outlaw

[tidal sequoia]

this is our tier

[vivid vessel]

[tidal sequoia]

cos im looking at sims and im liek

https://klipy.com/gifs/good-movies-rule-gmr

[vivid vessel]

outlaw always sims high tho

or higher than the other rogue specs at least

litteraly every tier

i think this is a perfectly average tier when i look at sims

sub is actually so close in sims i know we will play sub

[formal knot]

just one more low target cleave boss... i promise it's all we need... just one more cleave boss

[cinder relic]

It's a melee cleave raid tier

So like, Maybe

It depends what mythic looks like

[gaunt phoenix]

The other specs lowkey always have something that makes them undersim

[rocky kiln]

!fuu

[ornate heath]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[cinder relic]

A lot of fights are going to ask you to "deal a lot of st, and also cleave"

[tidal sequoia]

this guy

please give me hope

[cinder relic]

But on mythic, if it ends up being "you need to 1shot the adds that spawn" u will play sub

[tidal sequoia]

feed my copium

[buoyant stratus]

Every tier is melee cleave tier brother

[cinder relic]

True but this raid is kinda low target

And while sub bursts it's kinda poop at low target count unless u need to 1shot them

[buoyant stratus]

People keep saying assa is copium but im seeing these dummy logs and i gotta say

[cinder relic]

Ya

Agreege

[buoyant stratus]

Its a fkn sub tier anyway :^)

[cinder relic]

Disagree Ge

[tidal sequoia]

ITS ALWAYS SUB TIER

[buoyant stratus]

Nah i think all 3 specs

Are gonna have their moment

Tbh

[tidal sequoia]

can we get killing spree from that boss in murder row

[buoyant stratus]

I highkey think assa will be on last 2 bosses

Beloran seems sub coded but assa burst is insanr

[cinder relic]

Sins aoe burst is kinda ass tho no

[buoyant stratus]

Depends how its tuned but if egg phase is all that matters well

Seems good for sin yknow?

[cinder relic]

I mean yeah context is gonna matter as usual

[buoyant stratus]

Yerp, maybe p3 midnight falls is all that matters

Assa may be rly good there

[cinder relic]

Me with my thinking cap on: I will look at the st patchwork sims to evaluate how good my class is in raid

[buoyant stratus]

No dude please

I live to overreact to notes without context, timers, fight cadence

Holy shit they buffed feral gg!!!!1!1

[jolly geyser]

atleast outlaw scales better with stats this time around

kinda

like for sub mastery went from best stat to best stat

[leaden sonnet]

The real thinking cap is to not look at the spreadsheet itself, but look at content creators making tierlists based on the spreadsheet

[jolly geyser]

https://tenor.com/view/speed-ishowspeed-speed-stream-ishowspeed-stream-speed-nod-gif-1082323842437565509

[frail veldt]

That's smart since this is a good representation of how well outlaw performs usually

[crisp elm]

if i see another tier list head gonna explode

"vibe based"

wild

[midnight granite]

Its clicks bro

[crisp elm]

no

strictly vibes

[midnight granite]

Just upset your tierlist ain't getting clicks

[jolly geyser]

tier list based on piss lenght

[crisp elm]

ill give u something to click on fr

[midnight granite]

[random stirrup]

might pull ahead of law after tuning

depends on what happens

deathstalker especially

[midnight granite]

Man's rerolling warlock after he saw that tierlist vid

Wants me to click his gate

[crisp elm]

naw

ele

[river wing]

here's my tier list:
SSS: Outlaw, Arms
B: Assa, Sub
F: everything else

[midnight granite]

Man said arms

[crisp elm]

actually

sp

[midnight granite]

[cinder relic]

Literally

[jolly geyser]

just post some random tierlist, and then say after what it is for

[glossy ibex]

:bf: Blade Flurry at 4+ targets and talented into :acro: Deft Maneuvers.
i wanted to ask, when BF is like 2-3 seconds left and we are talented into this talent, the right play is to use BF as a builder (and to refresh) right?

[crisp elm]

yes

[waxen scarab]

boys how true is that?

[crisp elm]

very

reroll rn

[waxen scarab]

wdym reroll

we are so back

[crisp elm]

but you could be higher

no?

[wintry solar]

No

Because any higher and wed get nerfed

[dark ember]

Honestly this is a good spot

I'll take it, I don't remember seeing outlaw this high so, progress

It's a long way to the top of you wanna rock and roll

[haughty wigeon]

I love this soreadsheet

So many people dm me

When I post it

Asking for source

[dark ember]

"It came to me in a dream"

[snow rain]

While the sheet isn't really representative, Outlaw is still in a good spot right now - as for the other two...

[jolly geyser]

Most clueless tierlist and then put all specs in random places

[leaden sonnet]

Randomizer

[wispy valve]

Didn't naowh do something like that on twitter and people full bought it

Wheel of names tierlist elite content

[crisp elm]

already gearing my sp as we speak, so up rn

[snow rain]

Because people just look at these lists and go "Yay my class big"

[jolly geyser]

gearing my glad warr as we speak

[jolly geyser]

post it

[wispy valve]

Sin A tier

[snow rain]

Can you put Sin below 'Too bad for the list'?

[leaden sonnet]

That would make it inaccurate

[naive pecan]

!fuu

[cinder relic]

Pepelerf

[ornate heath]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[snow rain]

Oh yeah sorry, forgot this is based on pure facts

[leaden sonnet]

It literally is

See if you can figure it out

[crisp elm]

there needs to be more sandbag involved tho

[snow rain]

oooooooooooooooh

Yeah it's late, I'm slow

[lime lake]

[wintry solar]

My favorite genre of tier list!

0 context

[frail veldt]

It's alphabetical

[crisp elm]

vibes

[lime lake]

i feel like you shouldnt need context for it

[wintry solar]

I read nothing

Nor will I

[jolly geyser]

I should do biggest whiners spec tierlist

would need help on that

[wintry solar]

I think you know

Just make Ret and Sub PvPers equal

They're equally as bad

And deserve a special mention

[jolly geyser]

nvm,was gonna say something but I rather not

[wintry solar]

Do it

No balls

[sleek basin]

Why did they make outlaw so bad ? It was peak during DF and it's dead now :(((

[frail veldt]

It's what the people wanted

[wispy valve]

thats the joke bro

[frail veldt]

Wasn't sure if you knew

There's a wide range in here

[wispy valve]

true

[sleek basin]

Who wants this slow ass gameplay

[frail veldt]

The people

[sleek basin]

Were are my back to back bte procs

[frail veldt]

Gone and buried

[sleek basin]

https://tenor.com/view/batman-lonely-rain-sad-gif-7792030237214898863

Why is snd still a button lol ?

[polar kelp]

Press it pre pull in raid or dungeon start to mix max, get good

[sleek basin]

Soon they will make it proc on aa and you wont ever use it again

But at this point why not getting vanilla combat back ?

Enough wining for today, was I the only when struggling with energy regen during leveling ? Does it get better with gear at 90 ? Or am I just bad ?

[glossy pewter]

this is what happened for most classes, Your soul main is probably dead to you, but there are 3-5 specs that used to be clunky or too intimidating that are alot smoother and fun to pick up, its a main swapping expac

if i had never felt perma .8 sec gcd crackshot windows, this outlaw would be pretty cool id bet

[sleek basin]

I liked my otp outlaw :(

[glossy pewter]

https://tenor.com/view/yes-dure-sad-teary-will-smith-gif-14072299

[steep shell]

this is for single target?

[sleek basin]

Idk, mop combat gameplay is funnier tbh

[glossy pewter]

old

[sleek basin]

At least for leveling. I just dinged 90 on retail so I'll see

[glossy pewter]

saw this screenshot in dh discord, up to date allegedly

[sleek basin]

But 90 mop classic combat rogue is fun

[glossy pewter]

ret discord says they are 110-115k with the buffs

[tender wedge]

Tops been cut off though

[glossy pewter]

yea gotta hide the dh damage at the top

[tender wedge]

Ssshhhhh

[sleek basin]

Do you know if any other class / spec is faster paced than actual outlaw ?

[tender wedge]

Tanks I guess

[fathom bramble]

yeah tanks have a lot of apm from spamming their off-gcd active mitigation

there isn't a melee dps close(within 10%) of us though

fire mage looks like an apm outlier as the only dps above us

[glossy pewter]

prot pal

[fathom bramble]

they are one of the few dps that kept an offgcd spell(fireblast) in their primary rotation

[mystic berry]

speaking about off gcd

[next quarry]

so is the reason were supposed to use a dagger offhand is just speed?

[mystic berry]

who do we have to bribe to get prep and rtb off the gcd

[fathom bramble]

I'm just now noticing that the list I have here is missing warr

maybe fury is near us, but I doubt it

[ashen void]

i miss mfd speaking of off gcd

[craggy barn]

instnat poison procs yea

!oh

[ornate heath]

A dagger offhand is ~1% better than a slow weapon mostly because of Zero In, and also slightly more Instant Poison procs. Energy is not affected by offhand speed.

It is possible large ilvl differences can matter more than this bonus so use Raidbots Top Gear when in doubt.

[fathom bramble]

mostly zero in

[next quarry]

got it. playing sub currently and enjoying the shadow clone play, but was looking at outlaw and saw the dagger offhand so was just wondering. thank you

also bummed to see killing spree isnt used.

[sleek basin]

Also do you know why people didnt like vanish burst window gameplay ?

[fathom bramble]

there was a few common complaints

doesn't fit outlaw
Simply not liking playing around damage windows
failure to vanish properly in solo content can result in frustrating resets

[sleek basin]

I agree with the solo content one

This was rly an issue

But the other two are just personal preferences

Also most class plays around damage windows right ?

[fathom bramble]

I mean to me subterfuge was up so often it did not feel like a damage window in the same way as other classes

but those are I believe the 3 most common complaints

all 3 of which I disagree with for the record

[sleek basin]

ok ok

Solo content wasnt an issue for you ?

[fathom bramble]

not meaningfully

vanishing and immediately hitting anything was fairly reliable

if I was playing lazily and/or watching tv then it could happen on occasion

[sleek basin]

true

[fathom bramble]

but while paying attention and planning properly vanish dropping combat could be mitigated a lot

I think a lot of people just didn't really understand that you can vanish and immediately hit a key to have it work basically all the time

which does often mean vanishing into an incorrect spell like PS or sinister strike

since you can't well press BTE on time if it is on CD

[sleek basin]

Can't wait DF classic to play that spec again...

[brave lagoon]

half way there

[vivid vessel]

whats that

[brave lagoon]

for the fancy bird mount in zul aman

that one

[vivid vessel]

oh

fun

[brave lagoon]

terribly

it's up there along with shoveling trash piles for darkfuse rep

[wooden pilot]

if we're raiding as outlaw (cba with sub) are we crafting sword this week?

[sleek basin]

Optimisation question: If im at 1cp and have 6 stacks of ps and bte is up. Should I ps for 5cp bte ? Or ps (5cp) -> dispatch -> ss (+ps if at 3cp) -> bte 6+cp ?

[vivid vessel]

why not ps ss?

[sleek basin]

Because if it procs than I waste cp ?

[glass mortar]

you would PS > SS > BtE

[vivid vessel]

ye but thats how oultaw is

yo umight waste some cps if it procs

it is how it is

[sleek basin]

so sad :(

[vivid vessel]

thats the right thing to do tho

[sleek basin]

Thx

[vivid pine]

The grind was worth it, fair warning though, the bird squawks a lot lol

[brave lagoon]

😄 damn

[vivid vessel]

ok but did you guys get the pangolin

[brave lagoon]

I'm armored up

[floral mulch]

So is outlaw the best spec for raid?

[vivid vessel]

holy shmokerino!

[vivid vessel]

outlaw has been simming the best of the rogue specs for litteraly forever

its meaningless

[dull lintel]

if i hit the target dummies, and show the damage, would it be possible to see what I am doing wrong with outlaw

if my damage is lower on a spell than it should be

like for 5 minutes

[crisp elm]

id say prob not

read faq and practice practice

[dense coral]

It’s fake

[glossy pewter]

used to hide opportunity procs with a WA, is there a way to do that easily? is there an addon just for that?

[vivid vessel]

alert opacity in settings

[glossy pewter]

is this character specific?

[vivid vessel]

no

it would remove all the alerts things

you use them ?

[glossy pewter]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-spongebob-sad-spongebob-depressed-spongebob-head-in-hands-spongebob-react-gif-2112710549962906415

[glossy pewter]

on other classes, opportunity indicator useless but other ones i like

[tight kernel]

No this are lies

We need a buff

If you show blizz this stupid sim the community intern dev will give us a nerf

[vivid vessel]

outlaw has simmed this high basically every tier

and we played sub

so

[wooden pilot]

when will people learn

(never)

[vivid vessel]

idk i should make a compilation

of people sending sims every tier

"outlaw back??"

[tight kernel]

But the tier list Zac

[vivid vessel]

thats not a tier list its a sim list

[tight kernel]

Yeah which puts us at S tier of course

[vivid vessel]

also this particular screenshot has all the top specs cropped

shaman, dh, wls,mage, evoker

and dk

[vivid vessel]

so

[glossy pewter]

its from the dh discord, they are hiding

[tight kernel]

Still cringe list

[copper radish]

I like how ret doesn’t have sims yet god damn sandbaggers

[shut lichen]

damn u know shit is fucked up when ur sandwhiched between arms man

literally and figuratively i guess

[cinder relic]

Me with my thinking cap: Yeah I will evaluate what to play in raid based on ST patchwork sims

[vivid vessel]

there is as much as a gap between outlaw and the bottom specs, than outlaw and the top specs btw

which means

we are mid

!

[copper radish]

Outlaw in top 10 of classes? I’ll take it

[crisp elm]

so outlaw bis right???

[shut lichen]

always have been

[copper radish]

We are top 10 we won the season already

[shut lichen]

[vivid vessel]

its top 10 every season tho

i would argue its been higher and not played

[cinder relic]

Last season it was bottom 2

Like str8 up

[copper radish]

Holy reversal

[vivid vessel]

well last season it was so dogshit

[copper radish]

Buffs on Friday gonna send us to top 5

[vivid vessel]

also false

[cinder relic]

Talkin in the actual raid

idgaf about sims

[vivid vessel]

we were talking about sims tho

[frail veldt]

It's almost like outlaw performs worse in raid than it does in sim rankings

[copper radish]

All the time lmao

[shut lichen]

which one? Sims 2 was the best

[copper radish]

Wish I could hit buttons like these sims are

[vivid vessel]

i mean its not about that lol

[cinder relic]

Or maybe the game ismore complicated than a ST patchwork DPS

Is that a possibility?

[vivid vessel]

just oh well a spec that is flat perform bad in a raid with downtime and damage amp every boss

who knwe the specs with bursts would end up high

not me !

im surprised every tier

[frail veldt]

If you can show me when my statement has been false in the past I'm open to consideration

It's true of many specs

But outlaws pretty cut and dry

[cinder relic]

Sub is bottom DPS that tier

But then it was one of the best specs in the game

[vivid vessel]

ye and sub is always bottom dps in sims and then best spec in the game

he did say

outlaw

btw

[frail veldt]

That wasn't my statement

[vivid vessel]

here

says outlaw

the spec outalw rogue

pirate

[frail veldt]

My statement was that outlaw always ranks worse in raid than it does in patchwork sim

[cinder relic]

I dont even know what you are asking me to prove

If u use these patchwork sims to evaluate anything in the raid u are just a noob

[frail veldt]

Then prove my statement wrong

[vivid vessel]

i think its fairly good to evaluate how bad outlaw is tho, can very often just look at sims and if outlaw isnt in the very top it will not be good

proven by litteraly every tier ever

[cinder relic]

I don't feel like scrounging through logs to prove a point you will move the goalpost of

[vivid vessel]

mad cause bad

gg

actual skill issue

[wooden pilot]

aint even arguing about anything real

i love outlaw discord

[brave lagoon]

the doomposting gets to us all

[copper radish]

Dw aura buff next Friday to save the season

[shut lichen]

[vivid vessel]

guys

is it over

[copper radish]

DH ready to go just in case

[dawn solstice]

just switched to sub today, i feel reborn

[mystic berry]

disappointed in you

[dawn solstice]

i really tried man

geared up and everything

im dissapointed also 🙁

[frail veldt]

Gotta do what you gotta do

[mystic berry]

Unrelated, but I just found out ayjie cdm have custom text to speech phrases, and I can finally call myself dumb for missing a cooldown

[frail veldt]

Ultimate training tool

[mystic berry]

nothing like have a robotic voice yelling at you to put your mind into it

[lime lake]

i prefer having zac efron tell me to get my head in the game

https://klipy.com/gifs/basketball-team-dribbling-tricks-troy-bolton

[wild rivet]

is an any one actually playing outlaw in raid ?

[lime lake]

everyone

its an outlaw tier

have you seen the sims

[wild rivet]

outlaw sims dont always translate to raid logs

[copper radish]

Top 10

[lime lake]

that doesnt sound right to me

[copper radish]

Basically s tier

[lime lake]

bigger number = better

it is known

[wild rivet]

also cant tell if being facetious

[lime lake]

i have a glorp pfp

what do you think

[copper radish]

Somehow we will over perform this week and get nerf on Friday

[daring oxide]

https://klipy.com/gifs/cappys-fat-1

[mystic berry]

not if we purposefully play like shit

so guys, rtb BEFORE adr, always, and make sure to not have loaded dice in the tree

[vivid vessel]

well

our itert set is quite low

its like 4%

while sub is 13%

so we indeed prolly will look much better in hc week than sub haha

know what that maens :D

[shut lichen]

slowmode during mythic week tuning?

[wild rivet]

cant craft a weap for outlaw because it if it ends up not great

there goes the craft

[hoary apex]

What are we thinking for spark usage? Seems like two off pieces will be best sadly?

for early?

[shut lichen]

depends on ur objective

[dim parrot]

I always think there’s no way they’re clueless enough to not take this into account when tuning

Feel like they tune off community perception more and more rn

[vivid vessel]

idk i fuind it quite suspicious how outlaw end up nerfed often during hc week

[shut lichen]

9/10 ur making that weapon

[vivid vessel]

while we know it perform better in shitter content

so idk

i do think they are quite clueless

about a lot of things

[dim parrot]

Just make a tettles list to sand us plz

[shut lichen]

yes

just craft whatever has cheaper mat costs

[dim parrot]

I try to tell myself that it’s fun playing a dog class sometimes cuz it feels that much sweeter to outplay people

But idk anymore

[shut lichen]

class or spec?

[dim parrot]

Sham seems fun

Class

[shut lichen]

well that's cause u don't see the conspiracy

[dim parrot]

Anytime I try a new class I get jealous when I play with a rogue

[shut lichen]

somehow there are people who think atrophic is a real buff

[dim parrot]

Cuz I know it’s more satisfying

No one does

[shut lichen]

oh u'd be surprised

[cinder relic]

It's 100% a raid buff

[shut lichen]

exactly

so just convince whatever guild u trial for to let you in

[dim parrot]

The boss hurt ouchie oh thank god we have atrophic

[shut lichen]

and it should be easy sailings cause anyone not commited to this spec has rolled off

[dim parrot]

Oh nvm we dying to environment damage

[shut lichen]

ez profit

[dim parrot]

Pleb take

[earnest basalt]

!ui

[ornate heath]

Resources:

• ArcUI / BetterCDM - common suites for buff/cd customization
• WangBar - displays CPs/energy, customize colors per point, faster than Sensei
• MSUF - recommendation for unit frames
• Platynator - recommendation for nameplates (Jundies Profile)
  Misc:
• Clickable Raid Buffs - for poisons
• WilduTools - random QoL like melee range indicator, track cursor
• Mute Cold Blood sound - if we ever go back to this talent

[random geyser]

is Crucible of Erratic Energy still not simming right?

[near rock]

[daring oxide]

[hollow temple]

gotta use trade chat @dire rampart

[dire rampart]

all good, got it done

[dense coral]

I crafted 259 dagger day before the tuning expecting assa buff which never came. How doomed am i with crafted dagger if i wanted to play outlaw?

[bright crane]

Just use it for OH

Sub is the move for raid anyways no?

[dense coral]

I don’t enjoy sub. I like assa and outlaw

[bright crane]

Then just use it for OH

And /pray for a 1H

U never know tho we still got at least 1 more big tuning pass coming

[sturdy tartan]

!wa

[ornate heath]

Resources:

• ArcUI / BetterCDM - common suites for buff/cd customization
• WangBar - displays CPs/energy, customize colors per point, faster than Sensei
• MSUF - recommendation for unit frames
• Platynator - recommendation for nameplates (Jundies Profile)
  Misc:
• Clickable Raid Buffs - for poisons
• WilduTools - random QoL like melee range indicator, track cursor
• Mute Cold Blood sound - if we ever go back to this talent

[oak river]

I was smacking a dummy and I rolled Jackpot three times in a row. Is this RNG God territory, or did I do something to make this happen.

[gaunt phoenix]

rng

[oak river]

Damnit...... now if I don't get that in raid I'm going to cry lol

[dense coral]

Outlaw is very fun to play, i just hate how it’s damage is flat line with no ups and downs

[frail veldt]

it goes up and down

you just have no control over it

lol

[ashen void]

stupid question about this optimization: so if i'm not in that ~30s window of adr but i get a string of apex or ace luck and get a reset of bte which does land me in the 30s window, then I'm good to hold yea?

[frail veldt]

yep

[ashen void]

hard to tell my monkey brain to hold after i get an ace or apex proc when AR is close to being up :)

[frail veldt]

if bte is ready and adr cd is under 30s, then you can hold bte

regardless of how it became ready

[ashen void]

yuh yuh

tyty :)

[frail veldt]

yeah ace proc sound effect def makes you want to press it again lol

[neat atlas]

any good addons for rtb?

[sudden comet]

theres nothing special about pressing it when its glowing compared to waiting a bit right?

[frail veldt]

nope the glow is just blizzard letting you know its cd just got reset

[frail veldt]

cant really do anything but track the one buff

the icon shows you which stage youre at

and thats it pretty much

[neat atlas]

can I add the buff to my cooldown manager to see if its 1x 2x 3x or 5x?

[pure folio]

Yes

[vivid vessel]

@mighty pivot

you there cuh

[dull geyser]

never seen a discord full of so much doom

yall are crazy lol

[untold wadi]

rip outlaw

[keen belfry]

U guys ever been to Chico

And been club in

[tired lily]

just wanna ask, where did you get it from bloodmallet? cant seem to find it on their site 🙁

[haughty wigeon]

Cause outlaw sucks donkey balls

[proven ocean]

@vivid vessel wtf even rem is dooming

Is it rly that bad

[haughty wigeon]

Prep was the straw that broke the camels back

[proven ocean]

Stay strong everyone

[haughty wigeon]

Never in all my years have I played this game

Have I EVER seen an ability so dogshit as prep

Wanna know th closest?

Rune of power for mage

And even that is t a fucking cringe as prep

[proven ocean]

Meanwhile u have that one person that only gives positive feedback even when everything is bad

won’t mention who

[celest cave]

so no tuning for rogue i guess on tuesday

[proven ocean]

Outlaw needs a semi burst every 45 seconds off gcd

Doesn’t hinder ur gameplay, does decent dmg

Not too much

[vivid vessel]

i mean put adr on charges

and its already a lot better

[proven ocean]

Ye that one is good too but zac

I think 45 sec like a mage’s meteor kind of dmg

Something that does idk 5 seconds worth of dps

In dmg

[untold wadi]

bro rop wasnt that bad

ok maybe it was

[trim harbor]

Weren’t sub people dooming yesterday about crafting daggers dfuq is the outlaw doom for did i miss something

[fleet dragon]

Think people were expecting outlaw buffs in the notes.

[frozen yoke]

yo guys, whats the easiest delve to unlock level 8 in?

[river wing]

just about any IMO, they're all super easy even at 7 even in 215 gear
but if you see Atalaman "interrupting the ritual" or smth like that, you can stealth through 90% of the objectives and only kill the boss, so that's like 4-5 mins per delve once you know the pathing between the objectives

[cinder relic]

Who are you talking about

I literally write feedback for issues I have with the class

I write like 3+ articles a season when changes are coming

What more can I physically do

If Ur gonna make smarmy comments try at least being accurate next time

[wintry solar]

Evidently it doesn't count if you don't act miserable

[cinder relic]

Like literally

I wrote about prep being a bad solution compared to just 2 charges, about lackluster keystones, how pathing for utility at the top of the tree is hard as it competes for damage, and how 2 pointers like ace are bad

I have plenty of issues with the spec. I write about them any time I get the chance to

It's not like these articles have pull lmao. What more can I physically do here

[vivid vessel]

you got one maned so hard

actually owned

he didnt even @ you

ross is powerfull

scary shit

[drifting sleet]

Why is the outlaw faq dead in comp to the other two

[vivid vessel]

you have to click links bro ?

[drifting sleet]

outlaw just gotta make it gloomy man cmon spice it up

[vivid vessel]

what

but assa is just a wall of text

wdym

[haughty wigeon]

mafic liked werans post but not mine

[hollow temple]

this little yellow bear from france be infecting everyone with the doomge

[proven ocean]

hi notrickz

i got grandmaster CAs done

[hollow temple]

[proven ocean]

[hollow temple]

at 1 boss ?

[proven ocean]

ye

[hollow temple]

[proven ocean]

u saw i got radiant btw

[hollow temple]

yee

[proven ocean]

idk what to do next

been trying to speedrun phosani atm

got a min faster than GM time before tablet

[hollow temple]

all there rly is now is max, full GM, pets

then its either speedruns or iron

[gritty torrent]

Quick question as I haven't played outlaw since legion, does the energy Regen feel better at max level? I have tea, but there are times where it feels so slow and I'm auto attacking for a while, I'm usually top or 2nd DPS in most dungeons. So idk if I'm doing something wrong lol

[proven ocean]

real speedruns are post GM

ya idk might be max idk

i feel like theres still alot to achieve before those 2

need to do oathplate acquisition

[hollow temple]

u know theres a delve HoF this season apparently

[proven ocean]

in wow?

[hollow temple]

ya

[proven ocean]

hmm

[hollow temple]

first 1k per region to do ??

[vivid vessel]

its the ???

[proven ocean]

like whoever completes the delve challenge?

[vivid vessel]

like last season

[proven ocean]

ah

[vivid vessel]

but this time there is a hof

for it

[proven ocean]

idk i dont think i wanna login for it

did the ?? start

or when is it opening

[vivid vessel]

no

[hollow temple]

idts

[vivid vessel]

nezxt week

i mean

[proven ocean]

should i lvl up for it zac

or whatever

[vivid vessel]

tbf you could login, do like 3 days of m0

and you have the same gear as everyone does

[hollow temple]

idk if u have time to level and gear by the time it drops now

[vivid vessel]

rn

[hollow temple]

oo

[proven ocean]

nah time isn't an issue imo

[vivid vessel]

and if you login today you even have time to do one m0 set before reset

[hollow temple]

can u do 3 days of m0 tho

[vivid vessel]

yes next reset

its daily

[hollow temple]

icic

[vivid vessel]

like legit all the gear we have rn

you can have the same day 2

while having done nothing

[hollow temple]

ill c u then ig

im going to level my dh next

[vivid vessel]

you do that

[hollow temple]

because the warglaives are sick

[proven ocean]

it should've been top 100 per class

[hollow temple]

af

[proven ocean]

or something

idk i dont think i care about top 1000

fk that

[vivid vessel]

i mean ???? last season was fun tho

and now it has a fun achiev

idk

i will do it

[proven ocean]

idk if i wanna spend 20-30 hours for just that

[vivid vessel]

you have a level 90 yet ?

[proven ocean]

no

haven't logged in since like

[vivid vessel]

cause you dont actually need 20/30 hours

[proven ocean]

6+ months

[vivid vessel]

you need

look

let me tell youi

you need 8 h max leveling ok

if you are super slow noob

and then im telling you

one world tour of m0

you are the same gear as me

[proven ocean]

im pretty quick with lvling i think

usually lvl up before most ppl

[hollow temple]

these things are kinda cracked

[vivid vessel]

thats a dh weapon ?

[hollow temple]

ya

[vivid vessel]

goes crazy

is there a sword equivalent ?

[hollow temple]

thats the glaive from s1 raid

no

[vivid vessel]

bro ..

always

we never get swords

i swear

[hollow temple]

yep

[vivid vessel]

even intel sword?

im so sad

there is legit 1 sword per expac btw

[hollow temple]

but we can mog swords as dagger specs now

[vivid vessel]

not joking

[hollow temple]

yay !

[vivid vessel]

and usually its int dsword

i dont get it

its always axes

and maces

like fuck that

give me a nice sword bro

[haughty wigeon]

ah right

[haughty wigeon]

you reminded me

[hollow temple]

the prey swords are ight

[haughty wigeon]

i have to level up my vdh

[vivid vessel]

mh

[haughty wigeon]

i guess thats tomorrows project

[vivid vessel]

its not that bad i guess

eh

kinda boring a bit

[hollow temple]

the raid swords/daggers are turbo swampass

even the rogue tier set is the worst one

of the entire season

[vivid vessel]

bro

the rogue tier set

looks like leveling greens

not capping

[hollow temple]

ya

[vivid vessel]

dogshit ass

[hollow temple]

it does

the prey/wpvp set looks better

lmao

(blues)

[vivid vessel]

didnt see it

[hollow temple]

there's red, blue, and purplegold

[vivid vessel]

ew !

[hollow temple]

yea

looks better than our tier tho which is crazy

[crimson scarab]

By far one of the worst looking tier sets ever for rogue is this season🥲🥲🥲

Also what’s blizzard rationale to delay m+ by an additional week and not release it with the season 1 content??

I just can’t wrap my head around it

[vivid vessel]

becasue

hc week

there is no mythic raid

[crimson scarab]

Usually they never take so long to release it, no?

It’s 3 weeks now

[vivid vessel]

they do a hc week the first season of an expac

cause you get there lower ilvl

so its a bit different

yo uneed more time to gear up

there is a bigger gap

than between seasons

[crimson scarab]

So essentially if you’re lucky, you can start m+ with a full tier sets

Gonna feel both odd and nice

[open bane]

hi guys any addons for outlaw?

[proven ocean]

ugly

[sly oasis]

wth, i was in tww dungeon with 80 ilvl gear and was doing like 20k overal, i come to midnight dung with 100 ilvl and im doing 9? is that just some weird scaling

[burnt dragon]

blame shamans

[lucid sparrow]

why take sleight of hand over a point in heavy hitter?

im beefing with soh talent rn

[river wing]

20% better odds seems to mean that your chances to roll a 1oaK are reduced by like 10%, which is no small deal

you will RtB without AR buff quite often, so either you go "just get lucky bozo" and go with Heavy Hitter, or you know your luck to be shit and take SoH to at least get some improvement on that front

[atomic magnet]

Do we always want a dagger in the offhand or just in our BIS gear scenario?

[lucid sparrow]

i roll 1oak quite often even with soh

thats why im squabbling with it

[river wing]

well yeah
SoH seems to drop the 50% chance for 1oaK to 40%

[lucid sparrow]

and thought take the worse rng and 10% more dmg in generators

which seems like a decent amount too

but i guess if rolling dt and above more consistently

would end up overall better?

[river wing]

yeah DT is basically twice the finishers while it lasts

which is...whew

[lucid sparrow]

yeah

[river wing]

like 1oaK feels so terrible to play that I'm taking SoH simply to have as little a chance of seeing it ever

[lucid sparrow]

yea relatable

also

i wonder how much blizzard takes into account rtb buffs when balancing the spec

[river wing]

p sure outlaw is balanced around just having DT all the time ngl

[mighty pivot]

was eeping bruh. what up

[pulsar crescent]

!macro

[ornate heath]

Macroing gs is relatively "ok", be aware that it wont ever be entirely optimal: target swapping in m+ or putting it on a dying target for example. You can macro it to all your abilities.

[mighty pivot]

might be a good time to delete that command

[hasty warren]

Hi pirates

[vapid sundial]

Let me bring it back

rq

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/316923682607857685/1281275821075595374/6an3o7.gif

[fluid iron]

as god intended

[vivid vessel]

wasnt there an event that fire everytime you gain a resource

with the specific resource gained

i thought it was spell energise but

[crimson arch]

does one of u have a recommendation for target and focujs castbar addon? I dont rly find anything..

[graceful gyro]

i don t understand why people are hard dooming outlaw is simming better than sub and by y margin where forced downtime won t diminish it below sub

[molten gazelle]

is it smart to send a spark weapon now ?

then recraft later

[twin steeple]

In my short experience since DF, even if outlaw sims good, it's pretty much never brought to the raids

Always assa or sub

[worn lintel]

Hellow, i was wondering can anyone link me the spreadsheet for sims in ST with every specs and the tier sets bonus damage etc... i can't remember the name and i can't find it anymore 😭

[unkempt dew]

https://tenor.com/view/capybara-nose-poke-capy-coconut-gif-1974646734566907144

[worn lintel]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/656950331460157443/1478701499021525002/IMG_5348.gif

[untold wadi]

https://tenor.com/view/capybara-gif-25928729

[quiet ore]

Yo, what's the fastest time y'all have gotten hard mode hunts to? I've managed under 5 minutes, which feels pretty fast

[balmy topaz]

4:36

Got lucky with traps I felt tho

[jolly geyser]

ruby got lucky with traps huh?

[river wing]

y'all speedrunning them? I just do them as part of the weeklies

[quiet ore]

Random hard hunts are probably the fastest source of veteran crests rn, if you wanna max out your counts/ilvl going in to the reset

[earnest falcon]

is it worth over capping to get bte on 6+ cp

[river wing]

tbh next week is still no M+, and the cap is rolling, so the way I see it, I'll just be running M+0 a lot the next week (daily lockout is enabled on 17th, AFAIK) to get Champ gear and crests instead

[quiet ore]

M0 is vet crests and gear

[river wing]

for now

it's supposed to go to Champ 1/6 (and I assume champ crests since apparently even +2 will be hero crests anyway) on 17th

or on 18th in EU
w/e, next reset

[formal knot]

i just exchanged the leftover adventurer crests i had to veteran

[quiet ore]

Presumably nightmare difficulty hunts will also be out though. And also be comparably fast

[river wing]

fair, altho I wonder how big the gap will be between hard and nightmare
if it's anywhere similar to the gap between normal and hard, it's gonna be a cakewalk alright

[balmy topaz]

[junior fractal]

sims are saying Blessed Pango Charm is my best embellishment, guessing this is a bug?

[quiet ore]

it probably procs off slice n dice('s recuperator healing tag) and you have low vers, I'm guessing

[junior fractal]

yea only 5% vers atm

[primal holly]

yeah

don't use bte at below 6

[wraith mist]

Is blade rush completely mandatory in all builds?

[thorn parrot]

Yes as its basically tied into our tier as well

[river wing]

yeah we're BR gaming this season at the very least

(tbh not a big fan, it's good damage but it's also so boring)

[thorn parrot]

100% agree

[river wing]

wonder if next season could be KS tier
not even necessarily anything fancy, could just be stupid like
"KS resolves 50% faster and adds (CP) seconds to your AR/RtB effects" so that you could actually press it during AR without losing anything

[prisma bramble]

Chat are we cooked with tuning?

[river wing]

50/50
it ain't the best but it could be worse (poor Arms and Assa)

[jolly geyser]

Arms at the bottom of the ocean

[primal holly]

i'm gonna stick with outlaw until i need to switch for prog

going to be a pain to get two sets of gear but there we go

[wraith mist]

Im currently leveling an outlaw rogue (lvl 84) I often feel energy starved, will that be a problem at 90 as well?

[gaunt phoenix]

Yes until you get decent haste

[carmine mountain]

Solo I read what you wrote so for crafting you do MH and what boots or ring?

[wicked kestrel]

what's everyones stats looking like for outlaw? wish it was easier to switch between specs and not worrying about stats

[magic steppe]

!ui

[ornate heath]

Resources:

• ArcUI / BetterCDM - common suites for buff/cd customization
• WangBar - displays CPs/energy, customize colors per point, faster than Sensei
• MSUF - recommendation for unit frames
• Platynator - recommendation for nameplates (Jundies Profile)
  Misc:
• Clickable Raid Buffs - for poisons
• WilduTools - random QoL like melee range indicator, track cursor
• Mute Cold Blood sound - if we ever go back to this talent

[mystic berry]

petko puts in dead last bros, its so over

[ashen void]

it is about time petko finally answer

who let the dogs out

[errant lance]

Are we that bad 🙁

[pure folio]

All the specs best stat is haste? It's fairly easy, sub and outlaw like haste crit. assa is haste mast=crit

[pure folio]

we arent even bad

[rose kernel]

Sub wants mastery too tho

[pure folio]

Not saying it doesnt, they all do

p sure sub is also mast=crit

so they all use the same stat value essentially

only issue is making sure u have a non dagger for when u want to play outlaw

[rose kernel]

We are bad btw

having 0 aoe stops, mediocre dmg

no decent buff to the team

we for sure are down bad

We have fun tho :3

[delicate grail]

guys i have a question : Since we got stats squished and they made auto attack value more and while our Fatal Flourish give less energy from off hand attacks (8 down from 15) while it procs from pistol shot on top anymore and while we have vigor maxed out on main tree with tea and the requirement of haste is higher (27%) isnt it time to move to a slow off hand to win dmg ? cause iv seen a lot of dagger off hands in bis lists all around but im not sure if its still worth it since we can win auto attack dmg which values a lot currently

we lost some value tho on combat potency its 16 % down from 25 % forgot to mention that as a "nerf" to energy and 2% haste from alacrity but we cover that from gear so doesnt matter kinda

also iv been playing with this early gear and atm with double slow weapons at 17% haste and i rarely have energy issues

[gaunt phoenix]

slow offhand and fast offhand is the same weapon dps

it's also the same energy

the only reason to use dagger is for more Zero In procs

[delicate grail]

indeed is the same weapon dps but doesnt change when it comes to attack speed reductions from haste and SnD ? like u can get a slow weapon lower easily than a dagger which may have nerfs to attack speed heavier since its faster

idk just asking and for that reason i always believed a slow one is better if u have access to a lot of attack speed even tho its same dps

cause u reach the attack speed ratio reductions later with the slow one

idk if thats a thing tho

[gaunt phoenix]

No, attack speed is not any better or worse

[delicate grail]

so the same way u buff a dagger u buff a slow weapon aswell

without any thresholds

u sure ?

if thats the case then for sure dagger is better but i remember testing some attack speed limits just for fun in DF and i remember that i made a slow weapon in off hand a lot more valuable with more attack speed than a dagger even tho i ended up using a dagger back then cause slow weapon wasnt a match at all but i may be trippin idk

[tight kernel]

Aug is better than outlaw rn

[mystic berry]

aug? arms is better

[tight kernel]

Literally anything imo

But yall have your opinions

[nova sinew]

aug has extreme aura penalty but outlaw has aura bonus

[delicate grail]

yeah well we didnt get touched on the tunning thats sad indeed

[mystic berry]

the sin we committed is simming everything about our builds, we should live off vibes like enhance shamans

[tropic zephyr]

In DF attack speed was already normalized, weapon DPS and energy gains were the same

[tight kernel]

Bro what you expect.. you know who our dev is? I don’t. Prob some intern blizz picked up out of college who never played rogue and prob thinks he’s cooking and need to change the class cause last dev was dog

[mighty pivot]

UNIT_POWER_UPDATE, UNIT_POWER_FREQUENT

energize was from CLEU

[tight kernel]

Bro ret is hella sandbagging sims lmao

[nova sinew]

considering they didnt tune assa i dont think blizz is paying much attention to sims

[vapid sundial]

No you misunderstand

blizz doesnt care about rogue, besides sub

for some reason

[tight kernel]

No incorrect

[vapid sundial]

Its always been like that

[tight kernel]

We have no dedicated dev

Real issue

Give us a dev who plays rogue

[vapid sundial]

no class has a dedicated ev

from what i know

[tight kernel]

Gg ez fixes

[nova sinew]

i dont think gutting sub's 90s burst and aoe in general counts as caring but go off

[tight kernel]

Sub got an aoe nerf no?

[vapid sundial]

Depends what you care about

[tight kernel]

Psure udk with its 20% nerf still out performs

[vapid sundial]

blizz doesnt care about m+

they care about raid

[mystic berry]

its still bonkers

it was above 20% the other dps

which makes unholy dooming hilarious to me

[nova sinew]

idk if dk is tuned around "not having a raidbuff" or whatever

they just get a pass to be god class ig

[mystic berry]

we got a raid buff bro, atro bro

[nova sinew]

atro carrying rogue so hard bro

[mystic berry]

we gotta be balanced around atro

[vapid sundial]

Balanced around our low play rate

no1 plays rogue

[mystic berry]

lol

[vapid sundial]

may as well contribute to it

[tight kernel]

Play feral more fun

[mystic berry]

tbfh not many classes have the privilege of having no clear direction like the rogue

evoker maybe?

idk

[tight kernel]

In all reality if you’re only doing +12s outlaw is fine no one cares but gl if you’re pushing io without team

[nova sinew]

i actually think st stops will be used in raid maybe

[vapid sundial]

Evoker has a clear direction.

evoker direction is op or bust

[tight kernel]

I can’t wait for the 30 min lfg queue to get denied for a DK

[mystic berry]

feral is rogue, but with the privilege of having the druid dev

[nova sinew]

a few other things too xdd

[vapid sundial]

Druid buff, brez

[tight kernel]

Bro wym u got cables

And atro

[vapid sundial]

cables need to either be melee with no cast time

[tight kernel]

Gg op

[mystic berry]

and atro

[vapid sundial]

or ranged with cast time

idk whyt tyhe fuck

cables are

melee

and cast time

so unreal

[nova sinew]

idk i think

every healer should have brez and every dps have lust

[tight kernel]

Have you seen grey anatomy, cable realistic function hello?

I like immersive gameplay

[nova sinew]

everyone complains about mage but like

druid gets to be meta in literally every m+ season

[vapid sundial]

either a 9 foot elephant cow man

or a 2 foot fox man

but my immersion.

[jolly geyser]

druid is popular spec

[nova sinew]

i wonder if its because of their toolkit 🤔

[pure folio]

!oh

[ornate heath]

A dagger offhand is ~1% better than a slow weapon mostly because of Zero In, and also slightly more Instant Poison procs. Energy is not affected by offhand speed.

It is possible large ilvl differences can matter more than this bonus so use Raidbots Top Gear when in doubt.

[pure folio]

the answer is right there

[mystic berry]

druid is the most popular spec just by being the best at gathering

all the rest helps a lot

[vapid sundial]

No

ret is the most popular

lets not lie now

[jolly geyser]

well,class

[tight kernel]

Didn’t they change evasion

[jolly geyser]

spelling etc

[tight kernel]

Or am I dreaming

[mystic berry]

is it? last I seen, druids were at the top

in the data

[vapid sundial]

Ret every season is practically

the most popular

[cinder relic]

U know its the same one we've had for like, probably 5 years atp

[gray iris]

coming back for midnight. how rough is outlaw compared to daggers?

[tight kernel]

It’s okay guys the tier list and sim puts us a tier

[mystic berry]

ITS SHIT, RUN

[cinder relic]

The same one who created your favourite version

[tight kernel]

We are fine

[vapid sundial]

I have an ideda

[cinder relic]

no

[mystic berry]

they are revising us down now

[vapid sundial]

can we blame zac?

For his flaming realz?

SO the guy no longer comes here now

[jolly geyser]

did you post that tierlist btw Guy?

[tight kernel]

Nah we bring atro we fine

[mystic berry]

I wanna blame zac

[jolly geyser]

[gray iris]

i love seeing flat sub buffs and outlaw not touched. so didnt know if we were spicy or not

[mystic berry]

because he says "law tier fr"

[cinder relic]

I posted it like a month or two ago lmao

[jolly geyser]

shiiet

[vapid sundial]

zac is the reason outlaw didnt get buffed cuz he was #1 rogue as outlaw in m+

for sure

[mystic berry]

sub also brings atro

and like, 5% more damage

[tight kernel]

No stop

[mystic berry]

LOL

[tight kernel]

Don’t kill my cope

But outlaw sims higher wym?

[mystic berry]

as long as THAT sheet

dont get posted

[brave lagoon]

outlaw always sims higher, then the real world scenario hits and outlaw goes back to its rightful bottom place

[tight kernel]

Surely all tier is a flat patchwork fight with no damage amps that cd classes will zoom to the moon right

[mystic berry]

its alright

[pure folio]

@cinder relic what build do u use on calico, i cant find one i like this patch

[tight kernel]

Surely…

[cinder relic]

Do you guys ever get bored of this shit

Its literally every day

[mystic berry]

never

[cinder relic]

Holy fuck

[tight kernel]

Nah this way more fun that playing the game rn

?

[nova sinew]

outlaw only needs to compete with sub/assa in raid you realize those specs are awful at cleave right?

[cinder relic]

I need you guys to pick up new hobbies past going for rank 1 victim complex

[mystic berry]

this is what pre-season does to a man

[tight kernel]

Have you seen ret

[vapid sundial]

No thats DK discord

[mystic berry]

he dooms

[tight kernel]

Bro I’m trying to be like them

[cinder relic]

This discord is literally worse than balance druids

[tight kernel]

Can we delete the Channel once a week

[cinder relic]

Its so pathetic

[nova sinew]

i honestly think this is the best raid for outlaw in like a long time

[tight kernel]

Petition?

Let’s make a petition and shut down disc

[vapid sundial]

Okay but guy

Heres the thing

you are on the other end of the spectrum

where it seems like you think blizz can do no wrong

[cinder relic]

I legit havent played deadlock in a few weeks. Too busy with wow/slay the spire 2/poe

[brave lagoon]

rank1 victim is the fotm roller in my group that leveled a bear tank and then crashed out when the hotfix rolled out this week

[mystic berry]

We should only have a law channel when its patch day

[vapid sundial]

that is how u are percieved.

[tight kernel]

Bro we can’t even hit rank 1 victim wym

[mystic berry]

and patch day only

[cinder relic]

I dont??

[mystic berry]

then it gets deleted afterwards

[vapid sundial]

Yeah, but that's what people see from you with the way you talk.

its why people call you #1 shill

[cinder relic]

Then people should open their eyes and quit being so fucking stupid

[vapid sundial]

im not flaming

btw

[cinder relic]

I'm aware

[pure folio]

u shit u play sts2 too

[cinder relic]

Its just beyond fucking frustrating to have new people join this channel, ask about the class, and we have the village idiots just shitposting acting like the spec is LITERALLY THE WORST SPEC IN THE GAME REREOLL INSTANTLY LEAVE LEAVE LEAVE

Like jesus christ man

Just fucking stop it

[vapid sundial]

My normal response is 'we dont know yet'

[pure folio]

i have like 26 hours on it in the past week

[vapid sundial]

'wait until after heroic week'

[cinder relic]

LITERALLY MAN

How hard is it

[tight kernel]

Spec is dog

[shadow hawk]

Is outlaw good?

[tight kernel]

Straight up

It’s like league

[vapid sundial]

I doom about the design specifically .

[tight kernel]

I hate it but can’t stop

[mystic berry]

nah bro

[tight kernel]

What am I gonna do

[rose kernel]

I mean lets be honest, not a single class discord is social to newcomers. Don't expect this to be different

[cinder relic]

Why can't we try and be better

[wintry solar]

That's just untrue

[rose kernel]

oMg yOu AsKeD a QuEsTiOn tHaTs iN tHe PiNs

[cinder relic]

Why do we have to be the absolute lowest quality channel for new players trying to ask about the spec

[vapid sundial]

This spec channel is nice to new comers when outlaw is decent

[cinder relic]

Its a new expansion, the raid hasn't started, and half the channel is already convinved the spec is the worst spec in raid

[vapid sundial]

but start of a tier

its so aids

[cinder relic]

Like holy fuck

[tight kernel]

We are saving their time wym isn’t that nice

[cinder relic]

I hate you

[rose kernel]

I am just excited to play, and keeping an eye out for these channels to see some opinions

[mystic berry]

Same discussion we've had the other day

[vapid sundial]

Idk i made my choice

[mystic berry]

we can think law is busted af

[rose kernel]

so also, if ppl dont like the changes or think its bad

[mystic berry]

if the community think we are dogshit, we are dogshit

[vapid sundial]

[rose kernel]

Thats value

[cinder relic]

YOU ARE THE COMMUNITY

YOU ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM

[shadow hawk]

Bro, check shaman discord its the most shit class discord ive seen in my life

[mystic berry]

I dont make the lists lmao

[vapid sundial]

true

shaman discord

is pretty fkn bad

cant get any info there

its just ego

[mystic berry]

they are vibin there

[vapid sundial]

its like talking to ross and zac

perma

[cinder relic]

I mean we format well but holy fuck

the entire vibe of this channel is un-fucking-bearable sometimes

[vapid sundial]

Well