outlaw

[vivid vessel]

0% wipe

[pale pivot]

Oh nice then

[daring oxide]

ooof

dam

unlucky

[quaint wharf]

bf fixed

[vivid vessel]

ye lol

[quaint wharf]

woohooo

[daring oxide]

I almost got a 4mil btw

in 11.1

[vivid vessel]

nice

[daring oxide]

before the 11.1.5 patch

[vivid vessel]

ye i mean

i dont like bandit

[daring oxide]

was like 20k dps off

[vivid vessel]

it feels soooo rng

idk how you feel

like if things line up

[random stirrup]

are u guys not doing the fast push strat

[vivid vessel]

you do infinite damage

[vivid vessel]

no

[random stirrup]

we did it on reclear yesterday

[vivid vessel]

we stop dps

for 30s

[daring oxide]

yeah

[vivid vessel]

:)

[random stirrup]

that is better

[daring oxide]

its all about lining up really

[random stirrup]

than fast strat

ngl

[daring oxide]

and heavily reliant on RTB rng

[vivid vessel]

except you cant tho

[gaunt phoenix]

@vivid vessel fazed on secondary targets is fixed

[daring oxide]

like getting 5 natty at the right time

[random stirrup]

i got an 8 💀

[vivid vessel]

like with ks and shit

[random stirrup]

we didn't spawn any adds

at all

[vivid vessel]

wait real ?

[hollow temple]

[random stirrup]

single target fight

[vivid vessel]

tahts crazyu

@gaunt phoenix thoughts on spreading fazed

[gaunt phoenix]

yeah our assumption about the whitelist was wrong, it has to be scripted

[daring oxide]

well not KS, but you could hold vanish charges for like the booty spawns etc

you know at like 1min 40secs

[fathom bramble]

Does it copy off our main target or does it work like gs?

[daring oxide]

and obviously having 5 natty + GM buff up there

would be nice

[vivid vessel]

ye but you cant cause then you fuck up ks cdr

idk

[daring oxide]

you could send KS first

then into vanish

[vivid vessel]

also im mostly talking about reel assistant

[daring oxide]

unseen blade procs onto the booties

[vivid vessel]

i think its the most impactful

[daring oxide]

with VF

BF

[gaunt phoenix]

like gs

[daring oxide]

yeah real assist most important

i played PC

because it helps do big damage on Assists

[vivid vessel]

like if you manage to get good vanish windows where you cleave 3

reel + reel + boss

its very good

[fathom bramble]

Not the ideal fix, but it’s consistent with our other stuff at least

[daring oxide]

i could never do this

[vivid vessel]

but idk it feels so rng

[vivid vessel]

im starting to get it now

[daring oxide]

because my tanks never tank boss between reels

[vivid vessel]

but i didnt prog it so its a bit hard

[glass mortar]

does gs work again or

[random stirrup]

i assume he's mouseover bteing a far reel

[glass mortar]

🤔

[fathom bramble]

Making it copy is probably a nightmare anyway

[daring oxide]

i can only hit boss + 1 reels

due to my tanks

but i dont want to pester them to do it properly

so i just go along with it

unless theres another way

[vivid vessel]

nah you could hit other i think aswell

i dont think boss position matters for it

its just hard

[daring oxide]

like off a reel

max melee?

so off one reel at max melee BF should reach the outer one?

[vivid vessel]

target boss

cleave the reel behind

and bte behind you

basicallyt

angle yourself 90 degree

[daring oxide]

wtf

[tight kernel]

I’m just waiting for solo to hit us with “bf softcap” 🥲

[daring oxide]

this some kinda trigonometry shit

[desert tendon]

wtf

the fixes

zac show us some brew first pull damage now

[daring oxide]

zac gonna be doing 20mil now

on first pull

instead of 10mil

outlaw saved

[vivid vessel]

like vurai

[desert tendon]

you mean

[vivid vessel]

i target boss

[desert tendon]

he s gonna do 10m

[vivid vessel]

reel assistant 1 is behind

and i bte 2

[desert tendon]

instead of 6m

right?

[timber knoll]

ladies and gentleman, it's time to game

[raven condor]

LET'S FUCKIN GOOOOOOO

[potent latch]

so they pushed it on live already without any notes?

[gaunt phoenix]

Yes

[hollow temple]

happens pretty often

[vivid vessel]

i got pinged

[sullen narwhal]

I get quite pissed when playing outlaw

I think the reason is mostly because of the somewhat low proc rate on sinister strike

[runic bough]

True

[sullen narwhal]

It's so fucking annoying when you press sinister 5 times and none are double slash

It just pisses me off, and happens way too many times

[runic bough]

6 sinister strikes for a finisher can be soul crushing.

[patent mirage]

Remember how they reduced the SS chance for the tier set

In df s3

[sullen narwhal]

And then forgot to buff it

[patent mirage]

Yes

[sullen narwhal]

Honestly, in my opinion it should be at least 45%

if not 50

[cinder relic]

Just as a heads up don't expect articles like that to ever happen again

Likely the one, and only I request of this nature

[jolly geyser]

just posted abit degen poki gif to image and just shift click deleted

[sullen narwhal]

You cannot have such an important proc for the gameplay of the spec be so low

[desert tendon]

can u please not expose me like that tyvm

[runic bough]

I find it odd why it's being discouraged to post articles on bug findings.

But ok

[cinder relic]

Because wowhead isn't a bug reporting website

[jolly geyser]

they wouldnt have fixed shit otherwise

[vivid vessel]

wdym

[dense bolt]

Ye i think most of us get that, bf not hitting its intended targets tho was a good reason to send this particular article, but small bugs i dont think anyone would assume would grant an article

[vivid vessel]

tehy report bugs

litteraly on cd

[cinder relic]

In the sense of

It's not a website for class writers to just asy "Hey heres some bugs can you fix them pwease"

[vivid vessel]

ye i mean unless its mega major

[vivid vessel]

funy how its the only way to get bug fixed tho

[cinder relic]

Subterfuge got bug fixed without an article

[runic bough]

Yeah fr

After how long though?

[vivid vessel]

oik bro

after 3 years

of us

asking everyday

[red zinc]

i mean in all fairness this bug got discovered and the article came out less than a day later

[vivid vessel]

thats crazy

[runic bough]

[red zinc]

they mightve fixed it since they were made aware without the article alr

[vivid vessel]

and at the time we even had realz in here

everyday

and it still didnt get fixed

till now

[cinder relic]

U think if i made an article it'd be fixed?

[vivid vessel]

ye lol

probably

i think they get pressured

[tight kernel]

So what are the builds looking like

[red zinc]

subt bugs are too hard to understand for random goobers

[runic bough]

I thought itbwas established already they mostly fix bugs on publicity.

[red zinc]

writing an article would be a lil rough i think

[cinder relic]

Well when u write for wowhead you can use it as a platform to ask for daily articles about bugs

I won't be doing that

[vivid vessel]

litteraly the first time ever you did it tho

[cinder relic]

I've done 1

[vivid vessel]

not sure what the issue is right

[cinder relic]

This has been the 1 singular article i've written about bugs

[runic bough]

Well thanks for doing that anyways guy

We will sit with the remainder of bugs now.

[quartz violet]

You da GOAT dont change

[quaint wharf]

Big W for the outlaws

[runic bough]

Big win for outlaw guys

[quaint wharf]

More W’s to come in 11.1.7

[runic bough]

I want to leave work early to test bf

[red zinc]

tomorro

[covert kestrel]

Which means you've got a 100% record of getting their attention! Don't quit now!

[cinder relic]

I feel like finding the big bug behind blade flurry, along with stuff like GM, coup, and fazed as a good opportunity to highlight a handful of them. Could have maybe went a different way about it but either way, Likely will never happen again

[red zinc]

i imagine the ptr will be this week with all the stuff they've been dropping today

[vivid vessel]

I mean i apreciate that you did it, but i also think its not "wrong" to drop an artcile like that when its that major

[viscid forge]

!fuu

[ornate heath]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[vivid vessel]

well why was the title "11.1.5 new bug"

you knew it wasnt new right

[cinder relic]

Probably a misunderstanding between me and jaydaa

[vivid vessel]

like that was bad imo

but dropping an artcile about bugs as important as these ?

idk man

wowhead drops bug artciles everyday about random bullshit idk if anyone cares

[runic bough]

They are discouraged to bug fix Zac we should have known

[bright crane]

I kinda feel like this is a “don’t look a gift horse in the mouth” situation

[runic bough]

But at least he did this one for us

[desert tendon]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/316923682607857685/1212526973830570026/zachate.gif

[bright crane]

Sometimes we just gotta accept the W and move on

[icy orchid]

i used to be fat too dw u can lose the weight

[runic bough]

Yeah should I leave work early to go play or stay at work guys

[coarse plover]

Big W

[bright crane]

Finish your work…

[peak dock]

anyone know where is the next catalyst charge?

[red zinc]

yesterday

or in 2 weeks

[peak dock]

ty

[runic bough]

I got a spark from this week

Was that old or what

[bright crane]

A full one or half?

[runic bough]

Half

[jolly geyser]

new one next week

[bright crane]

U get half a spark every week

[covert kestrel]

You don't want to know about 5 earthen decorations the writer hopes they add for player housing!?!? What's wrong with you??

[bright crane]

If u made a full spark this week it means ur 1 behind

[cinder relic]

Housing is based

About to be the best feature the game has ever gotten

[runic bough]

Yeah got all my sparks then

[jolly geyser]

wonder how im gonna decorate

[fierce trout]

Just read the article. I think it highlights everything pretty well. Hopefully blizzard will start taking a closer look at us

[timid idol]

BUGS FIXED?

https://tenor.com/view/soccer-cheer-yes-portugal-uefa-gif-5770439

[hollow temple]

tbf i think most classes get articles when there's new highly impactful bugs discovered, especially after a patch

[jolly geyser]

warlock have some major bug also

[fierce trout]

Thank you based @cinder relic ❤️

[hollow temple]

like most recently DH had one

[timid idol]

now

killing spree damage immunity when

[jolly geyser]

that wont happen

[timid idol]

so dead spell

[queen birch]

someone tested?

[runic bough]

No we want ks removed

Not immune ks lol

[timid idol]

remove or damage imunity

just

let me play my dungeon

without running into aoes

[fierce trout]

Just need to make other builds as viable

[jolly geyser]

just make BR "op"

[fluid iron]

nothing new, that sub gets ignored

[frail veldt]

damage immunity is a bad solution tbh

[jolly geyser]

sub ignored but still does great dps

[frail veldt]

I sure hope so

I have many many questions about housing rn

curious to see how they do it

[runic bough]

What is so exciting about housing?

[cinder relic]

U get to make a house

[jolly geyser]

chill

[runic bough]

That means less time grinding

[covert kestrel]

Now you can be cozy while getting denies to 10s

[runic bough]

Will it spawn herbs in my home

If not I'm still never going to be inside

[jolly geyser]

I got shackled ur zul and hc gally mount drop today,the real endgame. mounts

[fathom bramble]

it's also crazy that damage/cc immunity would still leave the spell as uncastable in a lot of situations

[frail veldt]

wdym

[fathom bramble]

can't cast while baiting, can't cast on myth sprocket

[frail veldt]

if I dont die then idc

[fathom bramble]

can't cast with bombs out on mugzee

[frail veldt]

thats the reason immunity wouldnt work

youd just kill the raid on cd

most people arent gona not cast it

[prisma sapphire]

damn!

[timid idol]

no aoe build skips ks atm

[prisma sapphire]

BF FIX

let's goooo

[runic bough]

Also would immunity work on stun mechs?

[fathom bramble]

it's also simultaneously probably insanely overpowered at the same time somehow

because now it's a damage immunity with 10% uptime

[prisma sapphire]

are you guys noticing a decent dps increase from these fixes in keys?

[runic bough]

There are many bosses where ks will stun us and cancel out

[timid idol]

fr, as long as its not some lottery bullshit like in xiv and everyone has house it will be goated

probably the best feature the game has ever received

fluff feature at least

[frail veldt]

immunity usually means mechanics do nothing to you

[fathom bramble]

damage immunity wouldn't necessarily convey cc immunity, but I think when people say immune they mean both

[frail veldt]

like bubble

[fathom bramble]

like KS technically makes us immune to damage right now

[frail veldt]

"immune" usually prevents the application of negative debuffs

[fathom bramble]

it just delays it all until later

[frail veldt]

KS turns damage into stagger

but doesnt prevent harmful debuffs

[timid idol]

ya ur right lol, faced this issue on last and first floodgate bosses

you can literally troll ur team

[frail veldt]

all other "immune" mechanics prevent harmful debuff application

afaik

[timid idol]

why cant the teleporting be cosmetic and your hitbox just stays in the same place

[fathom bramble]

demon hunter thingy is just damage immunity and ton of mechanics still apply through it

[timid idol]

who came up with the idea of actually teleporting around

[frail veldt]

in pvp it prevents harmful debuffs

including loss of control effects

[timid idol]

why can it not be like demon hunter blade dance

cosmetic teleports

[frail veldt]

it could be

but it isnt

[fathom bramble]

weird

it doesn't remove or prevent the type of stuff that bubble and cloak of shadows can so idk

[frail veldt]

it doesnt remove no

but it does prevent loss of control

I dont think it prevents dots though

so it must be its own flag

since its an animation

it must prevent any animation impacting debuff

[fathom bramble]

does it only prevent player applied loss of control in pvp

[timid idol]

oh ye it removes some loss of control

[frail veldt]

does it actually prevent you from taking damage in pve?

[fathom bramble]

or does it actually grant loss of control immunity like bladestorm

[frail veldt]

like if you hda a dot

does meta actually prevent a dot from killing you?

how does that actually work

[timid idol]

idk bro just change this shit rn

give me blade rush back

[frail veldt]

that one

[timid idol]

can i just play blade rush and brick my dps

[frail veldt]

but vengful retreat is an immunity to damage

in pvp

but more in a "turtle" kinda way where it prevents new application of dots/damage but doesnt remove

turtle was a "deflect" originally iirc

also meld has a loss of control and damage iframe in pvp

[runic bough]

We need to replace ks with blade rush yes

[frail veldt]

you can meld storm bolts/chaos bolts/etc

[timid idol]

wait so

is kir better in m+ now bcs of deft fix?

[frail veldt]

but yeah can you not die in meta? like even if you have a dot

cuz meta doesnt remove dots right?

[frail veldt]

theyre both still about equal

[timid idol]

[frail veldt]

HO was 5% ahead in dslice before

[timid idol]

ic

[cinder relic]

sims for awhile assumed deft wasnt bugged

afaik

And ho was ahead

then it got fixed

[timid idol]

oh

[cinder relic]

then ho was more ahead

[timid idol]

[cinder relic]

then bug got added to sims toa ccount for rotational changes

Zac will say kir is better cuz he likes the build, HO is still good

Can play either probs still

[gaunt phoenix]

kir should win at higher target counts now

by like 3-4%ish

[frail veldt]

BF activation damage goes hard

[gaunt phoenix]

but lose lower target counts

[blissful zinc]

If you could play both sin and outlaw at similar levels what dungs would you run outlaw? (If any)

[cinder relic]

Theater?

[runic bough]

Outlaw is the Top key yeah

[cinder relic]

But probs none if you are trying to be omega optimal

It's not like the margins are that big

On top anyway, that u would feel the need to swap

But hey outlaw did get a bunch of damage fixes today

[craggy barn]

outlaw is huge in top, if u ever get picked during pvp u can just kill ur party member

[blissful zinc]

Yea thx for your effort 🙏

[craggy barn]

just KS ur team mate

[blissful zinc]

@cinder relic

[craggy barn]

ez

[runic bough]

I was vs a ret

He 75% my hp with one ability

[umbral verge]

Shoulda cloaked it

[runic bough]

No our dmg is weak

[umbral verge]

Cloak first global so they can’t hammer

[runic bough]

So just let them finish us

[timid idol]

yea was gonna say

[jolly geyser]

prolly carded then hammer

[timid idol]

i never lost top pvp as ret

[craggy barn]

nah u gotta play it so u dont lose gcd time

[jolly geyser]

or reckoning

[craggy barn]

get that free CDR

[runic bough]

Tru

Good call

[timid idol]

if bro uses wake of ashes for fun

and then the followup thing

you get popped instantly

[glass mortar]

everytime i go down with ret

[timid idol]

its like 5mil crit

[glass mortar]

they pop every defensive and mog me

and i beat them on dps on that fight

everytime

unhinged behavior

ngl

[timid idol]

yea ret single target kinda ass

[glass mortar]

but all that really matters is u keep doing ur dps rotation while ur dowen

its not like winning is gunna matter much as outlaw

u just need to keep ur cdr going

so i just pve into my ally and dont use any defensives and whoever wins wins

[timid idol]

how much damage increase are all the fixes

from deft fix to the ones happening today

[glass mortar]

literally impossible to know

[hollow temple]

there's no way of knowing

[glass mortar]

the deft fix is like 2% ish

[timid idol]

10000000000000000000%

[glass mortar]

gm fix is technically a nerf

for HO at least

[timid idol]

no damage buffs will ever fix killing spree anyway

remove this shit right now

[fathom bramble]

netherwalk does not prevent loss of control effects

[glass mortar]

11.1.7 kspree fix surely

[timid idol]

[fathom bramble]

I can apply both blind and cheapshot freely to a netherwalked player

[upbeat tundra]

@vivid vessel what do you do in workshop

do i have to just play fatebound or something

[delicate seal]

Lmao

[glass mortar]

lmao no

[delicate seal]

Don't speak too soon

[glass mortar]

trickster barely able to press kspree on 1 boss will still be way more dps

its just so far ahead in aoe man

if any aoe exists in a fight

if BF ever matters

trickster just mogs fatebound

[upbeat tundra]

i was thinking about just playing full st spec

[glass mortar]

ok but trickster ST is also strong

[upbeat tundra]

you cant hit ks in that key idk

[glass mortar]

and fatebound literally

loses prio damage

anytime a target exists nearby

[late swallow]

Skill issue maybe?

[upbeat tundra]

can i just equip 2 heroic daggers and play sin in that key

is that the play

[glass mortar]

thats def a play

[upbeat tundra]

with outlaw gear

[glass mortar]

idk u can press kspree its just hard

theres a lot of mechanics with like 1second safe windows to get it off for

so just get gud or die angle

very engaging rotation

[upbeat tundra]

hitting ks in that entire key feels so unbelievably dogshit

[coarse hound]

Thanks for the ones who found the bugs and made it possible for the devs to fix this ❤️ Ty vm !

[upbeat tundra]

like from start to finish

[timid idol]

when is this 11.1.7

is it soon or

do i kms

[glass mortar]

id be surprised if we dont have ptr leaks by friday tbh

they r moving at a very fast pace rn

[timid idol]

when mages or druids are at stake

they move at the fastest pace

[runic bough]

Outlaw can now use 2 daggers. A new talent passive called Tushy Parlay grants an effect equal to find weakness.. lowering armor.

Thoughts?

[upbeat tundra]

please bro just make me not kill myself repeatedly ill do anything all i want to do is play outlaw

just leave it all as is but also give me back acro and make me either not hit ks or make ks not unplayable and my soul is blizzards

[timid idol]

yea acro loss is also horrible

i dont understand why they removed it

im willing to bet blizzard thought it was bad and unused

[runic bough]

Also have you guys noticed the active time difference of ks when lust is active vs not active?

I think its bugged

[timid idol]

yea

lust ks takes 1 millisecond

[upbeat tundra]

ive played a lot of melee and outlaw is the only one that needs acro bad

[timid idol]

outlaw is not hard capped

there

fixed spec

also removed killing spree

[runic bough]

Because if we build up to the haste amount of lust, our ks does not reduce the active time the same amount.

[upbeat tundra]

i like having ks as a button i just dont want it to kill me

[fathom bramble]

you can also just apply garrote through netherwalk as well and it prevents the ticks from dealing damage until netherwalk ends

[runic bough]

Lust itself is a higher haste % than haste secondary stat applies to us

Currently

[timid idol]

the only way they can make it work is make the tps cosmetic ( happiest ending, easiest to do, which means 100% chance blizz never does it), make ks give full immunity, or remove it

[frail veldt]

yeah netherwalk is weird cuz you can still hit them during it

[fathom bramble]

yeah because it's just a damage immunity

instead of a total immunity like bubble

[frail veldt]

yeah as opposed to an immunity immunity

game is weird af

[fathom bramble]

when most people say KS should make you immune to damage they are probably picturing a real immunity anyway

but there is a difference between immune to damage(netherwalk) and full immunity(bubble)

[gaunt phoenix]

added this to pin

[frail veldt]

I think KS making you immune would have way way way more negatives than people realize

tbh its probably the worst solution they could make

[runic bough]

Imo lust is like a 35% less active time of ks. Lust is supposed to only be %15 haste. But it removed a lot of active time.

If we were to equip the same 15% haste from gear, ks will not lower the active time as such it does with lust.

Thoughts?

[frail veldt]

wat?

[runic bough]

This is current

[fathom bramble]

lust is exactly 25% less active time of KS

and it's 30% haste

wdym

[runic bough]

Oh 30% haste

[frail veldt]

bloodlust literally gives 30% haste

[runic bough]

Hmm

[frail veldt]

if you had 30% haste from stats its the same

[fathom bramble]

well not exactly it's slightly less than 25%

[timid idol]

yes when i say that i mean bubble

otherwise its still unplayable

[jolly geyser]

make it give 30% main stat / s

[runic bough]

Well my findings are still true then

[fathom bramble]

my hot take is that bloodlust should be removed from the game

[jolly geyser]

ye

[frail veldt]

did it get nerfed?

I thought it was 30%

[fathom bramble]

30% haste doesn't make KS 30% shorter

[runic bough]

30% haste on gear doesn't lower ks to the amount lust does. I believe lust has a higher effect to lowering ks active time.

[jolly geyser]

racials should be removed also

[frail veldt]

oh sure but BL is still 30% haste

[fathom bramble]

yeah

it makes KS 23% shorter

[frail veldt]

and 30% haste from stats has the same impact on KS as 30% hatse from bloodlust

[fathom bramble]

yeah

[frail veldt]

your KS doesnt know where your haste comes from

ryu is fried

[runic bough]

Like if you added 30% haste from gear same thing

[frail veldt]

yep

[runic bough]

No u don't get it

[fathom bramble]

well sort of

[frail veldt]

if you have 30% haste on your character sheet

[sour jay]

outlaw back boys

[frail veldt]

KS doesnt care where the haste came from

[fathom bramble]

lust multiplies your other haste so it's slightly more than if you just had another 30% from gear

[glass mortar]

lust from haste gives more then haste from gear because haste buffs r multiplicative and additive

[frail veldt]

yeah ofc

but im saying

[glass mortar]

PI and BL give u more haste then their tooltips

[frail veldt]

if your character sheet says 30% haste

[fathom bramble]

but the only number that matters is total haste

[runic bough]

30% haste on gear will be like .6 second less active time. Lust effect is greater than gear haste.

[frail veldt]

whether its from BL or from all gear

[glass mortar]

ye

[frail veldt]

it will have the same impact

[frail veldt]

no

provide evidence if you want to make a claim like that

[glass mortar]

if u have 30% haste on gear then it will be sure

[frail veldt]

LOL

yes if you ahve 30% haste already

and you gain bloodlust

[glass mortar]

because 30% lust from bloodlust will give you 30+30% of ur haste

[fathom bramble]

KS duration is always 0.4 seconds per combo point divided by total haste

[glass mortar]

so it gives 33% haste

[frail veldt]

bloodlust is actually giving you 1.3*1.3 haste

[fathom bramble]

it doesn't matter where the haste is from

[glass mortar]

yes

[frail veldt]

yeah

but you could argue

that bloodlust applies first

[glass mortar]

but i dont think thats what ryu meant

[frail veldt]

and your haste from gear comes after

lol

[fathom bramble]

I mean it's multiplication

[glass mortar]

well no because rating does not scale like this

[fathom bramble]

doesn't matter what is first

[wide nexus]

So all it took was one article and they fixed all of the blade flurry bugs?

[fierce sinew]

FLURRY IS FIXXED BOY ITS UP

[glass mortar]

its just % haste amps

[runic bough]

So we should have 60% haste with lust

[glass mortar]

haste racials dont either

[frail veldt]

no

thats not how haste works

its multiplicative

[glass mortar]

u would have 63% haste with lust

[frail veldt]

for example if you have 30% haste and you gain PI (20%) you will actually go up to 56% haste

cuz its multiplicative

[fathom bramble]

69% if we start at 30 from other sources

[frail veldt]

30% haste is really 1.3 haste

[runic bough]

Yeah that's why ks is so much better with lust

[frail veldt]

so 20% of 1.3 is .26 so 1.3 + .26 = 1.56

[frail veldt]

thats true of all abilities

haste is multiplicative

[wide nexus]

Foreverguy should complain on wowhead more often

[frail veldt]

this applies to everything in the game that haste is affected by

this is not KS

its just how haste works

[gaunt phoenix]

probably not happening again

mission accomplished though i suppose

[frail veldt]

but if you have 30% haste from gear and your KS duration is like 2.6 and then you compare that to having 0% haste from gear but gaining lust, your KS will also be exactly 2.6

[runic bough]

It was a nice outlaw treat

[frail veldt]

Lust does not affect KS more than gear does

[runic bough]

Hmmm

I wonder has anyone tried stacking haste to 60%

[leaden sonnet]

Did the fixes also apply to sub, or was it outlaw only

[fathom bramble]

lust just takes 23% off of the current duration of your KS no matter what your haste is at

it's not rocket science

[runic bough]

Ok ok

[wide nexus]

if they didn't fix sub that would be hilarious

[leaden sonnet]

Im too dumb to comb through the spelldata when its like 10 different commits

[fathom bramble]

the kind of concept your going for is true though

that more haste makes KS faster and less punishing to press in theory

it's just not worth stacking past the point that it is giving good damage

since the KS gains are not that large

[runic bough]

True

We would otherwise only be stacking haste for a shorter ks which isn't that great to begin with.

[final sluice]

When exactly did they fix all the bugs?

[frail veldt]

wdym how would the fix apply to sub?

[fathom bramble]

spaced out over the last few days

[frail veldt]

I thought they just fixed deft and grand melee

was there another fix?

[fathom bramble]

I don't think we have an exact time unless solo wrote it down

[hollow temple]

BF dead target?

[wide nexus]

Nimble Flurry was also bugged

[frail veldt]

how so

[tight kernel]

Bf target bug

[hollow temple]

earlier solo said it didn't apply to sub

[final sluice]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/fixed-blade-flurry-dealing-significantly-less-damage-in-patch-11-1-5-outlaw-376587?utm_source=discord-webhook

[gaunt phoenix]

I don't think nimble flurry was fixed

[frail veldt]

was that actually fixed?

[fathom bramble]

because nimble flurry is a copy of BF it has the same corpse bug

[frail veldt]

oh shit

[hollow temple]

yes

[frail veldt]

I had no idea that ALREADSDY got fixed

[hollow temple]

damn mewo

[frail veldt]

wowwww

cant wait to play tonight

[hollow temple]

keep up

[frail veldt]

been working all day

so precise cuts stocks are UPPP

damn back to HO

cuz fuck 1pt fth

[tight kernel]

Ye pretty sick

[fathom bramble]

when shadowheart bugfix

[runic bough]

Yeah I'm excited to play tonight too

[leaden sonnet]

So just like when they changed the range from like 7.7 to 8 or whatever they did a while ago and forgot to do with nimble, neat. Oh well ty for answering

[royal hollow]

[gaunt phoenix]

you will have to test if Fazed on secondary targets affects nimble flurry, this was fixed for BF but it is scripted so spell data didn't clue me in

[proven ocean]

[runic bough]

Hmm

[fathom bramble]

why does spelldata have a whitelist if it's just scripted 🤔

[gaunt phoenix]

it has to be scripted for bf specifically

[vivid vessel]

fatebound

[leaden sonnet]

Ok ye fazed not fixed for sub

Great stuff

[frail veldt]

workshop is brutal

[frail veldt]

wait whaaaaat fazed on secondary targets improves bladeflurry damage now

holy fuck I missed so much

[hollow temple]

its crazy cuz u been here the whole time

[frail veldt]

wonder how much damage we gained from all this

[frail veldt]

yeah fr fr

[hollow temple]

i'm starting to question things mewo

[frail veldt]

not paying enough attention

[vivid vessel]

@cinder relic you know about that "never writting an article like that ever again" https://www.twitch.tv/zac__________________/clip/WildEasyNightingaleDansGame-YNbAdmCg7xWQmU1f

[hasty warren]

when we have ks reworked ?

[vivid vessel]

(this is just a joke)

[hollow temple]

never

[cinder relic]

classic

[vivid vessel]

actually first time this happens to me

[torpid fiber]

Oh shit blade flurry fixed

[rich moon]

reminds me of falling to my death for using KS in the boat on Dawnbreaker lol

[strong cargo]

ok I'm never pressing KS during hook lol

[tight kernel]

Damn mewo, your work is under a rock

[fathom bramble]

already found a new BF bug

ghostly strike doesn't actually increase BF damage anymore

[prisma sapphire]

wow

[fathom bramble]

and likely hasn't for a while who knows

[prisma sapphire]

i'm pulling 4.5m in workshop

[fathom bramble]

doesn't really matter unless you target swap though

[prisma sapphire]

i'm guessing bf/gm fix helped a bit

[dense bolt]

well well well

[quaint wharf]

so PC is back?

[vivid vessel]

it never did

[fathom bramble]

it did

[vivid vessel]

ah

[sullen wyvern]

[fathom bramble]

it probably got ruined when they changed it from global % to a whitelist

[vivid vessel]

well we tested a bit ago

[gaunt phoenix]

ah ye

[vivid vessel]

ye

thats prolly when

soooo

its a bug ?

add it to the bug list solo

[fathom bramble]

I mean if fazed is a bug

this is literally the same bug, but for GS

[vivid vessel]

just stack them up

[glass mortar]

did u check ghostly lok

[vivid vessel]

i love having long bug list

[glass mortar]

if they fixed fazed

then maybe

👀

[fathom bramble]

yeah fazed is fixed

[vivid vessel]

it wasnt in the wowhead artcile

[fathom bramble]

I kind of accidentally found this while checking fazed stuff

[vivid vessel]

i actually find it funny how easy it is to fix bugs, they just dont do it

[gaunt phoenix]

okay but really ghostly strike on secondary targets cannot be more irrelevant

[fathom bramble]

yeah

[glass mortar]

ok but what if

[vivid vessel]

ye its not

well it is

[fathom bramble]

basically doesn't matter at all

[vivid vessel]

for pc

[glass mortar]

PC ghostly build

xd

[vivid vessel]

on 2 targets bosses

[glass mortar]

the most cursed u could ever make urself as ho

[torpid fiber]

Isn't it slightly relevant bc of 2t, yeah

[fathom bramble]

I guess it's technically optimal to GS your off-target during GM as trickster with pc on 2 targets

if it weren't for this bug

[hasty warren]

ty @cinder relic for the wowhead post ❤️

[glass mortar]

ye that would be so funny

[sullen wyvern]

should I be playing 1 FTH then

[vivid vessel]

ye

[sullen wyvern]

feels so cluncky though

[glass mortar]

ud be doing like 130% to ur not main target

xd

is this funnel guys

outlaw funnel return

[sullen wyvern]

how much do I lose if I play 2fth as KiR solo zac anyone ❤️

[fathom bramble]

going to look real funny on logs when your attacking not the prio target to kill the prio target faster

[gaunt phoenix]

you can just sim

sims good

[fathom bramble]

also weapon/trinket procs probably mean you still attack the prio target anyway

realistically

[dense bolt]

bf funnel, 2 words ive never written in the same sentence before @glass mortar

[glass mortar]

me trying to explain to my rl why i should never be directly targeting the posts on reverb

[gaunt phoenix]

but precise cuts is awkward to judge from sims ig

[glass mortar]

😏

[sullen wyvern]

I was so excited that my brain forgot to sim, still dslice right?

[gaunt phoenix]

well ye

but precise cuts value is not always representative

i guess sims not good

[prisma sapphire]

blizz making me excited to do keys again

[vivid vessel]

6% sim dps

is that real dps tho

[prisma sapphire]

but now the challenge is dealing with pug meta

[vivid vessel]

who knows

[glass mortar]

ah ghostly still bugged tho

etagg

probably for the best

[gaunt phoenix]

i want to use pc a bit now

[prisma sapphire]

i might go KIR tricks just cause my guild is progging on lockenstock

and regemming/reenchanting stuff is getting old

[glass mortar]

yea dont be like me

playing kir 2 times all season

and both times are on locken prog

fatebound too

[prisma sapphire]

yes

[tight kernel]

You mean FB KIR??

[prisma sapphire]

it's burning a hole in my wallet

[glass mortar]

u cant be good at kir without playing it consitently ngl

the st rotation is 10X the difficulty of HO

[prisma sapphire]

well KIR tricks will let me keep my haste for fatebound

[snow socket]

What's new with ol beside the fixed? It sounds like something new about builds?

[hasty warren]

we can sim with fix now or we have to wait a little ?

[glass mortar]

idk how people ever feel HO is harder

[prisma sapphire]

but if we get stuck on lockenstock again for like the 3rd week in a row

shit

i'm tired of all this gold going down the potty

[runic bough]

Technically speaking, if bf dmg is greater than our base damage, shouldn't we target the non-prio so we do bf dmg on our prio target?????

[gaunt phoenix]

deft fix made KIR a bit stronger at higher target counts is all

[glass mortar]

yes

[hollow temple]

pins

[hasty warren]

idk man

[civic void]

You aint playing kir trickster on sprocket

[prisma sapphire]

i'm not saying that

[tight kernel]

9% raid buff it’s a one shot fight now no?

[prisma sapphire]

but since i can keep my haste KIR between the specs

[torpid fiber]

My brain legit doesn't click with ho

[prisma sapphire]

instead of HO haste at 11% then retooling to 19% for KIR fb

[snow socket]

We talking trickster kir or fb?

[glass mortar]

what do u mean it doesnt click as ho

what u press barely matters as ho

pretty sure half its builder rules r within 0.2% dps of each other

[gaunt phoenix]

in keys so trickster

[glass mortar]

u just poop out CP

mistakes barely matter

just react to ur ace procs

took me like 5m in the new raid to do my sim dps as trickster HO xd

[hasty warren]

no buuf management

[glass mortar]

after not playing it once all season

[snow socket]

I'm so disperate for a reason to play fb again kekw

[sullen wyvern]

I always wondered, why do we sim as dslice compared to many other (fotm) specs that sim 5T5M ?

[civic void]

19% haste for ho sc trickster sounds completely fine

[late swallow]

You can’t really control what BF hits in big pulls tho

[torpid fiber]

We have good dslice support

[prisma sapphire]

raidbots is saying my KIR tricks with 20% haste is 1.7% lower dps than 11% haste HO tricks for dslice

is this accurate based on all the fixes

[pliant wave]

Is there any estimate on the expected DPS increase after the bug fixes?

[glass mortar]

no

and there never will be

[sullen wyvern]

I guess I gotta learn how to 1fth then

[glass mortar]

impossible thing to calculate

[late swallow]

About tree fiddy

[upbeat tundra]

imagine losing to outlaw as boomie in a cinderbrew

[late swallow]

Is what I hear

[runic bough]

No but we can switch in raid for example by hitting adds and doing more boss dmg with bf cleave for example.

[glass mortar]

the deft fix is probably like ~2%

[fathom bramble]

well the GM fix is somewhere between 0 and 7% for ho depending on how fucked your BF cast timing was

[prisma sapphire]

i'm going to assume my damage is taking off a bit after the fix

[hasty warren]

gg

[fathom bramble]

the corpse thing is like impossible to quantify

[prisma sapphire]

i was pulling 4.5m dps on details after 3rd boss

[upbeat tundra]

yo did they fix the corpse thing tho

[prisma sapphire]

in WS

[glass mortar]

yes

[upbeat tundra]

i was CRANKING first pull cb

[glass mortar]

like an hour ago

[prisma sapphire]

so i think the damage is def up

[upbeat tundra]

oh sweet

yea i ended first pull cb at 10m

[fathom bramble]

damage is noticeably up between all the fixes imo

[runic bough]

Yaahhhhoooooo

[prisma sapphire]

yea i'm pulling bigger numbers now on big pulls

[midnight granite]

Are we back?

[prisma sapphire]

like 12m at times

that's like coup numbers

coup bug numbers*

[runic bough]

Yo Blu we are back to mostly working now

[strong cargo]

First CB room +13 (I guess my pugs weren't the bests but still)

[midnight granite]

ARE WE BACK???

[runic bough]

Mostly back yes

[upbeat tundra]

if they just do something about ks my life is complete

[runic bough]

Huge fixes recently

[upbeat tundra]

i dont ahve to play shitty specs i dont like

[hasty warren]

lss bugged ig

[tight kernel]

Rework ks then we back

[upbeat tundra]

im doing omega dps now

hell yea

unfortunately still kill myself

but whatever

[runic bough]

Me next me next but I don't get off for another 2 hours

[sullen wyvern]

I've never seen this discord so happy before

[snow socket]

https://tenor.com/view/rainbow-spongebob-imagination-gif-8764636

[sullen wyvern]

it tears me up

[hasty warren]

[snow socket]

Flavour

[hasty warren]

WE EXIST

[runic bough]

Imagine bug fixes make outlaw happy hahahaha duhhhh

[prisma sapphire]

bro

[runic bough]

[prisma sapphire]

been fucking

[sullen wyvern]

[prisma sapphire]

depressed since coup fix

ngl

now

[upbeat tundra]

@peak crow thank you dad

[prisma sapphire]

i feel a little better

fucking blizz making me bipolar

[snow socket]

We running deft manouvers with trickster too now?

[quaint wharf]

prob not

[upbeat tundra]

im playin this and blasting

[gaunt phoenix]

np

[upbeat tundra]

ur not dad ur daddy

[wide nexus]

So this is just proof that blizzard doesn't fix bugs that get reported, and only fix things that they read on wowhead

[pliant wave]

A bug they hadn’t fixed for 4 years suddenly gets resolved in a day as soon as it hits a Wowhead article

[cinder relic]

Well it wasn't known for 4 years

[silent marsh]

good can someone posst my gilded achiev prob on wowhead

pls

[upbeat tundra]

first 15 cinderbrew i went into i wasnt doing tank damage and instantly timed it

[fathom bramble]

we found a bug on sunday and it's fixed already

[upbeat tundra]

sweet

[glass mortar]

idk how much u can put the devs on this one

[fathom bramble]

this is a win

[glass mortar]

we couldnt even find it

[quaint wharf]

actually its the opposite

[glass mortar]

all we had was conspiracies

[fathom bramble]

no matter how long it was in the game without anyone noticing

[sullen wyvern]

aaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh

[quaint wharf]

it got reported and fixed in 2 days

[glass mortar]

honestly i cant believe we ever figured it out

what a wild bug

[snow socket]

Still kir, mmh throught we were landing on an HO angle

[sullen wyvern]

1FTH FEELS SO CLUNCKY

[gaunt phoenix]

major bug fix let's just be happy

[upbeat tundra]

1fth is the way

it just is

[fathom bramble]

just took actually have a good log of it happening

[upbeat tundra]

im sorry

you have to take pc and gs

[glass mortar]

me and zac yapping in here all of s1 about ara ara

[fathom bramble]

good evidence is so useful for bug investigating

[glass mortar]

i think the video was what made us 100% sure and allowed us to find the exact problem in the log tho

like

[sullen wyvern]

I've always taken GS, I dont take PC

[upbeat tundra]

big mistake

[glass mortar]

zac 6 buff, 90% crit rate on bte, 12 ace procs on 8 targets

[fathom bramble]

yeah video helped a lot

[glass mortar]

and hes doing 6m dps

its not possible

[gaunt phoenix]

it was lok who daught it

[glass mortar]

the math doesnt math

[gaunt phoenix]

caught even

[upbeat tundra]

pc does insane work especially since that fix i could absolutely tell the difference instantly

wait can we stop talking about the target cap now

wtf

[fathom bramble]

I wish I investigated a bit more in the arakara complaints

[quaint wharf]

are you gonna mess with any ho variants?

[gaunt phoenix]

yeah im actually curious how it feels/plays now

[fathom bramble]

probably could have figured this out years ago

[upbeat tundra]

this is the first time ever i ended the first pull cinderbrew doing real damage

[glass mortar]

funny thing is this bug was probably way more impactful to the value of PC as a talent then it was to most peoples overalls

[gaunt phoenix]

HO doesnt have variants

[upbeat tundra]

infact i was top dps on first pull cb

[glass mortar]

PC has been such a placebo talent all season imo

i always felt it on 2 target bosses so i was like this must be so strong on packs that are low

[delicate seal]

Didn't they nerf pc a while ago anyways

[wide nexus]

So this in theory is a buff for PC since it will make BF deal more damage as targets die right?

[glass mortar]

but this bug has probably devalued it so much

[glass mortar]

no they buffed it

[prisma sapphire]

yasssss

[gaunt phoenix]

Yes

[glass mortar]

PC is insane on its target counts

[delicate seal]

But before that

[glass mortar]

its the only reason we even consider taking it

[prisma sapphire]

1st pull WS made me see the BF difference with the entire room pull

[cobalt mist]

we need more wowhead articles

[gaunt phoenix]

pc was nerfed in DF a bit

[upbeat tundra]

there are SO many bosses in keys that pc cranks on

[slow vale]

https://tenor.com/view/wedding-crasher-hro-gif-25636997

BABY WE BACK

[upbeat tundra]

the final fix would be ks

[gaunt phoenix]

We're so back

[upbeat tundra]

thats all we need is ks

and we are GAMING

[slow vale]

inc huge wave of FOTM players

[prisma sapphire]

watch them nerf outlaw damage by 6% in 11.1.7 cause we too much key damage now

[quaint wharf]

ks fix coming in 11.1.7

[slow vale]

can we just close the discord, no more new members

[sullen wyvern]

solo why do we sim as dslice compared to other specs that most of them sim for 5T5M?

[upbeat tundra]

idk if you can fotm outlaw

[slow vale]

cause we about to get swarmed

[fathom bramble]

most classes don't bother supporting fight events for various reasons which causes dungeonslice to be chronically unstable

[covert kestrel]

Never change reddit

[midnight granite]

I remember us talking about bf being bugged but the original idea was that it was hitting baseline 5 yargets and not 8 with the talent. It hitting dead mobs is a wild issue lol

[prisma sapphire]

let them come

[gaunt phoenix]

i dont really keep up with what other specs are doing but outlaw not having cooldowns and not having an 'aoe rotation' really helps it adapt to whatever sim style you throw at it

[sullen wyvern]

that has to be the biggest 🧢 of all times

[gaunt phoenix]

without too much work in the APL side

[slow vale]

https://tenor.com/view/adam-sandler-holy-shit-im-gonna-cum-uncut-gems-howard-ratner-gif-16259390

[fathom bramble]

in general outlaws rotation makes it simpler to handle fight events and we do have a few lines for fight event support(I think) to help allows Dslice to be good

[sullen wyvern]

I see, thank you

[past sky]

thinking... how can we submit "ks kills you" as a bug...

[keen belfry]

should i do an outlaw key i havent had a vault on this guy in 2 weeks im kinda nervous

[sullen wyvern]

Aightm thank you

[prisma sapphire]

i feel so fucking happy for a dps inc that might not make up for coup bug

maybe we will realize it was just a 2% dps buff

[gaunt phoenix]

trust me... the state of KS is known

[slow vale]

no no dont change KS, i like living on the edge of madness

[tight kernel]

What build are you running

[keen belfry]

i asked zac a Q on battle net and he didnt reply

@vivid vessel

[fathom bramble]

remember to keep bumping the Wox thread

so it feels like you are doing something

[severe grove]

YIPEEEE

[vivid vessel]

@gaunt phoenix thoughts? idk why the damage in that rookery is so low tho but (and i changed the priory boss to be actualyl a realistic 2 target boss otherwise he has like 1 bilion hp)

[severe grove]

Blade flurry fix 🔥

[hollow temple]

a lot of other classes just don't support dslice

[vivid vessel]

seems like in most dungeon pc isnt as high value as in slice

[gaunt phoenix]

yeah i kinda figured

[vivid vessel]

for reference pc for me is almost 7% in slice

[gaunt phoenix]

that would happen

[fathom bramble]

yeah slice does have an issue with representing the degenerate pulls that we eventually see in a lot of keys

this is why I stay in theater of pain

[gaunt phoenix]

we should probably embrace/publicize droute more

[fathom bramble]

where it's safe

[rapid spoke]

should've made an article about grappling hook not working correctly since 2020 LMAO

[vivid vessel]

ye but

lot of routes doenst work

[fathom bramble]

I mean they fixed it in dungeons at least

[vivid vessel]

priory first boss for exmaple

in mdt it wont be a 2 target boss

and it will have 2b hp

[fathom bramble]

which makes me think it's a misguided, but intentional 'feature' to reduce the chance of grappling hook abuse

[vivid vessel]

i had to replace it

if you try simming mewdery you ignore all the shitters that spawns

and you ignroe the 4 last that regenerate hp

dfc you ignore first boss is perma aoe

ML

every boss has a damage amp

[upbeat tundra]

THEY FIXED OUR SPEC KINDA MAN

WTF

[vivid vessel]

so smiliarly they dont have correct hp

[prisma sapphire]

without even knowing

how much the dps inc is

[vivid vessel]

top seems fine i think

[prisma sapphire]

makes me so happy

outlaw gettin some love

[vivid vessel]

so ye idk

dungeon routes arent like

plug and play

like slice is

[upbeat tundra]

dude all thats left is ks and we are just so fucking back

[gaunt phoenix]

ye

joys of dungeon simming

[prisma sapphire]

i mean ks sucks but honestly i like the switchup from the monotony of fatebound

[trail star]

real as fuck

XD

[vivid vessel]

!wa

[ornate heath]

Class packs:

• Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
• Zac's Group Devlin
  Utilities:
• Combo Point Standalone
• Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
• Ace refund sound trigger
• RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
• Unseen Blade tracker
  Fun:
• Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
• KS Ticking damage taken

[prisma sapphire]

if they can just give us some more interesting action animations

[rapid spoke]

at this point acknowledgement about spec existance is fine

[daring oxide]

The wowhead article says all of the bugs have been fixed, is that true? Including the fazed bug?

[prisma sapphire]

and sounds

the coup bug had a nice sound to it

and when you begin to associate that noise with high damage output

it's exhilarating

[hollow temple]

[runic bough]

TRICKZ IS WATCHING

[hollow temple]

its also in the pins

[daring oxide]

Oh nice

Wtf

[gaunt phoenix]

Yes vai

we did it

[daring oxide]

Fazed getting fixed might be an aoe buff for us

[gaunt phoenix]

not 'might', it is

[daring oxide]

Ok GG

How much solo

[quaint wharf]

https://tenor.com/view/jayson-tatum-we-did-it-boston-celtics-2024-nba-finals-celtics-gif-36181377516001359

(i didnt do anything)

[daring oxide]

Is killing spree fixed yet