outlaw

[crimson scarab]

and ppl dont seem to like to have rogues in their group

[karmic gust]

even though they perform less than them ?

[crimson scarab]

the duality of man...

[elfin tusk]

guys im so excited for the buffs 😊
Its making my all warm and fuzzy inside

[eternal hound]

They expect you to be 289

With 4k io

before you are even considered

[karmic gust]

feels like applying to an it job

[crimson scarab]

its even worse haha

[karmic gust]

10y of xp on a 2yo language

[eternal hound]

10 years xp of 3k

Or gtfo

[karmic gust]

i legit saw a job listing last summer where you needed to have 4y of xp on a 2 months old framework

[crimson scarab]

i bet it was in the US right?

[karmic gust]

nope

worse

[frail veldt]

whats worse?

[karmic gust]

🇫🇷

find worse

[frail veldt]

zacs home turf

[karmic gust]

wow is a coping mechanism

[eternal hound]

It always is

The cope is with friends life will be fun

[karmic gust]

gotta find them first tho

[crimson scarab]

https://klipy.com/gifs/angry-thiago-mad

[karmic gust]

been trying to find a key for almost 2 hours now, great sunday so far

[eternal hound]

is yours trash?

[crimson scarab]

try to push urs

[inner yacht]

if u try to push yours and you dont have 4kio you will wait 2 hours for a tank

its not btter

[karmic gust]

tried to do my 13 AA, 3rd dps was below tank and healer was dying to floor spells

[eternal hound]

okay the tank I can somewhat get

Maybe

a lil bit

BUT THE FUCKING HEALER?

[karmic gust]

other way around for me

[eternal hound]

cmon man that's actual griefing

[crimson scarab]

its always something

[karmic gust]

tanks are shiny pokemons

wiped first boss i think i was at 190k overall and 3rd dps was at 80k

[eternal hound]

I'd just

insta abandon

if they were griefing that hard

[karmic gust]

we did

[eternal hound]

good call

[harsh cape]

Might be a dumb question, but does Killing Spree scale with atack speed somehow?
I mean is there ever a reason to sync KS and AR?

[gaunt phoenix]

It doesnt

[agile orchid]

you guys ready to blast on reset?

[magic shuttle]

Hell yeah

[agile orchid]

I am prepared mentally to flame blizzard when they nerf outlaw next week

[unique fulcrum]

100% outlaw will get nerfed

i can already see it

[brave lagoon]

oops last minute hotfix before tuesday

[agile orchid]

most content creators are unaware of outlaw getting buffed

maybe blizzard doesn't know yet

[magic shuttle]

Pretty sure they made trickster intentionally more powerful

[agile orchid]

I'm expecting them to nerf bladeflurry in compensation

and fucking over fatebound

[crimson scarab]

im kinda bummed we need to play trickster over fatebound

FB seems a better fit to outlaw overall

[agile orchid]

so given KS is kinda weak now

do we bother using it during AR?

[crimson scarab]

im not 100% sure but i wouldnt say so

it will take up quite some time out of the AR window

[fading igloo]

"Outlaw has been overperforming with the recently added talent so to compensate, here is a small change to bring it back in line with the rest of the roster"

"Adrenaline is no longer affected by restless blades"

[cinder relic]

U guys need a new hobby other than fantasizing about getting nerfed

[mystic berry]

I would honestly reroll to enhance at this point

[agile orchid]

you have no moral standing to criticize us

I've seen your tweets

[mystic berry]

RECEIPTS

[fading igloo]

Doomposting is like 80% of the class identity

[brave lagoon]

degradation nerf kink 😩

[agile orchid]

least insane rogue player this tier

[cinder relic]

Nothing wrong with my tweets

[agile orchid]

you post tweets in caps lock, I doom about fantasy nerfs

it's the same thing

[cinder relic]

Completely different

[near rock]

guy is at least being funny with the tweets

[agile orchid]

that's another -5% to bladeflurry buddy

[tired rune]

15% buff to damage so we are removing blade flurry

thank you

[haughty sandal]

Dont need bladeflurry if all you do is pvp

Momma always said i was smort

[near rock]

I don’t do m+ all good with me 🙂

[river wing]

at the moment I'm trying to stay on hopium with "they won't nerf us, the nerf factor is having to play Trickster and struggle with energy"

[agile orchid]

you better prepare the tweet when they nerf us

[jolly geyser]

expect the worst and be suprised guy

[agile orchid]

and buff devourer

[cinder relic]

https://www.tiktok.com/@footballingability/video/7333899983474658568

Ill be moving like this if rogue gets nerfed

[river wing]

that's my point, trying to be positive atm

[haughty sandal]

"sir, theres still people playing rogue, willingly. Somehow."

"Well just nerf it again, they'll stop eventually"

[crude flower]

Why couldn't they have just buffed fatebound or outlaws base kit

But apart from the unfun part
How good is outlaw looking so far in the grand scheme of things#

[runic parrot]

!tricks

[ornate heath]

Auto Tricks on tank Addon - TankMD

[cinder relic]

They wanted to buff the weaker hero talent

[crude flower]

True, it makes sense
but like
it's bad it makes sense

But yeye
was gearing a rogue to play assa in m+, kinda slowed down doing it, but if outlaws gonna be super good then i might swap to it

[mystic berry]

Guys

we were already nerfed wym

We have to play trickster

this is the nerf

[thorn parrot]

Yall meta chasers are wild lol

[haughty sandal]

"Have to"

[crude flower]

Me?
Or
someone else

[haughty sandal]

Just play what you like

[mystic berry]

Damn I havent thought about that

really changed my perspective bro

[haughty sandal]

I play fatebound combat and diabolist destruction, and i only cry twice per hour

[crude flower]

?????

Wym only twice

think you missed a zero

[mystic berry]

Meta chaser

in rogue discord

[crude flower]

But yeye, p much that

[mystic berry]

lmao

[haughty sandal]

Im tough like that

[crude flower]

I play sv rn as a main so
Idk what this silly "meta" word means

[river wing]

zero playrate on old cloud cover

[jagged plover]

I don't think anyone has meta chased outlaw since bfa

maybe one of the seasons in df of tww we were kinda decent

[mystic berry]

I mean meta chaser are nowhere near rogue rn

[jagged plover]

forgot which

[crude flower]

i rememebr that one week in TWW S1 where outlaw was giga bugged and was stupid

[mystic berry]

Thats a wild take

[crude flower]

Before it got fixed

[jagged plover]

heroic week gimped whenever we're good

it's a classic

[crude flower]

I mean rogue is pretty decent in m+ no?
I'm p sure you can be more lenient w dps this season as the timers seem quite generous for most dungeons, with the main difficulty being placed on the healing checks

[jagged plover]

if an outlaw is top of the st charts people lose their shit

[crude flower]

At least from what i've experianced so far

[jagged plover]

damage is alright but we don't really bring much of anything

[mystic berry]

Rogue parses is full of outliers

[jagged plover]

not even tankiness anymore

[mystic berry]

The only people playing it on high keys are otps

[crude flower]

That's been a problem with rogue for a while tbf it seems

[crude flower]

I mean, that still shows you can take it into a high key environment, which is what i was trying to say earlier

[jagged ivy]

its twitter, thats wrong with it

[mystic berry]

Yeah but you dont balance around the 0.1%

[river wing]

could just not say "on high keys" and still be right

[haughty sandal]

Ackschually

[glass mortar]

calling it meta chasing when trickster is gunna be like 13% ahead

yea chasing the meta by not hard trolling my groups

13% is a hilarious amount

[cinder relic]

Get ready to love killing Spree

[crude flower]

Could be worse
could be the old killing

[fathom bramble]

old ks on lura

imagine

[crude flower]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/741275386188529734/1372656620034592869/3882ade1b2e0cab5893c24ec180af244.gif?ex=69e5d558&is=69e483d8&hm=7c2b5bc642c5ddc4776067161ce564e42773a1f89c0af499a1837e3c98e029dc&

Ik this has been posted 500 times

but still

[cinder relic]

On lura on paladins on dragons on

[fathom bramble]

bird boss

[haughty sandal]

Flicker strike be like

[zealous plinth]

You guys think Outlaw > sub Next Week?

For m+

[midnight granite]

It is right now soooo it will be even better next week soooo

[stone void]

what’s the % buff for overall?

[gaunt phoenix]

about 13% including the new ace

[whole oxide]

Is it as big a buff for sub as well or is outlaw gonna dominate?

[vivid vessel]

5/6% for sub

[stone void]

13% overall buff to outlaw rogue wow

[whole oxide]

I didn’t even see it in patch notes because it was under assassination 😂

[vivid forge]

Big upgrade in ST?

[cinder relic]

Sub gets 6% st, 20% stronger burst

Outlaw gets like 13% flat

Sin gets nothing afaik

[vivid forge]

Flat means 13% on ST too?

[cinder relic]

Yes

Might be more in aoe

[vivid forge]

Waw, 13% in ST is huge, maybe viable in raid

[keen belfry]

We will be strong in raid

[unique fulcrum]

anyone tested in m+ yet ? like does it feel good or is it clunky

[vivid forge]

Copium?

[keen belfry]

No I’m pretty sure we will just be a good raid spec

Still bad at paladins and crown tho

[vivid forge]

Im starting to prog beloren on Monday

Dont think Outlaw will burst higher than Assa in egg phase

[keen belfry]

No but it will everywhere else

And its egg dmg probably will be solid maybe? But yes thats probably a sub boss

[random stirrup]

the subtle man will outburst in egg phase but maybe ur comp doesnt need that

[keen belfry]

Ryldd go outlaw on lura

[vivid forge]

Assa is bursting higher than sub rn on egg phase

[keen belfry]

Not on Tuesday

[random stirrup]

idk if i can

its a bit gamble im washed on law

[vivid forge]

Maybe on next reset its Sub time, ZzZzZz tbh

[keen belfry]

Yeah nvm old man

[keen belfry]

Sub is back to one of best burst in game according to their pins

Which is a W

They should do dmg on their cds!

[random stirrup]

gg?

[vivid forge]

I recrafted all into assa, cba tbh

[keen belfry]

Sub is crit spec now

[vivid forge]

I have full crit haste, low mastery

[keen belfry]

What boss

[random stirrup]

dragons

[keen belfry]

Sounds like you’re geared for sub

Idk how much dmg I’m gonna do on dragons

My guild sucks so we are progging it

[vivid forge]

Got forced to play sub on dragons to kill the add on interphase

[random stirrup]

to do what now

[craggy quiver]

Can just go crit haste for sub now ?

[keen belfry]

Sounds like a g quit angle

[keen belfry]

New trickster loves crit

So ye

[fossil lintel]

How was the booty call awang?

[vivid forge]

Manifestation

[craggy quiver]

Maybe outlaw not bad in raid now tho

[keen belfry]

Marvin last night was so funny in here

[random stirrup]

does it do anything?

[fossil lintel]

I know I was here

[random stirrup]

it survived intermission for us every pull doesnt it just hit the tank

[craggy quiver]

I tried it in ptr that smokescreen is pretty massive

[fossil lintel]

You got here drunk, said you were being summoned irl and got into an uber

[keen belfry]

Mhm it even hits the 3rd tank only

[vivid vessel]

the sub people on the boss are inting their egg

[vivid forge]

It debuffs 2 players with circles, if it suvive enough to get 2 sets of circles its hard cuz its circles + orbs, high dmg and ppl might die

[fossil lintel]

So did you get it?

[keen belfry]

Never bro

[vivid forge]

Idk tested both and im bursting higher as assa than sub (in heroic)

[vivid vessel]

ye

you dont know the techs

and sub is harder to play

[random stirrup]

i looked with some other ppl and assa can actually do my prepatch numbers on assa if you include the second egg

but post patch itll def be sub

[vivid vessel]

i simmed it all ryldd

my assa doesnt come close

especially without lust

in 2nd egg

[random stirrup]

i was shown a log of 214 first 289 second egg from assassin man

[vivid forge]

Sub harder to play? give me some tip then idk

[random stirrup]

that would match my 290 first egg prob about 210 second egg

[vivid vessel]

thats just rng

[vivid forge]

I played MFO full tier as sub and did good numbers, maybe im missing something here

[vivid vessel]

sims dont lie

[fossil lintel]

Isn't sub about to get a burst glowup?

[craggy quiver]

6% I guess

[vivid forge]

20% on burst someone said

[random stirrup]

nah its big burst buff

it will be far ahead in beloren egg style stuff

[keen belfry]

They are back to nuke dropping

[fossil lintel]

It's 6% overall but it's entirely concentrated on SB

[safe pasture]

is there a new spreadsheet for raidbuffs for us this xpac?

like % gain

[vivid forge]

@vivid vessel the way i play sub in burst phase now is if i have BL, use 2nd dance during SB with SecTec so its buffed by supercharged CP and if no BL i sed 2nd dance so i can use SecTec inside 2nd dance + SB window

Idk if i explained myself

But idk if there is more optimization

[vagrant kettle]

so is true about the buff on outlaw

https://klipy.com/gifs/unotheactivist-thouxanbanfauni

[jovial sedge]

!fuu

[ornate heath]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[safe pasture]

tyyy

[cinder relic]

Mo

No

Most of it is idk abt all

U can technically play 1 talent for more dance damage and less burst if u wanted as well

[fossil lintel]

Wasn't it due to cloud cover during SB mostly?

[analog radish]

Yo where does it say info about this incoming outlaw buff?

or is that fake news?

[fossil lintel]

Pin

[tepid star]

any good roll the bones addon?

[fossil lintel]

The actual change is under assassination by mistake on patch notes

[mystic berry]

They forgot to do the math before changing cloud cover

so we will get one week of being viable

[fathom bramble]

what if they buffed us on purpose

in response to how bad we are

[tepid star]

is it like 100% sure we get nerfed immidaitly? xd

[mystic berry]

in all seriousness, im meme'ing, but its a possibility

they nerf something

[fathom bramble]

the buff is not serious enough to bring us to a state of being out of line

if we deserve a nerf after this then like 5 other classes that will still be above us surely would too

[mystic berry]

they would 100% nerf us at the same patch they buff unholy or devourer

im convinced

[fathom bramble]

it's always possible, but I seriously doubt we will recieve a nerf that fully or even nearly removes the buff

[agile orchid]

they nerfed bladeflurry after a measly 4% buff

[fathom bramble]

one thing some others have mentioned is that blizz may not have intended/anticipated all effects of fazed stacking(even though that is the logical outcome of making a debuff stack)

if that is the case we may lose the extra damage reduction and generator crit damage

[mystic berry]

I think thats the case

which is wild

they had ample time to see it coming

like rob said, this is way too far from their scared shitless approach to balancing rogue

it is sus

as long as they dont indirectly nerf fatebound, I'm okay

otherwise we are fucked

[frail veldt]

can check lorrgs.io

to see how others are using cds

[fathom bramble]

hey there's a world where they buff fatebound directly to let it compete with trickster

the most hopium world that can exist

[brave lagoon]

it's just weird that last patch had them fine tuning bf by 2% to offset the st buff, and now this patch feels the complete opposite in terms of approach yeah

[vivid vessel]

@keen belfry

[fathom bramble]

last patch was clearly a more delicate tuning pass and intended to be so

there are a lot of much wider swings happening in the .5 for this spec and others

[vivid vessel]

thoughts on zacrebleu

[hybrid pecan]

I'm like 90% sure they didn't intend to buff by 10% by trying to make a node playable

[keen belfry]

what boss

[vivid vessel]

saladar

boss dam

[keen belfry]

oh u suck

[fossil lintel]

They will definitely just throw an aura nerf over it and call it a day

[vivid vessel]

ok voracius bsos dam

zacrebleu kinda blasting idk

[fathom bramble]

lost to zacrebleu

gg

[vivid vessel]

losing to zacrebleu

[keen belfry]

go target the adds bro

[vivid vessel]

look at this guy

[vivid vessel]

waht for

[fathom bramble]

I was probably on the adds here tbh

or maybe idk

too long ago to remember

[keen belfry]

ill stay on vorasisu next week dw

120k dps

[fathom bramble]

we might not even reclear next week

just going to kill lura and log out

[unique fulcrum]

yoo i can see myself

[rocky kiln]

!fuu

[ornate heath]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[copper radish]

yall ready to be trickster rogues again in a few days

[calm osprey]

Ngl trickster is my jam

I want to killing spree

[real flicker]

i miss coup sound

[unique fulcrum]

i miss double coup bug

sooo much cdr

[copper radish]

and old KS

[unique fulcrum]

Nah

old ks was

sooo annoying

especially for keys

[haughty sandal]

No tabard; no shirt

Severely undergeared

Smh

[vivid vessel]

gg ..

[craggy barn]

dont even have blinky collar

[mighty pivot]

he wears a collar irl instead

[frail veldt]

dang nice gear

[vivid vessel]

gapped awang on every boss still

zacrebleu

[frail veldt]

whos higher ilvl

[thorny zinc]

greedy zac taking up ranks 1 and 2

its fucked up..

[tepid star]

zac can u send ur cdm?

[vivid vessel]

im 275 on zacrebleu cuh

[vivid vessel]

do !ui in my stream

[gaunt phoenix]

!ui

[ornate heath]

Resources:

• ArcUI / BetterCDM - common suites for buff/cd customization
• WangBar - displays CPs/energy, customize colors per point, faster than Sensei
• MSUF - recommendation for unit frames
• Platynator - recommendation for nameplates (Jundies Profile)
  Misc:
• Clickable Raid Buffs - for poisons
• WilduTools - random QoL like melee range indicator, track cursor
• Mute Cold Blood sound - if we ever go back to this talent

[gaunt phoenix]

didnt work..

[tender breach]

!fuu

[ornate heath]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[frozen quest]

Which trinket is better solarplasm or void rep & gaze ?

[timid portal]

sim for yourself

[frozen quest]

Generally Not sim ? I deleted the rep one

[leaden sonnet]

You can get it back via item restore

But you can also just add it in topgear

[eternal hound]

Gaming a lil

[worn patrol]

hey does anyone know why I sometimes instantly spend my combo points after using AR?

is there any known buff or am I just missclicking?

[fading igloo]

trinkets sending me into fight or flight

[gaunt phoenix]

AR gives you full combo points, if you use it right before a raid boss starts, your combo points reset

[eternal hound]

Leeme make it worse

[gaunt phoenix]

so u have to be in combat first

[eternal hound]

the warbanner is myth

LMAO

I literally have guidon and it sims as a downgrade

Both my characters trinkies are veyr cursed

well maybe not warr cuz they just got myth HoW this week

[cinder relic]

The warbanner is solid

[worn patrol]

thx didnt know that

[vivid vessel]

@keen belfry i did less damage on main

on almost every boss

i love wow

[eternal hound]

Unironically

swap to prep finally...actually do top damage for once (yes I know pugs are trash)

It was just unfort I rolled a one for like half of the boss cuz all my rerolls were garbo

[keen belfry]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1048716096217284653/1495528892440772649/Medal_JBaxSTaGoH.gif

[true dust]

how good is crucible as a trinket? i dont see it in the trinket tier list in the guide. I got guidon from raid, should i replace crucible with it?

[keen belfry]

CRUCILE BETTER THAN BASICALLY EVERY HEROIC TRINKET UNLESS ITS PLUME OR GAZE AT 276

[true dust]

ok thats crazy

thanks

so its also better than champion plume/gaze?

[fossil lintel]

Crucible is crazy

[crude flower]

wHaha

no fucking way

[fossil lintel]

Imagine if it hadn't been nerfed pre season

[vivid vessel]

SIMS NEUTRAL WITH SOLARFLAME PRISM

SO YOU CAN HAVE MORE ILVL

AND LOOK BETTER

[jagged plover]

https://tenor.com/view/yelling-meryl-streep-cheer-gif-8372999

[keen belfry]

i want a myth prism

[true dust]

i want a myth crucible now

[elder sonnet]

I hate thats its a champion trinket and that it cucks our ilvl

[fossil lintel]

It's not even worth a full ilvl going from champ to hero track

Bro has enchanted the ring but won't put a green gem on it smh my head

[elder sonnet]

Maybe he ran out of gold

[eternal hound]

Bro

I stg

the area of seat is cursed

I just had a tank run all over the place with the mobs in a 13 and wipe us multiple times

Because he's just running around with cones

[keen belfry]

is trickster BF stronger than fb

[eternal hound]

Oh my god shaman was in trash pvp gear

[tawny dagger]

Definitly, it sims 16 dps lower on my gear

[keen belfry]

is fatebound 41 and trickster 45?

[fossil lintel]

Trickster is only stronger during flawless form, no?

[keen belfry]

but thats like perma right isnt it

[fossil lintel]

No idea

[eternal hound]

from just reading it

basically

[zealous plinth]

Do we know yet if we gonna send KS during AR or before? Or just send and cancel? XD

[keen belfry]

it was perma uptime in tww

so our bf % is going up by 4 thats a W too for low target cleave

[fossil lintel]

I miss pc

[mystic berry]

using it during AR sounds wrong so far

[keen belfry]

i would guess for sure in aoe u can open with BF into KS

then AR stuff

into prep

into wait for AR to fall off

into KS

[timid idol]

bruh

this would be so much simpler if ar was perma

[keen belfry]

st im unsure

[timid idol]

[tawny dagger]

Is it possible to actually run a sim with the 12.0.5 build ?

[eternal hound]

probally not

[sacred panther]

!ui

[ornate heath]

Resources:

• ArcUI / BetterCDM - common suites for buff/cd customization
• WangBar - displays CPs/energy, customize colors per point, faster than Sensei
• MSUF - recommendation for unit frames
• Platynator - recommendation for nameplates (Jundies Profile)
  Misc:
• Clickable Raid Buffs - for poisons
• WilduTools - random QoL like melee range indicator, track cursor
• Mute Cold Blood sound - if we ever go back to this talent

[fossil lintel]

Cloud cover is updated on current master of simc, so if you get the code and build it you should be able to run a sim. Not sure if it's possible using raidbots.

[inner meadow]

1st proper outlaw key this tier

been subbing

[silver venture]

which spec is to best pretend to be instead of outlaw to get invites to 16s

[unique fulcrum]

assa

[formal knot]

aug

[river wing]

waiting till reset

[eternal hound]

ngl man

I kinda wonna wait till reset

to play more

[edgy owl]

!ui

[ornate heath]

Resources:

• ArcUI / BetterCDM - common suites for buff/cd customization
• WangBar - displays CPs/energy, customize colors per point, faster than Sensei
• MSUF - recommendation for unit frames
• Platynator - recommendation for nameplates (Jundies Profile)
  Misc:
• Clickable Raid Buffs - for poisons
• WilduTools - random QoL like melee range indicator, track cursor
• Mute Cold Blood sound - if we ever go back to this talent

[eternal hound]

We threw

We fucking threw

[vivid vessel]

i depleted a 12 yesterday

[eternal hound]

Yes but zac

I am literally

an ape compared to you

[vivid vessel]

but you almost timed it

!

my 12 was depleted by a lot !

[eternal hound]

Yeah we were close just a ton of deaths to balls

[vivid vessel]

you are better

[eternal hound]

wait

didn't you time like

17s

[keen belfry]

sup stream

[fluid meadow]

worst part isn't that it's a deplete, but waiting for half or a full hour to get invite again

[eternal hound]

tbh idk why

but invites haven't felt that bad this season

expect for on warrior

that shit is atricious

Maybe it's cuz I'm like 10 ilvls higher compared to where I'd normally be and I'm literally right at the gear curve

Then again

maybe it's because I'm not tracking them

[fluid meadow]

70% of playerbase playing 7 spec, sometimes they just permadeclines other specs

[eternal hound]

Tbh I thought I was getting invites because I was on sub for a bit

swapped to law

still am not waiting that long

[silver venture]

I aint gonna lie i made like 5000 fishing casts in voidstorm while waiting in que total

[eternal hound]

mount thou?

[silver venture]

Not yet

Tho i see it being dropped before i get invited to a 16

[eternal hound]

Tbh I would be running my own key (as I have for half the season)

But it's AA

And I don't trust pugs not to brick the shit out of it

that

and like a timed seat would literally give me 3k lmao

[silent grail]

How far behind is trickster at the minute? In 5 target I don’t see much difference and in a dungeon it’s v similar for me and my gear

[eternal hound]

It'll be ahead on tuseday

[silent grail]

Yeah I know it’s changing on Tuesday just wondering roughly what the difference is now because it’s almost not noticeable between the two for me

[glass mortar]

It's like 3 to 4% behind on live

Not a ton

Depends on ur gear abit as well it does not do well while gearing up ur haste

[keen belfry]

what do i copy over to setup my ptr like retail

i forgor

[frail veldt]

wtf and interface folders?

and specifically make sure you have the character folder renamed and realm matching

[gaunt phoenix]

Type ptr=1 in expert mode header

[peak dock]

Guys is it usual that oh dagger at heroic 6/6 track sim better than 285 slow weapon in oh? Or is it just something that goes with fatebound builds?

[gaunt phoenix]

Yes that's normal. Dagger is worth like 20-30 ilvls

[hollow temple]

I didn’t know it was that big

[peak dock]

Feels like our first mh craft is a pain in the ass xd

[frail veldt]

ye zero in is high value

[hollow temple]

!oh

[ornate heath]

A dagger offhand is ~1% better than a slow weapon mostly because of Zero In, and also slightly more Instant Poison procs. Energy is not affected by offhand speed.

It is possible large ilvl differences can matter more than this bonus so use Raidbots Top Gear when in doubt.

[hollow temple]

1%

[frail veldt]

also offhand ilvl just isnt that valuable

[hollow temple]

Tru

[frail veldt]

I think only bte and PS use offhand ilvl

or they use the combination

but everythign else just uses mainhand

so offhand ilvl just doesnt boost damage other than the raw stats its provides

for those other abilities

kinda funky

[inner yacht]

dont aa and main gauche scale with oh? those are like 10-15% combined

[frail veldt]

some of your autos

[hollow temple]

Ye but those are normalized between slow/fast weapons iirc?

[frail veldt]

I think theyre just saying hte offhand ilvl would matter for autos

[hollow temple]

Ah

[frail veldt]

but yeah 10-15% combined is autos and main gauche but the impact of offhand ilvl is a sub scalar on that

[vivid vessel]

zero in isnt normalized

[frail veldt]

offhand ilvl is barely more valuable than like ilvl on an off piece

[hollow temple]

Ik

[frail veldt]

its just not a strong slot for how our abilities work

[wicked flame]

wednesday how much got buff guys

[frail veldt]

like 10%+

pins have a longer writeup on it

[wicked flame]

so better than assas single in raid?

[frail veldt]

not sure on that one

[wicked flame]

off hand dagger is it ok?

[frail veldt]

!oh

[ornate heath]

A dagger offhand is ~1% better than a slow weapon mostly because of Zero In, and also slightly more Instant Poison procs. Energy is not affected by offhand speed.

It is possible large ilvl differences can matter more than this bonus so use Raidbots Top Gear when in doubt.

[fading schooner]

!fuu

[ornate heath]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[slim hare]

after patch when do we want to press ks ?

[dull ginkgo]

Correct me if I’m wrong: (AoE) AR > RtB > BF > RB > BtE > Ks??

[eternal hound]

Man

I'm gonna miss death's arrival

[timid idol]

i think i had like

13 bte stacks

jackpot

4p buff

and was on last seat boss

hit dispatch for like 300k

didnt even see my bte damage before phase ended

only the dispatch number jumped into my eye

surely it was some gargantuan funny number

[formal thunder]

just check your max hit in logs

[eternal hound]

In amp?

cuz dude

I'd actually go nuts for that

[wintry solar]

Found out my cat likes to go on truck rides

He must've been raised around dogs

Head out the window and everything

Last one I had liked to go on 4 wheeler rides in her little basket so ig it's not all that weird

[gaunt phoenix]

they got that dawg in em

[near osprey]

do u guys dispatch at minimum 5 or 6 cps?

[cinder relic]

With FB, on live, 5+

With Trickster, on reset, 6+

[lucid sparrow]

remind me why that is

[vivid vessel]

outlaw likes udilizing all the cp pool available

fatebound finish at 5 with disaptch because coins proc at 5

and dont scale with cps

so it just happens to be better

but usually, about every tier, outlaw tries to maximise cp spent by building till -1 basically

[sonic flint]

Wait wait wait, since we get more crt dmg on builders, do we start pressing ambush finally 🤔

[glass mortar]

no

[sonic flint]

damn...

[slim hare]

ambush is bad mostly because it doesnt proc anything

not cause of crit

there is some talent to support ambush

but they are not competitive aat the moment

[glass mortar]

HO build is far enough behind that the crit damage doesnt make it the choice

[sonic flint]

I know but I was hoping "what if it hit like a fucking truck" maybe then it would be worth it

[glass mortar]

also pathing for HO builds is kinda cursed if u wanna play an aoe build

i mean u dont wanna press the button if u dont have full HO build anyway

but even with HO build its still undertuned

[slim hare]

pliz let it rest undertune

[sonic flint]

Shame, used to be really fun

[slim hare]

or make if the fatebound build

i have a feeling i wont like killing spree trickster

even tho perma tricks is awesome

[cinder relic]

Fatebound has a passive that says "When u spend at 5" so theres more payoff for finishing at lower CP values

Trickster doesn't

[wintry solar]

I'm of the belief HO is still around because they ran out of time for anything else

[sonic flint]

Does the fact that Killing Spree return points make it count as a builder as well, cause that would be wild

[glass mortar]

same

no, it doesnt have the flags for that

would be funny if it did

[sonic flint]

Imagine the giga blasters with 150% crit

[glass mortar]

well

idk if id say giga blaster

currently it does less damage then a bte so i dont think 150% crit would save it

kspree is patheticly tuned on live

just waiting for solo to tell us we can instantly cancel it in the opener/during adrs

its so worthless

[sonic flint]

It LOOKS like it's supposed to giga blast

all that smoke and stuff u know

[glass mortar]

mhm

[wintry solar]

You're not supposed to KS during adr

[glass mortar]

well

if u have them both up at the same time u kspree first

if it comes up mid pretty sure u still use it

for now

[wintry solar]

We shall see

[glass mortar]

yea trust me im praying we can insta cancel it during adr

wish we could insta cancel every cast

[slim hare]

hq

ha

you think its that bad we should insta cancel it

not wait for it to build cp ?

[glass mortar]

during adr potentially

not outside right now

would be dumping energy into the void to do that

[wintry solar]

I love when I'm in a pack and health bars don't move during ks

[glass mortar]

during adr u dont really care

[slim hare]

i tried playing it and it felt real bad

[glass mortar]

yea 🙂

it felt bad last expac even when it did damage

now it doesnt do damage

its just awful

[slim hare]

at least like i played which is cancceling when full cp

i dont read talent

why do we have to press it ?

[glass mortar]

it readies blades for trickster

[slim hare]

is there a world insta canceling all the time is the play?

[cinder relic]

0%

[slim hare]

so outside of adr you at least wait for full cp

energy efficiency and all that i guess

wait im reading talent

except if ennemies dont have faze stacked there is no incentive to not cancel it, if its that bad dmg wise

[cinder relic]

iTS NOT THAT BAD

caps

[slim hare]

you actually lose dps with more combo point

or my english is bad ?

[gaunt phoenix]

it does scale worse with cps

but the damage is not so bad that it is worse than your builders

you can basically cancel ks if you have excess energy

but it's generally worth to let it go

[thorny zinc]

does prep reset ks?

[gaunt phoenix]

Yes

[thorny zinc]

gulp

[lethal oak]

Are we prep+KS gamers now?

[cinder relic]

yes

[hollow bloom]

[lethal oak]

[vapid sundial]

ks

yuck

[lime lake]

[vapid sundial]

i am rewarded for my decision that midnight is boring and that i dont want to play

[wintry solar]

What would outlaw look like if you were to come back?

[slim hare]

bte chain back

am i wrong ryker?

[lethal oak]

Its ok KS feels very rewarding to press because of its high non random damage

[slim hare]

your high

not you r dmg

[lethal oak]

[wintry solar]

I think you're high

What are you saying

[keen belfry]

right popo?

[glass mortar]

im sure the guy saying the exact opposite of what kspree is wasnt joking

the non random part definitly didnt make it obvious

[wintry solar]

He had me at "high"

[lethal oak]

[slim hare]

[dim parrot]

So trickster kinda easy right

Just spend 6+

[glass mortar]

easier then fatebound yes

less rules and ur builder orders matter less

because u just overcap a ton of CP and cant avoid it

[wintry solar]

Ryder never answered so I'm guessing he won't return until DF outlaw returned. Which is based ofc

[dim parrot]

Lollll

[slim hare]

feel like it will be more complex

ks + prep decision

[glass mortar]

we play prep on live

and kspree isnt complex its just apress on cd

maybe u cancel it during adr who knows

that would be like its only thing tho

[slim hare]

depends on what we end up doing

[glass mortar]

i mean either way its easy

[dim parrot]

Probs just prep around AR

[glass mortar]

just another finisher to press on cd mindlessly

[slim hare]

i guess i should see it that way

also how many cp ks ?

[glass mortar]

6+

like every finisher for trickster

there is no nuance to tricksters finisher rules

[slim hare]

pretty sure ks might be the exception

[glass mortar]

it is not as of now

[slim hare]

at least they seem to think it might be possible in tc channel

[glass mortar]

even if u were gunna instantly cancel it ud probably wanna finish at high CP

for restless blades and CP refund from ruthlessness

otherwise ur just pooping 40 energy down the drain

but we'll see where it ends up

[slim hare]

mmmh

[glass mortar]

even if we had 1 rule for kspree optimization it would be much more braindead then fatebound

[slim hare]

maybe im just too used to fatebound

refused to play trickster

[glass mortar]

u can remove ur SS at 1 CP rule and 5 CP dispatch rule

and u gain... maybe a kspree optimization which probably will barely matter

its very stinky to play

like everything we press builds us to 5 now a day

so u just build at 5 and overcap over and over

[slim hare]

yep

tried it

feels bad

and output was really bad but without buff i guess thats normal

[wintry solar]

I only play it in delves so

Not too excited to play it literally everywhere else

[slim hare]

im excited to see with legit 10%+ buff if its enough to be competitive

[wintry solar]

[daring yoke]

have the outlaw scientists figured out the tc on trickster outlaw yet

[native tinsel]

is it possible to sim already in raidbots?

i wanted to do a droptmizer

[frank finch]

im so excited for fartlaw meta

[keen belfry]

i am excited for next week

[gaunt phoenix]

tick 'expert mode' and type ptr=1 in the header box

[indigo token]

FARTLAW!!!!!

[native tinsel]

ty

[gaunt phoenix]

there is only 1 outlaw scientist, but yes, ill post a thing some time tomorrow

[keen belfry]

how do i help solo

[native tinsel]

will the rotation change?

[keen belfry]

-1 rule +new ks button

so barely

[frosty python]

anyone have a good addon for outlaw combo points for supercharger that is NOT elvui?

[gaunt phoenix]

wangbar

[outer meteor]

i actually like the supercharger optimization alot

idk why i wasnt doing it before

[hollow temple]

sensei resource display

[gaunt phoenix]

it will be more important with Ace being better

[outer meteor]

i was just brain off sending bte off cd

now i am enlightened

[indigo token]

THis spec needs a hero!!

[wintry solar]

I'm here...

It'll all be better

I just need

Inside

[keen belfry]

its W rule

massive BTEs

and more resets

and now even more resets

i wonder if ill notice 20% more aces

i bet i do

[frosty python]

so im noticing that even if i dispatch at 5, 6, or 7 combo points, my supercharger on combo 1, and 2 are used? is that correect?

[keen belfry]

yes

it just adds +2 to your finisher

[gaunt phoenix]

the supercharger display at 1-2 is just a visual representation

[keen belfry]

or +3 right whoops

[frosty python]

ok so i dont really have to "track" supercharger points

[gaunt phoenix]

your 1-2 cps are not actually supercharged

[keen belfry]

no you dont react to having super charger, you make your decisions before that

its just nice to see ui have them sometimes for vibes

[gaunt phoenix]

well

soon(tm)

you should try not to supercharge killing spree

unless you have no energy

[keen belfry]

solo are u thinking we are pressing KS during ar..........

please no

[wintry solar]

Do it before I bet

[keen belfry]

the way ive been hitting dummies has been 1 before, then your prepped one after first AR ends before 2nd

[craggy barn]

imagine double KS in first AR

[wintry solar]

Why would I imagine that

[modest scarab]

I have what may be a few dumb questions about Supercharger and Forced Induction. How much worse is it to play Lethality and Cold Blooded Killer instead? And the second question is does Supercharger add combo points to make things act like they were used above 7 or it just maxes out at 7 combo points?

[gaunt phoenix]

CB is like 5% worse

It goes over 7

[prime umbra]

Is Killing spree coded as a Generator?

[gaunt phoenix]

No

[wide coral]

is this going to end up on the faq? lmao

[frail veldt]

is it neutral to KS after adr?

I thought it was

how scuffed is our opener gona be haha

[craggy barn]

shrug

[frail veldt]

I figure we do our first KS before adr

but I guess whats KS's value even if youre goan adr right after and aoe apply fazed anyway

[glass mortar]

ks prepull

to ready 2 blades

[frail veldt]

but like

[glass mortar]

find a critter

[frail veldt]

you dont need a target

[glass mortar]

u dont even want it in the opener prob

[frail veldt]

to ks

[glass mortar]

legit

u do to start it

u dont to maintain it

[frail veldt]

its dpet is higher than dispatch though

[glass mortar]

u cant cast it without one

[frail veldt]

ah

but yeah Id figure even though it feels awful itd be worth pressing during adr

cuz it is more valuable than dispatching right?

oh

you dont need a target

I just tested

can just do it with nothing around

[vivid vessel]

adr ks pre key

bf snd end of bubble

ss ss to proc the 2 thingies while getting into pack

ks build to full dispatch

well you would need to refresh bf by now

prolly

so maybe you just insta cancel ks with bf

ks > bf > disaptch > adr > bte

and thats your opener

kidna scuffed !

[frail veldt]

wouldnt you want to bf on the pack

before the ks

you know

then ss->ss->dispatch

[vivid vessel]

you have ks prepull tho

[frail veldt]

adr

[vivid vessel]

so you have 2 ss to spend before

[frail veldt]

hmm

thats so awkward

okay so
prekey: adr->ks
bubble: snd->bf
pull: ss->ss->ks->(maybe cancel into bf)->dispatch->adr

[vivid vessel]

bf snd for cdr on bf

[frail veldt]

essentially cancel if bf running out

oh tru

[vivid vessel]

i dont think bf is back already wiht only 2 finsihers tho

or is it

i need to rmemeber what i do in keys

i think i go into pack and im kinda just adr bte bf

or smth

[frail veldt]

it really kinda depends on the key whether I bf in bubble

[vivid vessel]

ye i mean

most of them you can

[frail veldt]

still feels awkward

[vivid vessel]

also delaying our first adr is kinda needed now

cause of the cloud

[frail veldt]

oh true

have to wait to gather

[vivid vessel]

if you think about a pack like first pack of pit

i press adr directly on the 4 mobs

but that wouldnt be good really

cause then the cloud is all the way up there

[frail veldt]

I guess its fine then to have to ss->ss->ks while gathering

burns time

[vivid vessel]

so maybe just having ks as a gather tool

is not that bad

[frail veldt]

ye

[vivid vessel]

you just sit in ks for a bit

so ye

ss ss ks > fill cps > dispatch > bf > disaptch and at that point you can adr i guess

its a lot of cdr loss on adr

maybe you legit have to adr at full cp

[frail veldt]

well youre gona prep it anyway

so its not like youre losing any

in theory

at least on that first pull

[vivid vessel]

eh you can see it this way if you want

i guess

[outer meteor]

in keys like pit and skyreach where the 1st pull is so close

is it worth to bf - snd on bubble and start hitting mobs insta before they are even gathered?

ive been doing that but cant tell if its a dps loss or not

[vivid vessel]

i do that yes

bf at 3s in bubble

snd at 2

adr bte boom boom

[outer meteor]

do you br before adr bte

on wait till gather

to br

[vivid vessel]

i adr br bte

not waiting

[outer meteor]

yeah ok

ive been doing that

[vivid vessel]

well you rtb before all that obv

[outer meteor]

ofc

i always wonder if it worth to start hitting like that on aa first pull

[vivid vessel]

it is

i think

[outer meteor]

i did that once

[vivid vessel]

i wait a little bit

[outer meteor]

but i got aggro once the skitterflies padded in

mid pull

[vivid vessel]

i do bf > dispatch > adr > br > bte i think

in that pack

cause you cant hit too early

its a long gather

i start hitting when all 3 big guys has been tagged

[outer meteor]

yea i feel like if i dont start blasting soon

i dont get 3 adrs

on that pack

[vivid vessel]

then i find a spot where bf will fill cps and i start

[outer meteor]

i still have massive uptime issues on that pull tho

[vivid vessel]

i dont

you need to be quick on your feets

and watch where tank is going

follow him

[outer meteor]

yeah i think im trolling

im respecting the circles too much

[vivid vessel]

you have perma sprint and grapple

and worse thing you have cloak

[outer meteor]

they take a while to blow up

[vivid vessel]

i dont lose one second of uptime

and its important

[outer meteor]

very

[vivid vessel]

thats how outlaw does damage

[keen belfry]

u lose 2 seconds probcs

[vivid vessel]

me no noob

[outer meteor]

i tried playing sin on that pull for fun on a 17 and it feels so cringe not having perma sprint

but on the other hand u have dots ticking at all times

[cinder relic]

@vivid vessel we dont kill this week I thinkkkkkkkk so I might have to upgrade dagger

[vivid vessel]

for beloren?

or wdym

wait im confused

you are on lura rn right

why would you upgrade dagger if you dont kill this week

outlaw is for sure better on lura next week

[echo tapir]

for the trickster build what kind of stat shift are we looking at

[vivid vessel]

we arent

[echo tapir]

was wondering if we needed even more haste or anything weird

but thats goo

d

[cinder relic]

lura

[vivid vessel]

well i dont get it then

[cinder relic]

I dont got that shit ready and repped brother lol

I'm not about to sned mythic weapon on the mastery weapon

[vivid vessel]

oh you mean you are washed up ?

gege

its so over bro ..

[cinder relic]

Imagine spending ur upgrade on this

[vivid vessel]

honestly

depends how it works

[random stirrup]

ok but would you rather have 20 myth crest or a lil bit of stinky mastery

[vivid vessel]

if in the end its infinite

i think its fine

if you are stuck with that weapon for one week for example

[random stirrup]

or do u mean the voidcore is sad

[vivid vessel]

its not that terrble

[random stirrup]

cuz what else u gonna upgrade

guidon upgrade is mega ass

[vivid vessel]

a dagger

[random stirrup]

well yes but if ur progging on outlaw waiting a week for dagger is whatever

[vivid vessel]

guy doesnt wanna prog on outlaw

cause mastery weapon

i guess

[random stirrup]

I understand him

[vivid vessel]

(i think he is just scared to send it)

[random stirrup]

I am scared to send it

[vivid vessel]

im not

i was considering it after the 4% aura buff

[keen belfry]

These guys are so washed at outlaw

[vivid vessel]

and now they send me a 13% buff my way ?

alright lil bud

i take it

[keen belfry]

It’s why u stay ready on outlaw

U can outlaw to any spec

But u can’t go any spec to outlaw

[jolly geyser]

Crests are meant to be spent,fuck it dood

[random stirrup]

i have never progged a serious boss on outlaw and it takes way more focus to play than leaning back in the chair on sub

[cinder relic]

I mean yeah I'm also mega not practiced on it rn

Ive been only playing sub for like 2+ weeks now

If it was good on start of szn I'd be blasting

[vivid vessel]

10h of keys on reset

go for it

[random stirrup]

its a bit scary to prog an actual boss u have to pay attention to glaives and stars perma

[vivid vessel]

dont be a pussy

[cinder relic]

Maybe thats the juice

[random stirrup]

while doing law

[cinder relic]

This sounds like ego

[vivid vessel]

eh

[cinder relic]

But genuienly outlaw to me isnt hard

[vivid vessel]

dont be a noob bro

[cinder relic]

Like I don't take brain power playing it

Most of it is entierly automatic

[vivid vessel]

also i disagree

outlaw is easier

you have perma sprint

[random stirrup]

it's not hard you just actually have to look at your buttons more because you're proc based

[echo tapir]

yeah ive heard so many people say outlaw is so hard

[vivid vessel]

like just dodge them lil bro

[echo tapir]

and it just feels right to me

[vivid vessel]

sprint it up

[cinder relic]

Like yes, but idk

[random stirrup]

you dont know if ss is about to proc

[wintry solar]

You seem to dk a lot

[cinder relic]

I might not be practiced on the spec, but even playing it for the first 3 weeks was like, very automatic

[vivid vessel]

do it by sound

[cinder relic]

Ya

[vivid vessel]

i do it by sound

[cinder relic]

U do it by sound

[valid tartan]

It’s easier now guy

Freely

[random stirrup]

ye maybe im just washed because i do sub by sound

[cinder relic]

Ik it is but still

[vivid vessel]

you are washed lil bud

[random stirrup]

out of practice gg

[glass mortar]

tricksters also piss easy to play nglk

ur builders like

dont matter

ur at 1 CP and 1 PS proc?

u can just send either

no reason to not always double SS

[cinder relic]

I'd rather not 300+ pulls into a boss be like "lets try a diff spec

[random stirrup]

it was very chill on dragons ill say

was vibing on the law there