not trying to change topic
#outlaw
keen belfry
vivid vessel
to exist
keen belfry
but
proven ocean
#nerfoutlawinPTRitsOP
keen belfry
would scrolls/removing raid buffs in m+/giving everyone every raid buff in M+ fuck with the meta
random stirrup
I wonder if blizzard knows that nerfing chaos brand/AI, then tuning classes in raid around weaker raid buffs, just means they function better baseline without raid buffs
keen belfry
like MAN i actually hate loading into a dungeon doing 14% less damage
just by the people exisitng in my key and their spec
vivid vessel
#nerfoutlawinPTRitsOP
FUCK YOU
random stirrup
The fact that melees need a full comp setup or they’re 20% behind while a mage logs into a key and is only missing 3/3/3/2 ish % is cringe
random stirrup
you would actually never see a warrior again if they removed shout though 
keen belfry
they do a good job of being pseudo prio
i just really like how phys comp runs feel
just mark kick
blast pack
go next
novel socket
guys
is it normal to do mostly blue logs in mythic progress ?
or do i not put enough attention to dps over mechanics and playing it safe ?
the bosses do die
but idk if i should strive to do more
mighty pivot
by definition it's normal because blue logs are somewhere in the middle 
covert kestrel
is it normal to do mostly blue logs in mythic progress ?
well people that have it on farm will prob be more able to focus on dps and not on mechanics, plus outlaw being that spec that only a few nerds play make it harder to parse on
mighty pivot
yes
obsidian walrus
kk
novel socket
i see
i thought it was the opposite
unpopular specs are easier to parse on
since there is less competition
obsidian walrus
@vivid vessel you streaming some PTR today?
obsidian walrus
F
vivid vessel
usually outlaw is good on ptr
like every iter
cause shitter keys, people learning
etc
so
obsidian walrus
so maybe this tier we are giga on live
vivid vessel
when outlaw is shit on ptr
obsidian walrus
mate worthy maybe XD
vivid vessel
you know something is wrong
agile orchid
why is outlaw shit
mighty pivot
you are just scaled to max hero track
random stirrup
well 10% tier set is really really bad compared to most this upcoming tier
That certainly doesn’t help
agile orchid
are we seriously dooming based on early ptr tuning
vivid vessel
im not dooming
he asked me if i would play ptr
i said
outlaw is so utterly dogshit trash garbage terrible poop on ptr
agile orchid
outlaw on 200ms ping doesn't sound great
mighty pivot
random stirrup
covert kestrel
unpopular specs are easier to parse on
you parse compared to other people in your spec, and its all percentages. if your spec is underplayed besides only the sweaters/one tricks that know it inside out, then it makes it harder to parse. vs like bm and ret where you can just beat the brain dead pretty easily
novel socket
but wouldn't most sweats move to the meta spec ?
keen belfry
not outlaw
keen belfry
losers are in here birb
glass mortar
every spec has its die hard try hards even iuf its underplayed
obsidian walrus
ok do we know how much did i lose dmg wise by pressing ambush in stealth as KIR?
keen belfry
punches birb
random stirrup
ok do we know how much did i lose dmg wise by pressing ambush in stealth as KIR?
A lot
glass mortar
on my first gallywix kill i barely got a purple parse and it was a rank 8
so
it is what it is
glass mortar
no
keen belfry
have u guys ever ACTUALLY raid lead while playing outlaw
glass mortar
there was only like 50 outlaw parses by the point we killed it even
random stirrup
Getting high # ranks is easier with smaller population, getting a nice % is harder
keen belfry
like raid lead lead
glass mortar
and we were not high ranked
novel socket
i'm definitely doing something wrong
i parse mostly blue
except that one styx green because they had me chase bombshells
glass mortar
well i almost parsed blue with a rank 8, thats sorta my point
novel socket
to unstuck them
glass mortar
as u get to later bosses it gets harder to parse cause u got bozos like zac and rogues on farm playing outlaw and doing real well
vivid vessel
0s
glass mortar
gl on prog
glass mortar
mighty pivot
just get r1 then 
vivid vessel
well
its mostrly a early prog thing tbf
by now plenty of people killed bosses
so annomalies like these are rarer
but people have gear etc
if you are a late proger
its also not ideal
novel socket
and in my guild every reclear is a reprogress so i can't parse much in there neither
but if we kill gally quickly and we do one last reclear i'm gonna be a parse bitch
keen belfry
im so nervous to return to outlaw raid next season
im going to make raid lead weak auras
so i dont have to guide anyone anymore
random stirrup
aren’t you gm
novel socket
next season i'm thinking about going sub
glass mortar
next season looks like an awful awful outlaw season so far
random stirrup
can’t you simply make someone else the rl bitch
glass mortar
raid look horrendous for law
novel socket
s1 i did sin
s2 outlaw
s3 sub
random stirrup
If you want to play outlaw
agile orchid
why would you play outlaw in raid
keen belfry
can’t you simply make someone else the rl bitch
our RL quit mid season
agile orchid
why do this to yourself
random stirrup
next season i'm thinking about going sub
Sub looking good after tier set changes if they don’t nerf it!
keen belfry
i did fine raid leading as mage, could play that spec and call. but mug and gally i had to just guide people and said fuck it ill do mechs too idc about my parse anymore lets get ce
novel socket
Sub looking good after tier set changes if they don’t nerf it!
we both know they will definitely nerf it
first heroic week too
agile orchid
wrong, they will nerf it based on prepatch performance
glass mortar
bro they buffed dev
🤔
nerf its s2 tier set, buff the spec
s3 tier set is just as busted if not more then live btw
novel socket
mm and dev had it coming
random stirrup
ya that was interesting
novel socket
but dev has escaped the nerfs for some reason
glass mortar
buffed
keen belfry
the things i saw MMs and Devs do ST
glass mortar
its broken af on ptr
keen belfry
made me wanna recruit more devs and hutners somehow
random stirrup
although I didn’t see dev popping off in the raid testing I watched
Maybe they just weren’t playing it
random stirrup
It was the mm spriest boomie show
random stirrup
And all 3 of those got hit/bugfixed
cursive stag
@glass mortar what looks so bad in raid for outlaw?
vivid vessel
well we saw 3 bosses
glass mortar
pretty sure on one of the bosses u gotta do fly between platform bullshit
glass mortar
ye
and outlaw tuning obviouslyh isnt doing it any favors rn
relative to live we are alot weaker compared to specs and we arent exactly killing it in raid on live
we are fine
depending on tuning it could end up ok, its always possible to be overtuned enough the bad fight design doesnt matter
🤷
cant expect that tho
cursive stag
thank you. Yeah tuning aside, was just wondering regarding the fights
nimble sage
in m+ we "only" got CLOS and feint to reduce damage taken, right? Evasion does not work unless I literally got aggro?
mighty pivot
it does work on certain physical aoe abilities
and when it doesn't it acts as 20% DR if you are talented into elusiveness
for example these are just the ones for priory
vivid vessel
whats that
wintry solar
Take a wild guess
red zinc
depending on tuning it could end up ok, its always possible to be overtuned enou...
Amirdrassil fladhbacks
mighty pivot
secret s3 project
proper bear
vivid vessel
secret s3 project <:garf_sit:1334889429449314456>
?
wintry solar
vivid vessel
give the luink you noob
mighty pivot
I have only done priory so far
mighty pivot
I won't do it for s2 it's almost over
so I only did PSF since it carries over to s3
wintry solar
Dm the link to everyone but Zac
mighty pivot
I still got time until s3 
vivid vessel
mighty pivot
this is the entire thing for PSF, just make sure to not run other dungeons and it covers 100% of the dungeons 
vivid vessel
whats holy radiance
proven ocean
whats holy radiance
1st boss aoe
vivid vessel
ah
proven ocean
bozo
glass mortar
ye
mighty pivot
the best defense is offense or something
glass mortar
ye
vivid vessel
200% damage amp
glass mortar
oh
glass mortar
xd
vivid vessel
it looks like nightmare outlaw boss
vivid vessel
once
glass mortar
maybe there is hope
vivid vessel
flight seems to be 3
mighty pivot
btw the document's name is an homage to 👍 🏄♂️ 🏄♀️ guy
vivid vessel
still a rly hard pull btw zac
well there is no pulsing aoe tho
proven ocean
thats what u think wipes you but apparently alot of things is going on already in the first place
and no aug now
so
vivid vessel
but our tnak was getting destroyed
i think its just tank damage ross
there isnt anything going on dps
its the dot that we already had back then
vivid vessel
which isnt doing much
i did dawnrbeaker already
tank was getting destroyed
but like
nothing going on
for us dps
vivid vessel
monksea isnt a random tnak
proven ocean
well idk what to tell you cuh
sudden fulcrum
proven ocean
maybe brew just needs buffs
they're taking more than double prot warrior's dmg on ptr atm from the logs i saw
proven ocean
idk if taking dmg is the right word but
proven ocean
they are being healed way more
wintry solar
I'd cry
vivid vessel
holy shmoke man !
crazy stufs
proven ocean
jona guy ur always replying to the same msg
and u never say anything else
nothing practical
nothing for us to learn about
vivid vessel
ye fuc kyou jona
inland acorn
this is the entire thing for PSF, just make sure to not run other dungeons and i...
How cloak is working on impale, that's bleed
shy pecan
yes thats me
wintry solar
How cloak is working on impale, that's bleed
You can dodge the initial attack, no?
?
mighty pivot
it doesn't work on impale that was me testing the checkbox
inland acorn
Makes sense, for a second I started doubting
mighty pivot
(cloak doesn't work)
hot island
i'm doing LFR to try the raid spec
but i feel like i get super unlucky
is it just pray for 4?
mighty pivot
this season rolls are way easier because of the tier set
devout smelt
i wish they made the tier set into a talent
tough salmon
still a rly hard pull btw zac
This pull is easy
devout smelt
having 5 rolls feels so good
tough salmon
The pull on the right side of church is illegal now
vivid vessel
you dont kite tho
back in the days tanks just kited
since the mobs are slowed when they enrage
you just perma run
desert tendon
tough salmon
No but i cant dodge the bleed anymore and they put a bleedboi
proven ocean
or play prot warrior and dont kite at all
tough salmon
In s2 i timed blackout kick with the beed
vivid vessel
why you talking about other tanks
vivid vessel
ye he wont
proven ocean
outlaw bozomaster
tough salmon
Its so boring tho....
proven ocean
1 trick
tough salmon
I used to be warr main
proven ocean
ye kira said its like super boring too
sharp shadow
I noticed KiR in keys.. some people use ghostly strike, some don't
is it just for better prio and boss dam
proven ocean
I noticed KiR in keys.. some people use ghostly strike, some don't
just use ghostly strikes dude
glass mortar
yes and 1 fth is harder to play
hardest variant of outlaw prob
but best profile for top keys
proven ocean
idk about that, same as s3 DF
hot island
any guides to the raid ST spec other than the wowhead rotation list?
vivid vessel
this is too much
glass mortar
the FaQ in here
tough salmon
Just subscribe to everyone? Duh
sudden fulcrum
twitch ads aren't the same as regular ads
proven ocean
Just subscribe to everyone? Duh
twitch turbo
sudden fulcrum
surely you know this if you are calling him stupid
sudden fulcrum
turbo is not an adblocker
tough salmon
I aint directly injecting money into twitch
sudden fulcrum
it is a hilarious business model to create annoying shit and have people pay you to remove it
vivid vessel
worse video player in the game
proven ocean
10$ is nothing
vivid vessel
and they havent improved it
vivid vessel
since 1984
hot island
is the KIR fatebound raid spec better than the HO version?
glass mortar
ho fatebound is our worst build yes
proven ocean
zac i want to make coffee but im lazy
glass mortar
kir fb is not better then trickster ho tho
proven ocean
mighty pivot
worse video player in the game
true and real. Imagine not having proper rewind in 2025 
hot island
kir fb is not better then trickster ho tho
so HO trickster is the recommended raid ST? or did i read that wrong
glass mortar
yes
hot island
alright i'll try that out then
tough salmon
zac i want to make coffee but im lazy
I thought you were on coffee rehab
proven ocean
ah, yea, i was trying to lower the amount of coffee i had before push week
now im a osrs gamer so i dont need all of that shit anymore
minmaxing irl 
sudden fulcrum
WHATCHA PUSHIN BUD
proven ocean
hmm
i hope they buff all other tanks instead of nerfing prot warr
i hate weak tanks
its so annoying to play with
like its not enjoyable ever
the keys are already heavily carried by tanks
wintry solar
I want them so weak, they can only tank one pack at a time
junior coral
New killing spree change looks dope, being able to use cloak and not hold for shit KS moments. Ptr it feeling pretty good? Live outlaw feeling buttery, DF3 vibes with a lil more to it… hope yall vibing on the ptr also and they didn’t dirty it up
shy pecan
pray that they make ks dispatch when the channel finishes
devout smelt
that would suck
mild vigil
I mean it would solve the issue of needing to use builders after KS for disorienting strikes
b/c you can't do that when KS itself builds you back up to max CP
mild vigil
if you dispatch at 7CP you will get back 1 to 2 CP, so if you have coup you can just press coup right there
but yeah it's not like a catch all solution
I like the idea though personally
devout smelt
it could also waste cdr on like rtb
daring oxide
@vivid vessel how are the changes to tier set?
reef forge
changes?
daring oxide
2p was changed
so that unseen blades has 30% chance to double strike
so you get more coups
coup > ks > coup
very much a reality
if both Unseen blades double hit
mild vigil
where was this?
daring oxide
in tier set notes
mild vigil
idk how I missed that in these blueposts
was it an unlisted change? only showing up in game?
mild vigil
yeah I see it now
keen belfry
sp lil bros
daring oxide
sp lil bros
sup big bro
mild vigil
sp lil bros
o/
yeah having double strikes on UB procs sounds really good compared to what it was before
actually trackable as well like the pin states
daring oxide
yeah
just a 25% chance to overcap
when we are on 3EB
ofc
but yeah
every other time is fine
i think Solo mentioned in the Pin but the main thing now is to ask for EB to stack to 8
so when we consume 4 stacks
mild vigil
just let us cache excess stacks like subtlety can for CP in shadowy blades
daring oxide
we aren't at any risk of consuming more
yeah
that'll be nice
means more coups and more cps
and will be helpful after this tier too
when we lose our tier sets and go back to original
mild vigil
yep, agreed
keen belfry
yeah we should be able to ss after our first coup IMO
daring oxide
KS still needs some improvements though, right now it makes no sense being so random with targets, and has huge implications of just hitting immune targets and other weird scenarios
but KS in 11.2 is much better than KS in the past
aside from the random target hitting...
reef forge
does the 5s window for second coup go away if you press builders in it?
mild vigil
do we still generate UB stacks while the 4pc is proc'd?
daring oxide
i haven't had a chance to test this week on PTR
if the stacks are consumed immediately
on the first coup
before we use the 2nd coup from the tier set
ideally 1st coup will consume EB stacks
so we can rebuild EB stacks before we hit 2nd free coup
gaunt phoenix
you cant generate EB between coups
reef forge
coup, ks into coup is going to feel great
hot island
how bad is 2 mil dps on dummy over 7min? 683 ilvl Single target
sharp hinge
do i get the charged crystal enchant from the first skittering breach delve i do?
hot island
do i get the charged crystal enchant from the first skittering breach delve i do...
at the end yes, it doesn't have to be overcharged
gaunt phoenix
how bad is 2 mil dps on dummy over 7min? 683 ilvl Single target
what is your target dummy sim?
sharp hinge
at the end yes, it doesn't have to be overcharged
i think its overcharged rn, i need the upgrade for belt too
hot island
i think its overcharged rn, i need the upgrade for belt too
that's a 2 for 1 then
hot island
what is your target dummy sim?
didn't know you could sim that i'll give it a go
sharp hinge
that's a 2 for 1 then
how many does it take for upgrade
vale warren
1
hot island
how many does it take for upgrade
691 to 694 took me 2 694 to 697 took me 1
hot island
i've heard others where the first one took 1 too
hot island
what is your target dummy sim?
2.2
gaunt phoenix
within 10% of your sim for 1 pull is fine
The sim is an average of like 50,000 pulls
open meadow
Can anyone explain why you want to hold vanish with ks having 20s left on cd? Is there a buff or something that steroids it?
sharp hinge
what do radiant echos do
sudden fulcrum
you can go to spots on the map and go into some spirit realm and kill enemies for valorstones and shit
it's mega boring though
glass mortar
Can anyone explain why you want to hold vanish with ks having 20s left on cd? Is...
so kspree doesnt come off cd mid vanish
and u dont waste a ton of cdr on it
open meadow
So is it just send killing spree on cd then?
open meadow
Yeah, the wont die is the big one 😄
shy pecan
ks also gives 2 stacks of ub which gives you increased finisher dmg
worldly shale
Damn, finishing extraordinaire
worldly shale
big
keen belfry
farming darkfuse rep rn
jolly geyser
one of the farms of time
queen kiln
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
Guy's - Afenar's Edit 
Luxthos Edit
Zac's Group 
Devlin
Utilities:
Combo Point Standalone
Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
Ace refund sound trigger
RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
Unseen Blade tracker
Fun:
Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
KS Ticking damage taken
keen belfry
one of the farms of time
idk if i have the willpower for this
keen belfry
i think i have to use it
i think id use this coat
forever
its actually bisi didnt know it was looked this good wtf
jolly geyser
hope you got other monitors
keen belfry
i do
keen belfry
i didnt know the potion gave more research
mighty pivot
i think id use this coat
did you not get the one from BFA TW?
novel timber
ive farmed like 700 not too bad
i split it up because that shit was so mind numbing, i did like 1000-1200 a day
keen belfry
did you not get the one from BFA TW?
i didnt know it existed 😦 i found it in appreances yesterday and was like bruh
mighty pivot
keen belfry
yes
random stirrup
Nice ui
mighty pivot
the red one looks gigagood for being free tw appearance
keen belfry
shjutupo
red zinc
aaaaaæeeeo u
keen belfry
ty
keen belfry
timmys swing is so bad
keen belfry
send swing
jolly geyser
swing of what
red zinc
golf
jolly geyser
oh
sharp hinge
yall have never heard of the felsteel longblade and it shows
jolly geyser
rockin ginn su sword with green mog atm
sharp hinge
inner meadow
is 91% uptime on adr in m+ bad,good, really good, normal?
sharp hinge
sharp hinge
yeah, i liked this tier set
red zinc
is 91% uptime on adr in m+ bad,good, really good, normal?
Good
theres an element of rng there
As long as you’re consistently above 90 its good
inner meadow
kk
keen belfry
@red zinc
red zinc
golf course in the middle of a town wadahell
keen belfry
welcome to big cities
red zinc
im ass regardless
i can swing fine I just choke
when im actually playing
36 handicap or smth lmao
keen belfry
im like a 13
red zinc
if i practiced more consistently i could get to like 25-30 for sure
but its like
2 rounds a month for the 3 months its actually nice weather
keen belfry
yeah to get to my handicap u kinda just need to play and learn how to swing a small amount
red zinc
and then i drop it for the rest of the year
and by rounds i mean par 3/4 courses
i got my lil car and a student discount now though
can just go to driving range after classes or smth
300 balls for 9 bucks kinda craay
gaunt phoenix
Is this starcraft
worldly shale
Might be dark fuse rep
shittiest experience of the season
and now i cant take the coat off
because reasons
jolly geyser
and now i cant take the coat off
what
just change mog every week or month
should cook up real slutmog someday
hybrid crown
I used a dinar on the sprocket jetpack on my poopy alt so I could do this mog. Also this black recolor from delves you can also buy with bloody tokens if you are missing a piece or two. Just do some WQ's with war mode on
vivid vessel
ye these swords are crazy good
hybrid crown
the world set is the real gem this season
I guess the rogue tier is okay, but the world set and the coat
jolly geyser
ye these swords are crazy good
first thing I bought
hybrid crown
also this belt is so close to working with this mog
jolly geyser
eeh
hybrid crown
itrs such a good belt to subtly add a pistol into the mog
mighty pivot
is it though
thorny zinc
if it was black and white it would look cool
hybrid crown
I think if I had the other colors I could make it fit better
its a cool ass belt
hybrid crown
yeah which is annoying
jolly geyser
idk
hybrid crown
because those are the zone set from this tier
jolly geyser
could ask in #transmog im just saying what my eye says,they prolly got feet that fit that
thorny zinc
I feel like u could use the gold and red if u get matching helmet and boots as well
but maybe im geekin
thorny zinc
yea
jolly geyser
weapons can change to whatever the fuck tbh if it fits,there is so much
worldly shale
just change mog every week or month
I just cant, ptsd from sitting there for hours kicks in whenever i change it
worldly shale
jolly geyser
real elite before boss
jolly geyser
sheath on back is +
worldly shale
anything that back sheathes is goated
tender wedge
oh damn what's that enchant effect that looks sick
sudden fulcrum
oh damn what's that enchant effect that looks sick
void edge
worldly shale
looks good
i used this color of hidden app until now tho, was blasting
worldly shale
oh damn what's that enchant effect that looks sick
unbreakable resolve
the color effect is from the weapon, enchant is the blackish thing
jolly geyser
i used this color of hidden app until now tho, was blasting
them legion boys,use them orange ones with panda challenge mode set
worldly shale
im a bit of a full set andy atm but need some good purple mogs
the trading post weapons are good af
also those swords, i farmed the pickpocketing version XD
that was boring af
the darker ones
tender wedge
yeah aberrus purp was good but the weapons didn't match well imo
my purp set is fine but like...a bit basic
jolly geyser
mf in star wars
tender wedge
does look good with the new TP weapons though
i like those shoulders, they're the ulduar ones with the tentacly bits that come out from them
jolly geyser
aye those are nice
limpid kiln
oh ya thats nice
jolly geyser
I like the nose&mouth covering heads(forgot the name)
sudden fulcrum
mask?
tender wedge
theres a boe green version called clefthoof hide mask that's the same model
hot olive
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
covert kestrel
Bdsm
tender wedge
they do say you should enjoy looking at the character you're playing
jolly geyser
before zac says anything, m+ gets boring after like 5 weeks. done stuff
ofc you can learn more
but eh running it all day like these high m+ players? mental illness
sudden fulcrum
calling something you don't like mental illness is mental illness
sudden fulcrum
you don't have to be worried about what other people like or do
mighty pivot
"it's worrying when people enjoy things I don't enjoy"
jolly geyser
I like doing m+,but it gets kinda repetitive
sudden fulcrum
mighty pivot
I like doing m+,but it gets kinda repetitive
and it's ok if you find it that way
jolly geyser
ofc
old gull
Why doesn’t bladeflurry work in old raids 😩
shy pecan
if you have a group its fun
but pugging just gets annoying especially if you only play for 2-3 hours a day
mighty pivot
Why doesn’t bladeflurry work in old raids 😩
it was either that or corpses soaking the hits
bright crane
The entire game is repetitive rofl
There’s only so much content you can do and is available
Same can be said of raiding, delves
Like what else is there
sudden fulcrum
i'm doin a lot of transmog/mount runs lately
i love that change where you can collect transmog of gear you can't equip
abstract frost
guys Between the eyes is pissing me off
if target dies Between the eyes doesnt auto target
is there a macro?
lone spear
yea
just put /startattack in front of it
can also be combined with a mouseover macro (which i reccommend)
abstract frost
#showtooltip
/startattack
/cast Between the Eyes
lone spear
yer
mighty pivot
I use the following to not have my button auto attack to break vanish
/targetenemy [noexists][noharm][dead]
/use <spell>
it picks the closest enemy if you have no target, or a friendly target, or a dead target
edgy crag
Yooo wanted to go outlaw next season, seems like fun but also seems like a lot to understand. From the outlaw mains on here, is it worth it?
neat mist
I mean, you're asking a channel full of Outlaw mains that question
so the answer is definitely gonna be no
sudden fulcrum
i think only you can make that decision
you should try it and see if it's fun for you
edgy crag
That’s fair, I more or so wanted to see the perspective of the already outlaw mains.
I played sin rogue and havoc DH this season.
I played outlaw back in SL and in DF but I saw that they’re changing killing spree and that makes me excited
tight kernel
So FB is looking like the ST raid build
KIR over HO for m+ with potentially FB being equal or better depending on the damage profile we want to bring to key..
Did I read pins correctly
dim widget
So FB is looking like the ST raid build
KIR over HO for m+ with potentially FB b...
for like rn or are you assuming for s3?
quaint mauve
I like doing m+,but it gets kinda repetitive
people like pushing themselves to do better and better
shy pecan
there will be shitloads of tuning until season 3 actually starts
see recent trickster 2 piece change
tight kernel
for like rn or are you assuming for s3?
s3
nimble sage
Is the wowhead and icyveins guide equally good?
frail veldt
Is the wowhead and icyveins guide equally good?
wowhead is written by one of the mods here, not sure who maintains the icyveins
So cant say much for the icyveins but wowhead guide is pretty accurate since it sources a lot of its info from the disc
mighty pivot
they must be making major changes to make the fights better for outlaw
eager rose
there should be an aura like that to demarcate bf's reach
median lance
I had a dream about a gunblade
tight kernel
What trinkets are yall using on ptr
median lance
1 button rotation
gaunt phoenix
So FB is looking like the ST raid build
KIR over HO for m+ with potentially FB b...
yeah pretty much
Trickster will prolly still be used with current tuning
in keys
just funny Fatebound is so close by virtue of the ST damage disparity
vivid vessel
you know
now that i have seen
how big trickster tier is
for sub
i think trickster is doomed for outlaw
once again proving hero talents where a mistake and we should just have gotten one tree per spec 
lone spear
i think its a balance thing rather than it being a doomed system
granted we will always pick whatever is even 1% better
but they just dont even try balancing them enough
vivid vessel
trickster tier set is 30% for sub
10% for outlaw
so good luck balancing that thing
lone spear
if ur talking about ptr balance
vivid vessel
gonna be quite hard
lone spear
then idk what to tell u
lone spear
ur saying the trickster tier set for sub is giga strong
but they can just tune them individually
the numbers dont have to be the exact same
vivid vessel
ye well its quite hard to tune these things individually
actually
they havent done it a single time
lone spear
thats what im saying
vivid vessel
for any hero talent
gaunt phoenix
might be hard cause the concept of double coup itself is strong for sub
proven ocean
@hollow temple got to 90 magic lets fucking goooooooooooo
vivid vessel
- its just by design its strong
there isnt any numbers attached
and we are talking
big number here
30% vs 10
They don't need a tuning knob they need to find the codes to the nuclear weapons
proven ocean
guys
hollow temple
<@629463378250956810> got to 90 magic lets fucking goooooooooooo
Nice man. You’ll lvl it pretty passively as u do slayer so idk if I’d go all out on it btw
lone spear
i dont think the tiers need to be tuned to be similar per spec though
proven ocean
anyone wants a 1 month xbox pass code
vivid vessel
And the only guy that knew the codes was the intern that got fired with them
vivid vessel
i dont think the tiers need to be tuned to be similar per spec though
Except they do
Every tier
proven ocean
dont msg me you all motherstrangers
vivid vessel
They certainly won't let sub have a 30% tier set
So they currently need to nerf trickster set for sub while buffing it for outlaw
Let me tell you
That might be hard
Even for the greatest minds at blizzard
proven ocean
Nice man. You’ll lvl it pretty passively as u do slayer so idk if I’d go all out...
nah i'll stop at 94 and then do slayer, i understand but im watching squid game
so im just spamming 1 button
nothing else really
vivid vessel
And they are certainly very good at their job
proven ocean
so im just spamming 1 button
and watching 2nd screen
hollow temple
so im just spamming 1 button
Ez
lone spear
They certainly won't let sub have a 30% tier set
i dont think they will, and im not that into sub so idk if they can fix it or if its inherently doomed
lime lake
.
lone spear
but to say hero talents as a whole are bad is a bit much from just this
i think theyre great for some, boring for others
like a lot of things in this game
vivid vessel
As far as I know they haven't really done that ever yet
All the talents are 1:1 aren't they
lone spear
theres some precedent
lone spear
its not elegant, but it would work
lime lake
but for rogue good luck
vivid vessel
I hope you are right
lime lake
lmao
vivid vessel
Because this hasn't happened for rogue yet
And they have some work to do
If they wanna have this shit works
vivid vessel
And considering how much work they have put into rogue
This expac
Ye
I'm not hopeful
I'm tomelvis
craggy barn
tomelvis?? not the fabled tomeplvis???
loud hazel
gn boiz
wadayathinkabout removing enduring brawler and getting a pistol slot for extra stamina and to switch BtE effects (+20%Crit/4s ranged stun/stacking +5% Armor penetration per pistol shot/2s silence).
craggy barn
the pvp talent?
so remove a pvp talent for a new equipment slot
getting the BTE stun back AND a silence?
loud hazel
so remove a pvp talent for a new equipment slot
getting the BTE stun back AND a ...
my bad, combat stamina*
enduring brawler was removed
i keep mistaking both talents as they have the same icon
loud hazel
so remove a pvp talent for a new equipment slot
getting the BTE stun back AND a ...
only one effect
based on your pistol weapon slot, switch 20% crit to stun or silence
craggy barn
- too unnessarily complex
- i dont want to have to hunt for another BIS item slot
could just be a talent choice
loud hazel
loud hazel
1) too unnessarily complex
2) i dont want to have to hunt for another BIS item s...
- just one effect, not toggeable
if that's what ur thinking bc i also think it would be too messy
loud hazel
or need an aura to track it, just one fixed effect to switch out of combat
craggy barn
replace poisons with bullets
edgy phoenix
replace pistol shot with grenade launcher
loud hazel
grim spear
they've done it a lot with hunter
the same hero talent has completely different values for two specs ruins all the flavor. Sad.
mighty pivot
they already have different values per spec for DS tier. They can do the same for trickster
grim spear
loud hazel
grim spear
The entire hero talent system just feels so bad.
These shared elements between specs feel even less cohesive than covenants did.
cinder relic
I love hero talents
loud hazel
just feels bad
it doesn't fits for outlol
loud hazel
an outlol is an outlol (fking gunslinger cowboy)
i imagine a damn cowboy fking everyone with bullets
and heavier bullets over his heavy bullets
why tf his hero talents try to turn him into a pirate
mighty pivot
they concept of hero talents is ok, the implementation for the rogue trees is a mess though. Only trickster is somewhat ok design
and I dunno how they expect hero tree tier sets to be balanced when specs use hero talents differently
cinder relic
They generally are balanced tho
lone spear
they concept of hero talents is ok, the implementation for the rogue trees is a ...
thats what im sayin, i think the theme was off (for trickster and FB) AND the gameplay was eh
cinder relic
Not perfect, far from it, but it's fairly close generally speaking
lone spear
but like look at mage
they have 3 sick hero talents
the system can work, i just hope the iterate on it in midnight
mighty pivot
They generally are balanced tho
for rogues or in general?
cinder relic
I like FB, just needed more visuals. I think the new tier set helps it a lot tbqh
cinder relic
for rogues or in general?
For rogue, and a lot of classes
lone spear
yea new FB tier makes the spec play smoother, not quite different, but still sumtin
mighty pivot
aren't FB and Trickster sets giving wildly different % for their associated 2 specs?
lone spear
but the overalls are similar enough for there to be choice
lone spear
actually nvm
cinder relic
Largeish
lone spear
i was reading wrong numbers xdd
mighty pivot
yeah of course they can rebalance, but my point is that the difficult is that if you have the same bonus for the hero tree, the bonus benefits each spec in a different way even if the hero talent boost is identical. And that makes it difficult to balance properly
cinder relic
Ppl said that about the new talent tree generally speaking and look at ho and kir for the past 2 expansions
¯_(ツ)_/¯
mighty pivot
if they need to have say different values in all 3 sets for each spec they touch, then it doesn't feel particularly different than spec specific sets
lone spear
i think its worth trying, because if it works then it makes the 2 hero talents feel even better
mighty pivot
it is a cool idea
and maybe that's a good timing for them to experiment before midnight
lone spear
agreege
mighty pivot
¯_(ツ)_/¯ is a classic though
lone spear
uses a jp character therefore weeb therefore L
mighty pivot
70% of the users here are either weebs or closet weebs anyway
lone spear
cmon man dont give away my ragebait
gaunt phoenix
lone spear
Wrong this guy is iconic and better than a low res frog
you're wrong and a dummy
^this one is better
high res frog
covert kestrel
you're wrong and a dummy
Nah I love peepo but saying anything is better than the og is wild
¯_(ツ)_/¯
mighty pivot
cmon man dont give away my ragebait
covert kestrel
His face is so triangular
mighty pivot
rude
grim spear
IMO, ideally, hero talents would create some overlap by emphasizing the common ground between specs
grim spear
But right now, they're just further dividing them
covert kestrel
Stop discussing the spec please, we're here to discuss shrug emojis
grim spear
each hero tree becomes a new branch, and we might end up with what feels like six specs instead of 3
cinder relic
Sub has blade flurry what does that even mean
grim spear
I don't really understand what the designers think the end goal is supposed to be.
cinder relic
What
mighty pivot
lone spear
if anything i think the rogue profiles are becoming too similar. remove caustic splatter
grim spear
wintry solar
The other is archaic and outdated
lime lake
ur mom is archaic and outdated
wintry solar
On the same level as hieroglyphs
mighty pivot
it's not ideal if they have to make hero talents which are completely different for each spec but I don't see how they can completely avoid it. On the other hand there are some very problematic concepts with the rogue hero trees by trying to keep them similar (see deathstalker mark application mess)
wintry solar
it's not ideal if they have to make hero talents which are completely different for each spec but I don't see how they can completely avoid it. On the other hand there are some very problematic concepts with the rogue hero trees by trying to keep them similar (see deathstalker mark application mess)
mighty pivot
ty for spreading my word kind man
wintry solar
I'll go post it in the dk discord
mighty pivot
or should I say 👍 🏄♂️ 🏄♀️
mighty pivot
I'll go post it in the dk discord
make sure to accompany it with a unique hashtag
mighty pivot
mighty pivot
I'll be keeping an eye on you 
tread carefully
mighty pivot
that poor cat
mighty pivot
i bet it can afford pumas 
gaunt phoenix
