outlaw

[magic crow]

Used my token for this week sadly, or are they warband tradeable, does anyone know?

Good question, gonna look it up xD

[tender wedge]

the champ ones are not WB

[magic crow]

And the token, maybe tradeable ^^?

[tender wedge]

nope soz

[magic crow]

Dangit, Welp guess I can live another week ^^ Just started my rogue 2 days ago

Was undecided first so bought dagger for assa, but outlaw is so much more fun xD

[tender wedge]

save craft for now and buy the mace next week and use dagger as oh

[rotund zodiac]

I spent the token on a head mog day 1 event

Now I regret

[runic bough]

flushies did u see the pin

new aoe wep

[frozen sinew]

hi guys

between signet of the priory and whistle?

[novel timber]

hello

[frozen sinew]

mainly for m+

[magic shuttle]

Signet is nice if you wanna play assa as well

[safe pasture]

did so bad in my 13ML a paladin still thought we were bugged

[reef forge]

keep up the good work king

[coral onyx]

!haste

[ornate heath]

Total stat volume will look like Vers > Haste* > Crit > Mastery.

*But Haste has a **requirement ** because Adrenaline Rush lowers your GCD based on it, down to 0.8s at 25% haste.

The KIR build wants 18-20% haste from rating, because its only haste buff is from Alacrity.

The HO build meets this requirement with 8-10% haste from rating because of Take 'em by Surprise, but the new HO + Supercharger build continues to like Haste just because of energy, so you will have to sim. Your sim may settle for KIR-levels of haste (~18%) or slightly lower.

You need to use Raidbots Top Gear to determine what haste pieces to use.
You can also get ~4.2% haste from a flask. This can be equal or better than Vers flask if you need it for either build.

[fallow adder]

Heya - new to rogue in general. What's the best for beginners who aim to push m+ / rotation isn't really complicated. I'm kinda inbetween outlaw and assassin rn

[cedar kernel]

brothers u know what i want to say

[drifting bone]

in keys 16s and up is it safe to say kir wins on ho?

[hollow temple]

bro wait how???

[proven ocean]

Bac

My favorite rogue in ravenholdt

[dim ruin]

well, that aged like old milk, fuck this spell

anyone know how I can sim spec variations? I wanna see how much I'd lose with a non-suicide-spree build

[hybrid crown]

It's okay that's what people say until they do keys and die a lot

[honest sparrow]

Or play some of the later raid bosses

[dim ruin]

found it, raidbots threw it into topgear

[rotund zodiac]

Yea, that’s why I regret spending the token on a head mog

[dim ruin]

UGHHHHHH

FML :(

[random stirrup]

is this fatebound

how are you only losing 120k from dropping ks

[dim ruin]

"current gear" is fatebound

my gear sucks

I have almost no haste on rings neck and trinkets

[random stirrup]

I would just expect it to be more

even then

it's a large portion of hero tree

[dim ruin]

it's also patchwerk sim, not cleave

didn't even bother checking cleave, cause I assume KS is king in cleave

[desert orbit]

645 ilvl outlaw rogue with 4p and I run out of energy occasionally, what am I doing wrong, or do I just need more gear?

[latent belfry]

Probably just gotta pay more attention to your AR and when it’s about to drop so you can pop vanish if you were holding it for ks to come back, or sum

[cedar kernel]

[tropic zephyr]

Nerf outlaw ⁉️

[vivid vessel]

fr

[fossil lintel]

I haven't played since christmas and haven't kept up, thinking it's time to sate the addiction. Is outlaw doing well?

[vivid vessel]

well well well

[fossil lintel]

Hey Zac

[vivid vessel]

you think you can just come back !

no !

[fossil lintel]

Yes

[vivid vessel]

outlaw was bugged

now its not

it is doing well

[fossil lintel]

Bugged in a good or a bad way?

[wintry solar]

Bad

Unironically throwing

[vivid vessel]

bf was hitting dead targets

[wintry solar]

Which I know we throw around a lot but it was actually throwing

[vivid vessel]

for about 1- years

thats why it was doing 0 damage in bigger packs

once 1/2/3 targets started dying

you were hitting them

[fossil lintel]

wait

christmas was less than 1 year ago

[wintry solar]

Depends on which one

[vivid vessel]

this is the biggest bug fix outlaw ever had no cap

[wintry solar]

Frfr

Adr bug could be played around

[vivid vessel]

wild that it wents "unoticed" for so long

[wintry solar]

But how do you play around that?

[silent marsh]

😂

[fossil lintel]

how and who even found that bug?

[proven ocean]

@vivid vessel

3.6% dslice

Gains

On sin

Thanks to tobfon

?

[deep cedar]

hey zeross quick question in ur assa build do you use garrote in aoe?

[latent belfry]

our local gigachad, Solo

ITHINK

[vivid vessel]

big man

[vivid vessel]

its been a while we have tinfoiled about giga big pack feeling weird

one of the theory was that we werent hitting mobs cuase elevations issues

anyway

i had enough when i did tank dps on first pack brew while having full buffs

so i tried to find proof there was something wrong

and i found that we werent hitting 7 targets with bf sometimes

lok finally noticed it was in sync with target dyings

-1 target alive = -1 target hit by bf

[fossil lintel]

I remember it feeling terrible on large packs

That's crazy, so if there was a bunch of small things that died in 2 seconds, we were basically single target from that point?

[vivid vessel]

ye if you were closer to these targets

[unkempt swift]

@vivid vessel how about ho now?

[vivid vessel]

ho yes yes

[unkempt swift]

Better than kir or same?

[vivid vessel]

who knows

idk

[unkempt swift]

I have solo target issue in kir(

[vivid vessel]

I think its hard for me to say that one is better than the other considering i only play kir

and also i dont think most people will get more damage out of kir than ho

[fossil lintel]

are we playing trickster now in keys?

[vivid vessel]

just cause its harder

[vivid vessel]

its like 20%$ ahead in aoe

gl with killing spree

[timber knoll]

Ho is better than kir imo

[unkempt swift]

Ty ty. 20% haste and 30% vers good for kir?

[vivid vessel]

y

[unkempt swift]

Sim say me +10% in rookery 15)

Than kir)

But) its only sim

[hidden bay]

i always do more as kir than ho idk

[unkempt swift]

!fuu

[ornate heath]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[hidden bay]

maybe cuz ive never really got used to ho

[unkempt swift]

Guys - what about weapon from gally?

Weird?

[unreal drum]

anyone else think outlaws about to get gutted? Ion using outlaw as the example as almost impossible base ui makes me think they are working on it (bad or good)

[vivid vessel]

ye

i have internal leaks

i have seen 12.0 outlaw

it turned into a 1 button spec

you get a gun

and you just fire the gun over and over

[unreal drum]

ahh so combat with a gun O.o

[vivid vessel]

ye

you have to aim at the ennemies now tho

[unreal drum]

https://tenor.com/view/xddd-gif-11484761101775539239

[vivid vessel]

and if you hit the head it does more damage

[novel socket]

[unreal drum]

stop non of this would surprise me 😂

[magic shuttle]

back to combat rogue gameplay

[unreal drum]

back to this 😂

no thanks

[vivid vessel]

@proven ocean

[proven ocean]

cant join atm

[leaden folio]

he just want zac im sure

[timber knoll]

This made me think they’re rethinking outlaw - tracking RTB buffs with the new cooldown manager is easy so no WA required but all the other stuff may be simplified

[agile orchid]

I doubt they will touch outlaw’s apm

It is its identity

[rotund zodiac]

Do we get assault rifle?

[agile orchid]

I really hope they won’t listen to redditors who want to turn everything into ret paladin

[novel socket]

the same redditors that will then complain that everything is like ret paladin

[fossil lintel]

when did they fix the stealth during subterfuge not stopping AR bug?

[vapid rock]

do we play specifically around our 2-4 set to min max that buff?

or no?

[vivid vessel]

no

[unreal drum]

thats probably why they would change it high apm causes them alot of issues server/item wise

[agile orchid]

nah they will get a riot

[unreal drum]

idk if theres enough of us left to cause a riot that would matter xD

[novel socket]

but they are adding a one button rotation

no need to changte the spec

[red zinc]

I mean in all fairness they want to leave "cooldowns" out of the rotation priority thing

aka anything with a 1 minute or longer cd

but I don't think they quite thought about the whole outlaw cdr thing

vanish is not a 2min cd

[sharp wharf]

anyone knows how wound poison works for last 4 adds in cinderbrew? i tried to apply it but all adds were healing full hp

[vivid vessel]

you need the talent

and they need to be under 50% to not heal to full i think

[red zinc]

wat

that works?

[vivid vessel]

ye otherwise the healing is too much anyway

[red zinc]

oh

its written as 100% healing not set health to full

[sharp wharf]

ye they got anyways full hp so was wondering

[red zinc]

yeah okay that tracks

yeah its 45% heal dr so they'll heal for 55% hp

[slim hare]

xD those bugfixes !!! no wonder we were questionning why we were doing less on big pack than on 4 mobs sometimes

[red zinc]

gotta get shit below 45 for it to have any value

[novel socket]

what if rtb and adr were not active cooldowns but passives

that went up during fight

based off uptime

and in exchange spec becomes x2 faster

[red zinc]

put down the pan

[novel socket]

gcd goes down to 0.4

[red zinc]

take three steps away from the stove

[novel socket]

and ks is replaced with a ship and pirate crew coming in to assist us

in dps

we will all be on speeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed

[red zinc]

turbo niche question but if you need to vanish to maintain ADR but have a coup proc ready, would you press coup in stealth or nah

or just hold it the whole time

[magic shuttle]

hold

[prime glade]

!wa

[ornate heath]

Class packs:

• Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
• Zac's Group Devlin
  Utilities:
• Combo Point Standalone
• Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
• Ace refund sound trigger
• RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
• Unseen Blade tracker
  Fun:
• Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
• KS Ticking damage taken

[sullen narwhal]

Honestly, blizz has no justifications to have mastery scale so badly, bad secondary scaling is not a defining specialization trait, or at least it shouldn't be

It's like saying, doing bad damage is the trait of this specialization it's that ridiculous, nobody would accept such reasoning, and nobody should

[hybrid crown]

didnt they give it a huge buff for TWW

just slapped a dmg buff to it

and it didnt solve the problem

I want to say it was like 40%

[sullen narwhal]

They did it a few times i think, it's still bad

[magic shuttle]

you don't mind mastery as kir that much

[sullen narwhal]

Honestly, just slap an extra effect on it

Like stronger rtb buffs, or stronger generators if you don't wanna do finishers

Or mastery increases damage and proc rate

It's a bit dangerous to excessively increase the damage of generators though

Personally i wouldn't do it

Scaling rtb buffs would be very thematic though

[fresh skiff]

New to outlaw and couldn't find anything about it but how much uptime am I meant to have on adrenaline rush in dungeons?

[red zinc]

depends on your build slightly

but for kir 95 is a good average, can be a few % higher/lower

[novel socket]

i got a second Nightfall Curseblade's Cudgel from warbound drop in veteran tier

would that still be good for dual wielding with a champion tier one for keys ?

[red zinc]

champion version in main hand is maybe slightly worse than a 678 mainhand on aoe

definitely worse than 684 in a week though

[fresh skiff]

Thanks for the response. Seems like I need to do better then.

[novel socket]

there was a discussion here yesterday that dual wielding them could actually be better than mythic weapon for keys

[red zinc]

i mean

on pure aoe its like

such a small difference that weapon swapping for it is pointless

plus if you're playing optimally its a whole different story anyway

like unless your weapon situation is very dire id just play with a crafted mainhand over this

[novel socket]

hmm

[red zinc]

top sim is double 675 crafted, bottom is the mace in MH, its a 2.8% gap

weapon value is around that if not lower so like

weaponswapping for that .1% dps on aoe is just useless

[vivid vessel]

I get insta invites now

i think people know

[red zinc]

at the top maybe

or well

"top"

[vivid vessel]

tbf

its like

the same 5 players

i awlays find the same names in lfg

now

[red zinc]

almost like nobody pugs

idk what happened

really collapsed during the last season of df

since then pugging has shrunk so hard

even though theres more keys being done

[late swallow]

Meta brainrot has really gotten to people these last few seasons

[vale python]

Quick question, how does Weightstone/Wetsone work when you swap weapons in AOE/ST?

[red zinc]

just gotta apply it to all 3

i still cant tell whether resilient is account wide

doesnt feel like it

[late swallow]

It’s not

It’s character specific

[red zinc]

goofy

[wintry solar]

Everyone is looking for pugs but nobody's making groups

Assuming it's like pvp lfg

[proven ocean]

someone ping realz and tell him assassination is squishy and needs survivability buffs, same with outlaw

[vestal notch]

law squishy?

[proven ocean]

did u try it in +18 or

[unkempt swift]

Hard play in assa with pugs

[proven ocean]

open zac's stream more often than not he will die every 30 seconds

because he has to press killingspree

[jolly geyser]

isnt everything squishy in 18

[unkempt swift]

Insta 1% chain pulls)

[proven ocean]

no lmao

rogue is the only squishy class atm

assa that is

[vestal notch]

thats killing spree related, and relz has acknowledged killing spree issues in the past

[proven ocean]

rest are all tanky enough

[jolly geyser]

better buff sin dmg by 15% just incase

[vestal notch]

moonkin and shaman feel squishy to me but i dont play that specs

[wintry solar]

20% envenom!!!

[unkempt swift]

Event mace really up?

[proven ocean]

Event mace really up?

[late swallow]

[vivid vessel]

i think xav is bugged

i always get sent down

thoughts ?

!wa

[ornate heath]

Class packs:

• Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
• Zac's Group Devlin
  Utilities:
• Combo Point Standalone
• Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
• Ace refund sound trigger
• RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
• Unseen Blade tracker
  Fun:
• Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
• KS Ticking damage taken

[hasty warren]

get gud

[red zinc]

i never get sent down

literally a skill issue

[vivid vessel]

bro i must be bugged there is no way

last 2 top i did

i got sent

every single time

[dawn talon]

dude i feel like

[red zinc]

its rng but 2/3 chance you get sent down

[dawn talon]

1 person gets sent every time

[red zinc]

so getting it 10 times in a row isnt the rarest thing

rare but

[dawn talon]

i had that boss take 5:40

[red zinc]

possible

[dawn talon]

bc no lust

and our druid got sent every time

[bright crane]

Cuz ur doing too much damage Zac

Game trying to keep your damage in control

[red zinc]

if I had zacs gear id only lose by like 10-15% now

i read the guide

incredible

[bright crane]

Trying to leave some health for everybody else

[vivid vessel]

honestly

when i play with people that are one tricks

i do the same damage as them

when i play with dks

i gap them so hard

i think fotm rerollers are just all trash at the game

unless you are top 10 player

[red zinc]

can confirm

as a fotm reroller

[dawn talon]

ive played w some decent rerollers

only time i got gapped lately was a feral druid tho

[bright crane]

Sounds like they need 1 button to do their rotation

[red zinc]

the only reason i went dk anyway was for the funny high rolls

and they got rid of those now so

[cedar kernel]

how many new outlaws recently we get

[cedar kernel]

[vivid vessel]

i got surprised by feral aswell

he did insane dam

[mighty pivot]

aren't we all rerollers due to rtb?

[red zinc]

an outlawillion

[bright crane]

Feral is good

It’s just Boomie is better

[red zinc]

twerkshop?

[vivid vessel]

y

18

[red zinc]

mmhm

[bright crane]

Kinda wild they caught a buff ngl

[dawn talon]

dude i feel like

[red zinc]

raid buff

they aint good there

[dawn talon]

if ws last boss didn't like

[red zinc]

lizzard never takes m+ into account when raid buffing stuff

[dawn talon]

50000iq position balls to make it impossible to hit ks a single time

[red zinc]

leads to some stupid stuff sometimes

[dawn talon]

i would do 4.5 in that key every time

[red zinc]

playing with melee there kinda stinky

whenever im with ranged i never have issues

[dawn talon]

it's not that man the boss is sentient and deliberately fucks with you or something

[red zinc]

just fuck back

[fossil pagoda]

how can i get Nightfall Curseblade's Cudgel

[crude anchor]

Says it in the pin

[fossil pagoda]

ty

[red zinc]

https://raider.io/characters/eu/doomhammer/Tmyee?utm_source=addon how do i fix my gear

ts feels so doomed

[young prism]

Is swapping oh alllowed for only crafted dagger? Because the macro is not working for me in m+ run. However, it does out of dungeon

[red zinc]

what are you trying to swap to

[young prism]

the mace you get from gally

[red zinc]

yeah probably doesnt work since theres a cantrip on it

[young prism]

ah it is checking for flat stat weapon then?

[red zinc]

or you're trying to swap in combat, not sure what the specifics are but certain weapons are blacklisted to be swapped mid dungeon

i havent dropped any of them so i couldnt tell you for sure which they are

[young prism]

alright

got the idea gonnay try with another weapon

thanks for the reply ❤️

[kindred solstice]

!wa

[ornate heath]

Class packs:

• Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
• Zac's Group Devlin
  Utilities:
• Combo Point Standalone
• Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
• Ace refund sound trigger
• RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
• Unseen Blade tracker
  Fun:
• Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
• KS Ticking damage taken

[sullen narwhal]

Is the best outlaw rogue player the pirate king?

[red zinc]

rat king

[old badger]

[fossil pagoda]

when i try to buy the Nightfall Curseblade's Cudgel nothing happens

[crude anchor]

Do you have the mark to buy it?

[fossil pagoda]

i finish the quest

[gentle drift]

what is the best WA for rollthe bones? the one I found doesnt seem to be working

[crude anchor]

Read the pin again, make sure you have the item you need to buy it

[crude anchor]

!wa

[ornate heath]

Class packs:

• Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
• Zac's Group Devlin
  Utilities:
• Combo Point Standalone
• Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
• Ace refund sound trigger
• RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
• Unseen Blade tracker
  Fun:
• Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
• KS Ticking damage taken

[crude anchor]

ALl of those are decent

[gentle drift]

ty

[fossil pagoda]

so the items aren't red that means i can buy it

[crude anchor]

No, you sitll need the currency to buy it

[cinder relic]

It cannot be this complicated

[crude anchor]

It cannot be but whenever people ask questions like this I just think to myself, the'yre my 67 year old grandfather trying to play the game

[fossil pagoda]

got it

[polar kelp]

we just did a +15 (floodgate)with 3 outlaw rogues hahahahhahahah

[vivid vessel]

@cinder relic you tried outlaw a bit in keys

[cinder relic]

No, why do you ask

[vivid vessel]

we are legit decent now

big boom

[cinder relic]

thats funny

Its probably why we ended up sucking most seasons of DF then haha

[vivid vessel]

ye idk the difference is wild lol

especially in bigger pulls

you dont feel like being carried perma

its cool

[cinder relic]

So you're saying it wasnt the target cap

[vivid vessel]

WELL

[cinder relic]

[fast turret]

!prekey

[ornate heath]

Pre-key fuckery

• RTB as you enter the dungeon to get 2 Supercharger stacks.
• DO NOT RTB again inside the bubble as you will lose the supercharger stacks, similarly do not AR early inside the bubble or you will lose the combo points.
• After the bubble drops use RTB again (now at 4 stacks of Supercharger).
• Before entering the first pack BF into Stealth.
• Open on pack with AR into BtE.

[dawn talon]

it was the target cap just not in the way we thought

turns out 8 > 0

[cinder relic]

LOL actually

[tight kernel]

So softcap BF and rework KS in .7 ye?

Where our rogue dev at

[wicked obsidian]

there is a rouge dev?

[frail veldt]

Our target cap was actually even lower than 8 before

Lol

[glass mortar]

we were also playing pc when it largely probably wasnt doing anything

even on 8 target pulls when stuff starts dying pc wont go up because it was detecting off corpses

xd

[wicked obsidian]

because we believe in sims 😉

[glass mortar]

it really is a crazy bug

[dawn talon]

but yeah im like pretty happy with outlaw rn

there's still some changes id make but like

[tight kernel]

Anyone else enjoying the nightfall wep

[dawn talon]

i dont feel like im trolling not playing assa so that's cool

[tight kernel]

You are but it’s ok

We all cope together

[novel socket]

where is solo

need his wisdom

[glass mortar]

whats the question

[lethal sierra]

wait whut? Outlaw is playable right now?
Starts recrafting all his shitz...again

[bright crane]

https://tenor.com/view/costco-guys-five-big-booms-boom-gif-16319214973015367077

[stray star]

i was thinking abt swap assa for outlaw, it seems more fune, but the killing spree... i dont know if i have what it takes

[vivid vessel]

2 BIG BOOM

[crude anchor]

Only one way to find out, go play it, and if youj dont like it, swap back

[polar kelp]

Just accept you're going to die. It's not a matter of if...but when

After that acceptance, welcome to the club

[cold jewel]

the best way to find out what mechs to avoid pressing KS is just by dying to them in KS a lot

[fossil lintel]

is the weapon recraft bug where you get the discount from a single weapon still a thing or was that fixed?

[proven ocean]

@vivid vessel

[vivid vessel]

fixed

[vivid vessel]

oui

[proven ocean]

18

dfc

?

[cinder relic]

fixed on szn start

[stray star]

@vivid vessel are u using the nightfall offhand ?

[vivid vessel]

im with people rn

[tight kernel]

Someone better at the game than me, double nightfall wep for packs and swap to normal weps for ST cringe or ok?

[vivid vessel]

true

imma use it now

[fossil lintel]

sorry, just came back today, what is a szn?

[dim widget]

can someone please explain to me how iam not able to swap weapons during keys, is there some rules for that?

[frank finch]

i did that yesterday

[dim widget]

i tried multiple times now with macro and manually swapping, 100% out of combat since i was able to stealth

[covert kestrel]

Season

[tight kernel]

How did it feel? I tried yesterday just with oh but curious if double nightfall is bis aoe

[proven ocean]

?!

ok

[covert kestrel]

Mh you want ilvl

[red zinc]

It aint unless you are playing very poorly

[frank finch]

i posted the results , it felt fine tbh

[lofty pike]

Anyone thinks Outlaw gets a rework to lower the apm? 🧐

[cold jewel]

no because that's the whole niche of the spec

[red zinc]

Boy slow down posting all that bs messages 😂 ✌️

[red zinc]

Doesnt work with cantrip weapons usually (manual blacklist)

[cinder relic]

Double weapon would be dogshit because u lose the MH weapon damage

[red zinc]

They forgot to put this one on it though

[cold jewel]

wouldnt your ST be like atrocious with double cudgel?

[cinder relic]

u weapon swap

[red zinc]

On aoe its like .2% off in all fairness

[frank finch]

i swapped to real mh on bosses

[cold jewel]

unless you have BiS sure

[red zinc]

off 678 normal mh

[cold jewel]

cant you not swap unique-equips in keys?

[red zinc]

True actually maybe thats the common denominator

[dim widget]

what are cantrip weapons if i may ask

[cold jewel]

it was this way with underrot weapon too

[cold jewel]

green text at the bottom

[red zinc]

Special effect

[cold jewel]

typically a damage procc

[red zinc]

dont think it was at that point

[cold jewel]

it 100% was

[red zinc]

Cause i remember dh tanks swapping that weapon

On bosses

[cold jewel]

hmmm

o wait no i do remember people talking about the macro

[dim widget]

k thanks

[cold jewel]

ur right

[red zinc]

afaik it was a s4 introduction but i might be wrong

Regardless the unique-equipped thing is probably right moreso than cantrips

So atleast that helps

[frank finch]

al l iremember it was removed because of gavel

dont remember when added back

[red zinc]

GUARDIAN DRUID STRENGTH WEAPON TECHNOLOGY

[verbal mirage]

Hey hey shaman here lmao just wanted to thank all of you Outlaws for timing this

[tulip jewel]

not even a 2 chest

[verbal mirage]

Funnest FG I’ve ever had

[red zinc]

Gavel might be the single most broken item ever

outside of legendaries

[tulip jewel]

so the single most broken item ever except items that were way more broken right?

[light dune]

for the swap macro my non cudgel offhand is a dagger that I have 2 of in my bags for the other specs and it kinda soft locks the macro into just swapping between them is there a way around that or am I putting a dagger in the bank for keys

[bright crane]

Just remember how quickly they fixed that delve trinket earlier this patch

I wouldn’t get to bricked up on it

[red zinc]

almost like that did 14% on st

[tulip jewel]

yeah that was way more op than 5% aoe

[red zinc]

This is a marginal dps increase that would take a decent amount of effort for blizzard to fix

its not 5% aoe

[tight kernel]

Lmao did you guys see the DK wowhead post, wishlist and all

[tulip jewel]

over the course of a key yes it is

[red zinc]

no offense but you are either playing very low keys or not playing anywhere near optimally

Just see zac’s breakdowns using the weapon

[tulip jewel]

rofl

[red zinc]

If its 5% with 2 of em id understand maybe

[dim widget]

only a 14, but we also just had an interesting comp

[tulip jewel]

cute lil sin

[red zinc]

First boss trash PSF aoe segment

[tulip jewel]

2.6%?

[dim widget]

thats seem really low tbh

mine is usually around 4% on aoe

[tulip jewel]

bro was saying this too

it was more than 5% apparently

over an entire key

[red zinc]

What?

[tulip jewel]

[red zinc]

Is that what you interpreted from my messages?

Im saying its way weaker buddy

[tulip jewel]

CB 17 trash before 1st boss

4.4% over whole key

[polar kelp]

Thanks for healing!

[livid pewter]

idk if anyone needs a simple weakaura for equipeed weapons, since i found non i just made one quick

https://wago.io/0_MwwMejx

[tulip jewel]

but ye what do i know, i'm not playing optimally anyway

wonder if it scales more with HO from vers

[jovial sedge]

was fun tho! 🙂

[tight kernel]

Pretty sure if you’re over 3% with nightfall wep you’re not playing optimally. Should be around 2-3%

[polar kelp]

@past falcon another outlaw comp? get me in!

[fallen knot]

fml i guess uhdk is dead i need to gear outlaw

[proven ocean]

@vivid vessel since u dont wanna join 18 dfc

u think if i tell ur grp i have dfc 18 to kick you they'll replace you?

ur playing with pugs zac wtf

[vivid vessel]

ye

[proven ocean]

giga copium if u think dk is dead

[vivid vessel]

3 outlaw keys

udk is dead

time for outlaw to rise zeross

[tulip jewel]

xd

[vivid vessel]

ytou just arent aware yet

i need to find a third outlaw for our future keys zeross

[tulip jewel]

[proven ocean]

our

[vivid vessel]

maybe i try to recruit anything

yueye

[proven ocean]

ur crazy if u think im playing with outlaw

[vivid vessel]

dw about it zeross

you will come to understand

you arent aware yet

[tight kernel]

Y I thought the tuning was an ST buff and slight aoe nerf

[leaden folio]

you need sub

to go 1 ass 1 sub 1 outlaw

zeross obviously an ass

[proven ocean]

daily reminder of zac hyping up outlaw then remembering he plays cheat death and says fuck we cant play high keys i forgot

[polar kelp]

ewww thats so suboptimal

just 3 outlaw

[vivid vessel]

wait

true

fuck

[lone crow]

lmao

[modern terrace]

!wa

[ornate heath]

Class packs:

• Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
• Zac's Group Devlin
  Utilities:
• Combo Point Standalone
• Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
• Ace refund sound trigger
• RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
• Unseen Blade tracker
  Fun:
• Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
• KS Ticking damage taken

[tight kernel]

[vivid vessel]

have you done outlaw keys yet

[lone crow]

i did some weeklys but no real ones

rayan is busy irl

0 practice this weekend

[vivid vessel]

when are you guys playing

[lone crow]

friday

but like, we have 0 practice its gonna be a disaster no matter what

[vivid vessel]

reminds me of when we did it in s1

[lone crow]

xd ye

its fine, sucks a bit but what can u do

dungeons are even good for us

unlucky

[vivid vessel]

no outlaw keys ?

[fossil pagoda]

is 15% haste too low for HO ?

[frail veldt]

only slightly if youre playing with GS

[glass mortar]

no

[frail veldt]

but should feel fine

you can always use a haste flask if you want more

[fossil pagoda]

ok what is GS ?

[frail veldt]

ghostly strike

[fossil pagoda]

i play with PC in m+

[frail veldt]

then 15% is fine

[fossil pagoda]

ty

[frail veldt]

@vivid vessel is paranoid

is paranoid

[vivid vessel]

delete this message

no

[frail veldt]

lol

[dim lance]

xd

[frail veldt]

what target dummy do you use indoors? My love fool doesnt work anymore

[vivid vessel]

the mobs

[frail veldt]

ah

[vivid vessel]

ye

noob

[red zinc]

They fixed it?

[vivid vessel]

ye kekw

[red zinc]

doomed

[frail veldt]

been that way all season p sure

[red zinc]

I dont have it so wouldnt know

just remember always sucking off anyone that had it in s3

[vivid vessel]

NOOB

[frail veldt]

What do you do in workshop @vivid vessel if you cant get back up after jumping down

do you just dgaf

[red zinc]

jump down from what

[vivid vessel]

what

[frail veldt]

what

what jump

[vivid vessel]

ah ye

you dont care

[frail veldt]

kk

[eternal mortar]

What's the macro to change the weapon?

[red zinc]

wtf

nda?

[tight kernel]

Pin

[red zinc]

cease this withholding of information at once

[tight kernel]

u don’t know ws tech Timmy?

[red zinc]

man ive been under a rock the whole season

[tight kernel]

For ub stack pre key

Since can’t use dummy indoor anymore cause blizz is cringe

[red zinc]

oh like that

[tight kernel]

Or just get ub stacks at dorn before walking in

[red zinc]

as long as people in my keys are bursting less than outlaw i aint worrying about all that

manual progressing all over is always fun

[eternal mortar]

Is there a Stealth Macro for Meld?

[winged inlet]

can someone link me hes details profile?

[late swallow]

!meld

[ornate heath]

Night Elf does sim as the best race for m+, however there is a few quirks you need to be aware of:

• you need to restealth after pressing meld to trigger subterfuge (there is a slight delay)
• you cannot restealth against any boss (raid or m+) and some special global combat mobs
• meld can break quite easily if you move or take damage
• it seems that you need to break your stealth with something else than BtE to benefit from crackshot

[late swallow]

Hmm thought there’d be a macro

@frail veldt has a good meld macro

[late swallow]

Tagging you in case he sees this and replies

[vivid vessel]

Tagging you aswell in case he sees this and replies

[covert kestrel]

@covert kestrel tagging myself in case i see this and reply

[verbal fjord]

Killing spree so ass it crashed my game

Mid fight like

[vivid vessel]

deserved?

[verbal fjord]

I hate using it man

[glass mortar]

alright

today i brush off kir trickster

time to put together a gear set

[keen belfry]

ive been practicing it weran

i still have too many low points

i play bad

[glass mortar]

is this 1 fth nonsense really the play

[keen belfry]

its tuff

but i think so ye

you blast low packs/as packs are ending

[untold yarrow]

@glass mortar you gonna go back into KS hell?

[glass mortar]

i mean i been playing ks this whole season man

[red zinc]

1fth aint that bad just roll good

[glass mortar]

ur jokin urself if ur trying to play fatebound in keys at this point

even in the worst kspree key

trickster probably doing 10% more dps easily

[untold yarrow]

nah dw

im not playing fatebound

i just went back to tanking

[glass mortar]

xd

[untold yarrow]

zero fun with ks

[verbal fjord]

0

[untold yarrow]

even without KS outlaw would be frustrating

because of the usual issues, target cap yadda yadda

but this is just too far imo

[keen belfry]

KS is frustrating

its even more frustrating when you simply cant press it

cuz man coup is so good for this spec

[untold yarrow]

its even more frustrating when boomie / dk can do 3x your damage pressing 2 buttons

[red zinc]

do you get off work at this time or smth

[glass mortar]

its ok ur an ethical spec

and ur overalls r gr8 now

[red zinc]

feels like you're always complaining at about the same time every day

not hating just noticing

[untold yarrow]

no

i have an alarm clock set up

standing calendar event

[red zinc]

vali

d

[untold yarrow]

"cry on outlaw discorD"

[glass mortar]

tanks r fun this season anyway

i dont blame u

its kinda wild we get a full season of kspree

no bandaid fix

[keen belfry]

are we ethical?

[glass mortar]

yea i mean ur prio is decent and ur aoe is very high on every pull

[untold yarrow]

dr jay ele in 19 priory tho

big

[cinder relic]

Bro not even Zac is this much of a victim anymore

[keen belfry]

we r decent ethical id say

theres levels to ethical

[untold yarrow]

there must always be a cry king @cinder relic

[cinder relic]

[untold yarrow]

surely we gonna see outlaw in TOP

[vivid vessel]

prolly not

but that doesnt matter

[leaden folio]

since the fix, I like so much playing outlaw its amazing

[vivid vessel]

outlaw is exactly where i have always wanted outlaw to be

its not meta

but its right up there

[leaden folio]

still a bit weird on big pull, but I feel great

[vivid vessel]

its like assa kinda

im just a bit worried that outlaw destroy low keys too much but eh

it always does so

and even more now that they created pc

[latent belfry]

getting the major bugs fixed help so much

[untold yarrow]

how long did the bf bug exist for

[vivid vessel]

turns out damaging alive mobs is good

since sl at least

before that bf was uncapped

[untold yarrow]

nice game

[vivid vessel]

so it didnt matter

[leaden folio]

SL was such a waste

SL was not prepared

[eternal mortar]

Lets use this mace as long as we can, lets enjoy it

[unkempt dew]

Outlaw is always meta inside my heart

[untold yarrow]

xd

maybe ill try it again after fix

but playing with ks

[unkempt dew]

Oeh it’s time to get the event weapon

[icy hare]

Event weapon better then mugzee knucks?

[stuck timber]

Event weapon?

[gaunt phoenix]

on trash yeah. bosses no

[gaunt phoenix]

Pinned message

[latent belfry]

its very decent in dungeons

its shadow quake i think

[untold yarrow]

thats crazy dam

are you swapping to mugze for bosses?

[latent belfry]

yee

if i remember

[fossil pagoda]

when should i swap cycres ?

[untold yarrow]

i think u gotta sim it because it sims higher than some 665 rings

[latent oak]

the vers mstery ring at 658 sims higher than circlet in st for me

and aoe ofc

[magic shuttle]

hmm i wonder if i can extract pc value of such pulls

[vivid vessel]

i play pc in here

i think having a 2 target boss

• big momma

• appart from pack 1 you are under target cap mostly

it looks scary in mdt

but

this is kinda chainy

[gaunt phoenix]

its hard because pc also works when things are dying or you step out of range for a second or three

like

[vivid vessel]

this is under cap

[latent oak]

pack before duo boss u end up with 2 shredinators too

[vivid vessel]

this is perma pc

this you should get pc quite quick when mobs start dying

this aswell

and end of dungeon is perma pc

this big pc pack

[magic shuttle]

ok, will try pc

[untold yarrow]

gl

[gaunt phoenix]

first boss priory

not sure why it didnt hit 4 times

like it did single target damage to both bosses

[fathom bramble]

does it often not hit the entire pack?

[gaunt phoenix]

not noticed anything weird on packs, was trying to check the split damage scaling

[glass mortar]

yea doesnt look like it splashed

did it maybe happen during a leap away?

[cloud abyss]

some1 has a macro for casting BTE on focus target ?

[vivid vessel]

why does ww equp swords

and then hit with its fist

[late swallow]

@vivid vessel bumping this thread in case mewo comes back

[dawn talon]

idk why do we equip fist weapons and slash with them

[lyric blade]

/cast [@focus][] generic macro for any focus target ability

[glass mortar]

u used to have a default ability (ur filler chi builder) that struck with ur weapon

they changed it to be tiger palm years ago

theres a glyph that makes tigers palm strike with ur weapon tho

[dawn talon]

glyph of jab save us...

[late swallow]

Glyph of jab? No thanks Mr Fauci i won’t be getting the vaccine

[cedar kernel]

gm solo

[gaunt phoenix]

https://tenor.com/view/purify-restful-cat-distinguished-cat-ruocgiff-gif-24035424

[cedar kernel]

u know i dont have works these time so my nitro and my sub are all gone soon

so i need to send hi more

[craggy quiver]

I thought you can't swap equipment in keys

[glass mortar]

u can swap weapons

[craggy quiver]

Wtf

Since forever?

[red zinc]

ye

its in case they break so you can still play the game

[empty elbow]

There was some tech that survival hunters used to swap to bows during some fights and then back to their 2hander after

Especially in PVP too

[craggy quiver]

Wtf lol I remember when they change armor swap in m+

And never thought about it since

I thought it was all equip

[red zinc]

can swap weapons except for unique equipped

although

[craggy quiver]

Does this weap work in raid like stix ? Or u only get one proc?

[red zinc]

now thinking about it that isnt even true either cause crafted is unique equipped too I guess

[red zinc]

works on the new adds

[craggy quiver]

Well shiet

[red zinc]

just doesnt reset on vanish

cause its boss combat

[craggy quiver]

Got it

[red zinc]

so its probably worse on stix but thats feelycraft math

[craggy quiver]

So probably worth if you wanna pad

[red zinc]

nahh dont think so

[craggy quiver]

Ok

[empty elbow]

I've been playing fatebound in 15s and still keeping up in damage with my team

[red zinc]

[empty elbow]

Yeah it's objectively going to always be worse dps

But not killing myself is pretty poggers

[glass mortar]

oh man i cant use the weaponswap macro in the pins because im using two of the same named weapon

[latent oak]

there is a way around this

i just cant remember it xd

[glass mortar]

@vivid vessel u have the secret tech

[light dune]

i used gearsets to workaround it (2 seperate macros / keybinds tho)

/equipset 'set name'

[red zinc]

what if you tell it to equip the weapon in both slots in the macro

does it bug it

still

2 seperate macros i guess

[craggy quiver]

Two of these weap is probably pretty good then on adds

[red zinc]

na

[cloud abyss]

is the nightfall curseblade worth on stix mythic ?

[red zinc]

the margin is too small to give a precise accurate number but its probably -0.2-0.3% worse to use it in mainhand

on pure aoe

even if it was a slight bit better (massive aoe pulls) i dont think its worth the effort to swap

[craggy quiver]

Yea definitely super true once item lvl jump

[red zinc]

(over a generic 678 mh)

so yeah 684 will be definitively better

[craggy quiver]

I think champion gear stays the same

[frank finch]

its only mythic and heroic gear

[red zinc]

still better than a 684 oh though in theory

they just need to implement it in simc

i dont like feelycraft numbers like this when its close

[glass mortar]

@cobalt harness would u know how to bypass the limitation of a weaponswap macro if im DW two of the same weapons

[empty elbow]

Oh wait we have to use the weapon in mainland? Or offhand works

[vivid vessel]

/equipsdfasdf 2 2 (which are inventory slot)

figure out what 2 2 is idk if the first one is bag

and second is bag slot

or opposite

idk

you will get it

easy

[cobalt harness]

you'd need to use bag slots

[vapid blaze]

nice macro

i will try that

[cobalt harness]

or equipement sets

[vapid blaze]

equipsdfasdf

[vivid vessel]

i think equip sets dont work either

[cobalt harness]

I'd personally do equipment sets

[glass mortar]

how do i equip the bag slot to my oh tho

[cobalt harness]

/equipset name

make one with just the weapons

[glass mortar]

i wanted it to be 1 button, id need two equipset binds if i used that no?

[stiff hawk]

Btw do we know how much dmg the one button rotation does?

[sharp glacier]

Hi there, stupid question incoming.
I haven't played Outlaw in forever, always been Assassination but thought I'd give Outlaw a go. "Problem" is that I just spent my first and only gilded crests on a MH dagger and I noticed that you don't use daggers in OH anymore. Is it a huge dps loss to use a fast OH again until I get some decent slow OH?

I don't play much so can't grind crests fast to make a new one and not really doing high keys yet either.

[desert tendon]

if u look at assa / sub

you can assume that s -60% tira

[stiff hawk]

I would assume even worse for outlaw

[gaunt phoenix]

idk what you read but, daggers in OH is basically identical to a slow OH

[desert tendon]

you dont care about oh

!oh

[ornate heath]

A dagger offhand is technically like 0.2% better than a slow weapon because it generates more Instant Poison procs. That is the only difference, Fatal Flourish proc rate is normalized to be unaffected by the change in attack speed. Note that item level or stats will matter more than this quirk, or you can simply use a slow weapon anyway for transmog.

[magic shuttle]

does the mace proc interact with blade rush btw?

[gaunt phoenix]

dagger is slightly better even

Yes

well the damage proc doesnt flurry

just flurry instantly triggers it on the entire pack

or at least the 7 mobs that you hit xdd

[glass mortar]

whats the actual command

[gaunt phoenix]

equipslot

/equipslot <inventory number> <bag number> <bag slot number>

so the first number is 17

@calm osprey you can prob try this too

equip by bag slot

[sharp glacier]

Hrm, alright. Well, tbh, I just checked the guides which all put a mace/sword/fist as the go-to weapon of choice. I'll read up a bit better next time, thanks!

I'll see myself out :>

[glass mortar]

there we go

[gaunt phoenix]

they probably have these weapons

these are special weapons they have damage procs on them

which makes them better than normal weapons usually

but yea normal dagger vs normal sword/etc is the same

[sharp glacier]

Aye, very true.
Thanks again. Now to get a decent MH, will probably start with the champion one from Nightfall.

[cinder relic]

Proc dagger > proc 1hander > dagger > 1hander

[red zinc]

never seen thsi before

[hidden bay]

what stuns on gally?

[red zinc]

huh

[hidden bay]

i press ks and get stunned not sure by what

[frank finch]

thats .5 stuff

[frank finch]

the lasers when he starts spinning?

[late ruin]

Anyone have any issues getting the undersea gem for ring? Logged multiple toons and it wont show for any

[red zinc]

wrong way around

[hidden bay]

im not that stupid

[hollow temple]

its a new .5 thing

[hidden bay]

ill just go sin

ks on gallywix is insanely stupid

idk whats happening there but its cursed

[frank finch]

[undone coyote]

!rtb

[ornate heath]

How to use RTB
( HO build)

• Roll on cooldown until you get a 5 buff. If you have 4 total buffs including CTO, you can choose to keep them until 3, it's not an expected dps loss or gain.

( KIR build)

• Has a concept of buffs being preserved through RTB casts after pressing KIR instead of being rolled off.
• Use this weakaura to see how many buffs you "will lose" by pressing RTB (red or blue border).
• Roll if you will lose between 0-2 buffs.
• Roll if you will lose between 3-4 buffs if they are all below ~10s remaining.
• If you KIR a natural 5 buff, wait until buffs approach ~41s remaining before rolling.

The faq elaborates on these rules.

[frank finch]

zac using nightfall mace

it must be good

[high parrot]

i couldnt find this in FAQ but does dungeon slice on raidbots work for simming top gear or should you use something else

[cinder relic]

Orbs on gally stun

As does the cast the adds do

The technician

[gaunt phoenix]

it is good for outlaw

[high parrot]

TY i keep hoping it tells me to swap my gear because i have like 23% haste but i guess haste is just good

[proven ocean]

@vivid vessel @lone crow does +0 reset portal dungeon tp

or +2

only

[modern terrace]

+2

[proven ocean]

guys

i need a +2 key

anyone on europe

with a +2 key

plz

need now

[red zinc]

wish they'd remove the respeccing stuff in dungeons

get why people do it now

but just feels clunk

[cinder relic]

Huh

[red zinc]

talent / spec changing mid dungeon using portals and what not

[tender breach]

so the nightfall gudgel is BIS for mythics?

[gaunt phoenix]

ye should be

on trash

can swap it before bosses

[tight kernel]

you can play HO with KIR stats but not other way around right?

[gaunt phoenix]

ye

[tender breach]

@gaunt phoenix I had the impression that u couldnt swap gear in m+

[gaunt phoenix]

you can swap weapons

[tender breach]

cool

[gaunt phoenix]

some weapons they dont allow it but it works here

[tight kernel]

Im now a kir believer

maybe not in raid yet tho

Solo, trying to sim some recrafts to see where it puts my haste but I guess sim too large for report? https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/4vgK6VVA8WW2xhR2jTQHyL
Any way around this?

[gaunt phoenix]

click these dots

then you can rerun that combination in quicksim

[tight kernel]

thank you for being smarter than me

[spark glade]

!wa

[ornate heath]

Class packs:

• Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
• Zac's Group Devlin
  Utilities:
• Combo Point Standalone
• Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
• Ace refund sound trigger
• RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
• Unseen Blade tracker
  Fun:
• Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
• KS Ticking damage taken

[proven ocean]

these wowhead posts are nice they are very informative

guys we got darkmoon back for the 100000th time since classic

can u believe that

sheeesh?

[frank finch]

the word is spreading zac viewership going up everyday

[hidden bay]

!FUU

[ornate heath]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[compact sun]

Hey Guys, question is there someone who i can ask some niche questions about M+ outlaw KiR rotation

[gaunt phoenix]

just ask

[compact sun]

Well 1. killing spree in subterfuge window or outside

[gaunt phoenix]

outside

[compact sun]

2. does subterfuge affects trinkets?

[gaunt phoenix]

no

[compact sun]

is KiR or HO builds better in keys between 10-12

i wont go higher

[gaunt phoenix]

KIR 1 FTH is the best overall but its hard

[compact sun]

fth ?

[gaunt phoenix]

the KIR build can use 2 FTH or 1 FTH

fan the hammer

[gaunt phoenix]

if you ignore 1 FTH then HO vs KIR is preference really

HO slightly better at bosses/low targets, KIR slightly better at bigger pulls

you want this talent

[compact sun]

well i never played HO build is that easier ?

[gaunt phoenix]

precise cuts does infinite damage right now

yeah HO is easier

[fiery timber]

but feels like ass

kinda

kir is smoother if u ask me

[compact sun]

i struggle with ST dmg atm

aoe is oke dmg

but St is ....

[gaunt phoenix]

if you cant maintain adrenaline rush then prob making errors

[compact sun]

any gear suggestions

[fiery timber]

stats lookin fine

[fiery timber]

m+ or raid st ?

[compact sun]

i only play M+

[fiery timber]

!log

u can post a log there and someone maybe will check it

[compact sun]

i dont log 😐

[tight kernel]

someone u play with might

check your logs

[compact sun]

dont know how tho

[tight kernel]

and post if any

[fathom bramble]

what is good damage on a 16 cinderbrew? @vivid vessel

[vivid vessel]

i do 5mil now

[fiery timber]

that shaman was afk or what

[tight kernel]

posted ur log for u

[vivid vessel]

without raid buff (lets sayu sham doesnt count i think its minimal nowadays)

[compact sun]

thanks

[hollow portal]

are you using the zac event weapon?

[vivid vessel]

i didnt know it was named after me

[gaunt phoenix]

not sure HO can do 5 mill

[hollow portal]

xd are you using it?

[vivid vessel]

i just started using it

[tight kernel]

Finally fixed my haste

[fathom bramble]

I feel like I could do a bit more with more key practice