outlaw

[next wedge]

we all want to be gw2 thief spec

[lime lake]

real

[next wedge]

holy shit 5 mm hunters on liquid

[frail veldt]

is it just splits?

[craggy barn]

this is prog

lol

[frail veldt]

damn lol

[craggy barn]

they only split chimerus

[eternal hound]

Okay keys

are tilt city

Dude this shit is so easy

Why can't any pugs do crap

[radiant wyvern]

bricked 3 algethars to the pug terrorism trying to get my last key for resil

[eternal hound]

Dude I can't get even get to a FUCKING 10

because pugs are SO ASS *also because of a game freeze midway through a Misara that shit sucked

Like

[fossil lintel]

run your own key, although i was probably lucky to do it on day 1

[eternal hound]

Dude

I have done NOTHNING

But my own key

I can't trust literally anyone

Apparently I need to just get hard carried I'm gonna crash out so damn hard

[fossil lintel]

just vet people before inviting?

[eternal hound]

I have

Apparently I need their first born child and SSS number to varifey they are actual humans holy fuck

[fossil lintel]

i have yet to fail my own key

heck, i had a power outage in the middle of my pos 6 (during second boss), came back 2 hours later to see they +2'ed it without me

[gaunt phoenix]

That doesn't change their experience

[eternal hound]

At this point

Noone without 3k+ experience is getting invited

I'm being toxic

[low gazelle]

Any rough idea of how good the withered saptor paw and the fiber of living agony are? i dont see them on any of the trinket lists after finding them both at heroic in delves.

[fossil lintel]

io is a terrible metric to vet people in keys unfortunately

[eternal hound]

So I need logs

wonderful

[fossil lintel]

that's what i do, wcl addon, right click copy wlc url, check them real quick, takes 10s

[eternal hound]

All I have is the shitters left

[fossil lintel]

what level is your key?

[eternal hound]

7 lmao

[tulip warren]

I think I looked for people for 3hours yesterday for my own key 🙃 can't even make it higher than a 2 xD

[next wedge]

i feel so washed

i just did 60k overall in a dungeon

[long depot]

sh unc I js started wow and I am doing ah

[next wedge]

that is indecipherable to me

okay well my dslice sim is 68k so i feel less bad

[river maple]

are the ring set from nexus any good ?

[fathom bramble]

too much matery

[plucky wasp]

want to play outlaw, but tuning seems pretty shit and tending to craft dagger for sub : - (

[next wedge]

ok

[hollow bloom]

Can’t have the black sheep of the fam have any fun at all.

[fathom bramble]

who knows

[wintry leaf]

My rogue implodes from DMG compared to my other chard

[river wing]

real

[sullen walrus]

good or bad?

[sullen walrus]

windrunner spire +10

[sturdy tartan]

How the hell are people pulling that kind of dps

Maybe I’m just too old to play now

[hasty warren]

Hi pitates

[mellow dagger]

You have double, no loaded dice, ar not coming up soon, do you rtb?

[craggy barn]

no

u only ever reroll off of single

[mellow dagger]

Ok thanks

Wait even double with loaded dice you don't roll or...?

[craggy barn]

yea u dont reroll off of 2+

if loaded is about to fall off u can reroll tho

[mellow dagger]

Ok thanks

[craggy barn]

infact, u KIR 2+, with a minor optimization if 2 with loaded dice

[vivid vessel]

Guys I went to sleep and apparently liquid killed every boss

What happened

[unique fulcrum]

They stacked outlaw

giga cheatcode

[olive star]

4 outlaws bro u missed it

[vivid vessel]

Bro..

Was there even a rogue

[topaz spoke]

!up

[ornate heath]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1486352553166901328/drops.png

[junior heart]

dont think so

[unique fulcrum]

i think they had like 5 mm hunters for every boss

on each boss-*

[vivid vessel]

Bro what are these comps ..

Time to 20% aura buff rogue guys it's so over

[quaint wharf]

bro i thought my screen was cracked from the line on bottom right

[cinder relic]

There is gonna be a balnce patch on the next raid open

Rogue about to go thanos mode on alleria + new raid with another 5% trust

[vivid vessel]

bro ..

[rocky canopy]

ive come to the same conclusion

rogue is in a prime state rn

like you want to look dogshit and be sat before the final balnce patches

[vivid forge]

Tbh Liquid bringing rogue only on vorasius feels so sad

[hollow temple]

bro !!

[rich smelt]

hey is there a macro for tricks of the trade to target group leader

[weary fog]

https://www.curseforge.com/wow/addons/tankmd i use this

[zenith sparrow]

so is outlaw just cooked season 1?

[sturdy crow]

DF yes

TWW yes

MN yes

LT yes

[hollow creek]

!log

[proven ocean]

zac..

first thing i see when open stream..

[hollow temple]

outlaw stronj

[vivid vessel]

??

[proven ocean]

dont ? me

ur top dps

@cinder relic defend ur claims..outlaw top dps what happening

why ppl tell me outlaw bad..

me confuse..

[fathom bramble]

These are easy low keys

[proven ocean]

idk what thats supposed to mean

[fathom bramble]

Law was always at least pretty good at these

[proven ocean]

its not like the feral is bad at the game

[fathom bramble]

Title keys with people having proper gear are probably very diff

[proven ocean]

outlaw always dominated in high keys

in s2

cd specs dont matter in these comps

only in caster comps

unless they're able to pull big it wont matter

i mean it just sucks that its only decent in m+ tho

and its like one of the very worst in raid

honestly i also dont trust the r1 all stars w.e

doesn't mean they know how to dps m+

dpsing m+ is harder than raid

perfectly that is

[vivid vessel]

i dont trust people that dont haev r1 on every slot

[fathom bramble]

I’m just saying I don’t think day 2 easy keys are necessarily representative of how good law will be for title keys or other actual push keys

[proven ocean]

ye true

i mean

[fathom bramble]

But we are giga for farming 3/6 hero items rn

[proven ocean]

if ur good enough u can get r1 on almost all bosses

except the ones ur gated by ur guild

i think in undermine i had r1 on all bosses except 2 on assa

3 of them were private i think

and like everyone played assa

[proven ocean]

those 2 were prob rng or couldn't get them because of the guild

forgot

[fallen zodiac]

not on CDM?

do i need to track this?

[vivid vessel]

no

[fallen zodiac]

do i need to have BR ready so i can use it into ADR into pistol shot now?

[fathom bramble]

You can safely ignore it

BR on cd and pretend we don’t have a tierset

[proven ocean]

i've always been a fan of tracking those buffs personally

but thats super advanced anyway

i dont know if outlaw has some bigger hits that u sometimes delay

[fathom bramble]

Well cdm can’t track it

[proven ocean]

and instead send on that 5% window

but idk

i dont play wow so idk

[fathom bramble]

I don’t think addons can either

[proven ocean]

weird

[vivid vessel]

bro doesnt knwo

[fathom bramble]

It’s just 7 seconds and you know when it will be active from casting br so

[sterile dune]

Play audacity build or else im coming in through ur window

[fathom bramble]

Can you make custom auras of it?

[vivid vessel]

ye i did already

[fathom bramble]

I just assume anything not on cdm is not allowed

[vivid vessel]

since it comes from vasting br you can just show something for x second after spell cast

[proven ocean]

zac

[vivid vessel]

ross

[fathom bramble]

I see

[proven ocean]

do u think we'll see more of the chinese tech

the ones where they highlight mechanics

[gleaming reef]

Outlaw 5% buff again?

[proven ocean]

u remmeber them

or

[vivid vessel]

i mena its jsut overlasy

[proven ocean]

ye but

[vivid vessel]

overlays will alawys exist

[proven ocean]

its crazier than WAs

idk

[fathom bramble]

That is the same buff just also put on the ptr now

[proven ocean]

i wonder if they'll use it again

[sterile dune]

Thats not 5% tho

[vivid vessel]

it is

[proven ocean]

is it public anyway

[vivid vessel]

prolly no

[sterile dune]

34->39% is not a 5% buff

[gleaming reef]

But we got 4% not 5

This is 5% no?

[proven ocean]

the advantage is so big im confused why blizzard hasn't banned them for cheating

because it was blatant cheating even with WAs lol

actually craziest tech in wow

[sterile dune]

Its 4% budd

[proven ocean]

not even close

[sterile dune]

Buff

Or to be precise its

1.03731343284

So 3.73% buff

Cuz thats how much 139/134 is

[vivid vessel]

sub one is 2.7 also

[fathom bramble]

They often do different numbers to account for the current size of aura to get near the correct relative gain

[proven ocean]

correct % is irrelevant anyway

[fathom bramble]

In this case adding 5% to the current one is the closest to 4%

[proven ocean]

its just for nerd people to fill their ocd needs idk

[gleaming reef]

Ah ok

Sad.

[sterile dune]

We knew that

[gleaming reef]

I think we need another buff…

[proven ocean]

blizzard always balanced around wcl or whatever metric they want to use anyway

[sterile dune]

We just explaining to the ones who didnt go math in school

[proven ocean]

'not like

modifiers that are talents

those are usually whatever

[sterile dune]

Maybe easier for non-game designers

To just tweak a var

Than different spells

[proven ocean]

who are u talking to lol

[fathom bramble]

I’m just replying to a ping not talking to you or anyone else explaining it necessarily

[gleaming reef]

Yeah it’s additive not multiplicative

That’s why

I was just asking if it’s another buff in ptr basically

[sterile dune]

Anyone who is listening to this and doesnt get it

U’d be surprised

[proven ocean]

ye u didnt have to add the math school part lmao

[sterile dune]

I know I’m just memeing at this point?

[hasty warren]

Hi pirates

[proven ocean]

🧢

[noble moon]

coward

commit

[elder sonnet]

how we feeling post our 4% outlaw bro's?

[thorny ice]

ah, buff is online today?

[sterile dune]

Wasnt buff online since reset yday?

[nova blaze]

i just read somewhere that trickster is getting a change with dealing additional damage with ss and ambush without cooldown. Is that true? i hope its not fake i want ho build back

[vivid vessel]

wjhy you aint linking details now

[river wing]

well I got my outlaw purples yesterday
still losing hard to one other good player we have on WW monk

[gloomy adder]

Guys I’m simming higher with trickster build than fatebound what’s going on here

Fake news?

[wintry leaf]

How do I not so be so dang squishy?

[noble moon]

press feint sometimes

[proven ocean]

cuz i linked when i opened ur stream

[unkempt dew]

So Blizz will buff us right?

Right?

[river wing]

maybe, maybe not
maybe they enjoy watching us go "but, but, the boss damage on 5/7 isn't bad, sure you can't notice it behind all the padding, but it's not bad"

[gloomy adder]

Can someone with more knowledge than me give an opinion on this, I thought trick was supposed to be just flat worse than fate

Sim was just patchwerk with all buffs

But not PI**

[sterile dune]

Gonna have to look at thia when im home

[gloomy adder]

I am statted heavily into crit as well, currently still using crucible, and solar flare prism,
and janalai enchants on weapons if that helps

[sterile dune]

Crucible goated tho, its keeping up with the druma trinket, the one that gives like 300 crit for 12 sec

Drum*

Ontop of giving like leech and mov speed

Which sims doesnt factor in

Havinf extra leech during dmg buff from the trinket itseld givea u ton of healing

Its definately A tier trinket

I think the plume beats it

And alsneer

[static crescent]

Spammed m+ yday, was ok dmg, except AA

Holy fuck i got annihilated

Like 50% gap to frost mage and boomer

Dafuq

And that Crucible trinket, do i need to do something to it for it to be good?

Like shit at zones or what

[sterile dune]

U need to upgrade it to 6/6 and get the uncontrolled contamination tokens

And use them to upgrade the trinket

[static crescent]

Zzzz

[obtuse brook]

do any vendors sell them, if we misplaced them?

[sterile dune]

No

[obtuse brook]

the trinket, that is. I may have gotten rid of it in favor of other things before learning how good it was

[obtuse brook]

sad

[sterile dune]

U have to obtain it frim doing shit in voidstorm

Like the times defense event that happens in voidstorm

Can give it

Timed*

Its once every 10 min

[obtuse brook]

oh alright. I got it from the rep or quest or whatever, didnt know it dropped elsewhere

thanks then, ill get on that

[grim spear]

!addon

!ui

[ornate heath]

Resources:

• ArcUI / BetterCDM - common suites for buff/cd customization
• WangBar - displays CPs/energy, customize colors per point, faster than Sensei
• MSUF - recommendation for unit frames
• Platynator - recommendation for nameplates (Jundies Profile)
  Misc:
• Clickable Raid Buffs - for poisons
• WilduTools - random QoL like melee range indicator, track cursor
• Mute Cold Blood sound - if we ever go back to this talent

[worldly shale]

Ok my guild is forcing me to switch to sub

[gaunt phoenix]

The world is heartless and cruel

[worldly shale]

Yes

[vapid salmon]

Switch guild instead

Stonks

[digital oracle]

Where did you read this? I'd be very happy with this!

[serene urchin]

!sims

[ornate heath]

Simulations:
Bloodmallet: https://bloodmallet.com/index.html

[indigo token]

so after playing more M+

why did they remove our aoe stop

[river wing]

nobody knows
even they don't because they'll be bringing it back but like, in two months

like there's no logical pathway to removing our only AoE CC

[static crescent]

Too much dps to have utility 🙂

And apparently no rogues in world firsts

Guess our poison isnt too strong XD

[vague cape]

isn't it coming back?

.5 i think (too late imo) but it is returning

[indigo token]

i know that

[mighty pivot]

they never said why they removed it

[indigo token]

but why remove it in the first place if similar pruning of AOE stops didnt happen with other classes

[elder sonnet]

@vivid vessel love your playlist

[inland acorn]

Don't forget it was a hotfix

[vague cape]

in that case my answer is I genuinely think blizzard doesn't care much about rogue, it's felt that way for a while too

no way anyone internally tested this class

I can't believe it, with how much bs ends up happening

[inland acorn]

Wdym test

They have no QA

We're testers man

[vague cape]

[inland acorn]

Like

We now have recraft bug which can yoink your crests

[vague cape]

like did anyone actually try playing HO when removing the vanish cdr from restless?

[wooden pilot]

the note “rogues complained that they didn’t have an aoe stop” like uh…duh??

[vague cape]

they're trolling

I swear to fucking god they're trolling us on repeat

[inland acorn]

I mean HO is dead without cdr on vanish

[vague cape]

this deathstalker change proves it, we've been BEGGING to not have it be a debuff mark type shit

[inland acorn]

2nd charge of vanish is also

Question mark

[vague cape]

yes, anyone who played the spec for more than 20 minutes knows. which is exactly my point

who the fuck thought this talent tree is okay to ship

with entirely non option nodes at capstone?

[inland acorn]

Shareholders

Probably

[vague cape]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cat-crazy-crazy-cat-insane-cat-going-insane-gif-5752628082217795406

either way it's just a continued thing, sin spamming CT instead of spending points, sub shadowstrike / trinket interactions with sd being delayed

clearly they dgaf

no way none of the devs ever tested sub, pressed dance into strike bind too fast and had it cast backstab instead

there's just bs with the class every tier forever

honestly I think if I can bait a guildie to play rogue I'll hop ship

it's been enough years now, since SL

[inland acorn]

Aint nobody wants to play rogue man

And population size keeps shrinking

[vague cape]

also outlaw remains a non starter for raid

I got to play it for alleria hc last reset but thats probably the first and last time I'll get to play it til reclear. it's just shit

[inland acorn]

I think it's mostly ok

Except alleria

Would sub be better ?

Probably

[vague cape]

tbh with you it's not like make the boss impossible

we're 1/14 dps

but it begs the question, why does it need to work so hard for such little dmg

[mighty pivot]

paladins is also a bad fight

[vague cape]

I still remember exile and daizr trying to play it on soul hunters

[inland acorn]

I think paladins is shit because deft just sucks so much energy

for little cps gain

[vague cape]

you guys remember that? litteral rwf players couldn't manage

[inland acorn]

but deft still ends up somehow positive gain for paladins

[mighty pivot]

it's shit because low target cleave isn't good anymore

[vague cape]

it's not a headache to play anymore, yet it begs the question - why is this arguably the most consistently punishing spec ingame and why can't it be tuned to reward the challenge

[inland acorn]

Because

We're still paying for sins of BfA outlaw

Triple outlaw comp

[vague cape]

I personally find outlaw the most fun of the three rogue specs, and have done for a while

I don't get to play it in raid if Im being real

I don't have the hours on it and I won't ever get them either since it's just worse

my rl explicitly banned me from playing it after it wiped us on gally reclear xd

[inland acorn]

[vague cape]

rip ks

[inland acorn]

I mean anyone who played outlaw for more than 1 season knows what you said idk what to tell you man

Devs will do what they want

As famously certain person at Blizzard said

They know better than players

You can look at most of aspects of the game and see the same philosophy

like with pruning WA and addons

[indigo token]

IF thats even the case, what do they know that we dont

[inland acorn]

And now we're just slowly walking back on it

But game is still worse

Were WAs issue ? Sure

Did we need to brick half of the game for it ? Probably not lol

[vague cape]

as far as im concerned they failed

I still have to go get a bunch of addons to raid

my guild requires stuff like northern sky raid tools / bigwigs and all this other shit

[inland acorn]

I mean all we did is replace 1-2 WA package

with +7 addons

And then still some stuff is just cringe and shit

With secret values and stuff

Like sometimes when you hover on someones dps during any pull you can't even see their breakdown

Because of secret

Like

Basic stuff broken for no reason

idk

[loud blaze]

interesting, worse based on what metric? I'm having a lot more fun than I ave in years. Other than other classes doing more damage by default that it...still I'm having fun

[indigo token]

the base ui still sucks, and the bugs have been way worse than usual

[vague cape]

the game is fun as usual, I would say for me the class design atm is a step down for sure

from tww

they're less fun to play

[indigo token]

i agree

frost mage, of my mains, got hit the worst

its unplayable for me now

[inland acorn]

-base ui is shit
-i can't really tell from details what happend during my death now I need to upload log to external site to do it
-Why sometimes I cant inspect dmg breakdown during pull, due to secret values
Item/Spell Ids stop working after doing dungeon
-Visual clarity with mechanics is as usual bad (not on all bosses, but like alleria P2-P3 for example is just bad)
-Overall design of classes/specs is just boring, we've removed a lot of complexity which is not bad thing, but think we went just too far and now most just seem boring

[loud blaze]

Which class? Genuinely interested because so far im loving the outlaw updates and sub changes. I basically only play rogue so I don’t have much to compare to others.

[digital oracle]

I actually play with HO. But I'm not really into raids and M+ and stuff like that. It's mostly solo stuff that I like to do so maybe this doesn't really count. I use audacity as well

[loud blaze]

The details thing is the most bothersome to me.
I’m curious about the UI issue. What would you rather see?

[inland acorn]

Also debuff tracking is still just plainly bad for healers

[vague cape]

I would argue for me sub atm is an upgrade but they went too far in simplification, for me all it needed was them to get rid of some of the frustrating optimisations like very gcd sensitive symbols, cold blood, dance etc - they would have left flawless form uncapped

outlaw is largely similar but I do actually miss crackshot, I enjoyed it since df s3 beta where I tested it

[indigo token]

i miss crackshot too

[vague cape]

sin atm in aoe has less frustration but also so much less expression

no more decisions to be made

[indigo token]

and UHUH, i know it was awful and bad to play around

but it was fun man

[inland acorn]

I can get over UHUH, but like please

Give me something to preserve duration of BF

Pressing BF in low target cleave is just painful

on cd

[vague cape]

anyways I'd say outlaw preserved the best from expac to expac rework wise

[mystic berry]

sub is like, abysmal design, buff up, 1 and 2, 1 and 2, 1 and 2, its so ass man

[vague cape]

it's the most fun

[vague cape]

true, sub before was miserable in a different way

[mystic berry]

I would sooner reroll to arms than play sub fr

[vague cape]

you lived and died by cd window

if ANYTHING went wrong

gg

to the point that we'd afk to keep coup / stack sht before cds

they solved that kinda bs

but they oversimplified it

[loud blaze]

Crack shot was fun, but it was far too punishing if you didn’t get resets. I would like for the spec to work without good RNG and when you do get good luck it feels better.

[glass mortar]

You didn't need good rng for crackshot to work

[indigo token]

we're like, halfway there with the new RTB

[vague cape]

don't get me wrong, I still love rogue, it's just not as good as it was in the past, since imo tww s3 actually was a downgrade compared to earlier seasons gameplay wise

[indigo token]

but it still feels easy to enter an energy drought, and the new BTE doesnt feel all that good

[vague cape]

the killing spree change was good, but doubling the cd wasn't

[glass mortar]

The new law has identical variance to crackshot law

[vague cape]

it slowed the cadence of the spec + s2 tierset was insanely fun

less unseen blade, less coup, less cdr

well, less guaranteed unseen blade (not a fan of the x chance to apply 2 stacks, I like things that are predictable / within our control)

[glass mortar]

Both laws need average rng to function properly and ive been energy starved far more often as new law then I was as old regardless of my play

[loud blaze]

We all know the true problem, it happened when they reduced the extended range for outlaw melee…

[glass mortar]

And new law is way easier to play so what r u gunna do

They want getting meh rng to punish ur gameplay for w.e reason

Outlaw staple

[vague cape]

new law reminds me a ton of s1 df

[glass mortar]

I mean it mostly is

[vague cape]

before the rework / before they nerfed cp gen

[glass mortar]

New law is basically just crackshots filler

[vague cape]

you'd ambush > finish > ps > finish repeat kinda thing

kinda works out like that atm on fatebound since ps gives 4, you have 1-2 from ruthlessness so you can reliable ps > dispatch

bte needs a little more cp so it does have some thinking

[loud blaze]

I just hated with outlaw before that if you had any downtime from the boss it screwed the flow.

[glass mortar]

I mean downtime still destroys u but a but less I guess

If u didn't time ar for after it and ur starting with a naked rtb roll and get 1 buff it's just as bad imo

If not worse

[loud blaze]

If we had higher base damage tuning would we still be annoyed. Like if we were in the top 5 of the charts based on tuning alone.

[inland acorn]

base ui doesn't let you center cdm, doesn't show potion / racial / trinket cds, buff/debuff clarity is abyssmal, can't really filter which buffs/debuffs shows (both on frames and just as icons for yourself, unless they changed it ?).

There's probably more, but I think those are like biggest pains

[loud blaze]

I’m trying to figure out the potion/racial/trinket problem first…is it that you want them to all be grouped in a certain spot?

[glass mortar]

Yes

[inland acorn]

Yes, something like this, which I don't believe is possible with base ui

[patent totem]

!wa

[ornate heath]

Resources:

• ArcUI / BetterCDM - common suites for buff/cd customization
• WangBar - displays CPs/energy, customize colors per point, faster than Sensei
• MSUF - recommendation for unit frames
• Platynator - recommendation for nameplates (Jundies Profile)
  Misc:
• Clickable Raid Buffs - for poisons
• WilduTools - random QoL like melee range indicator, track cursor
• Mute Cold Blood sound - if we ever go back to this talent

[inland acorn]

I think the closest you could get to something like that is by putting pots/trinkets into separate actionbars and just position actionbars wherever, but if you wanted to change size of that...

Well that would require addon

Or toying with convars

Which is again going extra mile

Think simply letting us track some extra stuff in cdm would solve that though

Like potions trinkets etc.

[loud blaze]

I means thats what I did. Took a while of clicking around but I also made bars to track certai buffs. WA was definitely easier because you could just download what other people made.

[vague cape]

fellowship did it well tbh

the ui / customisability and all

[loud blaze]

I may go see if there’s something similar to this later when I can get online.

[vague cape]

few binds yet retained complexity in gameplay

[inland acorn]

Oh and also

Tracking cds and interrupts

Should be in base ui

There's 0 reason for not letting me see kicks of my pug group

[loud blaze]

How did kick tracking work before? I mean technically, how was that coded?

[inland acorn]

I mean I'm not in need of that since I have my ui setup now, but again base ui is lacking tools or making you do gymnastics for something that could be easly solved

[inland acorn]

I'm not sure on that, there were weakauras and addons doing it, think it might've been reading combat log which is now forbidden i think ? I might be wrong on that

[loud blaze]

Right. I’m trying to figure out why the game is worse when so much of it seems better. Probably my perspective is my computer could never really run high graphics and have a lot of add one so I only used bare minimum stuff.

Like I used some weak auras to track things, and I used details to check damage/deaths. however some people I played with tracked Everything.

[inland acorn]

Well it will always be like that some people will find it worse, some better. Depending on what you're used to and what you want/need

[grim spear]

Is there any tooltip addon that works right now?

[inland acorn]

I just find it weird, that it seems Blizzard went extra mile to hide so much information from players.
Was it competitive advantage ? Idk probably, but it was still mostly optional

[grim spear]

Something that can show a player’s item level when you mouse over them?

[inland acorn]

Idk if there's any tooltip addon that can see ilvl on just mouseover

[sinful dagger]

Itemlvlnameplate addon

[inland acorn]

That's when targeting someone though

Idk if its possible for tooltips to fetch ilvl data

[grim spear]

There used to be quite a few

but they all throw errors in keys

[inland acorn]

Ye, kinda expected

Instance zones are like mega protected

[grim spear]

[loud blaze]

Are they trying to move more toward a FFXIV model? Where no one is expected to use add ons but people also aren’t expected to only play that game?

[inland acorn]

I doubt, at this point addons are way too big part of WoW

and have been since very long time

[indigo token]

honestly

we should have had a season 4

[loud blaze]

True, but Theres the fine line between having the add ons add to the game and having them required to play for you.

[inland acorn]

Yes, they're trying to tackle the latter

But if you watch RWF you can see that a lot of is still possible

Its just matter of having people code stuff for you

[loud blaze]

I mean they have entire teams of support and data analysts etc to give them the edge. It’s crazy.

[gloomy adder]

Am I using raidbots wrong or why does our sims have scuffed supercharged snd openers

In st

[inland acorn]

What do you mean ? Can you link the sim

[glass mortar]

SnD does not consume supercharger so even if you see that its not doing what u think

but thats the aoe apl opener its possible it leaked over to st

shouldnt matter much

[gloomy adder]

In the sample ability log, one second it’s on my work pc so need to hand type it

[gloomy adder]

Ah good to learn cheers

[inland acorn]

What Weran said

[glass mortar]

opener optimizations barely matter honestly

the biggest thing is like, the kir prep opener

[inland acorn]

Yep

[glass mortar]

and not misuing KiR if ur gunna be prepping in the opener

everything else is pretty low impact

[inland acorn]

you mean not sending KiR if at stage 2, when you know you'll prep in next ~10 seconds ?

[gloomy adder]

raidbots.com/simbot/report/mhfWcJ51CpT7zEjCoR9sX3

[glass mortar]

yup basically exactly that

[inland acorn]

Ye thought so

Also I assume its worth to KiR stage 3 and above even with prep

[gloomy adder]

My concern is (not in this particular simulation) I’m trying to sim trickster with killing spree and I think opener optimisation actually will matter a lot with KS

Especially because I’m finding using prep as well sims higher

[glass mortar]

not sure how optimized trickster apl is for things like this

cause its not recommended... anywhere rn

could always ask @gaunt phoenix about it

seems weird the aoe opener is leaking over to st unless thats just the default apl opener now

[inland acorn]

think it might be just default

But doubt its making any big impacts

[winged zinc]

is there a channel where I can check logs?

[gloomy adder]

Sample log isn’t using blade rush until 20secs in as well

[mystic berry]

Oh shit its already thursday

[glass mortar]

well u probably dont have 4set

[mystic berry]

Buffs tomorrow for certain

[gloomy adder]

I’m suspicious of how raidbots is handling outlaw right now but then I don’t fully understand how it works so might be talking shite anyway

[glass mortar]

so its following the dont BR if you would overcap energy rule

[gloomy adder]

I don’t yeah

[glass mortar]

and the sample ur looking at was just flooding with energy for the first 20s

it can happen

[inland acorn]

it's still weird tho

that it send prep at 4 seconds

[mystic berry]

people here maintain the apl, I would say its quite good

[glass mortar]

is it?

[gloomy adder]

It also uses prep before blade rush so

Doesn’t seem correct to me

[glass mortar]

if u read the rules in FaQ prep only cares about blade rush in aoe

[inland acorn]

and BtE too

Cant tell in sim if bte went on cd

maybe it did and then it prepped

[glass mortar]

well it should care about BtE and AR in st

so bte probably went onto cd

[inland acorn]

ye probably

[gloomy adder]

Well apologies if this is more a question for sims channels but why doesn’t it care about blade rush in st

[inland acorn]

blade rush without tier set is mostly for energy

[gloomy adder]

It’s never not a good cooldown to use even if some energy is wasted

[inland acorn]

and aoe

[glass mortar]

because its not a valuable enough button in ST in the opener to care about resetting

uh

i mean yes, the current apl literally does not cast BR if you would overcap energy during the gcd

its a dps loss to do so, so its technically not a good button to press if ur wasting energy with it

its not awful tho

many of us do it since thats gunna be the rule with tier anyway

[inland acorn]

its mostly trying to be considerate of energy

[severe fractal]

guys, a question. When i'm supposed to press Prep? Like immediately after adr, bte and blade rush? in a singleT situation

[gloomy adder]

It does a lot of damage and if you use builder immediately after it then it’s always generating some energy

Is my understanding

[inland acorn]

not in ST

[gloomy adder]

Could be wrong

[glass mortar]

it does ok damage

doesnt generate or consume any CP or have any interactions with the kit

and it generates energy which u dont wanna waste

thats about it

i doubt its a big loss to just press on cd

we r probably talking about like a 0.5% optimization here so

but the apl is gunna do what it was written to do

[inland acorn]

When ADR bte and BR are on cd

If it's like raid ST opener, you can wait with prep after your ADR wears off

[gloomy adder]

In my experience it is impossible to go out of energy before restless blades or prep puts it off cooldown again so wasted energy regen on the first one really doesn’t matter

[inland acorn]

as long as adr bte and br are on cd

[glass mortar]

but it does

[jolly geyser]

Have they said any fix about the recraft bug?

[glass mortar]

its not a button that does enough damage to be worth pressing if the energy it generated went to waste

[grim spear]

What addons are you guys using to track trinkets?

[glass mortar]

even if u miss a whole usage

thats basically what the apl rule is telling you

[inland acorn]

No

Recraft* at your own risk

[jolly geyser]

fuck sake

[mystic berry]

small indie company

[glass mortar]

(in ST of course, in aoe its prio goes up and prep cares about it)

[inland acorn]

ayije CDM

[grim spear]

Someone said it might be due to some unknown reason (very likely some addons) causing the orders being sent to be incorrect, and Blizzard isn’t validating them.

[gloomy adder]

I guess without tier set it does less damage than dispatch on average

[grim spear]

So on the crafter’s side, the orders show up like this, and if you complete one, it just eats your crest.

[glass mortar]

u cant just look at its damage either

every other ability we press is doing something for our cdr loop

[gloomy adder]

40k damage for free seems good to me

[glass mortar]

either generating CP to spend for ability cdr

well the free is irrelevant if ur overcapping energy and its gen was useless right?

all that matters is the damage

and that it does not contribute to generating CDR to further the rest of the rotation (either giving CP to spend or spending those CP)

it only delays generating more cdr

[inland acorn]

Thats... still on Blizzard for not validating

[gloomy adder]

I get what you mean yeah

[glass mortar]

it feels wrong

[gloomy adder]

But surely cdr generation doesn’t matter much if you’re about to prep

[inland acorn]

It does for KiR for example

[glass mortar]

sure in that moment it matters less. it also doesnt generate coins or gravedigger stacks or contribute in any meaningful way to all the parts of our kit that proc off spending CP or generating it

all it does is raw damage and energy. so if you remove the energy value from the equation its worth less then its raw damage

and all of these things we are discussing are completely irrelevant as soon as u get tier or ur in aoe so

[river wing]

another stupid idea for a better mastery that seems workable: +% effectiveness on Restless Blades, RtB 3 with DBD is just +30% mast basically

[glass mortar]

like i said, despite how much im downselling it i dont believe its a big or particularly noticable loss to BR on cd, including in the opener

many of us do it regardless of tier

it feels bad to not press

im just explaining why that ended up the apl rule

[gloomy adder]

Yeah the point of the discussion is working out why the apl did what it did though so I don’t think it was pointless

[inland acorn]

It ended up the apl rule

Because solo put it there

[glass mortar]

it simmed the best so it ended up the apl rule

[gloomy adder]

I managed to waste 30min time at work on this discussion so definitely not pointless for me

:-DD

[inland acorn]

30 minutes well spent

That's 30 minutes less of work to be done

[noble moon]

i dont want a new mastery if we get a new mastery we might start running around with puzzle box

[mystic berry]

Would we drop haste over mastery?

[river wing]

might be, altho I think the ADR hidden interaction might force a haste softcap anyway

[glass mortar]

current law needs haste for energy and the gcd

so if anything was replaced it would probably be crit

[river wing]

that is a real downside, I agree

[noble moon]

we can get a new mastery next season

[gloomy adder]

I think this would result in some weird mastery breakpointing that would be a headache

[sacred panther]

Hey hey, quick question: I crafted Spellbreakers Blade with the embellishment and am now thinking about what to craft with my remaining sparks. Leaning towards the masterwork Sin'dorei Band, but unsure if a crafted OH-Dagger with the (better) embellishment would be a wiser choice?

[mystic berry]

chilling

[jolly geyser]

gamba crafted all max rank ingredients and sent on max quality

got sword

[river wing]

OH is the worst slot

[loud blaze]

I think the 12.0.5 changes are going to help, but we need just a straight buff to get in line with other specs.

AND our extended range back.

[gloomy adder]

I think it would be cool if mastery instead of altering main gauche damage altered its proc rate + a proc would apply a restless blade

[timid idol]

tf even are 05 changes except for aoe blind again

[sacred panther]

So basically either ring or boots? I'd go for the ring because I got lucky with a boots drop but my ring is awful 😄

[river wing]

ace is now 2/2 for +1% more proc per CP

[sacred panther]

Thanks a bunch!

[river wing]

yeah p much, either ring or off-set piece like boots/bracers/belt

[timid idol]

im still shocked mastery does not increase chance to proc it

[noble moon]

mastery should be bte reset chance

[timid idol]

its so insanely stupid

[noble moon]

imagnie the dopamine

[timid idol]

lol

[loud blaze]

It bring ACE to be over 50% though doesn't it?

[timid idol]

they're doing this intentionally btw

they're trolling us for fun

[river wing]

only with super, otherwise it's what, 42% at 7 points

[timid idol]

they would never do this to ret pally

[noble moon]

being in multiple spec discords is so funny bc literally every single spec thinks blizzard is trolling them

[loud blaze]

Hmmm..maybe my math was wrong but with super I thought it was coming up to like 60% and with 7 cps 50%

[gloomy adder]

Would be pretty pointless since more procs would just mean more energy regen which we don’t need

[loud blaze]

rephrase, my math was probably wrong. Mostly wrong.

[river wing]

it's 6% per combo point at 2/2

[fickle relic]

heh

[mystic berry]

mogged

law needs a nerf

sub a buff

[fickle relic]

and what's going on with warlocks, they're destroying m+ and raids

[mystic berry]

lock is fine wym, nothing to see here

[river wing]

ranged season in general tbh

[gloomy adder]

No fun allowed

Only cringe specs allowed to be good

[loud blaze]

it's been a ranged season since DF

[gloomy adder]

Except frost mage new frost mage is epic (fight me)

[fickle relic]

buffs, when?

[river wing]

this one feels more ranged than usual

[river wing]

we'll see tomorrow night IG

[fickle relic]

this might actually happen

[jolly geyser]

[timid idol]

ranged game* in general

unholy is the only non ranged that is ever allowed to compete with rangeds

[jolly geyser]

ret is good

[fair ore]

Honestly the 6% is fine

Just makes BtE stronger

[timid idol]

buffs ned to be gargantuan btw

[jolly geyser]

BR does 40% more dmg

[fair ore]

Isn’t there an overall stat buff as well?

Or is it just ace changes

[noble moon]

have you considered that you dont need buffs you just need to play better

[fair ore]

This as well I’m content

[slim hare]

give us pc back

and its already playable

[glass mortar]

have we ever confirmed if the ace change is an actual buff or a net nerf

[slim hare]

not in raid but we never are

[jolly geyser]

not yet I think weran

[glass mortar]

i know zac was dooming and doing some initial overrides

i went to bed that day tho

i guess it doesnt rlly matter

[slim hare]

zac and co said it was a nerf yesterday but idk

its minimal

1% buff/nerf anyway

[glass mortar]

its intended to be design stuff yea

[slim hare]

we need combo refun to be buffed

and spec is incredible

even with bad numbers

[jolly geyser]

some stuff off gcd also

[mystic berry]

would love to see rtb off gcd

and prep, but prep can get deleted for all I like

[jolly geyser]

ye prep is ye

[cursive gyro]

Preparation doesn't feel strong enough to not be affected by restless blades imo.

[jolly geyser]

[slim hare]

i love off gcd stuff but people wre complaining about ghostly strike so idk if its a good idea

[cursive gyro]

or just give us 2 charges of AR and delete prep

[noble moon]

would make more sense if we were a burst spec

but

[cursive gyro]

i feel like its supposed to give us a little bit of burst potential. blizzard likes to throw shit like that into talent trees.

but meh.

[loud blaze]

The pacing of outlaw is great. What sucks is how sub does more damage with the single button rotation helper.

[mystic berry]

If it was on restless, it would be, what? 2min cd?

[gloomy adder]

I agree

Not a huge fan of prep but how the spec plays feels fine to me

Just give more dmg

[noble moon]

un soft cap blade rush :)

[gloomy adder]

Or make ar 2min

That would be epic

[noble moon]

id be happy with killing spree hit everything in aoe as well

even if reduced

supercharged killing spree in aa doing 1m dps

yes please

[placid ocean]

Does killing spree not get affected by blade flurry?

[noble moon]

it does i think but

8 targerts

[gloomy adder]

One thing I hate is supercharger tied to such a long cd

[mystic berry]

the design of outlaw goes against their philosophy for content, which is following the ffxiv of blowing loads into the boss then going soft

[gloomy adder]

Imagine the put it on blade rush instead

Now that would be epic

[noble moon]

that would be hot

[placid ocean]

If one doesn't want to take prep (because it doesn't feel great to push) what would one take instead?

[mystic berry]

second summarily dispatched

[gloomy adder]

2 point summarily dispatched I think

[placid ocean]

Sold, thanks friends

[gloomy adder]

Fast action sims terribly iirc

Have you macrod it

[cursive gyro]

Fast action and basically every HO talent feel half-baked now.

Would love to see them finish the spec by changing those.

[gloomy adder]

HO isn’t half baked mate it’s not even in the freezer it’s still munching grass

[noble moon]

i was thinking the other day why does oppurtinity at 6 take over from ss in priority at 1cp even when oppurtinity will only take you to 5cp? is it just because we dont want to waste the proc? seems pointless to me if math works out that pistol shot is worse than ss at 1cp anyway because of the chance to go to 6

or does the dmaage of a 6 oppurtinity pistol shot outweigh the cp

[gloomy adder]

Damage, resource efficiency

[sterile dune]

Not with preparation and shid, it pops bery often

Also crits dont give us more cp like it does for assa

So cold blood kinda meme

[gloomy adder]

Still hate it when sub is allowed it on 20s cd with 2 charges

[river wing]

legit waiting very hard for FFXIV 8.0 where maybe they'll change a thing or two

[gloomy adder]

Subersharger ;—DD

[river wing]

because there's three outcomes here

1. press SS, get opp proc (wasted) and 5 CP for 6 total
2. press SS, get no procs and 2 CP for 3 total, press PS for 7 total
3. press PS, get 4 CP for 5 total, can either SS for 7 or Dispatch if BtE is on CD

[gloomy adder]

Fugg 10 gomboboint bedween dhe eyes XDDD

[noble moon]

but oppurnity proc only ever gets us to 5 so does it matter if its wasted? it feels bad to never press pistol shot but if you gamba and keep rolling 6 cp on ss you can just keep going ss > dispatch > ss > bte > ss > dispatch etc.. and have oppurtinity in backup in case it doesnt proc to 6

idk, i do what guide tells me my brain just wants to understand the reasoning

[glass mortar]

if u wasted a full SS proc you wasted 4 CP

the PS it procced is also cheaper and has more chances to generate energy then that SS

[noble moon]

wdym more chances to generate energy

where is it generating energy

[glass mortar]

fatal flourish

FtH attacks 3 times

SS at most 2

and its rng if it even does 2

[noble moon]

im new and cant check talent sheet rn bc im on work computer

what is fatal flourish what is FtH

[glass mortar]

FtH is fan the hammer the talent giving u 6 stacks

and making it shoot 3 times per PS

fatal flourish is your offhand attacks have a chance to generate energy

which directly generates energy off your main hand attacks because your main hand attacks can proc mastery which can then proc FF

its why outlaw doesnt pool in general, our buttons directly contribute to our energy gen

[noble moon]

and pistol shot is considered a main hand attack?

[glass mortar]

PS is one of the stronger ones

I believe so yes

[noble moon]

ok ty

when i read "attack" in wow i usually think its just auto attacks lol

[glass mortar]

yea its a bit of a wishy washy term

anyway even with AR and average rng if u tried to SS > finisher > SS every gcd of a fight, you would run out of energy decently quickly

even if u procced every SS

PS is much more energy efficient and helps you recover

[noble moon]

im probably going to be maining outlaw for all of midnight unless something goes horrifically wrong and friends usually end up asking me about stuff for the spec im playing so i like to know the reasoning for stuff :)

[cursive gyro]

weird question - is killing spree affected by Heavy Hitter?

[noble moon]

also means i can help people in the future in here

so then would it ever be bad to just PS at 1cp as long as you have 3/6 oppurtinity or only ever at 6?

not ps with 3 at 1cp has been the main thing ive been actively trying to stop doing recently but if its fine then

[glass mortar]

well no, you want to SS at 1 as fatebound as long as you arent capped on opp because it leads to more efficient builder outcomes

it is no longer more efficient if you add the chance to overcapp opp in tho

so at 6 stacks opp is always higher prio then SS, at 3 the standard rules happen

[noble moon]

got it

and if trickster then always ps with oppurnity first?

[glass mortar]

yea trickster doesnt really care about this because SS generates the same amount as PS anyway

and also u dont finish at 5 ever

trickster is bin

just dumps alot of efficiency out the window and has less resources to boot

🥹

[noble moon]

why cant trickster finish at 5?

i play it sometimes for fun because im weird and like new killing spree

and i have definitely just been following the same rules as fatebound

[glass mortar]

the reason fatebound finishes at 5 is coins and the chance to match coins pushes the finisher threshold down for dispatch

trickster has neither of those things

so its finisher rules ends up at 6+

fatebound is also 6+ for every finisher that isnt dispatch, so its not like 5 is the standard

5 is specific to dispatch because of the tie in it has in the fatebound tree

[noble moon]

yeye

ty ty

i will understand this spec inside and out one day 🙏

[gloomy adder]

The exact description of FF is “your offhand attacks and pistol shots have a 25% chance to generate 8 energy” so it’s explicit in this case

[noble moon]

ty

[keen belfry]

the raid let me blast last night i think they have to nerf outlaw guys

[river wing]

idk
I got purple logs yesterday and a couple oranges
still trash
not trash trash, but like barely above people doing blues and shit
in TWW my purple/orange were like 25% higher than the blues

[keen belfry]

i dropped a nuke on dragon boss

[noble moon]

.i beat a sub rogue in first pull aa in a 10 yesterday so clearly outlaw is fine

sub player definitely wasnt just bad

[waxen scarab]

how bad is it that i crafted this dagger instead of the other one?

[gloomy adder]

Basically you want to dispatch at 5 because that gets you a coin flip, scoundrel strike from apex talent, and 5% dmg from delivered doom fatebound talent, 1 or 2 more points doesn’t really get you much

You want to BtE with more than 5 because of more chance to reset it with ace

[noble moon]

and higher cp scales higher with zero in right

[gloomy adder]

Pretty bad it’s a poor imbue

Submit your ticket now mate

[inland acorn]

Bte at +6 more because of zero-in talent

But ace also adds up to it

[glass mortar]

we also just would finish at 6+ if we didnt have fatebounds tie ins for dispatch

[noble moon]

evenmore so if ace is getting buffed

[glass mortar]

thats why trickster dispatches at 6+

[inland acorn]

Woah hold on that

[cursive gyro]

What's the highest anyone has gotten BTE buff to?

[glass mortar]

i saw a 16 for a millisecond once in a delve

[inland acorn]

buff is very strong word for what they did to ace in .5

[noble moon]

i think my highest is 12 so far

[glass mortar]

last friday

shame we cant make a BTE MAX STACKS tracking WA like we had for ace chains last expac

[indigo token]

what are they changing in .5

[gloomy adder]

I got like 8 resets in a row last night I’ll have to check the logs

[waxen scarab]

bruh

[inland acorn]

ace has 3% / 6% chance to reset based on points put into talent

rather than flat 5%

[glass mortar]

they changed it so the chance to ace proc per CP scales with rank

[weary fog]

i had 13 on my crown hc

[glass mortar]

and the higher rank has higher chance then live

[indigo token]

wait

[glass mortar]

(note we play 1 ace on live)

[inland acorn]

so the buff is

[indigo token]

so

its a nerf

[inland acorn]

we dump 1 extra talent

[glass mortar]

we dont know

[indigo token]

oh my fucking GOD man

[keen belfry]

yup

[inland acorn]

for 1% higher chance

[jolly geyser]

7 in a row I think

[inland acorn]

[glass mortar]

but u cant really outright say its a buff

[indigo token]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/316923682607857685/1413242281515024545/image.gif

[glass mortar]

because u need to drop a talent to take the second point in it

[noble moon]

highly recommend adding a sound byte to bte when it comes offcd

[indigo token]

im gonna crash out

[inland acorn]

Yep

SO

[indigo token]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-backshots-online-card-virtual-backshots-gif-3195502009624477197

[inland acorn]

I wouldnt call it a buff

[glass mortar]

i dont know if the aoe build even can?

i guess time will tell

[inland acorn]

no no

[gloomy adder]

Ridiculous they didn’t make it 3/7%

[inland acorn]

time will not tell

Solo will

[jolly geyser]

[inland acorn]

[gloomy adder]

Lucky 7s???

[jolly geyser]

get the emote

[glass mortar]

time = solo

[noble moon]

ridiculous they didn't make it 6/7

[indigo token]

https://tenor.com/view/say-that-again-gif-968943876633031890

[glass mortar]

also

it still only refunds 4

so you still dont get to go BtE > BtE

[inland acorn]

yep

still ass

[glass mortar]

at least not 90% of the time

[keen belfry]

could run something like this in aoe in no tree changes

rip sleight

[noble moon]

just drop gravedigger :)

[glass mortar]

i mean just drop 1 point in gravedigger

who needs the 4th anyway

💅

[keen belfry]

imagine our energy without apex

[noble moon]

the fact there are actually specs running around with 0 points in apex is so funny

what a good design

[keen belfry]

how many are

i only know storm enhance skips it in aoe

[prime sleet]

Is Dagger offhand still a thing?

[wintry solar]

Yes

[noble moon]

i think mw is

[prime sleet]

is that late late game bis too?

[noble moon]

feral had a questionable build that could have

[inland acorn]

!oh

[ornate heath]

A dagger offhand is ~1% better than a slow weapon mostly because of Zero In, and also slightly more Instant Poison procs. Energy is not affected by offhand speed.

It is possible large ilvl differences can matter more than this bonus so use Raidbots Top Gear when in doubt.

[wintry solar]

Yes

[glass mortar]

its more bis then its been in years

dagger oh is like 30 ilvls or something silly right now

[noble moon]

Our 🗡️ Off Hand slot is ideally a dagger, it is about ~1% ahead of a slow weapon.
There is only one crit/haste dagger, :item_dagger_kricksbeetlestabber: Krick's Beetle Stabber, or crafted.

[inland acorn]

OH dagger is bis

cuz you can switch to sub

[noble moon]

:mhm:

[mystic berry]

mistweaver

[civic swan]

!up

[ornate heath]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1486352553166901328/drops.png

[mystic berry]

Im running nexus point dagger which is okayish

[light kernel]

@keen belfry did u craft oh dagger ?

[keen belfry]

yeah

[near rock]

outlaw best mythic spec boys sorry no buffs

[mystic berry]

loktark pulling us up

[indigo shell]

haven't played in over a year, but I'm looking at outlaw changes now

Is it even still fun to play?

[mystic berry]

wait that is raid

[indigo shell]

No AR uptime what's going on

[glass mortar]

depends on how much u liked crackshot

[keen belfry]

its still unique in this batch of wow specs

[glass mortar]

what we have right now is like all the stuff u did outside crackshot (ur filler) with a cute builder rule or two modified

and ~20% slower then u were with crackshot

its not like our filler is boring, but if u liked outlaw last expac or post rework DF it does feel very slow and a bit lacking yea

everyone in the game got hit and id say outlaw is still the most fun melee so theres that

[wintry solar]

If you're Zac's grandma yeah

[indigo token]

i think i speak for everyone when i say we're cracking zacs granny

[loud garden]

Mods vaporize this guy

[wintry solar]

Let him cook

[glass mortar]

crack...shotting right?

thats what u meant

[hasty warren]

zac grandma is zeross

[glass mortar]

crackshotting

[noble moon]

im 27 and i can kinda of play new outlaw so ye

old people approved

[wintry solar]

I rebuke this negative energy

[noble moon]

its nice that the spec doesnt give you rsi anymore

[vivid vessel]

@near rock you there cuh

[timid idol]

pacing was great last xpac when we had perma ar

that was real outlaw fun

now it feels so insanely slow and not having ar feels like i might as well afk

[timid idol]

very slow is underselling it

[loud blaze]

At the very end of the xpac and if you didn’t get resets it felt terrible. Not to mention anything that made you run out of melee range basically took you to zero DPS and threw everything off.

[timid idol]

there wasnt alot of things like that

[vivid vessel]

outlaw downtime issues might be worse now than they were in tww

[timid idol]

the only bad downtime i remember was in eco dome

when the 2nd boss was doin allat shit

[loud blaze]

I didn’t run keys, only raid.

[timid idol]

ah

[vivid vessel]

especially in raid

[near rock]

what up

[timid idol]

well

[vivid vessel]

long downtime is prolly worse now

[vivid vessel]

outlaw on voracius

[timid idol]

i gave up trying to be good in raid long ago

lol

[vivid vessel]

le me hear what you thought about it

[loud blaze]

What are you talking about downtime? The whole thing is basically downtime 😅

[vivid vessel]

i was thinking about playing it myself

[near rock]

uhhh it seemed good

[vivid vessel]

but it doesnt look as good as i thought

but idk

[near rock]

nothing insane

[vivid vessel]

your entire raid boss damage seems lower than other people raid also

[near rock]

if you wanna pad, you can hold ADR a few seconds until adds spawn

and then giga blast on the grouped adds until they go to their sides

[vivid vessel]

which might be why your boss damage doesnt look as good as i expected

[near rock]

otherwise its still decent, blade flurry hits far since vorasius's hitbox is so massive, you can target him and still blade flurry adds

[vivid vessel]

well you drop most adds far no ?

in mthic

[near rock]

yeah but for 2nd and 3rd add set

[vivid vessel]

i see

[near rock]

you can hit vorasius

[vivid vessel]

i think im gonna play outlaw on it aswell

[near rock]

depends on how far your group goes for soak 1

[vivid vessel]

i just watched perfecto playing sub deathstalker on it

staying on boss perma

rat behavior !

maybe its the right approach tho since rogue is prolly just bad at add damage now

[loud blaze]

I think we just need damage buffs baseline. It’s crazy to me they’ve done so much tuning and not touched rogue.

[noble moon]

wdym

we got like 3% this week

[glass mortar]

its worse then not touched

they thought 4% was enough

im sure more tuning will happen tho

[noble moon]

keep it up and give them more data

[vivid vessel]

race is started now

xd

tuning is over bro

[glass mortar]

until the race is over anyway

which is like 2 weeks

its fiiiiiiiiiiine

[noble moon]

race matters for like 100 people

[vivid vessel]

after the race great push

they prolly wont do tuning during greath push

after that there is mdi

[glass mortar]

they can tune during great push

aint it on its own servers

[vivid vessel]

so prolly wont do tuning during mdi

[glass mortar]

or do they do it on live servers

[loud blaze]

How will it hurt to do it now? There's no rogues in the raceanyway.

[vivid vessel]

after mdi they prolly are holding cause its end of the season anyway