#outlaw

1 messages · Page 661 of 1

coarse parcel
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yeah I was just wondering if possible

balmy topaz
vivid vessel
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it will target first in macro

vivid vessel
slim hare
coarse parcel
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thats cleaver

vivid vessel
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I mean

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i use a macro for keys

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where i have some prio mobs

balmy topaz
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I move with double mouse click

vivid vessel
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usually its one mob a dungeon

balmy topaz
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so I can't use mouseover

formal knot
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i remember having a macro to target the shadowland affix orbs

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urh or something

vivid vessel
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cause you cant really do multiple diff mobs per dungeon

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but like i have it set so it target shards in hoa for example

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giants in gambit

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etc

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was most usefull in floodgate actually

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i would target the constructor guys with it

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but ye mostly can only have one mob a dungeon

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so its not practical like you would want something to auto set a focus on each pack

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its good to set a prio target per dungeon that you dont wanna lose when there is big pulls tho for example

versed inlet
#

havent played outlaw yet in MN, is it comp with sub in dungeons and raid?

vivid vessel
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no one knows

versed inlet
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well how was it before sub buf/nerf

vivid vessel
#

well no one knew either

versed inlet
#

nice

vivid vessel
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we dont have tier set, we dont have gear, and we dont have real content

balmy topaz
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are there dmg amps in raid

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I haven't even looked

radiant wyvern
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probably

buoyant cosmos
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He will guide us

brisk crypt
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Oh yes buff sub where are my outlaw buffs bro fuck sake

gleaming reef
#

Did rogues get any buffs in tuning?

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Where outlaw?

brisk crypt
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Only sub

gleaming reef
#

Oh no

buoyant cosmos
brisk crypt
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Because buff the 2 button spec

patent mirage
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it has been told in the ancient prophecy

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outlaw cannot be mentioned in the patch notes

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or else the world would be undone

tough salmon
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Outlaw is so broken. zac almost outdpsed me in m0s

gleaming reef
#

But guardian Druid most dps right?

arctic hollow
buoyant cosmos
#

Guardian rake or shread echo was hitting for like 60k+ in pvp lol

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200k in one tick

high obsidian
#

Anyone know if the thunderfury transmog for the dreadblades able to get in Midnight?

inland meteor
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yes

high obsidian
#

Gotta get the bindings and all that yeah? I been farming Neth's lair and haven't gotten a binding in like 20 runs

inland meteor
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ye

prime apex
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!ui

ornate heathBOT
unreal drum
#

is there any decent CDM outlaw packs atm? mines fine but im sure someone way more invested has made something better

fickle relic
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is it worth using bte with minimum combo points when i have 6 hidden bullets?

soft abyss
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6-7

jolly geyser
unkempt dew
#

I tried survival hunter. But nothing gives me the joy as Rogue

river wing
slate plaza
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Why are they buffing the rogue spec that looked the best..

ashen void
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it was an aoe nerf starege

livid pewter
mystic berry
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The dopamine of procs and rolling a jackpot

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Unmatched

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Might be an undiagnosed gambling addiction

wraith mist
#

Hello guys, I have dusted off my rogue which i haven´t played since outlaw was combat.. Is outlaw a good choice if i want an easy roation for both AoE and ST? I hate specs uses different builders and spenders for aoe and st... Also how is the survivability and solo potential?

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Bonus question is, if it´s possible to use talents that can perform decently in both st and aoe

fluid meadow
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man fck it combo point bar disappears after porting in dungeons (simple blizzard ui, nice)

toxic gate
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ok, dumb question of the day (just messing with outlaw some) SnD? Is that still a spell in Midnight?

devout ingot
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Slice and Dice is a thing for all specs but, they made a change a while back that using your main finisher for your spec(Dispatch for Outlaw) gives you Slice and Dice

carmine mountain
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applied automatically when you dispatch with cut to the chase you never press it manually SnD that is

toxic gate
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Ok, that's what i thought is that it was a passive now but was so confused for a second

carmine mountain
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I think in the rotation with the outlaw faq thats why we open with dispatch instead of BTE now but i just got back too so

jolly geyser
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Sure

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Make sure its the agi one

tiny maple
normal forge
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!fuu

ornate heathBOT
normal forge
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where can i see dps gain by tier of each rogue spec?

untold wadi
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not my proudest moment

jolly geyser
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shieeet

vapid sundial
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had to explain to someone who got glad before that , no, you cannot be using an int shield on prot pala

plush grove
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Random question but does anyone have that full class sim spreadsheet

midnight granite
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!fuu

ornate heathBOT
bold fractal
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quick question, so I hit CDG as soon as i get it always?

wintry leaf
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In theory, which is tankier? Fatebound or Trickster?

lethal oak
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When is Combat daggers coming back so we can swap for the fight whenever?

tranquil spruce
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Hey guys should we still use BTE off CD or wait for higher stacks of zero in usually?

unkempt dew
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We just go brrr

frail veldt
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Just gets consumed naturally

bold fractal
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so like full combo points ?

frail veldt
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At normal finisher condition

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We finish at 6+ cp

jolly aspen
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is it 5 or 6 for OL?

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oh it changes between trickster and fatebound

frail veldt
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6 for everything except dispatch as fatebound which is 5

prime vapor
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as someone who thoroughly enjoys OL, but can also understand that sub may be better, would it be a bad idea to craft a dagger and use it for off hand instead of crafting sword for MH?

jolly geyser
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got another craft coming on reset also

trim harbor
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@frail veldt i saw you and zac talking about ayije could you help me with something regarding it i know youre familiar with it

frail veldt
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I only messed with it a little honestly didn't like it that much personally

jolly aspen
frail veldt
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There's a VERY low chance you will have to play outlaw

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I don't think that's happened once in the last 3 xpacs

jolly aspen
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i havent played outlaw in years but at least its more tolerable now for me with the midnight changes

frail veldt
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Yeah they made it more beginner friendly for sure

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The approachable expansion

jolly aspen
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i raid lead on rogue it kills me to play OL

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its too fast

dark ember
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Can m33kauras still like.... make a custom single-button rotation-like assistant?

Using the single-button assistant as a visual guide is actually how I used to set up my WAs, but WAs are gone now. The single button assistant is honestly almost good but just has a few quirks for us that makes it a no-go. Attempting to quest with war mode and the poisons blocking the use of it is one example, let alone combo inefficiencies

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I still don't understand how to install m33kauras and am wondering if what it can still do is worth learning how

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It'd just be dumb if ability information was secret info because.... dude I can see it. It's on my bars.

ashen void
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The point of a secret or a private aura isnt to make impossible for players to see

dark ember
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Yeah the point is to make Ion feel like he's earning his paycheck

ashen void
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holy good one you sure showed him

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have you considered going on tour? really original content HOLY

dark ember
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(I know people who used WA as an accessibility tool that can no longer play, still sour about it. I honestly agree with a lot of the aspects of the modpocalypse, on the encounter side. But mangling player UI options was a bit overboard.)

cinder relic
frail veldt
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We don't have access to buffs or procs or anything

prime vapor
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thats why im hesitant, cause i know for M+ im going to want to play OL but for any raid environment ill probably go sub or sin instead, im also considering just not crafting a weapon and just doing armor/jewelry embellishments, but that just feels bad imo

frail veldt
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Can't do any scripting of your rotation

dark ember
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Yeah that's what I figured. I think I'll try my best to find a CDM reskinner that can give me more visual options at least.

jolly geyser
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You could be demonic and craft sword and dagger on the same day come reset

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but eeh

crisp elm
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if it was a goal to get into a better guild, think itd be fine to send outlaw for raid ( i enjoy it more). im assuming theyd just be looking for parse in general not specifically spec wise right?

frail veldt
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Really depends on the level of guild

crisp elm
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say a cutting edge

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maybe like top 1000?

dark ember
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Can someone do that command that spits out the cool resource links like that addons with platy and whatnot

frail veldt
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Prob should multispec

crisp elm
jolly geyser
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!ui

ornate heathBOT
dark ember
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ty

frail veldt
crisp elm
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i just dont wanna fuck up crafts lol bc id be outlaw for m+

random stirrup
# crisp elm say a cutting edge

had a friend come back this tier after not progging since sanctum of domination and rogue is so underplayed that they are desperate (as usual)

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if you really want to onetrick outlaw because you like it its probably fine

storm whale
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any new roll the bones tracker

random stirrup
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if you want to move up ranks a lot then playing the actually useful rogue specs will be beneficial but still people like loktark exist

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so you can just law it up

crisp elm
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hmm good points, maybe i just send law, i wanna keep my goals realistic too, possibly could get more sweaty next tier w multispecing

random stirrup
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outlaw is also the hardest by far to play well and has been as long as I’ve been playing so if you can play it you can multi spec without too much trouble

soft abyss
# crisp elm ty appreciate it

being in that spot I'd say that multi spec is not 100% needed but if let's say you play assa and assa is bottom spec you should be able to play sth else

random stirrup
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especially with midnight changes

crisp elm
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ya im not concerned performance wise for multispec, just dont wanna fuck up first crafts and be down bad for weeks til catchup

unkempt cypress
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U shittin me m+ ot out until 24

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Gah

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Release the content blizz wtf

fluid meadow
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anyone tried 1 button gameing? holy the energy is legit balanced around that gameplay btw? zero tea useage cause of gcd penalty, sure zero dps, but really they are doing the things around that?

unkempt cypress
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I aint tryin to rp for a month

slate cliff
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Hey!

sand dew
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Anyone have a ArcUi profile?

arctic hollow
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Damn I forgot how making an interface from scratch can be time consuming. I'm trying out some of the recommended addons in !ui.
Is Midnight SUF out of date ? I get loads of LUA errors on load. ( just addon conflict with arcui seems like)
Which addons of the list are the best for a simple low maintenance, low automation interface ?

Does someone have a Better cooldown manager profile i could look at and tweak a bit please ?

frail veldt
burnt dragon
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wonder how accurate these are

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this is post 3/17 balancing

craggy barn
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arcui has profiles

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kinda janky tho

plucky echo
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guys how do u move roll the bones timer in bcm now

arctic hollow
elfin forum
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yes

plucky echo
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doesnt let me move it

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:(

elfin forum
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Select cooldown manager

plucky echo
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OOOHHHHHHHHH

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ur the best @elfin forum thanks

elfin forum
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no problem

tender wedge
unique fulcrum
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which trinkets do we run atm?

thorn parrot
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I bought the void one because Ive had the worst luck with trinkets lol

tight kernel
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BRO THE OUTLAW CHANGES

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LFGGG

glass mortar
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once u get appropriate haste you should only really run out if u make mistakes or get bad rng as usual

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but if a fight forces u to vial/feint nearly on cd (say ur trying to survive after a healer death) you will also run out more often

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so naturally with energy tuned that tightly slowing down the gcd by 20% or w/e the 1 button tax is makes it feel like u never run out

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LOL @vivid vessel

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@frail veldt

arctic hollow
craggy quiver
arctic hollow
glass mortar
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both r bad

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getting changes is definitly prefered by most people i think tho, rather then just being ignored

untold wadi
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becuase then we would still have df/tww outlaw

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and all would b right w the world

lime lake
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you would never have gotten df/tww outlaw

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peoples answer to which is worse will legit just change based on how they feel about their spec currently

craggy quiver
frail veldt
frail veldt
stuck mountain
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how is Outlaw looking for the raid? I'm really enjoying it in dungeons, wondering if I can stay with one spec

craggy quiver
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If you really like it just play it

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Many of us here one trick outlaw forever in raid

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Maybe besides dimmy

cinder relic
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Sub still has burst aoe ofc but it'll depend how the fights play out in practice

stuck mountain
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assa cleave isn't bad

rocky canopy
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Outlaw tier baby

cinder relic
#

Correct but assas damage is bad

rocky canopy
#

Bro sin is on par with guardian Druid rn 💀

cinder relic
#

So it's hard to say

gaunt phoenix
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We're so barack

cinder relic
#

Subs low target sustained cleave kinda ass now

patent mirage
#

outlaw

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more like pog law

rocky canopy
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Sub cleave is ahh

gaunt phoenix
#

We're so barak kodobane

rare rapids
#

!fuu

ornate heathBOT
wide flare
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no changes annouced for the next patch?

glass mortar
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a raid of low target cleave

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mm is gunna be god tier isnt it

lilac lion
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So wich specc could be strong in Raid?

craggy quiver
glass mortar
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ive seen sims of MM and their sim jumps like 90% dps going from 1t-2t

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idk what they did to that spec

viscid shuttle
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grappling hook fixed? why its so fast again

dark ember
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Why does BTE have to be used at 6+ but Dispatch is acceptable at 5+

glass mortar
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because 5+ is the flipping coins threshold for fatebound and bte has more conditionals on CPs spent on it (higher chance to refund from ace)

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dispatch has mods that make u want to cast it more often as well in fatebound, it has a higher chance to flip the same coin you already have

inland meteor
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havent checked

dark ember
#

Damn, even if risking CP waste?

If I'm sitting 5 CP, and have both Sin Strike and Opportunity, which should I press? Opp because it dumps it and is more energy efficient?

glass mortar
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SS if you arent capped on opp stacks, opp otherwise

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and yes, the threshold for finishing is basically just a war of efficiency vs wastage and value of higher CP finishers

haughty wigeon
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According to this

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Outlaw is fine

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:3

lime lake
inland meteor
obtuse schooner
glass mortar
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yea people were saying feral was gunna be wild with those buffs

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but there isnt much pure ST in this raid tier from what im hearing so i wonder how their cleave is

vivid vessel
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Why did we fell off we didn't even get nerfed

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We were simming 115 last time he posted the sheet kekw

lime lake
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emotional damage from not being in notes

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trauma is real

glass mortar
vivid vessel
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Y

glass mortar
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i thought i remember seeing us the same place everytime its been posted

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mid

vivid vessel
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Nope

glass mortar
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115k would certainly not have been mid, even on the old sheet

vivid vessel
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It was in the top 10

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With dk being 145 tho

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So there was a big gap

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But yes

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We looked toward the top

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10% aura nerf hit us hard bro

frail veldt
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@vivid vessel the pango persists through mount its amazing

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why did dk lose 40% damage from a 20% nerf

haughty wigeon
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I think bug fixes

frail veldt
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who made that even

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I thought a lot of sims werent done

rare rapids
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are there trinket sims anywhere?

lime lake
frail veldt
#

this shit is so goofy

image.png
inland meteor
#

im a haranir hater

frail veldt
#

I think haranir is the best allied race theyve added in years

cinder relic
#

The year is 20xx, we are still using st patchwork sims to evaluate how strong a spec is in raid

lime lake
frail veldt
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all I know is if outlaw isnt in the top 5% on patchwerk, its gona suck

dull lintel
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does outlaw need the tier set and like 0 mastery to start feeling good to do in mythics? I feel like I am doing half the damage on outlaw as i was on sub

frail veldt
#

truke

lime lake
inland meteor
#

sub to me is the most dog water feeling spec in the game

frail veldt
#

youre probably making rotational mistakes

random stirrup
cinder relic
#

Hmm in the low target cleave raid I will evaluate spec strength by st patchwork sims

empty tulip
frail veldt
spring hornet
#

Does Zero in change when I press BTE? In my normal rotation am I supposed to wait to maximize zero in stack count before using bte?

glass mortar
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it doesnt and u dont need to even track it

frail veldt
#

outlaws low target cleave talent is gone

inland meteor
dull lintel
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im probably gonna need to log a key or 2, and post them if i am doing rotational things wrong

glass mortar
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our cleave also isnt free anymore because BF has a maintenance tax

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at least if its low target cleave maybe we dont need to take the aoe talents tho

grizzled ravine
#

hello is there an addon for trackin Roll the Bones ?

glass mortar
#

looks like law still loses like 10% ST going aoe builds

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which is always ass feeling in raid

frail veldt
#

pressing BF in low target with poor cp gen from it is gona be rough

inland meteor
frail veldt
#

its pretty expensive energy wise

glass mortar
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well if u dont play deft

inland meteor
#

just track buff bar with cdm

glass mortar
#

BF doesnt cost as much

grizzled ravine
frail veldt
#

oh true

glass mortar
#

would u play deft if the maximum target count on a fight was like 3?

frail veldt
#

but if you dont then you can barely keep the uptime I thought

empty tulip
#

i just track it with luxthos' CDM layout

frail veldt
#

wait

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dancing steel is the uptime

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so youd run dancing steel prob only

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just for the duration

empty tulip
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and if its not level 1 i am happy and extend lol

vivid vessel
frail veldt
#

The year is 20xx and were still pretending outlaw doesnt need to sim high to be good

vivid vessel
#

Xdd

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Bro gonna say it every season

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I swear

patent mirage
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the year is 2525

vivid vessel
#

I understand wanting to be the non dooming guy

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But idk

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We know how outlaw works by now

inland meteor
#

just shoot enemy in head what can he do ?

sturdy crow
#

Week 1 good. Week 10 who

cinder relic
#

I've already reroll Ed

dull lintel
#

i was struggling getting above like 50k dps on outlaw

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but sub i could easily spike over 100k dps

cinder relic
empty tulip
#

ya the burst spec can spike

haughty wigeon
#

so we're okay :)

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prep is a grade A ability

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🏄‍♂️ peeposurf

dull lintel
#

i know outlaw is not a bursty spec, but idk if theres something im doing wrong rotation wise

inland meteor
#

over 100k dps spikes are definitely possible with outlaw

river wing
#

ran another world tour, now with some more experience and a proper damage meter instead of the default one
240 ilvl, can't really beat the WW monk friend ngl, like constantly tailing him, but he does like 60k overalls and I end up doing maybe 55k, give or take 5k for each of us
is that bad?

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generally beat him by 5k on bosses but lose on packs

thorn parrot
#

interesting your losing on packs, what were pack counts? or was it just all pack pulls?

frail veldt
river wing
#

just pulling everything between spaces

frail veldt
#

I think ive seen others doing 90k+

sturdy crow
frail veldt
#

?

river wing
summer swan
#

how is outlaw these days

frail veldt
summer swan
#

for m+

frail veldt
#

I was doing 55k overall at 200ilvl on outlaw

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so you def have room to go up

thorn parrot
#

^

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Im doing 100ks on pack pulls as well at 224ilvl

cinder relic
river wing
cinder relic
#

Like both packs and bosses die super super fast

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I think m+ will give us more time to actually hit mobs

frail veldt
#

yeah early m+ we do better then later m+ when people pull bigger we start to do worse again

cinder relic
#

Unless overtuned but yeah

mystic berry
#

uncap law NOW!

thorn parrot
#

Hell just bump the cap to 12 ffs

jolly geyser
#

Cap law more now!

lime lake
#

outlaw should cap at 2t

frail veldt
#

true

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thatd be fun

lime lake
#

but also not be particularly good there

inland meteor
#

outlaw should be reworked into a ranged dual gunslinger spec whos with me

thorn parrot
river wing
frail veldt
#

outlaws pretty front loaded damage wise

wintry leaf
#

I'm theory, which is tankier, Fatebound or Trickster?

frail veldt
#

it doesnt really have any ramp

frail veldt
summer swan
#

AR uptime is low right?

frail veldt
#

differences are marginal

wintry leaf
#

Ok, ty

frail veldt
summer swan
#

i mean on df s3

mystic berry
#

Solo will meme 2 charges adr for us

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No worries

river wing
#

but like
I know sims ain't everything, but my Dslice is like 58k also

thorn parrot
patent mirage
#

why stop there

frail veldt
#

at 240 ilvl???

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thats a really low sim

river wing
frail veldt
#

what talents are you running

patent mirage
#

make bf its original version

frail veldt
#

whats your haste at

patent mirage
#

attacking only 2 targets

jolly geyser
#

@cinder relic good numbers on that tweet btw you fucker

river wing
#

wowhead M+ build

thorn parrot
#

Yeah thats the right one

river wing
frail veldt
#

thats def low

river wing
#

lemme put this through a sim again

frail veldt
#

but still

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yeah could you link your sim

thorn parrot
#

^

river wing
#

yeah gimme a mo

summer swan
frail veldt
summer swan
#

how much do we need

frail veldt
#

im 224 rn

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and its simming 59k dslice

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so sometihngs wrong lol

frail veldt
#

need

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but haste is our best stat

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up until around 21 I believe

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then crit becomes better

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or at least similar

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I also have 15% haste in this

summer swan
#

i got 15 haste too rn

frail veldt
#

yeah that looks right

thorn parrot
#

Fuck id kill for that ilvl

river wing
summer swan
#

i did with full buffs

summer swan
frail veldt
#

wait nvm

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hmm this is weirdly low for your ilvl haha

thorn parrot
#

I mean you have a lot of mastery im not gonna lie

glass mortar
#

ur also simming with a trinket that does almost nothing

summer swan
#

so for cleave aeo outlaw is ahead of sub? with nerfs?

glass mortar
#

crucible is bugged and doesnt work for us in sims

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the crit doesnt proc

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ur just getting the agi, unless its been fixed

frail veldt
#

oh wait I simmed myself in st build

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and was still higher than you at 20ilvl lower

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lol

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the fuck

glass mortar
#

mewos pvp trinket is also showing as 276 ilvl in his sim

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idk if thats just a tooltip bug

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surely its not simming at that value

frail veldt
#

sim says 224 ilvl

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in m+ correct build im at 60k

livid pewter
frail veldt
#

I have no raid buffs on here

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just consumes

river wing
inland meteor
frail veldt
#

66% increase from buffs

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thats not right

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lol

thorn parrot
#

This is so funny to read lol

near holly
#

my ST sim was 66666 and i think its a sign

river wing
mystic berry
#

no buffs

next wedge
river wing
#

ok so I'm somehow 20k behind in sims

next wedge
#

ohhh we're doing dslice

mystic berry
river wing
#

ye, dslice

glass mortar
#

i mean dslice isnt meant to be a 1:1 with any dungeon in the game

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its a calculator for ur aoe gear

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wouldnt necessarily be trying to compare it directly to dungeon overalls

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thats rarely accurate

inland meteor
#

yeah its kinda just like a sim of those 100k dps packs right

frail veldt
vivid vessel
glass mortar
#

i mean

frail veldt
glass mortar
#

u say buffs couldnt be that big

vivid vessel
#

I'm on phone

frail veldt
#

and my dps is higher

next wedge
#

no buffs

#

im at 239 too

river wing
#

ok what's the trick here...

glass mortar
#

mewo ur no buff sim also has lust on

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which is not a small impact for outlaw anymore

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not huge obviously

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but still

frail veldt
near holly
thorn parrot
#

its gotta be cruicible as the common denominator no?

glass mortar
#

sure htis guys no buff sim has nothing tho

frail veldt
#

I guess I never turn that off cuz every group has that

glass mortar
#

no food, no lust

#

no anything

frail veldt
#

so his sim is just sandbagged

glass mortar
#

i mean

frail veldt
#

kinda went down a rabbit hole anyway lol

glass mortar
#

idk what sangbagged means

frail veldt
#

point was

livid pewter
glass mortar
#

these numbers arent supposed to represent anything but a comparison between gear for sim purposes

frail veldt
#

overall in an m0 as outlaw 240ilvl should be in the ballpark of 70-90k

glass mortar
#

none of these are accuratly simming dungeon dps

#

thats not really the point of it

frail veldt
#

if not more

glass mortar
#

as long as ur consistent with ur settings thats all that matters

next wedge
#

supercharge seems so ass now

glass mortar
#

and if ur comparing to other peoples dslice make sure ur using the same settings as well, obviously

frail veldt
#

we were just trying to get an idea of what overall they should be doing

inland meteor
glass mortar
#

sure

#

but like

#

dslice isnt gunna help that much with it idk

frail veldt
#

I know they brought it up

#

cuz they said their dslice was only 50k

glass mortar
#

im 238 ilvl and i did 62k dps on the m0 i did last night

near holly
glass mortar
#

this was the dps i did on the m0 i did this morning

cinder relic
glass mortar
#

its m0

thorn parrot
#

Horny

cinder relic
#

I think sub lowkey the worst rogue spec but we will see

glass mortar
#

what r u gunna do

cinder relic
#

@sub players

glass mortar
#

ur dps is in the hands of how ur tank pulls moreso then anything really

frail veldt
#

I mean true

glass mortar
#

i didnt lose 20k dps because i was playing bad or gear

inland meteor
#

yeah for sure, i dont think ive gotten close to 90k overall

pastel cedar
#

My tank pulls 4 mobs at a time

glass mortar
#

^ that was the dungeon i just linked

frail veldt
#

yeah if your tank is standing still between pulls and pulling tiny packs then thats fucked

glass mortar
#

i think i hit target cap 1 time the entire dungeon

inland meteor
#

but ive also only pugged

jolly geyser
frail veldt
#

but even ST youre doing what like 35k at least?

river wing
#

ST-wise, I was doing like 40k at least

pastel cedar
#

Outlaw bis m+ sub bis in raid

livid pewter
#

idk if im the only one who didnt care about minmaxing in m0? ii just wanted to get gear to be prepared for m+

frail veldt
#

yeah 43k overall weran idk what that is haha

#

thats like a single target fight the whole dungeon

glass mortar
#

i mean look at the other overalls

frail veldt
#

ive seen damage meter do that though

glass mortar
#

it was literally

frail veldt
#

where it just reads wrong

glass mortar
#

3-4 targets every pack

frail veldt
#

for the whole group

glass mortar
#

and ST

frail veldt
#

like its just giga low

glass mortar
#

and yes there was a lot of ST

#

because there was a lot of mismatched hp in this dungeon

#

so we'd have 1 guy left alive for 30s

#

and tank would not move

frail veldt
#

but even if it was pure ST shouldnt your dps be over 43k

glass mortar
#

not at this ilvl

#

i think i sim for like 40k

frail veldt
#

oh I figured you were like 240ilvl

river wing
#

like here's the last dungeon we ran today, the void arena one

image.png
vivid vessel
hardy vault
#

that frostmage is sandbagging

cinder relic
#

On the lowks

frail veldt
vivid vessel
#

Bro..

#

It's bait

cinder relic
#

It's not bait

frail veldt
#

its bait

vivid vessel
#

It's always bait

frail veldt
#

dont do it

cinder relic
#

Low target cleave raid = not sub

vivid vessel
#

Every tier they get us guy

cinder relic
#

Trust

hardy vault
#

sub progression spec once again

frail veldt
#

its bait

vivid vessel
#

And then

#

It's a sub tier

glass mortar
#

oh you know what mewo

frail veldt
#

sup

glass mortar
#

we softwiped to a boss

vivid vessel
#

Don't get hit by the propaganda guy

cinder relic
#

U have to trust me

vivid vessel
#

You know nebtter

glass mortar
#

and the entire party except tnak was dead for like 2 minutes

#

while the tank solod it

vivid vessel
#

Bro I cannot ..

frail veldt
#

aaaaaaaaaah

glass mortar
#

that probably nuked us all

#

very hard

frail veldt
#

for sure

#

100p

vivid vessel
#

It's a sub tier again ..

frail veldt
#

bait

pastel cedar
#

If it’s sub tier wtf I do with my crafted sword? Can I return it?

jolly geyser
#

its a sin tier

cinder relic
frail veldt
#

do people even consider the first 4 bosses as prog?

inland meteor
fluid iron
#

fact checked

cinder relic
#

It's the later bosses that are Low target cleave

#

Not just the early ones

#

Js

vivid vessel
#

Guy..

frail veldt
#

burst cleave?

vivid vessel
#

Stop it bro ..

frail veldt
#

sub tier

#

wait

#

wait

vivid vessel
#

We all know it's a sub tier again ..

frail veldt
#

zac

#

guy

vivid vessel
#

He is baiting mewo

wintry solar
frail veldt
#

put your sparks where your mouth is

#

craft sword

vivid vessel
#

What

frail veldt
#

do it

fluid iron
#
  • sub just got like a 6% single target buff
vivid vessel
#

No way I'm crafting sword

#

I'm not a inter bro

fluid iron
#

its finna go nice

frail veldt
#

im talking to guy

vivid vessel
frail veldt
#

its not an int

vivid vessel
#

Ah

frail veldt
#

its an outlaw tier

vivid vessel
#

He isn't a inter

frail veldt
#

craft sword

vivid vessel
#

He won't craft sword

frail veldt
#

but low target cleave

#

craft sword

jolly geyser
#

craft a neck to throw people off

vivid vessel
#

@cinder relic show the sword craft buddy Clueless

frail veldt
#

do it

#

I mean unless you arent sure

cinder relic
#

We don't craft until later

vivid vessel
#

Craft now nothing to lose ..

frail veldt
#

let us know when you send your first craft 🙂

vivid vessel
#

It's outlaw tier ..

jolly geyser
#

craft a shield

next wedge
#

outlaw in rwf

hardy vault
#

oh waits it's patchwerk

cinder relic
pastel cedar
#

The day I see outlaw on an end boss I’ll drop to my knees

lethal oak
#

Guy is trying to bait me in to sword craft

#

I need an adult

hardy vault
#

he already did for me lol @lethal oak

cinder relic
#

I mean u should wait until mythic imho

fluid iron
hardy vault
#

i'll craft a sword no matter what

#

outlaw copium train

inland meteor
pastel cedar
#

Based

frail veldt
#

I either play outlaw

#

or I dont play rogue

inland meteor
#

real

hardy vault
#

okay wtf is that dude doing simming 80k

#

from earlier

haughty wigeon
#

oyi

#

i forget

next wedge
haughty wigeon
#

what changes we want on outlaw? so i can post on the "Feedback" thread on the ptr forums?

hardy vault
#

(had it clicked from st still)

cinder relic
#

Prep to just be 2 charges, ace to be changed to a 1pointer. Buff atrophic and mind numbing

wintry solar
#

Add MFD

inland meteor
#

roll the bones off the gcd i beg

#

😠

jolly geyser
#

add back aoe blind

wintry solar
#

Give outlaw 2 charges of kidney

river wing
next wedge
#

AOE BLIND PLEASE

hardy vault
#

okay i sim 55k dungeon slice with phys comp ( copium ) buffs

pastel cedar
#

Remove RTB RNG just have it give jackpot Everytime

wintry solar
#

Just roll better

#

??

pastel cedar
#

Right my fault

wintry solar
#

Yeah

pastel cedar
#

Let me press the key better

vivid vessel
#

Hot take but I would rather keep st ccs if they actually make them good, aka be on a different Dr than AOE cc, and not cost all my combo points

wintry solar
#

There you go

pastel cedar
#

Maybe I’m too harsh

jolly geyser
#

I got 3 in row

next wedge
#

if blind wouldnt be insta cancelled then it might be good

haughty wigeon
#

ar haste tax removed

bte more damage

aces on talent point

ks does more prio target on main target

prep to be 2 charges instead of a button

buff poisons

blade flurry energy talent reduced

soft cap instead of hard cap

vanish on restlessblades

kir adds level on your roll

ho replaced with somethign else

fast action is 6 second cdr, adds a charge to bte, bte ignores armor (like havocs a fire inside capstone)

wintry solar
#

There's suppose to be a dmg threshold but idk about that

haughty wigeon
#

anything else?

vivid vessel
haughty wigeon
#

ah yes sorry, i add that too

jolly geyser
#

blind could make mobs have higher chance to hit after breaking it

hardy vault
#

dh still not being able to sim dungeonslice is such bs

vivid vessel
#

Also fuck prep just give us ADR 2 charges

#

The actual thing we need

#

Not this ass

inland meteor
#

also fix bug that makes BTE dmg number not pop up

jolly geyser
#

not hit

haughty wigeon
potent ore
#

any first craft recommendations yet?

haughty wigeon
#

will expand in the forum post

#

kk

#

so we're all in agreement then

vivid vessel
wintry solar
#

Prep gives 2 charges

vivid vessel
#

Noob!

haughty wigeon
#

oop my bad

#

rip

#

im washed

#

fr fr

vivid vessel
#

For keys

#

Is what's needed

#

For rogue to have utility again

#

And an actual niche

#

Let me be king of st ccs again

#

Let me be relevant

glass mortar
#

remove energy cost from feint and/or give evasion DR baseline and additional DR on elus

#

make crimson vial do something

pastel cedar
#

Every defensive and CV off GCD

glass mortar
#

how is this spell so unchanged/untouched for a decade when its supposed to be our core self heal

jolly geyser
#

should make crimson vial have dmg reduction also

inland meteor
glass mortar
#

yea or i was thinking something like its duration is increased everytime you take damage while its ticking up to a max

ashen oracle
#

!ui

ornate heathBOT
glass mortar
#

so like 4-8S, doubled healing if you use it with a big dot on urself

#

give us something a little stronger vs our weakest damage type to deal with

#

it still wouldnt be amazing

haughty wigeon
glass mortar
#

id actually be quite happy with a rogue that lost a bunch of passive defensiveness but was still very strong actively. if they just added more tankiness into our active kit

#

and also using the active kit during high damage punished ur rotation less

#

energy is too "well balanced" for all these buttons to cost energy dead

cinder relic
#

Energy isn't that bad

#

Can we be in reality

glass mortar
#

i didnt say it was bad

#

i said it was "well balanced" meaning if anything happens that makes u spend more then the exact amount of the rotation, you notice it immediatly and begin having downtime

ashen oracle
#

hey i replaced Sensei with WangBar since Sensei kept giving me tons of LUA errors, but can WangBar display the HP bar above energy like sensei ?

cinder relic
#

You don't press feint 2-3 times in a fight and "instantly have downtime"

glass mortar
#

i mean you literally can, ive had that exacpt thing happen to me in the open world several times. the more u use these things the less free budget u have over a fight

#

i guess if anything, in a raid ur much less likely to cast feint back to back and vial at the same time

#

so it will be less of an issue

cinder relic
#

How are u running out of 3 charges of tea in the open world

glass mortar
#

by fighting stuff constantly for prey or doing the world events like voidstorm where u fight stuff constantly and facetank elites

cinder relic
glass mortar
#

i didnt say our defensives were constrained by our energy ive never been unable to cast them

river wing
#

actually I wonder if adding tea to restless would help energy
probably not much

glass mortar
#

id just prefer to not lose any dps gcds from just the energy loss to them

lethal oak
glass mortar
#

but that is a good point for sin and the other specs

#

make feint free for all of us!

#

they shouldnt ever be constrained by energy to press this button

cinder relic
#

Not meant for a reply

wintry solar
#

Discord noob!

upper hawk
#

lrn2chatnoob

rose grove
#

Do you think Outlaw is now the go to spec for m+, after sub nerfs ?

cinder relic
#

Potentially. Sin does a lot of funnel

potent ore
cinder relic
#

Funnel in raid is kinda fake usually

rose grove
#

Raid i think sub is the way to go, cause it gets huge single target buffs

cinder relic
#

I think a lot of fights this tier are fairly melee cleave, and new sub kinda sucks at that

#

It's good at burst ofc

#

So it'll depend how mythic plays out in practice yk

glass mortar
#

if low target cleave is the most relevant target type in this raid its honestly hard to feelcraft who will be good

#

i feel like its hard to tell who has good low target cleave unless u actively play a spec

#

like outlaws is good

#

its the worst its ever been with the low target cleave talent gone, but its still probably the best of the rogue specs

#

i cant imagine how id compare it to other classes tho

#

its def just a wait and see

inland meteor
#

do we use blade flurry talents for cleave bosses?

glass mortar
#

PW sims tell u nothing, aoe sims usually dont tell u much either, because cleave builds exist between those two worlds

#

idk

#

solo question/play the bosses question

#

how much boss damage matters, how long/many targets the cleave is matters for that

cinder relic
#

Yep

#

Sims have 2 main purposes. Neither are "what spec is the best in raid"

#

3 I guess technically

#

But it's still not "what spec do I play in raid"

glass mortar
#

like feral post buffs looks like the best ST spec in the game

#

if they dont scale like that with cleave, and theres like 1 st boss in the raid tho

#

how valuable is that sim info

#

its gunna be an interesting tier for sure

#

@vivid vessel fine u baited me into doing it

cinder relic
#

Bottom 3 dps in the game, one of the literal God specs for prog

#

Like when will ppl learn sims are fake for shit like this

#

Sims are good for

Finding upgrades
Figuring out optimizations
Identifying spec strengths and damage profiles

glass mortar
#

i mean people like to play the game of speculate who will be good in raid always and the only info u really have for that is sims

#

ive never taken it too seriously anyway but also im not a numbers guy

#

unless something else peeks my fancy i'll just play outlaw even in the TWW s3s of the game so

#

its all irrelevant to me

#

but yea u shouldnt decide on a main before raids even out based on sims basically ever

#

thats very silly

#

unless ur using sims to like... see the rotation and builds and what class might interest u that way

#

ive done that before when u dont have logs avail

cinder relic
#

Like, even a fight like forge weaver, I think there's a world u look at that fight on heroic and say "this could be an outlaw fight"

haughty wigeon
#

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/rogue-feedback-thread-for-patch-1205/2271246/6

World of Warcraft Forums
Rogue feedback thread for patch 12.0.5

because theres no proper feedback thread, im going to post on here despite my better judgement. this is a list of things that will improve outlaw rogue thats agreed upon by the ravenholdt community that will benefit every type of player in terms of design and spec flow. this list is based on design/flow only not for damage, damage is something w...

#

its done

vivid vessel
#

Not reading all that noob

cinder relic
#

But then you know, the fight on mythic, I practice was "kill the orbs instantly and kill him in burn phase"

#

I mean even nexus king, if you squint a bit, it could have been a law fight, but then damage amp, and huge importance of platform damage which sub solo solves

haughty wigeon
glass mortar
#

i wonder if theres the potential for prep to give us some hyper unique fight where theres a moderate damage amp window for like 30s on a fight and u lust it

#

i dont know if anyone elses burst can go that long

#

with prep u can have AR for a full 30s tho

frigid shale
#

!fuu

ornate heathBOT
glass mortar
#

oh WW would be able to break a fight like that actually

#

and boomkin i guess

#

they still have 2 charges of their cd right

wispy valve
glass mortar
#

20s still a bit too short plenty of major cds are 15-20s, but yea thats close

#

everytime i play prep im like why the hell is this thing on the gcd

wispy valve
#

they NEED to remove prep from gcd man

livid pewter
#

we are in first week of new exp and people go full ham kekdog

cinder relic
#

Like what timer is this on

jolly geyser
normal forge
#

one of a kind is just super weak tbh

wispy valve
normal forge
#

prep has good potential, but i think it should benefit from CDR

#

and then like, if we need burst we can ks > prep > ks, assumig ks dmg would be decent

jolly geyser
#

dont cook KS builds

glass mortar
#

prep would not make sense on cdr

#

it is not supposed to be a talent to just increase raw ADR uptime by a bunch

vivid vessel
wispy valve
#

2/3 yea

#

afiak

#

3rd in journal

molten gazelle
#

been years since i played outlaw properly does it matter if we go dagger or slow 1h on offhand ?

cinder relic
#

Daggers are preferred

zinc briar
#

i preff diying

#

we dont even have enough energy for the dps rotation

cinder relic
#

Ur just wrong about that lol

jolly geyser
#

are you doing bad ragebaits or are you slow?

molten gazelle
torn lichen
jolly geyser
#

oh that way

glass mortar
#

!oh

ornate heathBOT
#

A dagger offhand is ~1% better than a slow weapon mostly because of cs Zero In, and also slightly more instantpoison Instant Poison procs. Energy is not affected by offhand speed.

It is possible large ilvl differences can matter more than this bonus so use raidbots Raidbots Top Gear when in doubt.

glass mortar
#

its been the case for a long time, usually it was small enough people didnt care tho

#

its the biggest gap its been in awhile so its worth aiming for daggers

junior coral
#

did zac release his ui yet <3333? @vivid vessel

gaunt phoenix
#

did zac release his ui yet <3333? @vivid vessel

vivid vessel
#

no

#

higly garded secret

glass mortar
#

did zac release his ui yet <3333? @vivid vessel

vivid vessel
#

national security

junior coral
#

all good, just didnt want to miss out on the list

molten gazelle
junior coral
#

akin to the Epstein

vivid vessel
#

i see

junior coral
#

dad gamer, need to get it where i can lol. im use to your flair

round spindle
#

Is outlaw performing as well as the sims imply?

junior coral
#

!ui

ornate heathBOT
cinder relic
#

U should craft a weapon first no matter what

jolly geyser
#

A weapon to surpass metal gear

vivid vessel
cinder relic
#

Hypothetically you should craft a weapon

vivid vessel
#

when we have boss 2 or whatever dropping dagger

#

and you are soaking daggers

#

can often just wait to kill 3 bosses that are easy

#

and get slightly lucky

jolly geyser
#

most people dont raid mythic

cinder relic
#

But even if u get a dagger, it's a fine first craft

#

Cuz u just put it in offhand

vivid vessel
#

not if you get 2 tho

#
  • other slots might have more value than off hand at this point
fresh acorn
#

You still have to spend the crests to upgrade the dagger

vivid vessel
#

so?

#

its less crests to upgrade than craft lol

#

and you would upgrade anywya

#

its higher ilvl

#

in main hand

fresh acorn
#

It’s the same now

frail veldt
#

whats the 2nd best craft

#

is it offhand?

vivid vessel
craggy barn
#

ring maybe

fresh acorn
#

And still relies on getting the dagger

vivid vessel
frail veldt
#

I thought ring this season was like lowest ilvl value

vivid vessel
#

iuts more that if you raid early

#

the 3 first bosses are usually irrelevant

#

if there is daggers

craggy barn
#

i said maybe bc i threw ring out of my ass

#

i also said idk

vivid vessel
#

you shouldnt craft weapon just because

frail veldt
#

I see

plush grove
#

If you rent a mythic raider

craggy barn
#

wowhead says boots

#

and THEN ring

plush grove
#

I think its safe to craft a weapon

glass mortar
#

survival hunter PL build Dws daggers i believe

#

😎

#

yes its very weird

vivid vessel
#

frfr

glass mortar
#

idk why they added this thing

cinder relic
#

Nobody us playing survival on prog

glass mortar
#

but they did

craggy barn
#

i saw there was some buffs to some embells does does that affect anything

#

on the 9th

glass mortar
#

thats toxic guy....

vivid vessel
craggy barn
#

or was i being lied to

vivid vessel
#

i thought you could play whatever spec you wanted bro ..

#

waht is this mentality

glass mortar
#

guys why is guy so rude to use when we doom but then he just throws another underepresented spec under the bus.....

craggy barn
cinder relic
#

U guys say outlaw is unplayable on prog and then larp about survival hunters taking Ur daggers

#

Get a grip

#

Pick a struggle

#

Stop the cap

vivid vessel
#

he was joking

cinder relic
#

Well the joke police rolled in

lime lake
cinder relic
#

And Ur getting fined

frail veldt
#

the only joke allowed in here is our viability in raid

cinder relic
copper radish
#

Can’t wait for notes next Friday

frail veldt
formal knot
copper radish
#

We are surely getting buffed

craggy barn
#

holy

crimson scarab
#

I should start checking the conversations here way more often, it’s pure cinema

formal knot
copper radish
#

10% aura Inc next Friday

vivid vessel
#

or wdym

#

then its just hof prog or idk

frail veldt
#

its team liquid

vivid vessel
#

ye bro same

cinder relic
craggy barn
#

ye

#

real

vivid vessel
#

exile is my best buddy and he plays outlaw every tier

#

remember when he played outlaw on council last tier

craggy barn
#

hes playing outlaw to end the tier faster

vivid vessel
#

was a banger

craggy barn
#

so he can play poe

frail veldt
#

lol

glass mortar
#

@cinder relic when u bully survival hunters this is who ur bullying just remember that

please-post-every-rem-image-you-have-i-need-my-collection-v0-5xgtroj3gkkg1.png
cinder relic
gusty shore
#

when do we use vanish im lost noguide says how xD

frail veldt
crimson scarab
#

It’s not part of the core rotation

gusty shore
#

bnut owuld be the best usage scenario xD

wispy valve
#

to not press it

gusty shore
#

on simc it says if ho

worthy surge
#

ya dont use vanish

#

unless youve got aggro

gusty shore
#

oki then ❤️

glass mortar
#

it is no longer a dps gain to vanish as outlaw

crimson scarab
#

I sometimes use it to land a cheap shot but super rarely

glass mortar
#

unless u play HO build

#

even that is nebulous tho

#

would probably be like 0.2%

#

but HO also isnt played rn

worthy surge
#

ya you could use it to cheap shot if you need to cc something and everything else is on cd

crimson scarab
#

Either to land a cheap shot or lose aggro

gusty shore
#

okii what aboiut poisons for m+

worthy surge
#

ip numbing at higher keys switch numbing to atrophic

crimson scarab
#

I usually run atrophic

#

I think both are viable and have their strengths

nova sinew
#

this spec is so much more fun when youre in adrenaline rush, i wish i could be in adrenaline rush the whole time ! :)

mystic berry
nova sinew
#

i wish haste extended adrenaline rush instead of reducing gcd inside of it

radiant wyvern
#

i've got my action bars hidden to only show on mouseover with eqol, but after every gcd they still show this little sparkle animation, does anybody know what i can use to disable it

43813b79a8a41c1d77d1d8294b77364e.png
copper radish
#

Looking like stars in the sky lmao

radiant wyvern
#

the airplanes in the night sky are like shooting stars

turbid wren
radiant wyvern
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nvm i actually just figured it out it was masque doing it

final pagoda
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quick way to test crafting gear w/ embellishment on raidbots instead of typing all items one by one?

crimson scarab
molten gazelle
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is it worth crafting boots 246 boots with arcanoweave ?

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and just recraft later with mythic crests

gaunt phoenix
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I might craft a ring

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cause crit haste one hardly exists

tidal sequoia
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@vivid vessel

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what are the chances