outlaw

[modest scarab]

Good evening all, probably a dumb question but is the info on wowhead or icy veins correct that we replace the DISC belt at approximately ilvl 710?

[severe drift]

also has anyone noticed any gain playing with Sleight of hand (in m+) ? I've just made the swap and it feels like a placebo overall

[gaunt phoenix]

it's competing with 3% vers so the margins are a bit slim

[severe drift]

it even sim lower in dungeon slice on my char

[gaunt phoenix]

it doesn't sim correctly. i have to edit the sim rotation a bit

it will end up simming like the same

[severe drift]

fair enough

[floral compass]

!fuu

[ornate heath]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[quaint mauve]

there can be like failsafes tho while keeping uptime high

make adr give no cps and give it 2 charges

so dropping it due to bad rng isn’t as harmful

[wintry solar]

adr pausing after not attacking for X seconds is good

im fine with dropping adr due to bad rng

I think its part of the spec

playing an RNG spec and wanting to bypass the rng just seems counter intuitive now that I think about it

[severe drift]

I would rather have my dmg lowered but keep ADR than loosing adr which changes the feeling

[tidal wave]

Welp...I tried to do us good on Dimensius

[pearl topaz]

just get rid of energy at this point

and CPs over 5

[wintry solar]

5/6 cp was good

idk why they decided to increase it

[cinder relic]

Cuz it's fun with ho

[rare rapids]

As fatebound do i still use KS over vanish even if I have two charges? P sure answer is yes but wanted to check

[wintry solar]

I guesssss. But cant they make HO fun without 7 CP?

maybe anticipation instead?

idk just spit balling

[cinder relic]

All the rogue specs just have 7 cp now. I think that's just the new baseline

I think there should be things done about this fact to make kir less ass to play

I think ho/aud should be earlier in the tree so kir can't just skip out on all the good generators

And fan should just be a 1 point talent, because this 1 fth shit just plays bad and shouldn't exist

[flat gate]

!wa

[ornate heath]

Class packs:

• Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
• Zac's Group Devlin
  Utilities:
• Combo Point Standalone
• Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
• Ace refund sound trigger
• RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
• Unseen Blade tracker
  Fun:
• Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter

[keen belfry]

guy cooking rn

[stuck patrol]

Guy based

[keen belfry]

hes so back

[past falcon]

he always was

[keen belfry]

yearly riddict post

welcome back lil cuh

[past falcon]

ty big bro

[keen belfry]

yw tiny king

stay small alright?

[past falcon]

yes daddy

[keen belfry]

https://tenor.com/view/dog-bark-gif-20068634

[ocean lodge]

Yall figure out how to tame manaforge fps semi reliably?

Araz felt like ass, almost killed it tho

[lone spear]

if something is semi-reliable

is it not just unreliable?

also nah just lower graphics and pray

[cinder relic]

Upgrade your CPU

[worldly juniper]

Someone killed dimen as outlaw

[buoyant cosmos]

Drutile the champ

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/316923682607857685/1416552600651698329/image.png?ex=68d5c36a&is=68d471ea&hm=95968e320e222f1622753a21b88e8620106b835a1d71713139e24b42f0642c7b&

[cinder haven]

Even beat two sub rogue parses

[buoyant cosmos]

He was fun to do keys with

Helped push me to play better

[cinder haven]

Now we are bottom on boss damage on mythic as well

Soul hunters not enough to prop us up

But i have a nagging feeling they won’t do any more tuning

[stiff vector]

going from reclear on outlaw to keys on hunter...holy shit is it the polar opposite of each other.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/YagXR2NtmJBGrd1W?fight=1&type=damage-done look at how disgusting my boss dmg was on big momma+gigazap lul

I was even holding my last set of CDs at the end of big momma, and didnt have lust for gigazap

how could I possibly go back to playing outlaw in that key, we 100% dont even come close to timing if I was on my rogue

[cinder haven]

Floodgate is rough as outlaw

You can do really good overall

But useless anyway

[stiff vector]

ye

like even I could put up a similar overall(10-11m) on my rogue, the key would still be dramatically slower...like way, way slower. The burst prio I can do with netherprism stacks is insane, and the amount of time save on the bosses with DR BM compared to my outlaw is huge

[ocean lodge]

outlaw for fun, sin for results on floodgate, lol.

Or sub but I'm more comfortable with sin

[wintry solar]

the vanish rules are annoying

[craggy barn]

is there a plater thing u can do to show truesight

or do u have to just go through every mob with truesight and add a color thing

[ocean lodge]

I just look at the stupid blue eye >_>

[dull ivy]

!fuu

[ornate heath]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[wintry solar]

@mighty pivot just finished watching bear videos. If I could go back in time, I'd convince our ancestors to domesticate them and selectively breed them

[elder phoenix]

is it this easy to hit 3k?

[wintry solar]

By now, we could have pet bears

[elder phoenix]

I just hit 3k and i just only tried this week

[somber plank]

Do we still use Fatebound in single target even with the bug?

[torpid fiber]

Probably, trickster is mega ass in ST

Sim it and subtract 3.5%

[somber plank]

🙁

so sad

thank you

[quaint mauve]

i think ima pull an all nighter today

thoughts chat?

[torpid fiber]

Recommend against

[quaint mauve]

im like wired off pre workout and 40 mgs of adderal

i don’t think i can sleep

i didn’t realize how late it was when i went to workout

[craggy barn]

my nameplates just cover taht shit so sometimes i dont notice it

[ripe ibex]

hey

[floral compass]

is the Sleight of Hand rotation updated in SimC?

[mighty pivot]

ok but stop there and don't google bear breeding

[flat needle]

Im so fucking done with this class... Always loved playing rogue but this season every spec is a pain in the ass. Bug fiesta...
My hunter with ilvl 701 blasts more than 714 rogue which i have been playing for years. i cant

[lucid sandal]

I fuckin did it guys

[strong halo]

Has Zac not been pushing io lately?

[spare dome]

only thing hes pushing is his hairline

[elder phoenix]

guys stop bullying zac. its scaring his hairline away

[vivid vessel]

Our tank works the weekends

And we all raid diff days

So we have been playing like

3 nights a week

Bit rough

But we will get there

Maybe not this week cause he is working weekend again tho

Next week is our week for sure tho

[elder phoenix]

its okay. it will be fix'd when the next patch comes out

[tulip quarry]

https://tenor.com/view/happy-monday-december-christmas-gif-27235878

Man we have bugs pending from BFA XD

[quaint mauve]

get a more dedicated tank

my tank moved to the same time zone as me to do keys

real news

[lilac jungle]

Hey rogues,

Need your advice on Fatebound vs. Trickster for MM+ content

Theory says Fatebound is the ST king, and my sims confirm it's strong BUT even in some ways in M+/AOE scenarios:

• Single-Target: +12%
• Dungeon Slice: +2%
• Priory Route: +1%
• AoE Burst: -4% (8-10 bosses 1min30-2min)
• AoE "chain pulls" : -6% (8-10 bosses 5min)

Given these sims and that Fatebound is probably easier to play, is Trickster's complexity really worth the AoE gain in practice?

Thanks!

[elder phoenix]

I dont think theres any complexity in trickster

[quaint mauve]

fate bound is in fact harder to play

it has more complex vanish rules

idk

[elder phoenix]

fatebound is bugged

Apparently

[quaint mauve]

that too

[elder phoenix]

So you might as well learn trickster now

its the easier of the 2

[lilac jungle]

yeah yeah i knwo ive seen the messages, that is exactly why i'ved sim fatebound ^^

[elder phoenix]

or just go sub

Youll get instant invites from 13+ and higher

thats how i got 3k this week (first time i tried)

[lilac jungle]

sub = 🤮 - im doing +16 atm, but the dps still sucks compared to others class

[elder phoenix]

Eh

i mean go sub

then switch to outlaw

just before it starts

Thats what i did

🤷‍♂️

[quaint mauve]

https://tenor.com/view/speed-ishowspeed-try-not-to-laugh-trying-not-to-laugh-holding-laugh-gif-3669331249104858057

[vivid vessel]

Fate is kinda constraining in keys, you have to always have GS ADR lined up and vanish GS which means you have to be in melee when you vanish
Fate is also not that much more st if you have adds on bosses which is often
You don't have Perma tricks which is mega op
Less AOE while already doing tank aoe so idk

[rotund zodiac]

It is??!?

Which bug

[jolly geyser]

pinned

[rotund zodiac]

Oh that one

[lilac jungle]

yeah i've seen you've played it once in Dawn breaker but i cant remember if it was worth it. Perma tricks is indeed insane you're right

[solemn radish]

picked my rogue back up after actually falling asleep doing my rotation on ret in a raid last night and so far i like outlaw
The real question is how do i make a weak aura that makes a kaching sound on those sweet gambling hits

[strong halo]

!wa

[ornate heath]

Class packs:

• Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
• Zac's Group Devlin
  Utilities:
• Combo Point Standalone
• Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
• Ace refund sound trigger
• RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
• Unseen Blade tracker
  Fun:
• Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter

[strong halo]

There you go

[solemn radish]

Holy awesome

[rotund zodiac]

Try this one https://wago.io/Pd53s_NPU

[strong halo]

Don’t take Zac’s group the creator cuts pictures in half

[rotund zodiac]

You can custom sounds

[solemn radish]

I have that one tryna figure out how to change the sound trigger

[strong halo]

He doesn’t know what a good ui looks like

[solemn radish]

Never actually touched WAs apart from importing them hhahaha

[strong halo]

🎣🎣🎣🎣🎣

[vivid vessel]

Nah I played it in street

Did the exact same st damage anyway

So idk

Was kinda a shit experience

[rotund zodiac]

It’s in the customization tab>roll audio

[solemn radish]

Awesome thanks

[elder phoenix]

this one is obnoxiously extra

[compact bear]

How do you handle really big group of adds on m+? Had a tank pulled like half a room yesterday on tazavesh gambit and I couldn’t deal not even half of the damage others did

[vivid vessel]

[jolly geyser]

play other class

[vivid vessel]

Do 0 damage

That's how it is

[compact bear]

Well we finished pretty close on overall tho. Still 3rd

[vagrant saddle]

BF on cd for big aoe dmg

[quaint mauve]

zacs group best group

[quaint mauve]

you’re not supposed to do huge dmg on pulls like that

[vivid vessel]

Tell this hater

[quaint mauve]

bc

we r hard capped to 7 targets :)

[elder phoenix]

go sub or assassin

[strong halo]

NESSA still pushing with HO

Truely the goat

[fleet knot]

how do you guys not forget to pres coup :XX

[strong halo]

Still working for us to get buffed

[quaint mauve]

forget?

it’s a shiny button

[fleet knot]

yea but i kinda insta vanish always 😭

[quaint mauve]

track your ubs better 😠

get ur finger off that vanish button

[strong halo]

Well I never forget to press coup

But in m+ sometimes I have to sacrifice 2nd coup to keep ADR up

[vivid vessel]

@tidal wave gg for the outlaw kill bud

Excited for our wcl overall performance to go down

[quaint mauve]

@tidal wave tell BBkidly that he’s dumb for me 🙂

[vivid vessel]

So now idk if I should kill th boss as outlaw hmge

Drutile already got us on the board

Also the dk that was sandbagging

Put the log in private

Gg

[strong halo]

Waitttt Zac why wouldn’t you do as outlaw?

More data helps?

[thorn river]

How come bm gets fking buffed through the roof but cant even fixx buggs with rogue, how blind are they

Holy

[vivid vessel]

I would bring it up tho

That doesn't help my combat

No

[tender wedge]

bug is bug, possibly problematic. tuning is number go up or down

[quaint mauve]

buffed when they weren’t even weak btw

[thorn river]

Even that yeh

We get to eat dust trough a clogged up straw

[lucid sandal]

Literally coinflip spec LMFAO

[tender wedge]

except one side of the coin is just a picture of a pile of dogshit

so get the good side or cry

[quaint mauve]

yeah but if you get tails u get to be an alright spec , and if you roll heads u basically get executed on the spot

[inland acorn]

Ngl this season feels like, everything is literally stacked against outlaw. From encounter designs to tuning/bugs

[buoyant cosmos]

You get a shiny button?

[buoyant cosmos]

It's now dead last for boss damage according to tobfon ☺️

[quaint mauve]

main gauche doing more damage than KS to prio target

might be the worst one

[quaint mauve]

i have a weak aura that covers my entire screen with the coup icon when it procs

[buoyant cosmos]

So the tech is to target some fodder so it'll maybe probably not hit the prio target?

[buoyant cosmos]

Oh hell yeah

[tropic zephyr]

Most DPS are a mastery class, but law works in mysterious ways

[vivid vessel]

No cause bf need to.hit your main target

Which ain't easy

And even if it does

Your ks damage is still lowered by half

+15% from gs

[buoyant cosmos]

Got it

[quaint mauve]

i have a question

was this an issue before aswell

i wouldn’t know bc i played with old KS for a week basically

what a great time to start playing this spec huh

[craggy barn]

old ks stuck to ur main target

and u just cleaved off of it with bf

[quaint mauve]

it’s just insane that changing KS came with so many drawbacks

fazed uptime nerf, prio dmg nerf etc

[craggy barn]

it used to not be random target in ptr

[cinder haven]

If I had to guess it has to do with handling of the case when your main target dies during your 30s channel of KS

And while trying to fix that they ruined the damage profile of it

Good intentions, poor execution?

[quaint mauve]

wouldn’t it be just as easy to make it swap targets AFTER your main target dies?

[cinder haven]

You would think yeah

[quaint mauve]

instead of making it do less than main gauche on your main target

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/316923682607857685/1420182044914487460/image_1.gif

wait wtf

why’s that gif also image_1.gif now

[cinder haven]

image_1.gif

[vivid vessel]

Old old ks was cleaving at 100% in a world were we had way less target count, old ks was only hitting your main target

This new one went back to the old design with targeting random targets

Expect it doesn't cleave at 100%

And it's also shit

[quaint mauve]

it’s just

[cinder haven]

[quaint mauve]

sad

yall r like long time fans im just a poser

and im still like

upset

[cinder haven]

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/s/cX9bHMfa29

Quite interesting and good idea

Go and upvote so we can get buffed

[shell fossil]

there are so many rerollers right now

[cinder haven]

Rerolling away from outlaw you mean?

That’s the true metric for balance surely

[shell fossil]

the conga line of hunters applying to keys

it's grief lol

ye like..at least you had to play outlaw to be good at outlaw and carry keys/raid/etc

[cinder haven]

What if we could measure when spec onetricks reroll and use that as balance metric

Maybe too much confirmation bias

[shell fossil]

idk the mike tyson effect is good entertainment

one of a kind fighter at the right moment in history

it's jsut they didn't go far enough and let other specs cook for weeks and weeks

[faint pendant]

good players play good specs

[shell fossil]

idk at least legion remix is coming out

[faint pendant]

it compares fire vs arcane. and says that "fire value drops because it's not popular"

why would anyone play fire?

[shell fossil]

there's a line of hunters wanting the unyielding netherprism rn

idk there's a lot of wow as a competitive experience this season

and heroic and 6-10 content is still tuned for the casual experienece? feels like they went after ther wrong issue with tuning

make the game harder earlier so we don't get conga lines and deaths on free 15s 😐

[faint pendant]

it's very easy rerolling right now so that might be an issue

like look at legion that had random legendaries every two weeks and AP farm

and also titanforging

[shell fossil]

..weird buti was yapping with a restro druid and it's fair that some of them don't want to globalmax cat weaving into their rotation

boomie weaving is fine but

biting someone's legs between regrowths not being it is a fair take i guess like...outlaw doesn't have a lot of transferrable skills to other specs so it got sidelined?

[tropic zephyr]

Pretty cool, I actually would love to know how blizzard decides what gets buff and what doesn't

Because I always thought they had mutliple metric taken into account like the method used in this post

But since they didn't buff us this tier, despite us having the worst ST damage in the game, idk what's happening on their side

[cinder haven]

I have no idea either

[sacred rune]

isn't this falsifying things even more

[vivid vessel]

That's actually quite good

It's still flawed tho

Cause of outlaw not having logs on end bosses

[cinder haven]

It’s not perfect for sure

[vivid vessel]

Well now it does kinda

[tropic zephyr]

I mean it does, but the point is that it's less "false" than WCL front page

[sacred rune]

why is loom 1x, the fight is mostly in line with plex and soulbinder

[vivid vessel]

Nah

[sacred rune]

also why is dimensius 2.5x

[vivid vessel]

Not true fuu

[cinder haven]

It should include some way to penelize score of specs with no logs on last bosses

[vivid vessel]

Loomithar was 10+ pulls for most early guilds

Plexus and the other were 1 pull

[sacred rune]

yes

[vivid vessel]

Dimensions should probably be 5x tho

[cinder haven]

Idea good, execution not perfect

[sacred rune]

but no guild will have issues killing loom

[cinder haven]

But still better than overall dps

[proven ocean]

Zac

I dreamt of being in a zombie apocalypse

Man the dream was so long wtf

[red zinc]

[proven ocean]

Felt longer than my sleep

[red zinc]

Glorpocalypse

[sacred rune]

Think its a good attempt, but i feel like you would need to go deeper

[cinder haven]

Yeah good start

[inland acorn]

Maybe we need to do a gofundme for blizzard to hire someone to fix/tune rogue

[cinder haven]

Needs more work

[mighty pivot]

you will never find any method that makes everyone happy because you have to include subjective factors (like these weights)

[vivid vessel]

It's still harder than the other 2 tho so I understand

[sacred rune]

also fractilus is equal to first 3?

[tropic zephyr]

Maybe the weight should be alloted dynamically with last week'numbers of boss killed. Like on 100 guild logs, if all of them killed the first 4 on mythic, then the first 4 should all get the same weight, and you continue giving the weight based on the % of kills per guild logs

[proven ocean]

Harder

[sacred rune]

its 1x

[cinder haven]

Maybe scale bosses with avg pull count

[sacred rune]

so equally hard than loom

[vivid vessel]

Well it's flayed

[mighty pivot]

like having loomithar=fract is wrong to me

[shell fossil]

being alive at the end of a raid fight should be worth something

[vivid vessel]

I mean fract is more like 30 pulls than 10

[proven ocean]

Fractillius is harder than loomithar easily

[buoyant cosmos]

Old old KS + blade twisting to dismount people on their flying mounts was peak

[cinder haven]

But he tried to also address outliers a bit I think

[proven ocean]

Fractillius has 2 problems only

Very simple boss

Weakaura

And spreading and living bleed overlap

If u dont do those 2

U will never kill the boss

Even in 5000 pulls

[shell fossil]

weight for stix was death grip x 4.0 followed by ball rolling but it was fun just a upsetting one hit kill mechanic

[faint pendant]

https://i.gyazo.com/09a19e7539c92bb9744dde7f9217ec76.png

he linked a graph without weights too

[sacred rune]

the thing is

if you look at the "outliners

you still got the same specs

so all that was done is make specs that are bad on the specific fights with low impact jump a bit higher

[tropic zephyr]

and spec that are bait like arms, fire and law get taken down too

In the end it highlights the overall meta and meta-adjacent specs a lot more

[sacred rune]

yes ofc, specs which are bad on especially the last 2

will drop

[tropic zephyr]

I think, if you make a class representation graph of the top 500 guilds you would end up with more or less the same graph

[shell fossil]

the lack of awakened style raids for the end of expansion season

[robust iron]

hello everyone, how do you sim outlaw in raidbots?

[shell fossil]

really doesn't help cause some fights definitely shine for the bottom half of those charts except for maybe frost and demo

liiike i would have preferred that over legion remix just to get more people into high level wow

[tropic zephyr]

why would you want awakened raids or remix when Fellowship comes out in 3 weeks

[gaunt phoenix]

Real

[shell fossil]

fellowship bad

[tropic zephyr]

you're lucky KS is bad at prio target otherwise this would have been a lot of damage

[shell fossil]

https://tenor.com/view/bongo-cat-demon-hunter-wow-gif-22567542

[mighty pivot]

I can't wait for the next round of getting stuck in queue, and then once in not being able to queue for anything other than quickplay, just to play with a 3 people party because someone couldn't connect

[tropic zephyr]

yeah most of the playtest was a shitshow, but the last day pretty much everything worked correctly

queues were quick and no server issues

[buoyant cosmos]

Is it looking fun? I've been out of town

[vivid vessel]

I think specs are too simple

It's hard to stay interested in the rotation alone

And that's something wow does very well

[shell fossil]

someone mentioned 4-6 player dungeons so you don't have to sit someone to do rpg stuff

[vivid vessel]

Even if the content isn't always great

You always have a banger rotation

[vivid vessel]

It's 4

[buoyant cosmos]

Iirc it's pretty much mythic+ the game

[vivid vessel]

2 dps only

Wait it's 4 right

Ye it is

[buoyant cosmos]

With the one button out now, do you think that gives them some more freedom of design or they'd still want to keep basic specs around for people not interested in what they are doing vs what they are seeing

[mighty pivot]

mara played very mid but that talent that made your rupture ticks summon clones to eviscerate the target was cool

[shell fossil]

if it gives dark and darker vibes im sure a bunch of ppl are gonna play it regardless of what wow is doing

[tropic zephyr]

I've had some fun with it, I'm just really here for the soloQ. Characters have an OK depth of complexity, it's not as furnished as WoW but you'll get a similar experience to pushing keys that's for sure

[shell fossil]

lots of skill expression not a lot of downtime due to gritty systems

[buoyant cosmos]

Sounds like if they can keep a player base it should be pretty dialed in next year

I wouldn't expect a brand new game to compare to wow right away, even if it is just one facet of the game they're trying to do right /better

[shell fossil]

downtime in wow that isn't meaningful sucks by the way like gritty one hit kill mechanics

[vivid vessel]

I think they should just keep specs diverse

You have bm hunters

And then you should have outlaw aswell

I think the game is fine the way it is

[buoyant cosmos]

I agree, not everything should be like outlaw

[shell fossil]

i liked how dark souls reintroduced some boss enemies as regular mobs later in the game

[red zinc]

You’re not competing against other people directly so I don’t think the whole “class being hard means it should do better damage” thing applies

[shell fossil]

felt very new game+

[red zinc]

You have the choice to reroll whenever you want

Just gotta do what you enjoy

[shell fossil]

old megaman games added new bosses after you got sigma the first time, was hype

[red zinc]

the one thing kyveza made me realize though

Solo content is fun asf when its skill mechanics attached to it

delves should be less about just surviving melees and more dodging stuff

[buoyant cosmos]

I think it's a sweet spot vs underpin

[mighty pivot]

whoever designed underpin hates melee

[buoyant cosmos]

Having a reward for playing something more difficult isn't bad though

[red zinc]

Oh yeah that reminds me again actually

[buoyant cosmos]

I did it on my rogue, and yeah it wasn't great. I felt like it'd be harder for ranged tho

[red zinc]

Is there a way to interact with ground objects (like packages on post master, bombs on underpin, etc.) with a macro

Or anything but clicking on them anyway

[buoyant cosmos]

They get the invisible debuff of "omg I'm in melee help"

[buoyant cosmos]

Yeah in accessibility

[mighty pivot]

enable interact key and bind it

[red zinc]

Its been annoying as fuck to pick up postmaster boxes cause that shit takes like 5 clicks for whatever reason

[jolly geyser]

I have interract on §

[buoyant cosmos]

I noticed that too, and sometimes it'll just throw the package when I hit the extra action button

[shell fossil]

i was gonna say alt + q but that's just extra action button

[buoyant cosmos]

Skipping the ground marker

[shell fossil]

not our fault those things aren't grabbable with an extra action button

[mighty pivot]

I think that's ~ for normal keyboards, right? Left of 1

[jolly geyser]

yee

I got nordic kb

[buoyant cosmos]

Good old tilde

[mighty pivot]

that's too good of a bind for something used so rarely

[buoyant cosmos]

I used it for vent

[mighty pivot]

it's my stealth, AR, shadow dance bind but underpin was impossible without interact key enabled

[buoyant cosmos]

I did it w/o

My stealth is bound to scroll wheel click

[shell fossil]

outlaw should get a kitty

[buoyant cosmos]

We've already been replaced by feral

[mighty pivot]

a kitty with a gun

[rich moon]

question, I'm looking at logs and seems like most are using sleight of hand, does it give that much more consistency?

[gaunt phoenix]

there's a pin about it

[rich moon]

always on top of things I see, gotta love you solo

[gaunt phoenix]

maybe not, sleight is undersimming a bit, have yet to update it

[rich moon]

got it

also wtf about the heads bug, that actually explains a lot of variance

[gaunt phoenix]

a cherry on top to a historically terrible outlaw season

[rich moon]

yeah

indeed

[daring oxide]

fukin rip

our souls

poor outlaws

we didn't deserve this

Zac's fault

this is retribution from the devs against zac

[tropic zephyr]

this is payback for what he did to realz

[daring oxide]

precisely

this is why we must always be nice

and positive

after this punishment is over

we must always be kind and gentle

[mighty pivot]

zac should be punished for the horrors he has caused. Have him eat american bread

[daring oxide]

and it may never happen again

yes agreed

american bread is torture

[tropic zephyr]

praise be our blizzard overlords

[daring oxide]

they bake bread in america using petrochemicals as the core ingredients

[vivid vessel]

I have always been nice to realz

You guys mistake being critical of changes

From being not nice to a dev

[daring oxide]

dunno

i just need someone to blame

zac easy to point

does the world's highest key levels as outlaw

gets us nerfed

[mighty pivot]

sorry you hate everything zac

[gaunt phoenix]

you know i saw everything in simc doing slightly more damage and in game

and i was like hmmm

but just thought some assumption is different

[inland acorn]

Ye assumption

[mighty pivot]

tbh the change that they made makes no sense, unless the old way heads coins worked had other bugs

[inland acorn]

That game actually works

[daring oxide]

despair tier

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-spongebob-sad-spongebob-depressed-spongebob-head-in-hands-spongebob-react-gif-2112710549962906415

[thorn river]

Next expansion could be even worse when they gonna rework outlaw

No trust

[daring oxide]

nah

[mighty pivot]

worry not, tuning is coming soon

[daring oxide]

im genuinely excited for a rework

and that tuning

potentially friday

[thorn river]

Im scared af

[daring oxide]

nah

dont be scared

it cant get worse

right

[inland acorn]

ye that ks rework, gave me a lot of faith in possible outlaw rework

[thorn river]

With blizzard i doubt it

[inland acorn]

[daring oxide]

is that sarcasm maerik

hmm

u guys need to learn to hope

[red zinc]

outluh next week

[inland acorn]

https://tenor.com/view/lumalee-mario-movie-super-gif-8382203904100129781

[tulip quarry]

We are currently more Outlol than Outlaw :/

[mighty pivot]

I am not worried about the rework. Many things need fixing

[thorn river]

If it gets worse even the panda who gives key wont give it to us when playing outlaw

[daring oxide]

its simple, take 5mins to meditate, and think of the wonderful things that could be reworked, and press your palms together and breathe deeply, this will allow your thoughts and prayers to be passed through the nether into the minds of the blizzard combat devs, to ignite a spark of inspiration for them to cook an even finer meal, for us to dine and wine with on the 2nd of october when they bring the dishes out

[rich moon]

I just want them to fix the Heads bug and a flat 5% aura buff 🙁

[civic zephyr]

what does your name mean?

confirmed rework?

[tulip quarry]

5 won't be even enough

[tropic zephyr]

i'm pretty hyped that the guy that worked on HOTS mentioned outlaw specifically to try to unbloat the spec

[daring oxide]

you gotta use your brain cell and think, what does it mean that 'outlaw rework 2nd october', it could mean that is the release date of our salvation?

[tropic zephyr]

I wanna see what he's cooking

hopefully

[daring oxide]

Jade Martin is the guy that gives me hope

[tropic zephyr]

he doesn't destroy the class

[civic zephyr]

why on a thursday, where did you get this info from?

[daring oxide]

ok

[thorn river]

Gives us 4 spells so we can play hots

[tropic zephyr]

yeah him

[daring oxide]

firstly i just know, so trust me

[rich moon]

should we make drama? not pulling a ret, more like making reddit posts or smth

[daring oxide]

secondly, the evidence is right here, look at phase 1:

[daring oxide]

nah no drama, i need a safe space to cry, this is my channel for that

[tulip quarry]

True las Words of every alcoholic

[rich moon]

yeah yeah, that's my point, I love this place

[civic zephyr]

LMAO that outlaw rework is very convincing

[daring oxide]

just trust me

[mighty pivot]

vai never lies guys (unlike zac who lies frequently)

[red zinc]

I mean if the outlaw rework isnt a part of “class updates” when its one of the two they explicitly stated in interviews

Then whats even the point anymore

[daring oxide]

I spent 10 hours analyzing the interviews with Jade Martin, and his sentences around reworking unholy and outlaw to remove the need for WAs, analyzing his body movements and behaviour, it was obvious that this was the truth and they have something cooked, you can tell based on the weight of his voice and the strength of his arms as he spoke the words outlaw throughout

[red zinc]

With the other being unholy dk for the third season in a row

[daring oxide]

so its 99.9% guaranteed phase 1 will have outlaw rework

but theres a 50/50 chance it gets delayed so

outlaw is very complicated

[slate forge]

75% chance it’s ass

[daring oxide]

no

we don't care if its ass or good

we just want something ya know

i think were starved for attention

but i think we should all keep our chins up

[slate forge]

Idk they just did ks rework they deserve a year or two vacation such hard work

[daring oxide]

and remain positive

[mighty pivot]

KS rework was rushed

they have been cooking this for a while

[red zinc]

everything is in wow currently

[slate forge]

Ks rework was terrible even for a rushed project takes 10 hours max to fix it

[mighty pivot]

well, not to the same extent no

[red zinc]

they dont even have the apex talents finished yet

[daring oxide]

the devs come here a lot to peek at our ramblings, if we remain positive and happy, that good energy will channel back to the devs and make them smile, and motivate them to help and fix us, putting aside their hatred for Zac

[red zinc]

[mighty pivot]

my conspiracy theory is that devs put more weight on mafic's opinions

[daring oxide]

ya i agree, I think they had grander plans for KS, but this was a quick implementation to remove the issues of suicides and then allow them to gather data and test on people's feelings on the new baseline

[daring oxide]

if this is the case then we need to silence mafic in peaceful ways

[mighty pivot]

also I don't think this chat is readable even if devs were actually interested

but I am sure they know what sucks regardless

now actually spending time on it before midnight... that's another thing

I would say what's more worrisome is that it's not clear how much hero trees will change, and imo all 3 rogue ones need fairly major changes/fixes

[spare dome]

rogue is low priority anyway cos not many people play it

and not many people play it because its low priority

[mighty pivot]

you can add more points to hero trees but if they remain the same they will still be ass

[red zinc]

last doomer message but

those hero talent nodes will legit just be like

2p from this tier, 4p from this tier, and a utility node

for over half of the classes

[hasty warren]

Hi pirates

[daring oxide]

I was hoping they'd bring new hero talents in

like

Swashbuckler

[red zinc]

chumbucketeer

[daring oxide]

i dont want to play fatebound anymore

i just cant stand it

so garbage

[mighty pivot]

I do actually believe that at least in our case we will see some set bonuses become talents (which is not necessarily terrible)

[red zinc]

i mean

only if its the ones everyone actually enjoyed playing with

and not just a blind copy paste on every class

[mighty pivot]

well yeah

[daring oxide]

they should do community based surveys

where we can pick the new hero talents

[red zinc]

no they shouldnt

[daring oxide]

from a list of suggestins

wtf

i wanna pick good stuff!

i think we genuinely play outlaw way more than the devs do

[mighty pivot]

yes I'd love to get talents based on all the combat enjoyers' opinions

[daring oxide]

no

they are excluded

only real outlaws allowed

[red zinc]

community polls always go well

[mighty pivot]

imagine all the ret paladins troll voting to give other classes shit talents

[hasty warren]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/9XhQU3AEhwtat8gsdcQTbu
why my myth neck not better than the hero one ???

[glass mortar]

i assume you've given the sim limited upgrade materials so its comparing upgrading your weapons ilvls with the low ilvl neck to just the high ilvl neck

and jewlery ilvl is not very strong, especially compared to weapons

its comparing a 723 neck with 720 mh/704 oh to a 723 mh/720 oh

[hasty warren]

I wnated to check if my stat balance stay ok

because I lose haste from wp

[glass mortar]

so upgrade the amount of materials so it can upgrade both items

[hasty warren]

oh y mb

[glass mortar]

there is no sim where it has both the 723 weapon and the 723 neck

i assume because u only have 60 crests

[hasty warren]

i'm dumb ty

ok way better ty

[agile orchid]

@daring oxide class tuning this or next week

[hasty warren]

I'm looking for outlaw pov on loomi'thar MM but I can't found one on yt

[strong cargo]

Hit boss, use gs on first orb if it's ready at spawn, not on second orb, feint every p2 ability it hurts

[hasty warren]

I'm grey parsing after 70 pulls

[strong cargo]

Nothing much to add, if you have to soak p1, try to soak first you can be back for add this way

[hasty warren]

idk what i'm doing wrong tbh

I'm already doing all of this

[inland acorn]

If you want to parse loom, dont hid orb lol

[hasty warren]

I don't want to parse, juste improve my dps

[inland acorn]

If you want to kill boss, forget about parsing

[strong cargo]

There is some things you are doing wrong in rotation, you can read #outlaw-faq to check for mistakes. I'm hitting orbs and logging around 80 so it won't make you parse grey at least

[hasty warren]

the only issue I see in my gameplay is that I use vanush to burst orbs

[strong cargo]

But if you want a pov for rotation any boss will be fine

[hasty warren]

and don't folow gs+vanish rule all the time

[strong cargo]

It must be a major mistake imo if your dps is very low

[hasty warren]

I have the rotation, it's juste on this boss I might be trolling somewhere

[inland acorn]

Link logs if u have them

[strong cargo]

You can try !log maybe someone can help you if you have a log

[hasty warren]

https://fr.warcraftlogs.com/reports/9LG84Rnc2jrFD3NQ?fight=26&type=damage-done

!log https://warcraftlogs.com/reports/9LG84Rnc2jrFD3NQ?fight=26&type=damage-done&translate=true

[inland acorn]

ew french

[hasty warren]

sry idk how to change language on wcl

[inland acorn]

remove the fr. before warcraftlogs

and add &translate=true at the end

[hasty warren]

is it better now ?

[inland acorn]

yo how the fuck u have 81 casts bte in 6 min fight

[hasty warren]

humm maybe i was dead on this on

[inland acorn]

oh ye u died at ~4:30

death will usually make you grey parse

your bte casts are still low though

[hasty warren]

wype 17 is similar

[inland acorn]

and you also somehow lost uptime

92% on bte

[hasty warren]

I'm casting it almost on cd when RP active and during crackshot window

[indigo token]

like

its so confusing to me

theres really not much on outlaw that wa's need to track

[inland acorn]

you should also cast it, when it's about to fall off

even without RP/vanish window

[spare lake]

Where does outlaw stand for m+ and for raiding

Like it’s still somewhat viable right or am I wasting my time having fun

[inland acorn]

next to a tank

[hasty warren]

why there is more hits than casts ?

[hasty warren]

y ik

[inland acorn]

dispatch from crackshot talent

counts under bte

[hasty warren]

but when explosion I can drop it

ok

[inland acorn]

your AR uptime is also not ideal 80%

Means you're loosing CDR somewhere

[hasty warren]

I messed up sometimes idk why

low variance maybe

[inland acorn]

No, i can see it in other pulls too

you're hovering around 80%

[gaunt phoenix]

"technically" this is the worst outlaw season in recent history, but it's viable enough until the later M bosses

you kinda have to one trick outlaw to do well im ngl

[hasty warren]

hmm that is big issue

[strong cargo]

In raid it can be fine if played well (will be a bit bad on mythic araz/dimensius)
In m+ I feel like it's fine but I didn't really check it's just feelcraft 🙂

[inland acorn]

will be bad on any relevant bosses*

King salad is also just atrocious for outlaw

[daring oxide]

unseen blades, container, basically everything Zac's WA group does

[daring oxide]

yup this friday!

[hasty warren]

@inland acorn well I wanna train a bit before sunday raid, focussing my BTE usage

and ty for help

[glass mortar]

80% uptime on adr in the ST build which gets even more adrenaline cdr then stuff last season is going to be very detrimental to dps yea

i usually consider my "low rng parses" when i get sub 95% uptime on it as fatebound

80% is an extreme loss

on a fight that always has a target to hit anyway

[ocean lodge]

Tried the smooth motion thing. Seems to help a lot for raid fps

Idk how a top end cpu struggles this hard with wow but it was really hurting the outlaw pulls

[tulip quarry]

Open device manager, diable high precision timer, reboot, enjoy way les latency on wow

[craggy quiver]

On salad bar is chest death usable anywhere

Or if you die you always mc

All phases

[ocean lodge]

I think the problem is a weakaura, but I don't know how to find the specific one.

[hybrid crown]

I upgraded from a 5700x3d to a 9800x3d and it actually made a big difference

[ocean lodge]

I have one of the only 13900s that isn't a bomb.

[hybrid crown]

I was hesitant because I thought the 5700x3d was still a beast but apparently not lol

[dark sable]

do 50/50 method

[hybrid crown]

I guess ddr5 ram too makes it more of an upgrade

[dark sable]

disable all, enable half, if it´s good, enable half of the remaining

if it´s bad, do the opposite, disable half of the ones you had initially

[hybrid crown]

My ram went from 3600 MHz quad to 6000 dual

[dark sable]

keep like that and see which one it is

[hybrid crown]

I think that was actually kinda a big part of it

[ocean lodge]

Our systems are pretty much on par. Unless the 3d cache is that big

[ocean lodge]

There's no debug tool to find the one doing it? :/

[hybrid crown]

I didn't know quad was worse than dual

[serene brook]

right click on WA icon at minimap, it will open Profiler, Start profiler and try to damage some manekens for 2 minutes, check profiler logs, big spikes are bad, big time mostly fine if its working in fight

ideally you want it in boss fight in raid

[hybrid crown]

Maybe do an lfr

[ocean lodge]

I'd have to run the raid again, the issue is only in rai-yep

[serene brook]

there is a mode "boss fight" in profiler

so check it out and you will find the problem

[hybrid crown]

I guess maybe certain raid fight wa's might not load in lfr

[ocean lodge]

It's probably northern sky, something with araz

[serene brook]

yes it is probably

[ocean lodge]

I don't remember having an issue before grabbing it.

[serene brook]

many auras that u dont need load in fight

u can just delete them im sure

[ocean lodge]

Gonna find out soon lol

Thanks

[serene brook]

those are mine for comparison, but its not raid environment, but you still can check if something wrong with WA

[vivid vessel]

What is bte crackshot weak aura

[jolly geyser]

hopefully no boss wa bs in midnight

[wintry solar]

the sound? theres no telling sometimes

[serene brook]

I believe its this one:
https://wago.io/ohoqujb06
slightly modified tho, cuz no need for Vanish anymore xd

just ez to visually understand when u should spam bte

[wintry solar]

I fucked up my stats and I dont remember doing so

[dark sable]

no idea, i just do it like that when i have any issues, same for addons

if you have bug catcher you can check that out, but in my case i don't have a lot of WAs so i just do it by hand

[ocean lodge]

My bugsack was clean, surprisingly.

[dark sable]

tbf, my WAs are the one for resource/abilities, raid, M+ timer and then like 5 or 6 more random things

[wintry solar]

I have a level 80 boost, what do I use it on?

[jolly geyser]

also make details not update every nano second

[glass mortar]

an evoker since anything else u wanna level to 80 u should just do in legion remix

[serene brook]

also raidframes and buff addons could be very cpu consuming

[wintry solar]

is enhance fun?

[glass mortar]

ye

[quiet root]

binary search enjoyer

[wintry solar]

I see what youre saying about remix but I dont play casters too much

[heady gale]

do you guys get 90% AR uptime consistently in a good run?

[wintry solar]

and im only getting the scythes

[serene brook]

pretty much

[dark sable]

no corrupted shalamayne?

smh

[glass mortar]

u dont want the capes and mogs too?

[dark sable]

then you can go RP a fel varian warrior

[red zinc]

anyone ever had the mobs on the sides of the ship on 2nd pull dawnbreaker start freecasting on your ass

im so confused whats causing it

[glass mortar]

someone tagged em

[wintry solar]

are there any new mog sets? I have all the ones from legion

idak

[red zinc]

must just be BM bullshit I guess

[quiet root]

lack of qa

[glass mortar]

yes

these are from remix

this series of mogs

[red zinc]

so fye

we will ALL be wearing them

[serene brook]

i love this cape

[wintry solar]

thats pretty sick yeah

[red zinc]

I feel like they can do cleaner flowing particles though

[glass mortar]

theres like 4 color variants of it as well

[fathom carbon]

Noob question perhaps. But is killing spree only hitting mobs infront of me? Or is it like blade flurry and just a 360 area around me?

[glass mortar]

infront of you

[red zinc]

its picking random targets in front of you and blade flurrying off of those

[ocean lodge]

The cloak is fucking giga

[glass mortar]

bf hits the ones all around

[dark sable]

the cloak

[red zinc]

its not a frontal cone aoe

[dark sable]

holy shit

[fathom carbon]

So if i wanna max out on my Ghost strike i can place myself so that i have X mobs behind me and only 1 mob infront of me that i use Ghostly strike on then hitting KS for max use of the bonus dmg into flurry dmg with KS ?

[vivid vessel]

Ye but that won't work in practice

[glass mortar]

ghostly strike doesnt impact bf damage

but it will increase the damage of the kspree on the 1 guy

assuming u can pull that off

[vivid vessel]

Can only really game it on big bosses

[glass mortar]

its harder then it seems in most pulls

yea

[vivid vessel]

Like eco dome first boss

[fathom carbon]

But on paper, if i mannage to ''only have one mob infront of me''. My KS will all in that one mob. If that said mob have GS on it, gains in aoe dps?

[glass mortar]

it makes kspree hit that guy harder

ghostly has no impact on ur bf damage cleave

it just increase ST damage

[fathom carbon]

I see, tyvm 🙂

[indigo token]

thats dumb

[serene brook]

its a bug for sure

[glass mortar]

more likely its intended

[serene brook]

cuz bf should spread dealt damage to everyone

[glass mortar]

bf has never been impacted by debuffs on targets

[fathom carbon]

I mean, makes me less stressed to perfect position myself in m+ with pug tanks xD
But would be a nice skill expression if it worked

[serene brook]

even if its increased by debuffs on target

[glass mortar]

its why hitting a damage amped target doesnt make u do 6000m dps to everything around it

atonement works the same way

and ignite

[serene brook]

well its make sense but why for gs tho

[glass mortar]

basically all these effects

because GS is a debuff

and supposed to be a ST talent

[fathom carbon]

i 100000% assumed this was a thing. I'm always hard swapping to the casters in eco dome when they're stunned for that extra % dmg. Thinking i do more aoe xD

[glass mortar]

well u should hit damage amped targets obviously because ur doing more damage to them at least

but yea BF cleave doesnt benifit from it at all

if ur trying to cleave off it

[fathom carbon]

Yhyh, but my main motivation was for aoe boosts. Sometimes i wanna hard push down an anoying caster etc

Good to know, i can plan differently in m+ now 😮

I've yet to hit my goal of landing 9 mil overall dps. All the tips will help me reach it >:D

[serene brook]

16 aldani xd

[lucid sparrow]

if u have full rtb, do u hold off rolling and only kir?

[glass mortar]

depends how many buffs u have (and partially what buffs u have)

[fathom carbon]

I'll get there one day 😄
Atm my pb is 8.1 overall with this setup
https://imgur.com/gZRbjUH

[tropic zephyr]

wtf that's bangers

man i don't want to play remix

but i want this mog

[glass mortar]

then no mog for u 💅

theres 4 colors of it too

[tropic zephyr]

[glass mortar]

gold, red and purple plus this

[tropic zephyr]

god i hate farmfests

[heady gale]

you got any tips to share 🤠 ?

[tropic zephyr]

fuck it

i won't have it

i'll be jealous

[proven ocean]

@lone crow @vivid vessel told u guys sub rogue sucks balls and ppl wont play it in few weeks

week 1 sub rogue trinkets ahh dps

overhyped every season

[serene brook]

i dunno, i'm just fanboy of @vivid vessel, he's my master

[proven ocean]

then some squared head guy shows up

saying

look at kush hes gapping

meanwhile he had 10 ilvls higher

[serene brook]

kush

[proven ocean]

than the 2nd dpser

my guy was doing dps at 720 ilvl

[fathom carbon]

Give outlaw a ''delete this pack'' button during BL and we'll stomp them DK's :p
I dunno, ghost ship barrage?

[proven ocean]

vs 708s

💀

[vivid vessel]

Sub still better than outlaw

[serene brook]

not false

[fathom carbon]

Outlaw get better transmog options though. Worth at least 2% more dps

[heady gale]

@vivid vessel do you usually have more than 90% AR uptime?

might be something i should i am for

[compact bear]

what weapon enchants you suggest? authority of the depths is the best?

[fathom carbon]

I think the good outlaws get like 95%+ ?
I'm just about hitting 90-92% with my nub ass :p

[proven ocean]

@gaunt phoenix https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1AnrasgflFc

[heady gale]

im scrappimg up 85% on average

🥲

[proven ocean]

https://tenor.com/view/moo-cat-cat-meme-moo-cat-meme-moo-orange-cat-moo-gif-8464777196900776742

[fathom carbon]

Does depend a bit on tanks aswell imo. If they chain pull properly it does help a fair bit.
And not having an affix that locks us into combat for 10 seconds for no reason >_>

[gaunt phoenix]

i like the 1 frame at the end that he puffs up to explode

[serene brook]

only for full st dmg, radiant power or stats procs like versa or crit

[vivid vessel]

95 something idk

[proven ocean]

100 something idk

[hasty warren]

@vivid vessel do you have raid pov somewhere ?

can't find it on yt

[vivid vessel]

Ye on twitch

[dawn tundra]

Is this bad?

[vivid vessel]

Good luck finding the first kills tho

If you want that

I reclear on Mondays otherwise

[jolly geyser]

self promo,banned

[ocean lodge]

Well we at least didn't vanish yet

[native holly]

Hello, I have a question. I was playing outlaw a bit in S1 and I remember having pretty neat KIR/RTB weakaura, but I cannot find it now on wago
Maybe someone of you know if there are any good ones nowadays?

[ocean lodge]

https://wago.io/Pd53s_NPU

This'un?

[serene brook]

its pretty cpu heavy tho, but looks nice ngl

[native holly]

Do you guys use this one?

[ocean lodge]

I do

[serene brook]

should turn off some settings tho, like target count detection

[ocean lodge]

God king zac doesn't iirc

Yeah I changed a lot of settings. Blade flurry part annoys me

[gaunt phoenix]

!rtb im not sure it will accurately assess the last rule here.

[ornate heath]

How to use RTB
(Assuming season 3 tier and Supercharger)

• Roll if you have 0 or 1 buffs.
• Roll if you have 2 buffs and Loaded Dice is active.
• Roll once asap after pressing KIR, as your buffs don't get rolled away. Use this weakaura to see when your buffs don't get rolled away (yellow border).
• After the KIR roll, continue to watch the weakaura as buffs tick down. As your buffs expire you may hit a point where your remaining buffs are yellow and you can roll again.

[native holly]

I see, thanks
I've had it for a bit, but it was super annoying

[ocean lodge]

I muted everything that wasn't from pressing rtb

Though for some reason the text doesn't work for me anymore lul

[proven ocean]

Compared to the half decent classes yes

[native holly]

I'll try different settings too, ty

[proven ocean]

I’d argue rogue is as bad as evokers

[ocean lodge]

I think it's like

[proven ocean]

Both have weird utilities

[ocean lodge]

Rogue is bad but the avg rogue player is better than the avg paladin player

[fathom carbon]

Aint Evo dps kinda stgronk atm ?

[proven ocean]

And nothing special

[proven ocean]

Idk maybe

[fathom carbon]

I mean, augment is a bit rough. But from my tank main pov i've seen a few decent Devo evokers

Mind you, i only hang around in +12-13

[dawn tundra]

https://tenor.com/view/solidsnake-mgs-kms-suicide-gif-10105235

Wee...

[ocean lodge]

I mean blizz could just get off their asses and buff outlaw

But lol let's make bm god

[fathom carbon]

Gonna be interesting to see the patch notes for the .5 patch comming in what...2 weeks?

[serene brook]

why HoJ have no holy power requirement? imagine if it cost 3 holy power for ret to cast 6 sec stun, we would not see it in dungeons at all

[ocean lodge]

The Discord would shut down if they did that

I will never let them live that shit down

Most crybaby bitch playerbase

[fathom carbon]

Imagine watching from an old Holy priest main pov when Retri paladins can combat ress but my holy priest cant.
Paladins are spoiled brats xD

[ocean lodge]

God forbid you pvp

I genuinely don't think it's possible to win on a rogue 1v1 vs them, even if they suck

That goes for most things, granted, but I could definitely kill one on like a mage or shaman

[cinder relic]

Well kidney is an 8 second stun

[wintry solar]

I thought it was 1 sec per combo point

that may be a pvp thing nvm

[cinder relic]

It stops scaling at 5 cp

[wintry solar]

I actually never noticed this

in pvp its 1 sec per CP and just assumed it was the same in pve

[cinder relic]

They buffed it awhile ago

Same with cheap, went from a 4 sec stun to a 6 sec stun in pve

[wintry solar]

I logged in just to check the duration btw

now idk what to do

[glass mortar]

go do a delve

[jolly geyser]

gonna do some pvp?

[wintry solar]

probably not. modern outlaw blows in pvp

delves is a good idea

[hasty warren]

btw @vivid vessel ty for dungeon WA update it's realy good

[ocean lodge]

I actually forgot about this lol

[glass mortar]

it also wont spend more then 5 tho right

if u kidney with 7 cp u will end with 3

[cinder relic]

I don't think it works that way

[glass mortar]

hmm i cant go ingame to test rn

[wintry solar]

it does

[glass mortar]

thought @vivid vessel told me it worked like this

[cinder relic]

Interesting

[glass mortar]

im pretty sure it does it would be silly if it could spend combo points that dont even benifit it

its not like we can control our gen enough to make sure u dont go over 5

[wintry solar]

says it in the tooltip

[glass mortar]

oh yea the cost

[gaunt phoenix]

Guys i think it spends at 5

[wintry solar]

aint no way tbh

[glass mortar]

would zac lie to me??

never happened and never will smh

[misty ravine]

Haven't touched my rogue yet this expansion until recently so I was rereading the guide. Why is Slice and Dice not mentioned at all on the rotation page of the wowhead guide? I must be missing something as it's still mentioned on the abilities page.

[glass mortar]

because dispatch auto applies it

[gaunt phoenix]

it is automatically casted by dispatch

[wintry solar]

you get it for free with dispatch and crackshot btes

[misty ravine]

Oh no shit okay

That's lovely

Thanks folks!

[ocean lodge]

I'm gonna crash out if it takes a wowhead post to buff us

[wintry solar]

youre welcomeeeeeeee

[indigo token]

the balance team has a lot of fucking explaining to do

genuinely embarassing work

stfg im gonna break into the wowhead offices and make a post

so that the devs can listen

[cinder relic]

?

[mossy shell]

Does anyone know if killing spree snapshots stats other than haste?

[gaunt phoenix]

i think you need to cool it

[vivid vessel]

Ye its a funny interaction

[normal forge]

can they make crashot be 100% all the time during subterfuge? pls

[vivid vessel]

It is

100% all the time during subterfuge

Crackshot

Kekw

[normal forge]

i mean, the refund thingy

[blissful idol]

i think he means cp refund

[vivid vessel]

Then it'd not fun is it

If a proc isn't a proc

[normal forge]

we need our dmg stabilized somehow

[mossy shell]

It definitely doesn’t work that way

[vivid vessel]

I think only you cares about that nessa

[normal forge]

like, RTB buffs, crackshot windows, can something be more like a dps cd or smth

[vivid vessel]

[cinder relic]

I feel like people dont actually understand what a cooldown is

[mossy shell]

I think it has some relevance tbh but yea it doesn’t really matter

I just

Want to know

[cinder relic]

If subterfuge always proc'd refund, the spec still isn't a cooldown spec

[frail veldt]

you mean ace?

[vivid vessel]

Working on it still

Very much default causese basically rn

[normal forge]

yes

[frail veldt]

that would be boring

youd just spam bte the entire window?

[blissful idol]

is it on wago?

[vivid vessel]

I think people don't understand why a proc is fun

Yuh

Wago

Everything

[indigo token]

wago my eago

[normal forge]

make proc do more dmg then

[frail veldt]

that wouldnt help us much either lol

the proc refunds cps

if you want outlaw to have cooldowns then you need to give outlaw cooldowns

[jolly geyser]

remake the hero talents,but they wont do that so

[frail veldt]

best way to do it(imo) is have a long cooldown that just does damage and doesnt feed back into our cdr system so it doesnt cost that much to hold it if you need to. Or just give it two charges

[indigo token]

i dont wanna be a cd spec

[normal forge]

i like law gameplay, i dont like its current dps

[frail veldt]

theres an inbetween........

[frail veldt]

so youre just asking for a buff

I honestly think outlaws damage profile needs fixing

[daring oxide]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/evokers-priests-monks-and-rogues-underrepresented-tww-season-3-mythic-rankings-378620?utm_source=discord-webhook

buff coming soon boys

wowhead made a post

[normal forge]

yes, buff

[frail veldt]

no

different things

if we did the damage we do currently but had a better damage profile we could actually be playable

[craggy quiver]

I been playing sub in raid

I have fallen

[daring oxide]

welcome to the afterlife

[craggy quiver]

It's dark here

[quaint mauve]

you’re like forced to on almost half the raid

[keen belfry]

i havent killed forgeweaver as outlaw yet

[quaint mauve]

it’s not even fun to

you don’t get to pad on adds

[daring oxide]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/773751924977696768/1414768253049503825/mirror.gif

[jolly geyser]

I just dont think current outlaw is fun, just a bunch of bs

[frail veldt]

I think the tier sets ruined the gameplay of both trickster and fatebound this season

tbh

last seasons tier set was a lot more enjoyable to play

more consistent

[normal forge]

i have been saying this since i got my hands on current tier