?

[night delta]

Give 👏 exsang 👏 2 min 👏 CD

[random fossil]

[copper hazel]

yeh big problem with that tree

its sub

[blazing totem]

sorry to tell you

[night delta]

This is a sick sin spec

[blazing totem]

thats not assa

[swift scarab]

wrong ss xD

[violet jackal]

Exsanguinate should be 30 seconds which will increase the amp by another 3 points 😈

[random fossil]

Subtlety more like subpar

[normal trout]

which class is bis for pve?

[copper hazel]

all of them

[blazing totem]

retri pala

[normal trout]

I can play subt in pve?

[swift scarab]

https://imgur.com/a/qZM69rB

[mystic gate]

so how exang is supposed to be used ? after deathmark with ic and vanish for imp garrot ?

[night delta]

At this point just ask for a passive +100% bleed expiration rate

[copper hazel]

yes

[strange python]

Warlock

[normal trout]

And is good?

Wtf

[strange python]

Warlock has been the best class in the game for 15 years

But you can play any class you want and be fine.

[slim hamlet]

Before deathmark

[slim hamlet]

And then on CD

[violet jackal]

I was a big fan of both shadowlands tier effects

[mystic gate]

oh that sounds more reasonable ty

[violet jackal]

I wish the shiv one was a capstone or talent under indrisimibate carnage

[balmy condor]

Need to take blindside, amp poison, and shrouded

Sbs also highly recommended

[night delta]

Shiv 2p in some form would be fine, prop up our aoe a bit

[slim hamlet]

Is blindside like a lot better than tiny toxic?

[balmy condor]

Yes

[slim hamlet]

Damn

[balmy condor]

About 3x better

[slim hamlet]

well damn

Weird keybind it is

[random fossil]

F1 for ambush

[little forge]

Im debating replacing my kick keybind with ambush, but I probably shouldnt

[copper hazel]

alt + tilde for ambush for me

[slim hamlet]

I just use an alt modifier to my mutilate keybind

But I never really use alt so a bit weird

[random fossil]

1 mut alt 1 fok F1 ambush

Come at me

[slim hamlet]

F1 is cursed

[night delta]

Alt + F4 is all the rage

[little forge]

I rebound caps lock to shift. Makes it easier to press

[night delta]

You should try

[slim hamlet]

I can't even use it for mounting

[random fossil]

I got big hands I guess

[little forge]

Some keyboards have really small gaps to f keys some have big ones also

[night delta]

Sausage fingers gang

[slim hamlet]

Mine are not that far, but I just can't press them

[quick chasm]

!ui

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/LuxthosRogueDragonflight (Luxthos's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[slim hamlet]

My 1-5 Is utility/cds too

can't press them and move man

[random fossil]

Just don't move

DPS loss from not strafing in melee is minimal I'm sure

[thorn crater]

this a bait? 😛

[night delta]

Props of having fucked up left hand coordination : no need to headscratch over keybinds

[slim hamlet]

I don'tt strafe

Just

I can't explain ok

[willow rapids]

don't strafe? not a true melee player

[slim hamlet]

I already hurt my hands enough playing this class

[strange python]

Tell your groups you didn't talent into kick and hope they don't notice

[slim hamlet]

The one thing I will never change is kick keybind

Went on X automatically when I started

Never going anywhere else

[strange python]

X is for crimson vial

[slim hamlet]

Wrong

Shift+x is crimson vial

Close tho

[strange python]

Shift x is door of shadows

For another week

[slim hamlet]

DoS aint even on my bar

anymore

[pulsar apex]

heya. Been Outlaw-ing for a long while now - want to work on my Assassination stuff. Do i HAVE to go Exanguin?

[strange python]

Kick is 6

[slim hamlet]

Basically

[royal lantern]

yes

🙂

[slim hamlet]

Think it's like 6-7% if not more

[royal lantern]

all content, all situations, exsang

🙂

pain

[slim hamlet]

🙂

[strange python]

Depends. If you're playing casually and just want to fuck around, no. If you want to maximize your output, yes.

[pulsar apex]

ok time to put my big boy pants on and get my head around it.

[royal lantern]

the move is

you dont

[strange python]

[royal lantern]

because its just "mut mut rupture garrote exsang"

congratz, thats the BIG EXSANG ROTATION CHANGES some bigbrains here sometimes talk about

🙂

[slim hamlet]

"sometimes"

It's like 50% of the messages

[royal lantern]

and 80%of them are trolling

[slim hamlet]

If you don't count shittalk

[royal lantern]

and thats not good btw

[slim hamlet]

If you count shittalk its 90%

[strange python]

Exsang is a little bit annoying when it lines up with DM still

[royal lantern]

hiding actuall disatifaction behind trolling makes it look better then it actually is 🙂

[pulsar apex]

but then "out" of that mode and for the next 45 seconds I play "normal" dot/pandemic stuff?

[royal lantern]

yes

you play normal

[slim hamlet]

Like when you make a joke about something you're sad about 🙂

Laugh the tears away 🙂

[royal lantern]

and when exsang is coming up, you litearlly re-apply your bleeds no matter the timer, exsang them just to re-apply again in 10seconds

[slim hamlet]

"no matter the timer" is legit NO MATTER THE TIMER

30 sec you click it again it seems

[pulsar apex]

ok so its normal mode and then throw those rules away because exang is coming up... rinse repeat. except with a LOT of cooldowns.

[slim hamlet]

Yep

[royal lantern]

yep

[pulsar apex]

ok i can do this

[slim hamlet]

Throw it in the bin

[royal lantern]

nice ability btw

oh and if you mix it up with DM once

congratz, you now do no dmg

[peak bobcat]

My boys

[slim hamlet]

➡️ 🚮

[peak bobcat]

it will be okay

[subtle kiln]

throwing my hard work into the bin.

[slim hamlet]

I made an aheago version of this, but I've been to scared to put it in here

[pulsar apex]

im sure wishpyr has a detailed write up on the playstyles and prios - are they live on wowhead yet?

[strange python]

No

[slim hamlet]

I fear I won't be able to live with myself

[copper hazel]

Soon ™️

[pulsar apex]

i thought his "why play and why not to play" was really well written.

espcially compared to some others.

[subtle tundra]

exsang is cool

just press the button

[peak bobcat]

Just play the game

[royal lantern]

his favorite playstyle is "i wish that thing would not exist"

[peak bobcat]

it will be okay

[strange python]

He missed one key point tho

If you play sin you won't be a clown pirate

[slim hamlet]

All the greatness of sin will shadow exsangs dirtyness

[royal lantern]

the correct name is "yahtzee pirate"

[gusty mirage]

you mean cutthroat highwayman?

[royal lantern]

robber in liquidation

[gusty mirage]

[marble hemlock]

No.

[subtle kiln]

[strange python]

Oxi orange name?!

We're all doomed

[gusty mirage]

[strange python]

Hunter emote...

[narrow adder]

any takes on why crimson tempest doesn't proc venomous wounds?

[royal lantern]

because then we would litearlly have infinite energy on multiple targets with a normal rotational button

[copper hazel]

energy oversaturation

[royal lantern]

and it would probs be played on ST?

[narrow adder]

fair enough

[subtle tundra]

we'd have 60 apm

[narrow adder]

I haven't really looked at sin for DF.

I play rogue to get carpel tunnel, I thought that was the upside.

[subtle tundra]

58 apm with basically no off-gcd abilities and 1sec gcd is pretty spammy

[narrow adder]

Love it.

[subtle tundra]

no ty

[narrow adder]

But not really.

[subtle tundra]

outlaw and sub can have the apm

[narrow adder]

I played sin S1 and enjoyed it, but felt like it just needed some more energy for sustained AOE to keep up, but things have obviously changed.

[subtle tundra]

assa has always been energy saturated in aoe

what do you mean

[narrow adder]

I'd just run out of CT's to keep up if stuff didn't die too quickly, just in my own experience.

[subtle tundra]

because you were playing wrong

[narrow adder]

Coulda been.

[subtle tundra]

not coulda

you were

running out of energy in aoe means youre playing wrong

[narrow adder]

I just had rupture on everything, and garrotes. It was a while ago. Could have just been gear issues or w/e.

[copper hazel]

did you have poisons on

[narrow adder]

That must have been it.

[subtle tundra]

you wont notice gear in your gameplay almost never

[slim hamlet]

The only gameplay I care about is the dps meter

so wrong

[neat plank]

what professions are you guys gonna be 🙂 gonna go herb alch to make dps pots less costly

[slim hamlet]

On main prob engi + alch

[drifting light]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Evaluation Spreadsheet: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz

[subtle tundra]

im a professional bitch

[spice spire]

That’s true

[ebon notch]

Also you suck xoxo

[subtle tundra]

aaaaaaaa

[shy dust]

True all m+ers are bad

[slim hamlet]

what and also why

[young knot]

Assas good in pvp?

[slim hamlet]

#pvp is prob better at answering, but it seems above average atleast

[shy dust]

Watch them discuss anything

That’ll show you enough

[slim hamlet]

So it was just bait?

[young knot]

What race yall play as rogue ?

[balmy condor]

m+ers are apes

[shy dust]

^

[young knot]

True

[shy dust]

Watch them discuss anything gameplay related and they live and die by how things feel

[slim hamlet]

belf

[balmy condor]

orc and dark iron are seemingly the best dps but it's really close, just play whatever you think looks cool

[young knot]

I'm tauren but the rogue gear looks so goofy

[slim hamlet]

How weird

that tauren has goofy gear

Highmountain Tauren is still the most rogue race

[young knot]

I honestly thought they would look stealthier

[slim hamlet]

???

It's legit a bigass cow

[strange python]

ayoo

assasin got mega buffed

to heaven

permament DoTs

[slim hamlet]

?

[strange python]

and exsang dmg is to 5000% dmg

[slim hamlet]

New buffs?

[strange python]

nah

just kididng around

[slim hamlet]

Got insta jebaited

[strange python]

just

[subtle tundra]

wanna fight

[strange python]

to be excited

[desert shard]

(yo don't tell anyone but I just spent like 2h on a target dummy and I'd honestly rather play exsang the entire xpac than sub lol)

[next edge]

whats the problem with sub tho

[desert shard]

doesn't gel with me

[balmy condor]

sorry what did you say? I can't hear you through the laminated glass that separates me from the gorilla exhibit

[dawn merlin]

I'm enjoying sub quite a lot, haven't really touched it the past couple of years

not very different but feels a bit more polished

[next edge]

Im actually loving sub

[subtle tundra]

woof woof

[next edge]

might play it for DF

[spice spire]

That’s my line

[dawn merlin]

sin is usually my go-to every time it is competitive, but the playstyle does feel a bit convoluted to me atm

[burnt star]

Fun part of rogue. 3 different way of stabbbingg

[subtle tundra]

except one shoots

[spice spire]

How so?

[subtle tundra]

and is annoying

[slim hamlet]

[spice spire]

A button you use when it’s up, very convoluted

There was a song about it

[slim hamlet]

[dawn merlin]

can't really explain it as it is highly subjective, the spec's flow just feels off to me

might take some getting used to

[spice spire]

That’s fair, for me it did take some getting used to

[stuck knoll]

[spice spire]

[viscid spear]

Stab, poison, bleed, ragglefraggle, Mutilate

Easy

[next edge]

For me sub feels really nice honestly

and the new gameplay seems a bit less punishing

also, seems really good on AoE and 4 targets, and pretty decent on cleave and st

not top tier but fine enough

[somber fractal]

yeah it feels really bad to play imo. ive spent enough time on the dummy where im doing it right, but just sending things on cooldown is a feelsbad.

also can't properly test the kingsbane opener on live right now

sub will for sure be my AoE spec

[thorn crater]

i konw what you mean

but it makes such a huge difference to be 70

until i got in teh beta nothing made sense

[little forge]

Legitimately thinking of being a dark iron dwarf for +5 blacksmithing

[thorn crater]

even to take ER you have to skip something which changes the playstyle which in turn changes the whole

[thorn crater]

it aint worth it

that +5 is 2 pieces of gloves/bracers

[little forge]

Daggers also?

[thorn crater]

no i mean the skill level 😛

[next edge]

Sin sends on CD too

[thorn crater]

its +3 on orange

on any orange

[little forge]

It goes to 105 not 100 max I think? Should double check

[thorn crater]

and each new gives knowledge

[little forge]

Which makes quality easier to make

[somber fractal]

sending ER on cd feels so awkward too

like it feels like i should be saving this for KB

[next edge]

uh

why so

Its just a waste of CP if you hold it

[somber fractal]

i know thats why i said it feels bad

[next edge]

But I dont see how sending ER in CD can feel bad

[neat plank]

just spec into something else, thats what i plan on doing, I hate ER

[next edge]

its just a fire and forget

then yo uhave 45 to do the CPs

[neat plank]

i doubt im gonna be gimped for not going ER

[dark token]

Ur gimped

There are no better points

[neat plank]

its not though, the dumb colored cps bother me, you cant REALLY just ignore them

[somber fractal]

everything just feels out of sync like "oh time to play the er minigame" 30 seconds later "oh time to play the KB minigame" 30 seconds later "oh time to play the Deathmark minigame"

nothing interacting with each other is sad imo

[neat plank]

theyre a distraction and if you wanna hit any of the lower cp ones, youre gonna HAVE to think about them, or you'll just never hit them

[next edge]

Then colour them otherwise

LOL

[neat plank]

yeah i just dont wanna play this annoying ER game, I wanna focus on my actual class and the content before me

not some dumb whack a mole

[next edge]

You are making it look like its complicated

or something like that

[neat plank]

its not complicated, it just distracts from the stuff I care about

[next edge]

Its literally free finishers thats it

[royal lantern]

i mean, KB and DM are no changes to gameplay lol

[next edge]

So you think its better to have a 15 sec every 2 min then a 1:45 of plain repeat same stuff?

thats just incredible boring

lol

[royal lantern]

tbf, thats how many specs work in wow

[next edge]

I know, but I would like to not have this gameplay, honestly

[royal lantern]

and how assa worked for years now aswell, can somewhat understand if people dont like the "new" direction

[runic hinge]

I thought er was just like take the finisher if you hit it if not it’s whatever

You don’t have to force every combo point

[somber fractal]

i liked the end of SL with 1 minute vendetta and the tier

[next edge]

Exactly

[little forge]

Is there a WA that just yells at you if you hit an empowered point?

I should probably see if I can find one

[next edge]

Almost all WAs

tell you so

they colour blue the empowered CP

so you just press finisher if you hit there

[upbeat mirage]

"Finish him!" Mortal Kombat sound. :)

[little forge]

Yeah, I can do that. I wanna play a sound when I go to 3 CPS if 3 is empowered

Exactly

[royal lantern]

ye dunno

SbS is worse then ER

atleast ER does something

[neat plank]

how much worse is the +% dmg choice instead of the 4 animacharged one?

[royal lantern]

SbS is really just "mut, but better"

[somber fractal]

i think im finally done with making my WAs. you may not like it but this is what peak performance looks like

[upbeat mirage]

Lol

[next edge]

If you like it, good for you

I would never play with that

[little forge]

Is that felblade?

[upbeat mirage]

Envelope countdown, prolly. Crown for kingsblade?

Envenom*

[little forge]

Think felblade is shiv probably

[somber fractal]

most my icons are custom

[upbeat mirage]

Yeah, that too.

[somber fractal]

yeah it's shiv

[thorny pond]

Could be multi boxing a DH

[next edge]

And I thought I was weird by having Dance on 3

and he has Shadowstep on 8

[somber fractal]

it's bound to F

[subtle tundra]

weirdo

[royal lantern]

we all play wow mate

[dark token]

https://tenor.com/view/davy-jones-gif-18933584

[outer cairn]

Wrong flag

[dark token]

People keybinding stuff on 8 look like this

[outer cairn]

I can’t reach that far.

[somber fractal]

i can't either

that GIF is a pretty good representation of new sin rotation tho

[outer cairn]

I feel like I should switch shift to one of the MBs and then shift for what I need to put on alt.

[hearty junco]

not enough glows, this is peak

[outer cairn]

Everything on CD. By the time you get to the last one, stuff starts falling off

[little forge]

Your lack of dots isnt glowing 😦

[hearty junco]

oh, they glow in combat when its time to redot

[royal lantern]

your energy bar doesnt even glow

same with CP

WEAK UI

[hearty junco]

goddamnit, ill make every individuall combo point glow in different color, will look like christmas tree

[gusty mirage]

tis the season

[little forge]

Need to add a unique sound to each combo point also

[midnight mist]

does your defs glow when you get low hp

[hearty junco]

on it

[midnight mist]

great

[gusty mirage]

ily

[midnight mist]

everytime a mob is casting I hope your kick is glowing aswell

[midnight mist]

same bro same

[hearty junco]

ill just have a word from mariah carey christmas song on each CP making a full sentece

[ebon notch]

me too?

[midnight mist]

well idk

you seem to be british

[ebon notch]

passport only

[royal lantern]

[midnight mist]

alright fine be me then

[ebon notch]

dont forget that ur also french

[midnight mist]

love you mister daps

[midnight mist]

passport only

[ebon notch]

[night delta]

Wish this was a baseline feature

[hearty junco]

really loving this plater mod, makes the frame around ruptured targets purple

[crimson crest]

how much do sin and outlaw share stats? If I want to play sin for raid, will I have to farm two gear sets?

[sour wraith]

Trinkets and weapons will be the biggest differences in gearing

[honest vessel]

i think they're both crit mast right now

[midnight mist]

outlaw is still gearing toward crit vers

[honest vessel]

outlaw might still be crit vers

ah

mastery isn't so bad tho ya

[midnight mist]

but we can get mastery now

[dark token]

Outlaw is anything but haste

[midnight mist]

y

[dark token]

Sin is anything but vers

So a decent overlap but not perfect

Sub is perfect overlap with outlaw tho

Crit/vers/mast

[crimson crest]

sin is more fun tho

[little ivy]

so we drop SBS in m+ unless we're focusing prio damage right

[thorn crater]

teh fact taht the 3 target permanent bleed needs to be dropped to maximize aoe dmg

showsthat something is wrong with the tree :p

[royal lantern]

🙂

[subtle tundra]

huh?

[thorn crater]

the aoe build drops sbs right

[subtle tundra]

no

[thorn crater]

and sbs is permanent bleed

[subtle tundra]

the m+ build drops sbs

m+ isnt aoe build

and sbs is locked behind doomblade

so sbs is essentially a 2 pointer for aoe

[thorn crater]

agreed

which is why i said that there is an issue with the tree aka its location

?

[night delta]

Is this an option in plater, or another mod ?

[subtle tundra]

i dont see how it is an issue?

[night delta]

Highly interested

[subtle tundra]

that part is more of a cleave/st part

sepsis was first there

[thorn crater]

you do realise that people are entitled to their opinions without getting tagged. even if they disagree with you and yes even be wrong about it. imo sbs location is a problem. same as in your opinions exsa gotta go

[subtle tundra]

and how you have an opinion i respond with my opinion

[thorn crater]

difference is

i dont tag you

[subtle tundra]

i replied to you

i never disable the tag

[night delta]

How rude of you

[desert shard]

everyone is so today

[subtle tundra]

sorry, i dont know proper discord etiquette...

[spice spire]

[coral sierra]

is sin single target better than havoc?

[spice spire]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Evaluation Spreadsheet: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz

[gusty mirage]

dunno, what's havoc simming after the nerfs?

[spice spire]

Loose numbers and stuff

[opaque sigil]

around 10k more on pure st than havoc after nerfs

[desert shard]

84ish st post nerfs

[opaque sigil]

and ST nerf was really small for havoc

[spice spire]

Then yeah around 10k

Unluckily there’s next to no pure st in this raid

[coral sierra]

true

[opaque sigil]

So yeah, we can reserve that to the only st boss in the raid lol

[spice spire]

Second boss innit

[uncut echo]

Orange name

[coral sierra]

does anyone have data to see both single target sim and aoe for all classes?

[gusty mirage]

for all classes? probably not

[desert shard]

u asked this inthe dh disc aswell my dude. half the classes haven't come out with their sims yet and things are changing still allthe time

[uncut echo]

A lot of people don't put this level of effort into sims

At all

[coral sierra]

i know, just trying to do some research 🥲

[uncut echo]

Rogue/DK are well above the cut

[coral sierra]

ok thanks!

[gusty mirage]

ye you're gonna be hard pressed to find a ton of info from a lot of the other discords

[uncut echo]

That's pretty much the only two I've seen publicly posting

[desert shard]

I can tell you very roughly that frost dk both obliteration and breath are like 87k-ish, uhdk is like 83-84, but with a bugged af talent on the way to capstone, ele is like 84-85ish

[gleaming fable]

Rogue discord also more willing to share publicly

[gusty mirage]

normally I'd say see what the guide writers on wowhead say about their specs because they tend to know really their stuff but then I saw Tettles say boomkins are undertuned

and yeah

[uncut echo]

Fucking guy from max's stream saying havoc was high A

[desert shard]

he was pressured to meme and sandbag

witnessed it live

btw the unholy dk bug is the dumbest shit in the world

they got a talent unholy aura, 2 pointer, each point boosts dmg of pets, first point gives dmg boost to every pet, 2nd point just to the main

[uncut echo]

What's thr bug?

[desert shard]

based blizzard coding

[uncut echo]

Ooo

That's gonna be ezfixed

[desert shard]

they probably took the code fromthe pvp talent, left it to work as an aura, and botched sth in the process, instead of just making it a flat increase like it should've been all along

[uncut echo]

Bdk design rn has me megasadge of needing to be in dnd

[next edge]

There's if your sin?

you just tunnel boss

and fuck mechanics

[desert shard]

^that's my story and i'll be sticking to it

[uncut echo]

Mom says its my turn to tunnel boss

[desert shard]

my mouse stopped working I can't turn my camera

[uncut echo]

Mounted?

If so, remount

[gusty mirage]

they botched something? I'm so shocked

[uncut echo]

Oxi leave them alone they're trying

[gusty mirage]

and they're doing a fantastic job

but it's a lot of shit for them to clean up

game turned 18 years old

there's a lot of spaghetti that needs to be cleaned up

[uncut echo]

No for sure. It's super rough to clean everything up

Especially with these new systems

[earnest imp]

so are we running the ST build mostly still in the new raid

[gusty mirage]

ye, you swap talents here or there depending on the fight

[earnest imp]

not as deep as going CT?

[gusty mirage]

@uncut echo the game turned older than half of #outlaw

[green harbor]

[spice spire]

Game older than me

Unreal

[gusty mirage]

if there's constant cleave, probably a good idea to play CT

[earnest imp]

will be interesting to see how that can be managed point effectively

[uncut echo]

Outlul is dead to me

We play dance now

[spice spire]

God bless

Welcome to the bleedy spec

[oak sky]

Bro i read tettles article then autimaticjak's article and it was like night and day

[spice spire]

Undertuned

[uncut echo]

Holy fuck lmao

[spice spire]

[tardy lance]

Looking @ Fuu's simulation

How come Void Elf is considered for Ass for race comparison?

in Dungeon Slice that is?

[oak sky]

Must be a good race

[royal lantern]

racial sims

[royal lantern]

"half"

[balmy condor]

pretty sure he just threw a dart at a board to pick the race

might as well just sim the whole thing as dracthyr

[royal lantern]

can add that allready tbh cus it will happen in the next 1-2 years

[dire lake]

Dragon rogue when?

[tardy lance]

Ah okay

Just wondered

[balmy condor]

sorry

what I mean to say

void elf is +58% dps buy a race change before blizzard runs out of stock

go go go

[royal lantern]

yes

but only for m+

in raids you go night dwarf for stonemeld

+69% st dps

[balmy condor]

yeah just need blizzard to add a race change store window when you put a keystone into the pedestal

[desert shard]

I'm just looking forward to body type 3 as a paid dlc

[nocturne current]

Jawlines DLC

[midnight atlas]

is this good?

[sour wraith]

Yes

[neat plank]

Though I hate things that give you buffs while restricting you in some way. I don't want to feel like I'm being naughty whenever I switch targets

especially in m+

[midnight atlas]

i would sim but you know

prepatch

[desert shard]

you see it as a restriction, I see it as an excuse to tunnel the boss

[neat plank]

Sims are good for this trinket, it's widely used, but I wouldn't use it myself 🙂

[midnight atlas]

the other option i have is 278 guardian trinket.

havent farmed s4 at all on rogue

[neat plank]

nah, use this then ;D

[torpid hinge]

Are you basing your opinion off of pre-patch? Cause boomkin is looking fine for raid, but not looking good for m+ in df. And nowhere near as insane as they are on prepatch rn

[gusty mirage]

I didn't give my opinion to base it off of anything

but to call boomkin "undertuned on beta"

is a lie

[royal lantern]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/222652526141505537/1045132245192683570/c4ed612cab.jpg

when seli makes something

it hits hard

[gusty mirage]

tettles was crying all of SL too

good thing "boomkin was undertuned" then too

[nocturne current]

Dem clickbaits.

[torpid hinge]

The tuning is a bit off rn for boomkin. Even tho they are doing good numbers in raid, the tuning causes a bad and counterintuitive play style

[royal lantern]

top3 in CN

[gusty mirage]

so the tuning isn't a bit off

[royal lantern]

top3 for SoD progress (but that doesnt count cus after other classes got buffed they where better for the last 4 weeks of the tier!!!!!!)

[gusty mirage]

tuning is all numbers

not playstyle

[royal lantern]

literally got picked 2-3 times in sepulcher aswell

[torpid hinge]

The numbers force a bad play style because you completely ignore the ST eclipse

[royal lantern]

meanwhile druids will cry that they where bad for 50%of SL

balance druids legit have no clue what BAD means

for them bad means not the best for literally all content, its ridiculous

atleast warlocks are OP and shut up most of the time

[torpid hinge]

I’m not saying boomkin is bad, they will be perfectly fine in raid

[mystic gate]

nah nah they dont shutup

[nocturne current]

I wouldn't want to draw attention to that nerf hammer either.

[mystic gate]

i remembered many warlocks after sanctum said they were bad last season so if we get to be stacked in raids (demonology) its our right

meanwhile many specs have been trash throughout most expansions

[nocturne current]

https://tenor.com/view/peace-vanish-bye-leaving-ninja-gif-16881763

Real footage of Warlocks after reading Hunter patch notes.

[spice spire]

So true bestie

[eager sorrel]

It's like when exactly one class does spread cleave well, it's going to be brought regardless of tuning :P

[royal lantern]

ah yes

spread cleave

a 100%unique boomkin thing

+its the ONLY reason they are brought

🙂

[eager sorrel]

Sure, the venthyr window was the biggest burst window in the game too which is a unique damage profile.

It also was the only spec that did spread cleave well...

It's why CoB looked like this

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/26#region=1&timespan=1000&dataset=90&boss=2412

Or Sylvanus arrows was the other big one I guess

And dealing with the collosus in p2

[tardy lance]

Does deathmark work for the DoTs already on the target?

Or do I have to deathmark and THEN use the bleeds etc.?

[limber lion]

Yes

[balmy condor]

you should get bleeds up first

[limber lion]

It duplicates existing bleeds.

[balmy condor]

then deathmark

[tardy lance]

Ah okay ty

[balmy condor]

awful change

unlucky

single handedly fucked vanish logic and brought in exsanguinate in one fell swoop

very lovely

[tardy lance]

I haven't played assassination since Legion

[balmy condor]

it's the same thing but more buttons and you garrote from stealth

[tardy lance]

my rotation drilled into my mind was to: Garotte, mutilate, rupture, mutilate twice into a vanish > garotte > max rupture > Kingsbane

[balmy condor]

yeah

that's basically what we do now

[tardy lance]

I'm assuming just slap deathmark @ the end

[velvet bridge]

do you just send exang of cd or do you hold it for deathmark?

[tardy lance]

Then exsang?

[balmy condor]

you do this

[balmy condor]

on cd

as long as you don't exsang during deathmark

you're doing it

exsang during deathmark is by far the worst imaginable thing you could do

[velvet bridge]

Ok

ty

[balmy condor]

np

[tardy lance]

Wait

why deathmark before Kingsbane?

[balmy condor]

because it lasts longer

you fit the full kingsbane into deathmark

also if you kingsbane before hand you waste time on the bleeds

[flint tusk]

Also why shiv after kingsbane?
don't you lose 20% of kingsbanes initial damage or is the Extra GCD on stacking it up better?

[balmy condor]

sim doesn't care either way

when you shiv before kingsbane expires after deathmark

so it's just a weird micro-payoff

[flint tusk]

ahh right.

makes it easier to remember also. as will have a mini rotation for kingsbane

[balmy condor]

I chose to keep the shiv after because it keeps kingsbane a little closer to deathmark

since you sync them

it's 1 seconds

but like

the difference is so minimal

[subtle kiln]

@balmy condor can you add a hyperlink easter egg and have one of the abilities go something completely random for say Warlocks?

[balmy condor]

I can, and I won't

[subtle kiln]

oh well

[balmy condor]

because touching other peoples guides is taboo

[subtle kiln]

your guide

or is this not yours

[balmy condor]

well trolling my guide would be taboo

[flint tusk]

I honestly can't wait to be lvl70. prepatch is so irritating to get a proper feel for how the specs will play

[tardy lance]

Does Deathmark duplicate Kingsbane?

[balmy condor]

no

that would be insane

[tardy lance]

O

Damn

Yeah I thought so

I thought my kingsbane was doing so much damage because I thought Deathmark was duplicating it

smh

should change the wording of kingsbane from lethal poison

[balmy condor]

your kingsbane was doing so much damage because deathmark duplicates poisons

[tardy lance]

my deathmark be lying

[balmy condor]

so your kingsbane stacks twice as fast

[tardy lance]

yeh true

smh tho deathmark says it duplicates lethal poisons and kingsbane is a lethal poison

but not duplicated

[balmy condor]

it should say lethal weapon poisons you're correct

but to be fair

all of assassinations tooltips are cursed

you just gotta use the ol noggin a little

[subtle kiln]

all rogue tooltips

[balmy condor]

and be like "yeah that would be dumb"

[tight lark]

Wow is not userfriendly game. We need to test every single thing lol

[tardy lance]

I played guardian druid for the entirety of Shadowlands and only did PvP

I have no noggin

not after that

but well

I'm a lover for Single target shit

[balmy condor]

for 99% of the playerbase the differences in what is and isn't affected is completely irrelevant

[tardy lance]

so trying to get back into Assassination

cause from what I can see it has the winning edge on ST for Rogue specs rn

[balmy condor]

45 year old steel mill worker Tom, loving father of 4, who logs in to pick herbs and run his random heroic for some gold after a long shift

does not need to know that mastery affects envenom

but zoldyck does not

it does not matter to his gameplay

[ebon notch]

Tom a grinder at heart, i heard he was scouted for method in vanilla

[tardy lance]

I honestly thought Outlaw with Dreadblades and just spamming the shit out of everything would edge out single target

but actually p disappointed in it idk why

[balmy condor]

problem with outlaw is that they spam all the shit, and because of that, none of the shit actually does damage

[tardy lance]

Yeah

[balmy condor]

can't have a spell you cast 15000 times also do a million dps

[tardy lance]

well

I enjoyed Legion assassination

so I'm looking relatively forward to it this expac

kind of disappointed in the other 2

altho Sub rogue looks fun for AoE

[subtle kiln]

I wish they’d add advanced tooltips

as a toggle on/off option

[meager granite]

Wouldn't we want a imp garotte/rupt (whatever order) exsang into DM
We are losing some time on the exsanguinated 7cp doubled rupture there no? Might be irrelevant tho

[balmy condor]

we do imp garrote/rup exsang into DM

I don't understand the question

[meager granite]

Sbs is in between

[balmy condor]

yeah

[meager granite]

Gcd time lost on it but I guess thats cause of cp

[balmy condor]

yes that's for the animacharge cp in deathmark

and is completely irrelevant

it gets SBS up which is important

the 0.5 seconds on exsang won't matter :)

[meager granite]

Smth like
Gar snd gar sbs rup er rup vanish gar exsang DM

[balmy condor]

that was shown to be worse

[meager granite]

Okay I trust

[tardy lance]

I'm actually in awe @ kingsbane + deathmark damage

[meager granite]

You da number man

[balmy condor]

that combo actually just straight up wastes cp

because the sbs cp go into the void

[meager granite]

I'm just a brainless button smasher

OK I see it gives you 1 cp more for the envenom

[balmy condor]

no

it guarantees you land on an animacharge

[meager granite]

My proposition aswell, but on your opener you have 1 more cp due to sbs for the 1st envenom. So that makes sense to me why it's better

(yours)

[balmy condor]

no, your proposition does not guarantee you land on an animacharge cp

[meager granite]

It does, I rupture er rupture

[balmy condor]

brother man

[dire lake]

We are not playing with tea? ._.

[balmy condor]

you go rupture er rupture, and then later you go vanish gar exsang dm env kingsbane yes?

[tacit oar]

Depends, are you British ?

[balmy condor]

we are

[dire lake]

German 😂

[balmy condor]

@meager granite

[tacit oar]

You play with beer then

[dire lake]

So many buttons. I need more keybindings

[dire lake]

Ahh the good old thistle beer

[tacit oar]

Yea, binded 2 more bars for assa

[meager granite]

Yeah so unless we don't play with the ER capstone I don't get why I wouldnt end on a Anima charge cp

Oh wait we talking about the 2nd rupt or envenom?

[balmy condor]

okay, ER crits, how many CP

[meager granite]

3 or 4?

[balmy condor]

3

it's 2 baseline

crit would be 3

okay

vanish -> gar

how many cp

[meager granite]

3

[balmy condor]

okay

so you ER to 3

then rupture

so you used your 3cp animacharge

then you vanish -> gar

[meager granite]

Oh I see

[balmy condor]

you're at 3

where's your animacharge

[meager granite]

Yeah you expose yourself to rng

I don't play seal and cry for the rest of the fight!

T'y for explanation

[balmy condor]

np

[midnight atlas]

noob sin player question, why garrote snd garrote again. doesnt that overlap the empowered garrote from stealth?

[meager granite]

And when do you CT in m+ setup? ^^

[spice spire]

[torpid hinge]

extends imp garrote for more dam from exsang

[balmy condor]

I will answer both of these questions at once

by saying

I do not have time for this

wait for FaQ/Guides

thank you

[torpid hinge]

Improved garrote makes it so that garrote is improved for 3 seconds out of stealth

so garrote -> snd -> garrote is 2 imp garrotes

[midnight atlas]

that's true i was living under the impression that only the first garrote is empowered

[tardy lance]

Do we go Dragon tempered blades?

[midnight atlas]

thanks

[meager granite]

I was actually being sarcastic. 🙂

[tardy lance]

@ 70?

[spice spire]

This is a question answered in the pins

The long short is, if you like it, sure!

[tardy lance]

Sorry I'm a brainlet

forgot they exist

[spice spire]

No worries homie

Happens to the best of us

[unreal kayak]

now that we have kingsbane back wating for this bad boy

[silk bane]

can we pin this please?

[balmy condor]

no

[silk bane]

sadge

hopefully it's in your updated guide/faq then cuz this is pretty good./

[balmy condor]

I have better

use this

[silk bane]

Cant wait! Do you have a rough ETA on when the guides gonna be done?

oh fuck thats perfect!

[balmy condor]

wowhead will be done by tomorrow night, not sure when admin flips the switch on the guides, I assume sunday night or monday morning they go live

FaQ will be done.................. some time

idk

lets say saturday for now

and if people piss me off

it'll be sunday

[worldly sail]

looking good

[silk bane]

youre an actual giga chad 👏 thanks for the hard work ❤️

[obtuse robin]

damn nice a clean

visuals

[green harbor]

based whispyr, just do it on sunday anyway

[hardy dagger]

Beauty!

[copper hazel]

some smooth graphical squares there, i like

[balmy condor]

I didn't make the visual btw

you can send the praise to @verbal mantle and @gusty mirage

[copper hazel]

gg's all round

[verbal mantle]

[opaque sigil]

thanks for the hard work guys

whispyr what is more of nightmare fuel: guide hyperlinks or exsang questions?

[balmy condor]

BiS lists

m0 BiS lists

are by far

the worst thing

[opaque sigil]

yikes

[copper hazel]

m0 bis lists for a weeks worth of content

[ember mural]

bis lists

[balmy condor]

and then like

you add all the items

you get to the bottom of the list

and you're like pfew

nice 15 minutes

and then you realize you have to go back through

and link all the zones they drop from

also like

trinket tier list?

for m0 week?

who gives a fuck?

play what you're given?

whatever

[opaque sigil]

I wonder if they could ever make a proper inhouse tool for guide writers to make such things a less chore

[balmy condor]

clicks are clicks

[balmy condor]

we're getting a new tool that allows us to push talent builds onto the calculator

and that'll let us do build updates site-wide

rather than right now

like right now we have to do [build title="Assassination Rogue" tab='Raid - Kingsbane' talents=rogue/assassination/DAPFVUEBEREaFFYhRQCUAMVWIEQUShRSXBBQ this thing

and if the build changes

you gotta hunt down all the pages where you linked it

[opaque sigil]

ugh, what a chore

[balmy condor]

but we're moving towards this I think

so

we get to just make builds

push them out

you get them

we can just link to the saved database builds

win win

[opaque sigil]

yeah, that’s a smart way of doing it - glad they kinda thought about a scalable long-term solution

so maybe an item picker one day soon as well lol

[balmy condor]

also cheat sheets

so that's cool

but yeh

back to work I go

linking to all the zones

[copper hazel]

oh thats nice

nice lil snappy page to look at

[balmy condor]

guide writing is chill

except 75% of it is just formatting

and not english

50 tabs open of wowhead searches to keep track of items and zones and talents to link to

[inner atlas]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Evaluation Spreadsheet: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz

[minor aurora]

i assume at level 70 thistle tea will make things so much better right as far as energy goes and maintaining bleeds and stuff

[strange python]

yoo

[uncut echo]

Hello Dracula

[spice spire]

[strange python]

hello

i am not dracula

i am ALUCARD!

sec

[spice spire]

Mfs really trying to Exsang irl

[uncut echo]

Henlo George 🥰

[strange python]

here

tacha!

[spice spire]

Greetings and salutations ahri

[strange python]

Hello ahri

[uncut echo]

Hi!

[minor aurora]

happy thanksgiving to those who celebrate it!

[spice spire]

@strange python

Solid name

[uncut echo]

Likewise, good friend :)

[strange python]

no

plz ;c

good

[spice spire]

Hope you as well papi

[strange python]

doggo op

[spice spire]

Ty George is a Part dog part GOAT

[strange python]

say hi to Georgi

George

[spice spire]

I can’t, he’s at home and I’m an hour away 😦
I will soon

[strange python]

oh,he will be happy waiting for you

xd

[keen helm]

Is sin looking like the best pvp spec or we dont know yet

[strange python]

ye

@balmy condor @spice spire i think you gave away permission to unauthorized people to edit name on his own,just in case

[balmy condor]

not sure what you mean

people can always change their own name

[balmy condor]

no clue, also #pvp

[strange python]

well it is a bit awkard becuase in another servers they dont let you change the name on own

[balmy condor]

yeah we've always let people change their own nicknames

[uncut echo]

I wouldnt have been able to be blunderbussy for a week otherwise.

[spice spire]

Nor I, a clout chaser

[balmy condor]

https://tenor.com/view/talk-lizard-ironic-gif-25847938

that

is enough out of you

mr george

[spice spire]

[uncut echo]

Very rude I must say

Maxwell does not approve

[balmy condor]

!mute @uncut echo no, that's not rude, this would be rude

!unmute @uncut echo

[uncut echo]

Caught that mod abuse in 4k

[balmy condor]

[spice spire]

He abuses me in dms

[uncut echo]

Maxwell is livid

[spice spire]

(He sends me feet pics)

[neat plank]

why do we have to choose talents? how about at max level you just have all of the talents? i don't want to feel bad about not having a certain fun talent

[uncut echo]

I made a KILLING in college selling feet pics :)

It's how I got most of my league skins

[neat plank]

define killing

[balmy condor]

PoV you are the least sane world of warcraft player

[strange python]

pog

[spice spire]

[strange python]

that means he made billions

[neat plank]

i mean there might be an obvious reason why it's good or fun to not have half of the talents, but its just not obvious to me

[balmy condor]

the fun is you get to change based on situations

[neat plank]

is it so you can differentiate yourself from others?

[balmy condor]

how is that not obvious to you

[uncut echo]

That fun is definitely subjective

[neat plank]

yeah but why do you have to be bad in a certain situation, why cant everyone just have the right tools for every job?

[balmy condor]

you want to just walk into a raid, every boss same talent

every mythic+ same talent

walk into pvp

same talent

[neat plank]

maybe, would that feel bad? i havent tested it

[strange python]

what we talking about,my friend?

[balmy condor]

aight enough discord for the day

I'm gonna lose my shit

[copper hazel]

you cant test it because its automatically bad

[uncut echo]

She, and about 8000

[strange python]

sheesh

[uncut echo]

Nappie time

[spice spire]

I agree mister Vhispyr .
Good luck

[uncut echo]

VVhispyr

[strange python]

wait

[uncut echo]

Doth thou wish to live deliciously?

[strange python]

@neat plank did you actually said "why do we have to choose talents? how about at max level you just have all of the talents? i don't want to feel bad about not having a certain fun talent" ?

holy

[neat plank]

yes

[strange python]

moo

just

[uncut echo]

Leave them alone, it's not a turbo unpopular opinion

[strange python]

idk what are you smoking at

[blazing totem]

this guy single-handedly solved our balance problems

[neat plank]

is there value in having to click other talents when you change content types?

[strange python]

yes

a lot

A LOT VALUE!

[blazing totem]

just give us all talents at once

[spice spire]

Let’s not incite issues. I don’t agree with it, but letting people have opinions is something we should do.

Even if we think they’re dumb. (Exsang haters)

[neat plank]

no one has given an explanation though 😄

[strange python]

for example

in PvP

[royal lantern]

u dumb

[blazing totem]

while we’re at it, why not give us all spells in the game? it’s not fun switching from rogue to warlock when I want to be ranged