yeah
#outlaw
white marten
proven ocean
white marten
shoots randomly forward
proven ocean
This guy
runic bough
Always on the move!
proven ocean
white marten
huge dam
wintry solar
Silly outlaw stuff. It's nbd, I'm at work anyway.
white marten
just stop moving. ez
white marten
KS pans the camera for you, ez
wintry solar
Q and E get the most use of my keyboard for sure
white marten
wait...u use q and e to move?
white marten
just hold right click and use A and D
wintry solar
I'm old fashioned
proven ocean
In my reels
final sluice
Be loke me and rebind q and e to a and d and dont use keyboard to turn ur chara ter which is giga meme
white marten
must be the warrior class discord
vapid sundial
wintry solar
I use grapple more than walking between packs
For the most part. Sometimes pulls are far apart
white marten
def dont use keyboard to turn camera
wintry solar
Noooo
white marten
i use ks
wintry solar
My arena teammate does that and she costs games
white marten
kick her
wintry solar
I cant
white marten
Im cuban, and i know what you mean
runic bough
Well
white marten
Very feisty
final sluice
switch her keyboard keycaps of the laters "m" and "n" - some woud call you a monster if you do that - others woud call you "nomster"
wintry solar
She's never taken accountability before so I'm worried
runic bough
Do you have a crush on this girl or just a friend?
wintry solar
She's actually my ex
runic bough
Losing matches because she keyboard turns is very sus to why you stay with that
wintry solar
We ended it mutually on good terms
wintry solar
Teehee
runic bough
Did you break up with her because she keyboard turns?
wintry solar
Lolol
runic bough
I would
wintry solar
Imagine
final sluice
I woud
runic bough
final sluice
xD
wintry solar
I almost did
final sluice
if she dosnt change that for you - its like you not stoping smoking
wintry solar
Jk
I'm not giving her enough credit, she's a great healer but her flaws are big ones like keyboard turning
runic bough
Tell her you'll give it another shot if she learns to use the mouse.
wintry solar
And in arena, she walks backwards
runic bough
wintry solar
Which is a big no no
wintry solar
Tell her you'll give it another shot if she learns to use the mouse.
Gonna buy her an mmo mouse frfr
winged depot
Should i have rougly the same abilities on my bars in stealth?
wintry solar
Yeah
final sluice
I walk backwards in arenas - only good players now that you cant dodge shit from behind right?
final sluice
Should i have rougly the same abilities on my bars in stealth?
for pvp yes - for pve I'd say only if these are rotational abilitys
final sluice
Well the idea is to out run them
Cant say something about this - normaly they try to outrun me.
wintry solar
Idk why people stopped running shiv, it's a good slow still.
Even though without it, outlaw still has the best slow in the game
final sluice
in case of outlaw - I'd say cdause ur faster anyway
wintry solar
Pistol Shot + Cripple
wintry solar
Yeah
final sluice
I mean even if u had no slow, you woud be faster than them anyway allready xD
wintry solar
Since outlaw got poisons back
final sluice
honestly is there a spec more mobile than outlaw right now?
wintry solar
Dh
winged depot
for pvp yes - for pve I'd say only if these are rotational abilitys
So all the builders & spenders stay the same?
wintry solar
Yes
runic bough
Evoker run fast as fuck boyyyyy
wintry solar
Evoker is immune to slows half the time
And the. Cc immunity
And then the leap thing
final sluice
u have like allready what 20% movementspeed in talents? 10% extra in staelth + sprint with no cd / hook with no cd - idk
wintry solar
It's actually bananas
wintry solar
u have like allready what 20% movementspeed in talents? 10% extra in staelth + s...
And you still can't connect to mages
wintry solar
Oh and also, do i need SS as well in stealth or just ambush is enough? :3
What build?
Kir doesn't use ambush at all
winged depot
HO i'm lvl 73
final sluice
!
wintry solar
u have like allready what 20% movementspeed in talents? 10% extra in staelth + s...
Also the movement speed talents don't really make a difference tbh.
final sluice
SS and ambush shoud be same button
wintry solar
At least in arena
winged depot
Are the playstyles similar? Like iif i learn to get decent at the HO rotation will it roughly translate to KIR for later?
final sluice
no
not at all similar
u can play both in high level pve so
dosnt matter, play what u want
winged depot
Well Kir seems more fun to me from what I read, should I level (14% haste) with KIR just to learn the rotation or is that bad idea?
wintry solar
Are the playstyles similar? Like iif i learn to get decent at the HO rotation wi...
Yes and no
Yeah kir more fun
wintry solar
Oh right leveling
winged depot
I wouldn't level with KiR
lmaoo ur the wowhead person thats cool ;D
wintry solar
Yeah don't level as kir. I made that mistake
winged depot
kay thanks
wintry solar
I like this guy. He's like a tourist lol
wintry solar
Yeah
Might as well say your wildest takes because someone has one that's hotter
Stealthless kir jumpscare
fringe crystal
false, dk is
final sluice
Lol no
compact mountain
false, dk is
In prog raiding I certainly survive more often than our DKs do
teal marten
do these two buffs change the way i do the rotation in any way? are they important to track?
winged depot
Might as well say your wildest takes because someone has one that's hotter
when i turned 18 I got really drunk and paid a prostitute to suck on my boobs apperently
cinder relic
Coup yes flawless no
teal marten
kk ty
wintry solar
when i turned 18 I got really drunk and paid a prostitute to suck on my boobs ap...
That's not a take but good to know I guess
They're open too
Pretty cool
final sluice
outlaw can have 100% uptime of feint which is the most stupid deff anyway - and feint stacks with evasion (elusiveness) which shoud have an uptime of what? 30-40% in keys? + high vers + immunity to alot of stuff due to evasion and cloak. + decent perma self heal + more heal from healhtstones / pots + solid hp pool + ks stagger + less damage inc due to poison.
dk can suck my ass
wintry solar
I noticed something
You're comparing specs on paper
On paper, it should be the tankiest
winged depot
That's not a take but good to know I guess
Oh i totally misread your message
wintry solar
But in practice, it's not always the case
final sluice
well if u dont press buttons - u dont press buttons - different story
outlaw requires more skill to be tanky than dk - thats for sure
wintry solar
They need to get healing out of vanish and into vial
final sluice
yes
wintry solar
It's ridiculous how bad vial is
final sluice
honestly
vial saved my ass a thousand times
I finished so much bosses together with a tank solo the last seasons
cause team was dead man
final sluice
basicly - if a boss dosnt do perma aoe - whicha re most bosses - its good enough to top you between aoes in case u lost ur healer or something
wintry solar
And its baseline
final sluice
what more shoud it be
wintry solar
A better heal than vanish
final sluice
see ur just negative to the whole thing
just think about it - yes vile coud be better
but
compact mountain
take it off gcd and have vanish refresh it, boomn
wintry solar
Vial is vile
final sluice
if I use veil + vanish = I'm full allready - why woud I need a buff for it?
final sluice
take it off gcd and have vanish refresh it, boomn
that woud be a nerf
wintry solar
I want my healing ability to heal, not my dps cooldown
I use the cooldown term very broadly here
So no one come at me
final sluice
I mean it does heal xD
ur dps cd just heals aswell
I mean from pvp perspective - which u seem to play - vial is shit yes - for pve its perfectly fine
wintry solar
Not fine enough
final sluice
ur a doomer bro xD
wintry solar
I just want vanish to heal less and vial to heal more
glass mortar
And the. Cc immunity
what
wintry solar
Also fwiw I play all the content in the game
glass mortar
am i reading rn
final sluice
ok ok I want it the other way arround xD
glass mortar
ur cooked
nothing in this game touches outlaw in burst or sustain mobility
maybe mage over 40 feet
they have cc immunity for breath animation once every minute and they dont even play the build where u use breath anymore
and its a dps ability when u do
wintry solar
they have cc immunity for breath animation once every minute and they dont even ...
Nullifying shroud
final sluice
I wasnt
glass mortar
thats once every 1.5m
wintry solar
Oh
final sluice
I was generally
final sluice
outlaw
wintry solar
I guess outlaw yea
wintry solar
Yeah lol
final sluice
I mean outlaw also is fastest in pvp ofc - but yeah it can be slowed and stunned
the reason you dont get a mage sometimes is cause hes ccing you not cause you are slower in the first place
wintry solar
It's also because the shimmer out of kidney and the infinite roots
Which is why I said DH because its not as effected by roots.
A good dh anyway
Lots of bad ones out there
final sluice
buit not forget you can do alot agains the roots and shit as rogue aswell
wintry solar
Yeah if you can get uptime lol
But you're right
I'd like to save my vanishes for mage roots but I simply cannot
final sluice
the best part is
if u killing spree them after hooking to them
before they teleport away
and then they panic teleport again
love that
wintry solar
I've never had that happen lol
final sluice
yeah or they waste nova
wintry solar
I thought nova roots if they do it during ks
wintry solar
Oh you mean the KS after nova
final sluice
y
final sluice
I mean the average mage does allways the same
u jump to them, or appear , or whatever, they will try root you and their next global is blink - and then start casting
final sluice
well dont press ks then
wintry solar
Because that's the time you actually deal your damage
final sluice
if they dont cc you they loose if uy press ks or not
wintry solar
GS+KS is the only kill pressure you have. Winning with just crackshot is very rare.
Especially when your highest crit is like 1.1 million
wintry solar
Yeah
final sluice
I'm talking mage vs rogue
final sluice
yeah but in arena - lets say theres just the mage and rogue - no healer right
cause if we talking team gameplay the whole idear is different
u can get dispelled, he can get healed etc. pp.
if its just a mage, ur kill pressure is permanent cause guy got no healer
u dont need ks to kill him
lime plank
Is it a kinda draw between Deft Maneuvers and Precision cuts?
final sluice
for what?
its totaly different for different situations
diff is Kir Vs HO - target count vs other target count
lime plank
HO atm
runic bough
Pc is going to add more dmg than a full cp builder every now and then imo
lime plank
Trying the build Dalaran made a video on
wintry solar
Plz link
final sluice
PC is better unless its singletarget or higher than 7 targets
lime plank
Link vid??
final sluice
HO with deft manuvers dosnt seem to be trustworthy
errant terrace
I've not been shit on by killing spree on a boss til mythic gally
like ... why is his hitbox so large for it? the stun orbs got me twice this pull alone
final sluice
I've not been shit on by killing spree on a boss til mythic gally
like ... why i...
sprocket?
xD
errant terrace
hell no, why would I killing spree on him LOL
final sluice
thats what I'm saying
errant terrace
I went full fatebound for that shit
my killing spree always simmed less on full ST
than fatebound KiR
errant terrace
nahnah
glass mortar
ho trickster should be the same or slightly better then kir fatebound generally
depends on ur gear tho
lime plank
@wintry solar https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKiLR0tJu30
glass mortar
xd
lime plank
Just got back into rogue had no idea but its been fun
glass mortar
i dont think thats even the best build anymore
final sluice
he basicly just drops discord information from us
final sluice
was outdated on upload tbh
lime plank
ooof
glass mortar
wouldnt surprise me
lime plank
Current build on Wowhead then?
final sluice
Icedale just check outlaw-faq here
in this discord
all u need to know
more complete then wowhead
errant terrace
much more comprehensive
final sluice
this
lime plank
ty yall I didnt see that tab much appreciated
tight kernel
anyone got the string to sim all flask?
tight kernel
false
final sluice
unless you dont have enough haste
gaunt phoenix
in which you have to run 2 top gears to determine the right gear combination with haste flask or vers flask
abstract frost
!prekey
ornate heathBOT
Pre-key fuckery
RTB as you enter the dungeon to get 2 Supercharger stacks.- DO NOT RTB again inside the bubble as you will lose the supercharger stacks, similarly do not
AR early inside the bubble or you will lose the combo points. - After the bubble drops use RTB again (now at 4 stacks of Supercharger).
- Before entering the first pack
BF into 
Stealth. - Open on pack with AR into
BtE.
final sluice
¬¬
shoudnt we change that tooltip - we shoud BF/RT into stealth after time - so u dont lose BF duration while running to pull 1
last 2 parts shoud be combined basicly
wintry solar
I don't like how outlaw does infinite damage in lower keys. They should nerf it
(🪤 )
timber cipher
dose Myth Remnant of Darkness is BIS for ouitlaw ? I have heroic Zee's Thjug Hotline and Geargrinder's Spare Keys. Simc says replace Zee to RD (1.3% dps higher). Should I use it ?
abstract frost
does first council mobs in ToP considered a boss
ripe ibex
!fuu
ornate heathBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
latent oak
u cant
proven ocean
Idk
abstract frost
i tried and vanished and they reset
so i thought it might work
guess not
kk ty
latent oak
u mean these guys?
abstract frost
yes
white marten
was outlaw pumping in s1 too ?
sharp sand
of TWW? didnt ffeel like it
olive plank
dose Myth Remnant of Darkness is BIS for ouitlaw ? I have heroic Zee's Thjug Hot...
remnant of darkness?
it doesnt rank very high on bloodmallet in any of the 1/3/5 target scenarios so i cant imagine it being a good trinket
light dune
is waiting to KIR buffs when they are below 30 seconds after a natty 5 buff (with 6th CTO'd) to not overcap the buff duration something we should do? Or is that one of the feelcrafty little impact on dps rules? I swear I remember reading it but I'm curious if its something we should still try.
frail veldt
is waiting to KIR buffs when they are below 30 seconds after a natty 5 buff (wit...
nah just send it as soon as you get the 6th
cuz youre trading cdr on kir for more duration
so its not as valuable as youd think
light dune
nah just send it as soon as you get the 6th
ok that makes sense. Intuitively it FEELS like the Kir is a "better" kir if its not overcapping duration and thus worth but yeah i guess its counterbalanced by less KIR casts
frail veldt
Yeah you can do either
but usually when theres two options that are very close in dps
I choose the easier rule
less coggy load
light dune
right thats smart
sullen walrus
do u have wa for ks?
frail veldt
wdym
tender wedge
theres one that tracks and announces the severity of the dot
i use one that's just a bar showing the duration
keen belfry
how can u 5 soak on 2nd boss priory
bronze robin
Can I steal someone's weapon swap M+ WA
sullen walrus
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
Guy's - Afenar's Edit 
Luxthos Edit
Zac's Group 
Devlin
Utilities:
Combo Point Standalone
Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
Unseen Blade tracker
Fun:
Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
KS Ticking damage taken
ornate heathBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
light dune
Wanna double check this rule so if I have coup and say I'm at 1 CP but I have BF/oppurtunity pistol shot would I still build with BF in aoe or PS in lower target counts to spend coup at regular finisher CP? As long as I'm not sending SS I want to build to finisher combo points right?
If the above is true, would it apply to any amount of combo points I'd want to generate at? For example if Coup is active in KIR and I'm at 5 CP, I think I'd want to spend at 6+ CP out of stealth like usual, so am I casting BF at 5 combo points or an opportunity PS? Do I avoid the SS generator THAT hard or would it better to spend at 4-5 combo points and save BF/PS for the 1 combo point situation immediately afterword's.
wintry solar
So when legion remix comes out and the gems and stuff become so strong your talents become irrelevant, what build are yall running?
Personally I'm running 5cp stealthless HO
random stirrup
Wanna double check this rule so if I have coup and say I'm at 1 CP but I have BF...
At 1-2 CP yes you would want to build with alternative builders. Above that it becomes a bit more feely craft, I don't know if solo has made any determinate rules for those situations. At 5 CP and having an unseen blade proc ready I would probably just spend coup but that seems like a pretty rare situation, usually you would be able to press sinister strike since you wouldn't have an unseen blade proc.
I think saving opportunity procs and not omega overcapping cp is probably better than building to 7 with PS.
keen belfry
im sending my ps then coup
frail veldt
Yeah you'd only use BF/PS if their individual builder conditions are met
light dune
At 1-2 CP yes you would want to build with alternative builders. Above that it b...
Ok I agree that saving oppurtunity procs would FEEL right and overcapping that hard at mid-high combopoints FEELS wrong. So it wouldnt be out of line to build at say 1-3 CP but spend at 4-5 when coup is available?
frail veldt
so if youre at 5cps you dont PS for 1 cp
or 2 cps even
you follow your traditional builder rules for BF/PS
though for BF the rule is technically to just hit it on cd if youre below finish condition
since bf is affected by cdr
so in aoe you can bf at 5cps with coup up if you have UB stacks and want to avoid pressing SS
random stirrup
I think with 1fth pressing pistol shot there without broadside is probably fine
you only overcap 1cp
frail veldt
Yeah 1pt fth PS rule is <=4 cp right?
random stirrup
ye it generates 3
frail veldt
usually I will bend the builder rule by 1 cp for the sake of coup
so yeah without BS and with 1pt fth you can PS at 5cps prob
but also I might jsut finish at 5cps instead theyre both fine
random stirrup
with 2fth its probably a bit cringe to ps thoug
frail veldt
also ALL of this is assuming youre playing kir btw
light dune
Ok that makes perfect sense thats easy to follow. So basically just do regular PS / BF rules and dont SS if coup is there aka spend at whatever combo points if neither are up and you're not at finishing bombo points
ye I am kir'in
frail veldt
yeah how I like to think of it is
without UB stacks and without Coup ready:
normal builder rules
with UB stacks and without Coup ready:
SS->BF(in aoe)->PS
with UB stacks and with Coup ready:
BF(in aoe)->PS->Finish low cp
without UB stacks and with Coup ready:
normal builder rules
essentially all you need to think about is that with UB stacks, SS goes to highest prio, but with coup ready, you never press SS and instead consider low cp finisher after other builders
light dune
essentially all you need to think about is that with UB stacks, SS goes to highe...
Ok awesome makes perfect sense thanks for the help
formal veldt
Junkmaestros trinket, is there a set of stacks we go for? i.e proc it when it hits 10 etc?
frail veldt
just dont overcap it
many people like it in m+ cuz you can save it for big packs/damage amps etc
also dont let it interfere with your other trinket if its also an on use
formal veldt
Im aware, but do I activate it at a min amountof stacks
green dune
hello friends. everywhere seems to have fatebound as the best ST build for raid, but when i look at wclogs most of the top outlaws are using trickster/ho? assume that's now coming out on top?
frail veldt
hello friends. everywhere seems to have fatebound as the best ST build for raid,...
cuz raid is not ST
theres one fight thats ST in raid and its sprocket
green dune
yeah, true, even cauldron though which surprised me as basically st for the most part (at least hc)
frail veldt
well the intermission is aoe
green dune
true
random stirrup
trickster is equal st essentially and blows fatebound out of the water if there is any sort of cleave at all
frail veldt
and the HO Trickster ST build is almost exactly as good as KiR Fatebound
Also HO's best ST build is trickster not fatebound
and HO is popular since its the easier build
green dune
fair enough, thanks for clarifyingh
sick rain
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
clear badge
Just for my information, what's the meaning of UB ? i'm a new rogue 🙂
neat sapphire
do we actively track anything regarding our hero talent tree? I tought it was all completely passive "select and forget" ??
clear badge
thanks !
weary fog
do we actively track anything regarding our hero talent tree? I tought it was al...
fatebound u dont really track anything
for trickster u track coup de grace/unseen blade stacks
neat sapphire
do you guys have BTE always on the same spot in the bar?
for example i have BTE on E during stealth/subterfuge.. and out of stealth its replace by dispatch
weary fog
for example i have BTE on E during stealth/subterfuge.. and out of stealth its r...
dont do this, u still cast BTE outside of sub
neat sapphire
unseen blade "stacks"?? isnt it always just 1? pick a prio target and stick with it?
vale warren
unseen blade "stacks"?? isnt it always just 1? pick a prio target and stick with...
I think you're thinking of fazed, unseen blade stacks up to 4 times and on the 4th your dispatch gets replaced with coup de grace
pure folio
do we actively track anything regarding our hero talent tree? I tought it was al...
Yes and no, you cant really track our Coup De Grace perfectly. there is an weak aura that can guesstimate when you will get it so you can play around it
It is minor in the grand scheme of things and not totally necessary
!log
runic bough
I hit a wall guys
14 resil
but thats it
havnt been able to get into a 15 or build my own key
in 2 nights now
runic bough
wiping is not fun when u did it alread
hybrid crown
That's why I stopped at 3k
It's the same thing except little gremlin add's trivial fire ball spell is now doing 8000% more damage
Nah dude
I'm good
hidden bay
You going this far while tolerating KS is alrd an achievement king
runic bough
tru
but i could go higher
and its better before bliz nerfs outlaw
to climb right now
runic bough
mighty pivot
you can challenge yourself in other ways, like try to get 3k with your gsw build
green dune
helllo friends - question on trickster.. a little confused what to do when i am at 3 charges but have like 15s on UB - i believe I'm meant to just send vanish in this case, but often i'll find i get the fourth proc right as i'm sending it - if that happens shoudl i be hitting CdG within vanish window?
zealous plinth
helllo friends - question on trickster.. a little confused what to do when i am ...
Never CdG during vanish, always bte
Happens to random resets
green dune
cool makes sense. thanks. so if we are at 3 charges is there a rough time that we'd wait for CdG before sending vanish? ie. if it's 5 sec to go i normally wait for it, but if more than that i usually just send vanish - is that about right?
neat sapphire
how is sub after the buffs?
zealous plinth
cool makes sense. thanks. so if we are at 3 charges is there a rough time that w...
I only hold if UB is ready and I’m at 3
But holding if it becomes ready within 5sec might be worth. But prob very situational, cause you might lose cleave targets by holding
green dune
But holding if it becomes ready within 5sec might be worth. But prob very situat...
cool thanks
pliant wind
10k vers is low low for outlaw
livid pewter
Like say you use KS and immediately cast coup
if you insta go into vanish after and pump guess its valid
stuck timber
Guys I couldn't find the ambush macro in pins
gaunt phoenix
!ambush
ornate heathBOT
It is possible to use a macro to cast Ambush during Stealth/Audacity and Sinister Strike otherwise, instead of using the stealth bar:
/cast [known: Hidden Opportunity, bonusbar:1] Ambush ; Sinister Strike
*This is most useful to swap between HO and KIR builds without changing keybinds.
Stance swap delay is, for now, not an issue since we don't want to cast vanish into ambush anymore.
long barn
!ambush
You think patchwork or dslice is better for sims on mythic boss fights with cleave.
Like Gally or scrapmaster
red zinc
But your right maybe 1%
Just custom code a non existent dungeon route that has the exact same add timings as gally
long barn
I mean.
If blizzard kills addons maybe all the devs and custom code all the dungeons and bosses in raidbots
I know I would stop managing the addons I maintain
hollow portal
Does anyone have the macro that Zac uses to repeatedly cast SND and not drop Alacrity's charges?
warm tangle
I think he means to use snd to refresh alac
civic void
Does anyone have the macro that Zac uses to repeatedly cast SND and not drop Ala...
simply a cast snd cancelaura snd
hollow portal
simply a cast snd cancelaura snd
I know, I have it and it worked before, but when I use it now, I can only use it once xd
mighty pivot
first cancelaura then cast snd if you have them the other way around
hollow portal
/cancelaura snd
/cast snd
wintry solar
Quality macro right there
civic void
I mean it doesn't matter anyway you just press that twice it will work
naive leaf
do you only go into BTE windwos with the buff? Or do you do it always
naive leaf
the crit buff?
hollow portal
Unless you get like nine 1 cp refunds
When I use it I get a refund of one CP, then when I use it again I get nothing and can't use it.
wintry solar
Bad luck
civic void
When I use it I get a refund of one CP, then when I use it again I get nothing a...
Skill issue, highroll ruth more
wintry solar
He gets it
hollow portal
is it rng?
wintry solar
Yeah
hollow portal
A little weird, I'm trying it 15 times right now and it's always the same hahaha
That's why I thought the macro was wrong.
lament gyro
hey guys if i know im gonna proc coup in my next 2 sinister strikes, and i have FTH and vanish up, is it worth using those sinister strikes to proc and finish with coup if i know i wont drop AR?
wintry solar
A little weird, I'm trying it 15 times right now and it's always the same hahaha
Yall thought ace procs were entertaining
Sometimes I get 1, sometimes I get 2, sometimes it feels like I bugged the spec somehow
vale warren
When I use it I get a refund of one CP, then when I use it again I get nothing a...
If you do it after consuming a supercharge it'll count as 4cps so you'll have an 80% chance of getting 1cp back
At least I think that's how it works
hollow portal
If you do it after consuming a supercharge it'll count as 4cps so you'll have an...
It worked for me, thanks
vivid vessel
I wanna play outlaw
balmy topaz
I wanna play outlaw
No 
gaunt phoenix
Any outlaws
glass mortar
not even one
vivid vessel
im one !
glass mortar
im not convinced
vale warren
Any inlaws
west dirge
what is outlaw?
glass mortar
why is outlaw?
red zinc
I wanna play outlaw
play feral 
glass mortar
feral is 4 fite
wintry solar
At least I think that's how it works
snd doesnt work with suoercharger
wintry solar
unless its bugged which it could idk
vale warren
unless its bugged which it could idk
It's rogue, of course it's bugged
wintry solar
Zac does snd work unintendedly with SC?
vivid vessel
yes
glass grove
which is like outlaw worse key but
Yeah play sub in workshop trust me
wintry solar
okay nvm plk
vale warren
I assume kidney does too but I haven't tried it
vivid vessel
also sub double buff got reverted
wintry solar
kidney in pve in 2025 
red zinc
feral kinda blasting rn ngl
its not even so much about the dps for me, who made this talent bro
"how do we make class unkillable with one node"
vale warren
kidney in pve in 2025 <:kekdog:907207037757296710>
Yeah that's why I haven't tried it lmao
Is cat fun rn
wintry solar
are you really an outlaw main if you dont have a criminal record irl?
I got speeding tickets
such an Outlaw
vivid vessel
its not even so much about the dps for me, who made this talent bro <:ICANT:9647...
hm
is that ferla only
vivid vessel
i mean druid isnt that tanky tbf so like
i see i see
idk i cant be mad about giving druids more tankyness
i couldnt play a spec that require sitting in bear
to just get a feint
thats stupid cringe
red zinc
i couldnt play a spec that require sitting in bear
i mean in this case you dont have to sit in bear
long barn
For haste
red zinc
you just go in and out for a split second and have a trillion armour and 14m hp
vivid vessel
i guess gcds are different
for specs like that
its not like 2 outlaw gcds
i would kill myself
red zinc
youll be waiting for energy sometimes
anyway
POOLING 
(its not pooling i just hate when people use that word for everything energy related)
vale warren
Was it 19.05 I can’t remember
Yeah 19.05 gives you 25% with alacrity stacked
vivid vessel
bro i need a weak aura
that draw a circle
around candle boss
or some shit
to know if i can press ks
or wait
nah you cant do that
idk i need something
there gotta be a way
brisk meadow
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
zealous plinth
to know if i can press ks
I only press it right after goobers are cleared
vivid vessel
ye idk thats so bad
zealous plinth
But prob lose some casts due to it
vivid vessel
some ?
brother
you lose like
5 casts per set
- when they are cleared
i need to bait
candles
so i would rather not
press it during that time
zealous plinth
Mhm true
vivid vessel
but i have to cause its the only time i can press it
so i always bait troll candles
idk
terrible
zealous plinth
Worst boss for us
Tank should drag it away till circles around us are about to spawn. But that sucks too
vapid blaze
but no way you baited all 3 or
vivid vessel
wdym
vapid blaze
i mean if its just you baiting a weird one who cares right
zealous plinth
surely there gotta be something you can do
It prob takes the player positions when they spawn?
vapid blaze
ah yeah if you need melee uptime its kinda cursed
but even there if 2 of those were slightly stacked you could still clear all
vivid vessel
hm
i could also attach a weak aura
on the plate
dont think that would work very well hm
vapid blaze
minimap overlay
zealous plinth
on the plate
They have plates? My UI doesn’t even show 🤣
vivid vessel
ye i think so
but i just meant a statick circle
im thinking i can do that around me tho instead of the mob plate
vapid blaze
man imagine if they just didnt stun 🙂
zealous plinth
im thinking i can do that around me tho instead of the mob plate
Should prob work
vivid vessel
like the idea is this
you stand under boss
and look down
and the circle is the best it can get
thoughts ?
that could work i think
winged depot
Why does Vanish matter inside of combat for extending Adrenaline Rush duration?
vivid vessel
!uuh
ornate heathBOT
- Stealth/Subterfuge/Dance maintains ADR buff
- ADR buff maintains Blade Flurry buff
If you are seeing very long buff timer (20 min type of stuffs), that's because Blizzard does not actually "freeze" buffs but instead slow them down a lot.
winged depot
Oh its extended in the Subterfuge window cool
zealous plinth
that could work i think
I guess that work, how big you’d make that circle?
vivid vessel
need testing
haughty moat
depends on hitbox
young lion
Hi everyone,
Is it better in boss fights with multipe targets (like azerok or mechagon first boss) to use the 658 OH ? Or only on trash ?
dark fractal
vivid vessel
i cant even test alone
glass mortar
Hi everyone,
Is it better in boss fights with multipe targets (like azerok or me...
what matters is if the weapon resets on vanishes or not
vivid vessel
they dont stun in normal
glass mortar
it does not on boss fights
thats why u dont wear it
btw zac can u override to make the weapon proc thingy work on patchwerk or do we not have a way
i really wanna see a sim of cudgel on ST if it can reset
vivid vessel
no
young lion
thats why u dont wear it
Ohh okay i didnt know that, thanks
vivid vessel
but you can do a dungeon route
glass mortar
to see if its worth weapon swapping or not for like
vivid vessel
with one boss
glass mortar
single boss mobs in dungeons
vivid vessel
btw
you guys think blizzard
will ever fix
these private aurs
that stays forver
when you vanish
vivid vessel
what did u test it against, capo?
normal weapon
glass mortar
ah ok so should always swap for ST dungeon trash
vivid vessel
i guess this is just lucky i could have gotten stunned on every jump i think
i cant really figure out the range
haughty moat
yeah that was lucky
vivid vessel
but like all these jumps
are melee range
is hwat i dont understand
like close
idk it seems kidna rng the range of ks
i guess its only weird if you look at the character model
haughty moat
that one looks kinda safe, but thats huge
vivid vessel
caue the animation is big
random stirrup
There’s no way to use the melee range weakaura to calculate the KS radius right
vivid vessel
my character is under the weak aura in the middle of the screen
vivid vessel
There’s no way to use the melee range weakaura to calculate the KS radius right
true you could scan around with your character i guess
or smth
xd
idk
thats cooked
is ks just max melee range ?
mighty pivot
perspective & animation make it look like you are porting further away ye
I would expect it's 10y around the target since that's its cast range but 
mighty pivot
mighty pivot
yeah
random stirrup
If we still had acro you would have to untalent it anyway to make KS safer
desert tendon
wintry solar
vivid vessel
If we still had acro you would have to untalent it anyway to make KS safer <:gar...
lol
i wonder if that worked tha way
i cant remmeber honestly
ok but now
it doesnt entirely help us
mighty pivot
surely when they reintroduce acro next patch KS will ignore the range extension 
wintry solar
Was this an expirement I'm walking in on?
vivid vessel
im trinna figure out how do i know
i can send ks
on candle boss
im tired of getting stunned man
ruby mauve
i don't like cudgel honestly lol
i keep simming and it wants less and less haste for some reason, thing just keeps doing more of my dmg
long barn
Zac any suggestions on sending KS on first boss workshop
zealous plinth
im tired of getting stunned man
Did you check if they maybe have a unit token even if they don’t have a nameplate?
vivid vessel
i dont have issues sendiung it on first boss
no
i asked the weak aura disocrd tho if that was even possible
to do range calc
glass mortar
can u even blow up mines during kspree
vivid vessel
between 2 units that arenyt you
long barn
The red circle on the ground
vivid vessel
cause i feel like thats not even piossible anyway
ruby mauve
can u even blow up mines during kspree
yes
ruby mauve
dispell with clock though
glass mortar
only thing u need 2 be careful of on first fight is not ending kspree in the tankbuster aoe
ruby mauve
or evasion
glass mortar
thats like the only thing thatll 1 shot u
zealous plinth
cause i feel like thats not even piossible anyway
If they have a unit token you could check their range to you though
vivid vessel
If they have a unit token you could check their range to you though
true
and then sit under boss
hidden bay
im trinna figure out how do i know
Funny how you never will because ks will get fixed 11.2 to no longer port you and the dungeon will be gone
vivid vessel
Funny how you never will because ks will get fixed 11.2 to no longer port you an...
and then
we will have another boss
with similar issues
oh you said ks getting fixed
ye
funny guy
I told you what my copium was regarding ks
i believe they do a dance
aka they make it viable for a bit
till people start complaining too much
then they get it out of the meta
so people forget about it
once its all forgotten
they can bring it back
glass mortar
i think itll be fixed
frank finch
so according to your copium
frank finch
we will be back meta soon
vivid vessel
so according to your copium
they are nerfing trickster, mega buffing fatebound
glass mortar
u cannot have an ability that makes people dizzy in this game without alternatives
vivid vessel
then we dont play ks anymore
glass mortar
and a whole hero tree built around it
zealous plinth
Some research told me they might even have a nameplate token even if it’s invisible
frank finch
oh we on that step
glass mortar
either trickster gets a rework or kspree, and kspree is easier
zealous plinth
Or a bossToken
vivid vessel
Some research told me they might even have a nameplate token even if it’s invisi...
im interested
frank finch
unlucky
ruby mauve
think ks will definitely not physically teleport you soon lmao
zealous plinth
im interested
Can’t test / check though cause I’m on vacation
random stirrup
Something tells me
random stirrup
That we will not be playing fatebound or trickster in 12.0
zealous plinth
You could do “/dump UnitExists(nameplate1)” and so on
And boss2 etc
To check if they exist
hidden bay
then they get it out of the meta
Honestly thats lowkey fine
vivid vessel
If boss 2 would exist wouldn't I see it in the unit frames
zealous plinth
If boss 2 would exist wouldn't I see it in the unit frames
I think blizz can hide them
glass mortar
except fatebound is boring now
zealous plinth
No matter if they exist or not
glass mortar
and also people have realized what some of us found mid s1
which is fatebound is stinky af
glass mortar
lucky coin is dogshit, 2 of the nodes turn off anytime a mob is nearby decapitating ur st
zealous plinth
But all that is prob false hope 
glass mortar
🤢
vivid vessel
I guess that's similar to the bombs on gally right, I think they don't have nameplates by default but some weak aura shows a bar on their head
glass mortar
oh sure it doesnt effect gameplay at all
hidden bay
Yeah but literally no impact on gameplay
glass mortar
that doesnt make it not dogshit tho
why is it just making my damage profile worse man
why does it have the only capstone in the whole game u can go a full raid boss fight not proccing?
how did we end up with 2 hero trees like this
☠️
vivid vessel
how did we end up with 2 hero trees like this
?
No devs
Also deathstalker is almost as offensive
We ended up with 3 hero trees like this
hidden bay
Class devs working on something else atm tho which is unlucky
random stirrup
Sub trickster only good hero tree fr fr
glass mortar
yea i cant comment on deathstalker i just havent been playing enough wow to try sub or sin since early s1
random stirrup
And even that has issues
hidden bay
Next expac classes will be good
glass mortar
sub trickster felt alright ig
random stirrup
Coup rng in opener is a bit cringe if you aren’t abusing the disorienting strikes bug
That’s my only complaint
glass mortar
if kspree wasnt kspree trickster would just be a solid hero talent
vivid vessel
what bug wtf
vivid vessel
no im actually unaware tho
random stirrup
The same one outlaw uses
haughty moat
send & pray
vivid vessel
ah you mean
glass mortar
idk is it really a bug when u take an effort to prestack a resource for ur hero talent tree and that prestack just gets u 2 more strikes over a dungeon
random stirrup
Ye
vivid vessel
not a bug tho
random stirrup
They persist through wiping
vivid vessel
ye i know
random stirrup
And death
glass mortar
meanwhile enhance prestacking 2X tempests before every key
vivid vessel
i did that the whole progresss
glass mortar
and getting to keep them
glass mortar
this kinda stuff is only bugs when it happens to outlaw ig
random stirrup
Idk
hidden bay
meanwhile enhance prestacking 2X tempests before every key
Bro i pray thats removed
glass mortar
it wont be
hidden bay
Fucking annoying af doing it every key
glass mortar
prekey stuff only gets fixed when its outlaw
random stirrup
They did try to remove it
glass mortar
we are too strong on first pull of dungeons
random stirrup
They just suck
glass mortar
remove it all imo
start dungeons naked
unlock a piece of gear for every pack u finish
hidden bay
Start dungeon only with buffs that are like 10 min + long
mighty pivot
only chance they significantly change hero trees is for midnight tbh - very low expectations before that
unreal drum
just do a Le Mans style start at the begining of the key
glass mortar
only chance they significantly change hero trees is for midnight tbh - very low ...
well why do u think that?
we've had like
hidden bay
only chance they significantly change hero trees is for midnight tbh - very low ...
11.2 for sure will have some stuff
glass mortar
2 or 3 full reworks of hero talents this expac already
across mages/shamans/hunters
random stirrup
They will try to fix all existing hero talents before midnight
glass mortar
and 5-6 fairly large changes to underused trees
i see no reason hero talent design couldnt flip on any major content patch now a day
just depends who they are focusing on
hidden bay
Yeah
frank finch
something something radar something
hidden bay
Thats cap
glass mortar
it sucks cause it isnt us but its not like u can pretend blizzard is doing the thing where they dont majorly rework anyone/anything mid expac anymore
hidden bay
We call out ion now
glass mortar
hell even in DF they were fully reworking specs all expac long
hidden bay
Ion mentioned outlaw
unreal drum
it sucks cause it isnt us but its not like u can pretend blizzard is doing the t...
they did tell us the cost of player housing in advance tbf
glass mortar
cuh why are my class designers working on player housing
class based housing???
i crave the sewers again
mighty pivot
well why do u think that?
if you don't expect anything you can't be disappointed 
hidden bay
cuh why are my class designers working on player housing
Nah fam they are working on blizzard dbmtm
unreal drum
you know what blizz are like the class designers are the cleaners the balance team the art team and the server guys
glass mortar
rogues should get the option to secretly live in the walls of someone elses house
hidden bay
rogues should get the option to secretly live in the walls of someone elses hous...
Would you spy on belfs nelfs or draenei?
red zinc
rogues should get the option to secretly live in the walls of someone elses hous...
rogue neighborhood will go so hard
shithole waiting room
glass mortar
you visit the rogue neighborhood and ur bags are empty when you leave
mighty pivot
you will need to use KS to enter your house
random stirrup
You visit the rogue neighborhood and wake up without kidneys
glass mortar
Would you spy on belfs nelfs or draenei?
glass mortar
You visit the rogue neighborhood and wake up without kidneys
we made them kidneyshot proof
!
its a buff
mighty pivot
i wonder if we will get wax statue decorations for the memories
hidden bay
<:vulpera:669210121284354068>
Cultured
glass mortar
honestly i usually dont care about these sorta systems but what ive seen from wow housing looks pretty sick so far
reminds me a bit of runescape housing back in the day
glass mortar
also opens up a huge box of goodies they can sprinkle around the game as rewards for all sort of nonsense content
hidden bay
Import someones insane creation and farm compliments
glass mortar
skins for buildings/furniture
cinder relic
Housing is going to save wow
hidden bay
Maybe
frank finch
red zinc
titles so boring
glass mortar
can i make it so my door only opens for 3k+ io aotc players
long barn
Can you grapple to the platform instead of using the parasol toy in Rookery?
glass mortar
hidden bay
I feel like the addon purge will save wow, assuming they actually get it right
red zinc
Can you grapple to the platform instead of using the parasol toy in Rookery?
yes
you can also just jump straight down without anything
and not take fall damage
to the further platform that is
hidden bay
Because rn as a new player addons are absolute bullshit
wintry solar
something something radar something
There's no telling how many useless meetings a change like that has to go through
glass mortar
man im so sad im gunna be 1 week behind on 8 mask achievements because i didnt read wowhead enough last week
hidden bay
im gonna be 1 week behind because why not make it easier for yourself to get the same reward
glass mortar
im in it for the challenge same as when first visions came out
eventually everyone will be able to 8 mask pretty easily for the mounts ye
vivid vessel
im going to be infniintie years behind
vivid vessel
cause im never doing it
glass mortar
if u complete both sw and orgrimmar 8m the achievement has a mount i believe