issue is there isn't really another outlaw to go to
#outlaw
agile orchid
fury is still high apm
pastel pendant
i just switched to fury
strange kelp
I mean there are other high apm classes
ebon elbow
Sounds like we need an outlaw spec for both sides thats perfectly balanced
jolly geyser
go fury
limpid grotto
Fury is super high apm
pastel pendant
fury is fun
untold wadi
fury propaganda spawn 
pastel pendant
but not nearly as fun as old outlaw
ebon elbow
Ya nothing feels like outlaw felt, it was so special
pastel pendant
bro fr tho just play fury, if ur gonna play a simple spec might as well play that
cuz outlaw is just as ez
and not as fun lol
limpid grotto
Problem with Fury is that if it’s bad you have to play Arms which is even slower than Sin
Might be the slowest spec atm
agile orchid
Problem with Fury is that if it’s bad you have to play Arms which is even slower...
I wouldn't count on that lol
jolly geyser
I dont remember complaining that much going from diff playstyles. Been mostly combat/outlaw since mid tbc. Was sin almost all of legion tbf
pastel pendant
war in general got the least pruned
pastel pendant
yea arms feels find to play its jus bad dmg
fury is the high apm fun spec tho, it satisfies that desire to completely mash ur keyboards
untold wadi
Fury is super high apm
high apm wasn't all of it tbh, UHUH/Crackshot/managing KIR/etc all really just had me addicted
ebon elbow
fury is the high apm fun spec tho, it satisfies that desire to completely mash u...
Agree, fury is fun. It feels like what the current outlaw change intended to be
limpid grotto
Yeah Fury is only high apm but lacks any management outside of maintaining Enrage
untold wadi
i could defo play a slower apm if it had all the og quirks of outlaw
limpid grotto
No spec does both
pastel pendant
yep pretty much, its faster than outlaw rn too which is crazy to me and sad
limpid grotto
Even the Fury apex just increases enraged duration
jolly geyser
go heal,def lot of quirks since addons are nuked
cinder relic
I do find it funny to be like, new outlaw is so empty and clunky, let me go to fury warrior
strange kelp
Yeah Fury is only high apm but lacks any management outside of maintaining Enrag...
Fury's decision making is just determining which of your short cd abilities is highest prio in the moment. Its not super complex but its just every gcd
pastel pendant
i could defo play a slower apm if it had all the og quirks of outlaw
ur not gonna find that anymore with the direction this game is headed 😢
strange kelp
I feel like Outlaw has clearer ability prio
cinder relic
Reck is like ar, but even less impact, running out of buttons cuz cd resets on fury feels worse than no energy on outlaw Imo
jolly geyser
on fury you press stuff
pastel pendant
fury is fun becuz all ur buttons feel good to press, and it feels smooth, even outside of CDs, and u have ur CD,s up constantly, which actually feel like a cd and do big dmg, adr doesnt lmao
untold wadi
ur not gonna find that anymore with the direction this game is headed 😢
yeh that's why i'm so pressed lol
huge loss for something you'll never again see until DF pvt servers
pastel pendant
or df classic lol
untold wadi
or DF remix 
ebon elbow
huge loss for something you'll never again see until DF pvt servers
Omg that made my heart sink
untold wadi
altho remix is just modern specs nvm
strange kelp
Remix would just be current class design
pastel pendant
df remix would still have current expac gamepaly
untold wadi
forgor
jolly geyser
I can see SL remix
untold wadi
Remix would just be current class design
yeh
jolly geyser
SL remix would have a lot of cosmetics
pastel pendant
idk maybe theyll make changes to the spec as some point to make it fun again, but i doubt it
strange kelp
I don't really think there is much that needs to change, if they just increase energy rate a little and make ace better I think it would feel pretty fine
limpid grotto
Needs to feel more impactful and less consistent/samey
Give it a cd outside of press more buttons for a little bit
ebon elbow
I don't really think there is much that needs to change, if they just increase e...
I think i miss the vanish gameplay loop the most.
limpid grotto
Fury has Reck, Avatar
pastel pendant
theres just no high anymore, no dopamine spikes, like nothing feels rewarding anymore
jolly geyser
Play something else or take a break.
strange kelp
I think i miss the vanish gameplay loop the most.
So basically just crack shot 😛
ebon elbow
I think i miss the vanish gameplay loop the most.
For the cdr
untold wadi
theres just no high anymore, no dopamine spikes, like nothing feels rewarding an...
get dopamine from almost dying while tanking
defo what i'm going back to
untold wadi
i do vdh and ppal
ebon elbow
Same, bdk makes my heart pump
untold wadi
ppal is so fun to snipe interrupts with focus kicks and shield
pastel pendant
isnt ppal highest apm tank spec?
jolly geyser
heart strike to stay alive
limpid grotto
Prot Pal most fun tank so far imo
untold wadi
yea cuz u spam SOTR between globals
strange kelp
ppal feels weird when the play is to literally only use shield on interrupts
untold wadi
it's ur maintenance buff and it's off gcd
limpid grotto
Ret/prot os is going to be super popular
pastel pendant
i might try it
limpid grotto
Especially with Ret actually pumping
untold wadi
paladin is just a fun tank cuz u can do so much for ur group
sac/spellbop
random wogs or LoH
jolly geyser
lot of interr
untold wadi
double freedom on those crushers back in AV was fun to help a melee dps
untold wadi
lot of interr
and yea interrupts casting hammer and giving holy power is kinda satisfying
altho haven't seen much of how it's changed in midnight, wonder how much of that is gone lol
limpid grotto
Paladin retained tons of utility and defensives
And still has brez
Short cds on burst
Paladin in a good spot albeit not doing busted warlock/dk/devourer dmg
vapid sundial
yeah but tbh
you cant compare to devourer imo
its a new class
its gonna be busted
vapid sundial
xd
limpid grotto
3 buttons, usually 2
jolly geyser
seems chill
limpid grotto
My 5yr old could top meters as Devourer
cinder relic
I'm excited for midnight because it sounds like literally every player is about to rank 1
fresh acorn
Amen
strange kelp
paladin is just a fun tank cuz u can do so much for ur group
Except for those moments where you just pull the group and get instant 1 tapped
tropic zephyr
True now that this Tomelvis guy can't cheat by developing shady WAs I will surely top him on the law ladder! 
covert kestrel
I'm excited for midnight because it sounds like literally every player is about ...
cinder relic
https://tenor.com/view/war-games-joshua-woppr-strange-game-doctor-only-winning-m...
So true
clever badge
can I turn off Wang in out of combat/dragon riding?
hasty warren
can I turn off Wang in out of combat/dragon riding?
it's not possible rn I think
clever badge
damn, ty
cinder relic
It does damage on beta still afaik
chrome gull
hello guys where can i find a good advanced cooldown settings profile?
gaunt phoenix
there's not really a resource for profiles here
would like to have one by launch
wowhead does have guy's personal export
craggy barn
can I turn off Wang in out of combat/dragon riding?
@keen belfry i made another PR for out of combat behavior 😛
i also just added hide while mounted
carmine bay
also, ive been noticing that there seems to be a small window where I want to pause after SSing before using a finisher otherwise the CPs dont seem to update and i send a finisher with like 2-3 cps accidentally. is this a thing or am I tripping
wondering if wang bar update interval is too low or smthing
gaunt phoenix
the 2nd hit of ss is just on a delay
carmine bay
yeah okay, so should pause to see if it procs?
gaunt phoenix
yeah but not too long or you miss your global/spell queue
low glade
yeah but not too long or you miss your global/spell queue
what spell queue are you playing with these days?
gaunt phoenix
i have always used default 400ms
low glade
yeah i started playing with 400 recently as well
craggy quiver
Oof I thought you liked crackshot
I like cs I'm also fond of s1 shadow lands mfd was still there
gaunt phoenix
yeah okay, so should pause to see if it procs?
the SS delay is about 250ms
maybe 200 + ping
cinder relic
I like cs I'm also fond of s1 shadow lands mfd was still there
To me it was always a dead end of the spec, there was really not much else that could be added to the spec
I like a lot of give and take design, it just felt like the spec had too much of everything
Like to me I like AR, or even recklessness for warrior, because you dont have it 100% of the time
When you have 100% uptime expected, when you don't it makes the spec feel extremely shit, rather than a cooldown intended to be a "nice bonus" yk
craggy quiver
If you put it that way ye I see your point
Not sure where you can go from 100% adr lol
cinder relic
theres also the whole thing of like, the more time passed, the more I was over the spec revolving around these "vanish/SHD windows" which happened in DF
I liked the DF version, where both vanish and shadow dance were used to "Refill" on fan/audacity procs
But I don't like how the spec had these like, "activated cooldown windows"
mighty pivot
that was in part caused by the fact that the spec was unplayable outside of AR. You can still have the expectation of 100% uptime if the impact is less
cinder relic
Now ofc sub dance is way bigger and more centralizing than crackshot was damage wise, but just the whole concep[t was a bit ick to me by the end
frail veldt
Does sub have more uptime on dance than we have on adr
small lion
Hi with fatebound build u dont use BtE?
cinder relic
u press BTE all the time
small lion
Ohh thx
cinder relic
2
gaunt phoenix
it's 2 buffs yeah
strange kelp
Does sub have more uptime on dance than we have on adr
You are probably in dance like 50% of combat, give or take a few % based on haste
frail veldt
You are probably in dance like 50% of combat, give or take a few % based on has...
What's the duration/cooldown now with proper haste
strange kelp
Dance is 20sec CD and I think starts at 8sec but the duration now extends based on your haste so you can get it to 10ish sec
frail veldt
Dance is 20sec CD and I think starts at 8sec but the duration now extends based ...
Daaamn that's insane honestly
strange kelp
And it still has 2 charges
frail veldt
Lucky
vapid sundial
You know what is nice about outlaw
You don't need to say
Need pi,rescue me.
Bop spell ward me
Pain sup me
Xdd
gaunt phoenix
rez me
wintry solar
We call that "skill issue" me
wintry solar
That sounds painful ngl
vapid sundial
Class has the worst defensive in game
Think it's a 40% 1m cd
Might be linger I forget
frail veldt
If you ever played enhance at high level
Won't we need that now though
We're pretty weak defensively now
Cuz assa needed that in tww
vapid sundial
See I said this same thing but another player was like 'lol now ur as tanky as sub and sin instead of overly'
frail veldt
And we have a worse defensive kit than assa now
Sub is more tanky than assa and outlaw
vapid sundial
Ye
frail veldt
By a lot
frail veldt
Outlaw is pretty undeniably the squishiest if not tied with assa
wintry solar
Not like we'd have the energy to press it anyway
frail veldt
Bro that's better than ours
wintry solar
If it did something else like IBF, it'd be fine but noooo
frail veldt
Ours is 2 min 20%
vapid sundial
What does feint do now
frail veldt
Feint is still 20%
Our highest Dr is 20% to non magical damage haha
And we aren't really a vers class anymore
frail veldt
But thst only aoe unless you drop cheat right
The AOE is 40
St is 20 if you drop cheat
vapid sundial
Yeah
frail veldt
I hope they consider removing energy cost from feint
wintry solar
No
keen belfry
rogue tannk still weird
i remember i needed an external on first boss of necrotic wave often
vapid sundial
I mean
That ability just wasn't legal
Practically everyone needed a Def iirc
Besides dk I think
frail veldt
It'll be interesting to see where outlaw falls if it's tuned at a normal level
vapid sundial
It is the curse when the devs have no idea how your class functions or scales
gritty hamlet
So why does one and two of a kind still feel bleh but Jackpot doesn't feel like a jackpot lol
lone spear
eh 2 roll is fine
3 feels good
and i think they didnt want 4 to feel giga insane cause the point of the rework was to reduce those intense moments of gameplay
gotta keep everything simple since thats their intent
arctic merlin
2 and 3 feel good, jackpot is alright, but i guess the 10% crit will be more meaningful later
gaunt phoenix
crit wont feel like anything, but it is very strong
gaunt phoenix
yep
arctic merlin
so 10% crit will be more valuable compared to the crit we'll have lvl 90 than it is now
do we actually use kidney shot as a form of cc?
ig there's blind and sap and cheapshot in stealth, but then do we use kidney shot if all are on cd?
loud garden
do we actually use kidney shot as a form of cc?
it's pretty useful on a select few bosses in the midnight s1 pool
3rd and last boss in skyreach, first in seat
arctic merlin
thank
loud garden
the neat thing is that you don't really need to waste combo points on it either
A 1 cp kidney shot on npcs is 4 seconds
wintry solar
I wish we still had Sting
Idm adding kidney to my rotation
Nvm, pvp talents exist
pastel pendant
still haven’t logged in to try the new outlaw since the prepatch
Prepare to be disappointed
arctic merlin
Nvm, pvp talents exist
i meant mostly in pve
wintry solar
Yeah I know, I was talking about the dmg taken increased when CCd talent
Sting Like A Bee
pastel sierra
I was gonna say blackjack but thats only sap and blind
wintry solar
Goober
uncut ginkgo
anybody else notice when you use between the eyes now, a tumbleweed shows up?
its the little things lol
wintry solar
Yeah, I like it. I don't notice it all the time but when I do it's funny.
keen belfry
<@177964030474977281> do u use any specific power bars for other classes?
better cooldownmanager is what i use rn if i dont want to setup anything
im conflicted about cdms cuz
arcui is cringe
random terrace
might be silly question but, when we get "crackshot" now, do we use it with low cp or get 6+
keen belfry
but static positions is kinda OP
vivid vessel
might be silly question but, when we get "crackshot" now, do we use it with low ...
you have to build yes
especially since we play 1 point into ace :D
random terrace
thought so, tyvm
keen belfry
might be silly question but, when we get "crackshot" now, do we use it with low ...
always 6+
i already replied to him zac
it just is being slow for senidng
vivid vessel
you are washed up awang
keen belfry
why lie
pearl topaz
What UIs are people going for
pastel sierra
I just rebuilt something close to the setup i had before
If blizzard puts more ppl on their UI team I might be able to do all of it without addons at some point
glass mortar
wtf
proven ocean
wtf are u wtfing at wtf?
keen belfry
wtf
glass mortar
proven ocean
@gaunt phoenix
vivid vessel
proven ocean
limpid isle
arctic merlin
Quick question. I very often end up with 5 cp - is it worth it to keep using ss/ps to generate the last 2, even if they overcap, or is it ok to use finishers? Speaking from energy conservation pov which is deep into the fight
frail veldt
Quick question. I very often end up with 5 cp - is it worth it to keep using ss/...
as trickster you would SS in this position
if you end up at 5cp with max opp stacks then you made a mistake
as fatebound you can dispatch finisher at 5cp
but if bte is off cd then you would also ss in this position
PS at 6 stacks opp > PS at 3 stacks opp and 1-3 CPs > SS
Finisher:
at 6cp(or 5 for dispatch as fatebound)
BtE > KS > Dispatch/Coup```this is the very succinct builder/finisher rules
undone notch
frank finch
!bugs
ornate heathBOT
[Outlaw bug Thread](#1276315296159760467 message)
cosmic shuttle
How do you guys handle the lag that sometimes happens? I feel like I sometimes press abilities again because I think they didn't get used yet because I still have my CPs in the moment, but then I use dispatch again with low combo points... Do you just spam less so you play more careful?
craggy barn
spam a bit less, adjust ur spell queue window, pay attention to ur cps more closely
if u hyper spam, u have a higher chance to override ur queued spell esp if ur sqw is high
if ur spw isnt tuned well for how u spam/react then ur last input in ur spq can fuck u
anecdotately, i used to have issues with mis inputs bc of how i was hitting my buttons and bc my spell queue ddint match my spam rhythm well
esp at low ping
cosmic shuttle
cool thank you, thats super useful info 🙂
craggy barn
outlaw is still a reactive spec, so u dont want to be spamming like ur life depends on it
smoky lily
How is everyone feeling about outlaw for midnight? Also in pre patch?
Not enjoying sub rogue much 🙁
smoky lily
I liked the look of the roll the bones changed, will check it out!
craggy barn
its fine, just playing outlaw in s3 content just kinda sucks
wintry solar
Lack of content is worse than the state of outlaw imo
craggy barn
even before the changes, outlaw in s3 content was just 
wintry solar
its fine, just playing outlaw in s3 content just kinda sucks
Yeah true
Damn Zomb woke up and decided to speak facts wtf
smoky lily
i could not bother to push keys bc outlaw was so dog
Damn 🙁
craggy barn
i only went to 3.4 then stopped bothering
started raid logging instead
er wait 3.2
i think
idr
frail veldt
We were one of the weakest specs in the game in s3
Pretty sad last season to enjoy old outlaw with
vivid vessel
We were one of the weakest specs in the game in s3
Not one
We were the weakest
I don't think that can even be argued this season
frail veldt
Yeah prob true it's just too late at night to start an argument so I didn't want to claim weakest haha
Went the safe route
vivid vessel
pussy
untold wadi
Pretty sad last season to enjoy old outlaw with
indeed
still had fun tho
ngl
just dont q gambit 
waxen scarab
!PREKEY
ornate heathBOT
- Use
Adrenaline Rush to activate 
Loaded Dice. - As Trickster, use
KS to activate 
Disorienting Strikes. - Do NOT use
RTB before the key, you will lose it. - Use
SND during the bubble once the key starts.
plucky wasp
Hey guys, have not been in touch with the beta in the last couple of weeks. How are things turning out for us in general? (Disregarding tuning)
untold wadi
did u like df/tww outlaw 
if u liked older outlaw u will like it more, if u liked cracked out outlaw, u wont 
kinda generalized opinion there
plucky wasp
Well I indeed enjoyed bfa outlaw the most! Thank you for the answere
wintry solar
You'll love this outlaw then
untold wadi
wintry solar
finite slate
hey. is outlaw ok for m+ in midnight ?
vapid sundial
who knows
you cant judge shit until heroic week passes
and they do tuning based off it
wintry solar
I know but I won't tell
untold wadi
hey. is outlaw ok for m+ in midnight ?
ngl if ur asking, any spec is prolly shill
vapid sundial
ngl if ur asking, any spec is prolly shill
what has baus done
untold wadi
typed "worf" in a key the other day
wintry solar
It's joever for you
jolly geyser
Popo posted a slur
midnight ridge
what was the name of better cp and energy bar?
untold wadi
!wangbar
ornate heathBOT
Resources:
ArcUI / BetterCDM - common suites for buff/cd customization
WangBar - displays CPs/energy, customize colors per point, faster than Sensei
MSUF - recommendation for unit frames
Platynator - recommendation for nameplates (Jundies Profile)
Misc:
Mute Cold Blood sound
EasyReminders - can show poison reminders outside of instances
midnight ridge
ty, fucking sensei bars keep reseting all the time
carmine bay
love wangbar
wintry solar
Who up wanging they bar?
jolly geyser
I wanged my pants
covert kestrel
Wangbar pulled me from a burning building
mighty pivot
wangbar buffed outlaw
wintry solar
Truke
vapid sundial
wangbar is what i call @keen belfry's strap on
keen belfry
Fart bar
warm patio
!ui
ornate heathBOT
Resources:
- ArcUI / BetterCDM - common suites for buff/cd customization
- WangBar - displays CPs/energy, customize colors per point, faster than Sensei
- MSUF - recommendation for unit frames
- Platynator - recommendation for nameplates (Jundies Profile)
Misc: - Mute Cold Blood sound
- EasyReminders - can show poison reminders outside of instances
copper radish
why do frost mages have flurry and why does it do 10x more aoe than blade flurry lol
vestal notch
mage
keen belfry
solo theres gotta be a way to avoid this cursed situation
having to decide between LD and 20 seconds of a good buff is quite cringey!
olive spire
if you didn't have AR it would be cursed but since you have AR my guess is you just toss LD
keen belfry
well yeah thats teh whole situation issue
wasting LDs is quite bad, bnut so its wasting 20 seconds of my KIR'd buff
this always happens whenever you extend a relatively old buff
random geyser
Been playing survival and now my rogue feels like discount survival hunter now. It's outlaw with a pet and a raid buff that matters. I know the last iteration felt more like sub but now its weird. Fantasy wise; playastyle is a little different.
cinder relic
Its funny viewing hunters mark as a real raid buff compared to atro
keen belfry
Been playing survival and now my rogue feels like discount survival hunter now. ...
welcome chamapinu culub.
random geyser
Am I crazy its like outlaw rogue+
Especially once they fix dw scaling which i can't imagine they ignore.
olive spire
but then you are playing hunter, have you thought about that?
cinder relic
I dont think any hunter has ever called hunters mark a real raid buff before
keen belfry
hunters mark is good now
its basically -3% health on any mob u put it on or whatever
it has joined the mandatory raid buff group in midnight
random geyser
And like death grip on some fight u will definately want a couple
cinder relic
but I mean hey, if theres any time to look for a new main, it's right now ig
vivid vessel
Been playing survival and now my rogue feels like discount survival hunter now. ...
welcome to the champion club
mighty pivot
I dont think any hunter has ever called hunters mark a real raid buff before
which is why blizzard changed it 
random geyser
What is champion club lol
cinder relic
which is why blizzard changed it <:shruggy:1386748322051522721>
I'd still say atro is better tahn new hunters mark
It'd be like calling fort not a real raid buff yk
random geyser
Atro and fort are good early prog or high keys but after turbo they dont really matter for raid.
cinder relic
in turbo I dont think a single raid buff maters because the content is so easy atp
but for keys, sure
olive spire
i would say damage is less of a problem than surviving with turbo
random geyser
True but the main problem is one shots usually
cinder relic
(which atro helps with)
random geyser
Atro helps prevent 1 shot mechanics?
cinder relic
If a mechanic does 3.6% less dmage, it's not gonna 1 shot you as often
Or do u mean actual wipe mechanics
random geyser
I mean usually 3.6% isnt gonna save you with how bursty damage is. 3% off a bosses health is just a 3% shorter fight
vivid vessel
i think atro for keys is legit the biggest cope
and numbing is better
but my healers always forces me to play atro
cinder relic
and numbing is better
true though
vivid vessel
like i wish we had a way to actually get data
to see how many times atro saved you in a key
if it ever did
olive spire
in pugs numbing is goated
covert kestrel
What is champion club lol
vivid vessel
while numbing is a lot of melee damage saved on tank and slow cast time is surely valuable when you try to kick things yolo
mighty pivot
I'd still say atro is better tahn new hunters mark
why? I don't think it's fair to say atro is "not a real raid buff", but 3% damage on the target(s - with multiple hunters) which matter the most is very good. Other offensive raid buffs give about the same boost, they just tend to be not target limited
cinder relic
why? I don't think it's fair to say atro is "not a real raid buff", but 3% damag...
I think the target limited factor is the difference maker to my personal evaluation
keen belfry
Imagine u bring 33 hunters to raid and one shot the boss
cinder relic
Cuz you still have to cast hunters mark right, and on any add fight, you aren't going to shuffle your mark around right
its still limit to 1 HM per target right
Like 2 hunters isn't 3% each right
keen belfry
Yes
vivid vessel
Imagine u bring 33 hunters to raid and one shot the boss
you need 33.3 hunters tho
thats a lot of hunters
keen belfry
you need 33.3 hunters tho
Mb
cinder relic
So unless its a council fight, stacking hunters isn't really useful
random geyser
3% boss bmg in a key is a lot isnt it thats one of the most time consuming parts
vivid vessel
its st onlyu
cinder relic
and then like, is hunter tuned high enough where stacking hunters is even correct on those encounters
keen belfry
I’m 99% sure with new hunters mark there is value reapplying your mark to prio mobs
But maybe not
cinder relic
Depends how fast they die right
keen belfry
Well yes
vivid vessel
i think atro is useless
cinder relic
Like dimensius platforms, sure, but the dimensius adds in P1? probably not right
vivid vessel
but i think hunter thing is also useless
keen belfry
Like dimensius platforms, sure, but the dimensius adds in P1? probably not right
Depends on when you do it, for a guild like me it don’t matter but for RWF I bet they apply it maybe idk
keen belfry
but i think hunter thing is also useless
3% dmg useless??
random geyser
Don't most packs have a priority mob? And a lot of raid bosses have a big add.
cinder relic
Depends on when you do it, for a guild like me it don’t matter but for RWF I bet...
The issue with dimmy adds in P1 is that u have to kill at similar times and hunters mark sonds annoying af to juggle
vivid vessel
its not 3% damage tho no
cinder relic
Don't most packs have a priority mob? And a lot of raid bosses have a big add.
A lot of fights also have "a lot of shitters"
vivid vessel
or has it changed
cinder relic
And ur not gonna hunters mark shitters
keen belfry
It’s legit 3% dmg increased taken now
cinder relic
Like most of the adds on a fight like broodtwister right, ur never gonna hunters mark them
cinder relic
I'd say rogue DR is better for prog anyway
cinder relic
I think the damage increase is too conditional
keen belfry
If rogue DR worked on everything ever I would say this is a real arguement
I’d still disagree but I’d see the point of it
vivid vessel
i mena it kinda does
cinder relic
it doesn't work on 1 thing every other tier, usually
vivid vessel
ye its kinda wahtever
cinder relic
Like I think all expansion it didn't work on Stix, and forgeweaver
so 2 bosses
Maybe some dungeon bosses but im not a dungoner
cinder relic
what boss was forgeweaver
pillar guy
keen belfry
He was the forgeweaver
vivid vessel
hm
random geyser
Hunters mark wouldnt be there for shitter adds though its for big targets bosses, araz add, dimmy p2 adds etc
cinder relic
Hunters mark wouldnt be there for shitter adds though its for big targets bosses...
Sure but every other raid buff just works on everything yk
vivid vessel
the one we play slow on
cinder relic
the one we play slow on
yeagh
keen belfry
Ignore tuning, u bring 2 hunters ideally
vivid vessel
3% damage on the whole raid
is a lot
i mean
its more than monk buff
and monk buff is perma locked
keen belfry
Mhm
random geyser
Also survival hunter will take daggers if the tuning is for dw pack leader xD
keen belfry
Close proba
vivid vessel
wtf
cinder relic
its more than 5 tho
keen belfry
For only them selves
vivid vessel
is that true
cinder relic
Oh is it onlys elf
vivid vessel
or false
keen belfry
It’s only self
vivid vessel
feel like this guy is capping hard \
civic meadow
cinder relic
They have a talent that buffs shouts, thought it buffed everybody
keen belfry
Warriors get stronger self shout
vivid vessel
whats the point even lol
keen belfry
Tuning knob
keen belfry
Mages had stronger AI in TWW
random geyser
So they don't forget lol
cinder relic
whats the point even lol
flavor
The talent buffs every shout
Battleshout is a shout
shrimple as
vivid vessel
i hate flavor
keen belfry
You’re French
cinder relic
waiter my steak is too juicy
vivid vessel
cause of flavor we have rng ks
cinder relic
and my lobster is too buttery
keen belfry
If it’s not pizza taco y don’t eat it
Is that what u would always say
Pizza taco
Taco pizza
random geyser
Have you guys had a chance to try survival?
keen belfry
I survive everyday brother.
random geyser
Survival even though its very short has an aoe stun aswell
cinder relic
survival is OP af rn but I don't expect that to last that long
random geyser
When was last time outlaw was op?
cinder relic
Like actually OP? the entire duration of BFA
magic shuttle
Survival tier inc
vivid vessel
s3 df and it wasnt op enough to be meta
magic shuttle
Year of the spear returns
vivid vessel
what was s2 sl
magic shuttle
Rogue was strong in sl s2
cinder relic
what was s2 sl
sanctum
magic shuttle
All 3 specs at top
cinder relic
They buffed domination gems
vivid vessel
domination?
cinder relic
But outlaw was already using frost
vivid vessel
wasnt that red
vivid vessel
ah ye
cinder relic
Sub used blood iirc
vivid vessel
i remmeber i had stocks in the frost early on
cinder relic
But either way, Outlaw was using frost, they buffed frost cuz nobody was using it
Outlaw became thanos mode
cinder relic
and Outlaw had the sylv daggers that tier too
vivid vessel
werenyt you invested in red gem guy
cinder relic
WAs real good
cinder relic
blood was best initially
magic shuttle
Also if you got lucky in s2 you would get court of stars ring from legion time walking, which was giga undersimming
cinder relic
Yeah there was a lot of fucked up items that tier
magic shuttle
And then s3 came out where they took 6 months to do any relevant tuning 🙁
magic shuttle
But survival got it's season at least
fluid iron
They were called domination gems, but there was 3 of them
AKSHUALLY they were called "Shards of Domination"
proven ocean
AKSHUALLY they were called "Shards of Domination"
AKSHUALLY they were called "shard of domination" "shards of domination" is plural..
fluid iron
they confers to it in plural
fluid iron
keen belfry
stealthi when he gets one shard of domination:
just got me a shards of domination!
@fluid iron
thoughts?
vivid vessel
fluid iron
stealthi when he gets one shard of domination:
just got me a shards of dominatio...
never got only 1
checkmate
keen belfry
sure bud
fluid iron
i was a week one set enjoyer
keen belfry
lethal oak
I get the cat gifs now, we are all switching to feral
frail veldt
as the prophecy foretold
gaunt phoenix
the scrolls have foretold of black wings in the cold
frail veldt
solo with the bars
copper radish
Less than 20 days and we leveling up some outlaws
frail veldt
Less than 20 days and we leveling up some outlaws
Don't you have like 5
proven ocean
https://tenor.com/view/cat-ai-ai-cat-dancing-sassy-dance-tuxedo-cat-gif-12024810...
drifting kraken
hey guys might be rerolling rogue next tier, was wondering if there is an easy way to track CP spent for Deadly Pursuit or is it not worth tracking it? I can track when buff pops in the CD manager but not what im looking for
is it even worth playing around it?
gaunt phoenix
not worth
dapper sierra
did outlaw gameplay change from tww? i didnt like the stealth stuff required
dapper sierra
fr? lets gooo
copper radish
did outlaw gameplay change from tww? i didnt like the stealth stuff required
We straight brawling now
drifting kraken
do you use pistol shot with opportunity if at 4 or 5 CPs?
gaunt phoenix
only if at 6 stacks
drifting kraken
even at 5 CPs? not worth sending dispatch?
gaunt phoenix
but being at 5cp with 6 opportunity is unlikely
fatebound uses dispatch at 5cps, but trickster must finish at 6+
the thing is that if you finish at 5cps and then pistol shot, you are at 5cps again
drifting kraken
yea feels bit weird
gaunt phoenix
when a higher finisher could have refunded you to 2cps
then you pistol shot to 6
on average if you finish at 5cp you kinda get "stuck" at 5cps
drifting kraken
so its worth risking a SS at 4-5 CPs if i dont have opportunity
gaunt phoenix
yeah
drifting kraken
i see it says Opportunity is higher prio builder, but is it worth fishing for 2-3 CPs first or just going to be sitting on 6 stacks for too long?
gaunt phoenix
it's not worth to risk overcapping the stacks
cinder relic
fr? lets gooo
WELCOME TO THE CHAMPIONS CLUB
drifting kraken
ty @gaunt phoenix
gaunt phoenix
drifting kraken
so pretty much if im 3 CP or less and have opportunity i just send it
gaunt phoenix
yes, that's the general rule
when we swap to fatebound, there is a minmax to sinister strike if at 1cp
if you have at least stage 2 rtb
covert kestrel
WELCOME TO THE CHAMPIONS CLUB
drifting kraken
if you have at least stage 2 rtb
ah ye thats what i was referring earlier, but theres a chance you keep proccing and not able to use opportunity right?
gaunt phoenix
at that point SS will either send you to 6cps and you finish, or send you to 3cps and you ps
drifting kraken
ok so maybe thats fine then and just sit on PS procs
gaunt phoenix
yes, so you dont do this at 6 opportunity
frail veldt
Yeah if you had 3 stacks opp you should have sent your ps when at low cps
Like solo said if you follow the builder rules right you shouldn't really be in the position where you have 5cp and max opp stacks at the same time that often
But if you play 2pt ace it might happen more often cuz they made 2pt ace awkward
gaunt phoenix
you pretty much need blade flurry to get there
frail veldt
Some people playing 2pt ace have asked about it I've noticed haha
drifting kraken
yea just doing some dummy testing atm to figure out the rotation, havent played outlaw since uldir
frail veldt
Yeah it's pretty straight forward now you'll pick it up quick
drifting kraken
those PS conditionals are gona catch me out a few times with how fast the spec is
arctic merlin
yea just doing some dummy testing atm to figure out the rotation, havent played ...
i sometimes get 5cps and 6 opp stacks because i mess up the rotation, but it's definitely less than before now
just takes some getting used to
frail veldt
It's p much just press ps when you have it at low cps
gaunt phoenix
it generally doesnt matter a whole lot
drifting kraken
It's p much just press ps when you have it at low cps
except if youre fatebound with 2+ stages RTB and at 1 CP 😄
gaunt phoenix
SS and PS generate the same CPs on average
frail veldt
except if youre fatebound with 2+ stages RTB and at 1 CP 😄
Yeah but again you could ignore that rule and it's like 0.5%
The spec is insanely forgiving now
drifting kraken
cool cool
frail veldt
HUGE
arctic merlin
it's ok we get nerfed again and it's less than 1%
drifting kraken
how outlaw ST looking compares to assa/sub?
gaunt phoenix
outlaw's ST was pretty favorable in the last raid testing but it ended up being on accident
drifting kraken
classic lol
minor ginkgo
!ui
ornate heathBOT
Resources:
- ArcUI / BetterCDM - common suites for buff/cd customization
- WangBar - displays CPs/energy, customize colors per point, faster than Sensei
- MSUF - recommendation for unit frames
- Platynator - recommendation for nameplates (Jundies Profile)
Misc: - Mute Cold Blood sound
- EasyReminders - can show poison reminders outside of instances
proven ocean
Wtf a cat walking with 2 legs
How 
Thought nothing can walk with 2 legs
Wait i walk with 2 legs
Hmm
@vivid vessel this you?
tender wedge
Do you have a subscription to a daily AI cat gif service?
arctic merlin
is this real
gaunt phoenix
yes
prisma lily
So I tried outlaw the other day and had a real hard time managing the finishers with their different CDs, I play on a steamdeck.
But I had the thought of making a macro like this
/cast KS
/cast BTE
/cast Dispatch
That way I can use 1 button and when Im at 6 cp hit that and use whatever is not on CD. I have a similar macro for sub thats cast coup cast BP and that works. But for some reason this doesn't, I cast KS but then nothing after until its off CD again.
Any thoughts?
gaunt phoenix
it's not possible, macros will not skip actions based on cooldown
prisma lily
it's not possible, macros will not skip actions based on cooldown
Well dang there goes my hopes of making outlaw work. Thanks for the info.
carmine bay
So I tried outlaw the other day and had a real hard time managing the finishers ...
ive been mucking around with outlaw on steamdeck too lol. if you are struggling why dont you go assisted combat or one button?
prisma lily
ive been mucking around with outlaw on steamdeck too lol. if you are struggling ...
Im gonna give it another go, I haven't use the combat assistance or one button yet but I lll check it out
covert kestrel
So I tried outlaw the other day and had a real hard time managing the finishers ...
Are you forgetting to use the cds or running out of binds? Might just need to tweak the UI so you have the important information closer but no clue what the steam deck addon situation would be
drifting kraken
i seem to be getting stuck on the 5 CP loop quite a lot, and if SS to 7 I get to 6 stacks on PS again, then the loop starts again, 1 CP > PS to 5 CP > SS to 7 CP and 6 stack > Disp
quick ridge
Fan the hammer makes this spec feel so fluidic, I love it
cinder relic
Nope
sharp shadow
I don’t want to sound dumb but I’m ganna go ahead and ask anyway. If we get back only 3-4 combo points from BtE, do you keep spamming BtE like before or no? .. > keep building CPs right?
gaunt phoenix
you gotta build
radiant wyvern
you gotta build
looking more like carpenters than outlaws
gaunt phoenix
i seem to be getting stuck on the 5 CP loop quite a lot, and if SS to 7 I get to...
you have to build at 5cp fairly often, just how it goes
hearty lagoon
Zac stream when ? 🧐
loud hazel
Crackshot returns when 🧐
low glade
what if instead of crackshot, it was WACKshot
and you pull out a comically large hammer
loud hazel
hm
hearty lagoon
🧐🧐🧐
loud hazel
shot of crack new talent?
hearty lagoon
I see the vision
loud hazel
shot of crack new talent? <:garf_sit:1334889429449314456>
this
what if olaw just get a shot of crack instead of Adrenaline Rush
so we get +100% crit chance and 50% mastery
over 15s
and cocaine on it's bullets
so we add poison damage
+blurry vision debuff on enemies
quick ridge
you have to build at 5cp fairly often, just how it goes
If I’m sitting at 5 combo points does the generator depend on how many stacks of opportunity I have, assuming between the eyes is available?
hearty lagoon
mid raid - Brb guys i forgot needles at vendor for crack shot
loud hazel
gaunt phoenix
If I’m sitting at 5 combo points does the generator depend on how many stacks of...
yes, you would pistol shot at 6 stacks
though having 5cps and 6 opp is fairly uncommon
at the same time
quick ridge
Yeah that would be weird
cinder relic
there was zero need to remove crackshot 100%
They want the game to be simpler. The crackshot uhuh gameplay, even if it was a different button, was extremely overwhelming to many players
gaunt phoenix
would need blade flurry cps to land you there
quick ridge
I really like fatebound so I’m trying to get more used to the sinister striking at one with sufficient roll the bones buff. Thank you solo 💛
loud hazel
They want the game to be simpler. The crackshot uhuh gameplay, even if it was a ...
why they couldn't just make it improved sinister strke instead of swapping to ambush everytime you take a shot of crack
cinder relic
What
loud hazel
i think i get it
the ultimate change for midnight and the solver of missing crackshot for outlul
add another capstone, AR overloads your flintlock with 25 bullets
so you get free BtEs that will refill your points for the same amount of bullets remaining on your magazine
and to unload those bullets you have to agressively dispatch your targets so dispatch gets +50% quadrillion dmg
until you unload all your bullets
or each BtE unloads bullets based on your max points
cinder relic
Alright
craggy barn
the rtb page just lists the old buffs
loud hazel
are you in the ptr page?
craggy barn
live
loud hazel
go into ptr
craggy barn
is it only on ptr/beta?
loud hazel
yep
craggy barn
thats crazy
cinder relic
I can't find them on an actual individual page, but I do mention them in the rotation page
craggy barn
the buff names themselves? i see the stage stuff, but i thought they all had names, like stage 4 being jackpot
craggy barn
ty
loud hazel
why 3rd stage is called triple threat?
i thought that was the 10% chance talent to proc a 3rd ss
gaunt phoenix
they felt like it
loud hazel
nova blaze
is coldblooded killer bug still a thing ?
loud hazel
missed opportunity to call it:
ace
pair
three of a kind
full house
loud hazel
oka here is it, what if this talent exists to replace crackshot:
Developers note, Crackshot shouldn't disappear, here is a replacement:
Cracked Magazine: Adrenaline rush overloads your pistol with 25 bullets (combo points), BtE won't enter CD until all bullets are unloaded, finishers will aggresively unload bullets based on your max combo points shooting your target by 50% dmg value of opportunity until all bullets are unloaded.
craggy barn
they should give us a slot machine we can carry around
sharp shadow
do ya'll send 6 CP finishers or keep building to 7 lol
gaunt phoenix
6
sharp shadow
word
gilded rain
funny thing that i discovered, excuse me if anyone else typed it out already, if you logged out before pre-patch with underhanded upper hand and in stealth, you would still have the buff of the old AR and it wouldn't drain even after you get out of stealth, until you activate your new AR
gaunt phoenix
no
lime lake
untold wadi
naive pecan
Can we stack set bonuses from leatherworking sets and raid sets? And +jewl embellishments?
mighty pivot
solo ban them 
gaunt phoenix
yes, but you can only have 2 embellished items total
naive pecan
Does crafted sets from profession counts as embellishments?
gaunt phoenix
yes, they should say Unique-Equipped: Embellished
keen belfry
good call solo
gaunt phoenix
thank you
keen belfry
reorganized my kitchen and bought 2 new jackets today solo
gaunt phoenix
nice
cinder relic
kind otter
Who do I report a potential scammer to?
keen belfry
blizzard
carmine bay
good call solo
is this THE wangbar?
keen belfry
THE
kind otter
I mean from this discord😅😅😭😭
untold wadi
!wangbar
ornate heathBOT
Resources:
- ArcUI / BetterCDM - common suites for buff/cd customization
- WangBar - displays CPs/energy, customize colors per point, faster than Sensei
- MSUF - recommendation for unit frames
- Platynator - recommendation for nameplates (Jundies Profile)
Misc: - Mute Cold Blood sound
- EasyReminders - can show poison reminders outside of instances
carmine bay
I love you mr Wangbar
untold wadi
I mean from this discord😅😅😭😭
idk just telll someone in orange/purple prolly
can green kil?
gaunt phoenix
even with BTE?
yeah
desert tendon
gritty hamlet
So what does Platynator do that plater doesn't for someone who's used to Plater's default look?
neat heron
Guys we should use RTB then Adrenaline as opener or Adrenaline then RTB?
sonic pawn
@neat heron AR > RTB specifically because you want to gain loaded dice talent from pressing AR first to guarantee rank 2 . I would suggest reading the Outlaw FAQ 👍
neat heron
<@476166726397198357> AR > RTB specifically because you want to gain loaded dice...
Thank you :3 and will do I'm sorry this spec is new for me
sonic pawn
I thought as much the question sounds like someone new to outlaw
@keen belfry Any progress on making wangbar smoother and less jittery on cp update similar to Sensei ?
keen belfry
none progress
covert kestrel
<@177964030474977281> Any progress on making wangbar smoother and less jittery o...
I'd rather take less smooth than sensei slow as molasses updating
craggy barn
i can keep doing random PRs until awang merges shit
keen belfry
lets go check taht PR
red zinc
ouwlaw
formal knot
OUTLAW!!!!!
sonic pawn
@covert kestrel Your making out the difference is huge between the two its not. Wangbar might be marginally faster but its cp update is jittery. Hopefully awang can improve it 🙂
frail veldt
What does jittery mean
keen belfry
@craggy barn energy bar dont come back
i think the old WAs we had technically filled up but very fast, mine just changes the color of the as it gets a combo point
sonic pawn
@frail veldt In this context the difference is Sensei cp update fills the bar so the animation for cp update is smoother . Wang bar essentially stutters a bit in comparison especially when using free pistol shots.
covert kestrel
<@259719852510543873> Your making out the difference is huge between the two its...
You're *
formal knot
<@151872253229924352> In this context the difference is Sensei cp update fills t...
i actually hate the smooth fill, i disabled that on sensei bars
keen belfry
yeah ive never used smooth fill either
covert kestrel
Yeah smooth fill is cringe
keen belfry
wangbar stutters??
formal knot
BUT 
its all preference
sonic pawn
well compared to sensei i meen the animation comparsion
craggy barn
<@118165766741819400> energy bar dont come back
which PR is this
the hide combat one?
keen belfry
yeah
sonic pawn
But yes all personal prefrence
wintry solar
wangbar stutters??
We all do sometimes
covert kestrel
We can leave sensei for the casual larpers and keep wangbar for the competitively minded
keen belfry
which PR is this
it comes back when i mount tho? (after i disable all settings)
craggy barn
weird, not seeing that behavior on my end bleh
keen belfry
@craggy barn
craggy barn
oh yea i see that
keen belfry
weird, not seeing that behavior on my end bleh
addon dev is quite cringe cuz theres like no control u just release it to the world and find bugs
looks like the energy bar ties in with mount behavior
craggy barn
nah i know why
formal knot
wtf i just downloaded wangbar™ and sometimes its like 90ms faster with combopoints than sensei
but sometimes its on the same frame
craggy barn
pushed a fix @keen belfry
oh wait i mightve pushed to wrong branch lol
ok pushed it to the correct branch
new pr
keen belfry
looks good
gonna publish to curse forge
refactor PR will be checked tm
big change, scary
craggy barn
its not big, i havent done the full refactor yet
my other pr is just dk stuff
ive been busy doing my own side project to focus on the major refactor
frail veldt
<@151872253229924352> In this context the difference is Sensei cp update fills t...
ah yeah its more responsive
you can add delay to make it "look" smoother
but thtas kinda silly no?
keen belfry
neighborhood shsould have trianing dumdainyies
keen belfry
for you
formal knot
so you can fix whatever just happened there
engagement bait.. he gets more clicks and views by adding typos to the discord messages
frail veldt
engagement bait.. he gets more clicks and views by adding typos to the discord m...
thtas ohnestly a graet ieda
keen belfry
@sonic pawn is this smoother to you
lyric crest
too fast, more lerp
sonic pawn
@keen belfry That does look smoother. What exactly did you change ?
past falcon
wtb a gun between the eyes so i can be put out of my misery watching the patriots rn
past falcon
that’ll work 💓
wintry solar
Full sized too
thick vigil
WANGBAR
graceful rover
I picked up outlaw in the pre patch and god killing spree visual vs broomstick is so much fun
covert kestrel
I picked up outlaw in the pre patch and god killing spree visual vs broomstick i...
Too bad it's a worse boomstick in every way
graceful rover
Oh yeah 100% it’s like 17th in detail vs boom is like #1 by miles
It it’s like John wick vs hillbillies
Idk I have three healers and was going to do 3 dps. Rogue is one dk and between mage or hunter.
craggy barn
<@132306347856363520> is this smoother to you
@sonic pawn like this?
top is wang bottom is sensei
covert kestrel
smoothing is gross
untold wadi
!wangbar
ornate heathBOT
Resources:
- ArcUI / BetterCDM - common suites for buff/cd customization
- WangBar - displays CPs/energy, customize colors per point, faster than Sensei
- MSUF - recommendation for unit frames
- Platynator - recommendation for nameplates (Jundies Profile)
Misc: - Mute Cold Blood sound
- EasyReminders - can show poison reminders outside of instances
untold wadi
idk weird
ornate heathBOT
Resources:
- ArcUI / BetterCDM - common suites for buff/cd customization
- WangBar - displays CPs/energy, customize colors per point, faster than Sensei
- MSUF - recommendation for unit frames
- Platynator - recommendation for nameplates (Jundies Profile)
Misc: - Mute Cold Blood sound
- EasyReminders - can show poison reminders outside of instances
wintry solar
He has favorites
sonic pawn
@craggy barn Yeah looks pretty similar now i assume the bottom sensei one has smoothing on. Did you add a smoothing feature similar to sensei to wang bar ?
craggy barn
to wang
sonic pawn
Yeah im saying they both look quite similar now
craggy barn
yea i added smoothing to wang. awang just needs to merge it
sonic pawn
yeah looks good thanks for adding it even if a few dislike smoothing appreciate your effort.
craggy barn
optional features are optional. people can dislike it but no reason not to add it when someone requests it
if wangbar is for the people then shit like that needs to get added
wintry solar
Call me crazy
keen belfry
crqazy
low glade
!wangbar
round spindle
I'm here for the wangbar
keen belfry
<@132306347856363520> like this?
can ucompare it to bcm, im worried about speed
frail rover
Is there an addon, Which announces shroud in chat an write Timings?
craggy barn
can ucompare it to bcm, im worried about speed
the interpolation shouldnt have anything to do with the execution speed. since thats tied to the event. my version of senseis uses the same event that wangbar and bcm uses