But HO is clearly better on non cordinated 10ish keys right?
#outlaw
chrome pollen
red zinc
I dont get where that coordination thing comes from
you really dont need any kind of routing to make kir work outside of the tank not waiting a full minute between pulls
And if they do that you might as well leave
wary bridge
Deserter debuff incoming🥸
rigid basin
Not if we afk at the zone in
Shit is gonna be so toxic
Both ways
"I won't vote so you can't leave" "you won't vote to leave so I'm gonna ask here"
agile orchid
outlaw thrives in uncoordinated groups
no matter what build you play
HO is just easier to play while KiR gives you more aoe damage
rigid basin
Outlaw doesn't give a shit about route or lust timings or CDs, you just gun your way thru dungeons
wary bridge
what's the radius on BF?
like where should i position myself for optimal dmg
twilit rivet
in melee range
prisma vapor
QQ: what do we do on start of the dungeon, previous expansions we would use RTB and AR - What do we do now these days?
rigid basin
!prekey
ornate heathBOT
Pre-key fuckery
RTB as you enter the dungeon to get 2 Supercharger stacks.- DO NOT RTB again inside the bubble as you will lose the supercharger stacks, similarly do not
AR early inside the bubble or you will lose the combo points. - After the bubble drops use RTB again (now at 4 stacks of Supercharger).
- Before entering the first pack
BF into 
Stealth. - Open on pack with AR into
BtE.
rigid basin
I coulda swore the cleave range on bf was further than melee (main target regular range tho) but I might be smoking crack
normal forge
honest sparrow
I coulda swore the cleave range on bf was further than melee (main target regula...
Nah i think your right. If i remember correctly after we lost acro 
they buffed bf in a patch soon after to work at the same range like it was with acro
mighty pivot
it is 8y yes
rigid basin
Now if they would just give us acro back xd
proper veldt
its also slightly smaller for some races like dwarf due to height
minimal tho but funny
rigid basin
That's so blizzard coded lmfao
haughty moat
its also slightly smaller for some races like dwarf due to height
srsly? im cooked as gnome? -.-
proper veldt
srsly? im cooked as gnome? -.-
idk I only tested dwarf vs undead
but its a pretty small difference dont think it matters
proper veldt
jumping increases the range too btw you can test it on dummies
rigid basin
Tauren best aoe race confirmed???
wary bridge
so size matters
rigid basin
wary bridge
edgy phoenix
mythic capo
civic void
capo + whatever trinket you are missing/want to play
civic zephyr
yeahh i see theres a lot of trinket options i guess, seaforium, house of cards / magnet, geargrinders
civic void
they are all close and come with their quirks so up to you/sim it tbh
civic zephyr
rocky pewter
im in the same boat with chips, looking at trinkets and have hero hosue of cards and its suggesting to take Mister lock n stalk as it gives best upgrade
but already at 18% haste
rigid basin
Jastor sims that much of an upgrade? What are your current rings? O_o
rigid basin
Hm
civic zephyr
i dont have a lot of gear on this rogue so sims might look weird
rigid basin
Yeah
Cuz jastors is like all mastery
Which isn't a bad aoe stat but it's typically lower prio
Like I've got less mastery total than that ring has alone
civic zephyr
yeah, idk, i did droptimizer, puzzle chips. Might be the only purchasable ring w/ puzzle chips, and idk if i have a lot of haste right now, so maybe the gems w/ haste are simming it higher? dont see a lot of people running mister lock-n-stalk on rio, is there any reason why it sims high?
- cicrlet ring only gives me vers, no haste
think i watched a video saying i wanted like 19% haste or something
civic zephyr
dwarf
red zinc
I cant see what gems are in your cyrce’s but
im sure theres a lot of rings better than jastors
civic zephyr
civic zephyr
right
stuck sparrow
skipper fell off didnt it
and yeah it kinda looked like human in the pic idk
bloodfang f tier
civic zephyr
my sin rogue is maghar orc
stuck sparrow
why would you need 2 rogues
civic void
Will you even get a mythic boost to get the trinkets though ? Kinda pointless to wonder about jastor or raid trinket if they are out of the equation
hybrid crown
That's the anniversary bloodfang it's kinda sick
civic zephyr
Will you even get a mythic boost to get the trinkets though ? Kinda pointless to...
i already got the boost
thats why im wearing mythic capos
stuck sparrow
That's the anniversary bloodfang it's kinda sick
just use t3
hollow temple
some BrewMonks are actually r.....
civic void
I guess I would go for capo junkmaster + a dungeon trinket if I had the choice then
mighty pivot
changing the gems in your cyrce's should sim better btw. You only keep the overseer one and switch the other ones to stats
rigid basin
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/mEALTQ5Bjmug48VadksNGY
Armory says your running 12% haste if that's so you want even more haste for KiR like 18-20%
civic zephyr
I guess I would go for capo junkmaster + a dungeon trinket if I had the choice t...
probably junkmasters / seaforium? looks like thats the combo people are taking if not house of cards / magnet
rigid basin
That's a solid combo
civic void
That's fine ye, would probably be either seaforium or wax whistle
hybrid crown
even with haste flask your haste will be too low
rigid basin
I like whistle but I also like scaring my group
civic zephyr
Armory says your running 12% haste if that's so you want even more haste for Ki...
ok cool, so the lack of haste is messing with the sim for sure then lol
hybrid crown
oh you also dont have 4 set
you should run loaded dice instead of sleight of hand, and2 points of vigor and lethality instead of the supercharger stuff
or go get your 4 set
civic zephyr
yea, going to run dungeons, get some gilded / crafted / and catalyst
i appreciate the help guys, thank you
civic zephyr
yeah this guys is 2 days old lol, havent had the time to really get everything set up yet
rigid basin
All good
torpid fiber
jumping increases the range too btw you can test it on dummies
???? How the fuck does this happen
civic zephyr
my main is a sin rogue - just wanted a seperated character to try outlaw
hybrid crown
congrats on your new outlaw main
rigid basin
Def run the pre 4pc builds on ho for now, like Eric mentioned in the FAQ there builds for both m+ and st
I'd suggest trying to get the ring from DFC
Heavy haste verse. If you wanna go for kir
civic zephyr
congrats on your new outlaw main
lmao
civic zephyr
Def run the pre 4pc builds on ho for now, like Eric mentioned in the FAQ there b...
okay cool, is the haste for faster gcds?
hybrid crown
ADR reduces your GCD with a cap of 25% haste
depending on talents you want haste to meet that
if you run vigor and take em by surprise you need less
KIR builds call for like 20 and HO builds a bit less
there is a pre 4 set HO build which doesn't mind a bit less haste like youu have
civic zephyr
ok, good to know that the gameplay will FEEL nicer to play once i build right
proper veldt
???? How the fuck does this happen
Yeah I mean elevation is weird in wow
You also sometimes can’t flurry on staircases
Or get hit by abilities
hybrid crown
these amounts of haste called out, you will want to make sure you have that much haste when out of stealth and not buffed by the mentioned talents
torpid fiber
I just don't understand how they're calculating distance lines such that jumping would increase radius instead of decreasing it
Feet to centre I guess?
proper veldt
I just don't understand how they're calculating distance lines such that jumping...
Yeah in older games it’s raycast from feet
vale warren
i know whirlwind and bladestorm are the saem
vale warren
Yeah in older games it’s raycast from feet
ah that makes sense
actually then why would gnomes have less range
torpid fiber
Yeah in older games it’s raycast from feet
Yeah that makes sense (it's the source of grappling hook breaking as well) I'm just kinda confused why it's a different spot for us vs enemies
oh I see
torpid fiber
No it's gotta be centre to centre
So if you're shorter than the enemy jumping increases range and decreases if taller
Only way it makes sense
proper veldt
Yeah that makes sense
edgy phoenix
we all migrating to entropy dh discord
rocky pewter
Kind of stuck on what i should spend my cartel chips, looking at trinkets and have hero hosue of cards atm i did a sim and its suggesting to take Mister lock n stalk or junkyard magnet but not sure which one would a better option. Have 18% haste
covert kestrel
Kind of stuck on what i should spend my cartel chips, looking at trinkets and ha...
magnet is good but most trinkets are within 0.2% of each other
dinars kinda bad for law
edgy phoenix
doesnt really matter dont stress over it
rocky pewter
magnet is good but most trinkets are within 0.2% of each other
What abt stat value
covert kestrel
What abt stat value
wdym
hybrid crown
trinkets with damage procs are unusually good for outlaw because of our secondary stats, and the BTE crit buff also affecting trinkets
unkempt dew
Pfff I love this. POW POW POW!!
haughty galleon
is there a channel where i can put a video of me doing a key for guidance/tips?
dapper field
anyone seen the killing spree change?
sudden fulcrum
is there a channel where i can put a video of me doing a key for guidance/tips?
i think a log would be more helpful, but it's up to you
covert kestrel
is there a channel where i can put a video of me doing a key for guidance/tips?
hit up !log and put the vid in with the log
fiery viper
'ello friends. I've seen some outlaw gameplay here and there and it looks relatively fast. For someone playing with a base ping of ~130ms, would you say this spec is manageable? How much of reacting to procs and reactionary stuff overall is there?
haughty galleon
!log
gaunt phoenix
Not sure. They need to push the data to a server for it to be simmed
Charged bolts may be deadge. Charged crystal doesnt seem to work sometimes
Idk it's all kinda fucked. Zac was saying he might go back to normal belt
proper bear
ty
haughty galleon
OH didnt log it only captured it. dont even know how you log nowadays
sudden fulcrum
'ello friends. I've seen some outlaw gameplay here and there and it looks relati...
i think you can get used to latency, but it's certainly not ideal. i used to play with someone from England on NA and she got CE with ~200ms
fiery viper
ty
fossil lintel
'ello friends. I've seen some outlaw gameplay here and there and it looks relati...
I play with 150ms usually. It is playable, the biggest problem is queueing the same ability a second time because your spell queue needs to be large in relation to the GCD. But as long as you get into a rhythm it works just fine.
grand shoal
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
Guy's - Afenar's Edit 
Luxthos Edit
Zac's Group 
Devlin
Utilities:
Combo Point Standalone
Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
Unseen Blade tracker
Fun:
Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
KS Ticking damage taken
vivid vessel
ai greatest creation is cats dancing
why is one boss optional in the new raid
we just skip it then ?
its stupid no ?
regal saffron
How many?
vivid vessel
one
regal saffron
How many in total
vivid vessel
7 + 1
regal saffron
Weirdge
jolly geyser
skipping bosses? pussy strat
rigid basin
Yo @proven ocean did you find any vendors for rogue weps on ptr, only vendors selling agi swords/dagger etc I could find were the pvp ones
jolly geyser
ye,when was a boss skipable,been awhile
vivid vessel
idk never ?
haughty galleon
!log
cinder relic
we just skip it then ?
Well it drops gear
rigid basin
its dh only summonable supposedly too
It's how they unlock the new spec
cinder relic
The boss has good loot on it too IIRC
vivid vessel
that you wonrt drop
proven ocean
thats so weird ?
Sounds like ra-den 2.0 from wod
cinder relic
Bro ppl do splits for days
Depends how hard the boss is
If it's a 30 pull boss or smthing, u probs just do it
cinder relic
If it's a 250 pull boss u probs don't
proven ocean
cinder relic
It depends how hard the boss is
On whether u want to do it for the extra loot or not
Even if u don't drop the gg omega turbo bis awakened mirror loot it's still gonna be 4 extra mythic ilvl pieces
cinder relic
It might be worth skipping, it might be worth progging. It could be cool idk
rigid basin
Oh yeah the 50% more flashban- I mean proc
Cloak proc is so bright lol
I could see them clearing on heroic for the boots and skipping myth depending on fight difficulty
I assume hero boots give same proc chance increase
valid kindle
does any vendor on the ptr give you cloak or gotta actually do the quests?
rigid basin
Quests
valid kindle
smh
rigid basin
You get it early but you don't unlock the proc until you get the quest to talk to guy in the middle island
Questline isn't that slow
It only goes up to ch 4
It also unlocks phase diving/ fast travel if you care at in the slightest about that
vivid vessel
Ok but
vapid sundial
i would rather have a skippable boss than another nyalotha 12 bosses
vapid sundial
I swear there has been
other optional bosses
in raids before
I swear there is a raid in mists
also nightbane
echo tide
It depends how hard the boss is
I think everyone who cares about their guild rank will just get the boots on heroic and go back to that demon hunter boss after finishing the tier
rigid basin
The question is, is RWF a race to kill last boss or race to clear the raid
rigid basin
I think everyone who cares about their guild rank will just get the boots on her...
This is what I was thinking
echo tide
Even if the last boss is giga damage check and dh boss is easy it’s probably not worth
rigid basin
Like unless the boss is just patchwerk 3 target lol
echo tide
Unless you get additional mythic vault slot maybe
naive river
anyone have sims of the changes for the disc belt?
haughty galleon
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
naive river
i looked through the pins i might be dumb lol but i was only seeing sims from a bit ago
cinder relic
I think everyone who cares about their guild rank will just get the boots on her...
Again it kinda depends on how hard the boss is, and how good the loot is
gaunt phoenix
i looked through the pins i might be dumb lol but i was only seeing sims from a ...
it's not until reset, i'd rather wait to see what they actually push to the servers before sims
cinder relic
It's first tuning pass, maybe the boots scale on mythic, maybe it's a 10 pull boss, maybe it's a 250 pull boss, maybe you need to kill the boss for world ranks, make it drops tier, maybe the trinkets are op
naive river
it's not until reset, i'd rather wait to see what they actually push to the serv...
gotchya.
gaunt phoenix
lately they say one thing and the actual hotfix is different
naive river
thanks for the answer
cinder relic
If it's a 10 pull boss, and a raid tier lasts 3-4 weeks, adding it into both prog and reclear is a no-brainer
rigid basin
Make it so not doing the optional boss puts last boss on hard mode 
cinder relic
It's 4 extra pieces of mythic loot
old gull
does bran get more xp at 11 vs an 8
rigid basin
I shouldn't have played ptr, going back to current KS makes me disappointed haha
sweet iron
Will there be another pin about the delve belt?
prisma vessel
so i tested the single button thingy on ptr, and it dosen't use the new KS.... like at all xD
gaunt phoenix
yes on reset when it actually happens 😄
fossil lintel
Not even the one button wants to sit for 5 sec on new ks
prisma vessel
nope
prisma vessel
is it bad i prefer fatebound in all content? just to avoid KS... Live, not PTR
rigid basin
Once it's been adjusted it's gonna a banger season fs
sweet iron
yes on reset when it actually happens 😄
my bad, did a key and it was already doing awful damage so i thought it was nerfed 🥲
rigid basin
If Trick wasn't 10+% ahead in aoe xd
prisma vessel
If Trick wasn't 10+% ahead in aoe xd
yeah :((((
ember goblet
I feel the belt is sooo up and down like one time it’s putting in work other times I’m like did it actually proc?😂
rigid basin
They are gonna have to buff it again or we just forget about it prolly lmaooo especially going into .2
fossil lintel
No no but the blue post said it's still good for specs that like damage procs. Blizz would never overnerf or overbuff something
fossil lintel
Actually I don't mind forgetting it, then we don't need to do the delves every week to upgrade it
opal sonnet
!prekey
ornate heathBOT
Pre-key fuckery
- RTB as you enter the dungeon to get 2 Supercharger stacks.
- DO NOT RTB again inside the bubble as you will lose the supercharger stacks, similarly do not AR early inside the bubble or you will lose the combo points.
- After the bubble drops use RTB again (now at 4 stacks of Supercharger).
- Before entering the first pack BF into Stealth.
- Open on pack with AR into BtE.
rigid basin
My battle cords got leech on it anyways 
I kinda prefer wearing it lol
winter nacelle
what belt thing do we use now since charged bolts got nerfed?
winter nacelle
oh
daring oxide
we might not use it at all
After the nerfs?
gaunt phoenix
yea
fiery viper
I play with 150ms usually. It is playable, the biggest problem is queueing the s...
very helpful, thank you
random stirrup
It's not nerfed yet
Can’t you use the overrides?
rigid basin
covert kestrel
we might not use it at all
i did 3 delves for NOTHING?!?!?!?!?
rigid basin
I will never get those 15 minutes back 
gaunt phoenix
Can’t you use the overrides?
yea but it might not be what they actually ship to the servers
rigid basin
Idk I think it would be fun to have another instance of us going back and forth about how much the belt does
vivid vessel
Ye but nothing else is good
stone mica
cancelaura line in stealth
proven ocean
making a belt is the biggest mistake
stone mica
bang
vivid vessel
They should have just fixed it to target your target
proven ocean
useless cancelaura
vivid vessel
Idk why they didn't
proven ocean
btw
vivid vessel
Again
proven ocean
u know the blind meld thing
in cinderbrew
that i do
belt can atk it
and kill u
vivid vessel
I don't
proven ocean
well
if u blind a mob
and ur close to it
ur belt can randomly proc and hit it
and u die
rigid basin
Kek
vivid vessel
Yes cause you are In combat with the mob
gaunt phoenix
with the overrides, charged bolts is dead
rigid basin
gaunt phoenix
charged crystal is technically a 1-1.5% gain but not sure about the bug where it doesnt seem to work half the time
vivid vessel
with the overrides, charged bolts is dead
It was already dead
gaunt phoenix
sure
vivid vessel
I played a priory and a top with it
Let alone this is random so the damage is useless
It just trolls the whole key
Weird
Who was even using that
Everyone I know uses stats things
mighty pivot
in before they buff it by 75% next week
plucky chasm
Hello guys. New Wow player here (Started last season of Dragonflight) had to learn first of all the Basics in WoW. Now in S3 i will be back with my new setup in our new flat and i wanna start, learn & Main rogue❤️ Wanna go for Outlaw, any advice for me ?
mighty pivot
#outlaw-faq covers all the basic (and advanced) information on how to play the spec. The wowhead guide is also very good
honest sparrow
Would focus on the basic rotation and then just play it till you get a feeling for it. If you like it then you can go further into the finer details of the spec
rigid basin
Will take a bit getting used to, def worth spending some time at a dummy while you learn
keen belfry
gonna tape a nap, brb
was up late saw 28 years later late last night
what a weird movie
coral onyx
ornate heathBOT
Pre-key fuckery
- RTB as you enter the dungeon to get 2 Supercharger stacks.
- DO NOT RTB again inside the bubble as you will lose the supercharger stacks, similarly do not AR early inside the bubble or you will lose the combo points.
- After the bubble drops use RTB again (now at 4 stacks of Supercharger).
- Before entering the first pack BF into Stealth.
- Open on pack with AR into BtE.
carmine geode
Is it bugged or Charged crystal doesnt show on details?
gaunt phoenix
Is it bugged or Charged crystal doesnt show on details?
sometimes it shows in logs but not details
sometimes it doesnt work at all
carmine geode
lol meme blizzard
small rune
just returned to outlaw rogue, is this killingspree spell a joke? there are so many puddle instant death spells and i dont see how it is viable. am i using it wrong?
small rune
ok, but am i using it wrong or can you somehow prevent this random tp?
rigid basin
It's a big ass learning curve to figure out when it's safe
If you don't think it will be you can cloak/ks
cinder relic
There not that many puddles of instant death but yeah there are a lot of dumb moments u have to learn while using it
Getting reworked next patch! We won!
gaunt phoenix
ks is massive pain point and is getting changed in 11.2
rigid basin
I'm so glad 😭
gaunt phoenix
however people do play it in 20s
you just get a feel of when to use it or send it at low cp
rigid basin
Nearly all my deaths can be attributed to KS in some way haha
small rune
i understand that i return to the point of casting but with that many jumps that kill my camera, i lose control of where i was and if a spell is getting cast on that place while im in it and i spawn back into it
Motherload was a nightmare
rigid basin
It's a timer thing mostly, you will most always be facing the same direction you started to focusing on that might help
Never send KS during drills
Unless you got cloak lol
gaunt phoenix
you get a feel for how long it lasts, and be aware if it's supercharged then it is 2s longer
rigid basin
Forgetting you supercharged it is a funny way to die
cinder relic
It's a skill issue but it's a dumb skill to have to learn and it's why it's being changed for next season
thin snow
down with current ks
vivid vessel
you just get a feel of when to use it or send it at low cp
Tbf, everytime I do keys my only deaths are from ks
You never get used to it
gaunt phoenix
sure
vivid vessel
Im so hyped for next patch ngl
I always love new stuffs
But this time it's different
I'm glad they aren't reworking outlaw
All I have been wishing for is to finally be able to play current outlaw iterations
Without the bugs and ks
And it's finally there !
Holy shmoly
Next season will be an insane outlaw season no cap
gaunt phoenix
vivid vessel
It better be meta or imma be mad 
rigid basin
Im so hyped for next patch ngl
Fuckin same
vivid vessel
Meta in raid and m+ I won't accept any less
fossil lintel
Outlaw meta lul
vivid vessel
Im fine if it's meta as it is now
Like not meta
But very much meta
You know what I mean
fossil lintel
The last time outlaw was meta we got the target cap
cinder relic
Outlaw wasn't just meta
rigid basin
We need triple outlaw meta again /jk
cinder relic
It was a 3 of in almost every single group
It's part of the reason MDI has a spec limit
rigid basin
Those were the days
small rune
The last time outlaw was meta we got the target cap
dragonflight season 2 or 3 i think. i peaked there
vivid vessel
The last time outlaw was meta we got the target cap
That's not true
Look marvin
I consider outlaw meta rn
And meta in s3
It wasn't bis fotm group spec
But like
I don't feel bad playing outlaw at all
That's what I want
Best spot to be in imo
steel oxide
Outlaw was #6 for meta classes on murlokio for weeks
It swapped places with assa this week
fossil lintel
It was a 3 of in almost every single group
wooden herald
Charged bolt still BIS on belt?
vivid vessel
Outlaw was #6 for meta classes on murlokio for weeks
That's more than enough
steel oxide
100%
vivid vessel
I think outlaw is well within top 5 DPS rn
And I'm very glad I can play it without feeling bad about it
Which is not very often
We can
fossil lintel
I wish we could be good in the raid
amber dew
As a long time healer, playing rogue as a dps in quite some time, would you say Assa is easier then Outlaw? I kinda like the Outlaw style, but guides seem to puush for Assa for starting
vivid vessel
https://open.spotify.com/track/2PaktlQ4uhWfR0Cuk0qRtN?si=864e4ba2a83f4758
It's jul
He is like
fossil lintel
But I also really like the flat damage profile
vivid vessel
Super famous french singer
A bit memey maybe
It's not really considered good music by most
But it's very appreciated
rigid basin
I wish we could be good in the raid
Idk I don't think we're bad in raid at all
vivid vessel
Very popular
edgy phoenix
Ye usual trap hate
fossil lintel
As a long time healer, playing rogue as a dps in quite some time, would you say ...
Assa you can play optimally and have time to make coffee while playinf
edgy phoenix
I really like the song
fossil lintel
Idk I don't think we're bad in raid at all
We're not good, flat damage profile is usually pretty bad in raids
wooden herald
Assa you can play optimally and have time to make coffee while playinf
This is what I feel. I always tell people 'If I play sin.. that's fine.. but I'm watching netflix while I do it.'
fossil lintel
Also we get super fucked by forced downtime which is a lot more common in raids
crude anchor
As a long time healer, playing rogue as a dps in quite some time, would you say ...
Very easy comparably
I sometimes alt tab during raid to play balatro hands, its p casual
rigid basin
We're not good, flat damage profile is usually pretty bad in raids
I suppose but I'm typically in the top 5/6 of the meters by the end which I consider not bad 
fossil lintel
It's okay for farm but not even Zac plays it in prog
amber dew
Outlaw feels like vanilla rogue 20 years ago
rigid basin
It's okay for farm but not even Zac plays it in prog
We play 2 outlaws :p
fossil lintel
For prog?
rigid basin
Ye
edgy phoenix
It's okay for farm but not even Zac plays it in prog
yes we play assa prog so they dont nerf outlaw week 1
fossil lintel
Sheesh get me in there coach
edgy phoenix
heroic week tuning 
fossil lintel
Let's get a full outlaw raid going
rigid basin
Moar gun rogue
small rune
heavy aoe dmg incoming, no one takes damage due to cloak
wooden herald
Sorry -- I didn't receive an answer and want to know if it's still true.. Charged Bolt for belt still BIS for ST/and AoE yeah?
vivid vessel
I think the biggest raid liability of outlaw rn is legit just crafted weapons
Since you can't craft a sword
fossil lintel
Sorry -- I didn't receive an answer and want to know if it's still true.. Charge...
For this week yeah, next week it's getting gutted
edgy phoenix
Wait from which boss does 1h drop?
vivid vessel
If I could have a weapon
fossil lintel
Why can't you craft a sword?
vivid vessel
Why can't you craft a sword?
How do I play other specs then
fossil lintel
If you're progging outlaw, don't?
edgy phoenix
I think he wants to play best spec for fights cuz its progress
wooden herald
@fossil lintel Roger. Thanks.
edgy phoenix
And his guild is like serious no
vivid vessel
If you're progging outlaw, don't?
You can't exclusively do that tho
In saying if I could play outlaw with a dagger there is plenty of bosses I would play it on prog
fossil lintel
Yeah cause outlaw doesn't bring much for prog
vivid vessel
But that's not possible so
fossil lintel
We can't have CDs to help burn and we get fucked by forced downtime
vivid vessel
Outlaw by default is worse
random stirrup
Im so hyped for next patch ngl
ye next patch looking insanely good
rigid basin
Yeah cause outlaw doesn't bring much for prog
Wdym we bring KS to sprocket
vivid vessel
Crafting a sword would be crazy
random stirrup
Cuz in adv guide 3rd boss drops 1h
even then you would have to spend extra gilded to upgrade it all the way to 681 equivalent
fossil lintel
Did they say anything about chips next tier? Are we getting it?
edgy phoenix
even then you would have to spend extra gilded to upgrade it all the way to 681 ...
Mythic drops 707 bro
random stirrup
Mythic drops 707 bro
yes and you can craft 720
vivid vessel
Cuz in adv guide 3rd boss drops 1h
You don't give 1 h to rogue tho
Your rogue is getting daggers
For free
You give 1 h to enha
edgy phoenix
Ah
fossil lintel
WW can get the agi 2h
fossil lintel
Yeah
edgy phoenix
Yea its the loot council afterall
vivid vessel
If your rogue is outlaw
fossil lintel
HH and enhance can go fuck themselves 😅
random stirrup
let's give our rogue the 1h instead of another spec so they can spend extra gilded to upgrade it just so they can play a spec that's maybe better on a couple prog fights
vivid vessel
So the spec is both not great
fossil lintel
We still use 1 dagger on offhand
vivid vessel
And the weapon just fucks you over
fossil lintel
Zac, do you know if we're getting cartel chips again?
vivid vessel
Idk
lime lake
dagger combat when
random stirrup
Zac, do you know if we're getting cartel chips again?
almost certainly
fossil lintel
Would be nice if it was available 1 per week from the start, so you can guarantee a weap on week 3
Oh mid season
vivid vessel
dagger combat when
I mean idk why outlaw can't just use daggers
rigid basin
dagger combat when
Gun combat when lemme start fighting with the hunters
vivid vessel
Would make it so good for raid
lime lake
i mean yeah outlaw should be able to use daggers
silly that theres 1-2 bosses each raid that drop a weapon 2 specs in the entire game use
fossil lintel
1 guaranteed item every 3 weeks isn't that much, especially since you need to kill the boss at least once
covert kestrel
same with guns and bows
lime lake
yeah but every ranged hunter can use bows at least
rigid basin
Glaives
lime lake
not every melee rogue can use daggers
rigid basin
Why can't we use glaives btw
rigid basin
We could in bc
old sorrel
weapon types are a mistake in general
lime lake
they can not be forgiven
chilly atlas
glaives used to just be swords
edgy phoenix
Isnt the new transmog wep from 11.1.7 basically a glaive but onehandsword
fossil lintel
What if instead of dropping weapons, we had special weapons that have 3 rune slots, and then they can make sure that runes are shared by an equal number of classes/specs?
rigid basin
chilly atlas
yeah bro, just bring back legion artifacts
lime lake
they still havent fixed the handle i see
delicate seal
What if instead of dropping weapons, we had special weapons that have 3 rune slo...
or what if weps dont drop
and we have artifacts
fossil lintel
Yeah, we can give them fun names like dreadblades or something
vivid vessel
Nah but one day outlaw will be able to use daggers
I find this type of shit so annoying ngl
edgy phoenix
new post zac
chilly atlas
outlaw can use daggers tho, just not in mh :x
vivid vessel
Just for flavor
vivid vessel
outlaw can use daggers tho, just not in mh :x
That's what I mean
Like just for flavor
edgy phoenix
and whatsa even the point in offhand
vivid vessel
It's accepted that a spec is unplayable every tier
Cause I guarantee you even in world first you would see outlaw
edgy phoenix
658 > 684 just cuz some effect
vivid vessel
If we could use daggers
edgy phoenix
atp we can hold a mop in offhand and it wont matter
fossil lintel
But daggers dont mog well
chilly atlas
just being able to get easy mainhand loot would make outlaw meta?
fossil lintel
Gotta look sharp
edgy phoenix
less frustrating to gear
vivid vessel
just being able to get easy mainhand loot would make outlaw meta?
Yes
fossil lintel
Well, would make outlaw considered
Not meta necessarily, that's tuning dependant
And fight dependant
vivid vessel
I mean
random stirrup
Cause I guarantee you even in world first you would see outlaw
surely they split gear at least one outlaw alt that can freely craft a MH
vivid vessel
Liquid rogue
Said it multiple times
If he had a main hand he would play outlaw on a few bosses every tier
chilly atlas
it makes sense, just never thought of it that way
vivid vessel
surely they split gear at least one outlaw alt that can freely craft a MH
But that guy is bricked then
I'm talking about spec swapping
For diff bosses
chilly atlas
i guess its just all early drops of outlaw mh going to other classes
fossil lintel
Just craft the sword and grab the first dropped dagger for other specs, the first few bosses are usually not a prob anyway
vivid vessel
And crafts are so powerful early
vivid vessel
Just craft the sword and grab the first dropped dagger for other specs, the firs...
So you have a useless craft
fossil lintel
Not if you play outlaw
tranquil orbit
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
fossil lintel
Also it's useful where it really matters: m+
fossil lintel
Yes
lime lake
fossil lintel
And when they ask you to go sub or ass you say "sorry don't have a MH for those =/"
chilly atlas
gkick
random stirrup
and then they sit you 
fossil lintel
More time for m+
buoyant ridge
I'm sure this is already asked and answered but wasn't sure if the pinned was up to date ... is Charged Bolts still our choice after the huge nerf or we moving to something else?
buoyant ridge
ah hell, you're right, completely scanned right past that, thanks
proven ocean
Eshel — 11:03 PM
ah hell, you're right, completely scanned right past that, thanks
jolly geyser
first zeross message when its a complete sentence,was just forwarded
rigid basin
Tru
jolly geyser
thats otag
vapid sundial
jolly geyser
came from twitch/7tv
vapid sundial
jolly geyser
vapid sundial
vivid vessel
vivid vessel
Stop shit posting in my serious channel please
jolly geyser
my bad, we are always serious here
vivid vessel
Yes ty
rigid basin
elder bloom
!log
frank bane
Greenskin's is gonna be played next season I can feel it 
Prob not, just huffing on copium
vivid vessel
Why do you want to play gsw
Legitimately one of the most boring lego/talent we have
It does nothing for gameplay
No cool visual either r
No sound
Nothing
Invisible
jolly geyser
I just let the better players test and I just copy
vivid vessel
I'm waiting for m+; next week
violet swan
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
unkempt cypress
is new ks a cone or a-round u
unkempt cypress
ok siik
rigid basin
I'm waiting for m+; next week
I'm just trying to find a weapon vendor kekw
I've found every other weapon type minus rogue Usable
proven ocean
leg day for me cuh
cya cuh
@vivid vessel SAY CYA BACK
WTF
ZAC
?
!
ANBYWAYS BRB
rigid basin
It get scaled in m+
Didn't know that, thanks 
vivid vessel
<@352916297262301194> SAY CYA BACK
Cya cuh
bright crane
So do we know what disc ability we’re using next week
modest tiger
so what are we thinking about the new KS for raiding next season?
rigid basin
KS didn't really feel like an issue cept on like Flarendo and Sprocket
And maybe some of gally
proven ocean
@vivid vessel
rigid basin
In M+ tho 
desert tendon
fickle relic
Just learned about new ks, why don't they just make it somethin like demon hunters ability? Dont get me wrong, i like the new one, but the old one is just too cool visually and conceptually :/
glass mortar
Probably because the demon hunter ability exists
And they don't like to overlap stuff too much
echo tide
demon hunters stole meta from warlocks
surely we can steal something from them
its rogue class fantasy
cinder relic
so what are we thinking about the new KS for raiding next season?
Amazing but needs tweaks
Longer cd and it's chill
mighty pivot
demon hunters stole meta from warlocks
errrm ackchually
cinder relic
Just learned about new ks, why don't they just make it somethin like demon hunte...
The boring answer is because "they didn't want to"
I think adding more guns to the gun rogue spec is cool
Rather than it being just scuffed blade dance
fickle relic
Yeah the new spell is totally cool
faint arrow
bruh the details breakdown for outlaw is so funny to me
fickle relic
But that classic kind of spell when the character jumps from target to target is too iconic
glass mortar
Doesn't rlly fit outlaw tho, we don't even have shadowstep anymore
mighty pivot
the old/current one isn't that cool visually anyway. Isn't it just the eviscerate animation playing back to back?
glass mortar
The guns fit way better
It's just ambush animation half playing like 7 times in a row fast
frank bane
the old/current one isn't that cool visually anyway. Isn't it just the eviscerat...
I wouldn't know. I have to have a WA to blacken the screen because of photosensitivty reasons
modern tapir
I think adding more guns to the gun rogue spec is cool
it should probably be renamed lol
something more gun related in the name
fickle relic
I'll still miss it visually at least
modern tapir
yeah but its like ur shooting a bunch of guns
mighty pivot
I wouldn't know. I have to have a WA to blacken the screen because of photosensi...
this makes me wonder whether they will update dawnbreaker for motion sickness sufferers
modern tapir
name it 'visiting an american school' or something
frank bane
this makes me wonder whether they will update dawnbreaker for motion sickness su...
They could prob just add a potion or something at the start like they did for Grimrail
mighty pivot
oh is that how they dealt with grimrail? I thought they added some option in the game instead
vivid vessel
something more gun related in the name
If they don't rename it to gunning spree
Ima be very disappointed
fickle relic
Gooning spree
mighty pivot
how about "run and gun"
"run at 80% your normal speed & gun"
advance with caution and gun
mighty pivot
will need a WA to play her laugh, but it will have to loop 2-3 times with how long KS lasts
frank bane
"Spray and Pray"
fickle relic
I think they'll keep the old one
midnight granite
cinder relic
something more gun related in the name
Name is fine, icon is off
celest nova
@vivid vessel Hi, please tell me what addon you use to track aoe and other casts in m+ sorry to tag
jolly geyser
Name is fine, icon is off
make it a mix between fan the hammer and reaper ult
minor trellis
yo is there a list or sheet of all known outlaw bugs? something like what sub has for ref? https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1e2w0iHBCVp8K7hdSk1T8RKtUK9lr4FsRqFWd68FCQnk/pubhtml?gid=579089422&single=true
vivid vessel
!bug
ornate heathBOT
[Outlaw bug Thread](#1276315296159760467 message)
vivid vessel
Yes
rigid basin
I still find it funny it has to be clarified not to play trickster on sprocket
fossil charm
hi all , does anyone know if it's better 2x crowd fevourite mythic or 1x crowd fevourite mythic and 1x capo moltem heroic?
Unfortunally i can't thake the capo mythic 😦
warm adder
can I remove killing spreee camera jumps?
mighty pivot
hi all , does anyone know if it's better 2x crowd fevourite mythic or 1x crowd f...
capo OH will do better on bosses even at heroic track
cinder relic
Nop
mighty pivot
you cannot control your character with the current KS
mighty pivot
you always return on the spot you originally pressed KS. Use that to your advantage if possible
frank finch
The best you can do is certain angles like pressing it from max range
For a higher chance to land on safe spot
old sorrel
killingspree bros...
keen belfry
gonna tape a nap, brb
napped for too long
tawdry arch
yo for someone that is new to outlaw, what guide is best for me to learn fastest
and you can sent me complicated stuff Idm I learn well
rigid basin
https://discord.com/channels/124169701881282560/856897810536071208
is a good place to start
oop
tawdry arch
HUH
tawdry arch
hehe
obsidian walrus
any news on what do we use after the nerf for the belt ?
rigid basin
Discord guide is managed by solo, Wowhead, Method and IV are all managed by ForeverGuy
they're all good
rigid basin
any news on what do we use after the nerf for the belt ?
Solo's waiting until its live since there is a chance it changes again before tuesday
But Bolts giga dead fs
obsidian walrus
time to get outscaled again by the classes that scale with stats better yeeeey
jolly geyser
new killing spree scales with everything, omega dmg. metzen said in dms
livid oasis
But Bolts giga dead fs
Are bolts userable in retail now? have i been stuck uinder a rock?
usable*
rigid basin
Usable... uh they do damage 😭
RN they do giga damage, but have all the issues with random targeting nonsense, on reset it is not gonna do enough damage to want it anymore
livid oasis
I have the belt, so how have i not actually chosen bolts yet?
Do i need to fill the talent tree for the belt?
DW i have done it 🙂
haughty wigeon
killingspree bros...
hi doobl
livid oasis
How are my stats from yours guys perspective?
rigid basin
pretty close to mine,
livid oasis
Fair okay :).
I run the Champ wep whilst in M+ and just use a macro to switch as i havenm't been blessed with any goodies in vault thaats for sure
keen belfry
anything i can complain about today?
rigid basin
Fair okay :).
I run the Champ wep whilst in M+ and just use a macro to switch a...
I do the same, I was asked to heal mug'zee so I'm not getting capo til reclear xd
rigid basin
anything i can complain about today?
I'm sure we can come up with something
rigid basin
How are my stats from yours guys perspective?
old sorrel
anything i can complain about today?
bit hot outside
rigid basin
KS changes not fast enough
blissful elk
!fuu
ornate heathBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
keen river
Is the new Killing Spree on the PTR slightly buggy or is it just latency on my client? Sometimes it'll only fire one shot even at full CP
blissful elk
How much haste i need in HO ST build?
vivid vessel
Is the new Killing Spree on the PTR slightly buggy or is it just latency on my c...
fatebound coin cancel it
cause its considered a cast
rustic lotus
Did you guys see the new glyphs for rogue? Wowweee
vivid vessel
@gaunt phoenix
i remmebered the other time we had issues with coins counting as cast
if you cb ks rn
it cb the full ks
unless ytou are fatebound
tender wedge
Did you guys see the new glyphs for rogue? Wowweee
😒
vivid vessel
cause the coin will consume cb
glass mortar
LOL
i mean none of the cb interactions were designed with even a remote chance of law using them lets be honest
that talent is so piss for us
no need to fix bugs
mighty pivot
aint no way the coin consumes cb 
red zinc
chris brown
red zinc
ye
mighty pivot
it's a choice node, no?
mighty pivot
well the choice node makes it only affect dispatch
so it was probably tested with that only
vivid vessel
i mean none of the cb interactions were designed with even a remote chance of la...
well
they made it work with ks
which had to be coded in
sacred saddle
You can't stop me from using the new tier set and cb to flip 7 edge cases in a row
vivid vessel
cause cb act different with ks
it doesnt get consumed till end of ks
so the full ks get the cb buff
cedar kernel
gaunt phoenix
i remmebered the other time we had issues with coins counting as cast
Lmao
proven ocean
i opened max's stream i was like why tf is he so quiet is he absolutely hating borderlands or what
then i realized he's using a headset mic and its night and day from his usual mic
frank finch
how he testing this
proven ocean
literally a different person
vivid vessel
how he testing this
m0
frank finch
oo
vivid vessel
no
proven ocean
oh
vivid vessel
there was nothing
red zinc
i assume they hard nerf second boss of hoa
red zinc
if that thing aint dispellable
vivid vessel
ye i guess
idk
it being a stun
is kinda cringe
ngl
every other change is kinda whatever
i hope there will be more
oh ye in gambit
the fish
that scream to alert
red zinc
that patrolling pack end of arakara
vivid vessel
he will recast now
red zinc
kinda seems sus
vivid vessel
idk how that will work
like in sl we would just stun the cast
im surprised they arent making it a kick?
like are you supposed to stop the cast
forever
proven ocean
u mean
vivid vessel
its silly
vivid vessel
ye
red zinc
idk
red zinc
maybe they make them hittable by anything
vivid vessel
ye but you stopped them ross
red zinc
instead of the weird hard targetting
vivid vessel
we were never playing them
you just stoped the mob
except now they recast
so wtf
are we supposed to do
there is no way we stop the cast
for 30s
like xd
vivid vessel
they doubled the cast time but like
what does it do
im interested
thats my tank
red zinc
niuzao knockup
vivid vessel
uwu
mighty pivot
what's even the point of the priory change
proven ocean
bro
red zinc
first boss is boring asf
proven ocean
no way they keep this fish shit like this
vivid vessel
what's even the point of the priory change
boss was snooze fest
proven ocean
fish stick is the most cringe shit i've ever seen in my life and they're making it a recast??????????????
vivid vessel
i dont think it looks particulary more interesting tho xd
proven ocean
vivid vessel
fish stick is the most cringe shit i've ever seen in my life and they're making ...
yeee...
mighty pivot
it still looks like a snoozefest yeah lol
sudden fulcrum
i hope they change some of the groups in PSF
vivid vessel
ye
red zinc
fish stick is the most cringe shit i've ever seen in my life and they're making ...
i mean i dont think they're making it anything
sudden fulcrum
the amount of casters is insane
vivid vessel
an annoying snoozefest now tho
vivid vessel
the amount of casters is insane
i dont think the issue is the amount of casters even
i think the issue is
let me show you
red zinc
will happen after m+ testing probably