were pretty close to it
#outlaw
frail veldt
vapid blaze
nah
cinder haven
But our niche used to be that we lost the least prio tio cleave
stiff vector
not really, Destro prretty much gaps us on SH
cinder haven
And then they add funnel to every spec
frail veldt
remember this fight also has a lot of movement
vapid blaze
that doesnt mean its overtuned cause its good?
tulip quarry
outlaw is VERY good on soulhunters
For now, but since we scale like shit, we will keep going down with gear grinding XD
frail veldt
I mean cmon we cant really pretend like we arent doing well on soulhunters
lets be honest for a minute now lol
cinder haven
I mean cmon we cant really pretend like we arent doing well on soulhunters
It's not a funnel fight though
stiff vector
Its crazy work to say were overtuned in 2-4t cleave, whilst we get gapped in that exact damage profile by a spec that is also one of the best specs in the game when it comes to uncapped/high target count AoE 
cinder haven
We used to be good on funnel too
vapid blaze
I mean cmon we cant really pretend like we arent doing well on soulhunters
were barely the best
frail veldt
Its crazy work to say were overtuned in 2-4t cleave, whilst we get gapped in tha...
I never said overtuned but we are definitely good
cinder haven
And low target cleave
vapid blaze
in the only usecase for this spec
frail veldt
were barely the best
read what I fucking said
vapid blaze
we are?
tulip quarry
We used to be good on funnel too
We use to loose the least ammount of ST damage while playing aoe , that was a great situation :/
vapid blaze
i agreed?
wintry solar
Did you?
vapid blaze
cause it is
frail veldt
jfc
cinder haven
We use to loose the least ammount of ST damage while playing aoe , that was a gr...
Yeah and then they added actual funnel to a bunch of specs
vapid blaze
wtf else does outlaw do
when the frost dk is doing the same
frail veldt
that attitude is why no one takes feedback seriously
frail veldt
"UGH were BARELY 2nd best fucking awful 0/10 useless niche"
wintry solar
But nOooOoOoOoo
frail veldt
like stfu
vapid blaze
"UGH were BARELY 2nd best fucking awful 0/10 useless niche"
it is pretty useless
frail veldt
whether the niche is useful is not whats relevant im saying we are performing in our niche
vapid blaze
its useless in the last raids aswell
kurog was the last time this was relevant and it got nerfed cause of it
vivid vessel
Barely
vapid blaze
but the low target perma cleave nieche doesnt exist
its padder bosses that die in 20 pulls
frail veldt
but anyway my point was that we are tuned too heavily into our niche at the detriment of the rest of our play
cinder haven
I'm saying our niche used to be wider
vivid vessel
We are performing so well in our niche that world first raiders decided it wasn't even worth playing outlaw on the fight
stiff vector
"were overtuned for our niche" despite the fact its not even really a niche that exists in the first place. So basically, the only hardcapped spec is too good at something it should be the best in...while it gets beat by a spec that also does some of the highest high target count AoE in the game (aka something we literally cannot do)
cinder haven
Funnel encroached
frail veldt
I'm saying our niche used to be wider
yeah I mean imo the other niche we normally have is good overall damage lol
vapid blaze
its also not overtuned
tulip quarry
The real fact are : we are good on one fight for now (will not stay the case without proper tuning) , We are real bad on almost all the other ones, we are gapped by other specs that have proper raid buffs (please do not mention atrophic poison, that's a joke), so why raid would bother taking us ? 🙂
vivid vessel
frail veldt
"were overtuned for our niche" despite the fact its not even really a niche that...
yeah as in like relative to outside of it
not relative to the rest of the field
fathom bramble
atrophic is a real raid buff on almost every raid encounter
vapid blaze
well if the nieche was good it would be fine
vivid vessel
atrophic is a real raid buff on almost every raid encounter
If that was true you would just stack rogues wouldn't you
Since it stacks
Why does it stop at 1
vapid blaze
if you have good burst or passive cleave
or spread target
youd actually be useful every tier
wintry solar
I didn't know it stacked
cinder haven
yeah I mean imo the other niche we normally have is good overall damage lol
We can't rely on having the highest patchwerk sim damage every tier to be viable
willow portal
Since it stacks
sorry what?
frail veldt
like even if we did 15% more damage than destro on soulhunters but did the same everywhere else we'd still have a problem
wintry solar
I'm the only rogue I know
vivid vessel
idk if people actually know it stacks
Max mentioned it before the tier
fathom bramble
but I often hear that atro is bad or doesn't work
vivid vessel
So they at least know
vapid blaze
Max mentioned it before the tier
didnt they fix dat
cinder haven
They won't tune us that high every tier
fathom bramble
which is simply not the case
willow portal
wtf how arent 2 rogues in each raid
frail veldt
We can't rely on having the highest patchwerk sim damage every tier to be viable
I totally agree thats why ive always wanted outlaw to sacrifice some "identity" of a consistent dps class and at least give us one offensive cd or something that can allow us to be more flexible
but whenever I say that I feel like I insight riots
vivid vessel
frail veldt
^
cinder haven
Widen our niche ye
fathom bramble
I think we can have a real offensive CD as long as we maintain the gameplay that outlaw has historically offered
cinder haven
Give us funnel or something
vivid vessel
IDK I'm close to being convinced about outlaw getting a cd I'm ngl
frail veldt
idk outlaw s3 was so good
cuz our ST damage was tuned really well but like tobfon said thats a bad thing ot rely on
vapid blaze
you just did big st dps with passive cleave
like ignite fire mage
fathom bramble
turning us into one ofthe infinitely cringe CD specs where nothing is going on for 60-90 seconds between cds would be not it
frail veldt
Give us funnel or something
for sure
vivid vessel
If we get a cd I want a cd on chatges
frail veldt
even if we didnt have good scaling uncapped aoe if we had some soft capped scaling funnel id be very very happy
cinder haven
It used to be our niche anyway so it makes sense
vapid blaze
cuz our ST damage was tuned really well but like tobfon said thats a bad thing o...
but even if you arent goated on st sim
youd always have some value
unless you are poop
but then the spec sucks anyway
frail veldt
but even if you arent goated on st sim
youd always have some value
well as outlaw not really
vivid vessel
If we get a cd on charges it's alright
frail veldt
you heavily rely on being tuned to have the highest overall damage
frail veldt
weve discussed this before, if outlaw isnt doing more overall damage htan pretty much every other spec its not gona be in meta
vivid vessel
I would accept it
vapid blaze
yeah u will always rely on beeing highly tuned on this spec
that requires you to have 0 downtime
frail veldt
yeah u will always rely on beeing highly tuned on this spec
that requires you to...
yeah thats why were suggesting something changes lolol
frail veldt
thats exactly our point
vivid vessel
vapid blaze
but i think its kinda fine?
like the uptime thing?
frail veldt
the uptime thing isnt really relevant here
vapid blaze
the issue rn is you do tank st for mediocre aoe
or middle of the pack st with 0 aoe
tulip quarry
Bring Combat spec back , problem solved :p
frail veldt
its not being able to pool damage via CDs
2 vanish charges helped
but like
if you know a damage amp is coming up
as outlaw
you can only do so much
and that hurts outlaw a lot
relative to other specs
who can capitalize on those mecahnics
vapid blaze
so u wanna be sub 2.0 or what
i remeber outlaw on smolderon 🙂
fathom bramble
I think this game should just unironically not have damage amps anymore
burst is already inherently a better damage profile
frail veldt
Im suggesting we take a step towards having SOME SEMBLANCE of a cooldown
fathom bramble
like dimensius without the damage amp all the same specs would still be best
vapid blaze
i personally dont imagine them beeing able to implement an actual cd to outlaw
frail veldt
a cooldown that we could hold without it completely undermining our uptime rotation
cinder haven
Im suggesting we take a step towards having SOME SEMBLANCE of a cooldown
Or a way to make management of adr during downtime easier
frail veldt
i personally dont imagine them beeing able to implement an actual cd to outlaw
theres so many ways they could
daring yoke
guys. would changing to wound poison for halls miniboss worth?
frail veldt
they need to give us a cooldown that DOESNT give us more cdr
so no CP gen
No energy gain
vivid vessel
frail veldt
no increased procs
vapid blaze
so its just
hey every 90s you get 20% damage
cinder haven
I'd like to be able to benefit from BL
vapid blaze
just boring
frail veldt
otherwise were gona suffer for holding it
it just needs to be a button
that does damage
thats it
vivid vessel
Fuck I was gonna say a cd that increase all our proc by a certain percent
proper veldt
Or just two charges
frail veldt
2 charges
proper veldt
Like vanish
vapid blaze
having cd's that dont do anything for gameplay just buff your damage is just boring
frail veldt
Fuck I was gonna say a cd that increase all our proc by a certain percent
see but then were gona want to slam it lol
as soon as we hit max charges or it comes off cd
vivid vessel
see but then were gona want to slam it lol
No cause I also said we need a cd on charges
cinder haven
A reset button for when you are down bad on buffs and energy
vapid blaze
they could make one that amplifies all your rolls
and change kir to grant you rolls
frail veldt
well yeah but if you hit 2 charges you def are gona want to slam
stiff vector
I mean, its moreso a problem with Blizzards tuning and design philosophies and the fact they just arbitrarily decide to give certain specs funnel+prio and tuning them very well more often than not(weird how that keeps happening huh...) and then decide to not give it to other specs. And in our case they not only didnt improve our dmg profile, they actively ruined it(even though our dmg profile was already not very desirable). Any spec that is hardcapped or excels at lower target count AoE whilst being weaker at high target count AoE should by default be the ones who are given giga prio+giga funnel, that would create a REAL and balanced niche.
frail veldt
they could make one that amplifies all your rolls
and change kir to grant you ro...
but this would suck so much to hold
vivid vessel
well yeah but if you hit 2 charges you def are gona want to slam
Ye like every spec In the game
frail veldt
thats the problem
vivid vessel
But if it's not on cdrr not really no
vapid blaze
but this would suck so much to hold
thats the point of cooldowns?
frail veldt
thats the point of cooldowns?
for outlaw its different
cuz holding cds hurts our uptime
thats why it sucks so much
vivid vessel
Cause they are on cdr
frail veldt
yes
proper veldt
If they turned outlaw into a full cd spec I would quit tho, I don’t think us doing low damage in uncapped aoe is that bad
frail veldt
and cuz they give us more cdr
proper veldt
We just need prio
frail veldt
I think its more the latter thats the issue
vivid vessel
But in this scenario your cd wouldn't be on cdr
frail veldt
but removing it from both would be very safe
frail veldt
But in this scenario your cd wouldn't be on cdr
yeah that would be great for us
vivid vessel
So it wouldn't be as bad holding that
frail veldt
idk its the same as bm or sub holding cds
it is not even remotely
vivid vessel
frail veldt
holding Adr and holding blades is not even comparable
cinder haven
We just need prio
Yeah give us funnel, fix haste so we can benefit from BL/PI and a lot is solved I feel
fathom bramble
outlaw is trying to maintain a feedback loop
vapid blaze
bm holding call of the wild last tier was very similar
fathom bramble
sub literally has an apl condition where you go afk for 10 seconds
vapid blaze
cause it amplified all the cdr you get from our spec etc
and you just hold for damage amps
cause its just better
frail veldt
like if you just "held your vanishes"
but then your adr dropped
your vanishes are now worth fuck all
wintry solar
Came back to that mewo
vapid blaze
except your vanish doesnt do 20% of your overall in 20s
wintry solar
My eyes hurt now
cinder haven
Maybe also add a way to pause adr during downtime unrelated to vanish
frail veldt
except your vanish doesnt do 20% of your overall in 20s
yes...exactly....
frail veldt
Maybe also add a way to pause adr during downtime unrelated to vanish
yeah that would be sick too for sure
stiff vector
you cant compare outlaw holding CDs to any other spec in the game, basically no other spec in the game functions with CDs like outlaw does
frail veldt
for some reason I feel like they wouldnt do it though
wintry solar
Maybe also add a way to pause adr during downtime unrelated to vanish
Uhuh should pause adr after X amount of seconds of not attacking
cinder haven
It can start moving again on next damage gcd or something
wintry solar
Or something similiar
frail veldt
you cant compare outlaw holding CDs to any other spec in the game, basically no ...
yeah idk how anyone whos actually played outlaw can say its even remotely the same
vapid blaze
you cant compare outlaw holding CDs to any other spec in the game, basically no ...
bm was kinda close last tier
cinder haven
Uhuh should pause adr after X amount of seconds of not attacking
Yeah that works too
vapid blaze
in the idea
and you sitll hold cd's
fathom bramble
"If you haven't spent or generated combo points in the last 3 seconds"
vapid blaze
giving charges on your main cooldown is kinda cool
but also just eliminates all thought
stiff vector
BM was not even remotely close to being similar to Outlaw last tier lol
cinder haven
Or my weird charges system idea for adr
fathom bramble
giving charges on your main cooldown is kinda cool
but also just eliminates all ...
that's not even remotely true
tulip quarry
We are debating in vain, we will not be listen though, and Realz is not there anymore so ...
frail veldt
vanish having 2 charges made its rules explicitly more complex
vapid blaze
in regards to how damage amps/fight timings are supposed to work
you dont get into the dilemma of holding
vapid blaze
vanish isnt a damage cooldown
tulip quarry
It's not like they have listened to the comunity feedbacks ...
frail veldt
multiple charges adds depth
fathom bramble
vanish isnt a damage cooldown
?
frail veldt
vanish isnt a damage cooldown
bro
you just lost all credibility
saying shit like that
vapid blaze
not in the way
the boomie cd is
hollow bloom
vanish is a defensive guys
frail veldt
is adr a damage cooldown?
hollow bloom
vapid blaze
do you even hold vanish for damage amps
frail veldt
yes
what?!?!?!
ofc you do
if you can do it without dropping other important stuff
or overcapping
its hard but you def do it
fathom bramble
you hold vanish for the most opportune moment like any other 2 charge ability
that's kind of the point of having 2 charges
stiff vector
I mean thats specifically what getting 2 vanish charges allowed for
frail veldt
yeah
tulip quarry
vanish is a defensive guys
Yeah, but the cost of Vanishing powder is too much ... Oh sorry, wrong decade
frail veldt
2nd charge of vanish added a HUGE amount of depth to outlaw
proper veldt
Allowed us to pad more 💀
frail veldt
that did not exist at all with dance + vanish
stiff vector
and wasnt possible to do when we had only 1 vanish 1 dance
vapid blaze
i agree
frail veldt
so then how can you say adding 2 charges of a cooldown makes it braindead
vapid blaze
but i dont compare vanish to shadowblades/flag
just cause it buffs your damage on a cooldown
fathom bramble
apparently it's much less braindead to hit your 2 90 second cds at the same time every 90 seconds
cinder haven
No charges and cdr makes a CD braindead if anything
vapid blaze
its more like idk
raging blow or whatever that is
frail veldt
No charges and cdr makes a CD braindead if anything
so true
lack of charges just completely deletes nuance
cuz the solution is cut and dry
vapid blaze
yes cause u have it every 20s
and it is a feedback loop on its cooldown
frail veldt
What depth does no charges have over charges
stiff vector
if everything had 2 charges on Outlaw it would make an already very in depth spec that is difficult to master and min-max and just turn that up 2x
fathom bramble
it would probably also lower the skill floor though
since losing AR would be much more difficult
frail veldt
Depends on tuning
wintry solar
it would probably also lower the skill floor though
You say that like it's a bad thing
fathom bramble
I don't intend to say it like a bad thing
wintry solar
With "though"
vapid blaze
^ same if all cooldowns had 2 charges
its so much easier to have it when u need it
fathom bramble
our skill floor is way too fucking high
frail veldt
If we're tuned to still have only 95% adr with two charges it could be just as low skill floor
frail veldt
^ same if all cooldowns had 2 charges
its so much easier to have it when u need ...
You're just describing having shorter CDs rofl
That's not what we're talking about
stiff vector
why do you think no1 plays this spec lol, people arent trying to play a giga high skill floor 100apm spec as a nice chill alt
frail veldt
Ofc if you just DOUBLED a specs available CDs you'd always have CDs
vapid blaze
why do you think no1 plays this spec lol, people arent trying to play a giga hig...
idk nobody plays rogue
not even when its op
frail veldt
But if you made blades have two charges but a shorter duration you'd end up with a more flexible design that could have more skill expression
You might play around coup going into your blades
fathom bramble
I think there's a very real chance you would always send both charges back to back since flag unfortunately exists
frail veldt
Cuz yeah obv flag forces it
vapid blaze
exactly like boomie actually xD
frail veldt
This isn't worth it I'm going to bed lol the answer is clear it's up to you if you choose to understand it
wintry solar
1 charge for on cooldown and another for your pocket when you need it :)
fathom bramble
or on boomie 2 charges to send back to back every 3 minutes
wintry solar
Okay but I like my idea more
fathom bramble
or save in weird ways on some fights ofc
wintry solar
fathom bramble
I think in general 2 charges doesn't always make a spec more interesting
wintry solar
<a:pepestab:1139020226067964004>
That's the animation for our CD btw
fathom bramble
since it only does anything interesting on a spec that is already dynamic
if you are a static boring spec you would need a lot more changes than just 1 extra charge on 1 thing to make it do something cool
cinder haven
It's mostly for cdr specs that it helps a lot imo
stiff vector
I like how weve done our daily circling back to theorizing and fantasizing about all the great ways the spec could be made significantly better and fix numerous problems, knowing full well none of these things are ever going to happen 
wintry solar
Well as the rogue dev, it's SL outlaw in its entirety.
fathom bramble
2 charges of AR, KS, sprint, and vanish
stiff vector
willow portal
wtf my dragon big
fallen mural
Have we decided to close the rogue discord yet 😛
timid idol
nice outlaw buffs 
wintry solar
Have we decided to close the rogue discord yet 😛
Yeah today. If they don't, come back tomorrow and read this message again.
Repeat if necessary
marsh coyote
does anyone have a roll the bones wa that tells you to roll when you have two or less buffs? the one im using doesnt work for some reason - https://wago.io/g-iov58mx
wintry solar
marsh coyote
https://wago.io/Pd53s_NPU
ty 🙂
stiff vector
https://wago.io/QqkF-OBL7 hmm interesting some1 made a WA to manually swap to the new spell density setting via the console when in raid so that it actually works(apparently the settings in th graphics options dont work at all rn), wonder if this will give a FPS boost in raid and make some things more clear to see
chrome pollen
is it ok to play KiR with more than 20% haste or should i swap around my gear to keep it around 18-20
willow portal
is it ok to play KiR with more than 20% haste or should i swap around my gear to...
just sim for what gear to wear
if you ahve alternatives why not use them when they are a damage gain
heavy shadow
!gear
ornate heathBOT
vivid vessel
https://wago.io/QqkF-OBL7 hmm interesting some1 made a WA to manually swap to th...
Why would the setting not work but this would
It's just a cvar
Isn't it
Weird
stiff vector
Why would the setting not work but this would
idk apparently blizz made a post confirmin that it was broken and they were working on a fix for it but apparently if you do it through console manually it works? Idk gonna run raid again later td and see if it makes a diff
vivid vessel
These devs are weird
They could have just told us that
I thought it just didn't work
Instead of the setting button not working
torpid fiber
It's crazy that they apparently need to "work on a fix" for a slider not working
Kinda indicates fucked up stuff about the environment ngl
cobalt sail
Let’s hope it works
vagrant zenith
hi short question, is a hard dmg los when i bind ghostly strike with a marko on other spells at the moment or doesnt matter?
cinder haven
!gsmacro
ornate heathBOT
Macroing gs is relatively "ok", be aware that it wont ever be entirely optimal: target swapping in m+ or putting it on a dying target for example. You can macro it to all your abilities.
cinder haven
but if you are playing fatebound, GS usage is much more important
it does use macros but very specific ones
there's a pin in this channel about it
vagrant zenith
all right thanks for your explain 🙂
inland acorn
https://wago.io/QqkF-OBL7 hmm interesting some1 made a WA to manually swap to th...
It does give small fps boost, also you can do the same in details --> options --> auto run code
Like this
fathom whale
its over im benching my rogue for the season its actually tilting me playin it
hollow bloom
starting to feel like last season with all these declines...
never had issues going into groups in DF
red zinc
Barely got declines last season what
wintry solar
I wanna see if they fix something in .5
Yeah, remix drops
red zinc
I wanna see if they fix something in .5
No class changes between patches anymore
Said as much in a gamescom interview
Only number changes for balancing
cinder haven
or not even that in some cases it seems
tawdry linden
Well it's a bit hard with Outlaw right now it seems, since we're strong in AoE but bad in ST, and anything they do to ST will directly translate into AoE
cinder haven
we are strong in aoe in very very specific situations
hollow bloom
outlaw probably busted until the expansion
quiet root
outlaw probably busted until the expansion
and beyond
red zinc
Outlaw is decent in blizzards eyes (wcl overall raid stats) so they wont change it
shell fossil
well they could change the 4 set
hollow bloom
its been busted for awhile but i mean, they did say they would look at the bloat, specifically saying "outlaw"
shell fossil
that happened last season didn't it
just giving extra cto procs or something would help with the downtime feelng as bad as it does
cause tbh the meta rotation is fine, its just the lack of situations where's it's good to get an outlaw compared to s tier pipe hitting classes etc
red zinc
I do honestly think some people take the argument into “my class has to be good” territory sometimes
Its mainly just nonsensical blizzard decisions that need to be addressed
torpid fiber
I do honestly think some people take the argument into “my class has to be good”...
i agree but also outlaw has this problem where if it's not good it's dogshit (especially in raid) bc of the damage profile
hollow bloom
yup logged off, too many declines and been trying for awhile noww
shell fossil
you can check that m+ comp site, outlaws are doing 16-18 keys
torpid fiber
like if we did the same overall but we actually had prio damage i feel like there'd be way less complaints here
cinder haven
we do need help with our damage profile
red zinc
i mean something can be dogshit once in a while too
Happened a few too many times recently due to weird balance decisions though
inland acorn
like if we did the same overall but we actually had prio damage i feel like ther...
ye good thing our prio from last season, now hits 1 random target 
cinder haven
we used to lose among the least prio while doing AOE
red zinc
Singular focus shouldve been a trickster talent idk
cinder haven
then they started added funnel to a lot of specs but not outlaw, so our niche became just low target cleave with PC
would make sense to add funnel to outlaw
they can also go for something else, but funnel would make the most sense to me
inland acorn
What would funnel even look like on outlaw 
red zinc
Would not be shocked with some kind of apex talent that funnels damage back in also
% of flurry damage on target
Easiest solution
inland acorn
Idk if Blizzard would do that
That would be so much of our power tied to blade flurry
cinder haven
% of flurry damage on target
yeah, issue with this is that it needs a debuff on main target to work from I think
another idea I had was a main gauche based funnel
quaint sable
GS
cinder haven
basically make MG only proc on your current target, but let any BF damage instance proc it
and then stop MG from flurrying
maybe scale proc chance with mastery
cinder haven
sorry sorry
inland acorn
That would actually be interesting idea, to make us think about mastery
IF only we revert this haste tax nonsense
red zinc
Mastery in big 2025 🥀
cinder haven
really want to be able to benefit from BL/PI
quaint sable
Ooh thats interesting. what abt making our target cap scale with mastery so it atleast says useless in st
shell fossil
also in a roundabout way, the lack of sparks is making outlaw feel worse than it is. i seriously doubt most people are fully developing their gear for outlaw etc.
like if i do my raid bracers for assassin i'm stuck waiting 2-4-5-6 weeks to get my outlaw bis rings
red zinc
Ye we might be going to daggers next xpac so
cinder haven
it looks like maybe they are addressing the dagger issue at least
red zinc
who knows
cinder haven
will help a little bit (as long as there are fights where we are competitive)
red zinc
will help a little bit (as long as there are fights where we are competitive)
3 different raids and still not competitive in any
red zinc
oh naw i meant next xpac
cinder haven
I'm sure there will be a council fight next tier too
but it would be cool if we could be useful for more than that
red zinc
honestly feel like theyve been toning down the amount of council fights
cinder haven
that's fine
shell fossil
top parse is running bleed build i'm low key excited to try it next week
red zinc
silken court if you really want to count it and soul hunters are the only ones
This xpac
cinder haven
yeah like I said, it's not much of a niche
we're not even good on full uptime ST fights
red zinc
Im honestly fine being mid ST so long as that st isnt reliant on fatebound anti prio talents
torpid fiber
The problem this tier is just that we're now bad at literally everything somehow
cinder haven
except low target cleave
reef ruin
I love starting raid pull with 1 buff!!
shell fossil
idk there's not a lot of swirlies to evade except for the streets boss, just not a lot of ways to make outlaw deal with mechanics that don't actually grief our rotation/damage
reef ruin
So happy!!!!
cinder haven
no LD?
sage sleet
Starting playing rogue, can you still use dagger in offhand as outlaw?
hasty warren
Hi pirates
hasty warren
is this build good for soulbinder progress ?
I removed PC for no padding
and but it in second fth
but maybe swift slasher is better ?
ornate heathBOT
A dagger offhand is technically like 0.2% better than a slow weapon because it generates more 
Instant Poison procs. That is the only difference, 
Fatal Flourish proc rate is normalized to be unaffected by the change in attack speed. Note that item level or stats will matter more than this quirk, or you can simply use a slow weapon anyway for transmog.
grim spear
but maybe swift slasher is better ?
fth -> pc, deft-> swift slasher
cinder haven
wdym?
harsh shore
simple target dummy check, my macro for /cast BTE /cast GS, doesnt cast GS
harsh shore
ive tried both. still not registering
inland acorn
copy your macro here
harsh shore
#showtooltip Between the Eyes
/cast Ghostly Strike
/cast Between the Eyes
hasty warren
fth -> pc, deft-> swift slasher
oh I forget deft, ty
dispatch below 2 killing sprees
inland acorn
#showtooltip Between the Eyes
/cast Ghostly Strike
/cast Between the Eyes
you do know, you have to press it twice ?
And are you making sure, you're in melee to cast gs
harsh shore
wait a damn minute
hasty warren
mine doesnt recognize casting GS
u have ur gmae in english ?
inland acorn
Wdym press twice
yeah true
but if you somehow are out of range it will cast only bte
so might as well press it twice for good measure
cinder haven
if you are macroing to trigger the bug in pin, then pressing twice isn't gonna cut it
since it only works if they go off at the same time
harsh shore
i fixed it.
for whatever reason showing the tooltip in the macro caused it to only cast BtE
removed the "showtooltip" and now its fine
inland acorn
that's not possible
Because i have same macro
/cast Ghostly Strike
/cast Between the Eyes```And it works fine
Not that i'm using it, cuz i find it cringe af
harsh shore
no idea. but now i have no issues with the macro shrug
inland acorn
i use only ADR one
cinder haven
I never trigger the bte bug anyway
willow portal
we just joined a 10 flood as bdk outlaw and bm hunter with 3100+ and then got kicked for not saying hello
inland acorn
vanish might actually be smart tho
but if you macro it to vanish, how do you proc it with ADR ?
since it will go off, before you press adr
cinder haven
here's my cringe macro
/cast [combat, nostealth] Vanish;[nocombat, nostealth]Stealth
/cast [combat, known:Edge Case] Adrenaline Rush
/cast [combat, known:Edge Case] Ghostly Strike```why stop there
still got space for flurry and bte and dispatch
cinder haven
are you sure about that?
willow portal
are you close to the char limit?
cinder haven
I can fit in one more thing I think
willow portal
the macro framework really needs an update
inland acorn
here's my cringe macro
```/click [nocombat] AutoTankMisdirect Leftbutton 1
/cast...
thats a lot of text...
cinder haven
it's a macro that does tricks + stealth if out of combat
and vanish if in combat, + adr and gs if you are fatebound
basically, if you have adr ready you use it at low cp
if you only have GS and vanish, you use at finish cp
zinc briar
nah im rerolling
cinder haven
to what tho
cinder haven
rage quit
shell fossil
don't play cloak of shadows for the rest of season 3 
tawdry linden
mm hunter and dk frost did 2m more than me
How much in total did you all do=
zinc briar
9-11-11
tawdry linden
Oh damn, that's rough
zinc briar
How much in total did you all do=
they did 11 and i did 9
cinder haven
and with 10 more ilvl the gap will only increase I guess
and then turbo boost on top of that
tawdry linden
At least we can play in the "least played specs" thingy they make somtimes (can't remember the name for the life of me xD)
zinc briar
1892379182379213 buttons for 0 damage
wintry solar
At least we can play in the "least played specs" thingy they make somtimes (can'...
Break the meta
I really like that
tawdry linden
Break the meta
Yes! Thanks
wintry solar
You're welcome!
cinder haven
we're still somehow high on mythicstats.com
hasty warren
we're still somehow high on mythicstats.com
our damages are ok but we have 0 utility
cinder haven
we tanky at least
cinder haven
!prekey
ornate heathBOT
Pre-key fuckery
RTB TWICE some time before entering dungeon to get 4 Supercharger stacks. These stacks don't have a duration.- Just before key placement use
AR into KS to get 
Loaded Dice and 2 free Unseen Blade procs. - KS will consume one stack of Supercharger but the 3rd+4th stack are removed when the key starts anyway.
- During the bubble, DO NOT RTB or recast AR as you will lose the CPs and Supercharger stacks when the bubble ends.
- After the bubble drops use RTB again (now back at 4 stacks of Supercharger).
- Before entering the first pack
BF into 
Stealth. - Open onto the pack with AR into
BtE.
pearl topaz
cheers m8
inland acorn
here's my cringe macro
```/click [nocombat] AutoTankMisdirect Leftbutton 1
/cast...
ok
I'm snatching this 
cinder haven
enjoy
beware though, if you normally spam stealth while waiting to get out of combat this will burn your vanish charges
I use weak aura to tell me when it's safe to press between pulls
inland acorn
I have separate binding for stealth
I'm just snatching the Vanish + AR + GS combo
leaving tricks and stealth out
Also tricks, cux i forget that I dont have 1h on FB 
hasty warren
is sub good in phys comp ? it's not majority of shadow damage ?
inland acorn
Its good in phys
Vers + mastery + attack power
Idk about monk buff for sub
Think it might depend if you're pressing evi for nimble or powder
unkempt dew
Are we closing the discord server already?
muted crest
Just canceled my sub and wrote in the feedback: 'I'll come back when Outlaw gets buffed.
worldly shale
Just canceled my sub and wrote in the feedback: 'I'll come back when Outlaw gets...
that will get them
wintry solar
I use weak aura to tell me when it's safe to press between pulls
I bet you use a weakaura to track your steps too don't you
cinder haven
So I don't walk of a cliff yee
hasty warren
manic light
why do we sned spenders on 6 CP outside of vanish instead of 5?
manic light
How is it more efficent? It feels like I need to press more buttons to get 6 than 5
torpid fiber
spenders do more damage per gcd that way
cinder haven
Gcd economy
torpid fiber
Every gcd spent on a spender is less cdr than spending it on a builder
cinder haven
But fatebound can actually finish on 5+ all the time
Because they buffed coins so much that it's worth
mellow mica
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/316923682607857685/1413242281515024545/im...
absolute cinema
torpid fiber
But fatebound can actually finish on 5+ all the time
there's still no world where that means you can drop a deeper stratagem point, right?
cinder haven
there's still no world where that means you can drop a deeper stratagem point, r...
Don't think so
torpid fiber
Dang
makes sense
Just feels weird that we can finish at max-2 but it's still not worth it to drop a max
indigo token
fair oak
cinder haven
Just feels weird that we can finish at max-2 but it's still not worth it to drop...
I did look into it at some point also dropping ala and getting more haste
torpid fiber
makes sense yeah
tulip quarry
+Crit ?
gaunt phoenix
torpid fiber
Yeah the issue is that all the nodes we could maybe drop aren't really taking up valuable points
tulip quarry
Lethality ?
vivid vessel
stiff vector
jolly geyser
cedar kernel
crude flower
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/316923682607857685/1413242281515024545/im...
Can you just queue as assa or stmth and during key countdown swap back to out
unborn basin
I've done it, nobody noticed 🤣
fading hatch
does tricks provide anything in raid? i haven't been using it incase it messes with tanking by giving one too much threat
gaunt phoenix
When you fly to the platforms on salad king before tank
crude flower
I've done it, nobody noticed 🤣
I can't do it for my own spec sadly
Playing SV rn, and pretneding to be a range only to swap to melle last second can fuck stuff up
daring oxide
But fatebound can actually finish on 5+ all the time
how much of a gain was this?
cinder haven
0.4% it seems
but I think only for 1FTH
2FTH it's neutralish I think
FB is fun to optimize but not so fun to play in m+ 😛
viscid forge
!fuu
ornate heathBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
hasty warren
Can you just queue as assa or stmth and during key countdown swap back to out
nah i'm not this cringe
proude to play outalw
crude flower
Im proud to play survival but i've legit been kicked for it before
hasty warren
!prekey
ornate heathBOT
Pre-key fuckery
- RTB TWICE some time before entering dungeon to get 4 Supercharger stacks. These stacks don't have a duration.
- Just before key placement use AR into KS to get Loaded Dice and 2 free Unseen Blade procs.
- KS will consume one stack of Supercharger but the 3rd+4th stack are removed when the key starts anyway.
- During the bubble, DO NOT RTB or recast AR as you will lose the CPs and Supercharger stacks when the bubble ends.
- After the bubble drops use RTB again (now back at 4 stacks of Supercharger).
- Before entering the first pack BF into Stealth.
- Open onto the pack with AR into BtE.
proven ocean
undead reouge
cinder haven
buff undead racial
leaden folio
worldly shale
i love typing rouge
indigo token
Unfortunately I’m not 11 years old so no, i don’t think having a pirate styled theme was ever a good choice…
Arg matey. No, i don’t want to play as a pirate.
The naming of “outlaw” is one thing but the actual pirate styled class/skills are completely alienating for those who are not fans of Pirates of the Caribbean
Honestly, because of this cringey pirate style concept, i dropped combat rogue as a spec when outlaw was introduced and rerolled assassination
Has Activision forgotten what it means to be rogue? What kind of correlation do pirates have with a stealth style spec?
i’m not sure what strain you have to smoke to remove something that was already fitting… i.e. Combat rogue, which completely got the idea across that it was a more toe-to-toe combat style rogue spec. But these devs went the unnecessary extra mile to replace it with something so unattractive and specific to a certain niche… why?
Assassination and subtlety speak for themselves. Their themes of poison and stealth are reflective of each of their play styles. Outlaw and this pirate junk stick out like a sore thumb…
Message for the invertebrates at Activision - please redesign this spec. you can continue to call it outlaw, but please remove the pirate themed “swashbuckling” garbage - this is in no way attractive to anyone nor as anyone in the history of World of Warcraft said “i want to play as a pirate”.
grim spear
soul hunters
indeed an outlaw boss
proven ocean
https://tenor.com/view/rouge-rouge-the-bat-sonic-sonic-the-hedgehog-rouge-day-gi...
wtf 
hasty warren
<@352916297262301194> works everytime <:ICANT:964717117071048774>
xd
hasty warren
old pfp..
I don't like having the same for long time
pref change it every 2/3 weeks
crimson arch
Unfortunately I’m not 11 years old so no, i don’t think having a pirate styled t...
nobody likes pirates and pirates are not rogues. Thats so stupid wow.
neat echo
Close the discord 
rotund token
Unfortunately I’m not 11 years old so no, i don’t think having a pirate styled t...
Your opinion man. Some like it some dont, same as every damn thing in this world.
indigo token
its a copypasta
rotund token
Ah, just saw lol, apologies
hasty warren
is Loumitar MM harder than soubinder ?
unborn basin
🏴☠️
shell fossil
freeman's mind pirate episode comes to mind
toxic gate
just switching to outlaw after a long time away, so i get the opener macro, then just have a vanish + GS macro as well?
or vanish + GS + BtE?
gaunt phoenix
u need one macro
AR and GS
you use it for opener
and you press it after vanish
Dw about the bte thing
toxic gate
Do you still macro gs to like everything or not anymore?
gaunt phoenix
you can for trickster but not with this fatebound tech
worldly shale
just switching to outlaw after a long time away, so i get the opener macro, then...
why
jolly geyser
elder phoenix
they still havent fix'd it huh
smoll indie company
tbh outlaw being pirate themed is kinda cringe
gaunt phoenix
sorry that seems unecessary
elder phoenix
we cant even equip a range weapon but we have pistol shot LOL
frail veldt
You cant equip a shuriken either
jolly geyser
anymore
frail veldt
Also it's a copypasta
elder phoenix
anymore
elder phoenix
Ninja theme fits more with the invisible/stealth tech rogues have
frail veldt
Nah
jolly geyser
I want drunk fat british man coming home from the pub theme
elder phoenix
yyeah
frail veldt
Also Wana talk cringe
Police captain of the light justice bringer
The most popular spec
elder phoenix
hunter doing 6.2 mil while casting and moving
frail veldt
Wows a fantasy game
elder phoenix
oh waht
frail veldt
Fantasy can be cringe it's part of the territory
craggy quiver
We getting giga tuning next pass
jolly geyser
lol
elder phoenix
if we are hopefully outlaw becomes a range dps spec
daring oxide
we are getting tuning tomorrow
last min changes popped in before reset
just relax all and be ready
craggy quiver
jolly geyser
they buffing 1 ara kara boss
proven ocean
if we are hopefully outlaw becomes a range dps spec
@vivid vessel thoughts on this based take?
craggy quiver
Outlaw being a mid range spec
elder phoenix
yeah outlaw should be a mid range spec
cinder haven
Could happen i guess
craggy quiver
Would be based if we still count as being "melee"
elder phoenix
bring back acro but make it 20 yard
proven ocean
u guys are cooked
elder phoenix
correction: bring back old acro
make it 20-25 y or how ever evokers range is
what ever*
cinder haven
20 yard acro, you promised, no taking back
proven ocean
outlaw should be -100 yards
if u aren't under the boss's ass u shouldn't do dps
and make the gcd 0.0001
no cappy
or
jolly geyser
They will make outlaw a sniper class,100yards away from the action
proven ocean
ngl tho
imagine if hero talents actually made outlaw ranged
that would've been a sick hero talent idea
lmao
and like
craggy quiver
I wouldn't mind at all
jolly geyser
or some mix shit
craggy quiver
But I would like to be counted as a melee in raid mechanics
jolly geyser
ranged melee
craggy quiver
Lol
proven ocean
idk they can do alot of cool shit
jolly geyser
also I kinda wanna see how using a 2H would work with rogue but thats farfetch
elder phoenix
i mean half of our damage is literally range
cinder haven
Mid range except you have to go in and ghostly strike every 20s
elder phoenix
pistol shot and between the eyes
jolly geyser
Mid range except you have to go in and ghostly strike every 20s
nah you send in pirate boy
elder phoenix
Might as well retire the melee weapons for a range weapon or 2
cinder haven
Ah we get a pet
jolly geyser
trinket guy man
cinder haven
Parrot
craggy quiver
Parrot barrage
jolly geyser
parrot shit barrage
cinder haven
New area slow
elder phoenix
ngl though i kinda dont like what they did to killing spree. but oh well. 🤷♂️ beggars cant be choosars
They should bring back the old killing spree instead of a rehash hunter ability called barrage
elder phoenix
they taking our subs but they cant make new abilities/spells which is hilarious
elder phoenix
Tbh bf should return to how it was during cata
where its permanent
instead of hurr durr toggle cuz button bloat
strong halo
Can I track AR uptime in keys with details or is the only way to log
cinder haven
I kinda like deft ngl
jolly geyser
Can I track AR uptime in keys with details or is the only way to log
details show
frail veldt
I kinda like deft ngl
Same
cinder relic
instead of hurr durr toggle cuz button bloat
What are you talking abt?
frail veldt
I could see them removing it though
elder phoenix
What are you talking abt?
i forget you didnt play during cata
jolly geyser
BF had energy penalty
cinder haven
What are you talking abt?
We are just circlejerking as usual
cinder relic
No what you are saying makes no sense
Thats what I'm asking for clarity on
What does old BF have to do with button bloat
grim spear
me, best healing outlaw
cinder relic
Also, if they changed BF to the way it used to be I think most people, especially zac would literally have a mental breakdown
elder phoenix
Fine not technically button bloat but pressing bloat
cinder relic
What the fuck does that mean man
jolly geyser
frail veldt
Also, if they changed BF to the way it used to be I think most people, especiall...
How did t used to be?
elder phoenix
Also, if they changed BF to the way it used to be I think most people, especiall...
I mean, ngl id pay to see that
cinder relic
a toggle that reduced energy regen
cinder relic
You could either have BF, or no, having it active meant reduced energy
frail veldt
Also that sounds like exactly the same amount of button bloat rofl
craggy quiver
I kinda like deft ngl
Rather them bring back wits man
elder phoenix
How did t used to be?
It used to be a toggle that auto cleaves another target, so for example if you have a 2 boss fight you can have it permanently on and forget about it
frail veldt
That's how it is now
cinder relic
Buzzword soup
frail veldt
If you don't play deft
cinder haven
GS can go if they want to reduce buttons
elder phoenix
GS can go if they want to reduce buttons
Gs took over what revealing strike was
so doubt it will go
cinder haven
Buff cto instead maybe and keep kir
elder phoenix
anytime soon
grim spear
gs with fb 4pc is quite fun
jolly geyser
make it cost no energy
grim spear
ye.
cinder haven
gs with fb 4pc is quite fun
It is but not really because gs is a good skill
frail veldt
make it cost no energy
Then it's even more just bloat
jolly geyser
yes
jolly geyser
so remove it instead
frail veldt
Just delete it
elder phoenix
im surprise no one has made a weakaura to tell you when to vanish or w/e that everytime you can vanish/AR more efficiently
im surprise that even after all the beta testing, this bug has still havent been fix'd.
craggy quiver
Wish gs was like a buff or something cause it's lame if you need to swap targets
cinder haven
Of course i made such a wa
craggy quiver
Give it the bte treatment
cinder haven
But it's mine
elder phoenix
Of course i made such a wa
I was gonna but, i was too lazy. and plus i think hekili does it perfectly
jolly geyser
GS becomes cd and buff
elder phoenix
so i just use hekili for that
frail veldt
the problem is
you want to know you need to vanish
before you vanish
so you know not to do other stuff
cinder haven
Ye
frail veldt
like having it light up right when you hit 6cps with certain conditions isnt that helpful
but having it light up when gs is ready is pretty simple
cinder haven
like having it light up right when you hit 6cps with certain conditions isnt tha...
Yeah mine doesn't really work like that
elder phoenix
and so far it is accurate in gs/ar combinations
frail veldt
yeah I track buffs on other cooldowns
like my PS glows when I have BS
so I know to change my rules
frail veldt
hekili does that for you
I wouldnt know lol
elder phoenix
well now you know
cinder haven
like my PS glows when I have BS
I just change icon to bs icon
elder phoenix
even if you dont wanna look at the rotation for it, just use the CD management for it
and it is accurate lol
frail veldt
I just change icon to bs icon
lol thats too confusing for me for some reason
I dont like my ui to move around too much or change animation or anything
I like it super static with just tiny glows
cinder haven
I like showing buffs like that
elder phoenix
cuz in hekili you can seperate cool downs to a different section and it tracks it for you when you need to use it perfeclty
cinder haven
UB replaces SS/ambush
frail veldt
I still think its wild people still use 3 colors for zacs rtb buff weak aura
its so much easier to count will_lose if you just have red and yellow
blue just confused me
frail veldt
I have durations color
globally
so numbers go red when theyre low
also my kir wa tracks the lowest duration of my rtb buffs
very useful
it shows a kir icon and the "duration" on the kir icon is the duration of my lowest rtb buff
elder phoenix
it shows a kir icon and the "duration" on the kir icon is the duration of my low...
theres a weakaura that has a kir thing but
its shit
someone linked it here a while ago
but its so bad lol
cinder haven
One of the coolest things about wow is this level of customisation
frail veldt
fr fr
elder phoenix
tbh its too much
frail veldt
I love seeing peoples UIs
elder phoenix
yeah scripting in it makes it more of a wild car
card*
but its alright though blizzards doing an addon prune and hopefully weakauras gonna take a big hit
details is getting cucked
frail veldt
I dont think they are
elder phoenix
imagine using details
frail veldt
they arent deleting addons
frail veldt
they have no avenue to do so
they cant just turn off "addons named details" or anything like that
elder phoenix
i didnt say turn off addons
flat briar
Anyone know the gain numbers of 0pc to 4pc?
frail veldt
lolol
frail veldt
how
vapid blaze
aint no way they execute no wa bosses on the first try
frail veldt
if they replace an addon with a substitute that is better than the addon
thats a good thing
frail veldt
aint no way they execute no wa bosses on the first try
theyve already tried
and failed
vapid blaze
i also dont believe their addons will be better than what we have now
frail veldt
then we wont stop using ours
vapid blaze
not at first atleast lol
frail veldt
I think people are ignorant about how blizz can just turn off specific addons
cinder haven
And then they revoke functionality to force us
frail veldt
yeah revoking api calls and stuff is the most likely thing
elder phoenix
man i remember having that radar option for dbm
frail veldt
but so many addons share calls it wouldnt really be that clean
jolly geyser
im happy if they can make functional wa like shit,was just make the game lag
frail veldt
I mainly want a customizable buff and cooldown tracker
im worried though that blizz doesnt understand that the two need to be combined
they seem to kinda be separating cooldowns and buffs like they arent intricately dependent
fluid crown
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
vapid blaze
they wont manage to make it good
like they cant make their stuff trackable via their own buff bars
elder phoenix
it wouldnt matter, as long as blizz handles this redic addon dependance.
one addon is already pre cucked. Im just waiting for the weakaura beat down
vapid blaze
i think their details wont be as good 🙂
elder phoenix
i think their details wont be as good 🙂
how so
elder phoenix
theres would be more accurate and server side
elder phoenix
LIke wym it wont be as agood?
vapid blaze
they cant even make their own buffs trackable
elder phoenix
server side combat logging is insanely better than what we have now
vapid blaze
thats how much they care about your ui experience
i dont have faith in blizzard
and neither should u tbh
elder phoenix
oh its not faith i just want them to cuck addon dependancy by alot
vapid blaze
they will just remove wa
and you will still get the WA boss that we get each tier
and it will be aweful
elder phoenix
they will just remove wa
and you will still get the WA boss that we get each tie...
Good.
frail veldt
theyve been prett clear saying that they arent going to war with addons and instead want to design the game to not incentivize addons as much
their goal seems to be to make addons less useful inherently by improving base UI and designing the game in general to not need such intricate logic that can only be done via a wa
its primarily to help the game be more approachable at least thats what theyve stated is their goal
elder phoenix
their goal seems to be to make addons less useful inherently by improving base U...
worked pretty well tbh
frail veldt
its not that they hate addons
they juts dont like that addons are a barrier to entry
in a game that already is hard to learn
vapid blaze
Good.
wdym good
will just be a miserable experience for every raider
but its fine
rwf can do it with 21 man raidleading 🙂
elder phoenix
wdym good
will just be a miserable experience for every raider
sounds like a they issue not mine
gaunt phoenix
calling all sleight+loaded dice gamers
please run this weakaura for a few keys for data gathering 
https://wago.io/I9nB9GUcJ
elder phoenix
calling all sleight+loaded dice gamers
please run this weakaura for a few keys ...
cant you just check logs for this
?
proven ocean
cant you just check logs for this
XDXDXD
elder phoenix
what idk how that works 🤷♂️
grizzled heron
guinea pigs assemble
elder phoenix
tis a simple question
gaunt phoenix
rtb stuff in logs not intuitive/broken
elder phoenix
Ah
gaunt phoenix
We have that bug where random rolls stay behind
random geyser
@gaunt phoenix do we just need the wa or do we need logs to compare too?
inland acorn
calling all sleight+loaded dice gamers
please run this weakaura for a few keys ...
Virus detected 🚨
Solo now has my credit card info
Gg
gaunt phoenix
just wa
random geyser
Does kir or ho matter
gaunt phoenix
no
frank finch
!haste
ornate heathBOT
A properly geared Outlaw's stat volume will look like Vers > Haste* > Crit > Mastery.
*But Haste has a **requirement ** because Adrenaline Rush scales your GCD based on haste, up to 25%.
The 
KIR build wants ~19% haste from rating, so it becomes 25% after 
Alacrity. 18% or 20% is close enough and not a problem. Don't play KIR with lower than 18% haste.
The 
HO build gets 
Take 'em by Surprise, so its haste requirement is technically ~9%., but it continues to want haste just for energy. You will likely optimize towards 14-18% haste, not a strict number, just sim.
You need to use 
Raidbots Top Gear to determine what haste pieces to use. You can also get ~4.2% haste from a flask. This can be equal or better than Vers flask if you need it for either build.
frank finch
to low?
elder phoenix
to low?
jolly geyser
who had that spell density command,saw it earlier
stiff vector
royal ermine
passed 2k apps this expansion wahoo
I need to get rid of this addon it just destroys my mental
jolly geyser
https://wago.io/QqkF-OBL7 this?
oh nice,ty big man
willow portal
passed 2k apps this expansion wahoo
what opener are you using tho
maybe try the "i am calling the police because its illegal to be that beautiful" one
elder phoenix
passed 2k apps this expansion wahoo
What weakaura is this
and ngl
I get instant invites lol
late swallow
@keen belfry the type of guy to say "i wasn't born yesterday" after seeing through someone's deception
willow portal
I get instant invites lol
to the boosts you buy?