outlaw

[fluid iron]

guess liquid takes the 3peat

[shut lichen]

sneak.lua was

but yes

[green gull]

I feel that Limit has just become better as a team

[shut lichen]

hard not to when ur the only good team in ur region

and sponsored by an org

[fluid iron]

limit, boomer

[shut lichen]

talents ripe for ur picking

[vivid vessel]

They just don't give a fun vibe like liquid does

Liquid is full of fun people

[green gull]

Old habits

[vivid vessel]

Echo give more of a serious vibe

And like

[shut lichen]

I like liquid bants but echo casters

[vivid vessel]

They all look depressed

[novel socket]

if you had to play this game full time you would also look depressed

[shut lichen]

i don't like the official liquid broadcasts

[novel socket]

if you think about it

[vivid vessel]

Also I hate how everytime liquid wins, somehow it's cause of na release

[shut lichen]

there is an excuse everytime anyone wins

[novel socket]

ye

[fluid iron]

tbh thats the fun part when all the EU peeps start seething with anger, over something they have nothing to do with

[shut lichen]

depends on if ur EU or NA

[green gull]

Liquid used to be plagued by the same as pretty much all US esport orgs during that era compared to EU.
Better individual players, but work worse in a group where you at times need to rely on others

[novel socket]

when eu wins its because na showed them the strats

when na wins its because na release is earlier

[vivid vessel]

Idk I'm eu and I will always support liquid

They have the best players

Anywya

They have the best mages the best rogues the best everything

[shut lichen]

i'm EU and I support whatever content there is

[novel socket]

isn't eu the best region ?

[shut lichen]

from any side

[vivid vessel]

Echo have gingi

[fluid iron]

i just cheer for my boi exile

[random stirrup]

the one esport where NA doesn't get completely rocked

[shut lichen]

i mean Meeres is goated

[vivid vessel]

Also exile isn't an outlaw hater like kush !

I cannot support kush !

[proven ocean]

his gf is crazy

just wants attention

it is what it is

unlucky zaelia

go next

gg

[fluid iron]

he is in my dms

[shut lichen]

idk about all zhat

[vivid vessel]

False bro

[shut lichen]

but regardless next Race to World 2nd looking spicy

[vivid vessel]

Exile one of the only world first player not Perma shit talking outlaw

Goated fr

With that guy from method ?

Ugzz is it

[novel socket]

next tier is most likelly gonna buttsex everyone

[vagrant pilot]

f. outlaw

[novel socket]

everytime blizz hears "tier too easy" they add more dildos to the bosses of the next tier

[proven ocean]

more like rwf, echo didnt lose anyone important if u want to be realisitic about it

[vivid vessel]

Ok common

[novel socket]

last tier was "rashanan is the easiest 4th boss ever"

this tier we got stix

[fluid iron]

he does also test in HC to see how shit looks

[shut lichen]

ofc not but Liquid is just hella strong atm

[novel socket]

[fluid iron]

where most others just cba

[vivid vessel]

The past few tiers they lost all their best players

[fluid iron]

just insta ruling out outlaw

[vivid vessel]

That's what I'm saying

[shut lichen]

echo strats is what cost them losses more than losing players

[proven ocean]

ur all stupid if u think its a race to world 2nd

[vivid vessel]

Echo is so washed up

[vagrant pilot]

Are we talking outlaw here or some drama?

[loud locust]

How many crafts are we at right now?

[vivid vessel]

Who is going to carry echo ross

[shut lichen]

this is outlaw chat

[green gull]

Wouldn't be surprised if echo does come out stronger even with those losses

[vivid vessel]

Gingi?

[shut lichen]

we barely talk about outlaw

[novel socket]

6.5

[vagrant pilot]

oh didnt noticed

[proven ocean]

like if u want drama sure u can troll around, but i dont think echo has the lower hand rn

[loud locust]

ty

[proven ocean]

they are both the same

echo is slightly better if anything

[vivid vessel]

Same than who

Liquid?

[latent belfry]

fix ks. fix ks. fix ks?

[random stirrup]

bro been watching the last 2 tiers with eyes closed

[vivid vessel]

That would be delusional

[novel socket]

outlaw = drama

[vivid vessel]

I hope you are talking about method

[proven ocean]

zac ur a smart outlaw player, but when it comes to these things ur too stupid to argue with

[novel socket]

[fluid iron]

liquid expansion sweep incoming

[vagrant pilot]

outlaw players = drama

[shut lichen]

i think Echo just has to go back to their Amirdrassil powerlevel

[fluid iron]

they for sure have the power of the "we got something to really show now"

[shut lichen]

just do excess shit for the bag

[vivid vessel]

Liquid wins world first by a landslide> "I think echo is slightly stronger"

[shut lichen]

get that sneak.lua baby

[vivid vessel]

Calls me stupid

[fossil lintel]

was doing a top 10 on my alt dk, a 672 outlaw rogue applied

dude did 1.15m overall

[latent belfry]

ofc he carried right?

[vivid vessel]

Hope you declined him

[latent belfry]

oof

[vivid vessel]

Low ilvl

[green gull]

I feel echo only lose due to going wrong with their strats on a single boss this tier

[shut lichen]

again it's a strategy difference imo

[vivid vessel]

You are accepting people under 680 to 10s ??

Xd

[latent belfry]

i hope thats a joke

[fossil lintel]

I'm like 657 on this toon lol

[vivid vessel]

What strategy

[shut lichen]

yeah the too many dps in mug'zee cages definitely messed them up

[vivid vessel]

Skill issue

[shut lichen]

is strategy not part of skill issue?

[vivid vessel]

I wish global release was a thing

[smoky venture]

For bosses in dungeons, should I be wearing Molten Knuckles?

[vivid vessel]

So liquid would still win

And zeross would stop yapping

[chilly dagger]

race is kinda a game of inches. night before liquid killed echo had sub 1% on mug. the look of defeat on gingi's face was priceless

[latent belfry]

naw use the 658 weapon (i forgor the name its in pins) on packs then knuckles on bosses

[shut lichen]

tbf if i faced the first version of mug'zee i'd cry internally too

[vivid vessel]

Now that kush left echo I can be r1 echo hater happily

No one left

[shut lichen]

what was stopping u before?

[vivid vessel]

I like kush

I have to support rogues

[green gull]

I think if it hadn't been the 2nd to last, but last boss, then they would been more eager to redo their strats.
But in the situation they were in, and if they assumed the last boss would take more pulls. Then I can see why they stuck with it. Because it was quite clear early on that it was killable with overloading cages

[vivid vessel]

Do they even have a rogue left

[green gull]

Perfecto

[vivid vessel]

Ah ye true

Mb mb

[shut lichen]

tbf i'd be more siding with Liquid

if JPC returned

[smoky venture]

Yeah was aware of Nightfall for aoe pulls. My Heroic Molten Knuckles still outsims 684 weapons for ST

[shut lichen]

my GOAT

[pastel heath]

Morning lads, what does everyone run in M+?

KiR or HO?

[fossil lintel]

KIR

[vivid vessel]

I don't think jpc is going to return ngl

[reef salmon]

Kir

[vivid vessel]

He looks like he wanna be a Chinese so bad

[green gull]

Isnt jpc like dh traitor nowadays

[vivid vessel]

Playing m+ all day

[vivid vessel]

Dk

[green gull]

ah dk

[shut lichen]

JPC just vibin

[latent belfry]

yee, make sure your using the macro #showtooltip 17
/equipslot 17 Nightfall Curseblade's Cudgel
/equipslot 17 Capo's Molten Knuckles

[reef salmon]

James have said that he won’t return to rwf due to the absolute degen amount of hours to put into a game

[shut lichen]

[chilly dagger]

he really stood on business when the whole nerf thing happened. he said if ppl are gonna be like that he isn't gonna play

left for a year

[fossil lintel]

isn't jpc getting a bit too old for outlaw? he must be close to 30, no?

[vivid vessel]

Jpc adopted the Chinese strat since he returned, bought mythic boosts and spend all day in m+

Kinda based

Not playing the mini game

[reef salmon]

Eyo what’s wrong being 30 and playing outlaw?

[pastel heath]

KiR out performing HO?

[shut lichen]

the problem is being 30

[fossil lintel]

You can't play outlaw if you're 30 or older

[shut lichen]

omegaLUL

[green gull]

Lies and slander

[reef salmon]

Thank god I still have two years to enjoy

[fossil lintel]

KIR outperforms on fun

[latent belfry]

RSI

[vivid vessel]

Bro I wanna play so bad

[chilly dagger]

i'm 40. time to move into my golden years as bm

[vivid vessel]

Why am I addicted

[fossil lintel]

if you're not aware this is a meme about a time jpc said you can't play outlaw if you're more than 30

[pastel heath]

And numbers?

[fluid iron]

then play bozo

less yapping more gamin

[fossil lintel]

same-ish, although I find it way more consistent in m+

[fluid iron]

cuh

[vivid vessel]

I'm going to see my parents rn

Cannot

[latent belfry]

L

[reef salmon]

Do a u turn

Easy fix

[green gull]

Get a steam deck

[fluid iron]

clearly you just dont wanna play enough

[reef salmon]

Straight back to outluling cuh

[vague cape]

!prekey

[ornate heath]

Pre-key fuckery

• RTB as you enter the dungeon to get 2 Supercharger stacks.
• DO NOT RTB again inside the bubble as you will lose the supercharger stacks, similarly do not AR early inside the bubble or you will lose the combo points.
• After the bubble drops use RTB again (now at 4 stacks of Supercharger).
• Before entering the first pack BF into Stealth.
• Open on pack with AR into BtE.

[near holly]

Im almost 37. It’s a lie. Play it till we die.

[shut lichen]

u can play WoW on one?

[fossil lintel]

yeah

[reef salmon]

@vague cape huh is my eyes betraying me, the diehard assa gamer turned outlaw

[shut lichen]

well I'll be

[green gull]

Yeah sure. Though I wouldn't suggest pushing keys as outlaw with it ;P

[fossil lintel]

I'm now scared of inviting outlaw rogues to my keys, i thought we were all absolute pumpers

[latent belfry]

your wrist......must be in so much pain

[vague cape]

I get stoned and play outlaw weeklies

[reef salmon]

Oh shit, me2 or in about 1 hr I will be xD

[green gull]

I'm 35 with out wrist pains. Though I do stretch them quite a bit during game times

[near holly]

I think I’ve built up some weird ass immunity. It only hurt one season when I did a bunch of keys in a week. In df.

[shut lichen]

it hurts if i take too long a time of outlaw

[latent belfry]

im 23 and my hands hurt after a while. like they feel numb and shitt

[shut lichen]

but then it comes back to me as muscle memory

[frail veldt]

Gingi deserved it for scamming the plunder storm tourney

Karma came back around

[green gull]

Only real time I kinda got pain was from playing whirlwind in D3 from pressing down mouse button

[shut lichen]

careful use of game mechanics*

[frail veldt]

The gloating after like he actually deserved the win was embarrassing

[shut lichen]

hey, if you find an accidental cheese and end up winning 50k

[proven ocean]

well he isn't a rogue player anymore thats for sure

those days are gone unlucky

[shut lichen]

i can't help but respect it

[shut lichen]

[proven ocean]

i feel alone

no other rogues

no one streaming rogue anymore

[fossil lintel]

zac streams rogue

[reef salmon]

I just don’t get any views kekw

[green gull]

Jpc had such a toxic following for a while early on, problematic

[shut lichen]

dead class

[proven ocean]

hes not a rogue

[latent belfry]

the number 1 outlaw player doesnt stream?

[proven ocean]

he plays outlaw only

[shut lichen]

who watches rogues

when u can watch gigachad mages just press barrage or some shit

[green gull]

I guess Casual streams quite often?

[proven ocean]

no

[fossil lintel]

yeah, our whole MO is to be invisible after all

[proven ocean]

he plays dk now

[shut lichen]

we don't got that Ric Flair like the other classes do

[reef salmon]

Casual plays dk xd

[green gull]

aha

[red zinc]

my stream coming soon

(only twinks can watch)

[shut lichen]

stream this

[reef salmon]

[green gull]

Shindigs perhaps streams

And well wox

I don't go around on streams much at all anymore

[shut lichen]

sadly we're just not a good streaming class it seems

also doesn't help we're like the least popular one

[green gull]

Rogues do have very low adoption rate

[vivid vessel]

Wtf does a good streaming class mean

[red zinc]

one that doesnt press killing spree every 20s

[vivid vessel]

I would rather say I'm surprised that many people watch us

Considered no one plays rogue

[glass mortar]

a class that doesnt make u dizzy to watch

zac i told that like 3 weeks ago i was doing keys with guildies in discord and someone asked us to discord stream

so i opened up my pov

[vivid vessel]

I get 100 viewers doing nothing with no mic while playing the lowest pop class in the game it's kinda crazy no?

[glass mortar]

1 dungeon later they were all like "can someone else please stream"

"watching from werans PoV is awful"

[vivid vessel]

I'm surprised that many people are willing to watch outlaw

[glass mortar]

i love my spec man

[shut lichen]

by other rogue enjoyers

[green gull]

I feel like a good mage or hunter is pretty comfortable to watch. Both usually have good awareness and view of the fights

[red zinc]

i secretly hid your stream on a shitty game wiki embed

all the viewers are fake

[vivid vessel]

Ye probably

[red zinc]

nah

[glass mortar]

yea zac me and my 20 alt accounts make sure to tune in daily

🫡

[red zinc]

people just watch u to learn

they dont really care about entertainment

[random stirrup]

the only people going to watch a wow stream are hardcore enjoyers

[red zinc]

fair enough honestly

[random stirrup]

rogue has a pretty decent hardcore enjoyer population

[remote pike]

I haaaaate killing spree holy.. how far behind is no killing spree m+ build, and which one is it

[vivid vessel]

Who tho

No one plays outlaw

[latent belfry]

pretty far

[red zinc]

100 people

[shut lichen]

if you watch rogue as a someone with no idea of the class u probs have 0 ideas wtf is going on

[red zinc]

all of em watching

thats it

[glass mortar]

~20% and its fatebound

glhf

[shut lichen]

if you see a mage though

[random stirrup]

100 people in this discord

[shut lichen]

you see explosions and magic and shit

[vivid vessel]

Fr

[shut lichen]

and know that is likely pumping

[remote pike]

f that, xD

[green gull]

I would say someone watching an outlaw rogue "to learn", needs to already have very deep knowledge of the spec to gain much of anything from it

[shut lichen]

like damn even BMs have more viewership and their visuals are ass

[glass mortar]

its hard to tell whats going on with outlaw when u watch it if ur not playing it or dont already know how for suree

without someone narrating the experience as a new player or undecided

every decision is made in 0.8s and if u glance away for3s u missed like 5 casts

[shut lichen]

i bet if you had the audio pick up the bashing of ur keyboard viewership would go up

[green gull]

Also with the variable amount of CP gain and spend. The no real CD timings etc.

[shut lichen]

gotta love the outlaw sfx

[random stirrup]

people say outlaw and rogue effects suck but the ace proc sound is my favorite in the entire game

[green gull]

Tbh I don't really think outlaw presses buttons physically more than most other gcd classes.
Most do the 200ms keyspam nonstop, rather than waiting 800/1000/1X00 ms

[vivid vessel]

I had to buy a webcam for work

Probably will add a hand cam

I think hand cams are fun

[shut lichen]

lowkey a smart investment

[random stirrup]

most have some breaks due to channels or casts or something even among the melee (which ig outlaw does currently with ks but still)

usually outlaw does not get breaks

and most dont have as many off gcd or as often

[shut lichen]

i'd say at best it's like enhance, fury and like shield tanks

u seen an evoker stream?

[random stirrup]

ye enhance and ppal were the only 2 I could think of

[green gull]

Evoker isn't a gcd class though

[shut lichen]

oh yeah u said gcd

[leaden folio]

actually sub for that

printing money for outlaw friend

[rotund zodiac]

cuz you're the goat, zac

[rotund zodiac]

did the guy land on bombs?

[nova sinew]

unfortunately not 😞

but i got quite a few of them

[rotund zodiac]

now I see why my guildees freak out on when I KS

from the pov

[vivid vessel]

Ks from outside is much more fun to see

[green gull]

Most things are better than new KS from inside

[rotund zodiac]

KS when you're beam target at cauldron

[vivid vessel]

I'm so sad

This season

[rotund zodiac]

[vivid vessel]

Is being ruined

By ks

Since I started the game outlaw ha sbeen good in m+ twice

S3 df and now

[rotund zodiac]

I'm sure the dev will notice us and rework or fix KS next season

[vivid vessel]

And it's all ruined by ks ..

[nova sinew]

trickster on sprocket this week?

[vivid vessel]

And next season outlaw probably getting nerfed and back to bad again

[rotund zodiac]

top meter at week 1 then get sent to oblivion

[leaden folio]

dont need nerf outlaw when you can only buff ass

[vivid vessel]

I mean it's going to happen lol

Pc is too strong for low keys

Outlaw will decimate first week of keys

[green gull]

will just be some random 4p balance that decide it.
Like rogues not scaling, strong early, sets receive adjustments. Weaker late

[vivid vessel]

Naaah idk

[fluid meadow]

nah just that, they buffed pc 2-3 times, since we hit dead targets, it was maybe 2%? if they revert that that would be a huge loss without any other thing

[vivid vessel]

I don't think current outlaw with pc survive first weeks of keys ever

It got nerfed early this season and it wasn't nearly as strong as it is now

[green gull]

Though, a lot of that, comes from MH scaling

[vivid vessel]

Wdym

[green gull]

MH Dps

[vivid vessel]

Comes from pc getting omega buffed

Idk

[green gull]

Think we're talking about different things

[vivid vessel]

Not really

Outlaw will look too strong early on cause of pc talent

[green gull]

But it's usually easy to get 4set and strong MH first 2 weeks.
After that and until BiS there's often less scaling for rogues than for other classes in that situaiton

[shut lichen]

i want a sub tier again

[main shadow]

I just want to shoot gun but not play a hunter

[vivid vessel]

I mean I guess, but I think outlaw has never been in this state

Pc is a talent

[fluid meadow]

change recommended guides to not use pc after release

[shut lichen]

just do it IRL

[vivid vessel]

That makes it so much better for low keys

[polar kelp]

I don't even use PC, if they nerf it it's no big deal

[vivid vessel]

It's going to look extremely strong for the early weeks

More than it usually is

[vivid vessel]

Well you are wrong

But ok

[shut lichen]

i'd assume they'd nerf for raid performance

[red zinc]

Just feel like law should’ve gotten one of those stat modifiers that basically every reworked class has gotten

A long time ago

[shut lichen]

over anything else

[shut lichen]

u mean a good mastery?

[red zinc]

no like haste gives % chance for bte to cast again

[vivid vessel]

Nah I think early on they get a lot of data from m+ as well

[red zinc]

or whatever

[vivid vessel]

So many people running low keys

[polar kelp]

? The amount of times you have a 2-5 tar pull is so rare except for top...and when packs die the remaining ones die together most times anyway. Prio is much better

[vivid vessel]

Okok

[polar kelp]

But kir it doesn't make sense NOT to take it. Im just saying HO with gs

[red zinc]

wym m+ data zac

[glass mortar]

i mean have u played HO with/without PC

[vivid vessel]

First Weeks

[glass mortar]

thats a cope PC is like +10% dps easily

in every key ive played

[red zinc]

The only time they ever nerf anything from m+ is if its clearly apparent from the details meter nowadays

[glass mortar]

even big pulling

that talent is just jacked af

i tried cinderbrew with no PC cause i was like surely every pull here is huge

and they were

and i did like 800k less dps then i did in my best PC run

[red zinc]

I know we had the “low key clear rate” thing in df

But feel like they havent looked at that since

[vivid vessel]

You done any outlaw low keys or what

[red zinc]

of course

[polar kelp]

Play with GS, you do more damage on big pulls and your boss damage is much higher. Prio mob+boss is more important then cleave pad

[red zinc]

Doesnt mean they give a fuck anymore

[glass mortar]

u do 1% more damage on big pulls

and more boss damage and prio

[vivid vessel]

Meh idk

[glass mortar]

which doesnt make up for how much more u do as stuff is dying

or on not such big pulls

lets not pretend ghostly is a noticable 8t+ talent

[polar kelp]

Where is 1% coming from? You literally do about 10% more lol

[glass mortar]

its like 1-1.5% dps at most

10% more on st...

[shut lichen]

low key tuning sounds like a meme ngl

[glass mortar]

ghostlys amp does not effect BF at all

[polar kelp]

What?

[vivid vessel]

Welcome

[glass mortar]

the amplified damage u do to ur main target to ghostly

does not blade flurry

it blade flurries like no ghostly was applied

this is how it has always been

[vivid vessel]

Every debuff is like that

[glass mortar]

the value of ghostly at 8 targets is mostly its initial hit/cp gen

[green gull]

All such damage reverses out

[glass mortar]

which is not very high

thats all about it that "aoes"

[polar kelp]

Really....shit ok if that's the case then I'm wrong. I didn't know that

[vivid vessel]

gs would be wild if it cleaved

[gaunt phoenix]

if GS affected BF it would be better than PC everywhere

[glass mortar]

^

[green gull]

In most cases such cleave works like if you had hit each enemy individually

[glass mortar]

trust me id love that

i hate that pc is strong btw

[gaunt phoenix]

real

[glass mortar]

but it is super strong

[shut lichen]

real

[vivid vessel]

I like that it feels like we finally have a niche

[glass mortar]

should be baseline

if its gunna be a niche

[vivid vessel]

Should be

[glass mortar]

why r we giving up a dungeon niche (demolishing dungeon bosses) to get one we should just have baseline (low target cleave)

[vivid vessel]

You know the biggest meme

Assa players Perma yap about their boss damage

Assa rn does the same st as outlaw in m+

If you aren't playing troll builds

And if you pull on bosses it's not even close

[glass mortar]

outlaws boss damage in 10s is such a meme if ur playing HO rn

cause bosses r lasting like 1m-1:30s

so easy to go a whole fight with turbo shit rolls

or the whole fight with a 5 buff

and the dps difference

[vivid vessel]

Outlaw boss damage rn

Also

Depends a lot on the boss

So many bosses you just lose too much uptime

[patent mirage]

darkflame cleft

[vivid vessel]

Well dfc is even more different

That's not comparable

[cinder relic]

The st sin build is so shit in low keys which is where the majority of players play lol

[vivid vessel]

But I'm more talking about things like rookery second for example

[patent mirage]

ah yes

[vivid vessel]

I can easily end last boss dps

[mellow thicket]

Do you think it would be feasible to write a Killing spree go, no go condition for mythic plus?

[vivid vessel]

If I miss play one GCD or bad rng or lose a bit too much uptime

[vivid vessel]

If you were willing to commit the time maybe

[mellow thicket]

Got bored and figured it would be easy to write

[glass mortar]

if ur kspree timings end up bad it can be so cursed

[vivid vessel]

No one is going to do that

[glass mortar]

sometimes it naturally lines up with mechanics on that boss

and u just look like a gamer

[vivid vessel]

Ye lol

First boss rookery also same shit haha

[glass mortar]

then sometimes its coming off cd everytime hes doing an aoe and u know u cant cast without cloak

completely out of ur control

feels so shit

[patent mirage]

just press it

[vivid vessel]

If it lines up nicely you just press ks between abilities

[patent mirage]

do it

[vivid vessel]

If it doesn't you are getting fucked

[glass mortar]

trickster definitly has some of the inflexibility problems df outlaw had

[vivid vessel]

Over and over

[mellow thicket]

Yeah, essentially if spell is up and spooky cast had less than 3 seconds or active?

[glass mortar]

fix kspree

[vivid vessel]

Ye

[patent mirage]

no fix

rework

[mellow thicket]

Surprised they haven’t attempted a fix

[vivid vessel]

Altough I have been training holding vanihs lately

Similar to how I was doing in df

It's a bit harder and it can easely go south or look scary

[mellow thicket]

Does holding vanish affect your ADR uptime?

[vivid vessel]

But for example on first boss ml

You can do infinite DPS

[mellow thicket]

?

[vivid vessel]

If you manage to have good rng and are able to hold vanihs

Cause then you do like 3 vanish during the amp phases

Every amp phase

[mellow thicket]

To stack the killing spree bonus?

[past falcon]

yeah

[vivid vessel]

And you mega blast

[past falcon]

feels good af

[mellow thicket]

sup Riddict

[past falcon]

hey u :3

[vivid vessel]

I have a wipe on first boss ml on 20

[glass mortar]

we got lucky zac

[mellow thicket]

Grats on 3500 btw

[smoky venture]

!prekey

[ornate heath]

Pre-key fuckery

• RTB as you enter the dungeon to get 2 Supercharger stacks.
• DO NOT RTB again inside the bubble as you will lose the supercharger stacks, similarly do not AR early inside the bubble or you will lose the combo points.
• After the bubble drops use RTB again (now at 4 stacks of Supercharger).
• Before entering the first pack BF into Stealth.
• Open on pack with AR into BtE.

[glass mortar]

theres only 4 damage amp bosses this season

[vivid vessel]

I checked

[glass mortar]

and outlaw kinda

fucks hard on 3 of thenm

[shut lichen]

is vanihs french or something?

[vivid vessel]

I'm doing infinite more damage than zeross

[glass mortar]

cause of timings/aoe

[vivid vessel]

On that boss

[glass mortar]

yea

the damage amp is too often to use cds on everyone

so having damage all the time is actually a boon

[mellow thicket]

It’s never worth to hold KS to line up a better vanish?

[glass mortar]

and uc an save up some damage for it even with the new desigjn

and magnet trinket

i love my magnet on those damage amp bosses

[past falcon]

don’t hold KS unless u would die

send at low cp > not pressing it

[mellow thicket]

Oh!

[glass mortar]

i really do need a way to track my supercharger

[vivid vessel]

Ye

It's cool

[glass mortar]

just randomly having 1s longer ksprees ur not paying attention to

can be very deadily

xd

[vivid vessel]

I mean you know no?

[glass mortar]

usually i know

[vivid vessel]

You just pressed rtb lol

[glass mortar]

90% of the time ye

[past falcon]

if u want to play with lining up vanish with those things u can consider sending a low cp ks i guess to save time but idk

[glass mortar]

just occasionalyi 'll have one leftovert after a fight

then RtB on the way to the boss

then i have 3

[mellow thicket]

Are there ground reticle skills that killing spree won’t acquire a dot if it hovers over?

[glass mortar]

and im not paying attention to it

it caps on 2 in my brain

idk

[mellow thicket]

Feel like birds in rookery sometimes don’t give me the dot

[violet ferry]

Haven't played GS much but tried it yesterday and it wouldn't apply to a lot of mobs in ML - I got the error text saying so. Is that common?

[glass mortar]

never heard of that

did u make a macro or something

[violet ferry]

No, just put it on the action bar

[past falcon]

i don’t think u pick up a dot unless u land in shit after KS ends, or maybe if u get ported through a frontal of some
sort

[mellow thicket]

Like if it pops while you’re in KS?

[frail veldt]

yes

some ground effect dots dont start ticking immediately

[violet ferry]

Press GS, "The target is not affected by that" or something similar, and could press GS over and over getting the same error

[frail veldt]

and ks moves fast enough that it goes in and out and doesnt take damage

[frail veldt]

thats gotta be a macro

[mellow thicket]

Yeah second boss on DFC I can get away with it

[frail veldt]

GS as in ghostly strike right?

[frail veldt]

yep

[violet ferry]

Ghostly Strike, yes

[frail veldt]

yeah you must have a macro or something

[vivid vessel]

You dont have it bound in stealth bar

[violet ferry]

No macro, no keybind, just 3 on my action bar

[frail veldt]

go to your spell book and drag it again to your bar

[violet ferry]

HOLY crap you're right

[vivid vessel]

Ye I know

[frail veldt]

oh yeah or that

lolol

gj gooner

[vivid vessel]

It's so easy

Honestly stance bar shouldn't be a thing

[violet ferry]

ahahaha that was it! Cheap Shot was in the same spot on my stealth bar

[vivid vessel]

So bad

[violet ferry]

praise be zac

[vivid vessel]

Np cuh

[frail veldt]

agreed

every good rogue player I know has their stealth bar identical to their out of stealth bar

theres literally no point

[shut lichen]

3rd boss mechagon at times

but 50/50 u end where a sawblade runs ur fade

[vivid vessel]

I think it's more problematic for new players actually

[past falcon]

i hate the stance bar

[vivid vessel]

They feel like they need to put their stealth abilities on second bar only

[frail veldt]

yeah its misleading in a lot of ways

[vivid vessel]

And then they learn that you basically press the same spells out or in stealth

And it's just silly

[frail veldt]

it made more sense originally

[shut lichen]

is this a personal attack or something?

[vivid vessel]

They bound sap on their main button

What do now

[shut lichen]

[past falcon]

side note

i was yesterday days old when i was educated that u can grapple through the wall skip at the beginning of motherlode

[violet ferry]

The whole 1-button-rotation thing that Blizz is implementing might make them realize that we have a lot of button bloat

[rotund zodiac]

almost got my first 16 and it's like this.

[shut lichen]

will it fuck

i bet they made it exclusively knowing outlaw would be the biggest outlier

[violet ferry]

lol probably

but if they have to devote resources to making sure it works with all changes and all talents... they might say it's easier to reduce the button bloat than continue making the game more complex

Since Blizz is a small indie company, I give it 4 years before that happens though

[shut lichen]

as long as you can do ur world quests with it

[frail veldt]

I dont think outlaws button bloat is too bad tbh

theyve done a lot of reduction

[shut lichen]

that's the dream

[rotund zodiac]

we have like what, 8 buttons?

[random stirrup]

outlaw doesn't have bloat at all what

[frail veldt]

you can kinda opt out of button bloat if you play certain specs

[vivid vessel]

Outlaw doesn't have button bloat

[frail veldt]

HO has very few buttons

HO no deft no GS

[shut lichen]

Button bloat doesn't have outlaw

[vivid vessel]

I think specs like druid and shit

Have button bloat

Shaman

[violet ferry]

Outlaw maybe not, but other classes and specs definitely do yeah

[vivid vessel]

Like you have so many random utility buttons

That you never use

[frail veldt]

you have ambush/ss, PS, bte, dispatch, vanish, rtb, adr

[vivid vessel]

That's button bloat to me

[frail veldt]

oh for sure

[frail veldt]

shaman

druid

[vivid vessel]

We just have more rotational abilities that most, but that's mostly cause we don't have a st and AOE rotation

It's the same for both

[frail veldt]

both shaman and druid have so many garbage buttons

[vivid vessel]

I said that mewo

[frail veldt]

its super annoying

[shut lichen]

bro fucking evoker has bloat

u press like 5 buttons but u have like 15 different utility ones

including actual offhealing u do for dps

[violet ferry]

They could give all classes and specs the Guild Wars treatment, reducing everyone down to 5 core damage abilities and 3 utility abilities, then specs will change them up

[glass mortar]

utility bloat isnt bloat

its fun since u only press the buttons under certain circumstances

also literally the only fun part about evoker is playing the utility

the base rotation is

i must not speak

[shut lichen]

flameshaper is kinda goated ngl

[glass mortar]

they have a wild utility kit its based

[shut lichen]

shit's pretty fun

[glass mortar]

yea we did a key with our flameshaper guy and 2 PIs

first pull of brewery

[random stirrup]

ye evoker utility isfun

[glass mortar]

he went FB > gulf > gulf

he hit 39m dps

for like 5s

[shut lichen]

i like the utility i just wish i had binds for all of them that are comfortable

[glass mortar]

seems based

[shut lichen]

even in raid engulf goes hard

[violet ferry]

Blizz putting extra fingers in the in-game shop soon

[shut lichen]

just suddenly burst like 14 million for 7 secs

tbf i wish rogue had one more aoe stop

[vivid vessel]

I don't

I just wish all this shit was off gcd

I don't like how clunky it feels

Tom like

Hold GCD

Or whatever

To stop when you are supposed to

[shut lichen]

hold gcd for what?

[vivid vessel]

Honestly I don't get why all the utility thing isn't just off gcd

[glass mortar]

u think the 1 aoe stop we had could be ogcd

would it really be so bad

using rogues stops feels so fukin awful

if someone needs me to stop during a crackshot man

[shut lichen]

that i agree with

[glass mortar]

sometimes im like "you know i could live this cast going off"

[vivid vessel]

I have a 6 sec cast, I wanna press blind at the very last second so that it stops it when it's optimal

[glass mortar]

"why is it my job to stop it

[vivid vessel]

Or you have a short cast and you don't wanna risk being GCD locked when you need to press

[main shadow]

[shut lichen]

i c what ur spitting

[vivid vessel]

Ye

When I have casts on me

I just feint

Cba pressing a stop

I will stop if it's someone else and they ask nicely

(beg for their lives)

[shut lichen]

i like running with shamans and mages for this reason

[leaden folio]

you miss that zac

early legion

nothing on gcd

you could blind when you want

etc..

outlaw was "control king"

with gouge

[steady crane]

Is kir really that much hard than ho ? I think i'm confortable with ho after some training so i was thinking to try the other? I feel like a wipe is even more punishing

[covert kestrel]

does brann now vanish with you so you have to break stealth immediately to not reset a boss in a delve

[leaden folio]

didn't get that this week, I play brannheal with pilar perk

[covert kestrel]

im playing with healer brann and he keeps vanishing

and resetting the boss

[leaden folio]

try to pick this perk :

3 turet

one is tanking

should help you

[shut lichen]

u sign the porsche?

[leaden folio]

dont understand this message

oh ok

it should be the spell of tinket on warcraft 3 so

[steady crane]

https://tenor.com/view/war-vietnam-ptsd-shell-shock-moment-gif-3022747568394546158

[leaden folio]

brann is playing tinker

tinker is heal

[glass mortar]

make sure hes not caught in combat with some piss mob earlier in the delve

sometimes he will just sprint off after it if he is

[covert kestrel]

that may have been it

[glass mortar]

and make sure hes actually attacked the npc ur attacking before u vanish

[covert kestrel]

just did the final boss no vanish, chad moves only

[desert tendon]

@proven ocean

Is écho done?

Is this method rising arc ?

[reef salmon]

Has to be

They just gained 5 really good players

How ever they don’t have as much going on in the background as echo

[desert tendon]

Imo

Liquid was already hard winning next tier

Now echo is dying

[fluid meadow]

does bte dispatch reduce cd? or just the bte counts as finisher in crackshot window?

[gaunt phoenix]

just bte

[desert tendon]

And it s too many changes for method to perf 1st season

So gg liquid

[cedar kernel]

have a nice day brothers

[gaunt phoenix]

[cedar kernel]

[desert tendon]

[late swallow]

bac

[cedar kernel]

some CN brothers told me

zeross betrayed us

[late swallow]

zeross is playing assassination now

he's moving in with whispyr

they take turns being the little spoon

(ross likes being the little spoon)

[cedar kernel]

[desert tendon]

I mean

As far as i Know zero he s like me

He main rogue

Not outlaw

[cedar kernel]

fair

[desert tendon]

[late swallow]

respect to ross for not fotm rerolling the class

just the spec

[cedar kernel]

now i am like outlaw not my favor style rn i would play other game or looking into the Sim

wait until it rise again

[desert tendon]

I quitted wow bac

[cedar kernel]

wtf

nooo

are we going to lose u

[desert tendon]

Aug rising

Rogue terrible state and bad management from blizzard

I m done

[late swallow]

holy based

welcome to the club mr. big dick giga chad

[desert tendon]

I had enough it starts to really impact my moral so I better just leave and have an happi life

[cedar kernel]

i am picking garbage

retiring

[gaunt phoenix]

freedom

[late swallow]

you going to any shows this summer?

[gaunt phoenix]

go outside? no

[cedar kernel]

what shows

oh wait nvm

[late swallow]

all the bands I wanna see aren't touring until like the fall

[cedar kernel]

i misunderstand thought solo is going for a show

like superstar

[gaunt phoenix]

camshow

[late swallow]

yeah solo actually does drag

he's in a drag cabaret

he streams ranked livejasmin

[vivid vessel]

Somnius

[gaunt phoenix]

[vivid vessel]

How does it feel being rh r1 gooner

[late swallow]

i feel like atlas holding up the globe

[vivid vessel]

I see

[late swallow]

i need to find a worthy successor for when I'm too weary

[royal ermine]

I dont think there needs to be one

[fossil pagoda]

is PC or GS better for ToP ?

[cedar kernel]

tbh at first somnius talked about show with solo, i thought solo is a superstar like Henry Cavill, he will do apl when hes free

[gaunt phoenix]

pc

[red zinc]

[gaunt phoenix]

so you do 7 million dps on first boss

[random stirrup]

bac is a tarkov enjoyer??

[cedar kernel]

only in PVE

PVP in asia full of cheater

sick of it

[random stirrup]

yeah i can imagine

PVE is fun

[late swallow]

do asian people cheat more?

[cedar kernel]

dont think so, just we have more amount of population

[digital linden]

does the warr buff benefit outlaw in a special way compared to other class buffs?

[gaunt phoenix]

no its just 5% dmg

Same as monk debuff

[cedar kernel]

i think the most special buff for us only is Windfury

[glass mortar]

we get more from monk debuff then most classes

but not warr

every melee gets the benifit from warr

[covert kestrel]

i also read somewhere (so could be wrong) but like china is like more ok with cheating in games and other stuff since they only care about the result and not the authenticity? so like if you hack and get rank 1, the only thing that matters is youre rank 1, not that you hacked

idk could be some armchair psychologist from reddit explaining why there are lots of hackers of games from china

[late swallow]

damn I didn't know fronteir was racist like that

[covert kestrel]

[late swallow]

fyi racism isn't cool pal

[covert kestrel]

https://tenor.com/view/nomore-scamming-adults-gif-26955649

[cedar kernel]

for a non-cheator player, its a shame and will be angry with it, but for cheater yea as u say, but indeed we are more care about result

since i wish cheaters can get into jailed

but we dont have laws for that, games become popular and can be accept only in recent 10 years

[vivid vessel]

Have you watched last twttles video

He explains how they play for money basically

They have a lot more live key pushers that just push to the top then sell boosts for real money

[cedar kernel]

yea

[vivid vessel]

That's probably why they are more willing to exploit anything

[cedar kernel]

cant deny that, esp when theres no CN server, thats was quite wild in AS server

[vivid vessel]

Cause it doesn't really matter, in the end only the result matter cause it brings more clients

[random stirrup]

i cant imagine how much money they are making over there with the dinar boosting now

we are already eating good in NA

where boosting is turbo down bad usually

[vivid vessel]

I need to start boosting again I think

I have 0 gold

[cedar kernel]

even though i dont want to admit, but its a truth

[digital linden]

its just a straight 5% damage buff is it any better for us than a class like enh sham

or unh dk

[shadow kindle]

Is it worth taking vexie trinket with dinar for two on use?

[hybrid crown]

I went vexie and stix trinket and I'm happy with the upgrade

It works with the good ol use 13 use 14 macro as long as you put the vexie trinket in your first trinket slot

[shadow kindle]

I just wasnt sure if having two on uses was worth it, running KiR with like 20% haste

[vivid vessel]

Monk would be better for outlaw than most

Because it's physical

But I think warrior scale similar for most melees

[digital linden]

i was just talking with a friend about how outlaw especially favours the warr buff but i guess i mixed them up

[vivid vessel]

I think it's monk

I think war scale the same for most melees

Altough maybe not enhance since it has spells right

Nvm idk

[steady crane]

How does the sham buff impact outlaw ?

[vivid vessel]

Probably the same shit

[random stirrup]

they mostly use attack power coefficient

[vivid vessel]

3/4% iirc

[random stirrup]

technically I think arcane intellect gives enh like a tiny tiny % buff since there's some hidden spellpower shenanigans

but warr buff is good on them iirc

[steady crane]

It's a lot ! And dors it help on enregy?

[vivid vessel]

Ye a bit but

[vivid vessel]

War and monk are more

Basically 5%

Each

Since well it's 5% buff

Or whatever

[digital linden]

are the buffs huge for the % parse on m+ logs

[steady crane]

So war /monl heal / sham is a good comp for outlaw

[random stirrup]

assuming you're not talking the overall % since that's just based on key level

[digital linden]

ye im thinking about the actual parse that matters

not that i know if any m+ parses matter

i dont hear them spoken about alot

[random stirrup]

well they dont super matter

its extremely dependent on route, other dps, buffs to some degree

[digital linden]

im just looking at them to see if i am consistently missing out on damage in m+, raid is so much simpler to troubleshoot

[random stirrup]

the only information you can really get from them imo is if you're getting purples then you're probably playing reasonably well

[steady crane]

Idk if i'm the only but having some buff like that make me feel like my overall is not "clean". Like when we play with Aug in df. Not really deserved

[random stirrup]

and if it's deep grey probably not/maybe cooked routing and stuff

[digital linden]

yeah i mean looking quickly at zacs logs

[random stirrup]

though for outlaw specifically you probably shouldn't ever be grey if you're playing well

[digital linden]

they differ from mine in many ways

his comps always got good buffs and he parses well so im wondering if my blue parses are due to routing and also buffs or if im missing out on something huge

[random stirrup]

probably better to just vod review your own play if you're going to that level

[fluid meadow]

i think best thing to compare with others is cpm on abilities meanwhile dps can be so different cause buffs/others dps/route etc

[steady crane]

What do you mean ?

[red zinc]

@vivid vessel whos the mayor of rogue town

[random stirrup]

because it is target capped and has no real dps cds routing matters a lot less than other specs

sub will gain a ton of dps if you pull 20 mobs around your flag and blow them up right as it ends since ur other dps are also good

meanwhile if your tank pulls 3 mobs with flag up you are gonna be sad

outlaw especially with PC will just do similar damage regardless

[steady crane]

Yeah but m+ parse score are not a thing right?

[random stirrup]

obviously clearing the dungeon fast with good dps and consistently pulling 8 mobs will make your log dps higher but it will overall just matter a ton less than sub or ele or something

[red zinc]

they are but nobody gives a fuck about them

[steady crane]

Ahhh...

And parse is important by ilvl or overall ?

[red zinc]

...

[random stirrup]

ye again the only thing to really look at for them if you are trying is purple+ = probably playing well and grey probably means making a lot of mistakes but again its all subjective

other metrics are better

[high girder]

For m+? Most people don't log keys so it already invalidates most key stuff in the first place. But there are a million variables so you can deep dive logs to get useful info in key logs but parse isn't a meaningful number in keys

[vivid vessel]

I mean I just told you

You will legit do 10/15% more with buffs

[steady crane]

Well my parse are green for overall. But by ilvl m'y last one are 95+

[vivid vessel]

That's quite significant

[red zinc]

the reading incomprehension is crazy today

and thats crazy coming from me

[steady crane]

But i'm still low. Like 65x

[vivid vessel]

But one of the most important thing is pacing for outlaw imo

[runic bough]

@rotund zodiac are u still awake?

[digital linden]

pacing?

[red zinc]

I think we need to make zeross the mayor of rogue neighbourhood

[astral wind]

In what sense? Trying to absorb all the good outlaw knowledge

[vivid vessel]

Quick pulling

Chaining

[random stirrup]

that is true

the specific pulls matter less but downtime between them is cringe

[vivid vessel]

It's one of the most important thing for outlaw imo

[digital linden]

and usually when u play u prefer quick pulling and full chaining over getting a restealth even when u lack buffs?

[vivid vessel]

I mean in general it's important

But

People in keys have become complacents

Idk why

With like meta comps

[red zinc]

restealths dont matter stop this narrative please

[vivid vessel]

They feel they can take 10 years setuping a pull and finishing it

[red zinc]

like legit its only when they chain mobs at 2% that its annoying

but good tanks dont do that anyway

[vivid vessel]

If you pull fast and chain you gain infinite time

I think the best example of that is mandatory in mdis rn

The biggest difference with the other groups imo

Is they pull so fast

0 downtime

And it makes them way faster than everyone

In general a lot of tanks will just be kinda slow

Like why am I waiting for my tank to pull

He should be already settupping next pack

Before I'm even looking at it

[red zinc]

assa restealth debacle last season actually ruined rogue pugging to a noticle degree

funny asf

fuck that spec

[gaunt phoenix]

love fast tanks

grapple into every pack

[astral wind]

Last season? 🤣

[dawn talon]

dude i played with this warr the other day

and we left combat maybe 3 times

[rotund zodiac]

it's 1.30 am here bruh

[dawn talon]

in the entire dungeon

was pog as fuck

[vivid vessel]

I have a good example actually

Floodgate right

After you kill first boss

And go toward big mama

[dawn talon]

dude

[vivid vessel]

I'm always first to that pack before big mama

[dawn talon]

u gain legit like 3-4min

[digital linden]

same

[vivid vessel]

And tank can sometimes be like 10 sec after me

[dawn talon]

just chaining

instead of walking around daudling

doing nothing

[vivid vessel]

Well the last key I was doing with a monk

He got there faster than me

Cause he had setuped his teleport

[digital linden]

tank monks are goats

[runic bough]

[vivid vessel]

Before going left

I think

[random stirrup]

some of these tanks gotta jungle in league man

[vivid vessel]

So ye

That surprised me

[random stirrup]

learn some efficient clearing

[vivid vessel]

But this gain so much time

[rotund zodiac]

if we can find a stix pug now, I can play

[past falcon]

i've started explicitly telling pug tanks to chain bc of this

[rotund zodiac]

and then sleep

[runic bough]

are u working tomorrow?

[past falcon]

theres this like 3400 prot warrior sou

thats cracked, mans got hella potential

[rotund zodiac]

nope, but I have other plans

[vivid vessel]

Pacing is important, and if you are ever finishing one mob instead of chaining next pack I feel like that's when you are losing time

Anywya

[runic bough]

[vivid vessel]

I do the most damage any key I play, any comp

So

To answer your initial question

[digital linden]

its the hoc

😭

[vivid vessel]

It's just skill issue

[digital linden]

jahahahah

[vivid vessel]

And no it's not the trinkets

[agile orchid]

so outlaw needs a nerf?

[digital linden]

why do u go hoc btw

[vivid vessel]

I meant most damage from the outlaw

I pug a lot so I definitely don't always have the best comp or the best tanks or the best routes

[runic bough]

i dont see any stix right now 😦 its joever for our dps race

[vivid vessel]

Good trinket idk

Sims the same as the other one

The vexie trinket

[digital linden]

does it really?

[vivid vessel]

Idk I had hoc very early on

[agile orchid]

would signet not be better since it should give a vers buff?

[vivid vessel]

For kir ye

Signet sim like shit

Lower stat budget

I might try vexie trinket

I don't enjoy the idea I could miss

[digital linden]

vexie trink sims higher for me than stix

[agile orchid]

wait vexie trinket can miss?

[runic bough]

FLUSHIES AND RYU ABOUT TO DPS RACE ON STIX GUYS ALERT ALERT

[agile orchid]

is it not a targeted ability?

[vivid vessel]

It's a line

[agile orchid]

oh

[vivid vessel]

So it mobs aren't in I guess it misses

[digital linden]

yeah its cancer

[vivid vessel]

And I know it doesn't hit some mobs

[digital linden]

i have had it be so wonky in the past

[vivid vessel]

Like rookery last boss

And sedonc right

[past falcon]

its a line that if u miss can go straight into a pack ur not in combat with

🙂

[agile orchid]

it's kinda sad how there are no crazy outlaw trinkets this season

[digital linden]

it is a bit of a shame

i have to admit

[steady coyote]

they nurf that nightfall mace yet?

[random stirrup]

can u imagine pressing killingspree with dathea trinket on

[vivid vessel]

Please stop

[random stirrup]