outlaw

[keen belfry]

like i wasnt searching frame by frame, you can see the difference very clearly in real time

[sly bone]

the other thing i was thinking connected to this, if we have level 4 and get loaded dice, would a RtB make it 4? 🤔

[glass mortar]

no

it is not based on your current roll

its effecting the odds of your next roll

[sly bone]

OOOOOO

then im basing my theory on false information

[glass mortar]

only rule i see we currently have related to this is if you have kir off cd and 2 buffs, and you know ur next Rtb will have loaded dice

[gaunt phoenix]

I would roll just before loaded dice expires if you would otherwise just lose it

[glass mortar]

you should delay KiR to roll again

[gaunt phoenix]

Unless you somehow have like 50 second buff with 2 seconds of loaded dice remaining

[glass mortar]

yea so someone, i think it was mewo pointed out this will often happen in the opener

with prep anyway

since ur gunna AR > RtB > KiR > reset AR and AR again 15s later

[keen belfry]

i am very curious what we can do to avoid weird stuff like 14 seconds of jackpot left but u have to reroll or lose a LD

[glass mortar]

so you will have a loaded dice timing out like 10s before ur kir buffs run out

[keen belfry]

i wodner if there is anything

oh and i am using events

[mighty pivot]

that's possible. Sensei does do some unnecessary things on each update

[shy meteor]

with trick or fb ?

[keen belfry]

should it be called Wangbar

[glass mortar]

dont think its avoidable other then not casting prep in the opener

[gaunt phoenix]

If you open with a 2 and are going to use prep, it's optimal to not kir until the next roll

[glass mortar]

ah i c

but when would u roll, you'd sit on kir for the whole 30s of the first buffs?

[keen belfry]

if its 2, yeah

[mighty pivot]

HugeWangBar

[glass mortar]

30s of basically 100% AR uptime maximized cdr gen

thats brutal

love new outlaw

[gaunt phoenix]

it was prepatch trickster

[keen belfry]

it actually feels good, in the total scheme of it you lose no 2 buff uptime, and have a chacne to get bette rbuff

[glass mortar]

probably lose an entire kir usage in a fight almost, doing that

but kir is basically just an rng reducer now so i guess it makes sense

[keen belfry]

yeah, we have to view kir differently now weran

[inland meteor]

wangbar is nice and simple and clean

[random stirrup]

you already have a "kir extension" guaranteed by virtue of having LD up

[keen belfry]

kir is a bridge cd now

[random stirrup]

so extending your current one doesnt do anything

[low glade]

is kir really that far ahead of prep for keys?

[glass mortar]

well sure, except potentially getting u an additional kir usage

over a fight

[keen belfry]

when solo announced we are 2 buff kiring i cooked up that rule cause i was like, why would i kir a 2 buff if im gonna be able to get a 2+ buff in 30 seconds

[glass mortar]

because if you go LD 2 > LD 2 kir then you basically delayed kir 30s for nothing

and lost 30s of 100% AR uptime cdr gen for it

[keen belfry]

no cause

[glass mortar]

but i understand its basically worthless enough now that it doesnt matter

[keen belfry]

you will lose that LD

and maybe have to non LD roll

[full dawn]

I would download your wangbar

[glass mortar]

well you'd just roll 10s early, so you'd cut off 1/3rd of the first kir value ig?

either way you are losing kir value

it just doesnt matter anymore

[low glade]

i think i want to run prep instead of kir

[keen belfry]

kir with this rtb is just different, its not just a allow you to blast button, its an allow you to function button

and if u lose a kir upres but it means your 2 buff uptime is higher, its a dub

[random stirrup]

pressing kir on 2 with loaded dice up is just burning a kir usage no?

[keen belfry]

yes

[random stirrup]

you waste cdr if you dont press it, but also you arent losing an entire use

[gaunt phoenix]

it is, but it gets it on cd

[random stirrup]

lose 30s of adr uptime cdr vs. losing 6mins of total cdr

[low glade]

menacing rush enjoyers don't even have to worry about this

[sturdy crow]

It's very funny that there WILL be logs where kir netted 0 dps and it's a capstone talent.

[glass mortar]

its ok, capstones arent supposed to be impactful anymore

to gameplay or damage

[keen belfry]

yeah there is a world where every press of rtb gets you 2+ buff and u never really need it

[glass mortar]

[balmy topaz]

I’m back

[keen belfry]

kinda funny

[balmy topaz]

I’m rerolling back to rogue

How bad are we chat

[quaint sable]

If only u could stack kirs and get a 1.5m long rtb

[keen belfry]

🙁

[balmy topaz]

You know it’s bad

When awang 🙁 you

[inland meteor]

but consider we have dice

[balmy topaz]

How fucked is our haste btw

On beta

[gaunt phoenix]

yeah in keys i don't think i'll be using any capstones

[low glade]

was this an ironic statement, or are you being for real

[balmy topaz]

Hi solo

[gaunt phoenix]

not ironic, that's just one of the builds

[low glade]

crazy

no capstones is just crazy

[glass mortar]

did they reduce the duration of loaded dice btw? or why would you lose a full use

[gaunt phoenix]

loaded dice is 45s

[glass mortar]

u dont cast ur second ADR until ~17s into the fight and its a 45s buff meaning if you kir'd ur first RtB LD would be timing out shortly before your kir buffs run out?

ud be wasting seconds off that set of KiR extended buffs only right

[quaint sable]

Only way u lose a loaded is with prep if u natty roll 3+ before ur first adren and then u adren again before spending the loaded right?

[glass mortar]

you know prep would be less toxic if adr could properly stack duration in some way 😠 but i assume the unpleasantness of it is on purpose

u dont roll before ur first adr so u cant waste

u adr > roll

[quaint sable]

I dont mean on pull

[glass mortar]

oh later in the fight at random moments yea that could happen

but i mean if u got to kir 3+ buffs ur already sitting pretty so u dont rlly care u wasted an LD probably

[gaunt phoenix]

The main gain is most likely from the potential to KIR a 3 or 4 instead of a 2 you would have gotten anyway i already wrote this

[glass mortar]

yea i know im just pushing back against the idea of it wasting a whole kir usage, it looks to me like youd at most waste a few seconds off ur first kir buffs

[gaunt phoenix]

probably not an entire kir sure

[glass mortar]

but kir is mostly an rng fixer now so increasing the odds of higher rolls while guarenteeing 2+ buffs for that whole window regardless is better

[balmy topaz]

Is there an advanced version that is WIP solo or is there just zero advanced shit

Like with a few min max things here and there

[gaunt phoenix]

There's some optimizations now

[quaint sable]

KiR's effective cd is what? 1.5m? 2m?

[gaunt phoenix]

go look

[balmy topaz]

I have been MIA for like 6 months

Ohh tyty

[gaunt phoenix]

80-90s

[balmy topaz]

Hope you’re doing well solo

[gaunt phoenix]

[balmy topaz]

When did the beta channels get deleted

[gaunt phoenix]

On prepatch

[balmy topaz]

RIP

Where is zac

The bozo

[gaunt phoenix]

in frenchland

[balmy topaz]

On a bus

I could put money on it

[glass mortar]

not playing the game cause he hates everything

[balmy topaz]

Microwaving a steak maybe

[glass mortar]

as usual

[covert kestrel]

ruby really upgraded the pooh

[balmy topaz]

I really did

[desert tendon]

zac is in my cave

[balmy topaz]

But

[desert tendon]

if you want him back

pay me

[balmy topaz]

I might downgrade it back

[covert kestrel]

og is goated]

got that ai slop sheen

[teal dust]

outlaw existed before the crackshot rework and stuff idk why people make a huge thing out of it

[glass mortar]

because someone tried to sell me a new expansion where all im doing was the old expansions filler and nothing else

[craggy barn]

hes not playing bc theres no real reason for him to play rn lol

[quaint sable]

If u get something fun people don't like it when it gets taken away.

[glass mortar]

and i didnt find that exciting, and neither did zac

[craggy barn]

raid is a joke and m+ season is over and a joke

[vivid vessel]

sl outlaw is 10 times more engaging than the shit we have rn

[craggy barn]

zac also hates everything

[inland meteor]

zac activated

[vivid vessel]

it had mfd, er leggo, infinite energy, 5cp, acro

dust

sbs

[quaint sable]

SBS was great 😄 MFD was great.

I forgot about dust ye

[teal dust]

well i played sub and assa in sl so cant really talk about how it was but i did play it in bfa and df

[pastel pendant]

Dude the outlaw we have now is a fkn disgrace

I’m at a loss for words I’m so sad

[inland meteor]

a second zac has hit the server

[pastel pendant]

Blizz ruined my fun

[teal dust]

so was back in the day with HO build were you pressed infinite ambushes and pistol shot

[quaint sable]

Guess we gonna have to wait till we get some new borrowed power that gets made evergreen to spice things up

[glass mortar]

that lasted less then 1 season tho

that lasted like 2 weeks

[quaint sable]

fr

[upper surge]

you spent 2280 hours in this expansions filler

[pastel pendant]

We’re getting the shitty Walmart version of crack shot in midnight WTF

[glass mortar]

yes

[upper surge]

dont you want to spend 2280 hours in the next expansions filler with a hot chick instead of an annoying dwarf

also prey

[glass mortar]

i mean filler rotation not filler content

midnight outlaw is just old outlaws filler and thats the whole spec

kinda hard to be excited about that

[upper surge]

ohh

i thought you meant content

[pastel pendant]

This right here

[teal dust]

would you say lower apm is the issue or not having as much bottons to press

[upper surge]

continue complaining about outlaw until guy gets here

[glass mortar]

not having buttons and systems that transform my rotation basically at all like crackshot did (wouldnt necessarily need to be the same)

[inland meteor]

nothing really to look forward to in the rotation

[pastel pendant]

There’s nothing fun about the spec anymore it’s slower too

[glass mortar]

lower apm def makes it less engaging, they also took away like every single proc you had to react to tho

ur just reacting to PS procs now a day

[upper surge]

maybe your computer can handle it now though

[glass mortar]

yea my computer probably can

unfortunatly thats not enough to sell me on playing it

[pastel pendant]

Bro no way I’m playing outlaw lol

[upper surge]

enter the raffle twist

[pastel pendant]

Not if it gonna be like this

[glass mortar]

i dont even have the game DL bro

[upper surge]

🙁

[glass mortar]

i uninstalled it last wednesday to do a fresh install with no addons

then i... didnt

[fathom bramble]

problem is that the aspects that made/make outlaw fun are still present more in outlaw than any other spec

[pastel pendant]

I’ll reroll fury war idc at this point

[glass mortar]

and i havent since

[fathom bramble]

it all got lessened, but like

what other spec even exists now

[upper surge]

enter the raffle, win, install wow

[pastel pendant]

Fury war remains relatively the same

So I will just play that

[glass mortar]

fury warrior just had their build diversity deleted iirc

[fathom bramble]

Fury war already felt like a gutted outlaw

[glass mortar]

they basically have 1 build now

its still a functional fury tho

[fathom bramble]

so ig it couldn't get more gutted

[upper surge]

play devastation, we are super high apm

[pastel pendant]

Rotation wise it’s still pretty much the same

[upper surge]

we reach 40 apm during lust

[glass mortar]

[pastel pendant]

Outlaw slower than fury now too lol

[glass mortar]

they should be similar speed

[teal dust]

so you rather outlaw being bottom of every single chart and have a fun playstyle?D:

[glass mortar]

i doubt fury could be faster they have a slower base gcd and no more ogcds then us

[fathom bramble]

fury would need a lot of haste or a lot of offgcd stuff to hit our apm

[teal dust]

or rather fun to you

[pastel pendant]

It feels faster than outlaw

[tame dagger]

i mean its looking like itll still be at the bottom

[glass mortar]

idk why the two would be tied together since this version of outlaw has not been bottom of the charts even a majority of the seasons it was like this

[quaint sable]

ye now in s3 haste lvls

[glass mortar]

but yes, i do prefer more fun gameplay to numbers

[fathom bramble]

fury also has like no procs in comparison

and only 1 finisher...

[glass mortar]

numbers are just a dartboard

whoever ends up op in a season or not

gameplay is gameplay

[pastel pendant]

Yeah but fury is satisfying to play pressing execute procs and rampage feels good

[pastel sierra]

no guys you dont understand the current tuning is final and you HAVE to pick your main until wednesday

[vivid vessel]

good df s3, trash s1 tww, trash s2 start then good, trash s3

[pastel pendant]

There’s nothing about outlaw that feel good rn

[vivid vessel]

50 50 i guess

[glass mortar]

we were not botto mof the charts s1

[pastel pendant]

Nothing feel satisfying to press anymore

[glass mortar]

def werent huge tho

s3 we r chart bottomers

[vivid vessel]

idk i only think about keys

we were bottom

[glass mortar]

s2 we were decent after buffs meh before

not bottom tho

and ye df s3 we slapped

[vivid vessel]

prolly had the lowest aoe in the game in s1

def bottom

[pastel pendant]

Even when u get an ace proc u have to use a builder b4 u bte again becu it doesn’t fill ur combo points up like DUDE

[quaint sable]

We also played fb right s1

[glass mortar]

maybe in the highest end m+ def didnt feel like that in raid

[vivid vessel]

i said keys

[glass mortar]

sure

[tame dagger]

i mean apex fixes this a bit

[glass mortar]

but if ur bottom in the game in keys and ok in raid then ur not bottom of the game

[vivid vessel]

raid tuning is so irrelevant

[pastel pendant]

Dude outlaw was so much fun in keys tho

[glass mortar]

if ur bottom of the game in keys AND raid, like s3

then ye ur bozod

[vivid vessel]

raid tuning is so irrelevant cause in the end you still play sub

so

[inland meteor]

nothin worse than getting a reset with 4 cps and u have to hit ur enemy with a wet noodle ss before u can blast bte again

[vivid vessel]

whats the point

[glass mortar]

not for most of us

fuk sub

but for u bozos at the top yea suffer

[vivid vessel]

then for most of you tuning is irrelevant

[glass mortar]

yes

[fathom bramble]

it's rare that outlaw is actually so doomed that you have to play sub though

[vivid vessel]

can do tank damage

in all content

[glass mortar]

which is why i said i care about gameplay

[pastel pendant]

Exactly no more 5-6 bte in a row lol

[glass mortar]

i mean they deleted ace as a talent

even making it so 2 ace was bis wouldnt save it

kinda crazy

[fathom bramble]

even just 1 point of ace is weaker than you might expect...

[glass mortar]

removed all its gameplay basically

[fathom bramble]

we can almost talent out of it

in aoe

any random tuning or tierset could make us lose ace entirely at this point

[glass mortar]

the new ace and bte usage was literally the only thing seperating this outlaw from just being crackshots filler for the whole fight

and its so weak we might not even take this ace

icant man

[vivid vessel]

well

[vivid vessel]

we talent out of it

[fathom bramble]

guess I had old news

[pastel pendant]

Bro they took everything that was fun about outlaw is threw it in the trash these fkn devs man I can’t with this company anymore

[fathom bramble]

new news is that we talent out of it

👌

[glass mortar]

i just think its crazy they took all our procs

[pastel sierra]

unsub then

[glass mortar]

maybe we get HO procs back at some point seems weird they left it in like a rotted limb completely unviable

[random stirrup]

best feeling proc in the entire game not even bis

[glass mortar]

but even they barely play like procs

[past falcon]

idk i think every melee spec feels plain

[vivid vessel]

i dont get it honestly

i couldnt find you one mf that would say ace procs arent fun

[inland meteor]

ye whats that all about, when i first heard about the changes i thought ho would make a comeback

[vivid vessel]

and they just removed them

like

why

[fathom bramble]

leaving all these vanish and ambush talents in after deliberately removing vanish from our rotation was definitely very strange

if feels unfinished

[vivid vessel]

your work is cut out for you

[odd dove]

Don't hate me ... But I think I'm gonna swap to Paladin.

[vivid vessel]

you dont even need to work

[glass mortar]

nah lok

[past falcon]

the midnight treatment just seems to be very... bleh

[vivid vessel]

you just need to not do anything

[glass mortar]

it was an excuse to remove vanish from us

[civic wing]

is there a better way to track roll the bones? Was hoping to see something similar to the weakaura to see the 1-4 buffs

[glass mortar]

if vanish was still on RB then HO would probably abuse that talent line still

[civic wing]

if not then whatever I guess

[glass mortar]

had to leave HO so we could remove vanish from RB

[pastel sierra]

look at the icon

that's it

[keen belfry]

loktark Wangbar has your combo point coloring

[wind grotto]

does outlaw play with a dagger in offhand? so i could craft a dagger as first item in midnight, to be safe with all specs?

[inland meteor]

i track it via CDM buff bar option, so you can see what number u got on the bar

[pastel sierra]

!oh

[ornate heath]

A dagger offhand is ~1% better than a slow weapon mostly because of Zero In, and also slightly more Instant Poison procs. Energy is not affected by offhand speed.

It is possible large ilvl differences can matter more than this bonus so use Raidbots Top Gear when in doubt.

[vivid vessel]

yes but an offhand craft is useless

[civic wing]

yeah thats what I thought the answer would be

[glass mortar]

yea dagger oh is good and generally stronger unless we have double proc weapons we wanna play

[vivid vessel]

so you are doing an useless craft for outlaw and a bis craft for the other 2 speccs

[glass mortar]

but also what zac said

[civic wing]

ty tho

[vivid vessel]

so you are just crafting for sub and sin

which is fine if thats what you wanna do

[pure folio]

Just track it on the CDM buffs as a bar

[inland meteor]

ye

[unreal ermine]

ull see if its 1 2 3 or 4 and its always the same buffs

[gloomy steppe]

Hey guys - so rn the CDM strings (for example guys wowhead one) are not working right ? I cannot name the profile after pasting down the string :X

[quaint sable]

Honestly u could not track RTB and just realise fuck this feels ass I should reroll

[random stirrup]

someday outlaw will be able to use dagger mh and i will be able to at least try it or play it in keys without an alt or accepting it being turbo dog or wasting crests

[quaint sable]

cause 1 buff sucks

[vivid vessel]

will never happen cause it would make outlaw viable in raid

cant have that

[pure folio]

Even 2 buff feels ass tho 😓

[pastel pendant]

nah ill just reroll

[quaint sable]

not really. Since ur cp gen feels good atleast. The cdr reduction is a lot less instantly noticable

[pastel pendant]

quite literally just reroll to a new clas lol

[pure folio]

This is true

Ig u can tell my cp gen

By*

[pastel pendant]

do u even play kir now since this new rtb is kinda a nerf to what we had b4

[quaint sable]

And then jackpot is only noticable if ur staring at the meters 😄

[pure folio]

U play kir with fb

[unreal ermine]

whats kir and fb

[pastel pendant]

keep it rolling

[inland meteor]

keep it rolling and fatebound

[quaint sable]

Keep it rolling, Fatebound

[unreal ermine]

tyty

[pure folio]

Kir - keep it rolling
fb- fatebound

[quaint sable]

solo removed the section on abbreviations now everyone is lost

[pure folio]

Oh no

Why’d it get removed

[pastel pendant]

i think the only way outlaw could be somewhat fun is if u play an ambush build or somerthing idk

[inland meteor]

theres one on wowhead here https://www.wowhead.com/guide/classes/rogue/outlaw/glossary-terms

[quaint sable]

He redid the whole thing from scratch and probs just forgor

[vivid vessel]

@gaunt phoenix

[gaunt phoenix]

i didnt want to

[vivid vessel]

you want a new !abb

or no

i have it still

[gaunt phoenix]

sure

[vivid vessel]

in a sheet

ok one sec

[pastel pendant]

maybe u play audactiy and hidden opportunity and ouitlaw will be fun??????????????

[vivid vessel]

i just remove every spell no cap

whats new

nothing

gg

[pastel pendant]

i swear outlaw might be fun if u play ambush build

thats the onbly way

[gaunt phoenix]

jackpot = jackpot

[pure folio]

Lmao

[vivid vessel]

:/

sad !

[quaint sable]

but since they made ss swap to amb automatically this is like nothing tho

[pure folio]

Is prep new? Or was that in the old one

[quaint sable]

Prep would be new ye

[pastel pendant]

prep is a dogshit talent they added

it was around in classic tho

[pure folio]

Yea that’s what I mean

It existed a long time ago, don’t know if it was in the sheet

[quaint sable]

It was a sub talent back then tho

[gaunt phoenix]

sheet is modern outlaw stuffs

[vivid vessel]

i didnt know they changed cb nmame

did you know solo

[quaint sable]

Make new abreviation for each rtb levle 😄

cbk

[pastel pendant]

nobody even playing the talent that increase adr dmg by 15% lol

[quaint sable]

it got buffed on beta to be p good

[pure folio]

Isnt it equal?

[pastel pendant]

im looking on murlok only 11 ppl playing it

[quaint sable]

ye thats on live tho right

[radiant wyvern]

theres only 11 outlaw players worldwide

[pastel pendant]

yeah live

maybe i just need more haste idk

maybe itll be more fun with more haste

[pure folio]

.

[pastel pendant]

i have 28% haste rn

[pure folio]

That’s the talent you’re talking about right

[lime walrus]

hi guys, My Blade Flurry skill is not working properly. When I activate the skill, I get the cleave/multi-target buff, but my character does not perform the attack animation and the skill does not deal any damage. What could be the reason for this? I am currently level 21. Is this related to my level?

[quaint sable]

much more aint gonna do much gameplay wise.

[pastel pendant]

damn

you know whatys crazy too

[inland meteor]

just keep leveling, probably some weird low lvl bug

works fine at max lvl

[pastel pendant]

they nerfed adr duraiton by 5 seconds lol

[vivid vessel]

they removed triple threat what de helly

[pastel pendant]

it was 20 seconds b4

[vivid vessel]

i didnt even notice

[pastel pendant]

isnt thast wild they diod that

[vivid vessel]

wild bro

[quaint sable]

cp gen is like so predictable now bcs PS now always gives 4cp no matter what.

[pastel pendant]

not only will you not be having adr up nearly as much they also went and nerfed its duraition just to slap us in the face

[quaint sable]

They gave us a talent to get back to the og duration

[pastel pendant]

do u guys even press thistle tea or do u just let it be used passively

nah even that isnt og

its 3 seconds

lol

[inland meteor]

isnt that talent only 3 seconds tho

[pastel pendant]

LOL

3 seconds

[keen belfry]

theres no time to press it other than when it would already passively proc

[past falcon]

passive

[pastel pendant]

like wtf drugs are these devs on

[quaint sable]

on beta its +4

[pastel pendant]

oh wow

[inland meteor]

hell yea

[pastel pendant]

4 whole seconds

[vivid vessel]

@gaunt phoenix can we call this DP bro

[pastel pendant]

like its such a useless talent bro when b4 adr was 20 seconds with everything we used to extend it

[untold wadi]

not adrenaline

[quaint sable]

Ye tea mostly passive but sometimes it legit doesnt wanna trigger fast enough and I need to click it myself or lose a global

[keen belfry]

love the cdr i get from DP

[gaunt phoenix]

sure

[quaint sable]

I legit have never noticed this talent proccing

and Im p sure I have it talented

[vivid vessel]

me when i get DP

[past falcon]

hnnngh

[pastel pendant]

they at least needed to keep our ability to have adr up most of the time intact

like theres just no purpose to this spec now

you just mindlessly hit ur buttons

[radiant wyvern]

that was the one thing that just wasnt going to stay

[pastel pendant]

and dont think about anything

[quaint sable]

Honestly I do like that now forced downtime feels like something we can play around instead of just be sad

[keen belfry]

also solo can wangbar make it into a command of this discord

thx

!wangbar

[fathom bramble]

you can maybe kind of sort of plan around it

it's more like AR either lines up with the forced downtime or doesn't through sheer chance

[keen belfry]

lok i literally implemented someting for you and u didnt even say thank you

[fathom bramble]

thanks

[keen belfry]

np

[fathom bramble]

does this mean it looks exactly like my old WA now?

[inland meteor]

we wanging soon

[keen belfry]

what did it look like

[pastel pendant]

how tho? it feels sad lol just for much longer and tehres nothing u can do about it. You know how when u lost adr before it would feel slow and clunky thats pretty much how it feels rn lol

[quaint sable]

ur less resource starved now out of adren

[keen belfry]

oh shit i misinterpreted

[quaint sable]

so not being in it feels okay

[keen belfry]

this is behavior rn

[fathom bramble]

I see

that's still better than sensei

[quaint sable]

that looks really nice.

And responsive

I legit have been playing based on how many times my ss hits instead of my cp bar bcs of the delay

[fathom bramble]

2nd hit of SS having a delay again on top of these combo point animations is just insane

[gaunt phoenix]

sure

[fathom bramble]

idk how or why that 2nd hit delay is back

[quaint sable]

Cause animations and delay make the game feel alive or smth

[pastel sierra]

at this point i think their version control is fucked

[fathom bramble]

I mean the delay was removed a few months into legion lol

version control couldn't possibly bring it back by accident

[cinder relic]

We will probably compile a bunch of UI addons/stuff into a command as the prepatch goes on

[keen belfry]

!wangbar

[pastel sierra]

things can get really bad

[quaint sable]

With how much they removed maybe they did a giant rebase 😄

[pastel sierra]

old dependencies and shit

[fathom bramble]

a color picker for each individual combo point would be a dream

literally perfect after that

no idea how easy that is to implement though

[quaint sable]

u mean for like the bg or when they are full?

[fathom bramble]

just so it can look like this
no color changing just each combo point having its own specific color that is static

[quaint sable]

Aah that makes sense.

[copper radish]

Did u make this combo bar and is it on curse

[fathom bramble]

guess it is always possible

I would love to see exactly what went wrong to bring it back if it really is an accident

[keen belfry]

yes and no, soon it will be

[copper radish]

That’s fire ima DL the second it hits 🐐

[quaint sable]

idem dito

[pastel sierra]

i can imagine it's some shit like referencing the ancient spell/animation data because whenever they fixed it back then they just fixed it for live and not in the 'database'

[fathom bramble]

fun fact: if you cancelaura Opportunity immediately after casting pistol shot it will still fire 3 shots, but not give combo points for the extra hits

[silent adder]

ive seen quite few people playing outlaw in beta is it the new deal?

[vivid vessel]

sounds like its overtuned on beta

[copper radish]

That means bend over and get ready for the nerf hammer

[cinder relic]

The last set of changes make us a lot stronger

[quaint sable]

Makes sense seeing as if u kill an enemy with 1/2 shots u keep the remaing amnt of shots and generate x less cp

[keen belfry]

@fathom bramble 👀

[copper radish]

I’m praying to god we go live with them for at least a few weeks 😭

[fathom bramble]

lets go

[oblique trench]

ootl where do I get this? I was looking for cp coloring but sensei doesn’t seem to have it

[vivid vessel]

@gaunt phoenix idk if we miss things no clue

[vivid vessel]

ugly ass shit

[keen belfry]

sybau?

[silent adder]

cuz last time people were complaining on the bladefurry nerf thats happened at the same time i thought it was gonna be unchanged for m+

[cinder relic]

Well people in here are a bit dramatic sometimes

[honest sparrow]

ER is gone ?

[cinder relic]

To put it lightly

[vivid vessel]

no its not

[balmy topaz]

@vivid vessel

[vivid vessel]

way to ignore the issue

[balmy topaz]

I’m back

Let me see your hi

Hi

Fuck

UI

[inland meteor]

the one in the screenshot is still being developed by awang but u can change individual CPs with twintops resource bar

[fathom bramble]

the only thing to really be said about the issue is that BF ratio is probably too low and they should(hopefully) tune it back up

[keen belfry]

will be on curse forge tn

[fathom bramble]

but that's what I thought when they dropped it to 35% so who knows

[oblique trench]

Ok cool

[copper radish]

They could just you know uncap flurry finally

[vivid vessel]

because bf on live is 45% +, in midnight its 25%, sure currently with the way outlaw is tuned in st with all the aura buffs they did it seems to be fine, but unless your spec is allowed to be 30% ahead of everyone in st (never will happen) then there is issues coming in the aoe department

[quaint sable]

no abbreviation for lucky coin? also deft for deft maneuvers but idk if that matters.

[silent adder]

i mean last time what zac was saying sound logical' if rogue is tuned to have same st as others reducing bladefurry output is a straight up nerf

[copper radish]

Are we the only class in the game with capped aoe still?

[vivid vessel]

i have never heard of an abbreviation for lucky coin

neither for deft

this is about actual abbreviations

not really just

cutting out words

[silent adder]

y this

[vivid vessel]

i think thats easy to understand

that coin is lucky coin

[oblique trench]

Fury

[vivid vessel]

we have been the onlky class capped for a while now

[inland meteor]

i think fury is capped still

[vivid vessel]

fury isnt capped

[inland meteor]

didnt they recap it

[vivid vessel]

this comes back every time

[copper radish]

Whirlwind def not lol

[vivid vessel]

idk about midnight

[frail veldt]

lolol how the fuck do you end up finding this out

[vivid vessel]

but everyu season they have things that are not capped

[fathom bramble]

I look for weird bugs on every new version

try cancelauraing random things with certain timings

[vivid vessel]

idk about midnight tho

[fathom bramble]

you never know

[oblique trench]

You mean bladestorm? Whirlwind does zero dmg no?

[fathom bramble]

it's how I found that if you cancelaura roll the bones it would make your next cast pandemic as though you still had RTB

so you could start any fight with 39 seconds of RTB

[vivid vessel]

this is the big aoe pack in priory

from live not prepatch

reap is softcapped and bladestorm is softcapped

[frail veldt]

its the same discussion every time, fury has SOME abilities that are hard capped but a large portion of their aoe is soft capped

[vivid vessel]

softfcapped at 8

[keen belfry]

uncapped

[copper radish]

Still uncapped… and 25% flurry for 7 targets about to be so weak compared to anything uncapped lol

[inland meteor]

all i see is a rogue spell hell yeah

[cinder relic]

Reap is tier set rn

[vivid vessel]

well whirlwind is softcapped at 5

[cinder relic]

unless thats midnight

[vivid vessel]

softcapped at 5 is a bit

[silent adder]

do you do aa lot more dam than others on 5t pulls?

[vivid vessel]

its not real really

[vivid vessel]

ye i know thats why i said idk about midnight

but basically every tier fury has had uncapped sources

unless rare ocasions

[frail veldt]

I mean technically were no longer capped

blade rush bby

[vivid vessel]

ye when br does 5% of your aoe idk how much that matters

[frail veldt]

HUGE

[fathom bramble]

you can and probably should expresse it as a % whenever something is partially hardcapped

we are like 90-95% hardcapped

[frail veldt]

yeah thats the most accurate thing for sure

[keen belfry]

kinda related but what % of our aoe would need to be blade rush for us to be "uncapped"

[copper radish]

One ability…… 😭

[mighty pivot]

@wintry solar in shambles

[vivid vessel]

i mean look at htat image, their uncapped is doing 50% of their damage

that will never happen with outlaw

[keen belfry]

yeah my guess was >30% and id say we are uncapped

[vivid vessel]

br will never do 50% of our aoe

xd

[fathom bramble]

imo it starts to matter around 30-50% soft/uncapped on a normal pack size

[copper radish]

Wait when did they add DB back

[frail veldt]

ye probably

[fathom bramble]

and then on a huge pack those will just do 70%+++

[gaunt phoenix]

thanks, I mean there's prep and ace, but i guess those are a bit obvious

[vivid vessel]

doesnt count for me

[frail veldt]

if your uncapped source does 30% on an 8 target pull then you can probably say you arent a hard capped class

makes sense

[fathom bramble]

yeah something like that

could also stick to the % just to avoid splitting hairs on it

and everytime someone says someone else is hardcapped you go check and see a ton of soft/uncapped damage

[mighty pivot]

latest beta build (coming tomorrow!!!!)

[fathom bramble]

sometimes they even have a ton of softcapped burst and just go insane

maybe in midnight it is different though

it's too hard to have a good idea of where everyones aoe actually stands rn

[vivid vessel]

let me see midnight

[fathom bramble]

I think warrior and MM are the only others that might be mostly hardcapped

depending on how blizzard has decided to randomly allocate their aoe damage

[vivid vessel]

idk about any dungeon pulls tho

that is uncapped

hm

let me think

oh academy

im stupid

brb

[fathom bramble]

wait they changed rampage to be softcapped lol

I guess fury is just not hardcapped anymore

at all

[balmy topaz]

How bad is AA first pull

I can’t imagine anything worse

[vivid vessel]

i think rend is fully uncapped idk no clue

this is 5 so kinda eh

[balmy topaz]

Isn’t red applied through thing clap?

[vivid vessel]

idk if im looking at mega shitter logs or not rn thop

[balmy topaz]

Thunder

[fathom bramble]

softcapped at 5 is better than hardcapped at 8 in almost all of these big pulls

but yeah it's worse than softcapped at 8 for sure

[vivid vessel]

this guy in a 16 so its a bit better than the other shitters

[fathom bramble]

I mean every spell is just un/softcapped down the line

fury isn't a capped spec anymore

[vivid vessel]

i mean in this screenshot he has almost 50% of his damage

that is above 8

so

[copper radish]

One day we will be able to say outlaw is uncapped

[balmy topaz]

No we won’t

It’s never happening

[vivid vessel]

i assume there is diff builds

[quartz meadow]

[vivid vessel]

some of them have thunder clap doing insane

[inland meteor]

the day we go back to combat is the day we shall be uncapped

[vivid vessel]

which is 5 softcap

5 softcap is kinda shitter but ye

i wouldnt say 5 count

still even in this screenshot he has 50% softcapped above 8

so

[copper radish]

That would just be 2 targets if they did that 😂

[patent mirage]

They should give a soft cap

[balmy topaz]

Hero talent I think

[fathom bramble]

MM has a new spell hardcapped at 9 🤔

[vivid vessel]

im not even gonna look at mm

they have been lying for years

[fathom bramble]

wait I just can't read

it's 8

[patent mirage]

Wat

[balmy topaz]

Zac

Do you have beta footage for me

[fathom bramble]

I mean they look at trickshots being 6/8 hardcapped and just say hardcapped

same thing warrior does

[balmy topaz]

I need to catch up on how to play again

[fathom bramble]

@vivid vessel

[vivid vessel]

ye

clueless

cuase they still do twice my damage in big pack

wonder why

[vivid vessel]

buddy

[glass mortar]

somehow every other "hardcapped" mf in the game walks into a pack of 20 mobs and does double the damage they did on 8 target pulls

[vivid vessel]

ruby listen to me

[balmy topaz]

[vivid vessel]

a disabled children with 1 hand could play outlaw rn ok

[glass mortar]

only spec ive experience that felt like it scaled as bad as law was WW ngl

[fathom bramble]

doing basically the same damage on a giga pull as you do on like 5 dudes

[balmy topaz]

Oh ok

[fathom bramble]

now thats hardcapped gaming

[balmy topaz]

Gg

[vivid vessel]

ye cause its softcapped at 5

[copper radish]

1,2 builder 3,4 finisher and that’s it GG

[vivid vessel]

and softcapped at 5 is shit

its not real

[glass mortar]

ye

[hasty warren]

and fire mage at the same time

[fathom bramble]

WW has some spells that say all enemies and then just don't do that

[glass mortar]

on like an 8 target burst pull with cds u do like 16m dps (i played it in s2 keep in mind)

on 20 targets ud burst like 18m

u definitly scaled

[vivid vessel]

also ww is crazy bro

[glass mortar]

but u barely noticed it

[vivid vessel]

like

when i was trying to tell people

that it was hardcapped to 5

in sl

they wouyodnt believe me

cause

[glass mortar]

i think that shadopan scaled more with aoe cause of an uncapped flurry strikes thing but ye

[vivid vessel]

you have this ability that does 3 clones that each hit 5

and somehow

[upper surge]

Hi zac

[vivid vessel]

people think this is more than 5 targets

like how stupid can you be

[vivid vessel]

hi larias

nice google doc bro

i saw it

didnt open it tho

i dont need it

im a pro gamer

[balmy topaz]

Where is it

[upper surge]

Ty. Hope you are well

[vivid vessel]

@upper surge link the doc bud

dont be scared

[eternal robin]

hey guys can someone help me? i need to know wich addons are placing the highlited bars on my UI, both left and right highlights

[topaz roost]

oyy zac

[topaz roost]

have a question

[balmy topaz]

[glass mortar]

dont do it

[balmy topaz]

He’s gonna get banned

[upper surge]

Not a snowballs chance of hell I link it

[vivid vessel]

bigwigs?

[glass mortar]

zeross is waiting on his 15 alt accounts to report u rn

[topaz roost]

why are u fatebound ?

[vivid vessel]

bro ...

link it ..

[glass mortar]

finger on the trigger

zacs honeypotting

smh

[eternal robin]

looks like it but cant see that bars on my bigwigs config

[upper surge]

It's on the competitive wow subreddit. You can find it there if you want it.

[eternal robin]

and left? can u guys identify it?

[wintry solar]

Smh

[vivid vessel]

@fathom bramble im seeing 5 on every spell for ww rn

[vivid vessel]

oh nvm thats buffs and debuffs bro

[frail veldt]

Builder: 
PS at 6 stacks > PS at 3 stacks and 1-3 CPs > SS
Finisher:
at 6cp(or 5 for dispatch as fatebound)
BtE > KS > Dispatch/Coup
CDs:
RTB at stage 1 or if buff drops
KiR at stage 2+
Prep with Adr, BtE, BR(in aoe) on CD, dont use if Adr low cd
BR on CD```

thats literally it

[vivid vessel]

thats just elvui

or whatever your addon is

[frail veldt]

that is the entire spec

nocap

[vivid vessel]

it is capped

at 8

[eternal robin]

not a bar i can move tho

[vivid vessel]

i mean you can prolly disable it tho

but its elvui for sure

buffs and debuffs on target and player

[eternal robin]

ill fidget a bit with it

ty

[strong halo]

@vivid vessel I haven’t kept up with beta in like 2 months we dooming?

[glass mortar]

u are up to date with beta changes

if u havent kept up in 4 months

you also would be

[strong halo]

Lmao

[vivid vessel]

nothing changed

[strong halo]

So like still slow ass outlaw rogue low amp

[vivid vessel]

other than the fact bf is 25% now

[glass mortar]

they squished our damage breakdown again ye but no gameplay changes

[eternal robin]

yep it was elvui

tysm zac

ill try and fin the red ones on bigwigs too

[balmy topaz]

@vivid vessel

When was the last time

You streamed beta

Wtf

Why am I having to go back like a month

[vivid vessel]

red ones are debuffs on target bud

elvui aswell

[vivid vessel]

ye

nothing changed

since day 1

and its been shit

since day 1

[balmy topaz]

Okay cool

[vivid vessel]

what you want me to do

[balmy topaz]

I need content

[vivid vessel]

its the first time i havenbt spammed keys

on beta

its just boring

im not gonna do that

[copper radish]

But but we got ST buffs

[balmy topaz]

Wait till it’s live

[vivid vessel]

ye fr fr

[copper radish]

S tier raid boss class??

[vivid vessel]

ye prolly

its always good in raid

im sure it wont get nerfed week 1 also

[glass mortar]

i mean no reason for it to get nerfed week 1 anymore

u lost most of ur entry power to the expac

gunna need actual stats to scale up now

[fathom bramble]

week 1 everyone will quit the spec thanks to how it plays at 0 haste

[vivid vessel]

the fact we need 30% haste is a godsend

now the spec can do 0 damage week 1

[glass mortar]

30% haste s1

[vivid vessel]

and we scale

[fathom bramble]

going to have to giga grind M+ to get haste on every slot

[vivid vessel]

bro said scaling didnt matter

cluclu

delulu

[glass mortar]

me when my specs major cd does literally nothing in leveling gear and low haste gear

[fathom bramble]

we also scale just barely better than stacking raw vers...

[vivid vessel]

i think there was a ring with 100% haste

in the raid

iirc

[fathom bramble]

yeah there is

[frail veldt]

loooool thats a good point

[fathom bramble]

it'll go to a caster though

[inland meteor]

i fucking hate vers man

[fathom bramble]

that somehow scales with haste better than us even when we are below haste cap

[vivid vessel]

nuh uh

[glass mortar]

i mean i pointed it out earlier in beta

if u dont take the talent to buff AR to 15% damage amp and u dont have haste on gear all AR does is increase ur auto speed by 20%

and give u a ton of energy u cant spend since ur gcd isnt reduced

[frail veldt]

huge

[glass mortar]

banger major cd or?

[frail veldt]

banger af

[glass mortar]

i love when my major cd does nothing if i dont have the correct secondary stacked for it

[frail veldt]

makes sense to me

[wintry solar]

It's a feature

[copper radish]

That’s the blizzard ai mods working OT

[wintry solar]

No, it was a deliberate thing put into adr that they had a meeting over

They sat around a table

And said this is a good idea

[glass mortar]

more then that they decided it was so good they kept it into midnight despite it being a pain point basically every outlaw complained about all of tww

super banger

i love it when my CDs do less just so you can make haste not awful for us

[copper radish]

And now we need 30% haste to go with it 😭

Even more yay

[glass mortar]

well thats trickster

for the gcd and needs for energy

[fathom bramble]

I mean on beta you only go to ~22% on gear

which is 25% total thanks to alac

[glass mortar]

fatebound only goes to the gcd cap iirc yea

[fathom bramble]

and then there is a noticeable dropoff in value for fatebound

[glass mortar]

not that 22% haste isnt like half ur secondary budget s1 anyway

[fathom bramble]

yeah just get haste on every item

and swap to gnome if you have to

[glass mortar]

👏

these dummy outlaw rogues complaining we gave them real haste scaling and made it so you can feel gear improvements smh

[fathom bramble]

I would so much rather never feel a gear improvement ever again

[glass mortar]

yup

[copper radish]

I wonder how much our stats would change if the 0.8s was just built into ADR with no stat requirement

[glass mortar]

would greatly reduce hastes value

trickster would still need some

[vivid vessel]

ok but we have 0 energy so

[glass mortar]

i imagine fatebound would also

[fathom bramble]

well haste is still decent to some extent for energy

[copper radish]

Was gonna say would they even change much cause of energy

[fathom bramble]

fatebound would probably drop a few %

it may not effect trickster at all

[glass mortar]

true trickster is going up to that much almost exclusively for the energy

[fathom bramble]

it would just make the progression as you gear smoother

because even if you are building past 25% there is still a drop in value past 25%

[sullen nimbus]

Midnight outlaw is so awesome!

Thank god they’re designing the spec for people like me instead of the elitist 1% of players

[vivid vessel]

[craggy barn]

yea fuck zac

[vivid vessel]

stfu bro

[radiant wyvern]

good bait

[copper radish]

Zac gonna stay mad all of midnight not healthy 😭

[vivid vessel]

bro some of these people i legit cannot take seriously

its too much for me

[sullen nimbus]

No more required addons is amazing!

[craggy barn]

us 99%er outlaw enjoyers gotta stick together

[vivid vessel]

fr fr

[sullen nimbus]

You disagree?

[vivid vessel]

no i agree with you

i hate elitists

[copper radish]

If they did legion classic would you play retail outlaw or legion

[vivid vessel]

they keep me down with their addons

[upper hawk]

you can't really have a 1% when there's less than 100 outlaw players. it's more like the 2.6%

[vivid vessel]

cause of them and their complicated rotations i cant clear my lfr runs some weeks

[sullen nimbus]

Its responses like this that turn people off of class discords which are ruining world of warcraft

So elitist

[vivid vessel]

• if I was running their rotations helpers class weak auras like them i too would get rank 1s

[vivid vessel]

what

im serious tho

why do you think im not

are you one of them elitist

i thought you were like me bro

[sullen nimbus]

No! I hate elitists!

[vivid vessel]

but you are just trolling me ?

[sullen nimbus]

Down with all elitists!

[vivid vessel]

fr fr

thats why i rarely type in these discords myself aswell bro

always with these elitists takes

get a job and touch some grass no ?

[copper radish]

Rarely?

[vivid vessel]

dude

back when the game was still hard

we didnt have all these addons playing the game for you

the game was actually hard

wish they would brought back combat entirely

instead i have to react to ace procs still

like I was playing this game as my job bro

blizzard still making rotations for the .1%

[vivid vessel]

nice damage breakdown

thats what i like to see

[keen belfry]

ty

[vivid vessel]

autos and main gauche on top

💪

combat is so back

[copper radish]

60% overall just purely passive dmg

[leaden sonnet]

1 button class smh, all damage from one ability

[craggy barn]

outlaw does all its damage as blade flurry, what an ez class

[vivid vessel]

yes !

[fathom bramble]

nerf BF that looks ridiculous

[copper radish]

Is that 25% flurry? Seems busted

[radiant wyvern]

instant poison looking a little low, needs a buff to be up to the #4 spot

[vivid vessel]

he prolly forgot to put them up

with no weak auras playing the game for you and all

now you have to actually play the game

and press the poisons

[copper radish]

Spam 1 with blizzard one button GG

[radiant wyvern]

how come theyre not just toggles

[vivid vessel]

??

dude you wanna make the game so easy or what

back in my days

listen

we had to go out and farm mobs for poisons

and then we had to buys reffilables for our bow

[thick vigil]

💀

[vivid vessel]

that was the real gaming

[radiant wyvern]

5min sham weapon buffs i remember

[pastel pendant]

thats not hard thats just tedious

[vivid vessel]

not this handholding game blizzard has done now

[copper radish]

Mobile wow is gonna be fun

[thick vigil]

I’m looking forward to the board game personally

[vivid vessel]

I hope we get a steam hentai wow adaptation

[copper radish]

[vivid vessel]

?

[copper radish]

Do u have a thing for sylvannas or something

[vivid vessel]

no

but that dwarf with the beard

whats his name

the guy that says champion

[fathom bramble]

"that dwarf with the beard"

[leaden sonnet]

Magni Bronzebeard

[vivid vessel]

see

its even in the name

[leaden sonnet]

The guy that says champion was more helpful

Than the beard clue

[vivid vessel]

nah it was the beard

[leaden sonnet]

ngl

[fathom bramble]

I miss doing his wqs

[copper radish]

Zac has a dwarf fetish explains a lot 😭

[vivid vessel]

gnomes aswell

you seen solo char ?

holy shmoly

bark bark as we say

[leaden sonnet]

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/2pNpwqkmN54

[vivid vessel]

champion

[copper radish]

That’s scary

[peak dock]

hello

is enemy debuff tracker not tracking kidney shot?

[vivid vessel]

no you need the dlc for that

[peak dock]

fuck me xd

[vivid vessel]

depends

are you a dwarf

with a beard

[tender wedge]

Dwarf without beard is cursed

Get a jump scare when I tmog some helmets that hide it

[long barn]

Why play a rogue like… we don’t even use stealth anymore. lol.

[lone crow]

wtf is this shit man

[keen belfry]

its banger no?

[daring yoke]

Sorry guys outlaw is bad time to switch specs https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/news/unholys-nerf-survivals-triumph-first-midnight-pre-patch-raid-dps-logs/

[peak dock]

a worgen w a very cool mog xd

[bright cedar]

anyone else experiencing massive fps drops when playing outlaw on Beta? not prepatch, but Beta

[bright cedar]

i don't know why, but when I am playing rogue, outlaw especially, every single big pull in a dungeon is literally unplayable, fps dips down to like 10-20 at most, everything is getting fked

and the same dungeon, same pull on ANY other class is easy 120+ fps

outlaw is literally unplayable for me and I cannot figure out why. i already disabled everything i could think of, no addons, no floating combat text, no combat logging, nothing

[frail veldt]

other people have pointed this out when they press bladeflurry in big packs yeah

[bright cedar]

yup

[frail veldt]

root cause isnt known yet afaik

[bright cedar]

as soon as BF is up, game is unplayable

[frail veldt]

so will most likely just have to live with it until we or blizz figures it out

[bright cedar]

comparison same pack on outlaw, you can see massive dips

ww monk, same pack, no dips

yeah okay, thanks for validating me, I have been going absolutely crazy

i have spent 3 whole days trying to figure this out

i thought my pc was broken

even though every other game, even retail prepatch is working fine with 120+ fps

i have a high end pc

same goes for nimble flurry on sub

assa is once again doing just fine

[cobalt token]

Is there a way to macro adrenaline rush into sinister strike

I'm suffering from the loss of weak auras

[gaunt phoenix]

yes, but then you will waste it

on a dying pack or whenever

[bright cedar]

imagine pressing SS on the last mob of the pack that's at 5% hp

[cobalt token]

😭

Listen you gotta do what you gotta do

I'd rather waste it on a pack rather than forget about it for half the dung

And lose 50% dps

I'm like extremely bad w long cds

Shorter ones are fine especially on outlaw

But if it's a important long cd

God save me

[gaunt phoenix]

Use the cd manager to show it in the middle of your screen, add an alert

dont have to track that many cds

[bright cedar]

i can recommend CooldownManagerCentered

it places everything nicely and you can add hotkeys to it

so you can see your binds

[gaunt phoenix]

/cast adrenaline rush
/cast sinister strike

will do what you asked, but pls dont

[bright cedar]

disregard the random order, it keeps resetting every time I load into an instance

[bright cedar]

do it the other way around pls, if AR is on cooldown, SS won't go off anymore i think

/cast sinister strike
/cast adrenaline rush

also @frail veldt my savior