outlaw

[crimson scarab]

Hey guys do you know if there is an addon which currently allows you to track the defensives of your teammates in M+

And also if they have interrupts available?

[dark steeple]

it doesnt click tho does it xddddddddddd

[proven ocean]

It has haptics

[hasty warren]

Someone know why we don't have different class tuning for M+ and Raid ? Since it can make it easier to balance damages profiles or sruff like that.

[dark steeple]

ye but it doesnt actually click tho, is that not just a motor for the sake of having haptics?

since not having haptic feedback feels weird

[proven ocean]

It does click

U do feel like its clicking

The only advantage it really offers is that it makes u click like

Earlier than a regular mouse

And it can slightly forces you to unclick so that u can click again

Makes 6-8 way switches instantly fast

[unborn jackal]

I've mained rogue since vanilla and started playing retail again in TWW season 1, now I'm back in Midnight and while I understand the Outlaw rotation and how it plays, I struggle to meet my unbuffed simmed DPS.. It feels way off. I get like 42k dps on single-target boss target dummy, while simmed I should get 57k. Is this normal or am I doing something really wrong?

I never let roll the bones run out and I keep between the eyes up as well..

from what I could see in my damage meters was that my melee auto-attacks were #1 on dmg, then dispatch and then between the eyes. while I look at the sims it's dispatch->between the eyes->melee

[tame flower]

Could be wrong but the sims are based of if you have every buff you can get as if you were in a party/raid including flask and food etc

[unborn jackal]

I made sure to sim it without buffs

[weary goblet]

There are many many factors that could affect this, from settings to personal mistakes. It's hard to say

test it in a real scenarion and post a log

[tame flower]

Im playing outlaw atm as my alt and learning as im going 😂 think im at 80-90k overall in keys but my gear is baaaaaad c teir trinkets veteran weapons

Cant get nothing to drop 🥲

[unborn jackal]

in keys I get like 90k overall due to blade flurry

I've made sim comparisons on my warlock alt as well and there I only get like 4-5k dps difference, which makes playing Outlaw really disgruntling

[tame flower]

Yea im almost at 2k rating then i can have 4 set for blade flurry

[unborn jackal]

I've managed to reach 48k dps now, so I'm still like 9k away. Not sure how much that is left up to chance in this spec since I only hit the dummy for like 3 minutes, while it sims at 5. Would be interesting to see if others get similar results and that's just how the sims are or if I still have a lot of optimisation to do

this time I did get the same breakdown as the sims at least, so I think I'm getting there

[arctic hollow]

I just realised I bound Blade Rush on my old Ghostly Strike Keybind. And now Blade Rush gives us a damage amp.

We got tricked, they pretended to remove GS and just moved it (and made it free and aoe so that's nice)

[junior folio]

There could be luck on rolls factors , don't forget that the SIM is only potential since you're not a robot with 0ms calculating the most perfect action to do next, keep building muscle memory and get exposure to situations, that's the best way to see where to improve @unborn jackal

But if you want I can sit a bit later and check it out

[unborn jackal]

would be sweet to see something to compare to

[unborn jackal]

I did as well lol, same keybind as GS previously

[dark steeple]

you can always do !log so people can take a look

[stoic wagon]

!log

Now that’s convenient

Didn’t know this command existed lol

[proven ocean]

If its your first retail expansion in a while then you’re definitely far from playing perfectly

Just practice and you’ll get there

[inland acorn]

Also if you want help in spotting mistakes, you can record yourself hitting dummy with some gcd tracker addon and post it here. That way it's essy to see if you're making some rotational mistakes

[unborn jackal]

any suggestion on such a gcd tracker addon?

[stoic wagon]

I use base wow Gcd tracker

Good enough if you setup right

[tame flower]

My rotation opener is
Ambush-adrenaline rush-roll the bones-blade flurry-blade rush, then i go into the whole pistol shot etc is that an ok opener or is it trash?

[stoic wagon]

And get used to it

[stoic wagon]

Don’t ambush

[inland acorn]

we don't use ambush

[tame flower]

I dont remember all the skill names so i cant do the full rotation 😂

[stoic wagon]

Remove ambush from your spell bar

[tame flower]

No? So is it just AR into roll the bones?

[stoic wagon]

Yh

[tame flower]

Aaah ok ok

[stoic wagon]

And dispatch if snd not up

[tame flower]

Thats it dispatch i use that 😂

I havnt looked at any guides i glanced over the rotation in the announcments channel

[stoic wagon]

If you follow the rotation in the channel it’s 90+% parse guaranteed

That’s what I do

[tame flower]

And anything thats over a 2 roll we want to use keep it rolling?

[inland acorn]

details has streamer plugin that shows gcd history too, if you're using it

[stoic wagon]

2 or +

2 is good enough

You keep it rolling if you have a 2 and no roll the dice proc coming

If you have a proc usually I wait for buff to expire and reroll

And then keep it rolling

[tame flower]

Yea looking at the rotation im doing it correct probably not perfect i havnt been looking at the dice proc though so that could help

[stoic wagon]

« Loaded dice » is the name of the proc

Forgot the name

[tame flower]

Yea i need to sort out my cool down tracker

[stoic wagon]

I do this

[tame flower]

Have only just started playing outlaw as ive got 3k on my main

[stoic wagon]

It’s good enough

[tame flower]

Is wowhead good talents for rsid snd m+? They seem pretty similar if i remember

[stoic wagon]

For m+ yes

But raid talent is different for each boss

Look up Warcraft log outlaw for each boss

https://fr.warcraftlogs.com/zone/rankings/46?boss=3176&class=Rogue&spec=Outlaw

Like that

You get a tree with what is used the most per boss

[tame flower]

Aah ok nice

Am timing 9's and 10's atm which is a bonus becausr i thought id play trash as a dps being a healer for so long 😂 but my god is my loot luck bad

[stoic wagon]

Put loot spec on assasination or sub

Because you want a dagger as off hand

And main hand is probably your craft anyway

Dagger is 1% more dps than a 1h in off hand

[inland acorn]

Also once you get dagger, you can switch loot specs, depending on dungeon to reduce loot pool, in case you get anything

[stoic wagon]

Ffs that’s true

[inland acorn]

Like if you see dungeon dropping only dagger, go outlaw

[stoic wagon]

I never did switch lmao

[tame flower]

Yea i did zee that a dagger off hand was bis i was confuddled 😂

[inland acorn]

Boom 1 item gone from the list

[stoic wagon]

Im lucky I only dropped 1 dagger so far

If I dropped a dagger I didn’t need I would be mad

[tame flower]

😂😂

[inland acorn]

I got like 5

4 of them from raid

Perks of being only rogue in the guild

[stoic wagon]

I dropped the bis dagger in pit of saron

And that’s it

[tame flower]

I am saving myth crests was to upgrade my ring or boots but might max craft a weapon currently have a vet wep and a chap wep because mothing drops for me atm 😂

[inland acorn]

defo weapon

[stoic wagon]

Craft is main hand usually yh

[inland acorn]

Main hand weapon is biggest upgrade you can get

[tame flower]

Might have to do that then

[stoic wagon]

Then it’s boot or ring

I prefer boots

[inland acorn]

Honestly

It doesn't matter

We get 4th craft next week

You should pretty much have covered weapon / boots / ring / lowest ilvl at this point

[tame flower]

Need to hope i get my other spark tonight might actually do some dps then 😂

[inland acorn]

Are you behind sparks ?

[tame flower]

Pretty sure i am

Ive crafted 2 items plus have a spark in the bag

[inland acorn]

did you do weekly quest this week ?

[tame flower]

I did dungeon one

[inland acorn]

there is weekly you can pick

from 4 options

it guarantees spark

[tame flower]

Aaaah no i havnt done that 1 yet

[inland acorn]

and it's arcantina this week

so you can bang it in 1 minute

[tame flower]

Nice do that

Then farm myth crests

[glass shard]

i asked yday but idk if any1 answered

what is r ough ilvl value of a socket

[unique fulcrum]

10 i think

[still matrix]

10?

or 1?

10 is insane wtf

[unborn jackal]

yeah 10 is crazy

[unique fulcrum]

why would it be 1 ilvl

idk it used to be like 10 last time i remembered

but idk about midnight

if anything changed

u get 23 secondary stats from a socet if you use the 2 stats one

and 13 ilvl on my cloak give me

+5 secondary stats

plus main stat and stamina obviously

[still matrix]

adding socket on sims gives me approx 470dps

[glass mortar]

could be more then 10 this expac tbh but usually its around there

[unborn jackal]

fair, good to know

[potent ore]

so, we in sub prison for the last 3 bosses?

[unique fulcrum]

imma play no matter what, my guild cant stop me

outlaw/*/

[barren plover]

is there big gap between Outlaw and Assa/Sub in M+, raids? In raid, i cant compete with them on single target fights.

[jagged plover]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1422983549044265010/1423417931118940230/image.gif

[solar plank]

is there anything to track rtb rolls now

[inland meteor]

cooldown manager, dont really need anything else

[unborn jackal]

but despite the changes to the Outlaw rotation in Midnight they seem pretty hard to play still, right? They're not exactly braindead like some other classes rotations seem to be

[stoic crown]

so is 1 pt in ace still the go to? or should we be doing 2 points?

[inland acorn]

it's defo still one of the harder specs

[inland acorn]

2 points when 12.0.5 releases

[near rock]

theres only very niche cases you want 2pt ace rn

[inland acorn]

are there ?

The only difference running 2pt ace now is it gets you 4cp instead of 2

which is still useless

[near rock]

yes 2 ace is better than dancing steel for example on paladins mythic

and you need one or the other to access grand melee

[inland acorn]

that

literally still doesn't do anything

because you still need to build after ace proccing

maybe in niche case, where 1pt ace lands you at 3

you ss and get 1cp because you don't have rolls and no proc

[near rock]

its still better than 0 value which is what you get from dancing steel

in that fight

[inland acorn]

but 2pt ace is 0 value

[remote pecan]

meh it's like a 0.5% difference at best over chain sending at 5

[near rock]

its not

[inland acorn]

are you sure about that ?

[inland acorn]

I mean i guess, but it's so close to being 0 value that idk

[near rock]

I'm not disagreeing with that, its def dogshit

[remote pecan]

i am i've simmed myself multiple times with the finish at 6+ for BtE rule vs just sending all finishers at 5+ as i've been gearing and i think rn in my current gear it's like 0.3% difference

[inland acorn]

also i don't have that kind of problem

I asked to be benched on paladins

cba this fight

Everytime i press BF on that boss, i just die inside, because deft sucks my energy

[inland acorn]

that sounds weird, I thought bte at 5 is like closer to 1-3% dps loss

[remote pecan]

deft even worth at a changing 2-3 target count? I would've thought deft would be removed for that fight and just keep the buff up instead but what do i know i went sub for prog because i threw my toys out the pram with current outlaw

[weary fog]

wouldnt dancing steel keep u from needing to refresh blade flurry as often on paladins

[inland acorn]

Deft somehow is a gain at 2 target

[weary fog]

so u burn through energy less

[remote pecan]

is it actually or is it just a gain in the sim vacuum?

[inland acorn]

I kinda assume it is, since you need to refresh blade flurry anyway all the time

30 energy for possible extra 2-3 cps probably outweighs the cost

[remote pecan]

if you play to keep it up only rather than slam it on cd sure

[glass mortar]

its not unless u have more recent sims, zacs sims from week 2 were fake

[inland acorn]

it's 3 seconds extra, so idk. I don't think dancing vs ace is that big of a deal on paladins anyway

[glass mortar]

deft is a dps loss (smol) on 2t

[inland acorn]

Hard to judge how often you're at 3t on paladins

[near rock]

deft hits like a truck

[inland acorn]

Because one fucks off to do his paladin bullshit

[inland acorn]

baited by zac again gg

[glass mortar]

yup same

classic zac

[inland acorn]

why does talent switching on raidbots is still so cooked, that I need to unclick everything from certain breakpoints 😭

[pearl topaz]

im guessing i should craft offhand if ive got a shitty hero one

[serene urchin]

man i am such a pig, but how can outlaw 140k overall with broken weapon

it was my dagger luckily

do we not use the offhand as much as i thibk

[remote pecan]

!oh

[ornate heath]

A dagger offhand is ~1% better than a slow weapon mostly because of Zero In, and also slightly more Instant Poison procs. Energy is not affected by offhand speed.

It is possible large ilvl differences can matter more than this bonus so use Raidbots Top Gear when in doubt.

[inland acorn]

sims neutral for me (-deft + deadly pursuit) on 2t

and like -1% on 3t

[glass mortar]

ye it depends on ur haste level

should generally be close to margin of error tho its so low impact

its not a gain tho

ur profile actually wants more haste on 2-3t iirc so if u have more haste on ur gear it will help

[inland acorn]

Ngl i still cant get over how shit deadly pursuit is

[river wing]

yeah it's really just...kinda nothing

I wonder if it would be good if it was just perma after being activated and before you stop fulfilling the criteria

[inland acorn]

Like stays whole duration ?

Of 5 seconds or whatever

[river wing]

like stays forever until you blow a finisher again

[inland acorn]

Well it defo would be better

[river wing]

well yeah, I just wonder whether that would make it good
bc the current version is just garbo

[inland acorn]

Idk if it would be mega good

It defo would be something we probably played around if downtime is coming like on alleria intermissions

[river wing]

yea, that's what I think also

[inland acorn]

would basically let us get whole ADR back during it

[river wing]

it would make big downtime actually bearable

[inland acorn]

or like more than half of it

Although it would make it like really annoying to track when we're gonna proc it

[serene urchin]

whats the BiS outlaw phys m+ comp rn

[inland acorn]

Does supercharged cps count as extra cps to proc deadly pursuit ?

[inland acorn]

warrior, sham, druid, monk, outlaw

[river wing]

I mean
it procs almost automatically if you play the target for more than 5 seconds

[inland acorn]

yeah i guess it would be "roughly" every 3 finishers

idk if supercharged cps influence it, but on average it should still be 3 finishers

[indigo token]

im 22

[worldly shale]

what do yall use for ui and shit, i cant find what works for me since the start of expac lmao

i had like

40 wa's

https://tenor.com/view/trashy-pepe-gif-20583391

[random stirrup]

@vivid vessel is there even a good way to find new was, seems like wago has made it quite difficult after it went defunct

we have some useful ones as a guild that are unlisted but i wonder if theres some new hub so i can see what ppl are cooking

[serene urchin]

i mean lowkey base ui has enough info for outlaw now since the rtb trim

[glass shard]

thank you:)

[worldly shale]

sad it looks like ass

[serene urchin]

theres like better cdm and cdm centered to customise it

shout out awang for wang bar

[stoic wagon]

Base ui is way enough

[serene urchin]

the goat

[inland acorn]

zac ui

[quiet ore]

Facts - I just use the base UI, albeit with an addon just to re-center the combo point display on the personal resource display, since blizz broke that

[stoic wagon]

Same same

Don’t need more

Im too lazy setting up addons so that blizzard destroy them a week later

I do everything blizzard made now

Only thing is platynator I really need

[vivid vessel]

No

[proven ocean]

What is was

[still matrix]

my aa first pull damage makes me sick man

like makes me sick

buff US

why did we get an AOE nerf

dafk

i need the big boy DPS

[fair charm]

Which addon fixes this for you?

[inland acorn]

Zacs fault

[near rock]

base ui has never been better #addonfreegang

[keen belfry]

i nearly went just a centering addon + wang bar

but i liked ayijiecdm too much

[frail veldt]

How's that uncentered UI

[frail veldt]

Yeah if you want even minimal levels of customization you need add-ons

Still can't even separate cooldowns into more than like two bars with base UI

And my God default nameplates suck ass

And the new raid frame out of range coloring is AWFUL

So hard to see

Still can't hide all your bars with default UI afaik, have to keep one non hidden

Character sheet is still fuck all useless without an addon

Oh and yeah centering of combo points and resource bar like who wants them under your unit frame

[keen belfry]

them not having a native resource bar in the cdm is wild to me

[frail veldt]

Oh and the biggest kicker

THE DAMAGE METER

The fuck is that useless shit

[tropic heath]

Hello everyone, quick questiob my simC tells me that i should do 80 k on mono, however i rarely do more than 65K is it normal at all ? i feel like outlaw suck for mono dps

or i just suck

cuz wth

[frail veldt]

You can definitely reach your sim DPS in st with practice

Have you checked out the faq for all the small rules

[desert tendon]

my sim is Mewo

can i reach him?

[frail veldt]

LOL

That was a good one

[desert tendon]

[frail veldt]

Good job

[desert tendon]

Get gotten

[frail veldt]

I have been got

[frail veldt]

That being said though yes we also aren't very strong right now

[desert tendon]

i dont even know if it's proper english but it sounded good in french

[tropic heath]

I have but someting is not clear to me, should i sync blade rush with bte all the time or there is a specific rull ?

[frail veldt]

It works in English for sure

[frail veldt]

Blade rush and bte don't have any interaction you need to consider

Blade rush rule is just to press on CD

Afaik

No matter what cp you're at or anything

[tropic heath]

well i does increase you dps by 5 % for 8 sec isn't it best to sync them ?

or i just yolobolo

[frail veldt]

Just press it on CD

It also gives us energy

No reason to hold it

It's affected by our cdr so it wastes a lot to sit on it off CD

Definitely give the #outlaw-faq a very thorough read

[eternal hound]

Energy is more important then the 4pc buff

[tropic heath]

okay thanks man, i'll be looking a bit more on the guide made here

thank you very much !

[vivid vessel]

the death recap

is the biggest thing

its turbo useless now

[keen belfry]

yuh

[vivid vessel]

• you cant see it in combat r

like

whaaat

[keen belfry]

i used to learn a lot about what i died from

now i just die and guess

[vivid vessel]

same

now i just take 1h after each key looking trough it trying to understand

[keen belfry]

what killed me?
idk
ok next pull

[vivid vessel]

the fact you cant see in combat

si so lame

[random stirrup]

idk if this happens to everyone but if i press it in raid after someone else has died it just shows me their death recap instead

pov i died to purgatory

[vivid vessel]

wdym

oh i meant the details death recap

i dont evne check blizzard one

its so dogshit useless

random numbers on my stream

[random stirrup]

oh ye that is terrible too

but the blizzard death recap is just completely troll

[keen belfry]

i got gapped by a demo lock in an AA yesterday

i think he did like 210

[eternal hound]

14 bricked up

[gleaming garnet]

does the console nodes for the crucible trinket work in dungeons too?

[azure snow]

Anyone able to help me on my parse ? I’m not sure what I did wrong more so

[eternal hound]

yeah I know

I once died to not losing Rukhmar apparently

death recap said I died to fixate pulse

I didn't believe it cuz I cloaked my greed on add

[keen belfry]

link log

[rugged nova]

So are we thinking the next patch will help things for rogues or keep them the same?

[vivid vessel]

same for now

nothing changes

[fresh acorn]

Expect nothing

Can’t get let down

[vivid vessel]

what do i need to do im clueleess

[cinder relic]

Despite everything, the biggest issue of rogue rn is raw tuning, and then the actual encounters

Like no aura buffs will fix paladins and alleria for a rogue

[buoyant cosmos]

Buy the toast beer from Bob and target another player when you click on it

[fresh acorn]

You get an extra spark if you rp hard

[vivid vessel]

ty good sir

[vivid vessel]

ye but thats spec design also

[buoyant cosmos]

Np

[vivid vessel]

all 3 rogue specs were redesigned to not do any cleave

low target cleave

[cinder relic]

Theres a reason you play no melee on alleria, more so than just tuning

[vivid vessel]

if you took tww s3 outlaw and put it on that boss it would have done fine

[cinder relic]

Melee on paladins just takes more damage

[vivid vessel]

yes but

can aura tune me by 20% i will still be last dps

clearly my spec design changed

i cant do loiw target cleave anymore

[cinder relic]

Yes my point is rogue isn't going to get a 20% aura buff to make it good on paladins

Because it'd legit be broken

No reasonable rogue tuning is going to fix rogue on paladins. It needs a redesign to excel on that fight

[vivid vessel]

well my point is that rogue spec design changed and now it cant do low target cleave so even with good tuning idk if that saves rogue much, especially outlaw, when its last niche is gone

[cinder relic]

Yes

Rogue bad on paladins now. Aura buffs won't fix this

[vivid vessel]

i mean im not worried abotu sub and assa

cause at least they have cds

sub has aoe burst still

and assa has execute

i just dont see how outlaw ever get brought into raid again

[keen belfry]

my daily tilter reading outlaw being bad on 2-3 target cleave boss

[vivid vessel]

unless its tuned way higher than the other 2 spec

[keen belfry]

daily zen has been ruined

[vivid vessel]

and i was saying that in tww already while we had an actual low target cleave niche

now we have nothing

so

sure hope we get a season where outlaw is tuned 20% higher than the other 2 rogues

will come for sure

how hard is this rp people

do i need to have friends

[keen belfry]

precise cuts will return

[azure snow]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/PLm248c3HZRMYtrg

[cinder relic]

U can just go in group finder

[glass mortar]

wtf zac invite me???

i;ll visit ur home

[vivid vessel]

wow

houses players do this for free?

tf

[buoyant cosmos]

Go to Argent dawn

[vivid vessel]

way too nice

[lavish shoal]

Add precise cuts back

4% more dmg on flurry per target below 8

W

[glass mortar]

granted, its now a talent in the place of HO

enjoy

[keen belfry]

we will get something like precise cuts back

u guys will see

[vivid vessel]

im actually visiting a house rn

[keen belfry]

and they wont fuck our talent tree addin git

[lavish shoal]

Would be good yes

[glass mortar]

would mean u cant take it and kir

or prep

[keen belfry]

dancing steel will be baseline, precise cuts takes its spot

[glass mortar]

[lavish shoal]

Yeah u just drop prep

Prep Isnt that good lol

[eternal hound]

guys

what is good damage

[glass mortar]

well doesnt dropping u prep get u 2/2 dispatcher

[keen belfry]

DANCING STEEL BASLEINE

[buoyant cosmos]

Timing the key

[glass mortar]

i think ud need to drop both or

i dont have the talents in front of me idr

[vivid vessel]

dancing steel shouldnt be a talent lol

i cant even maintain bf on 2 target

with dancing steel

[eternal hound]

Druid be like

"Dps is crap" mid key

[gaunt phoenix]

in first pull of seat, you used AR then prep and then immediately used AR again

you dont override AR while it's already active, wait until it expires

Your finishers look a bit off I see a lot of points you are at 6cps and then continue to build to 7cps

as fatebound we should dispatch at 5+ cps and BtE at 6+ cps

so if you land at 6 you never continue to build to 7

[eternal hound]

Doubble brick

FUN

I abandoned cuz tank is a fucking dumbass

[lucid sparrow]

im actually just never getting invited to academy keys

[eternal hound]

who can't take aggro EVEN WITH TRICKS ON THEM

Like

What the fuck

[lucid sparrow]

ppl rly dont like outlaw aoe dmg on academy first pack

just never invite

[vivid vessel]

target cap isnt bad for the games guys

[eternal hound]

It isn't but the cheery picking blizz does kinda is

[vivid vessel]

its good

cause of target cap we are allowed to be good at our low target cleave niche

[lavish shoal]

Yeah

Target cap is good

[eternal hound]

So dumb question about tricks

[vivid vessel]

here proof we get to shine in low target count thanks to being target capped

[eternal hound]

I just need to tricks the tank first pull and it'll last the whole dungeon yes?

[lavish shoal]

Massive falloff damage on every ability except for like 5 of them is also good imo

And then the uncap AoE classes being in all the highest keys

[vivid vessel]

@glass mortar @frail veldt @fathom bramble what if precise cut was a choice node with dancing steel +3 targets

so its only a raid talent

[lavish shoal]

Hmmmmm

[vivid vessel]

wouldnt that make more sense

[lavish shoal]

What would it do

[keen belfry]

why cant it be in m+

[vivid vessel]

precise cut the same as before

[glass mortar]

would need to be stronger

it scales with dancing steel

[lavish shoal]

But then it would be calculating from 5 targets

[vivid vessel]

because outlaw needs something to be able to be tuned separetly from keys to raid imo

[glass mortar]

but ig what u mean

[lavish shoal]

So it would be dogwater

Yeah

[vivid vessel]

i mean thats just tuning of the talent that doesnt matter

[keen belfry]

does precise cuts accomplish that on its own?

[lavish shoal]

But why does it need to not have low target cleave in keys

[keen belfry]

but i understand ur point

[glass mortar]

it would be better then not having it at all but would leave cleave in dungeons stinky

[vivid vessel]

precise cut does offer this niceh that is only really a thing in raid yes

[glass mortar]

i dont see any reason outlaw needs to pay for aoe profile to have cleave profile

[lavish shoal]

Nah I mean there’s a ton of 2 target bosses

[glass mortar]

this has not been an issue outlaws ever been forced to deal with prior to like last expac

PC should just be built into BF imo

[vivid vessel]

idk !

[lavish shoal]

Even a 3t in seat

I mean

Revert bf

To bfa

[keen belfry]

i think they just need to base dancing steel baseline and put pc there

[lavish shoal]

Since auto attacks are actually a thing

[keen belfry]

i think thats a simple fix

[lavish shoal]

Attackspeed slow

[near rock]

better than 4 specs

[lavish shoal]

Or energy regen or whatever right

Uncapped with Sqrt past a certain number I guess

[keen belfry]

why is dancing steel a talent? u have to talent into being to only hard capped spec in the game at 8 to avoid being the only hard capped spec in the game at 5?

[mighty pivot]

flavour

[eternal hound]

Only hard capped at five?

[keen belfry]

flavoour good but not when the flavor taste bad

[eternal hound]

Fury says hello for like 80% of their damage

[vivid vessel]

bro

where does this

[keen belfry]

stfu plz no

[vivid vessel]

come from

[keen belfry]

no one knows anything zac

[vivid vessel]

i think this is the only season since like

shadowland

[frail veldt]

I think choice nodes are heavily under used in their tree design yeah

[vivid vessel]

where fury is actually target capped

this season

but let me check

maybe its not even

[cinder relic]

A lot of furys damage is odyns fury and tclap rn so a lot of it is soft capped

[eternal hound]

Well I should specify nezt patch

After thane dies

[vivid vessel]

no way

[eternal hound]

Then 80% of its damage is.

[vivid vessel]

its again not target capped ?

thats crazy

[glass mortar]

doesnt slayer have the silly aoe proc thing thats softcapped tho?

[vivid vessel]

so its not been target cpaped since sl

and we still act

[glass mortar]

i see it on arms (ive only run with arms so far this season)

[unkempt dew]

21 april 12.0.5?

[keen belfry]

lectes is precomlaining for furry warriors rn

[vivid vessel]

like its target capped

every season

no way

[glass mortar]

and it does like 15-20% of their dps

[vivid vessel]

no way

no way

[eternal hound]

Yes cuz fuxk fury

[glass mortar]

that thingy pops off hard on big pulls

[eternal hound]

Give me better arms

[keen belfry]

why are u complaining for them if u hate furry?

[vivid vessel]

no way

its never been

this not

target capped

and we still act

like fury

is target capped

[glass mortar]

their filler is target capped zac

[eternal hound]

Bro

[vivid vessel]

aint no way bro

[eternal hound]

Stop

[vivid vessel]

aint no way

[eternal hound]

Typibg

Like

This

[glass mortar]

therefore they are allowed to steal valor from us

[vivid vessel]

aint no way

bro

aint no way

[eternal hound]

Bro

[formal knot]

lol or?

[lucid sparrow]

shotgun typing

[vivid vessel]

fury is target caped bro

[eternal hound]

Type normally

[glass mortar]

just like MM

[eternal hound]

Holy fuxk

[glass mortar]

most target capped spec in the game

[vivid vessel]

every season its target capped

[buoyant cosmos]

Just run some logs for a few keys

[vivid vessel]

aint no way bro

the spec is target capped fr fr

just dont read their spells tho

dont read

[barren plover]

It looks like i will need to run only my keys cause nobody invite me when they see Outlaw 😄

[keen belfry]

i gonna send this message again that got lectes to reply with some dumb shit:

why is dancing steel a talent? u have to talent into being to only hard capped spec in the game at 8 to avoid being the only hard capped spec in the game at 5?

[vivid vessel]

guys all their damage is target capped bro

trust me on that

[glass mortar]

because blizzard wants there to be a tradeoff to go a dedicated "aoe" build vs a dedicated st

for outlaw this tradeoff is usually very low

rn its about average for us honestly its not bad

but i get the sentiment

it feels dumb

[vivid vessel]

fury has not been target capped a single season since i started wow lets be real now

[azure snow]

I see ok

[vivid vessel]

stop trolling

[eternal hound]

Thats a blatant lie

[glass mortar]

its way less then it was last season because of PC pathing so lets be fair

[keen belfry]

yes i get the point of aoe vs st but that doesnt seem like a talent that should exist to do that

[vivid vessel]

mad cause bad

gg

[eternal hound]

Unless you started in tww ig

Yes I am bad

But at least

I dont

Type

[vivid vessel]

i mean it was true in df also

[eternal hound]

Like

This

[buoyant cosmos]

Is dropping 2/2 to 1/2 in dispatch for Prep the move now?

[vivid vessel]

i remember s2 df i played with fury

[eternal hound]

For one season

[vivid vessel]

gg i win

[lucid sparrow]

its called shotgun typing

[mighty pivot]

https://giphy.com/gifs/reactiongifs-tyqcJoNjNv0Fq

[eternal hound]

And its cringe

[vivid vessel]

mad cause you cant type

as fast

[gaunt phoenix]

i would for pushing keys

[buoyant cosmos]

Someone get Ros in to see how Zac is copying his typing lol

[vivid vessel]

bro thinks he is target capped

[vivid vessel]

?

[buoyant cosmos]

Gotcha

[vivid vessel]

i invented that typing bud

ross wasnt even born

[fathom bramble]

If target capped why damage go up so much on 15 target pull ?

[vivid vessel]

dont disrespect me

[mighty pivot]

wdym copying zac always types like his text box can only fit 3 words

[glass mortar]

people dont really know what target capped means

[buoyant cosmos]

I haven't seen you shotgun in a while lol

[glass mortar]

and they also dont know how triggered zac gets when people try to steal our valore

[formal knot]

outlaw already has blade rush, let's not get greedy guys

[buoyant cosmos]

Your chat is targetcapped

[vivid vessel]

if target capped why is 70% of its damage softcapped at 8

[glass mortar]

fury in those seasons was probably 90% more target capped then other specs in the game

doesnt change that it was a joke to compare its "cap" to outlaw

[jagged plover]

scientists are still trying to answer this

[keen belfry]

wanna know whats lit

i think this is our most uncapped season

[glass mortar]

where u gained like 0.69% dps going from 8 targets to 40 targets

[keen belfry]

in pulls like alge we are uncapped for like 20% of our dmg

[vivid vessel]

no we arent

[glass mortar]

meanwhile fury still gaining a solid 20-30% as u scale up to 20

[glass mortar]

it def is

[keen belfry]

oh fuck its onmly like 10%

damnit

[glass mortar]

i mean we still suck at it

and our variance in aoe is way too stupid high to even tell easily

[keen belfry]

fuck you

[vivid vessel]

4% of that br is st damage also

[glass mortar]

dont get baited by ur details

[vivid vessel]

so its more like 10% at most

[keen belfry]

sybau ok?

what about main goochie?

[glass mortar]

10% of our damage being softcapped is the most target scaling we've ever had

awangs not wrong

(it still sucks tho)

[keen belfry]

maybe like 12% uncapped dmg in messiah pulls

[vivid vessel]

idk we prolly had more in s2 df then

[keen belfry]

nbd

[vivid vessel]

cuase we actually played mastery

[keen belfry]

i didnt play outlaw in s2 df

[vivid vessel]

that season

you remmeber

[keen belfry]

so it doesnt exist

[vivid vessel]

no you dont

[keen belfry]

you think i played outlaw in s2 df?

or s1?

or ever?

[vivid vessel]

ye

[glass mortar]

ok but im pretty sure our MG values on live are more of our % also then it was that season?

[keen belfry]

read up

[glass mortar]

just because of revamping of ability values

[keen belfry]

read up on the legend of awangawang in df ok?

youll know there wasnt much outlaw.

yeah nbd

s1 df player played alittle bit

yeah nbd

@glass mortar i bet u didnt even exist in df s1

[glass mortar]

df s1?

[keen belfry]

yeah u dont even know what that is

[near rock]

I betrayed the pistols that tier

[keen belfry]

all u tryhards playing outlaw since ever

losers!

[glass mortar]

i was a survival hunter in main raid that season

still raided in alt raid on my rogue tho

[keen belfry]

nbd

[near rock]

SoD in shadowlands is when I rly started playing outlaw mostly

[slim hare]

.5 releasing the 21

are you happy about ace nerf? x)

[cinder relic]

Isn't it a buff

[wintry solar]

2 point is iirc

[glass mortar]

nerf to 1/2 points but we wont be playing that anymore

[keen belfry]

aoe build with 2 ace is cursed

[glass mortar]

idr if its a net nerf or buff to the spec i believe its intended to be neutral tho

it also misses the problem with ace a bit but w/e

[slim hare]

it completely miss the problem imo

[vivid vessel]

2 point in ace plays much worse than 1 point in ace rn

change my mind

[glass mortar]

it plays the same but it feels worse

thats the problem

it shouldnt play the same

[keen belfry]

naw u can get 6cp refresh so its automatically better

[glass mortar]

but at least it has higher reset chance then live

[vivid vessel]

absolutely horrendous having to press ss, ps, bf at 5cp poerma

[keen belfry]

but its also sometimes worse

[glass mortar]

i can live with pissing infinite CP away like new outlaw does

building at 5

at least we get more of the procs

[keen belfry]

aoe build no dispatcher?

[vivid vessel]

prolly remove slgiht

[keen belfry]

im pretty sure sleight is quite good?

[glass mortar]

nah

[keen belfry]

solo been doing math on it

[vivid vessel]

im pretty sure we dont sim sleight properly rn

[glass mortar]

doesnt solos math say its overvalued if anything in sims?

[slim hare]

your just happy pissing even more cp away?

[glass mortar]

thot that was the last thing i saw him say on the subject

[keen belfry]

he has new math

but idk this compared to no sleight

but more jackpots

even tho weran and mewo hate jackpots

they think power in bte reset

they are so excited for 2ace

[slim hare]

damn

at least someone is happy about hte change

[keen belfry]

im not happy about it

they changed the wrong number

[glass mortar]

ok but

he said this after the math

so i dont think sleight is that valuable

[gaunt phoenix]

sleight appears to not affect jackpot at all

[vivid vessel]

crazy

[keen belfry]

it does for me

[vivid vessel]

can we get a real dev working on outalw

much appreicated

[keen belfry]

whatever weran says about sims and dps i tend to ignore

[glass mortar]

no. im happy to be getting more ace procs

and I'll live with pissing CP away because new outlaw already does that

i mean this is just them getting us ready for when they buff trickster to be the top build

and everyone needs to learn to love building at 5 forever

and dumping infinite CP to the void

🙂

[keen belfry]

i been playing 2 ace on ST build already

[glass mortar]

thats what trickster does

[near rock]

played 2 ace on paladins last night, def a little weird

[vivid vessel]

i mean its better not in aoe

in keys bro

you will have to refresh bf at full cp

[keen belfry]

thats banger

[vivid vessel]

banger !

[keen belfry]

they should amke new talent

overcapping cp makes it supercharge

[vivid vessel]

ye so then cps are irrelevant you can just press random buttons

[keen belfry]

BF at 5cp = like 12 cp bte

yes

imagine

just also ss a few times at max cp to make sure u get bte reset

thoughts?

[lucid sparrow]

https://worldofwarcraft.blizzard.com/en-us/news/24266871/

ace change soon guys

soon saved

[keen belfry]

imagine SS into ps into ps into ss into bte

bte reset

gg

[slim hare]

i think thats cooking maybe too much but i like it

[keen belfry]

ty

[slim hare]

at leats is original

more work than the last year of the outlaw dev

[keen belfry]

ty

just came to me

all over me

[fair topaz]

maybe weird take but instead of having 7 cps and weird build at 5 rules i'd love to go back to having 5/6 cps max instead of 7

[lavish shoal]

Insane comm

[slim hare]

id do that to you

[lavish shoal]

I mean everyone agrees

Having 7 cps sucks

For outlaw

[keen belfry]

what if dont agree

[lavish shoal]

You might be stupid

[inland meteor]

i agree with everything awang says

[keen belfry]

7cps kinda good esp in aoe!

[lavish shoal]

7cps was the big change they did in df

[keen belfry]

if u had to choose bteween pressing BF and finishing at 6 or 7 which r u picking

6 7

[lavish shoal]

And it just sucks

For every spec it just does nothing

Adds nothing

Useless change

[cinder relic]

I love 7 cp!

[slim hare]

thats not a choice

imagine bf was baseline

[lavish shoal]

Bro is cooked

[slim hare]

its only a buff

[keen belfry]

good

[wintry solar]

7th exists for when youd overcap at 6

[lavish shoal]

Tell me ur lying rn @cinder relic

U better be lying

[cinder relic]

Nope

[lavish shoal]

What the fuck

[keen belfry]

how it not a choice

[slim hare]

no one would chose pressing bf

[jagged plover]

i mean is there anything wrong with 7cp inherently it's just because of stupid balancing you probably don't like it

[keen belfry]

i love pressing BF to build in aoe

[slim hare]

over 7 cp

[lavish shoal]

ForeverBuilder @cinder relic

[lavish shoal]

U press almost twice as many builders

[slim hare]

i love it

[lavish shoal]

Unlucky

[vivid vessel]

outlaw would play so much better rn if it was 6cp max

[wintry solar]

fr

[lavish shoal]

5

[keen belfry]

y u think so?

[vivid vessel]

its litteraly made to finish at 5

yes bro

[slim hare]

butt i prefer if bf didnt exist and we didnt have to press it

[keen belfry]

i dont udnerstand why its diff at 6/7

[vivid vessel]

every builder builds to 5 xd

[proven ocean]

bfa was 5 or 6

[slim hare]

fixed energy

[proven ocean]

so

thats why it was good

[vivid vessel]

fth goes to 5 ace goes to 5

[proven ocean]

7 is just too bloated

[vivid vessel]

also finishing more often is more fun

[proven ocean]

and annoying

[lavish shoal]

Finishing more often is just better

[keen belfry]

i think these are problem with fth and ace not 6/7

buyt i see ur point

[lavish shoal]

Fth not filling cps is dogshit

[vivid vessel]

ss builds to 5 also noob

[proven ocean]

ss builds to 5 also noob

[lavish shoal]

But then there is no friction or reason in having 7 cp it’s just cosmetic

[vivid vessel]

only with fatebound it doesnt and magically fix the spec

[keen belfry]

if ruthlesness didnt exist id agree

[craggy barn]

the math wants us to build to 6/7 bc math
if we cap at 6 it would want us to build 5/6

[slim hare]

when channel close ?

[craggy barn]

like before

[cinder relic]

I LOVE GENRATORS!!

[lavish shoal]

When it was 5 it was 4/5

[craggy barn]

ye

the math just maths

[proven ocean]

zac

[vivid vessel]

no thats cause you are playing fatebound lil bro

[lavish shoal]

Bro gets hard for ambush

[vivid vessel]

magically fixing the spec

cause + 1 cp

[proven ocean]

no cappy zac

like

not even 1

[glass mortar]

doesnt SS proc build to 6?

[keen belfry]

true

[proven ocean]

ur alot smarter than u were in DF

[keen belfry]

maybe if we were palying trickster id agree

[proven ocean]

u were kinda cooked back then

proud of u cuh

[vivid vessel]

yes cause of fatebound

play trikcster bro every builder is up to 5

[gaunt phoenix]

me applying to work at generac

[vivid vessel]

its complete dogshit trash

degenerate gameplay

[cinder relic]

LOLOL

[glass mortar]

is there anyway we get to 7 CP naturally other then an SS proc after a double ruthlessness refund (assuming no PS), or PSing after an SS no proc?

[slim hare]

i have an idea

[glass mortar]

i feel like 90% of our finishers are already at 6

[slim hare]

make zac sandbag

[glass mortar]

and almost all the times we go to 7 we are building from 5

[slim hare]

get buff

and be happy

[glass mortar]

meaning we are just vomitting CP to the void

[vivid vessel]

FATEBOUND

IS

+1

CP

READ

[glass mortar]

what

[gaunt phoenix]

deft

[vivid vessel]

ss builds to 5

if you play

normal outlaw

non fatebound

[glass mortar]

what

why is that relevant to what i said

why does fatebound giving u +1 matter for 6 max vs 7 max?

it already fits into 6 max regardless

its not building to 7

[keen belfry]

wasnt an issue outlaws hated in df was it was just builder spender builder spender

[vivid vessel]

because it goes to 5 cp

not 6

so then you have to build again

wdym

[glass mortar]

sure but thats irrelevant

if 6 was our max

then ud spend at 5 or 6

regardless of fatebound/trickster it works perfectly

[vivid vessel]

yes 6cp max fix the spec

[glass mortar]

SS builds the right amount

[vivid vessel]

is what i mean

[wintry solar]

sounds like delete 7th CP and make strat a choice node with MfD

[lavish shoal]

Go back to 5 cp man

[vivid vessel]

you would use ss at 1 cp, fth at 2 cp and fill cps perfectly all the time

like a real gamer gaming

[slim hare]

go play vanilla

[vivid vessel]

no overcap

[lavish shoal]

Vanilla shadowlands would cook rn

[slim hare]

true

[lavish shoal]

But like post double legendary patch

Let me go play echoing reprimand again thanks

Goddamn best patch ever

[wintry solar]

Best expac for outlaw imo

[keen belfry]

i like supercharger, but i think id like one more button

i really like br

in aoe*

[wintry solar]

tuning aside, it felt fun all expac

[lavish shoal]

It’s not even close

[craggy barn]

give rogs a legendary and make it daggers again lul

actually no dont do that

[lavish shoal]

Oh make it a set of daggers

[craggy barn]

i wont be maining rog for a long time

[lavish shoal]

A 2 set

So outlaw gets fucked

[craggy barn]

i cant let someone else take em in my guild

[wintry solar]

make it A dagger

[lavish shoal]

W devs

[winter steppe]

Could someone help me with log review this is the log and any help would be appreciated https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/xFkVDKAWva6TJ7nL?fight=27&type=damage-done&source=3

[gleaming reef]

Hmm how do I sim embellishments in Raidbots?

[vivid vessel]

the + thing

on a crafted item

can chose any embel

[gleaming reef]

oh

ok lemme try

[gaunt phoenix]

nitpicky but every time you press AR you are missing a global

AR is not on the global so there shouldnt be much of a delay

u should try not to press AR very early into the gcd either

[winter steppe]

So do I just need to be quicker with blade rush after AR?

[gleaming reef]

Hmm mine says hunt is better than void for me

[vivid vessel]

"better"

[gaunt phoenix]

yes

[vivid vessel]

prolly neutral

[glass mortar]

what stat does hunt even give in sims

[vivid vessel]

most of the weapon embels simmed the exact same fore me

[glass mortar]

is it the same one it gives in raids

or is its tooltip just a lie

[gaunt phoenix]

it averages based on the collective raid bosses

[glass mortar]

oh that seems like

[winter steppe]

Alright thank you I appreciate it

[keen belfry]

i need to go to france

[glass mortar]

a way... to do it

[keen belfry]

and find zac

hes in the attic of his apt right?

[glass mortar]

nono his apt is an attic

[keen belfry]

ok ill look for an attic apt

[proven ocean]

why are u trying to ragebait zac tho

maybe ur pretending idk

[glass mortar]

what

[proven ocean]

thats double dip sauce deluxe ragebait

another what

@vivid vessel Thoughts?

[gaunt phoenix]

i think you are not doing the optimization where if you are at 3 stacks of opportunity and at 1 cps, you press SS not opportunity

[proven ocean]

guys

[sullen walrus]

boys, trinket(hero) ranger captain from crown, is better than crudible?

[proven ocean]

did u know that zac is the fastest discord opener in the game

if u ping him he will immediately see ur msg

faster than a wow gcd

[wintry solar]

@vivid vessel this true?

[gaunt phoenix]

it is but basically only at mythic track lol

[sullen walrus]

@narrow raptor this true?

[proven ocean]

it is he just doesnt wanna talk atm

its fine zac

[winter steppe]

Ok so at 3 stacks of opportunity and 1 cps I just press SS then pistol shot for max cps?

[proven ocean]

you'll get it through

he's not feeling yappy atm

[vivid vessel]

its true

[proven ocean]

yap check? @vivid vessel

[vivid vessel]

because i have 2 screens

any 1 screen noob in the chat

[keen belfry]

idk i asked zaac a question earlier in discord

no reply

[proven ocean]

cuz

ur a noob

noob = no reply

[gaunt phoenix]

you press SS, but then you only PS if SS doesnt proc

[wintry solar]

1 screen noob

[vivid vessel]

if i dont replky its cuase i dont wanna reply to you noob

[keen belfry]

id gap tf outta zeross

[vivid vessel]

fuck you

[proven ocean]

see

[gaunt phoenix]

if SS procs at 1cp then you end up at 6cp

[keen belfry]

who me?

[proven ocean]

fuck you gnawa

[buoyant cosmos]

He knew you could figure it out on your own

[dark steeple]

[keen belfry]

o wasmt readomg ear;oer. ypi ta;lommg tp ,e?

ah

[inland meteor]

ye

[keen belfry]

hand one spot over

[proven ocean]

qgat sre uoi ykjhjhing snout?

what are you talking about*

[proven ocean]

^

[gaunt phoenix]

qgat sre uoi ykjhjhing snout?

[winter steppe]

Ah ok I understand now thank you

[keen belfry]

i wasnt reading earlier you talking to me?

[jagged plover]

snout

[vivid vessel]

i would never

[proven ocean]

i feel like snout should be a word

[jagged plover]

it is

[proven ocean]

shake spear didnt think about it prob

wait is it?

[jagged plover]

it's like

[proven ocean]

oh

[jagged plover]

a nose

[proven ocean]

its a cat

[vivid vessel]

shake spear

[proven ocean]

wtf

[jagged plover]

for animals

[vivid vessel]

shaking it f fr