outlaw

[flat stratus]

yeah, Ive never been this stumped on a class before lol, I crush on my mage but I just geared this rogue this week and I struggle to beat 140 overall at the end of a dung at 283 ilevel

[pure folio]

did u read the faq

[flat stratus]

5 target 1 min

yep

watched wows vidoes too

Ill rip a key and log it and see what I can see

[inland acorn]

Might be small rotational mistakes
Might be rng
Might be party comp
Might be how your tank pulls

[summer nimbus]

just play more outlaw rotation is conceptually easy but can be difficult to execute without practice

[inland acorn]

You can also record yourself hitting dummies foe like 1 min with gcd history on screen

And post it

[flat stratus]

k ill try that

[inland acorn]

That way we can help you check for any potential mistakes in rotation

[cerulean portal]

-_-

[flat stratus]

I see alot of mistakes I make when I play the video back, is there anything glaringly bad

https://youtu.be/rMmD0xXTP4A

also sorry about the keyboard smashing, forgot to remove audio

[cerulean portal]

blade rush should be used after bf

ar-rtb-bf-br-bte

if bte not refreshed use prep and insta br

[near osprey]

also finish on 6+ cps except for killing spree

and make sure u slice and dice right after you ar and roll the bones so then you can use between the eyes for the supercharged combo points

[cerulean portal]

ye bte with 5 cp was hard to watch

painfulllllllll

[flat stratus]

this is day 2 of playing outlaw and I have a new found respect for any outlaw rogue I see

[near osprey]

doing good though

keep working at it

[flat stratus]

how do your hands survive

[cerulean portal]

hands?

ok

left shoulder dead

left tit dead

[near osprey]

my hands are used to it

its fun clicking that many buttons

[river wing]

doing fine tbh

[harsh forge]

BOYS WE GOT IT FIRST TRY

[river wing]

and with a socket, too
gz!

[cerulean portal]

socket damn

gz

[harsh forge]

thank you gaben

[cerulean portal]

[inland acorn]

Worth mentioning, this is only for opener, not after every AR

[pure folio]

In a real key you'll have SnD at the start if u do the prekey properly, but you can actually adr rtb snd bf br to not spend supercharger

[flat stratus]

yeah thats in the timer before key starts

[near osprey]

yea

[flat stratus]

I do the ar ks prep ar before key is put in

[near osprey]

forgot to mention it

[inland acorn]

Thats good prekey

[flat stratus]

a thing a notice which is hilarous is when I see jackpot I freak out and miss play everytime

[inland acorn]

Tbf a lot of outlaw is muscle memory

Just coding your brain and muscle to reacting to certain procs same way

[summer nimbus]

does prep ar do anything prekey

[inland acorn]

2 supercharged cps instead of 1

[pure folio]

I would track your opportunity stacks in the middle of your screen with ur other stuff. your BR is higher priority than BTE. in opener, you want to prep instantly after u spend ur btes, you built up with sinister strike before prepping. when you prep it gives u back BF which is ur highest builder

[flat stratus]

that 19 @craggy barn just did for resil was with my brother and guildies and I watched the whole key and it's night and day the differnce at close to the same ilevel

[craggy barn]

lol

[summer nimbus]

i did not think about that

[flat stratus]

is it possible I'm pressing buttons too fast which is messing up spell que, do you guys adjust for that?

[inland acorn]

Ks used 1 sc, its minor min-max to prep adr to get it back

[split swallow]

guys on woxtoxic he saying use blade rush on 2 cp, i saw zac he always press it no matter what, what is correct and which difference?

[inland acorn]

Cp dont matter

[pure folio]

cp doesnt change ur br usage

[split swallow]

good

[alpine dagger]

guys is it true that blade flurry dint hit target behind u ?

[craggy barn]

if ur changing what button ur pressing during the gcd u could fuck urself

[uncut stratus]

Outlaw always been the "high cpm/apm" spec, maybe rivaled by fury warrior idk. feels a lil slower now in midnight, you do gotta manage that heavily.

The biggest dps penalty for outlaw is how fast you can press the right buttons inside and outside of AR

[split swallow]

also on wowhead im reading blade flury use on 4cp, why? if in aoe we can use it even on 1 and getting full cp after that

[inland acorn]

Setting up some sound cues/procs help alleviate how hard you need to stare into your UI and speeds up reaction

[uncut stratus]

Outlaw's definitely a zoomer spec in terms of speed, unless you've just been playing it since combat became outlaw

I could be mis-generalizing it, but feels close enough

[pure folio]

Not sure the exact question you're asking but - You only upkeep BF in 2+ targets, but at 3+ targets use it to build no matter cp

[flat stratus]

What addon do you use to setup sound cues

[uncut stratus]

Zac's gotta some good WA sounds for some abilities

[summer nimbus]

prob because at 5 cp u would rather just ss -> spend and then bf to max cp rather than bf for 2 cp? Idk i am just speculating

[vivid vessel]

I get 100% uptime when I'm playing well

[split swallow]

ye thats what im asking

[vivid vessel]

It's skill issue I think

[inland acorn]

Default cooldown manager also has this

[pure folio]

you're sitting on br and bte a lot and finishing at 5cps too

[summer nimbus]

get 100% uptime by kicking all the other melee dps out during circle clear lol

[vivid vessel]

[inland acorn]

https://tenor.com/view/dave-chapelle-chapelle-show-popcopy-fuck-em-thats-why-gif-11866262

[uncut stratus]

i just be grappling at boss as soon as I step on the arrow thingy that pops me up in the air

@vivid vessel the other day you said evasion nulls the arrow mechanic 1st boss MC, how about last boss WRS?

[pure folio]

I believe it’s magic, have to cloak

[river wing]

naw dawg
I'm over 30 and I am perfectly fine with current outlaw
TWW outlaw? yeah, that was a bit too fast for me (but then again I was coming back after 8 years of FFXIV, took me a bit to adjust)

[uncut stratus]

TWW and DF outlaw were incredibly fast, but that's why I said it's a bit slower in Midnight

[summer nimbus]

in terms of pure apm its beat by a bunch of specs tbh

[river wing]

p sure like half the tanks are more APM-y

[summer nimbus]

yea prot war is very high

i think prot pal too

[uncut stratus]

which one, MC or WRS?

[craggy barn]

wrs

its all nature damage

[uncut stratus]

ic

[pure folio]

Wrs ^

[summer nimbus]

i think the fast paced nature of outlaw is really due to the number of random procs that u have to react to in the timeframe of one gcd

[inland acorn]

we also do have 0.8gcd in AR

[craggy barn]

its a gcd locked spec with energy and .8gcd like 40% of the time

[vivid vessel]

Doesn't

[river wing]

yah

[uncut stratus]

I just remember the most fun I had playing outlaw was S2 of DF? I think it was S2. When the dungeon rotation had waycrest manor in it and atal'dazar, I think that shit was peak

right now might be the most fun ive had on outlaw since then

There was some big nerf on outlaw or they fell off in S3 of DF somewhere around there

[inland acorn]

Outlaw didn't fall off in S3

[tropic zephyr]

that's S3

S2 was a shitshow

[uncut stratus]

could've been S4, I just remember outlaw peaked mid DF then it was downhill from there

[tropic zephyr]

it peaked in S3

with the rework

[flat stratus]

When your getting the BtE resets and BR comes off cd from it. do you always send the BR then go back to BtE's?

[tropic zephyr]

DF S3 was the introduction of crackshot

[inland acorn]

introduction of crack*

ftfy

[uncut stratus]

most satisfying feeling crackshot

[tropic zephyr]

S2 we still had the old gameplay + dungeons were really big pulls + they were cringe

[craggy barn]

yes

[uncut stratus]

just hasn't been the same since then. occasionally get 2-5 BtE's in a row or almost in a row and that sound reminds me of the good ol days

idk why blizzard threw away peak

idk why blizzard continues throwing away peak*

[craggy barn]

they wanted to change things like they always do every expansion and they were also nuking weak auras

one of the main casual player complaints of outlaw was vanish

[hollow bloom]

Blizzard is scared of raising the skill ceiling and thus nerfs anything with skill expression.

[torpid fiber]

tbf tww outlaw at times was probably top 3 hardest wow specs ever

[uncut stratus]

Once you hit haste "cap" like around 24-26%, what's raidbots likely to to pick for you in terms of stats? What would be the next likely combination? Vers/crit?

[craggy barn]

crit then vers

crit til like 40

[uncut stratus]

ye im just looking to recraft OH dagger and belt, having haste/crit already, I'm thinking the runner up would be vers/crit

[craggy barn]

having more haste isnt bad esp in dungeons

[uncut stratus]

I mostly enchant/gem/craft stats based on raid sim results though, combination of mostly ST, 2t and 3t bc i can't keep switching that shit so much lolol

Having a separate gear-set for m+ sure ez I can do that

[flat stratus]

you can get to 40% crit?

oh with flask

[inland acorn]

even without flask tbh, but that requires to be like close to max ilvl and optimized gear

[river wing]

you can get to 40 crit and 25 haste with good gear yeah

[bleak storm]

with haste flask

[river wing]

p sure flask isn't super necessary

[split swallow]

guys should i track loaded dice?

[gaunt palm]

yes

[split swallow]

and if im on stage 2 i reroll only if he active?

i cant understand how this buff pop on me

[gaunt palm]

You get Loaded Dice when you use ADR. If you have KIR ready and Loaded Dice up and on stage 2, you can reroll to fish for a 3/4 to use KIR on

[split swallow]

we using pre pot only if get 3 stage or same rules like any classes?

[gaunt palm]

WDYM by pre pot?

[timid portal]

he prob meant light potential

[gaunt palm]

Depends on the situation I guess. If you talking about raid bosses, I'm not sure on the math if pot has more value with a good roll, or with Lust+ADR on pull for example. But you don't want to hold your pot for a good roll if it means you lose a usage ofc

[frail veldt]

I need to watch some vods cuz I feel like I'm having to chase the tank around or wait for boss to walk out of bad too often

[split swallow]

yes, in keys

preparation we also not holdin for stage 3 ye?

[timid portal]

no

prep you press on cd unless you know that there will be amp or really rough pack

[river wing]

it does help sometimes, yeah

[mighty pivot]

very cool ty blizzard

@wintry solar fix jackpot pls you are the worst outlaw dev

[river wing]

sorry I rolled all the jackpots assigned to outlaw for the remainder of the patch

[kind yacht]

can someone help my friend what mistakes he is doing , hes looking someone to help him to improve the gameplay @open surge
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/area-52/malyketh?zone=47

[quaint mauve]

@keen belfry champs op

ignore rengar game

champ sucks

[cerulean portal]

i see a lot of phys comp replacing rogues with hunters ;<

[uncut stratus]

I feel like I might've been trolling myself this whole time, when you guys speak about haste % which one you talking about?

[summer nimbus]

the one under enhancements not that one pretty sure

[trim harbor]

When you swap shaman for a mistweaver you kinda must do that

[uncut stratus]

[split swallow]

its ok when i out of my energy sometimes?

[uncut stratus]

probably yeah especially outside of AR

haste used to be capped because AR was endless when played correctly, that's why we go beyond like 21.5% haste now something like that

So yes definitely outside of AR you'll feel some low energy moments forsure

[split swallow]

i swap from sin just for testing and now my haste 21%

[uncut stratus]

I'd say if you're under 24% haste take Flickering Steel instead of Thief's Versatility

[split swallow]

ig i should use haste flask

[formal knot]

raidbots is the answer

[split swallow]

with flask im 25% haste

[uncut stratus]

That's a good marker. You won't really hit 24% haste without haste flask unless you have eye of midnight, voidsong chain, mask of darkest intent etc...

[river wing]

the real one, not just from gear

[river wing]

I'm at like
28% with flask, I think

yup
once I get upgrades done, I'm p sure I'll get another percent there

[uncut stratus]

time to go crit flask bud

[river wing]

maybe
maybe not
energy is still not safe...

[cerulean portal]

hooowww

[bleak storm]

drink haste flask, equip myth gear with haste

[cerulean portal]

r u kidding me

im 288

[bleak storm]

🤷‍♀️

[river wing]

idk
I have like
almost everything for haste/crit
here's your answer
no vers

284 tho

this is also oiled up tho

[timid portal]

it would be better if he could record him hitting dummies with some tracker what he press and then send it here in a thread under !log

[split swallow]

idk why but outlaw is so vibe spec, when i play on it i wanna grime music and play on edit xd

[frozen quest]

belo HC nice roll

[dusty magnet]

send a pic of ur gear

idk how u have 43/28 lmao.

[river wing]

flask, oil, FB (+3% crit)
no food tho, that already ran out

[dusty magnet]

FB?

[river wing]

yes

[dusty magnet]

what is fb

[river wing]

fatebound

[dusty magnet]

oh

I havent tested fatebound in keys yet

hows it feel

whats pros vs cons vs trickster

[primal holly]

pro is its more fun, smoother gameplay

con is less dps

[river wing]

cons:
slightly less damage (tho tbh I personally don't even notice the diff)
pros:
more fun
better energy
no need to use KS

[river wing]

idk how it'd show anything tho
it's all myth (except for trinks) and has extra sockets where possible other than neck/rings

[dusty magnet]

ye was just confused but its cus fatebound

cus im 290.8 with basically bis

[river wing]

yeah I'll need like 300 crests to max out what I have

[dusty magnet]

ill have to give fatebound a shot in some of my 21s

[valid onyx]

Hello everyone! New to rogue! Which Rogue Spec is the easiest for 14-15s keys (m+ only) and which one can flex more in fast pulls in 10s?

[river wing]

sub
sub

[valid onyx]

For pushing is Assa or outlaw?

[river wing]

outlaw and assa are for when things live longer
for pushing, it's basically a matter of preference

[slow granite]

I tried assa but i can't do any form of dmg

and it's way easier so i like to think it's not a skill issue xD

(it might be in the grame scheme of my gameplay, but not compared to outlaw since it's braindead)

and as assa i often find myself with no energy

[normal hawk]

It’s got downtime ye

[river wing]

it's just like that yeah

main reason I swapped to outlaw, TWW assa used to blast in keys and wasn't TOO bad on bosses

[normal hawk]

Yeah

[river wing]

now it's a snoozefest

[normal hawk]

I loved dragon fight assa

With the bone lance or whatever it was called whe. It first came out

[cerulean portal]

flask,oils,food

288

i hate u guys

[slow granite]

what's the difference gameplay wise between FB and Trickster?

[river wing]

that's 4 vers speaking

[slow granite]

simmed myself and it's a 2% dps loss FB

[river wing]

Trickster has to use KS
but AR is stronger due to cloud

[slow granite]

it should be competitive toh, no?
by sims at least

and u send finishers at 5?

expect for BTE

[timid portal]

in constant cleave trickster will be ahead more

[timid portal]

even if it would be the same people would still play trickster

bcs of perma tricks

[slow granite]

forgot about that

imma stick with trickster

and pray a bit more to rngjesus...last keys were a nightmare rolls-wise and i kept finding myself starved

energy wise

[uncut stratus]

blazing sunclaws gang with crafted OH

I've got 2 possible drops left in pit, one is kricks beetle stabber and the other are the bracers

[river wing]

got them 2nd week in the vault, luckeee

[river wing]

ya, it's like a 2-3% diff anyway

[river wing]

yes

[frozen quest]

Unbuffed stats for me

[vivid vessel]

Would it be bad if heroic raid had no lockout

Like you could just do it over and over

[normal hawk]

Uhhhhhh

Maybe at the start it would kinda wipe out any reason to do non myth keys?

Other than that don’t really see an issue

[burnt tangle]

over and over for loot?

[normal hawk]

Maybe if it was locked for the first few weeks then unlocked

[pastel sierra]

i think they should make myth raid lockouts unlock similar to heroic when crests are uncapped at the latest

[vivid vessel]

well ye

like

in the end good guilds do splits

so its infinite gear anywya

for the top guilds

the top like

1k still do splits

and its basically infinite but feel bad but also a bit finite but not really

and then the guilds that arent echo and liquid still need some gear to finish their hc gear so they just do mythic + all day every week

so essentially they have infinite access to hc gear anywya

[burnt tangle]

okay lowkey daily lockout

[vivid vessel]

well no that would suck ass

means you need to raid every day for 30s

min

instead of like 2 days for 4h each

i just think having a weekly lockout

that everyone by pass by doing splits anywya

and then you can also spam m+

is silly

[normal hawk]

Sorry what’s a split?

[vivid vessel]

i would rather there is no lockout, you spam hc raid with a single char a few times in a row and you are done

[vivid vessel]

most guilds till like idk

rank 500/1k

will do 1 or 2 splits or more

where you have another character

or more for more splits

and you split your raid in groups where you have a few mains and then alt chars

[inland acorn]

you take some mains, and fill rest of raid with alts, funnel gear to mains

[normal hawk]

I see

[vivid vessel]

and you funnel the gear into mains

[normal hawk]

So you’re just funneling onto the mains

Got it

[vivid vessel]

yes

but everyone hates it

and like

every tier

[normal hawk]

Yeah sounds annoying

[vivid vessel]

more and more guilds do it

[radiant wyvern]

zac
https://open.spotify.com/track/0ZtMpNZqZubJq2p0OCNiFL?si=4sC52Fm_QYeZuLOTfZ8JCw

?

[vivid vessel]

to the point that nowadays

im pretty sure even if you are in a rank 1k guild

you do at least 1 split

cause tis so op

[inland acorn]

Even my guild did 2 splits in the first 2 weeks of season

and we're like ~400-500

[vivid vessel]

nop

[inland acorn]

it was also really good, because you had 3 raids splitted

[vivid vessel]

ye

[inland acorn]

Chim and belo as 1st bosses with good loot

Some good stuff from first few bosses in voidspire too

[normal hawk]

Yeah

[burnt tangle]

I really like having 3 different raids, but I think releasing march later was a mistake

cause noone did heroic march..

[vivid vessel]

true

[normal hawk]

I did

[burnt tangle]

or like we did bird but not lura

[normal hawk]

…

[vivid vessel]

ye we killed lura once after like

idk when

[vivid vessel]

cause we had time left in the week

and we had killed alleria

and it didnt make much sense to do bird directly i think

idk

[burnt tangle]

I have not even pulled heroic lura..

[normal hawk]

Why not just kill it real quick on hero?

[inland acorn]

Because not good loot

And even on hero it wasn't that quick back before nerfs

[burnt tangle]

cause the loot was useless by the time it released and we are a 2 day guild

[normal hawk]

Fair enough

[burnt tangle]

but if it released at the same time as voidspire it wouldve been very good cause of omni token etc

[inland acorn]

We did lura like after mythic dragons, because we didnt prepare for paladins that day

[pastel sierra]

hero lura is harder than everything up to dragons mythic

[inland acorn]

Because we didn't expect to kill dragons

[burnt tangle]

I love joining lfr lura (trying to get glaives tmog on my dh) and seeing 5 stacks of determination

[normal hawk]

Do you have you do the symbols on lfr

[wintry solar]

You're playing it wrong

[burnt tangle]

ye

[normal hawk]

Oh lol

Same as normal ?

3 sigil?

[burnt tangle]

yep

I mean LFR dimensius was harder than mythic dimensius

[normal hawk]

That actually seems hard

People just no clue

[burnt tangle]

legit wiped to the hard enrage on LFR dimmy deep into the patch

[burnt tangle]

before they nerfed him

[grim spear]

[inland acorn]

https://tenor.com/view/bait-clickbait-thats-bait-gif-13073851

[vivid vessel]

fake

you pressed prep

or wait you didnt actually i see no gcd gap

weird !

[normal hawk]

People are still using the like lura helper addon right

[slow granite]

https://tenor.com/view/capa-pandu-stucapa-studiocapa-atg-gif-10949048042327825999

[inland acorn]

for mythic NSRT is bis

[normal hawk]

Righto, it’s just hitting Keybinds as well right?

[pastel sierra]

keybinds or clicking macros yeah

says a funny number in chat

[inland acorn]

Only specific people

[normal hawk]

‘Mm that’s what I am doing atm with a different addon

Was hoping there was a way to not do that but ye

[pastel sierra]

you can not do that

[inland acorn]

Does it show the map for everyone else ?

[normal hawk]

Yea it does

Pops up a little screen

[pastel sierra]

just have to find 19 ppl who can remember 5 symbols in the correct order

[normal hawk]

This isn’t possible I’m sorry

[inland acorn]

In different realms dont forget

[normal hawk]

I play with Australians

[inland acorn]

[pastel sierra]

i know i also can't remember 5 things in the correct order

[normal hawk]

I will look into nsrt though

[inland acorn]

Its actually funny doing memory game on mythic and you dont even knoe if phased people do it correctly

[normal hawk]

The one I use works fine but if there’s an upgrade

[inland acorn]

Until you suddenly see +5 people dead

[normal hawk]

Do people still die to the glaives in mythic

Or is that a brainlet thing

[inland acorn]

Yes

Brainlet

[mighty pivot]

https://giphy.com/gifs/baby-cat-sitting-beat-kid-RYOYNPbKoRORepL80E

[normal hawk]

They seem very obvious I just dunno how people get killed by them

[inland acorn]

Nsrt is nice overall not only for lura, notes, reminders, some general stuff and some cooked nice things like nameplate highlight for saladar interrupt

[normal hawk]

Oooh

[inland acorn]

Bar drop for carriers on lura is also very nice

[normal hawk]

Does it take much to get setup

[inland acorn]

depends what you want

for memory game everyone needs to have NSRT on same version

For personal use, it's fairly easy and quick

Mostly checking checkboxes what you want, maybe setup some personal notes if you're into it

[normal hawk]

For the nameplate flash

Just boxes?

[inland acorn]

ye you just click checkbox

[normal hawk]

Siick

[river wing]

"or"?

[normal hawk]

Is it harder for range? I feel like it’s always a ranged guy dying

[river wing]

IME everyone but tanks dies to glaives on occasion
what differs is the rarity
if you can avoid them well enough to only die in like 1/100 pulls
you're fine
then again they nerfed the glaive duration and they no longer come around as you're aligning for memory game

tho idk how ranged die to them

[inland acorn]

By being greedy with casts

As always

It's like biggest self-report boss for people who always greed casts, thinking they can facetank shit

[normal hawk]

It’s not even the like lingering bit

It’s the initial fire out

[inland acorn]

Nah if you die to initial cast

You're blind

[normal hawk]

Some range just always fuck peels over

[inland acorn]

Or don't have movement keybinded

[normal hawk]

Surely it’s easier if you’re further back too cause the gap is way wider

[inland acorn]

https://www.method.gg/images/uploads/guides/1005074-fallen-king-salhadaar-mythic-northernsky-raid-tools-addon-example.jpg

This is how it looks

ripped from method site, so quality is not great

[normal hawk]

I thought that was lura for a second

Dam that’s clean

Are the health bars part of it

[inland acorn]

No I think it's just your standard nameplate

It's just icons above, so you can quickly see which you need to interrupt

[normal hawk]

Sweet I’m using some other health bar adon cause the blizzard ones are a little ugly

[vivid vessel]

the cast bar also just change color cause it goes from non interuptible to interuptible so

[normal hawk]

Someone’s toaster pc going to explode from this

[cerulean portal]

omg finally

i did it guys

[inland acorn]

whole setup, just checkbox

[wintry solar]

Their toaster PC has been dropping frames at the lowest of low settings since DF

Prepatch to be exact

[normal hawk]

Does this replace dbm

Or is it alongside it

[inland acorn]

Technically both

Idk how good the generic alerts are, because I don't use them

I prefer BWs, because I can toy with it more, add sound to specific abilities boss does etc.

[normal hawk]

So you just turn off the generic things in nsrt

Righto

[inland acorn]

They're off by default iirc

[normal hawk]

Raiding before all of this shit must have been crazy

[inland acorn]

Also Reloe, guy behind this addon is going to push patch next week that pretty much reworks the alerts

And will give you option to customize it a lot more, similiar to BWs

with sound, tts, only specific abilities etc.

[normal hawk]

If only it could auto do the symbols so I don’t have to do that

[inland acorn]

Just don't be tank or healer

[daring yoke]

man i wish they delete stage 1 buff from outlaw completely. so rtb with just 3 stages

[inland acorn]

Its up to them, to click macros for memory game

[daring yoke]

stage 1 buff depression is real

[normal hawk]

Yea idk how i got lumped with this duty

Defo cuts into my dps a bit

[summer nimbus]

Is there a way for me to sim algethar buffs

Do they have diminishing returns like normal stats

[inland acorn]

I think they're flat % but I might be wrong

[summer nimbus]

Could vers ever outpace crit regarding that?

[inland acorn]

It might if you're at +40% crit

[pliant heath]

vers is usually the best, esp for ol

part of the reason vers is a "bad" stat is because it takes so much more rating per %

when you're comparing % to %, that isn't a factor

[uncut stratus]

Would you guys say outlaw fantasy is more old western shooter or pirate? I know people want it to be pirate so bad, but like, the new animations are tumble weeds which plays into the ol' western spitoon draw fantasy, "fan the hammer" can only do that on magnums, not old pirate flintlock pistols

Imo it plays more into the spec name now, outlaw

[unborn basin]

it was lost when they got rid of cannonball barrage

[uncut stratus]

think the only saving grace is that edwin vancleef is supposed to be the "face" of outlaw, but he only has a ship in a cave that never left that cave

[inland acorn]

idk if even Blizzard knows at this point, what they want outlaw fantasy to be

[cerulean portal]

do u have a ship?

[wintry solar]

It stopped being a pirate in BFA unfortunately

[normal hawk]

It was like Indiana jones for like a expansion

Now it’s sorta like pirate treasure hunter combat thief

[grizzled heron]

Like some kind of....

Outlaw?

[normal hawk]

It’s just stuff

[grizzled heron]

Huh.....

[halcyon elm]

jack

[cerulean portal]

imagine rogue with a pike

he can fight mid range/melee

aoe stun

and

guys help me

[normal hawk]

Isn’t that just windwalker

[cerulean portal]

they fight mid range?

[wintry solar]

I hate vague themes

[normal hawk]

Not really but they use a polearm

[cerulean portal]

i played wuchang last 2 weeks...

[normal hawk]

And have an aoe stun

[cerulean portal]

i want that kind of rogue

[uncut stratus]

survival and i guess devourer would be mid-range

[normal hawk]

25 yard range

With a spear

[cerulean portal]

i love spears

i mean as a weapon ok

kung fu thing

[normal hawk]

If only there were a kung fu class

Some sort of kung fu panda if u will

[gaunt phoenix]

https://tenor.com/view/big-floppa-gif-21759303

[torn plover]

Tbf we used to get 8yd attack range Vs 5, felt good still being able to attack during a bosses aoe while all other melee had to move out of combat range

[vapid sundial]

It was fair tho
We were so reliant on uptime

Still think adding acro to the class tree was the worst thing ever

And their reasoning for removing extended range is still laughable

[gaunt phoenix]

acro the goat

[vapid sundial]

"range has increased over the years"

[gaunt phoenix]

nokhud without acro

[vapid sundial]

Okay man whatever say

Range surely went up

I wonder how the intern who wrote that piece is doing

[pastel sierra]

yeah and then they make UH DK which is totally a melee i swwear it has a big sword

[gaunt phoenix]

think that statement was suspected to be about mob hitboxes

[vapid sundial]

Yeah, but it couldn't have been worded worse.

It doesn't help they keep bringing back old content with old hit boxes

(m+)

[somber plank]

i have a question.

Is there a table or chart showing the DPS gain for Outlaw Rogues from different raid buffs (like Battle Shout or Mark of the Wild)?

[gaunt phoenix]

!fuu

[ornate heath]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[gaunt phoenix]

the actual sim link is expired

[somber plank]

oh thank you~!

[gaunt phoenix]

but battle shout should be ~5%, mark of the wild should be ~2.5%, monk debuff should be ~5%, and skyfury is ~6%

[somber plank]

The numbers went up compared to The War Within

thank you.

[gaunt phoenix]

i don't believe so

battle shout being 5% attack power is always going to be 5% dmg

same with monk debuff

and 3% versatility is always a little less than 3% bonus

i guess skyfury is a bit stronger since melees are stronger

[somber plank]

i love res sh

[gaunt palm]

@gaunt phoenix do you know pot value of using with Lust+Adr+Double trouble, vs holding for An Adr+Triple/Jackpot?

[cosmic parrot]

has the invisible RtB buff on cdm been happening more often lately with anyone else, or is that just me?

i feel like its gotten to the point where every pull its at least once, sometimes more

[long barn]

I’ve been wondering this too. Or even + prep

[dim parrot]

Guys sub last boss seat feels kinda ass without an on use

[ancient veldt]

so what are the conditions to use KS?

[gaunt phoenix]

it's just higher priority than dispatch

if you were going to dispatch, ks instead

[gaunt phoenix]

not off hand but i can poke at it

[cedar bone]

someone has the tomelvis platers for platynator?

[cerulean portal]

@vivid vessel

[thick vigil]

https://wago.io/BBGSsnCBy

[cedar bone]

bro

it says plater

[static crescent]

I guess no class tuning at 12.0.7

No hints of it atleast

[timid portal]

12.0.7 due to outlaw performing better that before -10% bf dmg

[ancient veldt]

do we shiv at all?

[gaunt phoenix]

it's just a soothe

dispell enrage effects

otherwise no

[ancient veldt]

ok cool cool

do we blade flurry ST?

[gaunt phoenix]

no

[ancient veldt]

k just normal prio list no bladeflurry

[inland acorn]

I mean, zac is using plater so... I doubt any1 bothered trying to recreate it in platynator lol

[unique zealot]

its better now ig guysm right

[cerulean portal]

gj

[unique zealot]

from yesterday i did some train about rotation my dps still not good but at least im better then yesterday

[ancient veldt]

do we maintain SnD manually or is it procced by anything?

[unique zealot]

whats snd

im new sorry

[inland acorn]

it procs from dispatch

[tough lagoon]

dispatch applies snd

[inland acorn]

slice and dice

[unique zealot]

i never press snd, its automatcly active always

[cerulean portal]

did u play sega TMNT?

[unique zealot]

its true, right?

[inland acorn]

you should manually press it in opener

mostly applies in raid

[unique zealot]

in opener yeah

[cerulean portal]

i loved leos replic "SLICE AND DICE"

[inland acorn]

if you do pre-key stuff, you will have snd up from start

[ancient veldt]

what is pre key start?

[inland acorn]

!prekey

[ornate heath]

• Use Adrenaline Rush to activate Loaded Dice.
• As Trickster, use KS to activate Disorienting Strikes.
• Do NOT use RTB before the key, you will lose it.
• Use SND during the bubble once the key starts.

[ancient veldt]

cool cool

use KS before key is put in?

[unique zealot]

i did not prekey i think

[inland acorn]

yes

[unique zealot]

i need to do this before key put in right

[cerulean portal]

putin yes

[inland acorn]

AR --> KS is before key put

[ancient veldt]

thanks for the answers im leveling outlaw i got 2 toons to 3600 and tired of casters tbh

[cerulean portal]

and snd in bubble

[inland acorn]

SND inside bubble (after key put)

Roll the bones, you can wait till you get close to the 1st pack (usually like 2-5seconds depending on dungeon)

[unique zealot]

and im starting with snd after basic rotation

its make sense yeah

everyone is so helper here ty all guys

Im better now

[cerulean portal]

we r only toxic to other class players

[unique zealot]

eternal rogue friendship

[wintry solar]

Ew

[cerulean portal]

u r RE fan?!

[wintry solar]

Resident Evil fan? Yeah

[cerulean portal]

i love RE

even the trash series/movies

[wintry solar]

My last bastion of a good franchise

[wintry solar]

I've held that 6 is top five game for years

And Rev 2 top 3

[cerulean portal]

well 6 is fun

2 is top1 imo

[gaunt phoenix]

[wintry solar]

Re9 came in and cleared so I gotta redo my tier list

[cerulean portal]

7-8-9 is in my heart

[cerulean portal]

wat? u dont like RE?

[vapid sundial]

No way u list 7 that high

Crazy

It has the same problem as 2 remake

Hold w

Just walk

[cerulean portal]

yes

the scariest part

heared about atmosphere?

u should have seen me playinf re7.

[vapid sundial]

Outlast made me immune to fear from re games

[cerulean portal]

it took me 120 hours cz i was terrified

[wintry solar]

9 was scarier than 7

[vapid sundial]

Big girl spooky

[wintry solar]

I live in the same state so I had homefield advantage

[cerulean portal]

man i played outlast for 11 seconds LUL

[vapid sundial]

I will admit

[mighty pivot]

ok pussy

[vapid sundial]

Grace sections are not that great for replayability

[wintry solar]

Hospitals are scary

[mighty pivot]

for americans yes

[cerulean portal]

lets talk about RE8

THE BABY

OMFG

[summer nimbus]

I wanted to play re7 vr

Heard its pretty scary

[wintry solar]

It peaked at the baby

[vapid sundial]

Makes me hate Sony

[wintry solar]

That was one of the few times I felt the intensity

[vapid sundial]

Locking these good ass vr ports behind their console

I'd pay like $40 for access to the re4r vr

[summer nimbus]

Theres a mod

For pc

[vapid sundial]

Mod isn't as good as the innate one by Sony

Is the issue

[wintry solar]

Sony's vr gear is also pretty solid for its price

[vapid sundial]

I'm not buying a console just to play vr

On a game I already own

Buy the console.
Buy the game.
Buy the vr equipment.
Buy the special lenses cuz my eyes suck

[gaunt phoenix]

when the channel goes off topic

i would type "on topic "

but now i just

[cerulean portal]

whenever u want

[inland acorn]

you can also

[vapid sundial]

Solo doesn't really care I think

It's just a meme atp

Outlaw is off topic2

[wintry solar]

It's not like we stop being helpful when someone asks something outlaw related

I love consoles though, going on vacation with some buddies tonight and I'm bringing it

[cerulean portal]

try the evil within 2 vr

magod the ghost woman

i dont remember how i escaped

[wintry solar]

There may be evil outside, but there's evil within 2

I've never played the games but I refuse to believe that's not in the second game

Clip may be edited but idc

[formal thunder]

!prekey

[ornate heath]

• Use Adrenaline Rush to activate Loaded Dice.
• As Trickster, use KS to activate Disorienting Strikes.
• Do NOT use RTB before the key, you will lose it.
• Use SND during the bubble once the key starts.

[cerulean portal]

6 hours in que

zero invites in 20s

[vapid sundial]

Welcome to outlaw.

You are outlawed

[cerulean portal]

im thinking about to play tank

i wish rogue had tank spec lul

[hollow tartan]

n

[frozen quest]

Since +16 I only play own keys cause no invites that helps a lot

[copper radish]

Sounds like some manly fun

[shadow trellis]

haste flask brings me to 28% and im 24% baseline (with oils)

Should i consider crit flask at this point?

[vapid sundial]

I'd say just sim

Or do we not answer that anymore

[shadow trellis]

fair haha

[gaunt phoenix]

sim would crit flask

but, some people like haste anyway

in keys

since they are significantly longer than 6 minute dungeonslice

so thistle tea is a bit overvalued in slice

i dont think going haste would unlock infinite damage

but it is more comfortable

[frozen quest]

Depends on crit I got 42 with oils and 28 with haste Flask I feel thats rly good

[shadow trellis]

I see, thanks

Sim suggests going crit is 1% increase and im mainly thinking about Alleria prog tonight

But i will stay haste, comfy is good

[odd whale]

hey i just swapped from assa to outlaw - can someone (and yes i know its also in the guides) give me a rough breakdown of opener and rota?

[gaunt phoenix]

if you have nothing, the opener is

(before pull)
adrenaline rush > roll the bones > slice and dice

(on pull)
blade flurry (in aoe) > blade rush > sinister strike if needed to 6 CPs > between the eyes

if between the eyes resets, you continue to build+BtE, and watch BF/BR as they come back available

as soon as BtE stops resetting, you use preparation so you can build to BtE again

after you can no longer bte, then your next priority finisher is killing spree

and throughout all this, remember to keep it rolling if you hit stage 3 roll the bones

you also don't always start with nothing, you dont slice and dice if it's already active, if so then your first finisher is BtE

at the start of a key you will already have loaded dice from using AR before the key, so then you use roll the bones before the first AR to not munch a loaded dice proc

[odd whale]

thanks 😄 ima read through that

i remember from assa i basically never had to press SnD - is the generation of it different for outlaw?

so i actively use it like it doesnt refresh itself?

[gaunt phoenix]

it does refresh itself from dispatch, but dispatch is lower priority than BtE and killing spree

[odd whale]

kk

[gaunt phoenix]

you basically press it in the opener and never again

it does not consume supercharger, so then you get to immediately supercharge BtE

instead of spending a supercharge on dispatch

after the opener, your rotation is very generically just sort of building and finishing

[unique zealot]

hey guys one question heart of wind or ranger captains ? which one is better

[gaunt phoenix]

you should know the builder priority

[odd whale]

alrighty - so some getting used to the general thing but should be fine after a few keys i assume

[gaunt phoenix]

you are trying to maintain stage 2+ of roll the bones, through the loaded dice talent

if you are slamming, you normally have loaded dice for almost every roll

but sometimes you have to roll without it

[unique zealot]

also heart of wind will 285 too

[gaunt phoenix]

generally captain is better

[odd whale]

with 298 prism and gaze im good to go right?

[unique zealot]

my haste is 21%-22%

also whats the bis trinkets

i have 298 solar

for second trinket, what i need

[odd whale]

gaze most likely

[gaunt phoenix]

mythic gaze and plume

[odd whale]

atleast according to what my research told me

yeah i dont have access to mythic plume thats why i will use prism

[unique zealot]

i never get any trinket from raids

im not lucky

[cerulean portal]

broo

[gaunt phoenix]

heroic gaze is still ahead

[odd whale]

bonus rolls are your best friend

[golden stump]

Heart of Wind too, right?

[cerulean portal]

next week i have 100% reroll for gaze

[gaunt phoenix]

no, heart of wind is not special on outlaw

we dont really like haste bonuses

[cerulean portal]

yes sure

[gaunt phoenix]

we like passive haste all the time

[unique zealot]

i will use my rolls for rings maybe or helmet would be good

i got just 1 good thing from my all bonuses

[cerulean portal]

i did rerolls 3 times in pit

got everything bis

[unique zealot]

u are the lucky man

[cerulean portal]

seat head from vault

BUT

no weapons, no trinkets...

[unique zealot]

my last 4 vault i got just one myth

other 3 is sucks

i got nothing

[cerulean portal]

u said u play rogue for 2 weeks

liar

[unique zealot]

no 2 week /:

2 months

gg wp

[cerulean portal]

kk

[odd whale]

where do you suggest i spend my remaining 4 bonus rolls? - its just my alt thats why i didnt farm all the voidshards yet

gloves, belt, plat star band ring are all 3 myth track

[inland acorn]

You could sim in droptimizer

Though you would need to make yourself a judgement call, how much rolls you want to spend in dungeon

[gaunt phoenix]

mastery ring has to go

[inland acorn]

Like for example Seat has one of the best helmets, but has like 10 items in pool

[odd whale]

i have this one in bag

[gaunt phoenix]

Pit still has ring, neck, wrist, cloak, and pants to catalyze

[odd whale]

yeah only reason i was kinda leaning away from pit is i have crafted wrist and neck

[gaunt phoenix]

but some of those are only 285 > 289 upgrades

[odd whale]

yee

[gaunt phoenix]

but it's still essentially guaranteed loot

[inland acorn]

belt too

[odd whale]

the ring from pit would be a blessing but i know my luck and with my 4 rolls i wont get it xD

[gaunt phoenix]

he has mythic belt

[inland acorn]

is it mythic, shows 276

[gaunt phoenix]

Well any other slot is at least 4 rolls

[unique zealot]

crit with a potion

[inland acorn]

[odd whale]

myth belt w leech 😄

[inland acorn]

Give it up

I need it

[odd whale]

xD come get it

[gaunt phoenix]

i still think pit is your best case

[odd whale]

i honestly am just looking for something to do 😄 my main is all finished with gear

[inland acorn]

Other dungeons have too much bloat in them

[odd whale]

sv hunter main btw if thats at all relevant

[gaunt phoenix]

can use dagger too

[golden stump]

I've only done heroic raids. Is Mythic chim easy to get into?

Or is that a pipe dream

[cerulean portal]

who knows

where can i see embelishment ranking?

[gaunt phoenix]

hunt = void = arcanoweave = iris > the rest

there

[keen belfry]

hunt = void = arcanoweave = iris > the rest

@cerulean portal

[flat stag]

should I only use BtE at 6 stacks of Gravedigger?

[keen belfry]

no no

[flat stag]

Or do I just send bte off rip regardless

[keen belfry]

use it on CD basically

at 6+ combo points

[flat stag]

then hold for ar

[keen belfry]

yup

just know at 6 gravedigger stacks u got another BTE coming

[flat stag]

Why am I not getting refunds on BtE sometimes?

Is there something Im not paying attention to?

[keen belfry]

like refunding to 5?

[flat stag]

yeee

sometimes it just be going limp ya know

[keen belfry]

so you are guaranteed 4 from ace, and 1 from ruthlessness

it can proc 2 from ruthlesness

leaving u 6, but not always

often times you will build once after you get an ace reset

[flat stag]

What is being built, sorry Im not as well read up on this

CP?

[keen belfry]

yeah since you wanna only press BTE at 6+

and you end at 5 often

you should press your next builder, building combo points

[flat stag]

Okay cool. Is it ever worth to spend PS proc to get over 5

or is it best to use SS

[keen belfry]

if youre at max ps procs, use ps

otherwise ss

[flat stag]

sweet ty

[keen belfry]

or youd BF in aoe

[flat stag]

One more question. On these first pulls of keys, Ive noticed in vods some are going in and pressing KS going into packs and doing giga dmg. Im usually only around 400-500k. I've managed to pull off 800k but i hit jackpot

With an ideal opener with 3set role what range of dmg should I be doing on something like 19 Seat

[keen belfry]

so its not ks doing the dmg first of all

your ending dmg ina pull is dependent on a lot of things too, but you can pretty safely hit 700k+ always in a pull like seat

[flat stag]

Im guessing its to get fazed on everything?

[gaunt phoenix]

it's just using ks while the tank is gathering

[keen belfry]

its just to get that on cd, get your unseen blade stacks, and theres not much use pressing AR there can wait a few seconds while gather

[flat stag]

bc it would be best to use the special cps on BtEs right?

[keen belfry]

your typical opener is usally something like SS twice into KS into dispatch into AR

pre blade flurry

[keen belfry]

100%

[flat stag]

So for a first pull opener. Is better to BF on the pack or is it okay so send before to save a global?

well you'd want the CP from BF hitting mobs no?

[keen belfry]

you can press BF before combat in a lot of dungeons

[gaunt phoenix]

if your first bf is going to hit 2 mobs, its whatever

if your first bf is full cps then probably use it for cps

[hardy thicket]

SEAT for example I usually just BS on the small little shits right in front of you to get full CP then KS into maybe on dispatch while tank gathers then just full send

[gaunt phoenix]

yep

[gritty comet]

hey all, out of curisoity is there any channel related to log reviews and the likes?

[keen belfry]

i pre BF In seat

but it probs dont matter

[gaunt phoenix]

enter !log in here

[keen belfry]

i like pressing 2 SS before i KS

[gritty comet]

!log

[flat stag]

So on gather with BF up, rolls up, and SnD up | Killing spree > Blade Rush > AR > B/E procs > Prep > B/E procs until it stops, resume normal rotation?

[gritty comet]

thank you solo

[gaunt phoenix]

i know you

you are warlock man

big warlock simmer

[keen belfry]

oh no two sim guys

its just like when publik was here

NOOOOOOOOO

[gritty comet]

thanks a lot, also the whole command is pretty smart

[flat stag]

So is there a condition that you only use KS on gather?

[crude anchor]

@keen belfry spotted

[hardy thicket]

I guess BF first could technically kill you unless they fixed BF not redirecting threat and I just missed the memo

On the pack I mean

[keen belfry]

naw its just a good gather button

its not a dmg button

even tho it does dmg

id much rather not press KS during blaster moments ya know

so the gather is quite good

[flat stag]

They honestly just need to delete it. Its unbelievably mid. In the time that it channels you could of gotten 2 6stack cps off to farm ar back lol

Makes a lot of sense why everyone hates it

[keen belfry]

it needs another rework

trickster tree should just make it a blaster button

[flat stag]

yeah, not really beneficial

[keen belfry]

we wouldnt mind channeling a button like KS as much if it fucked

[flat stag]

thx for help btw o7

[pastel oxide]

!fuu

[ornate heath]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[hardy thicket]

I mean they coulda just kept original KS but allow movement and kicks

Iuno why they didnt do that

Just blade dance version of rogue

[keen belfry]

i think it would unironically be a chill button to add and track if it was just an aura instead of a channel

like you press it and fart out shotgun shots passively for 3 seconds

still pressing all buttons

the main reason things i like about BR and KS is tracking another button to press

[random stirrup]

what if it just did a large shotgun blast and then all your spells were frontals instead for like 8-10s

and uncapped

[keen belfry]

down

but not frontals

i hate cones

flurry better

[slim hare]

ogcd button doing that

[keen belfry]

wouldb elit

[slim hare]

would be really cool ngl

[keen belfry]

it would instantly become a good button

[slim hare]

for sure"

[keen belfry]

idc that it does no dmg still at that point

its an aura that gives me coups

[upper hawk]

whatever i had for lunch is giving me the coups

bad

[keen belfry]

dey Poups of de Ass

im sure everyoen cares but im doing some keys wtih crown trinket

wish me luck ok?

[frail veldt]

thatd be pretty cool

[brittle carbon]

ok I haven't touched outlaw in forever, only playing assassination. Can I use a dagger in the OH until i get a second myth weapon or is that absolutely non-viable?

[slim hare]

!oh

[ornate heath]

A dagger offhand is ~1% better than a slow weapon mostly because of Zero In, and also slightly more Instant Poison procs. Energy is not affected by offhand speed.

It is possible large ilvl differences can matter more than this bonus so use Raidbots Top Gear when in doubt.

[brittle carbon]

ow, fancy

[cerulean portal]

pit 20

i was first

whole dungeon

[gaunt phoenix]

lost to a r*t

[cerulean portal]

and my ping went crazy

350+

first invite in a key in 6 hours and this happened

fml

[frail veldt]

never coming back

[fresh acorn]

Killing spree should enable a “ranged” window where you pistol shot and bte are giga

[lapis meadow]

I think I'm just bad but I perform so much better with fatebound than trix

[rough oriole]

Well I def would say the dispatch at 5+ makes the rotation a bit easier

[round spindle]

Does outlaw require a full physical comp to shine?

[vivid vessel]

well its like 15% more damage

to have the buffs

bit more

you could argue dk gain the same but they dont need it to shine tho

so ye idk

:D

[surreal latch]

How much difference are there between fatebound and trickster ?

I prefer fatebound but I don't wanna gimp myself too much either

[craggy barn]

lik 2%

[surreal latch]

2% behind ?

[craggy barn]

yes

[surreal latch]

That's reasonable for me, 2% of 0 is still 0 anyways

[jovial dock]

In M+, :fatebound: Fatebound is closer, potentially within 1% overall. I believe this is because of :fatebound: Fatebound's performance when :thistle_tea: Thistle Tea has run dry. Fatebound is way more comfortable with resources so it's perfectly acceptable to use it again. Overall aside, :trickster: Trickster is still going to give you more of a boost during the early AR/Lusted pulls and has perma Tricks so you might swap between both to decide what you like.

its pinned

[pure folio]

I had one the other day pinging me on how to tank a 21… he then told me he was using ai on how to play his class

[surreal latch]

I was more thinking of raids

[jovial dock]

raids it like yeah 2%

its in pinned above^

[jovial dock]

In raid, :trickster: Trickster is still expected to be ahead of :fatebound: Fatebound by about 2% ST and 4% sustain cleave. Not a crazy difference but hard to give up even if you can't stand Trickster. Can depend on gear a bit

[surreal latch]

Thanks

[rugged wigeon]

does positioning matter on outlaw? cos my damage is lacking big time

like do i have to be closer to the mobs im trying to cleave

[pure folio]

Yes blade flurry is an aura around your character, not what you’re attacking

[frail veldt]

8 yard range on bladeflurry

so positioning does matter a lot yeah

[rugged wigeon]

any addon to show that 8 yard range ? xD

[plush comet]

dumb question really but havent played rogue since Cata.

Do poisons not apply to a specific weapon anymore?

[craggy barn]

nope

just 1 lethal and non lethal poison

[plush comet]

well thats simple

[frail veldt]

Not visually but there are add-ons that tell you how many units are within 8 yards

[plush comet]

what about an addon/feature that lets you see your character better?

like a glow or circle or w/e

[pure folio]

Can use a marker on yourself

[rugged wigeon]

will take a look

[rugged wigeon]

i use exwind tools and it has a crosshair centred on my character

[plush comet]

is Emberwing Feather bad?

[cerulean portal]

im sick of mw in my keys

5 melee comp

they never do mechanics

just spin

[fair charm]

I use a m33kaura that shows number of targets in 8 yards and Zac has one for melee range.

https://wago.io/f269_7hV1

[golden vine]

Hey guys, for m+, do any of you know if it is worth it to go with 295 radiant dagger in off hand over 298 PoS dagger and moving embellishments to other pieces?

[quaint mauve]

298 dagger with double arcanoweave is best

im pretty sure

[gusty pagoda]

guys is it impossible to time a +12 without gems?

[hardy thicket]

Enchant and gem ur gear

[gusty pagoda]

how about no

[hardy thicket]

Ok

[golden vine]

with arcanoweave on which items apart from cloak tho? feels like we got good stat options for all other items

[gusty pagoda]

when I'm playing an alt and doing +12

[hardy thicket]

Ye well you make your own bed

[gusty pagoda]

if I have to enchant every alt I play I would need to buy a token monthly

[hardy thicket]

I enchant and gem alts

[gusty pagoda]

I understand checking gear in like +15 and up

but doing it in a +12 is just a self own

[buoyant stratus]

Reminder that 12s were timed week 1 at 240 ilvl

Amen

[gusty pagoda]

my weaps are enchanted btw

just dont bother with champion chest

[hardy thicket]

Yeah sure but uh if im a keyholder and someone brings an alt which they didnt bother to enchant or gem then w/e

I can see both sides

[buoyant stratus]

Ye

[random stirrup]

had someone say this about a character in our group being 240 ilvl and also saying good luck and leaving and then we 3 chested it

[buoyant stratus]

The rogue said: why 252 ilvl in here????

Thats tough tiddies dude

[random stirrup]

ye its a classic

[hardy thicket]

Yeah but this is assuming people know who you are

They dont

So iuno chill on the self entitlement

You could be a random pleb

[buoyant stratus]

Ye, i just invited literally anyone when crests uncapped

Didnt matter

But i get it

[random stirrup]

idk doesnt really bother me when they leave the group its just funny

[buoyant stratus]

Same

[random stirrup]

like char says you can just invite the first people to app and it will go fine

i get why they do it

[hardy thicket]

Yeah im just saying like there are numerous people playing this game

[short plover]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/NCh6jzKqrFBpVRax?fight=last

can sb check if i am doing sth severely wrong in my rotation? the run was weird, many deaths, really slow, but just rotational wise

[hardy thicket]

And if they like you enchant your gear and gem then so be it

[buoyant stratus]

I actually wonder

Whats the untimed to timed keys in the 10 range at rn

[hardy thicket]

They cant possibly know if you do 20s on the regular and will breeze through a 12

[random stirrup]

I mean this part isnt true since main rio is always linked

[hardy thicket]

This assuming they have rio installed

And people asking you to gem and enchant for 12s seem to fit the demo that does not

[random stirrup]

I sympathize with the people slogging their way through 12s that are untimable without full geared enchanted characters, and I am also certain that their hesitation to start the key in such a group probably comes from real experiences bricking keys this very season, but I find the disconnect in experiences amusing

[quaint mauve]

just do your lowest ilvl item

[hardy thicket]

I agree but like you also gotta accept that these people exist. So in that sense its perfectly fine to ask that someone who joins ur key has their enchants and gems sorted

[buoyant stratus]

Idk i think that people who inspect for enchants are somewhat dialed in and would know of rio

[golden vine]

hmh i guess, just wanted to not waste bonus rolls for no reason

[random stirrup]

oh I assumed this is all in the context of being the keyholder

[hardy thicket]

If a high rio alt joins my 12 weekly i dont even inspect because i know they can play the game

[random stirrup]

I don't usually bring those things to pugged keys

[buoyant stratus]

Speaking personally as a noob, i knew of rio a lot sooner than i enchanted my gear haha

[random stirrup]

Enchants used to be so expensive

staring down the barrel of paying 100k for my bis shadowlands legendary