outlaw

[gaunt phoenix]

Also on mythic sprocket you cant use killing spree or you wipe the raid so you have to be fatebound

[wanton parcel]

Is KIR more RNG dependent for ST dmg than HO?

Been switching between KIR and HO in M+.

HO I’m almost always 1.7m-2.2m.
Kir I’m around 1.2-1.6m unless I hit 5
Bones on open.

Maybe I’m playing it wrong but im prio on keep AR>KS>coup>vanish crack windows

[tired marlin]

Oy okay 🙂 danke

[gaunt phoenix]

HO vs KIR 1 FTH should have similar RNG overall

KIR 2 FTH is more consistent

[wanton parcel]

I’m using 1 FTH kir

I sim around 2.1m ST with the M+ KIr build @680illvl, 20%haste 31% verse. I never come close to my sim dps as KIr. I gotta be damaged in the head or something

[gaunt phoenix]

it is harder and the rtb rules are slightly esoteric

!kir

[ornate heath]

KIR build compared to HO:

• doesn't use ambush, uses the same builder priority inside and outside of stealth
• is more cp efficient with pistol shot usage (see faq)
• has to use KIR itself as soon as you hit 4 buffs from RTB/CTO
• has an additional reroll logic after pressing KIR (see faq)
• is more punishing if you mess up builder priority at a given moment
• needs 19% haste from rating to reach 25% during adrenaline rush after alacrity

[gaunt phoenix]

also really likes the trickster optimizations in pin

Prio SS when unseen blades are ready

[wanton parcel]

Maybe it’s the tricker part I’m messing up. I don’t time the hero talent passive for trickster much

I have the bones weakaura that says when to reroll and such

[gaunt phoenix]

do u trust it

Ive never tested if some WA captures KIR rules correctly

other than the faq one https://wago.io/TIgC_QiQz

but it doesnt tell you to reroll, just shows the buffs that will be preserved through rtb casts

[wanton parcel]

I use that one as well

[fallen knot]

it basically tells you when to reroll

like

[wanton parcel]

It’s pretty good but I’ll hold reroll a or timings sometimes. Like if im missing buff 6 and it says to reroll. I’ll hold out for as long as I can maybe 6-7 secs and then KIR to keep buffs while fishing for last buff

[tender wedge]

let hekili tell you when to reroll and KiR 😉

[fallen knot]

from rtb logic if you know it

doesnt it

[red zinc]

priory such an annoying dungeon man

aaa

what compels anyone to pull this

[fallen knot]

yee try that + the 3guys near the buff

[red zinc]

we had 5 deaths

and the tank has the audacity to say "its a normal pull"

[fallen knot]

just after your ele shaman used 3min asc

on the pull before

[quiet root]

unless i'm misunderstanding you, you should never be in the situation where KIR is up, you are missing buff 6, and it tells you to reroll (and not to KIR)

[red zinc]

2 minute buffer before that too

[gaunt phoenix]

priory compels people to pull like monkeys

Monkey see lots of nameplates, must pull

[vivid vessel]

@fallen knot did you like how i pulled priory

[red zinc]

it should be so easily timeable man

[fallen knot]

yes it was omega

[red zinc]

im losin all hope

[fallen knot]

ngl

[vivid vessel]

its how we do it in high keys

[fallen knot]

pulls before 2nd boss i was blasting

[vivid vessel]

chill route right

nothing hard

[fallen knot]

well

pull before 2nd miniboss

[vivid vessel]

i just modifed the very start cause otherwise its a shroud pack

[fallen knot]

double channeler and double caster is scary

[vivid vessel]

ye true

[fallen knot]

probably hardest pull of the istance no?

like you get double channeled you just die

not you but any other guy

[wanton parcel]

So let’s say I reroll and hit 5 buffs and I’m missing last buff. It’ll say to KIR but if it’s like CDR or Crit I’ll hold for a few GCDs trying to fish for the final buff before I KiR to get all the buffs

[quiet root]

right it'll tell you to KIR, not to reroll, exactly

[wanton parcel]

Or it’ll say to reroll during sub windows and I’ll wait to reroll till after if I have crit / CDR up

There’s small optimizations I feel that it doesn’t do

I noticed a lot of it while watching shades on YouTube doing high keys

[gaunt phoenix]

Delaying KIR until the 6th buff is fine

not really a proven dps gain (e.g. sim dps doesnt change)

[frail veldt]

Well that would be wrong lol

[latent oak]

my rugby team lost to the frenchies in the final today

[gaunt phoenix]

Not rolling in stealth is tricky, you can miss a lot of RTB cdr if you dont do it

[frail veldt]

The rule I follow is to roll in the first half

It has less feelsbad

[wanton parcel]

You think we should reroll with crit and CDR during our crackshot / sub window?

[quiet root]

delaying kir to have all yellow buffs feels good, but in reality i think you just CTO into the last buff basically perma anyway

[frail veldt]

Yeup, simmed it and it's a loss to ignore a roll condition even if it's good buffs

Small loss

But still

[latent oak]

doesnt the sim say to just send rtb even towards the end of crackshot window

[gaunt phoenix]

I dont KIR anymore but as HO i'm def slamming rolls

[wanton parcel]

I’ve rerolled into doggo single buffs soo much doing it during the window

Hmmm

HO feels better cause we can ambush and have better combo gen naturally

[quiet root]

you get to supercharge subterfuged btes though

if you roll in stealth

[gaunt phoenix]

yes the base rule is to roll in stealth or not. but if you want to consider the last gcds of stealth it's fine

[latent oak]

which is more ace procs

[wanton parcel]

That’s what I normally do.
After window I reroll into KS > coup then go into next vanish

[latent oak]

yaya i figured

[pastel sierra]

I had a tank pull the forbidden 5 mage pull

Patrol plus door plus the 2 upper ones

[fallen knot]

ok zac weakaura rtb is bis gg

now i go steal his plater

[wanton parcel]

Is zacs plater profile in the WA links?

!wa

[ornate heath]

Class packs:

• Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
• Zac's Group Devlin
  Utilities:
• Combo Point Standalone
• Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
• Ace refund sound trigger
• RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
• Unseen Blade tracker
  Fun:
• Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
• KS Ticking damage taken

[obtuse hollow]

Should I AR if my current one is still active to keep the cycling going?

[latent oak]

yes

for combo points

[pastel sierra]

Unless there's non stealth downtime coming up yeah

[obtuse hollow]

Thankss

[pastel sierra]

Love pressing AR right before getting put on a ball or stix flies up

[vapid sundial]

Gotta hold it man

Gotta fight the urges

Fight the powah

[twilit apex]

Is twlight dev cooking rn people running it on mugzee............ Nevermind i saw the pin

[white marten]

Real men pop AR + pots right before downtime phase

[pastel sierra]

Before i tried any other spec i literally didn't know fight timers

Then i sent full cds on sub right before he went up

Now i remember to watch them

[sharp wharf]

how does 1h trick work btw? is it legit i get meleed while pulling for tank?

[cinder relic]

Use a ranged attack to pull for tanks

[sharp wharf]

ah okkay

[vivid vessel]

its not different than normal tricks in that regard, if no one has aggro on mobs, you will get the first melee if you, lets say, open from stealth with blade flurry

but you also need to activate the 1 hour trickz by hitting something first, otherwise you only have the 30s buff right

[hollow temple]

imagine 18 rook running smooth af no deaths, good pulls, good dps and then at last boss 2 people panicked so hard when i used KS on crystal timer debuff they left their crystal to run overto mine and when i landed back from my KS animation they panicked again trying to run back to their crystal and failed... at the end 2 people died out of confusion

better play more often with outlaw to familiarize urself with KS

take it or go home

[sharp wharf]

so if i aggro even with trick i get meleed so it's better to pull with pistolshot or just wait? or to proc it again i've to press it again

[red zinc]

you just dont pull for the tank

[hollow temple]

i usually do BF or yeah initial PS into rotation

[red zinc]

if he does literally 1 grain of damage you can then proc your initial tricks after

[hollow temple]

but if you are melee and start aggroing you get 1shot

[red zinc]

and then you're fine

[vivid vessel]

unless you pull wiht a ranged attack you will always get meleed first if you are the one that initiated combat

one set of melee before it redirect

[red zinc]

got a good hyjal hunter

instantly timed the key

[vivid vessel]

whats the name

[red zinc]

i mean not good good

just adequate

[sharp wharf]

good to know thx

[red zinc]

these mfs were doing 4m overall in a 17 psf

[vivid vessel]

hyjal is french tho

!

[red zinc]

out of all my 17s workshop was the fastest

?!

[vapid sundial]

!!

[vivid vessel]

wioth a french guy ??

[red zinc]

no that one wasnt

[vivid vessel]

timing with frenchs

[vapid sundial]

zac self hating french

wtf

[vivid vessel]

bro

i wanna play outlaw so bad rn

[vapid sundial]

so play

[red zinc]

he fiending for the next outlaw dose

[vivid vessel]

i cant

i timed all the keys

i cant lfg anymore

[vapid sundial]

2nd character

go again

[vivid vessel]

im prisoner

of

idk

nothing now

[red zinc]

leave the house

admire nature

[vapid sundial]

play nehance

[vivid vessel]

also my offcers keep messaging me about gearing my monk alt

idk whats up with that

[vapid sundial]

nah

fuck that

[vivid vessel]

litteral harrasment

[red zinc]

just make a second outlaw

[vivid vessel]

im not playing alts ! ! ! !

nooo ! !

[vapid sundial]

tell them no

[red zinc]

zac

[vivid vessel]

leave me alone

[red zinc]

if you make another outlaw

it wont feel like you're playing alt

and you can do keys

crazy

(mental illness)

[vivid vessel]

i mean i have

4 outlaws already

[vapid sundial]

ok and

[red zinc]

yeah but that was for advance wasnt it

they are ill

[vivid vessel]

they just arent geared cause i was asked to play monk instead as alt

they are ok

like 626 type shit

garbonzo ye

[vivid vessel]

next tier i will enter negociations

to have triple rogue

[stray star]

How much se Loose on using ks with low cp?

[vapid sundial]

me when i suffer the consequences of my actions

[vivid vessel]

now is not the time yet

my monk tho

look at him

[vapid sundial]

Bro

thats not a monk

[vivid vessel]

he is so big

[vapid sundial]

the fuck

[red zinc]

he got the swag goggles

[vivid vessel]

thats a monk !

bro he is BIG

BIG BIG

[red zinc]

not big on meters though

[vivid vessel]

!!

wtf

stop hating

[vapid sundial]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-angry-angry-mad-cat-meme-gif-17719456655395931550

zac rn

zac!

You dm me when outlaw fix

and i can play wow again

yes?

[vivid vessel]

ryker

[snow socket]

bois, im losing my shit over ks, how far behind is the last season's fatebound talent build?

[vivid vessel]

did you kno

outlaw is like

[snow socket]

keys ofc

[vivid vessel]

mega rn

its just you have ks

but

[vapid sundial]

yeah

Thats

the problem

[vivid vessel]

rotation is insane fun

[vapid sundial]

tho

[red zinc]

real footage

[vivid vessel]

and its doing big dam

[vivid vessel]

!!!

[vapid sundial]

I really dont like killing spree

it makes me mad

[vivid vessel]

you didnt even try tho

its so easy to do better

[runic bough]

yeah i got muted for one of my killingspree copy/pastas

[red zinc]

why would i do better

the point is that its fake

thats the joke

[runic bough]

killingspree is so tilting

[vivid vessel]

welcome back ryu

glad i see you went sub now

[vapid sundial]

LOL

hahahahah

[red zinc]

going from 17 to 18 pugs is crazy wtf

[runic bough]

my sub dmg sucks tho, still have to play outlaw

[red zinc]

every group is god comp now

in lfg

[vapid sundial]

yah

See part of me is like

[red zinc]

these nephews so cooked

[vapid sundial]

'outlaw good, i want to push'

but then i look and go

'but kir and ks'

[snow socket]

is the kir fatebound build that much behind?

[vapid sundial]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-insane-gif-21702784

[runic bough]

kir is fun its just ks that causes massive rage moments

[vapid sundial]

I dont like kir

[vivid vessel]

ok i need to do keys

wtf

im addicted

this is crazy

[red zinc]

30% or smth

[vapid sundial]

https://tenor.com/view/kitty-baby-speech-bubble-cat-speech-baby-cat-gif-4142671478724681183

[red zinc]

on aoe

[runic bough]

ty zac

[snow socket]

wtf, really? jesus fuck

[runic bough]

zac is good to watch on ks timing

[vapid sundial]

yeah but watching wow gameplay is

[red zinc]

yeah but we needed to buff frostfire mage for the seventeenth time

[vapid sundial]

💤

[red zinc]

[vapid sundial]

like

i cant think of anything more snooze inducing

than watching someone play wow

ig maybe taking melatonin

[vivid vessel]

??

[red zinc]

watching croquet tournaments

probably worse

[frank finch]

idk watching zac gap zeross in that + 20 was fun to watch

[vapid sundial]

xd

but nah legit

i cant stand watchign wow

[runic bough]

yeah but when you watch your class play at the highest level it can help you learn how to play

[vapid sundial]

or i can just

pick up enh and get title first season playing

instead

[runic bough]

i missed it

[vivid vessel]

you missed some banger keys ryu

unfortunate

[vapid sundial]

bang her?

[runic bough]

damnit

[vapid sundial]

hardly know her

[frank finch]

its to a point now where zeross says if they fix ks il swap insta

no more trolling outlaw dmg

[runic bough]

thats everybody and their mom tho

[formal jay]

Groups DH has some issues with screen and we are now testing WoW mobile apparently

[frank finch]

not zeross

[vapid sundial]

what the fuck is that ui

[frank finch]

he trolling outlaw for mnonths now

[vapid sundial]

nascar??

[formal jay]

His screen is putting it sideways

lmao

On his like 3rd monitor somehow

[red zinc]

admin hes doing it sideways

[vapid sundial]

doing it silly string style

ykwim

[formal jay]

This is funny as fuck

[vapid sundial]

I ahve a friend trying to get me into marvel rivals

and another smite

i just wanna be free

[runic bough]

i mean

outlaw will be the most funnest spec once ks is removed

tuned really good rn

[vapid sundial]

i wanna live in an outlaw paradise where the rolls are plenty

[frank finch]

theres a chance we could get buffed to

kinda crazy

[vapid sundial]

removing ks biggest buff alive

negl

frfr

ong

[red zinc]

it aint getting removed

they're reworking the whole class around ks

[vapid sundial]

https://tenor.com/view/coughing-cough-rkelly-surprised-gif-9601169

[runic bough]

i mean if they keep ks with no removal, at least increase the dmg for having it

[vapid sundial]

Just cut my balls off at that point

tbh

[runic bough]

if it does unholy dk 30mil aoe tho

Id not care it can kill me

[vapid sundial]

why stop there

take the shaft too

[red zinc]

ryu insensitive joke waiting room

can you do it already

[frank finch]

if we were garentueed top dps on every boss u an use ks on i would take a dmg buff to it and keep it the same

im toxic tho

[runic bough]

timmy please go to the roast channel

do your roasting there

this is outlaw

[vapid sundial]

I scratched before a with ghost pepper sauce on my hand

rather repeat that

than play with ks

idk

[runic bough]

yes thats also true

It would still suck to play

[vapid sundial]

maybe if KS brings me breakfast in bed

i will consider it

[vapid sundial]

wher at

[runic bough]

lol

but for real

sub is fun too

i just suck at it

[vapid sundial]

I would reather playt sub than sin

i will give yo uthat

[runic bough]

sub has the ace procs

and bf

if only i could figure it out faster

[vapid sundial]

isnt sub like mostly super consistent now

or whta

[runic bough]

I have no energy most of the time

[cinder relic]

About as "cosnsitent" as more specs are

[vapid sundial]

I have only played high roll gamba specs lol

Enh last season and outlaw

[runic bough]

Its about using your cd's like KiR imo

or u have no energy

[vapid sundial]

i fucked with a bit of sub before but

just enough to show guild i could play it if we rly needed

[runic bough]

like imagine no adr, thats sub

[vapid sundial]

Oh enhance how you have fallen in rng

gg

[runic bough]

if i could figure out how to not run out of energy im sure sub will be great until ks is removed

[cinder relic]

Running out of energy is the point

[vapid sundial]

You are supposed to pool on sub

arnet you

'pool'

[cinder relic]

no

[red zinc]

you dont pool you just dont have energy outside cds

is what it is

[red zinc]

[vapid sundial]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1078500556139659357/1266583932426653826/attachment.gif

[late swallow]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/732789561482149920/1005028701232177222/attachment.gif

[red zinc]

me and lil twin locked in

[vapid sundial]

https://tenor.com/view/the-peeper-speech-bubble-gif-25522030

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/449080055893590017/1278016827951157309/test23456.gif

[red zinc]

this gotta be like one of the most closely tuned seasons in a while

in terms of damage

i get the best comp has like crazy util that other classes cant beat

[latent oak]

have u pressed control alt shift w yet

[red zinc]

but its so frustrating people in 18s only play this comp theres no need for all this

[runic bough]

insta dies that is great ty for laughs

[vapid sundial]

Its a classic

[red zinc]

you should try ctrl+alt+shift+windows+L

[desert tendon]

https://x.com/NasDaCN/status/1926043499037601843

NasDa (@NasDaCN)

WoW China Retail Class Target Dummy Competition

Blizzard China and NetEase hosted a WoW Retail Class Target Dummy Competition and they've invited top CN players from each class to showcase their optimal single-target and AoE rotations and how their Hero Talents perform in 1, 5

X · May 23, 2025, 10:32 PM

@vivid vessel

i cant wait for u to participate and show 20 targets outlaw

[latent oak]

that is sick ngl

[vapid sundial]

I need to find a game to play to sink my time

that isnt wow ff or destiny

god

[desert tendon]

basically not a mmo

[vapid sundial]

if only lost ark wasnt such a p2w shit show

[red zinc]

wait

[vapid sundial]

[runic bough]

helldivers2 is pretty fun for a few hours

[red zinc]

how do i read that

[desert tendon]

99.90% of the games on the market arent mmo, you ll find you shoes

[vapid sundial]

I like mmos

i want an mmo

but not those 3

ff is too slow

[latent oak]

path of exile ezpz

[desert tendon]

runescape old school

[runic bough]

there is no mmo outside wow except ff14

[desert tendon]

runescape retail

runescape private

[red zinc]

they're doing 20m sustained on 20 targets

as fire

that doesnt feel that crazy

[vapid sundial]

I will never feel the high enh got me last season

of hitting 40m burst

in SV open pack

[red zinc]

or not even sustained

1min burst

20mill on 20t?

[vapid sundial]

thats like

[red zinc]

huh

[vapid sundial]

super low

right

[red zinc]

feel like it should be higher ye

maybe mage just doesnt have that kind of burst idk

[vapid sundial]

I think my 2nd highest was 32m in NW

I fucking emlted that first pack

good times

[red zinc]

frost mage best aoe

isnt what i was expecting

[vivid vessel]

chinese play some frost

in keys

its just not a thing eu and na likes idk why

[latent oak]

they nailed the fx of tempest

[vapid sundial]

Chinese always play something weird

[red zinc]

dont these numbers look turbo low?

[vapid sundial]

dont they

[red zinc]

like surely they dont have gear or something

[vapid sundial]

proper tempest managment was so fun

[late swallow]

the lofi thing?

[desert tendon]

frost is really really really good

[vapid sundial]

you got to do such stupid # s

[latent oak]

ya its cool just thought u might like it :)

[desert tendon]

since begining of the tier i m saying fire is trash and frost is the best by far

[runic bough]

damn it took 24 years to get a single target and aoe comparison tournement

[late swallow]

it's super neat man thanks for showing me 🙂

[desert tendon]

then they buffed arcane by 20%

[vapid sundial]

he is telling u to stfu

[red zinc]

1min 5 targets and its only 6m?

[vapid sundial]

stop being dense

smh

[red zinc]

BUH

[runic bough]

Once they test outlaw on 20 targets surely we get uncapped

[vapid sundial]

https://tenor.com/view/buh-gif-14465458220549268962

[red zinc]

they should uncap mute duration so we dont have to read another message

[vapid sundial]

Ryu u are making people hate you

gg

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/780377679227650079/1143175175391674418/Viberge.gif

[runic bough]

Timmy is just a hater

[vapid sundial]

dw i have people in here who hate me too

yappers

[vivid vessel]

ye me

[runic bough]

but yeah i kinda went crazy from ks deaths other day

[vivid vessel]

i hate you ryker

[vapid sundial]

fr

on god

wtf

zac!

!!!!

[red zinc]

ryker you cant even funny like this guy anymore

[vivid vessel]

timmy

[latent oak]

zac ur country beat my country in the rugby

[vivid vessel]

do you hate me

[desert tendon]

zac

[red zinc]

nah

[desert tendon]

why do they call that

tacos

[red zinc]

ur french that sall

[desert tendon]

answer please

[vivid vessel]

oh nice didnt know

we play rugdby?

[proven ocean]

@vivid vessel

[vivid vessel]

censi did you know

[proven ocean]

we will try double rogue + udk later at some point

[vapid sundial]

Im just burnt

[proven ocean]

i recon it'll be super crazy

[vapid sundial]

its too exhausting

[vivid vessel]

thats cooked on god

i need my war buff

[late swallow]

Anyone here tried any no-rogue comps?

Any good?

[fathom bramble]

I do literally zero damage in no-rogue comps

[vapid sundial]

RageFroge

@vivid vessel

[vivid vessel]

wtf is a no rogue comp

[late swallow]

Weird!

[red zinc]

goober genuinely believes deep state exists

[magic shuttle]

Physical comp but hunter instead of rogue

[vapid sundial]

frfr on god lets go

[desert tendon]

timed all the key i ve done without a rogue

[red zinc]

hunter is just worse rogue

[desert tendon]

just saying

[magic shuttle]

Marksman blasts

[red zinc]

ok but what does it bring that law doesnt

[vivid vessel]

bansher has done some of the highest numebrs

of any specs

in some keys

[red zinc]

ye but nobody else does

[vivid vessel]

he smashed me in top look

[desert tendon]

banshers is built diff

must be french

only frenchies do big damage

[red zinc]

like

[desert tendon]

just saying

[red zinc]

his character just has an aura buff

that nobody else has

is what it is

[vapid sundial]

on god

bro im losing it

[proven ocean]

zac

[red zinc]

i feel like i could do 5m details dps on top with buffs

[desert tendon]

zac

[proven ocean]

are u gonna talk about how u got destroyed on 1st boss ToP?

[vivid vessel]

ross

[red zinc]

definitely not that though

[proven ocean]

by the warrior

?

[vivid vessel]

well i had dogshit rng tbf

[proven ocean]

outlaw cant do 8m on 1st boss ToP

sounds like skill issue to me

[runic bough]

if we didnt have to ks our single target will go way up

[proven ocean]

arms 8m'ed its ass out of this planet

[vivid vessel]

are we going to talk about

how you got

absolutely

destroyed

almost bellow tank

or

[vapid sundial]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/316923682607857685/1375990781961044009/image.png?ex=6833b2c7&is=68326147&hm=977cfe92c714bd5877ced235b8e08a7b9d3281d63182f9b6450d7817804a60c6&

[proven ocean]

no 2mins

thats why

only once

[red zinc]

closer to the tank than to zac

[proven ocean]

well i do 7m if i send 2 mins again

but i didnt

[vivid vessel]

okok

[magic shuttle]

Arms blasts

[vivid vessel]

and if we just had a second outlaw

we would have killed the boss 20 second earlier

[magic shuttle]

And it's getting buffed next week

[vivid vessel]

stop yapping now

[red zinc]

doesnt do shit

[vapid sundial]

Real way to play wow is

[red zinc]

according to guy

[vapid sundial]

turn details off

[runic bough]

[vapid sundial]

ask for externals

and blast

[desert tendon]

yea stop yapping

[vapid sundial]

https://tenor.com/view/getting-out-of-leaving-gotta-go-cars-fast-cars-gif-17957775

[desert tendon]

or else

[vivid vessel]

but ye i think its just rng

[desert tendon]

i ll yap

[vivid vessel]

i prolly can beat him

depends

i mean its lust pull

i gain nothing from lust

[red zinc]

we should send zeross to new jersey

[vivid vessel]

but ye

[red zinc]

!!

[vapid sundial]

They need to change lust and let u pick what stat u get

fr

[magic shuttle]

You gain infinite energy regen

[red zinc]

would be wicked

never happening though

[vapid sundial]

Yeah

but it should

One of the things i like about ff combat

its just flat dmg % bs

for raid bufs

[vivid vessel]

BRO I NEED TO DO KEYS

[red zinc]

go to sleep

[vapid sundial]

https://tenor.com/view/allianz-direct-key-swinging-car-keys-gif-17689328

[runic bough]

zac we have until august

until next season

[vivid vessel]

since i got these new swords

i feel like

im doing

20% more damage

[red zinc]

Hey im keys

[vivid vessel]

no cap on god fr

[vivid vessel]

no

listen timmy

i like cocks

just not on mens

[red zinc]

vrazy

[vapid sundial]

zac i make eu account and you carry me

fr

[vivid vessel]

no

[vapid sundial]

200ms

yes

[runic bough]

500ms

[vivid vessel]

i need to boost keys tho

i have nothing else to do now that i cant push

[vapid sundial]

I will give you $1 an hour

[vivid vessel]

and i have 0 gold

litteraly poorest mf in ravenhold no cap

[vapid sundial]

no

cuz i gavem y gold away

when i quit

i have like

20s

[desert tendon]

that s really bizarre

[frail veldt]

idk fast ks feels great

[vivid vessel]

sure

it does right

what a missed opportunity

[frail veldt]

lol

[vivid vessel]

fucking

[frail veldt]

crazy idea

[vivid vessel]

devs i cba

[frail veldt]

how good outlaw would feel

if only

[vivid vessel]

if onlyt we had a dev ye

[runic bough]

yeah but ks also lasts longer often and when it doesnt time correctly and u dead it doesnt feel good no more

If i time my ks to hook away from mech and it lasts longer, im dead

so u have to pre-pre-pre ks incase it lasts longer

[vapid sundial]

alright boys

no more yap

i will be back later

hold my spot for me

fr

[magic shuttle]

Holding

[frail veldt]

it only lasts longer if you have supercharger up

just have to pay attention

[runic bough]

not even that

[frail veldt]

wdym

[runic bough]

sometimes its slow between teleports

[frail veldt]

no

[runic bough]

yes

[frail veldt]

only if youre lagging

get fiber internet

[runic bough]

my neighborhood is not fiber

[frail veldt]

rip

Yeah I mean lag can kill you always

[runic bough]

so if ks isnt removed they need to fix it during lag too

not all abilities prolong duration during lag

ks is a multi issue ability

[frail veldt]

movement abilities area always impacted by lag

[vivid vessel]

i mean

ks is an extreme mewo

[frail veldt]

only way they fix it is to remove the movement

I mean its an extreme cuz its like it uses 6 movement abilities in a row

and waits for the previous one to finish

its spaghetti coded af for sure

which is prob why it has so many stagger bugs

[snow socket]

how much haste is ideal for HO?

[frail veldt]

if playing PC without GS then like 14-16% if playing with GS then 17-19ish

[snow socket]

so still considerably higher than alst tier, tahnks buddy!

[frail veldt]

for HO yes

since we play supercharge now instead of vigor

[runic bough]

what

my haste is 11%

[frail veldt]

!haste

[ornate heath]

Total stat volume will look like Vers > Haste* > Crit > Mastery.

*But Haste has a **requirement ** because Adrenaline Rush lowers your GCD based on it, down to 0.8s at 25% haste.

The KIR build wants 18-20% haste from rating, because its only haste buff is from Alacrity.

The HO build meets this requirement with 8-10% haste from rating because of Take 'em by Surprise, but the new HO + Supercharger build continues to like Haste just because of energy, so you will have to sim. Your sim may settle for KIR-levels of haste (~18%) or slightly lower.

You need to use Raidbots Top Gear to determine what haste pieces to use.
You can also get ~4.2% haste from a flask. This can be equal or better than Vers flask if you need it for either build.

[frail veldt]

well fix that then ryu

youre playing kir with 11%?

is this your first day dog?

[runic bough]

well im kir now so i have kir haste

[frail veldt]

so your haste isnt 11%

[runic bough]

but when i played ho tricks it was 11%

[frail veldt]

thats silly

[runic bough]

hmm

ill try it again with 15%

[proven ocean]

@vivid vessel

wanna come

quick priory 20

[vivid vessel]

hm

who am i replacing

dk or war

[proven ocean]

dk

[rapid chasm]

I need them to buff fatebound so I don't have to play this teleporting shit

[proven ocean]

come

[vivid vessel]

alright

1 or 2 key

not much more

2am alreayd

[proven ocean]

yes

come

not long sessh

we're only doing 1 key

zac

@vivid vessel

[runic bough]

tuning into zac stream now

battle shout and windfury

should be good

[ember goblet]

!log

[tender wedge]

ryu why are you blue now

identity crisis?

[lime lake]

he has to swap spec every time he gets muted

[tender wedge]

i'd rather be blanket muted than play sub

[vapid sundial]

nah

rather play sub than sin

[runic bough]

no i switch spec everytime ks makes me rage

[white marten]

Do you guys use KS before Coup or after?

[white marten]

Use that fuel for more dps

[vivid vine]

think you want to use it after

since you get stacks from ks that increase finisher dmg

[white marten]

Ah true. Do we care to track FF stacks?

[fathom bramble]

getting KS on cooldown faster is super good

and the the extra CP from the coup cast recovers a lot of KS cd

[white marten]

Good to know

[runic bough]

i think devlins wa tracks it cuz I get an indicator for using coup

[white marten]

Bruh, casting KS without cloak on the Witch boss in ToP is literally asking to die

Must resist urge to pad on adds while orbs are passing through

[runic bough]

last boss sucks

the boss is the same color as the background

[vivid vine]

i just send ks on orb boss

healer prob

[runic bough]

the platform is the same color as the background and the boss

[vivid vine]

doesnt oneshot me

[runic bough]

blizzard has this thing where they make everything the same color and the mechanics is to determine where the boss is facing.

[vivid vine]

just make sure you dont end up in an orb at the end of k

s

[runic bough]

or infront of her during a frontal

[vivid vine]

seeing the bonks in DFC with a pala tank is abit hard for me

concecration with faint orange circles in there

great combo

[latent oak]

just make sure ur landing location isnt going ot be an orb

and then ur free to send on cd

[runic bough]

i often die from the frontal cuz I have to focus more on ghosts and adds and everything is the same color

when dodging ghosts, im coincidentally in the front of boss during a frontal

[vivid vine]

sub uses the cudgel aswell right?

[fathom bramble]

the orbs are only really dangerous if you stagger one and then also get ks stagger bugged at the end

so your taking ticking and are low

and depending on key level that might not matter at all either

tbh

[vivid vine]

rookery is the only dungeon i don't wanna outlaw in

first and second boss make me so sad

[granite slate]

When do you KS on the first boss on rookery?

https://tenor.com/view/thats-the-neat-part-you-dont-invincible-gif-27194608

[tender wedge]

you do it just after the aoe when he lands

[pastel sierra]

Nah u do

[tender wedge]

then probably just before he phases

[fathom bramble]

you can cast it a lot outside of phase 2

[tender wedge]

but it's certainly limited there yeah

[latent oak]

u can do it before he lands on that aoe

as long as u arent inside of it

[tender wedge]

true

[pastel sierra]

You can send it when he's in middle, just gotta be sure to be either after beams or finished before beams

[granite slate]

All y'all in here antimemeing.

[errant arrow]

just send it raw no matter boss state, pray to rngeusu to keep you safe

[granite slate]

So... KS on mythic sproket monger is funny.

[errant arrow]

its AMAZING hehe

[patent igloo]

guys I just tested Nightfall Curseblade's Cudgel on a m+, but when I tried to press the macro before the boss out of combat I coulnd't change weapon, why is that?

[granite slate]

You're in mythic plus

[patent igloo]

ah, I thought we could swap before bosses because of the last paragraph before the macro on the pinned message

"If you really wanted to, you can also swap to a different offhand for bosses and swap back to the Cudgel for trash."

[granite slate]

Pretty sure that is for raid

[runic bough]

check your macro is correct

[patent igloo]

it is, it works out of m+

[runic bough]

is your other weapon gallywix's mace it will not work

[patent igloo]

what, why?

I mean, yeah, it is the gallywix mace

[runic bough]

blizzard thinks its op so ask them

[fathom bramble]

some weapons are flagged to not be swappable in combat or in a mythic+

it's to minimize swapping like this, but sometimes they just don't flag some weapons

[patent igloo]

ok I ninjed it to my guild then XDD, I'll use the crafted one instead I guess for the macro to work

[cedar kernel]

have a nice day brothers

[runic bough]

yo bac

[cedar kernel]

hi Ryukage

[rotund zodiac]

[runic bough]

flushies u on? stix heroic dps race?

[lime plank]

Mister Lock N Stock Not that good??

[keen belfry]

am i suppsoed to be good enough to see this bomb premove

am i washed

[gaunt phoenix]

not great unless you desparately need haste

[latent oak]

lmao

[fathom bramble]

impossible to see, but also maybe don't run directly under a boss that might have a bomb under it

you can just stand where you can see

[keen belfry]

yeah i think thats the play

[latent oak]

macro the glitter dust into ur rotation

eezpz

[keen belfry]

i just ahte that bs

hate

but i should not run thru a boss

[hollow temple]

zac

u played with my druid tank

:)

[proven ocean]

@vivid vessel

what is outlaw bad at in workshop

only 1st pull?

is it possible to even play sub for 1st pull then swap out or

[vivid vessel]

its not bad

its bad at surviving

ks

[proven ocean]

well dont die then or

[vivid vessel]

ye its just hard lol

[proven ocean]

cant be harder than living on sin

[hollow temple]

you can play assa

hearth out

and back in

[proven ocean]

i think we can get a good timer

[hollow temple]

but put hearth to Rustbolt

[proven ocean]

?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

sin is so bad

on 1st pull

[hollow temple]

xD

[proven ocean]

its actually crazy bad

[hollow temple]

i mean

[vivid vessel]

you ever pressed ks my guy

[hollow temple]

bleederino build

[proven ocean]

XDXDXDXD

sub does double sin dps

on 1st pull

[hollow temple]

show me

😛

[proven ocean]

WDYM SHOW ME

WHAT

LOL

[hollow temple]

i dont play sub

[proven ocean]

sin literally does

15m dps

max

on 1st pull

[hollow temple]

hmm

[proven ocean]

and sub did 30m on week 2

XD

now im sure maybe 40m even

with good crits that is

[hollow temple]

true

havent played sub this season tbf

but sounds gigachad

are you planning to reroll to sub ?

[white marten]

Why would anyone do that?

[hollow temple]

to feel the pain

of downtime

[white marten]

Ah

Yes

[hollow temple]

i get peak aggression when it happens on sub

like spam backstab on drained energy until cds are rdy again

yikes

[white marten]

Yeah. Almost as bad as dying on Outlaw right after popping AR

[hollow temple]

uff

thats the worst

[next wedge]

@glass mortar

im coming for ur io

[white marten]

Someone hates Workshop

[next wedge]

and floodgate

i cant blame him

[white marten]

And Rook

Im ugly and IM PROUD!

[lime plank]

Wowhead is saying to use Eye??

[modern tapir]

a few months ago someone said that sometimes in aoe, blade flurry makes you do less damage because its hitting dead targets or something

has that been fixed?

[vivid vessel]

yes

[torpid fiber]

yeah

[modern tapir]

thanks

[torpid fiber]

Was the fix literally just removing the flag from it btw, I never checked in on that

[cinder relic]

theres like 10 good trinkets

they all have slight pros and cons

[lime plank]

Alright

Sim is saying us Lock n Stock and Energy Drink

[cinder relic]

Ilvl is an important factor

Use what sims highest in the end

[vivid vessel]

you prolly dont have enough haste also

lock n stock is haste as main stat

[rotund zodiac]

can't rn

[fathom bramble]

it's impossible to know if they did anything else, but the flag is gone

[torpid fiber]

tyty

[fathom bramble]

Realz mentioned that the flag may have been allowing BF to actually trigger off of targets that you kill with the original hit

idk if he ever said for sure, but if that was the case then there probably is some extra server side magic going on to account for that

[glass mortar]

that aint me LUL

im like 3100 or something i havent pushed since i got resilient 13s pugging a few weeks ago

[torpid fiber]

yeah, I suspect there would have been changes to make this work

[glass mortar]

just got a few 14s with friends but they have mostly quit

idk if i have it in me to pug up to 15s

this spec is exhausting to push pugs on im constantly worried im gunna int someone elses key with a greedy kspree

zac is merciless idk how he does it

[proven ocean]

Ive boosted many ppl for 18s/19

Ive never seen a rogue

With a 13

And a 18 timed

[river escarp]

As far as I've seen that is the case. I've been running older raids and blade flurry basically just doesn't work at all since I hit so hard the add dies before the move can replicate out any % of the damage.

[wanton parcel]

!wa

[ornate heath]

Class packs:

• Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
• Zac's Group Devlin
  Utilities:
• Combo Point Standalone
• Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
• Ace refund sound trigger
• RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
• Unseen Blade tracker
  Fun:
• Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
• KS Ticking damage taken

[wanton parcel]

!plater

anyone got a good plater profile?

[tender wedge]

i like jundies

[fathom bramble]

rip

no serverside magic to address it either I guess

[river escarp]

Yeah probably not, I’m not sure how much of a detriment it is in current content

It was definitely a net gain dps wise even if potentially it causes any final hits to not register.

[next wedge]

i just saw a name i recognized 😔

[glass mortar]

it b close

i need to learn 1 fth kir before i push higher tbh

and by learn i mean remake my WA to function with it

it currently only shows for 3/6 shots

[next wedge]

idk why im pushing tbh

ik im not gonna get title bc i dont have a team to run with

and pugging that sounds like hell

[shrewd thunder]

im like 620, I am grabbing the nightfall mace and should i craft a weapon or buy the hero track capo knuckles?

wont be getting all 12s done for a few weeks

[keen belfry]

man first boss dark flame can be so funny

i did 740 mil to laborers

[next wedge]

do both

mainhand craft, then swap offhand between capo and cudgel

[keen belfry]

is this ethical or

[shrewd thunder]

oh i cant use the capo and cudgel? ( im new to rogue )

[vivid vessel]

ye

they kill people

its very ethical

[next wedge]

you can, but they're not like crazy good together

[keen belfry]

zac i think ive been doing zac damage lately

[next wedge]

getting a 681 mainahnd is the best dps you can get until you get a myth wep

[gaunt phoenix]

main hand item level trumps everything so you craft one

[shrewd thunder]

ah ok

[vivid vessel]

No

[keen belfry]

yes

[next wedge]

then you use capo for ST, and you use cudgel for MT in keys

they're conditional use cases

[shrewd thunder]

ahh

i see

ok thanks

that makes sense

I didnt know if capo was ST or what

[gaunt phoenix]

ya you swap weapons inside the key with a macro

[shrewd thunder]

huh

wtf really

[gaunt phoenix]

yep

You could always change weapons in keys but there wasn't much reason to do it

[fathom bramble]

to be clear it's not like a macro specific thing or anything

[gaunt phoenix]

most weapons that is

[fathom bramble]

you can just always swap weapons in keys

outside of a few weps that are specifically flagged as unswappable

[shrewd thunder]

could you share the macro please?

[next wedge]

check pins

[gaunt phoenix]

/equipslot 17 Nightfall Curseblade's Cudgel
/equipslot 17 Capo's Molten Knuckles```

[next wedge]

solo nicer than me

[shrewd thunder]

and slot 17 is off hand yes?

[gaunt phoenix]

yea

[keen belfry]

no full zac dmg (i could but i dont wanna its too tryhard) but close

[long barn]

Doesn’t capo go MH

[gaunt phoenix]

if you get a mythic one

[long barn]

Can Gally be swapped out of combat, like I could use it in dungeon with nightfall before boss? And swap back after? Just cant swap it mid fight?

Or is it like hard no swap in dungeon

[lusty sparrow]

[keen belfry]

how to make critters more visible

kezan tech

[smoky venture]

Why do I see so many HoC on OL in higher keys

[frank finch]

its good for m+

when u play around it

[smoky venture]

Does it have to be the mythic version. I’m still not sure how I should set up my simms for m+

[tender wedge]

dslice

it doesn't have to be the mythic version any more than any other trinket has to be the mythic version

[smoky venture]

I’ve been told dslice is wildly inaccurate

[cinder relic]

for other specs maybe

[tender wedge]

you kinda just need to know what dslice is actually simming

for context

but

mastery does provide decent value aoe dps (because the proc flurries) and HoC is just kinda overbudgetted it seems

and being on use means you've got some flexibility to time it with 6 rolls etc

it's not the kind of thing you see the #2 rogue in the world doing so you grab one and macro it into ADR

[runic bough]

still climbing guys

[fierce sinew]

Hero Gallywix Thumb > Mythic Crit/vers mace in OH for Gally prog?

[cinder relic]

sim

[fierce sinew]

sim says +5k dps over 8 mins (which i think is a reasonable fight length), just wondering if there was any insight, or thoughts on added value since there are times we are of the boss

[random stirrup]

there's a reasonable amount of add cleave where mythic oh will perform better

[frail veldt]

5k DPS is effectively 0

What is it in relative percent for your sim

If it's <= 0.1% then it's within the margin of error

[frail veldt]

Yeah some spec discords perpetuate this narrative

[random stirrup]

well it is inaccurate if it's not maintained by the spec tcs

[frail veldt]

But due to outlaws target cap and lack of reliance on big CDs, dslice is rather accurate for choosing what's better/worse for gear and talents

[frail veldt]

Well still

Like are you gonna change dslice to pull around your CDs?

Like as shadow priest is dslice gona change to pull around 1 min vs 2 min if you change from void form to dark ascension

It's just not realistic as other specs

[hollow temple]

Some other class TCers do not optimize dslice at all

So it’s true for many classes

Oh I pulled a Mewo

[frail veldt]

Lolol

[hollow temple]

Like DH for example

Last I checked DH patchwerk and dslice sims were very similar dps numbers which would make no sense

Pretty sure they just use 5-8t patchwerk sims to determine aoe sim value