how do you land on 3 or 4 often without gs
#outlaw
random stirrup
random stirrup
only noobs roll stage 1
frail veldt
that would be wild gameplay
mighty pivot
press ps with opp but look away midcast
craggy barn
imagine if u never spent er and er banked till all ur cp were sc
craggy barn
and then it ended up forcing the only cps u used were what u were already doing
frail veldt
over time
craggy barn
make er based on cdr gained from rb
random stirrup
what if when you consumed the last animacharged point from ER your finishers were all max cp 
random stirrup
I am starting to think you might be mafic himself
mighty pivot
from now on I will only be replying by using real mafic posts
stuck radish
Hey guys is it mandatory to have 25% haste even if sims say otherwise ?
craggy barn
what if they removed rb
made ar passive and only gained whenever u spent 60 combo points
its mandatory to have 21 haste, the rest is sims
stuck radish
ok thanks
ornate heathBOT
Outlaw's stat prio is generally Crit > Haste* > Vers >= Mastery.
- You need ~21-23% haste for energy, this has priority over crit. That's the haste on your stat page after talents/buffs/flask.
- Crit is then your best stat until you approach ~40%, from there random vers or mastery pieces will be similar.
- You have to use
Raidbots Top Gear to determine the exact combination of pieces to use.
stuck radish
ah that makes sense
craggy barn
@gaunt phoenix should this be updated for the haste difference between trickster and fatebound? since it does trend towards 25 for trickster and those numbers are more fatebound right
and trick wants more haste in mplus than the recommended
craggy barn
makes it easier to have moroes explain it since every time someone asks we have to add the trickster caveat
but up to solo or whomever i guess
vivid vessel
why is this shit so ugly omegalul
cerulean portal
THEY R LOW
pure folio
Open eyes
keen belfry
why is this shit so ugly omegalul
pure folio
WIDER
random stirrup
d1 abuser
vivid vessel
Still ugly lo
gaunt phoenix
<@921608341048930304> should this be updated for the haste difference between t...
i think trickster with flickering vs fatebound with thief vers is not all that meaningfully different haste
the real caveat is perhaps adding more haste to help you when thistle tea runs dry
by simming droute
vivid vessel
ASIAN EYES
Do asian have a smaller fov on the y axis
cerulean portal
Do asian have a smaller fov on the y axis
yes
vivid vessel
Ok is that true tho
We don't see with our whole eye
We see with like
The little thing in the middle
frail veldt
rofl
cerulean portal
some1 donate boe boots with crit haste pls
vivid vessel
i was squinting too much
frail veldt
I mean
depends who youre emulating
my eyes are pretty narrow
if I smile I def lose fov
cuz my eyes squint
pure folio
it doesnt change shit
U might be on max fov
vivid vessel
idk i tried reducing my eyes to be like asian eyes and i didnt feel like i actually lose fov
also its Y fov
which is useless
frail veldt
how much nose blindspot do you have
frail veldt
close one eye
glass mortar
how big is it
vivid vessel
what do you want me to answer
glass mortar
big snoz??
frail veldt
I have lorge blind spot
glass mortar
thers worse ways to be
cerulean portal
my eyes are pretty narrow
u r asian?
frail veldt
technically no but im peruvian and theres lots of asian blood down there
vivid vessel
wait was it mewo that sent the capibara pictures
frail veldt
I get asked if im half asian a lot
cobalt tree
how do you guys sim for m+?
vivid vessel
i have seen you irl
frail veldt
yeah you met my relatives
cobalt tree
dungeonslice?
frail veldt
theyre chill
vivid vessel
he is an handsome asian looking guy
glass mortar
wait is mewos pfp not him?
pure folio
how do you guys sim for m+?
Dslicd for gear, droute for overall
glass mortar
i assumed he was just a naruto character
glass mortar
oh hi mark
frail veldt
wait was it mewo that sent the capibara pictures
no that was someone else
actually
I forget who
vivid vessel
oh really
frail veldt
@last cape maybe?
frail veldt
it was someone
frail veldt
yeah
frail veldt
name names
vivid vessel
french expression
frail veldt
we do
pure folio
Yes
cerulean portal
zac u sus
vivid vessel
ty
cerulean portal
why guidon
frail veldt
who was it
keen belfry
@vivid vessel there might be tech to playing with an ugly ui
vivid vessel
dont think so
dim parrot
Yeh if u troll u can blame it
keen belfry
which one
keen belfry
hahaha what
frail veldt
yeah
vivid vessel
you didnt see it ?
frail veldt
im searching
frail veldt
how long ago was it
vivid vessel
few months
cerulean portal
guys u r crazy
radiant wyvern
vai?
vivid vessel
vurai !
cerulean portal
searching for a pic that was shared last year?
vivid vessel
haha
cerulean portal
LUL
radiant wyvern
where did zeross go
keen belfry
he cant play 14 hours a day so he quit
radiant wyvern
noob
radiant wyvern
wtf
vivid vessel
fucking
radiant wyvern
y
vivid vessel
6090rtx type shit
pure folio
Just to play runescape
vivid vessel
yuo
pure folio
radiant wyvern
i have a friend who got stuck into runescape its all he does now he fell off so hard
frail veldt
I still cant find it zac
radiant wyvern
washed up like crazy
gaunt phoenix
ya got gooned
outer meteor
at least u had some miliseconds
grand vector
If I was good at the game I could have outplayed
long barn
Warrior buffs seems fine.
Why is it they got the ST buff yet they didn’t nerf their AOE?
faint pendant
because blizzard doesn't balance around M+
unless there is some absolutely deranged spec/build
radiant wyvern
surely theres way more game hours spent in m+ than raid
faint pendant
like 5 guardian druids 2 weeks ago
glass mortar
also because generally speaking u can buff and nerf the ST of other specs to a larger degree without drastically changing aoe output
outlaw ST to aoe is a pretty direct conversion rate
not to defend the bf tuning because it still wasnt necessary but thats the general idea
unkempt iris
like 5 guardian druids 2 weeks ago
What about the 20 guardian druids on crown?
faint pendant
that was mythic?
radiant wyvern
popo = poop
take it back
mighty pivot
no
radiant wyvern
dead to me
worldly shale
big bonus roll chat
cerulean portal
big bonus roll chat
myth?
wintry solar
popo = poop
serene pecan
What is it people do before starting an m+ key? Just Adrenaline rush -> Killing spree?
unkempt iris
!prekey
ornate heathBOT
- Use
Adrenaline Rush to activate 
Loaded Dice. - As Trickster, use
KS to activate 
Disorienting Strikes. - Do NOT use
RTB before the key, you will lose it. - Use
SND during the bubble once the key starts.
serene pecan
Cheers
mighty pivot
<:GRRR:1235640251129532498>
random stirrup
shame i have to sub for llura tho xd
Why
random stirrup
Tell him it’s p4 pad
Also the damage check is highkey chill now and outlaw is much safer
inland acorn
there is no dmg check
random stirrup
Well it just keeps moving ye
inland acorn
it's hands & eye coordination check
random stirrup
Do more damage and skip more p3 stuff
But yeah I think you should just play the safest spec/the one you are most comfortable living on
inner meadow
dim parrot
Gib
cerulean portal
gz
serene rivet
Anyone also having the problem that RTB buff just sometimes disappears out of their Cooldown manager?
dim parrot
Guys idk if I have what it takes to try n get title this season
inland acorn
Anyone also having the problem that RTB buff just sometimes disappears out of th...
yes
known bug
dim parrot
Never done it before but pugging already so frustrating usually I give up around now
pure folio
@serene rivet
pure folio
Guys idk if I have what it takes to try n get title this season
🤷♂️ title is never easy
serene rivet
thanks
pure folio
What is it people do before starting an m+ key? Just Adrenaline rush -> Killing ...
ADR ks prep adr- snd in bubble
soft musk
is it worth to ks after bf than do arush bte in packs? it feels like such a waste to use ks during arush windows
or is cancelling ks just worse during arush? i know outlaw faq says its minimal but not sure
i see zac full channel and other rogues cancel it after they hit max cp
dim parrot
KS is nice during gather I think but AR BR BTE seems fine too just depends on the key
frail veldt
Guys idk if I have what it takes to try n get title this season
you can do it
how far behind are you
gotta capitalize on outlaw actually being decent
we dont get seasons like this that often
craggy barn
title is gonna be like 4050 or 4100+
keen belfry
i wonder how many 22s u need
dim parrot
I have a 21 timed and 2 20’s left but haven’t been playing enough
keen belfry
im not feeling the grind of 22s
dim parrot
Work sm I have wife and two kids but my wife pushes too so it’s fun
dim parrot
gotta capitalize on outlaw actually being decent
That’s what I think too
tranquil tartan
So for Tricks do we just put it on the tank at the start and never press it again during m+, or do we still need to press in between packs to get the 30s buff on ourselves?
craggy barn
dont need to press again if playing trickster
unless u die
i press it on instinct
it doesnt cost anything
dim parrot
Sometimes I die from aggro if I die and forget to re-press lol
keen belfry
ive never died
nocturne wren
guys I did a few keys as Sub...it was beyond easy to do 200-300k every trash pack...100k+ on every boss. I was using 3 braincells
WHY IS THAT A THING
also really dumb question - we use instant poison ya?
pure folio
Most the time
nocturne wren
when is it not instant poison?
uncut ginkgo
pvp
nocturne wren
well fuckin duh
uncut ginkgo
hey you asked
nocturne wren
fair.
gaunt phoenix
Some mobs heal themselves so you can swap to wound in the middle of the key
No i don't know an example cause i don't do it
quick ridge
big void guys in magisters, big void guys in seat, big void guys in nexus point
gaunt phoenix
Big void
quick ridge
BEEG void
nocturne wren
its like big pharma
quick ridge
there might be some in caverns, too, maybe the beserkers?
nocturne wren
but
swapping poisons is downtime
which is adps loss
so is it a dps gain to swap?
hmmmgh
gaunt phoenix
You would try to do it before the pull
nocturne wren
quick ridge
i have wound on for the start of seat, after second boss of magisters, and then just down the right hall in nexus
but it's hard to tell in logs how much healing I'm preventing, if that's even possible
harsh forge
you can use wound poison for the first boss algethar and the entire first area of MC the mobs all have regen
most of them anyway
jaunty notch
From the circle that clears the bleeds I believe if he's standing in it
quick ridge
oh wow i've never noticed that, how helpful to know!
final pagoda
anyone knows whats the average CD of CoS?
upper hawk
cloak of shadows? the average should be really close to 2 minutes
upper hawk
VERY close
burnt torrent
just curious, we have to do a lot of effort to deal dps in m+ am i right?
compared to fotm dk/dh classes
glass mortar
yes outlaw is generally considered a high effort spec
burnt torrent
yes outlaw is generally considered a high effort spec
got outlaw as my 5th alt now, and i never dealt that low dmg with 252 compared to my other classes on this itemlevel
every button feels unrewarding, but the specc is fun somehow
pure folio
Yea it’s not really alt friendly imo, you have to dedicate more time than other specs to learn it
quiet root
surely between the eyes feels rewarding, i love pressing between the eyes
pure folio
If you haven’t already the #outlaw-faq is a very helpful resource to reference
burnt torrent
also i hate the concept of beeing full melee, wasnt outlaw some addons ago atleast ~8-10 yards?
glass mortar
we used to have acrobatic strikes talent increasing range on all our abilities by 3 yards
2 expacs ago
they got rid of it in TWW
burnt torrent
aaah i see
glass mortar
also when we had crackshot significantly more of our attacks were ranged
pure folio
Yea but that’s gone, we can at least ps and bte from ranged
glass mortar
hell with 6 FtH saved up and a little good rng u could practically do entire crackshot windows from a range if u had to
yup
glass mortar
yup 🙂
pure folio
^
quiet root
correct
glass mortar
believe it or not this is the "improved" version
burnt torrent
idk why i even press it
pure folio
The worst button in existence
burnt torrent
for some passives i guess?
pure folio
Yes
burnt torrent
cuz it deals 0 dmg
pure folio
Fazed
glass mortar
and by improved i mean they changed it to what they wanted it to be, we have them 3 pages of feedback on the forums (they asked for it) and then they never improved anything about it
burnt torrent
ah man idk
glass mortar
so its a slight step up from the garbage it was before
burnt torrent
i loved rogue
but atm we have sub (giga ass boring)
sin (i think its "okey"? idk)
and outlaw which is the coolest spec
but with a lot of weird buttons
soft abyss
Guys if I have a supercharged combo point and no BTE. Do I send KS or dispatch?
burnt torrent
sorry for the spam and respect for every outlaw main!
pure folio
Guys if I have a supercharged combo point and no BTE. Do I send KS or dispatch?
BTE > KS > Dispatch. Supercharger doesn’t change your priority
quiet root
but with a lot of weird buttons
you could play fatebound and be 3% worse than trickster in theory, but you wouldn't have to use KS
and you'd have better energy
soft abyss
BTE > KS > Dispatch. Supercharger doesn’t change your priority
Ok because KS we sometimes cancel it when we are full combo points so it doesn't make sense to send KS and stop it
burnt torrent
ah and btw do i blade rush > BTE?
glass mortar
u actually cancel when at full energy not full CP
i believe it the official rule
some people do do it based off CP (that was an old rule we had last expac)
quiet root
ah and btw do i blade rush > BTE?
yes blade rush is higher prio than bte
soft abyss
some people do do it based off CP (that was an old rule we had last expac)
I saw someone saying you stop it at 6cp if you want and it doesn't really matter
But maybe I am wrong
glass mortar
it doesnt really matter is the most accurate part of that
all these kspree optimizations are worth like 0.5% dps total
but the official rule is you can cast it with 5 CP (so its shorter) and you can cancel it if you max out on energy
generally that only happens in the opener or during Ar with good luck
probably not a huge loss to just be cancelling kspree at 6 CP at any point regardless
quiet root
yeah just vibe it out, but if you ks at 5 (with no supercharger) it ends at 6cp anyway
bright harbor
Hello there o/ Can someone help understand how the APL works here ? On a quick sim I would expect to go Prep Blade Rush AR into BTE spam but it ended up otherwise. Quick sim patchwerk 5 min
bright harbor
Oh yes makes sense, didn't acount for that, but since it's only 8s in it's most likely that
So wait for AR to fade before pressing again
quiet root
yes
snow hill
you could play fatebound and be 3% worse than trickster in theory, but you would...
I'm actually doing this now. Can't stand Trickster, it's been a month and I just can't keep track of everything or keep up in movement heavy encounters. I fkn hate it can rest in piss.
timid idol
spoke with someone trying outlaw (and rogue in general)
had to explain why outlaw has to waste a trillion combo points rn
trickster my beloved
keen belfry
pressing a builder at 5 is!
keen belfry
no
keen belfry
fth was better then
timid idol
i really dont remember trickster being this clunky back in tww
oh yea fth was goated then
keen belfry
its a pretty easy fix i have hope for s2 changes
timid idol
nerfs gonna be gargantuan for s2
outlaw was good for 1 season
maybe in 15.0 we get to play again
bye bye
keen belfry
we will have sick rtb tier set next season
glass mortar
everytime u press RtB u get +1 buff restarting everytime jackpot expires
keen belfry
and a small rework to energy and and deft
glass mortar
farm ur jackpot
timid idol
that was the first time i didnt main outlaw as my first character so i dont remember the tier set too well
glass mortar
timid idol
was it just a damage boost if u had rtb active
keen belfry
it was high chance to get higher buff count basically
glass mortar
in the opener ud have what
timid idol
ah
timid idol
everytime u press RtB u get +1 buff restarting everytime jackpot expires
slowly but surely we're just getting to bandit's guile
keen belfry
just make it +1 to expected rolls tier
keen belfry
ok s2 they make energy inside AR better, tier rtb that makes it goated to get 3+ buff easily, and then fast actin rework
timid idol
yea fast acting is weird
keen belfry
i actually think our energy inside of AR is kinda crminal
glass mortar
that was the first time i didnt main outlaw as my first character so i dont reme...
its because its supposed to be a second charge of AR
keen belfry
why not?
timid idol
prep is the complete opposite of the entire spec gameplay lole
glass mortar
oops idk why that was a reply
timid idol
npnp
keen belfry
AR should just be like, no ernergy cost
@glass mortar refute this
glass mortar
by that logic outlaw should just be done with energy
but sure that would be an improvement
glass mortar
and btw the argument outlaw should just be done with energy
isnt necessarily a bad one
keen belfry
i agree!
glass mortar
not sure i agree with it but it has its merits
timid idol
energy is only cancer to manage on rogue btw
never once have i ever felt bad playing around energy on monk
or any other resource
glass mortar
well the thing is outlaw never really manages it
glass mortar
the only choices outlaw ever makes about energy rn is
cancelling kspree rarely
and not being able to press buttons until u have enough
never been a pooling spec
timid idol
u can also use opp over ss to go over 5 for a finisher if ur low on energy ig
glass mortar
energy is supposed to be a mistake indicator for outlaw except they have never managed to design it so it doesnt just run out on its own randomly with bad bouts of rng
if energy only punished u for pressing the wrong buttons i wouldnt mind it
keen belfry
maybe my fix is overkill but i think it shouldnt be possible to proc tea or run out of energy in AR
timid idol
its crazy that u can
glass mortar
resource efficiency does drive some aspects of the rotation, like finisher break points and builder rules so its not like its inconsequential
but i definitly prefer too much to what we have now
and the gameplay fails to include "managing" energy at all despite the blue post we got on alpha
so 🙂
keen belfry
i mean yes resource efficiency is a thing
timid idol
yea idk
keen belfry
but it shouldnt be a thing that matterts when u play well
timid idol
glass mortar
yes exactly i agree with that
should be able to design outlaw so it doesnt have these pitfalls of u just randomly lowrolling and not playing the game
should only happen from mistakes
keen belfry
you shou7ld have a bad time with energy if u play shit
not if u play good
or have to aoe
glass mortar
theres enough variance in the actual damage itself with all this bte bullshit anyway
keen belfry
i hope u know weran, this version of outlaw would be very fun with like 3 things.
+1 to rtb, removal of deft cost, more ways to get palmed bullets
imo that fixes A LOT
more palmed pullets = more free bte = more energy
glass mortar
that would go a long way
vivid vessel
1 less max cp ..
glass mortar
idk about fix tho
keen belfry
idk about fix tho
fix is never
keen belfry
yup
glass mortar
change the whole CP dynamic yea idk who the fuck thought trickster was ok
perma 2 builder > finisher
perma building on 5 CP
keen belfry
i think mine are easy fixes tho which is why i say it
glass mortar
80% of the time
feels so ass
noway anyone at blizzard played this hero talent even once in beta
glass mortar
i mean
i think gravedigger is kinda pathetic as an apex
both in name and gameplay
keen belfry
i dont mind it
glass mortar
it should just be a buffed ace
keen belfry
most apex blow cock
glass mortar
should stack to 12 and let u store 2
should let u bte regardless of its cd when u have 6
stuff like that
as it is its just boring reverse ace
keen belfry
imagine BTE chains cuh
glass mortar
also also also
keen belfry
with bte storing bull;ets
vivid vessel
should just not exist lmao
glass mortar
if u press BtE with apex up
vivid vessel
why is our apex a thing
glass mortar
it should check for a ace
then consume stacks
if u didnt ace
not what it does now
keen belfry
why is our apex a thing
most apex blow bro
glass mortar
idk its a failure on all points for me
keen belfry
in every spec
vivid vessel
most apex blow bro
ok but ours is a copy past of a talent we play
and im quite certain they nerfed ace
so that apex
feels better
glass mortar
ye i feel that
because otherwise it would literaly be ace
"take away ace chaining gameplay so apex can have it for 2 gcds instead"
damn they r gunna love this 🔥
also probably remove the refreshing on projectile hit gimmick because
it literally just punishes u for wanting to play ur proc spec like a proc spec?
u go fight a boss like vor and if ur not tracking gravedigger ur just gunna waste half ur procs
because they will happen 0.3s before the gcd swings
bold scarab
outlaw is one of the specs of all time
keen belfry
ok but ours is a copy past of a talent we play
apex just blows for all, i think we are playing the beta versions of apex points rn
i think apex will be good
unkempt iris
Take blade rush off gcd lmk
pastel pendant
Also when my bte resets it always lands at 5 cp
pastel pendant
Do I rly have to use a builder then bte
unkempt iris
Yes
glass mortar
welcome to midnight
glass mortar
:))))
pastel pendant
That’s so shitty
unkempt iris
Its the buff you get from BTE
glass mortar
but its ok u get the super fun apex gameplay to replace ace chaining
unkempt iris
And because we’re doomed to always strive for 6 7…
unkempt iris
Sometimes it resets at 6 and it feels glorious
unkempt iris
Outlaw is just a dopamine rush spec
Feels good when it goes your way, feels awful when it doesnt
gaunt phoenix
dorp
timid idol
keen belfry
and might be like hmm we blow
timid idol
i would like someone
to write an in depth explanation
as to what was the thought process behind the new hidden opportunity
like how is it supposed to work and what is it supposed to work with
nocturne wren
Any LOG LORDS able to help me go through a failed key log? I was doing 123k overall. felt waaay behind and in general feel like ive been struggling
keen belfry
to write an in depth explanation
the common 2 stances are:
they forgot about HO
they left it unplayable for future rework
cedar kernel
us next season
crackshot again?
keen belfry
imagine they just bring back a 6 second window of BTE off CD
rough oriole
am i genuinely missing something or like some sort of interaction with the class
keen belfry
like BTE has a % chance to just enter crazy mode doing tricks on it mode and let u spam BTE for 6 seconds no CD infinite cps
sturdy hamlet
like BTE has a % chance to just enter crazy mode doing tricks on it mode and let...
“Doing tricks on it mode”
keen belfry
bouncing on it mode
mighty pivot
us next season
are we going to run 50% haste to offset the energy loss?
vagrant saddle
dw new set will be another bandaid for energy
mighty pivot
imagine if the 2p is just buffed combat potency or fatal flourish to what they were
and 4p is +1 cp for ace and opportunity or +1 cp for ruthlessness
torn plover
Is cloud cover still bugged where you don't have to stand in it to get the buff?
Also should I just replace ambush with sinister strike?
mighty pivot
cloud is still bugged last I checked and you never ambush unless you are talent into hidden opportunity (which you aren't hopefully)
cinder relic
!ban @delicate latch
safe pasture
what decides if we should take flickering over theifs vers?
i got 27% haste with pot
torn plover
cloud is still bugged last I checked and you never ambush unless you are talent ...
Tyty, I'll whip that mofo off my action bars
mighty pivot
safe pasture
idk maybe im crazy but i liked pre re work way more feely wise. minus killing spree lol
lime lake
🏄♀️ 🏄
mighty pivot
I am still amazed by the fact that he manually adds the emojis and it's not a signature
mighty pivot
@wintry solar your input is mandatory
wintry solar
L post
mighty pivot
mean
pastel pendant
Outlaw feels ok to play one thing I’ve noticed is the bte resets don’t feel as smooth anymore even when u don’t have to use a builder
Just idk maybe just the way the game plays now
It doesn’t flow as smoothly
Just feels off
wintry solar
inch deep and a mile wide
thorny zinc
yea if they made bte resets so u didnt need a builder would b pretty fun
pastel pendant
And prep on gcd feels like the worst thing ever
It’s legit a global where u just don’t get to press anything
I hate it
last cape
@vivid vessel @keen belfry do yall have gamer back
last cape
xd
vivid vessel
but no im rather lean
vivid vessel
last cape
😭
vivid vessel
and the guy also has the typical gamer/reddit mod face/body
like what you imagine a disgusting wow player to look like
its that guy
safe pasture
how are people running deadly pursuit is it not jsut terrible?
vivid vessel
who is doign that
safe pasture
idk i see 2 pplz on murlock who have it somehow
safe pasture
cray
cedar kernel
zac still awake the night fighter
keen belfry
i don’t think im allowed to send the picture in here.
why would anyone post that
wintry solar
i don’t think im allowed to send the picture in here.
plz share
dense bridge
wild bobcat
so lads, i've been trying out outlaw in keys now since sub i dunno if its me being bad or the spec itself feels slightly underwhelming in 21s and 22s (probably me being bad). it seems like my BF overall is like always 30k dps lower compared to the better logs but the uptime on logs are very similar like probably within a 1-2% uptime difference (depends if there are deaths)... any tips or do i just mash harder?
vivid vessel
well bf damage is your damage
that you do
with all your spells
if your bf damage is 30k dps lower its just that your are doing x amount of dps less in single target
which is then cleaved
dull ginkgo
@vivid vessel what talents do we use for paladins?
vivid vessel
m+ talents
dull ginkgo
m+ talents
Including this?
vivid vessel
y
or maybe not idk
never stopped to ask myself the question
it was obvious before the ace chage
now maybe not
who knows !
dull ginkgo
Halp
frail veldt
so the ghosts on MC 2nd boss, if a tank individual pops it does it even aoe the group?
thorny zinc
zac is ur plater still on wago
vivid vessel
yes
thorny zinc
goat
vivid vessel
i know ty
cedar wyvern
any way to turn off the smoke bomb i cant see shit on the floor for crown
vivid vessel
particle density low
normal hawk
Are you still using the tww wago one or is there an updated one?
grim spear
any way to turn off the smoke bomb i cant see shit on the floor for crown
drop it outside somewhere on purpose
sacred rune
wait, people still use plater?
is it stable now, i had a lot of issues every time i tested it and now stick with platynator
hardy thicket
Been using plater since release. Was wonky first 2 weeks but works like a charm now.
sacred rune
ah, nice
silent bear
quick question, returning rogue players but how does tricks work nowadays? I have the 1 hour tricks but it definitely does not redirect all threat perma
sacred rune
The 1h tricks buff only triggers after activation of tott
normal hawk
You need to hit something within 30s of tricks
sacred rune
so you need to use tricks on your tank once, and get the 1h buff after
sacred rune
after that, it works for the duration
however
if you die, need to do it again, as the buff gets removed
also, tricks was tricky always
silent bear
but even with the 1h buff I rip aggro
like if tank is dragging a pack and gathered little threat I just rip it
sacred rune
there is a small delay in thread redirecting
so if you are the first one to attack a pack and mobs melee
silent bear
yeah that always used to be a thing
sacred rune
you get the melee hit before tricks works
silent bear
but now couple globals in I can rip threat
sacred rune
so best practice is, to stand a bit further away (idealy outside of melee range) and use storm
if you want to "pull" before the tank does
gaunt palm
storm? 
silent bear
lmao
sacred rune
haha
hardy thicket
Does it perma redirect threat or does it go on ICD
sacred rune
there is no icd
hardy thicket
Then theres some user error here
silent bear
but then it should effectively redirect 100% threat perma after its up?
cause I swear to god it does not work like that
normal hawk
For an hour
hardy thicket
I have never had these issues Ken
sacred rune
thread generation is kinda low for the non active tanking person
hardy thicket
So you are doing something wrong
sacred rune
so you should not get aggro, but it does not stop others from doing so
e.g. paladins or warriors still need to be careful
gaunt palm
If the mobs has anything else than you targeted, you are good. The problem is if you social/pull adds before tank.
burnt tangle
I mean its kinda easy to notice perma tricks working, if for example your tank dies on the first pull of AA -> as soon as he releases he will gain new threat from you aoeing the pack
silent bear
I will log some runs later today, just doing 12 crest farms so havent bothered logging
hardy thicket
Ive only had deaths to body pull or the slight delay when ive been too fast to engage but ripping threat once ToTT is active no
So something is off
sacred rune
there are some rare bugs, we already had in beta for certain spells to not work.
gaunt palm
I believe also every "first time" you activate Tricks, the first damage you do, the threat goes on you, and THEN the actual effect activates. So if you reactivate tricks going into a pull and blast a big BTE, you might rip aggro
sacred rune
i don't remember this happening with tricks
but if you are unsure, just restart your game entirely and delete your cache folder in between
typically fixes weird unexplainable problems
slow granite
Started prog on paladins yesterday
Damn it feels bad to play outlaw there
Dmg is shiet
sacred rune
Started prog on paladins yesterday
Damn it feels bad to play outlaw there
if you feel down
do a pull on subtlety
it will make you fell way better on outlaw after
slow granite
Its worse yea I guess
sacred rune
subtlety is probably the weakest cleave spec in the game now
slow granite
I tried assa too but it feels the same pretty much
sacred rune
slow granite
subtlety is probably the weakest cleave spec in the game now
Gearing it up toh, for alleria
sacred rune
baloren is probably the main draw to it
aleria maybe slightly in fav of sub, but all 3 work on her
slow granite
Yea if RL doesnt ask me again Imma prolly stick to Outlaw
hardy thicket
Iuno ive only done one reclear on rogue since im not maining it but Paladins felt OK. I opted out of DS tho no sims was just a feelycraft move on the fly.
Not really a good fight for us cant do much to compete with the others
timid portal
on paladins you just hit no energy on certain point
fluid crown
Not a fan of how the rogue specs are melting into being good at the same thing
sacred rune
there are some exceptions to it
but rogue is typically balanced around all specs being close
which means the question is most of the time "is rogue good"
slow granite
Not really a good fight for us cant do much to compete with the others
Yea
+cloud cover made me die couple times bc i couldnt see the hammers on the floor
light mountain
+cloud cover made me die couple times bc i couldnt see the hammers on the floor
my log on pals was disgusting
i think my dmg taken was double the 2nd place
cloud cover was not humble
slow granite
my log on pals was disgusting
I care abt logs to a certain extent but being terribile in a fight AND eunning out of energy...feelsbad
foggy stump
!fuu
ornate heathBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
light mountain
I care abt logs to a certain extent but being terribile in a fight AND eunning o...
sry by logs i meant in the dmg taken
fluid crown
there are some exceptions to it
I was thinking more around us all being ST bots and our flavour being 90 sec, 2 min or no peaks
inland acorn
I care abt logs to a certain extent but being terribile in a fight AND eunning o...
Paladins was a fight, where I actually begged my raid lead to bench me
Because I just couldn't be asked to play this fight as outlaw, like i would rather just hit my head on the wall
sacred rune
I was thinking more around us all being ST bots and our flavour being 90 sec, 2 ...
I think rogue had good damage profiles and niches
its just a lot of these got purged or moved to other classes
fluid crown
Yeah, we used to have it. Now it feels kinda stale
hardy thicket
Rogue is delegated to old hunters position
light mountain
then didnt fix it till .5
still no prio and looks like they have no intention of changing it
maybe next xpac 🤷♂️
hardy thicket
I miss being tanky AF as Outlaw tbh
light mountain
Rogue is delegated to old hunters position
at least we have dr that only works on half the bosses
hunter pre mark brought 0
burnt tangle
I worked hard for this gear 
burnt tangle
was the 1 warbound hero item I had on main
hot portal
I'm trying to figure out how much DPS I'm losing by casting Dispatch and BtE at 5 combo points rather than 7. Does anyone have an approximate percentage?
hot portal
Yeah thats true, I Guess i ment 6/7
hot portal
its been hard to get it out of my system
inland acorn
I mean it's just muscle memory, if you keep doing it and correcting yourself at some point it will become natural
slow granite
Rogue is delegated to old hunters position
Do u think we'll ever get some raid utility beside the dr?
Something like +5% crit chance and 5% crit dmg?
Idk about numbers to tune it toh
inland acorn
No
Otherwise you'll just introduce imbalance, where class is technically supposed to have 1 raid buff
If they wanted, they could just bring smoke bomb back as raid util which worked similiar to AMZ in the past i think
slow granite
Oh ok, i see
Asking from a non expert player pov it feels like we bring..nothing
Can the dr diff be "felt"?
Bc im playing w/o war and that somehow shows in raid
The guy works too much
inland acorn
well, it's DR so your raid will take slightly less dmg
Issue with our DR is that:
- we need to be able to hit boss (alleria intermission for example sucks for this)
- It doesn't work if damage is attributed to environment instead of boss
slow granite
It would be better if they made something like a buff that puts 3.6% dr on u then
No?
On party i mean
primal thistle
gaunt phoenix
!prekey
ornate heathBOT
- Use Adrenaline Rush to activate Loaded Dice.
- As Trickster, use KS to activate Disorienting Strikes.
- Do NOT use RTB before the key, you will lose it.
- Use SND during the bubble once the key starts.
mild fable
!bugs
ornate heathBOT
[Outlaw bug Thread](#1276315296159760467 message)
unkempt dew
Its hot outside
inland acorn
just don't go outside
formal knot
tropic zephyr
radiant panther
outlaw as new alt causes me a lot of trouble, is it like one of the hardest spec in the game for m+ 
?
inland acorn
well, it is fast paced, reactive gameplay, with heavy reliance on uptime
And the more mistakes you make, the harder it will just snowball to blow in your face
solid grotto
Should we skip crafting weapon now and go for bonus roll mainhand? If I only play M+
inland acorn
why not both
sleek egret
its fast paced reactive gameplay, but the dps is super flat and I can't burst for the life of me 🙁
inland acorn
Crests are uncapped, you have probably billion sparks laying around
If the choice is to keep lower ilvl MH, until you bonus roll MH from dungeon
I would rather craft
solid grotto
Ah yes, Makes sense
sleek egret
Maerik, you are outlaw person. Anything I can do in like world content to just focus more on burst dps?
like rituals etc feel a bit slow on outlaw compared to sub for me. I think it's the low hp and high burst of sub that just makes it feel better.
inland acorn
No, we don't really have burst
It's upfront damage, that doesn't require much setup, but it will never beat burst in cds
sleek egret
meh, sub it is then for shit like that 🙂
inland acorn
best you could do is run on-use trinket that does big dam
sleek egret
Heh, I got a voidstalkers contract at max myth, but still 1.5min cooldown on that
gaunt phoenix
trinkets dont do dmg anymore
inland acorn
sleek egret
haha on low health ritual targets they do
inland acorn
https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1237499532590452817.webp?size=44
I would prefer grieftorch
tropic zephyr
grief + boon goated duo
inland acorn
Tho cast time sucked
tropic zephyr
bacon was cringe compared to torch
inland acorn
Ye, but it was still nice mini nuke
Nowdays, all trinkets hit like noodle
I press alleria insignia and feel nothing 
jolly geyser
nocturne wren
homies. I might have to leave Outlaw forever and go to Sub/Assass. I can't figure out why my dmg is not where it should be in 15+ keys and such. feels like I am fine ST but am struggling to hit big numbers in AoE
I have a log of a failed key if anyone can look at it and help
slow granite
@vivid vessel sorry to bother!
Imma ask u a thing
I simmed myself and guidon + gaze sims better for some reason, even if it means going to 21% haste (switch to crit flask toh)
Now, u used to use it, did u use it on cd or did u w8 to have low energy/on cds?
inland acorn
<@352916297262301194> sorry to bother!
Imma ask u a thing
I simmed myself and gu...
On cd
inland acorn
I have a log of a failed key if anyone can look at it and help
Use !log
And post it there, maybe someone will take a look
vital cedar
anybody know how to just play a sound when bte back up/resets, thats all i want, just a simple sound
inland acorn
Could also record yourself hitting dummies for 1-2 min with gcd history shown on screen. Easiest way to spot issues without mundane dig through log
inland acorn
anybody know how to just play a sound when bte back up/resets, thats all i want...
Cdm has option, but sound plays when gcd is ready
vital cedar
yeah its real bad
vivid vessel
<@352916297262301194> sorry to bother!
Imma ask u a thing
I simmed myself and gu...
on cd ye
nocturne wren
Could also record yourself hitting dummies for 1-2 min with gcd history shown on...
ye in a controlled environment I wont have the same mistakes
slow granite
Thank you both!
nocturne wren
on a dummy, I am fine. I crank
inland acorn
ye in a controlled environment I wont have the same mistakes
Are you sure about that
inland acorn
Post log with command
nocturne wren
inland acorn
Maybe someone will check it later
I can already tell you
You're making mistakes
Just from checking your slice uptime
ebon dock
!log
main radish
Guys are we Holding BtE before AR is Coming up?
gaunt phoenix
if AR is under 30s you should, but supercharged bte is bugged so it hardly matters
main radish
And does anyone of u guys have decent key% Logs ? Somehow I dont get over 50 Which is Strange as my Raid Logs Are 85+
gaunt phoenix
idk, seen a few good parses
pure folio
50 is very low, prob rotation issue
Could also be where ur standing, not getting value from ur bf
mighty pivot
50 is by definition average
pure folio
If he’s 85+ in raid, 50 is a drastic difference
gaunt phoenix
some of it is how you pull and raidbuffs
pure folio
Given he did not know about holding bte, I assume it cannot be 20+
mighty pivot
no it's like 0.5%
pure folio
Ik im just saying, if ur doing high keys you’re more than likely optimizing the best u can
vivid vessel
i mena if you are doing high keys
there is legit
3 people
logging
not hard to get a blue log
when there is 10 logs
chilly abyss
xdddd
meager sphinx
whats the best sim for outlaw?
pure folio
3 people
Feel like one would use context clues at that point though and not ask why they’re blue parsing
pure folio
whats the best sim for outlaw?
For gear dslice
meager sphinx
okay and just for dps?
pure folio
Depends what u want it for, droute or patchwork 5 mins with diff targets
meager sphinx
can i go with 5 target 1 min? or is 5 min even better with more targets?
pure folio
I mean you can, short sims undervalue haste and assume you have your tea charges. Sim for what you’re trying to see, that’d really only replicate your opener
gaunt phoenix
you sim for gear you dont really sim 'for dps'
unless you like wanna know your target dummy damage and then try to match it
if your droute is 182k it's not like i need to hit that or im bad
idk
meager sphinx
alright i appreciate it ❤️
main radish
Given he did not know about holding bte, I assume it cannot be 20+
19 resil started 10 days ago - have been away for 3 years.
main radish
Gonna start 20s now soon 😌
Just seems strange to See Green/Blue Logs on my rogue
But I also didnt put a lot of time into learning the changes since dragonflight - i did a bit of vod Research on Zac
pure folio
Like Zac said, In higher keys means less logs meaning you are more than likely going to be lower. But people do log reviews if you just !log and post a link in the thread that opens
If you’re doing 19/20s you’re doing good tho :)
main radish
Gonna improve and then Post 🤣 thanks guys
keen belfry
posting is how you improve!
stable lantern
!log