#outlaw
inland acorn
somber ridge
How do people feel about the current version of outlaw?
gaunt phoenix
but you don't need exactly 25%
frail veldt
How do people feel about the current version of outlaw?
varies wildly depending on who you ask lol
just like our dps
somber ridge
varies wildly depending on who you ask lol
So either you hate it or you love it kind of deal?
harsh forge
UHUH Crackshot vanish was peak
tranquil tartan
but you don't need exactly 25%
can you explain?
frail veldt
outlaw has a lot of problems
somber ridge
I didnt play midnight so far and as soon as I saw underhanded upperhand or whatever the fuck the talent was called was gone I thought I'd give it a try
frail veldt
some of which were introduced in midnight
midnight solved some things that some people considered problems
gaunt phoenix
can you explain?
you need haste for energy, but you dont magically unlock something at 25% haste compared to 24.5%
it's just you approach this value, energy gets better
frail veldt
but many would say it introduced more problems than it solved lol
inland acorn
I don't think it even introduced problems
frail veldt
it did
harsh forge
current outlaw is just walmart tww outlaw
frail veldt
it very much did
inland acorn
More like just exposed issue, that was masked with crackshot and UHUH
keen belfry
stop reminding me of rtb
gaunt phoenix
i agree with most of this #outlaw message
frail veldt
energy is an issue due to how they shuffled around what generates energy
harsh forge
instead of the spec feeling bad when you make a mistake and mess up adr up time now you just pool energy to sinister strike when you run out of thistle tea
frail veldt
low target cleave is extremely problematic cuz they added an energy cost to bf
yeah zacs post is very good
inland acorn
energy is an issue due to how they shuffled around what generates energy
idk if i would call shuffling
nuking every talent that had energy gen
frail veldt
idk if i would call shuffling
pick a word it doesnt matter
inland acorn
inland acorn
Yes
frail veldt
they introduced a lot of issues to the spec that did not exist before
inland acorn
But technically problem existed before
inland acorn
We just never noticed, because we had 100% ADR uptime
inland acorn
So we were just sitting on energy
inland acorn
that's true
inland acorn
Deft energy change is just mistake
frail veldt
there are a lot of mistakes lol
harsh forge
tea would be better if it was like passive +25% enery regen or something
frail veldt
literally yeah
somber ridge
Huh. Now energy is not something I want to worry about when playing outlaw tbh. I wanna mash buttons on my button mash spec pls
frail veldt
just feels like they didnt actually take us two steps forward
tranquil tartan
i agree with most of this https://discord.com/channels/124169701881282560/316923...
my biggest gripe from this entire list is that we can't just Adr after Prep to extend our original Adr
inland acorn
My biggest gripe is prep existing
frail veldt
prep is pretty awkward
inland acorn
Which is basically going against whole identity of outlaw
frail veldt
though it is kinda nice to have somewhat of a "big damage" thing
inland acorn
of CDR
frail veldt
for start of key
ive always wanted a non cdr big cooldown for outlaw
but prep was not it lol
frail veldt
yeah exactly
inland acorn
Like we're all about CDR and stuff
And now we press prep which wastes
literal minutes of our cdr
to reset couple abilities
every 4 minutes
granite quarry
Did you guys get accepted in pugs in 20s ? It looks like every group is playing uh devo or random mix non-phys comp
random stirrup
there are a ton of phys pugs at the 20-21 range on na
granite quarry
Nothing for outlaws
granite quarry
there are a ton of phys pugs at the 20-21 range on na
There is no one at this time in EU
Sadge
It's my key or nothing ig
gusty pagoda
when should I be using pot in m+?
modern shoal
Why do people think outlaw is ass I never really get beat in overall
granite quarry
Why do people think outlaw is ass I never really get beat in overall
Cause outside the phys comp is kinda the case no ?
inland acorn
if compared to meta
modern shoal
ohh
granite quarry
But why war is getting buffed and no rogues idk
modern shoal
I didn't really know that. I main aug but outlaw has felt really good
inland acorn
I mean it feels good
Its defo very good in just weekly keys
even without phys comp
granite quarry
Exactly, like a lot of melee tbh
modern shoal
I was going to say its like the second best melee
heavy shadow
What's the command to see optimal haste/crit caps?
lucid sparrow
isnt it just terribly shit design
this spec relies on 4 aura buffs
to be viable in high keys
to be ''invitable''
inland acorn
dont forget also, tank routing around your target cap
buoyant stratus
there are a ton of phys pugs at the 20-21 range on na
Na rshams need a home
lucid sparrow
and yea it needs to have a catered route
modern shoal
I guess
lucid sparrow
genuinely such massive problems shouldnt exist for a spec
modern shoal
anything under 20 any class is fine
heavy shadow
!stats
lucid sparrow
biggest tragedy
ornate heathBOT
Outlaw's stat prio is generally Crit > Haste* > Vers >= Mastery.
- You need ~21-23% haste for energy, this has priority over crit. That's the haste on your stat page after talents/buffs/flask.
- Crit is then your best stat until you approach ~40%, from there random vers or mastery pieces will be similar.
- You have to use
Raidbots Top Gear to determine the exact combination of pieces to use.
inland acorn
anything under 20 any class is fine
yes
placid vapor
dont forget also, tank routing around your target cap
2 target bosses
random stirrup
Na rshams need a home
filtering for groups without udk I see all the phys enjoyers 
heavy shadow
You know when it says you need ~21-23% haste for energy, is that unbuffed or in a raid?
buoyant stratus
filtering for groups without udk I see all the phys enjoyers <:peepoBlanket:8585...
Play fdk in phys comp is good
inland acorn
You know when it says you need ~21-23% haste for energy, is that unbuffed or in ...
unbuffed
buoyant stratus
Fdk fury assa bear rsham believe it
random stirrup
you will not catch me dead on that spec
but also
just play unholy in the phys comp
its good
buoyant stratus
Its ight
random stirrup
you dont like?
my fav comp atm is triple plate chuds
ret arms udk buds walking into a key
craggy barn
my fav is when a udk tells me they arent tanky
inland acorn
ah yes, the only class in the game
that still has
how many defensives and self healing ?
6 ?
craggy barn
a good player too who has only played udk
modern shoal
My fav is when a udk low parse and tells me its cause of bugs
craggy barn
and claims udk arent tanky
random stirrup
going up key levels as udk is so weird
you immune so many mechanics that the keys all feel the same kinda
modern shoal
^ this for my aug. Straight payphoning
buoyant stratus
What about
Also good psure dropping feral flr surv in phys is just faster
crude flower
Yea, ngl i feel the same going off hunter
Cause they made hunters walking tanks
The tallent "touch grass" or whatever gives like 10% Max hp
crude flower
Also good psure dropping feral flr surv in phys is just faster
BM seems p good too right?
Idk i haven't looked at M+ in forever
i just come on for my 2 raid days
glass mortar
hunter glowup was real
they were among the squishier classes like 2 expacs ago
they got turbo buffed last expac tho
and then not really nerfed this expac
so they r tanky af now
granite quarry
How you guys sims ?
Is : Dungeon Slice - 3 minutes - 8 targets - Nightly a good parameter ?
crude flower
and i don't think it's coping with it's new lifestyle well
inland acorn
How you guys sims ?
Is : Dungeon Slice - 3 minutes - 8 targets - Nightly a good...
1t 5 min for st
dslice for m+
dungeonRoute for more in-depth m+
glass mortar
u dont mess around with the settings in dslice
i dont think they do anything its hardcoded duration
just the buffs if u wanna
inland acorn
yes
granite quarry
1t 5 min for st
dslice for m+
dungeonRoute for more in-depth m+
Minutes and targets in dungeon slice are w/e ?
inland acorn
you can't change them, they're hardcoded
granite quarry
Oh yes I can see it
gusty pagoda
its so night and day
udk is like actual dogshit to play tho after pruning
I don't think there is a less enjoyable spec to play than unholy
gusty pagoda
okay yeah but i'm talking more about playstyle because dk is op rn but still sucks to play
gusty pagoda
dunno haven't played mage like ever
but the udk guide has this as a con so you know it's bad 
craggy barn
idk hard to say thats really a con when like
every spec got prunned
and udk isnt like 3 buttons
granite quarry
https://murlok.io/character/eu/twisting-nether/speedyo/pve
Speedyo gear is so unreal wtf
craggy barn
udk is simple, but sure is a lot of other specs
imo sub is arguably in the same boat
i find sin way more engaging than sub rn
gusty pagoda
yeah I dislike what they did to sub as well
but I've played udk for like 15 years so that's probably why I dislike the changes more
craggy barn
udk is my main second dps character
unique zealot
craggy barn
its much simpler than before, but shrug
gusty pagoda
I usually play rogue when not playing dk but it's still not really close
might actually swap over to rogue now tho
craggy barn
gusty pagoda
I always play on and off
I usually play for like 3-4 months then take a break and come back a patch later
gusty pagoda
based
craggy barn
when i play dk its usually blood
gusty pagoda
I'll probably start maining that on dk
craggy barn
like rn my rog is semi benched for raiding, since im bdk tank in raid
neat elbow
are you supposed to stealth up and press adr in stealth for the smoke bomb?
craggy barn
no
stealth has nothing to do with smoke bomb
stealht has no offensive meaning for outlaw rogue right now
neat elbow
ya i didnt say it did
i asked about using adrenaline rush pre pull
do you care about that first smoke bomb
craggy barn
if u prepull adr at the wrong time u could just lose adr if ur talking about raid
but u adr first global yes
but idk what u mean by "care" about the smoke bomb
frail veldt
what is this interface?
neat elbow
Ya I just assumed you are pressing it pre pull cause looking at all the logs it’s off their cast timeline
burnt dragon
(i wish i did heroic march so that ring would be hero)
granite quarry
what is this interface?
OAK LFG Sorter
craggy barn
Ya I just assumed you are pressing it pre pull cause looking at all the logs it’...
its probably right before combat starts, so wcl isnt picking it up
its weird, since u dont want to press it too early in prepull
since they changed some prepull shit in tww
burnt dragon
but idk what u mean by "care" about the smoke bomb
sounds like they're asking if you wait to be in melee range to pop AR so the cloud cover stays in range
craggy barn
being in the cloud doesnt matter
the cloud buff refreshes at the end of the duration regardless
craggy barn
and im answering what u think the question is
burnt dragon
granite quarry
I'm running with 24.91 haste with buffs, this is not enough right ?
It's like 771 in raw
neat elbow
sounds like they're asking if you wait to be in melee range to pop AR so the clo...
ya thats what i meant
cursive gyro
You should always cloud cover away from the mobs so you can actually see your feet.
frail veldt
I'm running with 24.91 haste with buffs, this is not enough right ?
depends on your sim
some people will find that they end up at like 24.5
some people above 25
just sim yourself
there isnt really a blanket correct haste to be at
red pike
yo how much cirit do i need for outlaw ?
and haste
keen belfry
a lot
harsh forge
a lot
red pike
Ty
cinder relic
its not like sub with a hard cutoff
keen belfry
pit good spam
not a lot of myth tier in there so after that u can decide btween stuff like MC, skyreach etc
gusty pagoda
why did no one tell me a +16 feels the same as a +14
lucid sparrow
why did no one tell me a +16 feels the same as a +14
it all feels the same until 20+
cinder relic
Pit+Skyreach?
Pit for general gear, skyreach for tier and a good trinket
not bis but like, fine
lucid sparrow
Pit for general gear, skyreach for tier and a good trinket
cinder relic
I've had this pfp longer
lucid sparrow
actually, its not the same pfp
cinder relic
POSER
lucid sparrow
IF YOU LOOK CLOSELY
MINE HAS A LIL BIT MORE ZOOM
SO ACTUALLY, I'M UNIQUE AND HAVE HAD THIS FOR LONGER
cinder relic
STB
gusty pagoda
it all feels the same until 20+
Shit i should ball harder
lucid sparrow
lucid sparrow
Shit i should ball harder
are u purely pugging
as an outlaw its near impossible
without premade
which is why im a proud devourer!
spec is actually alot more interesting than it seemed on the surface
formal thunder
me after the 3rd Seat 19 deplete cause people aren't focusing tentacles, only to suddenly attack it after the void has closed in and I blinded it at basically full health
gusty pagoda
are u purely pugging
yeah
But I did do the 14 and 16 with a tank from my guild so got an easy group. I expected +16 to be harder since I didn't really notice a difference in dmg intake in the +16
& yeah devourer is actually surpisingly nuanced for the amount of buttons it has
final pagoda
any tips for paladins ?
final pagoda
any sheningans to do w/ numbing poison?
unkempt iris
Nahh
Actually im curious if thats actually helpful for the tanks
But ideally your tanks should have more than 4 collective brain cells so that its a non-issue
glass mortar
its a decent passive dr for the tank
BF will keep it applied to mostly everything directly around u
we attack very very fast
lots of poison applications
uncut karma
when using preparation do we wait for the first adrenaline rush to fade before popping it again or do we send it for cp generation
glass mortar
u wait for AR, bte and BR to all be on cd at once
so basically u BR AR BtE > go until BtE goes on cd > prep > BtE
unkempt iris
when using preparation do we wait for the first adrenaline rush to fade before p...
You use it as soon as everything is off cd, keep getting BTE resets
Then you can decide if you wanna hold ur next AR for bte to be off cd or if you wanna just rip it
uncut karma
kk so BR and BtE are the main reasons for resetting. and then we want to clip KS there for the double unseen blade proc ?
unkempt iris
Correct
In keys it doesnt always have to play out that way ofc
Outlaw is inherently a vibes based spec, def requires the most practice of all dps specs imo because a lot of it comes down to your decision making on the fly
And ofc the rng
uncut karma
yea there are these little weird interactions sometimes that i feel are so nuanced and niche idk if its even worth asking, but they drive me crazy. like in a big aoe pull is it worth to clip the first KS before preparation or is it better to BR-BtE spam and then clip KS
unkempt iris
Yeah thats the appeal of the spec id argue, lots of player agency in terms of your judgement
And sometimes questions will just lead you to more questions
uncut karma
yea i was under the impressious KS is just an energy resource and fazed buff applicator
unkempt iris
At the end of the day, pressing more buttons faster and executing everything at the fundamental level is gonna be the most important, the nuances arent gonna make or break imo
unkempt iris
yea i was under the impressious KS is just an energy resource and fazed buff app...
I mean latently it is an energy resource since in FB you have some energy talents
But yeah its mainly for the double strike
The fazed application is redundant because BF does it anyways
uncut karma
i mainly do m+ outlaw so idk what we swap for raid
unkempt iris
Just the BF talents for summarily dispatched usually
Also you can play either hero talent in raid, dont let people tell you otherwise
You CAN play FB in m+, i do but im only timing 20’s atm due to lack of time but its indisputable that trickster is much better on the giga pulls like in AA or Pit
final pagoda
outside AA or Pit, did u find any difference w/ FB in keys?
uncut karma
is fatebound just better prio damage at that level
final pagoda
BF will keep it applied to mostly everything directly around u
no need for some sheningans? just making sure ur in BF range for the 3 bosses?
unkempt iris
In my experience FB just feels more streamlined and smoother due to energy talents and not requiring KS
glass mortar
ye
unkempt iris
KS is a horrible ability in its current state, does as much as instant poison in overall
Rather just spam more dispatches and have better energy as well as put the talent point from KS into something else
final pagoda
what about your overalls?
lime lake
why would i wear overalls
unkempt iris
If i wasnt on my phone id dig for the logs
keen belfry
why would i wear overalls
why not
final pagoda
why would i wear overalls
because bis?
lime lake
idk actually
unkempt iris
But i can say the highest overall ive had was in a 19 pit at i wanna say like 198k but that was pugged keep in mind
lime lake
maybe i should wear overalls
unkempt iris
In FB of course
keen belfry
But i can say the highest overall ive had was in a 19 pit at i wanna say like 19...
keepin that in mind rn
uncut karma
But i can say the highest overall ive had was in a 19 pit at i wanna say like 19...
is the FB spec your running one of the wowhead builds or what
unkempt iris
is the FB spec your running one of the wowhead builds or what
Nah its just the trickster build but instead of KS you get acro strikes and sleight of hand
unkempt iris
keepin that in mind rn
I wish i could join a group that actually gave me shaman buff and at least mystic or shout
Instead i must settle for quel’thalas mages 
quiet root
it's interesting that the fatebound tree in the faq doesn't have sleight by default
i feel like sleight does so much but maybe i'm just coping
unkempt iris
I think its because it hasnt been updated yet
keen belfry
Instead i must settle for quel’thalas mages <:bingdespair:1186556403863797811>
you need to try our ragnaros ele shamans
unkempt iris
Awang you’re gonna give me a hernia
keen belfry
awang
unkempt iris
i feel like sleight does so much but maybe i'm just coping
It does in keys, raid is personal preference but in keys getting a 3 set or jackpot is a massive dps increase in big pulls
uncut karma
doesnt trickster already take slight of hand? so i just swap KS for acro?
unkempt iris
It didnt originally but yeah now you do
So just copy trickster and put KS into acro or sleight whichever you don’t have
uncut karma
that sounds worth a try
unkempt iris
Oh wait does trickster take flickering steel in the choice node?
uncut karma
yea
unkempt iris
If the faq has you take that, you can swap it for the vers buff
Since FB gives u enough energy to work with, and vers in higher keys is always a W
uncut karma
i dig it
unkempt iris
I will play FB until they make the gap bigger than 10%
it just feels much better imo
Trickster would be perfectly fine if KS did more damage than a holy priest’s smite
But then FB would prob run it as well so 
uncut karma
so when you AR and it flips on the side, does your next dispatch have a chance to keep flipping it like that?
unkempt iris
so when you AR and it flips on the side, does your next dispatch have a chance t...
I would believe so but frankly ive never looked at the intricacies of the hero talent’s coins
I just treat it as it is, automated benefits
But yeah the FB talent that gives SS another cp on opportunity proc is genuinely what seals the deal for me on why its better
frail veldt
I will play FB until they make the gap bigger than 10%
I can't play without perma tricks ngl
glass mortar
perma tricks on class tree.....
radiant wyvern
perma tricks on class tree.....
the last night = hero talents gone = perma tricks on class tree ? 
unkempt iris
I can't play without perma tricks ngl
It doesnt apply to me as much because even with perma tricks i would still cast tricks on every pull out of habit 😭😭😭
frail veldt
It doesnt apply to me as much because even with perma tricks i would still cast...
well tricks isnt always there
thats why perma tricks is nice
cuz tricks has a cd
unkempt iris
Well yeah i know but id still do it anyways so im not terribly worried, plus i only play nelf so i always have my 2 get out of jail free cards :p
burnt torrent
How strong is shaman buff for Outlaw in m+?
inland acorn
How strong is shaman buff for Outlaw in m+?
!fuu
ornate heathBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
inland acorn
has all buffs listed
burnt torrent
Ty
frail veldt
lemme know what i did good/bad?
whats this doing there
lime lake
inland acorn
Also, are you rerolling from sub/sin ?
Your OH is higher ilvl than MH
You missed at least 1 extra Prep usage
Your adrenaline uptime is way lower than expected
You pressed KiR 3 times only, while you had 11 jackpots in this dungeon
You seem to just not be pressing buttons fast enough, your casts overall seem very low
You're also on ~18.5% haste, which means you probably should use haste flask instead of crit
I'm sorry to say this but
You should spent 15minutes reading through #outlaw-faq because there's a lot of basic mistakes here
viscid scaffold
!prekey
ornate heathBOT
- Use
Adrenaline Rush to activate 
Loaded Dice. - As Trickster, use
KS to activate 
Disorienting Strikes. - Do NOT use
RTB before the key, you will lose it. - Use
SND during the bubble once the key starts.
formal isle
Crazy question: Does the Solarflare Prism not sim well on Dungeon Slice? When I sim my top end of gear, it has my heroic Feather/Gaze beating a Mythic Prism. But I see everyone using it. Just curious.
soft abyss
they are better than prism
wheat canyon
Your OH is higher ilvl than MH
i thought you needed a sword in MH for outlaw?
wheat canyon
i was pretty bad at keeping dice up, im usually not that bad. i got unlucky with my rolls though
formal isle
But why is everyone running Prism/Gaze? Heroic feather can't be that rare
soft abyss
gaze is the best by far
and plume
the rest are worse
probably myth guidon is the third best
formal isle
Yeah, I currently don't really plan to have access to Myth raid trinkets. Was just curious. I know Gaze is like, autolocked in, but just figured I'd clarify on the second trinket.
soft abyss
whatever Sims best for you
also people may not have different trinket for raid and m
so maybe something Sims better in ST
But the 3 I stated are better than the rest
inland acorn
i thought you needed a sword in MH for outlaw?
Yes, but my question was, why is your OH higher ilvl than MH (is it dagger for sub/sin ?)
inland acorn
i was pretty bad at keeping dice up, im usually not that bad. i got unlucky with...
also he is not talking about your run, fyi
wheat canyon
Yes, but my question was, why is your OH higher ilvl than MH (is it dagger for s...
its a dagger that has the embellishment on it, so i figured that was better to upgrade than the plain sword
outer meteor
i was pretty bad at keeping dice up, im usually not that bad. i got unlucky with...
i have no idea what that means
but i agree
inland acorn
its a dagger that has the embellishment on it, so i figured that was better to u...
I'm pretty sure
That ilvl on Mh is worth more
And you could also confirm this, by running a sim
Actually
I'm not even sure if embellishments are affected by ilvl
wheat canyon
I'm not even sure if embellishments are affected by ilvl <:Hmm:88903212662272819...
tbh i figured they were? ig i never thought about how they couldnt be
thick vigil
Outlaw good on lura? Starting prog today
cinder relic
Its solid yeah
deep tide
I don't know if the person who made RogueFlow is in this discord.
But, I'd love to buy them a coffee.
glacial tapir
Outlaw good on lura? Starting prog today
the top 100+ are all sub, only about 20 ppl have killed on outlaw, it's markedly worse dmg
glacial tapir
You can play whatever you want and maybe you'll ge tlucky on rolls
vivid vessel
sub legit only wins secret phase
and secret phase is giga damage amp
irrelevant damage
all fake
rest of the fight outlaw does the same or better boss damage
its just that no one plays outlaw
glacial tapir
i can see that
long barn
Anyone know why no matter what I do I cannot get raidbots to recommend dagger from Pit as BIS in offhand over Hunt Craft?
Solo is hunt really that good or i the sim jacked?
gaunt phoenix
u need an arcanoweave somewhere to replace hunt
gaunt phoenix
let's see
dusty magnet
@vivid vessel have you tested st asa and stalling a set?
I was curious I think it could be better
Especially as you could save pot for execute %
cinder relic
the top 100+ are all sub, only about 20 ppl have killed on outlaw, it's markedly...
parses =/= the best sp[ec
I think whatever spec u have geared/are mentally the best at is gonna do u best on that fight
rogue kinda just spectates that fight
harsh forge
so far into the season it doesnt matter what you play anymore
long barn
@gaunt phoenix check DM
vivid vessel
<@352916297262301194> have you tested st asa and stalling a set?
stalling ?
isnt that the russian guy
earnest sphinx
Zac did u time the mt24?
vivid vessel
no
earnest sphinx
gg
earnest sphinx
fakin tanks man..
vivid vessel
next week mayvbe we play more than 2 nights
earnest sphinx
report
vivid vessel
and we time keys
vivid vessel
earnest sphinx
so many broken legs..
dusty magnet
stalling ?
Talking about seat last boss for amp
vivid vessel
ah
idk
we delayu 2 sets already
im sending 1min30 on pull
we delay 1st
and 2nd for 2mins
in 23
for 22 we only delay 2nd one
cause we overkill it now
long barn
@vivid vessel are you porting and going sub for last boss seat?
vivid vessel
ye
long barn
@gaunt phoenix - Nothing makes beetle BIS. What am I missing?
vivid vessel
whats wrong with this sim
hardy vault
Think he wants 298 offhand to outsim crafted?
vivid vessel
ah thats the dagger name
well idk all these things are kina whatever i dont really expect them to win or lose necesseraly
you are trading off hand ilvl for wrist ilvl '
hardy vault
Embellishment is just very good too
vivid vessel
the weapon embel is higher ilvl cause of 295
and ye idk
its just
bunch of random gear that are equivalent
its not really surprising to me
long barn
i mean yea we are tlaking like 500 dps
vivid vessel
all these pieces are legit the same
hardy vault
Also embellish scales with ilvl, so a 295 hunt is marginally better than a 285 arcanoweave
vivid vessel
like even just getting a straight up 3 ilvl upgrade on any piece
that isnt like main piece like chest head legs or main hand
is prolly already just a .2% gain at most
long barn
does hunt work the same in Dungeon and raid?
long barn
like the verbage is weird
vivid vessel
hunt is weird
idk
its a stat based on mob type
void prolly sim the same than hunt tho
cinder relic
I'm sure some dungeons hunt will be better, or worse but like
long barn
so its Worth More on bosses?
vivid vessel
so its Worth More on bosses?
no we dont really know
cinder relic
its probs just better on average
vivid vessel
no one really looked at mobs in dungeons
long barn
blah
vivid vessel
to figure out
cinder relic
I think at a certain point we get into overoptimizing stuff yk
long barn
fair
but it sbeen that way since 2018
been coming here for .01% upgrades for almost a decade
blizz kinda forced us
leaden sonnet
And just averages them p sure
It distributes them based on the bosses in the raid. So if 2/9 bosses give haste then its gonna give haste 2/9 (aka 22.2%) of the time
vivid vessel
i didnt know that
leaden sonnet
But you can manually edit it to give whatever stat you want
cinder relic
Ah
vivid vessel
its whatever tho it wont change shit really
leaden sonnet
Is there a WA to track what hunt is giving?
No, and it would be completely redundant anyway
cinder relic
I remember it working differently for similar effects in sims but sure
vivid vessel
can sim void its basically the same
long barn
its only too see if its good or not then I would remove it
cinder relic
Just use logs
light mountain
Anyone know why no matter what I do I cannot get raidbots to recommend dagger fr...
Tried as well with a few embellishments but crafted dagger came on top
frail veldt
Mine was 0.2% better
So any minor secondary changes can skew it
Also within margin of error
light mountain
I rolled the dagger early too but tbh still good to have since im using it for belo and also to swap on last boss of seat
rough oriole
is there something im not understanding
for the past literal 7 days
ive been getting sub rogues picked over me
olive talon
Dumb question but is the 12.0.7 loot going to fuck over M+ only players even more-so?
rough oriole
im gonna scream
olive talon
since it drops at 298 for helm, belt, neck, ring
true jackal
frail veldt
ive been getting sub rogues picked over me
In m+?
Could be a lot of things
Ilvl, score, past season score, etc
thorny reef
anyone have a macro for lura kick?
earnest sphinx
#showtooltip Kick
/use [@boss3,exists,nodead,harm]Kick
/tm [@boss3,exists,nodead,harm] 3
First kick though
Who is the funny gif guy i think it was you @keen belfry
i made my own gif apparently
hollow bloom
Didn’t use tricks. Tsk tsk 
tranquil tartan
If you roll on an item and leave raid then it gets mailed to you can you still trade it to people?
vivid vessel
no
tranquil tartan
Oof
next veldt
next veldt
anyone have a macro for lura kick?
^
nocturne tinsel
big damage inbound
nova sinew
YET ANOTHER week of dogshit rolls! ring never :/
random stirrup
YET ANOTHER week of dogshit rolls! ring never :/
wtf speed leech socket!
high rolla
nova sinew
(surely)
i think broll stuff
has higher tert chance
i got leech/socket bracer from my pit broll too
nova sinew
mayb
vivid vessel
this season i feel like you see more of them
vapid sundial
dont tert me zac
nova sinew
i did roll avoid on hands tonight so could b
vapid sundial
ily
thinking about ramfam
rolling for avoidance on all gear
he had like
20% or something
xd
back in sl
long barn
im trying to get all leech rn
I had like 8% leech and I only healed like 8k
Feels not worth
nova sinew
sounds like you should do more damage
vivid vessel
I had like 8% leech and I only healed like 8k
ok but avoidance does nothing
you just feint
also every single damage in the game rn is rot damage
long barn
Yea but doesn’t it stack with feint
shell fossil
vivid vessel
Yea but doesn’t it stack with feint
ok but what damage in the game rn
do you need more than feint
if feint works on the damage
you are not taking any damage
if feint doesnt work on the damage
long barn
What if I had enough to not fient
long barn
Or less feints for energy?
I agree on the dots though.
I’m just not sure even at 15% leech it’s enough to make a difference
vivid vessel
you are never getting enough avoidance so that you dont feint things you should be feinting
vivid vessel
no
avoidance is aoe only
things you would press feint on
which is litteraly nothing in nowadays dungeon design
long barn
I thought some dots were classified still as AOE because of crap blizz coding
vivid vessel
rare
long barn
I haven’t checked this season but last season I think it was more than rare
Is there a DR to leech?
long barn
Like how high we talking
earnest sphinx
i have like 10% leech
was so funny how much i healed when premed was ahh and ephemeral bonds was the choice
vivid vessel
get more
long barn
When I had 10% I was the lowest healing of my entire phys group and they have zero…
craggy barn
gz
desert tendon
ty
lime lake
np
craggy barn
i just got a hero plume bc i cant mythic raid on my rogue atm
desert tendon
zac would say bozo noob, i would say unlucky
craggy barn
both are acceptable
i had an alt raid i could take my rogue in
but i stepped down to let other people raid
im tanking in our main raid rn
desert tendon
damn
you re everything
you re a cool dude
you re my favorite rogue from now on
(mostly because you re not playing rogue ig?)
wintry solar
Wrong
wintry gate
best play to rogue is to not play rogue
ornate heathBOT
Why don't we macro trinkets to abilities?
- You want to use trinkets while BtE is active, but you can't macro them to BtE, as breaking vanish with a trinket will cause Subterfuge to not activate, so Vanish > BtE macro could fail.
- Trinkets are your only on demand burst damage, you sometimes want to hold it for specific mobs or vulnerability windows.
- You usually don't want to send it on a dying mob.
nova sinew
@keen belfry 🥸
nova sinew
gonna run it down
keen belfry
dude...
keen belfry
yeah u want in bro
craggy barn
yes bby
keen belfry
we didnt kill belo in one night
keen belfry
yeah...
craggy barn
u dont even have an app wtf
keen belfry
yes u just DM awang
outer meteor
yea i might have to gquit and join awangs guild if we dont kill crown this week
keen belfry
awangs guild collecting all the rogue palyers
frail veldt
Does anyone know why doing lower dps increases your rolls on loot?
keen belfry
Does anyone know why doing lower dps increases your rolls on loot?
@outer meteor
outer meteor
?????????????????????????
keen belfry
can have wf lura with 5 rogues
imagine the blade flurry cleave
earnest sphinx
keen belfry
oh he updated the text
outer meteor
the key was going fine
until some died and said "this healer is giving me aids"
and left the key
and the worst part is
frail veldt
once im pugged up to 20s can I batsignal your warrior wang?
outer meteor
i dont blame him!
keen belfry
once im pugged up to 20s can I batsignal your warrior wang?
yes hes ready
frail veldt
perf ill let you know when im there
keen belfry
look at lfg tanks
teal garnet
awangs guild collecting all the rogue palyers
I member, you dm'd me an expac or so ago kek. rogue guild inc, when do we get rogue tank spec?
keen belfry
back in DF i recruited i think every player ever
u missed out on the best shit guild
teal garnet
u missed out on the best shit guild
honestly woulda been nice. The guild I joined that tier was a rager, the GM gave this huge monologue about how shit everyone was after we killed and that he preferred good players to friends and just kicked like 50% of the guild and then swapped it to a 2 day guild and filled the roster with only his friends lmao
lime lake
based
keen belfry
thats a banger gm
teal garnet
was funny man took 2 weeks of to go to Japan, and said he spent half of the trip looking at logs seeing who he wanted to kick
teal garnet
ez
tbh surfing around 1000-300 ranked guilds, how good the guild performs feels like its based around how many people actually do chore keys / dont show up to raid intoxicated / and watched videos pre-pull
The biggest increase in like performance ive seen is when we've done review nights on off nights leading up to prog
people dont wanna put in the effort of pulling up the video but if 20 people are all in discord watching it and being discussed over the raid plan people tend to show up and actually do better
vapid sundial
I'd definitely disagree there.
No matter how prepared you make a wr 1000 there is a very low chance of them shooting up 500 ranks
The player diff is huge.
it's not every player, mind you.
but the specific good players.
teal garnet
im not saying it makes the good players better, just it does pick up some of the slack of the low end players that are in those guilds
vapid sundial
im not saying it makes the good players better, just it does pick up some of the...
tbh its actually crazy how low those low end players are lol
teal garnet
I dont disagree. A lot of the times its Friends/Family . Kicking out friends isnt an easy choice. No1 wants to tell bob he sucks but the vibes are good
ember rock
why u exposing me bro wtf
outer meteor
damn man
ember rock
im gonna blade flurry
vapid sundial
tbh i think it might be time to revive my enhancer.
To live the dream once again
i want to be blue
keen belfry
colussososu buffs ya know
might make ti worth the aoe blast
to do less crawth and last boss dmg
outer meteor
5 min crawth inc
actually just get a surv hunter and go colossus
he will carry crawth
smoky blade
hi, many times im on 5 combo points, while already having pistol shot proc. is it worth to overcap combos with pistol shot, or overstack the pistol shot procs? ( i know in an ideal world none of them are good).
also many times having back to back to back to back between the eyes procs. resetting it but also having only 5 combos, same question use pistol shot proc and overcap combos, or use sinister strike and overstack pistol shot procs. also in this case, many times, blade flurry is falling off while still procing between the eyes, but if i refresh bladeflurry i overcap combos.
earnest sphinx
is there any way to make plume go poof here ?
tight kernel
Wym poof
Like not tracked?
Just remove it from your cdm tracker
Whichever addon you use for cdm
tight kernel
Bro why warrior looking fun to play rn
outer meteor
its in ayjies cdm
tight kernel
Yes acdm puts it there
keen belfry
its in ayjies cdm
whajt 21 do u have
keen belfry
good
tight kernel
We back on rogue vibing
earnest sphinx
i probably need to manually change it every time if i respec and i want to see my trinket cooldown actually no?
tight kernel
And ele
tight kernel
i probably need to manually change it every time if i respec and i want to see m...
Uh not at pc but thought you could just blacklist certain trinkets
I don’t remember tho
earnest sphinx
imma play with it a lil bit
keen belfry
play with it eh
earnest sphinx
ur the goat boss @tight kernel
keen belfry
why
keen belfry
your ui not good enough for stream
outer meteor
bro...
normal hawk
Needs more dancing anime figures
earnest sphinx
are you a fizz main by any chance
earnest sphinx
wtf
ravenholdt full of talon players
jungle or mid though
very important question
earnest sphinx
ok u pass the test 👍
grim spear
frail veldt
!fuu
ornate heathBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
balmy topaz
Prep doesn’t fit outlaw
It’s was a desperate move to get rid of take em as a capstone IMO
hollow bloom
Take it off the GCD 
gritty hamlet
if there was one dungeon you'd fully clear with bonus rolls first, which one would it be?
balmy topaz
if there was one dungeon you'd fully clear with bonus rolls first, which one wou...
Pit
gusty pagoda
POS
somber ridge
pit of saron 100%
balmy topaz
Pretty much every item is good
gusty pagoda
I used all my rolls there
somber ridge
with assa/sub loot spec for the offhand
gritty hamlet
I was just gonna craft an offhand for multispec purposes
red pike
imagine dont accept u with 3.8 on a 14 😄
somber ridge
imagine dont accept u with 3.8 on a 14 😄
Imagine thinking youre entitled to invites because of your score
gusty pagoda
Dps fine but personally I'm not inviting "high" io tanks to my weeklies anymore
hollow bloom
imagine dont accept u with 3.8 on a 14 😄
gusty pagoda
They just can't act right
red pike
thats another true fact by winning
red pike
btw i never ever have been think about it to hear smt like this from a hunter 😄
narrow berry
do you guys know if i can roll the tier set on chimaereus with bonus roll? (I already have it but I didnt get it with bonus roll)
tropic zephyr
yes, you can
narrow berry
sadge, thanks
arctic hollow
is mastery a dead stat btw
cuz im debating if i go coin skyreach for the guaranteed weapon since it is the last item on the bonus roll loottable
and that 1 has guaranteed mastery
river wing
it is dead
but the weapon is okay
frail veldt
is mastery a dead stat btw
not really no
arctic hollow
i see
frail veldt
it starts to compete with the other 3 stats once you hit your haste and crit targets
in m+ at least
mastery is very strong in aoe
arctic hollow
yea i guess
cuz i wanna replace the crafted one
so i can swap to 2x arcanoweave
but sim said its rly small gain
river wing
once you approach max ilvl, everything is a small gain but trinks
arctic hollow
not having gaze hurts alot i guess
but i couldnt physically get it over the 1 week this was leveled
river wing
yeah gaze is v strong
plume is also v potent, like hero plume is = max myth prism, sometimes better even
arctic hollow
yea i just simmed raid
3k from gaze 2k from crit plume
idk if any dungeon trinket would be good to replace HOW
ember rock
got a heroic plume from the weekly crate bro wtf
river wing
got a heroic plume from the weekly crate bro wtf
gz
ember rock
ive never once gotten anything good from one of those
river wing
(got a gaze from weekly crate back when Cata tw was on, early in the season)
ember rock
thats insane tho lol
arctic hollow
so i guess i just send the arcanoweave and replace weapon
ember rock
was it champ tho?
arctic hollow
tw is champ yeah
ember rock
ahh unlucky but early on still a banger
arctic hollow
i prolly will take a way to get it
i got no coins
cuz it was legit a 1 week old character
thats just geared from pit and skyreach coins
its legit so free
ember rock
u can get all the coins right
arctic hollow
yeah u can
ember rock
but u just cant roll multiple times
arctic hollow
u need 1 run per coin
but my vault had like
3 items that were on the loot table of both sr and pit
and i was like
im just coining
over taking a dupe item
and i took 1 more coin
ember rock
fair
arctic hollow
i didnt coin the ring
might do it next week
so i just need gaze + vorasius ring and i am pmuch done with my gear
ember rock
the new raid? no idea
arctic hollow
neck trinket ring and i dont remember the other item
man shiii it has head
and belt
and the helm is bis stat
ember rock
ur talking about the raid thats coming out right
arctic hollow
yeah
arctic hollow
there is ye
but it was random stats
and they made it so it is with a fixed stat for every item now
arctic hollow
i need to figure out what i do on my hunter now
vagrant saddle
!fuu
ornate heathBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
keen belfry
yes
arctic hollow
bro i need to sim so much
ember rock
LOL
arctic hollow
got the stupid ass 2 socket neck to drop on my hunter
keen belfry
i timed the 19 WS dw
ember rock
he is a full on drone
ember rock
nah bro im sure ur fine
cant be that hard
ur dmg probably very dependant on tank
factors outside of your control def would annoy me
keen belfry
its all funnel shit
bright harbor
Hi there ! New to the class and having fun with Outlaw so far ! I'm in the 19-20 range on another character with some friends and I'm wondering about what could the better between Assassination and Outlaw regarding damage profile as I'm playing with a demo lock guardian and mw.
Sorry if the question have been asked many times, just want to know which spec to focus my learning on for the group's sake 🙂
keen belfry
Hi there ! New to the class and having fun with Outlaw so far ! I'm in the 19-20...
assa cd spec, big funnel dmg kinda
outlaw consistent dmg, perma tricks, target capped
both are good dmg profile
bright harbor
Ok, so since demo wants big pull maybe better to go assa in this case ?