Not when ur pushing for r1
#outlaw
shell fossil
it do be fun getting the route down and getting a 99 key% parse
shell fossil
ara kara tho with the prot warrior homie lmao
proven ocean
That happened once and it was 10 years ago too? Damn
vivid vessel
ok you cant do that in midnight
proven ocean
ok you cant do that in midnight
cerulean portal
can u guys tell me why tanks get oneshot in seat very first pack?:)
the fastest key so far
shell fossil
the shadowblade champions
cerulean portal
so he was just far from the adds
shell fossil
the bdk i play with doesn't start the other pulls til they're about to die basically they stack a debuff or bleed or something
jolly geyser
dont do the big pulll in a pug
kind otter
is there anywhere i can find a good outlaw level build?
jolly geyser
seat is like caverns for me, I dont have fun
keen belfry
i bet its bugged
inland acorn
is there anywhere i can find a good outlaw level build?
Wowhead has some leveling stuff
But fyi no matter what you do it will feel like ass leveling as outlaw
tough salmon
normal violet
because have you seen how they look?
cerulean portal
meme
dim widget
delete racials
cerulean portal
why play dwarf then
normal violet
It should just be like a build-a-bear situation where you can pick the race, the racial abilities, and the racial passive
idk
cerulean portal
NE my fav
keen belfry
not having dwarf racial and doing hard keys is a bit of a challenge
cerulean portal
they look good, racial is amazing
frail veldt
unfortunatly i cannot
be the change you want to see in this world zac
normal violet
Why can't I just be a blood elf with stoneform and the 2.5% crit dmg
buoyant stratus
U simply leave your life in rngs hands on seat if youre not a dwarf
lapis meadow
Petition: make races have no abilities and be purely cosmetic but make "backgrounds" that give abilities and shit
So I can be a velf and have stoneform
Gives RPers shit too
kindred nacelle
I think evokers have a bug where they can keep their humanoid form forever. I wonder if they can disguise themselves before that and retain the disguise
magic shuttle
Dracthyr is pretty cool with the glide
lapis meadow
Glide negates speed boosts tho so if you sprint and glide you move slower than sprinting
I think it also removes night stalker speed too
Rather it forces a static move speed cap while gliding which I think is slower than passive rogue move speed
vast mauve
ornate heathBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
livid pewter
jesus i literally camping in que forever... almost 2 hours and no invites for any 19/20's
proven ocean
LOOOOL
cerulean portal
i did grey logs on my 19 spires 😮
fading igloo
On Mythic Paladins, do ya'll just press BF on cooldown as long as they are stacked together?
cerulean portal
how do i delete that omg
fading igloo
I feel like I just run out of energy its misery
frail veldt
how do i delete that omg
cant delete logs
cerulean portal
frail veldt
so youll just have to play better next time and overwrite it haha
cerulean portal
i wanna die
fading igloo
should haste flask there
already am, i usually run out by the 2nd Execution sentence :/
maybe 25% with haste flask is just low idk
keen belfry
u can simply run out of teas 130 in
buoyant cosmos
i wanna die
run it back
cerulean portal
no just kill me
buoyant cosmos
can I have your computer ?
cerulean portal
no
buoyant cosmos
then live
cerulean portal
fading forum
is there anyone here that likes laughing at noobs and doesn't mind skimming a log to see if there's anything super obvious that i'm doing wrong? i'm definitely doing something wrong
i have no rogue friends 🙁
gaunt phoenix
Type !log and it opens a thread
fading forum
❤️
cerulean portal
no ones laughing here
fading forum
!log
frail veldt
video also works a lil better if you do any recording of your gameplay
gaunt phoenix
i am
cerulean portal
except @frail veldt
gaunt phoenix
ha ha !
frail veldt
watd I do!?
shell fossil
just remember that there's probably less than 500 parses in higher keys you're getting compared to at least one baller stack of ballers
past fossil
Is outlaw that unpopular?
fading forum
do people usually use warcraft recorder for recording?
shell fossil
no ppl don't log though i don't lol
fading forum
I heard people yell ahh data selling so didn't get it but
frail veldt
yeah I use shadowplay personally
craggy barn
and upload it
that too
i use warcraft recorder for guild raid related purposes
not required for just personal stuff, but having shit auto hosted helps
cerulean portal
watd I do!?
nothing wrong
shell fossil
frail veldt
not required for just personal stuff, but having shit auto hosted helps
Does it upload for free?
kinda sick ngl
fading forum
Is outlaw that unpopular?
in the first 19 i logged there were about 5k DK parses and 200 outlaw ones
frail veldt
sounds about right lol
past fossil
in the first 19 i logged there were about 5k DK parses and 200 outlaw ones
Lol, crazy
frail veldt
even when outlaws good its not popular
past fossil
So outlaw is fire mage #2
hardy thicket
past fossil
Why do people not like outlaw?
frail veldt
high work low reward
craggy barn
idk what the limits are
frail veldt
most players want low effort high reward
past fossil
True, that's why ret pally is popular
frail veldt
siiiiiiick I def need to do that, shadowplay is great cuz its pretty lightweight but I def will lose recordings since I'm not always paying attention to it
would be great to just auto record all instanced stuff
which I think the warcraft logs thing does
craggy barn
ret paladin has a huge amount of flashiness and fantasy tied to it that helps contribute a lot to its general popularity
it also has never been a very complicated class
hardy thicket
I will die on the hill that ret is actually pretty hard to play well if you try to maximize its utility for the group though
river wing
I will die on the hill that ret is actually pretty hard to play well if you try ...
that's the skillcap for it
frail veldt
high skill cap vs low skill floor
hardy thicket
tru
river wing
most players want low effort high reward
and some want high effort high reward, which WoW hasn't really pushed for a while
past fossil
and some want high effort high reward, which WoW hasn't really pushed for a whil...
MoP fistweaver, I miss it
gaunt phoenix
Why do people not like outlaw?
outlaw has a stigma of being the meme spec, since its introduction in legion
and then ppl who actually engage with outlaw might find it too much
but most of it is perception
smoky nova
If someone new jumps into outlaw it can also feel like crazy effort for same or less damage.
High skill, decent reward feel
And most rather hate it and take a different class or spec with less volatility
Invite an outlaw to the group? Hope he's ridiculously good.
vapid sundial
Invite an outlaw to the group? Hope he's ridiculously good.
This is the problem
outlaw is stereotyped bad
they play with a bad outlaw once then never accept another
smoky nova
Yeah, you can't hide bad outlaw like you can hide sub lol
vapid sundial
or they get one of the fucks in here who types in chat instead of focusing on the key
smoky nova
You guys are pro, you do the outlaw spam with your eyes closed
You hear and feel the Bte
You feel a sadness of one of a kind before you know what you've rolled
inner meadow
on belo ren
im doing the 1st soak with immunity
is it worth holding adr until after
or is it just worth popping on the start but lose a few seconds on adr
looking at lorrgs and there are some people popping adr late and id assume that's what they are doing aswell
sleek cedar
!fuu
noble lynx
is there a list of important abilities feint works or doesn't work on?
hardy thicket
Just play elusiveness and it works on everything 
vapid sundial
!def
ornate heathBOT
Rogue Defensive Spreadsheet: > Click to open <
noble lynx
thanks!
keen belfry
mess around with the colors of everything, not sure
maiden beacon
whats a good loot addon? Too easy check what loot drops in dungeons and raid? Before i used to see it in mys creen what ppl looted butnow its gone
rugged wigeon
did anyone use the crucible trinket when levelling ?
keen belfry
u can use it for a long time
rugged wigeon
damn really xD
keen belfry
its as good as any heroic trinket if u upgrade it
keen belfry
skyreach yuh
uncut stratus
There a resource I can look at on MH 1h OH 1h vs MH 1h OH dagger
inland acorn
!oh
ornate heathBOT
A dagger offhand is ~1% better than a slow weapon mostly because of 
Zero In, and also slightly more 
Instant Poison procs. Energy is not affected by offhand speed.
It is possible large ilvl differences can matter more than this bonus so use 
Raidbots Top Gear when in doubt.
uncut stratus
sweet thx
uncut stratus
Do we ever clip/cancel/interrupt Killing Spree channel early?
keen belfry
yuh basically always
viscid seal
yeah just on principle cause fuck it
uncut stratus
can't tell if yall being sarcastic
keen belfry
max energy, 6+ combo point, or if u want to do more prio dam in big aoe pulls
viscid seal
nah you can cancel it, its dps neutral
gaunt palm
I will let it run whenever I go get a drink mid pull
gaunt palm
keen belfry
i like to update my details when its on an old pull during ks
uncut stratus
check this 
the builds on WoWhead "raid tips" section that shows a build per raid boss are seriously recommended? or still better to grab like top talent builds from WCL/archon?
sand berry
big fan of killing spree pop a lil crimson vial into ss
keen belfry
just go to wcl and see what ppl run, some bosse swill have a little variance like crown if u wanna pad more
luckily its basically 2 talent points u r choosing to swap
radiant wyvern
just go to wcl and see what ppl run, some bosse swill have a little variance lik...
every top log is just gonna be a mf rolling 100% jackpot uptime, not talent choice 
frail veldt
max energy, 6+ combo point, or if u want to do more prio dam in big aoe pulls
Is it max energy OR 6cp?
keen belfry
i tink so
frail veldt
I cancel at 6 but I thought apl was specifically max energy
Cuz if you only do max energy it rarely happens I feel like
keen belfry
aint nobody i knew let that thang full channel
frail veldt
I do it at low energy
Outside of adr
Cuz it's dpet is still higher than a dispatch
keen belfry
u gain literally 0 energy during it i just go press stuff
it wont save u and i hate channeling as outlaw
frail veldt
Yeah but you don't lose energy during it haha
frail veldt
When I'm low energy id rather sit a channel than afk staring at my energy bar
keen belfry
okay go do that
frail veldt
Namean
keen belfry
im gonna press buttons i dont like ks
frail veldt
It's only ever like a 1s difference max
Esp if you follow the KS at 5cp
Then full channel is like the same
frail veldt
Just validating my own decisions
buoyant cosmos
this is a cavern 19 log... can someone tell me why im so trash in dps?
kinda unrelated but are you using wound poison for your MC runs in the first half?
buoyant stratus
go full channel it bro
The virgin full channel vs the cancel insta to proc more unseen blades gigachad
keen belfry
i can tell
radiant wyvern
fake outlaw player
buoyant stratus
Very
frail veldt
why dont u go pet my d <@151872253229924352>
I have plenty of time to since I full channel
buoyant stratus
Holy one of the greats!
keen belfry
ty
radiant wyvern
michigander?
outer meteor
oh i just saw that
i was gonna
but my friend wants full phys
and not my key
oh shit
radiant wyvern
outer meteor
i dont...
keen belfry
ive decided im gonna get a myth helm, myth gaze and mythg shoulders
keen belfry
ill have full discount for my last few slots and 170 crests
i think i craft ring
and just gain 50 haste
idk what else id do, im gonna get the MC helm in my 2 bonus rolls that ill have since i wont have to bonus roll on chimariues
surely
outer meteor
wait ur sitting on 170 crests?
outer meteor
just get prism in vault
keen belfry
helm and tie rshoulders
buoyant stratus
19% haste
outer meteor
19 haste is crazy
buoyant stratus
Even more reason to channel ks
outer meteor
i got it at 27 with flask
radiant wyvern
thats still rough in a key
buoyant stratus
So little mastery
outer meteor
maybe too much
buoyant stratus
Kinda chad
keen belfry
i have 300 mastery!
outer meteor
i have 297!
keen belfry
but to fix my haste i think i craft ring + 50 then cata bracers + 50
i think i want like 26
just based off vibes
ive had some bad moments this week with literally no haste
outer meteor
i was testing it
and it felt a lil better to hold like 1 extra br
but idk
maybe placebo
keen belfry
he has a few stacks by the time ur AR falls off
my dmg to first add is actually so rng
ive done like 17 mil ive done like 10
keen belfry
im unsure what my dmg will even be like, usualyl early on im doing 0 dmg cuz i raid lead
so i just look around
radiant wyvern
im unsure what my dmg will even be like, usualyl early on im doing 0 dmg cuz i r...
raid lead debuff is big
keen belfry
if i had guidon i think i would play sub here
i play sub when i have to
but i dont thikn i wanna play it without guidon
outer meteor
nah bro
buoyant stratus
U have a puzzle box?
keen belfry
ithink playing outlaw on belo is troll and id ont think ill do it
just like dimmy
i play outlaw unless its actually trolling
buoyant stratus
Disagree
Outlaw good on belo
Only thing that matters now is getting out of bird phase
Unless raid dps is actually mia
80 seconds on egg is more than enough for sub optimal cd usage
vivid vessel
ithink playing outlaw on belo is troll and id ont think ill do it
i think its not bad now
because
making p2 easier
is op
and outlaw make p2 easier
like 2nd p1 i mean
buoyant stratus
Ye
vivid vessel
and you should always kill boss if you get to 2nd egg now i think
no matter how bad your egg comp is
i think we overkilled by like 20% or smth
radiant wyvern
having so much power on smokescreen before nerf was pretty troll but it was nice having like some sort of burst dmg on law
slim hare
i killed belo first time tonight
second p1 was hard
but we did overkill by at least 5%
keen belfry
i forgot sub isnt a cd spec again
cosmic parrot
If you're at full combo points but don't have BF up during AOE, do you just waste the combo points to get the finisher in or would you send the finisher on a single target then BF
worldly compass
bf
keen belfry
bf
deft mason
phys comp on the board
vagrant saddle
not even 24
pastel sierra
If you were playing sub most likely, from assa might be fine to get a weapon and swap box for a better trinket
toxic galleon
dont u want offhand crafted tho
tribal cosmos
well sure but you can just get that in 2 weeks anyway
crests are basically uncapped already
and soon everything will be uncapped
keen belfry
i wouldnt say guidon is useless, its just not bis
keen belfry
yeah u just need to fix ur haste and mastery
keen belfry
he has same unbuffed haste as me
toxic galleon
but like no point playing outlaw without 298 main hand surely
keen belfry
if 500 of his mastery went to crit hed have good stats
keen belfry
and ideally, u dont want helm tier, but not end of world
tribal cosmos
that ring murders your haste
toxic galleon
ye well i havnt been able to bonus roll cause ive not got gaze
killed mythic 5 times and used 3 rolls
Lol
pastel sierra
ye well i havnt been able to bonus roll cause ive not got gaze
Time to go into the mines then
tribal cosmos
well all your rings are hero anyway
just farm occlusion and then next week reroll a 1h
pastel sierra
Farm hero gear
tribal cosmos
ez game
toxic galleon
i have myth signet of the starved beast
pastel sierra
Surely only 30 runs to get it
keen belfry
killed mythic 5 times and used 3 rolls
better than using 4 rolls and havent gotten it yet
keen belfry
i have myth signet of the starved beast
use this good ring
but u wanna be around 25% haste when u do keys
toxic galleon
yeah just rogue cause dont wanna grief my setup for raid prog as sub
toxic galleon
weapon enchant?
tribal cosmos
weapon oil
tribal cosmos
less fun then backstab evis simulator
toxic galleon
ye but the burst and shit is nice
and im good at it
mainly thats why
compared to outlaw
toxic galleon
surely grief tho cause i dont hav 298 weap tho
tribal cosmos
crest cap unlocks in 2 weeks probably
toxic galleon
ye ig then i can have 2 setups
pastel sierra
surely grief tho cause i dont hav 298 weap tho
All u gotta do is void core your crafted weapon
I assume you have mythic dagger on sub
toxic galleon
yeah
toxic galleon
All u gotta do is void core your crafted weapon
but my main hand would still be 289
ig need another voidcore
lol
toxic galleon
ye true
pastel sierra
1.5h per full core
toxic galleon
tbf my dagger is also haste/mast cause sub
i could make it crit/haste
and it shouldnt grief sub
toxic galleon
ye
frosty stratus
Ranger-Captain's Iridescent Insignia or solarprism ???
glass mortar
whichever one sims higher
frosty stratus
for m+
glass mortar
on dslice
frosty stratus
Ranger-Captain's Iridescent Insignia says higher but im switching from sub to outlaw to try spec https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/fspMC2Ycbod2hNrfGFFmkP
glass mortar
eh
frosty stratus
glass mortar
they basically sim identical
also idk what sim settings u have on but all ur results are in low precision so
frosty stratus
yeah so im asking bc i play sub n am trying to try
glass mortar
kinda jank
frosty stratus
rip
glass mortar
too many options at once maybe
or something idk why all ur choices are s omuch lower then ur current gear
frosty stratus
oh i see ill resim ty
frosty stratus
yeah im not home yet just trying to get an idea of gear
frosty stratus
lol
glass mortar
crit values arent the same and direct damage value isnt quite the same
itll probably be captains if u want ST/prio damage from ur trinket and prism for actual aoe
but it could just be prism overall depending on ur crit level
rough oriole
so why some people running guidon on outlaw 
glass mortar
sims will know
frosty stratus
hows the transition from sub like ?
frosty stratus
ill probably do solar prism with gaze but i wanted to know what others run as outlaw
yeah mastery bad
but i have some decent stats it wont be that bad but yeah ill have extra mastery unlesss i drop ilvl ill sim to get better results on outlaw
frosty stratus
but the rest of what u have probably not too bad
ty
toxic galleon
since im using guidon while i dont have a better trinket for outlaw, when do i press it
opaque lance
For trickster, both dispatch and BtE are used at 6+ cp, right ?
glass mortar
yes
formal thunder
since im using guidon while i dont have a better trinket for outlaw, when do i p...
I'd probably just bind it to AR
wintry solar
I miss the ring from df
wooden river
is cloud cover still bugged where it refreshes after it expires, or do we need to step into it still?
formal thunder
is cloud cover still bugged where it refreshes after it expires, or do we need t...
still bugged, pop AR and forget about Cloud Cover
wooden river
thank you!
vast owl
this may be a stupid question but is there any builds that dont utilize KS? just feel like it clogs rotation sometimes
gaunt phoenix
Yes, go fatebound
gaunt phoenix
Yes it is
vast owl
oh okay lol
gaunt phoenix
Trickster was harshly nerfed
so that it is only mildly ahead
well, the cloud cover was nerfed and outlaw was aura buffed in return, which boosted fatebound
past fossil
this may be a stupid question but is there any builds that dont utilize KS? just...
Hating on gunfu? Blasphemy.
jovial dock
with the correct stats, whats better.. lights potential or recklessness
and do we sim slice or patchwerk
torpid fiber
and do we sim slice or patchwerk
slice is better for M+ than multi-target patchwerk
viral heron
Hey friends.. has anyone been able to find an addon that will show a numeric value for your combo points? I have tried everywhere
Happy Monday!
wide shore
Is anyone running acrobatic strikes instead of sleight for m+
I have no credentials but yes because sleight is useless if you always roll 3s and 4s anyway 😉
dim parrot
Yeh that’s what I was thinking like what if I just high roll and then have higher peaks
and not think about the low roll
viral heron
Hey friends.. has anyone been able to find an addon that will show a numeric val...
figured out my own question - tellmewhen addon and create a group condition!
rough anchor
figured out my own question - tellmewhen addon and create a group condition!
good to know i was looking for this too
errant terrace
!fuu
ornate heathBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
lean warren
For rogue outlaw it is recommended to hold adrenaline rush for end of packs, and to hold BTE if adrenaline rush is coming of cd in 30 seconds.
But do we hold BTE as well for end of packs?
gaunt phoenix
No, not really
lean warren
Thanks Solo.
vivid vessel
btw @gaunt phoenix
im pooling for adr rn
when im at 0 energy
first time in my life i think outlaw has to actually pool energy
otherwise you can press adr and legit go afk
wintry solar
I was legit thinking that not even 30 seconds ago
wintry solar
They need to be finished
long barn
@vivid vessel lil bro, why you using the haste tinker
vivid vessel
!guidon
long barn
Yea
vivid vessel
🤓
long barn
What secret tech
vivid vessel
i dont have other mythic trinkets
vivid vessel
unlucky
i have good gear otherwise so its hard to complain
i guess
idk
maybe i can complain
long barn
I mean
vivid vessel
I will get belo trinket in vault tomorrow dw about me
vivid vessel
I mean
long barn
Is that mythic trinket better than heroic plume?
tribal cosmos
Guidon
vivid vessel
Is that mythic trinket better than heroic plume?
No but I don't have heroic plume
vivid vessel
I killed belo hc almost every week but
tribal cosmos
Manic grieftorch
long barn
No bonus roll on it?
glad kestrel
hello questions, is any way working put BtE and dispatch on same macro? so if one availbe press it , else use the other?
long barn
M+ build?
long barn
Don’t tell me go sub
vivid vessel
hello questions, is any way working put BtE and dispatch on same macro? so if on...
No
long barn
Oh okay not bad I think ring is good
tribal cosmos
Take your ring and pee on it
glad kestrel
okey second question,is there a macro checking when u stealth same button do Cheap shot,if out of steallth do kidney shot?
tribal cosmos
Yea
vivid vessel
Yes you can do that
glad kestrel
mouse over too
glad kestrel
would u send me the macro if u got it mate?
tribal cosmos
glad kestrel
i tries didnt find any working
tribal cosmos
Watch wotoxic guide he explains everything
Including the macros
Including gear
Including stata
Including literally every question
tribal cosmos
glad kestrel
now what % of your dps do Killing spee do in average dungeon? i dont find it so good,or am doing something wrong
talent with less cd in BtE seems more ok to me
dim parrot
Killing spree sucks yeh
gaunt phoenix
ks damage is whatever, but it gives you 2 unseen blades
gaunt phoenix
im pooling for adr rn
eh
unkempt iris
Actually never dropped once
literally me, still have yet to see a gaze or plume drop across 4 chars this game is cruel
keen belfry
uncut stratus
!ok
keen belfry
kinda fuckable no?
hearty edge
W protein
rugged wigeon
does the macro for max camera distance still work?
cinder relic
nop
keen belfry
i thnk not
rugged wigeon
is there any other way to do it?
keen belfry
stand farther away from computer screen
rugged wigeon
lool
keen belfry
it was very good no cap
like for a creami and healthy version of ic cream, strong 7
is it just worse than normal ice cream? yes
frail veldt
Wake up the whole neighbourhood tho
fr fr
dim parrot
Guys I pass my first 20 today
Then overtimed 21 nxp by 23 seconds cuz last boss reset at 80%
We had cc’d adds running across bridge
Then it made him reset
Was rly sad
uncut stratus
the goat:
light mountain
now what % of your dps do Killing spee do in average dungeon? i dont find it so ...
Ionno why ppl talking abt ks like its the plague 💀
light mountain
Gives back ur combo points and energy + unseen blade procs
serene cosmos
Ionno why ppl talking abt ks like its the plague 💀
KS just here to proc trickster hero tree
tribal cosmos
Yea but what if it was just one pump shotgun
light mountain
Its been dog shit since it murdered us
Except it doesnt kill u now
tribal cosmos
And didnt last 56 years
light mountain
U can defensive and u can move during it dont see any issues
Ig ppl still scarred from pre rework ks
keen belfry
Lfg
cerulean portal
is it ok to use blade rush b4 ar?
gaunt phoenix
ye
elfin lantern
do i use KS during AR or better to i use it outside of AR window?
or it does not matter?
dense bridge
does rb affect prep
wintry solar
No
silent edge
Saw zac using light’s company in skyreach 23 Yesterday. I thought we would Stay clear of on-use trinkets if possible. Is lights company good for outlaw now?
Or its always been good I guess but ya know
reef forge
I think that's his best option
silent edge
I see. Guess you would just send it on CD and have higher crit/abit less haste then?
cerulean portal
i got accepted
howd it go
wide shore
for BtE/pistol shot, does blade flurry proc around you or your target?
weary fog
its around u
thin fiber
its around u
blizz's logic: using a gun to do melee attack
quaint mauve
howd it go
tank died on first pull
uncut stratus
is there anything we can do besides cloak to break roots/snares, like pit gargoyle, seat chains, MT chains etc...
kinda like how locks can demonic circle teleport, hunters can feign death etc
weary fog
vanish
livid sand
Meld
wet gull
What metric is affecting performance the most ? Too much bar rolls ? Combo points waste ? Energy waste ?
inland acorn
Probably not pressing buttons fast enough (in ADR) and energy waste (incorrect build/finish priority)
wintry solar
Adr uptime I'd imagine
inland acorn
Basically if you just press stuff randomly, you'll run out of teas --> run out of energy --> logout
It's hard to fuck adr uptime now no ?
Unless not following build/finish priority
wintry solar
Ain't much else to gauge, except 1buff uptime
inland acorn
1buff 
wintry solar
inland acorn
even 2buff feels like ass
jolly geyser
One of a kind buff that
inland acorn
compared to 3
lean flax
Is KS or a coup de grace higher prio
inland acorn
We don't really track coup, but if you really want to min-max it
I would assume it's similiar to TWW, where you coup > ks so you don't waste UB stacks
lean flax
Yeah I haven't really been tracking it but it popped into my head I was curious if it mattered
inland acorn
Idk if solo like, simmed it or something. I assume if he did it probably didn't really matter, since it's not mentioned in faq/pins
lean flax
Also I was curious but wondering if this is a me thing or if it's universal. Especially during ADR I'll notice that I'm spamming my next gcd before the gcd is up and even though visually it looks like the gcd timer on my bars is ready it still takes like a sec for the next ability to send
Is that just like lag or something I'm doing wrong
inland acorn
Might be lag, might be your spellqueue being too low which makes you 'miss' ?
lean flax
I've tried messing with the spell queue, though it's hard to tell sometimes
inland acorn
Ye it's hard to like get it right
lean flax
Like I just feel like I'm spamming and then the next gcd is ready but the ability doesn't send properly
inland acorn
Since it varies for most people
lean flax
Like if I'm spamming fast enough to give myself carpal tunnel shouldn't matter right?
inland acorn
Are you noticing it more in raid or m+ ?
tulip warren
In m+ how much stronger is Trickster? I do like to play Fatebound but I might not if its a big diff, just started my 18ths
inland acorn
If its raid, it might just feel bad because of game performance
inland acorn
In m+ how much stronger is Trickster? I do like to play Fatebound but I might no...
somewhere between 1-3%, dslice will favour trickster due to short duration, but in droute (which resembles m+ more with your routes) FB is very close
lean flax
and other times i feel like im waiting like a standard gcd time instead of an adr gcd
inland acorn
Could it be due to Apex talent ?
BtE from apex resets and gives cps, when it actually hits
tulip warren
somewhere between 1-3%, dslice will favour trickster due to short duration, but ...
ty 🙂
inland acorn
unlike the Ace, which when resets gives you cp on cast
it's very noticeable on like Vorassius for example
lean flax
yeah i definitely notice that but not quite what im feeling
even now im hitting the dummy just to test it
and it feels like theres a slight delay between gcd ready
and the ability actually going off
like .1 or .2 seconds of dead time
my MS is 42 so idk
inland acorn
yeah idk then, it could be spellqueue, your ms, your fps all that stuff :/
lean flax
so just curious
inland acorn
Might even be like your keyboard and shit
inland acorn
For the most part ye
Only times i notice light delays, its in raid when like you have big performance spikes
From boss doing some aoe hit shit, so game calculates billion things
inland acorn
well, it gives you higher window to que spell, so technically ye, but might also make you miss some proc reactions
frail veldt
and the ability actually going off
Mine does this
Always has not sure why
It's like 250ms into the gcd that the swipe like skips to
My logs still have abilities going off on gcd timing so it really only hurts my time to react
But yeah if I press an ability it feels like it doesn't go off for like 200ms
inland acorn
Do you feel it since start of midnight or just recently ?
Maybe patch messed something up
frail veldt
Feels worse in midnight than before
Ive only done a couple keys after being off for a week so not sure if there's anything from the patch specifically
lean flax
like just looking at my logs things look STRANGE
inland acorn
I mean, nothing really mention in patch, but it's Blizzard
Not really known for their pipe control quality
frail veldt
My logs look normal so maybe different issue
frail veldt
Weird
lean flax
oh wait no
thats the mastery i think
for some reason on the same
nvm
and has the same symbol lmao
inland acorn
ye KS still has old icon in logs timeline for some reason
lean flax
shortest gcd possible during adr is .75 seconds right
inland acorn
wasn't it flat .8 ?
lean flax
oh ig
inland acorn
like it can't go below
lean flax
not sure
thats why i was asking haha
im checking my logs now
prep doesnt get the fast gcd pretty sure too right
inland acorn
no
lean flax
ok so my logs look fine then
i guess its just a feeling
at least opener looks fine anyways
inland acorn
My logs look fine too like 0.804 0.809 0.800 gaps in casts
It doesn't mean your feeling is wrong tho
lean flax
yeah thats what im showing on mine
inland acorn
It might be that game has slight delay to what you see like cps/animations/casts
But its correctly calculated in combat log
ngl hard to say
lean flax
all i know for sure is that the "feeling" of the button presses is off
at least for me
i feel like im missing time
i guess im not
it may be a sound delay
contributing or something
lean flax
when the gcd gets low sometimes my bte proc just doesnt be sounding
lean flax
I have sound effects muted 90% of the time
I couldn't the sound procs help me react faster on stuff
I had a friend who basically played outlaw on pure sound back on old RTB
different sound effects for different rolls lmao
so he didn't have to look
cerulean portal
kekw
inland acorn
I couldn't the sound procs help me react faster on stuff
I still get sound effect on Opportunity proccing, from WA
I don't really have other sound effects on so
and muting sound effects gives me like +10fps in raid 
inland acorn
I mean I think it has been a thing for a long time
It's just people started to notice it more now
Like even in like SL muting sound effects was boosting my fps, due to just insane amount of sound files being played sometimes in raid
lean flax
I feel like the optimization has been a lot worse starting with TWW
which is making people notice the drops more
it was honestly the worst i've ever seen it in TWW at least personally
on a relatively new mid range card i'd drop down to the 20s on lust pulls in manaforge
inland acorn
yeah, feel like they're going overboard with effects and shit to make fights look "epic"
on top of random ride-wide hits which cause drops, because game calculates all that
like belo this tier is so flashy in intermission and my fps are just being tanked
lean flax
yeah, it just feels bad because wow is really not a high fidelity game
so it feels bad to have low fps on a game that really should be running flawlessly considering how it looks
20 years of spaghetti code adds up i guess
inland acorn
And old ass game engine
I did gain a little bit fps though, with WAs mostly gone
But that was expected, since WAs were basically half of UI for some
lean flax
yeah the one benefit out of WAs being mostly gone is the fps bump
my fps drops def aren't as bad this season versus manaforge
but we'll see if that trend continues
ancient hamlet
hey guys, in AR do we can to use KS or we prefer to use other finishers prio?
inland acorn
you still use it, if your BtE is on cd
ancient hamlet
okok, but you cancel it at full cp right?
inland acorn
Yes
molten heath
I came back to wow a few weeks ago and still unhappy with my nameplates even tho I'm trying a bunch of tweans every now and then, any advice ? I'm using Platynator, previously Plater
mighty pivot
you ask for advice without explaining the problem 
vague cape
I came back to wow a few weeks ago and still unhappy with my nameplates even tho...
Keep trying profiles until one sticks
molten heath
Ah, the problem is the clarity of it, i cant seem to find the proper settings so it doesnt feel cluttered and the cast bar sometimes are behind the nameplates making it hard to see and kick
hardy thicket
okok, but you cancel it at full cp right?
It is generally a gain to let it finish unfortunately. You cant simply cancel at max CP like previous iterations. Theres a condition to cancel it if you reach full energy during the channel
quiet root
It is generally a gain to let it finish unfortunately. You cant simply cancel at...
outlaw energy in current expansion 😔
worldly compass
doing paladins rn, if you lowroll it's so over energy goes bye bye
neat flame
Hey, old timer rogue combat here, got my outlaw rogue jumped onto mythic vanguards for some reason. Although I still love the spec I'm not satisfied with my perf. Do you know of an outlaw stream pov / vod of mythic vanguard in outlaw spec ? (No success on yt or warcraft log so far :/ ) Thanks !
arctic hollow
Outlaw really doesn't perform well on vanguard. You are barely on the energy threshold of Bladeflurry at 3 targets, our damage profile doesnt favor 3 targets cleave, it's just not fun despite 100% uptime
There's not much to optimise beside the rotation in that fight
opal badger
Do we do same prepull stuff in raid as in m+?
arctic hollow
Raid prepull is ADR -> Roll -> SND, starting at 2s
opal badger
It reset on pull or we just prep?
arctic hollow
On pull you Rush build to BTE, once BTE doesnt reset you Prep, rush BTE until reset, KS, then normal rotation until BTE is up and use second ADR on it
Keep KiR if you roll a 2 on the first ADR, KIR on the second Roll even if 2
opal badger
I always somewhat forget about KS
opal badger
Keep KiR if you roll a 2 on the first ADR, KIR on the second Roll even if 2
Ya, that way we have roll till AR is back for another
neat flame
Outlaw really doesn't perform well on vanguard. You are barely on the energy thr...
I probably fail some basic stuff thus my question to see actual good gameplay / positioning. From warcraft log although the population is small it seems outlaw is competitive on vanguard regarding other rogue spec (huge variance though). Thanks I learned and thing or 2 just reading through your answers !
inland acorn
I probably fail some basic stuff thus my question to see actual good gameplay / ...
Zac streamed 2 days ago reclear, he played outlaw on vanguard
serene cosmos
I probably fail some basic stuff thus my question to see actual good gameplay / ...
Tbh, go for assa, it's way easier
Having to maximizing uptaime + not fail + mechanics on the boss is painful
But if you're a ol otp, pls yourself, I think ol can do well with some good rng + skill
toxic galleon
How grief is it to have no shaman in grp
m+
cause im running keys with my mistweaver mate
so trying to take a dps shaman most time ig thats fine thinking about it
arctic hollow
How grief is it to have no shaman in grp
Skyfury is 5.7, the best for us, then Battle shout, but sham is inconsistent in low keys when the tanks doesnt play around their ascension
vital otter
Anyone able to do a log review and tell me why i suck so bad at outlaw?
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/DFMR9JjBGgf4NtYZ?fight=23&type=damage-done
im having a hard time keeping up with other DPs and consistently getting out dpsed by even the tank sometimes.
Note: i swapped to outlaw less than 10 days ago fully and just started to push keys the last 2 days
timber knoll
Sin is boring baby spec outlaw will always be BEST
arctic hollow
Very hard to tell without a pov with spell tracker, but at 1:30 you ADR then Sinister Strike before your Blade Rush
vital otter
Very hard to tell without a pov with spell tracker, but at 1:30 you ADR then Sin...
I've got a PoV of the key, but i mean looking at my logs it's consistent, like parsing 1-10% for the key
timber knoll
Dumb question could you feed a combat log file and simc into an LLM and get rotational feedback from that? With maybe extra context / tips from wowhead guide or whatever
cerulean portal
Dumb question could you feed a combat log file and simc into an LLM and get rota...
try gpt :>
vital otter
Very hard to tell without a pov with spell tracker, but at 1:30 you ADR then Sin...
I'm noticing i have a substantial amount of more
melee hits than other logs, like 25% more. Would that be bad.
inland acorn
For best results, i would recommend you record yourself hitting dummy for like 1 min, with some GCD history/tracker on screen
Best way to spot any possible issues you're making, reading outlaw logs is just masochistic
vital otter
Yeah it's super frustrating, i did do a MC 18 earlier and had a tank who pulled for outlaw and went into first boss around the 230k dps area. It's felt great but anything over 8 targets I'm screwed
inland acorn
from quick glance though I can tell you
You have suspiciously low cast amount on blade flurry, between the eyes, blade rush
you rolled one of a kind 8 times, which is also sus af
vital otter
Blade fury on CD, Between on CD unless within 20 seconds of AR. blade rush on CD.
Dispatch at 5 or more
Between always at 7
vital otter
you rolled one of a kind 8 times, which is also sus af
Look at my buffs, i got a low ammoint of triple threat + jackpots
upper hawk
Dispatch is at 6+ too
wintry solar
For trickster ye
inland acorn
Look at my buffs, i got a low ammoint of triple threat + jackpots
did you
wintry solar
I'm assuming he is
inland acorn
not send KiR at +2 buff
if you knew that your next roll would be nat ?
Because otherwise I can't really fathom how you ended up with 8 stage1 rolls
you had only 9 kir casts
vital otter
not send KiR at +2 buff
11 triple Threats, 5 jack pots the entire dungeon
inland acorn
that
doesn't really answer my question
Like in my weekly 12 (i know its not really good comparison)
in 22 minutes i had same or higher casts than you
unkempt dew
Did we got buffed?
arctic hollow
Did we got buffed?
No pin no change
inland acorn
that's why i'm asking, because it's most likely due to you rolling stage1
if you're sitting on KIR instead of sending it at stage2
if you know your next roll is nat
vital otter
I'm only KIR on triple or higher right?
Also when i get the loaded dice buff, sometime i have a +2 but will reroll and get a +1
arctic hollow
In key you dont do that. You only hold kir for 3+ at pull when you have prep
inland acorn
it doesn't technically move dps needle, but it definietly feels way better
arctic hollow
Otherwise avoiding stage 1 is no1 prio
wintry solar
Shout-out to that time I fat fingered KiR on a 1 buff
vital otter
Maybe I'm just confused on how to avoid a 2 the
inland acorn
Using KIR at stage 3 means that sometimes you will low-roll drop to stage 1 RTB, just waiting for a promise of a future stage 3+ to KIR. Outside of sim scenarios this is not the greatest feeling so it is important to note that you can KIR at stage 2 to just keep yourself above stage 1 if needed.
It is also worth it to roll over stage 2 RTB if Loaded Dice is active and KIR is ready```i thoguht between is 6+
and dis
inland acorn
it is
vital otter
So that makes sense
So let's say i have a stage 2
I get loaded, I'm guaranteed to get atleast a 2 again
With the possibility to get a 3 or 4
upper hawk
That says you CAN roll at 2 for feels without losing much but on average it’s technically better to always hold for 3+
inland acorn
That says you CAN roll at 2 for feels without losing much but on average it’s te...
Would you rather
wintry solar
Based if you do
upper hawk
That’s not his problem though I can almost guarantee
vital otter
I'm getting destroyed so bad on dps, i thought there has to be some crazy thing im just missing
Like 120k ending a +17 at 284 i feel like im missing some key component
upper hawk
He’s not playing well enough to get enough CDR to have loaded dice up for more rolls
vital otter
I can't be missing something as simple as dispatch at 2 instead of 9 combo points ya know
vital otter
I mean yeah, i can see that, but very rarely do i feel like im cooked on CPs. More like cooked on the energy degen and my downtime between a big cds
Also, i almost never do more than 500k dps on a big pull
inland acorn
but you are
less cps --> you need to spend more on builders --> more energy consumed
upper hawk
You get more value out of holding KIR for 3+ and living with some stage 1. But that’s assuming you’re playing right and getting the most out of your high rolls
vital otter
Looking at top logs, i have a higher RTB uptime
Now I'm def higher in stage 1 uptime than stage 2
upper hawk
If they’re dispatching at 5 and BTE only at 7 they are losing a lot right there
vital otter
Anything else stand out super noticeable?
I have higher melee hits than a lot of other classes but lower Main Gauche damage
upper hawk
Higher melee by %?
vital otter
No like raw hits
sand berry
I think that means you're wasting gcds
vital otter
My active SND is significantly higher + 6%
BTE is down like 11% but I'm comparing the log right now
sand berry
well not wasting but not pressing buttons fast enough
vital otter
And it seems night and day to what others
I'm at like 25.6% haste raw, and usually 30% with buffs food tech
timid portal
can you send a pov of you hitting target dummies for few min? with some addon that shows what you press
vital otter
I'm offline right now 🙁
vital otter
what does casting have to do with melee
Less GCD usage = more melee hits?
sand berry
your melee will be higher than other buttons if you're not pressing them
inland acorn
?
vital otter
GCD use means no hit auto attack
inland acorn
I'm confused
vital otter
It interiors the auto attack when you use a spell?
pastel sierra
Guys thats why our dps is so low
vital otter
That's what i thought
lean flax
Someone dragged in a fossil
pastel sierra
We need to play with swing timer on screen again
inland acorn
arctic hollow
oh god
inland acorn
Ok to summarize this shit
lean flax
Gcd hasn't affected auto attacks in like
vital otter
Idk i have the litter all worst logs on almost every key right now
lean flax
10 years
inland acorn
Bte + dispatch at 6+, don't force Bte at 7, dont dispatch at 5
vital otter
Like these worst outlaw doing 17-18s lol
inland acorn
Consider KiR stage 2, if you know your next roll doesn't have loaded dice
Also you missed at least 1 extra use of prep in that key
its 27 min dungeon and you used prep 6 times
arctic hollow
Even for Vanish / Crackshot the swing timer was a rounding error
inland acorn
oh ye, unbind ambush
vital otter
No ambush for vanish? Blade fury?
vital otter
Ok
arctic hollow
Normal builder prio
vital otter
When send killing spree?
inland acorn
when bte is on cd
inland acorn
I like having a defensive back
wish it had little more usages though, very niche currently
like roots / chains in seat / skyreach last boss
lean flax
True but the usages it has this season are very impactful
timid portal
i mean they could put vanish back on restless
inland acorn
i think they want to avoid now vanish on restless
lean flax
Oh you said that but yeah