outlaw

[fathom bramble]

like we would ever actually take sepsis

[wintry solar]

I got greenskin and I knew what had to be done

[torpid fiber]

Tbh sepsis just always feels badly designed

the way it was delayed iirc

[fathom bramble]

yeah

it never should have had an expire proc

or the expire proc had to be something else

[wintry solar]

I liked it

We've never had anything like it at the time

Was new and I like new

[late swallow]

opp procs shouldn't expire

[wintry solar]

Real

[ocean lodge]

Hell naw.

[keen belfry]

guys

look at this buff uptime on a swampface

where is it

[late swallow]

[lime lake]

https://tenor.com/view/ultrasad-gif-23310565

[keen belfry]

pure ST btw

[late swallow]

@keen belfry the type of guy to dust his hands off and go "all in a day's work" after doing 4.33m ST in a key

[keen belfry]

imagine monk and warrior somnius

and druid

thats what, nearly 5mil?

[late swallow]

[keen belfry]

oph nvm warrior is there

imagine monk and druid

thats waht, nearly 4.7mil?

[celest kettle]

How difficult is the outlaw this season?

[worldly sinew]

If a train leaves Busan goint 334km/hr eastbound.. and at the same time a train left St. Petersburg heading southbound at 144km/hr... How many woodchucks would be required to cause a catastrophic failure of Russias newest Nuclear Testing Facility?

Solve for X.

[fallen mural]

To make it simple think of it as an actual "UNSEEN" blade lmao

[brisk lotus]

houly how lucky did you get?

[fallen mural]

you don't know when its there, If it will proc, or if it will give you combo points.

[keen belfry]

i rolled 5, kir'd kir'd those 5 again, then 5 rolled

[covert kestrel]

all the girls are talking about awangs massive sweaty hog around the water cooler

[late swallow]

i hear that thing just don't quit

[keen belfry]

[late swallow]

holy shit

it's mr. bombastic

[long barn]

I hear outlaw buffs are coming. I was told to report to this discord for confirmation?

[covert kestrel]

https://tenor.com/view/sun-the-office-shut-up-gif-19330811

buffs*

[wise ridge]

!wa

[ornate heath]

Class packs:

• Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
• Zac's Group Devlin
  Utilities:
• Combo Point Standalone
• Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
• Ace refund sound trigger
• RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
• Unseen Blade tracker
  Fun:
• Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter

[long barn]

🥺

[smoky lotus]

so max rolling gets us almost as much dps as other classes? nice

[keen belfry]

i was quite sad to not be first on that boss

[hollow bloom]

Needs more buffs to track honestly.

[ocean lodge]

in b4 they just dumb the spec down and don't improve tracking

[hollow bloom]

RtB is deleted and replaced with …what

[covert kestrel]

empowered spell

[keen belfry]

@honest cape

[late swallow]

RTB is now a targeted ground effect

[quaint mauve]

nothing really changed from last season

[late swallow]

there has to be a place to throw the dice

and you have to pick the dice up to get the rolls

thoughts?

[fallen mural]

you know how many times youll have to pick up your rolls in narnia off the edge of a map

[quaint mauve]

just turn it into caltrops or something

[covert kestrel]

you ever play league? i think our dice should be like draven axes where they toss up in the air with a marker and we have to stand on them otherwise we lose -20% dps

[fallen mural]

I think the just give us all our buffs when we roll, that's all static, 5 roll. So we can comepete with other dps 😛

[quaint mauve]

nah hold up , you roll a dice by tossing it up , it shows a number on the ground 1-6 and if you stand on that number the dice bounces again and whatever number you roll is how much buffs you get

[honest cape]

🌰

[hollow bloom]

Add a cannon ball explosion to RtB too. So we do damage while rolling shit rolls.

[late swallow]

yes dude now we are COOKING

[hollow bloom]

Dump buffs for a cannonball single instance of damage that scales with number of buffs you got.

[drowsy ridge]

Give the dice a gun

[covert kestrel]

every point of mastery is a new bullet in pistol shot

[fallen mural]

make adrenaline rush half our GCD. So we can increase apm x2

half of what it currently is*

[wintry solar]

I can't wait to be able to play outlaw out of adr

[hollow bloom]

Just make adr a toggle at this point

[wintry solar]

Thered be no reason to turn it off

[covert kestrel]

give us a 2.0s gcd while in range and toggle ADR to be in melee and buffs that we extend by swapping back and forth

[wintry solar]

I don't feel like comprehending that atm

100% ace chance when out of melee range

[drowsy ridge]

I would like an actual Mastery, MG is just... boring

[dawn talon]

apex talent where tea no longer grants energy but pauses your adr for 20 seconds or 15 gcds, whichever happens first

[dawn talon]

no

[gaunt phoenix]

all masteries are boring

[drowsy ridge]

Some are more boring then others

[dawn talon]

what specs have an 'interesting' mastery that is not either the entirety of the spec's gameplay or just fucking unbearable

and a lot of the 'interesting' ones are shit anyway

[drowsy ridge]

I guess I'm asking for our mastery to not be an old talent that we already had access to?

https://tenor.com/view/tv-simpsons-cloud-fist-grandpa-gif-12082744756246344299

I could also just be that

[hasty warren]

imagine outlaw rework at midnight

[wintry solar]

Right now I'm hopeful

[hasty warren]

nah we're cooked for this season

have no copium left

[wintry solar]

Earlier on my way home from work, I was convinced the only changes we're getting are kir removed and rtb simplified.

[wintry solar]

Hopeful for midnight

[hasty warren]

wdym by rtb simplified ?

[wintry solar]

Idk

Like

CTO is our new rtb

Completely passive

[bright crane]

https://tenor.com/view/big-aj-big-justice-boom-costco-guys-gif-13543695932005238540

[hasty warren]

idk I don't like changing actives into passives

snd is an exception

[wintry solar]

I'm not saying this I what I want

I'm saying it's on that level

Was an example

[hasty warren]

ye i got it

[wintry solar]

Frankly I want it worked on a large amount but depending on my mood, my hope fluctuates.

[hasty warren]

maybe rtb finisher like in bfa

the lore co used the more buff u have

honnesly I just want changes to make offtimes less ass for us

[wintry solar]

Energy fixed and I'm good

[hasty warren]

like second charge AR

[wintry solar]

Idk why people think we need more adr

[old gull]

New mastery plz

[wintry solar]

Realll

Fire damage

Pew pew pew

[cinder relic]

Anybody else jealous?

[fallow sonnet]

what are the rules on when it's worth it to hit AR even if you still have your previous AR buff up? I slam it sometimes to squeeze more BTEs in on my bte spam windows but idk if thats right (assuming Improved AR ofc)

[fallen mural]

A true outlaw doesn't abide by the rules

[fallow sonnet]

so true

[frail veldt]

You should always slam it

On cd

For cps

The rule is to press it on CD at 2 or less cps

Exceptions include when you have UB stacks up(this is for trickster)

As fatebound though you want to save it for when you have GS off cd and can vanish with it

[harsh forge]

!prekey

[ornate heath]

Pre-key fuckery

• RTB TWICE some time before entering dungeon to get 4 Supercharger stacks. These stacks don't have a duration.
• Just before key placement use AR into KS to get Loaded Dice and 2 free Unseen Blade procs.
• KS will consume one stack of Supercharger but the 3rd+4th stack are removed when the key starts anyway.
• During the bubble, DO NOT RTB or recast AR as you will lose the CPs and Supercharger stacks when the bubble ends.
• After the bubble drops use RTB again (now back at 4 stacks of Supercharger).
• Before entering the first pack BF into Stealth.
• Open onto the pack with AR into BtE.

[grim spear]

got this like 2 weeks ago

I’m just curious

patch notes say Blood DK got a 6% aura

but

why?

[frail veldt]

Yeah how does a 6% aura not end up as a 6% buff

Is that because they already had a huge aura passive?

[grim spear]

And also, st vs. AoE, plus the two Hero talents are different too

wth

why baby why

[cinder relic]

because different builds deal more ability damage vs auto damage

[fallen mural]

When it says Open onto the pack with :adr: AR into :bte: BtE. Why not just cast AR right when the bubble drops in stealth?

[grim spear]

but isn't 6% aura global? i mean everything?

[ocean lodge]

Could depend on if certain things are whitelisted

IDR if dk has anything like that

[frail veldt]

I mean it would have to be 50% auto damage lol

[frail veldt]

Yeah but for example if their aura was already 80% and it was 6% on top then that would be 6/180 so only 3.3% right?

[cinder relic]

Lets say a hero talent is "You deal 500% more auto attack damage" this would mean it'd be less of a buff than one that just does a damage buff, in a flat aura buff type patch

Idk why it'd be different for either hero talent tho

Idk how blood works

[random stirrup]

[frail veldt]

yeup

there ya go

[ocean lodge]

Owch.

[frail veldt]

thtas fucking insane

109%

[prisma heron]

Which tier piece do I want to skip out on?

[frail veldt]

like at some point you have to reset that right?

[ocean lodge]

meanwhile brewmaster goes

[frail veldt]

gloves

[ocean lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/ken-fist-of-the-north-star-gif-12286448

[frail veldt]

wdym

brew could have a huge aura buff too

[random stirrup]

idk if these 2 affect it either

but death strike with the 400%

[ocean lodge]

based

[frail veldt]

well death strike is in the large one too

so death strike is also receiving the +109%

but yeah that sounds like the answer as to why a "6% aura buff" isnt actually 6% more damage lol

[random stirrup]

215/209 is indeed around 2.9%

[frail veldt]

mystery solved

[random stirrup]

though when they write 6% aura for boomie they actually mean 6%, as they take their aura into account

[frail veldt]

wait really?

............

[random stirrup]

idk about this week but last time it was modified yes

[frail veldt]

where do you find the current aura values @random stirrup

[random stirrup]

wowhead

i just search "blood death knight" and its a sunfire icon

[cinder relic]

yeah

[gaunt phoenix]

Why dont they make that 28%

[cinder relic]

This is why sub is better

1% better aura

[gaunt phoenix]

true

[frail veldt]

why isnt killing spree on that list?

or am I blind

[torpid fiber]

oh my god I think you're right LOL

[gaunt phoenix]

they don't show everything

Affected Spells: Backstab (53), Garrote (703), Mutilate (1329), Sinister Strike (1752), Rupture (1943), Dispatch (2098), Deadly Poison (2818), Mutilate (5374), Shiv (5938), Ambush (8676), Wound Poison (8680), Mutilate (27576), Envenom (32645), Fan of Knives (51723), Killing Spree (57841), Killing Spree (57842), Main Gauche (86392), Blindside (111240), Deadly Poison (113780), Shuriken Toss (114014), Crimson Tempest (121411), Shadow Blade Off-hand (121474), Internal Bleeding (154953), Shadowstrike (185438), Poisoned Knife (185565), Pistol Shot (185763), Sinister Strike (193315), Eviscerate (196819), Ghostly Strike (196937), Sinister Strike (197834), Shuriken Storm (197835), Gloomblade (200758), Toxic Blade (245388), Toxic Blade (245389), Poison Bomb (255544), Poison Bomb (255546), Blade Rush (271881), Double Dose (273009), Secret Technique (280719), Secret Technique (280720), Secret Technique (282449), Secret Technique (282480), Nothing Personal (286581), Echoing Blades (287653), Between the Eyes (315341), Instant Poison (315585), Black Powder (319175), Black Powder (319190), Shiv (319504), Echoing Reprimand (323547), Flagellation (323654), Slaughter Poison (323660), Serrated Bone Spike (324073), Serrated Bone Spike (324074), Eviscerate (328082), Sepsis (328305), Sepsis (328306), Serrated Bone Spike (328547), Blade Flurry (331850), Serrated Bone Spike (341277), Sinister Strike (341541), Shadowstrike (345121), Flagellation (345316), Deathmark (360194), Rupture (360826), Garrote (360830), Internal Bleeding (381628), Amplifying Poison (383414), Flagellation (384631), Serrated Bone Spike (385424), Kingsbane (385627), Ambush (385794), Mutilate (385802), Mutilate (385806), Ambush (385897), Rupture (394031), Serrated Bone Spike (394036), Deadly Poison (394324), Deadly Poison (394325), Instant Poison (394326), Wound Poison (394327), Amplifying Poison (394328), Flagellation (394757), Shiv (400789), Sanguine Blades (423193), Envenomous Explosion (426581), Goremaw's Bite (426592), Blade Flurry (429951), Ambush (430023), Unseen Blade (441144), Coup de Grace (441776), Coup de Grace (450743), Fatebound Coin (Tails) (452538), Fatebound Coin (452559), Corrupt the Blood (457133), Deathstalker's Mark (457157), Clear the Witnesses (457179), Hunt Them Down (457193), Singular Focus (457236), Lucky Coin (461818), Fatal Intent (461984), Dispatch (Coup de Grace) (462140), Dispatch (Coup de Grace) (462239), Dispatch (Coup de Grace) (462240), Eviscerate (Coup de Grace) (462241), Eviscerate (Coup de Grace) (462242), Eviscerate (Coup de Grace) (462243), Eviscerate (Coup de Grace) (462244), Eviscerate (Coup de Grace) (462247), Eviscerate (Coup de Grace) (462248), Killing Spree (463781), Dispatch (467059), Echoing Reprimand (470672), Corrupt the Blood (1225168), Killing Spree (1235074), Killing Spree (1235097), Killing Spree (1235100), Killing Spree (1248603), Killing Spree (1248604)

[torpid fiber]

ah

[grim spear]

holy

this game is so funny

[haughty wigeon]

he doesnt know about the bear aura

[frail veldt]

oh god

yeah whats the highest aura? lol

[haughty wigeon]

we need a tad bit more, to hit 1000 on thrash

[indigo token]

wait

did we get buffed

[frank finch]

no

[long barn]

Outlaw got buffed?

[grim spear]

no

[lime lake]

we got buffed?

[hollow bloom]

Buffs?

[fallow sonnet]

Can someone explain to me what I'm looking at? Lol

[wintry solar]

The aura

Each spec has it

Apparently gdruid has super high aura

And not in a "this spec has aura" kind of way. It's a % modifier of dmg/healing done.

[cinder relic]

When a spec gets "aura buffed" they just tune the dial on every spell thru these hidden spells

[cinder haven]

It has always looked mostly neutral when I've simmed. I like to do it myself if I'm capped or near capped on vanish charges, but kinda hard to prove that it is good

[quaint mauve]

if it’s neutral it’s good enough for me

i don’t like sending low cp coups

[cinder haven]

Wait huh

What does low cp coup have to do with this

You'll still low cp the second coup if needed at least

I think ss at 7 to force coup is fine mostly if you need to get the coup out fast for whatever reason

If there's no rush it's probably better to finish, ss and then coup

[wintry solar]

Tob, can you make the passage of time go faster?

Anticipation is killing me

Got me sweating bullets

[random geyser]

? anticipation of what

[torpid fiber]

Outlaw not getting buffed

[cinder haven]

Think the time window for that has passed for next reset tbh

[random geyser]

It's crazy the are leaving us like this i feel like a boomy

[wintry solar]

Alpha

I gotta sink my fangs into the rework

Idrc about S3 tuning personally

I'm taking the L

Remix soon

[random geyser]

I wanna raid

[wintry solar]

Yeah I gotta get that hearthstone

After that it's GG

Dimmy is the only fight I care about and no amount of tuning could fix outlaw on that fight

[hallow crow]

close disc

XD

[wintry solar]

Just a design issue, it is what it is.

[hollow bloom]

They are afraid of our power, what we could do if we had no limits.

[wintry solar]

Have uptime

Ultimate power

I love patchwerk bosses

[next wedge]

guys i feel like overall ive done way less dmg this week

idk if im just washed or rusty bc all ive done is play silksong

but im becoming bad at the game

[late swallow]

i've had the exact same feeling in keys this week for no reason

[random geyser]

Glad I am not the only 1 lol

[cobalt sail]

Well no buff, time to play TFT

[fallen mural]

finally got 15 flood done

https://tenor.com/view/hot-so-hot-summer-sweating-sweating-hard-gif-16045826

[fair oak]

🎉

[royal ermine]

I don't know if you ever found it but this is it https://www.curseforge.com/wow/addons/lfg-inspect

[grim spear]

silksong sucks

[wintry solar]

Preach

[tawny meteor]

Guys which hero spec for outlaw

[wintry solar]

There are only two 2D platformers that are good

[tawny meteor]

I see fate So low in raid

On archon

[wintry solar]

And that's the Mario and Donkey Kong franchises

[vivid vessel]

because trickster is to pad on araz and nazindry

only boss where trickster is actual real damage is soul hunter

[tawny meteor]

What pad means zac

[vivid vessel]

pad

just aoe on random adds that dont matter

especially on naz

[tawny meteor]

Thanks

[grim spear]

pad means useless

[tawny meteor]

So Wich boss You are going fatebond then ?

I am not a raider so i am asking to find the best solution for wednesday

[vivid vessel]

imo every boss but soul hunter

is fatebound

[tawny meteor]

Alright Zac thanks a lot

When are you uploading some on YouTube

🙂

[vivid vessel]

but you can play trickster on naz and araz for fun

[vivid vessel]

i kill dimmy tonight

then i can go back to doing keys

[tawny meteor]

I want to see m+ content haha

[vivid vessel]

ye

[inland acorn]

He can, but when we do it you yell at us

[vivid vessel]

but i cant really rn since im raiding every night basically

[tawny meteor]

Are you from France zac

With the baguette

[vivid vessel]

y

[tawny meteor]

Haha superbe 😉

Je m’en doutais

Well thanks a lot for the answers wish me luck for wednesday myth raid

[vivid vessel]

gl cuh

[frail veldt]

Man I can't wait to wake up tomorrow and see the surprise buffs blizzard has in store for us

So excited

[inland acorn]

Who are you and what have you done to real Mewo ??

[frail veldt]

And to be honest we dont even need the buffs cuz we're good on one boss! That's fair we have our time to shine

[vivid vessel]

wild that we didnt get buffed im ngl

[wintry solar]

[grim spear]

for fun ×
for parses √

[vivid vessel]

idk how blizzard can be so clueless

honestly

[frail veldt]

Blizz just understands the game better than you. They know what they're doing

[frail veldt]

They're very experienced developers and designers

[vivid vessel]

if there is no mythic parses on last bosses

they should be looking at hc

[wintry solar]

We're simply not playing a build they intended us to play and we just haven't found the build yet.

[vivid vessel]

or at least trying to understand mythic logs

[frail veldt]

So true

Tbh I think the outlaw community is just behind the curve on TC

We haven't figured out the right rotation yet

[inland acorn]

Are you saying tobfon is slacking ?

[wintry solar]

My goat Tobfon would never

[grim spear]

we should only play no sd no pc build no matter what boss

[frail veldt]

I mean the only other reasonable explanation would be complete and utter incompetence at balancing but there's no way that's true

[inland acorn]

[frail veldt]

Blizzard only hires the best of the best

[grim spear]

no way, they didnt call me

[wintry solar]

We're not supposed to be looping adr with subt this patch and we're suppose to use them adr+vanish charges as our CDs and use both vanish charges one after another. Holding one vanish until adr is off CD again.

And the second vanish charge is back

[frail veldt]

It's punishment for abusing bugs that's why they didn't buff us

[wintry solar]

They soft launched CD spec Outlaw this season

[frail veldt]

Zac brought a curse upon us for abusing rtb bug

[wintry solar]

Just wait for remix when all our problems are solved

Because no one will be playing retail

So there are no groups to join

[stiff hawk]

real

and true

and real

[next wedge]

bad take mad cuz bad

zac can u upload OL POVs of bosses

nobody with good ui has uploaded any

[wintry solar]

How much haste past haste cap does it take to have a noticeable difference of energy regen out of adr?

[cinder haven]

Sorry boss, I'll try harder

[wintry solar]

Tob do you know?

I'm just curious

[cinder haven]

Eh, too much for it to be worth

[wintry solar]

What if I told you, it's for remix

And just for future reference for when it drops

[cinder haven]

Then I'd have no clue

[wintry solar]

Don't worry guys, I'll figure it out.

It's somewhere between 0% and 153% for sure.

[fair oak]

I have now lost three +16 floodgates to my tank getting one shot by big momma

https://tenor.com/view/rat-gif-22290918

[wintry solar]

Bdk?

Oh 3

[fair oak]

2x paladins and a dh

[wintry solar]

My condolences

[fair oak]

log out wow log in some other game type beat

[cinder haven]

Bdk would just ams and ignore the buster

[wintry solar]

Yeah I'd simply deathstrike tbh

I use purgatory as my anti-tank buster

[fair oak]

playing mm on big momma makes me not want to play any other spec on it ngl

[normal forge]

i truly do not understand why tunning freaking HUNTERS, so much time focusing on that class, no love for rogues, like, wtf

[wintry solar]

Yeah specifically Outlaw

Crying shame tbh

Only Outlaw

Smh

[worldly shale]

Did we get tuning

[wintry solar]

No

But they shouldn't tune the other rogues

[worldly shale]

[wintry solar]

https://tenor.com/view/dave-chapelle-chapelle-show-popcopy-fuck-em-thats-why-gif-11866262

[pearl topaz]

my copium is they are going to make us OP in a rework

[wintry solar]

Kir removed and rtb made passive

That's it

None of our real issues are getting addressed

[vivid vessel]

If you remove rtb kir isn't even an issue anymore tho

I don't even mind the rtb button removed

All in a cracked cto

I think I would prefer it ngl

Make SC trigger on vanish instead

But then keep kir

[wintry solar]

Gross

[vivid vessel]

Kir is fun to press

Why

[cinder haven]

I wouldn’t mind that either tbh

[wintry solar]

I like current rtb

And I don't want vanish anymore loaded than it is now

[vivid vessel]

Bro its you that said that

[cinder haven]

I don’t hate rtb

[vivid vessel]

I don't hate rtb

[wintry solar]

It was speculation out of spite

[vivid vessel]

But I would rather have a big CTO I think

I like the buffs

[wintry solar]

I never said I wanted it

[vivid vessel]

I don't like pressing the button much

[cinder haven]

It would simplify the spec and reduce need for weakauras

Which they seem to want to do

[vivid vessel]

Y

Have CTO proc on more stuffs

They added ss in df

Time to have ps proc it

Bte already does with crackshot so that's fine

[fallen mural]

what if they made ghostly strike an aoe ability 🤔 Dmg bonus to 8 targets.

then we can stay Paddington Bear

[cinder haven]

Change mean streak to bte would be cool imo

[wintry solar]

I just want to not be punished for simply not being in subt

I used to think transportation in dungeons was fun and neat

[cobalt sail]

!wa

[wintry solar]

Like that cart in that one dungeon this expac

[ornate heath]

Class packs:

• Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
• Zac's Group Devlin
  Utilities:
• Combo Point Standalone
• Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
• Ace refund sound trigger
• RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
• Unseen Blade tracker
  Fun:
• Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter

[bright lodge]

How about off gcd rtb?

[stiff hawk]

Not only that but Intermission

where you cant hit bosses

Like Dimensius Flying

Fucks with your DMG

Or Fyrakk Intermission

where you cant CDR

[wintry solar]

But rtb stuff is more important to fix

Somehow

[cinder haven]

For midnight it would be cool if we could pause adr during downtime somehow

Or that it pauses automatically if you haven’t done damage in x seconds

[wintry solar]

Kinda like how second wind works for warriors but instead of heals it pauses it

Isn't it 6 seconds without taking damage?

Regardless, it's made the spec more irritating to play in general.

[wicked obsidian]

we already have this with vanish, only problem now is that vanish is in the rotation and you always need to compromise it's charges... and ya properly pause should also be when mounted x)

[wintry solar]

Yes I am aware we have this with stealth, the problem is there are more cons than pros with this

If it just did that when we're not attacking, it'd all be solved

[wicked obsidian]

there are several solution what would work. killing energy for example, so that you don't play in slow motion when adr is down.

[wintry solar]

We're only this slow because they nerfed energy regen. I'm pretty sure this is the slowest our out of adr energy regen has ever been post legion

I'm sure there was a time during combat era but that doesn't really count

[cinder haven]

They nerfed everything yeah

[cobalt sail]

I really feel like poop playing outlaw rn. I do my part, but A BM or an Arcane can do 1.5x more dmg. It's just so unbalanced

[cinder haven]

Fatal florish, combat potency, base energy regeneration

[cobalt sail]

And + they are always blaming on chat beeing toxic as hell...

[wintry solar]

You really shouldn't play with mages in M+

[cobalt sail]

During the fight cuz they have to smash their keyboard to play their spec.

[wintry solar]

Too mixed a bag

[cobalt sail]

I shouldn't yep. But, i go wherever i can I want to do my 15's

[wicked obsidian]

still don't understand why they nerfed that in a time where other classes have infinite mana. energy for rouge should also only matter for stuns/cc utility

[wintry solar]

Energy management was always a thing you'd play around and it's fun when we actually have the economy to do so

[cobalt sail]

was* yep, now we are buffs/cd's trackers

[cinder haven]

Energy management makes sense for assa maybe

[wicked obsidian]

for me pooling energy is never fun. same fun when you need to do a damage stop cause of some sh* boss design

[cinder haven]

Outlaw could do without

Spell queue doesn’t work properly when you are low on energy either

Which makes it worse

[cobalt sail]

I still love how KS doesn't do any dmg to the murloc poles in gambit...

[wintry solar]

I just don't see what removing it would actually accomplish when there's a level of regen that obv works

And blizz just refuses to fix

[wicked obsidian]

a level of regen that works, would remove it 😄

[cinder haven]

Ye

[wintry solar]

We weren't complaining about it in SL

[cinder haven]

For all practical purposes but that’s fine

Replace energy with adr charges

Each skill use consumes a charge, as long as you have charges you get the 0.8 gcd

[wintry solar]

I'd wager not this many people suggested removing it until they made it this bad.

[cinder haven]

New power could be called Adrenaline

Think it would solve a bunch of issues

[rustic lotus]

Current killing spree and past killing spree lmao

[wintry solar]

I also don't see it as a bad thing to be able to run dry when you're playing poorly

[wicked obsidian]

why if you play poorly anyway you get punished by less cdr. why double punishment?

[wintry solar]

Like casting SS when you have an Opp proc should be punished

[wintry solar]

CDR can be recovered through good rng

Somewhat with current outlaw

Rn you have infinite and no energy at the same time

[wicked obsidian]

ok maybe i misunderstand, because playing poorly i understood playing all the time poorly :), anyway doing healer damage for that time (because tank damage is even higher) is a way to much punishment

[wintry solar]

Frankly that's a tuning thing

It could happen even without energy for outlaw

Your damage only matters in subt and you have adr up during it anyway

[spare dome]

guys

[wintry solar]

A bit of an exaggeration but you get the point

[spare dome]

is rogue the only class which uses 2 resources for spenders?

[wicked obsidian]

all the discussing here are anyway a kind of self-occupation. because i lost all hope that someone at blizzard is following it and get some ideas out of it. I mean see KS... there were a lot of good ideas and they picking the worst decision ever (longer cd, longer channel, but yeah more damge) but somhow they forgot its an key ability for trickster...

[spare dome]

they could just remove energy cost of spenders

would make sense to me tbh

they already cost combo points

[wintry solar]

Builders are energy heavy anyways

I like that

Nice middle ground

[crude flower]

Lean into the pirate theme

Remove energy and replace it with a drunkenness bar

[tropic berry]

Brewmasters have had it too good for too long, our booze now

[wintry solar]

I do miss having more fantasy

Fantasy goes a long way for spec pop

Fantasy and animations and stuff like that

That's why I liked Legion a lot

[crude flower]

Meanwhile I’m in the spec that imo

Has killer class fantasy and spells, but has like

3 players

Given it’s even less popular than outlaw (either less or on the same level)

[wintry solar]

Survival has the same Fantasy as Outlaw, don't kid yourself

[crude flower]

Even down to the

“One ability doing 50%+ of your damage”

[wintry solar]

Guns, bombs, harpoons. I mean frankly atp survival is more Outlaw than Outlaw

You even get your own parrot if you choose

[crude flower]

True

I just have a rat

Which btw is fucking insane

[wintry solar]

Goober

Where do you get a rat?

[crude flower]

The 50% healing reduction works on the HoA mini boss

[crude flower]

Undermine

[wintry solar]

Sick

[crude flower]

Also

[wintry solar]

Ngl

[crude flower]

What i mean by one ability doing all damage

[wintry solar]

I love surv bombs

[crude flower]

You seen the set bonus

It’s juicy af for bombs

[wintry solar]

I know I'm the minority of a minority

But I love loaded bombs

[crude flower]

For reference lunar storm applied to your next bomb every 30 sec and lasts for 10 sec

[mighty pivot]

have we had any new hunter changes yet today guys? It's been a while since the last one

@wintry solar do your work

[fallen mural]

ret pally mana+holy power

[mighty pivot]

isn't mana only used for healing for ret?

[fallen mural]

hmmmm i can't remember but i know mana's def not an issue for ret dps so even if the abilities use mana its not considerate enough for it to matter

[vivid vessel]

Spenders don't cost anything generally

I think they are mostly energy positive

[mighty pivot]

yeah some might have some meme cost, but it's just heals that can burn through it

[vivid vessel]

All 3 specs gain energy by pressing finishers

[wintry solar]

I only do rogue

[mighty pivot]

we can see that

[wintry solar]

I'm trying to get ER back

[mighty pivot]

like, the series?

[stiff glade]

What do you guys think about this lovely little sequence from yesterday?

Feelsgoodman

[wintry solar]

I've no idea what that means

[oblique trench]

oof

[sleek parcel]

peak combat rogue

[mighty pivot]

it was a tv series with doctors

[stiff glade]

I was GAMING for almost 20 seconds right there

[wintry solar]

Never heard of it

[tropic berry]

You must've been so sleepy the way you were out of energy with that sequence big dawg

[wintry solar]

[young prism]

Do you think class tuning is over for this season?

[mighty pivot]

krill issue

[stiff glade]

Yeah, sucks real bad when you get down to 2 full seconds between globals cause no energy

[mighty pivot]

shades of assa

[stiff glade]

This was without deft as well, so that BF in there didn't even give me anything, just had to re apply cause no AR

Oh wait, didn't put that in the screenshot, but there's a sad BF in there too lol

[mighty pivot]

is it at 3:54

[stiff glade]

57

There

[mighty pivot]

good stuff

[stiff glade]

Very solid gameplay

[mighty pivot]

one day HO will be back and subterfuge windows will be fun again

[tropic berry]

Right back into the sinister sluice, God bless you brother

[wintry solar]

They were fun for 4 weeks in df

[vivid vessel]

Fuck ho

I prefer kir cause I can hold my fth stacks for the windows fr fr

Instead of spamming ambush in subt

Braindead no cap

[mighty pivot]

I preferred HO because all you needed was BS and your subterfuge windows were clean af. As much as KIR is fun as a button, it's not enough on its own

[spare dome]

HO/SC with last tier set was goated

[wintry solar]

Modern Outlaw peaked there imma say it

[spare dome]

modern outlaw peaked with the double coup bug

[wintry solar]

I thought it was S3 but nah

[spare dome]

the most fun i've ever had

for a day

as the pasta would say, would do it again

[wintry solar]

I took advantage of it all of season 1

[mighty pivot]

typical bug abuser popo

[vivid vessel]

Idk I hate how I don't press ps in subt

I very very much like stacking fth before entering a subt window

[mighty pivot]

I mean you still PS but it's only in 1 situation

or 2

[vivid vessel]

And I love the rule were we don't send ps if it will overcap

Like at 5 cp we don't send

We SS again

So you don't overcap etc

It's very clean

[timid idol]

kinda is

i like saving pistols as well

[vivid vessel]

And that changes with bs

[timid idol]

feels nice

[spare dome]

I love SS proc animation

[vivid vessel]

Even cleaner

Also I just prefer SS animation

[spare dome]

yea its much better

[mighty pivot]

ambush animation is nicer imo but with old KS it was a bit too much because it used the same one

[vivid vessel]

Maybe a good middle ground would be that SS gives 2 cp per default in stealth

And we play with 2 fth always

So it's always worth pressing

[timid idol]

its always funny how dks and hunters do 20mil + in big pulls like gambit and flood

[mighty pivot]

if we're lucky they will kill 1fth for midnight

[timid idol]

and then u sorta stay top dps on the other packs until they get their cds again

cant really complain cuz im keeping up in dps with ppl higher ilvl than me but

it really is anti fun not seeing numbers in big pulls

small nitpick ig

ret pally last szn was crack in first meadery pull

whole screen was yello

i honestly dont understand how fury manages to do dps

with even lower target cap

[spare dome]

I mean its not bad having that niche of "stable dmg"

its just that its THAT niche

[timid idol]

ig, alternative is getting uncapped but with even more rng

which feels worse

[spare dome]

What other class has no burst?

[timid idol]

fury

bm

[spare dome]

Im not that knowledgeable with other classes

bm wut?

[timid idol]

beast mastery has burst?

pretty sure its 99% passive dots

especially after the recent rework

[wintry solar]

How could you tell?

[timid idol]

trying to think of others with consistent dps and no real cds

but i think these are the main 3

otl bm fury

idk how survival works

if they have big cds or no

[wintry solar]

Bm and fury are as close as you can get

[timid idol]

yea

ret is somewhat close

[wintry solar]

Surv has cds

[timid idol]

ret cd's are pretty low

and its overall just consistent damage like the other 3

only burst is execution and its not that huge

[devout garden]

Surv kinda have that flat DMG but it depends on build

[vivid vessel]

Cause they aren't target capped?

30%+ of their damage are sources that are SOFT capped at 8

[worldly shale]

Ye idk

[timid idol]

whar

i had no clue

wtf

[vivid vessel]

Ye

[timid idol]

wasnt fury capped at 5

[vivid vessel]

They lie a lot

[timid idol]

[vivid vessel]

Ye

On some abilities

[worldly shale]

think they got tierset too

so thunderclap

is no cap?

[vivid vessel]

The only real target capped spec in the game is outlaw

[worldly shale]

right?

[vivid vessel]

People need to stop lying

[wintry solar]

In the same way unholy is capped at 8

[mighty pivot]

warriors have a mix of 5 and 8 caps/softcaps

[timid idol]

blizzard bfa ptsd will never go away

they will remember that one mdi

with x3 outlaw

for the rest of their lives

were not getting uncapped ever

[vivid vessel]

This would have happened every season if they didn't have a rule to 3 stacks specs probably

Like wl in sl

[wintry solar]

I wouldn't say never

[timid idol]

bro but its so easy

just uncap it

and make bf damage past 8 like some sorta 10%

[wintry solar]

There's no telling how deep the supposed rework will be

[timid idol]

and play around with that number

SURELY

theres a number thats balanced

[inland acorn]

-10%

[mighty pivot]

they can literally make cudgel proc into some kind of talent

[worldly shale]

"We are reducing the target cap of outlaw to 5 targets to keep it in line with fury warrior"

[inland acorn]

When u vanish you drop bomb

[wintry solar]

I like to imagine the devs going "wow, outlaw players really love this mace for some reason"

And then they stop thinking about it

[mighty pivot]

https://tenor.com/view/don-draper-madmen-don-i-dont-think-about-you-at-all-gif-15031503

the devs

[vivid vessel]

Nah but ks should have just been actual uncapped cleave

100% damage on main target

Reduced to secondary targets

Like first of furry

And uncapped

So we have an additional tool to tune AOE

And we have an uncapped spell

[wintry solar]

They actively don't like the spec

[vivid vessel]

Idk ..

[wintry solar]

Hence being called out twice

[muted crest]

My main problem is not the aoe... Boss damage is crap

[wintry solar]

Mine is aoe and the vessel of my dmg

[vivid vessel]

Well ye

We are tuned superbly low in st

Out AOE directly scale from that

So we are just bad everywhere

[daring oxide]

its fucking over

[muted crest]

Kinda agree... I was fighting with a blood dk yesterday on bigger pulls in priory and that got buffed ..

[wintry solar]

Okay but your dreadblades will summon demons in remix

So

Idk I got nothing

[daring oxide]

really?

[wintry solar]

Yrah

Yeah

Everyone's does

[daring oxide]

where you got these infos

[wintry solar]

Ptr

[daring oxide]

oh

[wintry solar]

Oh whoa, name change.

[vivid vessel]

Blue name gg

[wintry solar]

Vais name is the waffle house index for outlaw

Outlaw/unholy reworks + housing

Great expansion for Popo

[timid idol]

whar

outlaw rework again

[daring oxide]

i give up, mentally starved of good news

[wintry solar]

In midnight

[daring oxide]

my hope is resilient but its breaking down

[wintry solar]

That doesnt sound resilient

[daring oxide]

it is resilient in outlaw standards

[wintry solar]

Vai eat a snack and take a nap

[daring oxide]

I'm hopeful we get a rogue specific tuning pack coming out this week's friday

I have a feeling we needed more specialised work to fix bugs and more thought regarding our tuning to resolve our ST issues

they just needed more time to cook

[normal forge]

will us out dps sub/assa with higher ilvl in higher keys? will our dmg profile be more adequate for that?

[daring oxide]

come back on Friday, and stay tuned for more hopeful news

[wintry solar]

I swear we were told we were getting news about the alpha soon

It's been 20 days

Ish

[normal forge]

we are we getting turbo boost?

[timid idol]

FRIDAY TUNING

GREENSKIN INCREASED TO 1000%

LETS GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[inland acorn]

no

We don't scale good with more stats unlike most specs

[vivid vessel]

?

Idk if you are trolling or not

[timid idol]

dont question mark him bro let him cope

why r u ruining his dreams like that

[vivid vessel]

Cause it's the complete opposite lol

We have low prio

Lower than the other 2 specs

Way lower

And we are target capped

And we don't have CDs

[wintry solar]

Bro pick an L

[vivid vessel]

All these things scale more with key level lol

[wintry solar]

Damn

[vivid vessel]

And we also are the worse scaling spec of the 3 with Ilvl

Kekw

[proven ocean]

Damn

He sent 1 msg zac what the helly

[vivid vessel]

Sorry

[proven ocean]

No cappy tho ur learning ur learning

10 msgs 10 enter’s

[inland acorn]

we need screenshot of realz

[proven ocean]

The key to become the best outlaw

[inland acorn]

feeling sorry for zac for hating everything

[proven ocean]

Is to type

1

Msg

At

A

Time

No cappy

[stiff hawk]

real

and

true

[normal forge]

was wondering if it would be wise to switch sub at this point,

I was thinking that maybe with high ilvl we could do better than sub

[eager rose]

Whats have in friday?

[hollow bloom]

Doom scrolling at its finest

[eager rose]

Tuning?

[wintry solar]

Hopefully

[lofty pike]

Why the Hope for friday Tuning? Guess If it isn't in tuesday/wednesday it won't Happen in friday

[wintry solar]

Tuning is announced on friday

[cinder haven]

Must keep hope

Or reroll

[spare dome]

somebody do the meme with the timemachine thingy, Girls: I am your granddaughter/Boys: Zac, dont type anything to realz you will doom us all

[hollow bloom]

Why tune something that will eventually be erased by the expansion?

[wintry solar]

I wish I had the foresight to warn Realz back in df because I knew it'd get this bad.

[lofty pike]

Hope is gone 🙁 noone of Blizzard is Reading any Feedback on outlaw

[wintry solar]

He prolly woundnt have listened tho

[spare dome]

I remember people being happy that we are gonna scale with haste

[wintry solar]

LMAO

Yeah

[inland acorn]

who ?

[spare dome]

naive me for example...

[wintry solar]

Me too

That was squashed quickly

[inland acorn]

How did you came to that conclusion

[wintry solar]

That was like, 3 years ago

[inland acorn]

They literally took something we had since I can remember, and forced us to get haste to get it back

How is it scaling lol

[wintry solar]

The wording isn't clear

Didn't know it had a hard cap

Not that hard to believe

[spare dome]

Yea i didnt play that season

[inland acorn]

you thought they would let us go to 0.6s gcd

[spare dome]

just read that we are gonna get haste scaling

[wintry solar]

No, I imagined we'd scale but to the point where DR would prevent us from going to .06

[worldly shale]

stream when

me want to watch outlaw suffer

play outlaw

gogo

[wintry solar]

And then KS scaled with haste

[spare dome]

zeross is an assa/sub player tho

probably doesnt remember how to play outlaw

[inland acorn]

neither does blizzard

[worldly shale]

thats why it would be fun

[proven ocean]

[wintry solar]

[vivid vessel]

When are you back to wow ross

I know you won't be able to not play

You are addicted like me

[wintry solar]

Idk when I'll be back, I've been brainwashed to play Helldivers 2 lately.

Instagram reals

[proven ocean]

Once i have good gear

[wintry solar]

Reels

[proven ocean]

Then i’ll probably be back

[vivid vessel]

I knew it

I knew you were lying

[proven ocean]

idk

I kinda want to play outlaw but not where its currently at

[inland acorn]

why, according to blizzard it's in perfect state

[proven ocean]

U know what zac

I thought about outlaw for a while last night

[vivid vessel]

I mean outlaw is kinda troll currently I'm ngl

[proven ocean]

I finally figured out

Why i actually hate outlaw rn

[vivid vessel]

Honestly without ks being rng targeting at least we would have had decent prio still

[proven ocean]

Its literally only 1 fth and the hero talents, and killingspree

[vivid vessel]

This ks change is actually just 9/11 for outlaw

Destroyed us

[proven ocean]

But listen zac

[proven ocean]

I just know i hate outlaw because of those things

It makes outlaw not the outlaw i rememeber

[vivid vessel]

Ye I get it

[wintry solar]

Gonna call this The Dark Era when referencing TWW S3

Outlaw sucks

Ozzy died

Outlaw dodged tuning

L season

KS

No prio

[timid idol]

ks is good now tho

i love it

its fun

[inland acorn]

It's not ?

Outside of not killing you, how is it good

[fallen knot]

that is the only reason and it's enough

[wintry solar]

I'd rather the risk of dying tbh

[inland acorn]

Same

[wintry solar]

Had more prio then

[proven ocean]

I feel like u never understood how 1.5min ks felt like no offense tho

[timid idol]

the only reason

[fallen knot]

you cant do prio, hell you cant even do damage if you are dead because of a frame bug

[timid idol]

fuck prio

spell was unpressable 90% of the time in floodgate

lol

and this is no exaggeration

it was genuinely unpressable

[inland acorn]

It is exaggeration lol

[timid idol]

like 90% of packs have gargantuan aoes

you either delayed it or you died

[inland acorn]

No ?

[timid idol]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

my experience playing a couple dungeons last season before i swapped to ret

[wintry solar]

There was def some skill expression with old ks

[timid idol]

skill cancer

glad its gone

and tbf

[wintry solar]

Bittersweet

[timid idol]

its not new ks' fault that blizzard doesnt know how to balance

[wintry solar]

No not at all

[timid idol]

i dont even understand why one of your main dps spells can even kill you

like how low iq is that

[wintry solar]

The prio should've been moved elsewhere

[timid idol]

sure

or

they could have made the spell like blade dance

where you dont actually teleport anywhere

and its just an animation

[timid portal]

i mean

guns are cool

[timid idol]

i agree

animation wise

new killing spree is INSANELY superior

[wintry solar]

Fof with bullets

[timid idol]

fits the spec theme way more

[wintry solar]

Is all it had to be

[timid idol]

im obsessed with pirates so i will defend this new killing spree with my life

old one looked like generic rogue spell

but otherwsie yes way higher cd and prio loss is bad

but thats blizzard being bad at balancing

[timid portal]

if they would just listen to zac...

[timid idol]

and me

for greenskins

change value to 1000%

[wintry solar]

There's a million ways to fix it

[timid idol]

which one will blizzard chose?

(they wont chose any)

[timid portal]

5% ks dmg buff

-10% bf dmg

[timid idol]

im telling u greenskin 1000% saves the spec

[wintry solar]

How

What do we even drop

[timid idol]

trolling mostly

[mighty pivot]

crackshot

[timid idol]

but its fun to think that pistolshot could randomly execute mobs instantly

[wintry solar]

God no

[wicked obsidian]

why they don't only removed the teleport and ok imho they also could changed the animation to pistol shots.

[timid idol]

blizzard MUST do the weirdest change of all

instead of just making the tping an animation only

[stiff vector]

nah it should just be that KS does execute dmg, like big execute...like were talking does 100% more dmg in execute.

[timid idol]

frfr

either way

i was in key but someone said shadow quake should be an apex in midnight

and i kinda agree

its super good and its fun

[stiff vector]

ye it would be a cool talent, just make it more outlaw/rogue themed, and make it stronger

[timid idol]

shadow quake and a talent to guarantee multiple crackshot procs like loaded dice for buffs maybe?

[mighty pivot]

make gsw exclusive with UHUH and give that boosted PS a +6s AR

[timid idol]

hell yea

make it a barrel explosion

like league gangplank

[wintry solar]

I'm starting to like you

[mighty pivot]

and rename gsw to Popo's poopoo pistol

[wintry solar]

[stiff hawk]

Shadowdust comes back

Trust

and MFD

[timid idol]

i remember mfd a little

it filled cps

and reset on death

but idk what the debuff actually did

dont remember anymore

atp wouldnt mfd just be another gs

essentially

cast on cd single target debuff

[wintry solar]

If the target died with the debuff, the CD was reset

[timid idol]

ig mfd had snipes

oh thats it?

[wintry solar]

It did

Very fun

[timid idol]

didnt it do anything else?

i swear i remember it having a debuff as well

but shadowdust i really dont remember

[stiff hawk]

It increased dmg taken in one iteration

[wintry solar]

Filled CP

That's all it did

[timid idol]

dang

what was shadowdust then

[spare dome]

marked for dick

[wintry solar]

Vanish CDR

[timid idol]

oh

shadowlands shit

[wintry solar]

Vanish reduced the CDs on all your abilities

Yeah

[timid idol]

yea i barely played sl

[wintry solar]

Missed out on peak outlaw

[timid idol]

i think i played zereth mortis a bit

with tornado trigger

that was fun

rest i barely played

peak was uncapped bfa that shit is never coming back

[wintry solar]

Peak bfa was wits

Not uncapped aoe

[timid idol]

wits too

bfa in general

[wintry solar]

I liked bfa

[timid idol]

same

sl worse expansion than bfa

in most aspects

[wicked obsidian]

This peak is one of the main issue. Cause of that i guess the devs keep us more undertuned than making the risk of overtuning again. guess they got some problems with the head designers during that time.. 3 outlaw rouge meta was too much

[wintry solar]

In terms of zones and grinding yes

Once you had your leggos, SL gameplay was very good.

A lot of specs shined in SL

[lucid sparrow]

am i crazy for swapping to wound poison on that miniboss that self heals alot

in halls of atonement

before last boss

[proper veldt]

Completely crazy

[kindred jacinth]

i mean it helps

[proper veldt]

No way you use wound poison on a boss that heals

Crazy !

[lucid sparrow]

is it not worth idk

[kindred jacinth]

some ppl just be mean but imo its cool

[proper veldt]

It’s worth always

Same for Keplers in flood

[lucid sparrow]

i thought dmg of IP would make it so u dont wound at all

but ok ty

[proper veldt]

Take the improved wound poison talent too

It’s basically free you sacrifice some leech or something

[proven ocean]

What

[mighty pivot]

instant poison is less than 2% of your total damage and wound poison does more than half IP's damage. You don't lose that much

[proper veldt]

What what

[stiff glade]

You lose the 25% increased health pot, but that's worth talenting out of

[inland acorn]

What are you both on about

lol

[lucid sparrow]

lmao

[inland acorn]

Are we playing

Same builds in m+ ???

[mighty pivot]

you can just drop the kidney shot energy cost reduction for improved wound

[lucid sparrow]

this is what i can drop for it

my speed 😭

[inland acorn]

you drop

one of those

[proven ocean]

What leech u losing from going to wound poison

[lucid sparrow]

ah yea that too