!wa
#outlaw
static axle
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
Guy's - Afenar's Edit 
Luxthos Edit
Zac's Group 
Devlin
Utilities:
Combo Point Standalone
Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
Ace refund sound trigger
RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
Unseen Blade tracker
Fun:
Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
KS Ticking damage taken
prisma heron
Which tier item do I want to leave out for m+?
lyric steeple
Is it okay to have 1 radiant power (MH) and Depth (OH) enchant for M+ especially when we are doing weapon swaps in dungeon?
pure folio
Which tier item do I want to leave out for m+?
chest
frail veldt
Is it okay to have 1 radiant power (MH) and Depth (OH) enchant for M+ especially...
Double radiant is better for m+ in general but depths gives you some more st/prio
It's a minor difference
arctic torrent
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
azure vortex
I can at most have 80% AR uptime, cannot complete the ideal 90% with KIR
What are the general reasons for that
rapid ore
if i get rooted from those builders in floodgate and press ks, does it even do dmg because it cancels the animation after one tick
pure folio
What are the general reasons for that
improper vanish usage, bad subterfuge windows
are u using adrenaline rush on CD?
is ur haste at the proper amount?
are u spending FTH stacks at the right time?
using blade flurry only at 4+ targets?
random stirrup
AR uptime is a culmination of your entire play it is very hard to attribute it to any one error
pure folio
yea
but ur subterfuge windows is what lowers the CD substantially
would have to look at a log or vod
make sure youre not using ambush as well
verbal fjord
Wait i need to spend FTH stacks wisely ?
And how to use it properly i just use it when im in sub with no cp
zealous plinth
Check the Advanced section in outlaw faq, it’s explained in depth in there
Outlaw prob the spec you can do the Most minmax, that’s why it’s my favorite one ^^
azure vortex
Thanks, probably over the course of the run, I am wasting some combo points, pressing wrong button in a subterfuge window or so and they are adding up.
But there is no way i can deal 5m overalls in a key
I somehow always last dps
next wedge
just looked at my logs
i got 87% AR uptime
most keys its clsoer to 80%
im bad at the game
random stirrup
just gotta game 
random stirrup
kir gets so many combo points from deft i feel it is hard to drop it on trash
random stirrup
most of my little drops even are letting it expire either right before ks or like 1 builder before ks to not waste uptime during it
next wedge
are u playing KiR KS?
random stirrup
ye the 1fth build
random stirrup
ur dps is pretty insane why ur io low
no group rn and was focused on raid
my main rogue is sub/sin only this tier and that thing is an alt
didnt want to waste dinars on outlaw gear
alpine valve
What do I activate before the Key starts? In DF it was AR, snd, BR, KIR
jolly geyser
!prekey
ornate heathBOT
Pre-key fuckery
- RTB as you enter the dungeon to get 2 Supercharger stacks.
- DO NOT RTB again inside the bubble as you will lose the supercharger stacks, similarly do not
AR early inside the bubble or you will lose the combo points. - After the bubble drops use RTB again (now at 4 stacks of Supercharger).
- Before entering the first pack
BF into 
Stealth. - Open on pack with AR into BtE.
lyric steeple
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
wintry solar
most of my little drops even are letting it expire either right before ks or lik...
Honestly, most of my downtime comes from it dropping off at the end of the pack and then not pressing it until I open in the next pack.
Very rarely do I drop it out of combat
Though it does happen
rotund zodiac
Do you send low cp KS then vanish when ADR is running out?
also do you send full cp KS when ADR is running out but ADR is off cd after that?
simple dagger
Actually came here to ask a similar question for when it’s dangerous to KS. Don’t you just value KS for the unseen blade proc?
proven eagle
hey witch hero talent better for raid now
long barn
Is there an addon that puts a circle around you to simulate BF reaching targets?
arctic hollow
Is there an addon that puts a circle around you to simulate BF reaching targets?
No, addons and wa that draw like that are forbidden
slate plaza
why do ppl play elusivness over cheat death
vivid vessel
in higher keys
you need elus as a def
otherwise you die
from litteraly anything
that looks at you sideways
desert tendon
vivid vessel
ye
well now i just die more
it is what it s
i dont have a choice anymore
if you play killing spree you should play cehat death
until you feel like you cant anymore
for me this was around 16/17 keys
were i started to need elus
with the lower ilvl tho
maybe now its +1 key level idk but you get me
https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxelRLNtafupuoR5ubl1bsCMTGB8qAs-Jz?si=mwpvjZMxOr1MvL0I @frail veldt @glass mortar @daring oxide idk which one of you told me to hold the trinket for the pvp phase
but ty
craggy barn
i ve been doing that
hold 30 stacks, kill some one with trash
i did it for the lolz but its still good
craggy barn
stun them for added lolz
full kidney
i eother send on pvp or on flag if we r killing it
fallen knot
AHAHAHAAH
is it
not ok that i feel like i do way more damage as outlaw athan as uhdk
craggy barn
1
100% value
fallen knot
outlaw is 670 with circlet still, uhdk is basically full bis or almost
vivid vessel
not ok that i feel like i do way more damage as outlaw athan as uhdk
you do
fallen knot
and 680
vivid vessel
in 95% of keys
smoky venture
night dragon
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
vivid vessel
99.5% even
but i mean that was true for sin aswell imo
people dont know rogue is strong
red zinc
but up till 20s none of these people do the damage to compensate
vivid vessel
it makes life easier if you are good players
with phyuscial comps you just play 5 specs that cant die
and you can have cast go trough
you can not press defs
you can play bad
vivid vessel
fr
i much prefer the comps with brew tank
resto sham
and then you go double rogue or rogue feral
i think a variant that could also work is resto druid and enahcne
crystal finch
what do you think abt: prot war, rsham, feral, rogue, ww ? or switch ww to mw and rsham to enha
I'm asking cause ppl whine about dps warris
fallen knot
arms warrior is good
vivid vessel
what do you think abt: prot war, rsham, feral, rogue, ww ? or switch ww to mw an...
idk prot is useless in melee comps
cause you dont need its externals
imo
ww is kinda poop i think
red zinc
I like ww in these lower keys, they do a lot of ST
and okay aoe
still would rather have feral/brew than ww/guardian but ill take it
magic shuttle
Dps warrs in my pugs lately have not been the brightest fellas
Prot warriors are better players
proven ocean
i think a variant that could also work is resto druid and enahcne
Thats beyond cooked i dont think u understand how cooked out the wazoo that is
You’d be boosting the druid
leaden folio
mdi ravenhold team when
past falcon
bm tank feels the best by far to play w
quick quail
What have we become
fallen knot
i am having fun with ks tbh
btw has anyone figured out how to ping/put a marker or anything similar on the place where you start and end your killing spree?
hot olive
im a DK 
fallen knot
yes
hot olive
physical comp so fun
quick quail
i am having fun with ks tbh
what key levels?
grave carbon
What have we become
unsubbing out of my free will
latent oak
btw has anyone figured out how to ping/put a marker or anything similar on the p...
/wm [@player] 1 would this work
cant place them while not in a group so idk if it works or not
latent jetty
as an Outlaw, do I use a Dagger as an Off-hand? Or something slow, or just highest ilvl?
rotund zodiac
!oh
ornate heathBOT
A dagger offhand is technically like 0.2% better than a slow weapon because it generates more 
Instant Poison procs. That is the only difference, 
Fatal Flourish proc rate is normalized to be unaffected by the change in attack speed. Note that item level or stats will matter more than this quirk, or you can simply use a slow weapon anyway for transmog.
past falcon
is it 13200 haste?
just about yeah
thorn river
!prekey
ornate heathBOT
Pre-key fuckery
- RTB as you enter the dungeon to get 2 Supercharger stacks.
- DO NOT RTB again inside the bubble as you will lose the supercharger stacks, similarly do not AR early inside the bubble or you will lose the combo points.
- After the bubble drops use RTB again (now at 4 stacks of Supercharger).
- Before entering the first pack BF into Stealth.
- Open on pack with AR into BtE.
gaunt phoenix
what rating get you to 20% haste?
You really need 19.05%
That gets you to 25% after alacrity
But 20% is fine
dense bolt
gaunt phoenix
zealous plinth
You really need 19.05%
And I still Wonder why sim tells me to go with 18.37% haste ^^ dslice though
carmine hill
zac in a key
with monksea
shouldnt ho go less haste and more crit? since ho gets 10% extra haste all the time
rotund zodiac
I asked sim, it told me to get haste ver neck
keen belfry
Crit kinda bad stat
keen belfry
Are you HO?
rotund zodiac
yea
keen belfry
Ye that’s fine
carmine hill
im not an HO player so i just assumed cuz of https://murlok.io/character/eu/malganis/obses/pve
keen belfry
HO just likes haste @rotund zodiac
red zinc
playing ho big dum
rotund zodiac
carmine hill
bro were playing outlaw, we shouldnt judge
keen belfry
Us KIR players must pretend we have moral high ground
Nice 5 buff that would be a shame if it only lasted 30 seconds right guys?
carmine hill
KiR is meta!
fallen knot
!gs
keen belfry
I did a DFC yesterday and I did like 1.3 billion dmg to the laborers
ornate heathBOT
Macroing gs is relatively "ok", be aware that it wont ever be entirely optimal: target swapping in m+ or putting it on a dying target for example. You can macro it to all your abilities.
fallen knot
ok it's now time to go kir
keen belfry
Nice
keen belfry
1fth too
fallen knot
yea
carmine hill
noice KiR ftw
fallen knot
i will go insane
rotund zodiac
I need to learn KiR again
fallen knot
i'll probably hit target dummies for a good hour before ever entering a key
carmine hill
do a double outlaw warrior monk key .
gaunt phoenix
And I still Wonder why sim tells me to go with 18.37% haste ^^ dslice though
That puts you at a 0.8046s gcd instead of 0.8 
late swallow
i need to eat
eat this 
frail veldt
what addon gives you the true rating and stuff
zealous plinth
That puts you at a 0.8046s gcd instead of 0.8 <:Shrugeg:1267197056888606762>
It even favors Vers crit gems > Vers haste 
proven ocean
zac do i schedule for after 1 hour or what
@vivid vessel
because idk if monksea is ready
proven ocean
good, our warrior is raiding so maybe we take a udk for now
proven ocean
udk does same dps as outlaw in priory
more dps if its malegus
but i dont think he will join
we'll see
vivid vessel
okok
lyric steeple
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
fallen knot
yea ok kir is kind of weird without broadside but manageable
vivid vessel
ye
fallen knot
i go read rtb logic
then i spam 12s
also
i need to rewire my brain to hit blade flurry on cd
proven ocean
@vivid vessel is murtaz around
or
anyone wanna do 10-12 keys
in chat
?
on EU
vivid vessel
why do you need 10s noob
strong cargo
Playing HO, should I play GS or PC in keys ? I've been playing PC for some time, no idea if it's bad in any situation or maybe some dungeons. (only ethical need, idc about overall dmg if it's bad for the key)
rotund zodiac
Playing HO, should I play GS or PC in keys ? I've been playing PC for some time,...
you can play both
craggy barn
Playing HO, should I play GS or PC in keys ? I've been playing PC for some time,...
some dungeons it has lower value, if there are too many uncapped pulls it doesnt do much
u can play both, but gs has the downside of sapping ur energy
proven ocean
i tanked 10 when i was 611 ilvl
no enchants no flask
now 633 with enchants and flasks
fallen knot
what ilvl are you now
proven ocean
should be ok i think
gaunt phoenix
HO without GS is very comfortable to have infinite energy
fallen knot
not really no
proven ocean
sure pug ur key
magic shuttle
No gs is the better build overall imo
craggy barn
much easier to play
strong cargo
HO without GS is very comfortable to have infinite energy
sims told me to go 13.5% haste, is it because of gs ?
gaunt phoenix
Removing GS yeah
mighty pivot
if you remove GS the haste requirement for HO drops dramatically (in dslice)
craggy barn
solo, how behind is the tea build from supercharger
fallen knot
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
gaunt phoenix
solo, how behind is the tea build from supercharger
Idk
thorn river
prolly like 5 hippo's
gaunt phoenix
prob at least 5%
winged depot
!wa
Hi. Am really new to rogue and kinda new to Wow, Is outlaw fun? It looks pretty cool.
Also, any rec's on which of the WA's to use?
covert kestrel
im tanking
what tank u tanking
covert kestrel
Hi. Am really new to rogue and kinda new to Wow, Is outlaw fun? It looks pretty ...
fun, but lil bit a tough of a learning curve compared to a lot of specs. Pretty unique
violet ferry
Hi. Am really new to rogue and kinda new to Wow, Is outlaw fun? It looks pretty ...
It is a lot of fun if you like high-APM
Like @covert kestrel said, it has a steep learning curve but it is very unique compared to other classes due to its toolkit
winged depot
Thanks, will try it out now. Is there one of the WA's people here favour of the ones listed in the class packs?
violet ferry
Thanks, will try it out now. Is there one of the WA's people here favour of the ...
A lot of people use Luxthos
it gives you an all-in-one look at your abilities, combo points, energy, RTB buffs, etc
white marten
The zac edit is better ngl
winged depot
How's the class compare to Enhancement?
I found it quite 'boring' in a way, Def not easy in m+ but it felt a bit bloated. I usually like harder classes in mmo's but it just didn't feel right on Enhance. Its the only character i've played.
fallen knot
enhance is an easier more normal and non griefing version of outlaw
winged depot
lmao
hot olive
we die on cd with killing spree
hasty warren
yo pirates
vivid vessel
when does outlaw do damage fellas be real with me
when you start presing your buttons
violet ferry
While controversial, many historical scholars have determined that the legend of Outlaw DPS is based in button pressing
fallen knot
next top i do i will do 4m
winged depot
I looked at some videos and I loveee the rolling dice mechanic where its RNG and ur playstyles changes up based on that a bit? That's atleast how it looked from a surface level.
Is the spec viable in mythic raids or is that just straight up griefing? 
fallen knot
so
at the end of the day
you can think of outlaw as build cp spend cp, just like stormbringer enha
rolls are just buffs that help you build and spend cp
they kind of impact gameplay but not really, since you kind of always have most of them up
hasty warren
I looked at some videos and I loveee the rolling dice mechanic where its RNG and...
outlaw is good atm
fallen knot
also
winged depot
kay thanks! will try it out and report back.
fallen knot
the diffecence from enha
is that you just go omega every pull
you do sustained damage, you dont burst 20m in the first 10globals and then afk
i mean you kind of do, but it's not enha type of burst during asc with tempests stacked
fallen knot
get 4set then press your buttons
vivid vessel
am i cooked
just get it ?
winged depot
Ya i felt like Enhance had me push a lot of buttons but it still felt scripted and kinda the same & only ascendance felt nice for a short amount of time
cunning portal
ok besides 4 set is eye of kezan or the 2 raid weapons a bigger dps increase
violet ferry
ability damage is based on your mainhand weapon, so get that thing as big as possible
vivid vessel
Don't we have like 10 catalyst charges
yes
fallen knot
probably myth weapons>>trinkets>>anything else
vivid vessel
idk how 4set is even a discussion
winged depot
My fingers might hurt then from Rogue cuz it was alrdy a time to get used to Enhance tbh and my fingers hurt at the start aha, coming from GW2 which was way more simple
fallen knot
trinekts are fake, you just want mainstat from them
winged depot
Yah I should really invest
I got a shitty mouse, a shitty keyboard and super small fingers x_X
weary cargo
Zac you are not tracking flawless form in your ui?
vivid vessel
Zac you are not tracking flawless form in your ui?
no
past falcon
ive got tiny little girl fingers
cunning portal
probably myth weapons>>trinkets>>anything else
thanks
grave carbon
What do you even bind on a 12 button mouse
past falcon
f1-12
craggy barn
i do utility
winged depot
buttons
craggy barn
all my opie wheels are naga side buttons
some people put major rotationals on them tho
past falcon
red zinc
random ass thing but
did the game die in taiwan region within the last year?
DF S3 title playercount vs TWW S2
keen belfry
whats the highest yall have hit in a pull
red zinc
wtf happened
past falcon
and my button #1 of 1-12 on my mouse is shift bc i cant acutally hit shift with my pinky and still hit my other buttons idk
grave carbon
Taiwan rogue mains
violet ferry
Bind movement, interrupt, CC, major rotational abilities, AoE, stuns, heals, buffs, defensives, and vanish on the mouse, all with Ctrl or Alt conditionals as well, that way I only press 1 2 and q with my left hand 🙂
fallen knot
i'm dumb dont even answer
grave carbon
At least we agree that hook goes on f
fallen knot
kir cooked my brain
fallen knot
At least we agree that hook goes on f
t
burnt swan
@proven ocean as assa Yea doesn't count here KEKW
proven ocean
and why's that
fallen knot
zeross is outlaw at heart
burnt swan
sadge he went assa for that then 😦
if you see Zac pumping like a maniak on law zeross can easly do to for sure
red zinc
almost like the specs do different things and one is less inclined to kill itself
fallen knot
or other group members
is there a way to get a statistic about %deaths of outlaw players because of ks vs %deaths because of missplay?
red zinc
unless you review stream vods or some shit not really
white marten
Ya i felt like Enhance had me push a lot of buttons but it still felt scripted a...
Enh and outlaw is pretty similar, biggest differences imo is Outlaw has significantly better defensives, and doesn’t have the blatant threat issues that enhance does. On the other hand Enh has better ST and on demand burst by way of Tempest and primordial wave.
fallen knot
tbh
red zinc
90%+ ks deaths are caused right after the cast finishes not because of the stagger
fallen knot
i feel way more tanky as enha just because of ks
red zinc
and you cant split that from misplays
fallen knot
true
white marten
Having to use maelstrom healing surge to heal urself as enh feels terrible
somber ridge
honestly though does anyone actually enjoy ks? I strongly feel like current outlaw without ks would be very peak design. so good in fact I don't even mind the target cap. with ks I kinda just play sin
red zinc
i can live with it
white marten
And the pre-set up as stormbringer is also dog sht
red zinc
would rather it not be there though
fallen knot
i have to say, without ks it would be kind of boring
vivid vessel
?
fallen knot
imagine having bladerush instead of ks
vivid vessel
Shut the fuck up
white marten
It would not be boring without Ks
somber ridge
oh shit you have awakened the french man
red zinc
i have to say, without ks it would be kind of boring
imagine this was the only message realz reads off outlaw discord for this month
fallen knot
might aswell go play cookie clicker
burnt swan
stovi you really wanna have a slap from the french man he haunts you with a baguette
white marten
“Having my camera spin and turn in random directions for 2 secs is so fun. Really makes the spec you know?
somber ridge
you know that meme weakaura for ww that spins your camera when you spinning crane kick? we got that built in by default, isnt that great?
and if you press the button after rolling on max cp you get to do it for a longer period of time. bonus fun
violet ferry
ah rogue life
fallen knot
and at the last frame you have that rush of adrenaline for not knowing if you live or die
so good
somber ridge
i do admit in the first 3 keys it was kinda fun. then it wasnt
red zinc
ah rogue life
thats not rogue life you're just "undergeared"
the requirements for 10s in pugs are way higher than they should be
but has nothing to do with your class
violet ferry
thats not rogue life you're just "undergeared"
lol very true
white marten
ah rogue life
No lust, no brez, no party buff. What u expect? 🤣
fallen knot
the even more fun thing is when you on a non outlaw character invite an outlaw
somber ridge
i do play my own keys whenever im on a new character and people appliyng to keys are so endlessly overgeared that usually i end up getting my 605 ilvl character boosted for free
fallen knot
and you see them dashing around
white marten
i decline every rogue in low keys lmao
What??
dense marsh
No lust, no brez, no party buff. What u expect? 🤣
I still get declined as dev evoker lmao
red zinc
if im on an undergeared alt im just inviting an okay hunter
covert kestrel
some people put major rotationals on them tho
top 6 buttons are for rotation + 1-3 q e r and the bottom 6 re defensives
white marten
I still get declined as dev evoker lmao
Bro, hitting 3k on my enh sham was SOOOO much easier than on my outlaw. I felt like I got invited to groups significantly more often
red zinc
did you do outlaw first?
red zinc
I mean i dont really get what everyone keeps talking about
fallen knot
i cba with enha rn, stormbringer was fun in s1, no more
vivid vessel
@proven ocean we go or what noob
fallen knot
did you block me zac or no
vivid vessel
yes
fallen knot
ok
proven ocean
Who are u anyways
vivid vessel
I blocked him too
we go ro what
fallen knot
u jelous zeross
white marten
i cba with enha rn, stormbringer was fun in s1, no more
Its still fun. Big damage if you know how to plan ahead and stack tempest procs
Assuming you dont pull aggro and get urself killed
glass tundra
what to pick with dinar on fresh outlaw when i dont mythic raid
glass tundra
i have capo hero already
glass tundra
mainhand crafted weap offhand event + capo
was just thinking wtf to pick after that
white marten
Prob trink then. Spare keys, wax whistle, seaforium or w.e if you play other specs
burnt swan
what to pick with dinar on fresh outlaw when i dont mythic raid
try first boss on Mythic for geargrinder is also a nice trinket or the whistle from dfc
proven ocean
@vivid vessel
white marten
Mega magnet and thug hotline pretty good too
frail veldt
Mega magnet and thug hotline pretty good too
hotline breaks our cudgel offhand
cuz you dont leave combat
so its a pretty big dps loss in m+
white marten
so its a pretty big dps loss in m+
Still very good in raid though
Love that outlaw BIS raid trinkets are basically trinkets nobody else wants. Everyone fighting for House of Cards, meanwhile outlaw “Rolls Need on Spare keys”
heavy sable
is mugzee capo MH + nightfall cudel OH the ideal for trash packs still?
frail veldt
is mugzee capo MH + nightfall cudel OH the ideal for trash packs still?
only if capo is myth track
if not then you just use any myth mainhand/crafted mainhand
heavy sable
ive got the myth track, once gallys 1h is obtained itd then be:
capo MH + nightfall OH for trash packs
capo MH + gally 1h for bosses?
heavy sable
ah dang, so then it would have to be MH
frail veldt
ive got the myth track, once gallys 1h is obtained itd then be:
capo MH + night...
yep
heavy sable
has there been a deepdive on around what mob count nightfall tends to edge out myth capo?
frail veldt
but you cant do gally swap
latent oak
has there been a deepdive on around what mob count nightfall tends to edge out m...
myth capo isnt competing since thats ur main hand
frail veldt
I think like 3 targets iirc
is when cudgel loses to myth regular offhand
I think
or was it hero capo
I forget
broken bronze
Hi guys, a strange thing happened to me on the last boss of mechagon, my killing spree literally killed me 2 times. Does anyone have an explanation?
heavy sable
myth capo isnt competing since thats ur main hand
yeah but lets say end of season we've got alot of people with gally mh and capo oh myth, so around 3 targets nightfall still edges out myth capo in OH slot?
frail veldt
Hi guys, a strange thing happened to me on the last boss of mechagon, my killing...
it teleported you into something bad
did you use it in p1 or p2
broken bronze
did you use it in p1 or p2
both
heavy sable
I think like 3 targets iirc
ty
latent oak
myth capo > myth gally as mainhand
frail veldt
looks like you hit plasma orbs
if your ks teleports you into an orb you take the damage after the ks
latent oak
so u'd be swapping between cudgel and any other myth track offhand
since u cant weapon swap gally weapon
heavy sable
ah I see
broken bronze
ok thx for the explanation
muted breach
what was that site called that shows what our "perfect sim" dmg breakdown spells would be ?,
frail veldt
raidbots?
muted breach
i dont think its raidbots, but i think i know how to find it sec
ornate heathBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
frail veldt
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/ghbbKumrjtfExzQWwkookC/simc
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/ghbbKumrjtfExzQWwkookC
latent oak
if u quick sim u can get a breakdown of ur damage
muted breach
oh it was raidbots, havent really looked at graphs and stuff before besides the regular simc spells list
latent oak
also ur details wont show exactly the same as some abilites are grouped differently etc
muted breach
been a tank this entire xpac, its insane how much ive forgotten about simming 
latent oak
u can make details show that too but its a few lines in the auto script thing in details
azure vortex
Been playing outlaw for some weeks, still noob, I'm literally trolling my party
quiet root
based
lone spear
its been a while since 662, but i think thats fine
uncut oak
anyone wanna try 17 dfc with 3 outlaw on eu?
lone spear
surely the boss will move away from the candles with 3 outlaws Clueless
uncut oak
true :D
lone spear
i cant wait to get the world first trickster kill on mythic sprocket
hybrid crown
you have to tell us how much you paid for it too tho
lone spear
look man, on our guild first kill our enhance shaman didnt have a ring on
sharp hinge
its been a while since 662, but i think thats fine
the other specs were 675+ so i wasnt sure
lone spear
cause he was re-equipping jastors
lone spear
the other specs were 675+ so i wasnt sure
its hard to tell in breakdowns alone, since tank pull count/caedence can effect it
sharp hinge
true, and i did die once. but overall it felt decent if that makes sense
lone spear
WAIT SOMEONE STOLE MY WORLD FIRST
bastard
ok its not just him theres a bunch at the bottom
surprise surprise
azure vortex
what killed me here?
hidden bay
what killed me here?
yourself
weary cargo
probably good for your ilvl, i am doing about 4,5 in priory (680ilvl), but mr. Zac can do 7mil idk what he makes differently 😄
sharp hinge
probably good for your ilvl, i am doing about 4,5 in priory (680ilvl), but mr. Z...
haha well that makes me feel better, kinda the first season i have a geared out rogue (kinda). i feel like i have the rotation down but never can be too sure
lone spear
good thing about outlaw is (usually) you can tell you're playing right by AR uptime
sometimes u get unlucky but usually its a good indicator
gaunt phoenix
Need good tanks for 7m
weary cargo
i am doing about 80% AR not possbile to fix better uptime idk unlucky on BTE crack windiws cps not resseting
hybrid crown
I just got out of priory 95% uptime
gaunt phoenix
Nah 80% is not rng
sharp hinge
gushing wounds is the play?
lone spear
you might not be rolling agressively enough, the most important factor in current uptime, for me at least, is the rolls
lone spear
gushing wounds is the play?
if you're primarily doing m+ you can do twilight dev, i havent had any ninja pull problems, but it has been reported
sharp hinge
okay kewl i got td
weary cargo
you might not be rolling agressively enough, the most important factor in curren...
ye rolls are think i have to learn, played sin before new here
young lion
hi, does anyone has weakauras for OH swap reminder ? :D
gaunt phoenix
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
lone spear
yea its also the most agressive season for rolling, rolling during subterfuge is how u know its gone crazy
gaunt phoenix
Look at zac profile page on wago
hybrid crown
man that change during KS tip was so helpful
I forgot very often
while channeling KS you can swap weapons
even in combat
young lion
Look at zac profile page on wago
aight thanks
hybrid crown
I have to press the button a few times for it to work though its a bit janky
cinder relic
yea its also the most agressive season for rolling, rolling during subterfuge is...
This guy didn't play bfa
lone spear
indeed, well not rogue anyway
gaunt phoenix
You have to press it after the gcd
lone spear
was on the ol mage, DH and woyer
gaunt phoenix
So late into KS
vapid sundial
This guy didn't play bfa
me spammin SS into opp and REroll
bfa rogue there were times you would roll 10 times in a row btw
hybrid crown
I hated roll the bones when it cost combo points
I pretty much didnt touch outlaw until DF season 3
wintry solar
This guy didn't play bfa
My memory is a bit shot up but I don't think we rerolled this much in bfa?
lone spear
god rtb costing combo points, was that in legion?
wintry solar
We rolled a lot for sure
cinder relic
Rtb was cp
lone spear
i cant even remember
cinder relic
Got turned into a cd in sl
vapid sundial
god rtb costing combo points, was that in legion?
bfa
lone spear
yall memory is wild or mine is shot
hybrid crown
I should have tried it in SL
lone spear
shit was 7 years ago
vapid sundial
Its not hard to remember something you played a lot.
hybrid crown
assa was fun in SL though
wintry solar
Damn I actually can't remember
I want to say we didn't rtb this much
We also didn't have kir or cto
hybrid crown
I hope they give us a similarly game breaking RTB 4 set next season
like
maybe something that buffs uh
cto
lone spear
eh, i would prefer they move away from rtb next tier
hybrid crown
to where you roll less but build up rtb buffs without having to press
lone spear
it was nice having common natty 5 rolls
wintry solar
I love rtb spam
white marten
Make RTB passive blizz, k thx
wintry solar
Super CtO lol
lone spear
what u mean like CtO?
white marten
Isnt that like CTO?
lone spear
i dont think rtb feels bad to press now that we have supercharger
wintry solar
Replace GM with a buff that fixes KS
keen belfry
how to not int uptime on 2nd boss dfc with candle
lone spear
i think if we dont see rogue changes (please god change ks) during 11.2, i would like them to visit a weak talent and give it some love in the tier set
gaunt phoenix
Vanish it
white marten
Replace KIR with something that makes RtB passive
gaunt phoenix
Idk having 2 grapples you dont lose much
lone spear
i would be down with a tier that buffs GSW or blade rush
make blade rush generate 5cp and do hella damage
white marten
Wtb dreadblades
burnt swan
Replace KIR with something that makes RtB passive
or Just combine count the odds with Keep it rolling
hybrid crown
oh but we would lose our pc in keys
lone spear
eh, can just drop ghostly or cto
clear basalt
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
gaunt phoenix
If the debuff to drop flames is on you then if you vanish it's gone
frail veldt
Idunno maybe make the buffs gained from cto last longer or something
They already doubled it since DF though I thought
keen belfry
dont u wanna light as many as possible
lone spear
thats why its unethical
gaunt phoenix
Ya
lone spear
but i mean aye, healers gotta earn their keep somehow
gaunt phoenix
But you'll live
wintry solar
eh, can just drop ghostly or cto
Wouldn't you have to drop both though? One for br/gsw (whichever for this hypothetical) and one for PC?
hybrid crown
only join dfc groups with 2 range
keen belfry
but also maybe im just not supposed to dmg if i have to run out and these are my buffs
gaunt phoenix
Are you kir 1fth
keen belfry
ye
lone spear
Wouldn't you have to drop both though? One for br/gsw (whichever for this hypoth...
yea, KiR builds might suffer cause of it, but idk
gaunt phoenix
Idk sometimes kir just ints bosses
lone spear
can always buff it
hybrid crown
what kinds of overalls are yall seeing with twilight dev
keen belfry
but those buffs gave me 1.64 on blazikon
gaunt phoenix
The same
keen belfry
and it felt SO bad
gaunt phoenix
Twilight is like 1.3% dmg
hybrid crown
damn
weary cargo
damn capo knuckle so op 😦
lone spear
tbf im usually the rat so i was paying it back
yea and thats a heroic one xdd
i was on vacay for mugzee and they killed it in a week
gaunt phoenix
Did you wear capo the entire key
lone spear
yea i dont do the swapping shit
gaunt phoenix
Wtf
weary cargo
next chip i will buy hero knuckle idk, i am playing hollowfall for 5+ and dagger for boss
hybrid crown
in an overall it looks like a small amount of dmg
in a big pull tho it like competes with bte
lone spear
its variance, some pulls procs heaps some doesnt
weary cargo
in overall everything over 1% on outlaw is op, because dmg breakdown is crazy by blade flurry
hybrid crown
it procs every time you vanish on everything you hit even once with even bf
you see the purple explosion from it
lone spear
OHHH ur talking weapon
hybrid crown
yea
lone spear
i thought u were still on td
yea i know the weapon is good
but i just dont wanna set up a macro and get it into muscle memory
just for me to never use it
like im already done with keys now, got all i need
i just do 4fun helping rat alts
hybrid crown
oh
does 1 pt ks not pull people on the moss boss
I was watching that only doing it when it was super safe and it looks like that might be the case
hybrid crown
ohh
lone spear
and if the casters give you lip
explain to them that the closer they are, the less they have to move for frontal
everybody wins
sharp hinge
idk how, but im beating dps who are 18 ilvls more than me?
white marten
idk how, but im beating dps who are 18 ilvls more than me?
Welcome to outlaw
First time?
sharp hinge
its just wild to me
frail veldt
idk how, but im beating dps who are 18 ilvls more than me?
theyre bad or youre goated
has nothign to do with outlaw tbh
runic bough
we did it guys
sharp hinge
so im not cooking
frail veldt
cant remember the last time I got beat on the meters
even in big pulls im still doing like 12 mil and keeping up a bit
15 if im proccing juicy
sharp hinge
i was planning to main my warrior, it just feels far too slow
late swallow
Zac is beating ross in 20s
wintry solar
i was planning to main my warrior, it just feels far too slow
Outlaw has the problem of making every other class feel slow
cloud thunder
people just suck idk
red zinc
(He did 4.5m overall so kinda cranking tbh)
gaunt phoenix
so im not cooking
u have to be good at outlaw to do good dmg
sharp hinge
Outlaw has the problem of making every other class feel slow
it just feels good to always have something to press quickly, granted the apm could go down a little and be fine. but i notice having to know mechanics more on this class because of killing spree or it can get me killed
red zinc
nah
gaunt phoenix
but you are playing 11s 12s where outlaw cranks ass
gaunt phoenix
20% ahead of the next spec
red zinc
I REQUIRE DOPAMINE
cloud thunder
i joined my friend for his resil 17s bc he knows i crank and were literally failing the key due to dmg
sharp hinge
u have to be good at outlaw to do good dmg
true, tbh i dont see many rogues. i ran like 30 dungeons yesterday on my warrior and didnt see any in que
cloud thunder
like in top im 2 mil above them
red zinc
Healer trinket effect
white marten
14-15s is the outlaw sweet spot
red zinc
Every key is good for outlaw wym
frail veldt
Every key is good for outlaw wym
eh
workshop isnt
tbh
thats the only key id consider going sin/sub
everything else is pretty great
minor lantern
!haste
ornate heathBOT
Total stat volume will look like Vers > Haste* > Crit > Mastery.
*But Haste has a **requirement ** because Adrenaline Rush lowers your GCD based on it, down to 0.8s at 25% haste.
The 
KIR build wants 18-20% haste from rating, because its only haste buff is from 
Alacrity.
The 
HO build meets this requirement with 8-10% haste from rating because of 
Take 'em by Surprise, but the new HO + Supercharger build continues to like Haste just because of energy, so you will have to sim. Your sim may settle for KIR-levels of haste (~18%) or slightly lower.
You need to use 
Raidbots Top Gear to determine what haste pieces to use.
You can also get ~4.2% haste from a flask. This can be equal or better than Vers flask if you need it for either build.
minor lantern
Oh I have 29% haste which is clearly too much
weary fog
29% out of stealth?
minor lantern
Yeah
weary fog
yeah definitely a lot of haste there
gaunt phoenix
the HO build gets +10% haste during stealth and 20s after stealth
so just making sure you aren't looking at that
minor lantern
No im sure I was in kir but thanks
icy niche
Used to be big outlaw lover a few seasons ago, not sure what has changed but besides being spammy, it doesnt seem too complicated, or am I wrong? Looking at gearing a rogue for funsies (prob not going higher than 14-15's on this alt)
barren plover
I loved Outlaw back on SL but right now i cant play it with good overalls in M+
cinder relic
Fairly simple but has a lot of room to improve
Killing Spree is also an ability u need to think about
barren plover
Whole stealth/opener windows with ambush feels weird to me. I dont like that kind of gameplay which is sad.
cinder relic
Wdym
icy niche
What do you need to think about regarding KS? Besides it being the coolest spell in wow?
wintry solar
Whole stealth/opener windows with ambush feels weird to me. I dont like that kin...
Can you elaborate on this?
civic void
What do you need to think about regarding KS? Besides it being the coolest spell...
Not dying
wintry solar
What do you need to think about regarding KS? Besides it being the coolest spell...
I love how everyone thinks it's the coolest spell until they start dying to it a lot
simple dagger
It’s cool as hell. It’s also fucking lame. Both are true.
wintry solar
Yeah in theory it's cool
foggy stump
with capo mythic knickles we drop the nightfall mace right?
civic void
with capo mythic knickles we drop the nightfall mace right?
No
barren plover
Can you elaborate on this?
After SL they reworked Outlaw and made it work with ambush/opener windows which was mandatory if you want to play it right and with good numbers. Thats what i remember from S1/S2 on DF. That spec was so different
wintry solar
But in practice 
royal hollow
with capo mythic knickles we drop the nightfall mace right?
capo mh nightfall oh
frail veldt
After SL they reworked Outlaw and made it work with ambush/opener windows which ...
in SL, subterfuge windows still mattered
cinder relic
After SL they reworked Outlaw and made it work with ambush/opener windows which ...
The spec has always revolved around vanish in some capacity
royal hollow
i dont think there was subterfuge in sl
frail veldt
they jsut shifted the power to those windows significantly more
barren plover
in SL, subterfuge windows still mattered
yes but it was not ambush spammy spec
frail veldt
i dont think there was subterfuge in sl
ofc there was
cinder relic
We weren't subterfuge in sl, but vanish was still used
frail veldt
subterfuge has been around for a while I thought
cinder relic
It was but we didn't use it
wintry solar
No that's very new to outlaw
royal hollow
i think its a df thing
frail veldt
oh sure I used it in pvp I guess
cinder relic
I also don't think outlaw had subterfuge actually
royal hollow
oh 
frail veldt
sl was sooo long ago now lol
royal hollow
frail veldt
I will say though I think they went the wrong direction when they removed dance and leaned into subterfuge
frail veldt
p sure ive said this before
wintry solar
After SL they reworked Outlaw and made it work with ambush/opener windows which ...
Yeah a spec like outlaw and subterfuge don't really get along imo.
barren plover
i remember openers on SL in M+. It was basically BF from stealth with classic rotation afterwards
frail veldt
wiiiild
cinder relic
Using vanish for damage has been a part of the spec it's entire lifespan other than exclusively bfa
wintry solar
I'm almost certain it did at one point
cinder relic
Legion was about vanish, sl was about vanish, DF was about vanish
frail veldt
yeah
frail veldt
I just thinkt hey could have solved a lot of issues if instead of leaning on vanish they instead leaned on an outlaw themed version of dance
royal hollow
im almost certain that theres no subterfuge in sl (pve), maybe there was pvp talent?
frail veldt
im almost certain that theres no subterfuge in sl (pve), maybe there was pvp tal...
I could just be entirely wrong
cinder relic
There was no subterfuge talent
cinder relic
Enjoy being dead
tropic zephyr
Trigger warning next time plz
barren plover
My point was that you didnt cared about ambush at all and after SL they made it mandatory with gameplay leaning to Sub with SD etc
royal hollow
or play kir and unbind ambush
barren plover
Yes in certain situation but that was not core gameplay
cinder relic
Well not certain situations, you did it at all times
frail veldt
You did it on cd p much haha
cinder relic
Count the odds was a very high value talent, a lot of the reason why was because of vanish
cinder relic
U didn't play dust until the very end but yeah
frail veldt
dust + er was so fun
barren plover
i mean i remember that in M+ was correct open BF
cinder relic
It was correct to do bf > stealth
Into ambush
The most correct but a bit impractical and clunky
I get not liking the damage window type playstyle of vanish. But vanish has been a core of outlaw for most times than it hasn't
barren plover
Yea, i know about vanish
cinder relic
Between MA in legion, count in sl, and then HO and crackshot for DF
young lion
Hey guys,
When im at the 20% haste, is there any reasons to not get versa/crit on my other stuffs ?
cinder relic
Hey guys,
When im at the 20% haste, is there any reasons to not get versa/crit o...
Unclear what Ur asking
barren plover
I am just lame with HO and KiR. I just cant get good numbers with it
young lion
is it better to keep building haste/versa, or versa/crit come better in terms of damage
wintry solar
I am just lame with HO and KiR. I just cant get good numbers with it
It sounds like you just don't like subterfuge and not vanish itself
Which to me are very different
barren plover
No no, its the vanish/opener windows which i dont like. Like Foreverguy mentioned.
cinder relic
That's valid
barren plover
I was fine with open/vanish/open and spammy playstyle with priorities which was something what we played many years.
wintry solar
So, for example, you don't like vanish into ambush regardless of subt?
I'm just trying to understand is all
Oh it clicked
I get it
barren plover
I'm just trying to understand is all
🙂
violet ferry
pray for my +7 ToP
wintry solar
I was fine with open/vanish/open and spammy playstyle with priorities which was ...
Isn't this the same thing?
haughty wigeon
we had master assassion lego in sl
which i think people are confusing for subt
another incarnation of outlaw synergizing w ith vanish really well with the mA kS build in early sl
cinder relic
I mean he just don't fuck with the boom bust playstyle of subterfuge crackshot atm
Which is fine
haughty wigeon
thats fine
it bounces for me
some days i enjoy crackshot, other i get bored of it
wintry solar
But he said he's fine with open/vanish/open
barren plover
yea a respect that
haughty wigeon
but i dont think it should be removed or changed for the sake of changing the spec
wintry solar
I'm probably reading too deep into it
barren plover
because you didnt cared about stealth opener for another x minutes
haughty wigeon
i still have a hate boner for vanish and its bugs even tho its not as buggy anymore.
it just seems like a new one is found every patch or something tho
wintry solar
but i dont think it should be removed or changed for the sake of changing the sp...
Wish they'd buff energy so we could have a choice
Uhuh having us by the balls is annoying
haughty wigeon
Wish they'd buff energy so we could have a choice
would have to reduce adr uptime 
cause blizzard likes tuning resource and damage to 90% uptime of specific "cd" buff
cinder relic
An energy buff wouldn't make subterfuge bad
wintry solar
No it'd make adr less powerful
cinder relic
Idk why u even begin to think this would "solve" the "problem" you have with the spec
frail veldt
No no, its the vanish/opener windows which i dont like. Like Foreverguy mentione...
honestly I agree
wintry solar
An energy buff wouldn't make subterfuge bad
Where did I say that lol
frail veldt
I dont like the downsides that come with requiring opening from stealth
cinder relic
Where did I say that lol
You've soft implied it for a long time, no?
frail veldt
I think theyve just said they hate crackshot
wintry solar
No I just flat out don't like subt on outlaw
frail veldt
p sure popos name was "crackshot hater" or something for a while
wintry solar
Yeah but there's layers to it now that's I'm wiser
cinder relic
They've nerfed resource gain in response to how many resources the spec has at a baseline after providing all these massive tools like audacity, ho, crackshot, fan
Just "buffing energy outside of ar" doesn't make ar weaker, because it doesn't matter, the spec is still able to achieve infinite ar uptime
craggy barn
guy, if theyvhad to revert ol to an older version what patch would u want
haughty wigeon
impossible
frail veldt
You could def go a route of nerfing adr uptime but then have subterfuge grant adr effects
dawn talon
i like the current crackshot playstyle but i do think a lower complexity build on the other side of the tree would be great
cinder relic
guy, if theyvhad to revert ol to an older version what patch would u want
A random sl patch probably
frail veldt
would probably lower the barrier to entry too
cinder relic
Any would work
dawn talon
you could even change fatebound to enable a more sl or late bfa style build
haughty wigeon
i like the current crackshot playstyle but i do think a lower complexity build o...
i mean that already exists
craggy barn
even s1?
haughty wigeon
ho
dawn talon
there is a lot of open design space with the spec
cinder relic
Sl s1 was fine for outlaw so yeah
frail veldt
i mean that already exists
not really
cinder relic
Ho plays nothing like old outlaw lmao
frail veldt
HO is lower in complexity compared to KiR but not compared to the rest of wow
frail veldt
and yeah current HO is def very different from old outlaw
burnt swan
bfa & SL S4 whas the Best imo
dawn talon
there should be a viable build johnny ret can pick up bc he likes pirates
haughty wigeon
but we shouldnt really put outlaw down to the avergae level of wow spec complexity me thinks
craggy barn
gsw build when
dawn talon
and while we're at it, make it similar in at least some capacity to late bfa/sl outlaw
haughty wigeon
but thats just my own personal opinion and frankly it could be wrong
frail veldt
but we shouldnt really put outlaw down to the avergae level of wow spec complexi...
I dont think having on build variant that is easy to play is bad though
I think that would be healthy for the spec
dawn talon
but we shouldnt really put outlaw down to the avergae level of wow spec complexi...
i think it should be a viable possibility
frail veldt
and by easy I mean easy easy
cinder relic
and while we're at it, make it similar in at least some capacity to late bfa/sl ...
It's impossible to coexist with talents as powerful as uhuh crackshot and fan
frail veldt
like no crackshot just ambush/PS proc rotation with a little gsw value or something
dawn talon
It's impossible to coexist with talents as powerful as uhuh crackshot and fan
i think fth just needs to be nerfed anyway it crowds out other resource gen
cinder relic
This design philosophy also isn't how really any class in wow works. There's not really two builds that are just two different classes like people ask of "old school sl outlaw" and "modern outlaw" lol
patent mirage
No
haughty wigeon
and by easy I mean easy easy
that would require somewhat of a overhaul of the core spec, and the difference between the two has to be somewhat decent amount to justify. ya it can be healthy for the spec
burnt swan
would be better to remove crackshot and take a turn like other expansions
haughty wigeon
but the community ultimately doesnt like healthiness
frail veldt
that would require somewhat of a overhaul of the core spec, and the difference b...
I disagree
cinder relic
U can play x hero talent or y hero talent for a lot of classes, but they aren't extremely different from each other like old and new outlaw are
frail veldt
I think it would be as easy as putting a choice node where UHUH is
cinder relic
It's not just uhuh tho lol
frail veldt
change this to something that buffs builder damage or something
cinder relic
It's fan, it's uhuh, it's subterfuge, it's crackshot, it's audacity, it's ho
It's everything
wintry solar
would be better to remove crackshot and take a turn like other expansions
Talents like that usually last a couple expansions so maybe it's gone next expansion.
frail veldt
UHUH is partly why we are designed around adr and crackshot
uhuh is the core of outlaw atm
craggy barn
the alt playstyles specs are usually bad tho, like SMF fury
cinder relic
The spec at the start of DF was not old outlaw either, all it had was ho and fan
haughty wigeon
change this to something that buffs builder damage or something
i can agree with that
cinder relic
Removing uhuh doesn't bring back old outlaw
frail veldt
Removing uhuh doesn't bring back old outlaw
it doesnt on its own
haughty wigeon
uhuh is a problematic talent that kinda is a huge factor to our eneergy problems rn
patent mirage
Old outlaw is gone
dawn talon
U can play x hero talent or y hero talent for a lot of classes, but they aren't ...
totemic and stormbringer play wildly differently for enhance even though they both can be simplified to spending malestrom efficiently
haughty wigeon
idk maybe im just cynic rn
dawn talon
i don't see why that wouldn't be possible for outlaw aswell
haughty wigeon
cause of mover vs no mover havoc
frail veldt
You have to put a UHUH substitute in the spec if you want to allow for non stealth based builds to compete imo
cinder relic
totemic and stormbringer play wildly differently for enhance even though they bo...
Explain to me how you make old bfa outlaw and new outlaw when u have to contend with fan, uhuh, crackshot, ho and kir existing
haughty wigeon
had movers only had a 5% gain on no movers. but yet was removed despite being a healthy spec dyversity thing
cinder relic
How do u design and balance a spec with talents that literally 3x its resource gain
haughty wigeon
so now you only have on movers
burnt swan
Talents like that usually last a couple expansions so maybe it's gone next expan...
Hopefully they do
patent mirage
Uhuh or crackshot wont go without a major rework
frail veldt
crackshot isnt really a problem imo
haughty wigeon
cause vr and felblade instantly canceling movement kinda kills the appeal of movement to begin with. yet the community wants it all removed/killed despite the difference between the two specs being marginal at best and means nothing in weekly 10's
crackshot isnt a issue
craggy barn
crackshot + ace technically is a problem
patent mirage
Is it though
dawn talon
nerf fth audacity and maaaybe base opportunity proc rate, make crackshot only accessible through uhuh at the bottom, and put other viable talents on the other side of the tree