yeah key performance is unchanged
#outlaw
fathom bramble
light kernel
assasination meta kekw
fathom bramble
or a very very minor buff
novel birch
Thing is, my AoE was pretty damn good as is, I did well in groups, it was boss burning that I struggle with
fathom bramble
you would get more of a buff by swapping to panda
stiff vector
and our aoe didnt need to be touched at all, so i mean they are cooked
novel birch
I think this is good. As I said, we gotta take what we can get at this point
proven ocean
you would get more of a buff by swapping to panda
Why does that matter
mint ether
he's saying it's a very small buff
fathom bramble
I guess it doesn't
faint pendant
fathom bramble
I'm just trying to get across how small of a change this is for key overall damage
vivid vessel
i dont get why they need to nerf the aoe when they do that little of an aura buff tho
like
outlaw isnt even
is outlaw out of control in aoe ?
its not even the best spec out of the 3
rogue spec
gaunt phoenix
exactly what i said
vivid vessel
im so confused
fathom bramble
now there is one potential hiccup with this
smoky lotus
theres no rogue dev to think anything through, the intern just turns some dials
proven ocean
exactly what i said
W complaint
vapid blaze
is that 4% gonna do anything in raid or
vapid blaze
like all these raids are either burst aoe
or low target cleave
and they just nerf it for that?
vivid vessel
outlaw wouldnt even be good in raid with a 10 % buff
zinc briar
wtf is the nerf on bf
proven ocean
4% is 4% but it wont change how bad it is
keen belfry
im of the stance that melee literally cant be good in this raid unless they are tuned to be exodia
keen cedar
Literally this! xD
stiff vector
like are we the best 6-8t spec in the game? Definitely not even close. Were pretty good in that, but realistically we SHOULD be practically the best in the game at 6-8t. And our low target cleave should be getting massively fixed/buffed. They are just completely cooked.
vapid blaze
with pc you would maybe be useful
vivid vessel
there is litteraly no one in the world playing outlaw in keys rn
and we nerf the aoe
like it was required
indigo token
ROGUE BUFFS???
vivid vessel
oh no im so scared outlaw is gonna destroy keys with a 4% aura buff
like what are we doing bro
are we that effraid
halcyon garden
outlaw wouldnt even be good in raid with a 10 % buff
sub on luria still?
vivid vessel
that outlaw might do any damage
runic gulch
Why have they nerfed bf again?
indigo token
bro...
vivid vessel
sub on luria still?
is that even a question or what
indigo token
BRO
sick prawn
ROGUE BUFFS???
read the room guppy
wintry solar
BROOKO
indigo token
what the fuck why is bladfe flurry NERFED
halcyon garden
is that even a question or what
between assa and sub zac im not that delusional
indigo token
read the room guppy
I just came in
runic gulch
Nah they’re actually fried
indigo token
i saw rogue buffs on twitter
dim parrot
Loktark you say 4% nerf at 8 target? Does that number approach 4% buff the less targets you have
light kernel
assa gonna be rly strong in keys
vivid vessel
wait but they just buffed assa ?
gaunt phoenix
just spell data override instead of napkin
vivid vessel
for free?
zinc briar
cant believe they nerf blade flurry, rip outlaw in m+
vivid vessel
xd?
proven ocean
4% to put it in prespective, if u do 10 dps u only do 10.4 dps instead so ye giga small
past falcon
imagine if blade flurry did x damage at 5 targets and reduced damage beyond 5 targets. then they could fix our 2-4 target dmg without inflating total aoe 🙂
vivid vessel
assa is already better than outlaw in keys ?
halcyon garden
thats why i am asking zac
vivid vessel
ALO
light kernel
zerocool started streaming buff assa 😛
blissful idol
Nice company guys
vivid vessel
ALO
hoary mountain
wait but they just buffed assa ?
yeah, assa got no nerfs what so ever
zinc briar
its time to play assa in m+
crude flower
or we not know yet
stiff vector
like what are we doing bro
28% base BF btw 
waxen scarab
WHAT IS HAPPENING
cinder relic
or we not know yet
P sure it's always a buff
fathom bramble
probably a small nerf at 8 targets
vivid vessel
WHY DO WE BUFF ASSA WHEN ITS BETTER THAN OUTALW IN KEYS AND WE CANT EVEN GIVE OUTLAW 4% AURA BUFF WITHOUT NERFING THE AOE
fathom bramble
buff to dungeon overall
keen belfry
lets go zac crashout
frail veldt
Can someone do the math at 8 targets im driving home from work
keen belfry
LETS GO
blissful idol
Inc
wide coral
nerf at 8 targets
proven ocean
Sin buffs are so huge
long barn
Fucking hate blizzard
proven ocean
waxen scarab
my guild officer woke me up to this someone explain plz
light kernel
@proven ocean i mean assa already had rly good overall in keys
near rock
cringe
craggy barn
why do they keep nerfing cleave
proven ocean
my guild officer woke me up to this someone explain plz
Outlaw wont change in terms of how bad it is in raid
keen cedar
This guy works for Blizzard xD
long barn
Get a real person that can fucking speak up for us
craggy barn
???
vivid vessel
10% bf
waxen scarab
Outlaw wont change in terms of how bad it is in raid
على زق
past falcon
blizzard telling me to go touch grass idk
craggy barn
what the fuck is that cleave nerf
crude flower
I mean
hoary mountain
Why did my tism make me want to main outlaw guys 
stiff vector
this hasbeen blizzards stupid ass "thing" every single time they attempt to fix our ST for the last like 3 tiers, they think they need to also nerf anything related to BF regardless of current tuning because they think we will magically become ultra giga OP in aoe if they dont
radiant root
Their meticulous approach to rogue, like that of a high level mathematician, was absolutely hilarious
silk sphinx
when do we lock down the discord? and @ everyone?
long barn
Now
crude flower
I mean tomelvis does high keys that means it's broken right
vivid vessel
im psoting my first wowhead comment
long barn
Fucking do it now
vivid vessel
nvm i cant login
stiff vector
im psoting my first wowhead comment
HOLY hes really crashing out
craggy barn
why
fathom bramble
This guy works for Blizzard xD
I'm just trying to speak accurately about a change. obviously they didn't need to nerf BF with this buff given our current performance
light kernel
if they just put 4% buff i would be fine with it xd
proven ocean
can we get a real dev
Why tho we’re getting tuned correctly 
long barn
Shut this bitch down
elder sonnet
even if there is a rogue dev out there he probably doesn't play outlaw so he doesn't know how to tune it
waxen scarab
even if there is a rogue dev out there he probably doesn't play outlaw so he doe...
true
swift moon
Someone tell our dev about raidbots pls
fickle stream
ok so we meta on keys?
proven ocean
even if there is a rogue dev out there he probably doesn't play outlaw so he doe...
They just think outlaw cleaves same way it did in tww season 2
dim parrot
Hahahhahaha
light kernel
@fickle stream only in delves
dim parrot
You guys think it’s funny
jovial moat
net buff right?
fickle stream
<@755863153123917834> only in delves
😂
dim parrot
They clickbaited us with “rogue buffs”
stiff vector
remember when we had 50% base BF, and precise cuts, and multiple other BF modifiers? Those were the days
dim parrot
I think it’s kinda funny
crude flower
This is so fucking funny ngl
Why are they nerfing bf like !?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
fathom bramble
This is so fucking funny ngl
Why are they nerfing bf like !?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
I would guess that the objective was to buff raid performance while leaving key performance almost unchanged
thorny crest
It's like the dev looked at his AI notes from the last outlaw changes and just hit copy+paste
fathom bramble
we could have definitely afforded having a buff in keys though so idk
last hedge
They have never done shit for M+, most of them are not aware of it's existance
indigo token
isnt paladins our worst fight though because we're bad at low target cleave
proven ocean
Wowhead is just full of tiktok devs lets post a controversial title for outlaws to crash out on their nerfs and get more clicks! Haha!
indigo token
so we're gonna be worse there?
frail veldt
but a buff
Net nerf unfortunately
stiff vector
So this clearly shows, they think our current aoe performance is perfect. Including low target cleave, where the only hardcapped spec is Brewmaster level bad on 2-5t. Absolute cinema.
static crescent
Shouldnt this be a buff in aoe too?
fathom bramble
go look at your latest keystone dungeon overall and tell me what % BF(passive, not initial hit) did
static crescent
very small
fathom bramble
if it's less then 50%
proven ocean
Shouldnt this be a buff in aoe too?
Probably not idk
jolly geyser
did they just look at raid buffs cucks doing keys and nerf according to that?
fathom bramble
this is a buff technically
frail veldt
go look at your latest keystone dungeon overall and tell me what % BF(passive, n...
Like 55% I think
crude flower
it is, but why would they modify blade flurry
fathom bramble
Like 55% I think
including the initial or excluding it?
I don;t think details does it automatically anymore
so you need a log now
to tell
proven ocean
Saying that its a nerf is just wrong unless we have sims that prove otherwise
crude flower
I don't even play outlaw but it isn't like nut bustingly, brain burstingly OP
proven ocean
But
dawn bear
We are cooking with these buffs they should increase the energy cost of deft again next it’s looking a little too strong!
waxen scarab
if it's less then 50%
just now
proven ocean
Its gonna suck in keys
indigo token
I don't even play outlaw but it isn't like nut bustingly, brain burstingly OP
absolutely the fuck not
it was op for like one season in BFA in M+
crude flower
absolutely the fuck not
Yea
So why don't they just give it a 4% aura buff and call it a day
wintry solar
Y'all acting like Menacing was nerfed to 10% 
jovial moat
disclaimer I don't play the spec and am here for the same reason children go to the zoo
but basic math would suggest:
~3% buff on ST
neutral on 3t
~3% nerf on 8t
unless there are talent interactions that affect things
keen cedar
I'm just trying to speak accurately about a change. obviously they didn't need t...
They have to give us one spec that is S tier, we are pure dps class, I dont wanna be outdpsed by hybrids
fathom bramble
They have to give us one spec that is S tier, we are pure dps class, I dont wann...
I agree
elder sonnet
if it's less then 50%
its usually 45-48%
indigo token
disclaimer I don't play the spec and am here for the same reason children go to ...
wowwwww
proven ocean
Surely a small buff
fathom bramble
disclaimer I don't play the spec and am here for the same reason children go to ...
these are the maximum possible amount that it could nerf if we assume all our damage is dealt only by bf and stuff BF can copy
fluid crown
Hello is chapgpt updated to latest buff?
fathom bramble
thanks to other aoe sources it is less than 3%
royal badge
disclaimer I don't play the spec and am here for the same reason children go to ...
this must be the rogue dev
light kernel
why did they even touch trickster tho xd
vivid vessel
my bad bro outlaw was out of control in keys
vivid vessel
let me check what rogue specs people are playing in keys rn
jolly geyser
devs dont raid with rogue it seems
vivid vessel
outlaw prolly doing too much aoe rogue players cant handle it
jovial moat
nobody raids with rogue
trail glen
they've nerfed blade flurry so many times this patch cycle
sour cedar
what the actual fuck are they smoking?
proven ocean
oh sub and assa?
Ppl dont play those specs if streamers dont touch them so
dense coral
eternal hound
Nobody plays with rogue
fathom bramble
@waxen scarab if we look at pull 1 of this caverns it is still basically even
maybe a slight slight slight nerf
next veldt
outlaw prolly doing too much aoe rogue players cant handle it
sub is good in keys because we're doing constant damage every pack
proven ocean
Me, casual arent playing rogue nowadays i think or?
stiff vector
its probably like net neutral in some keys, maybe like 1% buff in others depending on how often you are spending hitting 6-8t in a key...the longer you spend hitting 6-8t, closer to neutral overall it will be.
next veldt
and our ST is not terrible on bosses due to nothing much in our tree changing
vivid vessel
sub is good in keys because we're doing constant damage every pack
ok bro ?
hoary mountain
outlaw prolly doing too much aoe rogue players cant handle it
was too complicated for their new design phillosiphy. Had to nerf us to make people not play their shitty choices
next veldt
oh wait im too sleepy to read sarcasm
proven ocean
So
next veldt
sorry my bad, carry on king
vivid vessel
i didnt ask why sub was good in keys, all i know is no one is playing outlaw, and im not doing particularly good in keys rn
proven ocean
And its ahead without us
proven ocean
Kinda crazy
stiff vector
no raid buff z utility
vivid vessel
and im not topping keys
light kernel
wait is aoe blind back ?
waxen scarab
i dont have a raid buff
dmg rd?
stiff vector
not even tanky anymore
rocky canopy
I’m confused why do they need to buff outlaw cleave lol
vivid vessel
real raid buff
rocky canopy
Or nerf I mean
stiff vector
dont even have the energy to press feint half the time in keys
hoary mountain
wait is aoe blind back ?
sssssssssh, blizz might hear you and think that might be too op
proven ocean
Atrophic poison now lowers ur grp dmg by 3%!
amazing
Only with outlaw
Special offer
nova sinew
I’m confused why do they need to buff outlaw cleave lol
outlaw cleave is too strong
in the raid
unkempt dew
Are we meta now
nova sinew
we would be stacked
nova sinew
no other c lasses cleave like us
vivid vessel
real raid buff
jolly geyser
Atrophic poison now lowers ur grp dmg by 3%!
should be like 6 or 7
unkempt dew
Meta at being declined
Heheh I don’t mind, my brother is the main tank
mellow thicket
how good is this spec
welcome to sub
sour cedar
can they literally just delete our class and set me free from this toxic relationship please
dense forge
wait but they just buffed assa ?
hi , sorry uncle helped
vivid vessel
hi , sorry uncle helped
my bad bro they buffed the better rogue spec and nerfed the worse rogue spec
never seen before
mellow thicket
its what a one percent buff for sin?
vivid vessel
(every season )
keen cedar
i feel like assa has potential to be meta out of all specs
Average on best
proven ocean
my bad bro they buffed the better rogue spec and nerfed the worse rogue spec
Thats how it should be tho
light kernel
idk rly big overall in keys
proven ocean
Why buff an unpopular bad spec? Lol
vivid vessel
ye justy nerf it instead
formal pawn
Trickster nerf is wild
runic gulch
My fav part is them nerfing nimble flurry for outlaw when trickster is already behind and not being played anyway
vivid vessel
nah that part is good
woudlnt want to have to accidentally play that trash tree
nerf it more
keen cedar
My fav part is them nerfing nimble flurry for outlaw when trickster is already b...
Thats the proof how much they know about Rogue xD
runic gulch
Just for good measure
proven ocean
Hi guys its me, the outlaw changer guy, bladeflurry is bad so we decided it’ll be worse tonight, please stay tuned for more buffs 🙏
warped spruce
after these buffs is outlaw going to spend more or less time looking for group? or about the same?
edgy walrus
What in the gpt tuning is happening
light kernel
more as usual
vivid vessel
after these buffs is outlaw going to spend more or less time looking for group? ...
assa got better you got worse so longer
bout 2% longer by my estimations
keen cedar
after these buffs is outlaw going to spend more or less time looking for group? ...
I think you will not be able to make your own group xD
eternal hound
can they literally just delete our class and set me free from this toxic relatio...
Chief I'm sorry
It's like this with evrey melee.
novel isle
Anywhere I can make a ticket to report someone in this discord
edgy walrus
good one no ?
it hit for me
sullen walrus
pit +14 🙁
indigo token
Anywhere I can make a ticket to report someone in this discord
why
eternal hound
Or evrey dps who isn't kissing blizzard (mostly casters
novel isle
blissful idol
Anywhere I can make a ticket to report someone in this discord
Yes if it’s the rogue dev
proven ocean
I love how one expansion all 3 specs have crazy cleave when it was meant primarily for outlaw then they just remove that feature entirely on the whole class on midnight
stiff vector
its kind of like they are attempting to tune our aoe as if we are every other spec in the game and not the only hardcapped spec in the game
vivid vessel
charge your phone lil buddy
crude flower
novel isle
my cable is too small
last hedge
This is the rogue dev side hustle
vivid vessel
its kind of like they are attempting to tune our aoe as if we are every other s...
no but i do appreciate the aoe nerf like we are actually destroying aoe rn
novel isle
vivid vessel
(we are prolly not even in the top 10 aoe spec in the game)
jolly geyser
vivid vessel
(if you run without all raid buff prolly not even top 20)
proven ocean
(we are prolly not even in the top 10 aoe spec in the game)
We are top 3 but in reverse
limpid acorn
(we are prolly not even in the top 10 aoe spec in the game)
top3 rogue aoe spec
crude flower
<:Xalatath:1418552191131582556>
river escarp
sullen walrus
lol , because of death 34 parses
@vivid vessel its +16 maisara. its good dmg?
vivid vessel
top3 rogue aoe spec
gg
stiff vector
no but i do appreciate the aoe nerf like we are actually destroying aoe rn
this is true, it was very unhealthy for the state of balance for us to be ultra giga OP in aoe (including low target cleave ofc, where we are most OP) like that. Good job being on top of balance blizzard!
runic gulch
i'm starting to notice a pattern where whenever outlaw gets something addressed, it always comes with a stupid arbitrary caveat or just gets fixed in the complete wrong way
proven ocean
Lets goooo
rocky canopy
Yeah thank god they tuned down outlaws aoe it was really problematic tbh
vivid vessel
lol , because of death 34 parses
<@352916297262301194> its +16 maisara. its goo...
pretty decent cuh
proven ocean
We’re top 3 rogue spec in aoe
Actually true and real
sullen wyvern
so guys
why is outlaw getting nerfed in cleave
can some1 explain
pretty please
proven ocean
why is outlaw getting nerfed in cleave
Cuz its bad why not make it worse?
unborn moon
they're trying to make cleave a wash, and a slight buff to ST?
jolly geyser
cause blizz is 
sullen wyvern
I was legit about to level up my outlaw this weekend
tight pecan
hi guys im kinda new to the spec, are we happy with the buffs?
sour cedar
because Blizz actively hate the Rogue class and everyone who plays it
rocky canopy
Thank god aoe is going down I hated doing a third as much damage as mm hunters did
fathom bramble
hi guys im kinda new to the spec, are we happy with the buffs?
happy in raid, very slightly unhappy in keys
sullen wyvern
why isnt @vivid vessel outlaw dev yet
who is outlaw dev
gonna plant some leggos on his bedroom when he wakes up
proven ocean
who is outlaw dev
Chatgbt
indigo token
who is outlaw dev
grummz probably
runic gulch
who is outlaw dev
Chat GPT
midnight granite
Its not even chat gpt it's like grok
sullen wyvern
grok is more advanced tbh
indigo token
Its not even chat gpt it's like grok
we got cyberhitler tuning us
sullen wyvern
chatgpt is pretty pepega
indigo token
we're cooked
proven ocean
Only chatgbt can pull off a nerf to cleave when its already bad
light kernel
who is outlaw dev
Some1 who mains top 2 rogue specs
vivid vessel
Only chatgbt can pull off a nerf to cleave when its already bad
io mean its not bad but like
its not good either ?
proven ocean
chatgpt is pretty pepega
Crazy how it was good when chatgbt was 1.0
vivid vessel
why are we acting like we need to keep it in reigns
proven ocean
Everytime they release a new chatgbt model it becomes stupider
keen cedar
Imagine to see headline like this, I would be so hyped ahahahahahha
tawdry elk
I feel like my cdm is laggy regarding combo point tracking, anyone has the same issue ?
jolly geyser
I didnt expect anything
rocky canopy
Technically they’re not wrong yknow
jolly geyser
and still got dissapointed
proven ocean
Imagine to see headline like this, I would be so hyped ahahahahahha
Should’ve added the word massive
sullen wyvern
and still got dissapointed
zinc briar
we have to coment in the wowhead post
sinful sleet
wait is this an outlaw buf? It reads like a …. nerf? is this real life?
old gull
sullen wyvern
Imma keep playing my disc priest on my rat keys then
vivid vessel
wait is this an outlaw buf? It reads like a …. nerf? is this real life?
mental nerf
tight pecan
happy in raid, very slightly unhappy in keys
thank you!
indigo token
old gull
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/316923682607857685/1413242281515024545/im...
this was me btw rofl, the meme is alive
sullen wyvern
4% buff on mediocre single target, gotta nerf cleave too! winning!
slim hare
can guy make a tweet already
at that point pliz go for a wowhead article
novel isle
We dont want to play with meta slaves anyway
runic gulch
its how it works with outlaw, anything good we get comes at a dumb pointless price
sullen wyvern
meanwhile devourers uhdks and frostmages blasting 500k+ dps constantly
slim hare
its not acceptable
proven ocean
I mean
runic gulch
you like having double coup alongside your 4set? we hear you, its now your new 4 set. you dont like being murdered by killing spree? that's cool we hear you, we've reworked it to stop that, but now you have no prio damage and it targets at random
zinc briar
we have to write in wowhead post
proven ocean
Even solo wowhead commented at those changes
zinc briar
they ahve to change it
proven ocean
If solo comments on wowhead
zinc briar
like they did with paladin
jolly geyser
who reads comments
proven ocean
U know its that bsd
novel isle
meanwhile devourers uhdks and frostmages blasting 500k+ dps constantly
FM seems easy mode atm lol
zinc briar
sometimes they change it
vivid vessel
why did every other spec get a straight up buff
keen cedar
Rogue Dev should come in here, just to see this rage xD
sullen wyvern
I would say to close the rogue discord until our class gets properly fixed but rogue community is so small and irrelevant at this point that they probably wouldn't notice 
vivid vessel
but outlaw had to get nerfed ?
proven ocean
Rogue Dev should come in here, just to see this rage xD
They are usually here during changes i think
vivid vessel
outawl ?
gray summit
i do not understand
vivid vessel
outlaw ?
proven ocean
Just silent
fluid iron
where sub buff tho
gray summit
its a buff or a nerf ?
vivid vessel
the gun spec ?
zinc briar
we should rage everywhere
gray summit
xd
zinc briar
to fire outlaw dev
keen cedar
They are usually here during changes i think
Inkognito xD
spring rapids
Rogue Dev should come in here, just to see this rage xD
They're probably here and having the laugh of their life seeing this kind of rage 😂😂
vivid vessel
wdym they nerfed brewmaster
whatever its a tank
every other dps
got buffed
without any nerf
but outlaw was too good bro
outlaw is the spec
proven ocean
They're probably here and having the laugh of their life seeing this kind of rag...
Wouldn’t surprise me if thats their goal
vivid vessel
they need to be careful about
thorn parrot
What the actual fuck
sullen wyvern
We did too, we are gonna crank in ST now bro
vivid vessel
lil nerf added on top
sullen wyvern
thorn parrot
FELLAS WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK
jolly geyser
They're probably here and having the laugh of their life seeing this kind of rag...
untill they get fired so ceo gets 100mill bonus
main abyss
WTF BLIZZARD
proven ocean
Cuz all the changes outlaw got the past year or so has been extremely fried
vivid vessel
have to keep it in check
tiny dagger
single target buff in a full cleave season
rocky canopy
Yeah ngl these changes feel like they’re mocking us lol
mellow thicket
still not the time to ask why roigues are in a terrible spot across any communication medium to blizzard
junior folio
so true, outlaw so strong we need to keep it in check, its gonna go crazy and we're gonna start stacking 5 outlaw rogues
deep sequoia
someone pls tell me wtf the point of this is
proven ocean
i need a real dev that isnt ai bro
Ai knows everything it cant do anything wrong bro its chatgbt it means 1000 iq
slim hare
Cuz all the changes outlaw got the past year or so has been extremely fried
since df rework its going down bad
sullen wyvern
winning!!!
cinder relic
someone pls tell me wtf the point of this is
The point of what
mellow thicket
i wish they could show their metrics for decision making
mellow thicket
there has to be some transparent logic
junior folio
its a "compensation" for the last 4% buffs
static crescent
Even if they just did 4% buff it woulda been whatever
proven ocean
since df rework its going down bad
Df was like work of me and zac when realz listened then the zac’s great crashout happened and we never talked to realz again about outlaw
novel isle
nerfing bf by 2% seems
But it got a 4% buff... its still +2% no?
proven ocean
And few from chat
pliant wave
Why is it always the same with Outlaw? They give it a pathetic ST buff, then immediately nerf BF like clockwork. Why does the spec get punished every single time it gets the smallest help?
vivid vessel
outalw too good bro
fathom bramble
someone pls tell me wtf the point of this is
The buff is a very slight nerf at 8 targets, but a buff to overall key damage and a buff to all raid encounters. it's likely that it is just blizz trying to buff us in raid without significantly effecting keys even though we aren't super strong in keys either.
vivid vessel
gotta keep it in check
gray summit
its a buff of 2-2,5% for me
cinder relic
nerfing bf by 2% seems
An overcorrection
jolly geyser
cause the devs are
gray summit
and 3,8% in ST
thorn parrot
NO ONE FUCKING PLAYS OUTLAW JUST LET IT BE GOOD FOR FUCKS SAKE
vivid vessel
@cinder relic drop a tweet no ? where the tweet
quaint wharf
waiting on the guy banger
rocky canopy
Yes bro pls drop a banger tweet
proven ocean
Brb sleep
mellow thicket
<@96834520417828864> drop a tweet no ? where the tweet
please
jolly geyser
brb he says
gray summit
they will add 4% in some few weeks
slim hare
Df was like work of me and zac when realz listened then the zac’s great crashout...
i know but since then nobody at blizzard did any good regarding outlaw how the fuck is that possible and not called ouut by guy solo and other i;portant voice in the space
vivid vessel
they will add 4% in some few weeks
without forgetting to bring down bf to 10% cleave
junior folio
im actually curious to see where this arbitrary number comes from, why 4%, why not 3% or 5%. last week they buffed by 4% and now another 4%. are they that scared to change the spec?
vivid vessel
in case it did too much
jolly geyser
ai
cinder relic
im actually curious to see where this arbitrary number comes from, why 4%, why n...
They aren't going to change a class in a patch like this
thorn parrot
The only reasoning I can see is they have some larger change coming that will actually buff outlaw to some degree. But that’s some ass backwards logic it feels like
cinder relic
It's just gonna be aura tuning
runic gulch
there has to be some transparent logic
logic lol, we're talking about devs that have heard how pissed we are about low refunds from new ace procs and having to press a builder inbetween and decided to fix it by making us invest an extra point to bring it to 4cp so we still have to press a builder anyway but now additionally will overcap cp by doing so
cinder relic
This is how they've balanced the game for over 10 years
runic gulch
they dont have a fucking clue
proven ocean
Ya they never change classes
gray summit
But that's no sense
frail veldt
im actually curious to see where this arbitrary number comes from, why 4%, why n...
they probably thought this was the correct number to keep our aoe close to the same
gray summit
Just put BTE 5 CP to be useful come on blizzard
vivid vessel
cant believe the best rogue spec got buffed in keys again tho
proven ocean
As rare as a legendary item being introduced
hazy temple
where can i see the full patch note you guys are linking?
vivid vessel
its like 5 seasons in a row they do that lol
wicked ether
Outlaw should get 1 Week every year where BF is uncapped, just for the feeling how it could be.
vivid vessel
actually funny
hardy vault
Assa best spec?
vivid vessel
in keys ye prolly
proven ocean
its like 5 seasons in a row they do that lol
i remember
gray summit
Assa is uncaped
thorn parrot
Outlaw should get 1 Week every year where BF is uncapped, just for the feeling h...
That would require blizzard to be based as hell
sullen wyvern
12% pvp buff tho guys, rank 1 incoming
gray summit
they buff it again
light kernel
Make a spell to uncap blade flurry for next 15s idk xd
proven ocean
50% more dps
gray summit
1% in ST when u cant play assa this tier xD
sonic pawn
Outlaw will probably never be uncapped again like BFA best thing you could hope for is a soft cap reduced after say 5 or 8 targets
mellow thicket
when was the last time rogue was a top raid dps?
junior folio
yeah but like it makes no sense, what their goal is. If they wanted the spec to land on a specific spot why not buff it by 8% or 12% straight up? is it that hard to use data to just tune specs? when will they be satified with doing 4% changes? it's kinda backhanded buffs
gray summit
imagine they are giving 1% buff assa in ST, when they are on the botton 4 of overall spec
proven ocean
when was the last time rogue was a top raid dps?
Dragonflight season 1 which lasted like a week or 2 and only pure st assa
Idk what else
gray summit
and they give us an aura buff
thorn parrot
We’re aura farming
gray summit
when we are capped in dungeon
proven ocean
Last expac idk
light kernel
Outlaw was good in m+ df s3 but aug neta
proven ocean
sin in amirdrassil was goated too
Not top
cinder relic
yeah but like it makes no sense, what their goal is. If they wanted the spec to ...
Because a lot of the time the game is actually more balanced than what wcl might indicate.
A lot of the times a spec will be bottom of the wcl page, get a 5% buff and then literally slingshot to the top because of sampling bias.
There are more external issues to rogue this raid than just raw tuning either way. I'm also not saying that this buff is going to do that lol
deep sequoia
amirdrassil rogue was goated in general
light kernel
Meta
stiff vector
ngl I think its just a raidlog and not give a shit type of season and play more OSRS with the spare time. Maybe next season they take their head out of their asses 
tiny dagger
man fuck the raid
frail veldt
so bladeflurry went from 36% to 33% which is a 8.33% nerf.
In 8 target patchwerk sim our bladeflurry(non active) damage is 59% of our total damage so 59% of our damage got reduced by 8.33%. This means in 8 target we lost 4.92% overall damage so with the 4% overall buff we are going down by 0.92%ish in 8 target
someone check my math please
proven ocean
It was just smolderon we dominated
cinder relic
Wouldn't it be a bigger buff in 9 targets cuz Br damage
wicked ether
Because a lot of the time the game is actually more balanced than what wcl might...
This take it to rational.
mellow thicket
someone ask realz wtf
frail veldt
Wouldn't it be a bigger buff in 9 targets cuz Br damage
yes
mellow thicket
hahahaha
daring yoke
Man fuck blizz. Why they being such a pussy trying to buff outlaw
cinder relic
This take it to rational.
Trying to be a bit grounded in these trying times
mellow thicket
is this also the last tunning pass before the .5 changes?
gray summit
so bladeflurry went from 36% to 33% which is a 8.33% nerf.
In 8 target patchwerk...
i agree with that
wicked ether
this whole tier is "fuck the melee"-raid design
frail veldt
Wouldn't it be a bigger buff in 9 targets cuz Br damage
in theory our bladeflurry % looks like this
as a function of target count
mellow thicket
this whole tier is "fuck the melee"-raid design
its always been
frail veldt
so at its worst its a 1% dps loss
at 8t
and on both sides of that
its less of a nerf and somewhat of a buff
harsh forge
In a couple more patches bladeflurry will start healing the enemies
frail veldt
its def unfort
vivid vessel
tf are we doing
mellow thicket
autism buff
proven ocean
I mean
cinder relic
this whole tier is "fuck the melee"-raid design
It's not exactly just raid design but yeah. This season is very great for casters of all kind. Specs like mm are so absurdly op
frail veldt
its a buff for stage 3/4 rolls I bet
cuz bladeflurry damage becomes lower percent
oh wait
i can do the breakpoint
1 sec
proven ocean
Its a buff as i said its just not a good way to buff rogue in such a small amount
jolly geyser
when isnt a season great for casters tbh
zinc briar
should we cancel sus?
fossil lintel
did they make inspecting people's gear impossible?
junior folio
just update blade flurry to "deals reduced damage beyond 5 targets" and i'm already happy
zinc briar
with motive of outlaw sux
frail veldt
its actually right around 58ish percent
zinc briar
gonna do it
frail veldt
where this becomes a buff
stiff vector
tf are we doing
nothing, thats the entire point. Do something for the optics of it, while actually doing a bunch of nothing and not fixing anything whatsoever. Big brain move by blizz tbh
vivid vessel
just update blade flurry to "deals reduced damage beyond 5 targets" and i'm alre...
that would beterrible bro
frail veldt
so if bladeflurry non active is less than 58% of your damage
then you are doing more damage
post changes
rich moon
all tiers benefit casters, playing caster is ez mode in many ways lol
frail veldt
quick mafs
tiny dagger
in an algathar season theyy are nerfing aoe
elder crane
Just saw the patch, does the 4% compensate the aoe nerf?
frail veldt
in an algathar season theyy are nerfing aoe
did you read what I said
junior folio
that would beterrible bro
i don't think so, because you would actually benefit from bigger pulls, the rest is tunning
frail veldt
it will be a buff above 8 target for sure
fickle stream
@vivid vessel btw we win dmg or lose
junior folio
even if damage is spread out
midnight granite
They are balancing is around jackpot like it's guaranteed
vivid vessel
i don't think so, because you would actually benefit from bigger pulls, the rest...
5 softcap is worse than 8 hard cap in 99% of scenarios
frail veldt
it will be a buff at 7 or below targets
midnight granite
vivid vessel
<@352916297262301194> btw we win dmg or lose
nothing happens
frail veldt
it is only a nerf at 8 targets explicitly
vivid vessel
i would have preffered to not get any tuning '
zinc briar
it is only a nerf at 8 targets explicitly
gl playing with pugs then
light kernel
Bring back old killing spree kekw
zinc briar
pulling slow
gray summit
1% assa ST. 3,8% rogue. We are so far.
elder crane
it is only a nerf at 8 targets explicitly
I mean we are not topping in those big pulls anyways
celest cobalt
gray summit
No sense
midnight granite
1% assa ST. 3,8% rogue. We are so far.
All percentiles
thorn parrot
We aren’t supposed to top, maybe I’m wrong in saying that with our current design?
tired rune
We can’t
gray summit
All percentiles <:OMEGAKEKW:829051106361344021>
even if i take 95%
runic gulch
Bring back old killing spree kekw
yeah that'd go hard on last boss of AA, get the blood pumping
mellow thicket
and they buffed ww, when we were below them
light kernel
yeah that'd go hard on last boss of AA, get the blood pumping
Best feeling ever ngl
proven ocean
1% assa ST. 3,8% rogue. We are so far.
All percentiles is bait
frail veldt
I mean we are not topping in those big pulls anyways
never were
wide coral
legit seing blade flurry nerfed makes you think what the fuck are they doing
proven ocean
99 only
frail veldt
gl playing with pugs then
this doesnt help or harm that
junior folio
you realise most sin rogues are legit just hitting the bosses
frail veldt
barking up the wrong tree
cinder relic
Just saw the patch, does the 4% compensate the aoe nerf?
Yes
mellow thicket
zeross stream where?
cinder relic
It's always a buff
proven ocean
zeross stream where?
Season 2 maybe
frail veldt
Just saw the patch, does the 4% compensate the aoe nerf?
1% nerf at 8 target, slight buff below 7 target and above like 10 target
proven ocean
Taking a break this season
junior folio
1% assa ST. 3,8% rogue. We are so far.
swap this to boss damage
gray summit
All percentiles is bait
mellow thicket
Season 2 maybe
ok maybe zac?!?
jolly geyser
zeross arent you sleeping?
junior folio
mate, swap to boss damage 😄
jolly geyser
same
cold falcon
you realise most sin rogues are legit just hitting the bosses
They dont have a choixe xd no burst on add swap on such a shit padding show of a raid
mellow thicket
but hey devourer is doing great!
daring yoke
Guys is there any secret scaling that i dont know with outlaw? We somewhat become op at 285ilvl or something? Fuck this shit stain buffs man fakkk
frail veldt
we arent exactly topping in m+
not sure why they felt the need
to nerf aoe
kinda sus
junior folio
tbf devourer was dog water in st, just pad monsters
cinder relic
tbf devourer was dog water in st, just pad monsters
This just isn't true
Idk where this "Devourer does bad st" propaganda started
But it's just not true
junior folio
warcraft logs shows it
frail veldt
people bad at devourer
cinder relic
It doesn't show it though
junior folio
and blizzard tunned in that favor as well
proven ocean
Idk where this "Devourer does bad st" propaganda started
Because the animations look like dev evoker and they think it does bad st too 
casuals
frail veldt
mate, swap to boss damage 😄
gray summit
i think the 4% aura buff is good for ST
frail veldt
sorry bro
gray summit
but i cant understand
cinder relic
This also is ignoring the fact that on the hard bosses, it's just good st
vivid vessel
Like why do ppl larp about devourer
DEVOUR MY BALLS BRO
cinder relic
Paladins, it's very good
proven ocean
As i said
limpid acorn
Like why do ppl larp about devourer
it was dead last during hc week
cinder relic
it was dead last during hc week
That's cuz ppl are noobs at it though
limpid acorn
ye
elder crane
kinda sus
I avoided playing outlaw since they are always at a weird spot, now i know how it feels to be an outlaw rogue
cinder relic
It's an stm spec. Even if it is "just press devour" it takes a bit of learning to get good at it yk
shadow trellis
Like why do ppl larp about devourer
Assa is so good 
proven ocean
People probably didnt even come close to its full potential yet
Takes time to fully perfectly play a new spec
me cant type brb sleep for good gn
junior folio
this was during heroic week, before we saw buffs to devourer single target, thats where all the "propaganda" started
vivid vessel
this was during heroic week, before we saw buffs to devourer single target, that...
all bosses
damage to boss
is litteral
fake
news
prolly the worse tier for it
gray summit
this week.
zinc briar
Pfff and i crafted the sword
gray summit
damage to bosses
zinc briar
Gl for me
gray summit
we are so low
cinder relic
prolly the worse tier for it
I mean the point still stands
Devourer st is like, average
vivid vessel
I mean the point still stands
wtf nerf devourer !
sonic pawn
The upcoming outlaw nerfs to AOE what % nerf is it ?
dark ember
god damn I have an arcane friend that fucking PUMMMMMPS the meter I don't even understand how
gray summit
this data destroy myself
dark ember
galaxy brain level output from them they refuse to frost
dark ember
Sounds like they were confident about 4% but not the Ace change.
inland acorn
It's actually funny
How trickster also caught stray
The hero tree* nobody is even bothering with
gray summit
go spam in dungeon research BTE 5 CP POINT
dark ember
The hero tree nobody is even bothering with
inland acorn
yes
cinder relic
The upcoming outlaw nerfs to AOE what % nerf is it ?
It's a buff at all target counts
inland acorn
that's what i meant xd
hollow thunder
just woke up did we just got 4% buff but outlaw so insane strong they had no other way then also nerfing our crazy overpowered aoe?
dark ember
just woke up did we just got 4% buff but outlaw so insane strong they had no oth...
not really a nerf to the aoe just ensure the aoe only gets a 2% total buff as apposed to every else's 4%
If everything deals 4% more damage,
and then AoE is nerfed 2%,
AoE is still buffed by 2% effectively
sonic pawn
@cinder relic so what like a 2% buff then roughly ?
hollow thunder
ima reroll devourer fuck this
dark ember
Depends - but we were certainly more fine in M+ than we were single target so this is a good & fair change.
inland acorn
We were ?
hollow thunder
yes, we can fight with monk tanks
dark ember
Anecdotally I guess but I competed with if not beat any of the meta damages in Keys, where as in my raid group I'm like #12/20 on boss fights.
cinder relic
<@96834520417828864> so what like a 2% buff then roughly ?
Depends on the target count yeah
tiny dagger
boutta start making my key titles like this guys
vivid vessel
frfr
keen belfry
boutta start making my key titles like this guys
ive seen bray in que before!
tiny dagger
yeah im in queue all day xddd
cinder relic
yes, we can fight with monk tanks
It's not that bad. And didn't brew get nerfed
reef plinth
Bruh why is this dogshit company nerfing rogues?
runic gulch
boutta start making my key titles like this guys
valid crashout
cinder relic
Bruh why is this dogshit company nerfing rogues?
They aren't rogue got buffed on all target counts
reef plinth
Blade flurry is getting a 1 less target cap and a 2% dmg nerf?
inland acorn
where are you getting target cap lol
cinder relic
So the spec got a 4% aura buff as well
reef plinth
Ope I read wrong
cinder relic
Blade flurry is getting a 1 less target cap and a 2% dmg nerf?
Also not less target cap lawl
tiny dagger
shoulda been 8 percent
runic gulch
shoulda been 8 percent
they'd probably remove BF altogether at that point
reef plinth
So blade flurry is getting a 1% buff?
inland acorn
they'd probably remove BF altogether at that point
wanna take a bet
wintry solar
Should've hit us with that big ol 20% and called it a day
inland acorn
How often this topic is being thrown around in the office probably ?
cinder relic
How often this topic is being thrown around in the office probably ?
Probably never
inland acorn
yep
uncut fulcrum
these patch notes have to be ragebait
cinder relic
So blade flurry is getting a 1% buff?
It depends on the target count but yeah, it's always more damage than before.
wintry solar
I get they talk about removing RB more than BF
uncut fulcrum
blizzard is intent on making sure the 14 people playing outlaw arent too strong
elder sonnet
correct me if im wrong, 2% from BF and 1% from intertwined = 3% BF nerf. but the 4% aura buff offsets it to a 1% buff?
reef plinth
I want assass to be good. I fucking despise subtlety, but I love outlaw and assass.
tiny dagger
with these buffs i might hit 300 k dps on algathar first pull !!!! im so exciteddddd
inland acorn
I just wish they gave us a tiny little bit more energy regen
gray summit
i think assa will be the best spec with sub
tropic zephyr
fr
runic gulch
blizzard is intent on making sure the 14 people playing outlaw arent too strong
yeah, they make it super approachable moving into midnight so people arent put off from trying it anymore and then tune it so terribly that it still has the same low player count it already had
eternal hound
boutta start making my key titles like this guys
ah yes
stiff vector
25% fatal flourish for 8 energy is terrible
eternal hound
Gotta love the crash out groups made out of pure spite
vivid vessel
guys
inland acorn
and never recovered after that
eternal hound
Keys do not want to be played by you thou
vivid vessel
btw guys
tropic zephyr
vivid vessel
have you noticed this change
dark ember
4️⃣
eternal hound
have you noticed this change
Yeah
vivid vessel
they are starting to realise everyone is playing with colored plates
and thazt maybe they need to accomodate for that by mkaing their mobs not completly random
eternal hound
it's cuz dks could MC it and keep it alive forever after their necromancer died
vivid vessel
maybe next tier we are able to have more colors than 3 types of mobs
eternal hound
Apparently
vivid vessel
nono
zinc briar
Imagine playing outlaw in paladins
eternal hound
maybe next tier we are able to have more colors than 3 types of mobs
BUT COLORED NAME PLATES ARE CHEATING!!!!!
vivid vessel
swear this is for nameplate colored
zinc briar
Wasting energy to bf
vivid vessel
cause nameplate colors look at if a mob has mana
red glacier
So who is now more disappointing in keys. Shadowp or outlaw?
vivid vessel
to determine if a mob is a caster
tropic zephyr
and thazt maybe they need to accomodate for that by mkaing their mobs not comple...
I love to click 1 pixel on my screen to select the hidden stacking nameplate to not brick my key
eternal hound
So who is now more disappointing in keys. Shadowp or outlaw?
Probally outlaw cuz of how raw we are from blizzard like evrey other melee
tropic zephyr
cinder relic
Wasting energy to bf
Did u reroll yet
wintry solar
vivid vessel
I love to click 1 pixel on my screen to select the hidden stacking nameplate to ...
swear plates are so bad this season
i need to fix it
idk how to
cinder relic
U can craft a dagger still
zinc briar
Im fcked
inland acorn
Thats a gkick
cinder relic
Or reroll entirely
cinder relic
Ur fine on crests either way.
harsh forge
imagine not trolling your raid team
cinder relic
Ull be behind a bit by its manageable
zinc briar
Said the one who thinks its a buff for outlaw with simple maths
dark ember
Wait you guys don't actually think BF is getting nerfed right
You're just kidding - you guys can do basic math right?
cinder relic
Said the one who thinks its a buff for outlaw with simple maths
What
fathom bramble
bf is nerfed at 8 targets
and nerfed at smaller amounts/buffed isntead at lower target coutns
zinc briar
So we are nerfed
tiny dagger
YEP
fathom bramble
bf in a vacuum is def nerfed at more target counts than just 8
tiny dagger
I count that as a nerf
frank finch
lol
fathom bramble
but our overall damage amount isn't something I care to math out/sim for rn
zinc briar
But buffed for then 1st pull of AA
cinder relic
bf in a vacuum is def nerfed at more target counts than just 8
Is it not less of a Nerf on 9 targets cuz Br damage
fathom bramble
Is it not less of a Nerf on 9 targets cuz Br damage
that is correct
vivid vessel
behind it
vivid vessel
like outlaw is somehow omega blasting aoe (worse rogue spec in aoe )
that it need to be adjusted
anytime we give a minuscule amount of st
fathom bramble
could write all the overrides and actually check properly later
but my raid started 20 mins after the notes so
vivid vessel
i could do it in 5min rn
frank finch
wait i hvent seen solo in a while
vivid vessel
but i thought solo went to do it 20 min ago
so i didnt
now its too late
cause maybe he is done doing it
so i cant do it anymore
gaunt phoenix
im busy
fathom bramble
you also have to assume what they mean by 4%
so there is more than 1 potential override
gaunt phoenix
yes
vivid vessel
you also have to assume what they mean by 4%
eh
zinc briar
Dont worry guys ill do It for u its simple
zinc briar
Outlaw = declined in m+
fathom bramble
probably
they said all damage
instead of ability and melee damage
so idk what their convention is
zinc briar
Benched in cleave bosses
tiny dagger
this entire season is cleave
random island
Outlaw = declined in m+
😂 No joke
zinc briar
With this giga buff we Will be the best in drakes Boss
Because we got a monster burst
inland acorn
Just wait for .5 patch
eternal hound
Outlaw = declined in m+
The only specs that aren't insta declined are meta specs
so
inland acorn
Where Ace is gettin buffed (kinda nerfed tho)
eternal hound
Please tell me why is ace is 2 points
icy cedar
are these patch notes even a buff what's the math here
fathom bramble
yes
zinc briar
are these patch notes even a buff what's the math here
Yes, for the first pull of AA
fathom bramble
slight buff to keystone overall, nerf at 8 targets, buff in raid
zinc briar
But dont even try to look at paladins Boss in raid
fathom bramble
precise numbers to be determined
eternal hound
Paladins isn't a real boss
zinc briar
Y got have problems trying to beat tanks on that fight
wintry solar
Try that sentence again
zinc briar
Yeah, with that 4% aura Buff outlaw will shine in real boss like u say
Imexile is changing to outlaw
Ull see
cinder relic
Sadly all 3 rogue specs would legit need an entire rebalancing of its toolkit to be usable on paladins tbf
Like u can't aura buff rogue to be playable on paladins rn
zinc briar
I think they are waiting to do the last Boss with 14 outlaws
cinder relic
Cuz like, all 3 rogue specs do good in dungeons, it's just low target cleave we suck at
zinc briar
For the world first
fathom bramble
cap all 3 rogue specs at 5 and then buff their aoe so much that it's still the same as it was at 8 🤔
low target fixed
what could go wrong
wintry solar
Huge
vivid vessel
ye what could go wrong
icy cedar
it's just bizarre because paladins is like the ideal Outlaw niche boss, like the Twin Ogron in WoD
vivid vessel
(outlaw dead in keys for the next 10 expacs)
inland acorn
They might actually do it
icy cedar
in theory
tacit pelican
The old talent where bf dealt more damage when hitting less targets would work for paladins
cinder relic
it's just bizarre because paladins is like the ideal Outlaw niche boss, like the...
Was*
No longer is
keen cedar
Cuz like, all 3 rogue specs do good in dungeons, it's just low target cleave we ...
You cant do "good" as pure dps class... you need to have one S tier spec
tacit pelican
Worked on soul hunters
reef plinth
I still don't understand why blizzard keeps some classes target capped? Would it be that hard to balance around outlaw being uncapped?
zinc briar
(outlaw dead in keys for the next 10 expacs)
Go triple outlaw to AA
bright lodge
So is it net aoe increase or decreasae?
cinder relic
You cant do "good" as pure dps class... you need to have one S tier spec
I'd say rogue is solid in dungeons rn idk
zinc briar
Lets blast the 1st pull
cinder relic
So is it net aoe increase or decreasae?
Nerf at 8 targets, buff on most others afaik
runic gulch
yeah, its funny because its basically the midnight version of soul hunters which was the one boss we actually shined on in manaforge