outlaw

[vivid vessel]

which is one of the best dev out there

[inland meteor]

look here, i uploaded a short video for wang because theres a bug rn

[vivid vessel]

like you can be sure the addon wont be bugged to shit and it will be good performance wise

thats his whole thing

[proven ocean]

Zac

I hope a cow wakes you up one day and says meow

Just to shock ur ass

[vivid vessel]

wtf

[fossil lintel]

Is it possible to separate the CDM buffs into multiple sections or are they stuck being a single group?

[inland meteor]

alright maybe ill swap over then

[chilly atlas]

a cow eating a cheeseburger

[proven ocean]

Based cow

[fathom bramble]

best plan right now is probably to just pick anything and get a managable ui

[fossil lintel]

Nice wang btw

[fathom bramble]

and reevaluate in a few weeks when more addons are more done

[inland meteor]

single group, but better cooldown manager probably lets u separate, arc ui does

[inland meteor]

thanks bro

[proven ocean]

Ppl told me that day 1 beta

[vivid vessel]

its possible yes

idk if any addon does it rn tho

i havent checked

its abit finicky

blizzard made it hard

usually its a bit buggy

[proven ocean]

Finicky?

[vivid vessel]

yes

[fathom bramble]

arcui lets you drag icons all over the place

[proven ocean]

Zac knows englsih wff?

[vivid vessel]

finicky

[proven ocean]

How does zac know finicky

[fossil lintel]

I'll check out arcui then

[fathom bramble]

but they also still have their 'section'

[vivid vessel]

I read game of thrones in english back in the days

[fathom bramble]

it's kind of strange

[proven ocean]

Read!!

[vivid vessel]

its written in old english

[proven ocean]

U read books?

[vivid vessel]

like weird af english

[inland meteor]

the UI for arcui is dogass so you have to fiddle around a bit but it should work

[fathom bramble]

arcui is also the only one(I think?) that does bars rn

which I need in order to be content with my ui

[proven ocean]

New zac lore unlocked

[vivid vessel]

before i discovered video games i was a big reader guy, i would read legit 5 books a week

[proven ocean]

Wtf

Crazy

[vivid vessel]

i was just reading everyday all day

[proven ocean]

“Discovered video games”

[cinder relic]

It's a basic builder spender spec. It's like fury warrior if its a bit more involved if you ever played that

[fathom bramble]

reading a book in 1 sitting was nice

[vivid vessel]

that is true, altough better cdm is working on it

[fossil lintel]

Bro was almost 1gcd per book

[vivid vessel]

i mean

idk i cant read the same way i did back then

but when you are a big reader

reading is kinda insane im ngl

its better than watching movies

[fossil lintel]

Yeah reading is pretty good

[vivid vessel]

more immersive

[proven ocean]

I get bored before opening the book

Let alone reading it

[fathom bramble]

apm too low I guess

[proven ocean]

Likely

[inland meteor]

are u going to read race awang zeross

[fossil lintel]

I just got the mistborn trilogy in english, need to set some time to start

[proven ocean]

No but i can type race anyone

[keen belfry]

What do you read zac

[proven ocean]

I’ll win at a great cost of flooding the entire chat

[fossil lintel]

He said he read got

[proven ocean]

I’ll lose any reading contest

[vivid vessel]

i stopped reading a long time ago now

but i read basically everything that was good

[fervent garden]

HAHAAH

[proven ocean]

Can u read my cock zac

[keen belfry]

I’m back to reading

[vivid vessel]

fantasy / science fiction things

[fervent garden]

everything that was good eh?

[keen belfry]

Kinda goated

[vivid vessel]

ye

then i got bored cause the rest was bad

[fossil lintel]

Did you read Dragonlance?

[fervent garden]

its a tough genre. same tropes, blah blah blah

[keen belfry]

Read a tale of two cities zac!

[vivid vessel]

no

never heard of that

i mean im french tho

[fossil lintel]

Bro, you didn't read everything that was good

[vivid vessel]

i prolly read things that is not the same that you guys read

[fossil lintel]

I know, and I'm Brazilian, that's no excuse

[keen belfry]

Take of two cities takes place in French land and English land

Just saying

[fervent garden]

Red Rising series by Scott Pierce is good. It's called Red Rising in French.

fyi

[vivid vessel]

never heard of it

so its prolly bad

[fervent garden]

hahahaha killing me today zac

[vivid vessel]

[fossil lintel]

Bro trying to push sci fi

Did you read fall of giants?

[vivid vessel]

never heard of it

must be bad

[fossil lintel]

What did you read? Got and lotro?

[vivid vessel]

i actually dont like lotr at all lol

[fossil lintel]

So just got

[vivid vessel]

no i mean i read a lot of things

[fervent garden]

lotr sucks

[vivid vessel]

i cant make a list tho

[fossil lintel]

Yeah I don't blame you

[vivid vessel]

only a few i could name prolly

[fossil lintel]

What was your favourite?

[vivid vessel]

artemis fowl

and autre monde

[fossil lintel]

Never heard of either, must be bad

[vivid vessel]

well

artemis fowl is kinda known i think tho

autre monde is from a french author so

but absolute bangers

no capo

[patent schooner]

its crackshot dead on midnight?

[vivid vessel]

well it doesnt exist

[patent schooner]

u mean crackshot?

[vivid vessel]

yes

[patent schooner]

Holy moly

Im definitely back to game

[fossil lintel]

We have crackshot at home

[soft bobcat]

New outlaw is a bit boring but. It’s damage looks decent

I haven’t tried sin but the bleed spreading looks garbage

[latent oak]

bro u cant say u read all the good stuff and then list 2 YA series as bangers

[fervent garden]

shots fired

[fossil lintel]

If you ever want to read an absolute banger from Brazilian literature, look up The Posthumous Memoirs of Brás Cubas

[vivid vessel]

i was reading when i was young

[keen belfry]

We keep collecting non crackshot enjoyers to this spec

[vivid vessel]

also

i do think

books get boring

[keen belfry]

Fried!!

[vivid vessel]

when its books for adults

and thats not even a cap

people get too serious

[latent oak]

crazy take

[vivid vessel]

my father was reading a book about ants bro

talking like its an absolute banger

[soft bobcat]

I loved outlaw in dragon flight but the nerf at the beginning of tww made me swap

[latent oak]

it might have been a banger

[vivid vessel]

im reading books about fucking elves and shit

[latent oak]

who knows

[vivid vessel]

like buddy

i think young adult books are just better lol

like labyrinth and hunger games are objectively bangers

[latent oak]

gotta be the take of someone who has only read ya books

[soft bobcat]

Akotsk graphic novels

[vivid vessel]

its just better

thats all

[craggy barn]

zac likes reading elf smut???

[latent oak]

hunger games is certainly not a banger series

[vivid vessel]

it is

you are part of the people that need to feel intelectually superior about what they read so they only read boring af books

[fervent garden]

yeahthats mee

[vivid vessel]

so boring you slug trough it

[inland meteor]

ants are pretty sick i cant lie

[vivid vessel]

one chapter a week

[latent oak]

i liked hunger games when i was like 14

[vivid vessel]

thats litteraly every adult ever

[latent oak]

but wouldnt bother with it now bc there is better stuff

[vivid vessel]

enjoy reading when they are children and young right

[fervent garden]

like that Gravity's Rainbow jam.

[vivid vessel]

and then when they get old

[inland meteor]

maybe not read a book about them sick but still pretty sick

[vivid vessel]

they feel like thy need to read books for intelligent people

but its boring for everyone

[latent oak]

most adult readers just read chic flicks no?

[vivid vessel]

so they end up reading one chapter a month

one book every 3 years

but they feel better abouit themselves

[latent oak]

which is the opposite of what ur saying

[vivid vessel]

cause they are reading books for intelligent people

(no one cares just read fun stuffs)

[latent oak]

but there is so much fun stuff that isnt ya

hardly anyone is reading war and peace

or joyce

[patent schooner]

Im like the #1 crackshot hater

[keen belfry]

Guy is

[patent schooner]

Playing at 200ms with a time constraint mechanic isn't a good thing

[fossil lintel]

Eh crackshot was fine at 140ms

[fathom bramble]

I mean if your higher than normal MS is making you miss gcds that's still going to hurt your damage just as much in a post-crack world

we are still mostly gcd locked

and care a lot about not having gaps between spells

[fossil lintel]

Spellqueue solves that though

[fathom bramble]

yeah

[fossil lintel]

Just shortens how fast you gotta react

[fathom bramble]

solves it in both worlds

[fossil lintel]

Exactly

[patent schooner]

I understand the logic, but the gameplay flow was strange for crackshot windows

[keen belfry]

Crackshot was so fun

So fun having something to look forward to in our rotation

[buoyant stratus]

Just proc bro

[patent schooner]

Its most for react ace procs

[keen belfry]

Sadly this was over what 14 seconds or whatever

[old gull]

I miss it

[buoyant stratus]

Yeee not the same as 7 btes in a row i get it

[fathom bramble]

man the generator between every cast

rip ace

[buoyant stratus]

Ace 1 point such a tragedy

[fathom bramble]

we might not even run ace in dungeons anyway too

ace 0 point soon

[inland meteor]

i loved crackshot i just didnt like vanish, idk why they couldnt just give us something like shadow dance

[vivid vessel]

XDDDD

[keen belfry]

https://medal.tv/games/world-of-warcraft/clips/2bBKONMKxQlf_y

Look at dragonflight 😓

[vivid vessel]

this is like if you were entering a vanish window and got 0 ace proc

[fossil lintel]

We had shadow dance before, it was better with two vanishes

[vivid vessel]

so fun bro

me when i have fun in world of warcraft

[buoyant stratus]

Yeee i was playing the heightened rush no bte talents was kinda a banger

[undone notch]

NGL I might just stick on Fatebound

[buoyant stratus]

Dw s2 midnight tier set is just crackshot

[undone notch]

Killing Spree feels really weak rn

[buoyant stratus]

Smile

[vivid vessel]

idc aboytu crackshot bro

i jsut want

ace

to actually

give me cp

i want the devs to stop trolling me

[keen belfry]

Give you what?

[vivid vessel]

lot of cps

[fossil lintel]

I miss old KS

/s before Zac kills me

[keen belfry]

Ty

[buoyant stratus]

Haha i conflate ace and crackshot mb mlord

[vivid vessel]

old ks is legit better so

[undone notch]

"JESSE DON'T ABBREVIATE COMBO POINTS! JESSEEEEEE"

[vivid vessel]

they managed to change the worse spell in the game into the worse spell in the game

[craggy barn]

we had shadow dance...then people complaiend and then we got double vanish, and then people complaiend and now we have temu crack

[vivid vessel]

kinda a banger

only a rogue dev could have done that

[fossil lintel]

What's the problem with CP?

[buoyant stratus]

They coulda just made it like dh blade dance xd

But no gun goes pewpew

[fathom bramble]

I love that people have been saying KS should just be like blade dance since DH was revealed

[buoyant stratus]

(Randomly -prio damage)

[fathom bramble]

and it still hasn't been really fixed into a spell people will stop complaining about

[vivid vessel]

I mean even the gun thing isn't a bad idea but like

[inland meteor]

yeah i member, they shouldve just changed shadow dance so it thematically fit better but kept the functionality the same

[vivid vessel]

Why is the execution so bad

It's just a bad spel

[fathom bramble]

why isn't it just the samira/reaper ult everyone was suggesting

[keen belfry]

This is an old ass conversation but the KS rework was malpractice to me

[fathom bramble]

they just made a worse version of that suggestion somehow

[pastel pendant]

yeah i cant stand how new ks looks

[keen belfry]

The new dmg meter and ks rework could get someone fired

[pastel pendant]

just the animation looks off

[craggy barn]

new ks was fine until they made it frontal targetting only

imo

[keen belfry]

Its animation is the only coool thing to me

I love this new Zach guy

[agile orchid]

I don't understand why they didn't just make killing spree full aoe

[craggy barn]

when ks just aoe'd around u i didnt mind it as much

[keen belfry]

This Zach guy has to be moot

Like no cap

[craggy barn]

also if ks didnt only hit 1 target directly at a time

[undone notch]

I like the new Killing Spree visually I just don't really understand why they decreased it's damage so much for midnight

[fossil lintel]

13 sec long KS

[undone notch]

I thought it was really cool to have one high(ish) CD move that did good damage

[fathom bramble]

idk it got hit when they were nerfing a lot of classes cooldowns in general

[undone notch]

Now it does less damage than a BTE crit :(

[fathom bramble]

probably got hit too hard unless they just don't want us to ever talent it as fatebound

[vivid vessel]

Good damage but it's rng targeting so it's litteraly worth 0

[pastel pendant]

fr its that bad?

wtf

[inland meteor]

literally just shoot the final boss in the head thats why it had to be nerfed

[pastel pendant]

u still just end it once it fills ur combo points

[fossil lintel]

It does no prio

[pastel pendant]

lol

[fathom bramble]

KS really needed to be all nearby enemies(no BF if it does this) or just your target

the fact that it can hit immune enemies and other nonsense targets you don't want to hit is incredibly annoying

or similar to blade rush

where it hits the primary target for X and everything else for Y

[vivid vessel]

imma be honest bro

in s3 like live '

it was prolly worth it to cancel ks instantly

in packs like first pack of arakara

thats how bad the spell is

[past falcon]

my rogue’s just been picking berries all week for neighborhood endeavors . how the mighty have fallen

[pastel pendant]

hopefully they make some major classes changes becuz this just aint it

[past falcon]

this would be too logical!

why would you ever want to hit the target you’re .. targeting

[keen belfry]

Because vibes

[vivid vessel]

ye how did this even happen btw

like

[keen belfry]

We are outlaws. We don’t follow the rules. There is no rhyme to who we blast, we blast.

[vivid vessel]

how do you suddenly make a spell

[old gull]

Having to press blade flurry more often…

[vivid vessel]

that just

does random damage

in world of warcraft

you create that spell in 2025

who tf did that bro

[upper surge]

Killing spree can now Target corpses

This is a buff

[pastel pendant]

i mean it makes sense with how the devs designed classes now lol

[fathom bramble]

they also still haven't fixed BF not copying on killing blows

[pastel pendant]

most classes suck to play now

[fathom bramble]

which I was kind of hoping would get fixed sometime after the panic quick fix on BF hitting corpses

[vivid vessel]

i mena they will never fix thatr

i dont care about it tho

[fathom bramble]

BTE crits for 60k and just domes some add

[frail veldt]

I have a feeling it's reused

[upper surge]

Are you an LLM designed to complain 24/7?

[fathom bramble]

and you get no cleave

it's very annoying

[frail veldt]

Like it came from something else

[pastel pendant]

LLM?

[frail veldt]

Or they actually are that clueless

[vivid vessel]

tbf

[frail veldt]

Just don't get baited

[vivid vessel]

i have taken in the habit of swapping target early

[upper surge]

I can only deal with one zac

[vivid vessel]

few reason but

one is gs

2 is trickster

[fathom bramble]

copied from old ks that use to have random targeting 🤔

[vivid vessel]

3 is more general

you dont wanna finish mobs

thats not the fastest way to kill a pack

so staying on a target till it dies

is legit skill issue

[keen belfry]

He is the goat

[vivid vessel]

and should never happen

so idc about it really

[upper surge]

Zac I will give you 100k if you can go 1 week without typing more than 3 messages in a row

[fathom bramble]

I mean I was doing a low arakara to help someone out and I damn near oneshot an add on the first boss

[pastel pendant]

im sorry theres just nothing to be positive for outlaw now

[fathom bramble]

and got 0 cleave

[vivid vessel]

100k irl or in game

[pastel pendant]

like im just being realistic here

[fathom bramble]

the answer there is to mouseover BTE the boss I guess

[vivid vessel]

i do not care about 100k gold bro

[upper surge]

It doesn't matter because you wont to be able to do it

[vivid vessel]

im gonna be honest

i mean i can do a lot if you paypal me 100k bro

[upper surge]

Zac entering his only fans era

[vivid vessel]

tbf you are supposed to be cleaving from the boss so

[pastel pendant]

like do i just need to stack full haste to make this spec fun again idk

[fathom bramble]

yes

[keen belfry]

Not to be fun, to function

[fathom bramble]

that is how combat worked and is now how outlaw works

haste will fix it 🙂

if you don't have the requisite haste because you just got to max level the spec almost doesn't function

[pastel pendant]

thats pretty much it for me, if the globals were faster like b4 than i would be having gun

fun

i just want fast globals

[frail veldt]

The globals are the same speed during adr

[pastel pendant]

yeah but u dont get adr up now

its like 30%

[fathom bramble]

I'm more worried about not having enough energy

[frail veldt]

Correct

[frail veldt]

Same

[fathom bramble]

maybe we go goblin in the first tier for an extra sip of haste

[frail veldt]

Honestly I wouldn't care that much about the lower adr uptime if they didn't remove so much of the dynamic rotation

[pastel pendant]

yeah during adr im having fun its just when i dont have it up its so boring

[fathom bramble]

I don't think crit is high enough for tauren to be good anyway

[frail veldt]

If we had 90% adr uptime but we kept this boring builder spender logic I'd still not enjoy it

[keen belfry]

I’ve had a lot of moments on prepatch m+ where I genuinely have no energy for extended periods of time

[frail veldt]

Lower adr is not what makes midnight outlaw boring to me

[keen belfry]

And I haven’t played that much

[frail veldt]

Yeah that's a trickster thing once tea runs out

Like 5-10 seconds of just no buttons sometimes lol

[pastel pendant]

they need to make crackshots happen more often, and they need to fill ur combo points, you should be able to get 5-6 in a row if ur lucky, if they dont wanna tie it to vanish anymore

like it needs to happen more often to make the spec fun

becuz yea the builder spender downtime rotation of tww just isnt it lol

[vivid vessel]

ace

its ace

why is everyone

calling ace

crackshot

im gonna go crazy bro

i swear

[pastel pendant]

ok ace but u get what im saying

[upper hawk]

ok ace

[undone notch]

You got it Ace

[fossil lintel]

zace

[frail veldt]

Zackshot

[keen belfry]

They would fix a lot if they:
increased base energy regen
Increases BTE cd but add charges
Made ace higher proc chance + 1 point

[fossil lintel]

Can't wait for classic tww so we can play crackshot again

[quaint sable]

And then 2 years later tww anniversary

[undone notch]

IMO supercharger needs a buff

Its kinda really bad rn lol

[frail veldt]

It's shared so it's hard to buff

[fathom bramble]

that's probably true, but the difference between cold blood and supercharger gameplay wise is basically nothing

[frail veldt]

Yeah they're both passives

No gameplay so doesn't matter

[keen belfry]

I mean sc being on dance vs AR is kinda crazy

[fathom bramble]

it's kind of unimportant compared to most other possible focuses rn

[undone notch]

I mean

[frail veldt]

Yeup they did a poor job with that

[undone notch]

You get more Ace resets w Supercharger, so

That can matter a lot

[frail veldt]

Still a passive

[fathom bramble]

they can make it be a different number of supercharged points depending on spec

[keen belfry]

It’s hard to guarantee sc on bte

[fathom bramble]

they have done spec diffs in the past

[keen belfry]

With it on AR

[frail veldt]

Supercharger value is the least of outlaws issues rn hahaha

[keen belfry]

Yes

[fathom bramble]

it's definitely a bit lame that we have 2 capstones in the rogue tree that are basically doa though

even if it is hard to care compared to some of our more pressing and obvious spec issues

[keen belfry]

KIR could be so cool with our new rtb

But it was bold of us to ask for iteration during alpha and beta

[frail veldt]

Yeah how dare we

[keen belfry]

Like KIR could be so banger

What if KIR kept all active buffs rolling

Like AR, BTE stacks, and RTB

[inland meteor]

bring back crackshot make it work with KIR

[tender rapids]

hi

[inland meteor]

30 second crackshot window i see no issue

[keen belfry]

You

[fathom bramble]

replace fast action with a new crackshot

Between the eyes has no cooldown during adrenaline rush

also give ar 2 charges

[inland meteor]

also give prep 2 charges

[keen belfry]

Stop cooking up fun talents lok

You need to align yourself with Blizz

[quaint sable]

bte having 2 charges would also be huge

[fossil lintel]

Kir should upgrade 1 level and extend 30 seconds

It would be perfect

[keen belfry]

This would legit fix so much imo

[fathom bramble]

true

I really wish prep was just a talent that gave all skills on its list 2 charges

[keen belfry]

That’s been our wish since alpha week 1

[fathom bramble]

instead of being a reset active

[quaint sable]

it should also buffer overflow and turn jackpot into 1 of a kind

[inland meteor]

like make it passive u mean

[fathom bramble]

yes

instead of an active

[inland meteor]

im with it

[fathom bramble]

every spell on preps list has really goo reasons why it should be 2 charges

except maybe KS

[inland meteor]

no one sees the double KS coming

[quaint sable]

Ye ks woulnt really matter

I guess u could play around coup and try not overcap stacks but meh

[fathom bramble]

yeah the fact that you wouldn't really ever want to cast 2 KS back to back makes 2 charges a bit weird

[fossil lintel]

2 charges of blade flurry would help a lot

[quaint sable]

Honestly wouldnt be bad for m+ but isnt strictly that needed.

[fathom bramble]

it's more for raid than M+

if you are running 10 second BF any amount of bad rng makes it fall off

2 charges gives some wiggle room on it

[quaint sable]

Im thinking running between packs

but ye

[fathom bramble]

yeah it helps there too

BR lets you actually hold it for when you need energy and in the worst of times cast 2 in quick succession if your energy is really doomed

AR benefits are obvious and do not need to be mentioned

BTE we can refresh 2 charges at once in midnight, but can't even store 2

you also waste fractional charges constantly

[upper hawk]

after playing balance with charges on cd. and frost mage in beta with 2 charges on ray of frost, i think nearly all specs should just have charges on big cds

so fight timings aren't so shitty for some specs and not others

[keen belfry]

Charges offer an awesome amount of flexibility

ESPECIALLY for a CDR spec like ours

Wait I have a weird question about BTE charges

If it had charges, would we want it on restless blades?

I don’t think so right?

Or maybe it CD would have to be like, quadrupled

Like baseline 2 minutes

[fathom bramble]

why?

extra charges gets you probably only like 20% more casts at most

[upper hawk]

yeah, he longer the fight the more the extra charges converge to 0

it's just a way to have flexibility really

or to +1

[fathom bramble]

well for BTE it prevents a lot of fractional charge waste from overcapping the cd

[keen belfry]

How I envision bte charges is allowing you to kinda choose when you want to BTE. But if you do that, high chance you just end up wasting CDR cause BTE reset and you are now sitting at 2 charges while BTE could reset again. Right?

[upper hawk]

true, for a cdr class (is there another one?) charges have even more value

[keen belfry]

Like we’d have a rule like old dance , use it around 45 seconds on vanish cdr

[inland meteor]

but i feel like if you get unlucky a long cd bte would feel proper shit

[fathom bramble]

it could have aspects of this still, but because we can refund 2 charges at once it's possible that you end up mostly still casting on CD depending on how many bullets you currently have loaded

[keen belfry]

Yeah

[fathom bramble]

if the time in outlawseconds before you cap on BTE is lower than AR I would suspect that you cast BTE

and otherwise hold for AR

[keen belfry]

Wouldn’t removing it from restless but adding charges kinda allow you to press it whenever?

[fathom bramble]

stuff like that

[keen belfry]

Or is that same thing

[fathom bramble]

you would still have the same double refund problem incentivizing you to cast it as soon as you can

[keen belfry]

Restless + reset + charges seems a bit complicated to my head rn

[keen belfry]

Yeahhh

[fathom bramble]

I think keeping it on restless if anything makes it simpler

since you would only ever hold for AR

and it makes telling what will come up first very easy

since they will both pass time in outlawseconds instead of real ones

[keen belfry]

Yeah

I just want some dmg agency

I can already see a m+ mechanic failing cause I have no control of my dmg

[upper hawk]

welcome to the damage agency

[keen belfry]

Sorry that totem lived longer!

[round spindle]

Fury does a bit.

[upper hawk]

feral used to could

[fathom bramble]

yeah...

the answer to this one is 2 charges of AR as usual

[wintry solar]

Better have saved prep for the totem

[keen belfry]

Prep in m+ 💀

[quaint sable]

Remember we have zero in as a talent too which also forces us to press BtE on cd as overcapping zero in is bad too

so even with 2 charges u mostly press on cd

[patent schooner]

@fossil lintel can I Dm you? Im a BR too

[keen belfry]

You won’t overcap zero in for awhile in midnight

If ever

It barely overcaps at 47% crit on prepatch rn

[fathom bramble]

Preparation: 1 Minute CD, 2 charges. Gain 6 seconds of Adrenaline Rush, Blade Flurry, and a use of BTE.

Activating this or AR/BF during one or the other adds the 2 durations

[keen belfry]

With crit trinkets

[quaint sable]

Really I felt like I was getting close to 20 if I low rolled rtb for a while

[keen belfry]

On prepatch?

[quaint sable]

and that was with like 22% crit cause old stats

Ye prepatch. I dont own midnight epic so cant do beta

[wintry solar]

No

What?

[keen belfry]

Iirc solo said something like average zero in stacks on his sim was like 8

Could be misremembering

[wintry solar]

You're smart but you have a tendency to overcook things lol

[fathom bramble]

better than current prep

[wintry solar]

That's a low ball

[fathom bramble]

idk if it's even that overcooked compared to some of the uhuh replacers I've thrown out anyway lol

[long barn]

Are the outlaw buffs live on retail or still only beta

[wintry solar]

I'm scared lolol

[fathom bramble]

it's just what if prep was weaker and did the same thing, but more often

[radiant wyvern]

why cant we just have 2nd ar charge

[fathom bramble]

good question Elerk

good question

[radiant wyvern]

ty

[fathom bramble]

one day we might get 2 charges of AR

it's been a good idea for like 10 years

15?

something

[wintry solar]

Since before legion

15ish yeah

[undone notch]

Is HO still not great?...

[radiant wyvern]

spec would be so fun if we had a modicum of agency

[inland meteor]

Society if outlaw rogues had 2 ar charges

[fathom bramble]

HO got massively nerfed with the initial rework and hasn't gotten anything of note since

so it is unfortunately still not great

or maybe fortunately

depending on who you ask

[radiant wyvern]

it's also very expensive in talent points

[undone notch]

I thought it would be fun on Fatebound idk

[fathom bramble]

since the main cool part of HO was just to make our stealth windows more reliable thanks to actually pressing ambush idk what even the point of it is now

if they don't want us vanishing for DPS HO can never be good

[undone notch]

You could maybe still run a subterfuge build but its probs throwing

[radiant wyvern]

a monkey on a typewriter is the dev for outlaw

[fathom bramble]

I mean

say what you will, but it was probably just rushed

and they didn't have time to fully adjust our stealth stuff

[stuck sparrow]

*rogue

[fathom bramble]

so it was just kind of crudely removed with some talent that are basically placeholders now left behind

[radiant wyvern]

but why is any of it rushed

we're all going to wait anyways

[fathom bramble]

because they started working on nuking our UIs and then asked themselves if it was 'fair' to ask the player to need to track all these things

and accidentally triggered a gamewide class prune

[keen belfry]

Yo chat. Would you pay 250$ for a reimage of windows and then a data recovery + new drive for the data? Or just 100 for the reinstalled windows

My pc guy thinks my disk just had firmware issues, no PSU issues

[radiant wyvern]

if midnight was pushed another month would it have even been a problem

[fathom bramble]

the workload of what they are doing to every class in the game simultaneously imo was always going to result in something being rushed, unfinished, or forgotten

[radiant wyvern]

it would have actually made me bother trying to play tbc

[stuck sparrow]

too busy working on housing

[fathom bramble]

that gives them 1 extra day for each spec

who knows

[radiant wyvern]

better than nothing

[wintry solar]

Might as well be nothing

What can they get done in a day?

[stuck sparrow]

aura buff assa by 15%

prob

[quaint sable]

turn prep into a passive that gives us 2 charges of all the mentioned abilities

[inland meteor]

Add an extra ar charge

[wintry solar]

We've no idea the process of making changes

[quaint sable]

Ye the beuaraucracy is def gonna be crazy for any changes

[wintry solar]

I'm of the belief there are small meetings for stuff like this

And in classic corporate fashion they could be an email

[stuck sparrow]

im pretty sure outlaw is one of the community’s more disliked specs

like the casual lfr/quest andys

[radiant wyvern]

and it was basically christmas/newyear holiday leave into prepatch release, so they would have actually been able to work on anything at all instead of half the team probably being afk

[stuck sparrow]

i’ve heard more bring back combat

than anything from general playerbase

[craggy barn]

bring back combat just to not play it

[fathom bramble]

pretty sure no one playing combat was a big reason why we even got outlaw

[stuck sparrow]

wasnt it sometimes good

idk im not that unc

[craggy barn]

people fundamentally misunderstand why rogue is unpopular
and then scream about various issues that arent the real reason

[stuck sparrow]

low leveling experience

[radiant wyvern]

we need a zillennial cokehead dev on the spec, STAT

[stuck sparrow]

not enough energy

[fathom bramble]

like at the end of mists with the cooldown recovery rate trinket

more AR more good as usual

rogue leveling is abysmal

[craggy barn]

one of several reasons

[fathom bramble]

melee, no self-healing, no resources, no tank/healer specs to do dungeons with

[craggy barn]

but people love ot point at outlaw having used vanish as part of its offensive rotation

and say thats why rogue sucks and is unpopular

[stuck sparrow]

or rtb

[craggy barn]

if someone says "but other games make the rogue archetype popular" they are wrong

ffxiv : ninja is not giga popular

lost ark: rogue is anime hot woman so point is wrong

[wintry solar]

Well outlaw worked without vanish and BFA was completely stealthless and I think that's what really drove the stealthless outlaw craze

[craggy barn]

theres many reasons rogue is unpopular
scoundrel archetype is just not popular against things like bm hunter ease of play / pet collection or paladin flexibility / fantasy / flashy lights

[wintry solar]

It'd probably help if we had good visuals though

[stuck sparrow]

i’ve heard some say rogue archetype

feels wrong without daggers

[fossil lintel]

Rogues are popular in d&d

[craggy barn]

yea but dnd is a completely different mechanical medium

[mighty pivot]

they call a meeting with all the shareholders

[craggy barn]

and doesnt force a specific fantasy on u

warcraft rogue is very low fantasy and has had a reputation of being mechanically complex

[fossil lintel]

It is a scoundrel archetype

[craggy barn]

which has kept its population low

[wintry solar]

DnD has a whole list of rogue archetypes

Plentiful

[fossil lintel]

Yeah, but all of them just sneak attack and steal from everyone they can including the party

Fucking rogue players

[mighty pivot]

half of the rogue-y things you cannot even do in wow. Stealth, pickpocket, disarming traps are basically nonexistent

[wintry solar]

Not true

[craggy barn]

rogue in the public eye is just unpopular and it will take a lot to gain a larger playerbase

[wintry solar]

Ironically the Swashbuckler doesnt

Blizz should start stealing ideas again

[fossil lintel]

They still sneak attack and steal stuff

[craggy barn]

they have stolen ideas lately

they stole tic tac toe

[mighty pivot]

allow rogues to pickpocket bosses for loot, you cowards

[lime lake]

real

[fossil lintel]

I would say we need a Tetris boss but that was almost what we just had

[quaint sable]

Allow rogues to pickpocket our fellow raid members

[craggy barn]

custom emote and trick people

[mighty pivot]

billy might've won the roll, but you still got the item

[craggy barn]

like the old days

[peak dock]

hello anyone know how to make the castbar bigger in the plater addon?

[keen belfry]

Ninja robot where is buil

[undone notch]

Does HO take more talent points than other builds?...

At least on Fatebound, wouldn't you just put the points from Heavy Hitter into Audacity and HO?

[radiant wyvern]

outlaw gets extra dice to roll with :^)

[wintry solar]

Ye

You also get to take improved ambush :D

Over tight spender

[vestal notch]

i wish outlaw went deeper in the pirate role

[stuck sparrow]

they did in legion

and backtracked

[vestal notch]

yep

[wintry solar]

Because people who didn't play outlaw bitched and moaned

[fathom bramble]

and now we have a random tumbleweed for some reason ?

[vestal notch]

the pirate theme with cannon barrage and the swords

so cool

dreadblades was cool af too

[mighty pivot]

sorry it's solo's fault. he's late with his work

[keen belfry]

It’s ok I guess

[mighty pivot]

he added some extra nice changes though

[fathom bramble]

like surely wild west outlaw is even more niche than pirate

[vestal notch]

what did they moean about?

[fathom bramble]

bring back pirate rogue

[stuck sparrow]

rtb

[fathom bramble]

or

crazy thought

[wintry solar]

Pirate

[fathom bramble]

what if we used the glyph system

[wintry solar]

Nah

[undone notch]

I kinda don't mind super charger still. Idk if its great but if you get a gun reset, pop adren rush for charger + full points, a 9 point BTE into a Dispatch isnt awful

[wintry solar]

Pirate is the only chance I get at getting DB back

[stuck sparrow]

did they remove db

or its so so undertuned

idr

[wintry solar]

Have you played at all in the past 2 years?

Yeah it's gone

[stuck sparrow]

i dont recall if it got axed

it got shelved after df s1

[wintry solar]

Sub actually has it now

During

Yeah

[stuck sparrow]

sub also has goremaw

despite it sucks

[quaint sable]

didnt they just change the cp thing from blades with midnight'

[fathom bramble]

yeah

doubles cp generation now instead of making any generator max you out

[wintry solar]

Interesting

[stuck sparrow]

which for strike

[wintry solar]

They could give us Greed

[stuck sparrow]

didnt change anything

[wintry solar]

Gimme gimme gimme

[fathom bramble]

yeah

imo it was just to further force dancing during blades

instead of the potential of a weird dance outside of blades setup

[mighty pivot]

they wasted their once-in-a-decade glyph implementation on glyphs that you cannot even see. Unlucky I guess!

[wintry solar]

I still don't have them

[fathom bramble]

greed animation on blade rush with a glyph

[mighty pivot]

I have the gold pistol. You literally cannot see it

[quaint sable]

ye also bsing for macabre and maybe even cheapshot in pvp

tho cheapshot cd kinda does that too

cause u could cheapshot evis strike evis cheapshot evis

[wintry solar]

Damn

I miss shadowblades

It was the only fun part of sub

Everything else forgettable at best

[keen belfry]

Someone lmk when build is

@ me

[vivid vessel]

there will be nothing in the build bro

[keen belfry]

Sure man

[vivid vessel]

waht are you even waiting for

[keen belfry]

Sure zac

[vivid vessel]

[keen belfry]

Da Build

[vivid vessel]

there has been nothing since week 1 alpha bud

[keen belfry]

Yeah so this week the

Then

[wintry solar]

Giving up is where people go wrong

[mighty pivot]

delusional hopium is the only way

[copper radish]

Just because you made that CP addon they’ll have some amazing notes for outlaw

[ripe ibex]

awang

you need to save outlaw

[radiant wyvern]

combo points removed from outlaw

[copper radish]

!awangui

[keen belfry]

I’d save it in 3 hours

[frail veldt]

Honestly

Yo what if they undo our st buff on beta but then don't undo the bf nerf

[vivid vessel]

like this wont ever happen in one patch

when we suddenly get 10% aura nerf

without bf adjustment

[frail veldt]

They would neeeeever do that

Don't be such a doomer

[strong halo]

so if i tldr beta right now

were boring but numbers are ok

[frank finch]

trickster is boring

fatebound is a little less boring

numbers are ok

[covert kestrel]

me when i fucking love coins

[silk dirge]

How is fatebound more fun than trickster lmao it has nothing you need to play around

[fathom bramble]

not having KS is an upgrade

[vivid vessel]

you get +1 cp on ss

so you have a cool rule for ss

[fathom bramble]

also it actually has enough baseline energy to function and free combo points on ss

[hardy vault]

no KS

[vivid vessel]

where you can prioritize pressing ss over fth

if you have 1 cp

so its interesting to play

[silk dirge]

smile

[vivid vessel]

trickster is just a gameplay downgrade

what smile

[hardy vault]

he put * before and in front

like old school emotes

[vivid vessel]

ye why he smilling

[hardy vault]

because he's happy

i suppose

[covert kestrel]

how do you make better cooldown manager power bars just not anchored to anything

[silk dirge]

Even with 6 stacks?

[vivid vessel]

no

its a fun little thing to think about tho

[keen belfry]

Build not here yet

Hmm

Guess I’ll go to dinner

Indian food

[lime lake]

the outlaw changes are on the way dw

[undone notch]

I wanna play Trickster but I miss slamming people with 2/2 Summarily Dispatched

Gimme big stab

[undone notch]

I'm mostly an M+ player so idk if I'm throwing if I pick Fatebound there

But everything else is hella good and idk what to give up for s.Disp

[covert kestrel]

its prepatch there is literally no such thing as throwing

[undone notch]

Yes but no?... Idk

My damage is a lot lower on Fatebound rn

[lime lake]

throwing by playing outlaw to begin with so its fine

[ashen void]

nice notes today

[vivid vessel]

@keen belfry thoughts on the rogue changes

[hollow portal]

xdd

[buoyant stratus]

Dw we'll log in and blade flurry fps wont be 10 !

[past falcon]

trusting you!

[frank finch]

are you finishing on 5 or 6

[fathom bramble]

"Developers’ notes: In this week’s updates, we’re focusing on rotational bloat during major cooldowns"
apparently ret had too many buttons

[daring oxide]

BF reduced to 10% damage soon

It’s too strong as it is now

We’re better off being pure ST

[frank finch]

wtf redesigning talents

so theres a channce

for outlaw

[vivid vessel]

that would be a first

xd

[daring oxide]

Uncap bf?

[vivid vessel]

bro said there is a chance for outalw

like its his first time

you have been here long enough black

no?

[mighty pivot]

guys... we get giga changes next week for sure

[frank finch]

hey just saying

new tyalents and reworks this late

[mighty pivot]

different devs

[frank finch]

so not 0% for law

[keen belfry]

Huge changes

[mighty pivot]

the ret pala and uhdk devs are just bad and cannot get the changes right the first time

[fathom bramble]

I'm surprised at the scope of some of the changes this week idk

[frail veldt]

youre lying right?

[fathom bramble]

maybe we do get some small adjustments

[vivid vessel]

guys

xdd

is this your first time

there is no way

[fathom bramble]

they just made blade of justice autocast on hammer tosses for herald

[vivid vessel]

[fathom bramble]

during wings*

so idk

[frail veldt]

BAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAA

[copper radish]

Bloat when it was two buttons lmao

Wonder what it’s like to be spoon fed

[frail veldt]

two builders was too confusing

I mean

this is borderline insulting if I were a ret player

youre just calling them stupid

to their face

[cinder relic]

they'd be very upset at that comment if they could read

[fathom bramble]

maybe herald will be intentionally undertuned

and exist for people that want an easier gameplay experience

[copper radish]

Did dawnlight always AoE heal or is that new

[fathom bramble]

go crusading strikes herald

1 generator 1 finisher during wings

[frail veldt]

assuming the easier spec is going to be tuned to be worse lolol

I always figured that would be the logical method but I have run into enough people who disagree that ive realized the concept of something that requires more effort/more skill is not universally seen as something that should be more rewarded

[undone notch]

Goin for 6/7 point finishers

I hate the meme plz dont burn me at the stake

[frank finch]

iirc solo said not finishing at 5 is big dps loss

for fb

[undone notch]

Darn

[mighty pivot]

wowhead posted notes from december instead of the latest ones

[covert kestrel]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/patch-12-0-1-midnight-beta-test-development-notes-class-tuning-380173?utm_source=discord-webhook

[desert tendon]

Balancing arround difficulty is a bad idea

[mighty pivot]

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/1201-midnight-beta-test-development-notes/2213807/11

[covert kestrel]

actual post

[frank finch]

wait

got baited?

[fathom bramble]

baited by wowhead unlucky

[frank finch]

gg its over

[fathom bramble]

they already removed a button for ret weeks ago

[frank finch]

outlaw no chnages

[vivid vessel]

isnt it the same ?

either link if i press ctrl f rogue

there is nothing

[fathom bramble]

I mean no rogue on either version

paladin actually got a good change

[runic gulch]

Oh you sweet summer child

[fathom bramble]

crusader strike coming back for holy

[copper radish]

Dw yall less than 30 days for early access

[frank finch]

k now i see rogue stuff in the datamine

[covert kestrel]

no law

[mighty pivot]

grammar changes

[frank finch]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/midnight-beta-patch-12-0-1-class-and-spell-tuning-changes-paladin-evoker-and-380175

[vivid vessel]

point ?

hell no

points

!

[mighty pivot]

there is nothing new for any spec

[frank finch]

we just struck out 3 times in less then 10 mins

[covert kestrel]

POINTS

[fathom bramble]

awards 1 combo points

I wonder what made that happen

[tawny dagger]

PointS

[undone notch]

I've been doin like.... 30k avg DPS on FB for an M+, idk what is considered good lmao

[covert kestrel]

me when i commit a change to my code that is just renaming a variable to look like im working

[ashen void]

Bro that huge it went from 1 combo point to 1 combo points! That's a buff!

[mighty pivot]

it's plural so it must be more combo point||s||

[leaden sonnet]

Technically they can give 2 points if you use them during shadow blades

But uh

[soft bobcat]

I dunno arcane blew me out of the water 😔

Sin does dookie damage

Haven’t tried sub

[keen belfry]

Huge build

[covert kestrel]

you called it awan

[desert tendon]

wangbuild

[vivid vessel]

where can i get that wangussy

[keen belfry]

ok i got my pc back

[craggy barn]

fix ur shit

[civic zephyr]

anyone know whos the go-to internet personality for outlaw content?

preferably one that understands their shit and plays PvE?

[vivid vessel]

there is none

i stream keys and raid when its season

rn its not so no stream

but we dont have a guy doing video guide or smt h

[keen belfry]

me

[keen belfry]

soon

[civic zephyr]

thats devastating

i was hoping there'd be a critcake equivelant but thats fine

outlaw-faq here is quite helpful anyway

[pastel sierra]

We can ask Guy to record himself reading it to the camera in front of a power point

[civic zephyr]

with a comically large pointer to hit the board with

i'd be down

[covert kestrel]

Fwiw video guides stonks will prob be at an all time low with current spec design lol

[civic zephyr]

RIP

[hasty fable]

Good youtuber and loves outlaw - Dalaran

[civic zephyr]

imma have to firm it out and try and iron out what mistakes i know im making

[civic zephyr]

ahhh yee this guy, i saw a few of his videos

i'll have a closer look cuz i saw him show up and pikaboo

[gaunt phoenix]

respectfully, I don't think he's anywhere close to a "go-to outlaw personality"

[hasty fable]

he goes by the ravenholdt guides and seems friendly /shrug

[civic zephyr]

i should be fine either way, outlaw is nowhere near as hard as it was previously now that subterfuge is gone

my smooth little shrimp brain can figure it out now

my fingers are thankful they dont have to mash BtE anymore

[vivid vessel]

[hasty fable]

???

[vivid vessel]

i mean

he is a nice guy

but he is kinda clueless bro

[hasty fable]

hahhaa, well.... perhaps linking him as a request to a "go-to outlaw personality" isn't fair.... but I do enjoy his content, and he does love outlaw... so until something better comes along why not

[glass mortar]

hes an all class andy isnt he

just plays everything and vibes

seems like a good guy

[vivid vessel]

yes

[glass mortar]

idk if id use his videos as guides tho

or strict ones

[vivid vessel]

i mean he is supposidly a rogue guy

[hasty fable]

no no no

[vivid vessel]

at first

but he does guides for ever spec

and like general content

[glass mortar]

doesnt he do the 5v5 1v1s duels stuff

i remember that from df

[lime lake]

ye

[keen belfry]

guys i got my PC back, plugged in my mic, then got a power surge notificatigon on my usb device, now i cant use a few usb ports?

did micro center cuck me?

[lime lake]

[vivid vessel]

xdd

awang

send me your pc

i will fix it

and send it back

no scam

fr fr

[keen belfry]

ty

[vivid vessel]

mp

[glass mortar]

send me ur cc info and i'll fix it for u

send the parts directly to u

dw

[keen belfry]

i think i can bring it to them tomorrow for free

[glass mortar]

everytime i go to microcenter i buy some dumbshit thats cool af that i dont need

that store is too dangerous

[vivid vessel]

i never buy anything

[frail veldt]

Bro whaaaaat

[frail veldt]

What were they doing to your PC in the first place

[vivid vessel]

guys no cap tho

if you ever want an unlimited money glitch

you just

dont go out

[glass mortar]

microwave

pasta

[vivid vessel]

eat pasta every day

[glass mortar]

👏

[vivid vessel]

and never buy anything

then you have infinite money

i do that

[keen belfry]

its weird cuz its only a few usb ports? like the top 4 or so on the back panel?

my pc wasnt turning on cause i think it had a disk firmware breakdown

[quaint mauve]

i don’t go out, i live off protein bars

[vivid vessel]

its kinda cheat code in life

im ngl

[quaint mauve]

and im still broke

[frail veldt]

Well you have infinite until you try to use it

[quaint mauve]

play wow in my uni library when im not sleeping in my car

[vivid vessel]

ok but i never use it bud

thats the thing

[glass mortar]

i mean if u think its a hardware issue could be faulty mic or tower or motherboard

but also its microcenter

bring it to them and theyll handle it all anyway

[frail veldt]

Yeah they're on a different bus set probably so they're fused separately I bet

[vivid vessel]

i bought a 5080 tho last week cause my gc died

but

still infinite money no cap

[glass mortar]

i remember when I build my first pc my mobo was bad and I felt guilty trying to return it like they were gunna think i broke it

[frail veldt]

Yeah everything that you don't use is infinite if you continue to not use it lol

[quaint mauve]

i feel like

[glass mortar]

and the guy was like "oh if the mobo was bad it could have fried some other stuff to you should return ur processor and ram" and just had me refund it all and replace it

[quaint mauve]

50 series is not worth

[keen belfry]

i bought the warranty thing since i qualified, i probs just have to bring it in again zzzzz

[glass mortar]

microcenter is god tier

[vivid vessel]

ye so

im smarter than you trhen

i have inifinite money

you dont

[frail veldt]

Oh that's good

[frail veldt]

I have more infinite money

Boom

[vivid vessel]

doubt thgat bud

i bet you spend your money

[frail veldt]

Do you

[vivid vessel]

lkike a noob

[frail veldt]

I'm so cheap

You have no idea

[vivid vessel]

im way cheaper lol

way cheaper